An Old Timey Podcast - 59: The Original Kardashians! (Patreon Bonus)

Episode Date: June 18, 2025

Back in their day, the seven Sutherland sisters were a household name. They were celebrated for their outrageously long, thick hair. For years, audiences gathered ‘round to watch the sisters undo their updos. Audiences gasped as the sisters’ hair tumbled, in unison, to the floor. Soon, money poured in. The sisters spent every cent of it. Remember, kids, history hoes always cite their sources! For this episode, Kristin pulled from: “How 7 sisters made a fortune off their Rapunzel-like hair,” by Maria Ricapito for Atlas Obscura“Untangling the tale of the seven Sutherland sisters and their 37 feet of hair,” by Lisa Hix for Collectors Weekly“Introducing the amazing seven Sutherland sisters,” by Brandon Stickney for sideshowworld.com“Tressed for success,” by Dianne L. Sammarco and Kathleen L. Rounds for The Buffalo News“The Seven Sutherland Sisters,” by Dianne L. Sammarco and Kathleen L. Rounds for newengland.com“Hocus Pocus – Untangling the Sutherland Sisters,” by Linda Secca Spina for lindaseccaspina.wordpress.com “Showplace of the countryside was the seven sisters’ mansion,” by Arch Merrill for The Rochester Democrat and Chronicle“The amazing seven Sutherland sisters,” by Ferdinand Meyer V for peachridgeglass.com“Show and Tell: Seven Sutherland sisters’ hair grower,” by Stassa Edwards for Mental Floss

Well, hello, we almost didn't see you there. Howdy, howdy? You know, we're taking the month of June off, but we are bringing you some of our favorite bonus episodes in the main feed this month, and this one is pretty special. It's about seven sisters with glorious, beautiful hair

who took the world by storm. Kristen, you refer to them as the original Kardashians. Yeah, no lies were told. I think when you listen to you, to this episode, you'll be like, well, god damn, she made a good point there. It is a very strange story. It's super strange. I think it's so interesting, partly because they really were the OG Kardashians, and then,

boom, no one remembers them. We remember them now because we talked about them on an old-timey podcast. And I tell you what, if you're listening to this and you're thinking, gosh, I really need more. I need to get on that Patreon. Well, come on over, baby. It's patreon.com slash old-timey podcast. Norm, tell them what will happen if they sign up in the month of June. Right now we're doing a promotion, our $10 pig butter investor tier, which gets you add-free episodes, video episodes, cards and stickers, access to our trivia, 10% off merch.

It gets you everything. It's 50% off right now. For $5, you can become a pig butter investor and you're on the ground floor for the dairy product of the future, pig butter. It's very real. It's not a pyramid scheme. We can't stress that enough. It's not, but please tell five of your friends about it. Just for fun. Just tell them about it.

Anyway, patreon.com slash old-timey podcast. We're still doing stuff in the month of June. We're putting out a bonus episode. We're still doing trivia. But in the meantime, enjoy this bonus episode about the original Kardashians. And we'll see you in July. Bye. Bye.

Hear ye. You are listening to an old-timey podcast. I'm Kristen, Caruso. And big news, Kristen. Disney is coming out with a documentary about the making of a goofy movie. You know, if I had to choose between watching a goofy movie and watching a goofy movie documentary, I would choose the documentary. There we go. I'll take that win. By the way, my name's Normie C. And on this episode, I'll be talking about the seven Sutherland sisters. Ooh. Ooh. What is this sexy story you're bringing to me today? It's a wild story.

And I'll tell you something, Norm, I'm doing something a little unusual. What's that? I worked ahead. Oh. You know this. I worked ahead. You did, yeah. You wrote this quite a while ago.

And did I read the script beforehand to refresh myself a little? No, she didn't. Oh, boy. She went to the doctor to get her ADHD meds filled. She did her hair. She applied her lashes. And she said, I'm going to be just fine, baby. Are you unmedicated right now?

No, but I, you know, I'm not doing great. Okay. Hang in there, baby. We'll get through this episode together. I ran out of my extended release dose, so I'm just making do with my little sharpshooters. Sharp shooters. I don't know. I know that's a gun.

That's not really what's happening here. Don't worry. There's no violence on this podcast. Actually, a sharpshooter is the name of the type of soldiers. that would use a sniper rifle, they would call them a sharpshooter. Oh, well, then you must be devastated as my husband to learn that I've been doing sharpshooters. Okay. In the morning, in the evening, even at supper time.

Your wife is doing sharpshooters and she's happy all the time. Just actively cheating on me and bragging about it on a podcast. Way to go. I waited until we were recording to tell you. This is devastating news. It's great podcasting, Norm. And by the way, thank you all for your support. This is a bonus episode.

I don't know how much longer the podcast will go on now that I've learned my wife is sleeping with multiple sharpshooters. Are they sharpshooters in the bedroom? Catch my drift. Norm, norm. Are you upset or turned on? You got to pick a lane, buddy. You got to pick one. You know what I love to say.

Two things can be true, baby. It's true. Yes. Thank you, everyone, for. Do I have a dirty mind? I don't think so, but I mean, that's kind of... Your dad accused me of having a dirty mind. Yes.

When we recorded his episode and I was like, I thought about that for a while after we finished recording. I wondered, am I too dirty? Am I smutty? Are you self-conscious now? Absolutely. That's me 24-7, though. Okay. Well, I mean, here's a thing.

Maybe this is an issue of the blind leading the blind here because I said sharpshooters. I turned it into a joke about me banging, dude. dudes all day long, right in your face. Right. For your ADHD. And yet, here we sit and I'm saying, no, Norm, you're not dirty at all. I think my dad is just, wasn't prepared for you to say, hey, don't call yourself DP. That means double penetration, sir.

Right. Yeah. Yeah. Which I thought everybody knew about, but I guess. Not everyone has a filthy mind like you, Norm. Well, that's what he said, basically. Not everyone goes to the dark corners of the internet. Some people just use the internet for online shopping.

You don't have to go to the... And for reconnecting with old friends. You don't have to go to the dark corners of the internet to learn what a DP is. Just saying. Wow. Anyway, let's get into the episode. I am curious what this topic is about. Have I told you anything or are you being a coy boy?

I don't know anything. Okay. But I think of Sutherland. I think of Donald Sutherland. I think of his son. Kifa Sutherland. Norm, prepare to be a little turned on. And that goes for you, too, listeners.

This is going to be a sexy tale, sort of. Okay, here we go. Thank you to a local frog in the Discord for suggesting this story. Oh, we love a local frog. A loyal history ho. Them foreign frogs we're not big fans of. Yeah. Right?

Yeah, we're deporting them. Oh, okay, great. Glad you could bring that up. Picture it! The year is 1881. And we're at Atlanta's International Cotton Exposition and World's Fair. Ooh, la, la. Oh, a World's Fair?

Yeah. Oh, we love World's Fares here on an old-timey podcast. And we're about to see one hell of a show. So get your ticket, grab a seat, and get ready for the one, the only seven Sutherland sisters plus one brother. You. Oh, never mind about the brother. Turns out no one ever gave a shit about seeing him perform. So take two, take two.

It's the seven Sutherland sisters. Woo! They're matchless, incomparable. Some even call them the seven wonders of the world. Really? Oh. Are they twins? I guess they wouldn't be twins.

Oh, God. Well, it would be the number. It's not sex tuplets. That's six. So it's seven. I'm leaving you out to dry, buddy. You figure this out on your own. Are they twins?

No, there's seven of them. We're going to go with seven tuplets. Are they seven tuplets? No, sir, they are not. So they're sisters. Yes, they are the seven Sutherland sisters. You can be sisters. Joe, don't cut any of this.

It's all pure gold. What's the age gap between the sisters? Is it okay if I tell you this tale? I guess. Okay, you know, the other thing is, I really don't know where in this script. We're going to find that answer, but I know it's in here.

Oh, so I'm asking the hard-hitting questions. No, you're not. Anyhow. Buckle up, Norm, because this is the sexiest show in town. Now, it's hard to know what exactly they performed that day at the International Cotton Exposition and World's Fair, but we can reasonably deduce that the performance started as most Sutherland Sisters performances did with the Seven Sisters.

Sarah, Victoria, Isabella, Grace, Naomi, Dora, and Mary taking the stage. The ladies ranged in age from 18 to 36. Oh, they're much older than I thought. Well, I am so sorry that 18 to 36 is old and haggard to you, sir. I'm just thinking... Canceled. Seven Sutherland sisters.

The charm would be, oh, they're cute kids, and they're all. all sisters and they're dancing and singing. What a lovely show. Oh, I'm about to lock you up for that comment because I started this by saying it's the sexiest show and you're expecting children. You sir disgust me. No, no, no, no, no, wait a minute. Lock him up. Lock him up. Wait a minute. Uh-huh. I just thought they would have started in show business as kids and of course they would get older as adults. Yeah, maybe they did. But right now, I'm telling you, it's 1881 and you're about to see the sexiest show at the fucking cotton. Sorry, I don't know why. That was unnecessary.

You know what? Just call the police. I'm done recording this podcast. Just come arrest me. I'll plead guilty. You're like, just found out my wife's been banging all the sharpshooters. Also, um, I said some problematic stuff. Yep, and I have a dirty mind. Just go ahead and, uh, just go ahead and lock me up. So the ladies ranged in age from 18 to 36. Sorry, Norm. All right. That's enough.

They wore crisp white dresses. They had their thick, dark hair pinned up. And then, Get ready to rumble, brother! Because then those seven ladies began singing hymns. Oh, I thought they were going to start pile driving each other. Oh, my God, no. Suplexing.

Well, you said, let's get ready to rumble. I thought they're going to start beating each other up. I'm just trying to get people pumped for the show. Naomi, off the top rope. By God, she's got the steel chair. But wait, there's moving. They also sang the hottest songs of the day. Songs we all know and love.

Songs like, Woodman, spare that tree. And also, Come into the garden mod. Now, Norm, I know you're a huge fan of come into the garden mod. Yeah, I am. So I'd like to sing a little bit of it as a special tree. You're going to sing?

I am. And you know what's funny is, I looked it up online. I kind of memorized the tune, but that was weeks ago. So we're just going, you know. Your ADHD brain, that is long gone now. Now sing along with me at home if you know it, and I know we all know this. Here we go.

Come into the garden mod for the black bat night has flown. Come into the garden mud. I'm here at the gate alone. Now. Let me see. Now. Is this the... Hang on.

Is this the bridge where Kendrick Lamar comes in? Everybody. Okay, I was going to retake that, but Norm has ruined it by teasing me too much. I said now in the silly voice, because I thought it was part of the song. It's not. I'm just moving on. Anyway, you enjoyed that song, didn't you? Wow, it was great.

Now, you might be thinking to yourself, gee, I know. come into the garden mod is enough to get my engine going. But what about other people? Is this really enough to qualify the seven Sutherland sisters as a hot act? I think so. I'm going to add it to my Spotify as soon as we're done recording. Please do. I must now confess that although the sisters were quite talented singers,

and they did also play instruments, very few people attended their shows to hear them sing. What did they attend the shows for? Are they just all hot? Lookers? Were they hot? The thing that everyone was waiting for was the main event. That was the magical moment when the seven Sutherland sisters did something unthinkable, something unspeakably sexy.

It was that moment when the seven sisters turned in perfect unison so that their backs faced the audience. And then, again, in perfect unison, they'd all unfurl their hair and, oh my, oh my, their hair, there was so much of it. It tumbled and tumbled down their necks, their backs, their pussies, and their tracks, and down their thighs, their calves, and oh, glory of glories, their hair swept down to the floor. It went past the stage into the orchestra pit. Really? It was an incredible sight to see. All seven sisters had very long, thick hair, a combined 37 feet of hair, just hang in there all sexy like. Wait, hang on, I'm going to do the math here.

