And That's Why We Drink - E465 Non-Parallel Traumas and Neighborhood App Ghosts

Episode Date: January 11, 2026

One Flurida adventure and several new years eve pooch smooches later we’ve made it to 2026! This week Em kicks off Episode 465 with a double Mary feature, covering two paranormal Mary E. Harts, a.k.a. Midnight Mary and Noontime Mary. Then Christine covers Part 1 of a missing persons case that just passed it’s 51st anniversary, the Fort Worth Trio. And who’s joining us with our new moto for 2026 of embracing change?! …and that’s why we drink! Photo Links:Fred Watkyns PhotoFort Worth Trio: Mary Rachel Trlica, Lisa Renee Wilson, Julie Ann MoseleyThe Letter Catch our bonus Yappy Hour intermissions on Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3L28lDw or subscribe on Patreon: http://patreon.com/ATWWDPodcast!___________________Get 40% off your first box plus a free item in every box for life at https://hungryroot.com/DRINK with code DRINK. For 50% off your order, head to https://DailyLook.com and use code DRINK Stop putting off those doctor appointments and go to https://zocdoc.com/DRINK to find and instantly book a top-rated doctor today. If you think you or someone you know might be struggling with OCD, please don't wait to get help—book a free call with the NOCD team to learn more: https://learn.nocd.com/ATTWD Save 20% off Honeylove by going to https://honeylove.com/DRINK ! #honeylovepod #ad Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Please support our show and tell them that we sent you. Experience the new standard in comfort and support with, Honey, Love. My first drink of the year open. Did you hear that sound at all? Hang on, I have a backup. Sounded good. Hang on.

Hang on. Oh, this is going to be good. That wasn't good either. It feels like every ghost hut where you and I get the perfect thing, but then we're talking over it the whole time. Hold on. Let me try again. This can't be it.

And it's like, why do we continue? Yeah, we are terrible at Foley, okay? But that's okay. It sounded great, M. Thanks. And the spirit, yeah. yeah what is your drink because i thought you were cracking open a cold one over there like a can but then i realized it's a it's a it's a it's a it's a cup like a one of those stupid lids where

you know you can bend it backwards and that it technically covers it but once you've opened it the flimsy plastic yeah um i just got my i just got a little black tea situation but um i i i just know by looking at that they forgot to put the flavor in but that's okay um anyway that's what i'm drinking and i apparently i have two because you know i got a gull one I got a sip one. Yeah, and you hate yourself. Now you have two drinks you don't want. So perfect. I have the flavoring. So I'll just add her in later. Oh, that's right. You do. I forgot. Yeah, yeah. Well, you can go do that if you want. I'm drinking my, um, refrigerated iced coffee out of a bottle. So interesting. Do you put it in one bottle to put it in another bottle? Well, it's like in a big bottle,

you know, and then you pour it into a glass. Yeah. But that would be wild if I were just like, aesthetically, this cup isn't for me, you know. Some people do that. I've seen you put just like water bottle water into like a oh i've seen a tic-tok and i'm like what's happening um but yeah no i'm just too lazy to do anything but buy it from the grocery store so here we are here we are well it uh was recently new years as this week it was new year's when when people hear this it'll i don't i don't know anymore but for us it's recently new years do you have any resolutions Jesus. Survive.

It's a good one. Yeah. Actually, my resolution for this year is, I wrote it down. I have that app insight timer, and it's really nice because every day you can set an intention for the day. And it, like, when you, and it's like a little widgets, so when you open your phone, you, like, kind of glance at it. And it feels like, oh, you're, like, reminding yourself. So usually I put, like, you know, trust myself or, like, be still or whatever, be mindful. And the one I did, sometimes they get a little wacko, but the one I did for next year is in 2026, I will embrace change.

So I'm trying to just be less resistant to change because I've learned a 2025 that the world likes to pull the rug out from underneath this a lot of times. I mean, not that I learned that this year, last year. I knew that. But, you know, I've really, really learned it this past year. And so I was like, you know what? I'm just going to go with the flow and try my best to embrace everything from everything I can't control, you know. Nice. Did you actually stay up for New Year's this year?

Accidentally. Oh, okay. I went to a friend's house for board game night with my brother, and I was like, I need to get home before midnight. I'm, like, so tired. Blaze has been sick for 40 years, and I've been watching Leona nonstop. And today, as we record, this is the first day she's in. school in almost a month. Not really. It's like three weeks. And again, it feels like 40 years. But I went to that game night. And then I, my brother dropped me off at home afterward. And we looked

at the clock and I was like, oh, it's 1159. Like we just weren't paying attention. And we were like, okay, happy New Year, good night. And I went inside. And then I took a picture with Gio and he was waiting for me. So we took a little midnight kiss. We took a little midnight kiss selfie. Precious. Yeah. So, but did you? Did you party? Do you have a resolution? Are you jazzed or are you just kind of like downtrodden like the rest of us? I have learned not to say anything about what I think brings. I know. We learned that the hard way.

No, I was invited to a party and I ended up not going because when I was with Allison's family, everyone got the stomach flu. Everybody is sick this year or this past month. It's really bananas. I think it was neurovirus. I don't like know for sure, but it felt like neurovirus. Did you get it or no? Oh, yeah. Yeah, I got really bad. Oh, shit.

But so I was in the clear and I felt fine on New Year's, but I didn't know if I was contagious or not, so I just stayed home. But that means the Hankies was my midnight kiss. Oh, my God, we both had our doggies. Because Blaze was sick, and so he couldn't go anywhere. Oh, that's sweet. But so, yeah, that was nice.

That feels like the exact turning point in 22. We're just like, okay, we're just with our dogs now. Yeah. Just alone with our dog. As long as we got the dog, we're good. Yeah. So that was my new year's. And then, I mean, it was probably the most boring New Year's I've ever had, but it was fine.

I guess it wasn't the most boring. There was a year after Leoner was born that I was like, Leapley and I were in bed watching like severance or something. We were like, we fell asleep at like 10.30. So that was probably the most boring. This one was not quite as boring, but it was a very low key, you know. Nice. But also then I keep thinking, well, you know, they say like the year of the snake and the horse,

but like Chinese New Year isn't until February. So it's like, we still got a month to go, baby, till like the actual, like, you know, lunar, you know, until we're actually in the near. I know, I know. And so I'm still, I feel like I'm still buckled in just in case. Okay. Yeah, the airbag is still ready to be deployed just in case. I think being an American in what was 2025, I'll never know how to take the buckle off at this point.

Oh my God, I know. I think embrace change is a very good resolution if you're trying to just hold on fucking tight. That's kind of what it is. It's like I have to ride this out. Otherwise, I'm just going to crash, you know, like I got to just accept it because I've realized I can't force it to be the way I want. Oh, my gosh. Well, other than that, I don't know. I feel like I've, I have nothing to...

Do you have a reason to drink besides your boring new year? No. No, I... Well, I mean, I could certainly conjure one up. I mean, neural virus sounds like a good one already, but it sounds like you might have other options. It kicked my ass. And I got it on my flight home. And so I ended up staying in my layover for like three days just to... Can I ask what city you defiled in that time period? Well, it was Florida.

Never mind. They were fine. Fluurida. Flurida, always with fluurda. Jesus. No, I was in, I had a layover in Miami, and I was like, I'm not getting on the next plane. There's just no way. Yeah. Yeah. So I just turned around and went to a hotel and then didn't resurface for a while. But it was bad.

Anyway, that's all there is to say about it. It's like we just can't stop getting our asses kicked to this. Like, always, you know. I'm impressed with you. You haven't gotten sick. Doe. Knock on wood. Yeah, it's been a doozy of a... I don't think we would have survived because my mom was...

It's been... Listen, I... If we're asking why I drink, which I feel that maybe that's a loaded question. It was my next question, so... Oh, thank you. Okay, so I didn't want to put you on spot

and force you to ask me because it's quite... Never done it before. I got to... No, you know, I know it's... You're new to this. I'm not... I probably won't get into it.

I... It's been a traumatic couple weeks, like very traumatic. And then Blaze got very sick. and then he was like in the middle of the night he called me at 4 a.m. and he was like, I think I need to call, I think you need to call an ambulance. And I was like, Blaze worked in an ER for years in downtown L.A. He does not say things lightly, you know, especially when it comes to medical stuff.

He was having like, he was like, I'm going to die. Like he's like, my reptilian brain is like screaming. I'm going to die. And he had this flu, this super flu or whatever for almost, it was over three weeks. And we didn't see it for like weeks. And I was home with Leona alone because my mom and Tim went to Germany for three weeks. And so I was just kind of here with Leona. And I'll get into it another day.

