And That's Why We Drink - E170 A La Croix Lobotomy and a Big Golden Eye

Episode Date: May 3, 2020

Let there be fun! We've got a wild ride for you this week as we virtually travel to the southern hemisphere. First Em covers the extremely haunted and messed up Aradale Mental Hospital in Australia. Then Christine takes us over to New Zealand for the also extremely messed up Bain Family murders in Dunedin. We're also pretty sure there's a dancing candelabra involved in both... and that's why we drink!Please consider supporting the companies that support us!Explore your creativity and get 2 free months of Premium Membership at Skillshare.com/DRINK2

okay yeah i'm on okay good we're in the main frame even probably like how fucking hard is it for them to figure this out we literally also like she's she literally sent us an email spilling it out so non-complicated and i'm like did we do it oh my gosh uh hello folks this is uh christine and m we are attempting to record on skype today since we've had a couple issues with you know lags and things over the internet we were over the internet like program we were using so we'll see what happens yes we will we will see what's i mean a for effort i'm gonna call it that's the title of this episode that's the title of our podcast our new podcast it's just that's really

the title that was the first title of our original podcast, I think. Anyway, so hopefully this works. It seems to be working, but I don't want to jinx it. So how are you doing, Em? Hmm. Well, I think I'm okay. We, things are pretty similar to days one through 45 over here. So I'm thinking as it's day 46 we're we're good in that uh i guess everything's clean we have food yes i guess i'm a lucky a lucky person in that way i also have been cleaning a lot so i feel very good about myself because that's something i usually do not do i was gonna say in the beginning of uh quarantine, I was cleaning a lot and you were like, you were like, that's not gonna last very long. Now we've like switched places. And I got so bored in my filth and you're cleaning always. So that's exactly what I like to call it. Yeah. I well, I've been cleaning. I've been trying to

downsize like declutter. but then I think a lot of the goodwills around us are also closed and so there's nowhere to bring the goodwill so I like my car is slowly getting more and more stuffed with stuff yeah I keep trying to bring stuff out of the car and then I'm like I don't want my car to get broken into so I get nervous about that and then I just leave it all in the living room. So now there's just like bags of donations everywhere. I don't know. I don't know.

It's okay. I think we're very fortunate. Otherwise, we're not, you know, we're fully aware of that. Yeah. And I definitely don't get to complain. Just trying to make the best. No. Yeah.

I feel very fortunate that people in my family are healthy. Knock on wood. And that you are healthy. That's very fortunate that people in my family are healthy, knock on wood, and that you are healthy. That's very important to me. Oh, wait a minute. That just made my heart go a flutter. Something else that made my heart go a flutter a couple hours ago for lunch, RJ made me a steak. It was the first steak I've had in like over a month. Whoa, RJ.

I know. Big day. Big day Big day. Pulling out all the stops for you. Also, so I don't know how much I should say, but I do want to say something because I can't keep my mouth shut. And someone decided that my career should be giving me a microphone and speaking to the public. So he he he. But what is it? I'm dying right now. So I've already told you a little bit, but apparently RJ is going on his first date this weekend. Oh, yes. So I would like to keep people updated on that because I'm very excited for him. I hope it goes well. Allison and I have been trying to coach him a little and what to say. So but now this is a virtual date, right? is a virtual date yes he is not okay he's not

breaking the social distance rules but we are all very excited for him so i have not ever seen him i haven't seen him giddy before oh well i mean if it means more steaks for you i feel like this is a good turn of events that's exactly what i said i was like you must be in a good mood because you're literally making steak and then letting me eat it. And so like, if this is what love is like for you, then I also want you to be in love. I love it. You just brought probably broke a bunch of listeners hearts, who were hoping for their chance with RJ. But I know maybe someday, I just wanted to say, you know, I just wanted to let everyone know that we can all equally, you know, indulge in a little heartbreak right now. But, you know, no better time than to like eat a bunch of ice cream while you're quarantined, knowing that all eight packs of him are going on a date this weekend.

They are, but they're also being kept indoors. So, you know. They are. She doesn't know he has eight packs. These are things that our listeners know that this datee does not yet know so we all still have a one-up on her wow thank god i hope we keep it that way can you tell i'm slowly losing sanity i'm just talking about my roommate non-stop i would say quickly but sure yeah oh i would say steeply, like a sturdy incline. Decline. Decline.

Very much decline. So I also found my old EMF detector from back when my first original one. It's the gray one that I used to have at your place. Oh, the one that was at my house and I was scared of losing it, so I gave it back. Well, then I ended up losing it and so i i found it in the in the midst of my decluttering and so now i'm thinking if i ever hear that tapping on the lamp again i'm definitely gonna have to use it good idea and if you guys don't know did you talk about that on the show i think that was just on instagram live oh there's been a tapping in M's room. That's that is potentially a spirit.

I don't know question mark. Yeah, I'm sure a lot of people I rolled at that. But it does feel like it's weirdly intelligent, because it only happens when I mentioned it, or when I'm like out loud saying, Hey, I haven't heard that tapping in a while. And then all of a sudden it shows up. So and it's on your night nightstand like right next to you right next to me i one time it was on allison's nightstand and then i said out loud oh that's usually by my nightstand and then it started tapping my the lamp on my nightstand so like that's enough for me with my quarantine sanity or lack thereof to decide that like i should be ghost hunting in my own house now great i mean listen mean, listen. So look out for that. I think that we've been kind of like our lives have been building to this very moment where

we're stuck inside ghost hunting our own bedroom. So you're in the clear. Tell me about you. Tell me about you. I feel like I just like gave you like five different updates, which are not updates at all. So there are definitely updates. There are definitely ghosty updates, which I appreciate.

I had one note. Actually, I told Emma I was going to mention the reddit page and i wanted to um warn them because uh we try to avoid the reddit page um because some people can be really mean yes uh on the internet what a shock um and people can also just be brutally honest and not necessarily mean but it hurts my feelings so I try to avoid the reddit but my brother's on it and he's you know runs around like a vigilante like trying to defend us all the time and um he sends me like screen caps of things that he thinks are like nice or funny and um one of them is this uh reddit user said after listening to the last episode of

and that's why we drink which was my trees richardson um at the time i had to giggle about christine and her 98 honda civic in a week i'll be getting a 98 honda civic because it's a major upgrade for my car i like to name my cars my chrysler's dennis the menace um blah blah blah i was brainstorming names for my next car and i was trying to think of another respectable female influence. And I thought about Christine. And so now she's named her new 98 Honda Civic after me. And it's just like this weird thing goal that I never knew I had to have a car named after me.

What a nice like and like it came out of good intentions. But it's also kind of a backhanded compliment of like, oh, if we were to name any car after you it's going to be a honda civic from the 90s but like i hope like i hope i get named that was my first car that was my special car i love i know i get it i just would like to think if i ever got named after anything it'd be like a tesla you know not like not like a old school and the tesla that's pretty cool sounding yeah um no i'm very happy for you uh it doesn't have your username on here i think oh r shay um and i you know i respect that if it's an upgrade from your current chrysler seabrook i have no listen uh apparently m wants a tesla i am still in the old school car phase of my life um but uh then my brother commented and he said are you naming it christine schieffer or or just christine because i'm picturing you

telling people that your name car's name is christine schieffer and then um they responded that they're getting a lemon air freshener and then i was like how is nobody talking about the fact that stephen king's haunted car was named named Christine and like nobody that's the real question right I was like hello everyone like it's the perfect name because it's a literal haunted car so I texted my brother and forced him to write that in the comments and um he wrote that and so anyway it was just a very nice uh comforting exchange amidst some of the negativity on the internet so well that's nice i do very proud and i will say if it's an upgrade then i'm very proud of you i just it's i and actually also upon like immediate one second long reflection i actually retract the tesla thing and i would prefer per back to the future uh a delorean which is like much worse in quality so i like i really have no like to stand on well

um i you know used to drive a an audi from the early 90s and it was turquoise and that thing was um very special to my heart although i am please turquoise yeah it was quite a quite a it was a custom color um oh my i did not i definitely did not paint it that the person before me did but uh um it was special to me my car was named rowena ravenclaw by the way in case anyone's wondering oh i think you would have said that before i remember being impressed oh i thank you i i had um i've only ever had subarus um which definitely like like that's not helping the queer stereotype that everyone has a subaru but uh i wasn't gonna say anything but so fit the stereotype of my jewish mother because they have the best crash ratings so like one wins right um yeah no you do have a

subaru and you have like the full-on subaru with like the the seat coverings and like i feel like i don't know why this was the whole deal we recently had I think again because the quarantine we're running out of things to talk about but I recently went on a rant about how much I love Subaru's like I think it's the only car I'm ever gonna own is Subaru's anyway this is not an ad to Subaru's I'm just I just like my car I love a Subaru are you listening are you listening oh they could probably pay us some big bucks Subaru hello are you listening um I also wanted to say one more thing um someone mailed us a package and our like mailbox place sent a picture and apparently somebody had stolen the contents of this package and there was no return address it just said Carrie loves you and then an empty box

so if that is you and you're listening uh please let us know what was in the box unless it was like a ghost or something and it was meant to be you know an empty box but um it could be it could be really sweet or it could also be really sinister if like the only thing left is like carrie loves you and also like imagine we've gotten some wild stuff sent to us i hope that whoever stole it i like to think that the contents were something that freaked them out like i hope that karma serves its purpose wait that's a good point i hope that ghost that carrie put in there just haunted that person for the rest i hope that cursed doll really is doing well also by the way

we just talked about christine and car, two acclaimed Stephen King characters. So I wonder where this episode is going. Probably somewhere bad. I really wish that I had like delivered a Stephen King story today. That would have worked out really well for me. Damn. I don't have one either, unfortunately. I also want to say one more time.

I know we said this last week, but we are doing an Instagram happy hour every Thursday at three. That's gotten like super fun. And it's basically you guys asking questions and me catching up. So that's oh, it's 3 p.m. Pacific time. And then it's up for 24 hours on our Instagram at WWD podcast. And you're still doing Marvel Mondays, right?

