And The Writer Is...with Ross Golan - Ep. 187: James Blunt

Episode Date: July 22, 2024

Today’s guest is a songwriting legend who has knocked out seven albums over two decades, sold over 20 million records worldwide, and garnered countless accolades. After serving in the British Army, this writer's career launched into the stratosphere with one of the most evergreen evergreens ever. Following the success of his debut album, our guest continued on a streak of emotionally rich smashes — solidifying himself as one of the most prolific songwriters of his generation. However, it’s not just smashes that have kept this bloke relevant. This writer is funny as hell and his personality is a fixture on social media. All the way from the countryside in the UK, this family man’s humility and perspective shine a light on how authenticity is an artist’s most important quality.And The Writer Is…James Blunt! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to And The Writer Is with Ross Golan. There are millions of singers, thousands of artists, and only 40 songs per genre at a time. These are the stories of the hottest creatives, the most venerable legends, artists, songwriters, executives, and more. Follow our socials and share your music with the and the Writer is community. We'll see you all there and now. Here's this week's episode. Chartmetric is proud to sponsor the upcoming. season of and The Writer is.

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at chartmetric.com. Hey guys, I'm excited to tell you a little bit about one of today's sponsors, Peer Music. During a time of intense consolidation in the music industry, peer music's rich legacy is something that can't be bought. Peer music has been family run since it was founded in 1928. From its entrepreneurial roots, the company has grown into one of the largest and most respected independent music publishing and neighboring rights companies in the industry. They have 39 offices in 32 countries, so they are big enough to help your music reach the entire world. Peer music represents some of the biggest names in music, including our former guest, Poo Bear, David Lee Murphy, David Foster, Nothing But Thieves, Gabby Moreno, Cheyenne, the Trague, and

many, many more. And peer music neighboring rights represents over 300 record labels and more than 3,000 artists including Billy Elish, Imagine Dragons, Martin Garrick, David Gatta, Metallica, Megan the Stallion, Her, and Strom A. Delivering nearly 100 years of music publishing excellence, peer music is a trusted and widely respected leader in our music community. If you want to learn more, I recommend you go to at Peer Music on all their social media sites and check out PeerMusic.com. Hey, if you've listened to this podcast for the last few years, you know about LAMP. LAMP is the Los Angeles Academy for artists and music production located in Santa Monica a few blocks from the beach.

They have an incredible campus. They have common areas with the live stage and they host open mics, but most importantly, they have 15 recording studios with a world-class one-year intensive high-level music program founded by Stargate, our good friends and super producers who did sounds like firework and what's my name, diamonds, irreplaceable, think of Lamp as a nine-month high-level songwriting camp featuring world-class mentors that they've had, you know, Betty Blanco, Circuit, Emily Warren, Neo, Diplo, Diplo, Stargate themselves, Jimmy Nape's, Kenny Beats, they've had presidents of publishing companies, major A&R executives.

Super producer managers like Jay Brown, who has Rihanna. They have top-rated mixing engineers, vocal producers, lawyers, business managers, all kinds of business professionals that help you with a Wednesday, Thursday workshop that they're so known for. They've now been going on their fourth year. So if you want to learn more information about LAMPMUIC.com, that's lampmusic.com. Thank you for being fans of this podcast, LAMP, because we are fans of yours. Okay, cool. Welcome to And The Writer is I am your host, Ross Golan.

Today's legend has knocked out two decades of albums and accolades. His career was launched into the stratosphere with one of the most evergreen, evergreens ever. But it's not just smashes that have kept this bloke relevant. He's funny as how, and his personality is a fixture on social media. All the way from the countryside in the United Kingdom, This family man's humility and perspective shines light on how authenticity is an artist's most important asset. And the writer is my friend James Blund.

Thank you. You say the sweetest things. Okay. Some history, we've known each other for a while. I think the first time we worked together was probably almost 10 years ago. So we haven't caught up in a while, so I'm excited that we're doing this. and I think I'm really excited that you're putting out music the

just watched the new music video you just you're still putting out so much but it all started from being a wee lad so I want to tell a little story about you know I want to hear

how you became a human who are your parents My parents are old English, from old English background. My father is a colonel in the army. He's an army air corps helicopter pilot. And my mother is also from an army background. Her father was in the military as well. On my father's side, in fact, they've all been in the army through the generations.