But let's just say I was going through it medically as well and had some traumatic events occurred during this time, had to have surgery. And then Blazo still like completely incapacitated for weeks. And then he started going like kind of mentally crazy because he's, been up here for three weeks with like no access to the outside world. He's like Christmas, everything. I was like solo Santa for and I had to build a bunch of furniture and a trampoline. Oh my God. It's been like one of those like months where last night I started like just shaking and I was like, please, I don't know what's happening. And then I realized like, oh, I was having like that trauma released like after adrenaline crash. And I was like, oh, because Blaze is finally like here.

School starts today. Yeah. I can take a shower finally. Anyway. It's just been a doozy and I don't want to, you know, harp on it too much and I don't want to bomb anyone out. But yeah, it's been, it's, oh, and then I posted online about how it's been a really tough season and then Blaze texted me like half dead. And he's like, it looks like we're getting divorced in your post. And I went, no, it does. Oh, shit. And I looked at it and I, my brother was over and I was like, does it look like we're getting divorced. My brother goes, oh, yeah, kind of does.

And I was like, oh, no. so then I had to be like, hey, no, it's other stuff. It's not, we're not getting divorced, I swear. We're just both absolutely suffering. We're just at the worst possible. We're both like in and out of hospitals. And this four year old is just like running our lives, which is, you know, wonderful in some instances, not so much when you're at your physical. Wits end, exactly.

So anyway, it's been a very traumatic month. So I'm trying to, I'm trying to just like. embrace change you know just go at the flow so i got my ice coffee i'm just like fuck it let's do it well i won't even try to go after that because i i yeah i don't know i i feel for you listen the only thing that could have been worse is if i were stuck in miami so the only thing that could have been worse is if you also got whatever blaze got yeah well that's true then i would have probably been in really big trouble. No, my, I mean, my stomach thing was just, for me, it was like rough because I, like,

I am such a baby when it comes to stomach stuff, as I've mentioned before. So that, it was not a good few days. I also did not feel like I was mentally here. I think I just attached. But it's nothing compared to everything you just said. I was just throwing up and it went away. Hey, listen, some weeks I'm throwing up, some weeks you're throwing up, it's, it's, little. Life is a fucking roller coaster, you know?

Our traumas can't be parallel, you know, all the time. I will say, I've told you my throw-up trick, right? No. Have you? I don't know. Well, in case I... My thing that I try to do if I'm ever going to throw up is it's so stupid. Tell me.

I need to know right now. To anybody nearby, it sounds so much worse. But I scream when I'm throwing up. Oh, that's right. I do know that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because it like closes your nasal passages, so no throat comes out of your nose. And I'm a big nose throw-upper.

I know. That hurts. That hurts. So if you scream, it like blocks your nose. So I was just screaming my lungs out in this hotel. Like, people must have thought I was dying. I don't know. I can't even call 911.

And here's the thing, though, that has always worked. And whatever was going on with this situation, that screaming did not help. It was bad. Don't fail me now. Scream trick. That was a skis. part of it all when all of a sudden my tactic wasn't working and that I was like, no, I'm just a victim. Oh, no.

Anyway, so that's why I drink because for once I couldn't trust my own technique. It's okay. Lesson learned. First lesson of the year. Are you better now? You seem better. You seem more lively. Okay, good. Good. But I was lucky. Some people in the family were hospitalized for it. It was a bad situation. Um, anyway, that was the first time I'd seen Allison in a little bit. Aw.

Just throwing up. And screaming. No, she surprised me. She came to L.A. like a week before, um, which was nice. Although she ruined the whole surprise of me doing the whole house. Yeah, you can't surprise each other. That's just never going to work. Because you've always got a surprise in store, you know. I told her, I was like, it's been almost a decade else.

And you have to assume that if you're gone for a long career, of time. I'm up to something. Yeah, you can't just arrive. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There is hungry root at my doorstep right now and I just texted blaze. Bring it in. Bring it in. Bring the bells. It's here. I'm very excited. They plan all our groceries for the week. Well, all are, mine and my husbands and my daughters. They fill our cart and they deliver everything that we need to eat healthy and feel good about getting in our meals every day. We're all three notorious for forgetting to eat or like eating really weird times. And I feel like since we've gotten hungry root, it's like, oh, there's just some granola available or like there was a breakfast breeder

available. Like they just send things where they're like, yeah, we know you're going to forget breakfast a few days a week. So, you know, we'll deal with that. And it's just like really pretty magical. Yeah. And unlike other food delivery companies, Hungry Root has over a thousand grocery items, like smoothie, sweets, kids, snacks, salad kits, ready to eat meals and supplements to from each week. I mean, that just goes to prove that they know someone's going to forget, like Christine and her family. Yeah. Every now and then, you're just going to need someone to kind of go knock, knock, knock, knock. Here's some food. You need it. Yeah, here's breakfast. And I'm like, thank you. It's really nice. You're going to love Hungry Route as much as I do for a limited time. Get 40% off your first

box. Plus get a free item in every box for life. Go to Hungarroot.com slash drink and use code drink. That's Hungryroot.com slash drink. Code drink to get 40% off your first box and a free item of your choice for life. You may never know it because we're both wearing tie-dye, but M&I have upped our fashion game ever since we discovered Daily Look. They sent me a little cardigan with horseshoes all over it. I'm like, hey, as a Kentucky girl now, I can pretend to be like the horse girl I always wanted to be. Lucky in Kentucky. It's like they knew it.

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her box in the comfort of your home so you don't have to go to the store and get somebody face to face who's going to like try and talk you into and out of certain things. You know, whether you want something like just for day-to-day work stuff or you need like new athleisure, whatever you're looking for. They'll get it to you. It's time to get your own personal stylist with Dailylook.com. Head to Dailylook.com to take your style quiz and use code drink for 50% off your first order. Once again, that's Dailylook.com for 50% off. Make sure you use our promo code drink. One last time, Dailylook.com, promo code drink. I have a story for you.

Yay. And I actually have two stories for you. Yay! Well, I got confused in my research and I was like... That doesn't sound like you. Mm-mm. And I was like, this lady sounds like she's lived a lot of lives. And then I found out that they're two different women.

Oh. I don't know, because after that Jane Adams episode, and I realized afterward when I read the comments, like, oh, I definitely learned about this woman because I took sociology and some, what did she? She was like the founder of basically. Like social work. Social work, yes.

And so during like some of my courses, we'd kind of touch on social work. And I feel like I learned about her then. But yeah, she lived some fucking lives. So you never know. But okay, so this is two people. This is two people. But they both, tell me you wouldn't also be confused

because I typed in, after I knew the name, I would type in like, ghost story and then her name. And both of these people came up. I typed in ghost story, Mary E. Hart. And there's two of them. There's two Mary E. Hearts that have paranormal newsworthy stories. Is it H-A-R-T spelled the same? H-A-R-T, both of them.

And Mary is M-A-R-Y-E-H-A-R-T. I was like, well, I have every right to be confused. So you have, this is the story of Mary E-Hart and the story of Mary E-Hart. Okay. Although one of them is known as Midnight Mary. Oh, and one of them is not. not. Noontime Mary. So the first Mary Ehart

we're going to talk about all the information I got was from one article called American Ghost Walks. It was a very good article, but it was also what confused the hell out of me during my research because I was like, I did not find this anywhere else. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Totally different person. So this is

in the early 1900s in Gnome, Alaska. Oh, okay. I don't think we've ever, have we ever done a story out of Nome Alaska that's so specific. I don't think so. Alaska's a rare one. Yeah. I remember I did the Red Onion Saloon. The Red Onion Saloon, I remember. And I think somebody mailed a T-shirt that I still have from there. And then also Israel Keys. So good track record for Alaska, you know? Oh yeah. Yeah. It's rare but heavy every time. Yeah, apparently. Well, so in Noma, Alaska in the early 1900s, Mary E. Hart, she was actually, it's very funny that you mentioned Jane

She was also very Jane Adams coded. She was huge in the community. She was big in local politics. She was a suffragist. She was a founder of many women's clubs. She was a journalist. She was a gold miner. Literally, I mean, they could be buddies.

I love this. She also was the commissioner for any Alaskan exhibits at like world fairs and expos. Oh, so she's just like the foremost expert. Like the, she's like when you have an expert witness at a trial and you're like, Just call her in. She's essentially Miss Alaska. Love her.

So since she was a journalist, that's the thing you have to know the most about her. She was, you know, bopping around being a reporter, blah, blah, blah. But one day, Mary decides to leave Nome and never return because she was being haunted by a ghost named Fred. What? Apparently for years she was being haunted by a ghost. I would not have expected where this was going. I thought she would become a ghost, you know. Yeah, you, of course.

