And That's Why We Drink - E314 Haircuts for Haunted Dolls and Christine's October Elf on the Shelf

Episode Date: February 12, 2023

It's episode 314, so call Lucy and tell everyone in the fiery place that we're throwing a big bash! We're celebrating our big 6th podcast anniversary with 6 haunted dolls so get your hook noses and creepy smiles ready. Then Christine covers the horrific story of Christa Pike, the youngest woman to be sentenced to death in the U.S. And are we ready for doll Vegas? We think not... and that's why we drink!We love you all so much and can't wait to see you on the road! Come join us for our brand new On the Rocks tour at andthatswhywedrink.com/live 

hello i'm sick so excuse my voice and christine is for some reason losing her mind on the other end of zoom mental breakdown what happened what's going on we were about to record and all of a sudden christine just starts going and then she on? We were about to record and all of a sudden Christine just starts going, and then she goes, quick, quick, we need to record. So I have no idea what's about to happen. I did something. What? I'm not surprised.

I did something for our next live show and it just came in and it's so good. Shut up. Is it the thing that I think it is? I don't know if you know what it is. Did we discuss it yesterday in detail? No. Oh, shit. What did we discuss in detail?

JW. That's all I'm going to say. Oh, shit. I didn't even check on that. Oh, that would be even better. Fuck. That was a great guess. I mean, it's pretty on. Oh, that would be even better. Fuck. That was a great guess. I mean, it's pretty on par with that.

Like, it's equally important. Okay. But it is a surprise. Speaking of JW, no response on that front. So that might be a no-go. But thank you for reminding me. We're on this, like, unhinged train that, like, where Em and I had a call yesterday and then we just hopped on Zoom and didn't even tell Eva to join us. We're like, oh, we'll just chat for a minute.

And then two and a half hours later, we've unraveled and also raveled this insane plan. If you're seeing our live show, it's going to be something. That's all. We have a few ideas cooking and all of them are equally deranged. If you're seeing our live show, it's going to be something. That's all. We have a few ideas cooking, and all of them are equally deranged. So unhinged. Oh, my God. None of them make sense.

It's so bananas all the way to the top. Anyway, I'm excited to find out whatever you're talking about. I'm so sorry that I just burst out laughing, but I was like, I just wanted to peek in, see if what I had ordered was like up to snuff. And oh my. Ordered? Okay. Well, am I going to find out on stage with everybody? That's how it's sounding. No, no, no. I want to wait till like we rehearse and you get to see the full effect. It's just a part of the introduction. Let's put it that way. Okay. I can't, I don't even know what that means, but I'm very eager. Definitely eager. Yeah, I hope so. I'm sorry that I'm like in such a state while you're not feeling well. I am not feeling good at all.

I'm so sorry. Do I sound good, though? That's the real question. You sound like really raspy. And I mean, I got that same effect just by screaming at a football game. But you got all the way to ruin your immune system to get there. Yeah, yeah not as uh easy to bend as you i guess no i guess not well you sound great for what it's worth oh thank you no that's just gonna be so it's such a disgusting episode i um poor christine i had a texter and be like, we have to record later. Cause I

need to shower. Cause I feel, you know, when you wake up the day after like having the grossest day of your cold and you just feel like you're covered in a film. It's so horrible. And you can, it doesn't have a smell to anybody else. I feel like I can smell like it's a very specific smell. I think maybe if I like were in that state i would know what you meant i think right now i don't remember really i try to just not think about it when i'm not when i'm healthy i pretend like i'm never gonna get sick again maybe it's the smell of like the inside of my own nasal cavity or something but it just smells like that like death yeah bad. Yeah, I got you. It's like that kind of stale, horrible. Yeah.

Do you, do you, are you having some tea or honey or something to, to soothe the soul and the throat? I took my vitamins, which are not helping by the way. I take vitamin C every day now and look what fucking happened to me. Look what happened. You got to get on that zinc train, baby.

I am. Hey, I'm on zinc right now. Well what happened. You got to get on that zinc train, baby. I am. Hey, I'm on zinc right now. Well, it's not working either, huh? None of it is. Allison made me tea, which is very lovely. She's been making me tea every day. And yesterday I gave myself permission to order as much soup as I wanted from Panera. I was going to say, when you get the sick food, like in the evening when you're like,

I just get to get like any dumplings or soup or uh the best feeling I so my mom I love her very much but she is not a doting person and she's like not much of mine not even a little bit which by the way her and I got in the fight about recently where I said she wasn't doting and she was like what and I mean it is confusing to me because you do describe her a lot as like being like really present like ever present and like I think everyone's maybe everyone's definition of doting is different but I think in terms of like uh taking care of somebody like I think she's always there to like the way I had to describe it to her in a way that she understood was I don't come to you to cry but I come to you to bitch and she was like oh yeah that makes sense so, I don't come to you to cry, but I come to you to bitch.

And she was like, oh, yeah, that makes sense. Oh, so you're saying you kind of wish there was some comforting happening? No, no, no. I'm just saying I'm used to it. Oh, I see. Especially when it comes to being sick. My upbringing, my mom would throw me a cup a cup of like pudding like like a put like a jello snack pack she would literally throw it at me from across the room and be like get better

that was like right she did it reminds me of moira rose where she's like i don't want to catch your illness yeah she's just like i really don't have like you got to hurry it up and get back on my speed because i'm not here to like slow down for anyone yeah i had a similar background it was sort of like well my mom always thought i was faking and And to be fair, I faked it a lot because I really just hated going to school. So I did fake quite a bit. But then when I was really sick, it was like, boy, you cried wolf. And she was like, I'm over it. Every time I stayed home from school, I had to like vacuum the house. And like, I'd be like, I'm watching Jerry Springer. Hello, I'm homesick from school. This is what I

do. And she's like, here's the fucking vacuum. Clean the stairs. That was my, my punishment for being sick. See my mom, my mom was always like really chill when I came to like, especially when I got to senior year and I'd already gotten into college, I would just, I was just like, I don't want to go to school today. And she'd be like, she'd be like, all right. Well, she's so fun. I wish she was like, as long as you don't have any like quizzes or tests or like anything do, and you're trying to get out of that. And you're like, no, hell no. I just lied.

Yeah, exactly. Whatever. But you survived. But she was always like a super chill mom. And like, she definitely like, obviously would take care of me if like there was a real super duper urgency. But in terms of like illness. Yeah. She was not a nurse.

And some people don't handle that. Yeah. Well, she openly has not ever really been a nurse. And so I like I called her yesterday and I sounded worse than I do currently. Or I didn't call her. She called me and she was like, what are you doing? And I was like, I have a really bad cold. I don't feel good.

And she went, okay, well, here's what's going on with me. And then talked for like an hour. And I was like, I don't think you get that I want to be unconscious right now. My poor baby. Not even. I'll say it to you. I'll say it to you to make you feel better.

Thank you. Yeah, she just went, oh, okay. Anyway, but no, so it's very lovely to have Allison making me tea and treating me nice. But I am treating myself to a lot of soup and a lot of bread dipping into the soup. That's what you got to tell. You got to tell yourself, like, hey, listen, I'm an adult now. I can comfort myself. And ironically, the only thing that makes me feel better, Jell-O snack packs.

Okay, now we're getting somewhere. Something Freudian. Freudian is on the house. Yep. Okay, got it. Anyway, that's my most recent, that's my weekly medical update, everyone. I'm sick. Surprise.

I just said Freudian is on the house, which means nothing. So in case anyone heard that and went, what did she just say? I don't know. I heard it and I went, you're right. Anyway. No, I recognized that I said it and I went, that sounded cool. And then two seconds later I was like, what the hell am I saying? Um, well, so beyond why I obviously drink and I drink tea today, what, why do you drink and what do you drink this week? Kristen? I'm still on that liquid death roll. You know, I go through phases with beverages. Um, but I will say no more because they have not offered to sponsor us yet. And I'm still on that liquid death roll. You know, I go through phases with beverages. But I will say no more because they have not offered to sponsor us yet.

And I'm still waiting on that. But I drink because, well, we just found out I'm going to Germany this summer for the first time in years. Oh, no way. Yeah, I'm really excited. This is the first post-pandemic quarantine trip to Europe. So Blaze's family's coming, and so are Blaze's parents at least, and it's going to be Leona's first time abroad.

Oh, she has to get a little passport. Oh, fuck, you're right. Oh, jeez. Okay, let me write that down. Eva, write that down. Surprise. Actually, I'm just going to text Blaze, we need to get Leona a passport.

We need to get Leona a passport and i i told you this already but i checked my passport because we're going to canada soon and it is valid so i feel like you should be very proud of me um i really have no room to like speak though because with last time we went to can I almost couldn't get in I know but like you understand that feeling of like uh-oh because when you called me about your passport being expired you were like don't be mad at me and I was like I'm not gonna be mad at you unless you'd like really did something heinous I don't know um but you said like don't be mad at me and then you said like my password's expired and I was like mine's probably too like I don't know so I feel like we had like we had like maybe three weeks to get to before Canada yesterday I looked at my calendar went oh we're going to Canada in like a month I should really check my passport and I was like wow can you imagine if I'm like em don't be mad at me but

even after you already had to deal with this I just forgot um but it is it is not expired so we're good to go um now i just gotta get leona one man well the uh yeah there's there was nothing scary and truly by the grace of god or something i like got a passport in time without it was like it got there in like a week i was like how did that happen that's never happened yeah they were like there's no way this is gonna happen and then you had well i I like to tell this part of the story. Em called us and was like, okay, so I have to wait till like the week before our trip and then call the passport office. And then they will tell me which city in the United States to fly to, to get my passport.

