And That's Why We Drink - E453 Corporate Birthday Winks and Designated Pony Drivers

Episode Date: October 12, 2025

It’s Episode 453 and it’s time for us to kick off our spooky season! This week we’re headed to Ireland aka the birthplace of Halloween where Em first tells us about one of their most haunted buildings, The Hell Fire Club. Then Christine covers Ireland’s longest missing person case, the disappearance of Mary Boyle and the theories behind what happened. And we’re calling dibs on being the first time travel bloggers when it finally exists! …and that’s why we drink! Photo Links:⁠The Hell Fire Club⁠⁠Old Mickey Mouse Masks⁠⁠Mary Boyle⁠ Want to hear more from us? Subscribe to our bonus Yappy Hours on Patreon or Apple Podcasts! ⁠http://patreon.com/ATWWDPodcast⁠ Grab your Paraween merch at ⁠atwwdmerch.com⁠ !___________________Learn more at ⁠http://chime.com/drink⁠ For a limited time get 40% off your first box PLUS get a free item in every box for life. Go to ⁠http://hungryroot.com/drink⁠ and use code DRINK Stop putting off those doctors appointments and go to ⁠https://Zocdoc.com/DRINK⁠ to find and instantly book a top-rated doctor today. If you think you or someone you know might be struggling with OCD, please don’t wait to get help. Go to ⁠https://learn.nocd.com/ATWWD⁠ and book a free call with their team to learn more. Go to ⁠helixsleep.com/drink⁠ for 27% Off Sitewide! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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ZipRecruiter.com slash drink. ZipRecruiter, the smartest way to hire. As somebody who has suffered from OCD and learned a lot about OCD over the years, a lot of with the help of no CD, I can highly suggest this to people who are struggling with OCD. A lot of things have gotten better for me through the help of no CD and other, you know, services that I've used in other providers and other therapies, but it is really such a cool, especially starting place if you're kind of new to the diagnosis or new to understanding or somebody in your life maybe has OCD. It's just, I cannot say highly enough how much I think no CD is important and really helpful.

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with their team to learn more. That's NOCD.com to schedule a free call and learn more. Okay, really. I mean, really, though. I think it looks good. good. It does. I mean, it was a compliment that, like, you look like the cool kid in middle school. I do appreciate that. This is the first time I've been called a cool anything. So that's, I went to get like a sweatshirt and then I thought, well, what if I get a hot flash in the middle of the podcast and I can't just be willy-nilly. You know that when you take your sweatshirt off? There used to be this girl in high school, speaking of high school, but she took her sweatshirt off and it like took her shirt off with it by accident and then everyone saw her.

boobs and it was like ha ha ha and we talked about it for years like who gives a shit um i feel like i was scared of that happening here on this i see you needed a you needed a layer you needed a layer but not a pullover because you don't want to accidentally flash it's an easy access pullover sorry again i'm saying all these really inappropriate things when i wear this i finally feel like we're on the same page finally we can share the same same jargon you know i i i i I assume we're already recording the episode. We are, yeah, I guess, because I decided so. I was going to say.

Unceremoniously. I won't say who in case they're listening, but I was hanging out with someone yesterday, and I thought we were on the same playing field. And I thought we were like. And then you said, come in my pocket and they went, um. Well, they opened up the conversation for like, kind of like a, not totally X-rated, but certainly like an adult conversation. I thought I was like, oh, I'll, I'll.

Oh, opening. Oh, God. Shut up, Christine. No. I wish you were there because I would, then they would have been outnumbered and I would have not felt like such a freak. Apparently I was there just like spiritually fly on the wall. Well, I was, I guess they were, uh, I don't know.

I don't know how much I can say without like giving away the situation. But basically I thought we were both like kind of talking about personal experiences. We weren't. And then I just kind of started throwing them out. And I was like, oh, no. You're like, you know that thing that happens. And they're like, uh. Or, like, I thought they were going to match my energy.

I don't know. I don't know really what happened. The whole thing felt like a big headache by the end. I was like, now I'm just so embarrassed. But I love when that, I mean, I hate when that happens. I love what happens to other people, but I hate when that happens to me. But it also feels like a good story someday, you know. Well, they were telling me about, like, oh, I went on date with this girl and she was

texting me all this stuff. And like, I didn't, like, I did not how to respond. So I was like, oh, let me. Here's what you do. No, no. But I was like, oh, I can relate. let me give you a story. Oh, sure.

And then they were, it just, it turned into them, like, I thought I was hyping them up because I was like, oh, cool, like a cute girl saying these things to you, good for you. And they were saying like, oh, it made me uncomfortable. And I'm like, oh, and I was like gassing them up. Like, this is awesome. And they were like, oh, oh, oh, I never mind me either. So in their mind, you were like, oh, you love being harassed, hooray. Yeah, it was like, I, the energy was not understood.

if someone said I went on a date and they sent me these nights these I mean it depends on I guess the content of the messages I mean I felt I felt like I was reading the room the right way it sounded like oh she's really cute me like going on all these dates and then she started sending me this stuff and I was like oh yeah yeah yeah it seems like a natural progression and then it's like nope and then he was like so anyway I broke up with her because it made me uncomfortable and I was like oh oops well forget everything I just said for the last 10 minutes oh well hopefully that person who sent the messages is listening and now they're like oh I see I see what happened, and now maybe they'll reach out to you, and it'll be just like the circle of, well, actually, no. Alison would love that. Yeah, I was going to say, wait, don't say anything. I might reach out kindly, not reach out sexily. I understand. And I want to be super clear on that. Okay, everyone.

I honestly, if I got sensitively like that, I think it would just be, you know, I'm so lucky for Allison sometimes because if I ever got caught in a silly little situation like that, I, I've been with people who are one, jealous, two, you know, know, get, you know, get weird about that stuff before. I don't know. I'm just, I'm just very grateful for Allison because I was even saying yesterday. Let's talk more about them. Who is it? What are their names? Um, oh, it's never actually happened yet. But, uh, what's never happened yet? Wait, what are we talking about? Oh, sorry. I wanted you to talk more about your exes who were super jealous. Oh, I can't talk about that forever. Giving all their names and information. We are all listening. I am a little scared of them still, so I'm not going to say their names, but you know the names. I've told you the names. Oh, I know the names, yeah. Um, but no, I was,

I was actually in the same conversation yesterday. It was with a straight person. And I was trying to explain the difference between straight and queer relationships. And then it led into like, you know, when you're comfortable with someone and you trust each other, like you, weirdly, this is like the weird way, wrong way to put it, but like, get away with a lot because you are able to understand each other and like, it's not. So I was saying, like, I feel like with Allison, I can talk about my exes and I could, like, and it's not a thing. It's like, Right, right, right, right. I can go hang out friends that are girls, and it's not, like, a threat, you know.

So it just turned into, like, a little Alison praise party. So, Alison, if you're listening, I said nice things about you. Your turn. You're welcome. Your turn. Anyway, how are you in Blaze? And how is that sweet little birthday, girl? Oh, my gosh.

Thank you for asking. She is delighted. She's so kind and special, and I love her empty turn four. I can't believe you have a whole four-year-old. A child, and she picked a song for a class to sing, and they sang, they were going to do Shake It Off by Taylor Swift, but then her other friend had a birthday, and he picked Let It Go from Frozen. So she's like, well, now I want to do Let It Go. I get it. The problem is, it wasn't a problem, but she did take over the entire.

Her teacher sent a video and said, look how sweet. Leona was so excited on, like, her friend's birthday. And then it's literally this kid going, Leona, you're being too loud. it's my birthday song and she's saying like every word and like belted it out and you know what I see both sides clearly I know that's where I was like oh god so I was like I'm not gonna my brother was like see don't do don't like yeah leave it alone and I was like you're right you're right you're right um he won't remember the friend won't remember yeah and by the way the next day he made her a drawing of a bunch of actually it was just a swirl and leona said I drew him a bunch of pizzas

but he drew me a swirl I guess that's okay um so I think they're fine I think that was like their amical handshake on the matter so yeah she's just having the best time and like what did you do for her birthday was there a party was there a cake was it what presents did you get her was there a theme so her theme is gabby's dollhouse we took her to we took her and her best friend haley to the gabby's dollhouse movie cute we took her out of school early to take her was that her first time getting to leave school early yeah and she was so cool like i don't want to leave school and i was like oh oh someday why am i getting all the messages mixed up no no You're right. I mean, you're right, in my opinion. I just think at age three, they're just singing frozen all day. So apparently, it's a fun time.

I wouldn't want to leave you there. I know. Sorry, I'm also a PMS saying, and I have a ton of candy here. I will stop eating it, everyone, okay? Sorry. Get your last handful in. You got a care. Got my last handful in. Oh, okay. So what was the cake? What was the presents? So this weekend, we're doing a, like, a party for her classmates and her friends, and so that'll be more of, like, the big to do. But she's getting, like, a, Gabby's Doll House cake. It's going to be super cute. Got little like crafts for all the kids. And then yesterday my mom and Tim came over and we opened presents and it was super sweet. She just was like, first of all, well, we went to the movies and we were the only people there. And so I was like, oh my God, somebody take a picture because

we also took Haley and her mom. Like someone take a picture so that one day we could say like we rented out the entire theater for you, you know, but it was just an empty ass theater. But they ran around the theater and sang all the songs and it was really cute. It actually worked out so well if they're allowed to run around and everything too. Was that your fucking foot? Jack got out my butt. Did she just do a burlesque move over my head? Did I just go, whoa. The thing is it wasn't even over your head. It was directly through your face. Just like, yeah, it was mostly like, Giovanni. Sorry, he's driving me nuts. And so I'm trying to chew him. But instead, I just gave you a nice show. And I'm sorry, Jack.

for you, especially, because you have to cut that out. Please don't. You can cut out the conversation, but nobody needs to pause and freeze frame on the bottom of my blanket. I've been, I'm not had to... You're going to be rated again on that stupid foot celebrity website. Well, no, I'm not ready for it. I need a pedicure first before we take, like, the official photo, you know?

What's it, WikiFoot? Is that what it's called? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not on Wiki feet, but you have, like, a great rating, I think. Well, it's because I wear a lot of, like, sandals. And so then people, like, zoom in, you know what I mean? So that's the only reason. And by the way, I have a terrible rating on there

because the pictures they picked are just not good ones. And I'm like, just hold on, let me get a pedicure first. But then now I'm like, oh, I can't just pose a picture of my feet, right? Because then it's like, well, now I'm skewing it on purpose, which like... I'm sure someone has taken a picture of their own foot and put it on Wiki foot to up their ratings.

Yeah, I'm sure there'll be like, user number and it'll be like, I'm always crazy four for four for as uploaded content. Like, I mean, that would be so unhinged. but someday I'll swing my foot delicately through the screen and someone can take a picture and that means I've taken what do you do is slowly like this

while I'll know you want to freeze for it. And it's like oh look at there goes M with their fucking perfectly manicured fingernails speaking of maybe you'll be on wiki hands wiki fings wiki fings oh that's horrible I bet you get an A though thank you and that is a backhand compliment

a back fingered compliment okay uh what the point what's the point what's the your daughter's cake flavor oh chocolate okay oh and then she was really sweet because we were opening gifts and she kept saying she'd say who is this from and we'd all be like like before she opened it and she'd wink at them because that's her new thing she winks at everyone so she'd like wink at tim and then she'd open it and she'd go thank you tim and it was like who are you it was just so cute because what a corporate little lady she was like Thank you, Tim, and then she opened it. And then when she actually did get it, she said that to everybody.

But then when she opened Tim's gift, she just looked at it and said, I think this may be the best one yet. And we were like, okay. And it was her favorite. Someone learned being diplomatic. No, it was her favorite. It was her favorite game. She got a stomp rocket.

Oh, shit. Those are cool. And for some reason, she just looked at it and went, I think this one wins the day. And we were like, oh. second. I thought you meant she was saying that to every single person. Oh, no. Oh, my God. No. Little people pleaser. Thankfully, she's not a people pleaser. She's actually very ardently not a people pleaser, which is why when she says something nice, it like really means something, you know? Like, we don't make her say please and thank you and stuff, really. She just

kind of knows when it's appropriate. But yeah, she would be like, and then she was genuinely just really a sweetheart about it and was like, I can't believe I got presents. and people send to me. Like, she just feels very special. So, um, it's been a, it's been a good time. And we got her, uh, her own little bike to learn how to ride a bike. So. Cute.

She's very excited about that. But yeah, so it was a good day. But we're doing a party this weekend. Uh, talk to me in five days when I've had like 12 children in my house. And I may not to say the same story, but so far it's been good. Good. Is that why you drink this weekend or this week or what's, uh, it is. And also, Blaze has started buying me a constant rotation of mini D. Peppies. So that's what I drink today.

What do you drink and why? I drink. You know, I had it sent out every time I do. It's my own special little thing. So did I do. So did I, but Blaze is just the like send out guy, you know? The shopkeep, yeah. That's right.

I have my usual little iced tea. Nice. And. I feel like there's no reason to drink and so many reasons I know right oh my god it's like I have so many things I feel like I want to talk about but then I'm like oh I should talk about that but I should mention this I don't know hmm what's what's just here give me throw a topic at me and I'll find a I'm trying to think of a good little icebreaker um well how's my god son dog son he he's good he um uh you missed this episode because this was when we

had a little paroine special and Morgan from creeps and crimes was on but one of the reasons that I drank recently was because it was his first time being boarded and I did not do the like the smart what you should do warm them up by letting them stay for one night only I like just oh he had never left the house since he's been here and then he spent 10 days there and I was terrified the whole time he thought he was rehomed oh geez yeah so I felt very guilty about that um and so I'm not that guilty because I boarded him again. So he's... Is he there now?

