And That's Why We Drink - E25 Ghostly Frenemies and Alcala-ism

Episode Date: July 23, 2017

We’re officially 25 episodes deep! Em tells us about all the ghosts of the White House. Christine senses a large hat when Honest Abe shows up, and a naked Winston Churchill gives him a run for his money.Christine tells the story of the mo-fo Rodney Alcala, also known as the Dating Game Killer. This one sounds like a made-for-TV movie, but we promise it’s all real. And that’s why we drink!

booba-ba-dee-boop do you remember that show well i don't even want to say it because i'm definitely too old to even know what the fucking show is the boobas or whatever it was those like gumdrop looking things they're like the teletubbies but for the next generation i'm pretty sure you made that up no i swear to god there were like these weird colored gumdrops and they jump and they're like why do you know about that i'm babysitting i was gonna say you don't even smoke drugs like i don't know how you know it looks really fucking, and they make even weirder sounds than the Teletubbies. Do you like how I just said you don't smoke drugs? Like, I'm pretending.

No, but I snort them, for sure. Oh, right. Just crush them up the way Mom taught me. Yeah, yeah. Just put them in your milkshake. Yeah, that's exactly what I do. That's why I have a straw in everything. Nice. nice how's your milkshake it's about to be really good it's gonna be in a glass in a glass m just

poured her milkshake into a wine glass a linda wine glass bob's burgers because i just found out that i can't even breathe thinking about it that blaze and my brother and I were approved for a house to move into a house it's renting we're not owning the house but it has a big backyard for geo and I like cried because we wanted it so badly and there were like 40 applicants and she just emailed us so I opened the champagne and I'm drinking my milkshake out of a wine glass to celebrate yes um this wasn't the reason i originally drank but i'm gonna say it now did you know that my entire milkshake can fit in one small wine glass all right you drank some of it i watched i had two

gulps and i and now it all fits in a wine glass i feel gypped big old wine glass no it's not i've seen you drink out of bigger look you're drinking at a bigger right now. All right. Don't bring me into this conversation. Okay. Speaking of the wine glass I'm drinking out of, I want to say thank you because I was just really overwhelmed this week. I got two packages. Um, I got one surprise package from Chelsea.

Hi Chelsea. And she sent me this wine glass that I'm currently drinking out of that says engaged AF. I love it. I love it. I love it. And it's a big one, too. You can have so many drinks in that all at one time. It's a freaking huge glass.

And I was so excited and surprised. So thank you, Chelsea. And then we also got a package from Lisa G in Norway. She mailed us something all the way from Norway. And she's one of our OG listeners. Yep. She's an OG. She's been following us since the beginning. Sheiled us norwegian chocolate which is the greatest thing

and she gave us uh geo she gave geo dog treats from norway he loves them too he does he'll that's the only treat right now that he'll roll over for oh well thank you lisa for that gift thank you and postcards of norway they're super cute thank you guys so much for our gifts we would have opened them on air however i came to christine's apartment and she was like i couldn't wait i opened gifts i couldn't i couldn't wait that's why you're not getting a reveal my spidey senses said there was chocolate inside them um also uh i want to say a thing. Okay. We'll say it then. Jessica R-R-R-Rabbit on Instagram. R-R-R-Rabbit?

R-R-R-Rabbit. Like, cha-cha-cha-chia. Yeah, got it, got it, got it. She wants to wish her friend Jillian a happy birthday. Aww. And they've been listening. Are we doing shout-outs for people now, too? No, she just wrote and was like, it's my best friend's birthday. We've been listening to you since the beginning.

And she's like, you should find jillian murder to surprise her and i was like i can't i looked it up and i'm like i can't really find anything jill rhymes with kill does that help oh kill jill oh well okay we don't know happy birthday jill sorry but all the jillian stories were like about like victims and i'm like this is a little upsetting but happy birthday jillian um and speaking of mail we have a new mailbox i don't want anyone to send stuff to our old mailbox anymore because it's going to get returned and i'm going to be really sad yeah we were wondering how we were going to do this because let's say someone started listening to our podcast today and they start on episode one they might send shit to the wrong place and they're not going to find out for 25 episodes that they did the wrong thing so if everyone could spread the word that'd be great that uh if you send something to the original po box it's not going to come to us anymore

right our new number is 265 so it's the same address 1920 hillhurst ave uh blip blip blip number 265 los angeles california 90027 but it's the same place just a different number so now it's number 265 so just saying i have been rudely on my phone this entire time because i'm trying to find a message that we got but it was somewhere through my instagram and i can't find it now so i'm just going to paraphrase okay but we have a listener that I went to college with. Her name is Rachel. And she wrote us something really, really nice. Oh, I just found it as I'm talking about it.

Thank God, because I was going to butcher that paraphrasing. I was waiting for it. Okay. So she, and I told her I would read this in the next episode because it's very nice. Okay. She wrote, I need you to know that I'm obsessed with your podcast and I've been listening to it rather than music lately. It's amazing and I love all the stories.

I regularly laugh out loud by myself in the car and people look crazy. People think I look crazy when I'm stuck in traffic with them. Thanks for making it and please never stop. That was very sweet. Thank you. What's your name? Rachel. Thank you, Rachel.

Last really important thing that I have to say. Classic Kevin has a blog. Shut the fuck up. Listen. CK's got a blog say classic kevin has a blog shut the fuck up listen ck's got a blog ck's got a blog it's uh called uk myths and monsters dot wordpress.com i read the first uh post about nessie loch ness monster oh you emailed me that yeah yeah yeah i read it i i'm sure you did no no i really did no i really. I just also didn't ever respond to you. But it's amazing and hilarious. And I actually laughed out loud like three times when I was reading it.

So check it out because we love our CK. We love CK. We love you, CK. He's a good boy. And the blog is hilarious and amazing. All right. Em, I feel like you have a story to tell me. Are you ready?

You guys just like I'm sweating already. Just please brace yourselves if anyone followed me on uh instagram oh god uh you saw i was in the er this weekend oh my god i'm already ready to kill you okay go on okay so i drink for a good reason i drink for a bad reason and they're combined yeah the good reason is two episodes ago, we had Christine's college roommate, Allison, on the show. Hell pal. And now she's not just Christine's roommate from college. She's my girlfriend.

Hey! Here. So that worked out. Pick up your milkshake wine glass. Yeah. That's what I have to say. That's how I feel okay so i was kind of i was kind of salty at first because they were like hanging out without me all the time but now they're actually dating and we are and i haven't

dated anyone a long time makes me really she's a keeper she's she's a good she's a good one guys does this mean people will start sliding more into my dms because you're not single probably well i don't know i'm still i'm still more on the market than you since you're engaged fair point you know i mean we're getting there we're getting there i'm pulling you toward my life but i i am i am now unavailable wow i'm taken you're like an away message on on a.m with like the little asterisks and the squiggles on the outside yeah like mom's making me eat dinner but really i have a text it you know who you are i hate you you know who you are megan all right sorry please go on

okay so that's the good news i am in a relationship with a very very amazing person and i owe christine my life is is what that probably means to Christine. I keep making it about myself. I'm really a philanthropist. What's it like to know your college best friend and your grad school best friend are dating? You set that shit up from five years ago? You know, it really, I think, shines a light on me as a person. I think that it really reflects, you know, my... Just who you are.

...philanthropic view and my... We were just magnets that got pulled into your own jaw. Yes, exactly. I'm the center of all of this. Right, right. Anyway, on to the bad news. Uh-oh. Let's just get there.

So, being... You guys broke up. Yep, that's it. What if you break up? It's over. Well, that was the good and the bad all at once. Well, we probably should have broken up because Allison got to see a side of me that not many people do. Oh, no.

So let me just get settled in for this. Please situate your tree trunk legs. Is that what we call them? tarantula legs tree trunk makes me feel insecure tarantula doesn't no tarantula means they're like long and limber tree trunk means they're like they're put for life okay fine i'll call you the inflatable tube man like whatever you whatever you want okay so maybe i'm biased because it's a brand new relationship and i just think she's just hung the moon but she was very sweet to me uh when we first started talking and i was telling her how i'm homesick a lot and how i really like miss um going out and having bonfires

and camping and all this stuff so i was at work uh last week and she texted me and she said uh we're going camping this weekend like just totally set it up was just super good about it and we had everything arranged and we were we agree that it was like the best date either of us had been on and ever forever and we went on this walk and we saw the sunset by these really pretty mountains. Where were you, by the way? It was like an hour out of here. East? The direction doesn't matter, but it was a far distance, as you'll hear in the rest of the story. Oh, no.