And we were all like waiting on pins and needles. And then all of a sudden Em was like, okay, so it's either between like Hawaii or El Paso. And we were all like waiting on pins and needles and then all of a sudden em was like okay so it's either between like hawaii or el paso and we were like what like again we were leaving in like few days for canada and em was like well uh i'm calling it el passport is what you called el paso and i was like i know we're panicking but like that's good that's really good like i really really respect that yeah it was it was the scary time where they were like we can't we won't know if there's an opening until 24 hours before so like oh it was 20 oh 24 hours before like their opening would happen i got yeah it was it was something terrifying where i already had no time and they were like well wait a week you just have

to call us and then we'll tell you which cities in the next 24 hours are open and so i planned on call i planned on literally just flying to el paso to getting my getting my 24 hour getting my passport in 24 hours or less and then flying back and then getting on a plane to toronto or wherever we were going it was or was it vancouver i don't know it was insane um it was toronto it was the trip that got all this started maybe the universe really wanted you to not go and get covid but you know too bad i know oh well anyway um oh big fucking reason why we drink this week this is our sixth year anniversary episode oh my god that comes out oh well that's pretty typical that we just forgot it comes out technically you wouldn't it wouldn't

be on your mind because we're not anywhere near our sixth year currently as we for once early ever we're recording very early because we have people on our hashtag team that are helping us schedule and keep our shit together. I bet you somewhere, Katie, who helps us with admin is like writing down, check Christine's passport before every international trip. Like I bet somewhere she's like, no, come on. These people need so much help. I, but it's, it's six years and it's, it's a big, big deal. I shed a little tear. I shed six little tears while I was in the shower. And I was like, wow, this is a big time and it's a big deal.

I wish I could be there to throw a pudding cup at you and say, get it together. Thank you. That's what I call a six pack is a snack pack for me. I'll probably be having a different kind of six pack later to celebrate. And I can't wait. I'm very proud of us. And we said that this theme would be 666, which I think we were going to do something. I don't know.

Weren't we going to record something different for our birthday? Well, this is not the time to figure it out. I don't think it's totally too late. Well, happy 66666 happy 666 i wish we were together so i could give you a little cake with 666 on it my little favorite devil decoration you have but i love him well uh in honor of episode 666 which it's not episode 666 just our sixth year our sixth year. When we get to episode 666. Oh, we're going to go all out for 666. Eva, call Satan. We got to get him there. Call Lucifer.

I call him Lucy, but call Lucy and tell him we're coming. Call everyone downstairs in the fiery place and let them know they're invited to the big bash. They'll know what it means. Yeah. Also, isn't that wild that we're like only halfway there or like not even halfway there? Oh my God. Yeah. Wow.

We got a long ways to go. Okay, everyone, let us stay together for six more years. And 666 will be just the best episode there ever was. I can't wait. Okay, so for episode 666, or that's what I'm calling it, I have decided that I'm going to do a six theme for you with my story you're so prepared i'm not i know so here well i asked back and like i think a long time ago i i was like we're definitely doing a sixth a sixth theme episode. So it's been on the forefront for a while.

I see. Okay. You were prepared ahead of time. So this, for our sixth anniversary, you have six little topics today. How fun. And they are six of your favorite topic, haunted dolls.

Oh, no. Oh, yeah. Oh, no. By the way, sorry. I have to tell you something really quickly what blaze told me yesterday because so em and eva are coming in a few weeks to practice uh to rehearse the show they're coming to visit and we're going to practice a live show before we go on tour and blaze was like well the only thing i have is i have a plan for us all on one of the days and i was like what okay but we're rehearsing he's like i know but like I have is I have a plan for us all on one of the days and I was like what

okay but we're rehearsing he's like I know but like we have to make sure that we can make this plan work. Boy you said this? Yes and I was like at dinner last night and I was like okay and he's like we're going to a museum I'm like what I'm like we're not going to a museum he's like no we're going to a museum I said well how lays it open he's like let me check and then he goes damn it and I said what he goes oh it's closed until may for construction or something and i said okay now can you tell me what it is he said fine it's the vent haven museum and i was like the what like i don't even know what that is he passes me his phone and it's like this basically like ventriloquist dummy museum the vent the vent museum got it yeah and he goes well this is where

i was going to take you em and eva and leona uh one of the days they're in town and i was like well it's too bad they're closed uh but i do need you i do need you to marry him again though because that is just about the most romantic thing a man's ever done for me it was getting so mad because he wouldn't tell me what it was. I was like, I'm not going to a museum. I'm not like postponing rehearsal to go to a museum unless you tell me what it is. Anyway, that's what it was. It's not going to happen this time, but I'm sure if you come after May, we'll go. Yeah, I would like that to be priority number one. Blaze, excellentante. You did a great job. Excellentante.

one blaze excellentante you did a great job excellent great job well this is i guess our our pre-game into the vent museum great with six haunted dolls now these are six dolls that i have had on my list for a while but none of them really had long enough stories to be their own episode love that and so i kept thinking like maybe one day if i do like a compilation episode but when would that happen and then for our sixth anniversary i was like oh well here are six little convenient very convenient so do you happen tell me if you know any of these names but i doubt it but i'll i'll try okay well first i want to say if you search haunted doll on ebay have you done that before okay sorry the podcast i listen to my brother my brother me they have something called haunted doll watch where he finds haunted dolls

on ebay and like reads the the description um and it's like one of my favorite things in the world they're so banana grams well uh they will never run out of material because it looks like there are over 5 000 currently and many of them say things i'm sure as you know like haunted doll very active very dangerous some of them like fit into different categories so some of them are like bonded by another doll some of them have positive energy some of negative energy some of them are like sexual and it's like okay yeah some of them get really weird like oh she will try to seduce you and it's like this is not cool man oh yeah i i would hope people around me would notice if it was working

you're like man that doll's real cute something's real wrong with you so uh and a lot of haunted dolls like i said are in pairs and they're considered bonded like like adoptee animals i guess oh yeah like there's like a tiger cub and and a dog or a goat yeah they're like bonded for some reason exactly so apparently the uh haunted doll sector is booming cool pardon for nose blow cool okay did you like that no okay here's the first doll and maybe you know this name i feel like this is one of the more famous dolls i haven't mentioned but um their name's letta l-e-t-t-a no i don't know letta okay so letta is from well the story starts in the 1970s where a guy named carrie walton and his brother were visiting waga waga new south wales in australia okay and they were exploring an abandoned house

and while there they found something under the floorboards and they didn't know what it was but they said it looked like a small human and so they thought they found a fucking body of a baby yeah oh no they were so scared they lifted the floorboards up to grab the body and what they found was a wooden child-sized doll yuck and in this wooden doll it was carved with thick eyebrows a long hooked nose and a menacing smile oh no so carrie felt like he couldn't leave the doll behind oh no and i mean that's problem number one yeah so they took it with them and brought it home and as they were heading home which by the way had to have been like a 14 hour drive ish maybe longer uh on the drive the brothers said that it looked like he was or this doll was trying to escape from their backpack just just the way that it had like fallen in the back seat

and so they jokingly named the doll letta for Letta Me Out. Okay. Okay. Uh-huh. But as soon as they got Letta home, their family knew something was off about the doll. Maybe it's because they were sexually attracted to it. I'm just kidding. Maybe it was because she had a hook nose and a creepy smile. I don't know.

And they found her in the floorboards. There's a lot of things I feel like are red flags here, but okay. Immediately. As soon as you say, I feel like are red flags here, but okay. Immediately. As soon as you say, I feel like I need to bring this home, that's problem number one. Immediate problem. So the family experienced, they had like these strange presences that they were feeling in the house. And things began to move on their own when people weren't looking, especially at night. And in the mornings, the family would see their items had moved.

And they would find black scuff marks on the floor as if someone was walking around. Ew, she's scuffing her little creepy feet. And the kids were starting to have nightmares and even claimed that they had seen Letta walking around by itself at night. Forget it. Exactly. I was going to say that. When people were around the doll, they would feel nauseous and faint and dogs would become aggressive and violent.

I don't like it. And when Carrie drove around with him in the car, which why are you driving? Stop doing that. Apparently, whenever Carrie would drive around with the doll, it would begin to to rain i guess this happened enough times that it was not just a coincidence and carrie called in mediums to see like what was going on with this doll when the medium said that letta was bound to the spirit of a boy who drowned a long time ago oh god that's so dark. Which, by the way, Carrie says in their mind, it made people, or it made the rain make sense because if it always rained when the doll was out,

it symbolized the drowning of the boy. Okay. They also said Letta could be as old as 200 years old and maybe was made in the boy who died's likeness including the fact that this doll had human hair that's dark oh that's sad which at the time a lot of dolls had human hair but right it's it's creepy to me that's all i'm gonna say i don't love that for for them you know yeah uh i someone gave me a doll and they said it has human hair i go i feel like somebody has given us a doll and said it has human hair like someone has also just sent us like envelopes of human hair so like teeth so it's

like nothing would surprise me anymore so one of the mediums uh actually mentioned that carrie had a weird attachment to the doll and carrie said yeah actually well first of all you're driving around with the doll yeah i kind of figured that out pretty quickly but carrie also couldn't let go of the doll whenever they would try to sell the doll and carrie felt an unnatural urge to keep the doll with them that's sad because that means maybe the little boy was like attached to him so the medium said that carrie and the doll would be together for life oh dear and that being said letta has actually never caused any harm just been really fucking creepy um some even actually

feel calmed by the doll okay and allegedly holding leto will bring good luck i don't know about that but sure i'll just believe you i'm not gonna test it out exactly and carrie actually has charged people in the past only like five bucks if they want to take a picture with the doll which i love that you have to pay like five bucks seems like you might as well not pay um it sounds like a backyard carnival where you're like i don don't want to report this to the IRS, but I do want you to pay for it. It's like the Minnesota Iceman of like, I'll charge you a nickel, Sonny. Yeah. Yeah.

