An Old Timey Podcast - 5: John Brown Goes to Court (Part 4)

Episode Date: May 15, 2024

He led a massacre. He led a raid. And now, in the final episode of this series, anti-slavery crusader John Brown goes on trial. His trial had everything – peanut shells, a cozy cot, and not a speck of justice in sight. In John Brown’s final act, he became a martyr. Remember, kids, history hoes always cite their sources! For this episode, Norm pulled from: “Midnight Rising: John Brown and the Raid That Sparked the Civil War” by Tony Horwitz“To Purge This Land With Blood: A Biography of John Brown” by Stephen OatesFamous Trials - John Brown https://www.famous-trials.com/johnbrownThe John Brown Online Exhibit -  West Virginia Archives & History - https://archive.wvculture.org/history/jbexhibit/jbintroduction.htmlAre you enjoying An Old Timey Podcast? Then please leave us a 5-star rating and review wherever you listen to podcasts!Are you *really* enjoying An Old Timey Podcast? Well, calm down, history ho! You can get more of us on Patreon at patreon.com/oldtimeypodcast. At the $5 level, you’ll get a monthly bonus episode (with video!), access to our 90’s style chat room, plus the entire back catalog of bonus episodes for Kristin’s previous podcast, Let’s Go To Court.

Hear ye, hear ye. You are listening to an old-timey podcast. I'm Kristen Caruso. And I'm her teenage dream, Norman Caruso. What does that mean? I think it's dirty. Okay. Well, that's great.

What are you talking about today, Teenage Dream? On this week's episode, I'll be talking about the trial of John Brown. Let's go to court. Oh, my God. I was going to make that joke later on in the episode, but you went ahead and busted your nut way too early once again. Well, I am so sorry. And you're not even touching the soundboard.

You don't even want Hank Hill to back you up. There we go. I'm on it. Speaking of about to bust, I have to tell you something. Okay. Where's this going? I'm very nervous for this episode because, as you know, we ordered some takeout to eat before we recorded. Yeah, we wanted to get our bell.

plays nice and full before we sat in here in the sex dungeon. I ordered curry. Oh, no. I stopped as soon as I felt the fire. The fire? Listen, I am a powder. I'm a powder keg about to explode. I feel the fire right here.

It's like at the top, you know, just like bottom of my throat. Mm-hmm. And I don't know how long this episode's going to be, but I think it's just going to keep moving south, keep moving, keep moving. and it's going to be a problem. Sniff my butthole. You won't want to. No, think I will.

Okay, well, if we have to take a break so you can shit your pants, we will. It's no problem. Thank you for being so professional about this. And for remaining. We've got a bed, bath, and beyond bag around here somewhere. I don't understand what you mean by that, but I do want to thank you for continuing. to be very attracted to me. Despite all odds.

As the clock counts down for me to shit myself on this episode. I am excited for this episode. It's going to be the thrilling conclusion of your John Brown coverage. It is. It's part four of four. We're finally at the end of the road for John Brown. And to think, you thought this could be done in one episode. Oh, my God.

Can you imagine? What a silly little history ho you were. I just didn't know. I had to learn my lessons. But before we get into John Brown, should we talk about the Patreon? Absolutely we should. Hey, hey, you there? You listening.

You. Sign up for our Patreon at the $5 level. You get a monthly bonus episode. Oh, my God. And you get a video to go with it. Yeah, full video of that bonus episode. Oh, you get to see me shit my pants. That's not true because it won't happen.

It shan't happen. We'll see Stay tuned, folks At the $5 level You also get into our Discord You get all the whole back catalog Of bonus episodes For my previous podcast

Let's Go to Court And you get a whole bunch of other stuff Lots of stuff We don't have time to get into it Yeah, Patreon.com slash old-timey podcast Check it out Tell your friends

Tell your lover Whisper it to them Mid-coitus Yes While making love Okay, shall we? We shall. This is part four and the thrilling conclusion of my story on John Brown.

You should have used the dramatic voice. I'm going to get to it. You're busting your nut again too early. I'm sorry, I'm sorry. You are a premature joke teller. I'm very sorry. Maybe it's my... You need to talk to your doctor or health care provider about your problem.

Listen, my number one problem will be... The fact that I'm about to shit myself. The fact that I am beating you to some punchlines at, you know, we might not have time. Classic Kristen. Okay, okay, let's go. Okay. This is part four in the thrilling conclusion of my story on John Brown. I highly recommend you go back and listen to parts one through three. But if you're not a good history ho and there's no time, I'll sum up the last episode for you.

Oh, you bad little hoes. Previously. on an old-timey podcast. You happy now? I am happy. On the night of October 16th, 1859, John Brown and 18th, went into Harper's Ferry, Virginia,

and seized the federal armory, an arsenal, a rifle factory, and both bridges going in and out of town. They took prominent citizens as hostages, including George Washington's great-grand-nephew. Who was a bit of a bitch about it?

At first, everything was going according to play. But things quickly took a turn for the worse. One of Brown's men shot and killed an innocent black man, Haywood Shepard, during an encounter on the railroad bridge. Residents of Harper's Ferry rallied and called in the militia from nearby towns. Brown and his men were quickly surrounded and suffered many casualties. By the end of the day on Monday, Brown had only nine men left. The next day, Colonel Robert E. Lee and 90 Marines stormed the small brick building that Brown and his men were defending. somehow amidst all the chaos they captured John Brown alive.

The governor of Virginia, Henry Wise, aka Billy Bob Thornton, arrived and was ready to bring John Brown to trial as quickly as possible. After a lengthy three hours of questioning, Brown gave his captors a stern warning. You had better, all you people of the South. Prepare yourselves for a settlement of that question that must come up. You may dispose of me very easily. I am nearly disposed of now, but this question is still to be settled.

This Negro question, I mean. The end of that is not yet. And now, the thrilling conclusion to the story of John Brown. Hell yeah. I guess I shouldn't be doing that while you have the actual sound effect. Yeah, we don't need to hear it from you. But I think it really adds something. Don't you agree?

I don't. Oh, damn. I am so excited. Okay. Are you ready? Yes. Kristen, it's now the evening of Tuesday, October 18, 1859. John Brown had attacked Harper's Ferry two days earlier with 18 men. Ten were dead. Five had been captured and the rest were missing. Brown's men had killed five and wounded nine others. Citizens of Harper's Ferry began collecting the dead bodies that were scattered around town at the armory, in the Potomac and Shenandoah River on the B&O Railroad Bridge. The jewelry store. The jewelry store where Thomas Borley's dick was shot off.

Yeah, and that sounds like a joke, but it's not, folks. Tony, listen to that last episode. Blown off dicks are no laughing matter. Mm-hmm. Most of the dead men from Brown's Army were piled into large pine storage boxes, and they paid a local man $5, which was about $188 today, to bury them in shallow unmarked graves right outside of town. John Brown's son, Watson Brown, finally succumbed to his stomach wound.

His body was stuffed into a barrel, and he was sent to the nearby medical school in Winchester, Virginia, for dissection. Why dissection? Like, for research purposes? For science. Okay. This was the first medical school in the state of Virginia. It was a secessionist hotbed. bed. A lot of weird shit happened there, Kristen. What do you mean a secessionist hotbed?

A lot of like hardcore southerners who wanted to secede from the union studied at the Winchester Medical College. Were they just thrilled as shit to have John Brown's son's body to do sex? Yeah. So they took it for dissection because they want, it didn't say this for sure, but my assumption would be they wanted to know what made an abolitionist different. Oh, see, I think you're wrong. Or they just wanted to mutilate his body. I think you're wrong on that, too. Why do you think they took his body?

Well, around this time, and this is true, I'm going to cover something on this. There were a lot of scandals with medical colleges robbing graves. Oh, yeah, they definitely did that. So, you know, maybe, yeah, maybe they did want to mutilate, desecrate this man's body, but I think also probably it's like, oh, well, we don't have to dig anybody up. That's a research paper I'm writing. Yeah, you can go into more detail. Colonel Robert E. Lee wrote up his final report of the Harper's Ferry Raid.

It read, the result proves that the plan was the attempt of a fanatic or madman, which could only end in failure, and its temporary success was owing to the panic and confusion he succeeded in creating by magnifying his numbers. The residents of Harper's Ferry and the nearby areas, they were not convinced this was over. They were still spooked. They're scared to death.

I mean, it would be pretty scary. They thought there could be more of John Brown's men out there, just waiting to attack again. So Robert E. Lee said, all right, calm down. I'm going to send out my Marines, and we're going to look around and we'll see if we can find anybody. This feels like, okay, dad's going to check under the bed for you for monsters. And you're half wishing that a monster would get him just to prove that you're right. So the Marines went to that Little Log Schoolhouse where John Brown stored his weapons.

And then they went to the Kennedy Farm, and they found a ton of supplies. they found weapons, they found tents, blankets, clothing, and they found a surprising amount of knives on a stick. So dad was wrong. It was clear when the Marines found all the stuff that John Brown truly believed his plan would succeed and he would continue the fight. Yeah. I mean, you're not collecting tents and clothing and blankets for nothing. Right.

He's not a tent collector, Kristen. All right. The Marines also uncovered a lot of documents, including letters to the Secret Six abolitionists that funded Brown's plan. They also found letters to Frederick Douglass. Oh, keep Frederick out of this. John Brown had kept all of his letters, much to the dismay of the Secret Six. Well, I'm sure the Secret Six had asked him to burn those letters, don't you think? I don't know if they asked them.

They called themselves the Secret Six. They definitely wanted those letters burned. Yeah, and we'll find out later that they're like, why the fuck did you not burn those letters? The Marines also found copies of Hugh Forbes' Manual of the Patriotic Volunteer, which, fun fact, Kristen, you can read for free on the internet today. Hugh Forbes manual on guerrilla tactics. Have you read it? No, I'm not reading it.

It's a snooze fest. I tried to. Hugh Forbes was not a great writer. You know, history hoes are always curious, Norm. Yeah, I tried and I was like, you weren't that curious. Red Wall is a way better book than this. What's Red Wall?

That was like my favorite book series as a kid. History Ho's out there, if you remember Red Wall, let me know. What was it? It was like a fantasy book series about, like, mice that, like, had swords and they fought. It was really cool. I mean, it sounds like knives on a stick, but okay. Me and the history hose are going to gang up on them because you're talking shit on redwall. Don't you dare history hose.

You know what? I'm prepared for war at any moment, just so you know. Okay. Okay. Surprisingly, Robert E. Lee didn't really make much of those documents and letters. He barely acknowledged them in his official report. But Virginia governor, Henry Wise, aka Billy Bob Thornton with long hair. Yes, in looks only.

