And That's Why We Drink - E216 The Opposite of a Meet Cute and a Half Sister in Space

Episode Date: March 28, 2021

Blessings from the satanic praying mantis! It's episode 216 and Em is taking us to space for the wild and disconcerting story of the abductions of Laura Clarke. Then Christine takes us to Cleveland to cover an extremely disturbing case, the case of the Cleveland Strangler Anthony Sowell. We also discuss the recent rise in hate crimes against the AAPI community and the devastating, targeted shootings at spas in Atlanta. We'd like to provide the following resources to help combat hate crimes and support the AAPI community: CommUNITY Action Fund by Hate is a VirusSupport Georgia's Asian American Community by Asian Americans Advancing JusticeVisit stopaapihate.com to report an anti-AAPI hate crimePlease consider supporting the companies that support us! Go to HELLOTUSHY.com/DRINK for 10% off plus free shipping!Right now, you can go to HuntAKiller.com/DRINK and use DRINK, for 20% off your first box! Go to FelixGrayGlasses.com/DRINK for free shipping, free returns and a 30-day money back guarantee! Download Best Fiends FREE today on the Apple App Store or Google Play!Go to Canva.me/ATWWD to get your FREE 45-day extended trial!Go to Brooklinen.com and use promo code ATWWD to get $25 off, with a minimum purchase of $100!

let me uh clean the lenses do a little zhuzh they're so dirty can you tell no well mine are always filthy so i feel like i can't really judge yours i really do need new lens i mean these glasses i like them and i feel like people I mean, these glasses, I like them. And I feel like people know me for these glasses at this point. But we got to change it up a little bit. My fingerprints are like stained into it, basically. Are they like bent at all? Mine always end up being like slightly crooked.

Yeah. Oh, I thought, actually, I think my ears are crooked. Mine are off too. I think that's like a very normal thing because mine are off as well I always look just disheveled like like I'm a mess like it always looks like someone hit you in the face like not you I just mean like when you're good you're right you're right every and but my I think it's my face's fault not my glasses fault because every time I put glasses on I'm like why are my glasses yeah mine do the same where one eyebrow is lower if i think it's at yours also i have off i don't have a lazy eye but i have a lazy eyelid and so like oh it's we call

it the schultz side because everyone on my dad's side has this problem oh that happens with my left eye like remember when i wake up and i can't open this eye that's me with this eye i literally can't open this eye for like 10 minutes and for the rest rest of the day, I mean, just naturally, if you ever see me smile, this eye is always more closed. Yes, mine too. So weird. We've talked about this because we call it the Kaiser eye. So clearly it's a commonality between our families.

I like that eye as in Kaiser. That's more fun. Oh, Kaiser eye. Yeah. I never thought about that. The Kaiser-izer, you know. Yeah. Sometimes when you do those like flip photos, like on TikTok or whatever.

I'm like, why is one of my eyes like giant? Because I don't, I'm not used to it. And it's like, oh my God, I look like a freak. Oh, I feel the same way. I refuse, anytime I have to reverse a picture, I'm like, I'm going to fucking hate how this goes. It's the worst. It's awful. I'm like, I'm the ugliest person that ever lived.

I think the same way. Anyway, welcome to That's Why We Drink. Just a pair of two ugly people with weird fucking eyes. Oh, no. You know the truth. We're actually really ugly. Everyone's like, yeah, we know. OK, we follow you on Instagram.

That's why you have a voice for radio. That's what they say. I always thought that was a compliment until I learned English better and went, oh, that's not very nice. Welcome to And That's why we drink we are really attractive radio hosts here to entertain you with some stories yep of the macabre oh christine you are doing something different with your voice lately and i am not i'm not against it it's probably that i don't sleep much and then I drink too much coffee. But you know, if it's working, it's working. I'll stick with it. Yeah, keep not

sleeping. We'll just see what happens. Okay. It's not gonna be hard. Thank you. How are you, Christine? Oh, I'm good. I'm lovely. I'm wearing my vintage thing that I bought at a thrift store with Eva in Austin, Texas is a dinosaur t-shirt. Oh, nice. Makes me really happy. I just rediscovered it. How are you? Good. I'm wearing a shirt about blizzards. So we are wearing... From 1993, right? From 93. I survived the blizzard of 93. Were you alive yet? Yes, I was born in 92.

I don't know. You're always talking about how youthful you are. It didn't take much to survive it because i was a baby so yeah well it took everything to survive it because you couldn't take care of yourself and you had to depend on everyone else but that's true very impressive either way uh why do you drink this week christine well um i drink because i'm so thankful that everybody else understands my face washing struggles i saw that i'm glad that they feel it too i knew it would i knew i was like i feel like other people have to have this problem everybody like estheticians so many people reach out and they're like oh my god this is like the worst part of skincare is washing your face and then emothy sent me like a video of them washing

their face to be like here this is how you wash your face and it was very like you looked very annoyed and i was like i didn't tell you to make this video i had just woken up as i was in the middle of wiping off my sleep skin so yeah i'm literally looked at the camera and you went here and like put it down and wash your face i was like what am i getting in the what is this why are you sending me this so angrily and also by the way it wasn't this is how you wash your face this is how i wash my face because i don't know i know i'm sure i'm basically like this is how one does it properly but like literally and put dial soap all over their face like hand soap and i was like this i know is incorrect and guess what i said what did i say in

the video i said i know this isn't right but it's all i've got right now so just i just want to clarify because a lot of people were like i can't believe you guys put hands i was like i don't put hand soap on my face just to clarify that's m's doing um it's all i have facial facial cleanser i just don't properly use it but and then you grabbed a hand towel put that on your face i was like i feel like all of this is just a hand to dry your face are you not supposed to blot your face with a nice dry towel but everyone puts their hands on that don't you have like a washcloth that was a that was a clean one from the laundry i should have given you context i was like that looks like you just took it off the public apartment bathroom and put it all over your face oh my god i had but it had also just been hung up

like it had just been hung up so i didn't okay that made me feel a little better then but um yeah i've i've uh a lot of people say they do the sweatband method they actually sell uh scrunchies that like terrycloth scrunchies to absorb water but also i will say like thank you for sending me that but i will say i understand the difference here which is that i feel like you'd kind of like blot water on your face but like i feel like i need to like like wash i'm more about this i'm more about the... I'm more about the... I don't know. Well, I also thought that my face is really close to the sink the whole time, so maybe that's what's keeping the water from getting everywhere else.

Like, I really, like, kind of throw my face pretty close to the faucet. And I feel like maybe there's, like, a pool for you because maybe you're, like, higher up and, like, just whacking yourself with water. I think I just use more water. Maybe. I don't know used more water. Maybe. I don't know. I have no idea. Isn't there still a film of soap on your face after you do that?

No. It was pretty cleaned off. I really am like so gross about texture. So if anything felt soapy or slippery or anything, I would have washed it off. Okay. Well, anyway, thank you for clarifying. And thank you everyone for coming to my rescue. I'm glad it's not just me. The monsoon thing a lot of people have resonated with a lot of people well

since you've mentioned it i have been i've been getting like tiktok algorithm videos have you yeah there's tiktoks uh yeah there's tiktoks about well i mean i always got those because i was like clearly this is a problem i've dealt with my whole life i hadn't gotten it until we had that discussion and all of a sudden all of these videos on my TikTok were people talking about how they put scrunchies on to wash their face. And when you mentioned it, I had never heard of anyone doing that before. Yeah, I'm telling you, it's I opened the floodgates lit quite literally, not even just metaphorically. So anyway, I'm very thankful. Now, can I Okay, I don't know how the smoothest way to transition into

this but emma and i wanted to take a brief moment or do you want to say why you drink first before i get into the heavy stuff uh no let's just say this is also why i drank this okay this is primarily yeah this is like the real reason i think pretty much everyone who listens is drinking but we did want to take a moment to address what's been going on the shooting in atlanta and you know a couple people were wondering like why didn't you say anything and i did want to take a moment to address what's been going on the shooting in Atlanta. And, you know, a couple of people were wondering, like, why didn't you say anything? And I just want to point out, like, I was traveling. We didn't record last week. So there was kind of a gap where we were off the air for the first time in a long time.

And so I want to point out that was not an intentional, like, ignoring the situation. We just didn't record. Our episode was like, you know, from two years ago. We just didn't record our episode was like, you know, from two years ago. But we did want to say something. I know it's a little late now, but it's going to be hopefully relevant after this stops, quote unquote, trending. But so, you know, we're podcasters, we have a platform. I think I as a true crime podcaster can't just brush something like this aside, even if we do consider ourselves like entertainers. And so, you know, obviously, we want to we want to talk about it. I mean, I typically do try to

make a concerted effort to bring in more stories that are diversified, because a lot of times, stories about crimes against people of color, like showcase the inequality, the way police and media and podcasts handle, you know, crimes against white folks versus people of color. And now this is just becoming more and more to the forefront. So I'm going to personally at least commit to continuing to do that and making it, you know, more of part of our weekly broadcast that that's brought up even once this falls off the media, whatever you call it, the media. Once it's not topical.

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And I know that's easier said than done, but I want you guys to keep me accountable for that. You don't have to keep me accountable. I have to keep myself accountable. But feel free to obviously call me out if that's something that kind of ever trails off or I forget about.

I do want to also add some links in the show notes of places that I've found particularly helpful to kind of learn more, to get involved. There are quite a few funds set up to help support victims' families. There are fund efforts to combat hate crimes and increase protection and security for AAPI communities. And like normally this is not something I would want to discuss, but there have been people reaching out asking like what specifically have I done to help? And I want to like assure you this is very close to my heart and I take all this very personally and seriously. I've personally donated to the Asian Americans Advancing Justice Fund in Atlanta, which is doing a great job, a great thing for the local community, as well as the Community Action Fund set up by hate is a virus and like obviously donating is just one little drop in the bucket compared to the whole bigger picture in general which again

is why i'm hoping to keep the conversation going long into the show and finally one site that i personally really am excited about that exists and i didn't know existed and that i've bookmarked and i recommend you bookmark is called stop AAPI hate.com. And that's where you can like personally report any hate incidents you see or come across. There's obviously, as probably most of us know, there's been a spike in anti-AAPI hate incidents, xenophobia, et cetera, during COVID-19. And so if you are able to, you know, if you do witness something, I urge you to report it there.

If you can monetarily contribute, great. Otherwise, you know, there are other ways you can commit your energy and time and, you know, learn more. And we'll put all that info in the show notes. Damn, I could have not said any of that better than we. Okay. I wasn't breathing. Wow.

No, that was amazing. I was so nervous. I was like, I want to make sure I cover everything. I want to make sure, cover everything i want to make sure you know i'm as upfront and open and we we talked before the episode of like yeah we should definitely you know discuss this before the before we get into our stories and christine was like oh i already have something totally prepared so i was like shit okay great that's perfect well i felt part of me you know sometimes i try to wing it or we not this but you know we try to

wing like discussions and then every time without fail afterwards we're like oh shit we should have said blank or we should have brought up blank and it's just without fail where we get derailed and forget something so I want to make sure I covered all the no it's a huge important situation I mean well done I just wasn't expecting it to be that perfectly. It's like, it's like a third of my entire notes today are just on that. Okay, well, it's important. So I mean, well, it is it's, it's deeply important, obviously, true crime related. And true crime, you know, is one of those kind of controversial things, because it's not just because it's, you know, it's entertainment.