No. The reason I drink is because I'm about to go pick him up after this because he spent the night there. And hopefully he gets it. You did the opposite way. You're like, do you like two weeks there and then you do one night. Yeah, we do it the hard way and then you figure it out. But he, I'm picking him up afterwards. And I'm supposed to say to see my little mantis.

Oh, it's going to be nice. It's going to be happy reunion. And, yeah, so I'm going to see him. him and then next week I'm going to Florida for my grandma's 90th which is wild and it's turning into like a whole thing Of course it is

Of course it is because it's I can't wait to hear all the details It's three generations of me and it's a theme party God what a nightmare guys Let's think about this Linda and grandma Man it's going to be fun So and I've seen my mom

Way too damn much recently I saw her Dude I've literally been seeing her on a weekly basis Just as she intended I know it's like she's plotting because i i just went to philly and delaware i knocked delaware off my 50 states and my mom uh invited herself i think i i think i said something like oh you could come and then she really rolled like i didn't know was gonna and then it became a thing we're like now we're planning and so

i saw her and then that was last week and then yesterday i took my very first back-to-back red eyes to pittsburgh for the day so i saw her there and then i see her next week for florida and it's just a lot of Linda so maybe that's why I drink but the October Florida extravaganza is becoming a whole thing because since I haven't seen Allison she's coming to Florida to see my for my grandma's birthday oh so you're going to see each other in Florida I'll finally see the woman that claims to love me yes and and because we're going to be in Orlando and I haven't seen her all of spooky season which you know is like a crime for us and October is her birthday month we've decided that we're going to see grandma and then we're going to extend it and do

Halloween stuff in Florida. It's just become a whole thing. Oh my God. So, okay, wow. So I wonder if Linda had some hand in sending Alice in a way so that you would start, like, I'd be freer for her, right? Like you'd spend more time on the East Coast and Linda could just conveniently show up, you know? I know. I know. I, you know, um, I don't put in cahoots. And you could say them to be in my, uh, my, my, my, my, my, my dayline voice, but. I were going to say, that should have stayed in my head, but that also should have stayed in my head. But we can put some, we can fix it in post. I love it.

I love it. You could say probably any ridiculous conspiracy theory about my mom, and there is a line of truth. Yeah, there's a grain of truth in every conspiracy theory about Linda. So anyway, she's why I drink this week. You are welcome, mom. Wow. That'll be fun, though. Florida will be fun.

Yes. It will be fun. I'm just stressed because I haven't planned for it yet, so I just don't know what it looks like. I mean, I'll figure it out. I was figured out. I literally just got off the phone with some money folks and then I had to take a town and all. Oh, yes. It's really, it's difficult. And that's why we're so thankful for our sponsor, Chime, because they, man, we're a little envious of the people who have this now. Because back in the day, especially when we had no clue, we could have used their help.

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Open an account at chime.com slash drink. That's chime.com slash drink. Chime feels like progress. Chime is a financial technology company, not a bank, banking services and debit card provided by the Bankor Bank N.A or Stride Bank N.A. Members FDICC, spot me eligibility requirements and overdraft limits apply. Timing depends on submission of payment file. Fees apply at out of network ATMs. Bank ranking and number of ATMs, according to US News and World Report 2023. Chime checking account required. so I have a personal shopper not really but it's hungry root and it feels like a personal shopper because Leona's favorite snacks will arrive on my front porch and I'm like oh how did this happen oh hungry root knows that Leona likes this and does not like this other thing that they did not send it's just like a really cool program and especially with like a house of different people of different tastes and and lifestyles it's a really cool service yeah hunger route takes

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slash drink code drink to get 40% off your first box and a free item of your choice for life. Hungry root.com slash drink code drink. So that's why I drink. And is this our first? I don't remember the calendar, but I think this might be our first episode together in October. Maybe last week. Yes. I don't know. But I I have no idea. Morgan got the first week of October with me. So this might be our first one together, in which case, happy spooky season. Hey, I can't believe it.

Paroene is so fun. And shout out to Eva for even coming up with that whole thing. I can't imagine the headaches that have come out of having to align six different shows with each other. I don't know how she just like whipped it up, but she really, I feel like is thriving as producer across multiple shows, you know. Yeah, I think she's, I hope she's loving it. um otherwise big ask um thank you so much um and yeah i because this is uh maybe our first episode together in october i'm taking it upon myself to treat it as that at least um i was like well i should kick off the halloween stuff now right you better so my story today i was like i'm i'm really

if you guys could write in the comments um suggestions for future Halloween episodes that would be sick because I'm starting to panic where I'm like, there's only so many ways I can talk about Dracula. You know what I'm saying? Or like... Right, like the same like, yeah, like where the Jackalentard comes from and stuff. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I keep wanting to do like Halloween focused, but I like at some point will run out. And I even typed in on Google. I was like looking for inspiration. I typed in like haunted candy factory. And apparently that's an episode of Scooby-Doo. So I was like, well... L-O-L.

We could do a watch of that. But I also feel like it's hard when... Sorry. I also feel like it's hard when, um, we do, we do Halloween themed things every single week. I know, I know. It's like, there's a limited amount of like extra Halloween. Super duper Halloween. Yeah. I'm like, witches. And I'm like, well, I don't want to, I mean, I guess I could cover like, uh, you know, Salon or something. But I was like, that feels really

deep. And I'm, I'm so nervous to do something like that because I don't want. We already did like so many witch episodes with like a real team of researchers at, uh, like, of like five, six researchers who did like rounds of. for rituals yeah for rituals yeah so it's like daunting to do it is and i don't want to upset any of the witches certainly i certainly don't want to piss off witches i do let's just see what let's let's fucking find out you know well so anyway i was like why don't i instead of covering like a full-ass pagan festival why don't i just like look up the origins not just hang on with me because i know i've done this before the origins of Halloween that was kind of my inspiration blah blah blah and i was like

why don't I just pick a haunted location from the very beginnings of Halloween, which is, I don't know if you know this. I mean, I've said pagan and I think Celtic already, but Ireland is technically the birthplace of Halloween. And so I was like, okay, I'm going to find somewhere in Ireland. And that's, that's going to be my first, my first contribution to spooky season. So I was like, what's the most haunted place in Ireland? And I don't know if it's the most haunted, but certainly the most notorious is the Hellfire Club. So that's what I'm going to talk about today. That's a good one.

You know, I was expecting, I don't know, I don't think I did bad research, but I was expecting this to be like triple the amount of research as usual, because also anytime something is older than like a hundred years, I expect there to be like so much more history on it. They have pamphlets and stuff from back then, you know? And a lot of it, I was expecting like a lot more scandal, but every, everything I looked up, It kind of was just focusing on a few stories. So we're just going to get, I guess, a few stories.

And then I have a little special thing for you at the end. Oh, okay. So Hellfire Club, Fun Fact, is actually called Montpelier Hill. Oh. That's like the location where Hellfire Club is, but it's just become known as the Hellfire Club. But fun fact, Montpelio Hill. Excuse me. So before I tell you about the actual location of this Hellfire Club, which is in Dublin,

I wanted to tell you that in 1719, the very, very first Hellfire Club, because it's not, there's not just one, it's one of many Hellfire clubs. Oh, it's a franchise. It is. It's like a, it's like a fraternity, essentially. Yeah. The very first Hellfire Club was founded in England in 1719. And it was founded by this guy named Philip. He was the Duke of Wharton.

But I prefer calling him this dude called Philip. Of Wharton. I feel like a wart. You could make some jokes there. but you could witchy yeah true it's somewhere

but so the Duke of Wharton was the founder of the very first Hellfire Club in England and immediately I have things to clarify for people because when I was reading

up on these things I kept getting confused so I broke it up for everybody else so you can be that well actually guy later a lot of people were saying oh the Duke of Warden isn't the founder

it's actually this one guy named Dashwood, which great name. Whoa. That was actually his actual name because we kept making fun of Wharton and stuff. And he's like, uh, nope, that's not me anymore. No, Dashwood is his last name, but I'm just sticking with that so it's easier to swallow. But, uh, this, a lot of people have said the founder's actually this guy named Dashwood. He is not the founder, but he founded a similar club to the Hellfire Club. And on top of that, he later opened his own charter of the Hellfire Club. So a lot of people, And it actually is like one of the more famous Hellfire Clubs out there because they were like up to some real tomfoolery over there. So because his name is involved in Hellfire Club history and he founded his own club with similar beliefs. They think that he's the founder. He is not. Okay. Forget the name, Dashwood.

Fake news. Fake news. The actual guy is this guy, Phil, Duke of Warden. Aw. Another thing that I wanted to say that feels confusing in my head, but maybe I'm just sleep deprived from my back to back. guys um the the hellfire club that everybody knows the one i'm talking about today as a topic is haunted and it is in dublin it is not in england even though the the founder is from england and founded a club in england and and i only say that because it's a weird

coincidence but even though the duke of wharton is from england and he founded the hellfire club in england he also actually at one point owned this property before he ever for the Hellfire Club. Oh, so, oh, and then they later built a Hellfire Club on the property. Oh, wow. I'm sure the guy who ends up buying it, he was like, oh, well, you know, the founder of the Hellfire Club actually used to live here. Maybe I should open a Hellfire Club and make this a chapter.

Something like that would be the opposite where he would be like, I want to open a Hellfire club. Oh, there's a property that he used to own in the area. Interesting. Right. Like, I don't know. I feel like it's a hard reach to be like, I'll buy this random property and then what should I put here?

You're right. You're right. I mean, that feels more like how my brain would go where it's like, yeah, that's how like our sick brains would do it. We'd get the property first, but yeah. For example, like people in, who used to film in vaudeville movies, like Faudville actors used to rent out here. And one of my first thoughts was, well, now I'm going to make this like a vaudeville themed house. Like that was like my first thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

You're totally right. Your way is. I mean, I don't know that I'm right, but it's just a guess that normal people usually business people have a different brain than I do. and you do you are very onto something well i only say that because since the founders from england and they're the original club is in england but he lived here where there was a club people think that this is the founding one and that's why it's so famous oh that's the confusion right so anyway i don't mean to like beat a dead horse but i just wanted to make sure everyone gets it that this is not the OG but the OG founder did live here okay um okay so now knowing that uh he happened to

live here. He was known to have all of his aristocrat friends. And basically, when they opened the original Hellfire Club in England, it was called the Hellfire Club, I think, as a dig to the Christians, which immediately, of course, now we can see how this becomes this demonic place, right? Yeah. So he was known for his lewd behavior. Ooh. The word debauchery was on every fucking website. Just vague lewd behavior. And him and all of the of his social elite friends who were also into lewd behavior, they created this group because this was during a wave of Christianity in England, and they kind of put this club together to openly mock the church. Oh, good. That's going to go well. The first one,

the first club, I think, was actually, I don't know what the right word is, but like forced to shut down by the king. Oh, wow. Anyway, so they started this club. It said, at least, I don't know how true any of this is because everything had the word allegedly in front of it, but we're going to roll with it. At this club was originally open because they wanted to discuss science and philosophy, and it was like kind of during the Enlightenment era

or that's what they wanted to hold on to and they questioned society's rules. It was not a fun place for those who wanted to be super duper religious. So while the Duke of Wharton owned this Dublin site that was not at the time a Hellfire Club, he

ended up selling the property in 7th,000, to a very wealthy speaker of the Irish House of Commons. Ooh. And his name was William Connolly. He bought this area, especially, like Montpelier Hill. It's in the Dublin Mountains. It's kind of isolated, which makes it kind of spooky and no witnesses. So he built this area up because he wanted a hunting lodge as all wealthy politicians.

Where are you going to put it? Where are you going to put it in the woods? Does that make sense? Obviously. So immediately kind of fucked up And by kind I mean totally He began building on I'm just going to call it sacred land

It's where there were already memorial sites made of stones There was a 5,000-year-old Neolithic passage grave Which are literal tombs How many years old? 5,000 What is wrong with people? There he's like, well, but I'm okay And he was like, this is the spot for me

Not only did he destroy most of this area for his own construction but then he even which I'm sure felt condescending to the ghosts used those stones from the memorials for parts of his fireplace yuck yeah um fun fact the this part

is for sure true that these things exist that these passage graves existed they have even been uncovered bit by bit over time as recently as 2016 they're finding in his fucking fireplace probably I mean just carbon date a rock you know yeah right I mean it's made a carbon right isn't that

point. Yeah, that's a great point. Maybe they didn't have to dig up at all. They just kind of grabbed a brick from his fireplace. Yeah. Anyway, they have dug up and found pieces of the old graves. But soon after the construction, the roof of his new lodge blew off in a storm. So it wasn't built well, first of all.

Yeah, really. The locals immediately took it as these are the pissed off spirits getting back at you for desecrating their land. I could understand that. If somebody at the pub, like, gave me a few talking points. I'd be like, I believe it. Yeah, sure.

I would too. So basically with the connection of this hedonistic anti-Christian Duke of Wharton living here, plus desecrated land, plus angry spirits, immediately this place has like a cursed kind of feel to it. And after William Connolly died, the lodge was then sold or leased, I'm not sure, to the members of people who wanted to open a Hellfire Club in Ireland. So, in 1735, the Irish Hellfire Club was founded by James Worsdale and Richard Parsons. Richard Parsons was known for dabbling and black magic. Again, we have no evidence of this, but he was apparently already known for that.