I told you. Listen, I've told enough fucking stories on this show. I tell everyone not to go camping. Everyone does it anyway. Okay, no. For the record, the camping was never the issue. We had a great time camping. Everything was set up. We pitched the tent. We had a great time camping. Everything was set up.

We pitched the tent. We had a fire. We did s'mores. We walked around a bit. We, like, looked at the stars and had a very, very, you know, blah, blah, blah, mushy, gushy, heartfelt conversation under the stars. And so everything went well. And then it took a sharp left turn. Oh, no.

When we decided we were going to, like, go down to the communal bathroom. They're like, okay, well, let's just, you know, go to the bathroom, come back, keep having a fire, have a good time. And I went to the bathroom. And I left the bathroom. And then two seconds later, I realized I had to go to the bathroom again. Uh-oh, I know where this is going. And then, so i went back and then i realized four more times as soon as i stepped out of the bathroom i had to go again oh no and i was like oh no something's not something's not good something's

not right no um so i tried to play it play it cool i was like this something does not feel good and uh it started getting late i was like dealing with it i sat by the fire for a while and i just kept running back and forth to the outhouse by the way not a bathroom like i'm saying truly a cellared off room with a bucket into the floor that's what you get for missing virginia i'm sorry and there were flies in this outhouse that I... Oh! Christine, I've never had tens of flies hitting my naked legs while my pants are down and I'm trying to pee. I'm cringing. They were just like hitting me and buzzing. It was truly exorcist status.

I'm cringing. So after we decide, okay, let's just go to bed. I'm not feeling right. Let's just like hang out in the tent and go to bed. She fell asleep. I caught it and got maybe maybe about an hour an hour or so of sleep and then i was like i cannot stand it i have to go back down to this quote bathroom and pee again so i ended up doing that about you know nine or ten times and every time it hurt worse and worse to a point where i was crying in the middle of the night and the outhouse is not close i had to walk like a good 10 sites away oh god so non-stop i'm like

making these 20 minute trips and uh i was like i'm not gonna wake her up like i feel so fucking bad like this is our first official date because by the way we were only officially together for about 10 hours at this point oh my god so i was like this is our first real date together as like a couple and i don't want it to like be ruined so by like two three in the morning i can't even lie down in the tent and pretend i'm gonna be okay i'm just sitting at the picnic table outside of the tent and at some point she wakes up she's's like, we're leaving. Like, we're going. Like, you don't feel good. So she just handled it. Just fucking took care of it.

So she picks me up at, this is where it starts getting fucking funny. Oh, no. Oh, no. She picks me up at the outhouse. I just get in the car. And I have now mentally prepared myself. Because in case no one has picked up on this, was a raging uti in case no one like knew what was happening yet my body hurt like hurts just thinking about it oh yeah it was the worst

and i've i've had them before this was like the worst of the worst utis and then i got in the car and mentally remembered that i wouldn't have the access to a bathroom for at least an hour so my whole body decided that it thought I was pissing my pants for an hour. Oh no. And so my girlfriend of 10 hours is in the car. She's in my car. She took my car and she's flying through the canyons. Like it's a 40 mile drive. And she's literally, the car screeched at one point, like she was, she was truly saving my life. And I remember being in so much pain that I was actually tunnel visioning, right?

I could see actual stars and I, I really, I didn't say it out loud to her cause I didn't want to freak her out. But I was like, I think I'm dying. I was like, I'm pretty sure I'm dying. Oh my God. And as I'm thinking it out loud, she's like, you better not fucking pass out cause I will lose my shit so i tried very hard not to pass out i sat there white knuckling the door the entire time like just lamaze breathing i'm straight up zen breathing trying to get my shit together

and we have there was no service so we didn't know where we were going oh no so all we knew was it was an hour away to the nearest anything with a bathroom and she's trying so hard to keep her shit together but i'm in the truly the most pain i've ever felt in my life so my anxiety is through the roof i'm like sitting there just sweating because it hurts so much and she's trying so hard to keep her shit together and drive as fast as she can but she doesn't know where she's going oh my god it's so i can see her like i can't i can i'm watching her trying to like stay calm once we got out i she was like we're going to we're going to a hospital i was like no no no like i've had these before like it's not that bad like you were like no i was trying so hard i was like i. I might die, but no.

Well, I was thinking, like, I have to call my mom at 4 in the morning and tell her I have a UT item in the hospital. Allison was like, we have to go to the hospital. We have to go to the ER. And I was like, can we just text Blaze? Oh, no. And she was like, you can text Blaze, but I really want to go to an ER. So at, like, 4 a.m., I'm admitted into the ER. It was the most dramatic experience of my life

because they kept saying, okay, well, we need a urine sample. And I was like, I can't pee. That's why I'm here. Excuse me, where were you at this point? Somewhere in Pasadena. Oh, okay. So they had me do the whole thing of like put on a gown, be in my own private room.

They like closed it off. They like thought I had a kidney infection because it was so bad. And apparently the way that utis can get ranked is like mild to moderate to severe to extreme to raging which is an actual medical term apparently and they told me i have a raging uti and they wanted to do like blood tests to make sure that my kidneys weren't infected what the fuck and i know what the fuck i know and truly that was i think the first and hopefully only test for our relationship because uh i learned that night that she is a ride or die kind of gal because for sure 10 hours into being with me she heard all about my urethra and all the

horrible gross graphic things a doctor could possibly say because i i said like can my girlfriend be in here with me and not sit in the lobby and i guess they thought oh they must have been dating forever so uh i we can say whatever we want in front of them sure they know each other's bodies no it's so just you know she knows her urethra it's fine so they just said every horrible thing and i'm cringing the entire time and she's taking it like a fucking boss she was asking the doctor's questions she's such a champ dude anyway i'm sweating having just told that story i'm so sweaty um what the fuck so if anyone was wondering why i was in the hospital it's because i tried going camping i couldn't even make it through

the night we got home like six in the morning she then, instead of just putting me to bed, made me a sandwich. What the fuck? What kind of golden person does that? She was, yeah, my roommate for four years. And one time I accidentally overdosed on Percocet. It's okay. They were a prescription. It was a bad time.

And I accidentally took, I actually took the recommended dosage. Right, right, right. But my frail little Crohn's riddled body couldn't take it. So I ended up like losing my vision and my hearing at like three in the morning and like hitting my head on the toilet and like falling onto the bathroom floor and just laying there for hours. And I remember being like, Oh no, I hope I didn't wake Allison. Like I hit my head on the toilet and was like, Oh no, I hope that didn't wake her up. And the next morning I'm just like kind of lying there

and she's like, what's happening? And I'm like, oh, I was waiting until 6am to like call an ambulance or whatever. Cause I couldn't see cause my vision was gone. And she still is mad. Like she won't talk about it cause she's so angry. So she was pretty angry at me for not waking her up. Uh, when we went camping, she was like, you were just going to sit by the tent all night. And I was like, look, either I didn't wake you up and i just kept pretending i was gonna go pee or you woke up and watched me pretend that i was gonna go pee i mean what did you want me to do i know and then she ended up literally saving the day so god thank god she woke up yeah that was the thing and she's like what do you think would have happened if i she

was like yelling at me she's like what do you think what do you think would have happened if i woke up and found my roommate dead on the bathroom floor i was like think would have happened if I, she was like yelling at me. She's like, what do you think would have happened if I woke up and found my roommate dead on the bathroom floor? I was like, that would have been traumatizing. We did talk about it afterwards. And we were like, this really was a good test for us because we saw each other in a stressful situation. And she was like, you didn't like, you were in the worst pain in your life and you didn't yell at me. So really what I'm trying to tell everyone is I found a keeper. I'm off the market

i guess i'm not the hot one anymore her kidneys are okay are they okay i never heard from them so i guess that's a good thing you never heard from your kidneys oh or my doctors oh okay so i was like if i heard from my kidneys i'd be in big trouble yeah i was like we need to see a different kind of doctor anyway wow good luck editing that thanks we applaud you for all of the above thank you for your service anyway do you want to hear about some ghosts i want to hear about anything else besides the horrible pain in your urethra everyone knows me a little bit better today don't they yes like very intimately right yeah um so i always wanted to do uh all of the ghosts in the white house oh cool okay ready i know nothing about this so there's really no history to this it's just several facts