It's like, we get paid to do this and talk about kind of fucked up stories. And so there, even though it's like, oh, well, it's just entertainment. It's like we get paid to do this and talk about kind of fucked up stories. And so they're even though it's like, oh, well, it's just entertainment. Like, I don't see it that way. I feel like if you are broadcasting to a large number of people, and you have a platform, especially telling real life stories about people's lives and people's families and victims, then you have, you're basically a journalist in a way you're telling. I mean, that's what I learned in journalism school is like, if you are sharing on a platform, real information, that is basically all you need to be labeled a journalist. So I think I take it very seriously, making sure you know, we're very transparent and upfront. And I felt really like kind of stuck because for the last week, I've gotten a lot of tags and

messages being like, why aren't you saying anything? And I was like, you know, there's only so much you can post on Instagram without like, looking like you're performing for something. Yeah, exactly. And like, I don't personally, I don't want to just keep posting on Instagram. It doesn't feel like how I'm, it doesn't feel like I'm contributing as much. like how I'm yeah it's different like I'm contributing as much well it's also it's weird because to post something on Instagram feels performative but it also lets people know that you're aware of the situation and taking care of it but then the things you're doing behind the scenes to actually be of help no one's noticing and for some reason right and it's you know I don't want to get on and be like you have no idea what I'm doing behind you know it's not a defensive thing sometimes an Instagram pic post like means more to people just because they at least know that you're aware. They can see. Yes, precisely. It is a weird dance that we do. But no,

it's an important topic. We are contributing and taking it very seriously. And you're right that we are essentially whether or not we totally meant to be journalists and that we're reporting on something. We're reporting on something we're reporting on really dark stuff where there are victims like we hold people's like stories and lives in our hands basically yeah oh yeah and there's there's people out there you know families who have to deal with us talking about this kind of stuff so hopefully we are seen as being taken as taking it seriously if we ever ever crack jokes, hopefully no one thinks it's at the expense of an actual person, you know? Yes, yes. Like on any day under any circumstances,

that's really as far as the thing from what we want to do. And you know, as much as like I said, I don't normally go around saying, Oh, this is what I'm doing to but I just want to I basically just want to assure you anybody who's wondering that like, do we are we care we we care a lot um and it's something i've been you know just with my friends and family who were affected by this have been just very heartbroken and um it's been a tough couple weeks in the world for everybody but obviously for and also this is a time maybe to i know at the same time we're saying don't worry we are aware of what's going on and we do care and we it feels like not only does it feel right to say something but it would feel very wrong to not say something yes but this is also a time to at the same time thank people for wanting to hold us accountable

just in case because you didn't you you don't know what we're up to i mean for all you know that yes we're just kind of dancing around with a podcast and not taking anything seriously so yeah so thank you for reaching out and asking what we're doing or yes i i know a lot of times anytime i do post something a lot of times anytime yikes uh but whenever i do post something on instagram even though that's not exactly the way I would, that's not where like my action ends, but I do appreciate that people reach out and say, thank you for posting this. It is encouraging to know that I'm doing the right thing or I'm making people feel seen. So on the same coin, thank you for letting us know, but also you got nothing to worry about. We are on it. Yes. And, um, feel free, you know, if there is something

we're missing, obviously we are two white people. and if they're obviously we don't have that these kind of experiences so if there's something where you're like hey maybe they should know about this that or the other or they should approach this differently like please let us know um i'm here to learn and we love educate myself we love uh helpful criticism like honest educational criticism so we want to be the best we can so yes and this podcast has definitely taught us a lot over the years just in general like i feel like i'm a completely different person the way i approach hands down these topics and i really like think about terminology think about our place in the world and our privilege yeah

completely um so i just i'm always really thankful that like we have this platform it comes with a lot of like pressure and responsibility but also i'm like really thankful that we're in this position and and that you that you and i are both like on the same page you know i feel like it's i don't know i'm just thankful that uh i don't know no i just love you that's all what a twist i love you so thankful that like you and i are like totally on a team with this kind of thing and we're well i think this is not to like i mean i guess that it feels kind of weird that we're turning it into us but i this is another opportunity to say like i've listened back to our older episodes and i definitely see a change in us. Yes. Hopefully we're also changing perspectives for other people.

Yes. Yes. That's a good point too. On many different platforms as we've, as we've maybe learned, some people might've learned alongside us as we learned. Right. Which is kind of a fun, I mean, I learned, you know, for example, Em went to clown college as you learned it with me.

So I hope to think there are other bigger issues in the world that we've all learned together. Like, like our privilege and our place in the world and how we can help others. Like the important stuff, right? It's a wide gamut of the things we have all learned together. Like one end is sassy and the other end is like major world epidemics. But anyway, we hope everybody that has been affected by this, we hope that you're doing okay.

And if there's anything else we can do to help or organizations we don't know about that you would like us to make aware to other people. Yes. Definitely let us know. Yes. And in the meantime, we're learning and we're educating ourselves and doing what we can. And we'll put all the links in the show notes if anybody else wants to check them out or, you know, see how you can help. Well said, christine with your little speech earlier you did a great job thank you i felt like i was giving like a school

presentation because i realized halfway through i wasn't breathing but i was like if i breathe now i'm gonna go and it's gonna be so awkward no worries i i appreciate also this is a complete sharp left turn 180 um but just so everybody knows because this comes out at the end of march and i know last year we requested everybody to remind us around april fool's day that yes we should do something because only like our first year on the podcast we took it seriously and it was such a great episode and then we completely neglected it for the next well last year we did all those uh secret creepy messages and people still to this day are like what are these scary ghosts in the background i will say that one was less fun than having other people record our episode for us well we got to watch bob's burgers and eat pizza so yeah i think anything that's not

that is less fun but let's just say that in a couple of days, we did come out with an idea for an April Fools episode. We're prepared this time for once. And we already recorded it. It is a great gig. So if you would like to hop on and actually see us celebrate the beginning of April, you know, go check it out. If you want to see the ultimate fools celebrating April 1st, you can watch this.

Also, April 1st, we're going to do an Instagram live. Oh, yes. For people. A special Instagram live. We we've I know a lot of people have been wondering where our Instagram lives went because we were doing those at the beginning of the pandemic. And so since we're calling April fools a holiday, we're going to give you you an instagram live so go be on instagram all day and wait for our call yes wait for our siren call we are very excited about the april 1st episode it's like totally different and new and exciting and we

just can't wait for you to hear it so yeah check it out okay so i have a story I think you'll like, Miss Christine. I better like it. I hope you like it. I'm sure I will love it. I like it. I think the person involved didn't like it, though. This is an alien abduction case. I'm scared already. And I got to say, this was probably some of the easiest research i've ever done because i can only find one article about it um it's like it's like a good and a bad thing because it's like oh

it's all right here for me but also like this is it yeah i'm like usually i i'm using at least like 15 links or 15 sites to like really compile it all together but yeah this is one luckily one very long article okay and also super lucky probably the luckiest i've ever been because in terms of there only being one article uh this was written by a reporter taking the actual story from that person so it's it's pretty much a direct source or like one one removed from a direct source so okay i'm excited so the only link that i could the only link that is out there happened to be on mysterious universe so that is where i got this all from you could pretty much go to the website and look up the article yourself and i want to apologize now that because this information only came from one place

it's pretty much a direct read of the article so i just want to give it credit i tried to you know paraphrase it and make it more my own but you're going to be able to see the exact points of the article uh if you were to look back on it so anyway so this is mysterious universe and apparently the person who wrote this was contacted by the abductee herself because she wanted her story told so uh this is basically a whole synopsis of her experiences her name was laura clark by the way so laura clark if you are listening i hope i do you justice uh if not please don't be mad at me i tried my best and also to correct me if you'd like so laura clark was born in fayetteville arkansas which by the way is home to the duggars oh wow how special i was suckered in from sentence one i was like let's go this you were like okay

picked my next topic don't even know what it is also laura clark if you know the duggars please email us as well oh god so uh yes born in fayetteville arkansas and she moved around a lot uh because her dad was in the army but it was her her mom or dad and her sister barbara and this happened or began in the 60s so they finally landed on a place in alaska i think it was Fairbanks, Alaska, or it could have been Anchorage. I kind of got confused in the article. But there's like, I think like a six hour difference between the two places. So I'm not sure which one it is. But it was in Alaska in 1963. And Laura's first experience was when her mom, oh, she was five, by the way, Laura was five. And her mom was tucking her and her sister Barbara into their beds. And they shared a room just in case that's important. So Barbara and Laura were being put to bed.

And this was Laura's first supernatural experience. I just want to say now a lot of this, there are direct quotes from her. So I tried to, instead of giving you like big blocks of quotes, I tried to just kind of paraphrase what she said. But again, if you check the article, you will be able to see pretty much all this in quote format. So her mom walks away,

you know, leaves the room and Laura remembers being the only one awake and hearing someone in the hall. And she thought it was her mom. Then she remembers that the door opened or the a light shone shined through the room and she saw quote several small thin light gray people with large blank uh not blank with large black slanted eyes staring into my room nothing i'm not interested she said i was surprised and just stared back at them which

like yeah what else do you fucking do and you're five too so it's almost like you don't know much of the world yet anyway it's not like you even have a comprehension of yeah this is an alien this is wrong it's like why are you opening my door when you should be my mom where's mom yeah oh also this was uh i don't know if this is this was written in at all to say anything about like how skeptics would feel about it but it is interesting to note that only two years earlier was the barney and betty hill uh alien abduction story oh yeah which for those of you who are interested i covered that in episode 49 that was like the first like famous famous case and the in america i think i remember that they were the first people i think to mention grays gray aliens so some people could say like oh well

that only happened two years earlier you're five maybe that like you're putting it in your own imagination or something whatever whatever i'm gonna go off of the fact that Laura is of sound mind so so she sees these gray creatures staring at her and Laura looked at her sister to see if her sister was seeing this but her sister was sleeping calm as a cucumber then she realized that her sister Barbara's blankets were getting pulled off of her by themselves uh don't love that and all of a sudden barbara quote floated into a standing position that's the sister the sister so she went from sleeping in her bed to the the covers getting pulled off by themselves nothing is doing it they're just falling off of her and then she is floated into a standing position can i just tell you something real

quick that is like kind of a side bar but like happened last night that i just remembered when you said that oh christine what happened i was laying in bed and like i was so i was like falling or i was trying to fall asleep i was not asleep i mean this is how every fucking one of these stories starts but this has never happened to me before so i was like flipped out and i was like i have to tell em tomorrow and i completely forgot until just now blaze was asleep i was laying in bed geo's at the end of the bed like dead asleep and i was kind of laying there and you know how when you're falling asleep you just kind of like play out things in your head or you're just like thinking so i like started picturing some scene i don't know i was trying to like go through a conversation i'd had and all of a sudden it like

morphed and there was this i don't even know how to describe it it was like this creature and it was sort of like the Cheshire Cat like it was like smiling and it was like coming out of a wall and just kind of laughing at me and I remember my first instinct was like uh-oh and I remember thinking like this is not a safe place for my mind to be it was so weird I don't know how to describe what I was thinking but it was sort of like this isn't a dream it was sort of like uh-oh like something bad's happening and i was like i need to snap myself out of it and then all of a sudden my my blankets got like fucking pulled off my shoulders and like halfway down my body and so of course i like jerked up and i was like okay okay that was the cat like luckily the cat was and i looked up and the cats are both sleeping in geo's bed like over on the other side of the room and

i'm just sitting there going what the fuck and i like looked at my covers and they were like clearly not on my body it's like oh my god and it was very strange because i remember thinking i have to snap myself out of this and all of a sudden it felt like somebody just like like you know how they i mean just like this like they say in these stories like someone yanked my blankets i've never had that happen and i was like oh dear and i can still picture that creepy smiling face like oh my god i have such intense goose camera i forgot about it until you said the covers got yanked off and i went oh my fucking god like last night i was telling myself you have to remember and i was not asleep yet like i was just kind of moseying through my mind and all of a

sudden this like horrible image appeared and my covers just got anyway sorry that was so irrelevant but like it scared the absolute bejesus out of me so wow that's a lot to unpack um it feels like if to me if it had a creepy face and you had a gut instinct that it was unsafe and it was waiting for you to be kind of like in like more of like a vulnerable like space it feels dangerous for you and then like to feel the it's almost like it was watching you while you were sleeping and then like when it realized you were more coming to it like got rattled or something i hate that holy shit it was it was almost like it didn't feel like sinister so much as it felt like trickstery like it was like trying to like a poltergeist yeah like it felt like it was trying to fuck with me and i remember going it worked okay please leave me alone and then i took my covers and I like wrapped them very tightly around me. And I was like, don't pull on anything.

And I think I took my wallet full. Oh, I hate it. I felt something next to me a while ago. Like at some point yesterday, I felt something in the bathroom. And I was like, do you just like watch me sit on the toilet? That's such trash. No, it probably watches you try to wash your face because we're all trying to learn from the best it's like don't use hand soap what is wrong with you stop putting dial i'm an esthetician stop putting dial hand soap no ew watching you on the toilet is like

come on come on i don't know classy i did i did see a tweet at one point it must have been a tweet or a meme or something but it said like if you're ever worried that your parents your grandparents that they've passed on to the do they like watch you do stuff in bed because they're like creepy ghosts like that's not on you that's on them being fucking weird so like okay deal with that so sometimes when i'm in the bathroom and i think like if a ghost were to get me right now like i'd be in trouble and i'd be like but also they're a weird as shit ghost like what is the matter with you like you couldn't wait till like this wasn't happening like what's your problem what are you into wait that's a really good point says more about them than you it does yeah so anyway i don't know how we got on that

tangent but um well i was just saying because you said the covers got pulled off and i was like oh that happened to me last i'm so sorry that that happened that's really terrifying i would be much more scared than you're coming off it was so weird because i was like it must be the cat but then i was like i don't think i don't know how a cat could do that but then also it certainly was not a cat but i knew it was gross and it was really gross that's never happened to me before i don't know every now and then i feel like something something might be like pulling on my covers or like touching the blanket or something and i just have to convince myself that I was so focused on my phone. It like just fell a weird way and hit my arm by myself.

