And That's Why We Drink - E38 An Alli-Ghost and the Gilded Eleventh Ballroom

Episode Date: October 22, 2017

How are you peeling? Because it’s time for episode 38, in which Em throws Allison an epic birthday, the recording room is haunted as ever, and we find out Christine is the oracle of our time. Don’t worry, there are also ghosts and murders.Em’s story is San Antonio, TX. Wait, no it’s not. But it is IN San Antonio, TX. It’s called the Menger Hotel and it’s haunted by a rude lady knitting, children playing with trains, and Teddy Roosevelt himself.Meanwhile, Christine tells the story of this mo-fo named John List, a guy who pretends to be deeply religious but is actually just a plain old family annihilator.We cleanse our palates with a Gio-scope, brought to you this week by the Onion (and our good friend Theron). Let’s Scorpi-Go!Oh and Ernesto, if you’re out there, let me buy you a drink.

how are you feeling how am i feeling yeah oh wait what how are you peeling get it peeling like a fruit what's wrong with you how are you peeling that's my favorite joke we didn't even talk about fruit or anything to segue that in. Maybe you just like think about fruit. Oh, okay. Saying like, wait a minute, I'll try again. You know, I had fruit salad this morning. Oh, really? How are you peeling? There it is. Still doesn't make sense. Wait, wait, I ate a banana today. You have to say, I'm currently eating a banana because then I can be like, here, I'll just like start getting into acting. No, hang on. Whoa, this banana is real good oh yeah how are you peeling okay there it is we found it we would be

the best improvisers we found our groove i can't believe you're on an improv show i think we would only need like four takes each scene to like get it right oh yeah just like be like hold on cut and then start over i'll be like hang on i have a better dad joke. Give me, give me 20 seconds to conjure it up. Let me take some notes real quick. Yeah. Um, happy, uh, happy prediction day because we're recording this way in advance right now. So when this comes out, a lot of things will have happened in our personal lives. So that's true. Um, you will have come back from a 10 day trip. That's true. How do you think it goes? Um, it went really great. And a lot of people were like, like taking my photo and I had to wear sunglasses in the Cincinnati airport cause I'm a celebrity now. Right. If you, you know, it would be funny if we're joking about

this, but you actually do meet someone that'd be pretty cool. What probably will happen is I'll run into my high school boyfriend and he'll be like, uh, and I you actually do meet someone. That would be pretty cool. Yeah, what probably will happen is I'll run into my high school boyfriend and he'll be like, and I'll have dirty hair. That's probably more likely. Okay. Anyway, it was great. What else is happening?

For me, Allison's birthday already happened. It actually hasn't happened yet. How was it? I'm hoping it goes really well because I have arranged a whole day scavenger hunt around allison's town cue all the sappy eye rolls m has created the perfect birthday for allison i told christina about it um i i remember at one point i was just on the floor

and i she was she was hugging a pan and she was like, I'll get on the floor. I don't know how that happened, but... It's going to be, and when you hear it, it has happened, but it's going to be a scram drought where she wakes up in a room full of balloons. She has to pop all 25 balloons because now she's... Oh, no, she's going to be 26. Shit. Oh, I didn't know that was related to anything.

Oh. Okay. It's 26. Oh, I have a SpongeBob balloon. You can just make that make that the creep put that in your closet as the number 26 perfect she's gonna have to pop 26 balloons on 26 balloon it's gonna tell her that we're going guess what i know it's gonna fall out that's what all the balloons say though um don't conveniently skip that part each balloon says a reason that m loves allison well no no, there's going to be a note written. There's going to be a reason why written down on paper,

and I'm going to put it in the balloon before I blow it up and tie it. So she has to pop each of them. And on the last one, instead of just a reason why I love her, it's going to be a reason. It's going to be that she's adventurous, so we should go on an adventure. All those people who slid into your DMs back in the day are, like, throwing their computers against the wall. Well, also, at each spot, she's going to we should go on an adventure all those people who slid into your dms back in the day are like throwing their computers against the wall well also at each spot she's gonna get a present which i've already talked to um the places we're stopping at and there's gonna be

very kind employees who don't know me that are willing to hold presents for us in advance and i took the whole day off at work i mean come on to prep but allison doesn't know that yet well she will know when you happy birthday allison happy birthday allison i hope it's took the whole day off at work. I mean, come on. To prep. But Allison doesn't know that yet. Well, she will know when you... Happy birthday, Allison. Happy birthday, Allison. I hope it's everything you dreamed of. What are you going to do for her birthday? Oh, yeah, you're running away to Ohio.

Listen, I'm going to be far away from all this madness, this romantic madness. This is like a fucking Sandra Bullock movie. I don't totally understand how you have the mental... Okay, well, the birthday was actually going to go incredibly differently if Christine were in town because I wanted you to be involved in everything we did but you're not here so i had to it's better it's probably better for everyone's sanity that i that i'm not around to be like i guess so aggressively yelling at all of you uh it's

gonna be great i mean it was great i heard all about it in cincinnati where i'm i hope you do if allison hasn't texted you about this i'm gonna be sad that she didn't brag about it in Cincinnati where I'm I hope you do if Allison hasn't texted you about this I'm gonna be sad that she didn't brag about it oh of course she's gonna tell she's gonna be like did you know about this and I'm gonna be like I'm sorry I'm busy hiding from the paparazzi I also came to Chris Jesus Christ I also came to Christine's today and just stole everything out of her house so that I'll have things for the birthday so I stole everything it's like every birthday bag, every... Sprinkles.

Sprinkles, cake pans, wrapping paper. Which to be fair is like 80% of my belongings are like birthday paraphernalia. So yeah, you do make a good point. So I'm just trying to recycle what I can. Well, that's, I'm very excited. Anyway, I guess that's why I will be drinking when this airs.

Fantastic. And you're going to be drinking because you're probably gained 10 pounds from all the cake tasting you're doing in Ohio. That's right. We're doing a cake tasting on Saturday. I'm really excited. I mean, yesterday we did one. Do you have a cake flavor in your mind currently before you've tasted them?

No, I feel like I'm the worst bride ever. I'm just like, I don't know. I like cake. It tastes good to me. All of it tastes good. I don't know. What's your favorite cake in the whole world? Like my mom cake oh why doesn't she make it oh my god she probably will i could probably order a cake and then on my wedding day she's gonna be like i slaved all

night for this apple cake i made apple cake that sounds pretty good it is very good um if i had it my way my wedding cake would be fun fatty but oh, but. Oh, that would be fun though. That'd be fun. Get it? Please. Let's, let's pretend that didn't happen. Yeah. We'll see.

I don't know. I'm not picky about dessert or anything really, as you know, I'm just, I aim to please. All right. All right. Although a red velvet wedding cake would be great, but I don't know if that's a thing. All right. Anyway, you want to know something interesting that I think that you'll find interesting? Um, it might be interesting, but I'll have to find out first if I think it's interesting to tell you if I think it's interesting.

Okay. Well, that's really interesting. Here we go. Okay. Attila the honey ate, which by the way, I'm all about a good pun on Twitter. Okay. Sent this message and I was like, pun on twitter okay sent this message and i was like my mind was blown here we go i'm ready i just started listening um on september 30th and i'm now on episode 17 stanley hotel i heard m wonder where all the ghost children scene would have come from i've heard the theory that most ghost children are actually just demon trying to demons trying to trick us into feeling safe and comfortable in order to get us to trust them nope i think of the Annabelle story as a good example. The theory goes that most children are more innocent and wouldn't have any reason to be trapped on earth, no baggage, closer to spirit already, etc. Have you heard of this before?

And what are your thoughts? Ever since I learned that idea, every time I've heard of a ghost kid since, all I can think of now is, that's not a kid. I'm sure there are exceptions, but I've heard plenty of stories of people's children interacting with imaginary friends who are allegedly children like them, where the interactions become more sinister and or aggressive over time. Anywho, just thought I'd slide into your DMS to ask a creepy question.

You guys are awesome. Much love from Arkansas, Katie. Wow. That like blew my mind a little bit. Cause I was like, there are, remember we did that episode and I'm like, wait, who's whose children are these i think it blows my mind because it's something

so obvious that why haven't we thought of it right and because there are so many creepy ghost children and there's something so creepy about them yeah i think i don't have i don't know what my thoughts are because this is all happening at once it is very i haven't heard that theory but i absolutely like would not put it aside like that makes total sense i think it makes sense too i don't know because i know like like i have a little kid ghost in my in my childhood home and he's never ever tried to interact with us at all right people have just seen him in passing doing his own thing right but no one has ever he's never tried to talk to us maybe that's the difference if they don't try

to talk to you and they're just kind of stuck doing sure something from their time maybe we're good but if they like wake you up at night and they're like hello play with me then because that's a demon remember the story of the the child the phone was it a listener story last episode um who the phone rang and she answered the phone and it was a little boy being like can i sleep with you tonight oh that was my last story that was the franklin hotel i think was it the franklin hotel was it where she woke up on the floor yeah oh wait no it was the frank oh the franklin castle or whatever yeah yeah yeah okay the socialist airbnb right speaking of that place i do want to mention that i did find out that the German Socialist Party was a very far right wing.