We can date it back till 955 AD where they were still in somebody's army. I'm in Denmark. And as a result of that, I was always going to follow that path and join the Army too, which I did in the end. The Army paid for my schooling, assisted with my fees and through university while my father was sent abroad. You know, he was in Germany and Hong Kong, Cyprus, and as far afield as Yorkshire, which is in the north of England. And so I was at a boarding school from age seven. My parents dropped me off at this school and said goodbye. days later, I asked the matron, you know,

it was September when they dropped me off. I asked the matron, when are my parents coming back? And they said, she said at Christmas time. And in reality, you know, they just never called me back until I got famous, actually. What's it like? At that age, do you feel abandoned?

Or do you feel like, no, this is what English boys do? I think kids are so resilient. You don't really, you know, you don't have any questions. you know, they gave me a kind of, do you remember those Nintendo Game of Watches? It's like a fold open game. I played Donkey Kong, it was, and they gave me that. So I knew something was up because, you know, like it wasn't Christmas and it wasn't

my birthday and they'd give me a present. So I knew something was strange. But when, you know, they dropped me off and there's some other kids in this room and then they disappear, I suppose it's just a bit of confusion for a time. And also that age, you're seven years old. You don't really understand what time is. The notion of three months. months is too long for you really four months even, too long for you to work out what's what that

period of time is and that you no longer live at home unless it's the kind of holidays. So you just kind of get on and do the thing. And at the end of the day, you know, you mean to all with lots of other kids all the time. That's a bonus. Totally. I would think that being in a military family and going to a boarding school is the least creative way to, you know, being, you're just. not surrounded by creative people. I'm an idiot.

Yeah, totally. And I think you didn't hit the nail on the head. My dad, my dad thought that music was noise. So you didn't listen, you didn't listen to any music in the house or in the car or anything like that? Well, we did. They had three mainstay tapes. They had the Beatles' greatest hits, the Beach Boys' greatest hits, and the Donne

album. And, you know, that's pretty good basically. Yeah, totally. That's not bad. Yeah. I think if you're going to, if you're going to have anything, if there's the only things you're going to hear in the world, that's pretty much nailed it. And they also had in a, in a, in a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a song, wish you were here by Pink Floyd. And I kind of think, you know, that's the one that I found that they didn't like, they didn't listen to. And that's been, if you find that kind of thing, you think,

hey, what's this? That's the one you're suddenly interested in, even more so. Um, and that was the one I was kind of really blown away by even more so, and inspired, because it's, it's so, it's so ethereal and so dreamlike in its production and sound. And that was the most exciting one. Would you get in trouble for listening to music that wasn't sanctioned in the house? No, not at all. They just, we just didn't, we had one tape player. And, you know, they just would tell me to turn it off because they want to listen to the, you know,

watch the television and watch the news instead. But my mother was good. She still had music in her. She sings. She can sing. She has a beautiful voice. she knew that music is a gift. So she made me take up the recorder when I was very young.

No one makes a nice sound on the recorder. I can still can't make a decent sound on that. But the violin, she made me take up when I was something like, you know, five years old, and we would play with some other kids, play Hot Cross Buns with some other children. And there would be one of these buns on the table, and we'd all dance around it whilst playing hot cross buns on our violins. I mean, later in life I've discovered, this was probably us involved in some. kind of satanic ritual.

Yeah, it's like it. But you know what? It was the 70s. So that kind of thing is fine back then. And then when I was centerboarding school, they have, you know, these other classes you can take up.