I am. I'm doing that five o'clock Pacific time time uh eight eastern time on instagram yes and that every monday every monday yes and we're and we're doing uh half movies now for a while we were doing the whole movie but uh we're breaking it up that way we have uh more weeks in a row to watch but also so that way there's more like a succinct amount of time to do a q a instead of like you know people just there's no way as honored as I am that people want to be a part of that. I also understand that like nobody wants to be on an Instagram live for like two to three hours. So we're breaking it up. Okay, cool. Yeah,

no, that the Marvel Mondays are super fun. Even I go in there a lot of times and I don't know anything about Marvel. So check that out. And then I'm still doing my YouTube. I don't know what's going on on there i'm just doing random different things what's your plan what's your what's your like end like what's the i've never heard your whole spiel about it i know what what's on it but do you have a like a game well so i was doing my cautionary tales and then i kind of ran out of stories and um nowhere right now is really shipping books in a very fast pace because there are more important things to mail out right now so i know there are not i know it's hard to

believe um but so i haven't been able to do new ones of those so then i just had people send in like what they wanted me to cover and basically people sent in some like very creepy like personal true crime stories like somebody you know uh their neighbor was breaking into their house and they didn't know it and like creepy stuff like that and so i'm just doing like little readings of that those um with with some creepy music underneath and uh drinking wine and inviting people to drink with me about scary murderers and stuff um so it's basically what we do but just more of it while i'm drinking but without fucking me well you're just you're just running the show no most of the comments are like well where's m and i'm like well m's at their house like m cannot be

here right now because like we're not allowed sorry um so yeah people are not necessarily um most people were like well is this ending the podcast and i was like dear god if me doing a youtube channel that has like 800 views per video would end the podcast we'd both be in big big trouble um considering i'm making zero zero sense on that so anyway it's called the the x teen files if you want to check it out or email me a story and you know my white hand story with crazy carl yes of course so i'm uh writing that i had my mom send her version to me and i'm writing out like a full story of it for the first time ever and so i'm hoping to read that one um on an episode soon and yeah it's fun it's creepy i thought for a second you were gonna

say something like i don't know why but i assumed in my quarantine brain that you had like made contact with carl and he was gonna like guest star on your show and now well i did in more or less ways you'll have to find out wink wink oh nudge nudge but yes no he's not in my house don't worry no no no okay great well hopefully he's not in my house so oh god he's tapping he loved to tap on wait a second no i'm just kidding hang on it wait with his white glove oh no okay anyway uh oh yeah we have a podcast welcome here's our stories so oh god we've been talking for a long time sorry folks when we don't see each other like every single second we suddenly have a lot more to talk about oops i know i like i actually like miss your face i'm like what's it

look like let me guess you've got well let me guess hang on if we had a camera in our faces you would have some mascara and lip slut lipstick on. But because we're not recording, you probably got a whole lot of nothing on your face. How dare you call me that word? A lip slut? You're welcome. No, I'm just teasing. Yeah, you're actually right.

I did blaze out a day off today. So I was like, I'll actually take a shower for once. So I did take a shower and I did actually put my uh lip slut lipstick on it's uh the fuck trump again my favorite shade and um yeah so you actually you hit the nail on the head there i'm also wearing your t-shirt so that's also true which is usually the case cal surprise it make can can i request something now because i'm like i know i'm behind the curve i know this is like what a lot of like college students do but like i'm you know how like blaze has the uh his quilt with all the yes like all of his old shirts on it i would like to request a quilt of

all my old shirts when you decide you no longer want them so we like keep passing it back and forth yeah so i actually told that to blaze recently i like i was like why did no one ever make me a t-shirt quilt and he's like do you want me to make you a t-shirt quilt and i was like yes i okay so i'm literally having one made right now which is why that's on my mind so i totally understand oh boy all right sorry you can tell your story now so okay here's my story um this one is from australia i will not be a shitty american and try to do the australia accent um although i sure would like to we already did that we already did that in early episodes plenty of times that's true um by the way can i tell you a fun thing i about australia for me absolutely i think i've

mentioned it before but it's like my favorite story that's ever like happened to someone i know um was when i worked at the segway shop i worked with a girl that i went to college with and she literally had one of those aha moments of like oh you know i want to go do something really interesting like i feel like i you know i'm kind of wasting my time like i want to go like have an adventure so she decided she was going to sell all of her stuff and like just move to australia or at least like go for like three months or something and then everyone was always making fun of her of like oh what if like you like go to like the great barrier reef or something and like your diving instructor like is like the love of your life and then that literally happened no and so then she met him

fell in love with them and then when she came back to the states apparently they stayed in contact and he was like i will like fly you back out here. Like, I want to be with you. And now they've been married for like four years. Wow. What a story. Isn't that bananas? Yeah. It like sounds so fake. It would like make a lame movie because it's so cliche.

I love it. I adore it. I know. It makes me really it's like the only cool thing that's like, like picture-esque. So anyway, whenever I hear Australia, I like to like force that into conversation so you're welcome um anyway my story's from australia it's one of the most haunted locations in australia and um it i think it made i think i was trying to find more places outside of the states um to report on just because i know we have a lot of international listeners and so i just picked australia and i was, what are some of the most haunted places? And this was on a lot of the lists. So I'm Oh,

and I did get some very juicy info. So this is the Arundel mental hospital. Okay. Okay. And I keep wanting to say Arundel from Frozen. Me too. That's what I thought at first. So I keep thinking like, Oh, am I mispronouncing it? Because I just want to force the sound of Arendelle into it. So anyway, it's one of the most haunted locations in Australia. It was at one point 100 acres. And at its peak, it had 1,500 patients and 500 staff members. It was made up of 63 or 64 buildings.

So it was a really huge campus whoa and it went by many names over the years so it started as Ararat Asylum I think it's probably pronounced differently in an Australian dialect but any American I've heard say it was Ararat I think it might be Ararat Ararat but the Ararat Asylum the Ararat Hospital for the Insane yikes and Aradel or the Ararat Asylum, the Ararat Hospital for the Insane, yikes, and Aradel or the Ararat Training Center. So it's had a few names. So it was built in Victoria, the town of Ararat, in 1864. And it was named after the mountain where Noah's Ark comes to rest after the flood. Fun fact.

Oh. Am I saying it right for the biblical people out there do you know christine i think i actually have no idea how do you how do you even spell that a r a r a t error rat oh i think i've heard of that yeah that sounds right i tried i tried for the people out there probably the people on reddit who think i like don't know how to pronounce anything i certainly looked it up online and then i was getting a bunch of mixed answers because half the people had a different dialect than me so i really don't know what's going on um but anyway so it was allegedly built by the patients themselves oh so it was like one of those situations where you're like building your own jail or digging your own grave didn't we talk

about that once we said like we would put like a secret passageway inside it or something? Yeah, like if you're building it, I mean, I'm sure it was not that easy, but like in an ideal world, it's like, oh, well, I would just like build a car and drive away. I'll build a secret car inside this wall. Exactly, they'll never know. I don't know, put a loose brick.

Yeah, I'm sure they were definitely very carefully monitored, but just a thought. I'm sure they all had that thought at some point while they were building it but so in this case apparently that it's still just allegedly because rumors say it's true but i think the reason they assume this is because the building actually opened uh it opened two inmates before it was officially opened so there were like two years where construction was still going on around the hospital and some inmates were already in certain buildings that had already been built up but it hadn't officially been opened as a facility yet so a lot of people think oh well if there were inmates there two years before its official opening, they probably helped build. Sure. Does that make sense?

Yeah, that makes total sense. So they don't really know what the right answer is, but rumor is that they helped build the hospital. So in 1866, it was officially built, and it apparently had verandas and courtyards, and it was supposed to look very, very beautiful and wonderful. It was all self-contained, so it had its own market, its own gardens, its own livestock, it had orchards, vineyards, and it had a morgue. And fun fact, which isn't so fun, the morgue had a bunch of peppercorn trees outside of the building. I think there's still one that stands,

but the whole point was to disguise the smell of the morgue. Oh, man. Yeah yeah so the grounds were actually surrounded by i think they were called ditch walls um another site i saw where they were called haha walls h-a-h-a walls um they could also be called lol walls who knows i was like oh really i'm so stupid so um apparently they're called ditch walls because they appear so if you're not um an inmate or a patient i keep saying inmate slash patient because this was also it later became part of a prison so that's why i keep saying oh okay um i'm sure that was really jarring for some people i don't think that patients are inmates oh god but so uh they're called ditch walls actually weren't on the facility if you were in the general public

looking at it then the gates around the building looked really low it just looked like a normal fence maybe but inside on the other side it was actually a trench built around it so the walls were much taller to the people inside i see okay that makes sense so if you're like and apparently this is really fucked up but they did that for the aesthetic concern of the public not necessarily for the patients they just didn't want the right sure so it looks like oh they're not trapped in there exactly it was like apparently if you were outside the walls only looked like they were maybe three or four feet tall. But if you were on the inside, they were like 12 to 15 feet tall based on where you were. So there was no climbing it.

Makes sense. So then the original back when the asylum opened, it had 250 patients. But then only a couple years before or it was meant to hold 250 patients. But then a couple years before another hospital closed and to hold 250 patients but then a couple years before another um hospital closed and all the patients had to get transferred here so then the population doubled so then they had to keep growing the buildings um and let's remember that this was the 1880s or 1890s so psychiatry was hot spanking new And so there was only four types of mental illness back then, although now there's like 2000 or something. So back then you either had one of these you had

dementia, melancholy, mania, or paranoia. What about hysteria? Is that not one of them? I think that wasn't considered like a psychiatry. I think that was like, I don't know where that falls. Maybe it was under it fell under mania or something. Yeah, it was probably under one of them. Yeah, that makes sense. I think the four of these were like umbrella terms for any other condition. And they just kind of deemed you one of the four. Right, right.

Like Harry Potter houses. Exactly. Like if you're in dementia, maybe you're like Hufflepuff or I mean, it doesn't. Yeah, you get it. But the saddest. That's why I named my that's what that's why I named my my my Tesla melancholy. Where is this going? I get it.

I get it. I name. I love it. You know, you get it. It's very long. Do you want me to? I'll draw it out for you. I'll make you a chart later.

Who would who would they be? Dementia, melancholyoly i think none of them really like stand out as bravery or ambition i guess we really can't really not we can't align them with anyone but anyway so um but that being said because there are only four types that means like there was no difference between like having epilepsy or having schizophrenia like there was just you were just if you came in manic or like assumingly based on your symptoms you were more manic than melancholy then all of a sudden you had mania was epilepsy considered a mental illness oh yeah we're gonna get into that so and also because this was before the turn of

the century and psychiatry was so new that basically if anything was wrong with you quote wrong with you then you would just go into an asylum so like if you burnt the pot roast three nights in a row then off off you go yeah we will get into that don't you worry so uh there also i feel like this shouldn't have to be said on a show called and that's why we drank but the asylum did not have many good conditions or any good treatments especially given the time when psychology was so new. So some of the treatments included a lack, and these are just some of the lighter ones, but a lack of privacy, denial of basic care, such as dentistry.

So a lot of people who were there long enough ended up missing teeth. There was insufficient food, even though there was actually like a bounty of food. But the staff would literally just take it off of the like, take all boxes of them home for themselves. So. Oh, geez. It was like around 50% of food that came to the hospital, the staff would take home. So. Wow. Insufficient food. And also remember, this is like a garden and an orchard and everything.