Sure. So each one had hair about five feet long. Yeah. Wow, that was a lot of hair. It's a ton of hair. Mm-hmm. When they did that final act, the audience went nuts. Woo!

This is entertainment back then? Yes, what else? I have long hair. Oh, it's not just long hair. It's like down to their feet. Yeah, that's long hair. And there's seven of them. Okay.

And they're singing to you. You said no one gave a shit about the singing. I'm just saying it's not the main draw. Just like this podcast, for example, the main draw is not that fabulous poster of Linda Evans. But she doesn't hurt things, does she? That's true. Mm-hmm. Now, this might not sound like much to you, Norm, but in the Victorian era, seeing a woman with her hair down in public was kind of unheard of.

Pretty scandalous. In those days, women grew their hair long and they pinned it up during the day. And it was only at nighttime when you were with your lover that you would uncoil the beehive, as they say. Is that what they say? That's what no one says. So seeing a woman with her hair down was kind of an intimate thing. And if that hair was really long and really thick, oh, that was even hotter. Girls gone wild.

Girls gone wild. Girls like you've never seen them before. Oh, my gosh. Hair with five feet. Hair that's five foot long. It smells like hot dogs. You just know it kind of had to smell. Like hot dogs.

Well, they are to World's Fair. Mm-hmm. Get too close to the hot dog stand. Uh, lady, a hair's in my hot dog water. Come on, lady. Women with long hair were thought to be ultra feminine, ultra-sexy, and maybe even magical. Like, hold on, like blessed with seductive magic, not the scary black magic kind, nothing devilish about it, all right? So like, I can't think of a movie.

Surely there's a movie about a witch that seduces somebody. Why can't I think of one? That has to exist. I don't know, man. I'm not a big movie buff. For some reason, I just thought of love potion number nine, but she wasn't a witch. Sandra Bullock was just a scientist who came up with a potion that seduces people. Sorry.

You finished, Norm? I'm done. I had an intimate moment myself. with the audience there watching, looking at them, looking at me as we suffered through the thought of a movie. Yeah, I know. I'm sorry. So that's why, in their day, the seven Sutherland sisters were major celebrities. Some say they were the first celebrity models. And I'd argue that they give very strong Kardashian vibes.

Really? because they were a family and they were beautiful. Yeah. And they had stuff to sell you. And giant butts. You wish they had giant butts. No, it's all about the hair. It's strictly hair.

I don't know how into butts people were in the late 1800s. Future topic? Buts? Buts. I mean, you covered testicles. Why would I think that you couldn't cover butts? We'll get to everybody part. Norm's 17.

part series on butts. And toward the end, it becomes clear that you're really just doing it out of your love of butts and not because there's actually more to talk about. Yeah. But the people are into it, and they've come to really love you, so they put up with it. Oh, I appreciate it. So they had stuff to sell. After all, how could you go to a seven Sutherland sisters show and not take home a souvenir?

Yeah. What would be better than hanging a photo of those seven sisters with their hair? down above your mantle. Oh, are dudes going to buy this and put it in the Spank bank? Ew, I Well, I hadn't thought about it, but sure, of course they are. It's like

porn. It's like a dirty magazine. Okay, now hang on, hang on, hang on, I got to stop you right there, sir. And I know this comes later in the script, I'm pretty sure, like 70% sure. But one of the reasons why they sang hymns, and they were very

careful about their venues, was they wanted to walk the line of still being seen as respectable ladies. Okay. So, yeah, they're super hot, but also they're boss babes, okay? Maybe some people put it in their spank bank. Maybe some people put it above the fireplace. Who knows? I'm about to bust.

Oh, gross. But that was perfect. Right. And if you had a favorite sister, well, who could blame you, my friend? Perhaps you gravitated toward the oldest Sutherland sister. That would be Sarah. She was the sensible one. She was the leader of the pack.

She had a good sense for business. And she never went anywhere without her Bible. This is like a girl band. It is. You know, like from the 90s, like Bewitched or the Spice Girls? Oh, my God. If only the Spice Girls had stuck around for as long as the Sutherland Sisters. How long did the Sutherland sisters hang around for?

Oh, you're going to find out, buddy boy. Unless I tragically forgot to finish this script and thought I'll get around to it. And then I thought, actually, I did this script. We'll find out when we get to the end of this story. Thank God you're getting medicine. Tragically, though, Sarah had the shortest hair of them all. Damn. It was merely four feet long, which is why in all of their pictures,

they put Sarah in a chair so that her hair would still touch. the floor. Oh, tricky. Mm-hmm. If you're looking for someone with a little more spice, perhaps you'd like the second oldest sister, Victoria. Ooh. Named after Queen Victoria, she was brash. She spoke her mind. She twas the Chloe Kardashian of her day. Then there was Isabella. Isabella didn't quite look like the other sisters, but she did have long hair. So,

you're in. That was good. Um, oh, one thing. Um, s, pst. Yeah. She had a secret. What? She wasn't religious.

But don't tell anyone. Because if people know that Isabella doesn't believe in the hymns she's singing, this whole operation could go belly up. So shut the fuck up about it, okay? Wait a minute. Are they actually sisters? And oh, what about Grace? Hey, hey. Grace.

was the peacemaker. She was the chatty Kathy. She was funny. And when things got rough, she was the glue who held the family together. You didn't answer my question. Are they actually sisters? In fact, I did not answer that question. She had bright blue eyes and five feet of flaming locks of Auburn hair and I cannot compete with you, dear Grace. Oh, oh wow. Did you hear that? That was Naomi. She had the best singing voice of all the sisters. Plus, she had big pleasant hooters and thick curly hair. It was super curly in the front and less curly in the back. I don't see how she was the hottest one, but people tell me she was.

So, okay. Oh, actually, nope, here we go. Here comes the hottest one. Holy cow, have you seen Dora? She was the hot one. She was very cute. Was Dora the youngest? No, no, I'm still working through them.

I'm just trying to tell you how cute Dora was. She had one of these noses that did like, peep. Oh, like a little who from Whoville? Like a little peep. My nose used to do it years ago. A little curl up. Yeah, it was a little adorable, like a little bit of a pig, but not quite. Yeah.

Oh, also, she was very smart, but who gives a shit about that, right? We don't care about this. It's all about the looks. Then finally, we get to marry the youngest Sutherland. sister. Hope that didn't take too long for you, Norm, we're finally here. Mary didn't have good stage presence. She was not a great singer. She had big emotional outbursts, and she could be difficult. These days, we would say that Mary was dealing with mental illness, but back in old timey times, doctors generally agreed that Mary's long

hair was weighing down her brain and therefore making her cocoa bananas. Ah. That makes a lot of sense. Yeah. Great for her. That's some great medicine right there. Great science. So there was something for everyone in this tight-knit, long-haired band of sisters.

They were all sisters. Are you sure? Yes, but it's a little more complicated than that. That's why I was being a little cagey with you. Some adopted? Half sisters. Oh, you're really sniffing it out, aren't you? That's right.

At the height of their fame, the Sutherland sisters were rich. They were admired. People wanted to be around them. And that was pretty wild considering how they'd all been raised. By the way, do you want to look up a picture of the seven Sutherland sisters? Hell yeah. You really need to. Oh, but don't get too turned on.

Yeah, we might have to pause this podcast. Seven Sutherland Sisters. Yeah, just go to images. You are going to... Oh, my. It's a treasure trove. They do have long hair. I mean, yeah, it's not false advertising.

Okay. Yeah. Oh, my. Oh, turned on. Norm, you need a minute? No, I'm good. Yeah, that is some wicked long hair. But you see how in the posing, you know, some of them are standing.

Yeah, some are sitting. Two are like facing each other in one of these photos And then there's like a dude there Is he the dad or the brother? He's the dad. Okay. Does he need to be in the photo? No, get the hell out of there.

No, and he looks pretty young. Maybe it's just an old-timey photo and I can't tell. I was going to say I'm not looking at really high-quality images. Yeah, they were working on it back then. The Sutherlands grew up on a turkey farm in Cambria, New York, near Niagara. Oh my God. God, I can't say it scared this shit out of me. It surprised this shit out of me.

That's what they heard all day, every day. Honestly, there is nothing more startling than a turkey impression. Honest to God, I think of all the noises you could have made, nothing would have startled me more. And I said the word turkey, so I should have been a little prepared for it. Well, if I just screamed into the microphone. I know. Would a turkey gobble still been worse? I'm not really sure.

but please don't try it. Anyway, they were on a turkey farm. Yeah. Oh, you don't do it when you're cute. Well, it's not fun anymore. All right. In Cambria, New York, near Niagara Falls. Nice.

That's my waterfall impression. Very good. And boy, did that turkey farm not make money? They grew up poor. They were social outcasts. And their dad, Fletcher Sutherland, was a real piece of work. Fletcher had always thought that he was hot shit because his dad had like actually been hot shit.

Okay, so his dad had been a minister and he'd become a colonel in the war of 1812. Damn. And he'd actually been the one to purchase the turkey farm. You talk about a name you don't hear anymore, Fletcher. I think Fletcher's a really cool name, which upsets me because I don't like this man at all. I don't think that's a full name. Fletcher Sutherland? I think that's kind of cool. I'm just talking first name, Fletcher.

I don't think that's a good name. You know, it's funny. It's one of those names. I guess the more you say it, it does sound a little like something that would get caught in your throat. Yeah. You'd have to cough up or like something you puke up. Sure. About to fletch this tequito I ate at the gas station.

About to fletch it up, boys. What about a turkey leg? Make it old-timey. So Fletcher had kind of tried to follow in his dad's footsteps, but he, He never really had the drive to see a task to completion. He's got no passion for turkey farming. Yeah, what the hell is wrong with him? It's fun to do.

Oh, that's way better than mine. You just sound like a crazy woman. It's my long hair. It's weighing down my brain and making me go cocoa bananas. This is a medical thing. So, you know, he became a reverend sometimes when he felt like it. And at one point he got into politics. Hell yeah.

Get ready to be really happy. That's dangerous when you're bored and you get into politics. Why? Maybe you're just wanting to make the world a better place, Norman. Maybe you think I've got some good ideas out here on this turkey farm and I'd like to force other people to deal with those ideas. Oh, boy. Let's hear about his great ideas. Well, you should know that he hitched his wagon to a star.

He worked for a brief while for a president. Ooh. I'll give you a hint. You would not be impressed by this president. Hmm. How old was he? The president or Fletcher? Fletcher.

I don't know either answer. Shit. I mean, there's a lot of presidents during this time period. I'm just going to name some shitty ones. Yeah. Franklin Pierce. Nope. James Buchanan.

That's the one. Yep. The drunk cockatoo motherfucker. Yeah, Fletcher was in there probably drinking too. Who knows? The truth was Fletcher was kind of lazy. He was kind of sleazy. He married a young woman named Mary Brink in the mid-1800s. Brink. And they started having children. Jersey Brink? Disney Channel original movie? The skaters? First of all. Soul skaters. There's nothing we can't do.

First of all, Norman. Yeah. No one memorizes Disney Channel original movies quite the way you do. So even if I had seen this film, I don't think. I'd be able to confirm. Also, this is kind of a sore spot because when we moved back to the United States from Mexico, we were on a tight budget. We didn't have cable. It was a tragedy. That sucks. It did suck because the Disney Channel rocked, as did Nickelodeon. Instead, I was stuck with 38 family grates and, you know, whatever else came on. It was terrible. Well, I would love to rewatch Brink, if you want to watch it with me. I think I'm busy that night. You're busy with those sharpshooters.