Like I caused it because if I get too into the idea that someone is trying to like touch me while I'm in bed again, by the way, I just have to be like, no, no, no, no, thank you. um i just have to be like no no no no thank you this is it's probably why i don't go to bed until i'm completely exhausted out of my wits end so that i don't even have to focus on what's around me you don't have to like think about your surroundings yeah anyway wow anyway so poor barbara sidebar poor barbara is now floating in a standing position while apparently unconscious uh and five-year-old laura is just lying there watching this happen and then the same thing happens to laura where all of a sudden she is also floating in a standing position and she feels i don't know really how to explain it but her and barbara feel themselves floating or without their control being guided or moved in some way they're floating into the hall towards the stairs and they she sees the gray aliens in tow

um she once they get to the foot of the stairs it's very sweet as a five-year-old but it's also really sad as like you know this is a scary situation but she saw herself floating at the top of the stairs and she was like i think they want me to go downstairs but the only way i know how to go downstairs is move my feet and so she started doing like these weird like bicycle pedaling motions in the air kind of like how i imagine like if you have like put a puppy over some water and like they just they start paddling cute um but so apparently she remembers moving her legs as if she was trying to help get herself downstairs and suddenly in her head she heard a voice she says this is a quote from her suddenly the voice suddenly the first voice i heard was coming from the next from the

one next to me his mouth did not move but i heard his thoughts he said you don't have to do that we'll do it for you about the peddling her legs to go downstairs yucko so they were going to help her downstairs without her needing to do anything so she stopped moving her oh the rest of the quote is so i stopped moving my legs uh and felt that i was being floated downstairs without ever touching the steps. They got downstairs and Laura remembers seeing one of the aliens take her sister into another room. And at that moment, because I guess they were so far away from her, she saw just how short these aliens were. I guess her mom is about 5'2 and they were they looked shorter than her mom. So interesting. Fun fact, greys are probably shorter about 5'2", and they looked shorter than her mom. Oh, interesting.

Fun fact, grays are probably shorter than 5'2". Laura also remembers asking in her head or thinking, are these people like us? And then one of them in her head said, no, we are non-human living beings. human living beings uh and then laura goes on to say i don't remember anything more about that experience except that from that day on barbara was never the same she became an angry defensive stubborn brat to put it bluntly so sad justice for barb uh let's bring that back because seriously poor barbara needs it poor laura needs it too that's sad so anyway so laura's dad again he's in the military and so the family is used to moving around a lot and eventually they end up next in iowa in davenport iowa and laura is now seven

instead of five so two years have passed and they live in a house that is next to a ravine and they have a swing set in the backyard from what laura remembers and she says one night while she was sleeping just like the last time it always seems to be one night while you're sleeping when you're so vulnerable as a seven-year-old this is horrifying laura was somehow aware while she was sleeping that she was outside and floating above the roof and the swing set so my first thought is like oh this could be like some really cool astral projection yes that was my first thought maybe she just didn't know she could astral project yet but uh so she was outside and she was floating above the roof and the swing set and she could feel herself uncontrollably being moved toward the sliding glass door of

their house and then she felt someone smack her on the butt really hard oh what um and she said her parents didn't spank her so it was extra jarring because even her own parents wouldn't do it but all of a sudden instead of being asleep while aware that she was outside she i guess came to and woke up and she realized that she was now laying on top of her covers in her bed so she wasn't tucked in anymore she was on top of her blankets and her nightgown was up oh um uh she said that her underwear was still on so she doesn't know exactly what happened, but she still felt super violated. Well, yeah. Obviously.

And even creepier, if it gets worse, she then heard someone in the hallway faking the sound of her mom walking. Ew. What does that mean? How do you fake the sound? Quote, I knew my mom's normal footsteps in her leather loafers but this was not her when i heard what i heard was as if someone was holding her tiny shoes in their hands and slapping them on the slapping them on the floor in a fake walking sound oh my fucking god that's heinous i.e monty python with coconuts uh same difference same that's how i have to like tell

myself so i don't totally panic as i'm trying to panic yeah oh so laura and she knew that it was someone trying to fake her mom because she heard the sound of these footsteps slapping through the floor going into her parents room into the closet hearing the closet door open hearing the shoes get thrown in there and dropping to the floor and then hearing the door close holy crap and you have to wonder like since the mom was presumably sleeping like they could probably keep her asleep you find that out throughout this story i mean just like barb you know like if barb was sleeping the parents were sleeping i mean it seems like they're able to put everyone in a trance just to keep the one person

they want awake which is awful don't like don't love that and then as if it couldn't get worse uh laura then out in the hallway again heard two quote robotic voices talking to each other and she also reminds us in this interview that this was 1965 there were no like computers in your home yet where you're used to like whirring mechanical sounds right or like a siri type voice or like you've got mail like none of that existed no microsoft sam she oh she uh was very, very disturbed. She was like, this was a sound I'd never heard in my entire life. And she said it sounded like two computers in hindsight were talking to each other.

Like lots of beep boop, beep boop bop, you know. Or it could have been our podcast, apparently. Beep boop bop. But so she was just so freaked out hearing them talk in the hallway nothing else happened after that but she didn't know any better so she stayed up all night until morning all while barbara slept soundly by the way nothing happened to barbara that time and after this uh laura's mom started noticing that laura was acting really skittish obviously she would sure and laura said nothing about it because she felt this overwhelming anxiety that if she said something something would happen to her family

wow so they probably implanted some fear of i don't know maybe i don't know that's where my mind went like that's where my mind went to of like they are communicating with her telepathically or something or maybe it's just like an innate fear as a child after a scary experience i don't know which i mean i guess you do hear about like if something in a more true crime sense happens and you get scared to tell your parents because yeah you're not aware if you're in trouble or not i mean i can see that as well that kind of makes let's put it this way i'm 28 and if there was an alien that abducted me i would be scared to tell anyone now because i'd be afraid that they would come after other

people i care about so i think as a seven-year-old she was totally in her right to feel that way so two more years pass and now she's nine and they live in wisconsin it's even creepier to me that it's multiple locations yeah they're really tracking you can't hide from them sorry let me take a swig of g-raid oh i ran out of gatorade yesterday i miss it i'm still trying to get through my costco bulk buy oh that's right you have a million i forgot fun fact um when gatorade came out my mom was one of the people who tested the drink yeah you told me that once yeah it's called gatorade because the university of florida yeah and uh she was at college the year where they were testing it or something and so she got like some of the first samples

she was like it's better now yeah i bet okay so um two more years have passed, and now the family is in Wisconsin. It is 1967, and Laura is nine. One night, while she was sleeping, per usual, she was woken up by a very bright light. And she heard a, quote, almost electronic little girl's voice. Oh, God. It really does get worse every time you open your damn mouth em it's almost like it really every time they push the limit yes every time every time they show up they're like okay well that was fine like what's next how about this so uh an almost electronic little girl's voice and the voice said isn't the light pretty do you want to come and

play in the light for god's sake good night and goodbye you know what laura said in her mind at least she thought i have school tomorrow yeah um thanks but no thanks tell me you get straight a's without telling me you get straight a's i know i have a quiz in the morning so laura got up laura got up anyway to at least look out the window and see what this light was coming from and she realized the light was coming directly above their garage and that it was a very wide beam of light and we know what happens with light beams in ufo stories her body all of a sudden started to feel like every cell was, quote, vibrating apart from them. Like her body was completely separating from a molecular level.

And then she was somehow all of her cells were transferred or moved from inside the room to outside of her house, like through the wall through the the wood studs and all of a sudden she was outside and her cells were all put back together oh how weird is that so it's almost like that's how they phase through solid objects they completely separate themselves and then rebuild on the outside fascinating um she so now she remembers that she's floating in her driveway and essentially was beamed up she remembers uh passing through some sort of hatch and going down a hall and this is a quote from her describing what she had seen the entire place was made from some kind of silver metal the hallway had a flat floor but the wall to my right curved like an arch so that if you went too far to the right, you would hit your head.

The hall curved around towards the left, too, as if you were walking in a large circle. As I was floating alone down this long hall, I passed by several doorways. No doors were visible, but I could see each room was pie-shaped like a slice of pie. Oh, that's fun. They should do that with Cheesecake Factory. Like, make every room a little cheesecake slice of pie oh that's fun they should do that with cheesecake factory like make every room a little cheesecake slice i love that narrow on the opposite side from the doorway but flat like a bite was taken off of the end so that is what apparently the inside of this craft looked like intriguing pie slices um eventually laura actually saw a bigger room down the hall and it looked like it

was probably the control room it had a lot of like gadgets and screens and shit but before she even got to the end of the hall she was moved again against her will into a room with a metal exam table and she was laid on it see i would like to go home now. Thanks. That's what she said, too. Yeah. At the same time, Laura also noticed that other people were coming into the room. People? And they were greys.

Creatures. The greys. She realized they were the same greys that she had met during her first experience when she was five. Oh, Teddy. Hi. Good to see you again. How did she know it was them? Oh, God.

I think she had some innate knowing. I guess, right, if they talked to her in her head, there's probably some way to know who they are. But also, like, what a scary confirmation that, oh, yeah, they have been keeping complete tabs. This isn't like three isolated events. They have been following me. This isn't like three isolated events it's they have been following me this isn't like a fancy to meet you here this is like a yeah this isn't a meet cute this is a this is a big big problem uh the famous opposite of a meet cute a big big problem she uh also ended up seeing a different creature other than the greys there, which was a six foot black, completely black, praying mantis looking creature.

Oh my God. Oh my God. And apparently when she saw him, before she even saw him with her eyes, she felt a presence in the room that was, quote, completely evil. So I don't know what to do with that information. Like, I i don't know what to do with that information like i really don't so apparently he is just like she sensed that he was the leader and she sensed complete evil before she even saw him and then realized that this thing was in the room with her and apparently they like both repelled each other like i don't think he wanted anything to do with her she clearly wanted nothing to do with him what the heck and in the middle of her panicking that she felt like she was in danger all of a sudden all the walls were almost made of like smart panels and they turned this really

soft blue and laura said that it reminded her of like very calming fish tanks like okay you know how once you're inside a very calming fish tank it's like this is not this is not a spa laura i know you know that so this is very mansplaining of me but like i don't know if i'd be thinking of fish tanks in this moment i mean i guess what would you be i mean as a seven or nine year old you'd be like how do i have any other connection to this true i wonder though i wonder if that's if they were looking in her mind and thinking like oh what would be calming for her and then they put humans like fish tanks i guess i don't know well if they if they thought like oh you know maybe this is something that's coming to her and she doesn't even know it and then they made the walls blue and then they heard her thoughts going this reminds me of calming fish

tanks they were probably like okay well we nailed that like we wanted her to feel calm and we got confirmation and then they wrote down fish tanks fish tanks so for the next abduction everybody was like why why am i surrounded by like sharks and if if you've been abducted and you have seen fish tank looking lights on a craft, that was probably Laura's doing. Laura did that for you. That was a note from corporate. So then she also saw that there was a gray that seems to be a little girl. She was much shorter than the rest. She was about three and a half feet tall.

She had long, wispy black hair and slanted, completely black eyes. Yeah. So I've gone from thinking about astral projection to like black-eyed children. Valid point. It's really like a mod podge of, and that's why we drink stories so far. Laura says that she actually was not scared at all of this little gray girl. And she felt like this being was telling Laura that she was her sister. And what's even weirder is this quote from Laura that says, Somehow I felt this being was in fact genetically my sister.

I wonder if my parents had also been taken by grays in the past and i was like yeah i was like girl you can't just say that and walk away which is exactly what she did we don't know any more than that the connotations behind that are are disturbing um the the the storyline that you may be meeting your sister because your mother or your father have also been abducted and then assaulted i'm assuming for there to be another being out there that is genetically your sister um but so it made her instantly think i wonder if like mom and dad have if is this a is this something i inherited from them this weird gift of being traced and certainly a gift i would say yeah this seems to be really a blessing from the devil yeah

from the fucking satanic praying mantis or whatever it is and so the the next quote about this experience was later i was brought back into my bedroom again by moving right through the window itself i was floated into my bed stomach, and my body was then pulled by this invisible force into a certain position. I was then told that I would have trouble sleeping from now on and I should put myself in this position from then on to help me fall asleep. I've had to do this ever since and I have been plagued by severe insomnia for the rest of my life. Okay. Also, girl, what's the position? I thought it was on your stomach, she said. been plagued by severe insomnia for the rest of my life okay also girl what's the position like you

i thought it was on your stomach she said they said they put her on a i was floated onto my bed stomach down my body was then pulled by an invisible force into a certain position oh okay you're right i don't know give it up man some of us are also suffering from yeah we've insomnia we've all got insomnia do the aliens have like a trick like we gotta know it but also it kind of blows my mind because i'm thinking now they're saying oh sorry you're gonna have insomnia forever why don't they just not give her insomnia like what what what is the purpose of that like how can they maybe they realized i i wonder if there's like a you know how in wicked when like you saw the complete opposite side of like what the wicked witch was going through yeah i wonder if the aliens realized like oh she shouldn't have

seen the praying mantis like that's gonna fuck her up oh we we told her to wait in the control room and that motherfucker just needs to insert himself we we traumatized her she's definitely gonna have a hard time sleeping now so maybe they didn't even know they were going to do that. I don't know. I mean, listen, my recommendation is some Z-Quil, melatonin. And whatever that position is, Laura Clark, you got to let us know. Secret alien position. I'm disturbed.