And they're still getting insufficient food. Like they're not getting to eat. Damn. Also, there were restraint bags, strapped chairs, isolation cages. There were straitjackets. And then there was also communal underpants. What? Where you would have to share underwear with people.

And I'm guessing, I didn't see any more information on that, but I'm guessing they weren't always clean. I would think probably not. Oh, my God. Yeah. Especially since the staff didn't seem to really care about them. And there were, you know, whispers of abuse. So I'm imagining nobody was cleaning this underwear. You just wore whatever you got.

Yikes. That being said, they really thought that they were turn of the century when it came to mental health awareness because they also did things like moral treatment which in the 1800s was like a big um i don't know what the right word is i'm like totally blanking but it was like a form of like reform at the time where like you would give them trades and responsibilities and i see yeah i teach them to be independent and then they could leave earlier so just like how a lot of the old hospitals i've talked about how they had um like gardens and um a little store or sewing stations where people could learn a trade and then it helps them it's like uh

like rehabilitation kind of sort of yeah exactly that's the i was i could not figure out the word rehabilitation um clearly i couldn't either until just this very second so don't worry so anyway that's why they had the garden and the vineyards and all that because everyone had kind of a job to their responsibility to keep the place running so right right but let's not forget like how horrible their treatment was. And the things I just listed were kind of not as terrible as the rest. So I'll get into it in a second. But let's just say that like there's obviously like electroshock therapy and things like that.

So roughly a third of the patients that entered the asylum would never be released. It was a terrible statistic and just like how you said earlier if you you know burned your husband's food three times a week then that would be enough reason to get put away some of the reasons people got put away were obscene language oh by the way only women obscene language drunken disorderly um depression i'm already i'm already done i'm in oh bye the second i saw obscene language i was like well here i fucking go um drunken disorderly depression alcoholism and uh obviously homosexuality that was actually you know a thing until like the 70s and many asylums right um, or mental hospitals. And so sadly, a lot of the, um, a lot of the women that were charged.

So it gets muddled between like, were they there for mental illness or were they there as a, as a criminal? Um, but really any reason at all, someone could be put away. And one of the things that most women were charged with and why they got sent there was for stealing baby clothes because they couldn't afford them for their babies oh my god and a lot of people who ended up here they hadn't even done anything wrong they just found themselves dependent on the state and so they ended up getting put here as housing wow so and then they started uh so a lot of men if they had friends that worked there and they just, like, didn't want their wife around anymore, they would literally just pay off their friends to find a reason to keep them there.

Oh, my God. So there was a lot of truly mentally unstable people. There were a lot of people charged with petty crimes. There were people who were just homeless and needed a place to be. There were women whose husbands rejected them. And then it also began including children as young as 12. Jesus. So for no reason, just like, oh, we don't have space in the orphanages.

And then kids would end up there. So it was a potluck of everything except straight white men so and then one big pair of underwear for everyone to use exactly and so um let's see so one woman in general because i said earlier that a lot of women were charged with stealing baby clothes um there is one case i just wanted to give an example that in 1864 one woman woman named Ellen Jenkins, she was charged with having no lawful means of support for her children. So literally, she just got charged with not being able to support her family. So she got in prison for three months. And so she got put away for three months with her children.

So even her children got incarcerated for this. And then a few years later, when she was, I guess she was charged with the same thing. And so she got sentenced to another three months. And then they sentenced the girls to like a boarding school. And the boy, her son, was sentenced to four years. So it's like it literally is just like we need to put you somewhere. And for the most part, I don't think it was necessarily orphans when kids were welcomed in, but it was that like, their mothers were put away. And then there was nowhere, no one else could take the kids.

And so they just started incarcerating the children with their mom. So the moms would still be responsible to take care of them. um so many people chose to escape this life through quote the bridge which was a suicide walk on the upper story walkway um i'll talk a little more about the ghosts later but i will say that for if you're ever walking near the bridge a lot of people will still feel their arms and legs being pulled back oh my god or pushed towards as if they're trying to help you or maybe maybe they think by pushing you over the edge they're helping you so i just got mega goose cam so one of the worst statistics arguably is that to be let into this building you only needed two signatures from people to have you committed but you needed eight people no to agree that you were worthy of

being signed out holy so if you didn't know eight people if eight people didn't like you if eight people who didn't like you on the outside could like pay off their friends on the inside you were just stuck oh my god like you could not get out and so the average stay time was 23 years the average time which by the way is 50 54 times more than the acceptable world health organization standard whoa 50 how many 50 54 times so the the standard is 150 days and the average was 23 years whoa holy crap so in 1887 the nearby jail it was called the goldfield jail because this was all after the gold rush there um the jail there merged with the asylum and that's why it became a jail and a hospital so on the same property there were criminals mixing with people with mental health problems mixing with like women who literally just had shitty husbands and so petty criminals and the

quote criminally insane were housed together and what became the j ward and so the j ward was the the jail that they bought out and ended up using on their property it became the j ward which was their maximum security section for the criminally insane okay um so near the j ward were also the family cells where the incarcerated women would live with their children they literally had family cells family cells jesus yeah so the so the women that were either inmates or patients there could still take care of their children um throughout all this there were only three only yikes three executions that took place at the prison but considering there were thousands of people who stayed here over the years only three people were killed intentionally by uh by the staff there and they were buried in unmarked

unconsecrated graves on the property because they were apparently there for murder and so they didn't let them have christian burials wow so um another death there was in 1886 his name was george and he was the governor of the prisoner um and he was at the facility one day and died of a heart attack um before we keep going i do want to mention uh one patient that was there i guess one inmate because he was in the j ward um he lived in the j ward for 64 years he was what because he shot a man over a cigarette so he refused to confess or talk to police he wouldn't speak they just declared him insane they were just like well you're not talking so you must be insane what the frick okay and he was deemed award quote

of the governor at the governor's pleasure so that basically means that if you're deemed award of the governor at the governor's pleasure it means that there is no minimum or maximum sentence to you being put away it's just you get to be released when the governor decides that you were cured oh my god and the governor apparently didn't like him because bill lived there for 64 years until he died at 107 are you freaking kidding with me yeah i'm not 107 yeah wow and he went in when he was, I think, 46 or something like that. So that's 40 something. But like, I mean, your whole life is just over because the governor didn't like you for the most part. So apparently, Bill loved to smoke and he loved wearing suits. And apparently on the property, since they had so many little businesses that were ran by the patients, they

had a suit shop. And so he would go there a lot for his suits um he was a proper gentleman except he was pro he could be provoked into violence if someone was rude so he pretty much was like i'm a good person unless someone's mean and then i will literally kill them so um there was a quote about him saying that if provoked, Mr. Wallace was said to be fully capable of kicking one's head off. Whoa. And at age 100, by the way, this will be me at 100, because this was me at like 18. I've literally done this, which I'm not proud of. But one inmate asked Bill, he was 100 years old, and then an inmate said like, oh, are you going to eat that last piece of bread on your plate?

And before he let Bill answer, he was already reaching old and then an inmate said like oh are you going to eat that last piece of bread on your plate and before he let bill answer he was already reaching for his food and bill stabbed him with a fork and i definitely did that to a few of my friends at waffle house in high school if they came near my waffles a little too close i just kind of got them yeah so i'm gonna i'm gonna definitely be him at 100 because i've already i'm already there yeah that's already that's you've already made it. Congratulations. I'll throw you a birthday party later. Thank you.

I'm not proud of it, but I have to admit it before I say this to the public. And then my friends text me saying, like, you've literally fucking done that to me. So I'm just owning it. How dare you? It's true. I will attest. I will attest. Just don't touch my food.

So the staff actually really fell in love with Bill Wallace. And he was like kind of protective of the officers there, even though he was an inmate. And they even bought him a chess set for his 100th birthday. And when the public caught wind of this, they were like, wait a minute, a 100 year old is living in your jail. And so they did a whole bunch of petitioning to get him released by the governor but when he was allowed to leave he still stayed for four more years he was like i like living here i mean i guess at that point like what are you gonna do like what are you gonna do at 103

and you've been there your whole life probably all the people you knew before probably passed if you're that you know that old at this exactly so uh from the 40s to the 70s the hospital begins using electroshock therapy because that i think came out in 35 or something like that but both of them the electroshock therapy and my least favorite in the world the transorbital lobotomy no both came out only uh maybe like five years beforehand and so since that was the peak of psychiatry they were like well we got to do it um for those of you who don't know so there's a few different types of lobotomies all are terrible all are terrible but the one that people hear the most is transorbital yeah and oh my god it's so bad it's like the freakiest horriblest thing

so i didn't add this to my notes but i do want to bring it up because i had to read it so you have to listen so i was trying to i thought i would do like a whole little bit about like um like the history of lobotomies just because i've never covered that yet but i might cover it later as like its own topic because there was so much on it no i will not be there i will not be there that day thank you so i'm not gonna i just want to talk about one person the person who created the transorbital lobotomy personally so it started in the 30s and a swiss psychiatrist was like oh i figured out this way where if i cut someone's fucking skull open and pour ethanol into it it'll'll like kill some of the fibers. And like, that was the first lobotomy ever.

I think it was called like a lacrodomy. It wasn't a, not LaCroix lobotomy. It was, it was something like that. It wasn't necessarily a lobotomy, but then there was after him, there was another guy who,

you know, upped the ante. And then there was this Italian guy who um who was like oh i have this one called the transorbital lobotomy and this is going to be like the peak of science and so basically it was you keep in mind without consent and with no anesthesia and very low success they thought that the best way to solve a lot of mental illness back then was to take an ice pick and a sledgehammer and hammer the ice pick into your tear duct. And then, in theory, you would, you know, poke around and damage the parts of the frontal lobe that are causing mania or depression or anything like that. So terrible.

Yeah, well, actually, there's a really good episode. I mean, good, quote unquote, episode on Dude That's Fucked Up about lobotomies and I think one in lore. And for some reason, I listened to both of them. But yeah, I mean, and it would like, you know, disengage a lot of that behavior. And so people were like, it works because you're literally damaging people's brains. Right. Like, some people did request that, like, some people did request them willingly, like, they were like, I would like to have google search but the reason it i say non-consent is because the very first ones were tested on so the guy who created the transorbital lobotomy he would travel around the country and demonstrate for people on their own patients without their consent by saying like oh we've got this new idea and it's

going to help you and then without being told what was going to happen he would just but like the whole argument the way he advertised it was it's like a 10 minute procedure and it's free because it was brand new and so they were like oh a 10 minute procedure for no money that's going to help me yeah i want to do it and then before they realized what was going on right held down and but uh apparently at some point he got so cocky with it that he started doing both eyes at the same time and allowing nurses with even less training than him to do the hammering it was really terrible it's like so like i'm sweating so much it's horrible it's horrible so anyway the yeah it's terrible so that became like the hot thing. So then that was going on. Electroshock therapy was going on.