I love that even, like, they, like, claim the black magic thing, but then it's always, like, they're dabbling or, like, they're entrenched in it. And that's, like, how do they determine, like, the word, the level of how dramatic, we're going to sound about it but like a quick dabble doesn't sound as dramatic you know in which case like I wonder what the fine line between dabble and entrenched is because some people might think that we're entrenched exactly and like maybe scared of the witches right like I don't know you can maybe one of them just was like I've heard of a Ouija board and they went oh shit you're entrenched in this black magic he's not a dabbler anymore so um yes so uh Richard Parsons and James Worstell there are the two people who ended up

getting this place after William Connolly died again he did not have a hellfire club either he just wanted this far as hunting lodge and he was desecrating land cool um then these two guys end up moving in they want to move their hellfire club chapter into this building right imagine if they've I this is where again we go back to your point of like one of them must have heard that the founder of the hellfire club lived here or they got there and they went no fucking way yeah yeah yeah or that or that and they're like oh this is a sign from the universe that's how we would be yeah i mean if you're already talking about like a cult it's like oh it's yeah cosmic so there were other members who i'm going to discuss later that joined and they definitely if the reputation was already kind of yucky they really soured it so i'm just i'm just going to say their names now i didn't mean to sound so excited about that i'm curious sure um so there's one guy named lord santry and another named simon luchrell i'll say their names again later but they become some of the early members of this club once it's opened in this area. I'll bring it up again later, but they are no-gooders, I'll tell you that.

So it's debated how often the lodge was, and I'm calling it a lodge from what it previously was, but it's debated how often this building was actually used for Hellfire Club meetings. Some believe that most of the meetings were actually done closer into town so people could get to them faster. You know what I'm saying? I mean, I get that right. you don't want to like a huge yeah then you have to carpool is yeah by horse it's like my horse my horse can really carry too is that horse pulling i don't know uh there was

pulling no pooling pulling a cart a cart pool was that what it would be a wagon pool wagon pool wow can you imagine when the you know how like if my dog hears t r e a t goes nuts right imagine the the fucking sigh that comes out of a horse after he hears the word cartpool enough and he's like

fuck me this is gonna be such a bad day this drive is going to be this drive to the Hellfire club and back

is going to be so fucking boring and they're all going to be drunk by the end it's just going to imagine just the horse

is the DD it's miserable yeah yeah it's the D8 the H the horse driving us

home the the D.P. The designated pony. Uh-oh. D.P. Yeah. Okay. Well, we got drunk at the party. Don't worry about it. We've got the D.P. out back. Don't worry. What? I don't know. I don't know anymore. Christine. I'm so sleepy. Okay. So they don't know. They don't know where the fucking meetings happen sometimes. Either there's on the hill. Not out back. Don't look out back. Something's happening back there. You don't want to know. there was a there was a pub in town called eagle tavern um and i guess this tavern i would love to do it they can't anymore i'm sure but if time travel ever exists i hope one of the first documentaries they cover is is on eagle tavern because it sounds like this was the pub that welcomed all meetings

for secret societies like they had to know the craziest shit going on over there to be a fly in the wall eagle tavern um i'm just going to say the freemasons because the other ones I've never heard of. I don't know if you've ever heard of them either. That's how secret they are. I know. I don't even with me right now. But there were many clubs that are secret societies and they all for some reason

would meet at Eagle Tavern. So that then brings in the how true is even like is it because this place was spooky and secretive and hosted secret meetings that people think maybe some of the meetings were hosted here? I mean, it would make sense that they would, you know, reserve time there. it's easier for people to get to, but also you bought a whole ass house in the middle of the woods

where you can do all the secret shit you want. I don't know. I don't know, which is true. And how are they like, and this is maybe two in the weeds, but like how are they even organizing this so that there's not a double crossover of like a double booking because imagine you walking on the wrong secret society.

Like now what? Now must they kill you? Like, I don't know. Yeah, it's like are there like, is there like a... It can't be that secret if they're just like coming and going from the same blaze. That's a good point. Imagine if they're all actually just the same secret society,

but just different people coming at different times. And you would never know. Oh, that could be too. They're just all different levels. It's like, oh, I saw a ritual. I don't know if it's mine or the others or what. The DP outback. Only the horse knows.

Oh, God. So, where are we? Okay, so the Eagle Tavern may or may not have been where most of the meetings were held if they were not actually meeting on Montpelier Hill. Okay. But the perk of hosting activities in Montpelier Hill, like I said, is that because it was isolated, they could get away with a lot more. There was no witnesses.

There's very few accounts, especially after hundreds of years. So we really don't know what happened. It could have been them playing fucking checkers. And that's it. Right, right, right. And just drinking and being idiots. And just talking about how atheism rocks or something. I don't know.

But like other Hellfire clubs, they were like the Hellfire Clubs that came before them, the one that was founded in England. this one in Dublin was very outspoken against Christianity. They were full of high society members who spent their days indulging themselves. So they were drinking, gambling, especially playing cards on Sunday. They would hold black masses. They would, there was a lot of hinting at sexual debauchery with like sex workers, etc. They were also known to eat ghost pie, which is apparently pigeon pie. Oh.

I know. Why did they call it that? Because it's interesting all of a sudden. You didn't give a shit about pigeon pie. Yeah, but now I don't either again. I did. Like put something else in it. Remember I had, I was so hyper-fixated on that one, like, English Heritage YouTube website

where that woman would do cooking recipes from, like, the 1800s. She did an excellent pigeon pie. She did? I remember that. How do you know it's excellent? Did you try it? It's excellent because the actor was brave as shit to pick up a piece. pigeon and make a pie out of it. Yeah, I mean, yeah, that's pretty impressive. I'll tell you what

was an excellent. Some people ate pigeon in Egypt. Oh, it's like today, like these days? I mean, somebody on my trip to. Oh, how was that as a viewer? They said it was delicious. I didn't eat I didn't watch it. Don't worry. I wasn't there. Okay. I couldn't do that. I don't think. I know I couldn't. It's like, I mean, I think it's just pretty much like a normal bird, but I also don't eat normal birds, so I feel like I'm already out of the count. I, as someone who regularly eats cow and chicken, the second I am reminded at all that it's an animal, I'm violently disgusted with myself for like three minutes. And then I keep going. Oh, okay. I've never witnessed you be violently disgusted with yourself while eating, but. It's usually those moments of those three

minutes at a time where I'm really quiet in between my chicken wings. You just like say a little prayer for the little chicky. Well, so I do know, um, from that video, that I saw that pigeon pie is actually very easy to make. Fun fact but it looked gross because they decorated it with the pigeon feet. Huh? I hope that that was just a creative choice that an actor

in today's world did because I couldn't imagine that being served to me on a table and I'm like to bring it over. I'm sure people have done it because otherwise like how do you know it's pigeon? You know that proves that that's what's in there. Not just like something random. making a lot of good points today. Thank you so much. Here's another one, which I could see even 20 years ago, unfortunately, this being funny,

but it's not today. Apparently, since they were so, like, anti-Christian, they would like to play pranks on Christians and clergymen, and one time, like, their idea of pranking clergymen was inviting them over and then flashing them? That's assault. But I do see how, like, two generations of... ago that would have been the funniest thing that someone could have come up with. But if you're inviting people to a hellfire club, what do the what do the clergy expect like a fucking prayer circle, you know? I mean, that's fair. And also like they I mean, all it did was just perpetuate that they are like hedonists, right? Like, oh, they do everything in the nude and they weren't afraid to show with their weenies. Butts or whatever, yeah. Well, anyway, they did not like that. Let's just, they were just digging, digging their own line through the sand. Yeah, it seems like they wanted to prove a point.

They would also, they nickname themselves the Holy Fathers, I'm sure, as a dig to the Christians. That's very funny. They also tried out other nicknames, including The Blasters or the Young Bucks of Dublin. Which do you prefer of the three? The Blasters, because it's like insane. Like, why would you call yourself that? It's like, the young bucks? Okay, fucking fine.

But like, a blaster. You know one person just came up with that and was like, well, what about the Blasters? everyone was like, I'm not with the blasters again. You know what's so funny, though, is if that's true, they had the last laugh because in 2025, we're still talking about the blasters and no other suggestive means. I mean, it's excellent. Like, they knew some, I don't know if they knew what they were doing, but they knew they were doing something. They were like, I'm just ahead of my time.

They'll get it one day. I know something is here. I know it. And it is. So another dig is that the, at the Christians or at the church in general, is that the president of the Hellfire Club would be called the King of Hell and he would dress like Satan. during their meetings. Oh, my God.

He would, like, in a cape and everything. You're going to give these people a freaking heart attack at the church, seriously. And, you know, it's, I mean, they're doing, like, full open mockery. It's one thing, I guess, in my world. Like, I don't even know if I would join them. Like, I understand, like, the, oh, let's be critical thinkers here. But all of a sudden, it's like, oh, we're like, I don't know if I want to go somewhere where we're just flashing everyone.

I don't think we'd be part of the young bucks eccentric drunk debauchery group. But if I did get an invite, I would probably attend. But I imagine I wasn't really welcome. If religion wasn't involved in this, this does just feel like your average scene on TV fraternity. Yeah, exactly. We dress up. We're naked. And they're called the young bucks.

And they're just doing a lot of, like, flashing their weeners for no reason. Yeah. Like, it really does feel like they were just some young, drunk, rich kids. Yeah, 100%. And that's so far how I totally see this. At least that's where I... That's what I think the founder was expecting. Right, right.

It's also said that their mascot was a black cat. We have no reason why. Maybe it was just a stray that passed by. Maybe it's because they're occult practitioners. I don't know. It's probably just to say, like, what should our mascot be? Yeah. Oh, everyone's scared of black cats.

Let's do that, you know. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it's like an omen, sure. Yeah, yeah. They would also drink this concoction called scalvene. Have you heard of this? No. It sounds like a cleaning agent.

it actually i mean you tell me if this i've heard worse um whiskey and butter it's like coffee and butter some people say that that's good it's gross but i mean it's it's inarguably gross but like i also don't like coffee and butter and i don't like bourbon with anything so um i'm not the one to judge but or whiskey i guess in my mind of all the things i'm like a butter beer right i feel like it's kind of supposed to be like that like a butterscotch kind of situation. Yeah, I am sure it's, like, fine. I'd rather drink that than the pigeon.

I'll tell you what. You and me both. Yeah. It's also said that their meetings, at their meetings, they would always keep an open seat for the devil. Very, very, very. It's just, like, absurd at this point. It's like, yeah.

It's, like, funny to me, because it's just like they're clearly just trying to get a rise out of people. Yeah, and it's, so it is unclear how, at least in the, beginning, how truly into the occult the group was. And not even in the beginning. All in all, we really don't know much about what happened here, but because of its rumored relationship to the occult, people just guess a lot, but there really is no evidence of this. It's just that because they were so anti-Jesus, they must be pro-Satant. Right, right, right. I mean, one of them had their costume, right? Yeah, yeah. I would be curious to see what a devil costume looked like in the

1730s. Oh, I would be fucking terrified. I bet you it's, you know, like when cute masks back then, like cute early Halloween masks that like just looks so fucking terrible. Have you seen those? Like, my stepmom showed me her old like 1950s Halloween masks. Oh, yes. They are, they are absolutely fucking frightening. Imagine like a couple hundred years before that. Like what in the world? I feel like it was made out of like cast iron. Like it was like something horrible, like medieval. They're like, put real cat fur on the top. Like, stop it. They're just all so unpleasant to look at.

Oh, my God. Like a literal pitchfork, probably. The mouse, the mouse ones, like I think it's supposed to look like Mickey Mouse. And they just look like these. Oh! Yeah, there's just something so dead in the eyes. I don't know what it is.

It is. And like the smiles are all so big. And they don't really move at all. So it's like, ugh. Anyway. Anyway, horrible. jump scare real quick. I could see why the Christians would pray harder.

You know what I'm saying? Yeah, I do too. I get it. Oh, forget it, Christine. With that. Right, like, these are terrible. And then imagine, like, your parents dress up like this for the Halloween party. Like, there's an actual picture of a couple in these masks.

I forget. I mean, it's like, it's, like, fucking haunting. And those are the, those are the Disney branded masks. Imagine, like, the offering, you know? Oh, yeah, yeah. Well, so we don't know how truly into the cult they started. And I don't know if it's, like, the. chicken or the egg, but eventually others did join with more nefarious interests. And I'm sure

them hearing that they were, I don't know, open to darkness in some way that, you know, they thought probably they could come on in. I mean, probably Satan heard about this and was like, well, that's an easy entry point. Right. Yeah. Like if I want to collect a few young bucks, a couple blasters here and there. So the worst of them that we have on record of the members that came through here was Lord Santry. Oh, God. I knew it. I knew it. The moment you said that guy's name. I was like, I don't like him. Doesn't he sound evil? Something's evil about this guy.

Lord is, it's really... That maybe that's what it is. Well, so he straight up murdered his servant. And by murdered, it was like, I'm, you know, you know what I mean by this, but like, in an evil way. Like, it wasn't like a... It was a pain. full torturous murder. And then he paid people off to get away with it.

And then he just killed another servant, because he knew he could get away with it again. So the way that he killed the first one is that he force fed the servant an entire bottle of brandy, an entire bottle of brandy. Fuck off. Oh, my God. And then set him on fire, presumably to see if his stomach would just immediately combust his whole alcohol. Oh, so he's like a sick, sicko. Like, he's sick, this guy.