And it wasn't technically the Nazis, but they kind of transformed a lot of them which joined the Nazi Party. And I do want to say I really don't know a lot about history. Sorry, Miss Cronin. I know I took AP history, but I was usually playing brick breaker on my Blackberry. I took AP government and I got a one on the test. on my Blackberry. I took AP government and I got a one on the test. And apparently AP government is supposed to be like the easiest AP class in like all across America. It's supposed to be like, oh, even if you're not smart, you could pass AP government. And I took that and I was the only one who got a one. Everyone else got fours or fives on their test. I got a five on my AP English test for all you haters who keep writing to us. Well here's the thing I know that donator is not a word and I keep getting emails and tweets being like

you're bad at English donator is not a word it's donor and every time I read them I'm like I didn't say donator and then I listened back to the listener episodes and we say donator every single time and I'm like I know that's not a word it's not a word I mean yeah I mean it technically is from like the 1600s but it's well it's not a word but it's one of those it's one of those things that everyone says it and in the right context you just know what we're saying anyway and I just want to yield everyone I'm not going to stop doing it I promise I can speak English I know technically that donator is not a word I got a five on my AP English exam and my teacher went what did you cheat or something?

And I was like, you're really rude. I'm surprised you're not just going with your usual English isn't my first language. I tried that, but I was like, I joke about that too much. I need a new edge to my argument. I was really smart in high school. That's your new argument.

That's your new one. But I also got a, speaking of AP tests, I took AP music theory for, oh, I think I had a crush on someone in my class. I don't remember why I took it, but I got a one on the test because we had to sing. Oh, well, you had to read a bar one to a one. I had to read a bar of music in front of my whole class and attempt to sing the notes. And I was like, what the fuck is this? I'm sorry. I'm now I'm sweating again. I need to change the subject. Want to know something else? Yeah. We got a gift. We got a

gift. We did. And you didn't open it without me. I did open it without you. There it is. Because I want to surprise you. Okay, what is it? I want to know. Because you always surprise me with gifts.

And since I don't buy you gifts, I just wait for other people to send us gifts that I can give you vicariously and pretend like I gave it to you. Okay. So this is a gift we got from Nicole. All right. I got an email today that was like, you have a package. And I was like, ooh, a package. And I'm like a little kid about mail.

I just fucking love mail. So I went to her P.O. box and... All the way... Wait, don't put this on. All the way in... Mm-hmm. Okay. I didn't know if our intern Allison was going to be getting our mail from now on.

Oh, no. That'd be nice, though. Also, fun fact, our intern Allison has resigned as intern. Oh, yes, officially. She also doesn't like it when I refer to her as the intern anymore. Which is why we're always going to refer to her as the intern. Everyone thinks she's actually our intern. I'm like, no, she's literally just my friend and Em's girlfriend.

And she's just way too nice. But yeah, yesterday she laid down in our hammock and said, I resign. Yeah, it's on Twitter if you want to go follow her. But also, I think that we need a real intern. So put in your resumes, people. Okay. Okay, so this is really sweet. There's a note that says, to Christine M and Gio, thank you for all the time.

I'm sorry, Gio puts no time into this. Gio puts every ounce of his being into this. Okay, fine. And we both know it. Thank you for all the time and hard work you put into making your podcast. It's wonderful and it's been getting me through some hard times. Enclosed are some paranormal and true crime

inspired crocheted toys I made while listening. Best of luck to the podcast and all future endeavors. Nicole. I'm sorry. Crocheted toys. Are you ready? I can't wait. This is out of control. I screamed in my car. No way. No way, I want to see. I want to see.

Here's a Villisca axe murder axe. Shut the fuck up. Wait, they get better. Oh my God. Oh, and this is professional crochet. Oh, it's like. This is like something that you would buy for like 40 bucks at a store. Oh, it's like, you know that she has.

This isn't some flimsy shit. She is like a professional crocheter. This is a demon pig. Oh my God. She made a a demon pig oh my god she made a fucking demon pig oh my god look at its wings it has wings oh my god oh it's it's beyond it's the okay how many are there how many are there one more okay okay ready i'm ready this is for you i'm ready it's a disembodied foot shut the fuck up. Look at it. No way. Wow. She got the bone so accurate.

I was staring at it. I was like, there's five toes. There's five. And there are five different toes. Like there's definitely a big toe and a pinky. I'm like, is there a pattern for this or did she just invent this? This is really professionally done. There's not a stitch at a place.

There's, I don't even know where she tied it off. Did she tie it off? I don't know. This looks like a machine made it.icole send us your like instagram handle because do you want to be our intern oh yeah nicole you want to make her be our intern just make us toys oh my god wouldn't that be nice oh my god also uh nicole um if you could send us your instagram slash twitter i want to post a photo of these because they're so fucking oh hell yeah you also if you're not making money off this yet you better like. Oh, she probably is.

I imagine. This is incredible. This is the demon pick. The axe has blood on it? I can't really breathe about it. It's so good. This is the greatest. I scream so loudly.

Anyway, so that's all I wanted to show you. Holy crap, Nicole. Thank you. I just, I can't get over these. That's intense. The demon pig is the most precious thing I've ever seen in my whole life.

It's like, it's so cute, but scary. It's cute and scary at the same time. Well, let's see if it starts moving on its own or something.

Well, let's see if the basement troll girl wants to play with it. Oh, by the way, the cellar door apparently opens on its own. Oh my God. That's why I drink this week.

I forgot to tell you why I drink. Okay, go. So the, the the my brother had two friends from high school our friend from whatever i don't fucking know we took the bus together and i used to bully him so he stayed he stayed here uh with his boyfriend and the two of them stayed in the quote-unquote recording studio slash cellar room uh and i didn't really say anything the first night, but I guess Nick listened to the podcast and was like, uh, I know what that plunger for is. You can't like pretend that that's not in front of my bed. I was like, okay. Uh, but I guess the

second night they stayed here and Nick came out and goes, yeah. So I, in the middle of the night, uh, the door to the cellar or to the basement opened. And then, um, you know, we were sleeping and then the next morning I woke up and like went to look at it and shut it. And I realized that not only was that door open, but the door down the stairs, like to the cellar where it was open. Uh, and he was like, yeah. And last night it was definitely closed because I had gone around to make sure everything was closed.

Cause we had a party and I was like, I want to make sure nobody was definitely closed because I had gone around to make sure everything was closed because we had a party. And I was like, I want to make sure nobody, you know, wandered around and opened the doors. And so I had shut it. And he goes, yeah, they were shut when I went to sleep. And then the next morning they were all the way open, like touching the wall. Yuck. And then I keep this is I feel like I'm just putting this juju into the world. But I wanted to tell you that I keep having these like phantom

smells no which are driving me crazy because I keep thinking like it's got to be something so I'll spend like 10 minutes looking for whatever the source of the smell is and then it'll just vanish but like there there was one that was perfume and it was so strong and it wasn't like I have one air freshener in that bathroom and I know it's like a certain smell and I smell this in like a random room upstairs in like a certain smell. And I smelled this in like a random room upstairs in like a closet area. And I was like, this is coming from somewhere. And I wandered around looking for it. Then today something was burning and I was like, there's a burning smell and it was so strong. So either I have a brain tumor or there's like a fucking,

I don't know what's happening, but there's like all these weird smells in like pockets. Well, Christine also today decided to tell me that she bought a scry pendulum to communicate with the spirits here i bought a pendulum because in her very infinite wisdom in her very lawsuit way her uh logic is well it's not a ouija board yeah emgo so you basically bought a ouija board but not and i was like yeah but it's not a ouija board. Want to play? By the way, apparently she's already spoken to the friendly male spirit who lives here, who apparently knows who I am. Yeah, he does.

He likes Gio, but who doesn't? Yeah, he's an adult male, and he lives here, and he said he died on the land nearby or within this area. And he likes Gio. Oh, there goes G shit what did i say what did i tell you i don't like that no we both know what what caused that because there's nothing going on in that room anyway so let's move on do you want to tell me something else, Gary? I do. But first, I want us to high five on record and say that we kicked ass at beer pong. We did kick ass at beer pong, you guys. What else did you expect?

Back in our college days. Hell yeah. Christine threw a party for Alexander this weekend. Yeah, it was his birthday. And we had a beer pong area and Christine and I played. Oh my God, we kicked ass. We kicked ass. Like there was no question.

We both pretty much evenly decked out. Yeah, it was wild. We just like kept winning. It was really good. And then we played cornhole. And by that time, Christine was not around mentally. Let's just say I don't remember playing cornhole. We didn't win cornhole.

No. Because we got so good at beer pong that Christine lost a lot of her focus. I used all my talent on beer pong. Yes. And sobriety. I used all my sobriety and focus and then let it all go to the wind.

But we had never, we didn't know each other in college and we never partied together so that was a good time. It was. It was really fun. Alright. Enough chit chat. Stop talking about beer, beer m i know how much you love it i know team wine and team milkshake merged to for team beer and won the game yeah it was really a beautiful moment for all time yeah all right so this story is san antonio texas this story is san antonio texas i mean i'm just like trying to like edit out my own words just to get to the point faster.