And the insomnia thing freaks me out that they told her, sorry, you're going to have this issue forever. Bye. It's just so strange that they wouldn't just, that a they would even tell her because it seems like they don't really have her best interests at heart so why are they even caring and b if they care so much why don't they just fix it i don't know and see if they're able to put everyone else in a deep sleep so they don't have to deal with the bullshit laura's going through why can't they just give laura some of that and like oh you know what i wonder if she's part alien maybe they know something about like her composition her makeup that isn't like other humans and she can't i don't know i don't know that probably maybe i don't know i mean she if she's genetically related to

a gray then maybe they have more fascination in studying her than someone else but then wouldn't they also be interested in barb who would also have a half sister in space good point you know yeah i wonder i mean yeah if they both have the same biological parents then yeah that that wouldn't make sense you know so that's so raven had there there's a spinoff now i knew we were going there next totally prepared for this twist for those for those of you who don't know in the world of reboots uh that's so raven has a spinoff called raven's home or raven's house or something and uh she has twins and only one of them got her psychic abilities so i'm wondering if maybe that's something like That's a good point.

Maybe Barbara isn't as special to them. Maybe they think Laura is like more powerful or more connected. Maybe she just has a more of a connection or like genetically is more predisposed to their. I don't know. She has more space dust in her blood. Maybe. I don't know. Yeah, definitely.

That's the one. I'm a scientist. Yep. space dust in her blood maybe i don't know yeah definitely that's the one i'm a scientist yep uh so after this uh first of all laura did say she had severe insomnia for the rest of her life uh but she also had some very minor health issues for the rest of her life including like every now and then her left foot would just like go numb and would whenever she was walking it would just kind of drag behind her like it wasn't listening to her and also her eyes would start shaking for no reason it would stop but every now and then she would have little bouts of her eyes shaking weird and i guess that it that's different than like a seizure like i don't think i think it's her just acting normally but her eyes are kind of all over

the place i wonder what the foot is maybe they tested on it or something yeah i don't know why they would pick or something maybe it was like when her cells were like rebuilding themselves to get through the wall maybe all of a sudden like one nerve is like out of whack they like mixed up her toes by accident or something um but yeah so she i don't know what the foot thing is but it's interesting that like a part of her still can't control its own movements every now and then. Very interesting. You know? So she's also, not surprised, has developed intense anxiety.

Oh, well, no shit. Especially about the praying mantis leader, which like. I mean, I'm developing anxiety and I didn't even see it in real life. So I don't blame you. developing anxiety and I didn't even see it in real life. So I don't blame you. I feel like if you're in a room with what you know to be true as completely evil, just a completely malevolent presence, like how do you not- It's got to haunt you. How do you come back from that?

Especially as a child who's probably never necessarily experienced something like that, that level of fear. Or worked through it mentally and like now it's just like really a repressed evil that you you know because if you weren't comfortable telling your parents and you just had to know that any day now you could see that thing again i mean of course that would traumatize you so anyway laura finally went to her parents after this and uh she told them what was going on but they just said that she was having intense nightmares okay well not good i guess i mean like what do you do like a part of me is like oh my god i can't believe them but then also i'm like you know if a child is like i'm seeing aliens all the time i

don't know what you would do like what would you do even if you did believe them yeah i think that's almost if i were to ever deny my child that experience it would be out of my own fear of not knowing what like who do i bring this to yeah or like not knowing how to like fix it or i mean it's totally out of anyone's hands i would think i'm gonna be the worst parent because of how supportive i'm going to be because the second who the second some my kid comes up to me and says like there's a shadow figure in my closet I'm gonna be like we're burning the closet and like if there's an alien abduction I'm I don't know when I'm gonna I'll believe them but I'll be like that sucks let's just hope it doesn't happen again because I can't help you you know like I don't know what to do and also i just think about like like what would

a kid even how would that even manifest psychologically if you go to your parent who's supposed to be able to help you through anything yeah and just watch them go like i don't fucking know but i don't i also wonder like maybe the most beneficial thing to do is like believe them but also like comfort them like not be like i'm terrified i'm gonna burn the house down but like oh i wouldn't tell them i was terrified and i would burn the closet down i would just accidentally burn the closet down oops after they told me and i'd be like oh no well at least now there's nothing trying to make s'mores in the back of the closet i guess i would i'd be like oh no i have a new job i have to go we have to leave this entire house i would never let them know i was terrified yeah i

feel like that's the big thing is like a like the believing is a big part of it i think because you know you hear about all those kids who in true crime or in paranormal stuff whose parents don't believe them and how damaging that is but then also like yeah you don't want your parents to be equally as out of control and terrified because they're supposed to be protecting you and even if you are you probably have to pretend to be the strong one yeah whoever the new warrens are or the alien version the alien abduction warrens i would have to have their number on speed dial so yeah thank god we have like the internet and all of our listeners who could probably uh be like here's what to do because i don't know what to do uh well uh anyway so she told that she told her parents

they said that she was having nightmares and that being said laura always thought that her mom actually knew more than she was letting on oh so i was gonna say too like if if she really had that weird instinctual feeling that her parents had been abducted before yeah so yeah interesting that she would that that sorry but that brings up a whole other like slew of factors of like okay it's one thing if you don't know what to do it's one thing if you don't believe your kid but it's another thing to know what they're going through and just not fucking say anything like not to totally judge laura's mom i don't know what i would do in that situation but that's a whole other ball of wax i haven't even thought of so uh you are traumatized too as if you went through that as a parent you know what i mean

like so uh anyway so laura always thought her mom might have known something more but anyway five years later go by and it's 1972 and laura is 14 and And her parents are now divorced. And she's living with her dad in a suburb of Chicago. And one night she was about to go to bed, which is the first time that she wasn't already asleep. So Laura was about to go to bed. And she noticed that the light in her room was off when she went in. But she had left it on. So why was the light turned off all of a sudden? Turn right around

yeah go back to the kitchen eat a pop tart yeah exactly have two have three have the whole box i don't care and this is a quote from her as i stepped into my room and closed the door i suddenly became very weak and tired it hit me like a ton of bricks and i stumbled over to my bed and fell into it what was going on you know what's interesting is it's like whenever they've decided to visit her before she was already sleeping in her room and there was a deep sleep it's almost like they're not trancing putting her in a trance but putting that perimeter that space in a trance because the second she walked in point the second she walked in she was exhausted but beforehand she wasn't wow that is weird yeah so i don't know if she's actually being

put in some sort of spell or if it's just the space she's in but then there was that time where her sister was asleep but she was awake oh that's a good point which is also weird maybe this is like a new gray like an intern and he like doesn't totally know. He fucked up. He doesn't know how things get started usually. Oh. Like the boss ran out and was like, I don't know, you get this thing kicked off. And she's like, I don't know.

Oops. Okay. So while on her bed, so in the middle of her like passing out because she's so exhausted, while on her bed, she saw that her closet door was closed but the light inside was on yeah that's somehow really awful i don't even know why but that's just awful something's in there then the closet door opened and a gray came out and laura passed out and the next thing she remembers is her floating over her house moving towards her front door almost as if they were returning her oh she was coming back oh okay yikes she says i noticed my clothes were all stuck to me like i was vacuum sealed and i felt very cold and clammy when i was

when i was brought to the bedroom they set me down on the floor and i could feel the invisible force leave me and my clothes fell away from my body again like the vacuum suction had left oh that gave me goose cam what a freaky idea it's so wild because i feel like we all know these tropes of what an alien abduction entails and whenever i hear a detail i've never thought of it's for some reason more credible to me because it could be like a total random thing that someone made up but it's just there's an eeriness to it that someone has thought no you're totally right because it's not just another like cliche it's almost like something you would never have thought of that is also just so creepy that adds to the story vacuum sealed how weird yeah and then all of a sudden when she felt

them like leave her clothes fell off of her she also heard the sound of like a humming or a drone and trees moving as if there was a huge gust of wind or a chopper nearby so i'm imagining cleaner or i think it was probably like the she heard the hum of like the UFOs engine as it was flying away or. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then she saw this quote light beam leave. So and she basically she saw like the helicopter sounds went away. The trees stopped rustling as if there was a big wind that went by and she just like went to sleep. She was passed out.

She was so exhausted from whatever happened. So that was the next experience. And then we get to 1981 when she's 23. Oh, boy. And Laura is now living in rural New York with her husband. Okay, Laura. She's doing shit. They're like, no, keep coming with us.

And she's like, I got my own life to live, man. Well, you know, what's interesting, too, is that she in the beginning of her life they were coming every couple of years and it slowly started getting further and further apart so i don't know if that was kind of like you know how if something's like wrong at medically with you and you go to the doctor more often and then as things get better like you you don't have to go as often like there's a bigger gap between because it's fully exactly what you're talking about yes good because i don't and i was just totally telling you your own life yeah well there are times where you're like always going to doctor yeah i see what you're saying and then like over time you hopefully those don't have to go as often

yeah so i'm i'm wondering if because she was like new on the ufo docket of people to visit they were checking on her more often and then as time went on they only needed to check in on her well you know what i wonder too which this could be just total bullshit is like at that time she was a kid and growing really rapidly and i wonder like it was more of like tracking her growth and development if she was related to these aliens somehow versus like uh i'm convinced now oh my gosh versus like when you get older and you know you don't develop or change all that much once your past teenage years wow that is horrific wow it's so like when you go to the pediatrician to get like when you're a little baby or whatever and then it like stuff but like we keep relating this to the doctor as if like a giant evil praying mantis overlord is the

same as a pediatrician but um wouldn't that be terrible though if it's every two years and then by the time you hit like 16 you're like oh god any day now and then it doesn't happen and then it doesn't happen and then 23 and you're like fuck yeah no there's like a mental torture to it she did mention not in so many words but she was like at this point like what seven four why can't i do fucking math i don't know nine years at this point nine years had passed and so she was like i had never gone that long in my life not hearing from them so i just thought things were getting better yeah you would hope it was the end yeah she was like i've never gone this long without an alien abduction yeah same girl i get it

um and so she was uh in rural new york she's 23 she has a husband lance and they have a two-year-old son named morgan and uh one night her and lance were watching TV. Laura noticed that Lance got up very quickly from the couch without a word and just started walking really quickly to the bedroom. Uh-oh. And said that he started, quote, walking in a stiff, disjointed way. Oh. Almost like his own body wasn't in his control anymore. Oh, almost like his own body wasn't in his control anymore. Oh, no. Can you imagine?

Like, they really, in terms of originality, they've gone above and beyond every time they go see her. And now this is the first time that she's seeing, like, someone else be affected by them while she's awake, while he's awake. You know, they're getting more comfortable with her being coherent and seeing everything happen in front of her. Horrible. And so she's just like, she thinks, nine years, they're not coming comfortable with her being coherent and seeing everything horrible horrible and so she's just like she thinks nine years they're not coming after me anymore and now her husband gets up and starts walking really weirdly and you know is acting out of sorts and all of a sudden he stumbles into bed he was they were just watching tv like normal and all of a sudden he stumbles into bed and just passes out and goes into this super deep sleep almost like he's in a trance oh god oh god she freaks out and goes to check on her son morgan yeah right and finds out that he's also all of a

sudden in an unshakable sleep and she says that it's almost as if he was quote frozen in time well you don't want that with a two-year-old either like that's terrifying but all of a sudden the only two people in your house cannot be woken i mean nightmare real nightmare and so i'm sure she even if she's doing better after nine years i i can't imagine you just stop always wondering what's gonna happen next with these grays and so i think she freaked out and was like fuck like i'm pretty sure something's about to happen. Not again. And she went to go. Yeah, she went to go check on her son.