Like, you know when you hear of like the, the, the, the serial killers who were just like, I just wanted to see what it would look like. So this is basically like a, right, he's like a psychopathic. Yeah, like no emotion to it. Cool. Um, paid people off who witnessed it and then, uh, ended up, like, stabbing another servant and killing him. This is like how these people get away because the people in the group who aren't necessarily

at their core, empty and evil, just get swayed into saying, turning a blind eye, right? And then it's like, oh, then the people like this get to just fucking, run around yeah and I mean imagine if there was someone on like the I'm gonna use a fraternity phrase here but on the e-board like on like the people the higher-ups here imagine being someone who's like trying to like PR wise keep it to a minimum like yeah we mock the church but we're not evil and then this fucking guy like it's just a joke guys right you know and then like oh oh yeah and then a little multi multi time murderer is one of your members it's like oh this is gonna look so bad um yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah But then they're like, well, we better cover our reputation, so don't let it get out, you know, and then it just like devolves. Another guy was named Simon Lutrell, who he did not kill anybody, but he, I guess, either the lore around him is really intense or he swore by this himself, that he had made a deal with the devil in exchange for his soul. And at some point, I guess when the clock struck midnight, all of a sudden he knew that the devil was coming. and so he ran off but it became this whole story that like someone in here has literally made a deal with the devil and so aha okay we've crossed some sort of threshold yeah so now we're making deals with the devil we there have been murderers who have been in this club and so it just

on top of everything else really and they're also like paying people off so there's a lot of like yes corruption their corruption yeah it just seems like it's ready for that yeah yeah so darker stories just kind of started coming out and it just even if it started with good intentions or silly intentions like if the worst thing you did was like flash a clergyman right it's it's no longer that to the public anymore right right right right they can't look away anymore yeah and who's to say people again it was hundreds of years ago who's to say that these are stories that we were getting direct witness accounts from or maybe this was just like scared Christians who were just making up stories I don't know but over time people started saying that the health fire club was involved in very intense orgies that there was animal sacrifice, alleged children's sacrifice. There is a rumor that has lasted up until 2025, at least, that they one time kidnapped, killed, and ate a woman. What? Who knows if it's true, but it is a story on, like, every website I saw.

So it is renowned at this point. Amongst the animal sacrifice, they've also suggested animal torture, including similar with that servant, dowsing animals with alcohol. And hopefully it's not true, but setting them on fire. oh god oh god it's all bad i hope all of it's i hope the other thing wasn't true either i hope they

were just into philosophy at school and they just sat around and talked to each other just like beer and we're just like got a bad reputation yeah yeah um there are rumors that skeletons of sacrificial victims are all around the area or buried around the area and actually in the 1970s there was a grave of a child and there remains that was found on the property but again we have no idea of the context someone could have put it there to make them look bad maybe some a completely separate situation happened on the property but again it just means that even in the 1970s right before satanic panic we're still is still happening and perpetuating from all this the reputation was cemented as wicked monstrous and they were all satanic worshippers and stories

started coming out about them cavorting with the devil throughout the years and one of the most famous stories about the Hellfire Club, or this one at least, is that one day a cloaked stranger visited the club and the guys invited him in for a game of cards. And they're all having a good time. They're drinking. They're shooting the shit. And a couple hours in, they're still playing cards. One guy drops his cards while he's sitting at the table. So he bends down to grab them. And when he bends down, he looks and sees that the guy's feet are actually cloven hooves. that's the most famous one another one is that a curious visitor came to the Hellfire Club to see what they were all about so they invited him in and the next day he was

found so shaken that he never spoke again the third and final most popular story from this Hellfire Club is that another curious visitor who I guess was um why are all these people so fucking curious I know and also I love that they are just welcoming anyone in. Yeah, seriously. I'm just curious. Okay, that's all we need. We're slicing a throat of a goat open.

Come on in. Yeah, come on in. D.P's out back. Let's go. Deepi's out back. The devil's out front. Come on in. Anyway, another curious visitor.

He's apparently visiting all of Ireland because he's like a guest at a boarding house or something or he's, he has a host or a landlord or something that he's staying with. Okay, okay. So this guy's curious. He goes over to the Hellfare Club, which honestly, I could see myself doing this I literally knew this was exactly where we were going to end up. I was going to say if anyone would do this to you because you'd be like, well,

I just saw it on Atlas Obscura. Literally, yes. Atlas Obscura is going to kill me. I'm telling you. They're going to be the ways. Like the amount of abandoned ruins I've gone to because of Atlas of Sikera. This is not exactly what I thought it was going to be. Anyway, they will never be sponsoring us after that real.

No, listen. I fucking love it. But man, they do send you to some weird places. I think that's a vibe. them and randonautica should have done a collaboration with each other it's like what's the craziest fucking place we could put you yeah let's just uh team up with these coordinates so curious guy he's in town and he goes see what's going on the guys let him in and all of a sudden he goes missing oh good and his host the guy he's staying with whatever was like where the hell's this guy he said he was going

into the hellfire club i'm going to go check there and see if he's there so the host because he knows what the rumors are of that place he brings a priest's with him. He's like, you're coming with me to the Hellfire Club. No. Because I'm looking for this guy, and I don't know where he is. So they both go, and the Hellfire Club invites them in for dinner, aka a feast. The priest comes in for a feast. And during this, apparently the priest sees a Dalmatian-sized black cat with horns for ears. Dalmatian-sized. Literally, I'm not kidding. I know it sounds stupid. Four different websites said Dalmatian sized.

What the fuck? There's so many other things you could have, you could just said dog sized. Yeah, what could you possibly mean? You could just a big fucking cat. You could have said like any other animal that's about the size of a dog. And if it has horns for ears, why don't you see a goat?

A black cat that's a goat. Because he's for sure just like, it probably was a goat. I feel like this priest just saw 101 Dalmatians and was like, I know all about this. He's like, hang on, are you going to turn him into a coat? And they're like, what the fuck are you? you talking about you drink too much wine so uh the priest sees this big ass cat and is so scared that he grabs his holy water and that he just keeps on him strapped on him at all times and he

immediately mid-feast in front of all these anti-christians starts exercising their dalation i think and then they're like this is why we don't bring priests in here we're just trying have a nice meal and the guy starts chanting in latin again it's like forgive us for rescuing a big fucking cat. I mean, come on. This goat needed a fucking home. Anyway, he starts exercising the cat. Apparently the cat dies on site, like immediately from this exorcism.

Again, this is a rumored, like, popular story. Okay, okay, okay. This is like how the story goes. The second I said Dalmatian size cat, you should have known this is like Reddit. I really was still in it. I was like, you know what? I'm going to choose to believe. I appreciate that.

No. In the magic of the holidays. So cat dies and the priest is like, whew, I exercised a demon. You are all so welcome. You're welcome. You're welcome. You killed your cat. You're welcome.

Literally, I killed your cat. You feel better now? Like, hello? Well, then the story goes that as they're leaving, I don't know why they're leaving on their own accord and they weren't fucking dragged out for killing this. Yeah. Their animal.

But the men end up leaving. And on their way out, they find the missing man on the ground covered in scratch marks as if he had been released from the possession. of this cat oh shit he was the goat the whole time cat the whole time yeah oh my god so again i feel like the christians created that because it's like look how we saved them for themselves like yeah the pre sense of being the good guy he's like i'm just friendly i want to see what this is all about and then of course yeah he saves the day classic and a doubting thomas went on over there and look what happened the demon

the devil took them um also a lot of people will combine stories two and three and say after after the priest, saved this guy from being possessed by the cat, he was so shaken, he never spoke again. Oh, okay. I kind of, that's cleaner to me. Because the other one was like, okay, so what? Like, what if he just got punched in the head and didn't want to talk about it? Like, I don't know. Not that that's good, but like, I don't know. Like, it's, I don't know the guy. If he's not talking. I said the same thing. I was like, why did we even separate these two? Yeah, I agree. Let's smash them together. Okay. A few years later, this, we're back to reality now. A few years later, a horrible fire broke out in the building of the Hellfire Club, and many people, this is so weird, this is another thing where every single website had a different thing to say, but there are, there's a lot of speculation on this fire, even to this day.

Some people think it was accidental, like someone just slipped and a fire happened. Some people thought it was on purpose because, like, some sort of negotiation problem with the rent. Some people thought it was intentional. Truly, I'm not kidding, this was a major reason. people think it was intentional for the aesthetic so the place looked creepier it's that one guy you called themselves the pushers what were they the bulldozers young bucks the blasters the blasters and they're he's like no no this will work guys look it's just going to be a little tinged i'm just going to take a candle and like like

send a few of the curtains so you it'll look really cool for like a for a promo pick or something it's like no let's all take a picture in front of the place on fire they'll love it oh my god our album cover will be sick. Whatever. And I bet it was, by the way. Right. And also, I'm surprised that nobody suggested like this was a ritual gone wrong. Oh, see, that's good. Emcy. We got to rewrite this shit.

Okay. Okay. Down the hill, though, on the same property. This was back before the Hellfire Club was even there, when that really wealthy politician was here, he also built another house on the property called the Stewards House. and after this fire broke out at the Hellfire Club they just moved their clubs over to this little house

and that's where the Hellfire Club stayed on the property until their founder the founder of this chapter died and after that the Hellfire Club kind of just disbanded we will never know truly how much of the stories are true or other like I mean I just told you three out of travel is invented and M and I go to all the meetings

I'm calling dibs before anybody else does that the second time travel is real and it's accessible to us. I want to be the first time travel blogger. Don't get in my way unless you can go into the future and do it first. And you better call Atlas Obscura now and make amends because you're going to have to partner with them pretty soon when time travel exists and we've already heard their feelings today. When time travel exists, it is fucking over for you people. It's over for all of you. You are all in trouble. I'm coming. Including me. I'm just excited about it. You know, don't worry. But yeah, so we really don't.

those are just kind of the most popular stories but we don't really know all that happened for all we know they were just well educated social elites into science and they just like to like play cards right you know um and i i will i will say a lot of the members of this chapter of the health air club were literally like from trinity or cambridge and they were graduates from those schools and so maybe they were just demonized for critically questioning religion you know what i mean or and one can hope or since we do know that there were some who did believe in making deals of the devil and there were people who committed horrible crimes maybe they were practicing demonic ritualistic ceremonies plenty of frat boys who convicted who did horrible terrible things and didn't need satan involved you know so yeah maybe maybe they were just bad and the demon has nothing to do with it maybe some of them were bad you know and i'll tell you as a member of multiple greek organizations there are all sorts of people in there right and so maybe they're was just like someone who just wanted to go like make friends in color like I did you know there's

got to be one by the way and we'll be bringing a coloring book back in time to to the meetings in case they get bored before my my Greek organization's first club on campus I joined coloring club I'm not kidding it was the best and that you're not kidding I know and I joined it on the the Friday that Rebecca Blacks Friday because that that we all remember that Friday right guys Yeah, because it came out on like a Tuesday or something and the first Friday where we could all play Friday by Rebecca Black was a sensation. You had to be there. Oh, it was. I remember the front. You had to be there. It was, I remember the front of like the AU newspaper that day. And it was like, it's Friday. And I will never forget that day. It was, I think I still have a copy of that somewhere because I saved it in a box. I just thought it was so funny. We used to be a proper country. That was. I know. Those were the good old days. But that was, I was. I. that was my first day of coloring club and I was sitting there and everyone was just screaming the words anyway you know someone just wanted this to be a coloring club on a hill yeah with a good maybe that's what it was all meant to be and it just got out of hand you know maybe the colorings are

friends we made along the way that's wow now that's a beautiful point in the ending as for the ghosts uh there are a lot of footsteps on the property a black cat is seen literally fucking everywhere although again could be a fucking stray or it could be like people still go out there and try to do rituals and shit someone could just leave a cat out there you know what i mean like as a prank or something i don't know or it just ran away from yeah um there's actually a painting of this cat which i don't know all the details because every source had something different but what i'm gathering is somebody who actually saw the ghost of a black cat painted that thinking it was the original cat like it was like the ghost of the original black cat that used to be their mascot

and to this day it's hanging there and if you hang it upside down while you're ghost hunting like a lot of shit happens. Oh, that's fun. So a little twist. Yeah. I guess it's like just a, especially in a space where like theoretically there's a lot of occult stuff going on there. I imagine turning a portrait, a haunted portrait upside down is like really showing your intention. Yeah, you're like, I'm not here to fuck around or I am here to fuck around. So people have seen apparitions of the priest from that one story. They've seen apparitions of nuns. They've seen people performing masses and they weren't actually there. People see this cat everywhere. but sometimes with glowing red eyes

to a point where, like, people doing renovations have left because a cat with red eyes kept staring at them. Yuck. People hear a screaming woman in the woods, which I take one fucking guess. He likes to call her a banshee. Okay. People smell something burning here.

A lot of people have said burning skin, which would, I don't know if that's true or they're just trying to make it similar to the stories of torture. People feel hands gravest. grabbing at them especially their jewelry like their people's jewelry has gotten yanked off of them um bracelets necklaces anything it's just they could feel like it yanked off them um people hear bells people feel the ground shake for no reason um people have gotten shoved scratched pinched you name it and they've heard voices of someone telling them to get out and i guess people have brought crucifixes

here and they get like white hot to the touch ew i was going to say don't tell me they like get burning hot because I don't know why that happens but I don't like it. Apparently the feeling of doom is like insane here. There was some traveling reporter who said like I've been to the Tower of London and I've been to insert a bunch of haunted places here and I've never felt anything like this. And I'm sure even I'm not trying to be like such a diplomatic. Maybe they were. Maybe they want.

