An Old Timey Podcast - 52: The Creator of Mother's Day Tried to Destroy it

Episode Date: April 30, 2025

Mother’s Day. When Anna Jarvis founded the holiday, she envisioned it as a day for everyone to honor and thank their mothers. She worked tirelessly to promote the holiday. She hoped it would be celebrated around the globe. But after a few years, Anna noticed that Mother’s Day was becoming… commercialized. Anna was incensed. She went to war against florists, greeting card makers and anyone else who might make a profit on Mother’s Day. Her anger even spilled over onto charities that used the holiday to help fundraise for mothers in need. By the end of her life, Anna Jarvis figured that if she could bring Mother’s Day into this world, she could also be the one to end it.Remember, kids, history hoes always cite their sources! For this episode, Kristin pulled from: “The mother of mother’s day,” by Daniel Mark Epstein for The Philadelphia Inquirer“The founder of mother’s day mostly cared about her own mother,” by Nina Martin for Mother Jones“Anna Jarvis: The woman who regretted creating mother’s day,” by Vibeke Venema for the BBC“Battling the Mother’s Day monster,” The Ottawa Citizen“Why Mother’s Day founder Anna Jarvis later fought to have the holiday abolished,” by Jonathan Mulinix for Mental Floss“How the founder of Mother’s Day died alone, childless and penniless in an insane asylum,” by Laura T. Coffey for Today.com“Who made America?” for PBS.orgAre you enjoying An Old Timey Podcast? Then please leave us a 5-star rating and review wherever you listen to podcasts!Are you *really* enjoying An Old Timey Podcast? Well, calm down, history ho! You can get more of us on Patreon at patreon.com/oldtimeypodcast. At the $5 level, you’ll get a monthly bonus episode (with video!), access to our 90’s style chat room, plus the entire back catalog of bonus episodes from Kristin’s previous podcast, Let’s Go To Court.

Hear ye, hear ye. You are listening to an old-timey podcast. I'm Kristen Caruso. And I'm Normie C. And on this episode, I'll be talking about the woman who started Mother's Day and fought like hell to end it. Oh, what a twist. Yeah, you're not going to see it coming, except you absolutely will because I just said it. Ruin everything. No, this is a wild tale, Norm. You're going to need to buckle up, buddy. When is Mother's Day? Oh, wow. What a terrible son. God, yeah, okay.

Boy, we're just hitting it out of the park, aren't we? Sorry, guys. I know a lot about sports now because of my recent episode. Ah, yeah. Baseball metaphor. Hit it out of the park. Yeah. Yeah, it's in May.

It's the second Sunday in May. Hmm. Okay. I hope you're prepared to write your mother a nice heartfelt letter. I just remember growing up May was like, hell for me because it was not only Mother's Day. Terrible. It was my brother's birthday is in May and my sister's birthday is in May.

And as a little kid with not a lot of money, it just wreaked havoc on my little Snoopy wallet. Did you have a Velcro Snoopy Wall? I did. Oh. Yeah, it was a little Snoopy playing baseball wallet. Oh, I was going to make fun, but you know what? I feel bad for you, Normie C.

I bet you had to hit up that dollar tree and just do what you could. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I remember I got my mom. It was like this like calendar stationary set in like this dark forest green color with flowers and all that. It was very, very late 90s kind of vibe. And a few years ago when we went to visit my mom, I found that stationary set still in the shrink wrap. She never used it.

Wow. Norm, that's got to be worth some money now. You're telling me the dollar tree stuff was still shrink-wrapped. Get thee to eBay, make a killing. And then buy her an even nicer set. I think I can afford a nicer set now. Okay, wow. I'm bragging. He's rich, folks.

Well, folks, hey, we just gave you some great Mother's Day gift ideas. And Mother's Day is just around the corner. So why don't you give Mom the gift of a small, sexy, independent podcast? Oh, Norm. problematic here. Huh? Well, I'm, you're saying someone should buy something for Mother's Day, and I'm about to just crap all over that when I tell you what the founder of Mother's Day would say.

But anyway, go ahead and go ahead and ruin this whole episode with your plug. The listeners and I are just poor, sweet, innocent people right now. We don't know any better. Okay. So why don't you head on over to patreon.com slash old-timey podcast and consider supporting us. For just $5 a month, you'll become a non-threatened. fan and get access to our monthly bonus episodes with full video. But the real party is at that $10 pig butter investor tier. Get in on the hottest new dairy product on the market. You know,

the FDA is no longer quality testing dairy products. And thank God for us because boy, pig butter was not passing any tests. Did you see our stock price after that announcement? It shot up. Half a cent. Incredible. So on that $10 pig butter investor tier, you'll get bonus episodes, a signed card and sticker, early ad-free video episodes, access to our monthly trivia parties, 10% off all merch, and ad-free episodes of Kristen's old decrepit rotting podcast. Let's stroll through the halls of justice. Actually, Norm, fun fact, it was called Let's Go to Court. Well, Dr. Hubert Montgomery gave me some bad information.

So yeah, head on over to patreon.com slash old-timey podcast to sign up. Thank you. All right, are you ready to learn about Mother's Day? I don't know why I'm trying to be like a sports announcer right now. Are you ready? Yeah. You're trying to hype up the arena. Yeah.

Well, the thing is, this is kind of, it's kind of a weird story. You sound like you're in pain when you do that. Is that your hype noise? Honestly, this is a little painful, this story. It is? Well, why don't I quit goofing around and just get to it? Huh? Hmm.

I do like the goofy reference. Oh, God. Okay. Norm, let's start with the potentially confusing part of this story. Okay, just knock it out. Man, I, with the sports references, good God, here I go. You're doing it again. I didn't even complete the sports reference.

I just got so excited that I almost said it. Calm down. Oh. I think this episode is going to be a touchdown. Oh. Hell yeah, it is. Mm-hmm. Okay, the potentially confusing part of this story.

Is that it's actually called Mommy's Day. And we've been saying it wrong this whole time. Yeah, like daylight savings time. The confusing part is that the two people who are the most important people to this story have almost the exact same name. Really? That is confusing. What I'm telling you is that the woman who created Mother's Day, was named Anna Jarvis. She created the holiday to honor her mother,

who was named Ann Jarvis. Oh, okay. Anna Jarvis is the daughter. Anne Jarvis is the mother. Did either of them consider what a nightmare this would be for future storytellers? I'm guessing no. And yet, I trudge forward, bravely,

to tell you the treacherous tale of how Mother's Day came to be. Well, why don't you just call Anne Jarvis, Big Mama Jarvis, and call... I would be so pissed. The daughter, Anna Jarvis.

I would be so pissed if someone called me Big Mama Krista. Actually, it would be Big Mama Caruso. Oh, man. That somehow seems worse. Although it does seem like I would make great Italian food. And boy, would people be disappointed by that. They'd be like, ooh.

I can't wait to try Big Mama Caruso's Italian recipes. I hear she puts cottage cheese in her lasagna. Yeah, and then you make an Alfredo with Greek yogurt. Hey, I'm sorry for being healthy. Obviously, since Ann Jarvis was the inspiration for Mother's Day as we know it, we'll start the tale with her. Okay. First off, probably shouldn't surprise you to learn that Anne Jarvis was one hell of a mother.

In fact, Anne was just a really wonderful person. A wonderful person who'd been through hell. She lived in the 1800s, and I'm not talking about the tail end of the 1800s. I'm talking about the real meaty part of it, Civil War times. Yep. And to make things even more complicated, she lived in West Virginia. And that was wild because, fun fact, the only reason we even have West Virginia is because when the Civil War started up, the western part of what was then big-ass Virginia was like, nope, we're breaking off and going Union.

baby. We know this story. Hey, it's just a little refresher. Remember, Harper's Ferry was originally in Virginia. Now it's part of West Virginia. Uh, excuse me, sir, this is a Mother's Day tale told by a woman, so why don't you quit interrupting? Oh. Uh-huh. And mansplaining, boring wars to us. I wasn't even talking about a war. I was talking about Harper's Ferry. We know what happens next. You know what? I'll shut up. I know my place. Oh. Oh. So the Civil War was a really touchy thing in shrunken-ass Virginia and the newly formed West Virginia. And Anne Jarvis and her family found themselves smack dab in the middle of it. They lived in Grafton, West Virginia, which was and is a small town.

And life wasn't easy. And in her husband Granville, which is a very cool name. Granville? Granville. That is a cool name. Right? I've never heard that name before. Me neither. Sounds like a fancy subdivision.

Sounds like a Pokemon. Granville. He's like a rock type. I'm sorry. I'm too cool for that. Yeah. You need to listen to your little nephew who's obsessed with Pokemon right now. Yeah, and he thinks I'm so uncool because I don't know shit about Pokemon. Yeah, but he thinks I am the greatest human being walking the earth right now. It is true, everyone. I've had my feelings hurt multiple times. Last week, Norm stayed home from family Sunday dinner to...

