And That's Why We Drink - E85 Transgender Lemonade and Old Ass Bowling Balls

Episode Date: September 16, 2018

Episode 85 is upon us! Get your holy water ready because Em takes us back to the Zak Bagan's Haunted Museum to cover Ed Gein's cauldron and Bela Lugosi's creepy portal mirror. Meanwhile, Christine cracks into the fucked up case of David Edward Maust, another serial killer who actually begged to stay in jail. We also learn that Christine's 6 year-old self may have performed a dark ritual and, don't worry, we find a way to bring up bowling again... and that's why we drink!Please consider supporting the companies who support us!Use code DRINK at www.vistaprint.com to get 500 high-quality business cards for $9.99Hello.. FRESH! For $60 off ($20 off your first three boxes) visit www.hellofresh.com/drink60 and enter code DRINK60Try AMC's streaming horror service Shudder free for 30 days, go to www.shudder.com/podcast and use promo code DRINKVisit www.stamps.com for up to $55 in free postage, a digital scale and a 4-week trial. Click the radio microphone and enter promo code DRINK

hey hi we're recording oh i see this is how i started yell at you i was like we were just talking what are you getting my attention no um eva's taking a picture of our holy water and i figure this is a really like um a good way to start by just shouting yeah hey i mean it worked getting some attention how you doing i'm good how are you doing listen i've been better but i'm fine why do you drink christine well you know i had something written down and then things just got way out of hand you mean things beyond what you wrote down became even more worthy of correct a reason to drink let's just say my dog uh threw his body against a locked gate until he escaped

and i found him uh attacking a man across the street who then called me a slew of very terrible uh sexist terms and then uh a neighbor called the police on me and then g almost got hit by four cars and but look here we are and we're all alive geo got locked in a closet for five minutes and now we're all good how are you doing but how did you get them back that's the best part of the story okay so i called m because i knew i just i instinctively instinctively called m and i was like put me on speaker and i was like geo come see m and then m was like geo and then geo comes running and i'm like this fucking bastard little dog won't listen to me but you know you put m on speakerphone and suddenly he's right come running to funkle m and i grabbed that dog and i was like how dare you it's like when i try

to throw myself in front of a car when i was little and my mom spanked me and then she got like the authorities called on her for spanking me and she's like she threw her body in front of a van it's kind of like how geo threw himself into a gate yep and then threw his body you put him in time out of four vans and then um decided to run away from me and not the first time not the last it's funny now but like time has passed is it though i am not amused well it's more funny now earlier i came i came to the house and christine was in tears and i was like okay it was okay how do we get you in a funny mood because we have to record yeah i was like ha ha ha ha you're like i'm as tipsy christine why don't we go back to that i did say that exact thing too yep and um i just want you to know that if you were to

see the world from my view when you called me in a frantic panic and asked me to talk to geo calm talk him off of off a ledge yeah um i was getting my drink from starbucks and the window was open and i was mid passing my credit card to the starbucks girl as i was going and like she was like this is a Looney Tunes kind of person. She was like, this is why I hate LA. She was like, I shouldn't even be surprised because it's Los Angeles. This is what people do. And the weird part is I didn't even apologize.

I just let it happen. And I was like, she'll figure it out. You were like, she'll know why I'm doing this. She doesn't need to know. And then I drove off. And then I found you. It was a rough afternoon. You found me in a puddle of tears.

And I did. And you were trying so hard to be brave and not let me know you were crying and i was like i was just so angry you're like no it's fine he was making me so upset he almost killed himself can you imagine then i said what if we just start the episode today and i was like by the way geo's dead he threw himself in front of a van what if we do this podcast for a thousand years when geo maybe doesn't make it although he'll never die sure no in a world where what do we do for that i don't know m do i don't i mean i already talked to my therapist about it and she's like stop thinking about that and i was like too bad i can't oh boy um let's change gears anyway why do you drink this week why do i drink this week um i didn't have a reason planned great well

i have many so if you need more just ask i mean currently it's been a good week that's good i guess the real reason is because and this may sound like i'm like i like planned to say this but i actually have had avengers on my mind all day and i did earlier today think like oh i'm gonna go home and watch like infinity war and like have a nice relaxing day and then i like came here to like cry and christine i was like i like forgot that i was recording tonight and i was like i'll just watch it tomorrow so it's like my bad what is what a small problem in my life that like i had to delay my avengers viewing party i have to watch the movie for the thousandth time tomorrow. But I was like really hyped up because I'm still finishing things up at my day job

and I've been getting through it by listening to the Avengers soundtrack on loop. And so I've been like very primed to want to watch all of it. And now I've gotten to a point where I can listen to the soundtrack and I know every part of like I know where the scene is. Oh my god, I'm not surprised. I also have a good reason why I drink

because today I was on the Happy happy half hour with brett erlich and i had a blast i know christine was on the show a while ago it's on youtube tv yeah it was so much fun and i'm so fun i've never been like in a in a room before as like quote talent talent isn't it weird it was weird because we went to school to like do that to be behind the scenes of that yeah like we learned what to do for talent but we never learned what to do as talent so i'm always super nice to people because i'm like oh god i like oh and today were you in um you weren't it was the class that you walked out of like day one yeah i actually quit on day three after many volumes and i said i can't do this anymore well that class was uh studio production studio production which is exactly what the one class

i've ever in my entire life quit i've never dropped a class before in my life that was the first one it was like the best class i we had we had different plans originally before the podcast but it was my favorite i really liked that class And one of the things that I remember having to learn how to do was how to politely mic someone for like a talk show. Like put it up their shirt without being like, let me reach up your shirt. Exactly. And it was so weird because I saw someone, I saw the girl coming over to me with a mic and I was like, oh my God, I remember all of this. And someone was doing it to me. And I was like, this is so weird. Someone's like, do you know how to? And I was like, I got it. Yeah. She put up my own shirt.

Before she even finished the sentence, I was like, don't worry, I'll handle it. and I was like this is so weird someone's like do you know how to and I was like I got it yeah she like my own shirt before she even finished the sentence I was like I don't worry I'll handle it and she was like oh it's so nice that you knew how to do that and I was like I have a master's and it's not because we do it all the time it's because we learn how to do it to other people so like oh I'm an expert because I wear mics all the time it's like no no I was training how to do it for minimum wage the etiquette of doing it on other people but no anyway it was that was a very like weird tangent it on other people but no anyway it was that was a very like weird tangent to go off on specifically this but it was a great show so fun it was so much fun and brett is so nice and he's just wonderful and hilarious and they made me like the best milkshake i've ever had they put little mini hershey kisses in it what they had eco-friendly

straws they were made of rubber they're all about the straws they were a wild time yeah i went and they made the the slow gin fizz and i was like they knew i mean eva told them but they knew i loved gin and i was like they're on top of their shit yeah eva handled it because she did yeah i didn't even say anything about milkshakes and i actually came in early i got there at three instead of 3 30 and i saw him with a giant blender of ice cream that had not been blended yet. And he was like, hi, it's nice to meet you. Um, I'm looking for an outlet so I can make your milkshake. And I was like, Oh, now I feel like garbage. I was like, I can blend it. He does them. And then when I went to, he was like, had a protein shaker and he's like, sorry, I need to shake this for seven more minutes. Do you mind if I just shake this

in front of you? And I was like, do you want me to do and he's like no i got it and i was like this is odd anyway it was a great time that's so funny i can't wait to watch it i can't wait to watch it and it will be out by the time you're listening to this it will have already gone out so releases on tomorrow tomorrow 1 30 perfect which is friday at 1 30 so it comes out again to re-watch on sunday because it comes out live tomorrow at 1 30 and if you don't watch it apparently i found this out the hard way you can't watch it until sunday got it something like that okay so by the time you hear this it's out yeah true true true i didn't even think of that yes it's out on youtube tv so you should check it out and while you're there it's called happy half hour

get your free trial check out mine too if you want you don't have to and this is probably more fun but check mine out too don't listen to christine um all right um oh also last minute guys are not really last minute but i possibly last warning we are still below ticket mark for uh philadelphia on november 7th for our live show so if you want to go get tickets please do it now there's only a handful left so please sell us out because it will make us look very good to other people and then we can get other shows that's right go to um our website and that's why we drink.com and if you hit tour the tickets are all there uh we're adding shows soon as we keep

saying to you i promise that's real i'm not making that up um and there's a lot more coming so we're just getting the site set up for those and now we have a designated person named nicole who sends us the actual ticket link as soon as it releases yes so we're on it guys so uh i have either you're really and this is to the listeners not just christine you're either really gonna like this you're really gonna hate this nothing's about me anymore no and that's how it should be i'm just kidding everything should be about you everything should be about you also wait wait wait last this is a this is a This is a clink toast to you. This is officially one month left. Today.