I'm just like I'm very aware of like this. There's no evidence and it feels like this was kind of just a club that wanted to hang out and they just I don't I don't know how true it is and so anyway I'm being a little maybe too political or no you're being very diplomatic about it because I also feel like like you said it was right before satanic panic which I'm sure is when a lot of this stuff took off story wise and we know things were embellished and we know things were made up back then to like point to so I'm yeah yeah I would not be surprised it could have been nothing I I believe that I don't know what I believe I believe that at the very beginning it was not this and I think either some people came in and ruined it for everyone or a bunch of scared Christians just fucked up their reputation out of fear or like I think maybe nothing was going on there and because of its reputation in today's world so many people have gone there to practice stuff that now there's energy there created a yeah yeah yeah what's a sense uh Tulpa topa thank you I think atopa is that more like a

actual being. I think it's more of a being. But it's the... Or is that a golem? I don't know anymore. What's it? Is it maybe it's a dozenly a pony? Last thing I will tell you is of course, I think I'm Zach Bagan's.

I've been trying to tell you all along. I looked up Ghost Adventures, um, Hellfire Club. And this fucking man went there because it was Ireland for a Halloween special. see I felt so grossed out that my brain works like his oh my god see you're the same um it was an hour and a half long so more of him than ever shorter than our fucking episodes which means i'm not going to talk about the entire thing but i will give you like a little snippet and i do before i even start this i would like you to open discovery plus and i want to show you a clip okay let me find my it is 12 5 damn this tea is good i really wish you could try it actually just

Don't. I wasn't going to even try. Here, I'll let you have a little sip here. Just take a sip. There's delicious. I know, I know. All right, so I'm on, it's sorry, season what now? 12 and then 5.

Oh, dear. Okay, I accidentally clicked house calls. Season? For someone who's terrified of the phone, imagine if he was your call. I would. Imagine if you finally got the Braverdney pick up a phone. Don't say that. Hello, it's Zach.

Why do you think I'm afraid of the phone? Intrusive thoughts like this one. What timestamp would you like me to go to? Or should I wait until you're... Well, okay, so I don't know if it's different for you, but I could only see the, like, on a time, I can only see the end part where it says how much time is left, so I don't know what time...

Oh, it... Oh, okay, okay. Can you go to where it looks like there's 51 minutes and 10 seconds left? Yes. And it should look like Aaron's kind of just sitting there. yeah it's there yep that's it there he is okay so uh before you press play just to set up the scene i'm just going to play a few seconds here to get to the right there you go okay so when we get there or when they're looking around pretty immediately Aaron is super duper affected by this place and

I just want to say even before I say that uh because of course I got to give you a Zach Began's line I can't tell I can't do this without giving you like an infamous quote from episode I'll set the mood Aaron was trying really hard to be kind to all these ghosts and introduced themselves. And he was like, my name's Aaron. And Zach, and I quote, I'm here for coloring club. Zach says, Aaron, you're talking to demons, not fucking women making us a shit pie. And then Aaron goes, excuse me for his nastiness. Like, I was like, don't put that on me.

Hello? What is wrong with this man? Aaron, you're talking to demons making us a shit pie? No, no, not fucking women. remember that making us a shit pie what in the actual hell are you on mr did he overhear someone else say that in a different context and he just like thinks that's he think that sounds cool i don't even like know what that means does he think there's a hot girl out there who heard that and went you're so funny i guess there must be because people fucking fawn over this fellow insane to me okay so anyway

Aaron's already trying to be nice and honestly between the two of them actually people were getting and getting bullied for it right however it never goes that way And Aaron starts feeling something on him right away. He is fucking freaked out. He even tells Zach, don't go in that room. Something bad's going to happen. He's like, watch out. Here I come.

Yeah. And then immediately things start moving. You hear like pebbles and glass move across the floor and they're like, whoa, something moved. And right around this time, Aaron starts, I'm assuming there's like some little like tinge of possession because all of a sudden he starts saying that he's not. Just a dabble, just a tinge. Well, he's like, I just stood up and like felt like I like stood up like at a

when you turned the corner and I didn't do that. Like I was sitting and all of a sudden like I just caught myself. Oh, ew. So he said he felt like he was a little out of control. And then he feels something with nails grab his ear. Ew. And I've never seen Aaron actually that freaked out. Like he's bolting out of there.

He like he can't stop talking about it and he just immediately starts crying. Crying. Oh, shit. And he is quoted saying it feels. felt like I was touched by Satan. And, like, he's so freaked out that as they just started this investigation and Zach and him getting a golf cart and literally just start driving away, like, they were going to leave, like, not even investigate because Aaron was so freaked out.

And then they, obviously he's not thinking straight, but they're in the middle of the woods and they're on their way to escaping. But then Aaron has another panic attack and he's like, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop. And he just needed to sit like in the grass for a second because he's so freaked out. Literally touch grass, yeah. literally touched grass and while still crying like crying like sniffling crying like scared crying he says and of course Zach is who he is um Aaron says I swear to God it felt like the devil I swear don't put this on camera but it does. Hey and then remember a few short years later when his

wife literally tries to kill him and Zach is like oh so sorry bro let's immediately film it for the TV show I mean for God's sake this guy just won't give her to fucking rest you So I will say later on in the episode, Zach goes back by himself and uses the spirit box and he asks what touched Aaron tonight and the only word he got was Satan. Super creepy. Bye, that's no good.

What I'm going to show you right now, though, is him still out in the grass freaking out. And he's trying to calm himself down. He's like, there's nothing we can do about it now. We just need to keep it moving. And this is in the area where people say that they hear this woman screaming. So, okay, now press the timestamp, if you can.

Okay. The timestamp for everyone, by the way, is 3350. You got it. Here we go. Bye. You heard it? Yeah. Okay, good.

Yuck. Okay. I'm so glad that you heard it because I was like, I, I feel like that's creepy as shit, especially after he's, like, crying and freaking out. I think it's a cat. Like, I think it's like a... A cat. Yeah.

Which, like, also feels apropos, right? But I think it's like one of those wild cats because it goes like, whee-h-h-h-like, it sounds like that. Let me play for myself because now I want to hear it as a cat. I don't know. I mean, I can see cat, though. I can see it. I think, but, you know, not even like a normal cat, like the kind of sound you hear in the woods when people are like, I heard a woman screaming and then it's like, it turns out. to be like a mountain lion or something and you're like, oh, it sounded like a woman screaming and

people are like, no, it literally does like a lot of times. So I don't know. I don't know. I don't want to just immediately discount it. But it does sort of sound like when my cats are hunting at night and they go like, wow, like that. Interesting. Because I, before that the conversation of having with you right now, I went, that's fucking terrifying. I mean, it's, to be clear, it's fucking terrifying. And if that happened in front of me, I would absolutely shit my pants. But now it's terrifying for a different reason because it's like, what happens at spoiler alert, they then decide to go looking for the banshee in the woods. I'm like, you're

being hunted by a mountain lion, right, is going to eat you because also that's the sound that my, that moonshine makes when he's drowning something. He goes like, it's horrible. Well, that was definitely the creepiest part of the episode. Yeah, that's, I mean, it's terrifying. I will say the last two points is that

remains of the Hellfire Club and the Steward's house where they went after the fire. They're both still there. They are open to the public and tours are offered here. I think there's multiple tours, but the one that sounds the fucking worst to me is a three-hour horror hike, which is what I call every hike, by the way. Yeah.

But like, not three hours. We don't do those. But you do have to go like into the woods, right? So they will take you all the way up there. And the last thing I wanted to say is, fun fact, on June 6th and 2006, people came out here to see if the Antichrist would appear because it was 666. People are so stupid. So, uh, if you would like to go, go for it.

I do, there are warnings. Here, don't leave us hanging. Oh, man. I think he showed up in 2016 and then again, a few years later as president both times. But whatever. Wrong country. Wrong country. If you do go, there are warnings that people, even though they're not really supposed to be doing this, will sometimes be caught trying to do rituals up here.

So just beware of that. And that is the Hellfire Club. Oh, my God. I don't think I knew a single thing about the Hellfire Club. I just knew of it. I assumed it would be more haunted, but people really, because I, researching it, I was actively looking up like paranormal ghosts, spirits, like every buzzword I could. And everything just kind of talked about the, the are they, aren't they of how scary they

truly might be and like what the rumors are. But there was really very, I had to go digging for scary, spooky stuff that actually has happened there since. damn YouTube has a lot of good stuff but if you're looking for like reading there's very little material

man I think I just got Hellfire Hellfire Club inflated I think I conflate them with hell's angels in my head of just like

biker bar type thing and then I forget they all do a good job of the second I hear hell I just clash them together as like a big You're like scary

scary junkmen Anyway well thank you that was a great story I feel like I actually did learn something useful today. Thank you. No offense to say that. I didn't mean to say that so rudely. I just meant, you know.

No, that was only a compliment. I don't know where you heard an insult on that. Sometimes things don't stick, you know. If you can hear from my voice, Christine, I just woke up while we were recording an hour early. And one, I didn't want to do it because I didn't want to wake up an hour early. But two, the main reason is because I didn't want to get out of my helix match. I got to be honest. I don't know why you did.

You know that I record from there at least 80% of the time. Today, ironically, I'm not. But I feel like, although it is dangerous because then you do start to slide down and feel like, oh, my back feels so supported. And this, I mean, it's just like, it's life changing these mattresses. I mean, I'm sure they don't recommend you work from them, but I've had a success with that. It's an incredible mattress. And you know who else likes it?

Your dog. Because anytime I'm not in that bed, Hank is in that bed. It is 100% used 24-7-365 over here. Yes, it's dog approved. It's us approved, especially two people with sleep troubles and insomnia. So that should say something. So go to helixleep.com slash drink for 27% off sitewide, exclusive for listeners of, and that's why we drink. That's helixleep.com slash drink for 27% off sitewide, exclusive for listeners.

I mean, that's why we drink. Helixleep.com slash drink. As somebody who is on beta blockers daily. um i not not to brag not to brag but i'm on them daily and then i triple the dosage when i'm on a stage for those who might also need that i have a place where maybe you can find yourself a doctor you can go to zoc doc that's how i found my doctor christine recommended him to me he was very wonderful i told him all my problems and he said you need a blade a beta blocker like right now and i went couldn't agree more i said oh go see my guy yeah like i've never been able to say

Shefer. Yeah. And like I found him through Zoc Doc. So it's like, wow, this, this service has gotten us through a lot of medical breaks. But it was right away. I mean, so Zock Doc is a free app and website where you can search and compare high quality and network doctors and click to instantly book an appointment. I know. And I said, my guy, you got to get with my guy. No, but it turns out it's just Zock. I mean, he's great too. But Zogog is the one that made it so easy. Not me and not the dude. But they do filter for doctors who take your insurance. You can filter for that. You can filter for location, obviously. Ratings, you know, they're rated by verified patients. And then you can see their openings. And instead of making a phone call, yuck, you just click. Stop putting off those

doctor appointments and go to Zock.com.com slash drink to find it instantly book a top rated doctor today. That's EOC, DOC.com slash drink. Zocdoc.com slash drink. Christine and I just had a bout of fun and we actually recorded our Patreon Yappi Hour before she disturbs all of us with a crime so if later when you're... Why didn't we ever think of doing that? I don't know.

Because it's after the more fun topic. And we're in higher spirits. Yes, and we're getting a snack and we're not like so exhausted because we've only done half the show. Like I feel like that's a way better vibe. 10 years or however long. Don't say 10.

Don't say it yet. January is 9, right? Yeah. We got to figure out something to do for a 10-year celebration. Jesus Christ. You know it's going to take us two years to plant it. I know. But if you go and listen to Patreon, you'll see that we can plant things very well when our brains are operating.

In a matter of seconds. And then we just need to rely on someone else to, we outsource it. We send out for the logistics, right? Yeah, I'll tell the coffee shop. They'll do it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, they'll do it. Anyway, if you go listen to Patreon today and listen to our yappy hour and we seem like we're actually super happy, it's because we haven't heard the sad things yet. And now we're about to hear the sad things.

Yeah. So I joked about this and it's probably an insane thing to do, but I was saying we should have the intermission, like the yappy hour we just did. And then have you pause the show after M's time to the yappy hour as intermission and then come back. But that felt a little, that felt a little ridiculous. Someone will. Someone will. And honestly, try it, let me know how it goes. If you do want to try it, let me know. It's, it's kind of like the Marvel Cinematic Universe. It's like, do you want to listen to it chronologically? Do you want to listen to it based on, you know? Such a good point. I'm full of them. You're full of them as we learned in the Yapia hour where we came up with the best idea. Sure did. Yeah, sure did. So this is this and Eva's like, what? I better go. What happened? Because we literally said, I think Eva won't

find out about this because she doesn't watch this part but um now she will okay so this is so interestingly you did a story from ireland and i thought when you said um oh this is an october episode i'm going to do something Halloween i was like ah shit because i was like i didn't even think that in my brain and so just by sheer happenstance my story also takes place in ireland so i guess i did plan it somehow um and these were actually notes i meant to use two weeks ago. So all very strange. Yeah, little synchronicities. But I, full disclosure, did not do this on purpose, like pick an Irish story. But here we are with another Irish story. We both felt we felt some some pagan air. Luck of the Irish. Yeah, we're like, let's just go for it. Let's do

something spooky. Let's go for it. And this one is definitely disturbing. It is about a child. So do with that what you will. Maybe just go to the intermission again. but it's the story of Mary Boyle. So she was born in 1970 to Charlie and Anne Boyle, and she had an identical twin sister named Anne, which is also her mother's name. And I just thought that's fun. Like Anne Jr.?