Yeah, the sharpshooters are very demanding. Sorry, I can't watch Brink with you. I'll be hanging out with multiple sharpshooters. You know what would be more likely is that the sharpshooters are like, wait, he's watching Brink in there? Oh, he's watching Brink? I love that movie. And then I just sit there alone, brokenhearted. Okay, so this turkey fucker married Mary Brink.

We don't know that he fucked the turkeys? Oh, he did. Okay. And in the mid-1800s, they started having children. And Fletcher definitely cheated on Mary. He said, wow, you know, I could never have a kid with a turkey, but... Good Lord knows I tried. Good grief.

You had an affair? Oh, yeah. Damn. It's widely accepted that he had children outside of their marriage. And if the rumor mill is true, some of those children came from Mary's sister, Martha. The sister? Yeah. Shit.

So it's now believed that two of the seven Sutherland sisters, Isabella and Dora, were actually Fletcher and Martha's biological children. We're going on Mori with this. I think the evidence is actually pretty strong on this. When both girls were born, Martha temporarily moved away from the turkey farm. And later... Wait, Martha was living with them? Yeah. So she moves away.

And later in the census records, Isabella and Dora were listed as Mary and Fletcher's adopted daughters. Oh, they're definitely. Absolutely. So, yeah, things were messy at home. And money was very tight. Fletcher could have worked, but he really preferred not to. Feel the same way, Fletcher, to be honest.

Fletcher preferred to spend his days chatting with people at the post office. Oh, that's fun. Yeah, it was really fun for his wife and Martha and the kids because they had to work on that turkey farm while he chatted away at the post office. He gossiped at the post office. It wasn't easy work. They had 500 turkeys on their 140-acre farm, and the children didn't even have shoes to wear. They tied burlap to their feet. Jesus.

Instead of regular clothes, they wore sacks. And this is Northern New York. And he's fucking gossiping at the post office while they're wearing burlap sacks? Yeah, he's a piece of shit. Man. He's probably like, sure about that guy that fucks his turkeys? It's definitely not me. It's not me, but I heard about it.

I think we should set a law that says it's okay if you own the turkey farm to do whatever you want, right? Yeah, it's your property. Yeah. I'm going to talk to James Buchanan about this. My good friend. What the hell did he do with James Buchanan, by the way? What was his job? I mean, I didn't get that far into that. It was, and I'm sure he didn't do much at all.

He probably just campaigned for him or something. Probably. Growing up, the girls were so embarrassed by their appearance that when people came to the farm, they often hid in the tall grass. School was really rough for them. They were known in their community for being a little weird, a little reclusive, and also for smelling absolutely terrible. The gals came by the stench honestly. Their mom, Mary, wanted to ensure that the girls had beautiful, healthy hair. So she had a habit of mixing up a thick, gooey substance and slathering it into the girl's hair. To this day, it's unclear what exactly was in that stuff.

But what is crystal clear is that it stunk to high heaven, and it made the girls into even bigger social outcasts. I wonder if it was like turkey guts. I honestly, who knows what was in this stuff. But it also maybe helped their hair grow. I mean, honest to God, I think this is mostly just genetics. But maybe it was the stinky substance too. So despite everything, the girls had great hair. And they also had an appreciation for music.

Mary had been a music student when she met Fletcher. and she passed that love of music onto the children. But unfortunately, the children didn't have a lot of time with their mother. Mary died a few years after giving birth to her youngest daughter, who, again, for the sake of making this super confusing, is also named Mary. Yeah. And wow, with Mary gone, there was no one around to reel Fletcher in. And boy, did Fletcher need to be reeled in.

Mary's sister Martha was still around as a mother figure. But Fletcher was the one calling all the shots. He didn't get to call the shots. He's not doing shit. He's the man of the house. I know. I'm just saying how bullshitty blip. That's all.

Yeah. Well, you're going to love how this story all ends up. I can't imagine checking our P-O-box and some dude standing there being like, hey, she brought that guy that fucks turkeys. But you know what, though? I was thinking about it. I bet back in the day the local post office. was really the place to be.

Oh, no, it was. That's where everybody got all their news. Everybody would hang out there. Yeah. It was free. Yeah. That's what I'm saying today, it would be weird. There's a guy wearing a burlap sack in the post office.

Talking to me about rumors of a guy that fucks turkeys. It's definitely not him, though. What would you do? I would just be polite, smile and nod and leave as fast as I could. I wouldn't even check my PO box. I would like pretend I was and then leave. You are so full of shit What do you think I would do?

If a man wearing just a burlap sack wanted to talk to you about turkey fuckers, you would not smile and nod. You would just bye, see ya! Yeah, actually, if I spotted him before I walked in the post office, I would turn right back around and drive away. You would immediately at the first hint of anything like that, you'd be like, goodbye. Well, never mind. I actually don't want to go to the post office. You might even be like, you know what? I've decided we're going to get a new P.O. box across town far away from where I witnessed that.

It's really inconvenient. I can never go back to that one. After a while, Fletcher decided that the best way to make some money was to become a stage dad. Oh, yay. Wonderful. It's what all great parents do. It's like a P.T. Barnum kind of guy. Oh, he wishes.

You kidding me? This is Fletcher we're talking about. This guy has very few good ideas. Yeah, no one can compare to Phineas, Barnum. Oh, Phineas. Okay, yeah, starts with a P. Boy, my brain really had to catch up with you there. It's okay.

Your brain is a... A beautiful thing? It's a little unmedicated. It's low on the whatever meth. What ADHD people take? Just pure meth. Yeah, thank you. Yeah, uh-huh.

Yeah, just need a little more meth. I get it at the post office from the guy in the burlap sack. So he had the children sing songs in churches and county fairs. In those days, the social norm was that girls who hadn't yet reached adulthood would wear their hair down. So when the girls and their often forgotten brother performed, one sister stood out above them all. It was 13-year-old Naomi. She was the one with the best singing voice. She had a beautiful voice and also long, glorious hair.

In fact, Naomi's hair was so long and her singing voice so strong that local newspapers wrote about her. She got offers to perform in vaudeville. And Fletcher saw dollar signs. Well, yeah, but just her. They were only interested in her. They were only interested in her. But he must have thought that it. be better to keep the children together as a group. And so for most of like 1870s or so, he took

his children on the road. He did originally position them as the seven Sutherland sisters and one brother, which is ridiculous. He had and one brother on the end? Yes. That sucks, dude. Yeah, poor Charles. I haven't even given him a name yet. His name is Charles. He was quickly booted from the group because no one cared about him. He could take some advice from P.T. Barnum. P.T. Barnum would be like, that is terrible, dude. Are you hoping that P.T. Barnum shows up in this story? Absolutely.

Let's see how that shakes out. So it didn't take a genius to figure out that overall, people were way more interested in the girl's hair than in their sweet tunes. So their hair became part of the show. The girls did little fairs and community theaters, and overtime demand for them grew. and all of a sudden the circus came calling. Aha. Agents wanted to represent them.

People needed entertainment, and this was the era of the freak show, where people would pay to see people with tattoos, people with piercings, little people, fat people. Hair acts were actually really big. So just people with crazy hair? Who wouldn't want to see a bearded lady?

And who could resist, taking a gander at Fedder Jeff Tchoo, or as you might know him by his stage name, Jojo the dog-faced boy. He had hair all over his face. Oh, I see. Can I look this up? Yes, yes. And actually, I don't know that I've seen it.

The dog-faced boy. No, I don't want Jojo's Siwa. That's too. Oh, my. Federer, Jeff to Chew from Russia. Okay. Wow. So he just had hair growing all over his face.

Wow. That's pretty wild. It is. I kind of want to look into him. What the medical condition is called for that? I don't know, but I sure think it's sweet to call him the dog-faced boy, don't you? My God. P.T. Barnum signed him.

Hey, don't read too much into that. Okay. Back off, buddy. All right, sorry. Premature of factulation there. That's right. Well, how are these sisters going to compete with Jojo? He's a star.

Oh, okay. So the seven Sutherland sisters were in an enviable position because they were being gawked at for their hair. But it was kind of an admiring gawking. It wasn't like the bearded lady or, you know, Jojo the dog-faced boy where people were like, ugh, ugh. Yeah, it wasn't like fascination or like, whoa, this is weird. It was just like, oh, they have long. pretty hair. And fascination. It's fascination too. Okay. Because it's a wild amount of hair.

But it's not like a freak show amount of hair. It's like, you just have long hair. It's seven sisters, 37 feet of it. I mean, it's, it really is in this weird, enviable space. Okay. Before long, the sisters were touring the United States. County fairs were so over. They were doing world's fairs now. Don't look them in the eyes. And by 1880s, They hit it big when they joined Barnum and Bailey's greatest show on earth. As a side show attraction. Ah, not the main event. Well, I mean, it really can't be the main event.

They're just ladies with hair, but, you know, still. Hey, you know, General Tom Thumb was part of the side show at Barnum and Bailey circuits, and he did not like it one bit. Okay. What years was he there? I mean, these are probably all people who interacted with each other. Isn't that wild? Tomptham may have passed away by 1882.

Oh, bummer. Well. Yeah. All right. I can't remember the exact date. So this whole time, the sisters walked that impossibly fine line that so many women, but especially women performers, have to walk. They had to balance the sex appeal of their long flowing hair, and the fact that they were

showing it off for fun and profit with the need to also maintain respectability. So that's why. I was talking about they sang the hymns. They sang mostly unscandalist songs. And they told stories and engaged their audience in lively conversation. They're more than just a pretty hair. Where are you from, soldier? Okay.

Oh, you smell terrible. But your hair's amazing. Oh, I'm so conflicted. It was a tough balancing act, particularly when P.T. Barnum began marketing them as, quote, the seven most pleasing wonders of the world. Pleasing. Yeah, gross.

People kind of admired them. The Sutherland sisters had the kind of hair that other women wanted to have. Victorian ladies didn't envy the bearded ladies, but they sure did envy the seven Sutherland sisters. Maybe she's born with it. Maybe it's stinky stuff. Maybe it's stinky shit. They wanted to know.

Oh, what their secret was. How did they get such long, healthy hair? How, how, how do I get it myself? It's what ever their mom used. Maybe. Well, once again, Fletcher saw dollar signs. Yeah, that's easy money right there. Oh, absolutely.

But from where we're sitting, it's easy. But this really had not been done before. Before this moment. Okay. To be fair, their manager, a guy named Henry Becer, Bailey also saw dollar signs. He was the nephew of James Bailey of Barnum and Bailey. And he was also super into Naomi, and the two of them would eventually get married.

What? Mm-hmm. Whoa. That's kind of big news. Oh, this is going to get ridiculous. That's front-page People magazine news right there. That's right. In the meantime, he figured, if all these women wanted to know the Sutherland sister's secret for long flowing hair,

the most profitable way to answer that question was with a product. Yeah. So here's the deal. The sisters tried to remember the recipe that their mom had used to create that disgusting stuff, but none of them could remember it. Well, and it smelled terrible, too. Sure. You can't sell something like that.

Probably not, but it's not like it actually mattered. Because, again, the real answer was probably genetics, but you can't sell genetics. so they decided to just make something up. Yeah. Yeah, you got to. And why the hell not? The 1880s were a great time for snake oil salesmen.

Tonics were all the rage. Oh, yes. Uh-huh. If you created a product that didn't do what it claimed to do, who was going to stop you? I think this is the same era as Charles Edward Brown-Saccard's ball juice. Yes, yes. Where he was like, yeah, you drink this and you'll be rock hard again and you'll be shooting gobs of cum everywhere. Okay, he didn't say that.

