An Old Timey Podcast - 61: AAirpass: American Airlines’ Best Worst Idea

Episode Date: July 2, 2025

In 1981, American Airlines offered an incredible deal. For just $250k, people could purchase a lifetime pass that entitled them to unlimited first class travel, anywhere the airline flew, for the rest of their lives. People could also purchase a companion pass that would allow anyone to fly with them. They called it the AAirpass. It didn’t take long for the airline to discover that they’d priced the AAirpass too low. Way too low. Remember, kids, history hoes always cite their sources! For this episode, Kristin pulled from: “The frequent fliers who flew too much,” by Ken Bensinger for the Los Angeles Times “My father had a lifelong ticket to fly anywhere. Then they took it away,” by Caroline Rothstein for Narratively “The rise and demise of the AAirpass, American Airlines’ $250k lifetime ticket,” by Zachary Crockett for thehustle.co “‘Free’quent flier has wings clipped after American Airlines takes away his unlimited pass,” by Kate Briquelet, for the New York Post “Extreme frequent fliers sue American Airlines over loss of unlimited lifetime ticket,” by Erin McLaughlin for ABC News Are you enjoying An Old Timey Podcast? Then please leave us a 5-star rating and review wherever you listen to podcasts! Are you *really* enjoying An Old Timey Podcast? Well, calm down, history ho! You can get more of us on Patreon at patreon.com/oldtimeypodcast. At the $5 level, you’ll get a monthly bonus episode (with video!), access to our 90’s style chat room, plus the entire back catalog of bonus episodes from Kristin’s previous podcast, Let’s Go To Court.

Hear ye, hear ye. You are listening to an old-timey podcast. I'm Kristen Caruso. And I'm Normie C. And on this episode, I'll be talking about a corporate promotion. Yay! We love corporations. They are people, too. Sounds very exciting. Uh-huh. Nothing goes wrong. No details. No details in that topic. This corporate promotion. What? What's wrong? Is this a sponsored episode? Uh, I wish. Yeah, that would be good. Alas, it is not.

If anything, it might get us kicked off a couple flights. Oh. Something to do in an airline, huh? But Norm, hold on. Yeah. Hulture horses. We're back from break, baby. We are back, baby.

The people demanded us. Technically, we're still on break while we're recording this. Oh, my gosh. But they know how time works. They understand. Yeah. For those who don't understand our recording schedule. You see, we record these before they come out.

These aren't live. This is not live what you're listening to, Rhonda. Okay, now Rhonda knows. We are happy to be back. It was a nice break. It was a lovely break. What did we do? We went to Colorado.

Uh-huh. Did a lot of hiking. Uh-huh. Uh-oh. Norm's going to short circuit because he just figured out what time is. What are you going to do about the family trip? We haven't gone on it yet. But it's in the past when they hear this.

What are we going to say? It was a lovely time in, Where are we going? Wyoming? Yes. Wyoming. It was a great time in Wyoming. And boy, are we glad to be back in Norm? You got a Patreon plug?

Are you just sitting there feeling... Do I have a Patreon plug? It took me one month to write this. The whole break, I've been working on it. I wonder what you've been doing. Okay. Folks, Independence Day is just around the corner. Oh. The birthday of these United States.

I'm sure as a listener, you've learned a thing or two about this here country by listening to this here podcast. Oh, yeah. So why not finally support this small, sexy, independent podcast on Independence Day? Head on over to patreon.com slash old-timey podcast. For just $5 a month, you'll become a non-threatening fan

and get access to our monthly bonus episodes with full video, I might add. My goodness. Kristen, you know the real celebration is at the $10 pig butter investor tier, which is often to do. Described as slimy yet satisfying. You'll get bonus episodes, sign card and stickers,

early ad-free video episodes, access to our monthly trivia parties, 10% off all merchandise, and ad-free episodes of Kristen's old, decrepit, rotting, podcast. Let's go to court! Woo! So head on over to patreon.com slash old-timey podcast to sign up. Thank you very much. Norm, well done. Good plug. Thank you.

Meanwhile, I did something terrible. which is that I ate Russell sprouts and then I burped and we're in a very small room. So I'm sorry to all. Will Norm survive this episode? Is this an airtight room? Should we be concerned? We might want to crack a window. Is there a carbon monoxide detector from here?

Are you ready for this? I am, I think. Hang on. What do you have to do? You got to mentally prepare yourself? Locking my computer, giving you my undivided attention. Oh, thank you. We are ready.

You know, speaking of carbon monoxide, by the way. What? Yes. I took a little trip to Michigan during our break to see my parents, and I was hanging out in my grandma's old condo. And I went to go do some laundry, and she has a gas dryer. Okay. But no vent for the gas dryer. So she vented the dryer into like this little white bucket that just collects the lint, I guess.

But I was like... This doesn't seem safe. It's not. I was like, this is a gas dryer. You can't do this. So I like, I was like, oh gosh, I hope there's carbon monoxide detectors in here. There were. None of them worked.

So I had to run out. The important thing is they were there. I rant my mom was like, you'll be fine. You'll be fun. I was like, hell no. I ran out to Home Depot at 9 o'clock at night and bought a carbon monoxide. You did? Hell, yeah, I did.

All right. Well, good. Good. Safety first. I am not going to croak from the silent killer carbon monoxide. Slash Kristen's burps after she eats Brussels. It's kind of funny. I bought the detector.

And like, I didn't even enter the condo. I was like, let me put in the batteries and turn it on first. And then I'll like use it like a ghost hunt. devices I entered the condo and it didn't go off so it's all good. Were you a little disappointed? You could admit you're a little disappointed. I mean, a little bit. You really wanted to be like, yeah, I could have died, Mom.

Yeah, for me to tell my mom, I told you so, it would be kind of satisfying. No, everything was good. Well, that's devastating to hear that everything was safe. But we do kind of need one in here with your Brussels sprout burps. In a way, it's your fault because you're the one who cooked the Brussels sprouts. I did and I overcooked them. What did you think? I air-fried them and I forgot about them

and so they were a little extra crispy. Listen, I didn't want to cook, but you did cook and so I am grateful. Okay, I'll remember that. All right. Are you ready? Yay. Are you ready? Okay.

First shout out to brother-in-law, Jay, for telling me about this ridiculous story. Thanks, Jay. This is a story that I feel like everyone else on earth knows. I did not know it. I find it hilarious. Also, quick shout out to Ken Bensinger for the Los Angeles Times. There have been a lot of articles about this, but he wrote the main one. He wrote the article. Shout out to Ken. Norm, this is a story about a corporate promotion that went so very badly. And I submit that it is also a story of how that corporation

messed up even further and arguably got pretty shitty in their attempts to correct their original blunder. Here we go. Okay, it was 1980, and American Airlines was in a big pickle. Oh, this is about American Airlines? Yes. Oh, my God. I do not like American Airlines.

Oh, you're going to hate them at the end of this. Oh, great. Okay. That year, they operated at a lot of time. loss of $76 million. Inflation? $295 million. Okay.

Not as bad as I thought. That's terrible! At a loss of $295 million? Yeah, you're in the red. Yeah, you just barely dipped your toe into the red there. You got to get that revenue up. So it sucked, Norm. Some say their financial situation was thanks in part to the

Airline Deregulation Act of 1978. And I'd love to tell you all about that, but I can't because it's boring. Hey! Hey! You're talking to the context slut. Okay. You're going to tell me about the Airline Deregulation Act of 1978? Perhaps Jimmy Carter's finest bill he ever signed into law? I don't know about that.

Norm. I tried to just even read the Wikipedia page, and I got bored. I also originally wrote in here that I can't tell you because I'm not a context slut. So I'm sorry. You're just going to have to accept for the purposes of this story that American Airlines was a hurting. Okay? You know, I am so sick of these regulations. This was a deregulation.