yay so you're just getting nothing but ghost incidences that's all i want okay so you have this is a choose your own adventure oh Oh, good. Because the main one, the main ghost is Abraham Lincoln. I was about to ask if he was there. Do you want to hear about Abraham Lincoln and all of his stuff first? Or do you want to hear about all the other smaller characters first? You know, I don't like choices, decisions. Um, let me think. think okay i don't know uh okay okay i wait let me choose i choose i want to hear about abraham lincoln first yeah okay so again i feel like do i have to really give the history of abraham lincoln who's that um you know what i'd rather not say it's just you have a big hat he had a big hat he had a big beard oh yeah he was really tall he was assassinated kind of you were

gonna say he was sassy i was like oh probably he must have been a little sassy he was involved in like the emancipation proclamation 16th president big guy good times um okay so the first thing i wanted to say is that lots of people have seen him oh and witnessed him some of them who i'm not going to tell their stories because they were either longer or shorter and not worth it so you know one of one of the several guys uh teddy roosevelt herbert hoover dwight eisenhower jackie kennedy um all those they've all seen him but their stories just weren't as like good oh they saw abraham lincoln they've all seen they were seen no they've all seen the ghost of lincoln jackie kennedy saw oh yeah and and even more so um press secretaries for president johnson president eisenhower they've both said that they just felt

his presence um and what the hell does that mean like they've just like sensed him we'll get there don't worry good old abe is here i'm feeling honest what's going on so i sense a large hat right yeah sorry keep going uh okay so one of the well the reason that i wanted to do this story like i wanted to talk about lincoln is because i've always liked the picture of him and his wife have you seen this yeah there's a portrait of him and his wife but he was dead and it's supposedly just a ghost of him like like lincoln was dead it's just a portrait of his wife and then there's something next to her that looks weirdly like lincoln when no one was standing next to her wait you mean a portrait like someone painted like a

picture oh like a photograph yeah oh i thought you meant someone painted a ghost of lincoln that's fair to think because i said portrait so i was like that's on me but no like uh like there's a picture that someone took no i don't know about that 1869 i think that is creepy and their excuse their uh logic behind it is that someone must have walked into the picture halfway through and it's like a double exposure kind of thing yeah but it looks a lot like lincoln but he was dead creepy so i was like oh well i bet there's something about him yeah so anyway that's what that was the catalyst for this yikes um the main room that people see him in lo and behold is the lincoln bedroom and uh it actually now it's a bedroom uh in the white house

but at the time it was actually his cabinet room where he signed the Emancipation Proclamation. Oh, shit. So lots of big shit happened in there, and now it's a bedroom, so a lot of people mistake it. Oh, for his bedroom? Yeah. But it was actually just, like, his study. Oh. A lot of people have seen in there, now that it is a bedroom, people have seen him lying on the bed when they'll come in.

I've heard of this. Yeah, they think that, like, someone is taking a nap. Oh, it's so gross. And it's actually Abe Lincoln just lying just, like, flat on the bed. Creepy. So the first person who actually witnessed the ghost is Calvin Coolidge's wife. Oh, shit. Yeah, so a while back.

Her name was Grace Coolidgeidge and she's the first person to report having seen lincoln's apparition in the white house she said that um she saw him standing by a window in the oval office with his hands behind his back gazing out the window towards the potomac river which it was actually where like the battlegrounds for the civil war was at his time damn um and after she saw one time she saw the ghost all the time and a lot of people have reported seeing him standing by the window oh man that's like a regular place you might catch him eleanor roosevelt also used his room as a study when she was there and she said that she always felt him lean against the chair when she was working

like my god like to lean over and be like What you working on? What a nosy guy. Yeah. Well apparently. He's most active. When there's a lot of stress. In the White House. Which must be fucking always. So he's just running around.

He's just always busy. Room to room. Eleanor Roosevelt's assistant. Also saw him one time. Not lying on the bed. But sitting on the bed. And pulling his boots on. And she apparently like. Freaked out. And screamed. screamed running out of the white house didn't know what to do

that's terrifying because well he pulled he was putting his boots on and looked up at her like like she was bothering him can i help you yeah oh god uh franklin roosevelt's personal valet which where do i find one of those? Please. Also ran from the White House screaming one day because he saw Lincoln. Lincoln looked at him and said his name to it, to his face, like knew who he was. Wait, so Lincoln is not even just like he's an intelligent. Oh, my God. Entity. And the valet's name was Cesar Carrera.

So Lincoln had to have been watching him he didn't know that name it's like he just picked like harold out of a bag um roosevelt's dog also sensed lincoln um anytime that someone would hear pacing up and down the hallway that sounded i guess i guess he had a specific way of walking so a lot of people have heard him walking up and down the hallway and roosevelt's dog would always start growling and barking at the hallway and then like five minutes later they would you start hearing the creak so like the dog anticipated lincoln before it even happened reagan's dog named rex also would constantly bark and growl at the ceiling right under like looking up at the

ceiling which on the other side was the floor of where lincoln always walked and paced up and down and the dog would also bark at the door threshold to the lincoln room and would never go in oh no no that's not a good sign uh ray so actually ronald reagan was trying to be very scientific about the dog freaking out about these ghostly friends or enemies. Or frenemies. Or frenemies. Who's to say, really? Or lovers. Or Russian spies.

Nobody knows. I'm sorry. Champagne. I'm not used to it. Go on. I'm sorry. Champagne. I'm not used to it. So Reagan actually thought the dog was responding to like a pitch that we couldn't hear from electrical electrical signals that were being beamed between the White House and the foreign embassy. Oh. And so he asked the staff to look into it and they're like, no, he's just barking at nothing. So no, he tried to be like a like to debunk it.

So good for him. Good for him. tried to be like a like to debunk it so good for him good for him um also the lincoln room is also known as the queen's room because whenever queens visit the white house that's the room that they stay in oh so in the netherlands in the 1940s queen wilhelmina sure came to visit and she was staying in that room and heard a knock on her door in the middle of the night and went to go check and when she opened the door lincoln was fucking standing there i know like top hat coat and all and she freaked out and fainted and when she came to he wasn't there anymore she fainted i would do why were people was fainting back then yeah no one faints now you just kind of scream or

it's flight or fight i would do a lot less dainty things than faint i would like i'd probably punch him i'd get into like a heisman stance yeah i would probably grunt and like hit him or something yeah i wouldn't faint i but you know they wore like corsets and stuff right they were already on their last breath although sure they were near death always what what year was this 1942 oh that's not that long ago. They didn't wear corsets in 1942. Maybe in Norway they did. Lisa?

Did they? Netherlands. What did I say? Norway? Oh, fuck me. All right. Sorry, I'm sorry. Lisa, if you still know, by all means, tell us about the 1940s fashion of the Netherlands

that the queen might have worn to America. But only her bedclothes. What did she wear to bed? Maybe I just thought Lisa was really worldly. Maybe I thought Lisa was a queen. She could be aristocratic. Maybe. So anyway, she fainted.

I'm so sorry. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She fainted. She fainted anyway she fainted let's i'm so sorry yeah yeah she fainted gather our thoughts instead of sweat through them again i'm sweating again okay uh winston churchill oh he was the british prime minister oh. Maybe. What did he wear to bed? I'm sorry. Nothing at all. Probably. That left me some Winston. He was a guest one night. And actually, he was not wearing anything at all. Wait, are you serious?

He was taking a bath. Oh! And he got out of the bath to go get a cigar because he's a classy man. Oh, sure. Right. And as he's walking naked through the room. Oh, no. He runs into Lincoln standing at the fireplace.

And this is a guy. He did the exact opposite of faint. He kept his composure real cool because he grabs the cigar, puts it in his mouth and says, Good evening, Mr. President. You seem to have me at a disadvantage. And then listen lincoln churchill lincoln smiled chuckled and then faded away abe lincoln was like you got me this time i try he i feel like he just tries to like i feel like he tries to freak people out and then when you're winston churchill he's like you know what not this time oh my god winston churchill like no you can't so president truman also saw him

and his daughter margaret they both uh would regularly feel lincoln tapping at the door and knocking on the door because they actually stayed in the room across from where lincoln used to sleep one of the clergymen uh one time stayed the night in the white house and woke up to hearing lincoln's voice at the end of his bed pleading for help. And he sat up and saw Lincoln on the floor in prayer, arms outstretched with his fingers digging into the carpet. Oh, oh no.