He implied it. And he said he could like do research better and like read longer. The ball juice did wonders. I would have been such a sucker for a tonic. They could say anything about these products. I mean, they're still doing shit like that today. I mean, it's a little more regulated. Don't pshaw.

It is a little more regulated. than that. No, it's not. Norman, you can't just say this product will make you rock hard, shoot, gobs to come, make you smarter, better, faster, stronger. Uh-oh, that's Kanye, that's terrible. You just got to change the language a little bit. Have you seen that documentary?

I think it's called like harder, better, faster, stronger, or something. It's about like the supplement industry. And how like you can just fucking throw anything in a pill and be like, yep, this soul. Yeah, it's not FDA regulated. Yeah. that I am a sucker about supplements. People say that it's just making your pee more expensive, but I do take them, just on the off chance that maybe it helps something. You're rolling the dice on this.

Yeah. Yeah, and I'm the opposite. I'm just like, I'm not putting anything in my body that I'm not supposed to. Well, I mean, I don't think taking a collagen supplement is that bad. Yeah, I don't know anything about collagen, so I'm not going to take it. Neither do I, but I take one every day just in case. So, Harry Bailey applied for a trademark and founded the Sutherland Sisters Corporation. From there, they created a magical hair-growing potion.

Hair-growing? Yeah. I thought it was just about, I want to make my hair feel soft and smooth. Oh, give me a break. It was for growing hair. Yes. Oh, well, that's easy. You just rub a potato on your skin and you'll grow hair.

I just like spat into the mic. Is that, what are you talking about with a potato? Are you just making stuff up? No, I, when I was a young man, I really wanted a beard. I still want a beard. I can't grow one. Okay. Instead, you're going to have neck pubs at some point?

I can grow neck pubs. Congratulations. We're still waiting on 4,500 patrons. When I was a young man, I really wanted a beard. And I read on the internet, if you rub a potato on your skin, it'll help. stimulate hair growth. So I would rub, I'd cut a potato

and I would rub it on my face hoping to grow more hair there and then I would eat the potato. Right, because you'd hate to waste it. Well, yeah. Potatoes are expensive. No, they're not. How long did you do this?

I had no idea you did this. Not long because it just felt weird and like bullshit. And I felt stupid rubbing a potato on my face. Sure. There's only. I've never told, I've never told anyone this.

Wow. This is an exclusive people. This is what you sign up for on Patreon. You know what sucks? My brother can grow a glorious beard. Yeah. And I just cannot. Have you been angry about this for a long time?

Not angry, just sad about it. Yeah. He's just sad. I mean, yeah, he really can grow a beard. Yeah, he's got a great, great beard. I'm really sorry. My dad can't grow a beard. So I don't know what the fuck happened in our family.

Hmm. Is Ryan your real brother? We don't know. I think so. Actually, I don't know. Your dad left the turkey farm that year and, uh... No. Well, he was in the Navy, you know. Oh, my. Let's investigate my family's affairs. No, Ryan's my brother. Yes. Yeah. It's just a sad story about your beard situation.

Yeah. Sorry, Norm. So the Sutherlands are selling a hair-growing potion. Would you like to know the name? of it. Yeah. Lucky number seven, colon, seven Sutherland sisters, hair grower. That's great. I think so, too. Yeah, lucky number seven is, it's perfect. It's a great name for hair growth. It's a great liquor name. Yeah, just a great name in general. It kind of works for anything, especially a miracle product. And this is definitely a miracle. It definitely works. You want to know

what it's made out of. Yeah, what are the ingredients? Borax. Oh, salt. Oh. Bay rum. What's that? I'm not really... B-E-I-R-U-M? B-A-Y-R-U-M. Okay.

Ground-up bits of a Spanish fly and other stuff. I assume... I mean, it sounds like it would really dry your hair out more than anything, but, you know, I don't know how often... Borax and salt. Yeah, that would... Yeah, it's a bunch of stuff. No, clearly. It's just a bunch of shit that threw together.

I mean, I don't know. I mean, borax is a cleaning agent. Yeah. And I... It does sound like it'll just dry your hair out. I don't know. Why am I trying to defend this made-up tonic from years ago? Yeah, it's just bullshit.

Right. They bottled up the tonic and sold it at a kind of high price. It cost 60 cents for a four-ounce bottle. Adjusted for inflation? About $20. Very expensive. $20 for a four-ounce bottle. That's not a lot.

Huh? That's not a lot. lot for 20 bucks. Oh, okay. I was like, 20 bucks. Yes. So this, I mean, you know how I hate to give a compliment when it's bullshit, but I mean, this was a smart move because they'd created a bullshit product, but they priced it pretty high. And that effectively made it a product for rich, fancy people. Yep. But also for middle-class people who were willing to sacrifice a big chunk of their paycheck to get longer hair. This is just like the ball juice tonic.

Same thing. Ball juice tonic? Yeah, the brown sacchar. He was like, oh, I have erections. Yeah, yeah, but I thought he was put in testicle. What did I miss? Did he make a little drink for people? So this is pre-monkey testicle transplants.

Okay. Charles Edward Brown-Saccarred was the guy who smashed up. of guinea pig testicles and like injected it into his body and was like I'm rock hard and I can do research way longer now and all it took was just one guinea pig's testicles that's it I don't know what a guinea pig sounds like when you smash its testicles I mean probably not good maybe like a turkey oh uh but yeah it was kind of the same thing it was like expensive and rich old rich dudes were Like, oh, I want my erections back. Yeah.

They would buy it up. And yeah, middle class too. See, I think this is so toxic. And I can see, again, I think this is a thing that works on me. Sometimes if a product is expensive, I'm like, well, it has to work. This is a known marketing strategy. If you price something too low, people might think it's bullshit. Yes.

I hate it. And I think I hate it the most because I know it would work on me. Mm-hmm. It certainly would. Okay. So the bottles flew off the shelves. The sisters were already celebrities, but now they were influencers. Wow. They posed in shop windows with their hair down to the floor to model the effects of their hair tonic. But that created a bit of a problem because just the sight of a Sutherland sister caused such a disruption and drew such a big crowd that a just.

asked the Sutherland sisters to stop posing in store windows. Wait, they would, they were literally in the store window. It wasn't like a cardboard cutout. No, like, if they were literally standing in a window. If they really wanted to move product, they would travel. And I saw some of the old-timey advertisements. They were really good. So like, and it was kind of fun to see the local ones because you would see them for like every town.

So the Kansas City one, it was like, it came a couple days before one of the sisters would show up to model. And it would be like, you know, at such and such drugstore, we're going to have one of the seven Sutherland sisters. And like the advertisement was huge. And they would always include a letter from a very real local woman. Who was like, I've tried this. And it works. And it worked wonders.

And like it would list her local address. So you can go talk to this lady who gave the testimony? Supposedly. Sure. That's crazy. And it would include. This is the funniest thing. Now, like, they would include before and after pictures.

Uh-huh. But a lot of them weren't actually pictures. They were drawings. Yeah. Yeah. Which is hilarious to me. Because, like, you can't even trust before and after photos. But I'm definitely not trusting a before and after drawing.

Wow, they didn't have Photoshop back then, so they just had to draw it, you know. It was official. People couldn't get enough of the seven Sutherland sisters. The first year they sold the tonic. They made $90,000. Adjusted for inflation? That's just under $3 million. Very expensive.

Damn. It was a ridiculous amount of money. The profit margins were insane. Well, yet borax and salt? Yeah, and you know there's water, you know. How much is a Spanish fly? Come on. Pennies.

Plus, it was easy money. It was much easier than performing all over the place, having to be all in one group. But they still have to perform because you've got to keep up appearances, you know. Well, sure, sure. Of course, their dad continued to be himself. When they first launched their hair growth tonic, Fletcher felt the need to insert himself into the public narrative a bit, which was completely unnecessary and very weird. He positioned himself as the one who'd invented the product. No.

Which was funny for a lot of reasons, but mostly because he was damn near bald. Yeah. No. No. The way to market it is say this is what our mother used on us. Sadly, she has passed, but she handed down the recipe to us. Yeah. That's how you market it. And it kind of later became that, but, you know, Fletcher's still around. So he wants. God damn it, Fletcher.

Yeah. Shut up. Stay out of the limelike. Well, and, obviously. Honestly, you sound like the customers, because the customers were not interested in the dad. It was all about the women. As the sisters grew older, things maybe got a little tense with their dad. He now had a reputation as a womanizer.

Womanizer, womanizer. Who sings that? Whitney Spears. Woman, womanizer. You, yeah, you, you, you, you, you, you, womanizer. What if it came out that she was inspired by. Fletcher Sutherland. I would love it.

I'd be like, oh my God, I knew about him. Wow, I know who that is. He often walked around the family farm in just his underwear. Jesus. You know what? I'm disgusted by him, and I really like that you're almost more disgusted by him. Well, you said he worked for James Buchanan. That really set me off.

That was all you needed. You also didn't like him hanging around the post office. I don't like that either. Quit loitering around the post office. office. Go home, dude. It seemed more and more obvious that his main interest wasn't in his children, but in his children's ability to make money. It's hard to say how the women felt about their father, but there are hints out there.

One of those hints is that the sisters were all very close. They were very loving. They especially loved their pets. They gave their pets the best, most lavish lifestyles that money could buy. Hell yeah. Now, this is what I live for right here. What did they do? Okay. Well, first of all, when their pets died, they went into serious mourning. But when their dad died, not too long after they'd launched the hair care business, all the women were like, oh, no. That is too, I'm sad. Are you sad? What's for dinner? Oh, no. Another hint as to how the women might have felt about their father could be found in how they felt about men in general.

Of the seven sisters, four of them never married. Really? Yeah. What's that about? Were they... We'll talk about it. Into ladies? Maybe.

Maybe. And of the seven sisters, only one of them, Naomi, ever had children. With James Bailey. Yeah. Okay. That was highly unusual. And it would be unusual today, right? Seven sisters. Only one of them has children. Yeah. Four of them never get married. That's very unusual. The odds are, yeah, odd. Odds are odd. Yeah. What do you make of that? Could it have been a genetic thing where they like... So, wait, wait, sorry, I'm thinking they couldn't have children. But four of them. them never got married. Right. Yeah, maybe they just, they were not straight. Maybe they were gay or asexual or, I don't know. Why? Is this a gotcha moment? What do you mean a gotcha moment?

I just think it's highly unusual. I have some theories, but I wanted to get your take. I've noticed maybe it's the historian and you. I've noticed when I'm like, here's a scenario. What do you think? You're like, Well, I don't know I wasn't there. I mean, that's me. I don't want to say the wrong thing. That's all. Sure. These are just theories.

Do I need to put on my petty bitch lens? Yeah, please do. All right, hang on. Think of it through the petty bitchlands. Maybe they were just boss-ass bitches and they're like, I want all the money to myself and I don't want to split it with some dude. Fucking finally, Norman, welcome. Yes. That is one of my theories.

It is actually one of my theories. Yes. Man, the petty bitch lens worked. It sure does. Because buy yours today. 2999, 10% off if you're on the $10 to you. Make it more expensive so people believe it works. 179.

Yeah, yeah. Uh-huh. Okay, so I'm going to go through my theories. It could have been that the women understood that marriage could mean losing everything that they'd worked so hard to gain because marriage was nuts back then. You basically gave all your power, all your money to this dude. Yeah. It could also mean that maybe the man.

marriage that they'd seen modeled for them growing up wasn't something that they wanted for themselves. Right. I do think there's a possibility, you know, maybe some of the sisters were gay, who knows. I also think that maybe Fletcher was a really, really, really, really bad dude. Mm, could have been a, like a... Yeah. I don't know.