And then they started trying to not do electroshock therapy because they heard that that was a terrible way to induce seizures. And so then they tried to give people this chemical that was going to induce seizure without having to do electroshock therapy. And then they realized that was bad. So they went back to electroshock therapy. It's a whole mess. It's a real nightmare. Anyway, the conditions were terrible, although they were advanced for the time. So from the 70s to the 1990s, the number of staff increased dramatically, but the conditions

were slowly getting worse. And by 1991, there were allegations of sexual abuse, physical abuse, theft, and, quote, unprofessional medical procedures. And when they ended up investigating all this, many of the allegations were found to be true. So by 1997, the last buildings of the hospital were transferred out. All the patients were transferred out, and the hospital was closed by 1998. And it lasted 130 years. And even though there were only three executions um 13,000 people died there so that's about 100 people a year 13,000 100 people a year died there and

they were all i guess i don't exactly know the list of or the way that they all died because only three of them were execution but still 100 100 people a year. That's pretty wild. In 1997 through 2001, they did some renovations on the building, and then afterwards the building became the Melbourne Polytechnic, and it opened as a campus as part of the property. It became part of the college campus, and it was used more for agricultural studies, and it still used 30 acres of the vineyards and the olive orchards and lavender fields specifically for those students. Wow. And now there's a volunteer group called the Friends of Jay Ward, which actually they won an award recently last year for having like a really well-maintained museum of the history.

And they still conduct daily tours of all the places including the gallows the exercise yard and the main cell block um as well as the hospital itself but they mainly focus on jay ward i think you only get to see the hospital from a distance whereas you get to hear about the jay the jay ward and walk through the rooms right um and then last year they also opened a time capsule from 1994 when they were in the midst of closing and they found newspaper clippings some video footage of court hearings a straight jacket from when it was open um yeah so that's the the latest news there so anyway now here are just the ghosts i'm sorry that was so long no i mean it's so fascinating and disturbing

it's i just wanted to do it justice and it's probably argue that this is one of the locations that our australian winners have wanted to hear about for a while so oh sure i wanted to give it some justice well i mean we say this a lot too but like there's ghosts come from somewhere so i think it's the context is important too yes yeah i think so too so anyway so some of the ghosts there's one guy named gary webb and apparently he was a patient there known for um several cases of self-mutilation um he hurt himself at least 70 times and he ended up dying later it was like really really drastic self-mutilation it wasn't kind of like the the normal stuff it was

really him trying to hurt himself as badly as possible and he died by swallowing razor blades um so he was the i would argue the most traumatic death um on the campus um he was also buried on the property so a lot of people say that they when they're near his cell, they will hear him yelling, get out or they'll hear him crying. I mean, it's really fucking sad. So it's not really as scary as it is sad. A lot of the reports I saw were people just saying that they feel like a sad heaviness, which how on earth can you blame that? Like, I mean, sure. That makes total sense.

Also, George, the governor of the jail who had a heart attack apparently people when they're near where he died they will feel a tightness in their chests and they will hear footsteps walking around and like i guess he had these really specific boots and so his footsteps were really distinct and you can hear them walking around the same area where he passed away i said earlier in 1997 to 2001 that they're they were doing renovations uh in the building and a lot of workers complained about poltergeist activity which included uh they were missing a lot of tools they would hear voices they would hear loud bangs and then objects would move and the doors would open and close by themselves and like people just wouldn't miss this with their eyes um there was also which is interesting apparently if you were

a worker there and you worked there for longer than like 10 hours a day whatever energy was there would like leech onto you and so people would report no feeling things following them home and on top of it there was very very very light possession tendencies because uh very mild don't worry as a mild case of possession and so um but a lot of the workers if you were there long enough all of a sudden they started acting out of character and people who worked there but were even friends outside of work they were getting into huge fistfights and screaming at each other for nothing um there were also like when zach bagans starts getting like really hostile and like punching the walls yeah except they were punching each other oh well well uh yeah it's exactly like

that when he's like i don't feel good i don't feel good and then he's like screaming all of a sudden there's something taking a hold of me right and then he looks really intense and aaron's like i want to leave he's like i want to go home and he's like good because i'm sending you into the basement so exactly when he's all of a sudden he's like aaron i just want to choke your entire fucking body right literally i want to murder you and to slit you into pieces and he's, well, this has gone too far. Anyway, love you, ZB. He's like, well, my paycheck better be bigger next week. So during renovations, also people were claiming that they were seeing nurses in white uniforms and they were hearing moaning, footsteps, crying, and whispering.

Apparently there was a regular nurse named Nurse Carrie. Oh, Carrie. Oh my god. Oh, Carrie. Oh, my God. Wait a minute. So Carrie, apparently, she is seen staring at people from down the hallway, which is very Stephen King. No, thank you. Apparently, she's actually a really nice spirit, and people have made contact with her in the past. And so she's answered people's questions, saying that she's still there looking after the patients whose souls never left.

And she said that she hates the men in her area. And I was like, well, Carrie, you're one in a million. Except not. Everyone agrees with you. But so she doesn't seem to like men a lot. I think if women are alone in her space, then she's usually kinder to them. And with men, they feel like they're being stared at or they're they're less safe uh let's see also nurses like i said nurses have been seen and heard and also women's high heels and humming and singing have been heard in the men's ward that's

allegedly where the most dangerous patients stayed and so that is where the darkest energy is and so a lot of people have seen dark shadows they felt themselves getting touched grabbed bitten scratched pushed and they've even felt themselves being suffocated um people have seen black clouds show themselves by the ceiling in pictures so in a picture you'll take a picture and the ceiling looks like a normal ceiling and then apparently black clouds that look like thick ink will show up um people experience dizziness, nausea, and headaches, as well as weird smells, electrical malfunctions. They'll see shadow people walking up and down the halls. People have seen, they've seen patients in gowns, in medical gowns. And they've also, I only saw this on one article, but apparently someone has seen the figure of a woman being beaten over the head in the kitchen

what the fuck uh there was one investigative team that went to the j ward and someone was bitten on their neck when they were looking at the straitjackets and at the i think in that same on that same team one of the investigators was possessed and like straight up possessed like zach bagans possessed oh no where um apparently a bunch of the investigators around her felt like they were being pushed or grabbed beforehand and then all of a sudden she became unresponsive and she did the straight up like eyes rolling in the back of her head shit and god she was and then they like they left the room or they left the space and she kind of came back to her normal self.

But she was not in a good place. And also at one point there was a superintendent that allegedly died by suicide by drinking acid. And so now when people go into that superintendent's office, they'll have a bad taste in their mouth. One guy actually, this is probably my favorite one. This one guy stayed the night and slept in one of the cells with the cell door wide open. The cell door wide open because he was the only one. He was the only one with the keys to that cell in his pocket. And so he was like, I'm going to keep it open.

I don't want to get locked in. Um, he asked for the spirits to like make a noise or do something. And he was like, really like harassing, not harassing them, but he was very clear on what he wanted and nothing happened. So he eventually gave up and went to sleep but when he woke up the next morning his cell door was closed and locked from the outside oh boy and he was the only one with keys in his pocket so he got stuck in there and so he had to call someone to let him out oh my god there's also this is going to be your least favorite thing i ever say um great you already talked about lobotomy so i literally can't imagine how it could get worse Oh my god. There's also, this is going to be your least favorite thing I ever say.

Great. You already talked about lobotomies, so I literally can't imagine how it could get worse. But okay, go ahead. Well, this place is privy to doppelgangers who apparently look like the people you came investigating with. And they will try to lure you into the J ward or or the men's wing which is the most dangerous area they'll try to lure you in by yourself because let's say it's you me and eva on an investigation right let's say you don't know where me or eva are and all of a sudden i come out from like by the by the dangerous area and like you can kind of see me from afar saying you have to come over here eva's hurt and then you don't see eva but you you hear Eva's voice acting like it's hurt.

Oh, God. So apparently that happens a lot where they'll like use two of the people you came with and they'll both try to like persuade you to like go away by yourself. Holy shit. That has got to take like a lot of energy too. For two spirits. Oh, yeah. To create that much of a of a situation like physically

yeah it's also like kind of like like teetering onto the line of mental torture and we know i hate that shit so um but yeah like if all this and then so apparently that's happened to at least one group i read in one article that this happened and when she she felt like something was wrong so she didn't go forward and she didn't like go see what was wrong. And then went to another room and both those people were in the room, like being like, yeah, go.

People have been pushed into walls. People's legs become immobile. So like people have also dealt with like being like, like temporarily paralyzed. There was one medium who met a spirit named marie who was quote shy but told me she died in an experimental procedure she had half her head shaved and was in a gown holy and in this in this situation uh the same medium tried to help marie go to the light i think her name was amanda uh i think her name was amanda right amanda i really shouldn't have

written it down i think her name was amanda though Amanda, I really shouldn't have written it down. I think her name was Amanda, though. She wrote a really good article about how she was trying to help this one spirit go to the light. But this is a quote from that article of her experience trying to help Marie cross over. And this is pretty wild. I could feel a hand firmly on my wrist. Stones and large rocks were flung at me, and some were actually hitting me as I was praying. So I prayed harder and louder, and coins were also thrown at me.

I could hear screaming and loud bangs on the autopsy table, and I went into meditation mode and kept saying the Lord's Prayer, asking my guides to help take Marie back home with her loved ones. All of a sudden, in the middle of the autopsysy room a massive light opened up in the ceiling marie and several other spirits went straight through the light but i felt physically sick after the portal closed and when i got up to leave the autopsy room this black mass stood at the door oh my god i could hear a distinct growl and the black mass was gone after deep prayer so like yikes if you if you type in the aridel asylum asylum medium or marie i'm sure you'll be able to find it but i'm pretty sure her name was amanda um just want to give her some credit even though i like did that so half-assedly um also people especially mediums across the board have said

that they are if they're by the peppercorn tree, they will still smell death next to the tree, even though no one's bodies are rotting there anymore. But they will still smell the haunting smells of it. People have also fainted or been thrown across rooms. People have felt hands pushing on them. They've felt cold breezes in offices. They've heard banging on the isolation cell walls. Apparently photos will

show um faces in them if you ask someone to like be in a picture with you all of a sudden it'll be a face or figure um in the electroshock therapy ward cell doors will move on their own and there's sounds of furniture scraping the floor when there's no furniture. In the children's ward, you'll still hear giggling. People have gotten hundreds of EVPs, but one of the most popular is hearing men saying, hey. Again, there's female singing, female humming, electronics will malfunction. And the last quote I have is from the electrotherapy ward. And it was someone saying, quote, I got a tingling sensation on one half of my head in one of their rooms. And later I found out that was the shock therapy.