A nickel for this frozen toe or whatever. So anyway, the doll might just be the ghost of a lost boy, but we won't know. And also, I'm now going to send you send you okay i've been waiting for the picture if that's what it is it is the picture okay so are you sending it to geo's true so that we can post it on instagram yes also sorry for the it's a screenshot so oh my oh my oh talk about like she's cute mischievous smile the eyes are really foreboding eyebrows it's like yeah i feel like it knows how i'm gonna die it sure does and it's gonna be it's gonna be at her hands that you're probably gonna die um also i feel like she looks like she fits right in at the ventriloquist museum here oh yeah oh yeah she should make it up she he i don't

know what what those pronouns are yeah but uh yeah they could definitely be a like have a residency at the vet museum or something a residency doll vegas charge five dollars for you to go in all right so that was doll number one okay doll number two is okiku so in 1918 in sapporo japan there was a 17 year old named a akichi akichi suzuki who bought a doll for his two-year-old sister, Okiku. The doll was 15 inches and had black hair and a bob and wore a kimono. Okiku

loved this doll and names it after herself, Popoff Girl. Good for you. That's cute. Reminds me of Robert, though. Because Robert named the doll after himself and then changed his own name. So wait wait now there's two dolls that are haunted after that after being named after their owner that's weird that's probably more than that well so they the little girl named the doll after herself and she was never seen

without it they would eat together play together sleep together you name it and only a year later in 1919 okiku tragically died at three years old no maybe yellow fever or some other type of illness we don't really know but the family put her doll on the altar at their home and one day one day okiku's hair started growing oh oh eventually the bob that she was known for went all the way down to her waist oh my god and it felt different than her original hair and the family would have dreams about okiku and then wake up with the doll lying in bed next to them oh god that's so creepy they would hear loud banging footsteps and voices in the house at night. And so these hauntings were so frequent and intense, especially near Okiku's birthday and death anniversary, that the family was convinced that their daughter's spirit was in the doll. And as a way to be close to their kid, they accepted this doll as pretty much as their daughter, especially because no harm was coming from it.

But the hair growing is real wild. Real wild. In 1938, about 20 years after Okiku's death, the family had to move, but they were afraid to move the doll too far from Okiku's grave. Oh, that's sad. So they brought the doll to a local temple, and they asked them to take care of Okiku.

And this doll now has her own private shrine there. So she's living her best life. Hell yeah. And here's the weird thing, though. Her caretakers say that Okiku's hair still grows. Oh my gosh. Sometimes 10 whole inches. And they say they literally have to give this doll haircuts.

They cut it? Oh my god. And apparently when she gets doll haircuts they cut it oh my god and apparently when she gets a haircut they think it makes her spirit happy like she's getting attention or something oh that's so sad even weirder scientific analysis actually confirms that it is the hair of a human child no uh which i don't know if the doll originally had human hair if it does all of a sudden that's real fucking crazy yeah yeah yeah if that that's the that's the kicker the growing the the fact that it has active follicles is also pretty fucking crazy yeah that's true like approved

by science oh i don't love it uh the more visitors that she gets the stronger her spirit gets and she's now been able to visit people in their dreams after they visit her or their caretakers of her oh dear here's the real wild part okay visitors have also began to say recently that her mouth is a little more open every time they see her. And some have even seen the beginnings of teeth sprouting. I hate that. So this doll is becoming more human as time goes on. That's like, I just, it's honestly also kind of sad because it makes me think like,

is the girl still like stuck in there like should we let her out i don't know i don't know what's going on all i know is it's giving crem it because like this little baby for sure nobody wants firm pass truly firm pass especially if it's like oh uh science science says it's real human child teeth and i'm like okay someone needs to explain this to me stat something's very wrong like this how is this not the proof like wasn't there someone forever ago who like set up a contest of like if you can prove something supernatural to me i will give you 10 million dollars this okiko deserves 10 fucking billion dollars give her the 10 million like that? Like, she has teeth all of a sudden and we don't have like NBC News on the scene.

Like, how are we not reporting on this doll more often? I like how your first reaction is get NBC News on the scene. Someone needs to be there. Someone needs to be there. It could be you. Why not you? Okay, well, here's the press. Here's me.

Remember what donnie said if you want to be be the change you wish to see in the world why don't you go report on it and reporting live currently from and that's why we drink the the newsroom uh i don't know the troll hole uh i don't know breaking news this doll has fucking teeth and no one's talking about it enough and it's it's definitely haunted like sorry we. Like, sorry, we've called it. We've called it. It's not like a silly prank anymore. No, it's gone too far.

Oh my God. Okay, well, if the teeth start going missing, then we know the tooth fairy is also real and that's going to be so crazy. It's going to turn this whole thing on its head. Oh my God. Just cryptids abound. Okay, elevator music while I go grab toilet paper to blow my

nose into cool cute elevator music please stand by we have to step away and go get mine answer the door we just okay good elevator music people good good job okay doll three wait do i get a picture of okiku or no? Oh, shit. Yes. Sorry. Okay. I mean, I don't know if I want one, but I feel like just might as well. I think you deserve one. I think I don't want to see it for the first time on Instagram when I go, what the hell is that? You know, I'd rather just see it now and know ahead of time. I mean, I hope. Oh, I don't know what I hope.

I just part of me hopes it's really not real because that's just a sad story. That's Okiku in her little shrine. And that's her hair that should not be that long. Well, it is long. Like, whether it was before or not, it is quite long now. Yeah, she is thriving. It looks like salon ready. She cover girl yeah i mean it's beautiful hair this is so sad i hope okay all right what's next oh okay so we've got lily

okay lily i think you've heard of before and i just don't think you are aware of it no i don't okay lily is from 19th century germany you okay yeah i'm thinking sorry is that's all it took germany this isn't like the uh i don't know why i started thinking about the freaking box the dybbuk box but that's not the same thing. It's not related. Okay. No, no, no. 19th century Germany, and she wears a long white nightgown, and she also has human hair. This is three so far in a row. Three for three. God, that seems to be the thing that differentiates them. Maybe stopping that practice will just eliminate the haunted doll market. Definitely, that seems to be the magic ingredient. And and i mean is it really unsurprising if you're putting probably a dead person's hair on a doll it makes a lot of sense to me i don't know i mean if you're putting cuban hair that like

at least the body of the person whose hair you barred that body is maybe probably dead at this point whether or not you put the hair on the doll because the person was dead or now the person has died died since like now it's attached to this like of course that practice brought more spirits and especially if it's a child then it's like well of course it would attach to a toy that it loved you know it's like oh named after it yeah yeah so maybe that is it is for the best that we stopped putting hair on dolls. I agree. I'm glad we've not done that practice, I hope, for a while. Let's not do that.

Let's stop. You and me, at least. Let's not do that. It's gone far enough, folks. I think so. So her origins and original home are unknown, but eventually she ended up in an antique shop in Salem, Oregon. The dealer, the antiques dealer said uh that they were starting to have nightmares about a young girl in a terrible accident and apparently that the accounts of this

were quote too disturbing to tell so he put the doll in the antique shop just to get it out of his house and that's where a couple and their young girl found this doll and they don't take it home but the little girl was there talking to lily as if she were a regular child and she was acting like she could actually hear the doll responding to her and she had this back and forth with the doll for three hours at the antique store i can't imagine being a parent with a child and just like having three hours to kill in an antique store. I was going to say,

like, just say we're getting ice cream. Yeah. I'd be like, tell her bye. Tell her bye. So they had this three hour conversation and she told her parents that, oh,

oh, Lily, who I was talking to once quote, suffered great violence. Oh no. That's violence. Oh, no. That's terrible. That's terrible. The family left, but Lily continued to make the lights flicker in the antique shop and move objects on her own.

The dealer kept her on display with a sign saying, haunted doll, for your own safety, do not touch. Which I feel like if you're trying to sell her like for your own safety don't touch really isn't going to get her out of your shop are you sure because i feel like people sell these things left right and center remember that so lily someone's gonna buy that lily waited patiently for a home and waiting for someone to walk by and see don't touch to desperately need to go grab her me and you and zach bagans zach bagans no who felt compelled to take her back to his museum yeah no shit it says don't take me back to your museum and he went well i know what i have to do he went well that clear my schedule that answers

that give me three hours we got a chit chat so when he bought her the clerk that had to handle lily to get her out of the case apparently got really wild stomach pains to a point where she couldn't move and according to zach himself she got flushed and started panicking and she kept saying over and over i must wash my hands oh dear lily now lives at the haunted museum aka you and i have seen her oh she was in the doll room with miss p ptd but obviously got overshadowed by ptd i guess yeah i mean it's hard to imagine why and one time zach apparently even caught a picture of a childlike shadow figure standing behind Lily. Oh, dear.

And he says about Lily that her eyes are dark. Her eyes are dark and cold, but I find her presence comforting. But that's just me. Yeah, it is just you, bud. That's definitely just you. So that's Lily. Wow. Do I get a pic of Lily, even though apparently we've met before?

Yeah, I think you'll actually, you might recognize her. Really? Because she's also in. In the show? She was in the quarantine special we watched. That quarantine special scared the shit out of me. That scared truly the poop right out of me I like I that you were terrified

he's a businessman beyond everything he's the only person who can get away with saying he's an entrepreneur and not be bullshitting us you know yep yep 100% wow oh wow oh my goodness I just had the compulsion to do a

sign of the cross and I'm not even Catholic anymore. That's silly. Okay, well, you do whatever you need to do. Oof. Gives me the... A lily gives me the creeps. I don't want to insult her, you know, but... Yeah, she might hear you.

Yeah, it makes me a little on edge, honestly. Since you've been near her, maybe there's a... Oh, God, we're already connected. Attachment. Okay. it makes me a little on edge honestly since you've been near her maybe there's a uh oh god she we're already connected okay uh doll number four is mandy who i could have sworn was on uh familiar i could i didn't see if she was actually maybe because i swear she was also in the quarantine episode but maybe she was like a rental and like he leased her for a little bit i don't but is there like an uber for haunted dolls just like i just need to borrow her for a few days i i don't know for all i know she is somehow involved with zach bagans but i don't that's

not coming up in these notes at least weird okay so mandy's a baby doll from 1900 to 1920 she has a cracked face she wears a white nightgown a matching baby's bonnet shoes and she has a stuffed lamb with her oh oh yeah i remember that doll from the show i think really i thought so i feel like i've definitely seen that doll before somewhere with the with the lamb that's what sounds familiar to me mandy doll zach bagans i don't know maybe i'm wrong maybe i just had the idea in my head and i feel like mandy was totally there maybe i really i don't know anyway maybe that's some sort of like Mandela effect. So in 1991, as you know, that you're pretty famously.