Oh, I am so sick of these deregulations. There we go. American Airlines brand spanking new president Robert Crandall knew that they had to think outside the box, baby. and boy did they. Since they were so tight on cash and since interest rates were super high, why not come up with an amazing offer that would bring in just an influx of cold, hard cash? Why not offer the ultimate frequent flyer program? Why not offer at a hefty upfront cost unlimited first-class flights to anywhere that American Airlines flies. Ooh, how about access to all the admirals clubs for the rest of the person's life?

And hey, hey, why not offer that person a companion pass? Also at a hefty price, but not quite as hefty as the price that they initially paid, so that they and a companion not always the same companion. companion, mind you, could fly whenever they wanted, wherever they wanted, but always first class. Okay. This has got to be insanely expensive. It certainly should be, don't you agree? Unlimited first class flights for the rest of your life.

Yes, sir. Yes, sir. And there are $295 million in the hole. No, that's the inflation number. What was the actual number? 80 million? Yeah, something like that, yeah. Okay.

So if you charged, if you charged $5 million, I think maybe. You think it'd be worth it? You could get some good cash flow going. Okay. Well, let's see what they charged. But first, you haven't even heard the name of it because it's kind of a cute name. Okay. They called it American Airlines Air Pass.

The word air pass starts with two A's, and they're both capitalized because it's cute. Air pass. It has taken me so long to not read it that way, or like, a air pass. I'm interested in the air pass. Do you mean the air pass? I sure do. It was a beautiful thing. While it lasted, the program launched in 1981 and went through a few different iterations over the years.

People could buy the passes for, life, but they could also buy them for just five years. And in fact, the airline offered a bunch of different versions of the air pass over the years. But for this episode, we're going to focus on the most fabulous offer of them all. The one that, in 1981, offered a lifetime of unlimited first-class travel for $250,000. Oh, my God. No. Plus a...

That's it? plus a companion pass for drum roll please you're supposed to drum roll come on $150,000 are you ready for me to adjust for inflation sure that's $882,000 for the lifetime pass that's $529,000 for the companion pass that is so cheap for lifetime unlimited first-class flights. And I cannot stress this enough. The companion pass, it doesn't have to be the same person. So you basically are just buying an extra ticket.

Yeah. And you can give it to whoever you want. Whoever you want. Well, could you give it to your dog? I'm bringing my dog this time. I guess you could. I imagine. Well, no, it did say person.

Hmm. Okay. Although, well, we'll keep going. We'll keep going. American Airlines really needed people to buy this thing. So they even offered discounts to people based on their age. You know, if you're a senior citizen, the lifetime pass, you know, might be a little shorter. So you don't pay as much.

Do they realize you can like every day fly somewhere and then fly home the same day? Yeah, they realize that they're an airline. They'd be really stupid to not really. that people are going to use this thing. Yeah, okay. Norm, what part of cold, hard cash do you not understand? They needed it, baby. I feel like I would go deep into debt to buy this pass.

I agree. I just feel like the value just seems insane. It's an amazing deal. Yeah. I'd be paying the loan off the rest of my life, but like at least I'm flying everywhere across the country. Wait a minute, wait a minute. And then if you have the companion,

pass. You could like bring random people and charge them to fly with you and then you could make your money back. Oh, Norman. Oh, Norman. You're getting ahead of yourself. Oh, shit. So someone already thought of this. Norman, Norman, please calm down. I haven't even told you all the perks yet. You're so dazzled by the unlimited first class fly anywhere anytime. You haven't even heard that every time you use your air pass and the companion pass. You still rack up frequent flyer miles. Oh, my. So you still get all of those benefits, too.

It's like, what? So you could just literally just rack up miles for free. Yeah. I mean, again. This is a really bad idea. Hefty up front. Yeah, okay, so tell me, tell me more why you think this is so bad. This just feels not thought out at all.

Uh-huh. Uh-huh. And airlines, like, companies need to understand that consumers will find every single advantage they can when you offer something like this. Well, these promotions. Norm, dare I say, in this case, you don't have to go hunting for the advantage. The advantage is right there in your face. Yes. There's not a lot of, you don't have to read the fine print or anything.

It's just out front. Yeah. When management at American Airlines dreamed up the promotion, They figured that it would be really popular with companies. They figured that a lot of businesses spend tons of money flying their executives all over the place. So this promotion would probably be, you know, for the business cats. What about rich people? Ah, yes, Norm, they turned out to be wrong.

So wrong. So very, very wrong. As the airlines president, Robert Crandall put it, quote, The idea was that firms would buy this for their top performers, but as usual, the public is way smarter than any corporation. People immediately figured out that we'd made a mistake pricing-wise. Yeah, it's way too cheap. Yeah.

Take out a loan, get this pass, buy the companion pass, and then I'd put an ad on Craigslist being like, hey, you want to fly wherever? Come on, 400 bucks first class. Okay. Okay. Okay. I'd meet some interesting folks. You sure would. You sure would. I'm a little offended that in your fantasy, you're not flying all over the world with your wife.

No, no, no. Hang on. Whose eyeballs you are looking into right now. Hang on. I got to pay this loan back, babe. Okay. So every now and then, I got to put out the Craigslist ad or the Facebook Marketplace ad. Oh, gross. Can you imagine?

Uh-huh. I'll come pick you up. Uh-huh. We'll go to the airport. I'm just a totally normal guy. You have nothing to fear? Looking for a companion on this first class flight. I would like us to hold hands, but, you know.

I just get nervous during flights. According to one article, 66 people bought the passes. Another article had a different number, but, you know. Seems low. Well, again, this is kind of in its infancy a bit. Who bought the passes? Well, there was Michael Dell of Dell Computers. Oh.

There was Willie Mays of baseball. Hell yeah. Dennis Connor of Yachts. Yots, yep. And of course there was Mark Cuban of Shark Tank. Hey, he's known for more than Shark Tank. Dallas Mavericks. End of list.

No, he had some software company. I can't remember the name of it. I didn't realize that he was a close personal friend of yours who needed defending on this podcast. Now, Norm, not everyone who bought a pass was a household name. Some of them were just people who had some money, who loved to travel, people who maybe, you know, had a bunch of time on their hands. Yeah, maybe retired folks, late 50s, early 60s, life savings, retirement income. For example, some dude named Mike Joyce got into a nasty car accident and got a $4.25 million settlement.

And he was like, well, I love to travel. I'll definitely buy an air pass. Yeah. In his interview with the L.A. Times, he was like, I love Rome, I love Sydney, I love Athens, I love Vegas, I love Frisco, I love, I don't know, blah, I don't know, blah. This dude just traveled all over the place. In fact, when that L.A. Times article came out in 2012, Mike revealed that in a 25-day span the previous year, he'd flown to London, six, 16 times. Good God.

Maybe he should just do an extended stay. Why? You don't have to. He's got an air pass. Oh, wait. So this happened when he had the air pass. Yes. Okay.

If he paid retail for those flights, it would have been 125 grand. Instead, it was free. Kind of, because, you know, he paid up front. I didn't even think about international travel. Yeah. Anywhere. That's even worse. You were just thinking about the continental United States.

Yes. Even that's a crazy deal. And now international? Yeah. Oh my God. How desperate for cash was this company? Too desperate. Too desperate.

I mean, they sound like you trolling Facebook marketplace in Craigslist for companions. A 37-year-old guy named Stephen Rothstein bought the Air Pass in 1987. Initially, because he told him. traveled a lot for work as an investment banker. Wait, wait a minute. What? I can't believe it lasted that long. Oh, it's going to keep lasting, baby. And Stephen quickly decided that the Air Pass was the best thing he'd ever purchased in his life. Yeah. So two years later, he bought the companion pass. And oh my goodness, did he enjoy himself? He loved flying. He flew all the time, Norm,

and his friends really benefited. For example, if a friend of Stevens said something like, oh, there's some cool new exhibit at the Louvreux in Paris. The Louvre, yep, which we all know and love. He'd be like, well, cool, let's go. And he'd fly from his home in Chicago to his friend's home in San Francisco. And then they'd jet set off to Paris together. Oh, my God.