I just... We're going to talk more about their relationships with men, and something's off. I think. At any rate, boy, it's fun to talk about people who are long gone and can't sue me. You could say whatever you want. With their dad gone, the women continued to be business cats. Their hair tonics sold so well that they decided to add new products to their line. Hell yeah.

Got to expand, got to diversify. There you go. They added combs and brushes and scalp cleaners. Accessories, yes. Dandruff busters, hair colorators in eight. shades. Oh. Colorator.

Wow. Hair coloring? Yeah. Damn. All great ideas. They continued to keep their prices high because customers believe that if their tonics cost a lot of money, again, they had to work. That's got to work.

Their ads improved. One of their taglines read, it's the hair, not the hat that makes a woman attractive. So true. When you see me in my little Adidas running hat, You're like, I want to see that hair, baby. When I first met Kristen, she was wearing a beanie with a little propeller on the top, and I was like, take off that damn beanie. I don't care how sexy that beanie is.

Generally, before, oh, no, see, this is the downside to not reading my stuff ahead of time. I'm about to tell you what I've already told you. Sisters would make an appearance at a store. Okay, a little letter, blah, blah, blah, blah. By 1890, they'd sold approximately $3 million worth of their hair. growth tonic. Adjusted for inflation. Oh, okay.

So this has not been inflated yet. Are you ready? Yeah. Wait, can I guess? Sure. $28 million. I'm sorry, that was so condescending. Am I way off?

You wish, buddy. Oh, my God. About $105 million. That's pretty good. Their products were sold everywhere from New York City to Havana. It is unbelievable. The sisters were written about in nearly every publication you can think of. Cosmo, the New Yorker, Readers Digest, the New York Times.

Within just a few years of launching their hair growth tonic, they had one of the biggest beauty brands in the world. Damn. Was the brand Lucky Number Seven for all their products? No, no, no. I think, well, actually, I guess I don't know. Seven Sutherland Sisters was the brand. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know.

What if we found some of their stuff on eBay and tried it? There are bottles available on eBay. I want an unopened bottle. Well, that might be a little harder to find. You can also buy the ads where it's the hair, not the hat. It makes a woman attractive. I think it's pretty cute. But life wasn't perfect.

In fact, it was pretty weird. Ain't that the truth People were obsessed with them And as their fame grew People got bolder They didn't just want postcards Or products

They wanted a lock of their hair Yes Yep Yes they wanted actual strands Of the women's hair Not a lock Right But something to show the full length

They wanted a full hair Yes Oh boy A jeweler offered Victoria $2,500 to cut all of her hair off. Oh, that's way too low. Adjusted for inflation, it's $87,000. Yeah, that's not enough.

Yeah, she said no. But when she said no, he worked out a deal with her. $25 for one strand of her hair. That I would do. Adjusted for inflation, that's $872. Why not? One strand, yeah. Yeah.

She took the deal, and he went back to his store with the hair, and he attached a 7-carat diamond to the end of the strand and proudly displayed it for all to see. That is so weird to me. If any history hose out there would like to buy strands of my hair, I'll give you an even better deal. Yeah, you'll take, you don't even have to adjust for inflation. Just $25 for one strand.

How? Yeah, $25, I'll give you one strand, sure. Let's just call it 20, so I don't have to make change or anything. Oh, wow. Yeah. Negotiating against yourself. We love to see it. People were getting weirder.

They were more entitled to the sister's personal space. Don't like this. And in turn, the sisters got a little weirder too. In 1893, they went back to the turkey farm. They knocked down the log cabin where they'd all once lived. And they built the most wildly opulent Victorian mansion. Is it still around? Hang on, don't look it up.

Okay. They wanted it to be big enough to house all of them forever. And it was. They're all going to live together? Yes. Like the property brothers? Yes.

Ooh, that's kind of. I know. I think. Well, different time. I'm not going to judge. Here's a thing. It's weird, but it's also like, I think it kind of makes sense when they grew up as these social outcasts, but they had each other. Yeah.

And now they've had this experience that few people could ever possibly relate to. And so that just draws them. even closer. And now they've got all this money. Was James Bailey living with living with them too? We'll talk more about that. This house for some of them became kind of like, you know, again, they're these huge celebrities. So a lot of them were traveling a ton. Maybe it's more accurate to think of this as like a headquarters. I'm sure some of them live there like all the time. But the house had 14 rooms, seven of which were bedrooms. They had the first in-deme. bathroom in their entire town.

That's what I was going to ask you. Uh-huh. Plumbing. How many turlets did they have? Just the one, but I mean, it's wild to think of one bathroom for all those people is opulent, but it was. In this time period, it was a big deal. Yeah. Yeah.

It's just, it's so funny to me, you could have the wildest, craziest mansion back in the day. Yes. And there would be one fucking bathroom. But it's because it was like a brand new thing back then. Okay. This is me just assuming. I could be totally wrong. But I think so much of it is it's too big of a paradigm shift.

You're talking about a time period when everyone had an outhouse. And why would you ever have more than one outhouse? You only ever had one outhouse. Yeah. So it seems natural that like, okay, now we're moving it inside. You still only need one house. Yeah. You have to like evolve and learn.

Oh, it sure would be handy if there were two of these. Yeah. Because Naomi's in there taking a Mondo Duke. And I've got to take a Mondo Duke now too. The Chipotle opened up down the road. And now what we really need are seven toilets. Maybe a spare. It wouldn't be a Chipotle.

It'd be like a Boston Market. Boston Market is not going to send you to the toilet like Chipotle will. Whatever. I used to love their little cornbreads. Do you remember? Did you ever have one of those little cornbreads? Oh, yeah. Boston Market's great. We should go to Boston Market. Okay, I haven't been in like 20 years. I have a feeling it's gone downhill. I feel like if it was still good, people would talk about it. Well, that's why we need to go to find out. I don't know that we need to go. Instead of trivia next month. What if we just filmed a like little vlog of us eating a terrible meal at Boston Market?

I will say I do love the trivia. Trivia is a lot of fun. You've done a great job with the trivia. Oh, thank you. Yeah, I'm kind of the producer of trivia, I guess. You're definitely the producer. Yeah. Appreciate it.

You're the one who checks all my answers and makes sure I'm not making stuff up. It's true. Although our last trivia, we looked at the summary after the game. And it kind of shows you which questions were considered the hardest. Uh-huh. And out of the top five, four of them were my questions. So maybe I was being a little tricky boy, last trivia. You know, last trivia, like, your research for it was better than ever.

You put more energy into it than ever. And I just feel like it's because you smashed that guinea pig's testicles and drank the juice. Like, that's the only logical explanation. Oh, I'm sorry. I threw that guinea pig in the trash. Oh, stop. I don't know why you were going through the trash. I just had to have the explanation for why trivia was so good.

And that's the only logical one. It's because I drank brown saccharges. Extra testicles. Yep. Yep. Yeah. So they had the first indoor bathroom in the entire town. Incredible.

Hold on. You haven't even heard the best part. What's that? It had hot and cold running water. Ooh. Okay. The hot water is a big deal. So did they have like a big ass furnace to heat the water?

Like a cauldron? Here's how it happened. every day, servants had to refill the attic water tank by hand. It sounds terrible. I mean, that would be a hell of a job. Attock? Yeah. So it's not just we're carrying water.

It's gravity plumbing. Yeah. Yeah. Shit. So they have to haul buckets of water all the way up to the attic for seven sisters to use the bathroom and do all their business. And, you know, I assume other people are there too. That would suck when they all want to take a bath on the same day.

Shit. So the water, they heated the water up in the attic and then gravity. I assume, yeah. That's crazy. That's a ton of work. Yeah. But, I mean, they had all this money. And I guess they felt like this is a worthwhile expense.

You do think about back in the day, if you got a hot bath. how big of a deal that was. Oh, it would be huge. Yeah. It would be amazing. Imagine if you had a hot tub, then you would be the richest person on earth, like a true hot tub. That's why we say hot tub rich.

Yeah. It's an old timey phrase. You know, it's funny. Nowadays, people are all about like cold plunges. It's like, hey, back in the day, that's how everyone bathed. Don't roll your eyes. It's just commentary, how things come back around. No, no, no.

I'm not rolling my eyes at you. I'm just thinking, like, I do think we sometimes. do the old timey stuff kind of for no reason. Maybe a cold plunge works. I don't know. But it just seems kind of like, hey, here's something miserable. Try it.

It has to be good for you if it's kind of the same logic as it's expensive, therefore it works. Like, hey, this thing kind of sucks. Try it out. It's healthy. Well, I think there's a lot of things that come back around that people justify as like, well, this is how they did it back in the day.

And why did we stop doing this? And it's like, listen, if you went back in time with hot water, no one would choose the cold water baths. They'd be like, this is incredible. Yeah. Like there's a reason we moved on from that, okay, because it sucked ass, all right? We evolve, we change, we understand, we grow. You live, you learn, you take a hot shower.

You bleed, you learn, it's cream. Your servant brings you water. the attic. I don't even know what you're saying over there. Well, rude. The sisters had never been big on budgeting, Norm, and they certainly didn't rain it in. Oh, no. Well, there are seven of them. Oh, boy. You're getting a little concerned, a little worried. I am. Doing some math, not liking how it pans out. Well, I'm just thinking of the cost of having servants run hot water to the attic every day. Yeah, that's not even all the servants. That's just the water ones. Yeah. I don't know that there were certain servants who had.

Well, it would have to be, you'd have to have certain servants who were really the water people, because, I mean, that, you'd have to be strong to do that. Maybe they rotate. They're like, okay, Norman, you're on the hot water shift today. I'm like, fuck! No, I mean, damn it. Not everybody can do that. Yeah, only buff boys like me. Yeah, little buff boys. Yeah. Norman, you're looking extra buff today. Thank you. You just never realized that they're buttering you up to do the worst job. Yeah, got to make me feel good. So they didn't rain in their spending at all when it came to this house.

Damn, okay. They had the best furniture. The most beautiful woodwork. Crystal chandeliers. All of their beds were imported from Europe. Oh, no. They were some of the wealthiest women in America, and that gave them a lot of freedom. Freedom to ride bicycles in nothing but their swimsuits.

Jesus Christ. Freedom to buy all the jewelry, all of the jewelry. All the clothes. Hire all the maids, the valets, ingest all the drugs. Drink all the booze. Were that kind of party animals? Yes, some of them. Nice.

Well, it's not always good fun, Norm. Not everybody cuts themselves off after a couple, you know? Just saying, I'm just thinking of, like, you got money, you got the nice house, you got the party lifestyle, you know, have some fun. Okay. I know, I feel... Could become a problem, though, yeah. Could definitely, slash will, become a problem. Okay. Spoilers.

But, okay, I feel like I kind of teased you a little bit by talking about their pets earlier. Mm-hmm. And then I didn't really give you more details. I just said when their pets died, they mourned them, I mean, in a big way. Let me tell you about what it was like to be a pet in this house. Oh, shit, the tell-all from Fido. Their pets ate better than a lot of people did. Really?

Really? We're they feeding them? Boston Market? It was Boston Market every day. Take the dog to Boston Market. I mean, here's the thing. It's kind of like you and me. And I feel like it's this way with a lot of people who don't have kids.

You just, you put a lot of love toward your pets. You make sure they have what they need. We do. And I mean, yeah, if you have wild amounts of money, you know what? These dogs need prime rib. And you know, why wouldn't they have the best cream spinach? I don't know why. I'm just hungry now.

Yeah, I don't think we're going to go that far with Doddy and Kit. Well, we haven't made $11 billion off of our hair tonic yet. Yeah, you're right. Maybe if the Patreon goes up, we'll start giving them prime rib. What do we do with this money? And Doddy and Kit are like, we know what you do. Yeah. When a pet died, their sisters placed obituaries in the local newspapers.