That doesn't seem like the Lincoln I know. I was going to say, it doesn't seem like the one I want to see. That's not honest, Abe. That's fucking frightening, Abe. Oh, that's really scary. Also, the seamstress, the in-house seamstress named Lillian Parks, she one time tried to investigate the sound of someone pacing upstairs.

And when she went up and saw nothing, one of the staff members said, oh, yeah, that's old Abe pacing the floor. And I guess now people recognize the specific sound of him walking versus the other ghosts that have been seen pacing the same hallway which i will get to lincoln's ghost was also found a lot during fdr's term uh because that was another time the country was in like a great like upheaval sure so i guess the more stressed out the white house is the more lincoln like tries to trot on in and help he's like taking a bath uh why don't i step in oh you're feeling relaxed let's get cozy together uh so president johnson's wife ladybird oh right that

one sure the one i'd be yeah oh naturally oh yeah your past life she witnessed lynn uh lincoln's spirit when she was watching a television program about his assassination while she was in his room why would you do that i think that's kind of a fuck you like if you died but i want to watch the documentary in your room about you getting shot in your bedroom no no no i don't know something to think about would you want me to no okay it's good to know never know you'll need that information store it away. Don't forget it. Gerald Ford's daughter, Susan, also saw the ghost in the 80s. Also, Ronald Reagan's daughter, Maureen, and her husband both saw Lincoln's ghost next to a fireplace while they were sleeping. Woke up at different times and saw him standing there.

So, really, how long was he there for? He needs to find something to do. Can you imagine being dead and all you have is to look out a window? Or, like, stand at a fireplace? Yeah. All night? Fun fact, though, when Ronald Reagan's daughter saw him, she's seen him a couple times, and every time she saw him said that he had an aura that was a mixture of red and orange. Interesting.

Mm-hmm. Anyone who's into auras, tell me what that means. Sure, yeah, me too. November 19, or no, in November of 1860, Lincoln actually told his wife that he knew he'd be elected for a second term, but he would die in office. And the night before he died, he dreamed that he, this is really wild. He actually had three nights, the three nights before he died, he had the same dream every night for three nights that he woke up to a wailing crowd of people crying and when he asked one of the men what was wrong the guy said we're mourning the president's murder he also dreamed that he was in a mysterious ship by himself sailing towards a quote dark and infinite or dark and indefinite shore oh my god on the day of his assassination he told his bodyguard about this and his body

bodyguard's name was william crook and he said that he had been having dreams of himself being assassinated for the last three nights in a row and crook said don't go to this performance tonight and being the guy he is lincoln said but i promised my wife oh no i know and so as lincoln left for the theater he said goodbye crook which is even sadder because every night that lincoln was present he always told his bodyguard good he always said good night but this time he said goodbye i oh i know it's like he knew really sad um but i promised my wife but i promise what a loyal man whoa like beyond but also think of the guilt that poor woman had i was gonna say he kind of fucked her over too okay uh the most recent lincoln sighting was in the 80s when a white house operations forming came into the white house and saw lincoln sitting in a chair at the top of the staircase ew uh president harrison's bodyguard has also been kept or

has he was he's probably done now um r.i.p he uh used to be kept awake for many nights in the beginning of harrison's term because he was trying to protect the president from mysterious footsteps in the hallway and then one day someone was like dude that's lincoln's footsteps like you can you can go to bed poor guy um one white house staff member turned off the lights of the chandelier in the lincoln room and they turned back on by themselves and when he went back into the room again he felt an icy cold temperature change in the entire room another staff member saw lincoln's coat like his entire body very clearly um and the lincoln said hello and then when he blinked he was gone when the when the staff member blinked lincoln was gone and apparently that happens a lot too um so that's all of lincoln what do you think just real quick you're right

what do you redo everything so quickly so right Just like really snappy, really efficient, no editing involved. Right. How long have we been recording now? Three hours? Only 51 minutes. Oh. Well, not good. But, you know, we can pretend.

Okay. So real quick question. Give it to me. Lay it on thick. So what's he doing now? Is Trump the thing that sent him back to the other side or is he still there? I think we're all trying to get away from Trump. But I think he was like, this is a problem even I can't fix and just peaced out.

Well, keep in mind the last time anyone saw him was the 80s. So what was going on then? Oh, yeah. So, okay. Was he running from like Y2K like everyone? From Y2K. Sure. So he was running, Y2K, like everyone? From Y2K. Sure. So he was running from Y2K.

As we all were. Yes. But I will say that there are other ghosts there still. Okay. Even with Trump? Can you imagine if Trump ran into... See, Winston Churchill... I can see Donald Trump getting out of the bathtub naked.

I like to think that Winston Churchill is just as savvy on the other side. And for whatever, like, attitude he gave Lincoln, I like to think he would give it to Trump now. Can you imagine if Donald Trump got out of the bath naked, then Winston Churchill was standing at the fireplace naked with a cigar? Be like, I have you at a disadvantage, bitch. Yes! And then Abe was like, he would just, like, walk away, I think. I don't think he wants anything to do with all of the above. Anyway. Pray tell. We're going to pretend that there's, like, some healthy segue. I'll find think. I don't think he wants anything to do with all of the above. Anyway.

Pray tell. We're going to pretend that there's like some healthy segue. I'll find it. I'll find it. I always do. Or we could just do like our favorite catchphrase like sound that we've never actually made. We've never made an official sound bite. Okay.

We might as well have like a transitional, I'm sorry. Like, oh, oh, okay. Ready? I'm sorry. I like it. Just for, for you know the constant fuck ups oh that'll be playing a lot people we should just make like a full we should make a series of i'm sorry sound bites for here we didn't know how to edit i'm sorry yep geo was barking i'm sorry it's not a fault christine is drunk i tried to hide the wine but she drank it all i'm sorry i tried my best there's nothing i can do let's give this a fucking whirl listen take me on a ride

boy what a ride it will be so now that we're not talking about Lincoln, I don't know how else to get through the White House in its entirety, so I just am going to do it by room. Go for it. Let's start from the tippy-tippy top. The attic. Okay. The attic. William Harrison was the first guy ever to die in office from pneumonia literally only a month after his inauguration. I'm sad for him like it's like his dream was to become president and then he did it like he never actually wished to stay president he just needed to

you know he's like i've done what i came here for he got through the ceremony uh up there you can hear him rummaging around for something and i guess people know it's him because they've heard his voice oh at the i guess around the time when he died people could tell it was his voice and it's just slowly been carried on that that was who he was oh god they're also during the truman era there was a security guard that once heard someone up there say i am david burns what and the and david burns is actually the man that was forced to surrender his land so that the white house could be built there shut can you imagine being david fucking burns and you're getting

evicted so that the country's most powerful building can be built there it's like are you proud or are you mad i think i'd be bitter yeah it's my land i'd be like oh yeah president lives there that's nice i remember you know being a child growing up there. Raising my cattle or something, whatever you did there. David Burns. Poor David Burns. R.I.P. Okay, now let's go to the, all the way down to the bottom, the basement. We're just going to miss.

Thank you. Let's just do the bread before we get to the meat. You know what I'm saying? Remember that time when you were like, let's go through the layers, or the levels of the house. Let's start with two. And you were like, I didn't say I would go in order okay oh yeah that was just more proof that i don't really work hard on my nose on the third floor and then we're on the first so like let's start from the top and then go to the bottom but we're gonna alternate all the floors in between listen this is your ride

you take us wherever you need to go if i could get on a roller coaster that started on the third floor and then like dropped you down a little bit, rose you back up. Sure. That's like the Tower of Terror. Right. I am. All of my stories are just Towers of Terror. You are the Tower of Terror.

You and your tree trunk legs. Please go on. Here's the basement. My personal favorite because it's the only evil spirit in the White House. Oh, no. It's a demonic cat. What? And those who see the cat claim that it appears as a kitten, but as get closer to it it becomes larger and scarier oh no and according uh to the stories many like years will pass

without anyone encountering it at all but whenever someone sees the cat it's like a warning that some national disaster is about to happen what so uh example uh people have seen the cat uh days before the stock market crashed in the 1920s oh no uh they also saw it days before lincoln's assassination and kennedy's assassination there's a motorcycle guy the thing that i find most interesting about that is that the cat showed up for lincoln's assassination and kennedy's assassination but no one saw him before garfield's assassination and garfield's the name of a fucking cat whoa that was garfield maybe well i like i looked it up and i was like i know there i know that guy was assassinated why didn't anyone like make a report about like ahead of time maybe andrew garfield like became a cat

and was like oh yeah that's exactly what happened i'm sorry that's a stupid theory but but what that's so sad for him anyway so there's the cat as you can tell i'm blazing through these blazing blaze christine's getting blazed oh that's a new hashtag by the way guys yeah christine gets blazed every week is a new hashtag set the world ablaze for christ or whatever what was that one? That was my brother's stupid one. Blaze and teen empire. Teen empire. The one now that I like the best so far is Christine gets blazed.