So one of the biggest complaints people have when they walk into those rooms before knowing they're there is migraines and like splitting headaches and tingling on their body. A lot of people claim that and then find out later it was the electroshock room. That's chilling. claim that and then find out later it was the electroshock room that's chilling oh i feel like i flew through that because i'm aware like we're already like so like deep in time but anyway that is the aridel mental hospital i just wanted to cover as much as i could but whoa that was a good one thank you i feel like i don't ever really get to do like some like super duper hauntings anymore i feel like i've already found all that material. So when I find a really good one, it's like really exciting.

I know. I love like just the classic like insane asylum or like penitentiaries, all those very classic hauntings. Yeah. Anyway, there it is. I hope I did Australia a little proud. Lovely. I'm sure you did.

And interestingly enough, actually actually and we did it again because my story is from new zealand this week shut up look at us go i know and i mean obviously i'm fully aware they're not the same to everybody from new zealand and australia but you know they're uh i don't think i've covered uh many new zealand stories so this is um you know it's kind of a weird coincidence, I would say. I would love to go to both. I've never been to either, but I would love to go to both. Me neither. Well, Eva was very excited when she heard what I was covering because she spent some time in New Zealand and it was like her favorite place in the world.

And every time I see her photos, I'm like, holy crap, it is beautiful. It's so pretty. Yeah, it is. And Blaze's sister is there actually right now. And when the whole Corona and she's in college studying abroad. And when the whole Corona thing, you know, happened, they weren't sure whether to like bring her back or leave her there. And so she's still down there. And they've like extended student visas, guess to people who were oh wow stuck

there but it's one of the like the safest places so they decided to keep her there for the time being but she loves it too so shout out to new zealand oh yeah i guess i should say what i'm covering i'm covering the bain family murders today oh i don't know what that is but i in a i was gonna say i love a good family murder, but that's not what I meant to say. It just sounds wildly intriguing to me, and I'm excited about it. Yeah, it's definitely like a big case. I actually did not know much about it either, so I was very entrenched in this for a while.

But I'm just going to jump right in. So this takes place in June of 1994 um and there's this family called the bain family and they were gathering that day at their family home which was on uh the address was 65 every street which you know sure that's clever i guess um 65 every street their house was described by like their neighbors and people who knew them as dilapidated from hoarding and collecting. Oh. Let's just say they were in kind of a bad place. The mom and dad, their marriage was falling apart.

The mom was extremely controlling and the dad was very reserved and it grew into this really toxic situation. There was like known to be trash throughout the whole house. Like the kids weren't going to school. Like it was just a very it was leading up to a bad situation. Let's just put it that way. OK. So anyway, Robin is the father. He's 58 years old.

He's a principal at a small school down the coast. And he had actually been living at the school during the work week and then um an rv or like a caravan uh in the backyard amidst like all the trash that was out there wow so it was like it was so bad that they were living not even in their own home well so he was living there um she was living in the house and with the kids and he didn't live at home anymore. He lived like outside. Yeah. I mean, so gotcha. Okay. Still equally very bad situation. But yeah, he was basically living at the school during the week. And then on the weekends, he would live in his own kind of RV or camper or caravan out back in the backyard. So he was

described as the dad as disheveled. He didn't really take care of personal hygiene, that kind of thing. And then Margaret is the mother. So she's 50 and she's a homemaker. She's a devout new ageist, like super heavily influenced by Christianity. And I'll get into that a little bit later. But Margaret and Robin's marriage was like pretty much in tatters. She had planned to, she was planning to move the family into a nice townhouse without him and kind of leave him behind she was like really deep deeply entrenched in this kind of new agey christianity situation um she was constantly exercising evil from people oh my goodness i know and places and even food um i know how dare you call food evil no such thing um she had she believed she had a direct line to god and so she had this like power

over other people she anytime they were going like on a trip she would exercise exorcise to be clear the uh the family van she called the evil spirits belial do you know what that word is oh i'm not gonna say yes because i'll look stupid for the for what i think i just go for it i mean you're probably right i didn't really know but um apparently it's the personification of satan in the hebrew bible okay um it sounds like um it's it sounds like uh beelzebub yeah it sounds like a like a shorter like a different version of that so yeah it does yeah it does i think it's probably i would imagine it's probably similar i think i assumed it when you asked what i thought it was all i was gonna say it's a demon because i wasn't sure which one but it definitely sounds like a demon name yes exactly and so she took it upon herself

to basically call all the evil spirits belial and she so she had these dire entries that were crazy so she believed the food and the house were all contaminated with belial like these demons and she actually in her diary shortened it to bell like she gave the demons a nickname literally because she used the word so fucking often that she gave it its own nickname so you know whatever i'm just thinking of like beauty and the beast now but now it's like a demon and a beast yeah she would she would like call it a cutesy nickname she'd be like bell is everywhere it's like what the oh yeah i'm just imagining like if someone is this good at animation can someone just like take bell out of the opening

part of beauty and the beast and put like a demon in a little french town singing about the day i feel like our uh requests for animation are getting so wild like they just get weirder and weirder each week can someone at least put up a picture of a demon with like the background music of like there she goes that bell oh for god's sake um i accidentally just closed out sorry here it is it's okay we were on beauty and the beast i'll fill you in um so there's a demon lives in france uh- France, is about to find out that she's evenly matched with another beast, if you will. One from hell and one on earth. And then they have fisticuffs is what they do.

Fisticuffs, but there is like a giant candle, right? That runs around and dances a little bit. Only when paired with a clock. Yes, it's a weird magical hybrid. Yes. Got it. Okay, good. And it's all a happy ending right

because it's disney oh that i'm not sure about uh i prefer no i would like i i want it to be a little more gossipy than the rest of them well i've got a spoiler it's not a good ending i will tell you that much so great oh boy i hate myself what why because i was like oh yay and then i was like oh no there's actually a murder that comes up okay never mind oh see i think i thought we were still talking about my story and um and i was like does em really think it's gonna end well like it's not no i just really hope that at some point when it gets too sad you can throw in like the fact that there's a dancing candle and just kind of lighten everyone's spirits um we could try but it hasn't really worked in the past um so i can't promise anything um fair so you know i'm glad we're having

fun now as we like to say because it's not going to get fun right okay the fun's over fun's over everyone stop laughing okay so she also ranked the family by like how much bell or belial they had in them and she believed her oldest son david had the least amount and her husband robin had the most so i know they had four kids the oldest was david and he was 22 um he for work delivered newspapers and he also sang opera with a local opera troupe he and his mom were super close but he and his dad did not get along uh he like his mother was also extremely controlling with his sisters um according to their friends and uh he had actually dropped out of university but he

returned to study music theory and voice so he was like heavily into the musical world then the next oldest was aroa and she was 19 and she was training to be a teacher and she was you know pretty mild-mannered pretty close with her family and then the third child was lanyette and she was 18 and she sounds like sounds like lumiere it does doesn't it though yeah yeah there there's a connection i'm just trying to let there be fun I mean I I I appreciate it thank you um Lanyette I think that's how you say it Bane uh so she's 18 and she was pretty troubled um she had returned to their home but she had like she had defended her dad pretty regularly and that did not go over well with the rest of the family um and so she had moved out and was working as a sex worker and was according to friends using drugs as well so she was um struggling with drugs uh with a drug

addiction or at least like a dependency um and she had so they were meeting for this meeting i don't know if i said that at the beginning but so they were all coming back to the house for the meeting. She was no longer living there, but she was she was back. And then the youngest is Steven. He was 14. And he was also musically talented like his brother. He so they were all there gathering for like a family meeting. And in that evening, Robin, the dad, he went back to his van in the backyard and lignette um the only one who wasn't living at home at the time decided to stay the night and she uh stayed overnight in her old childhood bedroom which was now a study and uh that's kind of the beginning like setting the scene quote unquote and um okay now the the i'm gonna give you kind of like a timeline of what

happened and and this um this timeline is like factual this is like the the hard hard cold facts that we have and then it kind of turns into like speculation and theory got it so june 20th of 1994 at 5 30 a.m david who's the oldest son um his alarm goes off and he has he delivers papers um for a living so he goes out in his paper route and um he did complete his uh paper route because everyone on the route received their papers uh 6 30 a.m robin so the dad's um alarm in his caravan is set to go off at 6 45 a.m a neighbor sees david returning home from his paper route with his yellow bag at 7 a.m 15 minutes later another neighbor wakes up to the sound of a barking dog and then at nine minutes later at 709 david calls 111 which is new zealand's you know

equivalent of 911 and um he calls 911 or 111 in a panic and i will say this so i watched a youtube video on um a channel her name is danelle hallen and i i hadn't heard of her before but she's like i guess very popular on youtube telling true crime stories um and so a lot of that was from here but so she played the actual call um which always kind of disturbs me but he calls the um the emergency line and he's just kind of sputtering and he's he's yelling they're all dead they're all dead and so yeah it's very chilling to hear um and so at some point in the next 10 minutes the ambulance arrives but they don't make entry yet they wait for the police who come at 7 33 and the police start knocking on the door um but they don't hear an answer and like nobody's coming

to the door but they know that david had called from that address so finally they like knock the door in and go inside and they find david in a locked bathroom and he refuses to open the door like they're not sure if it's fear or shock or what but he's behind the door and they ask him to to open up and he says no and they're like okay and so they say so he doesn't open the door until the police ask where's your father so then he opens the door and he points to a room across the hall and then just has like and then just completely breaks down and starts weeping oh jesus that's the the opening opening scene and it just gets worse so i apologize no and also sorry reminder that so the oldest son is the one that was least ranked to have satan inside of him and the dad is most likely correct according to margaret

yes yes yes so um and then which by the way is a great way to rank your family members we should start doing that with each other geo has the most in him um thousand percent and i have the least oh okay well i thought you weren't including yourself or else geo would be second but yes okay sure you know what you're right I shouldn't include myself because I don't have any so I won't even make it into the ranking don't worry I'm just gonna keep myself out of it perfect keep your head low um so so that's right exactly so David um who's in the bathroom he was the one that Margaret had ranked as um the least sure evil I suppose okay so speaking of margaret she was found

first she was found in her bed um and she had been shot in the forehead and she was dead um then they found arwa who is the 19 year old and she had been found in her bedroom also shot in the forehead um and she had actually been found kneeling, and they believed it had been either her praying or begging before her death. So she had been awake, essentially. That's terrifying. Yeah. So then they found Lynette. She was in her former bedroom, and she had been shot twice in the head as well.