Yes. We don't know if their personalities were similar. I don't believe Billy Bob Thornton is enslaver and interested in seceding from the United States. We'll have to ask. We have no proof he's not interested. That's how I do my research. That's right. Virginia Governor Henry Wise, when he saw all these documents, he declared it was a vast organized conspiracy to overthrow slavery.

Well, I mean, I don't know how well organized it was, it was a conspiracy to overthrow slavery. Yeah. I wouldn't call it vast. No. And I would definitely not call it well organized. No. But he was right.

It was a conspiracy to overthrow slavery. Yeah. It's true that John Brown did not have any more men waiting to attack in the hills of Maryland and Virginia. But that doesn't mean his men weren't nearby. Governor Henry Wise offered reward money for the capture of Brown's remaining soldiers. and sent out militia patrols to look for them. Kristen? Yes, Norman.

If you remember, during the attack on Harper's Ferry, handsome spy slash lover slash husband, John Cook, he had fired his rifle from across the Potomac River to distract the militia and try to help Brown. So he did that, and it did help. But by nighttime, John Cook had heard from residents that were leaving Harper's Ferry, that John Brown was completely surrounded. So John Cook ran back to the Kennedy Farm to tell the three men that were guarding the farm about the situation.

So they all agreed a rescue attempt would be suicidal, so they just took off. Okay. They packed up a few supplies and they made their way to Pennsylvania heading north. Some of the enslaved men that they had liberated from the hostages, they also took off. for the North. Good for them. Okay. But some also went back to their enslaver. I can understand that.

It's like what are the chances that I'm going to get to freedom? Right. Yeah. By day five of their journey, John Cook, John Brown's son, Owen Brown, and three others were starving. Oh. They'd run out of food. Well, since John Cook was a ladies' man, they figured you can charm somebody. somebody. Yeah. So John Cook

went off alone to look for food and the rest hid in the woods. Well, John Cook went to the wrong place. Oh, no. He went to a ironworks factory. Read the room. Go to some little bakery where there's a lonely, sexy woman baking pies. Yeah, with a huge bust. Oh, well, duh. She's got the hugest tits you've ever seen.

And, oh, what's this? She places all her pies right there on the window sill where you can easily sneak a few away. Kristen, you're really... Sexy time. Ew, don't. God. My dad's voice.

Well, he didn't go to a hot sexy baker. He went to a Ironworks factory, and one of the employees immediately recognized him from a wanted poster. Yeah. He was taken back to Virginia to stand trial. Of course, because they're like, you're not going to fuck my girlfriend. Get out of here.

Why do you think it is that we have it in our heads that any woman who owns a bakery has massive jugs? I don't know. We ought to start a nonprofit for... Flat-chested bakers. Flat-chested would-be bakers who just need the confidence. That's right. Or a boob job.

Either way. We'll do it either way. We'll build you. We just want you to succeed. Well, Owen Brown and the other three men that were hiding in the woods, they eventually gave up waiting for John Cook to come back. And so they just kept going. They eventually found refuge with a Quaker.

community in northwest pennsylvania and ultimately the four men evaded capture we love the quakes i take back all of my criticisms of the quakers thank you to the quakers they did try to snitch on john brown well they did snitch on him you know what they say about snitches i've never heard this before please go on you've heard it while in the quaker community the four men learned about the fate of everyone at Harper's Ferry. Owen Brown returned to Ohio and told John Brown Jr. The Incredible Story. I want to talk about another man that also escaped from the Harper's Ferry raid.

His name was Osborne Anderson. You might recall him, Chris, and I've mentioned him briefly in a previous episode. You know, when John Brown went to Canada to try to recruit people, he got one recruit. That was Osborne Anderson. he was a free black man who from Pennsylvania and he was a printer. Well, Osborne Anderson and another man, Albert Hazlett, they were guarding the arsenal that was caddy corner to the armory. And Osborne Anderson saw that John Brown was surrounded at the armory.

And so he and Haslett agreed that the plan was basically doomed. And so under the cover of nightfall, they both slid. slipped out of the back of the arsenal, stole a boat, and crossed the Potomac River. Good for them. Okay. They made it all the way to Chambersburg, Pennsylvania, which is about 60 miles north of Harper's Ferry, when Albert Haslett became overcome with exhaustion. I would imagine so. And he told Osborne Anderson, just keep going. I'm stopping here. Weren't they both in the same boat?

Well, they just used the boat to cross the river And then they ran the chambers You can't take a boat all the way to Chambersburg Listen, I'm no geography ho, okay? I thought they were just rowing and rowing and rowing and rowing I imagined them rowing the boat on land Trying to get to Chambers Man, this is taking it forever

Why don't we just walk? This is really dumb, man, are you sure? And the other guy's like, I'm exhausted Trust me, it'll work Albert Hazlett was eventually captured by authorities and sent back to Charlestown, Virginia. You should have gotten out of that boat. That boat's not going anywhere. But they never caught up to Osborne Anderson.

He knew the area very well, and he used a series of underground railroad connections, including free black families and abolitionists, and Anderson eventually returned to his home in Chatham, Ontario, Canada. You are kidding me. Not kidding. That's amazing. Osborne Anderson would later write a short book about his experiences entitled A Voice from Harper's Fairy.

It's available to read online for free. Did you read it? Are you going to talk shit on his book? Just like you talked shit on the pamphlet? You know, it's old-timey. It's an old-timey story. It's no animorphs or whatever you were talking about, Redwall. Hey, don't talk shit about animorphs either.

We're going to have a problem. Okay. I was a Sweet Valley type of gal. Osborne Anderson wrote in his book that John Brown, quote, dug the mine and laid the train which will eventually dissolve the union between freedom and slavery. Well, shit. He knew it. During the Civil War, Osborne Anderson served in the Union Army.

Really? Mm-hmm. Sadly, Osborne Anderson died in 1872, poor and suffering from tuberculosis. We don't know where his grave is located. He was most likely buried in an unmarked mass grave at the National Harmony Memorial Park Cemetery in Landover, Maryland. What's this? Plack Alert?

Yes, let's hear it. At that cemetery, there is a memorial plaque for Osborne Anderson. It's most likely not where his body is. Of course not. The plaque was dedicated on Veterans Day in the year 2000. Hmm. Osborne Anderson is a really cool story. Highly recommend checking out his book available online for free.

Now I'd like to dive into the political and public reaction to the Harper's Ferry Rate. All right. Democrats accused Republicans of being behind the whole thing. Well, I mean, if all of Republicans were behind this, wouldn't it have been more successful? You would think. Yeah. Stephen Douglas, with his humpty-dumpty-looking ass, said that the attack on Harper's Ferry was the, quote, natural, logical, inevitable result of the doctrines and teachings of the Republican Party. How do you fucking figure, dude?

Because the Republican Party was against the expansion of slavery. Well, against the expansion of slavery is a far cry from, I'm going to rip the jaws of it. enslavers. Hey, look, there's a presidential election coming up, and the Democrats are going to say whatever the hell they can to win that election. Oh, that's a good point. Yeah. Republicans distanced themselves from the Harper's Ferry Raid, saying it was the work of one fanatic man. Potential Republican candidate Abraham Lincoln wrote that John Brown was no Republican, which is actually true. John Brown was probably not a Republican. Well, no, he, I mean, it's, he was. Here's what I hate about this. He's being called.

a fanatic. And in a way, I get that. Yes, he, I mean, he went way outside the bounds of what anyone expected. But what a fucked up society when it's fanatical and radical to be willing to kill over slavery. And yet, we have people who enslave other people who rape people they claim to own, who sell off children, sell off people and they're not radical, they're not fanatics, they're not crazy? Sure. And as we'll learn later in this episode, John Brown's trial flipped everything on its head. Okay. Humpty, dumpty indeed. Well, abolitionists, they defended what Brown did. Yeah. Henry David Thoreau gave a speech entitled A Plea for Captain John Brown.

Thoreau had some great points. He wrote, Is it possible that an individual may be right in a government wrong? Yes. Are laws to be enforced simply because they are made? No.

Are you the audience? No. Yes. Henry appreciates me being here to answer these rhetorical questions. John Brown did what he did, knowing himself for a man, and the equal of any and all governments.

In that sense, he was the most American of us all. Yes. Ralph Waldo Emerson delivered a lecture entitled Courage and wrote that John Brown was, quote, The New Saint awaiting his martyrdom, and who, if he shall suffer, will make the gallows glorious like the cross. Wow. Kristen, I mentioned earlier that the Marines had found all those documents,

documents and letters linking John Brown back to the Secret Six and Frederick Douglas. And Robert Ely was like, let me wipe my ass with these. And they were like, no, maybe we should put him in a file somewhere. He said, man, I just took the biggest dump out back on the Kennedy farm. I just had some curry. I shouldn't add that red curry. Oh, heavens. You know, he was a southern gentleman.

Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. I believe this was planted here by John Brown's man to make me shit my pantaloons. John Brown's men left Thai red curry on the table and I had to eat it. It was delicious, but now a great fire rages within my boughs. So, yeah, Robert Ely wasn't too interested in the documents, but you know who was? You already mentioned it. It was the governor, the wise guy.

The New York Times was very interesting. Oh, shit, okay. They reported all of the names of the Secret Six. And then our good friend, Colonel Hugh Forbes. Okay. He had an interview with the New York Herald, and he gave a very detailed account of John Brown working with the Secret Six. The Colonel had already left the building by the time John Brown started working with the Secret Six, right? Or is my timeline off?

No, it was around the same time. Oh, okay, never mind. Well, the Secret Six saw all this, you know, being reported. They are shitting themselves in bedbath and beyond bags, Kristen. Bed Bath and Beyond was a brand new store at the time. Uh-huh. Sure. Yeah. For any fresh hose, anyone who's not a fan of my previous podcast,

um, fun fact about me, one time I was served some bad iced tea at a McDonald's. I was attacked. Uh, it did happen in the South. I'm not saying there's a link here, but, you know, who knows? Anyway, I'm, I'm a very cheap woman, so did I stop drinking the tea when I noticed it tasted weird? No, I did not. I kept drinking it.

and then I stopped at a restroom, but it was a gross restroom, so I decided I was too good to use the restroom. And then, whoopsie daisy, I pooped in my car into a bed, bath, and beyond bag. A legendary story. I've never been the same. Did you like that sped-up version of the story? Yeah, you covered all the points. You didn't mention Peanut the dog crying in the back seat while you chat yourself. She was actually in the front seat with me, witnessing my humiliation.