Okay. Anyway, I promise I'll cut this out. Just cut all of it out all the way from like blazed. Just cut it from like five seconds. We don't need anything else. Okay. Just like cut it all out.

I'll cut it out. Honestly, can you just cut out from the beginning of this all the way to the first episode yeah so oh yeah i'll just go on itunes and hit shift delete all a delete erase trash um recycle yes okay so the second floor halls the the the whole second floor of the white house is like the residency area it's not the offices we went from attic base network second floor yeah tower white house is like the residency area it's not the offices we went from attic base and our second floor yeah tower of terror is now attic up we went down the tower terror to the basement and we've gone halfway up to the second floor rising back up and uh i'm sorry no i'm sorry i should know how architecture works better just you know what

you should we started this podcast and i had some faith in you and you're clearly i should just honestly follow the stairs and then just make notes based on the different levels in numerical order you should you'd think after 25 homes yeah i'd know how yeah you'd think you know you'd think in 50 i will know how but i won't let's just all prepare here's me getting my hopes up every time on the second floor that was the residence for the family like the first family um sure so any ghosts that are there are usually either the presidents or the first ladies or the first children okay um so lincoln regularly walks around the halls and knocks on people's doors like i said other ghosts that have been seen pacing the halls and showing up in people's rooms have been Grant, McKinley, and several of the First Ladies.

President Truman actually wrote a letter to his wife saying, I sit here in this old house all the while listening to the ghosts walk up and down the hallway and even right here in the study at this very moment. The floors pop and creak and the drapes move back and forth. At four o'clock in the morning, I awake from three distinct knocks on my bedroom door and no one's there damned place is haunted sure as shooting oh whoa so that guy was a believer he would have been team milkshake mckinley no that was president truman oh truman so also on the second floor president lyndon b johnson's daughter has seen lincoln's son willie who died at 12 from typhoid fever um staff members of the grant administration were so scared of willie lincoln that even in the 1870s uh they like

refused to speak about him all the way until 1911 when the taft administration uh had to sit down with their staff and say that any member who talked about willie lincoln would be fired excuse me they were like that afraid of like a 14 year old boy what yeah he was 12 a teenage boy uh so lincoln's walking around like waking people up and knocking on doors yeah but because apparently it's so i don't know maybe he's like a troublemaker that scary i think they were just afraid of ghosts okay um president cleveland's wife was the first woman to ever give birth in the white house so every now and then people will still hear her giving birth no i don't want to hear that all

right in another bedroom in the 50s the ghost of a british soldier who carries a torch would go around and try to set people's beds on fire. What? There was a husband and wife who stayed in the white house and said that a ghost tried to burn their bed while they were sleeping. And when they described the guy, they, uh, the white house believes that it is actually the man who tried to set the house on fire in 1814,

because a lot of people have witnessed this guy carrying a torch, trying to light the house on fire. Now he's just like, well, let me at least try the bed. let me just do like the tip of the the mattress cover let me just do the headboard and just see what happens so in the uh oval room uh during lincoln's administration like the oval office no oh this is like a called the yellow oval room oh sure okay that one apparently at one point it was

also called the blue room also called point it was also called the blue room. Also called the red room. Also called the green room. I don't know what to tell you. Presidents are high maintenance. I don't think they understand color. No. Well, it's white America for you. So that was so deep.

Um, speaking of color, please erase that. Um, speaking of white America, speaking of colors. Um, okay. so do we have something to say as two white people hear us out wait what we have to say is important it'll really move you we really will because as two white people we can speak for everyone our experience is right really universal i mean

technically am i white or am i rainbow this has gone down quite a path ready yes the yellow oval room during lincoln's administration this room was his personal library and one of his favorite rooms doors that are fixed open will slam shut on their own numerous people have seen lincoln gazing out the window uh thomas jefferson playing the violin and even john tyler to his wife. Even after death. Like, shouldn't they be married by now? Like, and they were married in real life. Like, why is he proposing now?

Maybe that was just a really powerful moment in their relationship. You know, it's replaying. I would love to get proposed one day where it's so powerful that when I'm dead, I'm still doing it. Yeah, because Blaze proposed like when I hadn't washed my my hair that will be what you relive in hell whoever lives in this apartment if they have to see that over and over i apologize they'll be like what a fucking mess um okay so during truman's administration uh they all they again heard i am mr burns but at that point the secretary of state's name was burns so they thought oh maybe that guy's walking around but that guy was actually on vacation he wasn't there um also in the north portico sure there is

again another torch wielding british soldier there is a uh there's a woman named anne surratt uh her mother was a conspirator in lincoln's assassination but the ghost of her still bangs on the door begging for them to let her mom go before getting executed. Wait, that's dark. Yeah, well, most haunted things are. I mean, the cat's, like, kind of fun,

but that part's dark. But I guess, like, her mom ended up getting hanged for being involved in it. Oh, no. And so she was banging on the White House door begging for them to, like, save her mom. Oh, no. Remember when you could just bang on the white house door yeah right now i can just bang on like three gates away from it and get shot yeah probably uh in the east room that was the warmest and driest area for um laundry at the time for them to like hang their clothes okay

like it was like cool because like the sun rose and that's like it was just stayed the warmest and driest for the longest okay so if they were to hang i don't know what i'm saying that's so funny i don't know it's just funny they would just hang that's where they would dry their clothes and so abigail adams john adams wife is regularly seen hanging her laundry in that room remember when first ladies had to hang their own laundry yeah right like as if that's a thing anymore fun fact uh john and abigail adams were the first presidents to actually live in the White House. Washington didn't even live in the White House. That's right.

At the time, I think. He had his own thing. Yeah, it was, like, in Philadelphia or something. Yeah. You know, East Coast living. It's fine. Eastern Seaboard. Abigail Adams is also the, quote, oldest ghost to be encountered today in the White House.

Like, the most recent time someone saw her today in the white house like the most recent time someone saw her was in 2002 oh shit also sometimes you don't see her but you can smell laundry soap which interesting that it still smells enough like today's laundry soap that we know that it's laundry soap right i would think that it would i feel like it would just smell like herbs wax or something yeah i just sound really ignorant i don't know what laundry soap smells like but uh in the garden james madison's wife dolly madison planted the famous rose garden in the early 1800s and 100 years later president wilson's wife wanted the garden to be dug up but the garden workers saw dolly madison's ghost and she was pissed that they were about to touch her garden

so there's now a rule where they can't touch the garden well why would she want to dig up the rose garden also if you bring her up in the house apparently the white house starts smelling like roses wherever you go oh i would bring her up all the time uh truman's daughter margaret constantly would hear like the floors creaking the doors knocking and all that and so she decided that she was going to spend the night in the lincoln bedroom to like call out the ghosts that were making all these sounds. Seems smart. So, uh, President Truman, like being a typical dad, even then, dressed up as a ghost and hid in the closet until she fell asleep. Are you fucking kidding me? And then scared her out of the Lincoln room and she never went back in.

I, yeah, well, I don't blame her. But whatever her arguments were, uh, also freaked Truman out enough that he had renovations done to the house and ever since then like things have calmed down a lot what do you mean like you can still hear people walking around but in like a phantom room because they built a wall through it that's so sad he just locked him away i know um also there's the rose room which is where jack andrew jackson's bed chamber used to be and a lot of people this is me as a ghost by the way because numerous white house employees have seen and or heard jackson in the room either laughing non-stop or swearing

violently or both or both uh there's also in uh a very obvious cold spot right where he used to sleep in the room even though a bed isn't there anymore but like right where he used to sleep it's always cold like even all the way down to like his side of the bed that one circle that one spot is cold since the 1860s people have been listening to him stomping around and swearing in the halls he sounds like a fun guy he sounds like a really cool neat guy in the 1950s the white house seamstress felt jackson's presence while hemming a bedspread in his room and lyndon b johnson heard him cussing during one of johnson's most important meetings the last story i have is jenna bush uh one time woke up in the middle of the night to 1920s music coming out of the fireplace in her bedroom and

when she freaked out and ran to her sister's room she made her sister go sleep in the room and they said that it sounded like a concert in there. The music was so loud. And it was opera music coming out of the chimney. Oh, my God. And when they ran out and went to go tell the White House staff, the White House staff said, oh, yeah, Lincoln does that to prank kids. Excuse me? Lincoln is, like, doing his own thing out there in the world.