That makes total sense. So, okay, in 1902, Mary was a reporter at Alaska's very first execution by hanging. And they're like, oh, yeah, lady, you want to be a reporter? Step on up and watch this hanging. She's like, don't mind if I do. Yeah, exactly. You can't scare me. I've never been better ready for an editorial.

Or I don't know, what they call it? Newsflash, news flash. Newsflash. Read all about it. So, okay, it's the Alaska's first execution by hanging and it is the first, there's a quote, the first under legal judicial authority. The first under legal, does that mean like she was allowed, I think, was it, I mean, oh. I don't know. Oh, so the first like official hanging by like judicial proceedings rather than like just a lynch mob or something. Just people taking it into their own hands. Yeah. Oh, I see.

Yeah, the first of fish. So before his execution, this guy named Fred, he was known as Fred Watkins, but he was also known by Fred Hardy. Just fun fact. Okay. But before his execution, he was with Mary, because I guess she was interviewing him, and she asked, or he started asking her about death and what she thinks is going to happen to him. Does she think he's going to come back as a spirit? and this is apparently a quote from Fred. He said,

do you think the dead can make themselves manifest to the living? I do, and I shall return to you and tell you about death and tell you about the beyond if I'm welcome. Why? Just because she's interviewing him? Yeah, I guess. Like, well, maybe it's the last person

he's ever going to talk to, so maybe he's desperate. I don't know. So not knowing what to say because Mary's just been asked to be haunted. She said, sure, Fred, whatever you want. But she apparently had an immediate,

bad feeling about saying that. Yeah, that sucks. She just got like cornered into agreeing to that, I feel. Yeah. And if ghosts are real, you're talking to someone who's about to be a ghost in like 20 minutes. Like that's, it's an immediate invitation it feels like. Like by nightfall, he'll be at your house, you know? He's like, I know I'm in handcuffs now, but by tonight I'll be in your bedroom. And it's like, well, hello. That feels like bad vibes on every front. Yeah. Yeah. No, thank you. So she immediately regretted it. And once he died, she was still the reporter of the day she had to take photos of him in his coffin to, I guess, prove that he had passed. And although she was alone in the room, there is a picture of Fred and his coffin, an older man, quote, standing next to Fred's

coffin and fading through the wall. Ew. He's like, I'm here. Yeah. So part of me is like, is it Fred? Was it like somebody else coming to, like, greet him? Was it like his grim reaper of sorts? Oh, his psycho pomp? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, because Fred was only 26. So for him to be described as an older man. Oh, so yeah, you're right. Maybe it was like his like escort to the underworld. Yeah. And to be fair, in 1902, maybe at 26 you are an older man.

I guess so. Well, like maybe he was wearing his like normal clothes, you know, like a hat and maybe he looked. Yeah. Older when he's not a prisoner. A tour. Yeah, a little more mature, yes, maybe. Well, there is an article titled Occult Features of the Executures. of the execution of Fred Watkins and Alaska.

And in there, they actually printed the picture that Mary took. So I'm sending that to you right now. Oh. And here is him in a coffin and to the left is a man fading through the wall. Okay. First of all, the guy in a coffin, I mean, he's giving no spheratoo with those hangs. He looks very Dracula. Like, what is happening?

And the fact that they like prop the coffin up for pictures is, of course, the most Victorian thing I've ever heard. Yeah. Oh my God, but there is like this old dude just like, oh, can I walk out of this door now? Let me scoot on past you. Oops, just scootch on past. And it looks almost like he's got a bald spot on top of his head. Yeah, yeah, he does.

It looks like there's a homeover situation. So maybe he is older. Maybe. Weird. Anyway, so that was the picture that she got. It's creepy. I love that it's in the newspaper, though. That's exciting.

I love. And I don't know if it's because she could pull her strings as the reporter or if it was because she was so sensible and everyone knew her in town that they were like if she believes it's got to be real. Or they were just like, oh, a ghost, throw it on the front page. Oh, I missed her. Don't give you here you. Don't give that woman credit. Just put it on the front page. Oh, I missed that. So the next few nights after this, Mary had dark dreams of Fred and this mystery man.

and eventually these dreams turned into reality when a few nights later Fred's spirit appeared before her. So I guess, you know what? He said he was going to try to haunt her and he's doing it pretty successfully, which makes me question every other person that has said that they would come to haunt and haven't. I'm like, well, Fred could do it.

Yeah, yeah. Fred could do it in like 48 hours. Yeah, like without, what, like it's hard? What is it hard? When he appeared, Mary swore that, she kind of went into this like catatonic state and felt his experience of him being executed. Hey, that's not fair. You didn't agree to that. She didn't agree to that. I guess it was a vague agreement. She was just like, I sure, whatever that means. That's dark. Including like all the way

down to feeling a rope tightening around her neck. She said that she like felt the full event. And as she was literally in the middle of about, she was about to faint from losing oxygen, her coworker, named Sunshine of all things. Oh. Found her while she was having this moment where she like couldn't breathe and she was freaking out. I think she was actually like frozen in place

and that was the weird part for sunshine. She was like, girl, what is what is going on? Went over to touch her shoulder and two things happened. So then Mary by being touched on the shoulder was kind of woken up from this trance that she was in. But that touch seemed to transfer the experience over to sunshine.

And so now Sunshine is freaking out. And apparently she shouted the words Hardie's here. And that was one of Frank's last names. And then she started speaking in this voice that sounded like Fred's voice according to Mary.

And she started describing the events of being executed. Oh my word. Okay. So luckily Sunshine got off Scott Free after that and never had to deal with this guy again, hopefully. But Fred continued to bother Mary after this happened.

So he was doing a for so long and so intensely, by the way, that Mary decided that she was just going to take a ship and get out of town, which I like you have to take a ship. Can take a ship. While she was on the ship, she actually met a clairvoyant who told Mary, I see a man following you around and then described Fred. He came on the boat with me. Yeah. He's here. Oh, my God. Luckily, I guess it was more that Fred was like on the dock watching her because as the boat went away from the dock, it seemed that Fred faded away from being. able to harm her. Oh, so maybe he was like trapped to that area because literally landlocked. Good for him. I mean, good for her. Good for her. Yeah. Well, because this was the first time she felt free through all this, she decided she was just not coming back to him because she didn't want to show up and he's still there. Yeah. So she never went back to that area. Jeez. However, because she was

the last person that was kind to Fred before he died, he made arrangements before he died to leave all of his belongings to marry. Mm-hmm. Which, like, talk about a random act of kindness. Kindness is a stretch, maybe. Maybe more just, like, not assholey. I guess. It feels like you're just burdening.

Like, what kind of belongings that he really have? He had $500 in possessions, which was the equivalent of $18,000. Shit, okay. Plus additional money in a bank account and about 2,000 acres of land. Jesus. So Mary's pretty made in the shade. I guess so. And I guess the acreage was in California because that's where she ends up.

And years later, Mary is, which you would think if you inherited his land and you're trying to escape him going to his land. It feels like a trap, right? Like that's why I said like, yeah, I don't know about nice because it feels like this is a trap like he's going to like corner her by giving her all this money and being like, well, now I can haunt you forever. But it, yeah. But so he didn't show up. at the land. That was... Didn't show up.

He didn't think to do that. No, I don't know what he was thinking. I'll play it on. I don't know what he was thinking. I haven't got a chance to talk to him yet, but... That's probably for the best. Well, years later, Mary was working at another expo

World Fair or something like that. And this is just an added fun fact about her story is that in her office, her personal office, she had chairs from this place called Baranov's Hill, which was a haunted area that was known to have, its own ghost called the lady in blue.

Oh, wow, that's a twist. Finally, a different color. However, just like every other colorful lady we've ever described, she was jilted, died of heartbreak, and has now seen and heard crying throughout the building. Classic. Well, eventually Baranov's Hill burned down and the only two items that could be salvaged from the fire

were the chairs that are now in Mary's office. Ooh, creepy. So a lot of people think that maybe Mary escaped Fred, but still has the lady in blue attached to her belongings. That's just a fun fact of it all is that she ended up actually being in the papers twice for two different ghosts. Man, she, like in different, in completely different areas. Yeah, and in different ways. And in 1929 she ended up passing away in California.

But she had made headlines, especially for being like a, quote, sensible woman who was in local politics and all this. But just the ghosts kept following her. or that was her lore at least. So that is Mary E. Hart number one. Okay, okay, okay. Yeah, this is confusing already because now I'm thinking another one and you've already moved from Alaska to California.