Okay. But by doing this, I ended up defeating the purpose. You're like that episode of The Office. I was thinking the same thing. Where Kevin just doesn't use like articles. He's like, why use words when me no need them? They too long. Okay.

This story takes place in San Antonio, Texasxas oh that's so many syllables um not even it's not even really a story it's this is um this is a hotel okay i'm just here to lay down some facts lay them down so it is one of the well the hotel itself isn't as old as the bar on site i know you love a good haunted bar i love old bar. It is one of the oldest bars in the country. And they're said to be up to 32 spirits in this bar slash hotel. It was built on land used as battlefields during the Alamo. Do you remember that, though? I don't know.

I'm sorry. That was so stupid. I tried to stop my mouth and I couldn't. How are you peeling? That's my favorite joke. Okay, so it's called the Menger Hotel, by the way. I don't know if I said that. Menger?

Menger. Or Menger? Menger? Menger? I'd say Menger. I don't fucking know. It has served a whole bunch of famous people, including Robert E. Lee, Bob Dylan, Oscar Wilde, John Wayne, and 13 presidents. Holy.

Oh, okay. This is where it gets good for you. They also have an on-site staple drink that they sell called the Mender Bar Margarita. Oh, nice. margarita. Oh, nice. So if anyone wants to drink one while they listen to this story, it is two ounces tequila, one and a half ounces triple sec, two ounces of sour mix or lime juice and sugar and a splash of orange juice. Okay. So with that, kick back, relax, listen to the story. We'll put on some elevator music so you can go make your menger margarita. Menger?

Menger? Yeah, we'll wait right here. Are you back? Did you already drink it? No, I think they need another minute to shake it and then put it back in. Oh, okay. Go shake it. Okay.

Okay, now that they drank all of it. God damn it, we waited too long, didn't we? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think they just paused the whole show and they just chugged a couple of them. Now they're not even going to remember the story. Ugh. All right.

Anyway. That's the problem with our podcast. So the Menger Hotel opened in 1859. And it was started, it originally wasn't a hotel, it was a brewery. And it was called the Western Brewery, and it was opened by William Menger. Okay. So he partnered with someone else, and they made the Western Brewery on the site. And it was the first brewery in Texas, and within the next 20 years,

it had also grown to be the largest operating brewery in Texas as well. Oh, shit. In the 1860s, menger also bought out his competitor so he just owned basically all the beer in the area that's nice and he earned the nickname beer king that's like every frat boy's dream i know um so on the other side of the brewery was a boarding house which was owned by a woman named mary and menger and mary knew each other pretty well i guess he stayed at the boarding house a lot and they ended up falling in love they got married and they expanded the boarding house and turned it into

a like pristine um luxury hotel nice to accommodate his brewery customers oh sure sure he also built um an underground tunnel because of course why wouldn't you always always the tunnels always nicole where is our crochet tunnel oh my god build us a tunnel out of crochet that we can like crawl through oh you know we could you just crochet a studio for us because this fucking plunger oh right is getting in our way still oh my god we're gonna get up she's gonna fucking crochet a plunger she's i know i was. She's not gonna crochet as a studio. I know it's coming. It's gonna be a plunger.

So, um, he had an underground tunnel. Technically, it was used so he could chill his beer at the right temperature and blah, blah, blah. But he also used it, um, I guess he was a little narcissistic. And he, anytime people stayed at the hotel, he would would let them if he liked them a lot he would let the guests go down the tunnel and he would give them a tour of the underground brewery i thought you're gonna say it was like line you said it was narcissistic and that was gonna be like lined with mirrors or something and he would have been neat go like look at himself in the tunnels oh a mirror tunnel um okay so the place was so successful that within three months they planned

to expand the 50 room hotel into over 300 rooms oh um the civil war came though and a lot of people weren't staying in luxury hotels anymore and so they had to shut it down but in attempt to support the war efforts they opened it back up as a hospital for the soldiers that on in the area wow so it also became a hospital so then you know a lot of people died there which is just fucking great correct in 1871 menger himself passed away and they don't really know the reason why because there was never an autopsy done on him but his wife carried on with the hotel and an exact quote from the website i saw which is within one of the 31st pages on Google, is Mary didn't allow the death of her husband to affect her business at all.

You take it, girl. Fuck yeah, Mary. You be that badass boss babe. Feminism in the 1870s was alive and well. Hashtag boss babe. Hashtag William who. Yeah. Hashtag new year, new me, who dis?

New hotel who dis. So in one year, even though he died, in one year of working in the hotel alone, she had 2,000 more guests stay in the hotel than ever before. Oh. Anyway, she's doing fine on her own. What a badass lady um also with the expansion of trains being um more common in towns the hotel got even bigger and basically until the 1870s through the 1870s it was known as the best known hotel in the southwest and it was entirely gas sourced which was very rare at the time. Yeah. Very extravagant.

And it was just super classy. But they sold it in the 1880s for what is now $3 million today. At the time, it was $118,000. In 1890, this is the first death there. That's the year my house was built. This house? No, sorry. In Cincinnati.

Ew. 1890. You need to just find, like, just go to a place that isn't from the 1800s. I'll tell you, a priest died there. I know, right? Why is that even creepier? You would think if a priest died there, you have, like, eternal security. Right.

Sure. Whatever. All your comments about priests, I know that. Thanks, priest. Thanks, priest. We have an elevator in it. No. It was built in, the elevator is, like, old and it was built because the priest was in a wheelchair.

So he could only go to the first and second floor. So the third floor was abandoned, which is where my room was for like decades. Shut the fuck up. So are you excited for my wedding where you get to stay there? I can't wait. That'll be, I feel like we're going to have to do a special for the show. Oh, for sure. Inside the elevator.

Yeah. I do this really mean thing like with my piano teacher when he came and he was so obnoxious. He used to like read my mail and stuff. And so one time he came over to a piano lesson. I'm like, let me show you the elevator. And he told me he had told me he was claustrophobic. So we got in the elevator and then I hit the emergency stop and turn the lights off. And I was like, we're stuck.

It wasn't funny when I did that because he was actually claustrophobic. Also, that sounds so bougie of you to be like, I already know how this elevator works. All right. To be fair, it's an elevator that's like from 1965. Like it barely moves. It's not. It's not very. Does it still work?

Yeah. Creepy. I know it is creepy. It's very slow and creepy and made of like old wood. Okay. Well, to be continued. Sorry. Go on.

So in 1890, the year your elevator house was created, an insurance agent stayed at the hotel. And while there, they don't know what the backstory was at all, but he pulled a gun and shot a man at the bar named Jim Draper. Oh my God. And they have no idea why. They don't know if there was a relationship between them. But Jim Draper was the first guy to die. Oh, my God.

As far as we know, besides all the soldiers. And then the previous soldiers from the Alamo. Because actually he, William Menger, built the brewery on the exact lot where Davy Crockett was fighting. What? Like where like everyone, every Texan soldier died. That's casual. Like, everyone, every Texan soldier died. That's casual.

So in 1903, a 26-year-old from Kentucky was staying there, and he was terminally ill. And knowing he wouldn't get better, he went to his room and slid his own throat. Which is, that takes a lot of heart. That's, like, that's a painful way to go if you're doing it intentionally. Well, and you have to be really fucking... You really gotta want it. I don't even... I can't even. So, here's a good story.

In the early 1900s, this isn't about death, this is just a fun fact. In the early 1900s, a circus performer was staying at the hotel. Was it you? Fuck you. And he left without paying the bill, which I would never do. Uh-huh. So he just so happened to be in such a rush from essentially dashing away from the hotel. He happened to be so busy that he forgot to bring with him his 750-pound bull alligator, and he left it in the hotel i'm sorry i'm sorry

his what alligator his 750 pound bull alligator bull yeah it's a type of alligator because it's this it's a bull it's 750 pounds he just like casually left it he was just like i'll be back he's like i'm just going to the circus i'll be right back yeah i left something over there um so as opposed to you know doing anything about the alligator on the hotel grounds they decided to name him bill after the bill that he forgot to pay. So he paid the bill with Bill the crook or Bill the bull alligator. And they allowed him to run free around the entire atrium of the hotel. Wait, can I say something really weird right now?

Uh-huh. Okay. I wrote a pilot script once about a hotel called the Babcock Hotel. And in it, someone had left an alligator behind in the hotel. Well, this is Premonition Day, isn't it? And it had bred, like, I guess it left two alligators. I don't know. But there were, like, baby alligators.

And the one alligator, like, roamed the hotel. And it was, like, part of the script. So that's super weird. Okay. Well, basically, you wrote history. Maybe I was him in a past life, Ann. Maybe you're Bill the Bull Alligator. Probably. I meant the clown, but, basically you wrote history. Maybe I was him in a past life, Ant. Maybe you're Bill the Bull Alligator. Probably.