Yeah, but then the twin sister gets like a totally different name. Yeah. You know what I mean? I have seen that. I'm like, what's that about? I never understood when families have like juniors or thirds, but like it comes after kids you could have already named that. I always wonder that too.

I'm like, kind of protocol or is it like you already had kids names in mind and then you thought about it later like oh I could do a junior I don't know but yeah it does seem like a twist up yeah in my brain

it feels like you're expected to get that one out of the way first if you're trying to do a legacy I mean not to be all about the office again but like when Andy Bernard like his younger brother is like the third or like

the 14th or something crazy and like they passed him and gave it to the brother because it was like that many generations yeah yeah well because i and i could see your theory of like oh we already use it the names we wanted and yeah another kid so we just kind of taxed on i could see that for a junior and maybe a third but once you get to once it's beyond that it's like you if you knew this was you have a responsibility in my mind like i'm friends with a fourth and i'm like there's no way a fifth if you've already gotten there

and so few people do it has to have come across your mind that fifth is something you could and in my mind should do Fun fact my uncle and my cousin but my uncle specifically was

he's the 12th or 13th of like the family name shut up like so annoying and my grandfather had six daughters and like he was trying for a boy because he wanted he needed to name whatever he wanted the family name to go on so he had six

girls and then one boy and then one more uh girl but he had seven girls and one boy just trying to get that damn name and i'm like was it worth eight children to try to get that fucking one how's your bank account like yeah right i don't know what you were thinking but um what a what a commitment in every way and also this is another one that really this I'll try to keep it tight. The Duggers, as you know, they, the 13th kid is James. And James is like James Dugger the fifth or sixth. And I'm like, why would you wait for 13 fucking kids later?

Maybe they just didn't want to do that. And then they were like, oh, we have, we stuck to the J name theme and we can't think of another team. I'm shocked. I'm like, if you're over again, like, keep it up, you know. So it's really strange to me. Maybe they knew they were going to have so many kids that they were like, well, one of them will eventually, you know.

It would have been really cool if, like, he's the 13th and they were, like, he was like James Dugger the 13th and they waited for the 13th kid. That would have been cool. Oh, so, yeah, that's at least more. Then it's like a golden number, you know. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Or golden age or whatever the fuck. The seventh son of the seventh son or whatever.

That's Jesus. Be careful. No, I'm kidding. Oh. It feels like something I learned in second grade, like King of Kings, seventh son of the seven son. Anyway, so I just thought that was funny because. identical twin sisters and what I get what I'm guessing is that the mom

they were gonna name the baby Ann didn't know they were having twins back then right you wouldn't know that necessarily and had twins and was like well we already have Anne now we need another name so maybe that's what happened I'm not sure but one of the great point twin sisters was named Anne after her mother and then the other one was Mary and then there was Mary they also had an older brother named Patrick and they lived in

Donegal which is the furthest northwest county of Ireland and Sersha made a nice note here that counties in Ireland are similar to states in the U.S. so we can kind of picture it like that. Anne was an adventurous and independent girl. She was very bold and liked to be outside and play games, but she did not like to go places without trusted adults. And I, maybe it's hindsight, but that already gives me red flags, like if a girl is scared to like a little girl is scared to be off without a trusted adult. I'm like, what's going on? But maybe I'm reading too much into it. So she was very attached, especially to her mother, not that unusual. Her mother described her as an awful careful child and said

she was very kind and considerate. She often would stay in with her mom when all the kids would go out to play and would just like help her clean up after dinner or like just want to talk while she you know clean dishes which i thought was very cute and anne her sister her twin sister knew you know the the different side of of mary that she was fun and fierce and feisty and she anne always said mary was the one that i let talk for me like she was the one who could you know speak on behalf of both of us like when twins you know have that kind of like one is the outspoken one yeah that kind of vibe so that was mary she She kind of spoke for the both of them.

And she was very bold, like she stood her ground. So they also like to play little pranks as if you're not, if you are a twin and you never pulled any fun shenanigans, then like, what were you doing? You've really, really lost the plot, man, because you could have. You don't understand the jealousy. You don't understand. Like, you had such an opportunity to be hysterical. What are you doing?

You could have been a sitcom, you know, just built in sitcom. Yeah. Yeah, my friend has twins, and I'm like, oh, boy, the shenanigans. I'm like, Leona, be friends with those twins because it's going to be a fun ride. Especially if they're identical twins. The hijinks and Sue, are you kidding me? Oh, the hijinks, indeed. So they were identical twins, the boils.

And they would, for example, change their clothes in the middle of the day and then, like, you know, pretend to be each other classic. They were very, very happy kids. They seemed carefree with a loving family and a secure home. at least that's what everybody thought so march 17th nineteen seventy seven it's st patrick's day the boils drive up the east coast to anne's parents house in cashelard anne's brother jerry galliger was there as well so that would have been um mary and anne's uncle galliger and his wife eve and they had two sons gregory and gerard so they were all gathered to mark the death anniversary of another family member and that's why they were all getting together for this kind of family

reunion. Anne and Mary were now six years old and they were always happy to play with their cousins and they only visited their grandparents a couple times a year so this was kind of like a special occasion for them as kids to get together and play. The house was on a farm in a very rural area where people's homes were very spread apart, just a very outdoorsy rural area and there were very few people living in the area. And for that reason, barely anybody even had a landline telephone in their house. So this is like out in the boonies. So the next day, March 18th, the children spent the morning doing farm chores, by the way, nightmare. Imagine like, you're on a fun family trip with your cousins and then you wake up at 6 a.m. to like shovel horse dung. And I'm like,

that's not what I thought was going to happen here. And I mean this respectfully, because I know they're listening. But I feel like Allison's family would do that where it's like we're all going to, get together and wake up at six and it'll be fun yeah we're going to do a big do a big family project and it happens to be labor and it happens in six and it happens to be hard labor for everybody and you know what i will say they do find ways to make that stuff fun i mean people like that need to exist though you know to like get the world moving like i need people like that to keep doing it and i love you for it i just can't understand it i could absolutely see them having like a paint party and we're all going to paint the house it's like wait a minute like i wish like i wish i wish i

could be that kind of person, but I never will be. I never will be. My, you know, I got to brag on my gammy again because, uh, happy birthday. Is it her birthday? Oh, I thought you were going. This is the this is the dead one. Don't say that. She's going to listen. She's, I'm already on her hit list. Oh, God. Happy birthday. I'm a happy, you know what, so here's the thing. I'm, I forget you ever had two grandma. So I only care about the one in Florida. And I'm saying happy birthday to that important one. My mom and I call her J.G. Oh, JG. Happy birthday.

Hey, Jay G. So embarrassed. No, you're good. Well, I don't know until she's mad. I'm not good. I'm not good. You've never met and she's only ever been mad at you.

Never me. She has like her eyes on me. Really. No, my gammy, the one who passed who has the shoe story. Yes. She was one of those. Your grandma just somewhere went, oh yeah, that one. The other one.

Yeah, the other 25% of my blood. She was one of those people where she, she came from a whole line of people that was very involved in the community and would make fun events out of like necessary tasks in the whole neighborhood like when you think about like oh you want to be like a part of a village she was oh that's the dream the head villager and so um one thing they would do every year for as long as my my parents can remember is that they would always host a stake and rake where the entire neighborhood would get together at one neighbor's house everyone would rake the leaves when all the leaves came down and so if there's like 20 people there took five seconds you go to the next house next house next house and then whichever the last house was uh where you everybody everybody that guy would host um like grilling steaks for everybody what the heck and they would have like a big steak they called it a steak and rake and they did it for years and years and years and years and

delightful and they could have called it a steak and shake and then honestly oh wait no raking hold on see that's my idea my idea is why don't we just do steaks and milkshakes and then you know other people do a wake and bake before the rake and steak right oh no I'll do it before the steak and shake I'm not doing any raking I'll be very clear about that up front but it was things like that where I feel like it'd be like let's all do a big family chore together but light hands make many hands make light work whatever it's called and then we'll just have a bunch of filet mignon hell yeah brother at whose house and then you and I will plan it so that ends at like a specific house you know like i'll make the stakes but i'm sick beforehand and i can't actually do any of the

rakings yeah um we'll just order some door dash but anyway anyway i'll let's say they were i'll gather together to do family to do farm chores together as the cousins and man that would make me mad as a kid uh i really hated when we'd go somewhere and my parents were like anyway go off and do do whatever chores they need to do and i'm like i know i also it's not my house yeah and also as an adult if i were hosting people and they were like ask them if they need any help with anything. I'd be like, with love, get away from my space because you don't know how things run here. Like I'm like, I'd be like, don't dash myself.

I'd be like that's very kind. And no, you don't have to go shovel like manure. But I guess these people had a different idea. And they were like. I would also feel like a bad host if some, if I was like, actually, can you grab a shovel and start fucking digging? Oh, you'd feel like a bad host. I'd feel like I'd probably committed a very felonious crime.

But yeah. Yeah. So, okay. So they're doing just farm chores and I guess they're not that upset about it. that's apparently I am. I'm getting spun out about it. There wasn't internet or yet. So maybe they just like had free time.

I don't know. They didn't even have a landline. So like yeah, well they can't even prank call the neighbors. So they're doing farm chores. It's early morning March 18th. And then the family decides to have dinner together in the early afternoon. I think this is back when you'd call it dinner and supper was later.

So Anne asked Mary, her twin sister, if she was coming along. and Mary said where and they said oh we're going outside to play and Mary said no she didn't want to she wanted to stay inside with her mom which I thought was very cute

so she helped with the dishes while Anne and Patrick went outside with her cousins and eventually Mary did wander outside to play with her cousins a little while later the mom Anne looked outside at the children playing in the garden thicket it was Patrick Ann Gregory

and Gerard but Mary was not there so Anne asked the kids, hey, have you seen Mary? She went out to play a little while ago. And they said, no, we haven't seen her. So her brother, Jerry, Anne's brother, was fixing a stone wall nearby. And she shouted to him about Mary, but he couldn't really hear what she said. So immediately, Anne goes into full panic because Mary, like I said, was not the type to go off on her own. She liked to be around her mom, especially, and her family members. So she looks around the property for a few minutes, but can't find Mary anywhere.

She then gets up to closer to Jerry and says, hey, have you seen Mary? And he says, no, but he jumps in his car and speeds down the road. And Anne keeps looking. And then Mary's sister, who's probably, of course, startled by this, seeing her mom in such a frenzy, joins in to search for her sister, Mary. And Mary was so little, right?

I mean, she's six years old. The picture of her that the twins that they have is just sweet. And she has, like, little pigtails. I mean, she's tiny. and so now they're worried like what if she um got stuck somewhere like she couldn't have wandered too far off or like she's so little right what if she got fell into something and got stuck or broke her leg like we don't know so they're kind of uh in full panic mode and uh anne the little one six year old anne grew desperate and she makes me sad she asked her mom to light a candle and then she started shaking

holy water everywhere and blessing the ground and just shouting her sister's name over and over saying like maybe now she'll she'll shout back oh my gosh terribly sad um her father said to stop doing that or the neighbors would hear because he really didn't think it was like anything that urgent like he couldn't imagine in his mind anything terrible had happened but anne didn't care she just got louder she just kept trying to find her sister and meanwhile jerry and Anne's brother, the uncle, came back amidst this chaos, and he told everyone he'd seen Mary about half an hour ago. He said he'd borrowed a ladder from the next farm over. After dinner, he walked there to return it, and he saw Mary come outside and start following him. So the other house he was going to

was only about 400 yards across a field between their farms, but along the way there was this flooded portion of field, and Mary was like, oh, the water's too deep. I don't want to go through this puddle. So at 3.30 p.m. she turned around to walk home and he said that was the last he had seen her. Oh my God. This was a straight route back. It should have only taken a couple minutes and Jerry said he went on to the neighbors and stayed with them for about 30 minutes and then didn't see Mary again on his way home. So Anne, the mom, ran toward the direction of the neighbor's house and she ran to the nearby lock or lake where she saw fishermen on a boat. And I mean, imagine this like thinking, oh my God. she's in the water you know she's absolutely fallen in like i mean it would be i'd be so scared that

i would convince myself it was a gut feeling that it absolutely yeah yeah because like what else could have happened you looked everywhere else she sees fishermen on a boat they had heard them screaming mary's name but uh they didn't know what was going on so they see anne now she she waves to them asked if they've seen a little girl they say they have not and it was getting dark out like this is the worst possible timing it's getting dark it's getting cold and the farms there were covered in bogs, and this is like mountainous terrain. This is just like the last place you want to be out in the woods by yourself as a kid. So no one could call the police because there were no landlines around at this point.