And at first, they couldn't find Stephen, who's the 14-year-old, the youngest. in the head as well and at first they couldn't find steven who's the 14 year old the youngest but they realized that a door in uh margaret's room the moms that they thought was a closet was actually a door into like another separate room and that's where steven's room was so they eventually found steven and and he was um laying on the ground there had been a clearly a struggle um he had a he had a wound or a bullet wound through his hand as if he had put his hand up um when somebody shot at him he had a head wound that showed he had fought his attacker he had been partially strangled with the t-shirt he was wearing and then finally he had been shot fatally in the head and so there there was, yeah, it was a very violent, bloody scene in his room.

And then finally they found Robin, so the father. And he was discovered in the lounge or the living room. And he had been shot in the head with David's rifle at his side. And so Robin's body was the warmest and it appeared to have been shot last for that reason. And they believed it had been um he had been killed within the last hour wow so they go back to david and they're like this is what we found and he has this like epic breakdown he begins like violently shaking they they think at first he's having a seizure um and then yeah he yeah and he falls like kind of between the bed

and the wall and so they're like trying to hoist him up. But they notice that while he's shaking, his body is shaking, his eyes are like completely normal, which isn't typical for when you're having a seizure and you're not in control of your body. Sure. So they're like, that's strange. And the ambulance came, said all his levels were normal. And then he kind of went unconscious, seemingly, but his reflexes were those of someone who was conscious. And so they kind of determined he seemed to be faking a seizure and then being unconscious for whatever reason. So they were like, well, we don't know what he's doing, but we don't think this is actually a seizure.

Right, exactly. know what he's doing but we don't think this is like actually something fishy's going on a seizure right exactly so they bring him into the station and they're like we're we're gonna record this because he's acting like really erratically um and we want to make sure everything's kind of recorded so he continues to yell at the station they're all dead which is what he had said on the 911 or the 111 call excuse me um but then he starts going off about black hands and he's like the black hands are coming to get me the black hands took my family what and um they're like we don't know what the fuck he's talking about and anytime they ask for more clarification he's not giving it to them and then finally he just keeps asking for his glasses he needs his glasses to see because he can't see anything so they find the glasses in his room but one of the lenses is missing and they're like that's strange um and so they they collect the glasses and while searching the house they find that the family's computer uh was on it

had been turned on and there are words written on the computer screen and the words say sorry you are the only one who deserved to stay what okay yeah it's sorry this is this is spooky ooky christine isn't it fucking creepy i like started researching like so i so i had done the research but then i was like i'm gonna watch just like this like this danelle girl she does this cute like she's just like very fun to watch and like easy to listen to so i'm like i'm just gonna watch this last night and then i got like 20 minutes and i was like i need to save this for the morning because it's too spooky yeah um so i watch community instead uh so yeah it's very spooky stuff um so they find this like text on the screen also ask like let me

know if you have questions i feel like i'm going like ultra quick and uh no no no i don't want it no don't go don't go quick this is good this is juicy it is juicy yes this is the the hot goss the hot goss if you will from 1994 we're finally catching up um that sounds about right uh so they find the words on the computer and because they think robin the dad had been shot last they um they presumed he had written this um he had they presumed he had killed his family taken his own life and spared the oldest son's david's life and had written that on the computer saying you're the only one who deserves who deserved to stay alive so that's kind of their running theory so now they're like well we need more evidence to kind of back this up before we

move forward so they continue looking through the house and there was blood everywhere um as if the killer had basically made sure to track it and touch everything and you know walk through every room they even found blood in the laundry room um which was odd because you know nobody's body was found there or near there um they found bloody sock prints that measured 280 millimeters uh there were bullets in robin's bed so the dad and they found true crime books in his car uh one of which was actually a book about murdering his fam murdering the character murdering his family so they were like oh no yikes i mean obviously circumstantial but like definitely leads you to believe this is in the right direction definitely a little close to home if it were a coincidence

like one million percent and i hesitate to say that because i'm like if i'm uh accused of a crime true yeah except my history but no you're exactly like you're totally right it was very uh i i do have to say if i am murdered like i i'm sorry christine but you're definitely gonna be a suspect like i'm going to jail don't fucking die or i'm going to jail it's true it's true i feel like we have like millions of people who are just gonna be like yeah yeah here we can quote christine verbatim and i sure would love to like be able to use a ouija board and convince people on your behalf that you're not the killer but at

this point maybe you fucking are who's to say honestly see now they're gonna use that exact audio footage against me in the courtroom so watch it are you ready all right for the courtroom she did it everyone she did it get her get her and then I'm gonna insert the audio Eva so it'll say Eva did it get her sorry I'm throwing you under the bus. It was both of them, judge. You need to handle this at once with haste. With haste, with utmost haste. I feel like people would look at you and go, yeah, nice try, Christine.

We know that was not Eva. Yeah, she just wrote it down. But you definitely told her to write down your whole plot. Which is bad, because she definitely recorded recorded everything she's a great writer oh no you two are gonna be the the end of me i swear okay that's the goal anyway so they found those books and they were like yikes um they also found a bloody glove under steven's bed and steven is um the youngest child uh who fought fought with his attacker so he's the one who had like the bullet wound through his hand and all that so things were a little bit

off though at the same time so first of all the gloves stood out to them to the police because they were like why if you're going to like openly kill your family and then end your own life and write a note on the computer why are you wearing gloves like what are you right why are you like hiding your fingerprints you know it's it's just strange um and then they found out that the glove uh and the gun belonged to david and the glove was actually like his opera glove because remember how he was in opera yeah so they're like well that's weird i he would have had to go get David's glove. And then they looked in David's room, and they found bullets all over the room. They found 1,000 rounds of ammo in his dresser.

I don't even know. That's a lot. That sounds like a lot to me. I don't know much about guns, but 1,000 rounds seems like a lot. It's definitely more than zero, which is what I have. So it sounds like a lot. It's definitely more than negative 100 do you hear that jury i have negative 100 rounds in my dresser for future reference um so they also this is even wilder they found the missing lens from david's glasses and that lens was found in steven's room where that

struggle had taken place so they were like well that is interesting um now before the trial so they were going to go to trial but before the trial david continued to act strange he was staying with his aunt and he kept having these breakdowns about like black hands coming to get his family um he spent a lot of time organizing his family's funerals but then when the day of the funerals came, he refused to go. And a friend who had traveled down to be with him asked why. And he just turned to his friend and said, you know. And according to the friend, that was the moment when he was like, I knew he had done it.

Like I knew he had killed his whole family. Oh, my gosh. Okay. So now it's looking like instead of robin that this is actually david's doing so they uh arrest david and they charge him with five counts of murder and um they go to trial so i guess i'll tell you like what the prosecution's theory was first and uh fun fact btw um so while the united states says like the U.S. we say, you know, the state of California versus whoever. Or the people versus M. Schultz, for example.

The people versus Christine Schieffer, which is what will happen after my death. I was hoping you wouldn't put that on audio record forever. But there it is. Yes, either one. Okay, sorry. So that's what we say here but in new zealand they actually say the crown or the queen okay or simply r which stands for regina which is uh latin for the word queen because elizabeth ii is considered head of state there okay so if i say like the crown that's basically the prosecution um it sounds way cooler too it really

does at this point yeah um so david wakes up at 5 30 so this is what the prosecution or the crown believes happened this is what they present at trial um against david so they say david woke up at 5 30 a.m the day of the murders he takes his 22 rifle out of his closet unlocks the trigger guard attaches the silencer loads the the 10 round magazine gets dressed puts on his opera gloves and an old pair of his mother's glasses um because his were being repaired okay then they say he goes to first lignette's room he shoots her twice in the head while she's asleep then he goes to his mother's room shoots her once in the forehead as she lies in bed then um enters steven's room i mean this is sounding like amityville though isn't it like i was gonna say it literally sounds like

amityville if he's going into each room and just like killing them off one by one while they sleep right while they sleep and so like i guess that kind of goes i know we've talked about amityville but like he had a silencer on and i guess they just didn't hear it, which is just wild to me. But, and the neighbors didn't hear it either, which is crazy. So then he, so he shoots his mother as she lies in bed. Then he enters Stephen's room and he pushes the rifle, is what they believe, against Stephen's forehead while he's asleep. And then Stephen wakes up, is what they believe against steven's forehead while he's asleep and then steven wakes up pushes the rifle away as a shot is fired a struggle ensues which is when steven's head injury happens and the bullet through his hand um and then they believe david began strangling him with his own

t-shirt and then as he's strangling him he finishes him off with one shot to the head jesus okay and so then they say you know during the struggle this is when david's glasses fall off and one of the lenses is knocked from the frames and left on the floor then he grabs his glasses goes back to his own bedroom puts them on a chair and then goes downstairs to his sister arawa's room and she they believe has at this point heard the struggle and was on her knees praying for help or at least begging for. It's really. Yeah. That part's just really tragic.

And so obviously she was killed as well. They think that now that he had taken his glasses off, he had missed his first shot because they found out a stray bullet but then hits her with the second shot in the forehead and she is killed yeah and so then they believe he went upstairs where he hears lignette gurgling um yeah that's yeah and that comes back into play actually as like evidence later so okay unfortunately i had to say it um it's really awful and he they believe he hears this and then shoots her again um and so during all this they believe robin is still asleep in the rv out back which is where he you know spends the night uh and then they believe that david throws his bloody clothing in the washing machine turns it on which is how the blood got into the laundry room uh then he throws on a fresh set of clothing and then he and his dog head out and

complete the paper route or paper route before coming home typing the message on the computer then uh hiding behind the curtains in the living room with the gun waiting for his father to come in because i guess every day his dad would come in at a certain time and pray, which was like his normal routine. Okay. So they think he completed the paper route basically as an alibi, then waited for his dad to come inside, and then shot him twice in the head. Placed the rifle next to Robin and called 111 to say they're all dead. And I found, I just got back from my paper route and found this you know situation in my house so how about that uh how about that candle labra and that clock

dancing around i was like my goodness waiting for you to find the perfect moment yep here it is oh you found it yeah i found it oh light-hearted haha okay next the worst part is you're gonna have to bring that candle back like eight more times oh no okay so he's gonna need an encore uh if you will happily so the so basically they say well what's the motive and they said oh well you know maybe inheritance um maybe uh he wanted the money that his parents had set aside for this new townhouse that they were going to move to but there wasn't anything like super clear as to why uh you know why he would have murdered the whole family that that was just the guess was inheritance so then there's the defense side and

david's defense team argues that robin who was initially believed to have committed this, was actually the one who did commit this. So he's the dad again. And they believe so that what they present to the jury is that due to pressures from like failing at his job and failing at his marriage snapped. And there was actually a witness named Dean Cottle, who was actually known as Lignette's pimp, who came who was a witness and said that Robin, her dad, was actually having an incestuous affair with his daughter, Lignette. And that she had revealed this to him and to a couple of friends. And that he said that that weekend at this family meeting, she was planning on revealing the secret and confronting her father at the meeting about this assault. And the issue is that Caudill, the witness, showed up to the trial really late. And the prosecution said, OK, yeah, you can give testimony even though you're super late.