That's when everything changed for the better in this world. Yeah. Better. Well, no, not really. In 1991, the last owner anonymously donated her. That's how you fucking know it's a problem. That's the problem. Mm hmm.

To the Quezonal and District Museum in Canada. And because the owner could not handle her hauntings anymore. So excuse me while I reflect on the time we got a whole crowbarred box full of hay and a haunted doll that someone anonymously donated to us and said oh that the house keeps catching on fire yeah it set the barn on fire my daughter sees her in her dreams anyway here you go i'm not putting a return address on this box wow thanks what do you like first of all we're not zach bagans nor are we exorcists we don't know how to we don't know what to do with this either and we open we used to open the fan mail in our in my house and i'm like

now what do i do i was like do i put her in the trash and we were like no that's not good when i put her in the closet i don't want to i don't want to set the house on fire i don't know that was just quite a conundrum i we neither of us knew what to do but also if you're thinking of sending us something incredibly haunted or dark and maybe has attachments to it we also don't want it just just so we are clear. We are attached enough, trust us. We can find our own hauntings. I still somehow, six years later, get a lot of people DMing me asking how to perform an

exorcism. And I don't know. I'm not an exorcist. To be fair, in those early episodes, you kept calling yourself a priest. And I think that might have put people on the wrong path. We're thinking, you know, oh, a priest. Well, you're definitely qualified. You know what?

That's my own fault, apparently. As the kids say, that's a you problem. It's a me problem now. It's a me problem. So anyway, it got anonymously donated. And apparently the donor used to store mandy in the basement but one night uh the donor started waking up to the wailing sounds of a baby crying in the basement oh jesus that's creepy eventually they go down and when they go looking for mandy the crying stopped once they were in the basement but mandy was gone

and the basement window was somehow open. As if homegirl had fucking busted out. Oh my God. The next day, they went back downstairs and she was back in her same spot in the basement. And after that, they would hear crying every night.

Oh, and when they finally got rid of her, the crying stopped. She was probably just out drinking with her friends. She was just having a good time. Leave her alone. She's out. She's breaking curfew. She's growing.

She's a growing girl. She needs to have a beer and cigarette every now and then. She needs an experience. And if you're going to deprive her of that, then I don't know what to tell you. It's a you problem, you know? Certainly. So in her new home that she has now been donated to, this museum, Mandy's hauntings started pretty immediately. And lunches would go missing, which I can't imagine a worse ghost.

That's hilarious. But that's also so easy to pin. Like, you can be like, oh, I don't know. I think that haunted doll took your bologna sandwich. You know? I feel like that's a pretty easy crime to cover up. Yeah. When it disappears and then reappears in someone else's mouth.

That's. Yeah, exactly. You're like, I didn't do it. It's a doll. Apparently Mandy would have lunches go missing, but then they would show up in random spots, like stuffed in people's like drawers and stuff. But again, I could steal someone's lunch and stuff in my drawer you know like yeah it depends on what the lunch was i feel like we need more

context because if it was like somebody's like leftover i don't know turkey chili then like maybe not but if it was like a lunchable i mean i get why somebody might have stuffed that in their drawer yeah and then blame it on a ghost and be like i don't know how that got in my drawer sorry it's just so the strangest thing your turkey chili never moves so the family would uh the they would also hear footsteps at night uh books and important documents would disappear and then reappear random places other dolls in the museum would get knocked over uh as if she's like bully yeah she was like this is my place bitch bully doll uh she also had to be moved eventually to her own private display uh because i guess she wasn't cooperating with the other dolls oh and uh while in her private display the visitors cameras will randomly die and it's impossible to get a good picture of her.

That's spooky. One person at the museum said, you try and videotape her and your camera light will go off and on. And we've had people who have said in May 2000 that the lamb that always sits on Mandy's lap wound up underneath her display case. Ooh. I hate that. And it's in a case. Yeah, that's creep. That's not good.

Like part of it is outside all of a sudden. Yeah, like somehow escaped. Ooh. I hate that. And it's in a case. Yeah, that's creep. That's not good. Like part of it is outside all of a sudden. Yeah, like somehow escaped. Ooh. Psychics who have met Mandy have said that she's possessed by the spirit of a little girl who just wants attention and honestly same. That's so sad. But like she's getting attention. She's literally beating up other dolls.

So like. I know. I know. She's acting out. Anyway, that's Mandy. I'll show you a picture of her. Okay. Okay.

I don't know why the lamb is what sounds so familiar to me. I swear we've seen Mandy before and I swear it was in a Zach Bagans situation. That's what I thought. Zach Bagans situation. A classic ZBS. We've had a lot of Zach Bagans situations to be clear. Some more personal than others. But I swear we've seen her on a show.

Maybe I know he did that show like Deadly Possessions or something. Oh, yeah. But I don't think I watched that show. She's from somewhere, but I've definitely seen her. Maybe I saw her at the museum, but then she might not be at the museum. So I don't know what's going on. Oh, yeah. I swear I've seen her.

This is very sad because she just looks like a sweet little baby. Maybe in my nightmares is where I've seen her. Maybe she's just living in your subconscious somehow. All right. The last two. The next one's very quick. We've got Ruby. Ruby is a porcelain doll from the early 1900s in Ontario, also Canada, I see.

Interesting. They're either from Canada or have human hair. Interesting. Wow, imagine combining them, you get Mandy. Or Ruby. Now that I don't like. Ruby is a porcelain doll from early 1900s, and she's named after the little girl who loved her. So we got another doll who's named after their owner the girl the girl ruby not the doll the girl ruby died tragically with ruby in her arms no and then was passed down in the same family for generations but people uh have hid her in storage spaces because she makes them feel so uneasy people experience dread and grief and nausea around her for no reason and ruby the doll would also move through the house at night and be found on different chairs beds and tables oh my gosh i really can't process when something's just moving

by itself i can't yeah i mean there's like because there's like literally no explanation for it except that somebody's doing it. And if they're not, then nothing good can come of that. Yeah. Yeah. Her family donated her also to a museum. This one, which we need to go to, by the way, is called the Traveling Museum of the Paranormal and Occult. It travels.

When's it coming to us? She better come to us right now. Hurry up. She better come to us right now. Hurry up. And many of these visitors who have gone to this museum have held Ruby, who also report and confirm the sadness that she makes people feel. Why would I then want to do that? I don't want to hold her then.

No, thank you. Many think that the spirit of the girl Ruby still follows her doll and we were just we're just encountering the doll or we're just encountering the girl in doll form. And fun fact, an attempt to exercise the doll has failed oh they tried and it didn't work oh i don't i don't think that's good because then they usually just piss it off that's what i would think yeah i have i have some really gnarly ghosts at my mom's house in my childhood home and my mom has always said like why don't we just like cleanse your space and i'm like because if it doesn't work we're all fucked then then things are gonna go out of control exactly i'm like they're kind of like creepy but they've never done anything and i think we have an understanding we're like at an impasse yeah uh-huh we don't like each other but we're not causing any

problems for either of us so yeah but if i push it yeah let's just let things be as they are i think that's probably for the best. This is Ruby. Okay. That's one of my potential future kid names. Really? I like Ruby. I love that name. That's definitely not a name on my list.

Not that I don't like it, but I just haven't, it's just never ended up on my list. Yeah, it did recently. I feel like it. Oh, hello, Ruby. Look at your little feets. Look at her little feets. Not a toe in sight. It looks like a little baby feet. Not a toe in sight. It looks like a little baby feet.

Not a toe in sight. The other one made me sadder, the Mandy one, because it really does look like a little baby laughing. Yeah. Ruby just looks like she's having a bad day. Well, wait until you meet the other Lily. Oh, dear. There's another Lily. Okay.

Our final doll. Lily number two, Ily okay our final doll lily number two i guess it's all this one i think she's gonna be your favorite christine oh god okay she's a very small doll and lily was given by again an anonymous donor to a paranormal investigative team like because she didn't want it she was like like, you have this as your own little mascot now. Because we don't want it. They dropped her off with this investigative team with instructions. Okay.

I don't even read instructions when I'm putting together furniture. What makes you think I'm going to read the instructions for this haunted doll? One of the investigators said i found her outside my door one morning with a note that said to not put her by mirrors or in the same room i sleep in oh no and then a smart idea i didn't think about this but the investigator gave the doll a flashlight so she could drain the batteries but instead she made my lights flicker at night that is smart though like here's something you can mess with yeah don't bother me here's a gift here's a disposable gift yeah yeah and then the investigator keeps saying my cat would not go near her and my dog would just

stare at times i would be woken up from a dead sleep smelling burnt toast or sometimes a sweet fruity smell her favorite Her favorite color is red. That is all I know. Oh. That is all I know. It's like, well, that's quite a bit. Yeah. Like, oh, she's related to the smell of toast?

Like breakfast? Hang on. She makes breakfast and loves the color red. So U.S. Ghost Adventures, which is, I think, separate from Ghost Adventures. I think U.S. Ghost Adventures is its own thing. They claim that Lily is an effigy doll made to ward off evil spirits and malicious ghosts so lily in theory is a good guy um okay this practice of effigy dolls dates back to the 1600s and came over with the dutch and lily fun fact is named after countess Elizabeth Bathory. Oh!

Which, by the way, episode 105, if you're interested in learning about Elizabeth Bathory. Yeah, that's quite a tale. Lily's new handlers, this investigative team, they have decided, which, what a marketing plan. This is very, like, zach bagans being a business entrepreneur this investigative team they decided they were going to reproduce lily dolls following her following her original pattern and likeness to sell to enthusiasts and now through their host a ghost program anyone can purchase their own lily to protect their homes from spirits and monsters.