I was recovering from a disease known as the flu. Yeah, very serious. He barely made it out alive. But anyway, Henry came out excited to greet what he assumed would be me and Norm. And, you know, he was polite when he saw me and, you know, said hello. But then as soon as he got back into the house, I overheard him say, It's just Auntie. Uncle Norm's not here. Just want to let everyone know.

The loser's here. Everybody put your streamers away. This sucks. But we got to deal with it. Come out from behind the couch. We're going to surprise. No, he's not here. So Anne and her husband,

Granville, who was a Pokemon character, owned a little hotel, and they had 13 children. But only four of the children lived to adulthood. That is, uh, Common thing back then. Yeah. I'm currently researching my next topic.

Same situation. Oh, boy. Double-digit kids, only half survived. Stay tuned to an old-timey podcast where we keep you laughing and having a good time. The jokes just keep coming, folks. They truly write themselves. Yeah. Here's a thing.

Back then, a lot of people didn't even know that germs existed, let alone, to prevent illnesses from spreading. And as a result, a lot of people died, but especially infants and children. And boy, I'm sorry, you turned this podcast on to escape the world, didn't you? Well, you didn't. Anne and Granville's children were no exception. There are nine children who died, all most likely died due to disease, probably from a man who opened mouth breathed on them at the Charlotte airport. Kristen, that's not funny.

You're making light of my illness. Well, I can make light of your illness because you survive. Are you now admitting that it is a disease? I only admit it because I was proven wrong on our podcast last week. But everyone, just so we're clear, we're pretty sure Norm got the flu because a man at the Charlotte Airport, which that airport is three times smaller than it should be, came up, stood real close to us and just open-mouthed on us. It was very strange. and he would not move, so I decided to move.

So Norm moved his face out of that man's hot breath, and a couple days later fell down with the flu. All this to say, that times were hard, but Anne was determined to make a difference. In fact, she wanted to do something good for her community, something that might help other moms, just like her. So through her role as a member of the local Andrews Methodist Episcopal Church, she began running Mother's Day work clubs.

It was pretty awesome. Thanks to Anne's hard work, all the local moms got together, formed a community. They supported one another. They learned about good hygiene, what to do when a family member got sick. They learned about ways to prevent illnesses. Practical stuff, like where to put your outhouse so that it doesn't contaminate your drinking water. Because, fun fact, poop slurpees don't just taste bad. They're also really bad for you.

for your health. Very good, Kristen. So this was like a, did they meet like weekly or monthly? Well, I don't have the meeting minutes right in front of me. Well, I just wanted to make sure this wasn't just like a one-day yearly thing. No, I think they met quite often. Okay. So that's how Mother's Day started.

It was, uh, no. What was called the Mother's Day? Mother's Day Work Club. Mother's Day Work Club. Yeah. You are, you know what? You're so excited about Mother's Day. Day and learning the history of it, that you're jumping the gun a bit, sir.

I say on a mother's day, we go to all of our moms and we say, mom, where would you put the outhouse on this property? And if you feel like your mom gives a wrong answer, you just insult her and say, you know what, I'm taking this card that I wrote you, and I'm ripping it up. You don't deserve it. If you had it your way, you'd be serving us poop slurpees and half of us would be dead. So you want to kill your children, huh? During the Civil War, Anne's Mother's Day Work Club was doing such a good job that a colonel for the Union was like,

hey, excuse me, will you ladies please help us figure out how to stop diseases from spreading through camp? We're doing everything right. We're never washing our hands. We're all sharing the same cup and we're sneezing directly into each other's mouths. And for the life of us, we can't figure out why we keep dying. Open mouth breathing closely near each other. So the ladies helped out and they made a real difference. That's really what Anne Jarvis was all about.

Big Mama Jarvis. Big Mama Jarvis brought women together for the greater good. She had this really cool, very community-focused view of what it meant to be a mom. She believed that moms aren't just mothers to their biological children. A mom should be a mother to every child in her community. Wow. It's a lot of work. Hell yeah. Sure. Anne could be, you know, a little controlling, maybe a little overbearing.

But is there any other way to be a mother? After all, Anne Jarvis subscribed to the Cherey Ray Pitt School of Motherhood, whose motto is, if there was a problem, yo, I'll solve it. And you're not going to believe this norm. But after the Civil War ended, and noticed that the tension in her community was too damn high. I wonder why. It's a real mystery. Well, you see, they'd been killing each other. I guess a civil war will do that. Why are tension so high in this town?

She wanted to bring people together again. Start mending fences. How did she do it? She created a mother's friendship day. Oh, boy. What? You don't like mothers? You don't like friendship? You don't like day? What do you got a problem with? Mother's friendship day? Yeah. What does that entail? Well, I'm about to tell you, but before I did, you sort of, eh.

Okay, okay, fine. I will not speak any more during this episode. Oh, wow. So go ahead. Tell us your story, Kristen. Sorry for reacting to it. I just want to make it clear that you have not been invited to Mother's Friendship Day. You don't need to shit all over. I've never even heard of Mother's Friendship Day. The idea was that all the mothers in the county would get together with their sons in tow, and they'd all have a picnic, maybe play some cornhole, and let the healing process begin. The healing process? Yeah, yeah, she's wanting people to mend fences.

She wants the sons to, like, get along with each other? Well, yeah. Yeah, by bringing together the mothers. for Mother's Friendship Day. I admit, it does sound really boring and terrible. It sounded like the beginning of Milf Manor. Oh, you wish. You wish this was Milf Manor.

You wish old-timey Milf Manor. Oh, gross. As legend has it, the Mother's Friendship Day was a big success. Men who had been on opposite sides of the Civil War started the lunch kind of mad, ate a couple devil digs. doffined up a bit, ate some more deviled eggs, and then they hugged it out. I am making fun of it, but it was a beautiful, meaningful event. Did they only eat deviled eggs? I don't even know that they had deviled eggs. I was just thinking of picnics, and what would be kind of the grossest thing

to eat right before you hug somebody? Not a hot summer day. A bunch of devil days. You'll have to excuse my breath. I had seven deviled eggs. Oh, God. Over the course of her life, Anne Jarvis became a champion for mothers and motherhood. She understood the importance of being a mom, but she always wished that society as a whole understood the importance of motherhood. And Norm, if this story was a movie and not merely a podcast episode told to you by a hilarious large-breasted woman, a pinnacle moment in the film would be this. Okay, picture it, Ann Jarvis, leading a Sunday school class. It's 1870-something.

Mm-hmm. And she tells the children, I hope and pray that someone, sometime, will found a memorial Mother's Day commemorating her for the matchless service she renders to humanity in every field of life. She is entitled to it. And was her daughter in that Sunday school class? Oh, Norm, Norm, you are the director of the movie.

Because, yes, the camera pans to the children. And in that crowd is 12-year-old Anna hanging on her mother's every word. A Martin Scorsese film, Mother's Day. Little Anna loved her mom. Like, really, really loved her mom. Anna was Anne's oldest surviving daughter. And the pair had an unusually tight bond. And if you're wondering, gee, did Anna also have an unusually tight bond with her father, Granville?

The short answer is no. The longer answer is hell no. You can't be in love with a Pokemon. It's just not natural. It ain't right. It ain't right. If we start burying Pokemon, what's next? Power Rangers, can't do it.

Hey, I would have loved to marry the Pink Ranger as a kid. In fact, later in life, when Anna wrote letters home, she always capitalized the word mother and never capitalized the word father. That's passive-aggressive. Yeah. I'm not sure why Anna wasn't close with her father, but I do know that the love that Anne and Anna had for one another was once described by a friend as, quote, A love which was more than love. Whoa. I know.

It sounds incesty. I don't think it was. I think it was just real intense. Maybe a little enmeshed. Maybe a little unhealthy. You decide. Now, did Anne have that same type bond with all her children? Not so much.

No, I mean, when you're that close to one of them, like, there's so much love to go around. Oh. You don't think there's plenty of love to go around? I mean, not that intense, you know? Yeah. Ask, if you have siblings, ask your parent which kid she likes the most. Wow. Any good mom is going to say, what?

No. Any good mom will be like, I love them all equally. Uh-huh. But they know the real answer. But then they'll wink at their favorite child. They will. Ding! Yeah.

So I mentioned earlier that only four of the Jarvis children survived to adulthood. two of the surviving children were boys, two were girls. I don't know whether the boys were envious of Anne and Anna's relationship, but there is evidence that Anne and Granville's youngest surviving daughter, Lily, had a problem with it. At some point, I'm hoping when they were both adults, Lily wrote a letter to Anna that read, in part, It has been your aim to render me virtually motherless.

Nothing would help and encourage me like your death, For you are the one barrier between me and all I deserve. Holy shit. Holy shit indeed. Sounds like someone's struggling for power. My God. Jesus, that is, uh, oof. I don't.