30 days. I'm drinking out of plastics. Use our pen cup that Eva bought us. Oh, wait. How do I do the thing? No, the cup. Oh, or that. Okay.

Wait. Oh, that was nice. Had a little reverberation. Yeah. One month away. And I finally gave Em the officiant speech. Yes. I thought I was going to be writing the speech, but I don't have to now.

I don't know why you thought that. I just assumed, like, as your best friend, I would. But, like, what part? I mean, you have to write the part that's, like, about you and us, but you don't have to write, like, the other stuff. I don't know. Are you okay? What are you talking about?

No, I, like, have, like, a whole, like, template ready to, like, write. No, I don't do templates you okay are you talking about no i like have like a whole like template ready to like write no i don't do templates i'm sorry oh okay i just wanted to clink and say congratulations thank you yes i'm very excited i finally gave you the speech yeah basically um so okay back to what i was saying you're either gonna like this or hate this um so make a decision and then keep listening or turn us off but don't turn us off just oh i thought you're talking to me okay no i was like again it's not all about you it's like i'll turn a scene i can't get that's something i can never get through my brain okay don't tell people to turn us off turn us back on right now young man why is it a man it

is a man it is um it's a 12 year old young man tell me more about him it's giovanni throwing himself in front of a van i'm just still mad okay the tension is real just drink your wine um okay so this is a twofer because i couldn't find a lot of information about either but i wanted to talk about both so i was like i'm just gonna smash them together okay and also i do want to say i want to give full credit i know like i never thought i would say this but i want to give full credit to zach baggins um because what the fuck because when we went on that tour i still can't stop thinking about it it was such a great tour and there were so many things that i wanted i thought like when

i went there grabbed her drink i i truly like although i knew you would love it and it was like a fun thing to do for a bachelorette party i did like selfishly kind of think like oh this is like research like i can like every room will be a new topic and like i've got like stories saying that all is still making waves in our podcast community so yeah yeah and so um i went there and i was like ready to like soak it all in and remember names and everything to like look into stuff and i don't know what this means but every single item in that fucking house i cannot find any information on except on his show fake news okay maybe i don't know but um i mean we talked about the doll that Shampy named. She shan't.

I already said her name, so hello, goodbye. But no, so Deadly Possessions is the second show that Zach does. What a winner. I don't know if it's the second, but it's not Ghost Adventures. But there are different items that he has in his museum. And, I mean, it's a good idea for a show in my mind. But the only place I could find information was episodes that he covered. It makes sense because if he's getting stuff personally from people, they might not be as famous.

And he interviews the people that actually owned it before. So it's personal stories. It's like the primary sources. So if you've ever seen this episode or if I somehow swindle you into watching the episode after this, it is going to be rather verbatim. It's going to be I'm going to try and do my own spin on it, but I don't. The information is from that source. Yes, it's purely from that source because I looked everywhere else and could not find anything. So I'm sorry if this is a little too similar.

I can't imagine you're presenting it the way that Zach Baggins with his glasses would well i can if you would prefer i would prefer it actually the best part because i mean we all know that like zb does this little thing where like his his voice he just talks a little too slow but i had to watch these episodes on youtube where like someone like warped the voices so that like because it was like illegal for them to be on youtube probably you know how like they like change it they slowed the voice and it was twice as fucking long his because zach really talked like this and i like i i really was committed to the story to have to go through 44 minutes of that so anyway i looked up both of these items not knowing he actually had covered them on deadly possessions i was just i lucked out oh my god i'm so excited he had covered both of them what are they

one of them can you guess which things i was like super stoked about okay um you already did the dybbuk box you already did ptd um the only other thing i remember is the room with the lady who took the polaroids okay that was the one that i wanted to do more than anything with that okay so there's this woman named lee sober shapiro yeah this is not this is not the story by the way like good guess that's what i'm saying but that one i remember you saying there wasn't much i yes i i cannot find anything the only thing i could find was from 2009 there is one blog from her granddaughter saying this woman was my grandmother and then that's it that's the only information but basically lisa over shapiro from what we learned is that she became very um

interested in the paranormal found her own equipment and built her own equipment to be able to talk to spirits and she ended up becoming possessed one night and had a Polaroid camera where she was taking pictures of her experience. And basically that night when she had all of the equipment on for the first time and she was taking pictures in like a seance circle. Yeah. She died that night. But there are some pictures that she took before she died where she's clearly not herself.

Some of the pictures have like bite marks in them it's like very scary and the weird part is the pictures were all taken in the same night and in the first picture she looks like a totally normal healthy person and only four hours later when she supposedly died she looks like a skeleton like she looks so fucking wild in the fourth photo half of it was missing and they searched the whole house and they never found the other half of the polaroid yeah and they're like well she was home alone like nobody knows what happened to the other half but it like was ripped in half it's very then the actual pictures are like are they at the museum or were they replicas they were replicas

and maybe they were the actual but they had big replicas on the wall okay um but so i was obsessed with that story and i was like wild and they still and they do have like zach actually has the real equipment in in the museum they had a full room of it like you can go into a closet where all the equipment is currently on and you can stand in there by yourself well they have a display where they have her they have like what it looked like in her living room the night that they found her and it was like tarot cards and then like a ouija board and then all this like crazy EMF reader shit hooked up. And she apparently said she could reach the netherworld that way or something.

It's very creepy. And they have her armchair in there. It's spooky. So I like was convinced I was going to do that story. Could not find anything about her. And I was convinced that I remembered her name wrong. I called the museum three different times and spoke to three different employees. And I was like, I need more information about this woman.

Did you talk to Michael? No, I did not talk to Michael, who was our tour guide. But I've called several times after the fact looking for information. Well, if you guys know anything else, just send it in. If you can find something, please let us know. Anyway, sorry. So that's not it. Okay.

What a tangent. Sorry. That's the whole story. That's all I know about that. So basically you get three stories out of me today. I'm just like pulling them out okay so the stories i cut i picked were um the ed gein cauldron oh yes and should i tell them one by one do you want another surprise later do you want me to say both of them now just say both of them um the other one is the

bella lugosi mirror i don't remember that one it was the interactive one yes where we were looking he's like ready go you can look in the mirror yes but i don't we will delve into that okay so start with the cauldron okay would you like to give a quick little thing about ed gein like the quickest paraphrase ever all i really remember from ed gein was that he had some sick twisted thoughts and he would kill people on his property and then turn them into clothing or accessories or furniture and he made like nipple belts and um he would put the the worst one in my opinion was where he took people's faces cut them off it was after they died but it was still really disturbing and then he turned it into an apron and they have photos of

all this stuff online so be forewarned before you google this at work the photos will come up immediately and he has an apron with just faces like sewed together like a nose is in there and you can see eyebrows it's very upsetting um so he was also the um inspiration for leather face from texas chainsaw master aka my number one favorite movie please stop asking just i probably get a hundred of those emails. Tell us your favorite scary movies. Everyone's like, what's your favorite scary movie? I like the Texas Chainsaw Massacre, both the original and the one from 2004. I think the original was 1973.

They're both scary in different ways. So, Ed Gein. Ed Gein. We also did a full episode on him in the past. I don't know what episode it was, but if you'd like to give us a quick Google. A couple of people have made full logs of every episode, the topics in each episode. Cool. On Reddit and on Facebook.

So look at those. Cool. And also Ed Gein sidebar is my personal favorite fascinating story in the serial killer world. And was excited to hear me tell. Yes. Yeah. Okay. So the Deadly Possessions episode where I got all this information. I just want to give full credit as well. story and the serial killer and was excited to hear me tell yes yeah um okay so the deadly

possessions episode where i got all this information um i just want to give full credit as well a man named dan uh met up with zach baggins and he was the one that owned the cauldron okay basically the cauldron was originally used in his home for like actual eating and making stews and shit like that so i feel like a cauldron kind of leads people to thinking there's some version of witchcraft there's like toads and right that's not it was just an actual just like a cauldron like for stew okay and it's currently sitting in the museum which we all got to stand around uh-huh and uh one of the things that ed gene would do is he also did he uh he dug up bodies yes he would take them from graves fresh graves so um if you go to the museum

you will get to stand next to the cauldron and they will warn you not to touch it yes and right above it is the shovel that um edging used to use to dig up the bodies as well really cute and you can see both of them it's pretty dark fabulous both of those were owned by Dan. Dan donated them to Zach Baggins because he ended up inheriting them. He lived in... How nice. I know. They call you in for the will reading. You get this cauldron.