And then she heard the trees blowing really intensely. She saw a bright light over their house and she heard a humming sound outside. And then she heard the humming sound inside. And this is a quote from her. I checked the front door and it was locked so i turned around and was stopped in my tracks when i saw a very short being standing in my kitchen oh my god i stared at it trying to figure out what it was i had apparently walked right past it this was something new i'd never seen before it was shorter than my son, and I thought it was odd. It had a very round basketball-sized head with tiny black eyes,

and I could see no other features except that it was wearing a long-sleeved white robe that covered everything else. I could see no hands or feet, and I thought, oh my god, he's shorter than my son. And the thing replied telepathically, huh, yes, but we are very, very old. What? What the hell? Wait, so he was shorter than a two-year-old? He was shorter than a two-year-old. Wearing a robe?

Like a paper towel? Like, what do you mean, a robe? It feels very Yodaoda like just like tiny tiny tiny old old very old very very old it's so strange i mean it's like the opposite of when you talk about three kids in a trench coat it's like the opposite of that like the honey i shrunk the kids version but like they uh but yeah so she saw one just standing in the kitchen after i thought i would like step on it like i feel like i wouldn't even see it you know what i mean if it's like a foot off the ground it's like a walking newborn you know

which is actually now that you say it way creepy yeah then she heard so she sees this thing, I would imagine at least slightly petrified of the experience. And then she heard the front door open and five more greys floated in. Goodbye. Are they also really tiny? Or do we know? very very old one but the five greys that did float in apparently all looked identical but they apparently had very different personalities so i'm thinking like the seven dwarves like bashful hungry oh there's not that's not there's not i always call it hungry too and everyone's like that's not one and i'm like i guess i'm projecting so i think we're both on the same page there bashful grumpy i would be grumpy also sleepy that one's me uh i think like we're both on the same page there. Bashful, grumpy. I would be grumpy also. Sleepy, that one's me. I think we're all of them encompassed, plus hungry.

We're all of them except, like, sneezy. I don't know. Well, speak for yourself. I have sinusitis. So anyway, all of them looked identical, but had different personalities. They floated in, And this is super weird. But Laura said that, I guess she never noticed before, but if they were all floating or they also have to float to move everywhere, I guess she probably thought this whole time like,

oh, they have to make me float so that they can move me so that I'm lightweight and so I don't have to move myself. But I think maybe this was the first time she realized that the way that they get around everywhere is they float interesting and she keeps feeling like she's one of them like she can move that way too you know she well she also said this is like the weird part is that for them apparently it looked really weird to see them floating because the way that they would, like, propel themselves anywhere since they're not touching the ground is they would, it kind of looked like an upright doggy paddle that they, she said they were, they were, quote, pushing through jello is what it looked like. What?

Well, you know, I wonder if that's because they're not used to this atmosphere. Like, maybe in their atmosphere it's a different gravity pull or something. Yeah, I don't know. That's actually a really good point thank you i'm talking directly out of my ass but i'm glad that it was a good point she thought that one of them was uh actually walking down the hall at one point but then it like snuck up around her and got right in her face goodbye and she said that he apparently smelled really bad. She says, quote, I noticed a strong, nasty smell. It was a combination of urine and sweet spices and vomit. And it made me want to throw up.

Oh, it makes me want to throw up. Yeah, that was a really awful description. It's very, very specific and detailed. Thank you, Laura. It's one I can follow easily and I hate it. So this really bad smelling one that was all up in her grill, this gray tried to actually like fuck with her head and I guess telepathically make her feel like garbage and make her scared of them. What? And to make her feel worthless.

I think it was like cower in fear from them or something like that. I think she insulted that really short one. It's probably like, you're short as shit and you smell like vomit. They're overcompensating. Yeah. Also, you look like you're swimming through Jell-O. Get it together. Yeah.

Hello. Yeah. I guess they have a lot of reasons to not feel welcome in the home. And so he was trying to intimidate her and laura says that she did want to cry but she wasn't going to give in so she looked him dead in the eyes yes laura also that must be a scary looking someone dead in the eyes like those creepy black slanty eyes especially like the eyes of someone that is not a human being and who wants you to be terrified of them. I can't imagine, but she owned it.

She stared him dead in the eyes. And apparently, uh, she, this is when she noticed for the first time that they're quote, all black eyes were actually, uh, normal eyes and the irises were black and the pupils were darker than

black. Ooh. Yikes. Ooh. She also said that their skin up close looks like rough cowhide oh yeah so that is when this gray being all of a sudden quote flooded my mind with memories of every time that they had visited her in the past. And they told Laura that her memories were connected to them. Oh my God. She was terrified. And so she started in her mind praying for help.

And she was thinking, please God, help me, Jesus. And the gray said telepathically, yes, we know God too. I hate it. i hate it what which made her feel like okay so no one's coming to no one's helping me okay this is so wildly terrifying i don't know that that got me good My goose cam is out of this world right now. I'm like shivering, honestly. So now she realizes that she's floating and they take her outside and she sees the beam of light again. And then nothing. And she woke up later.

So it's almost like it's almost like she like called their bluff on being intimidated. And they're like, OK, you just don't get to remember this one then. Goodbye. Wow. Yeah. They're like, we're done. Snap. Well, I also, I mean, that must be extra terrifying too now that you have a kid.

There's like that protection fear of like, I hope they don't touch him. Like get out of my fucking house. Like don't touch my family. Yeah. Terrible. Terrible. We know God too. Ugh.

Why is that so bad? And true to form, I did these notes like 10 hours ago, which means it was like 3 a.m. or something. So I was in my own house and there was this wild windstorm last night, Christine. Ew. I was nervous. I thought that like a chair on our balcony was going to like break through the door or something. It was really bad. Ugh, I have chills. I thought that like a like a chair on our balcony was gonna like break through the door or something it was really bad and so all I heard I was in like pitch silence and I just kept hearing this

nasty wind and things getting ruffled around my house and at 3 a.m I just read we know god too and I was like when you're reading about like the the trees were blowing with the UFOs descent. It was prime ambient sounds for what I was reading. So now she's floating. She sees the beam of light and she just wakes up and doesn't remember anything. So this is a quote from her about the next day. When I woke up, I found a red spot with a scab just below my belly button which this is the first time we're seeing anything invasive potentially happening to her when i pulled at it

the scab it popped off and seemed to be attached to a long thin sheath of tissue that no that had been burrowed down in my no i hate this i don't like it it must have been about five inches long oh my god it seemed that something had been perhaps implanted within me oh my god i'm gonna puke it was as if something like a giant fat needle had been shoved deep into my belly and it left a long hole okay okay okay okay okay it didn't even bleed or anything i wrapped the sheath in a tissue and saved it as proof then i went to wipe myself after peeing and i could not believe what i saw on the toilet there was a large circle of thick oily substance but it was divided in half like half circle of bright yellow and half circle of bright amber orange thick oily liquid

it was as if the two could not mix and they were touching but not mixing together the fuck wait so this came from her weird tissue so no so these are two separate events so she found this red spot on her in next to her belly button pulled on it and found this like telling me again yeah i appreciate it yeah okay so that tissue that she found or uh that sheath that she found she put in a tissue then she went to go pee and when she wiped oh when she wiped oh when she wiped i think if i'm reading it right her pee and something else that was very oily were separating on the toilet paper in front of her oh no oh no so she was panicked and she didn't know what to do she planned on saving the toilet paper as more proof but then she was like who do i give this toilet paper of right to and so she didn't know

what to do she just threw it away like what truly it's like what would you possibly do what could you do also like what happened to your belly and also was that one of two operations or implantations where now the second one is this weird pee thing well or was the first one an implantation and part of the effects of whatever's inside you now is that you are peeing out some residue well i mean i have a theory and it's not a good one i mean right here below your belly button is like where your womb would be or where like you would do like an amniocentesis like needle uh like that's how they get to your like womb slash placenta and i my thought is like if there's discharge of some kind like i don't know what it is but if it's like a foreign type of discharge it could very well be related to however they're accessing

your uterus oh my god i didn't even think about that oh i wanted to jump out a window wow that is and again this is just me speculating but that was where my mind but i horrifyingly it's a speculation i hadn't even thought of so like when it's just reminding me of when she was talking about how her she thought like her parents had been taken and had procreated somehow you know yeah oh my god oh my god christ Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Okay. Okay. Okay. Well, what year was that? That was 81. Okay. I'm trying to do math here. Whatever. Okay. Next. Three years later. Three years later. 1984. It's still not fucking over oh no 1984 she's around i'm guessing around 1984 she was around 26 years old and laura is now divorced and remarried and also has a daughter named rachel i do not know how old rachel is but if she is around three now i'm fucking panicked now i'm fucking panicked that rachel is part alien well it was weird because she always wore a little robe

and wandered around and called herself very old. Nobody knew why she behaved that way. Rachel, if you listen to this podcast for some reason, because you would have been born in the early 80s. You would have been born, presumably, unless there's a different gestation period, nine months after said abductionduction i'm not saying you're an alien i'm just saying can you confirm for me you're not an alien is what i want to know are

you okay are you all right i just want to know because i'm now i'm kind of freaked out that i like maybe get a blood test i'm just checking i'm just i would be nervous or maybe don't because like the government might intervene and i don't want to know what would happen actually never ever find out um okay yikes i'm so sorry rachel does not listen to this we are not helping i hope you take this in jest it's just very it's odd timing so i'm curious that's all um okay so now has a daughter rachel and morgan is now five years old. Morgan is five. Guess how old Laura was when things started happening? Oh, shit. Five.

Oh, you're right. Oh, no. And if we're wondering if things are generational or inherited, and Laura always thought, oh, my mom maybe saw something and she just never told me. And now I see things. And now my kid is five. What could go wrong what could happen one night oh fuck laura is watching tv and in her head she hears a voice wake up go

to your son he needs you probably a parent's worst nightmare i wouldn't know but that sounds horrifying to me although i will say if i were to ever, I hope I never have that experience, but if I were to have that experience, I would assume that if I'm hearing that voice, it's almost like someone saying like, this is your last, like you still have a chance that everything's going to be okay

because I'm warning you before it's too fucking late. Yeah. So I guess it's almost in the worst, most terrifying way. It's comforting that someone was looking out. I guess. Anyway, she goes to check on Morgan. Morgan is laying in bed and he looks like he's been pulled up from his bed and that his head and his shoulders are above his pillow.

So it's almost pulled almost out of his covers. Okay. And his blankets are weirdly neatly folded over the rest of his body and his bedding is not but he and his clothes are covered in blood what the weirder part to me is that his bedding is untouched with blood almost as if he was bloodied and then placed in there or they tried they tried to put him in there but they couldn't and so that's why he's like weirdly positioned over his pillow what the hell so it to me it sounds like it was a severe nosebleed blood was like coming out of his nose uh so i'm assuming it's a nosebleed but the again blood wasn't anywhere on the bedding so laura runs to the neighbor

and tells them to call 9-1-1 but her neighbor is also acting really weird oh here's a quote she followed me upstairs and acted very strange as i ran to the bathroom to get cold wet washcloths and towels she brought a dining chair in from the kitchen and parked herself at the head of his bed and didn't do or say a thing. It was almost like she was in a trance. She eventually left after I asked her again to call for help and she never did. Oh my god. No.

It's like a horror movie. So I don't know if this is like an alien abduction thing. I don't know if someone was almost possessing the neighbor to keep tabs on the kid like why would they interact with the the neighbor at all to make sure one thing i was wondering earlier too is like when you said oh she saw a beam of light and all this business and her husband and her son were like in a trance my first thought was like i wonder if they put that trance in like a wide circle so that people don't see the beam of light on her house don't hear the trees like i wonder how broadly this like trance goes that maybe it's the whole area or if the beam itself is what's

putting people on a trance or that hits your location right because like if she walked into the house maybe it was like then she got taken over oh well so we end up finding out why because so morgan ends up uh she morgan also by the way as this is happening and he's bleeding profusely just to make a mother's worst nightmare even worse he was not waking up during any of this so she didn't even know like if this was like it for him oh my god so it's almost like he was still in this trance of like not knowing what was going on. He was like this,

this unwakeable sleep, but come morning he wakes up and he's totally fucking fine. Even asks to go to school. Covered in blood. Covered in blood. Well, I'm sure she wiped him off, but yeah,

just nightmare fuel. So when he came home from school, Laura asked him, Hey, do you remember anything about last night? And he said that he, quote, woke up and saw a skeleton man standing in his room. So, he hid under his bed, but then he was taken out of his house along with the neighbor's son, who was the same age. Oh, shit.

So, it's not just Morgan. It's the neighborhood boy is also being beamed up at the same time. And they're both five. So that makes me think, unless the neighbors also have some sort of history with aliens, maybe it's like a compare and contrast situation. Interesting. Here's a random five-year-old next door to the one that we've- A control sample.