I meant the clown, but like... Maybe you could have been the alligator and I'd be the clown. Whoa. And we were in a haunted hotel. Listen. It was meant to be. This is where we were. It all makes sense now.

Now we know exactly where we were in the early 1900s. Finally, I've been wondering. I've been trying to figure out where I was in the early 1900s for years. Now we know exactly where we were in the early 1900s. Finally, I've been wondering. I've been trying to figure out where I was in the early 1900s for years. Now we know. Thank God. Fear not. Sometimes, if Bill was nice, they would even bring in other alligators so that Bill could have some friends around. Did you write about that? Yeah.

There were multiple alligators. There you go. You knew. So, okay. So, in 1924, there was multiple alligators. There you go. Listen. You knew. Listen. So, okay, so in 1924, there was a huge fire. It started in the brand new addition to the hotel, of course, and the kitchen. And the fire grew rapidly because in 1924, the building was made of? Plywood.

Plywood. Wood in general. Oh, okay. I just made i just you had you had it i knew that uh and did bill survive we don't know okay bill has not he's not around anymore i don't know how he how he died okay um but so the fire destroyed the third and fourth floors and the night clerk who was on duty that night was running from room to room um knocking on the third and fourth floors and the night clerk who was on duty that night was running from room to room um knocking on the doors and waking up the guests so all 101 guests survived but uh the fire steam engine that was heading to the fire to help everyone was driving so fast that they rammed into oncoming street cars and the firemen and the people in the streetcar all got injured no are you fucking kidding me so that was just irony that's that

right yeah that's shitty uh the paper said the flames allegedly enveloped the entire block but the original section of the hotel was okay so So just all the brand new addition went away. Oof. In 1980, it became a historic landmark. And in 1989, it was listed on the National Trust for Historic Preservation. Nice. So anyway, here are the ghosts. Oh, I'm so ready.

Is Bill a ghost? That would be fun, wouldn't it? Can you imagine an alligator ghost? An ala-ghost. Ah! I want it so bad. Hey, what's the difference between a crocodile and an alligator uh one of them doesn't live in north america oh wait is this a joke yeah oh uh what is the difference between a crocodile and alligator one you see in a while and one you see

later oh that's cute do you you get it? Yeah. Okay. I was going to say something stupid about their teeth. I don't know. Let's move on. Alright. So, there's one employee there who, as of the article I read, was 78 years old, so he might be up to 80 now. And he still works there.

He's worked there for almost 40 years, and his name is Ernesto. And he's been working there since 1977 and he loves talking about the ghosts there and anytime someone tries to approach the hotel for an interview he's like right on board first in line ready to go nice and anytime someone um says that they've been haunted by a ghost there he's the first one who wants to show up and talk to them and so he's really into it nice um he said that his first experience was a ringing bell but it wasn't connected to anything oh and this bell would ring and ring so he asked someone about it and they said oh that's just teddy calling his rough riders

so what is that you ask what is that i ask teddy is teddy roosevelt so teddy would uh regularly stay at the menger hotel and as of 1898 he started going there a lot and he really liked it and he used it as a base to recruit um people for the spanish-american war so he had his own little gang of people that he called the Rough Riders, and he would recruit them from that bar where he would sit there and he would just watch cowboys come in or people that he thought would do well. It really just ranged from whatever your job was. If you were at the bar and he could get you drunk,

he would basically convince you to sign up to be a rough rider and people would wake up the next day hung over on their way to boot camp. So I'm a rough rider is what you're saying. Oh, do you wake up hung over and go to boot camp or do you just wake up hung over? Oh, that just the first part. Okay. Right. So no, you're just rough. Oh, I just said, oh yeah. Well, you said he convinces people when they're drunk and I'm like, that's probably me. That's also true. I'm like halfway there. You're like the non-military version.

Totally. I'm there without the commitment of like getting up and being on a horse. Or like the patriotism or anything. So some of the people were Teddy's classmates from Harvard. Others were Native Americans. Some were cowboys from Texas. Some were rangers. And others were just people who would just walk in for a drink like but they all somehow ended up getting enlisted to fight

and even though um these people only remained in san antonio for a month before they ended up getting recruited out right they a lot of them still haunt the bar and so now they're called teddy's terrors oh my And those are the ghosts that? Yeah. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It just, I feel like the name Teddy isn't very intimidating.

So it's like, you know what is terrifying, also related to Teddy Roosevelt. The teddy bear. The Teddy Ruxpin. Oh, what's that? The Teddy Ruxpin? The robotic 80s bear that talked tape cassettes to you? I don't know what the fuck you're talking about. I still have my Teddy Ruxpin. the robotic 80s bear that talked tape cassettes to you? I don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

I still have my Teddy Ruxpin. He's fucking creepy. What are you talking about? Google Teddy Ruxpin. It's a bear. It's an animatronic doll that was like the most popular toy of the late 80s, early 90s. I never had that. Do you see what I'm looking at?

Oh, it's so creepy looking. Okay, so in the back. So he's dressed, right? He's got his little overalls. Yeah. So they were Velcroed on. You would take them off and in his back, it was a battery pack and a cassette tape. Right. And so you could collect cassette tapes and they were all different stories. And so you put it in his back and then it was basically his, in his mouth was a speaker. And so you would just hear the story, but Teddy ruxpin's eyes and mouth would blink and move so it was the idea was that you had like your teddy bear was your friend and he was telling you the story but he was a creepy fucking robot that when my teddy ruxpin started

dying out and like the story is like the tape cassette's still playing, but the battery's dying on him. So he'd go, and the horse said, nay, nay, nay, nay, nay, nay, nay, nay. And I was like, no, no thank you. He literally turned into a demon. That's what you're saying. Actually, the first Teddy Ruxpin there is an urban legend that it actually was possessed by a demon. Oh, okay. And he wasn't telling stories.

He was just telling his owner how to kill people. What the? Where are you reading this? It was a website that was really popular tumblr no no no it was a website that like doesn't exist anymore it was like urban legends.com like it was something so generic before like people had to fight for urls well i will tell you i just looked up this teddy ruxpin situation and they currently are selling them for iPad versions where you can download stories and it looks exactly the fucking same. And you can download iPad versions and it'll tell the story.

And you know what? That's good marketing because now all the eighties kids are parents. So they're, Oh, that's disgusting. You're right. So it's just, they know that those parents want them because they remember it, but don't they look at them and say, I was traumatized by this. those parents want them because they remember it. But don't they look at them and say, I was traumatized by this. I don't want to. I think the early eighties and mid eighties kids weren't traumatized. I think their younger siblings from the late eighties,

early nineties are the traumatized ones. Cause then Teddy Ruxpin was crapping out. Got you. Anyway, where were we? Oh yeah. Teddy Roosevelt. Who knows?

Okay. So Teddy Roosevelt also, this is just another fun fact for you. It's widely reported that one night his monocle popped out and it fell into his jug. His jug? His jug of old granddad. I think that's a whiskey. Sure thing.

It sounds like one. And he gulped it down monocle and all without even noticing. Wait, I'm sorry. That's a wide ass gullet if your monocle just goes right down your stomach. That's a drunk ass man if you swallow him. That's some Mike Malone shit. Yeah, Mike Malloy. Mike Malloy. You swallow that whole fucking monocle.

So anyway, Teddy Roosevelt's ghost. Let's get into it. Let's get into it. He is a translucent figure and he never moves, never shifts, only stares. Oh, sure. The staff has reported being watched at all times and if they don't see him they always still feel him staring there have been other times where he was more vocal where he was sitting at the bar and he has actually hollered out to the workers and tried to

recruit them to be one of his rough riders that's so sad that he's still trying to get people to be his friend i was like give up dude it's like Reportedly, he would sit at the bar and he will shout at the employees what he likes about them to try and coax them into a conversation with him. And then when they turn around to actually talk to him, he disappears. Have a great personality. And then, boop, you're gone. Your eyebrows are flawless. Well, they're not, but thank you. You're welcome.

So that's one of the main ghosts teddy roosevelt there's two other that's actually pretty badass though to have like teddy roosevelt as your ghost yeah like i'm just hanging out with like one of the presidents no big deal oh it's like casual it's whatever it's fine it's i'll ask him how fdr is sometime when i get to it fine but he invented the teddy bear basically but whatever so the other two main ghosts one is sally white who was a chambermaid during the late 19th century um her husband harry was a very abusive and very jealous and in 1876 he threatened to kill her so she ran to the police and an investigation was quote done but in the 1870s that makes me mad uh basically they had nothing to hold on him

because there was no proof, so they couldn't put him in jail. She went to her house to pick up some stuff, and he saw her there and chased her down the street. Oh, my God. She lived next to the menger, and so she tried to run to the hotel, but in the street before she got there,

he shot her twice. He shot her? And she survived for two more days but tried recovering at the mentor first of all why wasn't she recovering at a fucking hospital but she stayed in the hotel and died two days later oh that's so sad so um the hotel actually paid for her funeral costs which at the time by the way the grave was 25 and the coffin was seven. So they paid 32 bucks and her receipt is still in the lobby. Whoa. Wait, her receipt for staying there? No, her receipt for her funeral costs. Holy shit. So today people see her ghost a lot, especially on the third floor where she used to

work, but she is always carrying towels or sheets or like, she's still working like for eternity. Poor babe. Um, she is also often seen with, um, like a, a laundry basket essentially. Yeah. And one guest actually got out of the shower one time and saw her, saw Sally folding sheets at the edge of her bed.