Tough to read. Yeah. And I don't know much about Lily. I don't know what was going on there, but I do know that Anna responded to that letter by writing to her mother and urging her to show Lily extra love. Oh, it would have been funny if she was like, do you see this letter? Lily wrote, I think you should go spank her. It would have been a great idea, Norm.

Then Lily would have been like, finally, you're being a mother to me. Yeah, but Lily's like 25, so, you know, it just feels weird all around. All this to say that Anne and Anna really loved one another. Anna thought her mother could do no wrong. And that feeling stayed with her through childhood, adolescence, and adulthood. Over the years, Anna flourished. She went away to finishing school. She came back home, stayed home.

Finishing school? Yeah, that's where you learn how to be a lady, bitch. Oh. Sorry. That was rude. I was, when I hear finishing school, I think of, like, woodworking and you apply a finish to the wood. I'm like, well, in a way. You're saying they teach ladies how to apply a nice amber shalak to their skin, maybe a nice satin polyureth.

on the tithes. Norm. What? Satin polyurethane on the tities. It probably would give me a nice sheen. Nice little sheen. Uh-huh. Not too glossy.

No, I'm afraid that this was more of a manners and, you know, etiquette situation. Gracfully and grandly. Very little sheen, really. Gotcha. Just like her mother, Anna was very involved in their church. And also just like her mother, Anna had big ideas. She had ambition. And so when she was 30 years old, Anna moved to the big city.

What's the big city? Philly. Okay. Yeah, that's a big city. Yeah, you were about to be kind of shitty, weren't you? You were like, well, it's a big city. Well, coming from West Virginia, you got to wonder, what do they consider the big city? Yeah.

Philadelphia, absolutely. Philly will do it. Her brother, Claude owned a taxi company in Philly. So she moved in with him, and she got a job working in the advertising department at Fidelity Mutual Life. It was a big deal. She was a trailblazer. She was the first woman the company hired for that role. In other words, she had a career at a time when a lot of women didn't.

Now, I don't mean to dump a whole mess of foreshadowing on you, but in that career, Anna learned all sorts of things. Marketing, public relations, networking, the importance of getting things trademarked. Oh, ooh. Ooh. So yeah. That's a major foreshadow. So yeah. Anna had a career, but she was also a 30-something-year-old, unmarried woman at the turn of the century. Disgusting. I agree. It meant that society viewed her like she was someone with a fabulous collection of hats, but absolutely no pants. Folks, I realize that was a very stupid joke, but I wrote it anyway and I kept it in. Meanwhile, back in Grafton, West Virginia, things weren't going so hot.

Or rather, they were too hot because in 1887 a bunch of buildings caught fire. Feeling hot, hot, hot. I'm really hoping no one was hurt because that would be terrible. I'm sure people were. Anyway, one of the buildings was the Jarvis Family's Hotel. After that fire, Granville drank more and more. His health suffered. and he died a few years later in 1902.

That meant that it was just Anne and her daughter, Lily, still living in Grafton. And the two of them didn't do very well on their own. Lily had developed scarlet fever as a child, and she'd gone blind from it. And by this point, Anne was in poor health. She had dropsy, which is an old-timey term for edema. What's edema? That's when you get a bunch of fluid retention. I did have a joke in here about Dropsy being an old-timey term for clumsy people,

but I'm too classy to tell it. Yeah, so. Feel free to congratulate me. Yeah, so you didn't actually tell the joke. No, no. It's off the record. Yeah, it sure is. So Anne and Lily moved up to Philly to live with Claude and Anna,

but Anne continued to not do so well. And Anna was devastated at the thought of losing. her mother. And to make things worse, Anne wasn't ready to go. One night she said to Anna, Anna, I must get well. There is so much good work for me to do. But the next night, on May 9th, 1905, Anne Jarvis died with her children by her side. Damn. R-I-P. Big Mama Jarvis. Anna took her mother's death really hard. In the wake of it, she read and re-read the sympathy cards that came in. She reflected on how good her mother had been. She'd been the best, the best mom ever. Anna mourned her mother. It seemed impossible that she was just gone. And what about those good works

she had left to do? Who would do them? Anna thought and thought and mourned and mourned and finally, she decided that the best thing she could do to honor her exceptional mother would be to make good on her mother's vision, her vision for a day when all mothers would be celebrated. Mother's Day. Anna was instantly committed to this project. She may not have known that she would be forever committed to this project, but in those early days, Anna got to work establishing the basics. What would the day be called? Mother's Day! Well, duh! With an apostrophe S. Mother's. Oh, so she owns the day. Mother's Day. Yes. Because it's a day to celebrate your mother. Gotcha. When would the day occur? Sounds like a question Normie C might have asked. The second Sunday in May, of course, because that was close to the day when Anne Jarvis died.

Mm-hmm. Makes sense. I'm with you. How should the day be properly celebrated? Easy. Devil's eggs? No, go visit your mom. Bring her a white carnation, why don't you? And if you can't visit, write her a letter. And there you have it. Mother's Day, nailed it.

Easy enough. I can't believe this had not been invented already. Oh, well, I don't want to hear about that, because this is a totally original idea, blah, blah, blah. Yep, here we go. Norm. Yes. I mentioned earlier that if we're going to name one of Anne Jarvis's flaws,

it would probably be that she was a bit controlling. And I hate to tell you this, but the controlling apple didn't fall far from the controlling tree because, boy, howdy, as we're about to see, Anna Jarvis was determined to bring Mother's Day into this world, but she would really struggle with people putting their own spin on it. Oh no Oh this can only end badly Right from the start She made the rules of Mother's Day

Pretty damn clear, okay? Sheaf among them Was that Mother's Day Was strictly for celebrating Your own mother Do not Go to your neighbors Celebrate their mother

It is not I repeat not To celebrate your grandmother, the mother down the street, your fucking sister who has two kids, it is to celebrate your mother and your mother only. Wow. But what if you don't have a mom anymore? That is too damn bad.

Jesus. This is cutthroat shit. This is very interesting to me because I, one year, on Mother's Day, I did not send my grandmother a card. Because I just assumed, you know, well. You were following the purest interpretation of Mother's Day. I didn't know it at the time, but I guess I was. My grandma called my mom to complain that I had not wished her a happy Mother's Day. She was yapping to the captain.

Yeah. And so my mom called me. Oh, boy. And I was like, I was like in my early 20s or something. I was a fresh young adult. Yeah. And I was just like, but she's not my mom. Why would I celebrate her on Mother's Day?

Right. I was like, that's your job, Mom. And my mom was like, will you please just send her a text on Mother's Day in the future? So I did every Mother's Day. I always texted my grandma. Yeah, you didn't want to get in trouble. Right. And she would always fly, thank you, Norman.

Did you ever think about being passive aggressive? Happy Mother's Day, even though you're technically not my mother. But I know you are one. And I know Anna Jarvis, creator of Mother's Day, would not want me sending this text. Yeah, don't tell Anna Jarvis I did this. Yeah. Oh, that's interesting. And for a controlling person, you know people aren't going to celebrate it like that.

Yeah, well, I don't think she did know is the problem. See, here's the thing. When she conceived of a day to celebrate mothers, she had placed that apostrophe with the clearest of intentions. Okay, it's Mother's Day, Mother, apostrophe S, singular possessive, because on Mother's Day, you can only celebrate your own mother. It's not a plural possessive because that would be celebrating all mothers everywhere in a general sense. And that is not, not what Mother's Day is about. It's for your own mom. To make that point crystal clear.

Oh, no. Anna created a Mother's Day motto. For the best mother who ever lived, your mother. Now, I have a question. Why is she so obsessed with it has to be your mother? Why not celebrate all mothers? Okay. There are a few theories.

Actually, the one that comes to mind. It comes from a woman who has written a book about her. She's studied Anna Jarvis extensively. She has put forth this theory that because Anna Jarvis never became. became a mother herself, she viewed Mother's Day through the eyes of a child. And it's all about that one central figure. I'm not fully on board with that. I think, oh, God, I'm kind of maybe stating my opinion on this a little too early.

Okay. And this is a rough opinion. I'm just warning you, it's a rough opinion historically. a lot of men have dismissed and a lot of women have dismissed other women as crazy. You know, a woman shares an opinion, you don't want to hear, oh, she's crazy. Oh, she says something you don't like, she's crazy. Anna Jarvis might genuinely be a little off her rocker, I think.

Oh, really? I mean, and I'm not saying she's crazy because I hate that, but I do think she did an amazing thing, but I think she was just like I kind of don't, well, you know what, I'm going to shut my trap and I'm going to keep yapping about this story. And then we'll all come to our own conclusions. Well, you know, she was in her 30s and not married. Back then, that means you were crazy. So here's the question I thought you were going to ask when I gave the mother's day motto. And it's, you know, for the best mother who ever lived, your mother.

Yeah. What if you don't have a good relationship with your mom? Well, yeah, and what my question was, what if you don't have a mom? Right. And I believe the answer to if you don't have a mom is, you know, well, maybe think about your mom. Like a sacrificial offering to mom. Sacrificial offering, what are you going to do? Slid a goat's throat.