Yeah, okay. So that was Mary E. Hart number one. And you will see why I was confused at first when I thought these were the same people. Sure. So the other Mary Hart, aka Midnight Mary. Okay.

She is in New Haven, Connecticut. kid. Oh. And she is buried currently in Evergreen Cemetery. And her grave is what's haunted here. So, Mary Hart, she died in 1872. And her gravestone, I feel like they didn't come up with really anything clever. They just kind of described what happened to her as her group, as her little epitaph. It says, at high noon, just from, and about to renew her daily work

in her full strength of body and mind, Mary E. Hart, having fallen prostrate, remained unconscious until she died at midnight October 15th, 1872, born December 16th, 1824. Wow, what a catchy epitaph. Yeah, we could have shortened that for sure. Yeah, like, why do we need to say, like, put her business out there like that? Why did she fall prostrate and remain unconscious? I don't need to know about. Like, now we've got questions. Now it's like, what, give her some privacy. Yeah. So all you need to know is my cliff notes of that is at 48, she collapsed at noon, was pronounced dead at midnight and is now buried at Evergreen. Right. Okay. But after her funeral, her aunt had this horrible, horrible nightmare. Oh, no. That Mary in her coffin was alive and begging for help.

Sounding like you, she convinced the family to exhum body. Oh, shit. And when they opened the coffin, it's said that they found scratches on the coffin lid, as well as, quote, bloody, nope, Mary's bloody nails broken and a petrified look on her face. Hey, that's my nightmare. It's thought that when she collapsed at noon, and for those 12 hours before she was pronounced dead, maybe she had a stroke, and she just looked to sleep and wasn't moving because she was paralyzed, and the family just assumed. she was dead. That shit happened back then and like, I know. I wonder because it's like, well, you wake up from that nightmare and what do you do? Because it's like, first of all, it's too late now, right? I assume. Like, oh, we got to dig up the grave. It's like, well,

by now she's probably dead. But like, do you want to find out? Do you have to find out? Otherwise, she's going to keep coming to your dreams and saying, like, I need people to know. I don't know. It's just like, what do you even do to be the bearer of this news as the aunt? Like, uh, dig her up. I mean, and she must have sounded panic-stricken to convince other people to dig her up. I mean, if I were her, I, like, I wouldn't even want to know. I'd be like, don't tell me. Like, you'd know. I get it.

I get it. I'd be, and I wouldn't tell anyone about that dream. I'd be like, I'm, I'm just going to, I mean, she's dead now. She's, she's certainly by the time that the dream happened, she was probably not in a better place. I don't know. I don't know what I would do, actually. I, now I'm panicking. Hey, I've officially spiraled.

Yeah, I don't like this. You just saw it in real time. That's why the, uh, So I feel like that's why the aunt was picked. She was like, who's going to be the most like, like thinking straight person in my family? It's not mom or dad.

It's not, yeah, it's not Christine and M. It must have been horrified. I mean, I, because I'm if, oh my God. Yeah, I'm imagining that that dream could happen if I lost anybody and now I'm panicking about anybody.

Now am I going to be that person at every single funeral where I'm like, are you sure? Are you sure? Have you checked? Let me just like feel for a pulse. Oh. Oh, it's so scary. So luckily, uh, there is no actual record that this story is true.

Okay. Well, that's nice. That's comforting. The only reason or the inspiration for this story was that that those, that word, that verbiage is on her epitaph that she collapsed and then she was pronounced at midnight. And so people just saying like, oh, what could I? I don't know. It inspired the story.

Okay. Okay. And it's a college town like Yale's there. I feel like that's like prime location for kind of. of like a spooky story in the cemetery. Don't they have like skull and bones is one of their like secret societies? Yeah and they have all the they were there. It's where the bodies were being, that's like where the medical school is like where

the bodies were being stolen for, from graves and stuff. So we have to hope that Mary E. Hart's story is just a made up one. But because of this urban legend, Mary is now still said to wander the cemetery at night and angry about her fate that she was buried. alive, she will now curse you if you taunt her. Oh, well, yeah. I mean, let's not test that theory. Yeah, and I don't blame her either.

And in fact, the local belief now is that if you go into the cemetery at midnight, if you mess with her grave at all, you will soon die. And the stories kind of vary on how the deaths play out. Like, there's one that says, well, there's one that says, like, three teenagers went out there mess with her grave and then eventually one by one they all died from having their throat ripped out. Oh, what? Like crazy shit. Crazy shit.

There's another one that says some men came into the cemetery at midnight to see if Mary would appear. And then they all heard a noise. They all got freaked out. And when they tried to climb over the gate, they all slipped in the same way and were impaled by the iron spikes. Oh, Jesus Christ is like final destination shit. Like at some point there's got to be warnings everywhere. Like do not just stop coming. Just don't even come in here.

Yeah. There's another story where two guys were going to go see Midnight Mary or see if she'd show up. One of them chickened out so he didn't go. But then he didn't hear from his friend. So he ended up going to the cemetery to see if he was okay. And he was like frozen in fear dead in bush. Oh no. Not in the bush.

Not in the bush. There's another one that says, oh, this is from the general manager. there. And he said that he came out one night because a security alarm was triggered. And when he got to the cemetery, he recalled it feeling like eerily dark and empty and that nobody and nothing was there but him. Which is especially weird because security was supposed to be there, by the way. As a general manager, I'd be like, where the fuck were you? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But he got freaked out by how creepy it felt and he tried to leave. And even though his car was turned on, it would not move. Oh no, oh no, oh no.

He said, he was quoted saying, it was like his car was being held back. And when he checked his car's clock, it said that it was one minute to midnight. And he then said, the clock on my radio said 1159. I heard a sound. I said, let's get the hell out of here.

A branch fell near my car. I hit the gas. My wheels were spinning on the ice. And I got out of the gate exactly at midnight. So, wow. Just eerie, just eerie. And then, by the way, a different article told me that, this is a quote from that article,

when the general manager, when he came into work the next day, there was never a record of an alarm going off at any of the buildings, even though he had gotten a call from someone saying, you need to come out, there was a security breach. Oh, dear. Oh, dear. Another story, well, I don't know if it's really a story, but I guess it's local lore that if you live near the cemetery,

weird things happen like on your street and like the neighbors always witness stuff and they're looking out the window to the cemetery. Ooh, that's kind of fun. Like neighborhood lore, okay. I feel like you could relate to that though. Like you just look out into the cemetery and there's not weird stuff. Yeah, but like I didn't really know my neighbors at all.

So it's like I wish I had had somebody who lived nearby that I could like ask, you know. But it would be cool if like your local neighbor's app is literally just like people talking about the ghost they saw. I should check. I should get on next door and see what people are chatting about. If everyone's ring doorbells are all getting something fucking weird. Well, so there was one woman who said in the neighborhood that she would walk around with her cousin

and one night she was out there, she felt like something really weird was out in the cemetery. She says that she has seen, or people in her neighborhood have seen the woman walking by every now and then that they can't recognize and they assume that that's midnight merry. It's probably just someone walking their fucking dog. But the one woman who's gone in to,

the cemetery at night she's gone in with her cousin and there was one night where she heard someone calling her name and she assumed it was her cousin from a distance that she couldn't see and it ended up being a doppelganger mimicking her cousin because when she turned around her cousin was on the opposite side of the cemetery.

Yuck! So I do want to say one of the reasons that this urban legend even exists because the only information that I've mentioned so far that's on her grave is that like oh she was she fell and collapsed and then she died at midnight and therefore she's midnight mary but also on her grave i don't know why they chose to put this fucking quote but on her grave the only other thing it says in bold black letters is

the people shall be troubled at midnight and pass away yuck what so apparently that's from like the book of job but uh what a choice for your bible quote for obvious reasons people have decided that that is mary warning us that if you if you're troubled at midnight or if you come to me at midnight and you cause any problems you will die but so she died at midnight right she died at midnight so maybe somebody's just like put that on her grave being like well she died at midnight she loved the body she loved job or whatever she really loved the bible and the word midnight so let's say it's you know people what does it say people dropped out at midnight or what is it the people shall be troubled at midnight and pass away which is what happened to her she did right

Right. So I don't know. I guess that makes sense why they would have put that on there. But it certainly in 2026 sounds very threatening. It's extremely ominous. Yeah. Yeah. So the last thing I'm going to say is that apparently, I could not find one online. I tried looking. But apparently if you go to Evergreen Cemetery yourself, they have a map. And on their map is Midnight Mary's grave. And she's like a ghostly landmark. Because a lot of people are looking for her. and I guess they would rather show you exactly how to get there instead of you die in some weird fucking way at midnight.