Why not? He'd meet them in San Francisco. Sure, sure. So that they could do the companion pass. Sure. That is just insane. Oh, yeah. I mean, if you had the time, there'd be no limit to the fun you could have with this thing.

You could go everywhere. You could be like, hey, what if we watched the new My Big Fat Greek Wedding movie in Greece? Wouldn't that be cool? How? What year are you from, Norm? How is that the first thing that comes to mind? I'm just thinking of, like, the most minimal thing. to do that would for traveling to Europe to go see a movie, which you can do here in many places,

I hear. But imagine going all the way to Europe to just go to the movies. But you could do it because it's free. Yeah. And then you get on a flight and come home. Right. And you've racked up your frequent flyer miles. Okay.

Now what can you do with these miles? I mean, I don't really... Because he's already flying for. free. What the hell do you do with the miles in? You can give stuff away to people. Like, you can give flights away. You can do whatever you want. They're your frequent flyer miles. Can you redeem them for like holiday hams or gifts, sharper image stuff? That's the one thing I didn't look into was the holiday ham exchange. What's the exchange rate? Stephen flies to France with his friend, comes back with 25 holiday hams. Everyone's excited.

Stephen had a ball. Over the next 25 years, he booked more than 10,000 flights. He loved flying to New York. He flew there a thousand times. I'm sorry. Did you say 10,000 flights in a year? In 25 years. Oh, 25 years. Okay.

Really misunderstood that. He flew to New York a thousand times. He flew to Tokyo 120 times. He flew to Sydney 80 times. Sometimes he flew to Ontario because there was. was a sandwich there that he really liked. And, you know, he could just go eat the sandwich. Oh, that's even worse than my big fat Greek wedding idea. As soon as he said that, I was like, I cannot wait to tell him about the sandwich.

Fuck, that's really good. His wife, Nancy, later said, Stephen got on a plane like most people get on a bus. Yeah, why not? It's free. Sure. Sometimes, if Stephen was flying alone, he'd go up to a stranger in the airport and offer them his companion pass. Oh, my God. Why not? Yeah, why not? Yeah, it wasn't against the rules, and it always made the other person's day, you know. All of a sudden, you're upgraded to first class just because someone was nice to you. When Stephen went to the airport, he was a very happy dude. He knew everybody. American Airlines was his playground, and the airline loved him back. It seemed. In 1998, he got a lovely letter from American Airlines president, Robert Crandall, who'd recently bumped into him.

the letter read in part. I am delighted you've enjoyed your Air Pass investment. You can count on us to keep the company solid and to honor the deal far into the future. I feel like that is not true at all. What could go wrong? I think he's already, like, American Airlines has clearly lost money from this man buying the Air Pass. Norman, is it so unbelievable that I would just be telling you a nice little story about a corporate promotion where everything goes. right for everybody?

You are your father's daughter. No, that's the rudest thing you've ever said. I remember in his episode, we thought he was just telling us a lovely little story. No, I kept waiting for someone to get murdered. Yeah. Roll the tapes. You did catch on to him quick. Okay, so, yeah, I'm just wondering when American Airlines can be like, hmm, in retrospect, that was a really stupid idea.

Well, please. And how do you end that? How do you end it? There's got to be some legally binding. things here. Sure. Sure. There's gotta be. You would, it'd be crazy if there wasn't, right? Yeah, would be crazy. Another happy Air Pass holder was a guy named Jacques Vroom, which is a very cool name. Jacques Vroom. Jacques also said that the Air Pass was the best thing he ever purchased. It had been a pretty big purchase for Jacques. He was a, quote, direct marketing catalog consultant,

which I don't really know what that means. But when he bought him, he. bought it. The air pass was now $400,000. He'd never spent that much money on anything before, but he figured it would be worth it. So, just as you suggested earlier, Norm, he went out, took out a loan, 12% over five years, and he definitely got his money's worth because for the next 20 years, Jacques flew approximately 2 million miles every year. He loved that air pass. He had a son in college up in Maine. So, you know, he just flew out to all the football games, because why not? Yeah, why not? He flew to France to have lunch with friends. Why not? It was Vroomin all over the world. Naturally, these frequent flyers became known to the airline staff. One flight attendant came to know Jacques

so well that as soon as Jacques sat down in his first class seat, the flight attendant would come around with three salmon appetizers and a glass of champagne. didn't even have to ask for it. He felt like freaking royalty. Well, he does hold an air pass. I mean, God, he's getting salmon and champagne on these. So the food is free, too? Yeah, obviously. What else does this offer?

Foot rubs. I mean, that'd be the cheapest thing they're offering. It's funny. In the beginning, American Airlines had really wanted. wanted people to purchase these air passes. Oh, they needed it so bad. They were so desperate to sell them. I mean, that's freaking desperate. Yeah. This whole idea. Let me guess. The company was able to get out of that hole. They were making money. And then they're like, hmm, we're actually losing money on the air passes now. Well, that's an interesting theory. Norm, I regret to inform you that I'm not even

done telling you about the perks. Oh, there's more perks. Yeah. So, so. in addition to all the stuff I've already covered, these air pass holders also got extra assistance. They were assigned their own agents who could help them book flights wherever they wanted. And those agents often went above and beyond because, you know, these are the best customers. If the customer was afraid of missing a flight, the agent might book them on multiple flights so that they could fly out whenever. If the customer really wanted some extra room on the plane, then the agent might book. a flight for their companion pass, knowing that the companion's seat would be empty. Stephen took a liking to his go-to contact at the American Airlines Platinum desk.

Her name was Lorraine Cross, and she was from North Carolina, and she'd always book his flights, and they'd talk so often that they had this kind of cute thing where at the end of the call, she'd say, bye now, and he'd say, pay later, and, you know, it was just adorable. Oh, so sweet. In fact, Stephen flew so often and had such close relationships to the American Airlines employees that years later, when his 15-year-old son died suddenly in 2002, 10 American Airlines employees attended the funeral. Wow. Yeah. I mean, you're flying that much.

Yeah, you get to know the employees. You would get close to people. I got to know the lady that worked the drive-thru at Taco. Bell near R&S. Ruth. Yeah, you're also a very important man. Ruth, I miss you. You were great.

Always had a great attitude. Always very sweet. She doesn't work there anymore. Norm. Are you okay? I mean... Just reminiscing. I wish that I could hold a spot in your heart the way Ruth does.

Oh, you do. The same spot. No, the biggest spot in my heart. Now, of course, American Airlines did eventually raise the price of the air pass. In 1990, the price of an unlimited pass plus a companion pass was 600K. Three years later, they raised the price again. This time to a little over a million dollars. Okay.

Inflation's killing us here. Adjusted for inflation, that's $1.4 million for the 1990 price, which, again, I think, is too low. Still too low. and $2.4 million for the 1993 price. It was a lot of upfront money, but as one air pass holder put it, hey, once you get past that, forget it. It's lifetime. Yes.

You have to pay ever again. It was incredible, but maybe a little too incredible. In the mid-90s, American Airlines got a little cagey about the lifetime pass. It seems maybe they were starting to realize. that they'd made a really bad deal. Do we know about how many people have the pass now? One article I read said 66 people bought this thing total. Okay.

Another article had a slightly smaller number. So that's your ballpark. Man, I'm shocked. Not more people didn't buy it. It makes me wonder if maybe some people thought the airline would fold. Hmm. And so you wouldn't get the lifetime pass? Yeah, I guess I don't know how,

like big American Airlines was back then, but... Well, you know they were in the red. I knew they were in debt, but... I mean, now they're like one of the major airlines, so... Man, I would so get one of these. Spirit. Maybe Spirit can offer a wife... Oh, God.

Like I said, in the mid-90s, things started getting weird. For example, this guy named Leon Hendry bought the five-year pass in 1991. And as part of that contract that he signed, he was given an option to upgrade to the lifetime pass after three years. But once that time came where he could upgrade to the lifetime pass, he says the airline got a little weird with him. And they were like, oh, hi, how about you actually don't get the lifetime pass? It's really not a good thing. Also, it's discontinued. Yeah, we discontinued it. Also, so stop asking about it. Oh, hey, here's an idea. How about you give us your air pass back?