Here's a control sample next to our longitudinal study of of generational abduction something i don't know so wow so that would explain why the neighbor woman was also in a trance because her own kid that was her kid oh fuck so even her own house was put under a trance so both kids could be abducted and nobody noticed and then that makes me think like how connected is laura because that mom was able to like be in a complete trance and taken over by them but they allowed laura to stay awake and conscious during all of this and they even told her like go help your son like they they gave they gave her a head start well maybe they fucked up maybe they were like testing him and they accidentally like poked him too hard or something they were like oh that wasn't the plan i hadn't even thought of that

i wonder if i wonder if they planned on shutting off like her access to them once they had like a new generation to follow up with so without getting totally into it with wandavision there's a there's a new superhero where basically she was affected by Wanda's magic so many times that her genes started mutating and she became uh she became like she wasn't vulnerable to Wanda's magic anymore like it wasn't affecting her the same way it was affecting everyone else because she had been hit by wanda's powers so many times and so i'm wondering if like laura had had so much access with the aliens over time that she was almost like impervious to their putting the the moms under a trance while working on their kids oh my god you know yeah or maybe

they just they like her after all this time they're like she's not that bad let's like yeah involved or maybe they just see her as one of them and are like oh she's too far gone if they genetically think that she is part alien then technically her son would have like an aunt who's an alien up there just hanging out you know yes true that little gray girl so she when she realized that her son had been talking to somebody and was floating around outside of their house, Laura looked at the sky and thought really loudly, It's bad enough that you have taken me against my will all my life, but stay away from my kids. And after that, I don't think anything happened to Morgan.

I know she went to like, she took him to a doctor the next day and they couldn't find anything that was wrong with him. Of course. And I don't know what happened to Morgan after that. But Laura had two more kids after Morgan and Rachel. She had Ashley and Ricky. And she says that she's always felt like they were watching her. And she's even had UFO sightings that were at times when she saw the UFO sighting. ufo sightings that uh where at times when she saw the ufo sighting i if i'm reading it right or if i'm understanding her it feels like she has enough paranoia now where if she has what she considers a

ufo sighting she wonders if she actually just had been abducted and doesn't fucking remember it like true like her complete memory would have just wiped the memory. Yeah. So anyway, she says that she's seen things, but nothing really drastic has happened to her again. And it seems like since at least the 80s, she was telling them, like, stay away from my kids. And they listened. But what I mean, it just couldn't be more perfect timing. It's like the aliens really want to fuck with us because after 1984 or whatever, she didn't have any really, uh,

notable experiences until March, 2020. No, shut up. The beginning of the lockdown. So, uh, Laura was 62 and,

uh, she heard strange humming as she was falling asleep no and i think at that point after like once you're 62 maybe you're just hardened from some of the shit that you went through as a kid and she just fucking ignored it she was like i don't even want to fucking know at this point what are you gonna do i mean you can't stop it. There is a quote from her. This is a longer one, but it kind of ties everything together. But she heard humming is where we end with that. She fell asleep listening to some strange humming over her house. And when asked about it, she said, I was very tired, so I didn't think anything of it and never got up to look outside.

But last night, my daughter, Rachelachel sent me a message to call her right away keep in mind rachel might be the one that has some alien dna if if our theory might be correct yeah so it's interesting that maybe morgan's not being touched but rachel is or some of the kids are more affected than the others i don't know about ashley and ricky but rachel is having experiences which would also make it more credible that maybe laura's mom did know more than she let on so now that's three generations that we know of and four generations because rachel sent me a message to call her right away she said my granddaughter claire was the last one eating at the table last night and she noticed a humming sound and saw a black ball hovering outside her window. And they live two houses away from Laura.

Oh, no. So whatever humming Laura heard, Claire was also seeing. Oh, no. My son-in-law said that he'd seen it the night before they said it was humming or they said it was all black and round about four to six feet across and it had no visible lights they saw it hovering over a stump of a giant pine tree they had just cut down and it also went over their neighbor's yard behind that house and came back to their yard i'm guessing it may have been outside my house two nights ago when i heard the humming, which was the same night that they saw it. We live two doors away from each other. And also my son-in-law just told me that

the night he saw it, he was napping on the couch and woke up with their dog staring out the window and growling a low growl. And usually she barks loudly at everything. So he turned to see what she was looking at and outside the window saw the black ball above the tree stump it hovered very slowly towards him and as soon as it got a few feet away from his window it triggered the outside floodlights to come on so he got a good look at it but when their dog came in the room the thing took off fast so now two generations under laura are experiencing things And the person who wrote this article did vouch for Laura saying that she seemed very collected

and articulate and very convinced of her past and that Laura also was telling the story purely to tell her story and get it out there, not for any monetary reasons, just because she wanted people to hear about it.

I'm going to end on the creepiest thing to me is that very, very, very late in the game decades later after everything happened, and I guess Laura was more open about her experiences. Her sister Barbara came out and said, I was awake when I was floating down the stairs with you. Shut the front door. And we don't know anything else. Barbaraara we need we need more info babs come on we can't step it up this is your time to tell us what the hell is going on all we know is decades later she admitted that she was awake during the incident all those years that moment where barbara's like i have to tell you something in their 60s they're drinking lemonade on the porch the hottie toddies hottie

toddies sorry hot toddies hot toddies uh i uh yeah they're drinking on the porch rocking back and forth the movie ends yeah i have to tell you something oh so scary so scary i guess that means barbara can confirm that happened but i don don't know. Just another witness. That's all the info we got. Just another witness. So you've got a potential mom. You've got the sister. You've got Laura. You've got this genetic sister in space.

You've got Morgan, who's had an experience. You've got Rachel and Rachel's granddaughter and Rachel's husband. So that's eight people that have been affected by these aliens, not including those neighbors. To be a fly on the wall at that family reunion. Wow. I would pay big bucks to see this go down. Wow. Anyway, that was a long one,

but that was the abductions of Laura Clark. And Laura slash Rachel slash Claire, because you're probably within our podcast listenership audience demographics if you happen to be able to confirm any of this please let me know wow that is honestly one of the scarier ones you've told i as everyone knows i'm terrified of aliens terrified yeah fully believe shit happens and i'm wanna it's like i want to i'm fascinated so i want to learn more but i also have that weird theory that like the more you think and talk about it the more likely it is to be your for you to be a part of it so i don't know where i stand but yikes i know

i know you we've mentioned it a million times but like that the only thing scarier about it is that potentially to think about it is is gonna get you dangerous i know yikes okay well thank you for terrifying me um i'm gonna go to bed tonight and like fucking safety pin my covers onto myself i was gonna say duct tape yourself into bed i swear that was the weirdest feeling and i remember thinking like something's off and then all of a sudden my covers got yanked. Ugh. Ugh.

God. I don't envy you. That's awful. It's never. I've never had something like physically like that aggressive happen. No. I don't like it. I don't.

I don't envy you. I'm sorry that happened though. I don't know how to help also, which is one of the reasons I feel so bad. Because I'm like, if I could staple you into your mattress i know you'd staple me in and read me a bedtime story staple me in and then i'll tickle you while you're while you're locked in please don't that's maybe worse than an alien abduction i'm gonna be honest with you uh okay well i have a story for you that is uh probably even more horrifying so i apologize but here we are back in true crime world i have a story for you today this takes place in cleveland massive

trigger warnings uh for sexual assault rape bad times bad times so just a big heads up that um i know i that happens in a lot of stories i cover but this is just a little more detailed than usual okay so on october 29th 2009 police arrived at anthony sowell's home so well so well it's spelled like sowell so but it's pronounced so well got it anthony sowell's home on imperial street in cleveland ohio with a warrant to arrest him for Got it. Shit. saw a mound of dirt on top of the concrete flooring, and when they looked closer, they found four more bodies, both buried in this shallow grave in the basement and in other crawl spaces throughout the house. Okay.

Then they took to the backyard where they found three more bodies plus the remains of a fourth. Jesus Christ. Yeah. They also found a human skull in a bucket inside the house, which they lovingly showed without any warning on the Vice documentary. Very Vice of them. Just fucking here it is.

Yeah. Just a warning. Which now brought the body count in his home to 11. Yikes. Okay. So stop by to arrest him for a rape and find 11 bodies in his house. Wow. Yeah.

Not a moment too soon? I don't know. I don't know how that idiom works but that sounds right it feels like it's many moments too late though that's certainly certainly too late yes that i can't deny that so this is the story of the gruesome cleveland strangler wait so well the cleveland strangler i feel like i know that name yeah it's a very famous serial killer okay well there you have it and you're gonna know all about him in the next half hour yay yay so anthony so well was born on august 19th 1959 in east cleveland ohio he was one of seven children born to single mom claudia garrison and in this Vice doc, Vice doc in this Vice documentary, which is on YouTube,

they really delve into the background of the area. I mean, I'm familiar with the same kind of dynamic in Cleveland in the first half of the 20th century, a lot of black families moved to this part of Cleveland, East Cleveland from the south. But then in the 60s, white families, you know, migrated to the suburbs and over time the east cleveland area saw which had once been like beautiful and thriving saw the influx of drugs especially when crack cocaine kind of took the streets okay and uh this basically worked to just segregate the area further keep it under the thumb of poverty uh just you know it this is one of those stories that just shows the drastic you know difference in in how cases are handled and that kind of thing right right

so after so well's sister passed away from a chronic illness he was raised alongside her seven children as well so basically as a child he was raised alongside his seven nieces and nephews cool got it he was primarily raised by his mother claudia and his maternal grandmother irene and from a young age so well was witness to abuse so his nieces ramona and her twin leona said that a family friend would force them to strip butt naked and electrical extension cords were used to bind and whip them holy shit yeah and anthony was actually not beaten like he wasn't part of that but he was witness to it which is also traumatic obviously that you would witness your nieces you know suffering through this so although neighbor katie tabb

would say he was the kindest child you wanted to deal with he was always very respectable his family kind of had a different story they remembered him being conniving from a young age he would like drink his grandma's pepsi like when he was really little just which i was like okay well okay i did that but it's not like her malt liquor like vodka like you know some maybe he was just like a prankster or like goofy i guess i don't know yeah i guess maybe he just kind of got on people's nerves or like push buttons yeah he would drink his grandmother's pepsi he would start fights and then he would blame leona his niece and then she would get punished so i mean that much that that's more on the level that i was thinking of like got it not being a great uh kid he would

you know get his nieces in trouble and just let them be punished for things that he did so this side of him didn't really translate at school so a staff member of his school kirk junior high would later remember anthony was shy and skinny he was a little quiet and never wanted to start a conversation if you said hi he would say hi if you asked a question he would answer it he was friendly sort of in that he would smile whenever i looked in his direction um he wasn't known to be a ladies man this is from the school's recollection he'd often become the target of constant teasing about his lack of sexual experience he was basically bullied for being like not cool not you know, a ladies man. Yeah. It's just so weird to me. But OK.

So this was the narrative at school that he was kind of a nerd, kind of shy, not cool or anything. But at home, there was a different story. So according to Leona, Sowell would regularly take her upstairs to a bedroom in the house when they were preteens and would rape her. She said it was happening almost every day and she tried to report the rapes to authorities but no one believed her oh my god okay and here we begin on this lovely journey of infuriating lack of reaction lack of response to you know reports of these crimes so this is the beginning of it all uh she would try to report the rapes to authorities no one believed her on january 24th 1978 uh so well was 19 and he reported

for marine boot camp at paris island south carolina so there were two reasons that we kind of speculate as to why he left and went to join the Marines. A, he didn't have enough credits to graduate from high school. And B, he had apparently gotten a fellow high school student pregnant and wanted nothing to do with it. So he peaced out. Jeez. Okay. So after boot camp, Sowell reported for basic training and among kind of the courses or like the the training he went

through uh he took courses such as basic chokes and basic weapons of opportunity perfect unfortunately as you can probably guess this becomes relevant later uh so Sowell spent another month there learning electrical wiring and he was then assigned to the marine corps as an electrician so in 1980 at age 22 so well was sent to okinawa japan and upon returning he actually married a fellow marine kim yvette lawson and this was in 1981 and uh he stayed in the marines for about four more years before he left and although the marines said he went awol at like one point for two months so that was obviously not cool not something you're supposed to do and although they said he had gone awol for two months at one point

sergeant so well departed with a mountain of praise including a rifle sharpshooter award good conduct medal a certificate of commend including a rifle sharpshooter award good conduct medal a certificate of commendation and two letters of appreciation wow so okay at this point i'm fascinated because i'm like there are like six different versions that we're getting of this guy from different yeah i was gonna say it seems like we're not getting a i mean we're getting a full story but i don't know what what what. It doesn't like fit. Yeah. What's the right story or what's like the, what's the story that I should trust the most?