She was disgusted with me. Man. Okay, so yeah, the Secret Six are shitting themselves, just like Kristen did, oh, so long ago. Franklin Sanborn, he was the abolitionist that took John Brown on the lecture tour to raise money. He wrote to a colleague saying, Our old friend struck his blow in such a way, either by his own folly or the direction of Providence, that it has recoiled and ruined him, and perhaps those who were his friends. Okay, fuck off. Franklin Sanborn temporarily fled to Canada.

Perhaps those who were his friends. Mm-hmm. Not, ah, it's me, I'm scared. Do you remember Garrett Smith? He was the wealthy abolitionist who gave land away to free black people in New York. He became extremely nervous and paranoid. Yep. He told a friend, I am going to be indicted, sir.

Indicted. If any man in the union is taken, it will be me. He couldn't sleep. He was plagued with constant fear. He would be captured and executed. He took all the letters he had ever received from John Brown and burned them. Oh, the historical records. His family eventually had to put him into an asylum on November 7, 1859.

For treatment, Garrett Smith was given cannabis. Oh. Mm. Morphine. Oh. And a large sheet of Rice Krispy treats Shut up All right, I made that last part up

Oh, lock me up By December he was back home And Garrett Smith now insisted He had no idea about John Brown's plan To attack Harper's Ferry Okay, I'm being kind of an ass to these guys I would also be shitting my pants Yeah, you would

You'd have bags and bags of shit pile up in your room And I'd be like, officer, I don't know what you're talking about. They'd be holding their noses. Ma'am, please. Okay, we believe you. Let's get out of here. Oh, my God. Oh, it stinks.

Sniff my butthole. For evidence, you know. Uh-huh, yeah. Two other members of the Secret Six, Samuel Howe and George Luther Sterns, they were also very nervous, and they both fled to Canada, too. Samuel Howe wrote to a newspaper that Harper's Ferry was unforeseen and unexpected by me. even though he definitely knew what was going down. Well, and the letters are all there.

I guess he doesn't know the letters. Well, no, the New York Times printed that. Yeah, yeah, they've reported on it. Samuel, how did you think you'd get away with that? Great job, Kristen. Thank you. Thank you. See, these jokes are on time and delivered well.

You're not premature joke telling like you were earlier. Good job. I think you call it premature. I call it just like I'm faster than you. you. Zing, zang, zoom. That's what I say when I finish first. Don't make love. I'm just way faster than you. Sorry, I'm faster than you. Bam, speed running sex. Ten seconds, done. Men are so much better at this than women. You're still not done, Kristen. I finished like five minutes ago. That's enough. Our parents listen to this.

I'm about to bust. Oh, boy. Reverend Theodore Parker, another member of the Secret Six. He was in Rome at the time. Oh, convenient. He was sick from tuberculosis. Tuberculosis. It's not tuberculosis, Kristen. And since he was out of the country, he was not really afraid of what would happen to him.

He was like, I think I'm going to stay a while. Yeah, so he praised Brown. He gave a pretty badass quote. Okay. He said, The road to heaven is as short from the gallows as from the throne. There was only one man from the Secret Six who didn't flee the country or hide or try to distance themselves from John Brown. It was Thomas Wentworth Higginson.

He was the fiery, combative preacher. And he was absolutely disgusted that John Brown and his men suffered while, quote, Silent safe partners make haste to secure our good reputation by a lie. Higginson purposefully did not destroy any of his letters, and he dared to be arrested. Wow. And he never was arrested. That's really interesting that none of these men were arrested. Were they deemed too wealthy and powerful?

A big problem was jurisdiction. Oh, yeah. They were all in Massachusetts. All this took place in Virginia. Did we have the federal system set up yet? Like, could they have been brought up on federal charges? You know, back then, it's like people didn't say, I live in the United States of America. They said, I live in Virginia.

I live in North Carolina. It was like loyalty to your state was the big thing. Okay. And the Civil War really changed that. Oh, that's interesting. All right. Yeah. And now we get to Frederick Douglass.

Douglas's friends warned him that the good. governor of New York was willing to give him up to the state of Virginia. Yeah, so the one black guy is going to get in trouble. Yeah. So Douglas fled to Canada. Good. But he did not back down. He fully admitted that he knew about the Harper's Ferry Plan, but that he refused to take

part in it, which was true. He wrote to a newspaper, I have always been more distinguished for running than fighting and tried by the Harper's Ferry Insurrection Test. I am most miserably deficient in courage. Douglas felt he let people down by not being at Harper's Ferry with John Brown. He would soon go to England on a lecture tour, which he had already planned to do regardless of what John Brown did. And he ultimately would avoid any charges. Good.

I wonder if feeling like, which of course he was not a coward, but like, I wonder. if feeling like he chickened out in this instance made him braver later in life or bolder? Well, if you recall, Douglas was a pacifist. Right. But by the Civil War, Frederick Douglass was... I mean, he was in there with Lincoln talking. He was all in on this war is about ending slavery. Yeah.

So I think John Brown definitely influenced him to continue to... If he would have been that bold and that forward, you know, sometimes feeling like you didn't do the right thing in one situation propels you to be more courageous in the next situation. I think absolutely. Like, for example, a couple nights ago you finished fast and then a few nights later you finished even faster. That's right. It made you even braver to speed running. Yeah, beat that. Go ahead and top that.

Three point five seconds. They don't call me the minute. man for nothing, Kristen. Let's talk about John Brown now. Okay. We're in Charlestown, Virginia. Governor Henry Wise immediately called for a civilian trial in a Virginia court. This was a problem, though, because the majority of the violence in Harper's Ferry happened on federal ground at the armory.

Well, our old friend James Buchanan, the drunk cockatoo, he handed over everything. to governor wise. He said the whole ordeal was, quote, a matter quite indifferent to me. What? Which is exactly how James Buchanan felt about southern states threatening to secede from the union,

which is why James Buchanan is in my top ten worst presidents list. No kidding. He was a weak, ineffective president and did not give two shits about his country falling apart under his watch. And here's a great example.

No, shit. This is ridiculous. Yep. The Jefferson County Circuit Court was only in session for a few more weeks. And if governor wise didn't get the trial going quickly, they would have to wait until the spring. And so he said, let's get a trial going. And he justified it by playing both sides. So you ready to hear?

Yeah, let's hear it. So for Southerners, we want swift justice. Okay. If we don't hold this trial soon, somebody is going to rescue John Brown. They're going to break him out of jail. Or John Brown could die from his wounds before facing justice. And then for the abolitionists and the Northerners, we have to have a swift trial because what if Southerners lynch John Brown? What if an angry mob comes and just kills him?

And then he doesn't even get a trial. I mean, honestly, sure. He really is playing both sides Well, if he was interested in justice, he would have militia guard the jail so an angry mob doesn't come lynch John Brown. Oh, Norman, blow it out your asshole. What? Blow it out his asshole. No, blow it out your asshole because you...

I'm just saying it's bullshit. No, you already heard how they guard a federal armory in these days. They had one dude standing out front. One dude standing half a mile back. Don't you think they would maybe change things up after this incident? Probably not. Okay? Because Lincoln was murderedly ordered.

Spoiler alert for all you history hoes. Whoa. And after that, you know, years later, President Garfield was murdered by some dude just walking up to him. And it wasn't until like then or maybe even later that they were like, hmm, maybe we should get some security guys around these presidents. They spilled hot lasagna on President Garfield. And President Garfield hated it because it was the dish he most loved. He was killed by the dish he most loved.

That's right. I'm pointing to my Garfield statue. This is kind of the relationship I'm having with the curry right now. But do you see what I'm saying? I just don't agree with you. I just think governor wise, if he had a chance, he would hang John Brown immediately. He wouldn't even want to. a trial.

Agreed. So this whole bullshit about, oh, what if an angry mob lynch is John Brown? He would love it if that happened. Of course he would. Of course he would. If he was actually interested in justice, then he would protect John Brown and his men from an angry mob lynching them. But he doesn't give a shit about justice. In his mind, an angry mob lynching John Brown is justice.

What I take issue with, sir? His definition of justice is warped and twisted. Well, no shit. He fucking loved slavery. So anyway, what I take issue with, sir, is this idea that like, oh, I'll just put a bunch of guards around John Brown. No, they didn't do that back then. They were like, this won't happen again. You're just wrong about that because there were like 800 militiamen around the jail at this time because Governor Henry Wise was

very concerned about another attack coming and people trying to break John Brown out of jail so they did learn their lesson Kristen there were tons of militia surrounding this jail right now Patty I'm going to need you to edit all of this out Guess what I'm editing this episode So Patty can't save you now We're going on a trip to see Norman's sister

And now I'm fud itly upped Me looking stupid can't be edited out of this episode You might just play it on a loop once again You're busting your You're not way too early. I was going to get to that part. Okay. Sorry.

So Governor Henry Wise went to John Brown and his men, looked them in the eye and said, Let's go to court. Love it. I did bust my nut too early. Well played. So yeah, Governor Wise got his wish, and John Brown's trial would begin October 26, 1859, one week after the Harper's Ferry attack. Boy. Even southern newspapers criticized how fast everything was moving.

Yeah, that's ridiculous. One Maryland newspaper commented, There is an evident intention manifested here to hurry the trial through and to execute prisoners as soon as possible. Yeah, do you know how bad you have to be at your job for one of these southern newspapers to be like, I don't know, I think we're going a little too hard on this anti-slavery guy? I say, I say.

You done fucked up, governor wise. Newspaper reporters swarmed the jailhouse at Charlestown, Virginia, where John Brown and his men were being held. And John Brown was loving it. I'm loving it. Yeah. This was his teenage dream. Sure. John Brown was not a great public speaker, but his words were powerful.

Yeah. And if it's in a print newspaper, that's all we mean. Yeah. No one has to hear his flat, nasally speech. And so, yeah, John Brown, he's got a flock of reporters around him listening to his every word. And when they asked him about the speediness of his trial, he was indifferent about it. He said, if you seek my blood, you can have it at any moment without this mockery of a trial. Wow.

I am ready for my fate. Bad ass. Yep. The judge overseeing Brown's trial was Richard Parker. He was an enslaver and a former employee at the federal armory. Okay. Well, doesn't that feel like a conflict of interest? Hmm, I don't know.

What do you mean you don't know? He's an enslaver. Do you think the South gave a shit about conflict of interest? I'm just telling you today in the year of our Lord 2024 that that seems like a conflict of interest. Okay. While giving the jury instructions, he noted the enormity of guilt of the defendants. Well, yeah, because you're conflicted of interest. Who had, quote, invaded our common country.