The family, his family lived in the area, which it's in Wisconsin. I forget what town it was. Oh, I don't remember. But it was in Wisconsin. His family lived in the area since the time of ed gein's murders and his grandma was an antique collector and would go to auctions and that's how she ended up getting the cauldron in the shovel okay kind of weird though i wonder what i wonder how much she knew about what she was getting because she did know ed gein right because everyone in that

town apparently was so small everyone knew you each other. Well, and you would know, especially after an arrest like that. Yeah. So to Dan, the guy that has these items now, or before he gave them to Zach, he had a neighbor named Hollis, and Hollis was also neighbors with Ed Gein. Okay. So, and Hollis has recently passed away, but Dan was able to tell Hollis' story, and Hollis' son was also on the show who also told Hollis' story. So Hollis, he apparently was around. He was next door neighbors to Ed Gein when the police discovered all the bodies and everything. And when the basically when the police found out about Ed Gein's murders, they obviously were the first responders and walked into this building and saw or into this home and saw a bunch of mutilated bodies and so this story about the

shed that they walked into was like so disturbing it was so this all the bodies that they found they had to remove them from the house but the police had never seen anything like that and many of them were like getting sick and couldn't do their jobs and there were so many bodies and so many items that they couldn't do it themselves and so they actually went door to door and asked neighbors to volunteer to help me and they uh basically recruited neighbors to help remove the bodies oh god and because this was also mentioned in the show but it's a very good point that i didn't even think about is that because it was such a small town and it was such a close neighborhood like these people knew all of the victims oh fuck so like it's like walking in and like seeing all your friends just mutilated in on an apron and oh no so the neighbors all knew each other so they

were walking in and like seeing all these people that had gone missing. Fuck. And they were having to cut them down and also getting sick. And Hollis was one of the neighbors that helped. Shit. And so was Dan, the one that was on the show that has the cauldron. His father, brother-in-law, and cousin also were all people who helped clean up the house. So he, although he wasn't involved, he was a little kid. He still remembers it. Right, he was adjacent

to the whole search yeah and hollis also um once dan over time inherited it from his grandmother hollis went to dan's house and saw the cauldron and without like any questions just knew that it was ed gein's cauldron and he remembered it specifically because back before ed gein was known as a murderer hollis used to go to ed gein's house and with ed gein's parents he would use that cauldron to cook hog fat in the winters and he remembers lifting the cauldron or trying to lift it by himself to take it out to the shed and he recognized it without anyone so he was like i thought that thing was gone how did you find this thing or how why is it still next door is it here yeah why is it in this area so that's imagine like seeing something like that and thinking it's like long gone and then it's still next door to the murderer haunting you oh so now when he goes near the cauldron he says that he can

feel an incredibly dark energy near it and every time he goes he would go near the cauldron all of the hair on his arms and legs stand up on their own this is hollis hollis okay and he just wanted nothing to do with it and never saw it again so hollis also has a son named carneth a lot of wild names here so carneth was the guy other than dan that came on the show yeah oh okay okay so he was able to tell his dad's story. Sure. So one thing about that Carneth was able to say is that, uh,

his aunt Hollis, his sister actually almost got attacked by Ed Gein. Oh, on her own. And she ran into the house screaming for like someone to help. And her mom heard. So Carneth's grandma heard like her daughter almost getting attacked by ed gein and so she ran in with a shotgun and put it against his chest and said get out of here or die

and like he ran off the fuck but then imagine like still having to live next door to that guy yeah and he's just always around still so anyway when hollis was part of the recruited neighbors that were cleaning out this house, he apparently told his kid, and he also told Dan before he died, that when he was in there, he saw bodies hanging everywhere. He also saw two barrels and all of that was next to the cauldron. Oh, God. So in the barrels that were next to the cauldron, there was definitely blood and guts. So potentially there was also blood and guts used at some point

in the cauldron part of the cauldron but to this day nobody knows what the cauldron was used for it could have totally not been used for anything dark could have just cooked stew in there could have just cooked next to all the dead bodies but also it is big enough to definitely put body parts in and it's very large it's heavily rumored that it was also used right for that although there's no no way to confirm it so quick list of things that the police found oh god um which this also came directly from deadly possessions i just want to give credit because i'm saying it is this the same list i gave at the in the episode with like i don't know this is a quicker list oh okay it didn't have like the apron or anything. It's just some quick stuff.

There's a trash can made of human skin. There was a corset of a female torso that was skinned from shoulder to waist. Oh, my God. There was a suit made of women's skin. Oh, my God. So he could dress up and become his mom. Yep. There was a whole head in a burlap sack.

And the owner of the head, her heart was in the stove right next to it obviously classic nipple belt and um there were lips on the window shades yep and to like pull them down with the lips and my personal i didn't think he was going to mention this one but my the one that i always think of is the lampshades made of faces. Oh, no. And then you mentioned the apron. There's truly such an extensive list that, like, everything that Zach wrote. And there's photos of it. It's horrible.

Really. I mean, bravo on how well documented it is, though. Yeah, because it's so twisted. But still, it's so dark. So, fun fact, if you can find one. Fun dark fact. Fun fact. So fun fact, if you can find one, fun dark fact, is that Hollis actually saw something that has never been reported on the police list, which was a nipple doorbell. Yep.

A female nipple doorbell. Wow. How? Just that nobody really saw this while it was happening? Or like there was just so much to write down on a list. He was like, no. He was gripping her chest. Not today, Satan.

Not today. Anyway. So. Gross. If you can imagine a fun fact in this, there it was. Sick. So while the police were cleaning out the house, the neighbors were cleaning the garage where the cauldron was.

And Hollis, Dan's dad, Dan's brother-in-law, Dan's cousin, and a couple other people all helped to lift the cauldron and move it out of the garage. But they are the only ones who ever physically touched the cauldron while everyone cleaned that place. Within 18 months, all of those people were dead. What? In different ways. Wait, wait, you said including Dan? No.

Dan's dad, Dan's brother-in-law, and Dan's cousin. Oh, no. What? And then Hollis and then people that they lived with. So, like, the energy, like, almost, like, followed them home. So, Hollis, too. They all died? Mm-hmm.

Oh, no. So, some of it could have been easily explained away. Some of them were just older and probably died of old age. Some of them died of cancer. But others, such as Dan's brother-in-law, he literally died just walking upstairs. And he, like, was relatively young. Like, he just dropped dead.law. He literally died just walking upstairs. And he was relatively young. He just dropped dead. Fuck.

His cousin died from surgery complications that could have easily been avoided. His mother, 10 days after an accident where she fell out of a wheelchair, she just fell out of her own wheelchair, and then she died 10 days later. Oh, my God. While keeping the cauldron in his house,

Dan saw himself getting really, really, really sick for a long time. And he thinks that the energy might have seeped onto him. What do you mean he saw himself? Like he just felt really sick. Oh, I thought you meant like he had like a vision or something. Oh, I mean, that's a reasonable, that's a reasonable thing to think because I said that. But no, he just, he got sick. He found himself to be very sick.

Got it, got it, got it, got it. Once, once the cauldron had left his area, he, he didn't got sick. He found himself to be very. Got it. Got it. Got it. Got it. Once once the cauldron had left his area, he he didn't feel sick anymore. Wow. But apparently Carnith from what Carnith, who's Hollis's son, from what he says, he assumes that the cauldron was used to cook organs and then either eat them or. Christ alive. Make things out of them. The cauldron, like I said said ended up at dan's grandma's house although this is the same grandma that pointed a gun at his chest at one point and oh

no that's carneth okay in my head they were the same grandma and i was like you almost killed someone because he attacked your daughter and then you take his cauldron how dare you no two different grandmas okay that was my bad that was my Anyway, so Dan's grandma took the cauldron and used it to put flowers in, made it a giant flower pot. Oh, how nice. Some carnations. And it's like a big cauldron. It is a big cauldron.