And my mother said, you're going to learn the piano. And so I, I started doing grades with the piano. It's the most boring way of learning the piano. Like, you know, you've got some friends and you say to your mate, hey, do you want to listen to me playing Mozart,

Sonata, and F sharp minor? Most of your friends are going to say, no thanks. But also, like, if you combine the education of, you know, the Beatles and Mozart, you're also starting from a pretty good place of understanding the importance of melody and hooks. Exactly. So there are things in there that have definitely given me a little bit of where the music's at and the technicalities of music. But also, there's something else going on there, which is if your parents have left you, and then they live in a different country

and you're just in a school with only boys, mine's an all boys school, and these teachers are effectively your new parents, there's no outlet for emotion. It's a very, very emotionless place. You become emotionally stunted. And for me, that was also a gift in itself because I needed, at some stage,

I discovered music as a fantastic musical outlet. I couldn't express emotion. I didn't know what feelings were. I can't just, you know, describe that to you as, you know, boy to boy at that age. But I started, you know, having ideas and could express emotion through music. How did that, so when did you start? What's that moment? What's the moment where you're like, God?

Yeah, I was still at an old boy school, boarding school. At age 14, I saw someone playing the electric guitar. I saved up. I bought my own electric guitar. My dad said, why can't it be an acoustic guitar so it's quiet? But no, I really went electric. And this guy, he showed me the three chords I still know and are limited to. And, you know, and immediately I could,

immediately I don't have to play people with Mozart, Sonart, F shot minor. I can start playing them songs that I can hear on the radio. And that's exciting. And at the same time, you know, armed with those three chords, I can start writing my own musical ideas. And with musical ideas comes emotion. Music is emotion. You know, that's almost all music is is emotion.

A chord set aside beside another chord makes you feel a particular way. And with that would come a lyrical idea. And from that moment, I was starting to write songs. What's the first song you wrote? I think I didn't even have a title. It certainly was pretty crap. And I don't think I'll ever, I hope it never had, here's the light of day.

I've definitely played it to a record label. And they kind of, you know, gave me a pat on the back and said, thanks, but no thanks. Can you sing it now? Do you still know it? No, no, I can't. I'm not going near it. No, no. But do you actually have the, do you have the kind of memory that you can recall songs that you've written whenever? You know, I can't remember how to play songs that I released in 2003, you know? No, no, me. And actually, weirdly, as you start to get into the business and write more and more songs, you know, and for every album,

I, you know, right almost just shy of maybe 100 songs sometimes for a 10-song album. And then a few years later, a couple of, you know, I've heard a song of mine this, but then been released by somebody else and I just have no memory of writing it. You know, I just, I know it's my kind of lyrical style, but I just can't remember the song in any way, shape, a form. Right now, as a grown-up in sessions, trying to get to that emotional place is a much harder thing than it is. At that point, you discover songs are what allows you to be emotional.

And so those songs were good or not, those songs were outlets. And now once you get into album number five, six, whatever, you know, you're, you sit there and you're like, this is just a song, but there's no emotion in it. And it's so hard to find that. I know what you're talking about. And so, you know, my first album has all this, you know, misguided emotion and innocence and naivety, the questions of life, what am I going to do? Who am I going to be? Who am I going to meet? And those are huge questions of what your place in the world and you come up with a ton of

ideas and songs as a result of that. Then you have success and then you're just trying to fill the gaps and try to keep yourself relevant in the charts and keep the record label happy and all of the stuff that comes along with that. But I do think sometimes along the way things hit emotionally that will be just as good as those times. You know, I wrote a song on my last album for my father, who's been this amazing heroic man to me through all of my life, and suddenly he got ill, needs a new kidney, and suddenly I can, suddenly he's frail and he needs me to look after him,

and he's, my position changes instead of the one being cared for, suddenly I have to care for him in some way. Is that monsters? Exactly that. Suddenly, I'm writing a song that means more than any other song I've written for years. Joe and I were texting back the video from American Idol that I'm sure you've seen a million times. And I think all of us who grow up, you know, as a man to grow up under somebody who's, you know, your father is the guy. He's everything.

And it's really, it's a hard thing to, it's a hard thing to. it's a hard thing to grow up and there's a point where you have where you're I always say like aging gracefully happens on both ends of the spectrum I think we always think that aging gracefully is about somebody who's older who has to like grow up well but also like when you're younger

you have to learn how to how to listen and how to become a grown up and there's that transition that transition is that that song really eloquently talks about how to transition into being the patriarch in the family.