Okay. He concluded by saying they were entitled to a fair and impartial trial. Let's give these guilty motherfuckers a fair trial. The lead prosecutor was Andrew Hunter. He was also an enslaver and related by marriage to the mayor of Harper's Ferry, who had been killed in the attack. Well, but the mayor was kind of being a dumb dumb. He was kind of being a dumb dumb. I know I'm victim blaming, but he was going around being like, I wonder what's happening now.

And then, you know, eventually you do get shot. John Brown's first two defense lawyers. And notice I say first. because he would go through a few of them. Lawson Bots and Thomas Green. I'm sorry, what was the first name? Lawson Bots. Okay.

They were two local Charlestown lawyers, also both enslavers. Oh, my God. Thomas Green was literally the mayor of Charlestown, Virginia. Okay. John Brown was not a fan of these men. I bet not. Being enslaveders did not help. He wanted to kill both of them,

with a Kansas butter knife. He did. And again, John Brown felt like he didn't even need a defense because the whole trial was a sham. Sure. He didn't really give a shit. On the morning of October 26th, 1859, John Brown and his men filed into the courtroom to hear the charges. So along with John Brown there was sexy as hell buff boy Aaron Stevens, still alive. How is he still alive? He was shot six times, by the way. You know, I've been thinking. thinking about your last episode. Okay, everyone, just for, if you didn't listen to that one, Aaron Stevens is the hottest person who's ever lived until this point.

All everyone, it's all anyone can talk about. He's there part of John Brown's army of threatening boys. The townspeople are terrified. He gets shot to bits. And the only reaction these townspeople have is, my God, look at how sexy he is. Yeah. I was thinking about this today. because I'm just blown away that that was their takeaway was like they couldn't get over how hot he was as he bled out.

Well, he didn't bleed out. I mean, he survived. He was still alive. Do you think? Because, you know, around this time, there's obviously there's not the internet. Probably you don't have a ton of photos of people. So people who saw him were literally like, oh my God, this is the sexiest man I have ever seen and I'm ever going. going to see in my entire life.

I'm about to bust. No, for real. Don't you think that's... Doesn't that explain why this was their reaction? Well, yeah, they were... They're probably... I've never seen such a hot dude before. Yes.

They were transfixed. So Aaron Stevens had been shot six times during the Harper's Ferry raid, and he had to be held up by the bailiffs. I'm sure the bailiffs loved it. Aaron Stevens could barely breathe, but neither could the bailiffs because of how sexy Aaron Stevens was.

Because I can feel you breathe. It's washing over me. And suddenly I'm melting into you. There's nothing left to prove. Baby, all we need is just to be. History hoes, you know what to do? Add it to the playlist. Because I am barely breathing.

Aaron Stevens is. Hard as hell. Ooh, the bailiffs. I'd love to speed run sex with Aaron Stevens. 3.12 seconds done. Beat you again, Aaron. Okay, so Aaron Stevens was there. Also there was John Copeland Jr.

He was one of five black men in John Brown's Army. He was caught trying to escape in the Shenandoah River. Oh, yeah. Yep. Edwin Coppick. He was a Quaker who had joined John Brown's Army back in Springdale, Iowa. and his brother Barclay also joined the army, but he was assigned to guard the Kennedy Farm.

So he escaped with Owen and the other. So Barclay was free, and he would never be captured. Good for him. And finally, there was Shields Green. He was the former enslaved man who was friends with Frederick Douglass, but he joined Brown's army at the last minute. John Brown could also barely stand. His face was still swollen from being.

bashed over the head repeatedly, and they were read their charges, first-degree murder, conspiracy to induce slaves to make insurrection against their masters, and traitorous war and rebellion against Virginia, aka treason. The state treason charge was controversial because none of these men lived in Virginia. Okay. But prosecutor Andrew Hunter argued they could bring the treason charge because, of Brown's Constitution. Oh, this is weak.

They found his Constitution and his Declaration of Independence, and the evidence suggested John Brown wanted to form a new nation and overthrow Virginia's rule of law. And parts of Brown's Constitution were circulated in newspapers, and Virginians found it quite scandalous, Kristen. No, it was the opposite of scandalous. He wanted, like, no sex outside of marriage, no inappropriate, conversations. There's no scandal.

The number one rule in that in that constitution was no slavery. And Virginians loved slavery at this time. But the biggest problem with that constitution was no unlawful sex. Because Virginians, to this day, are horny as hell. You know the phrase for that state is Virginia's for lovers? Yeah. Yeah. They're banging all over the place.

This constitution would have wiped it all away. There'd be nobody left in Virginia. That's right. John Brown would be the first to stay in trial. At the end of the charges hearing, Brown declared himself too weak to return to court. And he also demanded more time to prepare for his case. Sure. But the judge would not allow any delays and denied Brown's request.

The next day on October 27, 1859, John Brown's trial officially began. Kristen, the courtroom was a circus. Hell yeah. There was a monkey. There was a clown. There was an elephant. Untrained, unfortunately. So if you remember, John Brown declared himself too weak to stand trial.

He had to be carried into court on a cot. Yeah. And so most of the days of the trial, he just lay in his cot with his eyes closed and a blanket drawn up to his chin. Hmm. And every now and then he would stay. He'd raise up and he'd say something and then he'd lay back down and close his eyes. I kind of believe he did this for the theatrics. Absolutely he did.

And then I also thought it would be really awkward if he was. Norman. I know where you're going. I know where you're going. He got some morning glory during court. Brown pitching a tent during trial. Excuse me, Mr. Brown. I believe you have an erection.

Yes. I don't deny it. No, that's just a Kansas butter knife. That's just my Kansas butter knife. Judge Richard Parker listened to testimony with his feet up on the table. No, he didn't. Yes. There were peanut shells scattered all over the floor.

What the fuck? Is this a Texas roadhouse? What are we doing here? Like the restaurant? Yes. Lawyers were spitting chewing tobacco everywhere. There were hundreds of spectacles. dictators gathered ground watching.

There's tons of reporters. It was like a circus in here, okay? Listen, I don't know what kind of lame-ass circuses you've been to, but some dude with his feet up and some peanut shells on the floor is not enough, sir. What do you think John Brown's attorneys? What do you think their defense would be? Okay. Well, they're inslavers, so they don't give a fuck.

They're not going to try at all. If they were trying. So here's, okay, if I'm his due to. bag lawyer and I'm going to give half a fiddly fuck. Here's what I'm going to say. He's insane. He can't be held responsible. He's insane.

Lock him up. Give him some edibles, some, what did they give that other guy? Meth? Rice Krispy treats. Morphine. Yeah. The works. Am I right?

Great job, Kristen. You've done it. How is that? I don't know. I just. Great job. Yeah. There we go.

Man, it was right at your fingertips. Okay, John Brown's lawyers, Lawson Bots, and Thomas Green wanted to go with the insanity defense. It was sort of a new tactic in courtrooms at the time. Most notable was New York Congressman Daniel Sickles, who murdered his wife's lover Philip Barton Key, the son of Francis Scott Key, who wrote the National Anthem, by the way. Daniel Sickles pled temporary insanity and was acquitted. Kristen, I believe you covered this case. I did on, I think it was a bonus episode for Let's Go to Quar. Available now at the $5 level on our Patreon.

Oh, business cat. Oh, baby. Lawson Botts presented to the court a telegram from a man who lived in Akron, Ohio, that claimed that John Brown and several members of his family were insane. Insanity is hereditary in that family, it read. In that family alone, huh? Who's this person who's sending this telegram? Is this a doctor who's examined the Browns or just some dude?

Some guy that knew the Browns. Great. John Brown was not having any of this, Kristen. He was not insane. He rose up from his cute little cot. No erection. He was soft. And he said, I am perfectly unconscious of insanity.

That's a weird way of putting it. And I reject so far as I am capable. any attempt to interfere on my behalf on that score. So he basically stood up and said, that's bullshit, I'm not insane. Yeah. It's worth noting that I think we talked about this on one of our recent long walks

about a modern analysis of John Brown's behavior. Mm-hmm. And he does show signs of bipolar. Yeah. He experienced very elevated emotional highs and lows, including violent mood swings. But obviously, it's very hard to die. diagnose a historical figure.

Especially when we have no training in that area. Exactly. We don't know what the fuck we're talking about. In my opinion, I don't think John Brown was insane. Right. Yeah, I think there was something going on for sure. But no, to me, I'm taking it back to what I said earlier. What kind of fucked up society is this that he is deemed the Christ.

crazy one because he wants to end slavery? I mean, at the time. Yeah, I know. Yeah. It's just amazing the inability to look at ourselves in these situations. I was reading parts of Alexis de Tocqueville's Democracy in America book. Yeah, yeah. And he mentioned that one of the pitfalls of democracy is tyranny of the majority.

If a person comes up with a radical new idea, the majority will shoot it down because it's different and not what they're used to. And de Tocqueville definitely saw that as like a bad part of democracy. That progress stalls a lot in a democracy. I mean, it does feel that way. And I think this is a great example of that where abolitionists want to end slavery, which, is a good thing but you know people were so used to it

and relied on it they just like couldn't even well the people in power were so used to it and relied on it and wealthy people yeah well those two kind of go hand in hand

usually anyway okay we don't want to get too slutty in this episode we're really slutting it up here okay so the prosecution

presented their case first I'm not going to go into too much detail about this because I talked about the Harper's Ferry Raid in the last episode, and that's what happened. Yeah. They had a ton of witnesses. They had a ton of evidence against John Brown. The train conductor Andrew Phelps testified. Several combatants from the day testified. Some of Brown's hostages testified, including Lewis Washington.

Oh, I bet he did. The great-grand-nephew of George Washington. They about messed up my floors. He did admit, though, That he was treated well as a hostage and that John Brown frequently told his men do not hurt civilians. Well, that's pretty awesome. Yeah. But there was a shitty witness.

It was John Alstadt. He was an enslaver and also a hostage. He put his racism on full display. He testified that the enslaved people that John Brown had armed with those Kansas butter knives, they basically did nothing. And many just slept the whole time. Well, Southerners in the courtroom laughed. They delighted in the stereotype that black people were lazy and that John Brown was an idiot thinking that he could arm them and they would fight in his army. Oh, I totally didn't understand what you were saying at first.

No one else in the trial witnessed this happening. So it was clearly made up by John Allstead. Wow. It's amazing what the stereotypes were. you've got other people doing all of your labor for you and they're lazy. Yeah. Okay. For the defense, this was a pretty hopeless case.