And we will give you money. Oh, a buyback program. And we will forget this whole mess ever happened. But Leon was like, no, hell no. The air pass is awesome. I am keeping it, baby, and I am buying that lifetime pass because I've got a right to. In 1994, the airline stopped selling the unlimited passes. They were done. But what do you do with the 66 people? Slow down, norm. By that point, the airline had discovered what the customers had already discovered,

which was that, yeah, the AirPass was expensive, but if you used it a bunch, it was like the deal of a lifetime for the customer. Yes, it's like a charity. But for the airline, it really sucked. The truth was, the Air Pass didn't do any of the things it was supposed to do for the airline. It was supposed to bring in just a ton of money, but it kind of didn't. Hell no. Instead.

It was too cheap. Well, and also, as you kind of mentioned already, like, this thing didn't fly off the shelves. Yeah. So it did bring in some money up front, but it cost them tons of money in the long run. And as the 2000s rolled around, the airline started really worrying about their bottom line. times we're getting tight again. It's like the beanie babies of corporate promotions. Going all in on beanie babies.

Norm, that's a bad example because Beanie Babies have famously held their value. I don't know about that. I liquidated our retirement accounts. It's all Princess Diana Beanie Babies. Get a fact check on that. Yeah, I'm just shocked that they thought this was a good idea. To get cash flow. I mean...

The foot rubs would be a better idea. It's... 20 bucks. you'll get a foot rub in first class. That sounds disgusting. I am strongly, strongly against anyone taking their shoes off on an airplane. I have seen some stuff on the Internet of customers behaving badly on planes. Airplanes are buses.

They truly are. Busses of the air. In 2004, they did briefly revive the Air Pass. Oh. They put it up for sale in that year's Neiman Marcus Christi. Catalog. How much? $3 million for the lifetime pass,

$2 million for the companion pass. That is still too cheap. Adjusted for inflation. 5.2 million for the lifetime pass, 3.4 million for the companion pass. That's just too cheap. It's just, that is way too cheap. You think so?

Yeah. 5 million, 5.2 million? Yeah. Well, we don't even actually need to talk about this because no one, literally no one, bought those passes. Interesting. Yeah.

American Airlines continued to struggle. And in 2007, an analyst took a look at the airline's expenses and profits, and they were like, whoa, hey, do you guys have any idea what the AirPass program is costing you? Oh, please tell me you have a number. Please tell me you have a number, Kristen. The short answer was, no, they did not really have any idea how bad this was for them. But then once they started digging, they realized, oh, landslide of poop, we done fudged it. The air pass is terrible for our business.

But Norm, as you have already mentioned several times, what could the airline do now? They'd stopped selling the passes. So that was good. They'd stop the bleeding. Stop the bleeding. Yeah, but what do you do with the 66 people flying to Greece every weekend to watch my big fat Greek wedding? Could they take the L? Could they hope that the lifetime passholders all died in mysterious accidents,

thereby tragically ending their lifetime passes? Wouldn't that be a shame? Assassinate. No, no, no, no. Just wouldn't it be a shame? Wouldn't it be a shame? I'm not saying they actually considered this. This is all jokes.

This plane's going to... Oh, purposefully crashed the planes of the air pet. No, Norm. They couldn't do any of those. things. So what do you think they did? Well, they offered a buyback, I bet. We'll give you, you know, a million bucks. Give us back the air pass. Okay. That's one idea. What if people are like, no, I really enjoy this. I fly to Ontario for sandwiches. The best sandwiches. Shoot. Well, they can't just say you can't do this anymore.

That would lead to a court battle. Sure, sure. Which is what happened when I went into the All You Can Eat Restaurant and just made myself a home. That's a plot on the Simpsons, Kristen. Yeah, what do they do? I don't know. Well, my guess is they said you can't do it anymore and they got into a lot of trouble. Okay.

They decided that their best bet was to figure out if, please God, dear Lord, some of the air pass holders were violating the rules so that hopefully please god dear lord they could revoke the person's air pass they could like plant a gun and carry on now this is just me talking here but um also maybe if no one was actually breaking the rules because in fact there hadn't really been any substantive rules in the first place maybe they could make rules up after the fact and then be like we're Taking your Air Pass and it's all your fault. You can't do that. Oh, you can't?

Okay, you could, but you'd have to have them agree to a new terms of service. Oh, really? You think that's how this is going down? Yeah, it should be. Enter Bridget Cage, a member of American Airlines elite revenue integrity team. Permission to take a look at all the Air Pass users and destroy anyone who was abusing their privileges. She started with the most frequent flyers, Stephen Rothstein and Jacques Frum, who we now know and love.

She poured over their records. By that point, Stephen had flown more than 30 million miles on his air pass, and Jacques had flown nearly 40 million miles. And she was like, my God, these guys are costing us more than a million dollars every year. Just these two dudes. And it cost them how much to buy the pass? Like nothing. Jacques paid 400K.

Stephen paid, I think it was 250K. Yeah. And they both bought companion passes too. That's why the pass should have cost like $5 to $10 million. But it didn't. Yeah. And here we sit. So she's looking at these numbers.

And she's like, how is that even possible? What are they doing? Hopefully something fraudulent. Now, Norm, this is where things get sticky. Because what is misuse, really? Isn't fraud in the eye of the beholder, sort of? Sure. She discovered that Stephen, yeah, like I already said,

sometimes met random people at the airport and was like, hey, if you want, you can fly on my companion pass, you'll get in first class. But that wasn't against the rules. Technically, no. This, of course, pissed the airline off, but their own terms and conditions hadn't forbid him from doing that. It was his companion pass.

He could give it to whomever he chose. Yeah. So they took a different tactic. They noticed that over the course of about four years, he'd booked a little over 3,000 flights, and he'd canceled about 2,500 of them. Interesting. Okay.

They called it speculative bookings. The airline decided that what he was doing was bookings. was booking flights that he never intended to take. And that, apparently, was fraud. Even though if we're being technical, and I think we should be technical, there was no rule against this practice in the contract that Stephen signed. Well, and like, wouldn't fraud mean he stands to gain something from it? If he just books a flight and doesn't go, what does he gain from that?

Good question. So how is he committing fraud? Well, that's up for debate. I guess so. Stephen's attorney would say he wasn't. So Stephen showed up at Chicago O'Hare in mid-December of 2008, ready to hop on a flight to London. Again, he's in his playground. He loves American Airlines.

They love him. Life is good. Woo-hoo, who-hoo. Stephen checked his bag. He got to the gate. And an employee for the airline was like, nope. Oh. Not happening.

That employee handed him the following incredibly bitchy letter, which I will read. to you now. Mr. Rothstein, I write to inform you that effective immediately American Airlines is hereby exercising its right to terminate your Air Pass Agreement dated October 1, 1987. As you know, speculative bookings are considered invalid. In fact, American has informed you on several occasions

that speculative bookings are invalid and that the practice of holding speculative space for Air Pass companion travel under another passenger's name with no intention of that passenger to travel on that flight is considered fraudulent behavior under Section 12 of the agreement. With regard to your air pass, your booking and travel history shows numerous speculative bookings made by you for companion travel, bookings which are held up to the departure date with no check-in by the intended companions. In several instances, these bookings are then canceled by you after you check in, only to be reinstated to accommodate different companions

who already possess paid-for coach seats on the very same American flights. Our investigation into your account shows multiple instances where you have approached other passengers for the first time at the gate and have offered them travel on your Air Pass companion seat. American considers this fraudulent behavior, clearly violating Section 12 of the agreement. We have determined that your usage of the Air Pass account is in violation of the applicable terms and conditions reference above. Therefore, American exercises its right to terminate the Air Pass Agreement under Section 12. In addition, American exercises its right to terminate the agreement under Section 17C, separate and independent of the foregoing grounds under Section 12, also terminated is the

Admiral's Club membership associated with the agreement. In addition, American is closing your advantage account. All current, unused mileage is forfeited, and all future advantage flight reservations have been canceled. Good day, sir. They didn't say that part, but you know. you lose. Good day, sir. Yeah. They went full of Willy Wonka on him. Wow, that would be a hell of a letter to receive when you're trying to go to London.