And when he was on the stand, he couldn't recall the details of his conversation with Lynette. He was all over the place. And so he was deemed an unreliable witness and his evidence was considered hearsay. So it was basically dismissed. Okay. So, yeah. So that was kind of out the window. But so after, so what they believe happened is that David goes out on his paper route. As per usual, Robin enters the house from the backyard kills everyone with david's gun um types the note on the computer and then shoots

himself and um according to david's testimony after his paper run he got home and entered the house without turning on the lights and uh he entered he said that's why he didn't see anything like that's why so here's the discrepancy there was a 25 minute period between when he got home like when he was spotted by the neighbor and when he called the emergency line okay so there was kind of confusion about like well what took him so long to see this and call the police um and he said he you know got home he didn't turn the lights on so he he didn't see anything. He immediately went downstairs to the bathroom to wash his black newsprint covered hands, which just side note becomes a thing, you know.

Yeah. A longstanding thing of like the black hands, they think, because he would come home on his paper route with newspaper covered black ink all over his hands that that was kind of where the the breakdown and like this the yelling about the black hands did it got it okay got it got it got it but so oh i see okay sorry i don't think that was very clear my bad um no no it was i remembered hearing you did not do anything wrong i remember hearing black hands from earlier but i was trying to place where in the story i had heard it yes okay i'm with you right so he kept saying like oh black hands came from my family and did this and so a lot of people believe right because his

own hands that he was like disassociating somehow and um but anyway that's just a side note because his defense team obviously did not say that they said that he went down washed his hands and while he was down there he tossed a load of laundry into the machine turned it on he went upstairs he turned the lights on in his bedroom and that's when he realizes that his gun is gone and there are bullets everywhere and so he panics and finds his mother first then finds lanyette who he said he heard gurgling at this point then he runs downstairs and calls 111 and then uh in great distress and then you know the rest is history so that's the defense's version of events is that he came home innocent as all get out and and caught you know saw the

scene right right um so there are a couple issues with this and that's you know the 25 minutes again he said it was dark and he was doing laundry but why was there blood all over the laundry room that was unclear okay there was literally blood on the laundry detergent and like why would that have and he was he admitted he was in there doing laundry so it's like that's strange um please tell us please explain but there's no reason really robin would have used the laundry room like in the midst of murdering people you would think um he also would have had to pass his father's body on the way to his own room um which you know again he said it was dark but it's still kind of strange that he wouldn't see his dad in the living room on the ground

uh he said he ran to his mom's room first uh and noticed she had been killed but a lot of people had issue with this because apparently the way she was laying in bed you really couldn't tell she was dead unless you got really really close like you couldn't tell like it wasn't a bloody scene it's like he had to have noticed yeah like you would have had to check and like again i mean maybe he did check uh very you know perfectly likely but then um you know next he ran to the lounge and found his uh dad and a lot of people argued that like well if you had found your mother dead wouldn't you like just try to find the nearest bed like nearest person to help you and call the police whatever but that's all you know

that's not any like full evidence um and then they got results from the rifle, and they actually found a bloody set of fingerprints on the rifle that matched David's fingerprints. Oh, interesting. Yeah, that was, like, definitely not good for him. What's that called? Like, what's the, I don't know if there's a, there's got to be a phrase where it's, like, the creme de la creme, the, piece i feel like there's oh yeah like the kicker or like the uh yeah i know what she means there's a phrase i keep pointing i keep wanting to call like the golden eye which like is not true whoa that's like our podcast logo i know you know what i'm saying but i feel like that would be the golden eye you know what i'm saying yes yes like the final nail in the coffin maybe yeah something something like that yeah i

feel like everyone's probably screaming it at us right now um probably so sorry sorry everyone um but you knew what you got yourself into so creme de la creme it is um the big golden eye the big golden eyes what they call it so they found these fingerprints uh that match david's and that kind of sealed the deal sealed his fate i guess um and on may 29th 1995 the jury returned and declared david bain guilty on all five murder charges of his family and the judge sentenced him to he was family. And the judge sentenced him to, he was 23 years old. The judge sentenced him to life imprisonment, life imprisonment with a 16 year non-parole period. Wow.

And at this point, he like pretty much immediately started appealing the verdict over and over and over again. And it kept getting denied. And that is until this story takes a really strange turn. And David meets this guy named Joe Karam. Joe Karam. Okay. Now, Joe Karam is a very famous former professional rugby player.

Oh. Who had retired at age 22 and become a multimillionaire businessman. Okay. NBD. And what's that? NBDbd oh i thought you said that's me i was like yeah i'm totally thank you for uh thank you for patting my head on that one but no i did not say that yeah patting your head like so hesitantly and like not sounding legitimate at all i'm very sorry whatever you say buddy pro athlete extraordinaire um so this guy is like this super rich famous dude and i guess he had been like really closely

watching the proceedings and he did not agree at all that david was guilty and so he actually reached out to david and david's defense team was like, I want to donate to your defense fund because I don't believe you're guilty. Oh, wow. So, yeah. So it's pretty weird turn of events. So the defense provided Joe Crum like the entire case book of evidence. And then over this period of time, Joe Crum visited him about 200 times in jail. I know.

So he was like 130 percent to this like yeah they were like at this point they were just homies they were just like okay well yeah like we know each other too well completely like they were bffs at this point and he was like fully in um he decided he was going to fully fund david's appeals rather than just donate to the fund he was gonna like fully pay for david's entire defense um yeah so this changed the game for david big time um joe crumb began writing books about the case he wrote four in total i feel like if you and i if one of us ended up in jail we'd be like well i love you and i'll defend you but i'm definitely not writing a book about it like i'm sorry oh for sure i'd be like there's many like I'll donate there's many things I'll do for you but

there's also many I won't like there's like way more things that I won't sorry if if you like were put in jail and I was like the only way to get you out is to take a big old hike I would be like well Christine I hope you get I hope you're okay in there i hope the food is okay because you're never leaving yeah i feel like there's definitely the book right i mean at this point i was reading this like jesus i mean there are four full fledged fully fledged books just on how he's innocent like this guy is hardcore into this and like spending all of his money and he's like a multi-millionaire he's spending all of his money on this defense like it means everything to him at this point it's kind of it's kind of weird to me though because i mean i just feel like someone

must have pulled him aside at some point to be like you are wasting your money you are the only person who disagrees with the judge well there was actually a lot of well i mean we'll get to this but yeah it was definitely okay once he started like writing the books and like talking about this publicly a lot of people publicly were like huh yeah you're right like you're adding and i'll say the details later but like there was a lot he was kind of bringing into the light that made people question the initial decision. And I guess, yeah, no, but you're right. Like, the commitment to it is so wild for someone he never knew.

Well, at least the initial commitment of, like, I'm going to spend X amount of money or donate X amount of money, you know, for you, even though everyone says that you're wrong. Yeah. Like, he really built up his own support system. No, you're you're wrong. Yeah. He really built up his own his own support system. No, you're totally right. Like he was very much from the beginning gung ho. Like, no, he did not do this. And yeah, no, exactly. And I get I'm sure there probably were people who were like, this doesn't make sense.

But I mean, you know, if he's like, this is my money and I want to spend it on this. I guess there's only so far you can convince somebody. So and I imagine once you're in at a certain point, it's hard to be like, actually, no, I'm done spending money on that. You know what I mean? Yeah. Can you imagine that? Like, what if what if halfway through he was like, oh, wait a minute.

And then he looked like a total fool. Yeah. Because it's like, oh, well, you know, you're running out of money or you need to like start selling things. I mean, I can't imagine at what point would you be like, i've gone too far you know so yeah so it's pretty wild he writes these four books um and for a while they're not getting a retrial but then he puts together with the defense team nine points um to bring to the council in an attempt to exonerate him and get a retrial and like you know reassess this case so i'm just gonna like list some of these points that they brought up to publicly and to the court

so the first one was robin's mental state and uh so robin was presented in the first trial as being like this father who you know he just was trying his best and living out back and and david came and like murdered him in cold blood his own father yada yada um but so karam and the defense team brought up that like apparently a lot of robin's colleagues came forward saying like robin was not mentally stable he was um allowing publication like his students were publishing or writing these like really sadistic stories and like sexually violent. And like people, yeah, there were like writings they found about like his students were writing, killing family members, just like this weirdly dark, sadistic content in his paperwork and that kind of thing. And so they were like, this was never brought to light or like presented um another thing was that there was no clear motive on either side so like four

more people had come forward at this point saying that lignette had told them she had been sexually assaulted by her father so now they suddenly had like actual multiple witnesses who said like no that was true i know the first guy um her pimp who was uh question on the stand was deemed unreliable but now there were multiple people saying like no she told me that too like that was true okay um and then as for the bloody sock prints so they were 280 millimeters and they had measured robin's and rob Robbins feet were 270 millimeters. So 10 millimeters off. But no one in the first trial had measured David's. So this time they did.

And his were 300 millimeters. So like much farther off from the prince than Robbins were. Right. And this is actually where so this video is watching on YouTube. This Danelle Howland. So she actually inserted this later when she was editing. She's like, I actually looked at some crime scene photos. And in the photos, Robin is wearing shoes in the picture.

So that's strange because he would have had to leave the sock prints. He would have had to take his shoes off when he came in from the RV. Right. And then leave the sock prints, then put shoes back on um and then kill himself but also there was no blood on his outfit at all um he was wearing a watch too and some accessories that also had no blood on them but then uh i actually scrolled down and read the comments and someone actually mentioned like their dad had attempted to take his own life and he put on a really expensive suit and shoes and dress really well.

And later on when I mean, he survived, thankfully, and the the the child of this person asked, why did you do that? And he said, I wanted to look nice when I died. So, you know, they were saying maybe that's what happened. Maybe he killed his family and then changed because he wanted, you know, to present himself a certain way. So it's possible. But it is still strange that the sock prints were there and like he was not wearing, you know, he was in shoes. It's just weird.