Since John Brown denied he was insane, his attorneys could only argue one thing. Yeah, what can they argue? Do you want to take a guess? Hang on. Okay, so let me think. What would I? Well, you can't really argue that. the laws are unjust and therefore we have a right to fight against them because that's not that's not a defense in a court of law granted i only went to one semester of law school

what do you think hang on i'm thinking i need the jeopardy sound on here i know i know i know i'm sorry do i have something else hang on that might work um oh okay here's here's another tactic but john brown's not going to go for this at all leader of this. Someone else was in control. I know. I know. No, Kristen. They argued self-defense.

But he started it. John Brown never intended to hurt anyone. He treated his hostage as well. Obviously, that's not a good argument because Brown's men had killed five people and wounded nine others. Well, and also, I mean, when you take over a federal armory, you kind of are prepared, or it's reasonable to expect that, yeah, there will be violence. Yeah. It was not a good defense.

His lawyers, Lawson-Bots and Thomas Green basically gave up on John Brown. He was not being cooperative. He wouldn't listen to their legal advice. And so they withdrew from the case. And John Brown was more than happy to see them go. I see, now I was going to, I was assuming that he fired them. But that's interesting that they withdrew. No, they said, all right, forget it.

That left only one defense lawyer. His name was George Hoyt. Oh, thank God. If you were going to tell me another man named John showed up, I was going to flip this table. Okay. George Hoyt. He's a young 21-year-old. He was described as a beardless boy.

A non-threatening boy if I've ever heard of one. There is no doubt, Kristen, he was non-threatening. My kind of guy. They did not call him a beardless boy. A beardless boy. Boy, that'll make you feel like nothing. George Hoyt had just arrived from the New England area. He was sent by John Brown's abolitionist allies to assist in his defense.

But George Hoyt had another objective, Kristen. His abolitionist friends couldn't have sent a grown man. Well, hang on. Okay. George Hoyt had another objective. He was going to spy on the jailhouse and see if they could somehow break John Brown out of jail. No way. You beardless boy.

Beardless beautiful boy. Okay. George Hoyt asked Judge Richard Parker for a continuance. He was still getting caught up on everything. He had just arrived. He hadn't even read the indictment. Well, surprisingly, Judge Richard Parker gave him one day to go over everything. That's more than I thought he was going to get.

This gave George Hoyt enough time to bring in two more defense lawyers, Samuel Chilton and Hiram Griswold. Oh, my. Also funded through abolitionist allies. Are these Virginia attorneys or no? No, so one was from Cleveland, Ohio, and the other, I think, was from the New England area. But new legal counsel didn't really help John Brown's case. All the defense could do was bring up witnesses who spoke of Brown's treatment of hostages,

and they could argue technical points about the jurisdiction of the case. You know, they said... Well, and they don't know Virginia law. either. I mean, that's a pretty big disadvantage. You know, they said John Brown wasn't guilty of treason because he didn't live in Virginia. He wasn't trying to incite a slave rebellion. He was only trying to free enslaved people. Big difference, Kristen. Well, but he got all those weapons. Yeah. And John Brown's men didn't murder people. Victims of the Harper's ferry raid were battlefield casualties.

Who were murdered by John Brown's men. I mean, I'm on their side, but God damn. Yeah. Yeah. Closing arguments ended at 1.30 p.m. on Monday, October 31st, two weeks since the raid. The jury took 45 minutes. John Brown was guilty on all counts. Yeah. On November 2nd, John Brown attended his sentencing hearing. Judge Richard Parker asked Brown if he wanted to say anything before his sentencing. Boy, he was super happy. Hope everyone has plenty of peanuts. This is going to be a long one.

He said, grab the mic, clear his throat. He rose from his cot to deliver the speech. Sure. I'm going to paraphrase it a bit. Well, I hope so. I bet he talked for hours. He talked for like five minutes. I never did intend to murder or treason, or the destruction of property, or to excite or incite the slaves to rebellion, or to make insurrection.

Had I so interfered in behalf of the rich, the powerful, the intelligent, it would have been all right. Every man in this courtroom would have deemed it an act worthy of reward rather than punishment. If it is deemed necessary that I should forfeit my life for the furtherance of the ends of justice and mingle my blood farther with the blood of my children and the blood of millions in this slave country whose rights are disregarded by wicked, cruel, and unjust enactments, I say, let it be. be done. Wow.

Go ahead and kill me. Pretty moving. Yep. Judge Parker was not moved by Brown's words and sentenced him to death by hanging. The execution was scheduled to take place in a month, December 2nd, 1859. John Brown's courtroom speech did have some factual errors. He definitely did want to incite a slave rebellion. Absolutely.

But his speech would be reprinted word for word in newsbe. papers across the country, and public opinions slowly began to shift in favor of John Brown. He had put forth a profound question to the American people. Why was it a crime to fight for enslaved people's freedom? Right. His actions at Harper's Ferry were not insurrection. He was making the ultimate sacrifice for liberty and justice. For all. writer John J. Chapman summed it up very well when he wrote that the public shuddered not only with horror but with awe. The raid took place. It took place not in Kansas a long way off, but within a few miles of Washington. Innocent men were killed. No one could tell whether a slave insurrection would follow.

A wave of panic swept across the south and something not unlike panic across. the north. The key note was struck. There was no doubt about that anywhere. That's really amazing. And his speech was incredible. He's saying, go ahead and make me a martyr. Yep. And the judge... I will shed my blood with millions of others who have shed their blood in this slave country. He had no problem with that. And the judge is too stupid to see. See, if he'd given him life in prison, that would have taken so much power away from this moment. Yep. After John Brown's speedy trial and his courtroom theatrics and a shifting public perception,

the Republican Party changed their opinion on John Brown. They now saw John Brown as courageous, faithful, noble. John Brown and his men dared and died for what they felt to be right, though in a manner which seems to us fatally wrong. So it was kind of like they were saying, yeah, Brown's intentions were really good, but we would never use violence. I mean, I get that. Yeah, I don't want to shoot some dude's dick off either.

Yeah. Well, it depends on the dude. So the next trials were for three other men in John Brown's army. Edwin Coppick, the Quaker from Iowa. John Copeland Jr., the free black man from Ohio. and Shields Green, the former enslaved man. They all faced the same charges as John Brown. But interestingly enough, charges of treason were dropped against the two black men, Shields Green and John Copeland, Jr.

Okay, why? Their defense lawyer argued that as black men, they were not citizens and therefore could not commit treason. Fuck, yes, I love that. The prosecution agreed and dropped the treason charges. Wow. Loop hold you. Mm-hmm. But it didn't matter.

They were all found guilty, and they were all sentenced to death. Their execution was scheduled to take place two weeks after John Browns. And now we come to the trial of John Cook. He was a jack of all trades, Kristen. Uh-huh. Spy, lover, husband. And I want to add one more description to that list. a fucking snitch.

Oh, John, I knew it. I knew it. You had a bad vibe about him. The first time I even talked about him when he was like, oh, let me go to Harper's Ferry. I'll spy on everybody and I'll tell you what's going on. And you were like, I don't like this guy. I don't, I, he was putting himself out there on his little solo mission. He wanted to be the star of the show.

This little shit stain was squawking like a parrot. But the story had already been told. He wrote a 25-page confession that implicated the Secret Six and downplayed his own role in the raid on Harper's Ferry. And he even brought in his own legal defense team because John Cook's sister was married to the governor of Indiana, Ashel P. Willard. And Willard personally went to Charlestown, Virginia, with an attorney for John Cook's defense. So this was, the cooks were just a very sexy family. Yeah. Just marrying.

His sister was named Celine Cook and she was married to the governor of Indiana. John Cook's lawyers argued that he was a, quote, wayward misled child. Whoa. How old is he? That was exploited by a crazy old man. How old is John Cook at this point? He's in his 20s. Yeah.

And he's a father. He's a husband. No, you're not a child. You're not a beardless boy. Mm-hmm. Nice try. You ready for more of their arguments? Yes.

John Cook simply obeyed nothing more. John Cook had a, quote, face for a mother to love and a sister to idolize. What the fuck does that have to do with anything? Also, John Cook had changed his mind on slavery. Oh. Since John Brown's raid failed, slavery was actually totally fine and it's here to stay. Eat my ass, John Cook. What a dumb fuck.

Sniff my butthole. That's right. John Cook, I hope that we can revive your corpse in time for this curry to really do its damage. Your shit on his face? I would. After all this, oh, now slavery's okay? Well, despite the stirring defense, the jury didn't give two shits. They found...

But did they see his lovely face? They found John Cook guilty and sentenced him to death as well. Okay, well, I'm not going to say good. I wanted to mention one more person that was arrested and brought to Charlestown, Virginia. Last episode I mentioned an enslaved man named Ben. Mm-hmm. He was put on guard duty during John Brown's attack, and he was stationed at the rifle factory when the militia stormed it. Ben immediately threw down his knife on a stick, and he surrendered.

Sadly, Ben died in his jail cell only a week after being captured. Oh. According to his death certificate, he died from, quote, pneumonia and fright. Oh. His mother, who came to the jail cell to console him, also died a few weeks later from a very similar ailment. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. What do you think that's about?

I'm not really sure. I mean, it's totally possible that he got sick and he died and his mother caught whatever Ben had. That's totally possible. But the way it was described was like, Ben. was just scared to death. Well, and I'm sure conditions in this jail were not good. No, definitely not. They knew nothing about germs at this time.

Yeah. So, yeah, I bet he wasn't being fed well. I bet he wasn't being well taken care of, and I'm sure diseases can spread very easily. After Ben and his mother died, their enslaver, John Allstott, one of Brown's hostages, he petitioned the state of Virginia for compensations. Oh, oh, I've found a new man who can eat my ass while I have the Curry explosion.

He claimed Ben was worth $1,450, $55,000 today, and he claimed his mother was worth $600, $23,000 today. It's unclear if John Allstott was ever compensated. Who's going to get Shad on first? John Allstott or John Cook? John Allstead. Yes. John Cook can get the splatter. You'll get the splash damage.