I would add, you know, they say in this letter, we told you multiple times you shouldn't be doing this. For what it's worse, Stephen says, no, that did not happen. I don't say we haven't mentioned that before. And I thought you could use your companion pass for like extra leg room. Right. So did Stephen. Yeah, it couldn't be fraudulent if you were just like, yeah, I'm bringing somebody and they're just not showing up because I just want the leg.

Couldn't he just claim I just wanted the leg room? One would think. And we'll get more into what he was thinking. First of all, Stephen was shocked. He was devastated. But what could he do? He slunked out of the airport. He slunked out.

He slunked out. What was he going to do, Norm? So shameful. Meanwhile, his freaking bag went off to London, and the airline didn't even help him get it back. That is rude. Rude, rude, rude. Stephen couldn't believe it. He went home and slept and slept and slept. He was really depressed. This had kind of become his identity.

He even had the guest bedroom in their house and had turned into his packing station. He was really good at packing, you know, for obvious reasons. I mean, you're traveling the world full time now, basically. Yeah. So he kind of gets in this funk. But later he was like, wait, that was bullshit. How could they do that to me? Yeah, get a lawyer, dude. Lawyer up. So according to Stephen, when he bought the air pass,

they told him that there was only one rule, that he couldn't give anybody else the air pass. And this was even before they started checking IDs to get on planes, which is unreal to me that there was a time when they didn't check that, but okay. He said that one time a guy offered him five grand to use his air pass. And he's like, come on, I'll give you five grand. they don't check IDs, what's the problem?

But Stephen was like, no, no, I'm not risking it. I love this thing too much. They've got one rule, and I'm following the one rule. The fine print says that they can revoke the air pass only if American determines that an air pass has been fraudulently used. I do want to pause because that that bitchy letter that I read to you kept referencing Section 12. Oh, you violated Section 12. Right. I want to read you Section 12 of the contract that he signed.

Okay. It's titled, fraudulent usage. And it reads, If American determines that AirPass has been fraudulently used, American reserves the right to revoke the AirPass and all privileges associated with it. Holder will thereupon forfeit all rights to the AirPass without refund and will return the AirPass card and this agreement shall terminate. So this is where I think it gets sticky because I don't think a contract has to list all the things you can and can't do.

Yeah. That would be insane. But it really does seem like they retain all the power to kind of arbitrarily determine what is fraudulent. That bitchy letter also mentioned the companion pass. Oh, you've been fucking up using this companion pass incorrectly. Right, right. So here's what the fine print reads on that companion pass. It allows him to, quote, take along one accompanying,

companion of any age per flight. So Stephen's like, nowhere does it state that I have to have known this person for a long time. Yeah. It's just a companion. Why can't I go up to someone in the gate and just offer it to them? Absolutely. Stephen was so pissed off that after a while, he had no choice, but to look himself in the mirror and say, let's go to court. So yeah, he was not going away quietly. He saw this for what it was, which was the airline sold something, which turned out to be a bad deal for them, and now they were trying to renege on the deal. Yeah. He told ABC News, quote, A deal's a deal. I've made deals in business, which I've regretted five minutes later. But a deal is a deal. I'm big on taking the hell. Yeah. I really am. I don't see what other choice you have.

Yeah. It's like when you're driving and, you miss your exit. Uh-huh. You got to take the L. Uh-huh. Take the next exit. Turn around and go get, go back, you know, and then take the correct exit. As opposed to people swerving over five lanes to make sure they get to their exit.

They've got to go to Taco Bell, Norm. I've got to take this exit. It's, uh, there's a saying I read the other day that was like, bad drivers never miss their exit. I love that. And it's like, yeah, that's true. That's really funny. Yeah. Sam,

just take the L. It's okay. We all take the L sometimes. What about the bottom line, Norm? See, yeah, these these freaking businesses, that's all they care about. Bottom line. And it's like, okay, you made a bad business deal. You've stopped the bleeding.

This won't last forever. Like these air pass people are going to pass away. Oh, okay. Eventually. Uh-huh. So like, yeah, just take the hell, man. So to recap, you think that the airline handled this situation with Stephen incorrectly. Yes.

Are you ready for them to fuck it up on a whole other level of shock? What they do to poor Mr. Vroom. This one is too much. So meanwhile, they're still looking into their other all-too-frequent flyer, Jacques Vroom. And while their tactics with Stephen were kind of ice-grim, cold. I'd say their tactics with Jock were kind of creepy. Jacques was similar to Stephen in that he obviously flew a ton, often with different new companions, but Jacques was different because he often would fly internationally with someone

and then fly back home immediately after landing. And that led the airline investigators to think that maybe Jacques was selling his companion pass to randoms, which was for sure fraud. though I do hate to be technical. This was not explicitly barred in the contract that Jacques signed. Yeah. And I would think that it would be kind of a foreseeable one that you would want to mention. Well, and is it fraud? Again, Jacques doesn't think so.

And I kind of don't think so either. I don't think that constitutes fraud. If he bought these passes fair and square, what's the problem? If someone gave me two tickets to a concert. And I sell one of the tickets to somebody. That's not fraud. Well, and you're not even doing that. I mean, he's flying with someone somewhere and flying back.

I'm going to the Boys to Men concert with some random person. Again, what year is it in your head? It keeps changing. You know, it's the golden years. It's what I remember late 90s, early 2000s. My big fat Greek wedding, boys to men, some Amanda, Bind's movie, you know, the good days, the good old days, as they say. Would you like to know a little bit more about Jacques Vroom?

Yeah. The following intel comes from an email written by the airline's head of global investigation. That man's name, I am not lying, no shit, his name is Chick Dickie. What? Chick Dickie? And if there's anything you should know about Chick Dickie, it's that judging from his emails, which are ridiculous. This man has no idea when to use quotation marks,

but he is nonetheless a big fan of them and uses them all the time. His name is Chick Dickie. His name is Charles Dickie. Why you would go by Chick when your last name is Dickie, I really don't understand. There's a lot of great names in this episode. Oh, amazing. None better than Chick Dickie.

I hate to. Chick Dickie. We've peaked. Something for everybody. Chick Dickie is my picky. for the number one name on this episode. So, according to the internal emails, Jacques was six foot five, a white male living in Dallas, Texas, who'd amassed a considerable personal fortune working in marketing for the business and entertainment worlds.

Jacques had prominent wealthy friends, including Hollywood celebrity. Like a freak, like he's some agent or something. What do you mean, Norm? It's like a spy. Are you spying on this man? They suspect fraud. This man is stealing a million dollars from them every year because it's something they set up legally. But hey, hey, we don't want to hear that.

You sold it to him. According to Chick Dickie, Jacques had even, quote, brazenly advertised over the Internet about his ability to provide domestic and international airfare to others. This was fraud. Jacques had been a bad boy. The airline was sure of it. The circumstantial evidence was all there. Now all they needed was a confession. Truth was, um, the Air Pass managers and corporate securities revenue protection unit had all tried to catch Jacques in the act.

They'd stopped him in the airport and asked him if he had sold his companion pass. Did you do this? And they'd stop his companions and ask them, Did you pay Jacques to be on this companion pass? But alas, Jacques had been, according to Chick Dick Dick. Virtually untouchable. Damn. I wish she would have said.

Chick Dickie said Jacques was real tricky. Oh, you just want everything to rhyme. When your name's Chick Dickie, hell yeah. I appreciate the drama that Chick Dickie brought to this situation. We've tried talking to him, but he's virtually untouchable. Chick Dickie said Jacques was tricky. This situation was very sticky. This sounds like you're trying to write a children's book about...