Stop! Host a ghost! So there are some rules that come with your doll. Okay. They say each lily has her own personality and should be treated with respect. Okay, understood. She should only come out in October when the spirits are most frequent,, she will get bored and cause mischief in your home. Uh-oh. Children should only interact with Lily under adult supervision, and you should take Lily out on the town with you to give her something to do. Okay. Here are 10 ideas for using Lily in your own home.

Okay. From the website themselves. And this is only in October, right? I guess only in October. Okay. 10 ways to use Lily at home. One, make a carriage for Lily from a spare pumpkin. Okay, so now we're just in like DIY arts and crafts.

Got it. Number two, make Lily be the thing that they see through your letterbox. Oh, so like in your door when you have one of those. Oh, no. So you just see a little creepy doll's eyes. That's a bad idea. I mean, it's a fun idea. Number three, put Lily in places you put Lily in places where you wake up.

Lily is a morning ghost. Okay. Is up. Lily is a morning ghost. Okay. Is a what? Is a morning ghost. I thought it said don't put her where you sleep. I feel like these. But put her where you wake up? I don't know what's going on.

I'm just reading from the website. Number four. Make Lily move around and appear in a different place for others to find each morning number okay now that sounds like elf on the shelf and i'm loving this this is getting like for sure into elf on the shelf territory number five add lily to a door wreath oh oh oh number six which i feel like should just be a continuation of number one. Put Lily inside a pumpkin. Illuminated. Okay. Number seven.

Put Lily near a nightlight. Say goodbye to sleepiness when you spot her. It's so unhinged. Number eight. It does feel like we work there and we gave them one recommendation. I'm a little scared of how like on the notes this is for something we would do it gets worse number eight lily works just as well on a ceiling oh no oh no number nine opening a cupboard to see lily is a fun surprise no it's not a fun surprise i promise number 10 number 10 a surprise appearance on a bookshelf is sure to catch some unawares. Yeah, I'm not surprised by that.

So these are ways to help you bond with Lily. But really, you should know that she is a powerful effigy doll and not to be intentionally messed with. Sure. Fun fact. Lily was also once for sale through the Lizzie Borden house. And fun fact, one product review, which I guess her name was Christine Schieffer, said that Lily is October's newest elf on a shelf. Okay, see, I'm telling you. I mean, to put her in little pumpkins and put her on the ceiling and hide her in the cupboard.

Yeah, it fits. And because it is our sixth anniversary and I went to get you a gift, you have a little Lily coming to your home. No. You sure do. Make sure to put her on a pumpkin or something. I'm, are you serious? And here's what she looks like.

Can you send a picture? I'm going to make this our new thing. This is going to be like, because I've always wanted to do Elf on the Shelf, but not really just for my baby, just like for fun to do like, not, I feel like this is the kind do Elf on the Shelf, but not really just for my baby, just like for fun to do. I feel like this is the kind of Elf on the Shelf that I can finally get behind, you know? Well, happy sixth year. She's a coming. And this is the biggest honor of my life.

You have no idea how shocked I am. Oh, dear. Okay. Well, I didn't picture her looking like this. She looks like she came from the Beetlejuice universe. She looks ready to play what are you talking about she looks like she does great on a ceiling or that's what i meant she looks like she could be in a pumpkin carriage um you should just put like a put a ring camera on her and leave her in the mailbox like they say you know to see what happens i honestly my poor mail carrier would be just like probably quit on the spot i love her wow i'm honored and

honestly like it looks like she would be great pals with the little devil butt from the cake decoration like they look like they would go hand in hand. I honestly am very excited to see what positions you put her in because. Oh my God, I can't wait. She'll be somewhere. I don't know where. So if when this episode comes out, hopefully she's here by then and we can take, I'll take a photo and we can post that on Instagram. That'll be fun.

That would be lovely. I really, I wish you well with your new little baby. Thanks. She's on her way. She loves you so. And it's going to be like that TikTok where the little girl's obsessed with a zombie doll. And Leona's going to be like, this is my baby. Anyway, happy sixth year.

And those are six haunted dolls. I am so honored. I didn't get you anything. Now I feel like a shitty friend. I'm so sorry. I was sick and on the couch. and I went, you know what? I've got nothing going on. So here goes me spending money.

And that's how that happened. It's my favorite activity because it really gets me in the mood for presents. I'm like, something's coming my way. Any opportunity to give you a present is my favorite kind of day thank you so much i love giving you presents because you're also you're always so appreciative because they are so fucking weird there's nobody else so true though it's like it's just always the most perfect like how like it just i don't know match made in heaven me and this doll i i hope so i can't wait to see you snuggling her in bed instead of blaze you know

maybe i'll name her ruby and that'll be my i'll use the name for that she is wearing a ruby dress okay see she looks just red maybe cut a couple of leona's hairs off and just throw it on her head that's good excellent idea takes us yeah it took us approximately 15 minutes to immediately 180 on our platform to stop using real hair on dolls. We're now doing it ourselves. Cool. It's different because it's us. It's different. It's not the same.

Yeah. Well, anyway, I hope you had a good 666 day. Thank you. I did. I had the best time, really. Perfect. Now I'm going to really bum you out. So we all right.

This is the story of Krista Pike, a.k.a. the youngest woman to ever be sentenced to death in the U.S. post-Furman era. And I will explain what post-Furman era is. Yeah. OK. post-Furman era. And I will explain what post-Furman era is. Yeah. Okay. So she was put on death row in 1996. And for context, in the landmark 1972 case, Georgia v. Furman, the Supreme Court ruled that the death penalty is unconstitutional, citing the Eighth Amendment, the one that prohibits cruel and unusual punishment. And this basically voided all prior death sentences,

which at the time was about 630. Some states dropped the death penalty altogether and executions were paused for four years while states scrambled to draft new sentencing requirements and guidelines so any future death sentences would hold up under Supreme Court scrutiny. Basically, the idea, the goal behind this was to make sure no one was being sentenced for arbitrary or biased reasons. The idea was to consider all other possibilities before capital punishment and to only use capital punishment if

the court feels it's absolutely necessary, which, what does that mean, absolutely necessary? At what point? Let me know. What does that mean? Absolutely necessary. At what point? Let me know. What's your limit? It seems like a very vague gray space, but, you know, I'm also very anti-capital punishment, so I guess I'm not the one to know. And yet, according to the 2020 U.S. Census, despite self-identified Black people in the U.S. making up only 12.4% of the population and self-identified white people making up 61.6% of the population. Both demographics are about equal on death row as of April 2022 stats. We have black people make up about 41% of death row, white people make up 42%, meaning

black people are still being disproportionately convicted and sentenced to death. So that's just worth noting. I mean, again, I don't think any of us are very shocked by the information, but it's good info to keep in your back pocket. Anyway, that all said, in this post Furman period, death penalty sentencing is supposed to meet really rigid standards of discernment and equality. And as of April 1st, 2022, of the 2,414 people on death row in the United States, only 50 were or are women. And Krista Pike is one of them. Interesting. Wow. Okay. So that's 50 out of about 2,400. So now we get into the story that put her there. We're going to jump to a different character here. Her name is Colleen Slemmer, and she was born September 20th, 1975 in Pennsylvania.

When her parents divorced, she moved with her mom to Florida where her mom remarried. She was a deeply compassionate and empathetic girl from a young age. Her mom remembers her as an awesome, giving person. She struggled with a learning disability, so she always looked out for other disabled kids and, you know, kind of protected them. And it's something people admired about her and remember her for. She was just always very inclusive, wanted other people's needs to be met, but her own needs were unfortunately ignored. And she ended up having to drop out of high school because she couldn't keep up. Her grades slipped pretty desperately.

And so to keep up, she started working various minimum wage jobs, like mostly fast food, to get by. But she didn't know what to do next. She just knew she had to do something, like she wanted to get out of the minimum wage cycle. So she heard about the Job Corps. Now, the Job Corps is a government program, and this is from the Department of Labor's website. It's a government program which helps eligible young people ages 16 through 24 complete their high school education, train them for meaningful careers, and assist them with obtaining employment. their high school education, trains them for meaningful careers, and assists them with obtaining employment. So basically, Colleen could get her GED this way and learn a trade or professional skill and finally, you know, escape this minimum wage cycle she was in and carve out

a more comfortable life for herself. So she jumped on this opportunity and she enlisted for the Tennessee Job Corps because she wanted to pursue training in computer science. And unfortunately, the Florida Job Corps didn't have computer science, so she would have to move to Knoxville to participate in this program. So in September of 1994, she moved to Knoxville for her new start. Her mom and stepdad had a hard time saying goodbye, but they knew, you know, this was the right thing for her. She was pursuing a new career path. It was all very exciting. But once she got to Knoxville and started the program, she pretty quickly realized things were not what they were, not all they were cracked up to be.

The campus itself was in really bad shape. The other students had little respect for each other's space. People had gone through her stuff and taken things. There wasn't much supervision or guidance. And keep in mind, at this point, she's about 18 or 19. So she's still very young. And a lot of these kids are, you know, still very young in their formative years yeah yeah so there was no reliable structure to the program and she struggled with that um and she also for whatever reason pretty immediately had to deal with several very alarming bullies oh shit really yeah so one of the bullies came into her room one night and stood over colleen's bed with a box cutter and threatened her. That's a fucking, that's a scary person. That's a criminal. That's assault. I don't know. That's not a bully. That's truly a threat to your life. Well, that person was Krista Pike.

Oh, shit. Yeah. So, of course, now we have this horrible, this is just a horrible story, everybody. I'm sorry. I don't know how else to put it. It's just horrible. Krista Pike's childhood was a nightmare. This is where we see that classic cycle of abuse. Her parents were split up, so she lived with her maternal grandmother, who was abusive, was an alcoholic, beat Krista up, locked her in a closet, just really physically and emotionally abused her. Eventually, Krista ended up in the permanent care of her paternal grandmother, whom she loved dearly and was very close to. She was drinking and doing drugs by age 11. That's how quickly things kind of spiraled out of control. And when Krista was 12, her paternal grandmother died very unexpectedly and she took it extremely hard. This was like the only person who had ever been nice to her and cared for her. Yeah. Yeah, and had been nice to her. And so she attempted suicide by overdosing. Again, she was 12.