The final two men in John Brown's Army were sexy as fuck buff boy Aaron Stevens. Well, he's got to be barely living at this point. And Albert Hazlitt, he was the guy who tried to escape with Osborne Anderson, but he got tired and was captured. Because he was in the boat the whole time should have gotten out of the road. Osborne was like, can we please get out of the boat? this boat. We're on land now. Governor Henry Wise decided to delay their trials

because he wanted to try them in federal court. Oh. Okay. Because he hoped with federal help they could link the whole Harper's Ferry raid with abolitionists from the north and punish them as well. Oh. But ultimately

that plan fell through and they would be tried in a Virginia state court, but it was delayed until next year, which was probably a good thing for Aaron Stevens because he was in really bad shape at this time. Well, he was in excellent shape. We all know that. I'm about to bust.

We need to stop talking about Aaron Stevens so much because I'm getting too turned on over here. Yeah. I'm sweating. I understand completely. And the listeners are just a mess right now. You know, some people listen to this podcast while they walk their dogs while they're at work, while they're cooking while they're cleaning. They can't be horny as hell while they do all. While they're making love.

What if you're making love and you shout out, oh, Aaron Stevens. Oh. And your husband's name is Tom. Oh, God. Who's Aaron Stevens? And then. Nobody. Tom Googles Aaron Stevens.

And he's like, well, I guess I do understand, but I'm still hurt. And we've got to talk about this in therapy this way. And then you have to go to therapy with your husband. And no one wants that. Meanwhile, the beardless boy, George Hoyt, he continued to try and fight for John freedom. He met with a Republican congressman from Maryland named Montgomery Blair. Hmm. Montgomery Blair suggested that maybe Governor Henry Wise would put John Brown in an asylum if they could just prove that, yeah, John Brown definitely was insane. So George Hoyt traveled the

country for the next month collecting affidavits from people who knew John Brown, and people were claiming all sorts of things. No, no, no, the solution. Either we bust him the fuck out of jail or he dies and becomes a martyr. We don't want him in the asylum eating Rice Krispy treats. That sounds like a fun time. It's a sin. I guarantee you John Brown would think it was a sin. Sugar is a sin. Yeah. Rice Krispy treats are a sin. So are dirty jokes and, you know, getting a boner in front of the jury. Well, these affidavits claimed all sorts of things. Insanity ran in Brown's family. He exhibited erratic behavior. His quote, penchant for wild and desperate projects was proof that he had an unsound mind.

Well, I mean, he did love desperate and unsound projects. One man specifically mentioned John Brown's wool business in Springfield, Massachusetts. Okay, that was episode one or episode two? Episode one. You've got to be crazy to think that would work, Kristen. I mean, sure. Imagine if the wool business is what saved John Brown's life. And he would feel vindicated. He'd be like, I knew I should have held on to that wool. Vindicated.

I am selfish. I am wrong. Add it to the playlist. So these affidavits were collected and sent to Governor Henry Wise. And Governor Wise had also received many letters from people asking him not to execute John Brown. And many of the letters were from Southerners. And they said hanging John Brown would make him a martyr and inspire others to emulate his actions.

I mean, they're right. But Governor Wise denied a stay to Brown's execution. Not very wise, after all. Beardless boy, George Hoyt brought the news to John Brown in his jail cell, and John Brown rejoiced. Woo-hoo! He said, let them hang me. I am worth inconceivably more to hang than for end.

any other purpose. George Hoyt then proposed sneaking John Brown out of jail, but John Brown said no. Yeah. Escape was impossible anyway because the jail and the surrounding areas were heavily guarded by 800 militia. Yeah. Anyone would be a fool to think that there was like one dude out there and maybe he was napping. For the last month of his life, John Brown sat in a jail cell awaiting his execution. He kept busy, though. He wrote letters to friends, to family, to newspapers, to politicians, and he spoke with visitors, even people who hated him.

Well, yeah, he loved to do that. He loved to disagree with people and argue. Many people were just curious to talk to the man who wanted to violently end slavery, and Brown was happy to converse with anybody. However, Brown did refuse any visits from Southern clergymen. Oh. Many had come to pray for his soul. Yeah, fuck off. But John Brown said fuck off because they had violated the laws of nature and God by justifying slavery. Brown ultimately blamed himself for the failed plan.

He replayed the events of the attack in his head. He should have held the B&O Railroad Bridge. He didn't believe anyone would attack him if he had hostages. and he blamed his own compassion for letting that train go and caring too much for the well-being of his hostages. But none of it mattered to Brown because he believed in predestination. It was God's plan that the mission failed and he would die for it. You told me something interesting several weeks ago,

which was that before the Civil War, there was this time period in America where people thought of death differently. than we do now. Specifically in battle. Yeah. Yeah. So could you talk about that?

Because I feel like that sheds some light here on his mindset. Americans considered it an honor and glorious and noble to die in battle, die fighting for your country. And people still do. Well, sure, of course. But then the American Civil War happened. And this is during a time where now photography is a thing. and the battlefield is your backyard. Yeah.

And now people are seeing up close and personal what war is really like. Well, and you know people who are dying. You know people who are wounded. It's not just like, oh, some legend or a friend of a friend of a friend who you now hold in very high regard. It's affecting everyone. Over 600,000 people died in the American Civil War. everybody knew somebody who died in that war and they saw up close and personal

what war was like you know people marched off to battle thinking I'm going to die a glorious death many men died from disease in camp or they were just blasted by a cannonball or just shot by a random bullet coming from somewhere and like there was no like honorable charge or anything it was it was chaotic

Yeah. And war's chaos and death and destruction and horrible. So, yeah, people's feelings on death really changed after the Civil War. But, yeah, I bring it up just because at this point, you know, I just think this makes sense for John Brown. First of all, he wants to be a martyr. This is something he's had in his head for a long time, I'm sure. And the other thing is, like, he's had so many family members die. He has seen death up close.

Yeah. Yeah. You know, he had been fighting in Kansas since 1856. But he also, you know, there was that, I can't remember if it was like a week-long period where four of his children died. And he was so weak he had to bury them all together because he couldn't dig in all those graves. Like, yeah. I imagine him feeling like, well, what better reason to die than this? Exactly.

As John Brown's execution date approached, Governor Henry Wise declared martial law. Well, he didn't actually declare martial law. He basically declared martial law. Anyone who didn't have a specific reason to be in Jefferson County during that time would be arrested. Oh. He called in the state militia to guard the area. And he also dispersed souvenir sellers that were at the Harper's Ferry Railroad Station. A few vendors had gotten a hold of some of the first.

Brown's Knife's Knife's on a Stick, and they were selling them as souvenirs. A tour company from Boston tried to organize a group visit to witness John Brown's execution, but it was denied. The souvenir industry in this time is so weird to me. Get your knives on a stick, yeah. Well, I mean, I get that, but, like, this was a time when, like, they'd rip part of your clothes so they could have a scrap of fabric. Or try to cut your hair.

Yes. Yep. On the afternoon of December 1st, John Brown's wife, Mary, arrived in Charlestown to visit him before his execution. She had actually wanted to come earlier, but Brown begged her not to. He didn't want her to waste any money, and he was concerned about her emotional well-being. Yeah. But he was certainly glad to see Mary now. For minutes, they hugged silently.

After having dinner together, Mary told John, goodbye. May heaven have mercy on you. On the morning of December 2nd, John Brown wrote up a will, and then he visited his men who were in nearby cells. He wanted to say goodbye. Yeah. But he also found time to admonish John Cook. Good.

You have made false statements, he told Cook. Cook replied, Your memory is very different from mine. Oh, shut up. They argued for a few minutes, but then John Brown stopped. There was no point. They were all going to die for the cause. Yeah.

Lastly, John Brown visited his faithful, sexy buff boy, Aaron Stevens. They embraced, and Stevens said, Goodbye, Captain. I know you are going to a better land. Yeah. I love Aaron Stevens. I do too. What a faithful buff boy.

We could all use an Aaron Stephen in our life. Yeah, some really hot guy who has good morals. All right. Will you lift me up and down repeatedly, sir? At 11 a.m., jailers wrapped a rope around John Brown's body and his arms, and he hopped into a wagon containing a black walnut coffin. It was his coffin. It also served as his seat for the ride to the gout.

As the wagon rolled along, John Brown looked out at the breathtaking countryside and mountains that surrounded him. This is a beautiful country, he said. I never had the pleasure of seeing it before. The gallows were built in a 40-acre field full of rye. Authorities wanted to make sure John Brown's hanging spot would not become a sacred spot for abolitionists. Over 800 militia stood guard all around the gallows, including a young volunteer of the Richmond Gray's militia, John Wilkes Booth. Oh. Fun fact about that. John Wilkes Booth was not actually a member of the Richmond Graves. During this time, he was in Richmond getting ready to act in a play when he saw the militia boarding

a train for Charlestown, and when he heard they were on their way to John Brown's execution, he borrowed a uniform and hopped on the train. Booth would later admit that John Brown. inspired him to commit violence for a cause he believed in. Oh, shut up. He did not. He did. No, I don't believe it.

That's what I'm telling you. He did that to be like, see, ha. For the same reason that the fucking daughters of the Confederacy put up that faithful slave monument. Yeah. Just to stick the knife in and twist it. John Brown made his way up the gallows. Jailers tied a noose around his neck and put on a hood to cover his face. Brown was placed atop the trap door, and he had to wait 10 minutes for all the militiamen to fall into rank.

During the long wait, Brown didn't tremble or move an inch. Finally, they were ready. The sheriff cut the rope holding the trap door, and Brown plunged through the floor. The rope did not break his neck. He struggled for five minutes. Oh. And then his body went limp. John Brown was dead.

Plack alert. Despite the governor not wanting John Brown's hanging site to be memorialized, it was. I was going to ask, how did it being in a field stop it from being memorialized? What was his thinking there? It was in a 40-acre field. So there's no landmark to identify. I see. You know, it would have been much harder to identify where it was.

Okay. Well, at John Brown's hanging site is a marker with information on his execution. It's on the property of a Victorian brick house that was built in 1892, and it was built for a Mr. John T. Gibson, and he was in charge of the Virginia militia the day John Brown was executed. Wow. So he built his house right where John Brown was executed, so he would know where it was.

But now it's memorialized. Well, suck on that, John T. Gibson. John Brown's body was placed in the black walnut coffin, and Mary Brown boarded a train with it to Philadelphia. In Philadelphia, there was a massive crowd gathered at the train station awaiting John Brown's arrival. The mayor feared a riot, and he arranged for a decoy coffin to be carried through the city, while Mary in the real coffin made their way to North Elba, New York. John Brown was buried at his farmhouse, and he remains there today. Towns across the country mourned John Brown's death.

Church bells rang. There were hundred guns salutes, prayer meetings, lectures. Akron, Ohio closed all businesses that day. One woman went to John Brown's birthplace in Torrington, Connecticut. By then, an Irish family was living there, and they had no idea who John Brown was. But they graciously allowed this woman to tour the home, and they even let her take a door latch as a souvenir. Really?