I mean, they were around, but not in their home. So one of the fishermen, P.J. Coughlin, rushed to the police station. There were no phones, so Ann asked them to alert the police and tell them just to come straight there. So the police reached the farm at six, and that was about two hours after Mary was last seen. They immediately launched an urgent search for her, but the town where, like, this is just a kind of fun fact anecdote here, the town, the Bally Shannon Theater, which is the town where the police had come from, they were putting on a festival that day. And so somebody stood on stage and read a police report or read a police appeal, I'm sorry, to ask for volunteers to go somewhere. joined the search so they were able to get like a big search party going because one of the actors like read a or somebody went on the stage and read like an announcement about yeah yeah yeah

unfortunately though despite all the help mary was not recovered that night the next day the search was expanded and soldiers from a nearby military station called finner camp joined on the ground and in helicopters now they had hundreds of volunteers searching every barn cabin and empty hut in the area there were farmers who were clearing their own land to look the days passed and nobody found any sign of mary at all and of course at this point people are thinking well she probably hasn't made it especially if she you know is still out there somewhere yeah so the case quickly gained national attention um the mom said she just fell into such a a grief, a depression she could barely get out of bed.

At a press conference, she said the family had begun to suspect that Mary might have been abducted because of all this searching they were doing and no luck. But they continued to hope that she would be recovered somehow, right? Like they have to believe this. Somehow there's still hope for that. Initially, a kidnapping did seem unlikely. Like I said, this was an extremely rural area and the road itself was so remote that people thought, you know, why would this, it feels like just a fluke. Like, that's a freak thing.

And it wouldn't happen out there. And people would have, and if it did happen out there, people would have noticed a stranger's car, you know? Right. And by the way, what do we know nowadays about abductions? Don't get in the car? It's not, it's not all about stranger danger. It's actually most likely someone you know pretty well. But then, back then, it's like the 70s And they're like, oh, you know, abduction, like, why would somebody drive all the way out here to abduct a child without being seen? And it's like, that's not actually statistically how it was. There's probably somebody on the inside. Usually.

Especially if you never heard her screaming for help or anything. Not that, like, but it's likely that she knew the person so she didn't feel scared. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, either way, yeah, yeah. Either way, yeah, I don't want to spoil anything. But okay.

You're on the right track. Yes. So divers searched lakes near the farm, entire bogs were drained, team searched with scent dogs, Anne the sister was led to the very spot where her uncle said Mary had separated from him. A family member, this is so bizarre, a family member pretended they forgot something and sent Anne to go fetch it from her grandparents' house. And the goal was like to see how long it took a six-year-old to get back and like how like how how well she needed to know the terrain or the route to make it back, just these

couple hundred yards. I feel so bad for her that she was used in this way, because I'm sure that's like its own mental load, but how lucky that they, scientifically speaking, in the world of research, she looks exactly like her, so people know what to look for. And she, you could test out how long it would take her to go do something. And yeah, it's helpful. Yeah, it was, yeah, it was at least interesting. to see like, you know, if she got lost, then maybe they would have had the same mindset

and turned the wrong way down a path or something like that. But Anne made it quickly back to the house without any issue. And they were like, okay, so that's not quite the lead. Mary, who was missing, was also the more confident, practical one. So they were like, it just doesn't strike us that she would go off for some other reason or not know the way back. So the day Mary Vannis, she had been wearing a wool cardigan, her mother had knit for her and rain boots that were a little too big for her. She also had this ribbon in her hair that her mom had added to her hairstyle that morning.

And her sister Anne and her uncle Jerry both said she had been carrying a bag of potato chips when she was last seen. And her family believed that if they believe she may have been abducted, that they believe that if she hadn't been abducted, if she did fall into a bog hole, that something of hers would have been recovered. ribbon from her hair, like a thread of the cardigan being caught in a branch, you know, it just seems so strange that like, or a shoe falling off if you fell or got hurt. Sure, sure. It just feels unlikely that- Or like footprints in a bog, right? Anything, it sounds like a raffy, a raffy song. Footprints and a bog.

It's a polywag in a bog. Okay. Sorry. Yeah, so she has this cardigan knit by her mother. It just seemed strange that like nothing, like the boot, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, potato chips hadn't been found the abut hadn't been found like nothing nothing had been found not even with search dogs right like they didn't even find the fucking potato chips like that tells you something i actually was going to say that earlier and i didn't i didn't know i didn't want to make

too much light of that but i if i told hank to go find a bag of potato chips i mean i find it on saturn like if you're going to find a scent of a little girl you'd think the scent on the potato bag chip would be pretty distinct right or like it just yeah it just doesn't make sense they did searches for about a month with soldiers, police, volunteers, dogs, and nothing. Not a single shred of evidence they found. Their mom, Ann, said that going home without Mary was a shocking experience. Because remember, they were at their grandparents' house. They were at Anne's parents' house.

So they weren't even at home. So now they had to travel back home with just one daughter, with just one of the twins. I mean, that's just a nightmare. throughout the entire search and the kid's father charlie believed they would still find mary he really held hope for a long time um he couldn't speak about her he was just like very deeply traumatized you know and one of the things his wife said was we just there was no resource like you didn't have a therapist you didn't like what are you going to do you don't know how to talk about these things so like why would you it's just painful yeah um and i thought that was a fair point because

we look back going like somebody get these people help but it's like what help you know i mean even to this day like it's hard to find help so it's just really sad and and the sister of course is also going through her own version of a nightmare because she's like missing her sister and a part of herself essentially and she she said it was torture she became fearful she became really to her parents. She became afraid she would disappear. I mean, it's just terrible. Yeah, I can't imagine being a six child thinking,

she got taken. I can get taken too. Yeah, and like, where is she hurting? Like, where, it just all sense. Oh, my God. Just got a fucking delivery person. Oh, my God. Jesus old Pete.

Every time. Every time. Every time. I'm so sorry. As I'm talking about someone's going to take me and then a grown man was like right here. You're like, you're like manifesting. No, but I would be worried.

I mean, she was already, you've mentioned this already, but she was so scared of even leaving her mom's side. Like, imagine now. Like, there's nobody leaving her mom's side. I would tape myself for my mom. Well, the other sister was the one afraid of leaving her mom's side. Oh, really? Well, then this sister's probably like, I fucking get it now.

Yeah, exactly. She almost got, like, fearful because of it. Like, she hadn't really been in that headspace. And then her sister disappeared and she was like, shit. Like, she became as kind of... attached as her sister had been. Yeah. Understandably, yeah.

And this picture said, too, there's a picture of her at her first Holy Communion, and that was shortly after her sister's disappearance, so she had to go do that alone. The priest actually postponed the ceremony for as long as he could, hoping that her twin would be home in time, but eventually they just had to do the first communion. Charlie, the dad broke down in the chapel. This is like where he really had his first kind of, overwhelm breakdown um just seeing like his daughter go through this what was to them very important ritual and like stage of growing up that the other sister just had been like plucked out of

you know the scene but as years passed um and sort of started to feel like her sister was never coming home and she said that was really an adjustment because she told herself from little on that her sister would come back someday and perhaps on their 18th birthday for example perhaps on our 21st she'll finally show up you know just like all these potentials and after their 21st birthday passed and said okay I think like if she's not around for this birthday and like it's not happening couldn't find her way back then she's there's no way she's coming back I can't imagine holding out hope for that many years and just at some point having to just throw your hands up And it's so sad, too, exactly, because she said she remembered that day so vividly, the day that her sister disappeared.

And she said, she couldn't believe she was not the one to walk her to the neighbor's farm because she said, we were always together. Like, these few minutes, we weren't together. Like, and it just something terrible happened. So decades passed, police occasionally opened new inquiries. But again and again, you know, the family was crushed when nothing came from anything. Um, there were tips from all over the UK. There were tips from parts of Ireland. There were tips that, like, maybe she'd ended up in Scotland or, you know, just, and the family

followed through on all these leads. They would go to these places. They would, they would try every angle, but every lead ended up nowhere. So when Anne got older, the twin, Anne, um, she started to realize, like, when she was a kid and her sister had vanished and then she had to travel home from her grandparents. It seemed like her sister could be anywhere in the world, like out there in this vast place. But as she got older and kind of understood more of the world, she realized actually the place where she could have ended up is a lot smaller.

You know, the odds of her ending up somewhere like in Panama or like some random place in the world are much slimmer than where she probably, like the actual radius of where she probably ended up, especially if she had been killed. that day. And so she started to realize, like, maybe she was never lost at all. Maybe she was abducted. And a detective sergeant on Mary's case called Aidan Murray interviewed a man that he actually wanted to arrest. And he said, he claims that if he had gotten another hour with him, he would have gotten a guy to confess. But I don't know what that means. I don't know, like the context of that. I don't know how true that is. But either way, he believed this man was on the verge of

confessing to taking Mary, but he didn't have enough evidence to hold him. So they were forced to release him. And then this caused an extreme controversy later on down the line when rumors started spreading among detectives that a politician had called the police station and demanded to let this individual free and to not bother this individual. And Detective Murray heard these rumors, but he could never corroborate it or prove it. So basically with the with the kind of getting this guy, off the hook, rumor started that this is a cover-up, essentially, that somebody was brought in, and then a politician called the police said, you have to let this person go, don't question him anymore. And the police said, all righty, we'll cover it up. And that is the, that is the

controversy that, that's, was spawned by this. Someone's getting, we don't, we don't want to find out the secrets or we don't want the secret out or whatever it is. Yeah, yeah, we don't want this person to be involved, even though they were, you know. So a man named Robert Black was also considered a person of interest for a long time. He was a Scottish serial killer who kidnapped, raped and murdered multiple young girls in the UK. In the early 1980s, he spent time in Donegal. So many people believed he had kidnapped and killed Mary. And besides that, in a 1999 article, writer Bridget McLaughlin reported that in 1978, Robert Black was at a pub in Donegal and overheard a woman talking about Mary's disappearance, and he asked them to show him the family's house. This is the story in the

article. Okay. The serial killer was apparently in a pub and said, can you guys show me Mary's house? And he specifically asked to see Mary's twin sister in where she lived. Okay. And so this woman was like what the fuck dude and assuming he just had like some macabre fascination with i would assume that yeah this dark story um she just refused and was like what the hell and apparently he got like enraged like he was pissed off and this is like something he really wanted to do back the fuck up dude yep and so that was alarming um despite robert black's crimes against children and his presence in donigal around the same years that the boys lived there

and his fucking weird ass. Weird interest in this. He's like, I want to see the site again where I did this or whatever. Or where someone did this even. You know, it's just bizarre.

Although that's not even the site because they lived in Donegal but the crime happened in a different part of the country because they were traveling to see the grandparents. So this would have just been like where she lived like as a kid

which is just fucking... So weird. So in any case, he was just a creeper either way. And despite his crimes against children and his presence in, like, he could, because he was such a sicko, like he could have really had a fascination and wanted to see the twin sister, you know, and like, who knows? What the fuck? And is he, he's talking to her?

Like to this. No, no. He's talking to, apparently it was, he overheard somebody. in the pub talking about Mary's death and said, can you show me where her house is? I want to see her twin sister. Because I could, I mean, I'm not trying to make total defenses for this guy, but as

two people who have a morbid show and people who listen, I'm sure have a morbid fascination, like, and we literally wrote books about all the morbid places you can go. Like, I'm, I could see him just taking it way too fucking far. But also, he had murdered several children, so it's like... Oh, yes, I forgot about that.

He's a serial killer. So it's also like, never mind, that on top of that. You're right. I see it corrected. I'm corrected. That was, never mind. I totally forgot about that for a second. I was like, when do I cut in?

You did a great job cutting. Sorry, I didn't cut in the suit. No, probably. But, okay, that aside, if we weren't thinking about that, I could see someone being like, can I see it? Like, I know it's fucked up, but can I see it? Yeah. But you're totally right.

And it's also the fact that, like, they were like, no. And he got pissed off. It's like, okay, you're being a fucking weirdo creep. And also, it had happened like a year earlier. It wasn't like, this is like decades old or something. And it was like a historic site. Like the little girl still lived there, you know? Like I don't think any of our listeners or like us, which I feel like decades later maybe

or like years later, but not like where does the sister live now? I want to see her. Yeah, I want to look in the window. Yeah, something fucking creepy. Also, you know what? Even if he didn't take the first one, he might think I'll get the second. Well, that's, yeah. that's kind of what I was trying to hint at it like even if he wasn't involved he probably

had some nefarious fucking idea in his head or oh i see yeah no at first i was just thinking he just wants to see it to like weirdly feel like the energy of the space or something but or he wants to get involved i don't know yeah um but either way thank god she was like hell no and uh despite all this investigators did eventually determine he was not in the area the day Mary disappeared and he was dismissed as a person of interest. Then in 2014, a 64-year-old man was arrested as a suspect in Mary's disappearance. Anne actually knew the man as a child. She was a few years older than him.

He was a soldier at Finner Camp when Mary disappeared. And at the time of his arrest, he had been previously convicted of child sexual abuse charges. Detectives were hopeful that the arrest would lead to discovering what happened to Mary, maybe even leading to her remains but the suspect was released soon afterward with no new answers and just more pain for the family who had their hopes up again.

Sure. For several years, Anne and Anne and senior and junior. Sorry, I want to I know this has nothing to do anything but it's in my brain now and I just kind of want to word vomit. So you were saying why would they just pick Mary when they got an Ann and an Ann?

Isn't the dad Jerry? No, the uncle. Oh, fuck. I was going to say, well, one got a rhyme. No, Charlie. Okay, I'm back to not understanding. I know. Well, Charlie, Patrick, and Mary are all very Irish names, I feel. Sure.

It feels like maybe they were just family names. Sorry, I did not mean to take us out of the... No, no, no. I mean, it's a fair... I was hoping somebody would solve the mystery, but... Not me. By the way, I meant I'm not solving it. Not, I don't hope it's solved.