Oh, I don't think that's necessary. Maybe throw a white carnation at the sky. Throw a spear at a toad. I don't know. Whatever it takes. Do whatever the fuck you want. I don't know. Anna Jarvis's attitude, if you didn't really have a strong relationship with your mom, was,

suck it up, Buttercup. No one wants to hear about that. Go celebrate your shitty mom. She's the only one you got. I might be paraphrasing. That's healthy. Perhaps the greatest irony in this whole Mother's Day story is that Anna always said that she wanted to make good on her mother's vision for creating a day to honor mothers. But what Anna actually created and would spend the rest of her life defending wasn't really what her mother had had in mind when she talked about setting aside a day to celebrate mothers.

Her mom had been very community-minded. She probably would have liked the idea of a Mother's Day where people got together, helped one another, and mothers, gasp, in general, were celebrated. I mean, yeah, that's what she was doing in West Virginia. Right. But buddy, let me tell you something. That was not, absolutely not what Anna had in mind. As she planned what would eventually become a national holiday, Anna decided that a white carnation would be central to Mother's Day.

Can I look up a white carnation? Sure. It almost just looks like a white rose. It's... It has a lot more petals, though, and they're very, like, wavy. Yeah, it's sometimes considered a filler flower. And that's a very bitchy thing of me to say. Imagine call it someone a filler flower.

Ouch. She picked the white carnation for a couple reasons. One, because it had been her mother's favorite flower. And two, because it was the type of flower that she figured men would be willing to wear on their lapel. Partly because carnations can stay fresh for several hours on even the driest of suit jackets. So, with all the basic details of stucing. Anna put the skills she'd learned through her career in advertising to use. She wrote letters to anyone who had any influence at all.

Business people, politicians, she knew she needed help getting her idea off the ground, and she got early financial help from a guy named John Wanamaker. John was... I want to make her a star. I want to make her holiday a reality. Oh, my... Well, yeah, and he did. He once said, and this seems cheesy as hell, but God bless him, he said he would rather be responsible for helping make Mother's Day a thing than to be the King of England.

Bullshit, dude. Uh-huh, sure. Yeah. So he was Postmaster General, but that's not what he was really well known for. What he was well known for was inventing the department store. See, he changed the game in 1870. when he created the first ever store advertisement. He invented the price tag.

He did this wild thing where he held things called sales. You see, the items would be on sale, and people were blown away by that. Wait a minute. Before him, items weren't on sale. I mean, I highly doubt that. He probably just popularized something that was already kind of happening. Kind of the way Mother's Day... Oops, oops. I've said too much.

Anyhow. The important thing, Norm, is he was very successful. He also had this fabulous reputation because before he came along with his price tag idea, store owners would just kind of look you up and down and decide how much they wanted to charge you. Yep. Sucks.

I wonder what they would charge me. Yeah, it would be a whole game, wouldn't it? Right. Would you be going in there with your boobs all pushed up? No. Trying to get a good deal on something? I'd be... I would do it.

Well, you don't have much meat to put together there, buddy. If I had weaves, I would definitely do it. Maybe I can put a big old bulge in my pants and lean on the counter. Uh-huh. So, uh, how much for a eight-ounce bag of those peanuts, buddy? Wow. Ooh. You know, I like the idea of you going in with something shoved down your pants with the idea of purchasing a small bag of nuts.

Yeah, just like the most inconsequenact. The store owner would be like, you know what, buddy, I feel so bad for you. Just take these. It's like a penny for the whole bag. I can't really discount it anymore. Customers love the idea that at this department store, everyone paid the same price. John Wanamaker was an ideal backer for Mother's Day. He was powerful.

He had deep pockets. He was a good dude. But he was also a businessman. A businessman who owned a businessman. who owned a department store. Now, I've alluded to the fact that Anna Jarvis would one day become fed up with Mother's Day, and a big part of her frustration would be the commercialization of Mother's Day. Join the freaking club, Anna.

Every holiday has been commercialized. Yeah. It sucks. I mean, I feel like it's inevitable. I kind of do, too. In a capitalistic society, that is inevitable. People are going to try to find a way to make money off of it. Norm, I'm going to say that's a very healthy way to look at it. It's inevitable.

Right. Anna Jarvis did not have that healthy outlook on it. She fought tooth and nail. You're not going to win. Oh, boy. So here's the thing. I feel for her, but I get a little less sympathetic when I learned that one of her earliest backers was this guy who owned a department store. How do you not see this coming? His name was John, John, John, John, oh, want a maker. That was beautiful, North. That's shake your money maker, right? Yeah, yeah. Ludacris?

Is that ludicrous? I don't remember. I don't look at that, hang on. I never had much to shake, so at that point I would usually go to the bar and get a new drink. Yeah, it is ludicrous. Well done. Yeah, I'm kind of a hip-hop historian. Oh, wow.

I don't know if you know that. Yeah. You look like just the man I'd like to learn hip-hop history from. Hey, I took a hip-hop history class in college. Oh. Thank you very much. So I do have some credits to my name. Approximately four.

Three. It was worth three credits. Oh, wow. Well, you shouldn't, you should have just let that one slide. I was trying to give you more credit. Oh, you're right. And you're like, excuse me, no. I know even less than you said.

Also quite helpful with getting Mother's Day going, Henry J. Hines. Heinz tomato ketchup? I'm afraid so. Which is why every Mother's Day you have to give your mom a bottle of ketchup. You know it would suck if you had to give your mom a bottle of Heinz 57. Ew, nobody likes that. Exactly. Oh, okay.

I'm glad we're in a great. Now, if Mr. Hines was smart, that's what he would do. He would market his worst selling product on Mother's Day to give your mom a bottle of Heinz 57. But then we would not have Mother's Day as we know it because the holiday would have been tanked. Another big helpie helper? The editor of the Philadelphia Inquirer. Also, Anna took donations from the floral industry. She spoke at floral industry conventions.

Would that later lead to a big beautiful bouquet of bitterness? Stay tuned! The important thing was that in those early days, Anna Jarvis was cooking with gas, baby. and just three years after her mother's death, Mother's Day got its official start with two ceremonies. One was held at the Andrews Methodist Episcopal Church in Grafton, where her mother had been a longtime member. Anna didn't attend that ceremony, but she did send 500 white carnations to the church to be distributed to all the mothers. Anna also donated funds for a portrait of her mother to hang in the church. Was it paint by numbers on black velvet?

Tragically, no. No, I don't think so. The other ceremony took place at Wanamaker's Department Store in Philadelphia. It was there that Anna gave a moving Mother's Day speech in the department store's auditorium, which is the weirdest thing I've ever said. Auditorium. This place must have been a damn palace. I'm telling you. So right now it's just localized in Philly.

Well, and it's in West Virginia. We got two places. And West Virginia. Yeah. Wow. The first Mother's Day celebration. It was pretty momentous. It got the ball rolling.

Got to start somewhere. And it was just the beginning. Anna wanted Mother's Day to become a holiday everywhere. She wanted it on the books, baby. That would be no small task. But the funny thing is, people always try to talk about the opposition she got. She did get some, but she didn't get a whole lot. Well, who the fuck would be opposed to Mother's Day?

Senator Henry Moore Teller. He said, quote, every day with me is a Mother's Day. I love my mom so much. I can't tell if that's like I love my mom so much or if it's shut up about my mom. He said the idea of Mother's Day was, quote, absolutely absurd and also, quote, trifling. Why would you be opposed to this? It's just trying to ruin a good time. Senator Jacob Gallinger of New Hampshire also thought that Mother's Day was a stupid idea.

He was like, my mom's dead. I miss her a whole lot. I don't need a day to remember her. That's insulting. Some people want to remember their mother. Well, no, I think that's what he's saying is he's saying, I do miss my mother dearly. I do remember her. The idea that I would need someone to tell me.

hey, on this day, you need to think about your mom? Well, it's an appreciation for mothers. Like, think about all the wonderful things your mother did for you. And yeah, I know she's passed away. But you can have a day of remembrance, maybe. Sure. One thing I saw that I actually thought was kind of funny and not a bad point was someone was like, well, if we're going to have a mother's day, what's next?

So we're going to do Father's Day, Grandparents Day, like the A is like, ah, maybe. And we've got it, baby. But Norm, as you pointed out, yeah, for the most part, people didn't really want to go on record as being against Mother's Day. What would their Mommies say? And so, Anna got a lot of green lights. The next year in 1909, 45 U.S. states celebrated Mother's Day. Wow. I know.

So did Canada, eh? So did Mexico. O'Le. It was kind of It was kind of nice. When you say the state celebrated Mother's Day, how does that look? Does the governor declare it's Mother's Day in Missouri or like? You know, that's a good point and a good question.

I know there were some states where the political leadership said, you know, this is an official thing. I think in these early days, it was probably a lot less official than that. But it was just being celebrated in general on a much bigger scale. Gotcha. Just one year after this first ceremony. And it was really nice in an era with a lot of social change and income inequality. It was nice to see people come together because everyone was just arguing about everything. Whether women should have the right to vote.