She's also been described as nearly translucent, nearly translucent, like Teddy Roosevelt. Um, but she's wearing a maid's uniform with a scarf tied around her head that looks like a bandana and a lock necklace of beads oh she also wears a long gray skirt and i guess that uniform was very common during the era so when people see her cleaning they'll call down and be like why is she not in uniform and they're like oh that was the

old uniform or there are even maids who have died there even before sally died and those maids are in like old lace uniforms whoa and people will be like why is my maid wearing lingerie yeah and they'll say those were the uniforms like 200 years ago so um the other main ghost is captain richard he was a cattleer, and he loved the hotel so much that while he was still alive, they named a suite after him. And so he was regularly staying there, and anytime he did stay in the hotel, he would just go there. Sure.

And eventually, he found out he was terminally ill and requested to stay there until he passed away. So he had his own suite, just he made it his deathbed. People like just staying there till they died, huh? Yeah. Wow. I don't get it. And the bed is said to be the exact same bed frame that he passed away in.

Oh, no. So a lot of people who are into paranormal stuff try to sleep in that bed. The room has since been remodeled and the door is no longer where it used to be. Uh, the room has since been remodeled and the door is no longer where it used to be. Um, but he still moves through the wall where the original door was. So they know it's like a residual ghost because he's not following current rules. Right, right, right. He's going off of like the blueprint of his life. He also died in 1885.

Fun fact. Just so we like know where in the timeline I am. 1885. Fun fact. Just so we know where in the timeline I am. So his funeral was held in the lobby and guests who rent the king room have awakened to see him standing over their bed or sitting on their bed. Or when they go towards the bed, there's already an impression sitting on the bed or on the pillow, which is even creepier. It's like a ghost ass on the pillow which is even creeper it's like a ghost ass on the pillow um they get the sense

of being watched and one woman woke up to see um not only him watching her but pacing as he was watching her um as if you like get out of my room get out of my bed just want to nap uh he's also been spotted roaming the halls right outside of the door and disappearing through areas that used to be doorways okay um as the story goes he does not use his own door and he never uses any other door on the hallway so he'll go into other people's rooms too because it all used to be one big suite right so he'll just walk through any part and so a lot of people will see him going through walls because that used to be where different rooms were in his suite uh the last thing that happens or is so like circulates around him is that around his

old room there's a dancing red orb that shows up or is always just outside of his room and people have followed the orb down the hall and then it ended at his room oh or they'll see an orb they'll see like a red dot in the hallway float into the room or they'll see like it'll come up to people and they'll it'll like approach them so that's kind of weird that's creepy but people always say oh yeah that's um captain richard so he's just a red orb it's fine just a red orb other than that i have um a couple other quick um paranormal things that have happened nice but they have no you'll see so there's another ghost that's a lady and she wears metal frame glasses she wears an old-fashioned blue dress she wears a beret and she is often seen knitting one time an employee thought that it was a real woman

and went up to her and said are you comfortable can i get you something and then she looked up and said no and and then as like after she said no she like just vanished into thin air in front of him um do you think she was knitting a disembodied foot i think that might have been what she was doing probably apparently also the kitchen area is known to have their utensils float around by themselves oh no and a lot of times people will come like staff will come back the next day and all the kitchen looks totally different because the ghosts don't like what the kitchen looks like now no this is not where the spatula goes which is not the first time i've heard this there's a lot of places with kitchens and haunted areas where they will rearrange the kitchen because they don't like how it's set up anymore.

Right, right. People also report seeing their beds levitate. They'll hear strange rapping noises, and they have seen clear apparitions appear beside them when looking into a mirror. They've also smelled cigar smoke. They've watched heavy doors swing open like they were really light and they have had um they basically watched people replay the last moments of their life

because they'll report what they saw and then go downstairs and and the people working will say oh yeah that guy killed himself or that guy died or that guy got shot right before he was seen doing exactly what you just reported seeing. There's apparently also a young blonde boy who plays in guest rooms while they are sleeping. And you can even feel him. I guess he has a toy truck and you can feel him rolling the toy truck on the bed. Oh. And sometimes he'll accidentally go over your leg. Oh, no, no, no.

TVs turn on by themselves. There are definite temperature changes in certain rooms, and there are certain rooms where the maids have to go in as pairs because they are too afraid of the feeling that they get when they're in there alone. Another time, a bartender was trying to find the correct top for a bottle, and so he placed a random one on top and just turned around. And when he turned back, the correct top was sitting on the bottle, and the random top was sitting beside it on the bar that's some spooky shit right there oh yeah um lights will

also flash people have seen skeletal hands reach out to touch them while they're in their beds like reach out from under the bed like a real monster under your bed oh i would rather have a kid with a train i don't care maybe on that theory, maybe they're the same thing. Oh, I don't care. I'd rather have a demon playing with the train than a fucking skeleton hand. Apparently, the young ghost children will also try to tickle your feet while you're sleeping. Okay. I take it.

Fucking pass. Take it back. I don't want that. There was one guest who said that from 7 p.m. until the next morning, none of the electrical outlets would work. And then all of a sudden they would come back on. Another person said they heard moaning in their room and it sounded like a man, but they were the only ones in their room. And while visiting another person's room to complain about it, they smelled cigar smoke

thinking that that person was a smoker. But and she definitely smelt it in the room. Yeah. But the person's room that she went to that person said that the smoke smell followed her it's like they both like were getting it from different perspectives right um there's also a male ghost named frisky because he can't keep his hands off the woman especially the redheads so apparently gross i know ernesto apparently um was talking to one of the female guests who had experienced a ghost. But she was saying, oh, I've lived in haunted houses my whole life.

Like, this isn't even a problem. And Ernesto watched her ponytail suddenly stand straight up as if someone was like playing with her hair, like watched it moving around as if to find gravity all by itself. moving around as if to find gravity all by itself. And she, in the middle of the interview, she turns over to her side, like looks behind her shoulder and says, would you leave me alone? I'm trying to have a conversation. And her hair fell back down.

Listen, what a fucking pervert, first of all. Also, people have taken pictures and have noticed that in images that were taken right next to each other, there are now people standing in the background of the picture when a second before in the other picture, no one was there. No thanks. And it wasn't like, oh, they could have walked. It's like they're now just appearing. Right.

And then Ernesto said that there is nothing here that will hurt you, but sometimes they'll scare me. I was standing on the third floor the other day looking at a photograph, and all of a sudden the lights started to dim, and I felt as if someone was trying to, I felt as if someone was trying to hurt me with their stare. I turned around and there was nothing there. I got scared.

Even at 78 years old, they still try to get me. Oof. Ernesto, man. So that is the Menger slash Menger Hotel. Whoever wants to correct me, do it. Email Christine. She'll get it. It could be a soft G, a hard G, who knows. Ay yi yi, what a mess, dude. All right. Ernesto. Ernesto. You okay? He's- You need a drink, buddy? Yes, the answer is yes. Christine, tell me if I'm wrong,

but I'm guessing you like podcasts. How did you know that? I think you also, when you're not doing them, I know you do your improv, don't you? I love improv. Okay. So here's the thing. If you've ever wanted improv and a comedy podcast in one and sci-fi, my favorite genre. Sure. There's a podcast for that. No. Yeah. It's called Mission to Zyx. Z-Y-X-X. Mission to Zyx. Oh, man. And so get this. It's a podcast that's created by veteran comedians from UCB. You do improv at UCB. I sure do. It's like family. Oh, my family. The first season's special guests include cast members of Saturday Night Live, The Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt, The Chris Gethard Show, Search Party and other great comedies. Oh, my God.

But so they do improv and then they edit it down to turn it into basically a sitcom podcast. Oh, that's great. It's pretty wild. Let me guess. Tell me. Does Mission to Zix follow the misadventures of Ambassador Plek, Dexeter and his crew as they attempt to establish diplomatic relations with the inhabitants of a distant, uncharted corner of the galaxy, a quadra often referred to as the ass end of space. Okay, so either you, so you've heard this, you've heard of the show. Well, I just, I didn't want to burst your bubble, but.

Well, the ass end of space is probably the best thing I've ever heard of. So, I mean, if, if that doesn't pull you in, I don't know what will. I mean, I'm going to be honest. It's a great fucking podcast. Okay. I'm dramatic as hell. And I love sci-fi. And this is basically a sci-fi drama plus improv plus comedy.

And it's a podcast. And there's just very, very juicy stories. Very juicy plot lines. Like, will the omnisexual security officer succeed in sleeping with her new work crush? Like, will the omnisexual security officer succeed in sleeping with her new work crush? Will the droid C-53 manage to remove his restraining bolt and experience real emotions? Will he? I don't know. Will the sentient starship reconcile with her countless ex-husbands?