Jesus, wow. She was just from the start having it rough. Having a really, really difficult time. Her attempt failed and she ended up in a joint custody situation between her parents, who bounced her back and forth between their homes with like no stability, no structure. parents who bounced her back and forth between their homes with like no stability no structure her mom was very neglectful and she later openly admitted to neglecting Krista and even sometimes doing drugs with her daughter in an attempt to bond and like that's terrible but also there are so many people out there who have that exact same story I feel like I've heard it so many times like

oh well that's how we bonded that's how we bonded. That's how we got together. Yes. Yes. How does that happen? But I know shockingly common. It's sort of a story where the mom just wasn't ready to be the mom, you know, and and she even said like she just wanted to be young. She wanted to be she wanted to keep being young. And now she had this child she didn't want and just treated her as a nuisance until she was old enough to be a quote unquote friend and, you know, do drugs with. I mean, it's it's very it's horribly sad. And by age 14, Krista had a live in boyfriend that just lived at her mom's house with her. But one day he beat her so badly with a belt that she tried to fight him off with a knife. So the police showed up and arrested him.

But Krista never filed any charges and just continued living this way without structure, with no hygienic control whatsoever. Her mom had even noticed that by age nine, Krista struggled with issues that require serious professional intervention. But, of course, that was never addressed. And that was at nine. That was before. At nine. Exactly. So she had struggled with what? So her mom had noticed that by nine, Krista struggled with issues that required serious professional intervention.

Yeah. And then she started drinking and doing drugs. It wasn't. That was even before. Exactly. And some of the examples of things she was doing by nine were lying stealing uh she broke every rule and crossed every line and the thing is like yes she was misbehaving quote unquote but like as a direct reaction to abuse and neglect you know like she's nine years old like you can't expect her to be following the rules if you're treating her like garbage. It's just horrible. Her aunt noted that Krista had become a pathological liar who was growing pot in her mom's house, was pushing boundaries, had boyfriends over.

Then again, her mom was also having boyfriends over and doing drugs with her. So it's like, well, that seemed like that was part of the living arrangements. She, her aunt even remembers being afraid of Krista, even at a young age. Again, like you said, even at age nine, they were noticing these patterns, these behaviors that needed intervention and not one person intervened. So she continued to live a life of neglect, instability and abuse. She had been kicked out of her dad's house once before, but then ended up back with him. And one day in 1989, while she was at her dad's house horribly, her father claimed he caught Krista sexually abusing his own daughter. What?

Who was her half sister, age two. And Krista was 13. And so, you know, in some cases, traumatized children might reenact their abuse and unintentionally traumatize even younger victims by kind of playing out what has happened to them. And that's one of the many reasons why professional intervention is crucial for kids who are in this position, especially victims of abuse. So Krista had already attempted to take her own life and was clearly a danger to herself. This is after her grandmother had passed. And now she was a danger to other children. But instead of once again, getting Krista the help she needed her dad just kicked her out of the house one more time for good and um age 13 very tragic it's like so many i mean treating treated like just throw away garbage and it's terrible which like i do i do it's such a tricky situation exactly that's what the horrible part is like such a cycle,

you know, because it doesn't excuse anything later. Right. But, and it doesn't excuse sexually abusing a child. It just kind of starts to explain it. And so you feel bad for them, but it's like also,

Oh God, it's so hard to find that. I don't even know. Like there's, it's one of those situations where no matter what, like there's not a right answer. Exactly. Like, there's, it's one of those situations where no matter what, like, there's not a right answer. Exactly. Exactly.

It's not clear cut. There's no right answer. It's just sad. It's just really sad. And I hope, you know, people keep moving toward the path of, like, getting help and, like, noticing these things and saying something. And I hope that's where we continue because stuff like this breaks my heart. So her dad kicked her out of the house for good at age 13. And as she got older, like Colleen, understandably, Krista struggled in school.

So she eventually ended up in the Knoxville Job Corps to finish her education and get a handle on life. So she enrolled in the same computer course when she was 18 and she met her 17 year old boyfriend to Daryl ship and their mutual friend Shadola Peterson, uh, in this program. So to Daryl was interested in the occult, uh, and specifically quote unquote Satanism.

And I put air quotes around that because his interest in Satanism was not like the real tenets of Satanism that uh you know it's not those like 11 core rules or yes it's not like he's making up his own version or something it's sort of like he just I think liked the idea of like Satan you know worship and all that and and so the darker side of the occult he was very in into that he was into the aesthetic but not the actual values yeah it's almost like it gave him a cool edge or something like gotcha okay just a dark edge if that makes sense by the way i we've talked about this before but like at least like eight of those 11 tenets of satanism make me think i'm a satanist so i know every time i read them i'm like oh okay it's not even hard to like like for him to be like into

satanism but not into like the core tenets did we read those on rituals that wasn't on this show right if if we wherever we read it it was a long time ago yeah because i feel like we went through it um i think it was maybe on rituals so we i don't know if we've talked, it was a long time ago. Yeah. Cause I feel like we went through it. Um, I think it was maybe on rituals. So we, I don't know if we've talked about it on here, but yeah, in case you're wondering, um, the fundamental tenants of Satanism are not like worship Satan. Yeah. They're like, don't harm children. Don't harm animals. Don't be nice to everybody. And like, so when you say he he's like he wasn't truly following the core values like it wouldn't even be that hard to follow the values like they're they're all i think probably back in the 80s people weren't like sure you know sure following followings you weren't just

googling the 11 rules to make sure you were down yeah exactly and i think like when we were 17 if someone said i'm a satanist like we would not have been like oh so you have compassion for all living creatures we would have been like right oh you worship satan got it you know i think yeah that's true it has a different meaning um so he was into satanic panic versus satanism yeah sure he was in he Yes, he was into the what satanic panic was trying to shut down, I guess. OK, got it. And this was the height of satanic panic, speaking of which. So people ran with it either way. He was also black. So regardless of the crime that he does commit, you know, later on in the story, the media was ready to jump on the fact that he was a Satanist.

You know, later on in the story, the media was ready to jump on the fact that he was a Satanist. He was a young black boy, age 17. The Satanism only gave them more material, basically. So as soon as Colleen arrived in Knoxville, Krista began harassing Colleen and began stalking her. For unknown reasons, Krista became convinced that Colleen was out to steal her boyfriend to Daryl. And she became obsessed with Colleen, like despised her, hated her guts. And Colleen just couldn't understand it. She had no interest in him. She said to other students, her friends, even her mom, like, I don't want her boyfriend.

I have no interest in him. Like, I don't know what her deal is with me. Huh. Okay. So Colleen approached the program counselor once for help, but he basically dismissed her. And so she was on her own at that point. She called her mom and said, Hey, mom, I want to come home. But her mom said, Hey, you know what? We made a six month commitment. Why don't you stick out the six months and then we'll talk. And unfortunately, her mom didn't realize how extreme

the situation was. So Colleen spent her Christmas break in Pennsylvania with her dad and she seemed to kind of cheer up and feel like, OK, I'm optimistic about returning to the program. You know, I'll be able to handle Krista. She got back in kind of a better mood, a better place. But then Krista surprised her by approaching her and saying, you know what? Forget it. Let's put all that behind us. I want to mend our bridges. I want to make peace with you. And Colleen was like, thank God. Okay, finally, it's about time. So Krista's bullying or, you know, further than bullying, had been just like so hard on colleen obviously very distracting like how was she supposed to be studying like feeling fulfilled feeling safe

and so she was super relieved so krista said i know let's go smoke some weed together and rent a movie and colleen was like great i'm in i already know this is bad i already know it's bad it's really bad it's really bad i mean this this person ends up on death row so exactly i can't imagine this and she's a woman which i'm sure was makes it harder it definitely makes it harder for i think people to say yeah you deserve to be on death row so whatever's about to happen is about to be so fucking brutal and bad i okay i'm glad you know i think i didn't really think it through like i just let it the information come to me and as i was always prepared because i never know how to keep think like some things obviously are not um there shouldn't be uh making light-hearted making levity of it but there are every now and then when

you're telling your stories i'm always looking for a place to like try to bring some light-hearted stuff back back into the content to make it conversational yeah and i'm just preparing that like i've got nothing i have nothing in the arsenal it's about to be really bad it's really bad um it's really bad so january 12 1995 um colleen called her mom seemed to be in high spirits things were looking up uh she didn't know that just the day before krista had told another student named kim that she was planning to kill colleen because quote i just feel mean today wow so she really just fully had the intention it wasn't even like she had i don't even know if an episode is the right thing to say but like it's not like this

it wasn't as for the moment yeah like it was fully thought out and because i feel like being mean yeah that's fucking crazy like that's crazy like again again like this Colleen hadn't even done anything like hadn't made a move on the boyfriend like there was just something about Colleen that Krista despised and just like I think it was probably that Colleen sounds pretty darn perfect and loved and like that's everything together maybe and has yeah it just sounds like everything that this girl never got or never was able to have at the risk of being armchair psychologist yeah like she has parents that she's visiting and calling her mom every day and yeah that might be part of it for sure so um Krista had told Kim you

know I'm I just feel mean today I'm gonna kill uh I'm gonna kill Colleen but Kim was, you know, I just feel mean today. I'm going to kill Colleen. But Kim was like, you know, she said shit like that all the time. She was a bully. Like, I just thought she was just saying that to be dramatic. So Kim didn't really take it that seriously. But the next night, January 12th, around 8 p.m., Kim saw Colleen leaving the campus with Krista, Tadaryl, and their mutual friend Shidola. So Kim saw the group return at 10 without Colleen, and she still dismissed it, thinking like, no, there's no way. Moreover, all four students had signed out of the program's logbook, but Colleen had never signed back in. So at 11 p.m., Krista came to Kim's room and told her she just killed Colleen. If I were Kim Kim I'd be like how on

earth do I get out of this room now without also being killed as a witness or like yeah like what are you supposed to say cool like high five girl like dial hitting a silent panic button under my desk like what am I supposed to do I can't imagine the instant paranoia you haven't even done anything wrong all of a sudden you just heard information and now you're like, how do I unhear that? Yeah. They could consider you a threat and they've clearly already been able to murder somebody. I was going to say, especially when they've proven that they don't have any qualms if they're just feeling like it, you know? Like, did she was, do we ever find out if Krista was hoping for recognition on that?