Whether workers should have the right to organize. Whether businesses should face any regulations at all, the answer is of course no. Do we even care if children work 16 hours in a factory? I sure don't. The refreshing thing about Mother's Day. I said it was just nice, just nice thing. Hey, you know what else they were arguing about during this time? What?

Daylight savings time. Yeah, and we're still arguing about it today. Cheers. It was great because Anna wanted my... Mother's Day to become even bigger. It wasn't enough that so many states across America were celebrating her day. It wasn't enough that President Teddy Roosevelt responded to her letters, or that President William Howard Taft responded to her letters, probably well stuck in a bathtub. Oh, that's not nice. Well, no, and I know that was a rumor for a long time, and it's been disproven,

but I just really like the idea of it. You know how they got him out of that tub? Greased him up? Yeah, pig butter. And to think that pig butter is just really an emerging market now. Well, how do you think we got the idea? Yeah. Well, you know, Carrie Nation was all about her pig butter. I thought it was John Brown. I'm forgetting where...

Pig butter is from the Carrie Nation episode. Oh, excuse me. You need to get with the old-timey lore. Okay, okay. You study up. It's your own damn podcast. You know, I've been present for every episode. Which is crazy.

Terrible memory. It's crazy. You didn't know then. Anna wanted Mother's Day to be. become a national holiday. That was the next big goal. So she wrote more letters. Every politician got a letter. In 1910, West Virginia named Mother's Day a state holiday. Yay, but not enough. She kept working and kept working. But it was a funny thing because with success came drawbacks. See, more and more people were celebrating Mother's Day. Except, oh my God. Oh, dear God.

Some folks weren't doing it right. Oh, no. And when you're a control freak, you want everyone to do it the way you want to do it. Yeah. So what you do, barge into people's homes and say, hey, stop that. See, Anna started noticing that her holiday that she had created was slowly becoming a money-making opportunity. And she wasn't seeing a dime of it. No, and she didn't want to.

To her credit, she did not profit off of this. holiday at all. She noticed, to her great horror, that some people, instead of writing a letter to their mother on Mother's Day, went out and, oh my God. Norm, they went out and bought these things called greeting cards. Oh, from Hallmark? God, I hope not. Anna took a hard stance against greeting cards. And those thoughtless assholes who sent them to their poor mothers. She said, quote, A modeling, insincere, printed card or ready-made telegram means nothing, except you're too lazy to write to the woman who has done more for you than anyone else in the world.

I don't think I've ever heard someone who is anti- greeting card. Yeah. This is a first for me. Yeah, she's telling you to take that Mother's Day card and shove it up your behole. It promotes laziness. Not promotes, it is lazy and unthoughtful. Wow. She also noticed that all of a sudden, white carnations became more expensive around Mother's Day.

Now, I do feel obliged to point out this could just be an issue of supply and demand. I mean, that's what it sounds like. But it could also have been an issue of people jacking up the prices on carnations. Sure, because if Mother's Day is getting popular and that's the flower, then yeah. Take advantage. Either way, Anna hated it. Another thing she hated? This sudden influx of people buying candy for their mother on Mother's Day.

I would like to read to you a quote in which Anna Jarvis simultaneously destroys greeting cards, boxes of candy, and any asshole bold enough to send them both. Are you ready? Oh, my, okay. She said, quote, a printed card means nothing except you are too late. to write to the woman who has done more for you than anyone in the world. And candy? You take a box to mother.

Then you eat most of it yourself. A pretty sentiment. Well, wait. That's a bold assumption. I felt personally attacked because I feel like I probably have been guilty of that in my younger years. You know. You gave Sherey some candy and then ate it? sounds like a very christen move to, uh, you know, as a young child, get something nice and be like,

well, she's not going to want to eat all of this. I feel like you've done that to me before. No, no, false. Yeah, I feel like you bought me. I feel like you bought me some treats before and then you've got right into. That must have been some other wife you had. By 1912, Anna decided to protect the idea that she held so dear. So she put her professional background and marketing and copyright to go.

use by incorporating her own association. She trademarked the white carnation. I shouldn't say trademarked. I don't think she got away with that, but I do know that she tried. Trademarked the white carnation. Trademarked second Sunday in May. Trademarked Mother's Day. With an apostrophe.

Okay, I'm glad you said that. So, yeah, she trademarked the correct way. and later when it became very clear that she was absolutely willing to sue people over this, they tried to get around it by moving the apostrophe. But she still sued their asses. Sure. Now, anyone who tried to use Mother's Day in a way that Anna didn't like might just find themselves knee-deep in a steamy dump of a lawsuit. As it turned out, Anna didn't just need to protect Mother's Day from businesses.

She also, sadly, needed to protect it from horrible political groups. Like who? Okay. Wait, what would they do for Mother's Day? Okay. Think about it. Okay. Horrible political group.

Mm-hmm. So, like, not like a political party. No. Just like a group. Okay, let's see. Around that time. The KKK? Okay, I'm just going to tell you.

Okay. Around this time. a lot of women were working really hard to get the right to vote. Yes. And some shitty groups who were against women voting tried to use Mother's Day for their own agenda. Like, oh, yes, let's celebrate Mother's Day. And while we're on the topic, don't we all agree that what women really need to focus on is just being moms and not voting ever? Ah, yeah, okay.

And of course, the suffragettes were like, hey, dumbass, if your mom's good enough to raise you and you love her so much, maybe she should be able to vote. It's too distracting, Kristen. I agree. Are you ready for another Mother's Day victory? Yeah. Buckle up. Because in May of 1913, the House of Representatives passed Resolution 103. That as a token of our love and reverence for the mother, the president and his cabinet, United States Senators, representatives of the House, and all officials of the federal government are hereby requested to wear a white carnation or some other white flower on Sunday.

May 11th in observance of Mother's Day. Let's hear it for the moms. Yeah, it's great, right? Right? Let's give the moms a hand. You like it? Love it. Wrong.

Terrible, bad. No. Why? Well, Anna was disappointed because she wanted a joint resolution for a national holiday. She wanted the flags at half-mast. Hey, you know, you got to walk before you can run, Anna. What was it going to take to get Mother's Day on the books? Did she need to write more letters?

Fine. she'd write more letters. And right she did. And soon enough, a hero emerged. Woodrow Wilson? Oh, well, calm down, but you know, he's coming. Okay. Technically not a new hero.

He was Alabama Senator Thomas Heflin. And actually, Thomas had been the one to introduce the House Resolution in 1913. But let me tell you something, Norm, he was just the man we needed to get this thing across the finish line in 1914. When you think about it, it's almost hard to believe that Senator Thomas Heflin had any time to make Mother's Day happen, considering how busy he was, ironing his KKK robe and talking so much shit on Catholics. You would have thought the Pope himself had made fun of his terrible haircut. Joe, please include a photo of this man in his goofy-ass haircut. Oh, I'm going to look this guy up.

Heflin? Thomas Heflin, Alabama, Senator. I mean, that's not that bad. What's the problem with his haircut? It looks slick down with pig butter. That's what it looks like. I mean, that's probably what they used back then to slick it down. Also, why is his bowtie tucked into his suit jacket?

It's the goofiest looking man I've ever seen. Okay, I'm looking at a picture of him in an all-white suit. He looks like a ghost. Does he have a hood on to? No. He must have tucked that in his back pocket. By the way, Norm, true story. Like 10 years before Thomas became the hero of Mother's Day,

he who at the time was a member of the House of Representatives when he did this through a black man named Louis Lundy off a street car and then shot at him through the window of the street car he wounded Lewis and oopsies accidentally shot some white dude he was charged for these crimes charges were dismissed shocking and not only did this not hurt his career he actually bragged about it on the campaign trail Oh, well, yeah, that's no surprise to me. Well, I was horrified.

Have you completely forgot the Robert Smalls series? No, I have not completely forgotten it. That shit was totally normal back then. Anyhow, like I was saying, in 1914, that Krusty Dickhole introduced a joint resolution. Whoa, whoa, hey. Oh, no, he deserves it. Yeah, really. We'll call him the Krusty Dickhole.

He introduced a joint resolution to make Mother's Day a national holiday, and it passed unanimously because everyone loves their moms. and President Woodrow Wilson Waiting in the Wings signed it with a flourish. Yay! It was official. Mother's Day was a national holiday. Celebrate your mom but not some other mom.