I'm going to go to the bar and drink a Mickey Lobe Light. Well, now the kids can't read it because you're encouraging drinking. Wow, there goes that idea. Go to the bar and drink with Mickey Mouse. Oh, a water. Oh, gee, mommy and daddy. The true Mickey and Mouse is sitting at every bar. I guess I'll go to a bar now.

See what you're doing to the fabric of our society norm. Okay, so they're going full, they're going full born. identity on fucking Jacques Vroom here. Chick Dickey has five unpublished detective novels on his laptop right now. I mean, it's what he was born for. So here's the thing. They tried to talk to Jacques. He didn't crack.

They tried to talk to his companions, but the companions didn't crack either. And by that, I mean that when asked, they firmly and confidently said, no, I did not pay him for this ticket. He is allowing me to fly for free on his companion pass. Norm, to the folks at American Airlines, that meant one thing. These companions had been coached, coached by Jacques. Okay, this is going way too far. Ooh, Jacques was bad. Oh, you think it's too far now? Oh, just fucking wait.

Oh, my God. Sometimes airline employees just watched Jacques and his companion. Sometimes he and his companion barely spoke to one another. Some companion, they were clearly strangers. This was clearly some sort of business arrangement. Who cares if they're strangers? There's nothing in your air pass that says he can't bring a stranger on the flight. Yeah, but if they're strangers, doesn't that kind of mean that they're paying him for the companion pass?

And isn't that for sure fraud? And should we just punch him in the face right now, or do we have to wait until we get some actual evidence? I really liked my idea of just planting a gun on it and calling it a day. That would have been way cheaper than all this bullshit. Here's the thing, though, they still didn't have any real evidence against him, and the people who were using his companion pass weren't squealing. Part of what made this investigation so hard was that the types of people who used his companion pass were people like Jacques. Wealthy people, established people, people who absolutely were not going to be intimidated by some dude in a uniform asking them in an intimidating tone whether or not they pay Jacques for their ticket.

It was terrible. What was the airline going to do? They needed a miracle. And then? A miracle. Then? Oh, glory, glory, hallelujah. The airline discovered that Jacques had just booked a flight from London to Nashville with a young man who was unlike any of his previous travel companions.

Oh, so they can get them to squeal? Yeah. Young and influential. Easily influenced, I think is what you mean. Yes. Bingo. I'll let Chick-Dickey describe the young man whose name is Oyan McCargy. This passage comes from an internal email. Unlike the vast majority of Vroom's other companions, Muckerjee is very young and seemingly

inexperienced. Totally unlike most of Vroom's other fellow travelers, Mucker G appears to be a struggling musician, a mandolin player, originally from Kansas, and currently trying to break into the music business in Nashville, Tennessee. Why did he use quotations there? Norm, I don't know. Break into? Yeah, Chick-Dickey loves quotation marks, does not use them appropriately ever.

Was it like a crime metaphor? Break into? At first glance, McCarty appears to be naive without financial wherewithal, and most probably very anxious to return home. Needless to say, absent McCargy's highly unlikely ability to come up with the full price of airfare, going home is not going to be a viable option for him. Wow. This is gross. This is just weird now. It's just getting weird. It's so weird. It is so freaking weird. Your corporate promotion backfired. Now, what are you? doing? You're tracking

down this 22-year-old going he doesn't look rich. I bet we can make him squeal like a piggy. Interrogate him under the heat lamp at the airport bow jangles. Like what the fuck? This is so strange. Just admit it was a fuck up and move on. Norm. Find some other way

to make more money. The American Airlines folks are thrilled because there's a struggling musician from Kansas of all places and they're going to make him cry. He's from Kansas. I know he's stupid. In other words, Jacques was flying to London with someone else on his companion pass, but that companion didn't look like an easy target for the investigation. So they were letting that guy slide. But once Jacques arrived in London, he was scheduled

to pretty much immediately turn around and fly from London to Nashville with Oyan, who the airline deemed the. week length. Jesus Christ. This could be a hilarious movie. Oh, it could be a Cohen Brothers movie for sure. Oh, yeah. This is like burn after reading levels of ridiculous.

Which I love. Yes, which is one of Kristen's favorite movies. Oh, my God. Brad Pitt as Chick-Dickey. Oh, man. Amazing. Amazing. Chef's kiss.

So the airline's plan was to wait for Jacques to arrive in London and before he could even think about meeting up. with Ayun or on flying back to Nashville, they'd come up to him and be like, Jacques Frum, your bad boy days are over. We are revoking your air pass. You will never fly on this airline again. Meanwhile, they'd wait for Oyan to show up at the London airport where he would be greeted by a corporate security representative who also happened to be a former NYPD detective.

That is not a joke. They really did this. That woman would give O'Yon the bad news that Jacques's air pass had been revoked. in that unfortunately he no longer had a flight back home to Nashville, but maybe they could get him back to Nashville if he agreed to talk. Oh, my God. And if he cracked under the pressure, well, then they'd finally get the admission they'd been hunting for all along.

This is nuts. I feel like the stakes are a little too low for all this work. Right? Yeah. This is creepy. This is so unsubes. Settling. Yeah.

Soon enough, the day of A Yun's flight came. It was July 30th, 2008. He was just an unsuspecting young boy. Jacques Frum landed in London and his companion skedaddled, probably to go see Buckingham Palace. Who wouldn't? And Jacques was given the bad news in the form of, you guessed it, a very bitchy letter,

which I will read to you now. Mr. Vroom, I write to inform you, That effective immediately, American Airlines is here by exercising its right to terminate your Air Pass Agreement, dated January 4, 1990. As you know, American Air Pass Companion Seats cannot be sold or bartered. Section 12 of the Air Pass Agreement clearly states that Air Pass Travel is subject to Americans' rules tariff as in effect at the time of travel and any other general terms and conditions applicable to travel on American, which may subsequently replace or supplement such tariff. Americans' tariff prohibits the sale of an Air Pass companion seat. Similarly, the Advantage Program's terms and conditions prohibit the sale and or barter of advantage, award,

mileage credits and or tickets. Any such tickets are void if sold for cash or other consideration. Since December of 2003, your Air Pass travel history includes well over 100 different companions on 500 flight segments. Numerous flight segments involve one-way companion air travel to international destinations with your return flight departing less than 24 hours from arrival. In many instances, your return flight from these international destinations is only a few hours after arrival, we have determined that your usage of the Air Pass account is in violation of the applicable terms

and conditions referenced above. Therefore, American exercises, it's right to terminate the Air Pass Agreement under Sections 13 and 18C. This termination also includes the termination of the corresponding advantage account and Admiral Club's membership. All future flight reservations

have been canceled. Good fucking day. Okay, I hope I never see your face again. It's formed like a valley girl accent midway through the letter reading. What did you think of that? Yeah, they're desperate to end these air passes. I was hoping you would say that Jacques was a bad boy and you are now on American Airlines side

because they did such a totally chill and normal investigation into this guy. I'm curious to hear about the companion. Well, first of all, you should know that Jacques got that letter and he was like, what are you talking about? I didn't sell my companion pass to anybody. I never have. This Oyan guy went to the same college as me. I met him through a friend.

I'm just doing this as a favor. No money was exchanged. But they didn't want to hear that. Meanwhile. They got to get this Oyan guy to squeal. At approximately 11.20 a.m. Poor Oyan showed up at the American Airlines check-in desk in London's airport. From there, he was whisked away into a private office.

Was it a dingy room? room with just one metal chair in it. Probably. And the former NYPD detective began to question Ayoen. Oh my God. She put the pressure on. She told him that she'd get him a ticket

back to Nashville if he'd just admit that he'd paid shock to fly on his companion pass. What do you think of this? I think it's weird and gross. I think it's so disturbing. And clear...