So let's see. Okay. Okay, so the next point is the computer and they use the time on the computer initially to build an entire time frame of when of when David got home and killed everyone. But it turns out the computer actually wasn't even set on the correct time. So like that was just a moot point. Yeah. And then there's the glasses. So apparently they had found, you know how they found the lens of David's glasses on the floor of Stephen's room and they were like, it probably got there when they were

fighting. Yeah. So apparently the lens was actually found like really tucked away under an ice skate and had dust on it. So it was like it had been sitting there for a long time. So when he was saying like, I need my glasses, I need my glasses, he clearly didn't need them that bad. Well, no. So it actually turns out that the glasses were actually his mom yeah

because he was borrowing hers because his were broken and so they're saying like maybe they were broken and they didn't know where the lens was and it was in his brother steven's room like the whole time it wasn't like it had been knocked out while they were fighting if that makes sense sorry i was stuck on a previous point but yes i hear you sorry it's all very convoluted but basically it turns out he was actually wearing his mother's glasses anyway um and the lens that they found had had dust on it so they were like it probably didn't get there during the fight like it had been sitting there for a while so they believe the jury had been pretty

much misled about these glasses they weren't as big of a case or a point as they thought and then there's the golden eye the bloody fingerprints on the rifle that's what i'm saying the golden eye so david um had said the those fingerprints sure there's blood my bloody fingerprints is my gun but i hunt regularly like that could have been blood from an animal um but the smoking gun the smoking oh my god it's literally about a gun that's what you said gun and i was like all the pieces are coming together shit okay anyway the smoking gun is a gun it's a bloody gun um and so he was like well it could be animal blood like i hunt regularly and uh it turns out that the jury had been led to believe the blood was human blood with david's fingerprints but it had never been tested so they tested it and it turns out that

the blood of his on his fingerprints were actually not human blood so oh wow okay yeah so they were actually like from an animal presumably from hunting so then finally there's the point of lanyette gurgling and how he said he had heard the gurgling well the prosecution originally argued like david would only have heard that if he had killed her because between because someone would have had to hear the gurgling and then shoot her one more time to kill her but um this is a really good point that danelle made in her video i hope i'm saying her name right um that in post-mortem like your body does some weird shit i mean we've gotten listener stories from people who work in mortuaries funeral homes you know like there's gas escaping your body after you die your eyes can open your muscles

can twitch it could be anything exactly so like it's entirely possible that he heard like a gurgling sound and it was after she had been already dead so um then finally the kicker was that uh they hired a a pathologist who named dr gwynn who said the evidence showed that Robin did in fact die by suicide. And so that was kind of their presentation as like, Robin did this, not David. You need to give him another chance. So because all of this is so wild and public and such a huge thing in the media, the public perception shifted completely, pretty strongly at least into david's favor so suddenly people were like shit i see okay right so like they're like maybe he didn't do it and maybe it's the wrong guy so they basically this spurred an entire new investigation and

in 2007 the council concluded that a substantial miscarriage of justice has actually occurred so they decided to do a full retrial full investigation and at this point they recommended that david remain in custody while he awaited his retrial like he'd been in jail for 13 years at this point they were like let's keep him there just in case but five days later they decide uh the high court at christ church decided he was not a flight risk and they basically sent him out to to basically live with Joe Karam until the retrial. Wow. OK, great. I mean, that's, I guess, his only pal now.

You know, they're like BFF. So he basically gets out and like lives with Joe until the retrial. So the retrial began March 6, 2009. It lasted about three months um the defense also showed some additional things which is that robin apparently had injuries on his hands which they said was probably from fighting with steven in the altercation um they apparently hadn't run tests properly like robin's hands were not covered when he was transported to the morgue and um they did a gunshot residue test five hours later even though after four and a half hours usually all the residue is gone so it's just like mishandling by police they thought um and then overall the prosecution called

130 witnesses and the defense called 54 so this was like an insane uh you know reassessment of the whole case yeah holy crap and then on june 5th 2009 after a single day of deliberation the jury well first they came out and asked the judge to give some more clarity as to what counts as reasonable doubt and the judge was like okay i'll give you some more clarity and then when they got an answer it only took a little bit longer for them to come back out and find david not guilty on all five charges so they completely overturned wow 180 180 on the complete like of murdering his entire family just like complete 180 um and so at this point he had spent 13 years in prison so he and joe karam had this like press conference outside the courthouse. It was like super emotional.

They were like, we finally did it. Justice has been served. And he had a lot of supporters, but there were also so many people who were just pissed and devastated. And like, you let a murderer free. We still think he's guilty. Sure. And now he's like roaming the streets.

And actually, like some of this kind of goes into that. So two jurors actually were seen, like, shaking hands with him and congratulating him. And then they went to an after party that Joe Karam was throwing to celebrate. What? Okay. And they were like, these are jurors. Like, they're supposed to be impartial. And now they're, like, out partying with Joe Karam and David.

Yeah. A nice, that's a healthy dose of bias right there I would say right yeah so that got a lot of criticism and then some people said well no they just were invited so they showed up but then left and then apparently some jurors were said to have been passing notes and giggling during the trial which obviously also is not no yeah no so and then something that like i didn't know where to fit in because it wasn't actually included in the trial but i thought it was like really important because it added a lot to the public anger um when david was released is that apparently david this is

from an acquaintance of david's that he had this rape fantasy that he had told his friend about oh and um yeah he said prior to the murders in 94 david had basically told his friend how easy it would be to rape a young woman who lived on his paper route oh my gosh and he had told his friend like yeah it would be so easy i would just use my paper out as an alibi like use my delivery route as a cover um and this wasn't heard at trial but like it just became part of the narrative of like well that's really fucking creepy and awful awful and like what you know and some people are like well he's making it up and people are like why like why would this friend make this up why would you do that yeah it's just really uh a bizarre like cog in this whole thing that i wasn't sure

where to fit um but then basically this is kind of just wrapping it up so uh David filed a compensation claim for wrongful imprisonment in 2010 but apparently to receive compensation for wrongful imprisonment it's not enough to just be to have reasonable doubt it's not enough for a jury to say like oh we're not sure like basically you have to prove that you are innocent like not, not that you're not guilty, but that you're like, no. Yeah, you've got to be able to, like, convince someone otherwise, not just like a meh. Exactly. Exactly.

And so basically, he had to prove this. So they brought a retired judge from Canada in to investigate this, and he determined that David was innocent and deserved compensation. They brought it back to New Zealand Zealand and the previous judge had retired. The new judge was like, no, I don't agree. So anyway, in 2015, the Crown finally agreed to make an ex gratia payment, which basically means like a payment without admitting guilt or admitting culpability. So they're like, we didn't wrongfully imprison you, but we will give you it's like a settlement.

Basically, they're like, we'll give you this money if you, like, don't fight us on this anymore. Gotcha. And that was, they gave him $925,000. Damn, okay. So, big chunk of change. Well, I guess that's also a New Zealand currency, I believe, so I'm not actually sure of the, the, you know. Got it, got it, got it, got it.

Difference. That's a good point but I think it's still a still a lot of money I think um yeah so anyway this is kind of like the final chapter on this so David Bain ended up remarrying he took his wife's surname which I guess makes sense you know changing his last name he currently works for an engineering firm kind of like lives a chill life um so joe our friend joe kimura uh he spent pretty much all of his fortune or at least most of it on david and his legal fund and since that since that um that trial that retrial he's been fending off or suing people ever since so he's just like all of his money has basically gone toward this. Wow. And they've done separate public opinion polls in New Zealand.

Most people apparently believe David is innocent, but a lot of people are strongly adamant that he's still guilty. Even the chief coroner of New Zealand like question the findings and he's like the death certificates were off and like I want to look into this. certificates were off and like i want to look into this but the court basically said it doesn't matter because if you find that like oh no like there's literally a picture of him stabbing his or shooting his mom like there's nothing you can do because he's already been exonerated right right so like we're not going to spend the money and time on this like it's just not worth it no matter what it's over exactly so, the entire case cost taxpayers $7 million. The retrial alone was $4 million. And so this basically became the most expensive trial in the history of the country of New Zealand. And this is a little bit chilling, just like a creepy fact. In 2017, David received

his rifle back, among other belongings because no they'd like no longer you know held any evidentiary valley value sure and then um final fun fact for you is that t-shirts with so margaret the mom had knitted these sweaters and david actually wore them at his trial and so now they sell t-shirts with like those kind of like 90s designs yeah i googled it they're like these very like 90s like shapes and stuff you know oh wow okay so you can buy like shirts that he wore during the trial that his mother had made so anyway that is the story of the bane family murders wow oh wait and then there was this giant candle that started dancing around. It was really great.

That's my favorite part. That's got to be. And obviously the teapots, you know, in a little rocket line. Exactly. I do appreciate you trying to throw in a fun fact about merchandise after the fact to really like uh make make my heart feel a little lighter that was a really wild fucking story it was just a lot like i was watching that youtube video it was over an hour and i was like how could this take over an hour and now i'm looking at our time and i'm like jesus that like almost took me an hour well i mean like you like you told me

the first wild part of the entire death and then you were like and then things take a turn and i was like what what kind of plot twist is gonna happen here they turn and like launch into outer space and we never return because it's just so bonkers yeah i mean imagine like potentially murdering your entire family and then like mia ham like wants to help you and then you you go live with her. And also she has no money anymore because she was defending you for her several years or months or whatever. And now people are like buying your mom's, your deceased mom's T-shirts or selling them

as merchandise. Yeah. Like it's just so absurd. And you're right. It would be like Mia Ham or something. Truly. I'd be like Mia Hamm is writing me like what is going on? Yes like can you imagine that first because he's probably like

I'm screwed I'm in here for life and then they're like you just got a call from this super famous rugby player and he's like that must be a prank like you'd think that would be a prank why I don't know it's just so wild anyway. No that's super bizarre. So that's that I'm sure people in New Zealand probably have their own very strong opinions on it and I obviously don't know. It's just so wild. No, that's super bizarre. So that's that. I'm sure people in New Zealand probably have their own very strong opinions on it. And I obviously don't know as much as, you know, a lot of people do. They probably do. Yeah. So that's that. Thank you, everyone, for listening to our wild tales.

Yeah. Holy moly. Well, hopefully everyone's having a better week than David Bain did did um a few for a few weeks in a row there um yeah and uh hopefully everyone is safe that you know and no one's going through anything like either of the stories we shared and good luck we'll talk to you next week we'll talk to you next week or we'll see you thursday if you join us for our happy hour or marvel mondays and you know all that fun stuff um and we love you very much or maybe tune into like tune into like a judge judy episode where you find out if christine killed me or not i mean who knows also like just like maybe we'll see you on beauty

and the beast oh yeah the new live action uh one where i play the big candle. Yeah. Yeah. I play the clock. Love story for the ages. All right. And? That's. Why. We. Drink.