Don't do it wrong. Or you'll be haunted by Anna Jarvis's Ghost. Okay, that's the end of the song. This is a great song. Thank you. Woodrow Wilson, very problematic, but he brought us daylight saving time

and Mother's Day. Oh, oh, what's the problematic? stuff. Oh, we probably don't have time. Future topic? Future topic? Yeah. He screened birth of a nation. Oh, that's right. He sure did. He sure did. He was, uh, well, he's a southern, he was Southern Democrat, so I think that's all we need to say. I think what we need to say is crusty dickholes all around. This is, that's a disgusting thing to say. That is a very graphic What if someone's listening to this and they want to recommend it to their mom? Listen to this episode of an old-timey podcast. Now they can't recommend it to their mom because you keep bringing up crusty dick holes,

you're the one that said it. You're ruining it. And you know, I do want moms to listen to an old-timey podcast and sign up on our Patreon at patreon. patreon.com slash old-timey podcast. You should only want your mother to listen. Okay, so it's a national holiday. We're all so excited. The mayor of Boston hosted a Mother's Day picnic. 20,000 people came out to dance and listen to music and celebrate mothers. Were all the moms there? Seems like we're celebrating a lot of moms and not individually, but hey, I'm no critic. In Sherman, Ohio, 42,000 soldiers stood at attention and recited the Lord's Prayer for their mothers. Wow.

The point is, it was all really happening. It was all coming together. By this point, Anna Jarvis was on a leave of absence from her job at Fidelity Mutual. But the leave of absence ended up being permanent because Mother's Day, the promotion of of it, the protection of it, it had become her full-time job. So she was getting paid for this? No, no, no, I'm about to tell you how she's doing this. Okay.

She was able to make that work because when her brother Claude passed away, he left everything to Anna. And he'd had a very successful taxi business. He left her millions of dollars. Oh, shit. She'd also been a shareholder in the business for a while. So, you know, she'd done okay. So Anna was able to continue working to make Mother's Day a global phenomenon.

She wrote to leaders all over the world. She kept every piece of correspondence. Eventually, when her home became so stuffed with stuff that she could barely move around, she just bought the place next door and stuffed it with stuff too. That's the solution. Oh, my God. It's like when there's too much shit in your house and so you go get a storage unit to put more shit in there. Yeah, except this is the richer version of I'm going to buy a hold of.

Damn house. This is the rich version, for sure. Mother's Day became Anna Jarvis' whole identity. She never married, never had children. She was the mother of Mother's Day. Think of it like that. I have thought about it like that. And I keep thinking I'm going to get to this mythical place in this story where I tell all my opinions.

And I'm like, I'll probably just forget by the time I get to that mythical place. but I do think there's something to be said for that. Like she's the mother of Mother's Day, and I'm saying this not a mother myself, but I think that probably one of the hardest parts of being a mom is accepting that you let your child out into the world. Yeah, it's all grown up now. It's got to be independence on its own. Yeah, but even before that, like I think it would be so hard. You drop them off at school.

You don't know what's going to happen there. They talk about it like, oh, what's that saying about like, it's like watching your heart walk around without you? Like, it's just your everything. And so what I think a mom has to do is accept that she can't control everything. Yeah. And she shouldn't control everything because you want the child to grow and flourish and become their own person. And I think that's kind of one of the ironic things about this story is like, yeah, she's the mom of mother. Day, but she didn't know how to let go.

Right. As time passed, Anna couldn't accept that she'd created something much bigger than herself, something she couldn't control. But damn, did she sure try. Sometimes people would say that Woodrow Wilson had founded Mother's Day. He'd done it. And she would say, uh-uh, all he did was sign it. I did all the work, which is true.

Fair. Just want credit where credits do. Sometimes people would say that Julia Ward Howe was the founder of Mother's Day. After all, she'd started something very similar way back in the 1870s. But Anna Jarvis didn't want to hear it because it wasn't the same, damn it. Who's Julia Ward How? She's a woman who a lot of people also say was the founder of Mother's Day because she started something very similar in the 1870s. Okay.

And yeah, she deserves some credit. But also, yeah, if we're looking for who made this thing. a national holiday. Anna Jarvis was the driving force. But yeah, you would think she could be a little generous to the other people. Nope, they get nothing. Yeah. The thing that Anna could never accept was that she had wanted Mother's Day to become this big thing, you know?

But in order for it to become a big thing, it had to be bigger than her. It had to grow beyond her control. And she'd done it. She'd made it a national holiday. And that meant that it was now officially beyond her control. Well, yeah, you can't enforce Mother's Day nationally. You're one person. Really?

You can't? She's going to try, but it's not going to work. Oh, it's going to be ridiculous. Oh, boy. As the years went on, she fought harder and harder for control of her holiday, namely by going after anyone who sought to make money off of it. Even John Wanamaker, the department store owner who had given her financial backing, became an enemy. Excuse me, his name is pronounced John, John, John, Juanamaker.

I am so sorry. She once went into a tea room at his department store around Mother's Day, and she noticed a Mother's Day salad on the menu. Ooh, sounds delicious. Do you know what was on the salad? I know what became of that salad. Really? What do you think Anna Jarvis did when she saw a Mother's Day salad on the menu at this place? She lost her ever-loving mind.

Could you be more specific, please? And just know that you don't need to be real reasonable or cool about it. Did she walk back in the kitchen and start flinging lettuce everywhere? Get this shit off the menu! This is not how you celebrate Mother's Day! Norm, I will tell you what she did. She saw the item on the menu. She ordered that menu item.

And she dumped it on the floor. She did. And she stormed out. She did pay for it. She did pay for it. But, man, she threw it on the ground. I'm an adult. Anna fumed as people bought more and more carnations at higher and higher prices.

It was getting out of hand. At one point four men in Philadelphia were arrested for stealing 2,000 carnations. from a greenhouse because they were like, hey, we can make some money on these. Hell yeah. It was madness. She'd never met for Mother's Day to be about buying stuff. So she sent out a press release. I would like to read part of it to you now.

All right. What will you do to route charlatans, bandits, pirates, racketeers, kidnappers, and other termites that would undermine with their greed one of the finest, noblest, and truest movements and celebrations. I'm sorry. Did you say pirates? Also kidnappers. I got you, I got your white carnation eye patch for my

her. Arr. Are you going to finish your candy? We're stealing this booty for me, mother. First of all, yeah, that's too much. That's too much, Anna. You don't need to call them all that. Also, can you imagine?

starting a holiday and referring to it. First of all, not wanting to give any credit to anybody else who may have been involved, but also calling it one of the finest, noblest, and truest movements and celebrations. Norm, what we're doing here on an old-timey podcast? Yes. It's without question. One of the finest, noblest, truest podcasts ever. Don't you agree?

And anyone who disagrees is a charlatan, abandoned? a pirate, a racketeer, and a kidnapper. They're all termites. I don't see a problem with anything. Yeah. Of what you just said. Yeah, I don't exaggerate. I just come up with the finest, noblest, and truest podcasts.

That's what I do. Yeah. So, yeah, she sent that out and, you know, people really didn't do anything because... Who's going to take her seriously with a press release like that? It's too much. It's too much. It's crazy. By 1920, Anna was officially done with flowers.

She told people, do not buy flowers for Mother's Day. You can't control an entire nation. Okay, Norm. Okay, you're saying you can't control this. But she does do something to try to stop people from buying flowers. What do you do? What do you think she came up with? To stop people from buying flowers?

I mean, do you try to associate the flower with something bad? So then people will stop buying them? That's hilarious. I never thought about that. That's actually really funny. Well, I heard white carnations represent. What? Uh-oh.

I'm trying to think of something terrible. I'm trying to think of some shit, something terrible. Uh-huh. Oh, boy. I heard white carnation means you actually want to kill your mom. Oh, wow. Yeah, so don't get them. Mm-hmm.

But then those pirates and termites in the floral industry will be like, give her a red rose instead. Walk the blank. No, here's what Anna did. She had thousands of buttons made that had like white carnations on them. And she gave them away to people for free, hoping that that would stop the demand for flowers. Like you just, hey, you've got this button. No.

That's all you need. No. A free button? That shit will get lost in a day. It'll be in the packet drawer. You won't see it for 20 years. Yep. Yeah.

Shocking to everyone, this did not stop the demand for flowers on Mother's Day. Florists tried to reason with her. They appreciated their new profits, and they rightly pointed out that they weren't the ones who started this trend. They're like, hey, Anna, I hate to break this to you. We're not the ones who told people, oh, go buy white carnations. You started this. And yes, we are profiting. and we are grateful, but like, what a reasonable take.

Quit calling us termites, man. Okay, now are you ready for the ultimate misread of the century? Here we go. The Florist Telegraph Delivery Association really wanted to just, you know, calm this thing down, wanted to make things right with Anna Jarvis. So they went to her and they were like, hey, hey, what about this idea? Could we give you a commission on every carnation that we sell on Mother's Day? Would that be all right?

Hey, that seems like a sweet deal. Oh, oh, Norm, you've never been more wrong in your life. That is a good deal. She's not trying to profit. She's calling anyone who makes a profit a fucking termite. And here you are offering her a commission. She lost her ever-loving shit on them. She wrote that florist, quote,

Take the coppers off a dead mother's eyes. Oh my God. Is that not too much? That is too much. This lady is on a crusade. Yes. A crusade that no one asked for. No, and one that, like, again, you started Mother's Day.