A company... I hate to call this confession because it's like you're not the Police. No. But this is a coerced confession if you're saying you can't fly home right now unless you say X, Y, and Z about this other guy, then I will arrange for you to fly home. A company taking a customer into a private room and interrogating them is insane. What do you think happened, Norm? I hope the guy laughed and left. I think you're going to be pretty happy Because they underestimated this guy He was like

I don't know what to tell you I didn't pay Jacques anything for this ticket And I mean you're right I don't know him well I met him in March through a friend But no I didn't pay him anything But like any good pushy detective

The woman questioned him again She said well Jacques no longer has the air pass It has been canceled Which means your seat on this flight has been canceled. So I'll ask you again. How did you get this ticket from London and Nashville? How much did he?

Perhaps he's telling the truth and he didn't actually pay for it. Yeah. When you assume Jacques is selling... See, that's the problem. They're just automatically assuming that Jacques was doing this thing. Well, and they might be right. But how many people are you going to harass before you just accept that like, hey, we got to take the L on this?

Well, and again, the stakes are too low if he, the worst case scenario for this young man is, oh, I don't get to fly today on this airline. I guess I'll get a different flight. You're saying they should have seen if he had any nude photos he didn't want getting out. Yeah, it's not like we're going to throw you in prison or a gulag or whatever. It's just like, you can't fly today at this time. She's like, I will put you in the Tower of London. So, no, Oyan once again was like, I told you, I didn't pay anything.

It was free. In other words, like a pistachio left out in the Arizona heat, O'Yon was a tough nut to crack. Kristen. It seems at some point that the investigators tried to do that thing where they left. Oh my God, this is an airline. Jacques and O'Yon together in a room. alone, you know, hoping the two of them would like, you know, pour their hearts and souls out to each other, admit everything. That didn't happen. Instead, Jacques was like, what the

hell. I want to talk to the highest ranking person at this airport. Hell yeah. I'm an AirPaths member, baby. Not anymore. And the American Airlines people were like, you can talk to our legal department. And also, oh, would you look at that? Here's an officer. The officer will be escorting you from the area, but not to prison because we don't have to. of that kind of authority. We will be locking you into the Hudson News for two hours, you bad, bad boy. We will keep a log of any magazine that you thumb through and any snacks that you consume. That interaction hadn't gone quite how the airline had hoped.

They didn't get their confession. And yeah, they did end up giving Oyan a coach flight back to Nashville. Yeah, you fucking better. Right. That's a lawsuit, too. You would think. Now, Norm, I can hear in your voice that you're concerned about the airline. You're on their side.

You want them to get this guy. I sure hope everything goes well for American Airlines. Well, don't worry. They had other irons in the fire, okay? Because there was this other guy named Sam Mulroy. He was a personal trainer. In fact, he was Jacques's personal trainer. And the two of them had been scheduled to go on a flight to Europe together.

And once again, American Airlines thought that they'd found another weak target, which is interesting because if I'm thinking about personal trainers, male personal trainers from Dallas, I don't think that this alpha male is going to crumble. Hell no. Yeah, they were wrong. He's from Texas. This one's the most ridiculous one to me. Oh, it gets more ridiculous.

Yes. So I have a document from Sam. Okay. I'm going to start by reading to you an email that he received from an American Airlines employee. Just out of the blue, he's getting an email from an American Airlines employee. Well, not out of the blue completely because, I mean, this investigation is very real and very valid and shouldn't be made fun of it all. Right, right. But like, if I was booked on a flight and I got an email from an American Air Force, Airlines employee, to me, that would be out of the blue.

Sure. What? Why are you emailing me? Okay. What did this say? I'm going to read this to you, and I think the context, it'll kind of fill in as I read the email. You know, I love context. This came to him on Monday, August 4th, 2008.

It came from Linda Navarro, and she wrote, During our telephone conversation on July 31st, you stated that Jacques Froome had supplied you with a ticket from DFW to LV. HR in exchange for payment of taxes. At the time, you advise that you did not yet know the exact amount that would be charged. Please advise the details of the transaction, including the amount agreed upon for payment, as well as the form of payment, whether cash or training sessions. Your advantage account will be released upon receipt of the information. Thank you for your cooperation. What phone call? Payment of taxes? Where's this coming from?

All valid questions. Norm, when Sam received that email, he decided to write another email. It appears maybe he wrote it under their complaint section, you know, given feedback. Here's what he wrote. To whom it may concern. I am basically being extorted by an employee of an American Airlines. Yeah. In an effort for them to punish another customer, I would like to file a formal complaint and make sure

this behavior is not only admonished, but that no one else has to endure these types of tactics from a publicly owned and government regulated company. No kidding. I have copied the email from the offender below, but I want to set it up with a more detailed explanation as follows. Okay? Contact sluts. You ready?

Here we go. Yeah, please. I was set to travel with on August 31, 2008, with a Mr. Jack Vroom, who is a Lifetime American Airlines Air Pass holder. I have known him for over 20 years, and I have never taken him up on an offer to accompany him on any trips. As an air pass holder, he and a guest fly first class for free anytime, anywhere. However, I have recently started fitness training him, and when he told me he was going to London this summer a few times, I jumped at the offer because I have friends in Stockholm I wanted to visit.

After he booked the tickets, I asked him if he incurred any costs, and his response was, quote, I'm not sure because I don't know if there will be any taxes going on from Heathrow as we'd have to take British Airways to Stockholm. I said, I don't want you to have to pay anything, so if there is, maybe we can just add it on to your training package. He had already purchased 10 sessions. On August 30th, I received an email from Mr. Vroom, saying he was stuck in London and would not be able to take me on our schedule date. I called American Airlines, booked a ticket with 90,000 miles, and didn't miss a beat. However, I received a call the day of departure from Linda Navarro of American Airlines and was offered a first-class upgrade if I would tell her if I paid Jack money for the previously booked ticket. Oh my God.

She stated she had confirmation that I had. I repeated to her verbatim what I wrote above and was told, That's not enough for the upgrade ticket. We need you to confirm that you paid. I asked her how she had confirmation of something I didn't do, and if I was being accused of any wrongdoing. She said, I can't divulge that information and that I wasn't being accused of anything. That was the last time I communicated with her regarding this subject until I received the email below. I haven't been accused of wrongdoing, nor did I even fly with Mr. Vroom, and yet my advantage account has been frozen until I do what she says.

Is this legal? Yeah. I'm getting a hold of a DA tomorrow to see if I can press criminal charges as well as possibly filing a civil suit. There we go. The American Heritage Dictionary defines extortion as. Oh, he's doing that. Illegal use of one's official position or powers to obtain property, funds, or patronage. I have to pause here.

I love it when someone has to break down to the dictionary defines this word as this. Right. I see no other way to look at this. First, it was tell us what happened, and we will give you a carrot. I did and got nothing. Now it's tell us again the way we want to hear it, or you will get the stick. Please help me resolve this, and I would hope for you to sanction American Airlines and Ms. Navarro for their actions. Sincerely, Sam Mulroy.

What an insane story this is. He also sent a follow-up email. This is much shorter, but I like it. It read, I would like Lindon. and Navarro's supervisor to contact me ASAP. I am being extorted by her in an attempt for her to pursue another passenger for some vendetta that has no bearing on me. She has frozen my AA account unless I provide her with basically a false statement.

I have filed a formal complaint and I'm calling the DA's office tomorrow to see if I can press charges. Thank you. Damn. They messed with the wrong personal trainer. They sure did. Okay. This is nuts, right?

Yes. This is gone off the rails. These are horrible tactics. Yeah. You are going up to random customers and like, okay, you asked the question. They answered it. They may be lying, but you have no proof that they're lying. Yeah.

And you're acting like. And you're holding their advantage of housing. Oh, my gosh. A few weeks after all this went down, American Airlines sued Jock. They alleged that he'd sold and bartered his companion pass multiple times. And when he did that, he fraudulently accumulated frequent flyer miles off of both his travel and that of his companion. They're suing him? Yeah, but they're suing him to cover the losses that they incurred.

Jacques didn't take too kindly to being sued, Norm. So he looked himself in the mirror, which was a handheld one facing another mirror. And he said, let's go to court for a countersuit. Because the contract that Jacques entered into with American Airlines, didn't expressly prohibit him from selling his companion pass. And yeah, American Airlines did eventually prohibit that practice, but they did that three years after Jacques bought his lifetime pass. Yeah. Did he sign new terms of service, new user agreement?