Oh, well, I think that's. touching. Yeah. Yeah, there's nothing wrong with that. No, and they held elaborate funerals. Aw. They gave their pets summer and winter wardrobes. Oh. Yeah. These pets had the finest things. Hell yeah. Each sister had a maid who brushed her hair every night. By the way, this is kind of gross. So if you got a queasy stomach, at the end of each hair brushing session, the maid would collect any loose hairs, and then those loose hairs, once they got enough of them,

would be made into a three-foot-tall replica of that sister. What? Yes, and that doll, I'm sorry, this is so gross. That doll would then be dressed in the finest Victorian fashions and then sent out to stores to help promote the Sutherland sisters hair care products. Is that not nasty? I hate it. Why?

I mean, I guess for marketing. People back in the day were into hair art, right? Yes, yes, it was a thing. It was kind of a cool thing. Like they would take, you know, if your loved one died, hair is the kind of thing. It never loses its color, never loses its texture. and you know, you wouldn't necessarily have a photo of everyone. And so you'd get the lock of hair.

You'd make art out of it. But how do you make a, the doll was completely made out of their hair? Yes. How do you even do the facial features with hair? I don't want to know. Stick a little button on there or something. All I know is, you know, with this amount of hair, you know, they're kind of like, oh, cute hair art you did there, Sharon.

Look at my three foot tall doll. Yeah, made from the Sutherland sisters' hair, which is the finest hair. The sisters had always tried to cultivate an image of proper Victorian womanhood. That was very important to the brand. Sure. But as they got more famous and more wealthy and more not married, people started to wonder about them. Also, what was the deal with Mary? Something was wrong with her, right?

That was the one that maybe had a... Mm-hmm. Illness. Yeah. Yeah. So the truth was, Mary had always suffered from some kind of mental illness. And although she was privileged enough to live in that beautiful mansion, the door to Mary's bedroom had a lock on the outside. Oh.

The door also had a little slot where servants could pass her food and water. That's really sad. I mean, that's how they handled a lot of mental illness stuff back in the day, was lock the person away. And it's like solitary confinement. Yeah. Yeah. Future topic? Oh.

Isn't that a Quaker thing? Solitary confinement? It came from the Quakers, right? I think so. So I think that's one of those ideas that starts from such a good place and then has bad results. I believe it was the Quakers who thought that, you know, prison should be a time for reflection. And, you know, maybe if you could, if somebody could take some quiet time and reflect, then they could reform. do better and, you know, ultimately be a better member of society.

But yeah, it turns out too much solitary confinement is not good for a person. I know. I've watched Oz. You've seen it all. It's not good. Not good what goes on in prisons. Good show, by the way. Oz was great.

See, I think Oz was one of those shows that made people much more fearful of the people in prison. Oh, yeah. It was like way over the top. Yeah. And, like, definitely don't watch Oz and be like, yeah, this is what prison's like. But it was just like a good-ass show Because we lock up way too many people in America And that's a real

Anyway, we're getting way off topic We're way off topic We need to talk about three foot Tall hair dolls Let's reel it back in Let's get back to the hair The smelly stinky hair Also I've got some scandalous stories to tell you

Okay Here we go Once, while they were on tour in San Francisco The Sisters met a man named Frederick Castle Main He was so cool He was so hot. Oh, my God.

He and Dora, the hot one, were the obvious match. Yeah. They were close in age. They got along great. End of list. So the sisters invited him to come back to their fabulous mansion. He's like, I'm available. And the story goes that back at the mansion, everybody got pretty drunk.

But Frederick got super duper drunk. Oh. And it was in that drunken stupon. stupor that he married Isabella He married a different sister She was 40 He was 27

Oh The neighbors said Uh huh That on the carriage ride back from the wedding Frederick had his arm Around Dora Did he get confused It was like

I care what sister I married There are a couple theories on this one of them is that Isabella was being kind of predatory and took advantage of how drunk he was. Another theory is that this was kind of a love triangle and everybody was fine with it. Oh, this is scandalous. I don't know. It got the rumor mill a going, though. What happens on the turkey farm stays on the turkey farm.

Except it didn't. Oh, that's right, because it was gossipy. Well, yeah, and I mean, it really fed the rumors more. more when Isabella and Dora continued to be close, continued to not have a problem with each other, people were like, what the hell is going on? What the hell went on? So we don't know what was going on, but we do know that the sisters were kind of playing with some fire. That same year that they built the mansion, Naomi Sutherland, the sister who'd married Henry Bailey,

and who was the only sister to ever have children, passed away. Oh. Yeah, she was only 35 years old. It's believed she most likely died from cancer. Okay. After she died, Henry focused on the hair care business, and her sister Grace raised Naomi and Henry's children. How many children did they have? Oh, gosh, I think three or four.

So do we have descendants today of the Sutherland sisters? I'm sure we do, but there'd be very few of them. Why do you say that? It's only Naomi who had the children. Yeah, but if she had three or four, like, you could start a good crop with that. You could start a good crop. I mean, you know, I'd have to look it up, but I'm sure we do have descendants. Naomi's death would be the first of many examples of the sisters not handling death well.

For too long, they just kept Naomi's body in the mansion. Oh, dead? Yeah. Ooh, that's creepy. They made plans to create this $30,000 mausoleum adjusted for inflation. That would have been a million dollars. But they never actually got around to making the mausoleum. So they just buried her in the family cemetery and didn't even get around to getting a headstone for her.

Oh, gosh. That's a very stark difference from a mausoleum to buried without a headstone. What's your theory on that? They ran out of money. I think that's definitely possible that 30 grand was just way too much. Yeah. But what's your theory on, okay, we want the $30,000 mausoleum, and instead what we end up with is no headstone whatsoever. Maybe was no headstone to like for privacy reasons?

Nope. Well, then I have no idea. Why? I mean, there's only theories. Do I need my petty bitch lens on? Yes. Put your petty bitch lens on. Hang on.

was it an ego thing? For who? Like where the sisters like we all want, we're going to make like a grand giant headstone for all seven of us when we die. And so she's not going to get her own because we're a team. Maybe.

I mean, maybe I can see there being like, we all need to be together. It needs to all be this big elaborate thing. Part of me wonders about the trouble with coming to a consensus with this many people, especially when they're grieving this hard, I imagine it would be really, really tough

to come to an agreement on what to do. And I do think in situations like that, it can become, okay, either we do the biggest, most elaborate thing, or we do nothing. Paralysis of choice kind of deal where it's like you can't decide, it's just easier to barrier and move on.

Also, you know, an ADHD thing. This is me to a T. I want to do the best biggest thing. And that is so overwhelming that instead I will do absolutely nothing. I'll do the bare minimum. Like bury the body. Yeah, I will bury the body because the county health board is like, lady, you can't leave a dead body in your mansion for this long.

It's starting to smell bad. Naomi's death created a weird problem. Without her, could they still call themselves the seven Sutherland sisters? Technically, no, there are only six now. Oh. Could they still tour? Yes. As the seven Sutherland sisters?

No, just call yourself the six Sutherland sisters. Norm, you are so damn wrong. Did they just bring a stand in? Yeah, they got a replacement. They hired a woman from Pennsylvania named Anna Louise Roberts, and she had nine feet of hair, so she did just fine. What the hell? And no one was like, I've never seen her before.

I think this is old-timey shit. You can get away with this stuff. Yeah, there's like not a lot of visual references. So, yeah, you could. And yeah, you've built this brand, the seven Sutherland sisters? Sorry, we're not changing it. It can't be six. It has to be seven.

In the meantime, things weren't going so great for our friend Frederick Castlemain, who was definitely Isabella's husband and probably Dora's lover. As it turned out. He was two-timing, you think? I don't even know that it's accurate to call it two-timing. It might have been... It's just a weird situation. Well, and, you know,

Oh, God, this is me trying to cosplay as someone who's not judgy. I am judgy. This is an incestuous three-way. Really? I mean, no, maybe not a three-way. We don't know that. You know what, this is grosser than the hair dolls. I'll just say that.

Okay. As it turned out, Frederick loved a good time, but he also, in a deeper sense, loved opium. Lots and lots of opium. What does opium do to you? I know it's a drug. And I know it was like the thing to do back in the day. It just makes you kind of loopy. Perhaps coincidentally, he had some really fun hobbies.

You want to hear about them? Yeah, I like hobbies. Hobbies like sitting on the front porch of the mansion with a gun and shooting at the wagon wheels of people who are passing by. Oh, that's, yeah, okay. Yeah, you're never going to believe this, but the owners of the wagons were never amused by those antics. We're talking about farmers who were trying to do their job

And some fucking high as a kite, Frederick, who is shooting their wagon wheels and cackling, and then, you know, the farmers would get mad and he'd pay for them because, you know, they had the money, but. What would you do if I was sitting on our front porch with a gun shooting at cars driving by? Are you kidding me? No, I just asked you a question. I would have you evaluated, darling. By whom? I'd be like. Dr. Phil?

I'd be like, Norm? Get in the car. We're getting ice cream. Oh, boy. Now put that gun down. The folks at Andes do not like it. You can't bring the gun into Andes. And then I'd go to a facility.

Okay. It'd be like, they actually have great ice cream in this place. You're going to love it. Yeah, as they tie me up in a jacket and take me away. I mean, the idea of me doing that, yeah, there's something going on. Well, yeah. I wouldn't just like. Maybe I'm high on opium.

To answer your question, that would not be something that I would be cool with. Okay. That's a good answer. Frederick had problems. And in 1897, when he was accompanying the women on one of their tours, he died by suicide. Oh. Yeah. Okay. I think he had a lot going on.

Yeah, clearly. Once again, the sisters didn't handle death well. they kept his body in the music room of their mansion in a casket that had a glass dome, but they didn't embalm his body. They kept him there for several weeks until finally the health department intervened, and they moved his body into a mausoleum. What do you make of them not handling death well? You think it's from their mother dying?

Possibly. I think they had it. I think that's why I'm so hard on the father. I think they had a very traumatic childhood. Because a lot of this stuff doesn't make sense to me. Okay. You know, of course, death sucks. I mean, and I even hate saying they didn't handle death well.

Because I don't think it's right to say that there's a right and wrong way to grieve. But like, for kind of all of them to co-sign on we're just leaving his body. can all agree that leaving a body in a room for weeks that's not embalmed is like not a good way to grieve. And it's because their hair was dragging on their brains. That's a damn shame. And that's why. Yeah. For the next two years, Isabella walked three miles to the cemetery every night to visit the mausoleum. But she stopped when she met a guy named Alonzo Swain. Now that's a cool name. He was 30 years old. And how old is she? 46. Oh boy. The two of them got married and Alonzo apparently convinced Isabella to sell off all of her shares in the company that she had with her sisters. So she did. And then she and Alonzo created their own hair-growing tonic to compete with the seven Sutherland sisters tonic.

No, don't ruin a good thing. It was a massive betrayal to the family. Yeah. The experience really shook the other sisters. So when Victoria came to them at age 50 and was like, hey, check out my new 19-year-old boyfriend, the other sisters were like, whoa, no, no, no, no, what are you thinking? Age gap, which is what anyone should say in this situation. Well, no, these guys are just like trying to make money, right? They just hustling these sisters? I mean, I think probably, yeah. but I think it also says something about these women that they want someone much younger than them. I think that shows that they definitely don't want to be taken advantage of.

So they want them young and dumb? I think so. And, you know, there could be an argument that, well, these young men are taking advantage financially. But I think that's just, to me, that's just part of the deal. Maybe they're just looking to get rocked. What a young dude. Sure, sure. So yeah, the sisters were like, Victoria, get a clue.