I know because I've been there and thought. Did not touch it, though. Did not touch it. And no one ever truly found out if anyone was cooking it. Although, like I said, the rumors are pretty heavy. though did not touch it and no one ever truly found out if anyone was cooking it although like i said the rumors are pretty heavy so dan had it in his garage and he always felt that there was a creepy feeling near it and he knew people were staring at him and sometimes he thought he saw shadows hiding behind the cauldron fucking hell in wisconsin in the area where ed gein committed

all these murders apparently it's still um it's potentially folklore but people are still really bitter about the whole story and they say that if you're talking about it out loud and give the story energy you're asking for a death wish so that was dan and carnith's story about the cauldron but they actually found or zach found um someone else who owned more of ed gein's possessions one of them was this girl courtney and her boyfriend derrick and courtney's parents used to live near the ed gein house and they in either inherited or just found ed gein's skis oh surprisingly not made of humans we're all uncomfortable so courtney and derrick apparently when they were younger they would

investigate the house and try to contact him which like i want to say what idiots but also me and deirdre used to do that all the time yeah i was gonna say it's like some shit you would pull i can't i really am not one to talk but so courtney would take pictures of derrick at the house and derrick would say that he felt someone there it was always female um he said he would like be able to tell like whether it was on his left side or his right side or behind him or in front of him. But they would ask like they would say, hey, take a picture with us. And Derek would stick his arm out as if someone like sticking his arm around someone. Oh, like a like a friendly.

Yeah. OK. Like arm around a person. I thought it was like elbowing them. And when they ended up seeing the pictures afterwards there was like definitely a mist body standing there and in multiple pictures the mist had moved from left to right wherever derek said that he felt it no um so zach baggins was very interested in this enter zach he says that it's very interesting that you know they feel like there's a they have a

connection to ed gein especially because these skis the skis belong to courtney's parents and the parents were actually supposed to come on the show but then the day before they were supposed to be on the show or like that morning or something courtney's sister had a stroke and what and so courtney and her boyfriend went on the show on behalf of her parents because her parents had to be at the hospital the fuck but courtney did make sure to say my parents believe it's because ed gein was pissed and like didn't want them to talk about him or something like that how fucked up is that and so like what are the odds that like someone who's like in her 20s and healthy and all that just had a stroke intervened somehow yeah like didn't want sick so that being said courtney and derrick came on and zb was all about it of

course he was and so he said well since you guys feel like you have a connection and i have the cauldron here how about we get out the spirit box and like maybe like the energy will like all you know mingle so apparently there were massive spikes on the emf when near the cauldron and the spirit box got the word evil and then a door slammed oh on camera and then uh there was another they asked what is attached to this cauldron and the spirit box said death great and apparently the voice that kept coming out was a female voice i didn't know that because the video was warped and it sounded like a man but they were like this female voice and i was like was that a female wish that was my fucking voice um so uh the female voice from the spirit box this was kind of an

interesting point that zach had is that because um because Ed Gein always dressed up as a woman and maybe potentially wanted to to be female at some point, maybe his voice is female in the afterlife. And so even though he's maybe you're talking to one of his victims or he's disguising himself as a female. So my identity or whatever. Yeah. Or it might or he might not identify as female, but he's still pretending that he has a female voice, so Zach and Courtney would feel more safe to talk to him. Ew, that's the creepiest option of all.

Yeah. So they asked the questions specifically for Ed and said, do you like that other people own your item? And in a female voice it said no so now it makes you think like oh that just gave me chills i like to think of it in like the happy gender identity way of like maybe in your afterlife you like finally pick here you finally sound the way you always wish you did i don't know i'm trying to like good let's be happy for ed keen i don't know i'm trying to make lemonade right now i'm trying to make transgender lemonade man um so you always trying to make transgender lemonade

i'm i like citrus and i like lgbt rights and sue me put them together and what do you get you get ed gein in the afterlife oh so uh then they said do you like that the cauldron is going to be in this building with other dark energy? And the answer said, the spirit box said yes. They ended up stopping the interview. And right before they ended, Courtney said that she started to feel pain in her back. Oh. And she sensed that someone was standing behind her. Oh, good.

So that's that on that for the Ed Gein cauldron is that on that baby okay we are 50 done oh god all right sorry no you're fine okay so the next one is the bella lugosi mirror okay this i don't remember much about so i'm excited and like a like a yeah anticipation yeah i'm like i remember it being creepy but i don't remember the details well i had a good time with this one because this episode on youtube was warped in a way where the voices were sped up. And so not only was it faster to watch, but ZB sounded like a normal person. So they were like, this is a male voice.

And I was like, well, instead of talking like this, he finally talked like a normal person. And I was like, wow, Zach. All right. Who knew it only took a little bit of speeding up to make you sound like a normal person and i was like wow zach all right who knew it only took a little bit of speeding up to make you sound like a fast forward okay so the bella lugosi mirror i'm personally a very big bella lugosi fan because i my dad had me watch abedin casella growing up and in the movie abedin casella meet frankenstein aka one of my favorite halloween movies right bella lugosi is in the movie and so that's where i first ever saw him but he is known like he's known known in hollywood as like the main guy to have ever played dracula right okay okay now i'm

remembering um to a point where he's so famous for playing dracula in several movies and several like everywhere like if there was like an opportunity to cast a Dracula Bela Lugosi was the guy sure um so famous for playing Dracula that he's buried in Hollywood Cemetery in a Dracula cape yes place brought me there on our haunted on my birthday to the like haunted cemetery tour yeah yeah okay cool so we're all I remember that so in bella lugosi's house there was a producer that lived with him named frank selechery frankenstein no close dracula is that who he played um i don't remember you said it 30 seconds ago who does he play well he doesn't play anyone he's a producer no the other guy oh bella lugosi plays dracula i said frankenstein never mind frankenstein is

buried in a dracula but he met frank he met frankenstein in the halloween movie yes okay well in abedin casella it's misleading because it's abedin casella meets frankenstein but they actually meet frankenstein dracula and werewolf okay so yeah i was very confused about and then they also at the end meet the invisible man all right spoilers god look it came out in the 40s if you haven't seen it yet you clearly don't want to see it i have 30 more years before our 100 year mark okay give me some time um so frank seletri was a producer that lived in bella and bella's house and the person who actually showed up on the deadly possessions show was that producer frank's niece were they like together or did they just no i know no no that's a good question but no i think they were just like

roommates i mean it's all like you say you can be as like i mean it's a 40s as you want roommates i don't know fair fair fair but okay i'm just curious okay um who knows is really the answer to that got it got it got it so frank lived in the house and his niece cindy is the one that inherited the mirror over time and now she's donating the mirror to zach on the show got it so frank was murdered in 1982 oh god in a house and just for everyone to feel a little more interactive with this when we went on the tour this is in the room with several um haunted paintings oh yeah and it currently when he when the tour guide is talking about this it is covered

with a dark black drape so that you can't look into it by accident it's so creepy and then he tells you the story of what happened and then one by one says if you would like to leave you're more than welcome to but i'm about to take off the drape and you you know have the opportunity to look into the mirror like one-on-one basically one-on-one and you you know have the opportunity to look into the mirror like one on one basically one on one and then you can leave the next person will look in the mirror after that i think renee was like i'm out oh i think eva too yeah even in like eva renee and like maybe two other people were like bye y'all he was like i deal with enough of this shit every thursday night i don't need more yeah right he was like i get paid uh somewhere else i was like we didn't make her sign a waiver or anything we can't have even you're more than

welcome to leave but also please don't ever fucking leave sign a waiver first um so frank was and you're gonna remember as soon as i give you some of the details so frank selecci the woman's uncle he was murdered in bella lugosi's house in 1982 um it is suggested that it was a mob hit although they never found the guy that actually killed him um but the niece personally thinks it must have been a close friend because there was no like didn't look like there was any foul play or anything okay so true to form zach asks for details on her uncle's death um really slowly really slowly um and this is what you're gonna remember so okay frank they found frank on his knees leaning against his bed it's like his basically his face was on top of the mattress while he's leaning up on his knees oh

god someone had you ready for your memory to flip ready someone had taken a screwdriver to his knees and elbows oh i remember screaming bloody murder about this um i don't like that at all m someone took a screwdriver into his driven into his knees and elbows all right and then uh they shot him in the head and then they tried to remove the bullet with the screwdriver oh my god i do remember this i was like i'm not gonna remember that yep i remember he was found days later and the mirror was in the room that he was murdered in well no wonder it's fucking haunted so people think that the murder was and i think he actually said this on the tour

the murder was the or the mirror was the only witness to the murder. It just gave me chills. It's so cheesy, but it gave me chills. I remember him saying that too, yeah. Yeah. So, and supposedly mirrors are portals and they capture energy. And so the fact that it bore witness to that, you know, it could carry some dark stuff.