I suppose so. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, that is Mary E. Hart and Mary E. Hart. I can't believe there were two of them. That feels like it should have been a really good, like, true crime plot twist that there were two. Yes, because I've done a story like that of two people, and I think their names were Mary, or maybe even three people. I can't remember the exact story, but I remember it's in the 200s, I think, or maybe 100s. Did, so when, when did Mary number two pass away? What year was that? Mary, so Midnight Mary died in 1872, but then the one that I talked about originally, I should have done them chronologically,

she died in 1921. So they're like 50 years apart, their deaths. Damn, that's wild though. Although maybe Midnight Mary, who died in 1872, maybe she was reincarnated. It has the same damn name. Can you imagine not being able to escape that? You're like, this time, don't die at midnight. Don't fuck it up. up. Fuck it up this time. Anyway. Wow.

What a story. Stories. Very good work. What do you want to do for our yappy hour while I go pee? And do you want me to brainstorm? Do you have anything in mind? As I look around my office again, like I'm supposed to just pick something. I feel like this is what we do every single time.

I know. Just a glance around. I, yeah, I'll figure something out. Is there anything we have to tell the people? Yeah, like or like something about the holidays. I'm trying to think what we got for Christmas. I don't know. Oh, sure.

We could do that. Yeah. I built a trampoline. We could talk about it. I would love to hear what you got Leona for sure. Okay, okay, yeah, let's do that. Let's do a Leona Christmas update and an Eme and Christine. Okay.

Okay, see you in a minute. This sponsor makes me feel the most like we're living in the Matrix because this is like one that M and I actually used and talked about before we ever even had a podcast. Yeah, Zock Doc has always been such a big help, especially now that it is January. I'm in the middle of medical month and I have used Doc more than I probably will all year, but it has been such a godsend. It is a free app and website that helps you find and book high quality in-network doctors so you can find someone that you love. Yeah, we're talking about booking in network appointments with more than 150,000 providers across all 50 states.

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schedule a free call and learn more. Yes, okay, that was it. Great. We did. We love it. Christine and M. Due Christmas. Sick. Yeah, Christine and M.D. Christmas time two weeks late. Okay. So today I have what turned into a two-parter. I have the first part of a story that I had not really heard of, at least extensively. And I'm shocked because it's the disappearance of three young girls in Fort Worth, Texas. in 1974. So they're called the Fort Worth Trio, usually, if you're trying to like Google the case.

And we just actually hit the 51 year anniversary right around Christmas time. So I thought, let's do it. The top sources I used, I just want to say here because they were other, like either podcast or YouTubers. And I feel like some of the information, the way they put it, is worth giving credit to. So one was called Void the Warlock. One was called a creator called Stephanie Harlow and then True Crime Garage podcast did a two-parter on this. Okay.

The girl's in question here today. Rachel Trellisa, her last name is spelled T-R-L-I-C-A. And multiple creators have said it differently. the news, the local news clipping said Trilisa, like when I, local news like TV clip from the 70s. But also I, as someone who worked in journalism and studied it, know that people mispronounce things all the time on the news. So I don't know if that's like official. I've not heard anybody else say it. But I'm going to say Trilisa because even though it looks wrong, that's what I heard.

I like here, like I know on the news sometimes they mess up our names, as you've been on the news and we've heard them call you shy. for her. Oh, right. Like, okay, fair enough. I don't even need to be on the journalism side. I just need to be existing to know that, to know that fact. That's very true. Yeah. That's really funny. Yeah. After they asked how to pronounce it, I'm like, okay. Yeah. You're like, I know that they've done this in the past to other people. You, girl. Yeah. I remember it like it was yesterday. Yeah. Yeah. So, we've got whom I'm calling Rachel Trilisa. Renee Wilson, her friend, who's 14. Rachel, by the way, sorry, Rachel is 17 years old. We've got 14-year-old Renee Wilson, her friend,

and then a 9-year-old girl named Julie Ann Mosley. So 17-14-9? Correct. And that definitely comes into play for like theories and stuff. So December 23rd, 1974, it's two days before Christmas, and three girls, Rachel Trilisa, Julie, Anne Mosley, and Renee Wilson, went to do some last-minute Christmas shopping at the Seminary South Shopping Center in Fort Worth, Texas.

So 17-year-old Rachel, she had recently moved in. Now, this is something I'm going to try and explain right off the bat. She had recently moved in with her new husband, 22-year-old Tommy Trulisa. And this is the part where I say, yeah, she's 17. She's still in high school. She's married. But, like, it's the 70s and also that happens. I don't know.

I don't know what to tell you. But she was married and people get kind of been out of shape about that online. but she was married to this 22-year-old guy. Oddly enough, he was actually divorced already once and had a two-year-old. So he's like moving and we'll get to his whole story later. It's a good life, not a long life. Yeah, right. He's just like getting, he's getting things done early.

He's 22, he's divorced. He has a child. So in other words, Rachel moves in with her new husband. his name's Tommy and she now has this husband and this stepson and a lot of sources talk about Rachel's kind of troubled home life and so some people argue like you know most of it was just she's dating this guy and she wants to get out of her own house like for safety reasons for to save herself and moves in with this new husband Tommy but we don't really know now she actually lived with her sister Deborah. Deborah lived with them, I should say. And she had gotten out of a

relationship and moved in with Rachel and Tommy after they got married. And she, Deborah, the sister is 19 years old. Okay. So Rachel wants to go to the mall and buy some Christmas gifts because she had a gift already wrapped for her stepson in the car, but she realized she learned that day that the stepson, the little boy, would be coming to their house for Christmas morning. And so she was like, oh, shit, I only have like one gift for him. If he's coming to our house, I want like Santa. Yeah, and I'm like, she's 17. I just think that's so, like, thoughtful.

So she decides she needs to buy some more gifts. So she asks her sister Deborah, who's living with him, 19-year-old Deborah, if she wanted to go to the mall. And I guess they had all been up playing Canasta the night before of all things. And so she was like, I'm tired. I want to stay in bed. So she didn't go. Okay.

She decides she's going to call a couple people. Nobody wants to go to the mall. Nobody's available. So she asks her good friend Renee, age 14, who was staying at her grandmother's house. Now, Renee, her boyfriend lived right across the street from her grandma's house. So that morning, she's staying at her grandmas and she and her boyfriend are exchanging Christmas gifts because he lives across the street. he is with his nine-year-old sister and she's just kind of hanging around.

Her name is Julie. And they're exchanging gifts and Terry gives Rachel a promise ring for Christmas. And she's so excited. She's just head over heels for this guy. They were going to a Christmas party together that evening. And so she was really excited to show the ring off to friends and family. And then her friend Rachel called and said, do you want to go shopping? and Renee was like, I don't know, like we have this party later,

but she finally agreed on the condition that they be back by 4 p.m. to ensure she had plenty of time to get ready for the party. Renee asked Terry, her boyfriend, if he would like to come to, but he declined as he had made plans to go spend time with a friend who was sick, but Terry's nine-year-old sister, who was kind of hovering around, wanted to go and was like, I want to go to the mall. And I like to think, how did a nine-year-old get involved with this? No, that's where everybody asks immediately, like, nine.

It's debated, like, nobody really knows what their thought process was, but the girls were like, okay, but you have to ask your mom for permission. And they, like, knew her mom would say no, because her mom was really strict, you know? And so they kind of, most people assume that they were, like, kind of hoping that the mom would say no. but we don't have any like real proof of that. It's just like the idea of like two BFFs who were like married and have a boyfriend and then like the little sister wants to tag along a kind of vibe, you know? Sure. So Julie's mom did initially say no because she was like it's she apparently said you don't even have money. Like what are you doing?

Wow. What a clocker. I know. Yeah. Way to remind me, mom. But Julie begged to go and finally her mom was like, okay, but you have to be home by 6 p.m. and unfortunately this decision, she says, has haunted her for the rest of her life. A little before noon, this kind of unlikely group of three girls went shopping together.

They stopped first at the Army Navy surplus store to pick up some jeans that Renee had had on Layaway, and then they continued on to the Seminary South shopping center. That afternoon, 4 p.m. came and went, and the girls did not return home. as 4 p.m. got closer to 5 p.m., the girls' parents grew increasingly worried, and by 5.30, they headed to the mall in search of their daughters. Rachel's brother Rusty remembers going with his mom as a little kid. I think he was like four or five. And I know, he's been very eaten up by this case for a number of reasons that we'll get to. But so he remembers going to every single store in the mall and asking after his sister and her friends. and talking to anybody and everybody paging them over the intercom,

like they were looking frantically right away. So sad. It is. And they get to the upper level of the mall, and they find Rachel's 72 Oldsmobile parked in the parking lot, top floor at the Sears. Weirdly, that would immediately make me, that would be a bigger gut punch than relief.