I mean, there's just so many things to worry about. Anyway, if you wanted to listen to it, it sounds like you've already listened to it a little bit, but if anyone else wants to listen in, it's called Mission to Zyx. That's Z-Y-X-X. And you can find it for free on Apple Podcasts or really wherever you listen. Listen. I listen. Listen.

I know that I was like, oh, what is it? But really, you're right. I know what it is. It's a great show. It's epic and it's great. And it's very fucking funny. And if you want A-list comedians doing improv in your ears this is the place to go everyone's gonna leave us for them oh crap mission to zyxx

z-y-x-x check it out all right lay it on all right lay it on me okay so this was suggested in an email to me um from a named Marlon. Hi, Marlon. Hi, Marlon. And she names herself as Marlon, aka the one who got away from Scientology. And if you don't get that, which apparently Em does not, you should join the secret, and that's why we drink group, because there is a whole thread about that.

Yeah, I didn't see it. It is a very interesting little thread. So that's your little teaser to join the secret Facebook group. So here we go. This is the story of John List. Okay. This mother. He was born in Bay City, Michigan, as an only child to German-American parents in the 1920s.

He grew up in a family of strict Lutherans, and he would grow up to be a devout Lutheran himself, even following in his father's footsteps and working as a Sunday school teacher for a while. He served in the military from 1943 to 1946 as a laboratory technician during World War II. And later he was recalled to active military service in November of 1950 as the Korean War was escalating. So it was at Fort Eustace in Virginia. Hey, I know Fort Eustace. Do you? Yeah, I went to college right next to it. Oh, I figured you might know where it was.

Where he met his future wife, Helen Morris Taylor. She was actually the widow of an officer who was killed in action in Korea. And she had one daughter named Brenda, and they were married. So John and Helen were married on December 1st of 1951. Near the end of the Korean War, List got a job as an audit supervisor at a paper company in Kalamazoo, Michigan, where he and Helen had three more kids. So by 1959, List had risen the ranks to general supervisor of his company's accounting department. But unfortunately, Helen had developed a pretty bad alcohol problem, and she was growing increasingly unstable.

Uh-oh. Not a good start. In 1960, Brenda, her daughter, got married and moved out of the house. And in 1965, List was offered a job as vice president and comptroller at a bank in Jersey City, New Jersey. So he took his wife and three kids and they moved to New Jersey. And they moved into a 19-room mansion. Oh, shit. You know. Casual.

As you do. Called Breeze Knoll. Of course. So it was an elegant place. It had marble fireplaces. It had its own ballroom. And his mother also moved in with them. And she had her own separate living quarters on the third floor.

So it was like her own little apartment where she had a kitchen, bathroom, and all that. Helen's drinking problem didn't get any better and after a few years things were pretty much unraveling so john lost his job at the bank he fell into deep debt that he wasn't able to get himself out of but his family had no clue okay so he would leave for work every single day and just fake it. Yeah. He actually went to the train station. Aw, sad. And he would nap, read, and wonder how to get his family out of their financial mess. Very sad.

Very sad. To add insult to injury, Helen had stopped attending church with him, and he was, like, deeply... Hurt by that? Yeah, deeply hurt. He was deeply religious, so it really put a strain on their relationship when she wouldn't go to church with him. On November 9th, 1971, List left a note for the milkman to cancel delivery. Helen was having her morning coffee in the kitchen, and the kids had just gone to school. John walked up behind his wife and shot her in the head.

That was how he was going to fix the financial problems? Just kill them? Yeah. All right. I bet it worked. She was 46. He then went upstairs to see his mother on the third floor, and she was making herself breakfast.

He gave her a kiss and then shot her in the head right above the left eye why why the mom he realized she was too heavy to drag downstairs so he put her on a carpet runner and stuffed her body into a nearby closet then he went downstairs and put his wife's body in a boy scout sleeping bag and dragged her to the floor of their ballroom. Oh, right, yeah, their ballroom. Oh, the ballroom. I forgot it. Which one, the second or the fourth one? Was it the one painted gold?

Oh, right, it's the Gilded Eleventh Ballroom. Oh, there it is, okay. Right, yeah. Next, he went to the post office to stop his family's incoming mail. He went to the bank, cashed his mother's saving bonds, and closed their bank accounts. When he got home, he made several calls to explain that the family had left town to visit his wife's sick mother and that he would be following them shortly by car. Then he made lunch and ate it at the table where he had just shot his wife in the head.

Jesus. A few hours prior. Wow. His explanation was, I was hungry. What could I do? His 16-year-old daughter, Patricia, called from school saying she was sick. So he picked her up and brought her home from school. As she entered the house, John shot her in the back of the head.

Oh, my God. He dragged her body into the ballroom and put her in another sleeping bag next to her mother. He ran some more errands, and then John went and picked up his 13-year-old son, Fred, from an after-school job. As Fred entered the house, John shot him in the back of the head and moved his body into the ballroom with the rest of his family. Jesus. Jesus. Then John went to see his son, John Jr., the oldest son, age oldest, the oldest son, age 15, playing a soccer game. After the soccer game, the two drove home. And when they got there, John shot him.

But there was a struggle. And John Jr. didn't die right away. Oh, no. So his father ended up emptying two. He was holding two guns, the dad. He shot both guns until they were empty and there were no bullets left. Holy crap. And so John Jr. was shot 10 times before he died.

Oh, my God. There was a note that he was crawling across the floor trying to, like, get away. Yeah. And he kept shooting until he was out of bullets, basically. Fuck. He later said, I wasn't sure if it was because, I mean, I'm paraphrasing, but he basically said, I wasn't sure if it was because I didn't want him to suffer or because I wanted to, like, release all the tension of finally finishing my assignment. What a sick bastard. Right.

what a sick bastard right um so his body so john jr's body still wearing his coat and winter gloves was dragged into the ballroom by his dad to be with the rest of his family basically john just fucking systematically murdered his entire family entire family Family. Entire family. His next step was to write a letter to his church's pastor. Oh, my. Of course. Thanks, priest. Hashtag thanks, priest. Hashtag thanks, priest. The letter was a detailed confession in which he explained that his life had fallen apart

and he didn't want his family to suffer the truth of how bad things had become. So bad. But good thinking. Right. Good thinking. But it's that family annihilator thing that I've mentioned before where, um, people consider it's like a, a psychological thing of where men who are family annihilators consider their

families and extension of themselves. And so they almost like you've done, um, people like that before. Yeah. Yeah. I did one story like that before and they want to end the suffering. So they kill their families so they don't have to suffer.

It's like, so they don't have to look in a mirror. Yeah, exactly. It's almost like an extension of themselves and they, yeah, so fucked up.

Anyway, yeah. That night he ate dinner as usual and he slept in the billiards room. Uh-huh. I don't know which one. There's probably 12.

I don't know. With 19 rooms, at least seven of them got to have billiards in it. You'd know which one. There's probably 12. I don't know. With 19 rooms, at least 7 of them gotta have billiards in it. You'd think so, right? The next day, he calmly turned all the lights on in the house. How many lights? Probably like 812,000.

Probably 8. 19 rooms, 8 lights. It's like Hanukkah. That's how Hanukkah works, right? Yes. Okay, cool. Every billiards room has one light. Oh, except most of them.

And they burn for many, many hours. Okay. He turned all the eight lights in the house on. He found every family photo in the house and cut his own face out of it. Wow. Oof. Yeesh. Turn turned on a christian radio station perfect and blasted it through all the intercoms of course and left that's pretty

eerie imagine being the cop who walks in on that and just hearing like christian music all throughout the house and then you find a bunch of dead bodies. And like smelling blood and dead bodies. Yikes. Yeah. Firm pass. So Patty, the 16-year-old, had told her drama teacher that she was worried about her dad. And she told him that if he heard anything about the family going on a vacation, it would mean that something bad had happened and that her father might have hurt his family.

Ew. For a 16-year-old to just know that? Yeah. I mean, well, that's also so specific. Like he had to have threatened it multiple times or something to them. It is a very specific thing of like, if my dad says we're going on a vacation. Cause I've heard like, if something happens, know that it was my dad, but not if you hear this exact alibi. Which is the one he used. Like it's very specific. You're right. Sounds like he has like like he tried like threatening them one time and saying what he would do well apparently one night at dinner he said later he had asked them he said he thought he was very very sly he had asked them

what they would want done with their bodies once they were dead and i'm like respectful well and i'm also like was it that they wanted to be in Boy Scout sleeping bags? Right. In the ballroom? Like, I don't understand. That's not even slick because it's not even slick and it's not even useful information. Like, you just want to be found out at that point. Well, it's not useful at all because it's like, why on earth would you even ask that when you're just going to put them in a ballroom with their heads shut up and then leave for

Yeah, exactly. What do you mean? Like, he just wanted to be found out. He just wanted to bring up the conversation. He just liked that he could say. Right. Exactly. So anyway, the drama teacher heard the school's news that the family was going on a trip.