And then I literally, I want you to read it so you know that i'm not kidding or like pulling a joke what is the next the highlighted note that i have it says then zach goes on a tangent and here's my edition just like m does zach and i are one i think that's why I like kind of really love him. You relate. Yeah. Then Zach goes on a tangent highlighted in green. So Zach goes on a tangent where he explains how mirrors are rumored to be portals. I feel like you and I hate him because we're like. I hate him because he's so much like me. We want to hate him.

It's like I'm half Zach Bagans and half Michael Scott. And I really. What a great combo. And I don't know which one I hate to love more. You hate to love them. Right. Yeah. Love to hate. Yeah. I don't know which one i hate to love more you hate to love them right or yeah love to hate yeah i don't know what it is but i get it i want people to fear me so much that they love me okay so zach explains how mirrors are rumored to be portals and then he talks about scrying where you can um it's basically like a meditation practice where you look into the

mirror long enough and you see another form of yourself or you can see the future i'm terrified i used to do that and it scared can you when i was really little stuff yeah and it scared the shit out of me what would you see when i was really little one time i stood into a mirror for like 30 some minutes and my face completely changed to something else and it started to scare me so badly but i couldn't look away and then it felt like there were other people behind me and i was just watching myself i mean i was like six well and i'm still terrified of it i i mean i did the first time i actually ever heard about this was in one of my classes because i said psych and so they there was a whole lesson on like mind games and my i just always assumed it was my brain yeah and if you stare at something

long enough then supposedly you just start seeing because your mind makes like connections and yeah yeah so there is that theory and i think i just like to happily use that excuse so i don't have to believe in this stuff but mirrors do kind of freak me out like even though knowing now like that was fully in my own mind it was very creepy how your face can mutate like in front of your eyes. It's very, very scary. So he also so he talks about scrying and how a lot of people will actually do that during dark rituals. Oh, God. And some my five year old self is like, yep, on it. Damn.

You're really prepping for this podcast. I told you I threw myself in front of vans. I had a really rough time. People claim that they can see supernatural beings they'll see versions of themselves that look a little off things like that apparently bella lugosi practiced the occult which makes sense if you're gonna be like the poster child for dracula that's a very fair point and so this was the tangent is that this is entirely made up assumption, but potentially if Bela Lugosi did practice the occult like it's been on record and if he did scry using a mirror and he did use that mirror, then perhaps he could have opened it up as a portal to collect energy and then it happened to be the only witness to a murder so like so it had been already opened up to the energy and then it would have already been used as something to go back and forth in a different world well now i need you to say it a lot slower and a lot more dramatically

i don't want to it wasn't the full effect too long um so basically the idea is that the killer's energy could have gotten trapped in this mirror portal if the mirror had ever been previously used as a portal okay um so then zach was like cindy like have you while it's been in your possession have you ever experienced anything and cindy's daughter who actually refused to be on the show because apparently the mirror has fucked her up so much oh she said she brought the mirror with her when she moved out of the house and when she would look in the mirror has fucked her up so much. She said she brought the mirror with her when she moved out of the house, and when she would look in the mirror, she would see a black figure standing behind her playing with her hair.

What? Oh, God. She would feel her hair getting played with, and she would feel it hit her shoulder as if someone dropped her ponytail or something onto her back. She would also see this being, this black shadow, climb out of the mirror. Fucking hell. She would see it three-dim black shadow climb out of the mirror fucking hell she would see it three-dimensionally climb out of the mirror and like actually like just like in a movie see

the hand come out first and like hold on to the wall and pull itself out of the mirror and she could see um she would feel it bite her neck what which interesting duality since it's Dracula. Very. So that is just further proof that maybe this guy who was known to play Dracula might have used this mirror during some dark stuff and there was some remnant of him left or a sign that he was around. And that is just beyond creepy. No wonder she didn't want to deal with this on TV. God. Well, so she was so scared that she actually moved back home and moved in with her little sister.

Like, moved into her childhood home where her 14-year-old sister still was. Got it. Okay. I mean, I did that, too. I just had student loans. Everyone's scared of something. Everyone's scared of something. So her sister Irene actually did come on the show and talk on

behalf of her sister and said that her sister never wanted to be alone ever never wanted to be near any mirrors and eventually told irene about the figure that she saw and said that she would actually see the hand reach out and grab her and she would feel it with the fingers wrapped around her what the fuck the sister they'd also never used her name so i just have to keep saying sister sure the sister began seeing oh so after the sister told irene what she saw in the mirror the sister um irene after irene had been told irene began seeing things herself and her older sister asked to like go to a priest she has to go to counseling nothing worked she just had this like consistent paranoia and apparently it became a regular piece of like

daily living in their lives they just always talked about this mirror and what they saw so the mirror stayed in the house for years after that but just like hidden somewhere and then um irene who had never seen any had never seen anything really scary or never experienced anything too wild she moved out and as soon as she left their bedroom became vacant and so um their parents just put the mirror in that room since no one was in there and irene came to visit and stayed in her room no and she hadn't made the connection yet she didn't realize that she just thought she felt really uncomfortable but she excused it off as like oh i don't live here anymore it's weird that i'm home right sure so she went to bed and woke up from a nightmare of some black shadow attacking her and holding her down good it had

a solid black face and hands and it was scratching her non-stop she woke up with scratches all over her body okay in places she could have not reached including the center of her back okay and all the scratches had broken skin oh the mirror apparently likes people talking about it and it feeds off the energy shut the fuck up right now stop it i mean i don't know if that makes sense to other people but do you know what i'm talking about like i can't i've felt that before we're like if you're talking about something and oh a hundred percent whatever's there is definitely you're both feeding off dark and it likes that you're talking about it totally so as the interview is going on she kind of got more and more shaky because she could feel that it enjoyed you're giving it power by talking about it sure exactly yeah so basically the final theory out of that interview was that the killer after

after killing frank um looked in the mirror and became possessed to kill frank beforehand or after the murder um he became connected to the mirror you know i mean like he might have looked in a mirror that had bad energy became possessed and killed someone which would make sense since it was a potentially a close friend since they were already in the house in the same house and they never figured out who did it right right wow so it could have been possessed beforehand and then killed him or killed him and then part of his energy stayed in that room and attached to the mirror or even if someone else did it it could have still been a part of yeah it could have still been what what did i say like the wit the mirror like bore witness to it it could still have taken

the negative energy right um i liked you saying my notes so much. I'm going to make you do it again. What do you mean? This was the final part of the interview. Zach goes up to the mirror and then can you read the next part? Oh, this part. I like this. I feel like I'm in like a school play. Okay. Okay. Well, get ready. This is basically at the end of a really dark, heavy interview. In classic Zach Baggins, slow, deep voice. This is what happens. classic zach baggins slow deep voice this is what happens zach baggins looks intimately looks intimately into the mirror and asks it quote what is inside of you wait wait hold on he looks intimately into the mirror he goes what is inside of you the frick what the frick man that's what

zach says in bed that's what she said but it's zach that's what zach says um god we're gonna get sued in bed it's like a fortune cookie but anyway he said he's he said what is inside of you and i lost my mind because i just thought it was like i mean it's like definitely something i personally asked in my mind i was like what is going on with that mirror but like just hearing it out loud I was like this is funny yeah but if we asked the mirror we'd be like what the fuck is wrong with you not like what is inside of you so okay so he didn't experiment which is a very um I'm just gonna I'm just gonna keep going there hang on it's the final part I need to like really zen myself out so there is an experiment that he

decided to do with this mirror where he would put it in downstairs okay so you both were there i don't know eva ran away which i'm kind of regretting i didn't so all right so do you remember walking through the house and then there was like technically a basement where there were like a it was chained off stairs and then our tour guide said only Zach goes down there with like. Oh, there was that creepy doll at the bottom. Yeah. Yes. There was a creepy doll down there.

And he said they use that as a seance room. Only like the most. Like professional. Like professional like psychics. Right. Go down. Investigators. Only like a very elite amount of people are allowed to be there.

Because apparently there's something so dark down in that basement that zach does not want anyone messing with it right well before they found that out and i knew because in the show they had footage of what's going on in the basement because clearly like they didn't know how dark it was yet yeah so apparently that basement used to be an isolation chamber oh where like that made by zach and his crew where they would put haunted things down there and experiment and like study i see I see. I see. I see. So he put the mirror down in the isolation chamber and then he recruited some of his crew members to go downstairs in the empty room in the basement by themselves and stare into the mirror and then like report back on like what they saw. Okay. Oh, God. Can you imagine? Including a PA on her first day.