I'd be like, where the fuck are you now? Yeah. because there is no sign of the girls anywhere in or around the car. It's like eerie. The car is parked. It's now considered the employee parking lot. But at the time, it was just the Sears parking lot. It was the top floor of the garage.

There was no sign of the girls anywhere nearby seemingly untouched. There was no like blood or anything alarming at the scene. This is where I had to do a little more digging because a lot of misinformation has been spread about this. in the car a lot of times people report that the items they found items in the car that had been purchased at the mall indicating that the girls went back to the car and then disappeared but that's not the case because they actually found the jeans from the navy army surplus store and they found the wrapped gift for the stepson that rachel had already had like in the car so that was not anything new so we basically basically that debunks the idea that they went back to the car and then something happened to them. But most sources say that their shopping bags and stuff were in the car, but it was not. They were not.

Okay. Most importantly, like I said, no sign of the girls. I will say just one minor detail or I don't know how minor it is, but when Renee picked up those two pairs of jeans at the Army surplus store, she had actually changed out of one pair and into the new pair. And so when they found her two pairs of jeans in the car, it was a... her new pair, one of the new pairs and her old pair that they found in the car. Sorry, can you say that again? Yeah, sorry, it's really confused.

It's not even that confusing. It just sounds confusing. So they had gone to the surplus store, bought two pairs of jeans for Renee, and then she changed into one of them. So they found her new pair, one of her new pairs and her old pair in the car. Okay. And some people find that really weird on like Reddit and other forums. I don't.

I don't either at all. Like people were like, why would you change into jeans? And I'm like, because you're a young girl. And she liked how they looked. Yeah, I just thought it was so strange how people got like up in arms over that. Back in the era when they're like brightly colored denim was a thing. Yeah. The second I found my purple jeans, I wasn't waiting until I got home to put those.

Are you kidding me? Your hands are going to be purple from all the dye. And they're not going to wash them. And they were. And they still are. To this day. Don't look at them. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They're probably radioactive. Yeah. No. But so can you see why this became a two-parter? because every, like, detail I would get kind of in the weeds on because people are kind of making these claims online.

And I'm like, that doesn't attract him for me. That doesn't attract for me. Only men, I feel like are making that statement. No, a lot of people where they were saying, like, well, why didn't she just wait to change into them at home before the party later? And it's like, because she's at the mall. That's a social gathering, like a place where you want to wear your cute new jeans. If it's not just men, because I feel like it's like a very like girlhood experience to do that. But what, so then I have to wonder, like, are you not of an era where the mall was relevant?

But what I think is happening is I think people just aren't even thinking through like what it would, the fact that it's like a teenage girl. Like I think people are just like, why would you do that? That's weird. Where were her jeans? Just immediate victim blaming. I guess. Yeah. Or not even victim blaming, but more just like, oh, this is, this has to be like a huge clue. And it's like not really. I don't think. I mean, I don't think it like raises any red flags more than any other part of this case. But people talk about. about it all the time. So I just wanted to throw it out there as like, as like something that's worth noting because people discuss it a lot. But, um, and it could be a clue if we had any other clues to go on, but like alone, I don't see how it really changes the story, you know? No, it's, I think that's just the, the teenage girl experience. Yeah, I would agree. I would agree. And maybe not every teenage girl, but certainly I had

zero chill at that age. Certainly enough. Yeah. Still do. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So, They found the wrapped gift for the stepson. They found the jeans and then nothing else. They had Rachel's husband Tommy come look at the car because it was his car and he said he didn't see anything out of the ordinary or odd except the fact that his parents will. They had actually recently both died. His parents will and $350 bonds appeared to be missing out of the glove box. But he wasn't sure if he had taken them out himself. So, like kind of a useless clue, I guess.

Okay. But, you know, if somebody stole it, he claimed like, oh, there was three $50 bonds in there and my parents will. And now they're missing. But he couldn't be sure that he didn't take them out and misplace them. So I guess I'm going to give some grace to that because there have been times where I was like, there was a pretty big check I needed to cash. I can't remember if I cashed it. Yeah, yeah. And I get it.

I mean, and especially if someone says, like, would you swear on that? And it's like, well, not really. Like maybe I did mistake. throw it away or something. Yeah, so I don't blame him either. And he's 22. And this is a very traumatic incident. So, you know, but other than that, he was like, I don't recognize anything out of the ordinary, which is also just a little creepy to me. So the family stayed till the mall closed at 11 p.m. The lights went out. No sign of the girls. After which the girls' dads got shotguns and staked out the parking lot to see if anything suspicious would happen at the car.

I totally get it. I understand. Like, I didn't mean to laugh at like, it's just like that's the most dad reaction. It is. It is. It's like step aside. Yeah. And I will say they had already, well, A, we're in Texas, so also not surprising. And B, they had already told the police. So it's not like they're doing this vigil. I mean, they are doing this kind of vigilante. But they're not doing this like, you know, because they don't want to tell the police. They've already told the police the police are doing their own investigating or what or. Or. lack thereof, we'll get to that. But you can just basically tell from the way the family handled this that they knew something was wrong, like immediately. They didn't think like, oh, they probably went off to the party and just forgot to tell us. Like, they were at the mall from 530 till morning.

Right, right. And to know both of them, or at least two of the three had curfews that they needed to get to. Oh, yeah. One of them was nine, so like had to be home by six. One of them was like 4.30 because of the party, right? Yeah, wanted to get home for the party that she was so excited about. And she almost didn't even go on the shopping trip because she wanted to go to the party.

And then the older girl who had just invited them along. So, yeah, it doesn't quite track, especially when the mall closes at 11 and they're not anywhere to be found. The second the mall is closed and they're still there. You have to assume the worst. Yeah. They described like the lights going off at each store and like, I mean, the dread building, you know. And what year is this? 74.

74. Okay. So they are staking out the parking lot. Clearly they all know something is up. Like all three of the families know something is going on. Police have been accused, as I sort of hinted at, of botching the case early on. They didn't seem particularly concerned. They assumed the girls were runaways and sort of told the family like, oh, they'll be back.

They just, you know, went to blow off some steam like teenagers do, which, you know, we've heard this time and time again. And again, it's the 70s. But then you think pretty immediately that's debunked because, like, this was an impromptu trip. It's not like the girls had planned this weeks in advance. Two of them didn't even know each other, the 9-year-old and the 17-year-old. Like, why would they take a 9-year-old to run away? Why wouldn't they take the new car and the new jeans? Or not the new car, the car and the new jeans with them?

Like, it does make any sense. Well, also, if there's a 17-year-old who is somehow matured, enough and emotionally intelligent enough to like want to be a good stepmom and like show up for her step kid like then you're going to be like I need to get home because I got to wrap these presents like I got to yeah like she's literally going to them all the day before Christmas Eve like which is a nightmare you know I mean maybe not this is like a week before and this is your last day of spring break and you just fell into one last hurrah this is like everyone expects everyone in the country to be home tomorrow yes and she's already acting on

it like getting more presents It's like, I mean, it's bizarre. And like she has the other present wrapped in the car. It's just so weird. And so the police are kind of like, they're probably just runaways. And clearly the family was like, step aside. We've got shotguns. We're going to watch the car.

But all the way through the night and into the morning, nobody went anywhere near the car. I just sat there. So, so sinister. So creepy. Christmas Eve. So we're talking the day after. The dad's stay through the night.

Nothing happens. Tommy reaches out to the other families and says there was a letter in my mailbox this morning. Oh, no. Yes. This is one of the creepiest parts of the case. It is a letter. I'm going to send you a picture of it, of course, or at least a scan. A picture of a scan of it, you know, it's not the best quality, but I tried to find the least blurry example I could find.

Okay. So there's that. Just came in. Okay. So the envelope is up top and you can see that it's addressed to Thomas A. Trilisa. It just says from Rachel. It doesn't say an address or anything. And then at the top left, just Rachel. And oddly, the envelope was written in pencil. But the letter was written in ballpoint pen. The paper that the letter was written on was the wrong size for an envelope. So it was almost like a kitchen notepad.

it had been written on it like a kitchen notepad style and then like put into a different size envelope. Yeah, you can see the fold line. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Like they're scanned. The envelope is literally smaller than a letter. Yeah, you can totally see it. Exactly.