You were the one that was like, oh, yeah, white carnations for Mother's Day. The white carnations have to come from somewhere. You got to go buy them. I agree. I think this is partly like, And again, you live in America. What do you think is going to happen? This is a capitalist society yet people are going to find a way to make money off of it.

And it sucks that you wanted this to be a nice thing for mothers and it's not turning out that way universally. But you can control everything. It can be two things. Two things can be true. People can profit off of Mother's Day. And it can also still be a day to appreciate your mom. And also, I'll add a third truth that anyone who sells flowers is a kidnapper. and a pirate. Don't you agree?

Termite, yeah. I can't wait to go up to my local florist and tell them off. How dare you profit off of Mother's Day? Anna started suing florists. She sued music companies for making songs about Mother's Day. But on like what grounds? Well, she had that shit locked down. What was locked down?

The term Mother's Day, second son. Monday in May? Listen, I don't know. You'll find out how these lawsuits went. If you're thinking she's being ridiculous, don't worry. The courts agreed. In 1923, she threatened to sue the New York Mother's Day Committee. It sounded like they had a nice thing in the works.

The governor and the mayor were members of it. They were planning to throw a huge Mother's Day celebration. Woo-hoo! But, you know, she threatened to sue them. And they were like, geez, okay, different. her mind. We'll cancel it. Not worth it. Now, before anyone starts thinking, well, it does seem pretty reasonable that she didn't want people making money off of Mother's Day. Get ready for this next part. This, if I'm choosing favorites, this is where we get really wild. Okay. Anna famously

opposed people using Mother's Day to do charitable work for mothers. What? One of her most famous beefs was with the American War Mothers Association. Oh my God. And about war, too? Okay, the group was originally founded during the Great War. And after the war, they kind of evolved to help veterans and also widows and mothers whose sons or husbands had died at war. And, you know, maybe they needed some financial assistance.

Uh-huh. Sounds like a great cause. Yeah, they did really good work. And during the 1920s, the group sold carnations around Mother's Day to help raise funds for all the work they were doing. Oh, my God. Are you okay? I'm just like, who's the fucking pirate now? Yeah, these asshole war mothers, right?

They're terrible. How dare they do this? I can see you're on Anna Jarvis's side, and I support you. No, no, I'm not. So I can't stress this enough. I think that Anne Jarvis, the woman who inspired Mother's Day, Big Mama Jarvis, would have probably loved this organization and all the work they were doing. Yes.

But when Anna Jarvis found out that those bitches at the American War Mothers Association were raising money for moms and using Mother's Day to do it, well, she went a little ape shit. In 1925, she went to their annual meeting and raised hell, hoping to put an end to their little carnation sale. And yada, yada, yada, she was dragged away kicking and screaming by a police officer who arrested her for disturbing the peace. Oh, my God. Lady, it's a charity. Calm down. Norm, you really got to hand it to Anna. It's tough to be anti-charity.

It's a tough position to defend. That is, uh, ooh. You, you're, you're very lonely on that hill. Let me tell you. Anti-charity. Especially when the charities you oppose are one specifically designed to help mothers. And not just any mothers. Uh-huh.

Mothers of the war. Yeah. Norm, Norm, you, you, I can tell you're on the wrong side of the, These bitches, they were selling the carnations, okay? They can't just do that. Oh, my God. That is insane to me. Are you ready for it to get worse?

Worse? Yeah. Worse than anti-charity? Oh, well, we're talking about levels of anti-charity, okay? Because the truth is getting arrested for disturbing the peace. That's child's play, okay? We haven't insulted the First Lady yet. Is she going to shoot someone?

Thankfully, no. As the roaring 20s came to an end, little thing called the Great Depression set in. Sorry, what was that? The Great Depression. Depression! Fun fact, everyone, the Great Depression wasn't great at all. Nope, nope, nope, nope.

As a matter of fact, a lot of people really suffered from it. Who named it the Great Depression? I sure hope someone got fired for that blunder. And so, in 1933, because of the Great Depression, the Senate changed the original Mother's Day resolution. to add in that, you know, instead of just hanging a flag or celebrating your own mother, maybe if you're able, you could donate to charity. Oh, yeah, sure.

Yeah. The thinking was that there are women whose husbands are gone or dead and perhaps lost their sons and now they have no way to support themselves. So why not on Mother's Day donate charities aiming to help these moms? Norm, pop quiz. How do you think Anna felt about this idea? Did she like it? Love it.

She probably ran into the fucking chamber with an axe. Yeah. So now enters Anna Jarvis' latest nemesis. And of course I'm talking about those skanky whores at the Maternity Center Association. The, uh-oh. Norm's about to drop. He's coughing. He's overwhelmed.

I'm sorry. What? The Maternity Center Association focused on maternal health, okay? That's fucking horrible. Oh, yeah, we can all agree. We don't need this. Never needed it. Absolutely disgusting behavior.

I'm appalled. Yeah, I'm going to tell you about it, but I think we can all agree. It's totally unnecessary work. In the 1930s, maternal death was still super high. And the MCA was trying to fix that, okay? Well, too fucking bad because I've got the trademark. Mark on Mother's Day, you bitches. They trained nurses and midwives.

They had classes for prenatal and postnatal care. Please stop. I can't handle hearing about these horrible things this organization is doing. Yeah. For years, the organization had survived off of federal funding, but all of that went away in 1929. Yeah, Great Depression. So they were in desperate need for money, and Mother's Day seemed like a great time to do some fundraising. First Lady Eleanor Roosevelt was very supportive of the Maternity Center Association's Mother's Day fundraising efforts.

She thought it was a great thing. What the fuck did she know, though, right? She's just an idiot. Frances Perkins, the first woman to serve in a presidential cabinet and passed topic on this very podcast. Previous topic? Also supported the Maternity Center Association's Mother's Day fundraising efforts. And Anna Jarvis went ballistic all. on both of them.

God. She accused Eleanor Roosevelt of, quote, grand larceny of human reputation and achievement. What? Yeah, for using Mother's Day to raise money for mothers. Grand larceny of human reputation and achievement. The circles you have to go in to come up with that is like. Yeah.

She accused Eleanor Roosevelt of, quote, crafty plotting. To help mothers? Yes. What a great way to use a holiday. Crafty plotting? She's just as bad as those pirates. She's worse.

She referred to raising money to combat maternal and infant mortality as, quote, the expectant mother racket. Foo. Lady, know your audience. Mother's Day. Come on. She sent telegrams to FDR. letting him know that she did not appreciate what his wife was up to.

She was even more harsh with Francis Perkins. Oh, hell no. Leave Francis Perkins alone. Right. Francis Perkins had enough bullshit to deal with. And now this is just an added layer. She accused Francis Perkins of using federal money to help the MCA steal Mother's Day. Oh, my God.

Hilariously. Steel Mother's Day? What does that mean? See, this is, again, her bullshit. it. She's trying to make it hers. But by putting this out into the world, making it a national thing, trying to get other countries to sign on, guess what, it's not yours anymore. It's everybody's. And you do not have control over it anymore. Well, and it's like you wanted people to celebrate this day. And they are. And you can't have it both ways. You can't be like, this is my day,

but also I want everyone else to celebrate it too. Oh, but you can have it all the ways. That's like on your birthday, telling dropping hints to everyone you see, oh, it's my birthday today. It's my birthday today. I don't think it's anything like that. I think it's like saying, it is my birthday. I want the entire world to celebrate in this one specific way. And what if, by some miracle, the entire world is like, okay.

All right, Kristen, we will celebrate your birthday. And then I'm like, ah! The exact way I want it, damn it! And don't you raise money for charities? I want a McGrittle for breakfast with a hash brown. I want everyone to eat a McGrittle for breakfast. Now, why the hell did the McGrittle prices shoot up? We don't know.

So, hilariously, she also wrote to Francis Perkins and asked her to resign. Francis Perkins did not resign. Spoiler alert. Don't know if you've listened to the episodes. Dan, it's where you didn't mention this in the Francis Perkins episode. It's almost as if it doesn't matter at all. When Anna Jarvis rallied against charities, she often said that she didn't believe that the money was going where it was supposed to go.

Okay. Well. Here's the thing. There are scenarios where money doesn't go where it's supposed to go, but that's not a reason to be anti-charity. And also, going with my own opinion here, I don't think that's the real reason she hated this. No, of course not.

I think she showed her whole ass when she said this. she said that she didn't like that charities were helping moms around Mother's Day because this was not a day to feel bad for moms or help moms. It was only a day to appreciate moms and not moms in general, your mom specifically, damn it. Yeah, I'm sure those moms struggling with their sons dying in war. Oh, don't give me any help. I don't want to be pitied. I only want to be appreciated. No, go ahead and give me a helping hand.

Yes. Again, the irony of her own mother. this whole thing of, you know, oh, it shouldn't be about telling mothers what to do. Well, your own mother really helped her community by telling other mothers, hey, this is where you should put the outhouse. This is what you should do. Yeah. During the Civil War.