He's not in love with you. He wants your money. And Victoria was like, nah, and the other women were like, yeah, huh. And they got into a huge fight, and that fight became permanent. Oh, did it split the group up? They kicked Victoria out of the mansion. And it was only when she was on her deathbed three years later in 1902 that her sisters came and visited her again. Now, you just said something interesting.

You said, so this is what breaks it all up. Yeah. Soon enough, they hired a woman named Anna Haney to be Victoria's replacement. Yeah. She had six feet of hair, but everything was getting so much more complicated. The women were getting older. Times were changing. And ridiculously long hair was starting to go out of fashion.

Hmm. Yeah. Okay. Their business was still bringing in a lot of money, but not nearly as much as it once had. And the sisters hadn't curbed their spending at all. Yeah. It seemed like everything was slowly falling apart. That guy's still hauling hot water up to the attic. Yeah. I'm going to need a raise. And they're like, we'd love to, but everyone's chopping their hair off now and we're all screwed. Also, we're 50-year-old influencers, and it turns out that's not nearly as popular as being an 18-year-old

influencer. It's funny how things don't change. What do you mean? I mean, I mean, I I think that happens in like Hollywood today or, yeah, like people get older and their value goes down. Yeah, you kind of have to evolve. Right. So things are falling apart. Isabella had gone off to start her own competing hair tonic, but the formula she had come up with was basically just alcohol. And it failed. It's hard to know.

Was it the timing was bad? She didn't have the branding. also sounds like she'd had an inferior product, which is tough to say about another product that was also bullshit. But in the end, Isabella lost everything. She died in 1914, in poverty. She was 62. Damn.

A few years later, in 1919, Sarah died. She was 73. She had been the sensible one. She'd been the leader. What would they do without her? The remaining sisters weren't sure. So they did what they always did. They displayed her body in the mansion for way too long.

Oh, boy. Before eventually burying her. Can I ask a question? Sure. Did that Alonzo guy stay with Isabella? Oh, okay. Or did when the alcohol hair tonic failed, did he skip town? So, okay, this is the downside to researching something a long time ago and then trying to go back and retell it.

The story I read was, I believe, that immediately after Isabella died, he just bounced. Okay. I feel like I'd read a more scandalous version of that story, and I can't remember it now. Maybe he started up another family or something. I can't remember. But, yeah, he bounced. By that point, only Mary, Dora, and Grace remained. They were in a really bad position.

Times had officially changed. The Bob haircut was in. Are you familiar? Oh, yeah. It was unreal. Women were cutting off all their hair. Suddenly, it was seen as old-fashioned and matronly and maybe a little gross to have hair so long that it brushed your butt cheeks. Well, Sutherland Sisters, you're in your 60s and 70s now.

So, yeah, it's an old lady look. Yeah. Nobody wanted the seven Sutherland Sisters products anymore. That was bad news for Dora and Grace and Mary because they had run out of money. And when I say run out of money, really completely run out of money. So in 1919, they went to Hollywood. A studio had expressed interest about making a movie based on their lives. Really?

Yeah, and the sisters had high hopes. Because I think this is the way to go. No one's buying the hair care products anymore. But they did have a really interesting life story. Sure, yeah. Why not make some money off a movie? Yeah. Sell the right to your life.

story. But the trip turned out to be a complete disaster. While they were there, Mary had to be hospitalized for insanity. Dora was hit by a car while she was crossing the street. And she died. Oh my God. Grace had Dora's body cremated, but she didn't have the money to pay for it. So when it came time to pick up Dora's remains, Grace and Mary just didn't. Grace and Mary... They are in Bad shape. Yeah. Grace and Mary left Hollywood without Dora. Worst vacation ever.

I mean, I hate to say it. But it is almost like comically horrible. I mean, you're starting up here high. Like we are selling, we're going to make some money. Yes. Selling the right story life story. This is our lifeline. A studio has expressed interest in our story. They go out there.

They don't make any money. Right. One sister gets hit by a car and dies. Mary had to be hospitalized. Mary is hospitalized. They cremate their sister and they can't pick up the ashes because they can't pay for it. That is a terrible trip. And they've got a long way home.

Yeah, it's the opposite side of the country. We know geography. That's right. So Grace and Mary went back to the mansion, but life wasn't nearly as lavish as it had once been. You got to sell that mansion. There's only two of you now. Sell the 14-bedroom mansion. Quite an idea, Norm. They didn't have servants anymore. They didn't have the latest fashions. They didn't even have enough money for food. The only real family they had left were Naomi's children, who were now grown. And holy shit, one day Naomi's son Harry sold the mansion to some guy named Cecil Carpenters.

The house sat empty for a while. And on January 24th, 1938, it burned to the ground. Oh, so it's not there anymore. Mm-mm. Shit. That sucks about all these cool old houses. I know, but they're so susceptible to fires. Yeah.

Mary was committed to the Buffalo State Asylum for the insane. She died there in 1939. And that left Grace as the last of the seven Sutherland sisters. God, how old is she? She's got to be like 90. Yeah, she's in her 90s. She was the funny one. The peacemaker, and she was the last to go.

She lived for a while with her nephew, Harry, but then he died. She outlived the nephew. Yes. And the next year, in 1946, Ray Sutherland passed away at the age of 92. She was buried in an unmarked grave. Unmarked? Which is pretty wild. Yeah.

At their peak, the seven Sutherland sisters were a huge sensation. They were the first celebrity model. arguably the OG Kardashians, and in the end, all of that just vanished. Disappeared. And that's the story of the seven Sutherland sisters. Damn, that is wild. I've never heard of that before. I'd never heard of it either.

It's almost scary to me. It's this one-of-a-kind huge beauty brand. They're everywhere. They're doing all these things. They're known by everyone. And then nothing. That really is like the Cartagians. The Kardashians just, poof.

Yeah. Everyone forgets about the Kardashians. They're just gone. Yeah. Yeah, that's crazy story. There's got to be descendants. Well, sure, sure. Do you want to look up the mansion now?

Yeah. Yeah. Search Sutherland Sisters Mansion. It's the Sutherland Sisters and the beautiful mansion. Just down the street from Boston Market. My. in Niagara Falls, original song. Yeah, it's beautiful.

That's a cool-ass house. Yeah. You love a turret. Very Victorian. Mm-hmm. Yeah, if your house has a turret, congratulations. You've made it, baby. You have made it.

You know, you're talking about circle driveways or hot tubs or double front doors. If your house has a turret, you fucking made it, my friend. Very good, Kristen. That was really interesting. Thank you to a local frog for that suggestion. Local frog, you've done it again. You crazy, rabbit. Kristen, we asked our discord for a question this month.

We sure did. Like we do. And would you like to tell the history hose our inspiration for this question? Folks, our inspiration was simply this. Your girl took a tumble down the stairs. broke my butt. This is the second tumble I've taken down the stairs. So if inevitably I die from falling down the stairs, please, it's on all of you to make sure that Norm does not go to prison for my murder. I was chilling in my office when Kristen came a tumbling down. Oh my gosh. I had a

full glass of iced tea in one hand, a full water bottle in the other and also a phone kind of, you know, you got to do what you got to do. And boy, She fell. I was very lucky I did not hit my head. But when I tell you, my tailbone hit at the worst possible angle, I felt like I shattered my ass. Shattered it. There's a huge crack down the middle. But also other ones as well. My butt hurts just sitting here. You gave me ibuprofen before we recorded. That was very sweet. Yeah, well, I remember it, I heard quite a loud crash, and I came running out, I was like, is everything okay? And you were at the bottom of the stairs, and you were in pain, and you were like, just want to be left alone. Because, like, I tried to help you up, and you were like, no, no, no, no, don't. Yeah, it's a weird thing. Kind of let you chill there for a little bit.

We were telling my mom about it, and my mom said, that's a weird thing that you hear about people who have been in accidents is they don't want to move. Like for several minutes, it's like just let my body adjust to whatever is happening. I felt like this weird, like chemical sensation run through me. I mean. Drenelin, got to get your bearings. Anyhow, what I'm trying to tell you, folks, is tragically, my butt, my butt. Your brut? My brunt and my butt are in several pieces.

Also, okay, so for Valentine's Day, Normie C got me a massage. And so I went to the lady And like they have you fill out forms and everything And I mentioned in the form like I because they they asked like Is there anywhere you don't want to be touched? And I was like I recently had a fall You know

Don't touch my butt Well it was kind of embarrassing Because you know I felt fine writing it out in the form And then when I got there she naturally was like Okay just you know Will you kind of point out where And the second she said that

I realized Oh, the pain is really like two inches above my butt hole. And why she would ever touch there is like kind of a ridiculous. And so I had to be like, you know, I'm actually realizing as I stand here before you that you. I don't think she's going to be getting her fingers in your crack and deep tissue massage there. I think so much. I'm so happy to be here. if you could just for this massage specifically not finger the crack of my butt that would be great i know you normally just go to town on the crack this time please don't i know this is a full body massage

and when you say full body you mean every part of my body but this time around please stay out of my butt crack. So the question we asked this month was to tell us your embarrassing ouchy stories. Now, Norm, do we have some to share? We do. I will get started with Carlos the serial killer. Oh. Carlos the serial killer says, I was playing Uno attack and took it too seriously and broke my finger. Oh. So I think I think you have to like slam cards down or something. I know exactly how it can happen. Yep.

And you're trying to beat other people. Yes. It makes sense. Now, I got to tell you, Carlos, the serial killer. You are a true gamer. If you broke a bone playing a game. Yeah. That's cool as shit.

Kudos. The most embarrassing thing about an injury like that is people ask about it. And then you have to tell them, I was injured. playing Uno too hard. I was playing Uno attack. I'm sure you get it. Yeah, I go pretty hardcore in my family, so, you know, got nasty. I remember my family played Uno, and my uncle was really good at it, and he, like, fucking

destroyed me one time, and I got so upset, I cried. You've always been competitive. I, like, I, like, ran out of the room crying, and I think I made my uncle feel real bad, but he was just, like, destroying me. Was he talking shit? Or just being good at the game. It was a casual game. Like, looking back, there was nothing wrong with what he did.

But I was just little competitive, non-threatening norm. And he was just absolutely annihilating me. And it really hurt my feelings. Poor Norman. All right. What do you got, Kristen? I haven't even looked. Well, damn.

Well, I've been telling a story. I've been telling my own tragic tale of breaking my butt. You know, these things happen. May I read another one? Yes, please. Andy Bashar's tramp stamp says, freshman year of high school, walking into the gym for a pep rally.

I was one of the last people in there. Oh, no. I tripped over the cheerleading mats and went down in front of the entire school. That's embarrassing. Oh, man. Imagine having a crowd for your broken butt, Kristen. Imagine if you fell in front of a live studio,

At the laugh track and everything. I mean, it would have been, if there'd been a video of that, it would have gone viral because the iced tea went everywhere. The water went everywhere. The dogs came running. It was a scene. If that was a murder scene and the iced tea were blood, I mean, they would have thought 10 people had died in that room. There was a ton of ice tea all over that, all over the stairs or some on the ceiling. Yep.

It's crazy. That's brutal. That's character building, though, falling in front of the whole school. Okay, we've got another cheerleading thing. Okay. Witt says, my senior year of high school, I was a varsity cheerleader. Our football team had made it to state finals. During the game, the cheerleaders were goofing off trying to see who could kick the highest.

When it was my turn, I tried so hard and put everything I had into my kick and ended up kicking myself in the face and forehead and knocked myself out cold. Oh my God. I woke up in an ambulance 15 minutes later. Never did find out who the highest kicker was that day. Witt, it was you. I just got to see, that's just impressive that you kicked yourself and knocked yourself out. That is incredible.