And he was like, oh, wait. He was like, no, they didn't. He's like, something is up. So he drove by the family's house. But all the lights were on and things didn't look abnormal the cars were there sounded like people were inside so he went home thought he was also if they went on a trip why the fuck are lights on and people talking that's a very good point just saying didn't think it through and he's the teacher that is a really good point nearly a

month later on december 7th a neighbor noticed that the lights in their house were flickering and that it seemed empty. When the police arrived, they found the bodies. A month later, that shit had to smell so fucking bad. And an entire month, almost an entire month. Like, my aunt used to live, my aunt and my cousin used to live in a very dingy apartment in Brooklyn? Somewhere in New York.

But they lived in an apartment for years, and she told me that the guy upstairs was definitely a loner, super introverted, didn't know anyone very, like, basically she thought he might have been agoraphobic. And he died up there, and because he didn't have any friends, no one went checking on him, so they only found him by the smell. And she was the one who had to call the cops because she she smelled the dead body and she said that he had only died 10 days ago and he was already stinking up an entire complex where from the bottom floor she and also

she said like um and she's no cop or anything but i'm gonna take her word for it she was like you never have to have had smelled death before to smell it the first time and know what you're smelling is death. Right. And she was just like, she just, it hit her like a ton of bricks. And she was like, that's, that's a dead body. I mean, it must be a very unique smell too, you know. She said it's weirdly sweet. I've heard that too.

Which makes sense. Cause like all you're like. I've heard that. You're sleeping out. Well, I, I, speaking of that, did you see the post? It was a while ago. I think it was a few months ago on the secret Facebook group. And hit wink, wink, nudge, nudge.

Wink, wink, join the group. Or you'll miss out on all these fun death stories. This woman said that today I drink because my across the hall neighbor was found like dead in his apartment i saw that i saw that i guess he had like she woke up till i don't know if she woke up but she saw all these emergency personnel and things outside in the hallway and they had all these crazy intense industrial fans set up to try and get rid of the smell and tarps and like they had found his body in the apartment across the hall and i mean that's traumatizing even just to be like that close to it yeah but to think like you're the cop who finds

a family and also like getting back to the point is that like um a month of a month a month of like what i was that whole story i said was just to insinuate that like that was 10 days right right right imagine three times that well and like the youngest is 13 like that's so fucked up yeah if the youngest is 13 that's just horrific yeah okay uh so they found the bodies john was immediately the prime suspect obviously because he was not the only family member not there. Right. And he had cut his own face out of all the family photos. Right. No big deal. And the daughter's testimony about if we ever say we're going on a trip.

Well, sure. But they didn't know that yet. But yeah, yeah. At the time, yeah, those were the main points. Gotcha. To make him the suspect. But the problem was they had no idea where he had gone. Because again, it's been almost a month.

Right. He could be anywhere. Yeah. Do you think if you did something that horrible and you're on the run for a month, what, like, are you still on day 30 and think you haven't been found out? Or, like, what day do you start getting paranoid that you're, quote, on the run and people are looking? Like, when do you start thinking you're on the run? You mean when do you stop thinking that? Or when do you?

No, because I feel like, I bet he thought, I got a good two weeks before I had to start being paranoid. Oh, before they find out. Yeah. Right, right, right. On what day do you start thinking, I'm probably wanted and need to look out? I would think within, like, a week or two I'd start getting paranoid, but I'm also a very anxious person.

Do you think he found out that, like, he was, like, slick about it for 30 whole days? I mean, he definitely, i don't know i don't know i don't know how you would find out because it was also you know the 80s that's oh yeah that's true that's even scarier like if you're like i'm sorry i did that the 70s no it's even scary like if you're like a bad guy that had to be even harder because you had no way of knowing actually it's probably easier though, because you don't have nobody to track you. Yeah. Or like no one's like posting your picture everywhere on social media, which is also like as much as that's, you know, as much as

you think, Oh, well, like you won't be able to keep track as much at the same time. Like you can distance yourself from it. Cause it's not constantly what you're looking up on google you know yeah anyway um okay so the police had no idea where he had gone so breeze knoll the 19 room mansion was destroyed by arson on august 20th 1972 which was approximately 10 months after the murders oh shit okay and that crime remains officially unsolved okay um the ballroom stained glass skylight was destroyed which was rumored to have been a signed tiffany original wow which was worth at least a hundred thousand dollars geez which is in 2016 was equivalent to 570 000 um and so the whole house was destroyed and in 1974, a new house was built. So basically he was disappeared.

And the only thing they had going was this house caught on fire and they had no leads. Fast forward 18 years later, Jesus on May 21st of 1989, America's most wanted featured the massacre on their show. It was a relatively new show at the time um and they had a sort of like a forensic guy who would make busts of people he would like age progress what a person would look like and they would make a bust of it so they featured a clay bust of john list that had been age progressed to resemble what he would look like that like 18 years later yeah um and List's former neighbor recognized him as a suspect she saw the tv show and was like oh my god I know that guy and within two weeks of the broadcast

List was arrested oh wow um it turns out what he had done is he had left his car at the airport as like a decoy, then taken a train from New Jersey to Michigan and then from Michigan to Colorado. He had settled in Denver, taken an accounting job as Bob Clark, which was the name of one of his college classmates. He joined a Lutheran congregation and he ran a carpool for church members who couldn't drive themselves to church. Very heavily involved in the Christian community. All right. He married a woman that he met at a church social gathering named Dolores Miller.

They got married in 1985 and moved to Midlothian, Virginia. That's an hour away from my hometown is it yeah in 1988 uh he was arrested on june 1st of 1989 during the trial list explained that he was too ashamed to tell his family how bad his financial situation had become um he says quote i finally decided the only way to save them from that was to kill them. Or he could have just taken them on a train, then a plane, then a car to a fucking bank where he could get a job under the name Bob Clark and then make a bunch of money and no one had to die. Sure, he could. But it was just easier to kill them before he did all that and made the money for himself.

Why not just fucking shoot them in the head? Right. Just makes sense. He said he killed his family because he wanted to make sure they got to heaven. Okay. And he said he didn't want to wait any longer. He had seen a lot of sin in the world, and he knew that now is the time that if he killed them, they would make it to heaven for sure. And he wouldn't have to worry about their afterlife.

sure and uh he wouldn't have to worry about their afterlife uh when asked why he didn't kill himself he explained that suicide was a cardinal sin and if he had killed himself he would have prevented himself from getting to heaven and reuniting with his family so he wasn't going to kill himself because it was a sin so he murdered his entire family to make sure that he didn't commit any sins you know because murder isn't a cardinal sin, I guess, unless it's on yourself. Right. Sure. Exactly. But he like he thought, oh, I can murder all these people for no reason and still go to heaven.

Right. And we'll get to heaven together. Yeah. I don't understand. Yeah. The judge was unpersuaded and said, John M. List is without remorse and without honor. After 18 years, five months and 22 days, it is now time for the voices of Helen Alma, Patricia Frederick and John F. List to rise from the grave. He sentenced John to five terms of life imprisonment that were to be served consecutively, which it was the maximum

penalty at the time. And on March 21st, 2008, at the age of 82, John died of complications from pneumonia. Okay. Before his death, he said he was very excited to reunite with his family in heaven. And he knew that by the time he got there, they would have forgiven him. Or maybe they wouldn't remember what he had done at all. Oh, that's nice. Yeah.

So what about his other wife? Like, did he even love her? The one that he married later on in life? Most of the articles I read, there was like a New York Times article that tried to reach her. The reporter tried to reach her uh the reporter tried to reach her and i guess she just refused to return any calls or any fair can you imagine if you totally no totally please what what if he did that what did what murdered everybody yeah then i'd be dead no i mean what if he had a life before you oh right because he's 27 and i'm sure he has a long

oh yeah history of murderous pasts you know what a lot of people have kids before they're even 18 he could have had a whole family and then said like oh yeah i went to yale no big deal you want to marry me and you're like oh yeah i just want to send them to heaven yeah right yeah that's why would you be answering phones either though for interviewers i'd be shutting them down the fuck so i don't really blame her no i don't blame her at all but so it's definitely like very unknown like what her stance was because she was kind of like leaving me out of it for obvious reasons um after he died fun fact no one came to claim his body well because they all were already dead. Well, well fair, but he had extended family and stuff.

Nobody came to claim his body. Um, and I read an article that explained that if no one claims his body, the mortuary calls the local funeral director and that person will have the body cremated. Then the undertaker keeps the remains for a year. And if nobody claims them, they're put in a concrete vault and buried in the state cemetery. Ew.

So the Undertaker has to keep the remains for a year. Jesus. I mean, don't you think that person's seen a fucking ghost? Oh, for sure. Okay, so actually when I was applying to BU. Yeah. To meet me. To meet you.

Yeah. Who knew? Actually, this is a full circle this this is one of those tell me tell me if someone did a movie about our life and this part showed up before we even became friends it's such a foreshadow oh man i the only reason i got in is because one of the people not in bu not in the bu the BU comm department, but in BU in general, they were still looking at everyone. So they were coming because I interviewed as an RA or a TA or something like that. Didn't get the job, but whatever. The guy liked me because I, he was asking what other people had done before. And this was on my like professional interview. And I was like, I was a paranormal investigator. And everyone else had been trying to brown nose me.