She sounds like he's having a fun time. I also wanted to know if the Obamas ever experienced anything. And I guess Sasha and Malia had a sleepover in the world he's having a fun time uh i also wanted to know if the obama's ever experienced anything and i guess sasha malia had a sleepover in the white house which by the way imagine how cool you are of a fucking kid if you just get to waltz into the white house for a sleepover oh they had like a slumber party yeah people came we had a slumber party shut the front door and sasha malia were talking about um like uh the ghosts that lived in the house and i guess all of a sudden they heard a whisper saying like obama like how much like how great of a president obama is and when they turned out the lights

obama was hiding behind the couch and was literally whispering to his kids i was about to say i hope he was pulling an andrew jackson or whatever that was uh truman truman hiding anyway that's all of the ghost stuff i could find i'm so sorry for your editing process somehow that makes me just love him so much more that he's hiding behind the couch being like, ooh, I'm a ghost. I hope Michelle was videotaping. Oh, she's probably rolling her eyes in the other way. I know. Her and her biceps were Snapchatting.

Yes, that's true. Anyway, that's all of the White House haunts. Hot damn. Listen, I hope every single ghost. This is a call for all the ghosts in the White House To haunt the shit out of Donald Trump Get him out Let's bring Bernie back into the mix

Abe, if you're listening Honest Abe Can you become Dick Abe And can you just knock Trump out of the house, please Enough of this tomfoolery and pranking Yeah, no more pranking Let's get real weird Let's get real weird yeah down and dirty let's get real gnarly with it let's get gnarly abe gnarly abe so anyway i don't know how you plan on doing this but let's

also squeeze in a murder sure okay okay good luck so my um story is about the assassination of abe lincoln it would have been really lame if i told that after you told about the ghost i know i'd be like my story's cooler you'd be like yeah we already know what happens afterward all right i have a story for you i'm super excited it. I had a hunch this would be a good episode. Yeah, it's a fun one. It's lucky number 25. Hey, hey, hey. We're a quarter away from 100.

Oh, that's alarming. That's a year. No, it's not. There's 52 weeks in a year. Ignore that part. We're now at a number where if we were a battery percentage, I wouldn't feel like I needed to race to get a charger. Definitely that.

That's a pretty good thing. I'd be,fy i yeah we're still uncomfortable we're starting we'll start we are still nervous about like how long until we get home yes we're starting to plan for the charger right like we're thinking how how long can i get away with this right like when is it gonna say low battery mode right pretty soon right right right you get it i get it i get it so my story this week is about uh rodney alcala no that's one so fucked up it's twisted i don't okay i only know it because i when i'm trying to fall asleep i just look at conspiracy and murder pages on twitter oh me too oh do you really yeah maybe we follow the same pages but like i love reading about murder before i go to sleep but he seems to be on a lot of those i've seen snippets

i don't know the whole story why don't you just tell me about it are you sure i feel like you're telling it really well i think you're a big fat liar so ronnie alcala also known as the dating game killer i'm so excited so this was a my favorite murder episode um like a while ago and i remember hearing it um like way before we were even starting a podcast and just being like what's the word shook oh yes i'm pretending i'm pretending i'm an approach like a millennial but what's the word shook i'm shaken by it i'm i'm i have a a shook a shooky yeah shaky shooky feeling it is shooken shooken me all up so anyway uh it's i feel like it's been long enough where now i can kind of go and do my version of the story without like treading on their footsteps. Um, it is a crazy story.

Okay. He, this was actually suggested to me on Instagram by Abriana with three N's. Mm. Mm-hmm. So Rodney Ocala was born in San Antonio, Texas in 1943 and moved to LA at the age of 12. When he was 17, he joined the u.s army but was discharged for psychiatric reasons after suffering suffering a nervous breakdown in which he went awol and hitchhiked from fort bragg to his mother's house okay he was diagnosed with

antisocial personality disorder and then i also found a list of um diagnoses that he would receive throughout the rest of his life. So I'm just going to list those for you. By all means. Narcissistic personality disorder. Borderline personality disorder. Malignant narcissistic personality disorder with psychopathy and sexual sadism comorbidities. Took me a minute to get that word right.

After the Army, he enrolled in fine arts at ucla and graduated in 1968 it was then that he committed his first known crime okay a driver in los angeles called police after seeing him lure an eight-year-old girl named tolly shapiro into his apartment in hollywood 10 minutes from here oh no police arrived to find the girl raped and beaten with a steel pipe oh my god she was barely alive i was watching a documentary about this um on youtube and the detectives who actually found her were interviewed and they were uh understandably fucked up for life and they said the most disturbing not the most disturbing but one of the most like poignant things in their memory was walking in and seeing a pair of white mary j Jane shoes on the way into the room where her body was.

So it was before they even found the body. So they found her body. She was barely alive. They found it with a pipe on her neck. And she was still alive somehow. And somehow Alcala escaped. He fled to New York City under the fake name of John Berger and enrolled at NYU to study film under Roman Polanski, of all people. And then in a weird turn of events, Polanski's wife would be murdered by Charles Manson the following year.

Wow, that is convenient. Right? And then Polanski himself would be indicted for sexual abuse of a 13 year old just a few years later so this is just like a whole tornado of terror uh but polanski did teach alcala to use a camera so then alcala began his career as a self-proclaimed fashion photographer that's where it all kind of like that became his mo basically um so soon after that he got a counseling job at a new hampshire arts camp for children god damn it good old days under the alias john burger with a u so their first one john burger with an e and now we change it to a u and oh that's slight just pulling it off somehow

um and then in june of 1971 a woman named cornelia michelle crilly who was a 23 year old flight attendant was found raped and strangled in her apartment in Manhattan and that case actually went unsolved for 40 years so this happened during that time but it wasn't actually solved until later on when he was on trial meanwhile while this was all going

on two children at the camp that he was counseling at noticed his photo on an FBI poster at the camp that he was counseling at oh no noticed his photo on an fbi poster at the post office um that's so like retro modern of like right when normally now you're like oh i saw something on facebook but it's like oh i went to the post office and saw a flyer i was mailing my mom a postcard from summer camp and I saw his photo. That's wild. That's a very like lucky thing to just happen to run across. It sounds like a movie.

Yeah. It doesn't even sound real. You would think he would be like if I were in his shoes and I wanted to not get caught, I would be patrolling every single public billboard and bulletin board just to make sure no one was posting my picture. I think while he was at the camp, he was added to the most wanted list. So I don't know if he even knew. Right, right, right.

Okay. But I'm not positive. I know that they were kind of happening at the same time. Gotcha. But yeah, so these kids like saw his face on a poster at the post office and told authorities, thank God. So Alcala was arrested and extradited to california but talia shapiro the girl the first girl that they had found um her parents had relocated the

whole family back to mexico and refused to let her testify so he was not convicted of uh rape and attempted murder because they didn't have their primary witness. So instead, he pled guilty to assault and was paroled after 34 months. Oh, well, that's nice for him. Great. And then, oh, yeah. So he was paroled after 34 months when authorities deemed he had been rehabilitated, which I guess was apparently a theme, like a trend in the 70s where they would do these.

No, they would do these like indefinite sentences where they would say like, oh, we'll just, it sounds very like hippie-ish, like, oh, we'll let them go and like see how long it takes them. Right, right, right. To get better. But without like a definite term. It was just very flippant and. Yeah, just kind of like. Wishy-washy.

We'll see. Yeah. We'll see how your spirit feels later. And so obviously a narcissistic sociopath, whatever, wishy-washy. We'll see. We'll see how your spirit feels later. Exactly. And so, obviously, a narcissistic sociopath, whatever, can, like, talk his way out. So, after 34 months, he was deemed rehabilitated. And then, less than two months after he was released, he was arrested again for assaulting a 13-year-old girl named Julie J. After telling her he was giving her a ride to school so he served

two years for that under uh the same sentencing of like we'll see how long it takes two years later he's released again so this is 1977 um his los angeles parole officer uh decided to permit him as a repeat offender and known flight risk to travel to New York City, where cold case investigators now believe that he murdered Ellen Jane Hover, 23, a week after arriving in New York City. And she was the daughter of the owner of a popular Hollywood nightclub and the goddaughter of Dean Martin and Sammy Davis Jr.