That's just mean she like he was like okay so he made her stick her hand up and like swear that she gave permission for this i bet imagine your first day and you're like oh i'll never be on camera and then bam i have to be in an isolation basement oh she was film doing this yeah they put her on camera they had like aaron and like who's the most vulnerable person here? They were like, oh, this is your first day? Come on. Who's getting paid the least amount of money? Right.

So Ashley and Aaron, who are regulars on Ghost Adventure. Yeah, I got in trouble last time for mixing up like Nick and Aaron. Listen, I don't know. I don't watch the show. Sorry. Ashley and Aaron at separate times, they all went down there individually and it was recorded their reactions and all that they both heard scuffling and they both saw the

same lights moving behind them at the same like in the same way like afterwards they both talked and was like it was on your right wasn't it yeah it was on the right and it was like moving in a certain way where it was like it should have been it should have been um i guess like the light should have been dimming but if for some reason was getting brighter in one section only of the room and they both were like, I thought like that, that part of it was over. I thought you were like giving us like a light signal to like come upstairs.

I was going to say, was it Zach standing there with his cell phone? No, but like if you watch the recording that there's no light going on, like they were just, they just saw it. Well, basically Zach had them essentially scrying where they were just sitting there

staring into the mirror and they both over time, both saw light moving behind them in the same way. Especially especially in the dark if you stare into like it's have you ever stared into the mirror in the dark that's even worse your it's contorts your whole face so they both heard scuffling and saw the same lights um ashley saw herself but something seemed off yeah and aaron saw himself as really old like he says he he saw himself very, very old. Yuck. The PA was a little homey and didn't see anything and just didn't flinch, wasn't scared.

She just kind of blankly stared until someone called her up. She was like, I'm going to get out of here. So they left the mirror in the basement overnight and they came back the next morning and the basement had flooded. What? And Zach Bagans had all the, he like took a video on his phone and they put that footage into the show.

And it's truly like at least a foot of water is in there. And you can hear the wildest banging. Like, not just like little taps, like something is pissed. Was it the pipes? It was not pipes. Whatever that sounded like, it was not pipes. But like, it was like, it sounded like someone's taking a baseball bat to a garage door like it sounded like obvious like i want you to know that i'm here rattling what the fuck and then zach even said like what was that sound and then it happened

again i don't know i am a sucker for like believing in anything paranormal so i'm like all for it um you know they don't never mind but basically there was i'm not gonna say anything don't don't drag me down they can't make sound effects in post it's not like that's the thing anyway the the floor was flooded and they were very creepy several especially because they wouldn't have they wouldn't have willingly flooded their own place right with that's just yeah and the only thing down there was the mirror so very creepy and that's that on that oh god that was a lot man i know i gave you guys a lot of information i'll tell you what and we used to have this these mirrored doors back here glad they're not here now and it broke last week

so blaze removed it thankfully so there's no reflection behind me anymore but it used to creep me out to have the mirror behind me i don't i'm not into it well I I don't have a lot of mirrors in my house either probably for that reason well they're creepy all right my turn yes okay this is the story of David Edward Most and I hadn't heard of him actually until I did these notes so yeah I don't know who that is so he's it's a pretty fucked up story not that that should be a surprise to anybody right um so this guy david he was born in connellsville pennsylvania in 1954 and uh although his name has amish origins he was not raised amish but he was in that part of pennsylvania or like the pennsylvania amish or pennsylvania dutch um his father divorced and left the family when he was seven.

And according to records, his mother was diagnosed as psychotic. And she had David confined to an institution when he was only nine years old, claiming he set fire to his younger brother's bed and then tried to drown him in a local lake. Oh my God. But this is disputed because his mother was also not considered a reliable witness because she had a lot of mental health issues.

Right. And so that's kind of like a little bit wishy-washy. But nevertheless, he was sent to an institution at age nine. And that kind of set off like a whole series of terrible behaviors for the rest of his life. He later said that the institution was filled with children who were there more often than not because their family members were mentally ill and couldn't or wouldn't take care of them which is just like a drop-off center yeah for a lot of people um so that's just really heartbreaking and for that same reason he felt that his mother had dumped slash abandoned him there so for the rest of his life he kind of felt like he had been abandoned by his own family um and so to his credit staff at the institution

did not observe like the lying and stealing and out of control behavior that his mother had accused him of. However, he did have an early history of violence. He choked two of his friends, didn't kill them, but choked them like pretty severely when for no apparent reason when he was young. And he explained about one of them. He's like, yeah, we were just watching TV and I took a rope and just started choking him. You know what? One time. I'm sorry. One time. I don't like where this is going tangent one time this is like one of my mom's favorite stories of when she was a little kid which makes her sadistic in her

own way oh god um she was a little kid but like old enough to know it was right from wrong and her older sister was watching tv and had like a like spaghetti strap shirt so like her like shoulder was showing and i guess my mom was really hungry or something but she just saw my sister's shoulder or her sister's shoulder and was like that looks like a really good piece of meat and like just what the fuck down as hard as possible what the fuck and then like and she remembers it so vividly because she remembers as it was happening she was like what the fuck am i doing and she was like six like five or six punched in the face yeah well i think that's probably what happened but she remembers like just biting her with all her might like just to see what would happen and i think that was when my mom like she had her her aware her awareness came in and she was like

i need to stop this well it's interesting because i feel like that could go one of two ways like one like this is not good or two like great this is the rest of my life now i will now bite people i'm glad that out of like 50 50 chance like we we went the right way your mother's not a cannibal it's great right but she she remembers specifically biting in and there's so much of that fucked up stuff when you hear about kids they do stupid shit to like practice such stupid shit like i'm i'm glad i decided no on all of those things yeah but you never know like if something's super enjoyable people uh just stick with it so anyway i you saying like oh they were just watching tv and he just he just looked over and thought this is a good idea my mom's had that

exact same thought at some point apparently thankfully she went a different way than this guy yeah she stopped after one time so yeah it was it was a similar concept because he would look over and he said like he just felt like someone else was in his body and he like couldn't control and he's like i know this is my friend but i just couldn't control it which is just very sad so he um so he choked but not killed two of his friends for no reason and his brother remembered david beating a squirrel to death with a baseball bat for fun oh my god that's when you know things are not looking good that yeah that's that's when you know one of those signs where you're like let's let's start looking into doctors yeah let's uh let's get this treated asap i mean that also can

go one way either completely you hate it or like why did i sugarbush his mom sure yeah you're like i need to care for one squirrel for the rest of my life put her in a little tutu um the same brother also recalled that david had been molested at an early age by apparently a family member and they didn't reveal who yikes and then at this institution to his credit dav David was pretty well behaved. But he just was super despondent over his mother's failure to visit him regularly. So, like, it, like, really got to him that his mother kind of abandoned him. And that kind of was a complex that he built up.

Got it. And after he left the hospital or the institution, he came to live at a children's home where at age 13 he was molested by another boy okay um at the child home and so that children's home which again was another thing that added to his just like confusion about life and like struggle um and at one point he actually managed to escape and the first thing he did was go to a cubs game um where he later said chicago beat houston 12 to 8 uh okay which the only reason that's relevant is that a lot of his later memories, including the super violent ones, are like bracketed by detailed account of sporting events. Weird. He would like, yeah, like phrase what was going on around like the score, the Chicago Cubs score or like whatever.

I get that. NFL team was like he was just able to kind of map out what happened through sports scores which that was kind of interesting yeah so after the cubs game uh he returned home to his mother's house and he was again a teenager at this point and his mother had remarried and didn't want him at the house um and apparently quote she got a knife and was coming at me with a knife telling me to get out of her house right now or she was going to stab me whoa and then later she apologized and said i'm sorry i just don't want you in my house and i was reading like i'm sorry it's not me it's you yeah please fucking leave i mean yeah and like it sounds terrible but i was reading like um her statements later

and she was like you have no idea how scared i was of my own son like i tried so hard with him and then i can't even imagine he was so violent with his brother and with other kids that like i was scared to have in my own house and i was like that's actually really heartbreaking so yeah yeah and she knew he was supposed to be in the children's home so like he had clearly escaped and so it's kind of like a double-sided story it's hard to say who was in the wrong at that point um and so as a young adult like he finally got out of the home and he worked in construction for a while but he was fired after he crashed a company truck um which i feel like you know isn't that's a good reason yeah i feel like that could relate to plenty of teenagers you can't be surprised right not the worst thing so when he was 17 his mother took him to an army

recruiter and in 1971 when he turned, he enlisted in the army. He completed basic training at Fort Lewis and was stationed in Frankfurt, Germany. So while he was there, he served as a cook. And he was like pretty normal and like a good guy. And they, you know, by all standards. And he was apparently a really good bowler, too. And he averaged scores as high as 297, which is like super duper good. Yeah.