Like. Yeah. It feels conflicting. Like all of it doesn't add up. Right. Somehow. Yeah. No, that's how I felt as well.

Um, so he left the Marines with all this praise and strangely that same year, Kim pretty much right after he left the Marines with all this praise. And strangely, that same year, Kim, pretty much right after he left the Marines, divorced him. So Kim later reflected that during their time in the Marines, Soel was drinking excessively. And Kim said she had married him to help him. Her daughter later explained that her mother didn't want him to get a dishonorable discharge. She was trying to get him through the Marine Corps. And that's why she divorced him the day he got out. Oh, okay. So interesting.

I mean, everyone has, I guess, reasons for what they do, but clearly there was a lot going on behind the scenes during their marriage. I mean, to the second he takes off the uniform for the last time, you're like, here are your divorce papers. I'm fucking over it. It's not working anymore. Yeah, I'm over it's not working anymore yeah i'm over it i tried um and you know the the cliche of you can't change somebody you can't fix somebody it's just like extra you know obvious here i guess yeah so in 1985 he had returned home to cleveland but the city was pretty much changed it was changed pretty radically from what

it had been seven years before when he had last lived there. So in 1985, when he was back, a quarter of the population of East Cleveland now lived below poverty level. And 90% of the population were black, which plays again into the treatment of this case and the handling by police. And so it was also a time, like I said, when crack cocaine had taken kind of hold of the area. Crack was sort of a new thing on the scene, new smokable, potent form of cocaine. And with its introduction, crime rates rose drastically. There was now also a new subset of folks with addictions, which were sex workers who worked in exchange for crack cocaine and that was something that

hadn't it was like a new phenomenon that that subset kind of hadn't existed before right so this is like a whole new angle to addiction to crime to you know having to live on the streets all that all that stuff so kind of adds a picture or more detail to the picture totally so into this new kind of changed east cleveland arrived 25 year old so well who had just served a seven-year military regimen divorced after four years from a wife who had worried about his boozing and a man who according to documents court documents was accused of ducking his responsibilities as the father of a now seven-year-old from the high school pregnancy he had co-created. Got it. Okay. So basically that child ended up being born and he was accused of abandoning his responsibilities in taking care of the child.

Sure. So Sowell went back to his heavy drinking. He would start drinking first thing in the morning, and he became increasingly aggressive when he drank. And that surfaced in 1988 when police arrested Sowell on a charge of domestic violence against a woman whose name we actually don't know. He served eight days in jail. And as this was happening, meanwhile, in the background, terror was taking over East Cleveland.

Meanwhile, in the background, terror was taking over East Cleveland. So in May of 1988, the body of 36-year-old Rosalind Garner was found in her home on Hayden Avenue. She had been strangled. Carmela Karen Prater, age 27, was found in an abandoned home on First Avenue on February 27th, 1989. So the year after and the cause of her death is unknown and then only a month later on march 28th the body of another woman named mary thomas 27 was found near an abandoned building also on first avenue and she had been strangled with a red ribbon so jesus these all took place in less than a year these three right in the same neighborhood same area and uh i want to be clear here that has never been definitively these murders have never been definitively linked to Sowell.

But the MO kind of signifies that they could have been. It's implied. It's suggested. Yeah, it's definitely some people. Yeah, assume it was him, but there's definitely no outright proof. outright proof however even if it wasn't him it kind of gives you another insight into like the tension and the terror that was happening in the neighborhood even if sure these specific crimes weren't done by him this was still happening in the neighborhood where he was living and operating so just a bad time just a bad time not good tough times tough times um so while all these murders were going on uh and even though we don't necessarily know whether they had been committed by so well uh he was

definitely guilty of another crime by this point in that he had raped a 21 year old woman who was three months pregnant she told her story to authorities four months after mary thomas's body was discovered so basically he was directly linked to this crime and this was happening right in the midst of these other crimes so just to give you an idea of like why some people believe that he was involved in the other three as well okay so she told her story and this is what she told police on july 22nd 1989 so well met her at a motel and told her that her boyfriend was waiting for her at soulell's house about 500 yards away. So she went with him, entered the house, and he threw her on his bed, choked her, and raped her repeatedly.

Probably goes without saying, but her boyfriend was not at Sowell's house. It was obviously his ruse, his lie to get her into his home. And when she tried to leave, Sowell bound her hands with a necktie cinched a belt around her feet and stuffed a rag in her mouth and thankfully when so well who had been drinking fell asleep she was able to wriggle free and escape out of a window jeez thank god so yeah i know and it's like horrible because you in the documentaries you see people retelling like the trauma of what happened and then there were so many people who didn't make it it's just it's really sick that's awful um so a grand jury indicted so well for this

case but he didn't show up for his court date so on december 8th the court issued an arrest warrant but he was nowhere to be found then seven months later and only four miles away, another woman came forward saying Sowell raped her, too. So at 1 a.m. on June 24th, 1990, the 31-year-old woman told police she went to a house in East Cleveland. She sat beside Sowell on a love seat, and they started drinking, hanging out. came up behind her and started choking her spewing a stream of obscene descriptions of sex acts how and where he would violate her and announcing that she was his bitch and she had better learn to like it oh my god it gets worse here uh obviously of course it always does he dragged her upstairs by the neck uh he raped her orally vaginally and anally and even after the woman told him she was five months pregnant and begged him to stop he instead forced her to say

yes sir i like it oh my god oh my god that's so terrible oh my god yeah it's an extra violating gruesome retelling today wow fuck that guy oh my god yeah and it's one of those things where you know i don't like to repeat it or say it but this was her testimony and the story that she want wants to tell on the documentaries in court um and so it's sort of like you know this is the story she wants told and yeah no i feel like that's a small thing i can do is at least tell it how she wants it to be told i get it so wow it's it's really horrific and it's tough to say and think about so i apologize if i'm ruining everyone's day uh because i'm sure i am so i'm so if she were to ever hear this i'm so sorry that happened to you yeah it's uh it's really rough to watch them retell the stories in in court and on in the interviews it's very um

sobering and and dark so so well uh you know after all this he went to sleep and the woman was able to leave and when she returned with police at 8 a.m he was still sleeping the police arrested him but charges were never filed because they couldn't find the woman to testify and this seems to become a pattern of letting so well go because women were either too traumatized or terrified to testify or they were too scared to speak to police. Or even though the evidence was right there in front of them, the witness was too scared to say anything. And so he was let go over and over again, which is just so infuriating. over and over again which is just so infuriating uh so the police finally even though um they weren't able to get or they didn't get him on this charge they had finally found him because he had gone missing when they originally when the grand jury indicted him for that rape so they

finally had him for that and so i was in jail awaiting trial on those charges and he did eventually plead guilty to attempted rape which is not even bare minimum and on september 12th 1990 a judge sentenced him to 15 years in prison and he actually remained in prison for 15 years and then in 2005 he was released he was supposed to be clean and sober a psychological evaluation deemed him unlikely to rape again okay yeah i think we can see where this is going but he had to register as a sex offender and report to the cuyahoga county cuyahoga county sheriff's office once a year but not shockingly at all he did not leave prison a changed man he pretty much immediately began targeting sex workers.

So according to four women suffering from drug addictions who had encounters with Sowell, he would offer women malt liquor, companionship, and shelter from the danger of the streets on Cleveland's east side. So he basically took vulnerable people and offered them help and care, you know, and took advantage of that, yeah sorry i'm just like so fucking no i mean bummed out i can't expect you to say anything you know it's like i'm just waiting for the next horrible thing to come out of your mouth christine it'll keep happening it'll keep coming jesus okay sorry no no it's your job. Glad you know. I'm glad you know what's coming here. Yeah. Yikes.

Just worse and worse and worse until the end. Great. So let's see. He would offer them companionship, shelter. And then if he ever felt, so he was very kind to them until, if he ever felt betrayed by anyone he was trying to help, he would begin terrorizing, attacking, or raping them. Oh my God. Two women told police he would

turn on them as quickly as he had befriended them so like one wrong move and he would find an excuse to violate you or hurt you in some way jesus yeah so out of prison so well rented out space in the home of his uh stepmother his late father's widow who was a stepmom he started dating women who lived or hung out in the neighborhood one of whom was tanya dos who lived across the street from him and at this time tanya dos said he did not use crack cocaine but she and tone she called anthony tone drank beer played chess barbecued he told dos he had been in prison but that he had served a crime committed by someone else so she was under the impression that like he had been falsely accused and he actually wasn't a criminal which obviously is the farthest thing from the truth he uh dos tanya dos would later

say he seemed like a regular human being so it really does seem like he's able to kind of dupe people right throughout all of this which is like extra scary seems very uh he's kind of got that weird killer charming thing charm yeah yeah like he's able to swindle you yeah yeah like make you feel comfortable with him it just always adds like such an element of creepiness it's just the the ability to so easily manipulate another person is really disturbing and it makes it extra disgusting when it's like people who are suffering from drug addictions or poverty or people who need help yeah people who are already going through like this is the last thing they fucking need yes they're like so vulnerable and you take advantage of that it's just extra gross

so um anyway she was saying i thought he was just a normal guy i never knew all this had been going on and it was around this time that so well began dating a woman named laurie frazier so interestingly enough laurie was actually the niece of cleveland's mayor frank jackson huh so interesting climbed his way to i don't know local local politics great yeah great so he and laurie dated until around 2007 2008 and laurie frazier even remembered later he took good care of me good care of me so according to tanya doss frazier and so well lived together in what looked like a normal quote-unquote normal you know she already said he seemed like a regular guy monogamous relationship uh it seemed as if

frazier actually might have been leading him down a life of more stability he got a job as a rubber molder at a place called custom rubber corp interesting and yeah and you don't think of that as like a i don't know know, a thing, but I guess someone has to mold the rubber. Oh, well, that's like, that was the room I always wanted to work in at ISS. I've always- Oh, interesting. They would call it the rubber room.

I was like, damn, I always wanted to work in the rubber room. Isn't rubber room also like a, what you say about an insane asylum or whatever? Those old timey- Oh, I don't know. I never, I only knew it as like the room where you make rubber so let me see i just want to make sure i got that right i would have thought it would be like a like a like a leather sex dungeon well i guess i don't know why because rubber and leather are not the same oh here we go yeah uh rubber room informal a room padded with

foam rubber for the confinement of a violent mentally ill person that's what they used to never that's what they used to call in the old timey quote-unquote like um insane asylums where they had the white room padded rooms i had no idea i really just thought it was because we made fucking rubber i i'm so stupid no i mean it's i think it mean, it's, I think it's like a, I don't think it's like an official term or anything, but. Well, hopefully that's not offensive to anybody. I really just thought like, oh, the room where we make rubber,

obviously it'd be called the rubber room. So it makes some sense. But no, it's, it's, I, I think that's, that's like the only redeeming, redeeming quality thus far about him is that I always wanted to be a rubber molder when I worked at ISS. And that's the last good thing I'll say about him. How sweet.

Yeah. So he worked at this rubber company, molding rubber, and the president, Charlie Braun, later recalled that he was a very good employee. So again, just like a conflicting outlook from a different person in his life. Right. just like a conflicting outlook from a different person in his life right so his girlfriend laurie frazier uh everything to her seemed pretty positive until 2007 when his personal and work lives started to kind of unravel and simultaneously women on or near imperial avenue where he lived began to go missing this all started with crystal dozier she was a 35 year old mother of seven who went missing on may 17 2007 in july 2007 after so well didn't show up for work two days in a row

he was fired by custom rubber products corp and suddenly he didn't have a steady job so his means of self self-support drastically changed he began collecting and selling scrap metal and collecting unemployment benefits and once those checks started rolling in he was using them to buy crack cocaine and that is where his uh addiction began so he had not been using crack cocaine until now got it okay so it was also around this time that so well's next door Got it. Okay. But so local councilman Zach Reed, his next door neighbor, first complained right around this time about a horrible odor that permeated the street of Imperial Avenue. Okay. Well, I think I could bet money on what that smell is. It was the rubber room.

No, it was not the rubber room. I wish it was, but it's not. At first, nobody thought much of it. And because it was a lower economic area and complaints simply were not given the attention they deserved there, it just kind of largely went ignored. So no matter how many times people would complain, people dismissed it, you know, authorities dismissed it, and it just kind of became a nuisance that people just had to deal with. So in late 07, early 2008, Sowell ended a nearly three-year relationship with laurie frazier and in retrospect laurie claims to have smelled the stench of what she thought she kind of realized later like i think that was the smell of decaying bodies that was like her gut instinct yeah laurie i think so laurie i think you're on to something but Sowell told her, no, that's just the smell coming from my stepmother.