And her remains were found buried on the grounds of the Rockefeller estate in Westchester County. So within a week of his parole officer letting him fly to New York, he murdered somebody. In 1978, Alcala got a job as a typesetter for the Los angeles times um which is when he started to convince people that he was a professional fashion photographer um but that is apparently i read one thing um about a guy who knew him who said he was like had the quote gift of gab like he could walk up to any woman in a bar and somehow just like entrance her you know oh me too oh my god are you also a professional fashion photographer i am a professional clown they're basically the same thing yeah i mean i mean yeah i mean i i got your

college roommate that way hey uh have you heard i'm a i'm a clown have you heard i'm a clown you want to squeak my nose oh my god yowza oh help okay um anyway okay so he also convinced we're sorry we're so sorry for your loss of time and energy anyone still out there no hello it's just us it's just us and my mom oh my mom's gone a long time ago okay so yeah so he was convincing young people and i mean really young that's the other thing like a lot of them were kids so how old little kids summer camp kids like eight nine literal children so it wasn't even like oh he had to convince like grown-ass adults that he was a fashion photographer it was like oh he just was able to talk men women

and children into it um and so he got a lot of people to pose for him many of the poses were pornographic um some does excuse me some investigators believe that he killed some of his subjects, one of which was Cornelia Crilly, who they found photographs of later on. The one who was the flight attendant who was strangled and raped. He so he ended up with thousands of photos in his portfolio, quote unquote. So a coworker of his at the Times actually remembers him showing the photos to co-workers and she just thought it was strange but didn't like she brushed it off um and the actual quote was i thought it was weird but i was young i didn't know anything when i asked why he took the photos he said their moms asked him to i remember the girls were naked he said he was a professional so in my mind i was

being a model for him that was a different woman i'm sorry i should have He said he was a professional. So in my mind, I was being a model for him. That was a different woman. I'm sorry. I should have clarified. That was a different quote. OK. Another woman said he was a professional. So in my mind, I was being a model for him.

The same woman said the portfolio also included spread after spread of naked teenage boys. Most of the photos are sexually explicit and most remain unidentified. the photos are sexually explicit and most remain unidentified um so police actually fear that uh some of the subjects are cold case victims who just haven't been identified yet did you ever see do you remember the show um in the early 90s remember smart guy from disney sort of with taj maury and he was a little genius yes i actually loved that i loved that show do you remember the episode where like first of all remember when disney was actually educational and taught kids fucking lessons like there was an episode of smart guy where he was like 10 years

old and his best friend who was kyla pratt hashtag penny proud from the oh but they they were like they were 10 and hanging out and then they went to a stranger's house and the stranger tried to take pictures of them wait what yeah it was like a disney episode it was a real whole episode and like the fuck and taj maury was like this isn't a good idea i'm gonna go home and then he went home and told his dad and the guy got arrested and he had like was out there excuse me are you serious i'm dead serious this is when i was little this is how i know i'm my mother's child because i live for drama, apparently. Because I remember watching that episode and knowing it was different and knowing I loved it. Like, I knew that it was a little risque and it was right up my alley.

What the hell? I loved that episode. I mean, not because I loved watching children almost get attacked. But it was like, I remember, I remember watching it and being like, I'm going to actually learn something from this episode. You'll have to YouTube it. It's definitely, I don't even know how to, wow.

We'll talk about it another time. I definitely don't remember that, but I did love that show. So, okay. Well then you'll love the episode. So here's where it gets fun. Okay. So in 1978, despite being a convicted rapist and registered sex offender alcala was accepted as a contestant on the dating game by then he had

murdered at least four women yay that we know of or that we can prove so i watched the episode of the dating game that he was on the whole episode yes how creepy was it what the fuck i've seen snips of it i haven't seen the whole thing but he looks like he's dead behind the eyes he's a fucking weirdo he looks like he knows he's up to no good i mean to be fair the other two are like also kind of equally weird like growth like you know they're 70s studs they're not what today you'd be like wow i want that but at the same time it's like that something's wrong with this guy so first thing i noted right off the bat let's just go into like a nice little dive into notes here okay are we about to like bitch about reality tv let's dive in this is what we were educated in we literally have masters in critiquing television we do masters of science by

the way everybody yeah let's do it let's let's put our let's put those bad boys to use let's go the host of the dating game first thing he says is we're in los ang, the dating capital of the world. Wrong. Wrong. Strike number one. Right. Okay, next. Moving forward. Moving forward. You literally casted a registered sex offender and someone who assaulted, like, children. Like, what?

What? What? Well, I mean, i want to defend them because uh the i mean i don't know how the 70s worked but when i when we first moved out here and got our first jobs i casted for the price is right remember i used to did you cast child molesters maybe i don't think so because a lot of them were very happy old women but but like the casting process was very specific like he would have had to i don't know how they did in the 70s three people not like an audience you know what i mean well and the price is right fun fact they you cast they cast 13 people sure that's a little it's a little inside tip now that i don't work there anymore i know but i mean if you're casting a dating show

you you know if some they knew he was a fucking sex offender slash oh like they had his background information he's a convicted rapist they knew his name all right despite being a convicted rapist and registered as a sex offender they casted him that's their bad that's their no yeah like it wasn't it wasn't an accident like if it was an accident sure one thing but like they had police records they usually just picked people based off of how excited they were maybe he was just super excited and considering he was dead behind the eyes you probably okay cast him for price is right so don't don't blame yourself all right yeah i'm just feeling a little guilty i know i know it's okay all right bob barker wouldn't have even had one second of that guy no he wouldn't have no he wouldn't have all right so let's see all right we said dating capital of the world um okay so

some weird quotes that i like to pull out uh that i you know i'm already found especially heartwarming okay so he's on the dating game he's a contestant the uh woman who is the quote-unquote bachelorette is named cheryl bradshaw and she asks contestant number one who is rodney alcala this is like a weird 70s question that i don't totally understand like what is your best time i didn't know if it meant like time of the month like like your best time i guess like your favorite memory is like is that the 70s way of saying what's your favorite memory like your best time that you've ever had well his answer was night time oh and she said oh why do you say that? And he said, because that's the only time there is. Yeah, that sounds a little. Sure.

Not great. And then she said, what's wrong with morning or afternoon? And he says, well, they're okay. But nighttime is when it really gets good. When you're really ready. Really ready. That's not even. I understand like in like a sleazy dating game.

Maybe he was trying to like be flirty, but that's not even. Nighttime is the only time. I mean, I'm, I'm really bad at flirting, but even I know that that's not. Right. A thing you said. Like nighttime is when you're ready. For what? For what?

To go to bed? Question. I'm serving you for dinner. What are you called? And what do you look like? Any guess? What would you say? You're even make this shit up what are they calling me i'm serving you for dinner so remember they can't see each other if i were a food what would i be sure is essentially the

question what are you called and what do you look like i'm serving you for dinner i feel like it'd be something raunchy and shitty honestly i'd be like fried chicken because it's good you'd probably be like yes fried chicken i'd be like i'd be ice cream and i wouldn't i wouldn't share myself with it at all it looks like ice cream i don't know i feel like a pizza and it's got a lot of pepperoni i don't understand the question no he said i'm called the banana okay okay phallic and i look really good and she said can you be more descriptive and he said peel me what listen and she goes yeah and everyone's like laughing and giggling and she's like later later okay he won he won the game she picked him well she's an idiot fucking serial killer rapist of children.

Sex offender. Won the dating game. Do you want to know what they won? A date with him. Yeah, but do you want to know what the prize was? No, why? Tell me. They won tennis outfits.

Ew. I know, right? They won tennis outfits from a Studio City tennis shop and tennis lessons together. Like, that's a nightmare date. Like, I don't want that. Wait, like, they won that to then go play tennis on the date? Yeah, that's their prize. Ew.