And I'm sure there is a way to do that in a condescending manner, but hopefully it wasn't. And when people's lives are at stake, who gives a shit? You're not going to put your outhouse there, are you? It's going to look stupid. But the drama wasn't over. Pretty soon, those awful women from the American War mothers lobbied FDR and the Postmaster General to put out a stamp? Yeah. Mother's Day stamp.

Uh-huh. Yep. Yep. Well, I bet she went to the freaking post office and took a big dump on the floor or something. What's she going to do this time? First, I have to tell you how terrible it was. Norma would say Mother's Day right there on it. The image would be of Whistler's mother.

Anna was incensed. This was thievery. This was Tom Foolery. So she got a meeting with FDR and she let him know just how pissed she was. And finally, he was like, okay, okay. Geez, we will remove the words Mother's Day from the stamp. But just to be dicks, the post office added a vase of white carnations to the stamp. So it's kind of an undercover Mother's Day stamp.

Wait, did FDR actually respond to this woman? Yeah. I think sometimes when somebody is this wound up, like, okay, who cares? Don't show them any attention. Nope. I think that's the wrong tactic. Really? Yeah.

I think you just work around it. By this point, Anna was exhausted. And as am I, this is ridiculous. I think the entire nation's. was exhausted. She was running out of money. Her brother had left her millions of dollars, but those millions had dwindled,

not just because of the Great Depression, but because she'd been suing the pants off of everybody, and that's a very expensive thing to do. And buying buttons for people. By 1944, it's estimated that she had 44 lawsuits pending. Jesus. How old was she at this point? Oh, gosh.

She would have been, I believe, her 80s? Yeah, I was going to say, or late 70s. She's not even going to live to see these cases go through. And maybe that was FDR's logic. He's like, how much longer am I going to have to deal with this lady? Well, he didn't have too much longer either. Wow.

Spoilers all around. Sorry. By that point, Anna Jarvis was so disgusted with what her holiday had become that she decided, I brought Mother's Day into this world and I'll take it out of this world. Oh, dear God. Yeah, she kind of ripped off Bill Cosby, which is problematic. too. And she began walking the streets of Philadelphia, collecting signatures with the intent of ending Mother's Day. What? Imagine getting that petition walking through the city.

Oh, God. Okay, what's her justification for ending Mother's Day? That it basically has gotten out of control. It's not what it was supposed to be, so we should end it. I would not sign that. It was just really sad. Anna was old. She'd built her life around Mother's Day, and now she wanted the day to end. She still lived with her sister Lily, but now Anna was starting to go blind, too. Except it was either an issue of she didn't want to accept that she was going blind or, you know, who knows what was fully going on there. But it said that she believed that she was being held in a room that kept getting darker all the time as some sort of punishment. Finally, in 1944, Anna Jarvis was placed in a sanatorium in Westchester, Pennsylvania.

So an insane asylum. Yeah. Lily didn't go. She stayed alone in the home that they'd shared. And Lily died alone in that house two months later from carbon monoxide poisoning. Oh, shit. Yeah. That's sad.

A silent killer. Anna Jarvis lived for several years in the sanatorium. She died from heart failure in 1948. she was 84 years old. She died without a penny to her name. But according to legend, it was members of the florists' exchange, who all pitched in and quietly paid her bills. These days, Andrew's Methodist Episcopal Church, where Anne Jarvis made her mark and where her daughter Anna came up with the idea of her Mother's Day, is now known as the International Mother's Day Shrine. Oh, wow.

Plaque alert indeed. And that is the story of how Mother's Day came to be. Wow. Who knew the person that created Mother's Day wanted to destroy it completely by the end of her life? I really hate it. I got to say, it's really sad. Yeah, it's a much darker story. I think when I just read kind of, you know, a few basic articles, you're kind of thinking,

oh, this is kind of a little funny, a little quirky. But the deeper you get into it, it's just sad. It is. I just can't imagine spending most of your life trying to, like, control this thing you can't control. And it's like, it's a wonderful thing you made for people. Like, people really enjoy it. Right. Can't see the beauty in it.

Can't see the joy. This is a lesson in control and letting go. Yeah. And moving on. Yeah. We could all learn from this story, folks. I think so, honestly. For real. For real.

Yeah, I mean, it's, it is funny because I do think about stuff in my own life and it's, every now and then life has to kind of hit you upside the head and be like, yeah, this is outside of your control. You can't do a thing about this. And the best thing you can do is accept that. Well, there's, uh, there's this theory that like these, uh, like things you hold on to. Mm-hmm. You hold on to them because you need them. them in your life.

And so maybe that was her whole thing. It was like her way of holding onto like her mother or. Yeah. It was like this crusade she was on and it gave her life purpose. Yeah. Even though it wasn't healthy at all, but like. No, I think that's, I think that's spot on. Yeah.

I think she made the holiday all about her own mom. Mm-hmm. You know, it's her mom's favorite flower. the date was chosen mostly about when her own mom died. So yeah, you're taking this relationship that's so important to you and you're trying to share it with the world and tell everyone here's the way to do this. It is sad. She just went off the rails, though. Like when you're anti-charity, I'm sorry. No. Yeah, I mean, to me, the big thing is she lost sight. of the good that her mom did.

Yes, exactly. Like you said, Big Mama Jarvis would have loved all the great things that Mother's Day brought to the world. Was she super religious? Oh, yeah, of course. Yeah, I'm sure there's like a religious aspect to it all, too. Okay, well, this story has inspired me. I'm going to come up with a holiday now. Oh, yeah?

Yeah. Oh, you're going to create a holiday. Yeah. And try to control the shit out of it. What are you going to do? Son-in-law day. Uh-huh. Is that a thing yet?

It should be. It will be once you take over. Ah. There is no officially recognized son-in-law day. Now, Norm, how should one properly celebrate son-in-law day? Well, here's what has to happen. Okay. The mother-in-law and father-in-law have to take the son-in-law out for lunch.

Can they take the son-in-law just any place of their choosing? Well, the son-in-law gets to decide where they go. Wow. Okay. Okay. And it's celebrated on June 12th, which is my birthday. Yes, yes. And, you know, I'm just a very good son-in-law. I'm maybe one of the best son-in-laws in the nation. Do you have any proof of this? Any good deeds? Charitable acts? Maybe you should ask DP and Chererey.

Who the best son-in-law? is. They've never said anything positive about it. Oh. Oh, wow. Yeah, I think, I think on son-in-law day, you take your son-in-law out for a burger. Okay. And that's all it is. And you just say, just to let them know that you appreciate them. All right. Let's get this thing on the books, norm. I think we petition, we get it going. But if people start taking their son-in-laws out, for fried chicken or pizza or tacos? No, it is about a burger. What if people start adding a fried egg on top of the burger?

Here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to start going into these restaurants where they're serving son-in-laws, non-burger items. I'm going to say, that is not allowed, and I'm going to grab it and start eating it. Oh, no, no, you can't. No, you cannot serve this to your son-in-law. Norm, if you want to be like, make the, make the, you know, most impact. You got to throw it on the ground. You can't be eating it and giving them some compliments. It's free food. I'm going to eat it. Actually, I'd be stealing food. Yeah, yeah.

Oh, great episode, Kristen. You know, somebody commented, maybe it was a Spotify comment, actually. Okay. On the daylight saving time episode, they were like, I loved learning about something that we all celebrate, but we know nothing about. Yeah. And so like daylight saving time is one. And now we have Mother's Day. I've never thought about where Mother's Day came from or how we got to this point in life. Me neither. And I just, wow, it's kind of a disappointing and weird, sad story. It is a crazy story. I always just assumed most holidays were created by a greeting card company. Well, now you know that they can be created by one lady with the help of some businesses, and then boy will she be mad at those businesses later on.

And a lady who was anti- greeting card. Sure. As well, which is, man, what a wild story. Well, should we wrap things up, Kristen? Let's do it. Kristen, you know what they say about history, hoes? We always cite our sources. That's right.

For this episode, I got my information from the article The Mother of Mother's Day by Daniel Mark Epstein for the Philadelphia Inquirer. The article, the founder of Mother's Day, mostly cared about her own mother, By Nina Martin for Mother Jones. The article Anna Jarvis, the woman who regretted creating Mother's Day. By Vebeck Venema for BBC.

Plus more. Check the show notes for a full list of our sources. That's all for this episode. Thank you for listening to an old-timey podcast. Please give us a five-star review wherever you listen to podcasts. And while you're at it, subscribe. Support us on Patreon. Patreon.com slash old-timey podcast.

Join the Reddit community, R-Slas, Old Timey Podcast. Follow us on Facebook and YouTube and Instagram at Old Timey Podcast. You can also follow us individually on Instagram. I'm at Kristen Pitts Caruso and he's at Gaming Historian. And until next time, Tooteloo, Tata, and Cheerio. Goodbye. Bye.