In Boston, 4,000 people attended a ceremony honoring John Brown. And one of the speakers was William Lloyd Garrison, the pacifist

abolitionist who opposed John Brown's methods of violence. But he had now changed his view. He said, in firing his gun,

John Brown has merely told what time of day it is. It is high noon. Wow. Two weeks after John Brown's death on December 16, 1859, four of Brown's men were executed. First were the two

remaining black men in John Brown's army, John Copeland Jr. and Shields Green. John Copeland's father wrote to Governor Wise, asking if he could claim his son's body after his hanging. Governor Wise said yes, but he couldn't do it. Why? You cannot come to this state yourself, said Governor wise. Racism. He had to send a white agent to claim his son's body. Sadly, after their hangings, John Copeland Jr. and Shields Green's bodies were taken to the medical college in Winchester for dissection, just like Watson Brown. When an agent for John Copeland's father went to the medical college to retrieve his son's body, the students refused to give it to him. Oh, my God. John Copeland Jr.'s funeral and

in Oberlin, Ohio was attended by 3,000 people, and the casket was empty. Is this school still around today? We'll get to it. Okay. That sound means. Plack alert. In 1865, a monument was put up in Oberlin, Ohio, dedicated to John Copeland, Jr., Shields Green, and Lewis Leary, three of the five black men who served in John Brown's Army.

On the monument, it reads, These colored citizens of Oberlin, the heroic associates of the immortal John Brown, gave their lives for the slave. In Latin, it reads, et nunt servitude atium mortua est laos deo. And now slavery is finally dead. Thanks be to God.

You know, I took Latin in high school. I know. I expected you to be better at that. I thought I heard something about an ATM in there. My Latin's a little rusty. The next two men to hang were Edwin Coppick, the Quaker, and John Cook, the little snitch shit-stain. No plaques for him.

They had actually tried to escape from jail the night before. They had borrowed a knife from a guard to cut a lemon, and they used it to chisel a hole in the wall of their jail cell. How big was the hole? Did they even have that poster from Shockroom Redemption? What are they going to do? I didn't have a Raquel Wells poster. They hit it behind the stove, like the whatever heats the room. Sure.

Yeah, it was behind there. Heated blanket. They just plugged it into the wall. From the sunbeam heated blanket. Coppick and Cook ran to escape, but were greeted by a 15-foot wall surrounding the jail. They climbed a pile of lumber, which was actually the lumber that was John Brown's gallo. They had disassembled it. Okay.

And they scaled the wall. Local militia immediately spotted them, and they were returned to their cells. Well, they got pretty far. I mean... Mm-hmm. Okay. On his way to the gallows, John Cook called out to his neighbors from Harper's Ferry, saying, Remember me, to all my friends at the ferry.

Edwin Copick and John Cook died an hour after John Copeland Jr. in Shields Green. Albert Hazlett and sexy buff boy Aaron Stevens had their trial in February of 1860 By now Aaron Stevens had recovered from his six gunshot wounds How! He's buff as hell, Kristen. The bullets bounced right off of him probably. Off his pecks.

Yeah. Beow, beo, boom! And now that John Brown was dead, Aaron Stevens became the center of attention. Well, yeah, because he was so hot. Right? Reporters continued to heap praise on his appearance. Oh, my God.

Such black and penetrating eyes. Such an expansive brow. Such a grand chest and limbs. Oh, my God. Sexy times. No kidding, Dad. Aaron Stevens also received many letters from women. Oh, well, of course.

Mm. Albert Hazlitt and Aaron Stevens were both found guilty. Did Albert feel a little bad about himself? I bet he did. I mean, you couldn't help. What about me, ladies? Yeah, what if Albert was, like, actually, you know, fairly above average looking? And he'd always caught me.

I guess I'm a pretty good size, too. Yeah, he'd always caught glimpses, like, oh, yeah. All of a sudden, next to Aaron Stevens, he ain't shit. He's probably, like, flexing a little, leaning against the wall. Like, oh, hey. Look at my penetrating eyes. Hey, reporters, what about me? I mean, I do have to say it is pretty amazing that his body still looked incredible

after six bullets. He was eating plenty of gruel in that jail cell, Kristen, getting his muscles back in the shape. Yeah, he had some protein powder. I remember when I was working out, like when I first started working out, I went to Walmart to get some protein, and I saw that they had Snickers protein bars. And I was like, wow, you know, I love Snickers. Well, sure. And so I bought a ton of them, and they were delicious. But they're like the worst protein bar in the world.

Of course, because it's so much sugar. It's just candy. It was a Snickers bar with some weight protein in it. Did Joel kick your ass over that? This was like before you and I started dating. Oh, excuse me. Who were you trying to get buck for? This was during my hoe phase, Kristen.

Okay. Did you lure in anybody? Well, you. And I was like, he looks like the type of man who eats a lot of snobes. Knickers bars. Yeah, I did. Albert Hazlett and Aaron Stevens were both found guilty, and Aaron Stevens expressed no regret, saying, When I think of my brothers slaughtered and my sisters outraged, my conscience does not reprove me for my actions.

I shall meet my fate manfully. Indeed, he did. He did, however, write to his brother that he wished he could live a little longer. I have a desire to live yet a while, for I am young and have just learned how to live. Oh. That broke my heart for some reason when I read that. Well, not for some reason. He's a young guy.

He's just figuring himself out. It took an attack on a small Virginia town. Tale is old as time. Tale is old as time. You don't know how to live until you've attacked a small town in Virginia. It is, you know, there is something to be said for like, John Brown had lived a lot of life and a lot of these other guys hadn't. Yeah. A March 16th, 1860, Albert Hazlitt and Aaron Stevens died at the gallows.

According to witnesses, Albert Haslitt died immediately, broke his neck, while Aaron Stevens struggled for a considerable time and appeared to suffer very much. Oh, gosh. Why can't they just shoot people? Yeah. The bullets would have bounced off him and hit one of the guys trying to shoot him. That would be great. The trials and executions of John Brown and his men were officially over. Many of Brown's men were buried next to him in North Elba, New York.

Most people would think that John Brown's last act in life was dying at the gallows. But he had one more trick up his sleeve. What do you mean? The morning of his death, a jailer had asked John Brown, Brown for his autograph before his execution. Brown spent some time scribbling on a piece of paper, folded it up, and put it in the jailer's pocket. After his execution, the jailer finally pulled out that piece of paper and read it. He did get John Brown's autograph, but he also got more. Brown had written him a note. I, John Brown, am now quite certain that the crimes of this guilty land

will never be purged away but with blood. Of course, John Brown's prophecy came true. During the election of 1860, Republican Abraham Lincoln won the presidency, despite not even being on the ballot in 11 southern states. Wow. One writer commented, Now that the black radical Republicans have the power, I suppose they will brown us all.

Wow. To protect the peculiar institutions, institution, Southern states began seceding and formed their own country, the Confederate States of America, launching the United States into a bloody civil war over slavery. During the first year of the war, Secret Six member Samuel Howe and his wife, Julia Ward Howe, were staying at the Willard Hotel in Washington, D.C. Oh, my God. We've been there. We have been to the Willard.

Beautiful hotel. right smack in the middle of all the fun stuff in Washington, D.C. Highly recommend it. We stayed there because I googled it, and I was very excited. Yeah. And I got a deal through Costco.com. Very expensive. It was.

Do you remember when you threatened me in the Willard Hotel? With what? Twas late one night. And as you know, as my husband slash lover, I like to snack. I like to have a snack attack. at about 10 p.m. every night. And we didn't have any snacks. We just had like the hotel mini bar stuff.

And I was about to eat some. And you were like, don't you dare! Because a bag of chips was like $7. It was $12.50, I think. I think I remember. And you were just like, don't. No. So yeah, Secret Six member Samuel Howe and his wife, Julia Ward Howe, were staying at the Willard

Hotel in Washington, D.C. From her hotel room window, Julia could hear a troop of Massachusetts its volunteers marching to an interesting song. John Brown's body lies a moldering in the grave. John Brown's body lies a moldering in the grave. He's gone to be a soldier in the army of the Lord. His soul goes marching on. I am, see, this is a song I swear I've not heard before,

but when you started this series on John Brown, so many people mentioned that song. And I mean, you brought it up too, I think, in the first episode. Yeah. One listener said her mother used to sing the John Brown song to her in the car. Yeah. Which is very odd. But anyway, Julia Ward Howe was an accomplished writer and poet, and she was inspired by the marching song, and she decided to write up new lyrics.

Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord He trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored Oh my God He hath loose the fateful lightning of his terrible swift sword His truth is marching on Glory, glory hallelujah Glory glory hallelujah Glory glory hallelujah

Glory I cannot believe that I thought that that song came first and then the John Brown thing came after. Nope. Wow. Julia Ward Howe sold her song, The Battle Hym of the Republic, to the Atlantic Monthly for $4. About $160 today. All right. It skyrocketed in popularity and would become the anthem of the Union Army during the Civil War.

They say she was the Taylor Swift of her generation. Isn't it true that they say that? I'm trying to think of a Taylor Swift song I can parody here. Wow. You can't think of... Baby, you'll take me on a raid to Harper's Fairy. Free the enslaved and kill some people enslavers. Wow.

Sorry, that was terrible. It wasn't very good. The first slave was pretty good. I don't know about you. I'm feeling slavery. It needs to end today. You're feeling slavery? No, you had to.

There was a pause. Taylor, no. Taylor, stop. You have to listen to the whole song. In 1862, during the Civil War, the Union Army raided the Winchester Medical College, where the bodies of Watson Brown, John Copeland Jr. and Shields Green had been sent. They were able to recover the body of Watson Brown. He had been absolutely mutilated.

They could not find John Copeland, Copeland Jr. or Shields Green's bodies. The soldiers burned the medical college to the ground as revenge. Watson Brown was eventually buried next to his father in North Elbe, New York. That's amazing. The American Civil War began as a fight to preserve the Union, but it soon became a fight to end slavery. By the war's end, more than 600,000 people were dead. After the war on December 18, 1865, the third,

13th Amendment was ratified, officially abolishing slavery in the United States. Soon to follow was the 14th Amendment, which provided citizenship and equal protection under the law for everyone. Finally, the 15th Amendment, which gave black men the right to vote. Sorry, ladies. Not there yet. Men always come first. We've already covered that on this episode. Yes. In 1881, John Brown's old friend, Frederick Douglass, who was now 63 years old, visited Harper's Ferry to give a speech at Storer College. Storer College was founded in 1867 as a normal school for black students, which, Kristen, we recently learned, was another name for a teaching school. I hope you're not trying to rope me into some kind of mistakes of shame segment.