We are really... How many feet can we put in our mouths? Jesus Christ. I already swung one across the screen earlier. This is a mess. Don't worry, I'm here to remind you. Okay, so for several years, the mom, Anne, and Mary's sister, Anne were not on speaking terms, which is pretty devastating, but you can imagine this would have had, like, quite a dramatic effect on the dynamics of the family. The sister, Anne, with the support of her cousin Margot, had remained a staunch advocate for her sister.

she would lead protests and marches demanding more reviews of Mary's case and in 2013 she filed a complaint against the police for potentially ruining a dig for Mary's remains an investigative report on Mary's disappearance claim that just days after Mary vanished a witness reported

a site where hair and clothes appeared to be protruding from a fresh mound of dirt. Oh God according to the report the police never investigated the site and so Anne fucking freaked out and was Yeah. You had a fucking lead and didn't do anything?

The reporter worked with Scantec Geoscience to survey the location and they reportedly detected a possible burial at the site. And when this was published in 2013, the police agreed to excavate the site to search for possible remains. They did this, they needed to do a very painstaking and meticulous excavation because forensic dig protocols are such that like after decades and decades of someone being dead that this could be a very fragile they needed to do a very like painstaking meticulous dig to make sure they didn't damage any evidence that kind of thing sure instead the police used heavy machinery and just like fucking blasted through the ground and destroyed any possible evidence of mary so

so ann launched an official complaint and an investigation was open to review the excavation. She also requested a coroner's inquest to declare Mary officially deceased, which normally would be unusual without a body, but not unheard of. It was like so, but this time's so obvious, it's like, hello, she's, it's over. Like, let's do something about it. And Anne, the mom, though, had to approve the coroner inquest, and she refused. And so that's where this, this rift kind of.

Gotcha. I mean, I get it. It's like, she's like, I just want to, there's still hope. Maybe she's out there. I don't know. So, yeah, her husband, Mary's father, had actually died in 2005 in a fishing accident. And Anne said Charlie never wanted this inquest done because he just had maintained hope that she was alive for so long. That when he died, like, accidentally and, like, unexpectedly, she felt this urge to, like, carry this on.

And she felt like she couldn't sign it because she knew her husband wouldn't have wanted it. So, Anne, the sister says in interviews now that she is confident, actually, that she knows the identity of Mary's killer. And she believes that Mary was dead by the end of the day on March 18th, 1977. Okay. She believes, and this is her identical twin sister. So you guys fucking tell me what you think. Twins weigh in. I mean, twins weigh in.

There you go. she believes that Mary was the victim of sexual abuse and that she was murdered because the abuser believed she was going to report him. Okay. Other families have directly accused Mary's uncle Jerry of murdering Mary that day in 1977. Does Anne think those too? Oh, yeah.

Oh. In 2023, Jerry died, and Anne spoke to a reporter at the Sunday Independent saying she hoped that this death might lead to some answers. She said, I just hope that maybe there are others who might have been told something who might now speak out after the death of my uncle. Sure. Anne had said in multiple interviews, she's not looking for justice or an arrest. She said, all we want is to find where my sister was left to give her some dignity and lay her to rest with a decent burial.

Somewhere we can go visit. Everyone deserves that to have a grave. Anne says she's just been tortured by this mystery and not having answers. and she hopes someone will make an anonymous report that they can just finally end her misery and find her sister's body. The controversies have continued to cause rifts among Mary's family and people who investigate the case.

There were even lawsuits raised against documentary filmmakers. Politicians have been accused of interfering and they have vehemently denied any involvement. And the mom has received letters with accusations of people who think she had something to do with her daughter's murder and it's just really a painful thing for everybody in the family to keep reliving she often thinks back to the day she lost her daughter before dinner mary ran to her and said mom i forgot to kiss you this morning and she wrapped her arms around her and gave her a kiss

on the face and she says that's what she thinks of i know i know yeah so it's been 48 years as of this recording i believe so uh and we're in 2025 they all just hope to find answers someday. I mean, the sister, Anne said, in my head, I'm always talking to Mary. And if I'm in trouble, I'm asking her for help. I always believe that she's looking out for me. So, yeah, anything, anybody has an inkling or any idea, even if it seems insignificant, they ask you to contact the authorities. Mary Boyle's disappearance remains the longest open missing child case in Ireland. And if you want more information, you can go to Facebook.com slash justice. for Mary Boyle.

Wow. And yeah, so happy Halloween. Life is scary. And that's why we drink. Hey! Good story, although mad there's no result, but I guess. I know, I know.

I hope. I can only hope. So he died in 2023, so maybe. It still sounds like it's kind of actively ongoing. Yeah. Things are still getting movement, I guess. So the fact that, like, like multiple people think Jerry was sexually abusing her to begin with is already just yeah and the fact

that he said okay remember at the beginning which i meant to harp on later i'll harp on it now when uh anne told her brother like oh have you seen him and he's like i can't hear you and then she went up to him again and said have you seen her and then he said no and jumped in his car and drove away yeah like he like didn't want to even be on well they thought like maybe he's looking for her or something but then he came back and he said oh the last time i saw her was half an hour ago when i was walking to the neighbor's house and like why wouldn't you say that when she said have you seen her i saw her half hour ago she was following me to the other house maybe she's over there you know like maybe that was true and he saw her half an hour ago and that's when he snatched her up that's exactly it's just a

weird way to like drive away and then not tell them until you come back later and say oh i did see her earlier it's just weird anyway i would be there's no way to know this now because it sounds like there was any documentation of it but i'd be curious to see if he if everyone was so freaked out about her missing that they maybe overlooked any details of like how he looked like did he look disheveled or dirty or bloody or did he just kind of house her somewhere until later right and back then like there was no understanding of DNA evidence so it's sort of like there wasn't much nothing infuriates me more than what we don't know will be great evidence in the future because I'm like what are we just totally discarding that we I know it's like

that John Mullaney bit of like oh a bunch of blood yuck wipe it up like yeah yeah yeah it's like what the hell are we just like a bunch of blood yuck it's like now back to my hunch um that's such a good line yeah it's exactly that it's like how are you supposed to know what you don't know and then um yeah to have just all these like to have a clue like oh there was a hint of fabric coming out of some fresh dirt and then the police are like oops we smashed it like what the fuck

I mean were people like fired for that like was there there had to be they said that they were doing an inquest into it or doing a doing an investigation into the excavation which whatever that means but like again

imagine if there if there was some cover up if there was involvement then like why would in what it does not behoove them to get involved but also that's just a rumor so you know who knows wow well good job christine and would you like to end on a highlight and describe to everybody what's going on with your shirt here oh yes leona made me this well we made tie-dye recently and it was really messy i mean like obviously it was really

messy but it was so much messier than i thought because i really did prepare i put like trash bags over the outside tables we did it on the porch i put on aprons is it because she's a kid is that what makes it messy like i think it's because of me and because she's like me and so it's like yes it's like we can both be as careful as we can and then one of us will elbow an open bottle of tie-dye and it'll just stay in the porch well i i hope that didn't sound like i was accusing no you're a hundred percent right to ask because i was just in philly a week or ago now, I guess. And my, one of our friends that I was hanging out with, she was like, oh, we should all carve pumpkins together. And I was prepared, like, I wore like a shirt that I was down to get

messy and like, because I remember just being disgusting, like just like a, oh, it's gnarly. Slimy, nasty party. And I remember just always being so gross. But I also haven't done since I was a kid. And then all of a sudden, it was just four 30 year olds in a room. And I was like, is this like weirdly clean and like not a problem for anybody? Like we, I just would scoop it out. and put it in the bowl and scoop it out and put it in the bowl you know i'm still like doing this right with the strings we did the thing where we put like trash bags out and like we were like we didn't even need these trash like it was just totally clean and fine and within like 15 minutes we had done all the gross scooping and then we were just like carving and it wasn't even like little bits

of pumpkin everywhere like we carved like big pieces and then just put them in the trash and i was like has it always been this easy we were just children and that's why it was so messy i just couldn't No, I've done it recently, and it was still as messy, so I think it's just the mess is in the eye of the pumpkin holder, you know. That's beautiful. Thank you. It's kind of like that one time we had a conversation where you were like, how do you wash your face without water, like running down your elbows? And I was like. And then like literally we started some sort of culture war within our own community.

People to this day are like, do you still not know how to wash your face? And I'm like, God. And you're like, yes. I don't know. I have no fucking clue. No, I bought those wrist things. that everyone told me about um i think i honestly i think it's the placement of the hands like i think it's just like or how where which do you bring your hands to your face or your face to your hands

so if you bring your face to your flat hands then it doesn't happen but if you bring your wet hands and i've tried everything i don't believe you i want to see you can watch i told you i'm gonna show you because i feel like because it does happen to me if i like if i'm washing my hands and i'm going to wash my face and then i do this yeah water rolls down but if i keep my hands here and I bring my face to it. You can't just keep going down. That's exactly like my, that sounds painful.

No, like you bend your face into the sink where your hands are. Like, but like the whole time I'm washing my face and stuff. Yeah. Oh, you like do this whole situation.

Well yeah, because I have to get makeup off and like, you know, all that shit. And then it's like you, and then there's just like black mascara. Then you have to like wash more of it. It's just male slash mask privilege that we don't have to do with that.

Oh yeah. I feel like if it were just a one and done, I could just like go. Because I'll ever do is I. slap some soap on and I just go to do to do and then like five seconds that my face is clean yeah I wouldn't know about that yeah I think it's just being a woman society sucks I think it's yeah it's pain yeah it's pain thank you I said that recently and I kept saying pain is beauty my brother's like my brother was like I don't think that's how

that goes are you a tortured artist are you that's what he says like you sound like fucking sadomasica so it's like I don't know anymore um but yeah so that's all I've got for you but yes Oh, yeah, this is my tie. But, like, for how messy it was, it looks very minimal. It looks great. It looks great. But she did, like, she has Blaze in her where she's like, I'll pick three colors for each person's shirt. And I'm like, let's do all the colors on all the shirts. And she's like, no, because then it turns brown.

Is there a reason she picked green orange and I guess red? Purple, I think. Oh, she, oh, did Blaze get the complimentary or the primary colors? He got the secondary colors? The two of them got the best colors. What did they get? I don't know, but she decided they were the best ones in. And she said, and mom, you can have the ugly.

Yeah, you can have the remaining. Talk about being a mom, the thankless job. Here's your ugly fucking shirt. Yeah. Honestly, here it is. And I was like, well, now I have to clean ink off of my hands for the next week of my life. But like those gloves are so uncomfortable. They suck.

And your hands get like weird and hot. By the way, it was like July. So like mosquito. I mean, it was just so rough. I was like, I think Leona, I felt thankful that I got it out of my, out of her system. sure and my system it's never left my system to this day if I get bored I want to tie-dye something I know

and you are much more equipped for something like this if you can do a pumpkin without like creating a serious problem I'd throw my pants away like it was bad and she had a brand new shirt on and she was wearing an apron but I had to like throw out her clothes they were just completely destroyed I really

think it was just that I was the only I don't know I maybe I was just on my best behavior because I was with a bunch of type A people but like We literally all just scooped it out. What design did you make? I made a polka ball. Cute. Did you buy one?

Like a printout? No, I just saw a picture. It was kind of. Nice. But the one of us like volunteered like, oh, once we put all of the scoops, all the bush into a bowl, I'm going to, I already finished my pumpkin, so I'm just going to pick out all the seeds.

And then while we were carving, she like roasted the seeds and baths when we worked out. All the seeds were done and everything was clean. And I was like, I was like, are we in a, like, better home and gardens magazine seriously you are you're the cover of it it was going way too well like holy shit those Halloween parties they put on magazines they're like easy easy crafts and it's like fuck my life and i never occurred to me to roast the pumpkins first of all i don't like pumpkin but second of all it's like that feels like its own whole ass half but she did it in like five seconds right because they're already like kind of wet so you just like put like salt on them and stick

them right in the oven i was like how did how did everything happen so efficiently I was like within a simmer pot going yeah within an and like cider and I was like within an hour everything had been prepped done and cleaned and I'm like this feels impossible I could never do this on my own it's type A people are incredible I there are props to all of you because we're just over here making up ideas like what we talked about in the intermission Allison is very type A and she was currently doing a project for us that's very type A and requires me to just pat around the back and say thank you for helping for doing all this because I certainly can't. I live in a house with Zero type A, people accept Leona. So I'm counting down the day still she turns like 14 or something can answer the phone or do something useful for me. Well, I was telling you, Alison, I was like, I feel like sometimes I'm just like the heart planeteer on Captain Planet's team because it's like you're doing like really hard important things that require hours of like brain power. And sometimes I'm like, I'll help too. and everyone's like, oh, you could tell a joke and keep me entertained while this goes on.

Yeah, you keep the keep the tea coming. I'm just like I, I know I joke about being a personality hire, but sometimes when I realize what she's capable of and my brain could never do, I'm like, I really am just here to make you laugh while you work. Yeah, but like you work because, you know, I mean, it's... We balance each other out very well. Yeah, yeah. It was one of those things where I was like, I feel really guilty I'm not contributing, but I also

So it would be better for everybody if I leave it in your hands and just tell you how great you are. That's as good as we're going to get. Anyway, wow, look, Alison, I compliment you twice in this episode. You're so lucky. Wow, good for you. Now your turn. Your turn twice. Thank you.

Love you. And that's why we drink. I love you too, out, pal.