So it was like a little bit odd. Now it gets even weirder because the 10 cent stamp appear, which you can see has been canceled, like stamped out. It was stamped on or canceled on Christmas Eve. But the zip codes look blurred and the three is backwards on the stamp, which like, I guess could happen. And True Crime Garage talked about this extensively. Like, could this happen at a post office that like their zip code number is backwards and nobody notices? Could the stamp have malfunctioned when it was being made or something? Yeah.

Or, yeah, do they just have like a wrong stamp? but I think it's like one of those where you add the numbers in yourself. But like, but if you do that, then like, and you work at this post office, then like presumably you're not changing the zip code. It's like, when would you notice that? It's just weird. I don't know. It's just another weird thing that doesn't quite make any sense or fit into any specific

clue. Oh, okay. Yeah, it's just weird. But so whatever the case, oh, some people also think maybe the three was actually an eight that was altered to look like a three. Oh. But they like crossed out the wrong half of it. Dummies.

Okay. Maybe. Yeah. So just odd. Like people have argued different things. It's unclear if that was intentional or not. So with the two possible zip codes, the three and the eight, two different towns, but they're both east.

Now let me read you the letter actually first before. Actually, do you want to read it or are you able to read it? Oh, okay. Sorry. I don't want to put you on. That's like such a fucked up thing to be excited about. I'm sorry. No, I want you to read it.

but I don't want you to feel pressure to because it's in handwriting. Oh, I'm no Gen Z. I can recursive. Don't worry. Oh, few. All right. It says, I know I'm going to catch it, but we just had to get away. We're going to Houston.

Houston. Thank you. See you soon in about a week. The car is in Sears Upper Lot, love Rachel. Doesn't it feel creepy? That feels way, that feels very curt. very um very a little too on on like to the point yeah like there's no feeling to it there's no warmth to it it's just like here's a fact here it is looking for me and now look um at the rachel down

there because people have noticed that somebody went back over the e an e and made it into an l and so some people argue hey maybe rene wrote the letter right and was able to copy the handwriting of her friend and was used to writing Renee and so did two E's. But I mean, this is all a stretch, right? Like, this is nothing we can really claim. But for what it's worth, the families were like, nope, Rachel did. This is not from Rachel. We do not think this.

And of course, this caused even more alarm across the board because, like, what the fuck? This doesn't make any sense. Again, we talked about why they wouldn't be running away in this scenario. know, like with a nine-year-old, like without the car. It would like, and I'm, I. The address being somewhere east instead of on the way to Houston where they said they're going. I mean, with confidence. Oh, that's what I meant to mention.

Sorry, the zip codes that are blurred, the two towns are both east and they're not in the direction of Houston. So even if it said that, it's not true or somebody is trying to trick them or who knows what, but the letter did not come from Houston. So I hate that. I also, my first thought, which like, and I'm not like I can crack a case or anything, but the eerie part to me if I were Thomas is like, this person knows my name and address. Okay, so good point.

Thank you for bringing that up. First of all, they were like, she calls him Tommy. She does not call him Thomas A. Trilisa. Like she would not address it to, but, you know, maybe because it's the envelope she wrote. Thomas A. The etiquette of all. Yeah. But they were really alarmed by that.

They were like, I don't, the family was like, I don't, Rachel's family said she wouldn't have written Thomas. She would have written Tommy. That's point A. Point B. The other point to it though is that back in those days, especially you could just open, like you could look at someone's license, open the white pages, like open a phone book and just see, which by the way, his name probably would have been written as Thomas A, Trilisa in the phone book.

That's a great point. another kind of creepy point that the family says she would never have written Thomas A Trilisa on a letter to him. That's a great point. And so, you know, it just kind of adds to the creep factor. But then also it's like, this is a bad sign then, a really, really bad sign because then whoever did this clearly knows enough about her or to copy her handwriting or to force her to write this, coerce her to write this. So some people think this is her handwriting. I will say handwriting experts have analyzed it. And they, it's inconclusive.

Some people say it is a match. Some people say it's not. But Stephanie Harlow made a really good point of like, then it must be close enough. If people are divided over whether it's her handwriting, it must be close enough to look a lot like her handwriting. So either somebody knew her well enough to copy her handwriting or she was forced to do it and she did it like funny. to try and give a clue or who knows. If I were, I hope this obviously one never happens, but two, if it does, I hope the person that would have done this isn't listening right now.

But if I were forced to write a letter so that it was in my handwriting, I would hope that I at least left some like odd nods so people could catch on. So like maybe she intentionally wrote Thomas knowing that people would be like, she wouldn't call me that. Like so hopefully that was maybe like a tactic of hers. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Because if I wrote to you and said like Christina M instead of. Right, right, right. Right, right. You'd be like, what the fuck's going on? I'm gone from, I'm gone of my own free will and I love Zach Began. He's my favorite idol. Couldn't imagine hiking being any better for the soul.

Oh my God. I love to. Let's go hiking soon. Yeah. That's what I'll know. No. us. Maybe she did write it, but she was intentionally trying to make it look. Some people do argue that. Yeah. Colder. Or even funny, like, writing it with like her left hand or writing, not maybe with her left hand, but like writing it in like a different form of cursive than she usually. Something, you know, might be off. And again, like the envelope being in pencil, the note being in pen. It's just a little strange. Some people think that the note had already been written and that somebody put it in an envelope.

that didn't fit the note pad it was written on and like pretended it had been I don't know there are just a lot of weird theories as to like how this got in the mailbox some people argue like well there's no way it could have come overnight so maybe rachel would have written it a few days earlier which means she would have planned this whole thing but then like she wouldn't have gone with a nine year old that she didn't even know was coming no she'd be like that kid is ruining my fucking plan literally the one plan i've had for weeks and this little child's coming. Like, no, that just wouldn't happen. Um, and also like back then, especially, like if you mail something from a town over, like, yeah, it can get there overnight. It's not that abnormal, you know. Um, so essentially things are odd. The Rachel, like,

you write your name so many times and it's kind of odd to like miss spell, like, miswrite the last letter of your name. Like, it's just an odd thing. Um, and so of course, people kind of home in on that. The formality of the envelope, they didn't know if this letter had been sent before they left or last night. If somebody stamped it to look like it had been stamped, but then just put it in the mailbox because actually there were no other letters in the mailbox that day. Well, it also, because it says like the cars in Sears Upper Lod, so you know it had to.

Technically, at least they want you to think that it was written. Like since last night. Since last night. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And that's just so creepy too because it's like not only do they know her handwriting, but like or are forcing her to like tell, oh, God. And we just had to get away.

Why? What stressors were going? Exactly. And like they don't even know each other two of them. It's like, what in the world? And also if I'm ever writing you and I'm saying, I just had to get away with my friend and her little sister, I'm not getting away. Now I'm babysitting a random kid.

Yeah. Yes. And so it's so strange to me. me, but police were like, well, see, the letter says they ran, they just needed some time to blow steam. It's like, that's a nine-year-old. And by the way, this nine-year-old wouldn't leave on Christmas. Like, this nine-year-old is waiting for Santa to deliver presents. And I promise you the nine-year-old didn't need to get away. So like, no, exactly. So I'm pretty sure the nine-year-old is kicking and screaming in the car being like, why did the two of you need to get away? It's fucking

Christmas. I'm going to miss my presence. That's a great point, Christine. That ain't. Like, there's no fucking way. And so it's just ridiculous, but also that makes it so sinister, because, because now we know there's no way this letter is real or at least we don't believe it is. So like either somebody forced her to write it or somebody's trying to fool the families and the police, which is triple bad. I will say too that like at this point, it's not like this was widely, this wasn't like reported yet, right? Because it had just been one night. So it's not like some prankster did this.

You know, it's like this clearly was somebody who knew what had happened the night before. just really sinister and creepy. So on January 1st, which was just over a week later, there still had been no sign of the girls, a man who knew Rachel, like as a friend, called Rachel's father and said, hey, I just wanted to let you know. I just saw what happened,

and I actually saw Rachel and her two friends at the mall that day on December 23rd. And he says he talked to Rachel and he noticed that another person was with them. Oh. Like kind of just part of their group. But we don't have any more details on this. There's nothing else reported about it.

And it doesn't appear that at least really followed up on it. So we don't know what it means. Like, was this person like hovering over them? Was this person like just like creepily in the background? Was he like hitting on one of them and kind of joined their squad for the day? Was it a man? Was it a woman? We don't even know.

Was it another little girl? Like, we don't know. So it's just frustrating. Like we don't even know much. Could have been someone from school. Yeah. Right. So we don't know much besides noticed another person was with them.