And they won a trip to Magic Mountain together. Okay, that's fine. If I were playing and even slightly wanted to win at a dating game, my prize better be, like, an all-you-can-eat buffet some right yeah really good to like dig in there it wasn't even like a trip to magic mountain plus like all-you-can-eat churros it was like a trip to magic mountain and then you pay for all your churros or whatever you want so cheryl bradshaw who was a bachelorette um actually refused to go on a date with him good girl good girl because she decided he was

creepy good girl good girl follow your gut when they met backstage so she picked him you know like on the dating game you don't see the contestants right she actually told cnn in 2010 quote he was quiet but at the same time he would interrupt and impose when he felt like it like an narcissist yeah exactly he became very unlikable and rude and imposing, as though he was trying to intimidate me. I wound up not only not liking this guy, he was a standout creepy guy in my life. Later that year, he murdered 32-year-old Charlotte Lamb and then 21-year-old Jill Parenteau in 1979. Both in LA. and then 21 year old jill parento in 1979 both in la on june 20th 1979 this is really fucked 12 year old robin samso went missing on her way to ballet class her friends told police that a

strange man had asked to take their pictures while they were at the beach um they described the man for police and i'll call's parole officer recognized him from the sketch. So police arrested him on July 24th of 79 and then searched his mother's house, where they found a receipt for a storage locker in Seattle. That storage locker contained thousands of photos of young women and boys and Robin Samsoe's earrings. Oh, no. So ever since then, he's been in San Quentin State Prison. He's still alive? Yep.

Oh, my God. It took several trials to secure conviction for Robin Samsoe's murder. The California Supreme Court threw out the conviction in 1980 because the jury had been told about Alcala's earlier sexual offenses, robin samson's murder this california supreme court threw out the conviction in 1980 because the jury had been told about alcala's earlier sexual offenses so he said that them knowing about his prior convictions had like tainted their view oh my god mistrial right so then in 1986 the ninth circuit court of appeals nullified another conviction conviction and sentence claiming that the police

investigators had hypnotized a park ranger who was a witness in the trial. So this guy is just like, and he's his own lawyer at this point, so he's just like throwing shit in their face and somehow getting his conviction overturned. But with the development of DNA technology, his luck began to run out. So while he waited in prison, investigators collected samples of his DNA and matched it to some of the women that he had raped and murdered. So in 2010, he was tried for five murders. So Sam, so the 12 year old girl, Jill Parton, no Charlotte lamb, Georgia Wickstead and Jill Barkholm.

He was convicted and sentenced to death. Um, and he's currently on death row in San Quentin Prison. Well, thank God. So there were other women who are suspected to have become his victims, including 19-year-old Pamela Jean Lamson from San Francisco, who disappeared in 1977 after telling friends

she was meeting with a photographer. Of course. Police say they have no DNA evidence to go on, but witness descriptions convincingly match i'll call his profile and then police in seattle are also convinced he was behind the deaths of two teenage girls in 1977 and 1978 but they also don't have enough evidence to convict him um they actually posted uh the photos of thousands of women and children men women and children online legally the authorities did because they wanted to find out if these were unidentified you know they

wanted to identify who these people were um so i read a vice article which is where i got some of this information um that had several photos of unidentified women actually every photo in the article was of they're probably like 25 photos and they were all unidentified women. Actually, every photo in the article was of, there were probably like 25 photos, and they were all unidentified women. And then at the end it said, if you recognize anybody, call this detective. In 2013, Kathy Thornton saw an online display of photos

taken by Alcala decades earlier and recognized her sister, who had been six months pregnant at the time of her disappearance oh my god and the photos online it's a photo of her on a bicycle in wyoming um so investigative work by police in huntington beach and wyoming um was able to connect the crime to the picture. Oh, my God. So the Huntington Beach police released about 200 of the photos to the public in the hope that people would be able to identify the victims because police still believe that even though he was only convicted of five murders,

that there are, some people say, up 130 um murders that he committed and about 40 women have been identified as alive and well in the photos but there are also thousands of photos that have gone unidentified so um again some people think he murdered up to like 130 150 people jesus and most detectives say even if it's not that high it's definitely in the double digits it's actually really creepy to look through the photos and they're all like from the 70s and they're just like beautiful young women. How do you get away with that many murders? You just wonder. And a detective said, you know, like people have said, oh, his IQ was so high and it was 135, but he wasn't that brilliant that he.

Right. it was 135 but he wasn't that brilliant that he right like apparently he wrote a book called you the jury and it was not great good yeah apparently he was just like rambling and it didn't make much sense so it's not like he was some sort of mastermind but i guess he was just so confident and narcissistic that he was able to i mean he won the fucking dating game after murdering four women and assaulting young girls. I don't know how he got away with all that. Unreal. That's so weird.

Well, and actually, one thing I want to add, too, before I forget, the woman who had been attacked, the first crime he was ever convicted of, the girl named Tali Shapiro, the eight-year-old that he attacked with the pipe, she actually testified 42 years later in court. Did the statutory limitations not run out? I mean, I don't think it was. She wasn't testifying for her own case. She was just testifying as a victim for the other cases that he was being tried for. So her testimony said over 27 stitches in the back of my head he hit me right over the head um describing the severe injuries she received

at his hands this was when he was 66 years old um she said she was eight years old walking to school in hollywood in 1968 when alcala then 25 years old offered her a ride she told him that Good girl. shapiro said that alcala took her to his apartment where he said he wanted to show her a picture shapiro remembers walking up to his apartment with him and that's where her memory ends oh my god and that was from um an abc7 article but so she's actually been called to testify against him three times um and apparently he apologized for his despicable behavior to her right yeah i'm sure so people are just angry like the she and um the investigators were not having it because it's like right oh okay yeah yeah thanks thanks for that very slow clap for your apology very kind of you and the article here says it took months before shapira was physically well enough to return to school i'm like oh she

returned to school like oh my god even imagine even today emotionally she said she has a hard time trusting people well I don't fucking blame her yeah please don't don't ever feel like you don't trust another person even survive that so anyway so he was convicted um and sentenced to death but he's still on death row uh at St. Quentin so he's in his 70s now and i wonder what his uh what his catchphrase will be when he dies what's his last name um alcala i'll call you later oh for fuck's sake i don't know maybe there's a job for you in that field maybe yeah we'll work on it we'll figure it out we'll work it out alcohol alcohol alcohol i'm an alcoholic no that means you're like into him oh no no i'm not into

him i'm not an alcoholic i gotta say i when they talked about this on my favorite murder karen and georgia talked about how easy it was when you're young to be flattered if someone says oh wow you're so beautiful let me take a photo of you like we'll go to this park and i'll take headshots you'll be a model whatever you know it's just such an easy it's awful to like prey on young women like that the thing that's interesting to me is that only one person like listened to their gut about how creepy he was and there's all these other women well maybe they couldn't get away you know yeah well and who knows there might have been more who just didn't even realize who it was. We were just like, no, thank you. Like, my mom's college roommate almost was a victim of Ted Bundy. Oh, for fuck's sake.

Like, remembers him approaching her in a mall and, like, being super suave and being really handsome and saying all the right things. And he was really pushy about, like, taking her back to his place. And she was like, no. And he was really aggressive about it. What the fuck? And she was like, no, and just had a gut feeling not to. And then only a couple months later, she saw him on the news, and it was like no and he was really aggressive at it what the fuck she was like no and just had a gut feeling not to and then only a couple months later she saw him on the news and it's so hard to resist that when you're trying to be polite again like my favorite murder fuck

politeness like sometimes you just need to it's true yeah it's sad that in this world if if you're a girl you're expected to be polite no matter how shitty someone treats you. And then whether or not they get the hint, you're still a bitch if you don't... A thousand percent. And girls are garbage people, too. Definitely. Everyone's a garbage person. I'm not just trying to say all men are trash. No.

Everyone seems to be trash in their own way. Everyone but Gio is just trash. Oh, baby Gio. He would be such a gent to whichever boy or girl or in between. Or anything. Not puppy. He not no cradle robber no no he's no uh someone his age all across the spectrum he would treat properly because he's so good itty bitty baby geo so guys are you no is everyone gone

my own mother is texting me at this point being like when does it end i'm not gonna give it a shot my mom gave up 10 episodes ago but um thanks guys sorry guys oh well also sorry but also thanks if you want to hear more you can we're sorry we're sorry we're sorry um if you want to hear more what you can you can rewind to zero zero zero and stab yourself in the eardrum and get the same effect oh yeah great idea uh you can also follow us at atwwd podcast on just about everything on earth we're sending out the next round of merch oh oh other big thing that i forgot to mention we're putting up our store yes we're putting up our store so you can buy shirts or whatever you want we have a listeners episode coming out august 1st which means you and

i need to get cracking on that we love you guys and that's what and wait do it again and that's why wait do it again and that's why oh wait we can do the Linda song and that's why we drink cheers