Like, what did she want? Okay, well, I'll tell you what she says and stuff, and you can tell me if you can get to the bottom of it, because I still can't totally wrap my head around it. I think anybody who's not, you know, been able to just kill someone on a whim, probably can't really understand what was going through her head. Okay, fair enough. But it gets worse for Kim, who's in this silent panic moment, because Krista says, oh, I just killed Colleen, and then pulls something out of her pocket. And she says, oh, this is a piece of Colleen's skull.

I kept it as a prize. Wow. Wow. piece of Colleen's skull I kept it as a prize oh wow wow Kim was like I don't know I think Kim just didn't really believe her like thought she was trying to like get a reaction or like it just seemed so outrageous like oh you have a piece of bone and that just happens to be I mean it sounds like something I can't i can't imagine meeting i can't imagine someone i know no matter how mean they are actually murdering somebody and then being so bold as to brag about it and then show me evidence of come to my room and show me like a piece of bone from that night if in my mind if one of my friends is secretly a murderer they at least are super secretive about it like they at least know not to say a goddamn thing yeah so she said uh not only did colleen say a goddamn thing but

she was smiling singing and even dancing around the room like recounting what she had done and so it was we don't know if it was like disbelief or just like shock or maybe like you said a fear of being next uh if she told on uh on krista but kim didn't report this to anyone so in the that night at least so in the morning she asked krista hey what do you plan to do with that skull fragment and krista said uh she smiled and she said i'm taking it to breakfast in my pocket ew yeah it's so twisted. So later that same day, Krista told yet another student, Stephanie Wilson, what she had done. And she pointed at her shoes, at the brown bloodstains on her shoes as proof that she had actually done it. And Stephanie, like Colleen, said nothing to anyone because we don't know. Maybe she was scared. Maybe she didn't believe her. We don't know. But the next morning, January 13th, a University of Tennessee employee spotted what

they thought was unfortunately a mutilated animal near the campus greenhouse. Oh my God. Yeah. So a little after 8 a.m., police responded to the scene and unfortunately discovered Colleen's body. She was naked from the waist up she had suffered extreme head trauma had been cut multiple times by a sharp blade and there was a pentagram carved into her chest with a knife oh oh my god yeah um her body this is really fucked up okay this is really brutal and gruesome and i i beg of you if you have kids in the car please don't don't listen to this um her body had been so badly mutilated that it was difficult for officers to even understand like what they were looking at because they thought

it was her face but it was actually she was lying face down and the back of her head had been beaten so badly that they couldn't tell like what they were looking at. Oh, my God. And the crime scene itself encompassed 6,000 square feet. Like that's how much space they had to rope off to to find evidence. Holy shit. 6,000 square feet. There were hand and knee prints in the mud, different pools of blood throughout the area.

Colleen's clothes had been scattered around. There were broken bushes, footprints all over the place, like just signs of an intense drawn out struggle. And during Colleen's autopsy, she had so many wounds that the medical examiner decided to only catalog the most severe because he just couldn't individually record all of them. Oh my God. The examiner identified Colleen using dental records, and she ruled blunt force trauma to the head was the cause of death. The murder weapon was a piece of asphalt, which had left residue in and around the wound on her head.

And so I'll tell you now how they caught Krista, and I think you can guess she wasn't very subtle because police pretty much immediately began suspecting her due to her odd behavior around the crime scene oh was she like real fucking giddy about it that's m that's literally the word they used yeah oh yeah it's literally in the bullet i'm about to read so she showed up and stood by the crime scene tape during the investigation and kept asking if they had any suspects. And she seemed strangely giddy about the whole thing. So you nailed it. One investigator noted the pentagram necklace she was wearing.

And when he found out about the pentagram in had been engraved into Colleen's chest, he reported krista's odd behavior and uh they found the skull fragment in her jacket pocket just right there standing there and all the blood stains on her shoes yeah exactly like she just walked right up into it even such obvious things like like there there is i already am very aware this person is not mentally all there, I don't think. But you would think if you're going to kill someone, you would think, I don't know, what's the sane answer to this? I know, it's hard because there's not really logic here. Yeah, but trying to follow logic, which I guess makes this is not a space for logic,

but if you were to kill somebody, you would then want to make sure nobody found out. And the obvious things, I mean, if you've watched a single crime show or anything or just have common sense hide evidence don't show it off to everybody and dance about it i think you nailed it earlier it's like clearly she wanted people to know she did it like she's telling people i really i mean it's almost like a game as you said at the risk of being armchair psychologists or whatever it just feels like she didn't think that she was good enough or on the same level as this girl and now she's better than her because she took her out yeah took her out yeah like eliminated her i mean that must be what it is and like she

clearly had no qualms about telling people what she did and showing off. I mean, she was bragging. So of course they find the skull in her jacket pocket. It matches the body. And so knowing she had no way out at this point, she waived her Miranda rights and confessed to the killing right away. However, she did try to paint herself in a sympathetic light. She told investigators that Colleen was stalking and harassing her because Colleen was after her boyfriend. So she started accusing Colleen of her own tactics.

She said one night she awoke to see Colleen looming over her bed with a box cutter, which, again, is something Krista had done to her. looming over her bed with a box cutter, which, again, is something Krista had done to her. So she said she felt afraid and she planned to fight Colleen just to scare her off and to get her to stop running her mouth. But as Krista described the details of the killing, it became pretty clear to investigators that she was deeply disturbed and Colleen was innocent in all this and was not, you know, harassing Krista. It was all the other way around. So Krista, again, seemed gleeful when she recounted the crime. She described torturing Colleen for 45 minutes. She said she repeatedly attacked her with a box cutter and a mini

meat cleaver. And then she let Colleen stand up and try to escape before she attacked her again oh my god that's like that's truly i mean it's all gut-turning but there's something particularly sinister it's the same thing from that last story where the woman got stabbed 27 times same thing and then the car yeah oh and he came back or whatever oh there's something about knowing that someone's on the brink of death and letting them try to escape knowing that you're not going to let them escape it's like a wounded animal like it's just a horrible horrible thing like watching the the torture watch it's it's it's like twisted on another level it's like psychologically sinister yeah it's evil it's truly evil it is evil it is absolutely evil um she said colleen begged to be

let go and again when she's recounting this she's just having like a grand old time telling the story she said uh colleen said she would pack up her things and move back to florida she would never talk to her again she would never tell anyone what krista or the others did and krista recalled and i said shut up i don't want to hear you talking to me you know it's harder to hurt somebody when they're talking to you oh no what that's what she told police oh my god krista said to daryl and chidola threw rocks at colleen to knock her back down whenever she tried to get up and at some points they even held her down so that krista could hurt her witnesses to her confession slash testimony said krista had a disturbing childlike amusement about

her when she recalled the gruesome details yeah sounds like it yeah it it led some to understandably consider krista for an insanity plea but a psychiatrist who examined her testified that krista was self-aware extremely intelligent and she had perfectly normal even above average reasoning logic and decision-making skills so this wasn't about like you know she she knew what she was doing is what they is what the psychiatrist said sure she was capable of analyzing risks and understanding consequences um and there was no reason to believe she was mentally incapable of comprehending her shocking crime that is according to the psychiatrist who uh took a look at her the The media, however, found out Krista smoked marijuana. Uh-oh.

Well, she's out. Yeah. Well, we should have seen that coming. Yeah. That's what they're going to focus on, not the murder. Yeah. Yeah. They said since she smoked marijuana and, get this, she was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder. So the media took both of those and ran with it. Not that either of those things, as we know, makes somebody a murderer. Not even together. Like, there's no reason, not even together. There's no reasoning why that would be like relevant. But of course, they, you know. They heard drugs and big bad mental illness.

Yes, exactly. And then they heard that the boyfriend was black and loved Satan. And, you know, you can just imagine how the newspapers ran with this. Of course, as we all know, logically, scientifically, nothing about weed or BPD makes someone a murderer. So that was just like. Or dating a black man who's also a Satanist. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly, exactly. Jesus.

So the psychiatrist acknowledged that it seemed like Krista premeditated the attack, which is exactly what you had said, because she basically told people she was going to do it and then made up a plan to lure Colleen into the woods. And the fact that she brought accomplices was also part of it. Like she didn't just snap and act on impulse um she planned this all along and she very much intentionally made this decision so after only two and a half hours of deliberation the jury found krista pike guilty of first degree murder and conspiracy to commit first degree murder and she was sentenced to death by electrocution. Oh. Mm-hmm. Well.

Wow. Yep. I mean, you call it. It's pretty fucked up to get you to death row. Electrocution. Do we know anything about... Do they still use electrocution? I believe so.

Yeah, I believe... I believe so. Let's see. Oh, okay. Apparently, as of 2022, this is according to Wikipedia, the only places that still reserve the electric chair as an option for execution are the U.S. states of Alabama, Florida, South Carolina, Kentucky, and Tennessee, which is where she is. Okay. So, wow. Wow. Okay. So, wow. Wow. Wow. So, oh, God, sorry.

Some states still authorize gas chamber. Oh. Firing squad just came back for someone. And hanging. Oh. What the fuck? The fact that there's, like, a menu and you can just, like, fucking pick. Seriously. Like, hello?

Does nobody see how barbaric that is? Anyway. So, Tadero was only 17 at the the time so he could not face a death penalty in tennessee instead he was sentenced to life in prison for his involvement in the murder shadola however became an informant in exchange for a plea deal during the investigation and she received a shockingly light sentence uh considering all of this she uh was sentenced to six years of probation with no prison time. So she kind of got off pretty easy. In prison, rather than kind of look back and regret her behavior, Krista's behavior only deteriorated.