I think you just win by default. Zomboi says a few months ago, I sneezed so hard that I threw my back out in front of an entire training class of people. I'm 30 years old. No, that was possible. You're seeing that video of the, somebody sneezes and the baby reacts. The baby's like terrified of the sneeze. Yeah, I love it.

That's an intense sneeze if you throw your back out, though. Okay, you know what it makes me think of? Okay, so we've just had lunch with my parents. Uh-huh. And my dad was like, they were in the area because my dad had to go get a shoulder injury looked at. And like my dad has kind of always complained about his shoulder. He used to play softball. So, you know, I'm going to use.

Basketball. Yes. Bench strength. All that. Mr. Olympia. But I didn't know that something new had happened with his shoulder. And so I asked him, what's, you know, what's going on? What'd you do to it?

And he was like, well, you know, 35 years ago, I really heard it. And, um, he tore his rotator cuff. Yeah. And what really said it over the edge? My mom asked him to open a jar. Yeah. Like four months ago. He re-injured it.

And he was just like, the pain was so bad I thought I was going to pass out opening this jar. So you do wonder like, okay, what was the first injury? And then you sneeze. And then all of a sudden, all hell breaks loose. You open a jar. You're down for the count. You never know. You never know.

You never know. You never know what's going to get you. I guarantee it's the rhythm that's going to get you. Oh, my God. I don't know that this fully counts, but I'm saying it anyway, because this is so funny. Les Bot the Digital Cow says, my time to shine. Ooh. I work for my state government and got to meet our governor one day.

Oh, no. He was shaking hands and said, thank you for your work for the citizens of Wisconsin. And I said, thanks. I love you, too. That's fabulous. You know, something was injured inside of you after you said that. So we're going to count that. It's an ego injury.

Thanks. I love you too. You know those moments where it's just like, okay, love you by. And you're like, oh, no, that was the pharmacy I was talking to. Or when, you know, someone in the airport is like, have a great flight. And you say, thanks, you too. I have done that. And you feel like such a fool.

Enjoy your meal. Thanks, you too. Yeah. Okay. I've got one for you. Okay. Cotton candy math teacher. She prefaces this with,

This is really embarrassing to write. And I was in college, my then-boyfriend, now husband, and I were being playful in the bedroom. Oh. I was pretending like I was going to run and jump on him. He was sitting on the bed. And I was going to throw my legs out as I jumped, like to straddle him. Ooh. Hang on.

sexy time. He panicked, thinking I was going to actually hurt him. So he threw his legs up to protect himself. Oh, no. Kneen me with both legs in the vad. Oh, broken vagina. I didn't actually think you could bruise that part of your body. Yes.

But for a week, it was so painful. You can see it. Can't you just see that happening? Yeah, great description of, I know exactly what has. It hurt my vagina just hearing that story. Well told. Oh, no. Oh, no. Bulletproof, Emu says, at a week-long school camp in the mountains, a bunch of friends and I were out on the balcony just chatting. I was sitting up on the railing with my feet curled in the bars so I wouldn't fall. When it was time to go back inside, I hopped down off the railing, but my feet were still curled in the bars. I slammed down onto the floor of the balcony.

I twisted my knee and had bruising on my face. It was the first day of camp. Oh, damn. Ouch, I can picture that too when you like curl your leg up in those railings. I know exactly. Yes, and to do that on the first day of camp, that's rough. That's a rough one. You twist your leg real bad.

Okay, I've got one. pro boni attorney says when I was in college we had one of those electric stoves with the metal coils that hung above a drip pan one particular coil always stuck up at a 45 degree angle

and so they'd slap it to make it lay flat one day I saw it sticking up and wound up giving it a good old slap oh no right as my hand fell I thought this would be really bad if the coil was hot and it was

I had a spiral-shaped burn on my hand for the rest of the semester. Oh. Does you give it the good old slap a slabber? Yeah. I think that burning your hand would be brutal because it's not like you can be like, well, I'm just not going to use that for a while.

Honestly, I think this is kind of a common injury. I have definitely grabbed something out of the oven without wearing an oven. Just like, you're not thinking. Yeah, you just space and you just grab a hot pan. Yeah, I've burned my hand before. Now, I haven't slapped the top of a stove, but. But yeah, don't worry. Don't worry, pro bonie attorney.

We've all been there. Okay, this one's funny. Okay, let's hear it. Sarah and the Wolves says, I was in college taking a gen ed, so literally hundreds of kids in a class. We were taking our final, and I was the third person to finish.

This is not just a brag. It is actually pertinent, but it's also a brag. I stood up to go hand in my test without realizing my foot had fallen asleep. I put my full way on my foot as it was slightly turned. And went down hard.

In an attempt to save myself, I reached up to grab the table and brought down an entire stack of books and my laptop on top of my flailing body. The entire lecture hall audibly gassed. Oh, no. About 10 people asked if I was okay. Luckily, my foot was still numb, so I was able to walk out without feeling much. But by the time I got to the car, it was swollen to three times its size and discolored. I broke five bones and tore the ligaments on the side of my foot. But I fucking aced that final.

God, it was a final that way you didn't have to go back there again. Yeah, you don't have to go back and see those people again. I could just hear the audible gas like, oh! As the folks go flying in the air. That was a great description. Oh, I do hope it's okay that we're laughing this hard. Oh, it's hilarious. I mean, it is funny.

I have a weird injury. Well, tell us. So, when I was like maybe 12 or 13, I was in the kitchen with my sister. And like, I got up to change seats or something. And I felt like a pinch in my toe. Yep. And I was just like, ow! Like a long pinch.

And I was like, what was that? I thought I like stepped on a nail or something. Yeah. I looked down, there is a thread sticking out of my big toe. Ugh. I was like, what the hell is that? And I realized it was a sewing needle with a thread on the end. Yeah.

And had completely gone into my big toe. Gross, gross. I am so grossed out by that. My mom's a quilter, by the way. So that's why there were sewing needles everywhere. So, yeah, we went to the hospital and the doctor was able to pull it out with that thread. He numbed my toe and then just slowly pulled it out. But just imagine if the thread was not there, they would have to cut open my toe.

Oh, my God. I can't even imagine. Yeah. It's just weird how I just stood there and screamed as I was pinched. Why is that weird? That seems... I don't know. I just like...

It was just a freak injury. It probably happened very quickly. Yeah. It went at the perfect angle, the side of my big toe. Oh, anyway. Oh, God, I'm so grossed out by this. Sorry.

It's okay. We'll find a fun one to recover. Okay. I have another one. Okay. Tori W. says, when I was in kindergarten, we made little construction paper kites and then got to go to recess. I didn't understand wind or physics or whatever and was pissed at my kite wouldn't

fly. So I started running with it behind me and was watching it instead of where I was going. Oh, no. I turned around and ran straight into the flagpole. Oh! I remember it ringing. Oh! And must have passed out because when I opened my eyes, teachers and everyone were surrounding me, I ran so hard into it that they sent me home concussed. Oh my God. I still have a bump on my forehead from it. Sent you home? Well, yeah, if you're concussed. Well, I don't know that you need to go home. I'm just imagining a little kid running full speed into a flag. You can picture it, right? Yeah.

Yeah. Not paying attention. Uh-huh. Well, no, paying perfect attention to the kite. Okay, Nick at night says, when I was about nine, we were playing car accident with the neighbor's power wheels car. We decided it would be more realistic if the car was flipped over on top of me, the victim. Little did our child brains know the batteries in those cars were not strapped in,

and they were heavy and large. I never saw it coming, but it hit me square in the forehead and split the top of my head open. There was blood everywhere. I ran home screaming with half the neighborhood kids behind me. A trip to the ER and a few stitches and I was good to go, but to this day, I have a bump on my forehead and a little bald spot right behind my hair line on the top of my head. I'll forever rock the millennial side part. Damn. Oh, my God.

Yeah. and good lesson to learn don't put a power wheels car under you I needed to hear it because you know what I was planning to do after this power wheels I know it sounds fun but there's nothing cool about it oh okay you know what

ruby chub has the ultimate broke my butt story are you ready ruby chub or it could be ruby chub we don't know I'm going to go with ruby chub that's a great name I go on float trips each year and I'm usually too chicken to do any rope swings or cliff jumping. They mostly look pretty dangerous. But we came up on a section of the river that looked pretty safe.

The cliff was seven feet at most. Some of the guys in our group went off a steeper section of the cliff and they were fine. I decided, what the hell? Why not? I climb up, jump out into the river and wouldn't you know it, I hit my butt on a rock in the riverbed. Oh! I hurt, but it wasn't excruciating. We continue for six more miles into this float in a fucking kayak,

and my ass is hurting more and more. By the time we were done, I could barely move without wensing. I knew I broke my tailbone. My husband looked at my bare ass and saw a black bruise between my ass crack. Not my best look. The four-hour drive home was the worst experience ever. I wanted to puke the whole time. Urgent care later confirmed that I did break my tailbone, nearly severed it from my spine.

Holy shit. It took eight weeks for it to heal. I was 41 years old when this happened. I'm a fucking dumb ass. No, you are not. Oh, ruby chub. That, I cannot imagine. Consider yourself lucky, Kristen.

I do. That story should make you feel a lot better. It does. Because I have been, like this whole time been like, how is this not healed at this point? Because I had a fall a couple years ago. And I had a hilarious bruise from where the stair hit me like kind of right mid-cheek. Yeah. But it was in the meaty section of the cheek.

So it hurt when it happened and for a little while afterward. But then I was okay. This one, it's really something. It's deep in the crack. It's in there. For sure. God, I can't imagine jumping off of it. a cliff and you hit a rock.

And the worst part is when you're not expecting it. Because you're like, oh, la-di-da, I'm going to land in water will be soft. And then you're just like smack. And the adrenaline lets you keep going, but as it wears off. It made total sense the thing of, oh, yeah, it hurt, but it wasn't excruciating. And then you get in the kayak and you're going. And then it just the pain builds and builds and builds as the adrenaline wears off. Oh.

Everybody, thank you for your stories. Thank you. That was hilarious. Horrifying and hilarious. We're glad everyone has recovered. Yes. We may have scars. I've got scars from some of my injuries, but the memories remain. Thanks for the memories, folks.

Yes. Kristen, you know what they say about history hose. That's right. Hang on. Let me finish my sentence. Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Yes. Actually, we should thank the patrons before we go.

Okay. Patrons, thank you so much for your support. Thank you. Thank you for listening. Thank you for getting us to that goal where I'm going to grow Horatio Seymour's beard. We really appreciate it. Thank God we are nowhere close to that goal. No, seriously, I'm super thankful for all the support.

Obviously, this show does not exist without you all, so thank you very much. Yeah, we do appreciate you a whole lot. Yeah, we hope you enjoyed this bonus episode. And with that, we're outy. Kristen, you know what they say about history hose. We always cite our sources. Yeah, we do. For this episode, I got my information from a bunch of articles. They'll be listed in the show notes, but I want to give a big shout out to the article, The Seven Sutherland Sisters, by Diane L. Samarco and Kathleen L. Rounds for New England.com. Also, for reporting from Atlas Obscura and The Collectors Weekly.

That's all for this episode. Thank you for listening to a bonus episode of an old-timey podcast. Please give us a five-star review wherever you listen to podcasts. and while you're at it, subscribe. I'd tell you to support us on Patreon, but that would be ridiculous. Join the Reddit community, R slash Old Timey Podcast. Follow us on Facebook and YouTube and Instagram

at Old Timey Podcast. And you can also follow us individually on Instagram. I'm at Kristen Pitts-Carruso, and he's at Gaming Historian. And until next time, Tootulu, Tata, and Cheerio. Bye.

Goodbye. Thank you.