Mistakes of shame. All right, Kristen, time for you to fess up. I will not. Okay, so here's the deal, everyone. In my Carrie Nation episode, I mentioned that she went to a normal school, which I said sounded like it was something that aliens would start trying to appear normal. You know, oh, let's set up town in Humansville, Missouri, start a normal school. and people did come forward and say that a lot of teaching schools were referred to as normal schools. They tried to put me in a mistakes of shame, and now here you are trying to put me in a mistakes of shame.

I maintain that all of these teaching schools that were called normal schools, it's weird. So it's still weird. So you're denying any mistake. I deny any mistake. I am John cooking this whole thing. So yes, in 1881, Frederick Douglass visited Harper. Ferry to give a speech at Storer College, which was a normal school for black students. Frederick Douglass pointed out that Harper's Ferry was the perfect place for this institution,

since it was the town where, quote, the end of American slavery began. And in his speech, Douglas praised his old friend John Brown more than anyone else had done before. He proudly proclaimed, His zeal in the cause of my race was far greater than mine. it was as the burning sun to my tapered light. I could live for the slave, but he could die for him. And that's the story of John Brown. Wow. You made me cry again.

Oh, that was incredible. Thank you. I did want to recommend some sources for people who want to get real fucking slutty about John Brown. How slutty can people be? We just, well, you just presented a four-part episode. How many hours do you think this is if you put it all together? I think total would be probably eight to nine hours. So you're thinking somebody's going to get to hour nine and be like,

I got to know more. Not deep enough, big boy. Okay, I have some recommendations. If you want a great page Turner, Midnight Rising by Tony Horwitz, Rest in Peace, is the book you want to read. It is fantastic. And if you're watching the video, I have it placed back here. Behind a statue of Garfield and a drinking bird.

If you want something a little meatier, like a rotiss-free chicken or something, check out to purge this land with blood by Stephen Oates. Also rest in peace. He goes into a little more detail. If you want Fogo de Chowl full meat belly buster, you have to read John Brown abolitionist. The Man Who Killed S. Civil War by David S. Reynolds.

I know that's the mediest one because it has the mediest title. It is meaty as hell. If you'd like to watch something about John Brown, maybe you're not a big reader like myself. PBS had an American Experience episode. It's about one hour. It's called John Brown's Holy War. There's a bootleg version of it on YouTube.

Okay. Fantastic documentary. If you want more of an entertaining watch, I highly recommend the good Lord Bird. Oh, that's right. It was a mini-series starring Ethan Hawk. It's based on a novel. And it's the story of John Brown told through the eyes of a 12-year-old enslaved boy. So it kind of starts out with, they're in Kansas, and this enslaved boy.

boy's dad dies and John Brown rescues him. And it goes through all the events in John Brown's life told through the kids' point of view. Yeah. It's fantastic. And it's very entertaining. Stars Ethan Hawk. Unfortunately, it came out in 2020, like right when COVID hit. So it didn't get a lot of press, but it's very good.

You can get it on Amazon Prime, but you have to pay for it. It's like a buck an episode, though. Okay. So, yeah. there you go folks that was incredible i'm so glad you told this story um we should all know way more about him it is such an injustice that we have all these fucking monuments to these confederate dipsets and not enough plaques for john brown we do need more plaques for john brown you know what i'm going to put one in the backyard right now this this plaques dedicated to john brown

John Brown. John Brown was in Kansas, and this is Missouri, and he didn't like Missouri. Future owners of this home will be very confused about the plaque. They'll be like, so what's the connection exactly? You know, when you and I went to Osawatomy to visit the John Brown Museum, you made fun of their little statue for John Brown. He did look kind of puny in that statue. I think you've got to be real careful with the statues.

I think you've got to have the budget. for a big one. You need like an Aaron Stevens type of statue. Well, yeah, it needs, first of all, it needs to be at least human and a half is my feeling. If I go up to your statue and I outweigh it and I out height it by a mile, I'm not going to be like, whoa, who was this guy? I'm going to be like, hey, their little fella. John Brown was so cute. Yeah, and he wasn't so cute.

He was big buff boy. Cheeby John Brown. We need like a hello kitty version of John Brown. I do understand though that like, you know, budgets are tight. Tight like Aaron Stevens. Finally developed muscles. Absolutely. I do want to, before we end this, I do have to do something.

What's that? Mistakes. Of shame. Are you going to do it like I did mine where I basically did not. everything. No, I'm a non-threatening boy. I own up to everything. You take accountability for everything. A couple episodes ago, I claimed that Philadelphia didn't have a lot of plaques. It was lacking in plaques. Yeah, which when you said it, I was kind of like, hmm, that is an outright lie. I apologize. I guess I just wasn't paying that much attention during my one day in Philadelphia.

There's a shitload of plaques in Philadelphia. Yeah. Yeah. So I apologize to all you Philadelphians. The next time I'm in Fishtown, I'll buy you a beer. Non-alcoholic, of course. Wow. Kristen, any last words? Are you going to execute me? I'm going to assassinate you. Yeah, I did want to say something because we were talking about this last night. I revised my opinion. At the end of the last episode, you asked me kind of my thoughts on,

did John Brown intend for the raid to go the way it was? went, was this all a big fuck up, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Yeah. My revised opinion that we talked about last night is like, I just think that with these big historic moments or really even smaller moments where it seems like, huh, something unlikely occurred, but it all turned out great in the end. I think we as people just have this inclination to be like, well, that's how they planned it all along. And I don't think that's realistic at all. I don't think it's

black and white. And I think that especially in this case, it seems to me that John Brown had a plan. I don't think he fully appreciated how badly it could go. But at every turn, he made decisions and he made kind of the best decisions he could make in the moment. And ultimately, you know, I think especially at his trial where he's basically like, no, don't try to say I'm insane. I'm not. And telling the judge, go ahead and kill me, make me a martyr. He's making the smartest decisions he can for his cause at every step of the way.

Sure. It's a fair assessment. It's a brilliant assessment from a brilliant woman Brilliant brilliant Thank you Brilliant sexy Glamorous Flying first class up in the sky

Popping champagne Living the life Are we flying first class to your sisters No We don't even have seat selection Kristen They assign us the seats when we get there So maybe they'll put me in first class

And they'll put you all the way in the back Why on earth would they do that? By the turlots They might say are you the gay gaming historian? Oh, God. And I'll say, Yes.

And I'd say, I'm the gaming historian's wife. I wasn't given a name at birth, just gaming historian's wife. That's all you have to say about me. You had to earn that name, Benny. I would be by the turlets, wouldn't it? You'd be like, she had Curry before she got on the plane? She had Ty Red Curry. Please seat her right this way, ma'am.

Great episode. Thank you. I hope those history hos. out there have learned a little something about our friend John Brown. Yeah. Oh, I want to go to Harper's Ferry so badly. Me too. I've never been.

And it's funny, I didn't realize how close it was to Washington, D.C. Yeah. Because, you know, Harper's Ferry today, it's technically in West Virginia now. Okay. And so when I heard Harper's Ferry West Virginia, I was like, whoa, that's, that's far. Yeah. But it's like right on the tip of West Virginia and Virginia in Maryland. So, yeah, it's super close to Washington, D.C.,

I could have gone to it very easily where I grew up. But you know. But you messed up big time. I'd love to go the engine house where John Brown stood his ground is still there. They've got all the mountains there. And the whole town looks like it hasn't changed since 1859. I'm excited to check it out one day. Yeah.

Maybe we'll make it a bonus video for the patrons. That'd be fun. What if all the history hose rented, we like care of, band. Okay, I talked about this idea with you. Yes. I think it sounds so fun. I proposed field trips.

Yes. So we gather up a bunch of history hose. We get in a small bus. Uh-huh. And Sherey is there with orange slices and Capri Sons. And we go to these historical sites together and we all learn about the history together. For any fresh hose out there. Sherey is my mom.

Her real name is Sherry, but we call her Sherey Ray. and she would absolutely, first of all, you're way wrong to think it would just be orange slices and Capri Sons. Have you ever been anywhere? Turkey sandwiches. Yes. Do you want me to cut the crust off? Because I will. Okay, so we've got three kinds of chips back there.

Now, does anybody need a fresh water? Okay, I've got paper towels here. I have ibuprofen if anyone is a headache. Do you need a plate? We got paper plates here. I always keep them in the glove compartment here. I brought 200 of them. I know there are only 12 of you hoes on this bus.

Yeah. Yeah, we did talk about that would be so much fun to do a little field trip. So, yeah, we'd be like, hey, we're going to, we'll be in Harper's Ferry on this date. And like any of you history hos nearby come meet us and get on the rented bus, the shuttle bus, and we'll head to Harper's Ferry together. So normal podcasts, once they reach a certain level, they go on tour. Not us. We're not going on tour. We get an RV.

Oh, God, an RV. I can't do an RV. We get a giant bus. Uh-huh. And we just bust it up all over this land. We're bussing. That's dirty. Oh, is it?

Busen. What's it mean? Busen means amazing, fantastic, lovely and cool. In other words, extremely good. Yeah. Suck on that. It's not dirty. My food is bussing.

Yeah. You look bussing. Yeah. Let's go there. It's Bussin. My Hot Pocket is Bussing. This definition is from the Today Show, by the way. Thank you, Al Roker for telling us about Bussing. You know, Al Roker writes all those entries himself.

And who's the Smucker's birthday guy? Oh, Wilford Brimley? That's not Wilford Brimley. I'm sorry. Willard Scott? Willard Scott? Willard Scott. Yeah, Willard Scott.

Maybe he'd get on our tour bus. Yeah. It's crazy. Willard Scott was actually in Harper's ferry during John Brown's race. You know what they say about history hoes, Norm? We always cite our sources. That's right, and for this episode, I got my information from Midnight Rising, John Brown in the raid that sparked the Civil War by Tony Horwitz.

To purge this land with blood, a biography of John Brown by Stephen Oates. Five for Freedom, the African American soldiers in John Brown's Army by Eugene Elmire, in the John Brown online exhibit from the West Virginia Archives and History. That's all for this episode. Thank you for listening to an old-timey podcast. Please give us a five-star review wherever you listen to podcasts. Seriously, please do. It helps us a ton.

Yes. Until next time, Tudaloo, Tata, and Cheerio.