She wrote a letter to Darryl during his trial, which was intercepted. And I'm going to read this letter to you. Oh, okay. Please write me. I miss you so much. to to daryl during his trial which was intercepted and i'm gonna read this letter to you oh okay please write me i miss you so much you see what i get for trying to be nice to the hoe i went ahead and bashed her brains out so she'd die quickly instead of letting her bleed to death and suffer more and they fucking fry me ain't that some shit please write me and tell me what you're feeling also tell your lawyer if he wants me to testify for you i will love you for the rest of my life and then she signed it little devil so wow so cutesy speechless like clearly just no

doesn't give a shit you know like also like i did her a favor yeah like look how empathetic i am and also no you didn't because like even if you were taking her out per her request, you still made her suffer and watched her get up and try to leave. You didn't do anything quickly. Exactly. It was like a prolonged torture. There's nothing quick about it. You wanted to kill her.

You said you wanted to be mean about it. You didn't like her to begin with. I mean, you actively wanted her to hurt and suffer. And you made sure she did i it's revolting yep it is it's revolting uh in prison she attacked another inmate and tried to strangle her to death with a shoelace so she ended up being convicted of attempted murder during her stay in prison on the phone she said to her see, now I know the difference between premeditated murder and what happened with Colleen. Because see, I premeditated the hell out of this. Sure

did. If I'd have had 30 more seconds, we'd have a little chalk line out there in our rec pen, and that bitch would be gone somewhere. So it's fully admitting that it was premeditated. Yeah. Yeah. Wow wow so one psychiatric professional believes that if krista had gotten away with her first killing she might have easily become a serial killer but other others think she is too disorganized and obvious to get away with multiple attacks which makes sense i mean she was bragging about it the day it happened like i don't think she would get very far but i think think given the opportunity, she probably would kill more people. I mean, she tried.

Oh, yeah. I think, I mean, the second that the way that I assume it would work is if your main target is now out, you just find another target. Yeah, it seems like. I mean, she it wasn't like one and done. You know, she clearly. She would find someone else to be threatened by. Exactly.

Or would remind her of that person or something. Yep. Yep. She would find someone else to be threatened by. Exactly. Or would remind her of that person or something. Yep, yep. In 2007, Krista's defense team requested a new trial, alleging she was newly diagnosed with bipolar disorder, which had not been considered in her original trial. But again, like, having bipolar disorder does not make you a murderer. So it wasn't like, oh, see, we need to reconsider.

You know, I understand that her defense was trying to like get a new trial, but, uh, you know, having bipolar doesn't also doesn't make you a killer. Right. Um, and so that request was denied in 2012, Krista hatched an escape plan and she wanted to escape from prison. So she involved a man on the outside who had often visited her and a 23 year old prison guard, and they were caught and the two men were charged with criminal offenses for trying to help her escape in 2015 her legal team requested another hearing to reveal that krista was possibly pregnant during the time of the killing but the court ruled the pregnancy would have had no effect on her actions that night they're really gonna say hormonal like please they're really just throwing anything they can at the wall.

Yeah. And so, you know, that didn't work either. So in the meantime, Colleen's mother filed to attain her daughter's skull fragment that Krista had put in her pocket and taken from the scene. And she wanted to be able to bury it to put her daughter finally, you know, fully at rest. Yeah. But the court refuses to hand it over because it's crucial evidence, quote unquote, in Krista's ongoing case and appeals. Ongoing? I argue, like, what's, what do you need that for? Yeah.

She literally, we know, everyone knows, she did it. She said she did it. Like, we don't need to just. What ongoing? That's such bullshit. It is bullshit i feel like if homegirl is on death row you've made a pretty you've made a serious opinion you've made a pretty serious decision and the jury has made a pretty serious understanding of how it all went down

what's this open case thing that's the thing i think the reason for it is that because she's on death row it's like constantly being assessed evaluated yeah re-evaluated and i think that's why they refuse to like well that's fair because there are a lot of people wrongly on death exactly and i think it should be open i think that's the reason but also like do you really need that skull fragment for that like i mean i understand there's probably so much red tape like i can't even begin to imagine i know they can't just be like here you go you know but it's just infuriating because she really just wants to put her daughter to rest and it's like it's just so dark so in june 2021 pretty recently

krista's defense team asked the tennessee supreme court to reconsider the sentencing once again on the grounds that the prosecution failed to acknowledge Krista's mental illness and childhood PTSD. In a statement, her attorney said she recognizes her childhood trauma and mental illness do not excuse her actions as an 18 year old girl. But she asked that her sentence be commuted to life imprisonment, a commutation that reflects the punishment imposed on other young people who, like Krista, committed crimes while they lacked the maturity and reasoning of adults. And that same week, Colleen's mother spoke out requesting Krista's execution date be set finally so that she could just put this whole thing behind her. She said her heart breaks again and again as she continues to relive her daughter's harrowing death. And she just wants this to be over so she can bury the rest of Colleen. Tennessee has not executed a woman in nearly 200 years.

And like we kind of alluded to, Krista's date hearing continues to be postponed. And so it's possible it might never even happen. And these things move so slowly sometimes. While Tadaryl and Krista remain in jail, they get letters and do interviews and Colleen's mother understandably resents the attention they seem to get for murdering her daughter. And really all she wants is to be able to bury the rest of Colleen before she dies,

before she grows old and dies. And she wants people to remember Colleen and the justice she deserves. And essentially she doesn't care if they execute Krista or not she said execute her or give her life and give me the rest of Colleen back so I can live so just just wants it to be over and uh that is the horrible story of Krista Pike sorry I didn't get you anything nice for our sixth anniversary or whatever I just maybe just cover my therapy,

Bill. Yeah. I was going to say, I made you just feel shitty. So you're welcome. Well, thanks, I guess.

But I mean, it's a, it's a story worth telling. It's an important story. I just, it's, I, what a dark,

what a dark story. I mean, I just, just so it's just really tragic. It's just sad. It's just really tragic all the way around, all the way from day one, from her birth. From Krista's birth. Yeah. I mean, she was, you almost feel like she was doomed from the start, but then like there are obviously there are people who have lived rough childhoods and don't become murderers, but like. And exactly. And break the cycle. And it's like one of those things. And I

know back in the day when we started the podcast we made we sometimes made offhanded comments like that like we would say oh well she was doomed and then like you know we hear from people saying like hey I saw you know I went through something similar as a child and I've really been able to move past it and grow and like help other people and so we were like you know that is a really like infantile way of looking at it like oh you're doomed you know, obviously there are so many people that escape that kind of neglect and abuse and grow up to be like wonderful, loving humans. But it does explain, you know, when something like this does happen, you do see the effects of neglect and abuse just kind of fall together right in front of you like it's just

horrible how cyclical it can be you just really hope that people who are born in those situations are able to like rise from the ashes of it all they shouldn't have to they shouldn't have to it's like you're they're already at a disadvantage by yeah not having just general love in their lives or not being like the the one feeling safe the one basic need of being cared for and loved. It's like they're already starting backwards. On such a deficit. Yeah. And it's just a bummer.

And like you said, there's no right answer. Yeah. I feel bad for, you know, it's one of those really awful things where it's like you don't want to feel bad for someone who committed such an atrocity. I know. But also, I feel like there's more that could have been done earlier in her life. But then you think about the people that she's hurt in the future because she still made bad choices. It's like, my God, like that whole, the family of Colleen, I can't even imagine having to hear yes what happened to her and like and then having people say like well you know she had such a rough childhood and I'm sure for them it's like

so what she still killed our daughter like I'm sure I mean I think you don't care as the family I wouldn't as I mean I am because I think we're third parties we're able to kind of see both sides and that doesn't excuse anything that Krista did you just wish that there were systems in place earlier to help her so that none of this would have happened but I can't even imagine being Colleen's family and finding out about

it's really just it's horrible I just think if it happened to someone I loved it's just horrible i just think if it happened to someone i loved and i it's just really fucked up yeah yeah happy 666 i know i guess wow i guess i just did the exact thing that um you always do that i always do that you always yell at me for so you're welcome yeah just we i remember we tried to do geoscopes for a while. We tried to do something else. We really tried to end these on a nicer note. Coroscopes, geoscopes. Now we do our after chats where we get our bullshit out afterward for Patreon.

Because otherwise we just sit here for 10 more minutes and we want to spare you. Unless you want to hear that, in which case you can go to Patreon. But I know most of you are probably like, seriously, stop talking. So yeah, if you want to check that out, we'll be on Patreon. But otherwise, happy sixth anniversary, Em. I'm sorry I made you feel sad today. Well, that's every week. But I do think that it is important to six years in, we really would not be here if it

weren't for everybody listening in. Shocking to me. Coming to our shows, wanting to meet us, wanting to hear us every week, wanting to be involved in our lives. And every time that I've ever run into somebody who said that they love the show, I hope you know how special that is. It does. Yeah. If it weren't for you, we wouldn't be here. I mean, six years ago, you couldn't tell us that this would be our jobs or our lives. And I never I'm just so grateful

for all of you. So thank you so much. I really you've just changed our lives. So it's true. Happy six years. Yeah, that's that's such a good way of putting it. And Em's right that anytime somebody does say like, oh, I love love the show i recognize you or anything like that it just is like so humbling and wonderful to hear because i feel like i mean we've said this before but it it feels weird to have an audience you can't see and like sometimes you know we just kind of go on and on and it it means a lot when people are like hey thanks for what you do you know yeah thank you for what you do is what we're trying to say because we would not be here um without you so uh especially to those who want to listen to our after chat on patreon you can go do that right now um and we'll

see over there i'm sure we'll talk about something absolutely unhinged. Talk about unhinged, yeah. Last week, I think we talked about, like, I just went on, like, some long-storied rant about ADHD and mental illness, and you had to talk me off a ledge. So, you know, if we're in that mood, we'll see. And before that, it was cereal or something. Oh, yeah, so you never know what you're going to get. We'll see over there. And that's why we drink.