And he won a lot of awards and money in his Army Bowling League, which I feel like my stories always end up turning back to bowling leagues. I feel like you look for any excuse to talk about when we were both on bowling leagues. I have a complex about it because I was so bad that I think I just need to keep bringing it up to be like, I bowled one time. One day, if I talk about it enough I won't hate myself my average will go from 100 to 297 yeah yeah I mean I only did it to like date a guy and it didn't work so right right right I only did it for the Tom and Jerry cheese bowl I mean that's a better reason let's be honest yeah and a more successful one it sounds like um well i still have the bowling ball that's about as far as we got okay it is a little weird that we both have

our own bowling balls like i don't think that we should go bowling sometime with our old ass bowling balls i just feel like that would be exactly what we need to do okay when i go back home for christmas i'll bring back my bowling ball great all right cool even settled get a bowling ball oh you write that down even right down that you love bowling in case you forget because we will yeah I will remember I'm gonna ask her in a month like hey have you ever bowled before like a fucking asshole hey are you American never been bored on a rainy Sunday my stepmom used to be she's her favorite thing ever that i ever said which is just weird and embarrassing but we would like meet people when we were on ski trips or wherever we were and she'd go

christina people would say oh what do you you're from where are you from cincinnati oh what do you do there for fun and apparently one time when i was like nine i went i don't know i guess we go bowling and it was like her favorite line and so every time we met someone she'd be like tell them what we do for fun and i have to be like i guess we go bowling i mean isn't that what cincinnati is known for and it became like this horrible joke and i was like this is just embarrassing and sad anyway i guess we go bowling so we'll talk about it in like five more episodes it's fine we'll talk about it again and again and again so don't worry we're never gonna give it up um anyway speaking of bowling in germany that's when he committed his first murder.

Wow. So according to... It's really fucked up. Oh, my God. Let's get dark, guys. Transition. Whoop, whoop, whoop. According to David's diary, he...

Okay, this is just where it gets... Bananas. Yeah. He awoke in his room to find a boy he had befriended named jimmy sleeping naked on top of him and he was also undressed okay and at that point he kind of flipped right and a month later he invited this boy named jimmy on a moped ride no jimmy no not good uh in a nearby forest and while they were out kind of near the woods, he took a knife out, led the boy into the woods where he tied him to a tree and beat him. Homophobia is a great, a great, great thing, isn't it?

Yeah. Yeah. It's not not pretty. That's kind of the thorough line of this whole. So is he. Do we know if he's gay? I mean, it sounds like internalized homophobia. It's at the fucking max.

I think that's exactly what it is. And when he was younger, like he'd also been like victimized by a a lot of teenage boys so i don't know if there was like a so he might have still not known a trauma traumatic thing i'm not sure what the what the right what it was but he does say later that like yeah it was usually boys he was attracted to that he would got it feel just like anger toward just very sad sounds like internalized homophobia exactly um so he beat this boy up with his fists and then a board and then um carried him further into the woods and buried him under some leaves uh and he died and then apparently he revealed in his diary later that he had promised himself nearly seven months earlier that he would kill jimmy when the

boy had grown out his hair maybe he was attracted to it maybe like you got a new hair right maybe maybe he said quote i thought to myself at that moment that when jimmy gets long hair i'm going to kill him when i killed jimmy on that day jimmy had long hair geez my thought was like i mean maybe if he grew out his hair he was looking kind of girly he was being effeminate and obviously you should kill gay people and he must have known he was going to grow out his hair if he's like oh in seven months when he grows out his hair or what like yeah he must have maybe jimmy said like oh i plan on growing it right weird very weird very psychologically disturbed um gosh so about a month later his

body was found in a bomb crater and a friend of a friend of his a friend of david's revealed that and said um that uh sorry david's defense lawyer argued that the boy died after he crashed the moped because apparently he said some teens threw a screwdriver into the spokes of the tires and that's how Jimmy died. So basically, David said it was an accident. So David was convicted of manslaughter because prosecutors couldn't find any witnesses and just couldn't find the right proof they needed. So he was sentenced to three years in jail for that. Okay.

And he was sentenced in Leavenworth, Kansas. in jail for that okay and he was sentenced in leavenworth kansas so after he was released from leavenworth uh david's behavior got worse his mother said her said that david would visit her after he got out of jail and she once said he came down to our place with a friend before two or three weeks or were up he stabbed that same friend in the stomach and pulled the knife all the way up oh my god yeah so that's again his mother's like this is what happens when i'm like letting him come be close to me or whatever like she just didn't know how to handle him so do you think do you think something might have happened in prison that like made his behavior exacerbate or? Yeah, I don't know. I mean, it sounds like this was just something that was kind of already happening.

Yeah. Because it sounds like he got close to this first boy and then it just went. I understand. You know? I hear you. Because this was another friend. She said he brought his friend over and within two weeks that friend was dead too, which is just like. Do you think he might have been attracted to that friend too?

Maybe. Maybe. Yeah, I don't know know that's a good point like as soon as he develops a crush he like hates himself for it and so he gets rid of the problem yeah you know what i'm saying he like gets that anger it's really messed up geez yeah in 1979 in his apartment in chicago david also stabbed a close friend while he was sleeping so yeah maybe it's a similar these guys don't even have a chance they're just they're not even doing anything wrong just sleeping no and then he was tried for attempted murder um in 1981 so two years later he uh decided david decided to find and kill the 13 year old boy who had molested him at the

children's home so he decided now is my time to like get revenge basically so um he went on a mission to find this boy, and he was unable to find him, but instead he found 15-year-old Donald Jones and decided to kill him instead. Okay. Which is, like, it's one thing if you're getting, like, revenge for, like, being victimized.

Like, somehow you can rationalize that. Yeah, but, like, you can't just find someone else and be like, hmm, he'll do. Like, that's not how that works. Weird. I wonder if he was, like, just in the, like, did he look the same? Yeah, there must have been a similarity. He must have fit some sort of standard, I would think.

Or he was just desperate for someone to get the anger out or something. Yeah. So he decided to kill Donald Jones instead. He was eventually, God, drowned in a quarry, a local quarry. So David drowned this 15-year-old in in a quarry a local quarry so david drowned this 15 year old in a local quarry this same year in texas uh david stabbed a 14 year old boy was arrested and sentenced to five years for causing bodily injury to a child so the boy didn't die but he stabbed him and he was um jailed for that okay and this is an excerpt so the i think it was a chicago guardian no that's

wrong chicago the chicago tribune took so the chicago tribune got a copy of his diary from jail some of these excerpts explain like what was going on in his own head while all this was happening so um this is what he had to say when i got locked up in the army and then especially when i got locked up in 1981 i knew i should never be let out again i didn't know how to act around other people and i was never taught how to make friends and keep them when an inmate says he doesn't want out i hope that somebody listens so he was in jail and he asked to please not be released so in 1982 uh he was in jail in Texas and he was extradited to Illinois

for the Donald Jones murder of the 15-year-old. And a county sheriff wrote on a cover sheet of the extradition papers, bad guy, gacy type. Oh my God. Which is like bad news bears. Oh my God. It's not a good sign.

He was originally found unfit to stand trial and was held in mental health facilities and ultimately after those hospitalizations and roughly 10 years in jail awaiting trial david finally pleaded guilty in 1994 and was sentenced to 35 years but he received credit for the 12 years that he had already been held and time off for good behavior what so he only served 17 years and was released in 1999 and then there was a fact sheet sent to the illinois department of corrections by the cook county state's attorney office that said quote this inmate is most likely the most dangerous inmate you will ever house wow so the prosecutor urged that david be kept incarcerated but under

the law he was eligible for this early release which is when he wrote that passage of like, I'm begging them to keep me in jail. Right. But they were like, well, you're eligible for release. And he even wrote a five page letter to the Illinois Department of Corrections requesting to not be released from prison. But since he didn't meet the criteria to be placed in any other sort of facility, he was released. Oh, my God.