Oh my God. She smelled like a dead fucking body. That I literally wrote in my notes. It gives new meaning to that phrase. She smelled. Don't worry, my stepmother. Just poor stepmother. Leave her out of this.

She still smells like a dead fucking body. Can you imagine hearing that in hindsight and being like, what the fuck did I like what yeah how did i let you live in my house how did i get dragged into this what is going on it's awful and so that's what he like insisted was happening and when laurie moved out she dismissed it basically is coming from uh the neighboring sausage shop there was a place called ray's sausage shop next door and i'm thinking shouldn't he just have used that as an excuse it's a better season it's my stepmom like to say i live next door to a literal sausage shop like to say that i'm i live next to a place that probably has some rotten meat in their dumpster or something like and not oh, my stepmom smells like the sausage factory after a bad batch.

Yeah, it's so just extra rude. Like, it's so not important, but like so rude. It is so rude. Yeah. So Lori was like, yeah, he was telling me all these things and I just kind of dismissed it. But as we probably know, Lori's first instinct had actually been correct so it would not come as a surprise to any of us that more women around this time went missing so Tashauna Culver was last seen in June of 2008 she was 33 years old and she had drifted in and out of her family's life so often that it had gotten to the point where they stopped

reporting her missing which is just extra sad because at a certain point they just assumed she would come back and she never did so sad it is it's really really really sad and then there was lashonda long who was last seen august 08 she was 17 and at the age of 17 she had three kids but was deemed unfit to raise them and she at 17 was the youngest of all of so well's victims jesus yikes okay then there was michelle mason who was last seen uh in october of 08 before she went missing the 45 year old had experienced a pretty like triumphant kind of comeback period in her life she had kicked her heroin and crack addictions she was living independently she hadn't been arrested in years like she was very proud of having turned her life around and um then she

you know became a victim of so else that's so sad it's all very very very tragic none of it's happy but i mean just like i have nothing else to say i like i'm just like yikes every time just it's just yikes tmtm the entire story yes um and then there was tonya carmichael who's 53 and was last seen november 10th 08 uh and although these women going missing weren't linked to so well yet there were other cases at the time that were clearly linked to him but how fun we're being fully dismissed by police right so here's an example on december 8 2008 a bleeding woman literally runs up to a police car and tells police that Anthony Sowell asked her if she wanted to have a beer with him.

And when she said no, he punched her, choked her, and tried to rip off her clothes. Oh my God. Police went to Sowell's home, arrested him. However, police later said no charges were filed because the woman didn't want to talk to detectives. Oh my God. Okay. okay i'm like she's covered in blood she already told you what happened i understand like it would be helpful to have somebody re like you know recount things but like this person has been traumatized probably doesn't have a great experience with police for obvious reasons and now you're demanding she like walk you through this all over again it's

it's just infuriating how often this guy just gets off the hook because yeah because of situations like this yeah so however while these women were being attacked and uh some obviously murdered tragically in the meantime so well had joined an online dating service and uh his biography on the website revealed like his profile revealed that he was a master looking for a submissive person to train which like that's not what you're doing no like that's not what this is like that is not like that other that one really really really extra awful one earlier when he like went up behind someone and said like like was really demeaning to her and like yeah that was not a consensual experience no no no no you're not like he's making it come off as like a bdsm like relation like partnership and it's like

that's not what yeah any of this has been really fucking insulting to the bdsm yeah it is i mean it is i i can't imagine like the only time you're ever like anyone's ever hearing about this kind of stuff is just through like serial killers i mean anyways just an extra kick in the crotch to them but okay so he is full-blown lying but yeah he's making up some uh excuse as to what he's doing did he do we know if he legitimately thought that he was doing that or no i don't think so i think he just was trying to find a way to get people to come over. He was always making up lies about like, hey, I have beer. Hey, I have shelter for you.

Hey, I have, I don't know. Yeah, okay. I just wanted to confirm that he knew what he was up to. But also, I'm assuming he knew what he was up to. Master manipulator. Yeah. So meanwhile, his house was the site of regular neighborly cookouts neighbors would come to play chess and drink together and

hang out and during these party months two women came forward saying they had gone to his place for a good time but then things turned violent one of the women was tanya das his across the street neighbor whom he had dated for a while and she would later say in interviews and to police that so well attacked her on april 21st of 09 saying he slapped her choked her and forced her to strip naked after he ran out of crack she curled up on a bed and eventually he left her alone and she was able to get away and it was around this time that so well also started using alcohol and drugs to lure women with criminal pasts to his house. So typically these encounters began unthreateningly, but they would turn violent once the beer and drugs ran out.

Or if they asked him any question that he thought was he didn't like or, you know, anything, anything, anything. You're not safe, right? Like there's nothing you're not doing anything wrong. He's just picking and choosing. He could very well have just been like, I don't like your fucking face and just exactly exactly yeah yeah so he was just kind of finding any excuse to you know go off the rails on september 22nd of 09 so well persuades a woman named latundra billups to come over but he becomes angry he hits her chokes her and rapes her as she passes out fortunately she is able to get away after promising him 50 she said i'm gonna go get 50 i'll bring it to you

and i won't tell police about the incident of course he lets her go and she goes to police to tell her about tell them about the incident okay good yeah however uh progress with the case was slow because according to police the victim was difficult to reach oh my god i don't even know what that means what okay yeah next it just is so easily all these are so easily dismissed and this is i mean how many times has somebody come up to police and said this guy has raped me and it's like well i wonder let him go home again i I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. It's infuriating. During this time, however, on October 20th, 09, an ambulance is sent to Sowell's house after neighbors called 911 to report a naked woman falling from a second story window.

Sowell tells rescue workers he and the woman had been doing drugs and that she accidentally fell out of the window but ems takes the woman to the hospital and calls police who go to his home but so well has fled he is not there convenient very convenient police then go to the hospital where the woman refuses to talk to investigators and then nine days later october 29th police finally get a warrant they enter enter Sowell's house. And this is when all of this comes full circle to the beginning of these notes. As we'd already covered in 07, one woman had gone missing. In 08, four women had disappeared. And then throughout 09, Sowell had murdered another six women.

So all of this kind of culminates in their, you know, finally making it into his home and seeing the carnage and everything that he's done. Some of the women that he had murdered, the six women that he had murdered throughout 2009, six in one year, are as follows. Kim Y. Smith was last seen January 17th of 09. She never married. She was actually the only one of his 11 victims who didn't have children. And friends described her as the artsy type. Then there was Nancy Cobbs, 44, who was last seen on April 24th, 2009. Before she developed an addiction to drugs, she had been an active mother of three children.

Amy Hunter was last seen in spring of 2009, and in her final years, according to her family, she had felt overcome by life's troubles and had sort of retreated into a house near where so well lived then there was janice webb who was last seen in june of 09 and before 48 year old janice had developed her uh crack cocaine addiction she was known as the family jokester she loved to pull pranks and she loved being with family and then there was talatia fortson who was last seen on june 3rd of 09 her biological mother struggled with a drug addiction and her father suffered from alcoholism according to friends and uh she had already kind of had a tough life and was a mother of three and was found dead at only 31 years old and finally uh there was diane turner who was last heard from in september of

2009 she was 38 and she was the last of the victims to go missing and her remains lingered unidentified in the Cuyahoga County Coroner's Office the longest. It took more than a month to confirm her identity because she had been so removed from her family, like her connections with her family were pretty tattered. And so it took them a while to find someone to identify the body. So all of these women's bodies, took them a while to find someone to identify the body so all these women's bodies all of the above were found that one day in anthony sowell's house either in the house or buried nearby in the backyard in shallow graves and just as a refresher that means they found 11 bodies on his property that day and this is in addition to all of the women who had escaped and you know

said they had been raped and attacked so the 11 were just the ones that he had murdered and my god that you know isn't even part of the bigger or that's only a part of the bigger count of his crimes so two days later october 31st he they finally found and arrested so well he was charged with 85 counts of murder, rape, and kidnapping. Wow. I know. It's like when you hear it all kind of together, like 11 bodies. And it's just outrageous.

Oh, my God. First, he pleaded not guilty by reason of insanity. But then he later changed his plea to simply not guilty. OK. plea to simply not guilty okay on july 22nd of 2011 he was convicted on all but two counts against him including the murders of the 11 women whose bodies were found in his house and on august 10th jurors recommended the death penalty and on august 12th the judge upheld this recommendation for the death penalty wow however so he had served 10 years until last month, February of 2021, when he died of an undisclosed terminal illness. Okay.

So as he was on death row, he served 10 years and he died last month. So it's kind of coming back into the news a little bit because of his death. Got it. Okay. Wow. But that is the story. It is heinous, horrendous. There are a couple documentaries if you're interested.

There is the one I mentioned the vice documentary um and that one's good because i mean i really like that one because the guy who covers it talks about how he grew up in cleveland he's black his parents were police officers during this time and so he has a very like unique connection to the area, to the families, the time, the families that even the police investigation because he, you know, has family in the force. So it's very interesting, like how he gets to approach it from such a personal standpoint. So I really like that. It's on YouTube. It's called The Cleveland Strangler.

I was gonna say, I really I always love a good Vice documentary. They do them so well. I know they do. And like, I know they get a bad rap and sometimes I like, it's just like an eye roll because they're like, we're so edgy. Yeah. But I think like this, they do have a great team of, you know, editors and researchers. And this was definitely really well done.

And so I definitely recommend. And, you know, he talks one-on-one a lot with the kids and parents and friends of the victims, which is really cool to see, like, just like to humanize them a bit, you know, because obviously we see victims like who are sex workers who have drug addictions. And oftentimes by the media, they get kind of lumped into just kind of a dismissed group who aren't taken as seriously but uh it's it's cool to be able to see you know their backgrounds their families and learn more about them so there's that and there's also one called unseen so definitely if you want to learn more check it out wow that was a really heavy one but it's a lot uh yeah my bad no i mean needed to be told but wow that was that was a tall order uh yeah that was a roughy uh that was you know one of the worst serial killers in cleveland history well i'm glad i didn't tell that at our cleveland show can you imagine and

i told the torso killer and like obviously that was hein that was heinous. But like, yeah, thank God I didn't do this one. Thank God when, you know, we pick up live shows again, we are not trying to tell horrific stories on stage and then expect positive reactions. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What a time that was. Oh, my gosh. Anyway, I don't know. I don't know so that's that that's on that thanks for listening thank you and you can check out all of our stuff at and that's why

you can follow our socials or it's at wwd podcast please follow our patreon um always good stuff there and as of tomorrow christine and i are opening many many many uh fan mail packages and oh i'm so excited we're finally getting to them over zoom so we're uh just just a note that we are those will be up soon on patreon so yes and uh eva and jess have come up with some really fun stuff that they do i mean there's obviously the patreon newsletter uh which is really fun and has some like fun perks and stuff and then on patreon as well we're doing uh on wednesdays we're doing like alternate titles to episodes that eva came up with but that didn't get picked um and people can like vote on their favorites or add their own titles they come up

with which i always have a really fun time reading and And then every Saturday now, Em and I are giving three clues about the next day's topic to see if anyone can guess kind of what we're covering. So a lot of fun stuff. Sneak peek Saturdays as I'm trying to coin it. But I think that's what it's called. So good job.

Thank you. Well, do you want to shout out those places people can donate again? Oh, absolutely. Great idea. And then we will also put um put those in the show notes as well oops sorry i'm sorry i know you probably already closed out of your notes but i don't know why i never do that and today i think i was just like overwhelmed and i just hit

like quit quit pages please escape please escape escape escape escape uh so yes i will definitely uh oh wait this is not this is my beach too sandy notes it says bagel shop so like we get it christine also has a show called beach too sandy go listen to it and none of them are well uh organized or you know professionally monitored or taken care of okay so here we go. Here are a couple sources in my long rant. So there is the Asian Americans Advancing Justice Fund in Atlanta that has a fund dedicated to helping people in the Atlantic area, Asian Americans in the Atlantic area, as well as the Community Action Fund, which is set up by Hate is a Virus. And you can donate to both of those. They're still trying to reach their goal. So definitely worth checking out. There are also several GoFundMes. I think GoFundMe actually created their own fund called like Stop Asian Hate. That is definitely

worth checking out. And then a website that I really recommend and that I've bookmarked myself is called StopAAPIHate.com. And there you can not only learn more about the movement but also report any hate incidents you might witness or um you know see in your day-to-day life that are that need to be spoken up about so we'll put that in the show notes but otherwise um thanks for you know listening and checking that out and let's see let's do what we can do yeah for the world because it needs some help a lot of help all right everyone and everyone. And? Now I'm hitting escape. And? Escape. That's why we.

Escape. I was trying to escape the show. It wouldn't let me out. Drink.