Yeah, I don't think so. Unfortunately, though, the court stuff didn't go so hot for our boy, Jacques. Damn. Investigators did discover some instances of people paying Jacques for their flights. but, you know, like a good hooker, he claimed that the money was for other stuff, not the flights. Hear that all the time on cops. Yep. It was $1,000 for a hug.

As for our other frequent flyer, Stephen Rothstein, well, in 2011, a federal judge found that Stephen had, in fact, violated his contract with the airline by booking seats under fake names. But even that is sort of a funny thing, in my opinion, because, yes, he did occasionally use his companion pass. for Bag Rothstein, which was obviously just for his bag. But Stephen never used a computer to book his reservations. He only ever booked those reservations with the help of an American Airlines employee. And when Stephen's favorite booking agent was deposed for the lawsuit, she said that the airline never gave her any kind of written directions on what she was and was not allowed to do regarding making reservations for customers at his level.

And further, Stephen says that when he bought his companion pass, the airline sold it to him as something that he could use to keep the seat next to him empty. The example they used was Yo-Yo Ma. They were like, Yo-Yo Ma flies all the time with his cello in the seat next to him. You can do the same thing. You can have your documents there. You can do whatever. Yeah. In other words, he got in trouble for doing something that the airline employees knew about and helped him do.

And that other people do all the time. Well, maybe not with the air pass. No, but like people buy extra seats for all sorts of reasons. Well, yeah, but they're okay with that. They just didn't like that he was getting such a good deal. Well, too fucking bad. You came up with the deal. So he lost.

But did he kind of lose? Because then the company that owned American Airlines filed for bankruptcy. So all this stuff is still kind of up in the air. Har, har, har, hear. Get it. But for Stephen and Jacques, it meant the end of their air passes, which was a sad thing for them. It is sad. Worth noting one other air pass holder also had his pass revoked. He'd actually talked openly to the media about how he sold his companion pass to random people.

He'd even, I mean, he'd talked about it on the news. And then years later, the airline came after him and revoked his pass. But he was like, I'm not going to sue them. I can't beat American Airlines. Yeah. So he just let it go. Well, and he definitely got his money's worth, I'm sure. Yeah.

So it's like, well, that was a great time. Other people still have their lifetime air passes, though. Really? Mark Cuban? Don't you think he has a private plane by now? I mean, he definitely flies private now, but I'm just wondering if he's still an air path holder. Jacques has an interesting theory about why some people still have their air passes and why he doesn't. Okay.

He said, American was hurting and went after the most vulnerable air passholders to free up cash, people they knew wouldn't fight back. What do you think of that? From the tactics they used to get these confessions? Yeah, that makes sense to me. It's interesting to me. It does make me wonder, were these two truly the most frequent flyers? Or were they guys who were not famous? so, you know, they can't make too big a stink.

Yeah. And guys who maybe didn't have as much money as everyone else? Mm-hmm. Or, I mean, hell, maybe they were just the two top users and they had to take them down. Yeah, you can be the most frequent flyer, but also not be, you know, super famous or... Yeah. So, possibly. And Norm, that is the story of a terrible deal for a business, but a fabulous deal

for the consumer. Jesus Christ. So had you heard this story before? I knew that American Airlines, well not American Airlines. I knew an airline did have some lifetime pass and then they canceled

it. That's all I knew. I didn't know it was American Airlines and I didn't know they went bat shit fucking crazy trying to get people to cancel their air pass and take it away from people. That is ridiculous. I think this might be more common with companies than we think it is.

That they look into people. Oh, yeah. But boy, does it creep me out. It's weird. I just love that they chose these targets, and these targets did not flip. Yeah, it seems like a huge waste of time and resources. Well, I don't know. They're saving a lot of money now because Jacques and Stephen aren't flying.

Yeah, but now they're known in history for the... this ridiculous story. I mean, it is really stupid. And we can make fun of them now. But we can't make fun of Chick-Dickey. Oh, yeah, we can. Because Chick-Dickie knows all about quotation marks. I wonder if Taco Bell has been keeping tabs on me.

Why? This guy's been redeeming his fire rewards tier. There's no way this guy eats this much Taco Bell. We are losing so much money. This man's redeeming for the cheesy Gordita Crunch every time. Every day. Yeah, that's my advice for you. If you have the Taco Bell rewards, you know, you get a, you get like a free menu item if you earn enough points.

Norman, you want to be sponsored by Taco Bell so bad. That'd be great. But they have the cheesy gordita crunch as a item you can redeem. That thing's like $5.99. That's huge value, folks. What? You're looking at me. I am.

I'm in love. I'm in love. It's true. You do love Taco Bell. I do. I also love Taco Bell. That's why you're the lady for me. Norm, I got to tell you, I loved this story.

I thought it was so stupid. But I love really bad business decisions where ultimately no one gets hurt. I love, well, I don't love, but I do find it hilarious. The lengths people will go instead of taking the L. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Great job.

Thank you. Yeah. That was very entertaining and that's what I love about this podcast, you know. You never know what you're going to get? Do those long, serious topics. Oh, this was very serious. But we can also do those. This was deeply serious.

Those one-off, hilarious, ridiculous topics. I can tell you don't feel sorry enough for the airline. And I'm sorry to hear it. At all. Can you believe, speedy airlines, can you believe Southwest Airlines took away? The bags flying free, perk? No. Can you believe that?

I hate it. I hate it so much. When they announced it, I was just like, there's literally no reason to fly your airline now. That was what you had. You ride into your Taco Bell. No. Here's the thing. I've never liked Southwest that much. All of these airlines suck.

Yeah, pretty much. So what are we going to do? There's nothing we can do. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah, you just have to book a ticket on some other airline. And they're, yeah, they're all bad. So what do you think the best airline is out of like the U.S.

I don't know. I don't fly enough to know what the best one is. All I know is I always hate flying. And every time we fly, I'm like, that's it. Next time we're going first class or nothing. And then when it comes time to buy a ticket, I'm like, holy shit, it can't be worth it. And then we fly coach. And I'm like, this sucks.

Yeah, it's a cycle. When I was in my YouTube heyday going to all the video game conventions, I remember in the beginning I was like, this is so cool. I'm flying around the country. After like year two, I was sick of it. Yeah. Just the flying was just terrible. Terrible. Now if you'd been flying first class.

Up in the sky, popping champagne, living the life. Yeah. Then I think you'd feel differently. You'd be saying, bring me another one of those little salmon appetizers, please. and I will take the foot rub now while I eat the salmon. All right, can we wrap this thing up? We can.

Folks, we're happy to be back. Thank you for putting up with us while we are on our break. But yeah, we are ready to bring joy and knowledge and humor to your ear holes. Wow. Norm, you, I can tell, are completely unaware that you are the one who has to lead the outro. I can tell you don't have it pulled up. I do. No, you don't.

Kristen? Look at it right now. You know what they say about history knows. We always cite our sources. That's right. For this episode, I got my information from the article, The Frequent Flyers Who Flew Too Much by Ken Benzinger for the Los Angeles Times. The article, My Father Had a Lifelong ticket to Fly Anywhere.

Then they took it away by Caroline Rothstein for Narratively. The article, The Rise and Demise of the Air Pass, American Airlines 250K Lifetime Ticket by Zachary Crockett for The Hustle.com. Plus more. Check the show notes for a full list of our sources. That's all for this episode. Thank you for listening to an old-timey podcast. Please give us a five-star review wherever you listen to podcasts. And while you're at it, subscribe. Support us on Patreon at patreon.com slash old-timey podcast. Join the Reddit community, our slash old-timey podcast.

Follow us on Facebook and YouTube and Instagram at Old Timey Podcast. You can also follow us individually on Instagram. I'm at Kristen Pitts Caruso and he's at Gaming Historian. And until next time, Tudaloo, Tata, and Cheerio. Goodbye. Bye. See you. See you.