And even his family at the time was like what were they thinking like nothing good was gonna come of this like he killed next it's not good so he was released uh against his own wishes which i feel like i just did a story where somebody said the same thing that guy who like killed all those people you tell whenever guy who killed yeah that guy he killed all those people and he's like you can't release me or i'll keep doing this and they were like right i remember okay you're fine to go like i don't know who that was and then he immediately started murdering people it's like hello was it the the nurse one no it wasn't the nurse one it was the guy who

killed um like the woman and her two-year-old daughter and like he had all those weird friends oh peewee gaskins yes he would guess yeah and he was like no don't let me go and they were like you're fine geez yeah so the same similar story so in 2001 after he was released david hit an acquaintance six times in the back of the head with a metal pipe um but the guy wasn't killed and he survived so david wasn't prosecuted because the acquaintance although he did report the incident to police didn't want to press charges that just happened but he didn't get in trouble for that on he's like hitting people with a metal pipe and whatever i feel like if a guy who had already murdered several people hit me in the

head with a pipe i'd be be like, take him back. Yeah. I don't know. On December 12, 2003, David's arrested for the strangling death of James Ragani, age 16. Ragani's body was found encased in concrete in David's basement in Hammond, Indiana. Wow. That's a very Gacy move.

Yeah. Right. It's creepy. Wow. That was like keeping him in the basement. He like had that... He really wrote that into existence. That M...

Right? Gacy in the making or whatever? He's like, called it. Gacy type? Called it. He was later charged with the deaths of Michael Dennis, age 13, and Nick James, age 19, similarly wrapped in plastic, encased in concrete in his basement. In November 2005, he pleaded guilty for the three murders and was sentenced to three life

terms. And then in January, 2006, about a month after his last sentencing, David committed suicide by hanging himself in his jail. So, uh, jail employees found a suicide note in his cell in which he confessed to

five killings and apologized to each of the victim's families. And he was 51 years old at this point. And I think that's really interesting because I feel like so many of these killers just don't have that apologetic bone in their body. Like they maybe take their own life because they don't want to be punished by the law or whatever. But I feel like they want to be in control of what happens to them. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And I think this seems to be at least more of like a remorse thing. Right.

At least from the journal entries that I read, which is just so twisted. So the David Moss case helped lead Indiana public officials to pursue a state amendment that required a violent offender registry for convicted murderers. So basically, if the registry had existed back then, it might have reduced the chance of David's continuance of murder upon release because if people in the area knew that he was registered as a murderer, maybe these 13 and 15-year-olds wouldn't have been hanging out with him or been in the area.

So now Indiana Code Section 11887 provides that sex or violent offenders must register with local law enforcement. And the law defines a sex or violent offender as a person convicted of murder. Yeah, correct. Good job. All right. Good job, self. There's a lot of numbers on here. Okay.

And that law was enacted in July 2006. And as of this date, there are four lot of numbers on here okay um and that law was enacted in july 2006 and as of this date there are four types of offenders there are sexually violent predators offenders against children sex offenders and then violent offenders oh wow which are persons convicted of murder or voluntary manslaughter so like now they're required to register with local authorities and their presence is known in the area and there are two registry terms of enrollment so you can either be registered for 10 years depending on what you've been sentenced for or life you can be sentenced for life and the chicago tribune like i said has a copy of david moss 87 page diary which he wrote in prison and in 1983 just an excerpt excerpt that i found interesting um he wrote that he attacked more than

a dozen teenage boys killing two of them up to that point and that was like way before a lot of the murders took place right he described a blinding rage directed at boys that he felt affection toward yikes yeah and he continuously throughout his entire life pined for the love of his mother, which he felt he never got. Just toxic. He said, quote, what I done in my life is bad things to good people. I cannot remember the good things I did in my life, but I can remember the bad things. Because when you do one bad thing, it takes away the good. Wow.

So, I mean, he did seem to have a concept or a grasp of like he was he seemed to at least be aware that he knew these people like didn't deserve it yeah because i feel like even in the peewee gaskin story he was just like i don't know i feel like what do you say like it was a recreational weekend activity when i killed people like it was very much like charles manson said like killing people was like going to the drugstore like he wouldn't, he wouldn't think twice about it. Just like an errand. Right. Yeah. Exactly.

It was like, oh, if I see you and I want to kill you, I'll just do it and I won't even think about it later. Yeah. The only reason I'd think about it is if someone caught me. It doesn't matter to them. Yeah. And so this seems like it really got to him psychologically speaking, which I find really interesting. Yeah. It's not.

Even if it's like, even if he doesn't have the capacity to actually feel true remorse, he at least feels capacity that he should feel remorse. Yeah. It's not. Even if it's like, even if he doesn't have the capacity to actually feel true remorse, he at least feels capacity that he should feel remorse. Yeah. He knows what he's doing is not right, which I feel like is different from a lot of these like really psychopath killers. Yeah. So anyway, that is the story of David Edward Most. And I do have his Aries horror scope.

There it is. Aries is, I don't know is i don't know i don't know good one i'm sorry um here it is aries this is uh david here's your horoscope please don't come in here though i have my holy water where is it oh thank you next to my box of wine just make sure my wine and my holy water. Okay. David. A household member might toy with the idea of moving out or going away for a while. This could stress you out, but don't make yourself crazy.

Don't try to talk her out of it. Oh, boy. Oh, boy. Listen sympathetically and let your relative get it out of their system. This person is probably feeling temporarily restricted by forces outside the home and isn't really likely to go anywhere give them a break i was just thinking of his mother saying like get out of the house yeah oh my god wow anyway anyway how's that for you that's a good one i i what do we talk about now i don't remember

oh god we do this every week i know well sorry oh everybody i thought you were actually gonna go off on something there i was excited no just sorry to everybody sorry for doing this to you it's just as awkward at live shows by the way guys in case you're wondering like i wonder if they've got their shit together live no it's even worse because eva can't edit us it's we're really smooth at live shows oh yeah we take out our saxophones and just do jazz number we do get on the stage to pony so i mean if that's not smooth i don't know what is maybe we should go off the stage to pony maybe that'll fix our problem oh right i feel like getting on is really smooth and then at the end we're like so we're like see ya goodbye if anyone has a suggestion of what we should be doing yeah

help us i feel like a lot of people think that we think we're professionals we really just like i listen this is what happened i was at work and I texted Christine do you want to start a podcast I didn't say do you want to know how to get on and off of a stage in front of an audience but that's where we ended up so do you want the public to be writing reviews about you on the internet no I don't want that but here we are but here we are so if you have any ideas of things that we should also throw into the mix to make things seem more professional by all means give us a shout and please be nice because we're done with the mean mean things yeah um also before i forget like come see us live and i know i keep saying this but like we're posting stuff regularly and

i mean even if you are a few weeks behind and you hear this in a few weeks like we've probably added a few new shows um we have a lot coming up and i think my guess is that they're all going to be added like pretty close together because we have so many coming up i think it's going to snowball a big snowball right so um keep an eye out currently we only have available november 7th in philadelphia and it's low ticket warning so for all we know as soon as this comes out there might not be any left coming out this upcoming week nicole told me yeah i don't remember entirely what city but there's a city coming out this upcoming week listen it's in the emails i don't know okay so just keep your eye well look forward to that because i certainly do because i'm as clueless as you right now i don't

know what we're talking about join the secret atww group on facebook we talk about this stuff um you can do the rest i don't remember it i saw you really trying i you almost went for it instantly glazed over we should do kind of like in like a tv and like a tv set you know like they have like i'm just you know i was just on a tv you know on a tv set uh i was just on a tv set today so i feel like a talent um god you know how they have like teleprompter no they have like cue cards oh sure we should just like in really big letters get like the whole end right spiel and just have it like taped on the wall i think it's more fun when we both stare each other like uh do i get everything yeah anyway let's try it okay um if you want to spend any more of your free time with us

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so if you want to see us twice in one day if you're coming to hollywood improv that night then what's wrong with you um so yeah that will be our facebook live and um is that it i think that's it um i said a lot i know but i think that was that was the gist of everything and you know if we if you're at our live show on next sunday that's very exciting i just remembered that it was happening so good for all of us so um thank you in advance to everyone that comes and sees us and we're super excited to sell out la again that was very exciting yeah and it's going to be a wild day because also next week's episode comes out that day that's true you guys can listen to an episode of us, then watch us on Facebook Live, and then see us live. You can have a triple threat if you guys are all going to leave us.

Because you're going to be over it. You're going to be like, wow, I listened to an episode and watched you live on Facebook. I don't even want to come to your show tonight. No, I need something better to do with my time. And we don't blame you. So thank you for listening. Hope we didn't haunt you with that cauldron but if we did send us a story oh my goodness thank you guys thanks guys and that's why we drank clank