Like, oh, I did this, this, and this. And I did this, this, and this. And trying to one-up each other. And I had the only unique answer. And I was like, I was a paranormal investigator. And he stopped dead in his tracks and was like, I used to be a mortician. No. And so he pulled me aside.

And everyone was supposed to eat together for lunch and him and i sat alone and we just swapped ghost stories all lunch talk about brown nosing talk about brown nosing like wow that paid off wait but you didn't get the job no so it didn't bail i didn't want the job anyway so because after we because they made us take all these like training orientations and halfway through i was like i do not want this job um but no so i got to like all we did was swap ghost stories so i absolutely and he's told me too he was like every mortician i know has wild stories really yeah that's fascinating kind of have to be a believer if that's your business someone on jim harold recently said they worked in a funeral home for years and they were like, I never had any experience until like one time. And it was like crazy.

But he was like, yeah, it was years before I had anything happen. It's kind of like being probably like an investigator where when you go into it, you're either a staunch skeptic or a total believer. There's no in between. Right, right, right. I would think so. Yeah. Anyway. Okay.

Is there a geohoroscope i'm not done yet oh okay uh okay so he said that uh his body would be buried in the state cemetery yeah uh they also said the department would use any money remaining in his account at the prison to pay for all or part of the cremation and burial according to state regulations wow yeah so like if interesting you i would never know isn't that fascinating yeah that's why i included it i was like what a weird detail they use the money from his prison account like from his commissary yeah to pay for his own yes funeral basically yeah and his burial wow and cremation um and then they would also contact the Social Security Administration, Veterans Administration, and Public Welfare for any death benefits and use that money toward it.

Oh, cool. And then the state would pay the rest. Wow. I just thought that was interesting. Yeah, no, so many. I never even knew that was a question I had. Same. But now that you've answered it, I now know what happens to bodies who don't get claimed. Listen, last week I told you what humans taste like. This week I tell you

what happens to unclaimed bodies. Oh, you're such a sage, an oracle. I'm the oracle of our time. There it is. The millennial oracle. That's my new blog. You heard it here. I like it. All right. Okay. So that's that. That's the story of this mofo who murdered his entire family hashtag family annihilator which was yeah family annihilator was a term i used in a different episode but it's the same kind of story where he killed his family because it was an extension of his failures totally and it was featured in criminal Minds, which is why I know what it is. Hashtag Shamar Moore. My true love. Okay.

Well, that's fucked up. That's fucked up. You want to know something? Yes. So Theron, our good friend, he messaged us. He actually was on the Facebook Live with us. Yes, I know that. And he suggested that we do horoscopes for geoscopes from The Onion. Oh, I love that. And he suggested that we do horoscopes for geo on geoscopes from the onion.

Oh, I love it. Which is a great. I love the onion. You don't have to tell me what the onion is. Journalistic. I would say probably the most professional news of our time. Definitely. It's like Colbert report.

Like I learned so much. And it's sadly not as ridiculous as it used to be because our actual world is so fucking ridiculous. They have to be more balanced and normal. The Onion is supposed to be a total... Hashtag fake news, but everything else. An actual joking comedy news outlet where they make up fake articles right that seem somewhat plausible just basically to troll people right but they're so funny to people who are aware that it's fake right but now they actually have to go above and beyond ridiculous just so people don't confuse them with the real

news that we're seeing these days because everything looks like an onion article now everything does my brother subscribes to a really fucking funny subreddit called Are Not the Onion. And it's a subreddit. Not the Onion? Yeah. And it's funny. Articles that are so absurd that your headlines that are so absurd that you're like, oh, this has to be the onion. Yeah.

But it's not. But it's so true. Like there's so many nowadays where you're like, this has to be fake. Like there's no way. Yeah. But yeah. So he said they do horoscopes. And I was like, that's fun. I'm going to read you. I'm going to read you a geoscope. Little baby G.

You're welcome, Scorpios. All right, let's go. Okay. Let's Scorpio. Nope. Let's Scorpigo. Let's Scorpigo. Oof, that's even worse.

Let's Scorpistop. Okay. Baby G, listen up. While there's no shame in admitting you don't know everything, there's actually quite a lot of shame in admitting you can't figure out how to eat chips and salsa. Baby G, that is so true. Baby G. Baby G, but if you need help, just ask.

I mean, he's not going to. He has a lot of pride. And he is a Scorpio. Very stubborn. Thank you. Exactly. Very stubborn. And also, when he eats like salsa or things that are a little spicy, he gets really upset.

Oh, baby G. He starts sneezing. Oh, baby G. But apparently that's shameful, according to the onion. I don't think Scorpios would like that. No. Is that the whole horoscope? Yeah. It's literally just one sentence? Yes. Baby G, that's it. All right. Well, there it is. Do you want to hear yours? Oh, you mean ours? I mean ours. Okay. Okay. Gemini. All right. They say that it's not how well the bear dances that's impressive, but that the bear can dance at all,

which is kind of insulting considering the number of hours you spent teaching it. Huh? Hmm. You're teaching a bear to dance? Is that the point? How come we get sage confusing wisdom? I don't know. But Baby G gets a get sage confusing wisdom? I don't know. But baby G gets a chips and salsa comment.

I don't know. I relate to Gio's a lot more. Yeah. I guess it means that if the bear's trying at all, you should be proud even if there was effort. Even if he's trying and he sucks, just be happy that he's trying at all. Yeah, sure. Let's go with that. I mean, that's kind of how I live my life looking in a mirror every day i'm like you know i'm trying you're

like bear who's dancing i'm the bear who's dancing i'm like look i'm making it work the best i can even if it's not great i'm just i'm still breathing that's the impressive part like how else could you expect me? Yeah, don't expect more from me. I'm already doing all that I can when it comes to my bare minimum requirements. Bare minimum. I had to go there. All right.

All right. Thank you, guys. Is this where I do my spiel? Listen, do your spiel while you hold that disembodied foot. I'm going to let the Villisca axe hack at the disembodied foot. Oh, that's beautiful. In front of the demon pig. The demon pig's going to watch. Upside down?

Yep. All right. Thank you guys for listening. You can find us on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram at ATWWD Podcast. You can also find us on our website and that's why we drink.com. You can find our merch store at, and that's why we drink.bigcartel.com. You can find our Patreon at ATWWD podcast where you can help us. Please help us.

What else do we have to offer you? You can find us on iTunes, iHeartRadio, Spotify, Stitcher, Google Play. Google Play. We're on Audioboom. Find us on our secret page or just add us on our general page. If you do find our secret page and you are a Patreon donator. Donator. You can. Donator. Watch us on Facebook Live at the beginning of every month. You can also email us at and that's why we drink at gmail.com and send in your listeners stories. We do that every first of the month.

Thank you to everyone who came out for our most recent Facebook Live. That was super fun. I appreciated all the good questions about ghosts. Mm hmm. One last thing we have been promising you and promising you and promising you that something halloween themed would be coming out of our show it's coming and it is coming and unfortunately you don't get to hear about it because christine can't know about it because for once in this fucking show i am in charge of something and it's a surprise and

christine can't know about it until it's happening. Listen, if I have to suffer, y'all have to suffer. So when it does happen, I will be recording it on some format. I don't know if it's going to be video, audio, what, but I'm going to document Christine's experience and that is going to be your Halloween present outside of our normal storytelling. I'm just losing my mind over whatever the hell it is. I don't know what it is. But it's going to be pretty fun, and it will be out by Halloween. I'm so excited. As long as Christine remains free and doesn't make plans by accident

on the day that I've told her to be free, even though she can't know why, when, or what we're doing. I will be liberated AF. So happy Halloween in advance, because the next time you hear from us, it will be Halloween Eve Eve. Eve Eve. Yeah. So anyway, you are getting something. I can't tell you what it is. Just be ready for it. Just know that I'm waving the disembodied foot around. I'm super excited about it. The disembodied foot's excited about it. The man in our part in our house that I talked to with a pendulum is excited about it the disembodied foot's excited about it um the man in our part in our house that

i talked to with a pendulum is excited about it probably so everybody's excited about it um and thank you guys for helping us we've been our our numbers have been doing really well i know we're not like supposed to talk business for to you because like all of the uh podcast 101 uh blogs out there tell you that we're not supposed to tell you the personal stuff about our show. But at the same time, if it weren't for you guys, we wouldn't have personal information. Right. So we might as well keep you up to date with how we're doing. And it's because of you guys.

There's no reason. It's not how hard we're working or how good our stories are or how funny or not funny you think we are based on the iTunes reviews I've been reading, you slick demons. But it's because you guys are helping us out so much and we really appreciate you. Thank you. Thank you, thank you, thank you. You're the reason we do this. You're the reason we drink.

You're the reason we drink. Stop making me, you're driving me to drink, people. Because she likes it. In a good way. Okay, guys. See you next week. See you on Halloween weekend. And that's why we drink.

And that's why we drink. Clink. And that's why we drink. That was really close, though. I know. Almost got it. We almost got it.