Then January 3rd in the Fort Worth Telegram, they quoted a detective saying, I wish we had just one clue, one clue to get us off that parking lot. They basically said they were stuck at the parking lot. It was like as if the girls just poof, vanished. And even though a couple people at the mall had seen them and had said they'd seen them, they had said they'd seen them, there were barely any details and nobody could say where to go next, like where to leave this top floor parking lot and where to go. So in early January, the family received a call from an alleged friend of the girls saying the girls would be arriving that evening on the Greyhound bus, like the 10 o'clock Greyhound.

And all the families rushed to the Greyhound station. They waited there and, of course, were devastated when the bus. bus came and the girls were not there. Oh, so it's just toying with them now. Yes. So, or, so Thomas and someone else, I forget, who waited through several more hours to see if maybe they would somehow by miracle chance, like, have gotten on a different bus, but they never came. And by the time the families got home, Renee's family found their house had been burglarized while they were out.

Oh, ew. Is that not the creepiest fucking thing? So they are absolutely just Toying with these families Or it's just a prankster who knew that this would get the family out of the house knew where they lived and said Not a prankster, I'm sorry, a full-blown criminal And then planned a robbery for when the like got the family out

Like sociopath level like got the family out to the bus station Knowing they would all go You're totally right So but yeah so we don't know But it could also be somebody Who wanted to access Rachel's belongings, you know?

We don't know. I mean, you made the good point earlier of the white pages. I mean, and this is all in the news, it could have been anyone who just said like, oh, well, now we know where they live and we know a way to get them out. Oh, yeah, we just look up Tom and say Trilisa or whatever.

But yeah, so they were able to find a family's house and burglarize it while they were out. And it's like sick. I mean, it's sick either way, if it's the person toying with them or if it's just a random. I feel like it's the same.

people that are from the beginning. Yeah. Because in the letter, too, it says, see you in about a week. And I immediately read that and thought they're stringing them along. See you in about a week. Oh, ew. I feel like they're not coming back in a week. That was just like to push, to delay the inevitable. But also like this burglary happened like a week later. Oh, ew. Like the person who either wrote this or forced them to. That's what I thought you were saying. I was like, see you in a week. Ooh. Wow, I'm accidentally a genius.

I know, except now that I look at it, I'm like 12, 23. A week later is a 30th. So, okay, never mind. It's like a week and a half. I said about a week. About a week. But that feels like it was, the way I read it from the second I read the first time, it was like, I feel like that's just stringing them along and they're never going to show up.

So, yeah, yeah. I don't know. It just feels like a similar mind game. Yeah, yeah. But I'll be honest, a lot of people prank these. families and so and strung them along like for fun that's so evil like this one obviously was like with criminal motive but the like as an example here i'll find it actually let me tell you about one more that was like creepy and then we'll get to the prank calls because uh there were so many prank calls

but on january 7th julie's mother received a call julie was the nine-year-old and she said hello a few times she didn't really hear much. Then she heard a moan and she heard a little girl's voice say, Mama. And she swears. She would be willing to swear on her life that it was her daughter. She said, I understand that someone could be stringing me along, but I know, I know that's my daughter. You know your kid's voice. You know your kid's voice. She asked who it was. She said, no answer. She said, is this Julie, Julianne Mosley? And the girl said, yes. She said, where are you? And the girl said, I don't know, Mama. And then the phone hung up. And, she said she would swear her life on it.

Then again, you know, you're in this shock trauma. You're hoping for something. So, of course, that can skew your perspective. We don't know that that was Julie. However, she is convinced and swears to this day that it's her daughter's voice. One call came in, a call to Renee's parents. And they claimed it was Renee. And when they traced the call, because now they knew all these pranks were coming in

and all these potential not pranks were also coming in. So they traced the call and they found it was a 14 year old girl just prank calling for fun. Evil. I mean, what? The way that I quickly believed that woman, I believe the mom, though. I was like, if you know your kid, fuck, like I'm not going to, but it was just a little girl the whole time. No, no, no, so. Sorry, I think I.

No, no, you're good. So that was a call to Renee's family that they traced to a 14-old girl. and this girl admitted to making several of the calls but said she did not make the one to Julie's mother. Okay. So I just say that to say even though they caught one of the girls who was doing this quote unquote for fun, I guess. They did not, she did not admit to doing the one to Julie's mom and said that was not her. So Julie's mom still swears that that was Julie. So it's possible, you know.

That little 14-year-old girl, I hope. Let's talk about karma. I hope karma finds her. That's all. Yeah, I, I'm like, there's one thing about being like a child, right, and making bad decisions. But, like, that is like what's going on with you, my dear? Like, something's up for you to be making decisions like this. Like Stephanie Harlow said, I want to look up where the hell this girl isn't out.

Yeah. Like, that's alarming behavior. But kids are kids are kids. I don't know. Okay. So, Rachel's. mother also learned. So a lot of this is kind of on the ground work that the families are doing because the police are sort of like, they're just running away. That's all. They'll, they'll be back.

So the parents are doing, and of course, they're the ones getting all these phone calls, right? So they're like kind of being driven crazy and they're trying to pursue every lead and they're trying to figure out how to find these girls. At one point, Rachel's mother learns that an elderly woman may have witnessed the abduction. And I have, this was from Stephanie Harlow's video, a screen or a clipping of the article from March 14th, 1975, Fortwood, Texas. An elderly woman may have witnessed the abduction of three girls missing since December 23rd. Mrs. R. W. Arnold, mother of Rachel Trellisa, 17, said she has learned three clerks at a store in Seminary South Shopping Center, where her daughter and two friends are believed to have been, say an elderly woman discussed three girls with them.

the woman said she saw a girl being forced into a pickup truck the day of the disappearances Mrs. Arnold said the woman told the clerks there were two girls and a man inside and a second man was forcing the third girl into the truck. If the woman would call us, we might be able to learn more about this thing and we would promise to keep her name secret, Mrs. Arnold said, but they never were able to get a hold of this woman. Dang. So essentially three employees just to give like a quick. Clifference. Yeah, cliff nuts. Three employees at the mall separately said that this elderly woman had come to them and said, hey, I saw this thing happening. And I mean, I don't know why nobody did anything, but whatever. And they said,

oh, yeah, she came to tell us about this, about seeing these girls being forced into a pickup truck. was a yellow truck with lights on top of it. So it could be like mall security or, you know, something of that nature. And that was all they could find. They begged for this woman to come forward. They could keep her anonymous, but they never heard from her beyond what the employees at the mall said. So another just really frustrating dead end of a lead. At one point, the family worked with a private investigator named John Swame.

and he was kind of notorious in town for making really wild and bold, like claims about cases and things like that. He liked to stir the pot and stir up drama. He would get on these like press conferences and like, you know, say like the police blah, blah, blah are doing, like just to kind of stir the pot. Sure. He pursued several false leads that ended up kind of creating some turmoil, but he was doing a lot of interviews and he was talking to a lot of people. He unfortunately died of a drug and alcohol overdose in 1979 and it was ruled as a suicide. And when Rachel's mom went to pick up some photos that she'd loaned him for the investigation, she found out that his last request was to have all his files burned upon his death. Oh, shady. And so they burned, everything had been

burned three years of his work, three years of interviews, all the photos and paperwork that the family had loaned him. Everything was burned. But not only that case, right, it was all his work. So it's sort of like it could have been a different case, but this was the one that he was, you know, one of the ones he was actively working on when he died. Got you. I thought for a second you meant just theirs. And I was like, hello? That's so bad. I know. And it like, it could be from that case, but we just have no idea. And so that was just another really frustrating part of this. So that is the end of part one. I'm going to give you a little hint here, part two, a teaser. I'm going to tell you more about Tommy, Trilisa, and his marriage to Rachel,

some possible culprits that have been mentioned over the years and why Rachel's brother Rusty has grown up and now believes that their older sister, Deborah, might have had something to do with it. Wow, thank you for the little teaser trailer. What that was that? done. I don't know. I just wrote down a bulleted list of what I needed to cover next week. And I was like, it's so we hold you accountable next week. I know. I have somebody has to. Somebody has to. But yeah, no, it's just so crazy. Like I'm on page, I don't know, I'm like way far in and I still have so much to discuss. So no, this is awesome. Look, I love a two-parter. You can keep that up if you want. Yeah. It's a good time. It's when I get invested, you know, really invested. Well, thank you everybody for listening.

We appreciate you and happy new year, even though, you know, let's just all hold out until the actual horse comes around in February, whenever that is. And hopefully, hopefully we can, I don't know, survive until then, I guess. Sure, sure, yeah. But good luck, everybody, in 2026. And that's why we drink. Thank you.