You've hit the nail in the head there. And so for me, that was one song in an album which I felt like I was returning to the songwriter with something to say for myself. And then what I found, you know, I'm just putting out a new album and it's called Who We Used to Be. And it is a nostalgic look back at that time

when I did have so much to say, so many questions. And I'm now at the stage of my life in the same stage as you are, where actually some of those questions have been answered. I know what my job is in life. I've been a musician for a period of time now, 20 years. I've met the girl of my dreams and I'm married her, and I hope she's going to stick with me for the rest of my life.

And yet, with that at the same time, more questions have started to come up now because of where I am. You know, my parents are older and frail. and I am starting to take that position in the world. And how does this next chapter start to play out? And so, yeah, so suddenly I'm inspired in a way that I haven't been inspired since I was a young man. Instead of writing songs about a girl I saw in a subway, who I saw for one second of my life, and I ran over to her saying you're beautiful.

Instead, I'm writing songs that are much bigger about the girl of my dreams who I married to. I can't say, you know, they're not lame songs just saying, hey, great, I married you and isn't it lovely and I'm going to be with you. I'm saying statements like, you know, all the love that I ever needed. I got it from you to her. You know, bigger statements than just saying you're beautiful. It's so interesting. The meta look at your career like that, that's what's allowing this new album to have such insight. and often when you work with somebody who's had 20 years of music, you know, you see,

you see them trying to grab onto the hit and not necessarily trying to grab onto that emotion. It did somebody teach you that? Are there, is there some producer, somebody manager, somebody in your life that was like, hey, this is how you're going to age gracefully? or is this natural to you to not want to write songs from that honest place? Yeah, I think I'm finding it myself. You know, a record label would always say, come on, you know, let's write the hit and let's aim for something on radio.

And at the moment I start writing a song for radio, I'm thinking about the audience. And if I think about the audience, some of them are going to want it to be the shade of black and some of them want to be a shade of white. And so I will just end up with a dirty shade of green. in the middle. But if I instead just write about what I understand and how I feel, about the person I've met, about the fears I have for my children, about the things that, you know, make me tick,

without anyone else in mind, without the record sale, the chart position, the radio play, but it's just an honest perspective, then those are the songs that people relate to because that's the human inside you, you're not in the business, but just being a human again. Going back to the story a little bit, from getting an electric guitar and starting to write songs and you said that first song you played for record labels, that's a huge jump from Here's a Guitar to Here's This is the music business. And nobody at that boarding school is like, you know what you should do?

You should go in the music business. So what's the synopsis of I'm in boarding school all the way to like, hey, you should go and meet with record labels? Yeah, I don't think anyone was ever telling me I should go to the record labels. No, of course not. I was telling them, I, there's something really, there's something really true that you can manifest, you know, something. If you believe in it enough and you act on it and you go out and do stuff,

you know, you need to actively write songs. You need to actively go out and live life. You need to go and pursue your dream. You know, you manifest it by action and self-belief. and sometimes really deeply naive belief, conviction. And I don't know, you know, how assured you were of yourself, but I just really said, I'm going to be a musician. I'm going to go out there and I'm going to be a famous musician,

you know, and I'm going to record albums and I'm going to be on a stage. And, you know, I had a vision of how it would be. It's slightly different from how it's turned out to be. I thought I was going to be on electric guitar with long hair playing kind of final countdown by Europe poisoned by house, Cooper. And you need a band to do that, and you need friends to form a band. I didn't have any of those. So I was eventually reverted to an acoustic guitar and wrote sad songs saying,

where are my friends? But, you know, that those sold, too. But I had that dream and I manifest it with an amazing naivety. If I didn't have that naivety, I wouldn't have been able to get the deal because you kind of need to say, yeah, I'm going to do this. And it's going to be easy. I'm going to find my way. I suppose if I had grown up in Los Angeles, it would be much harder because everyone in L.A. has the same dream.

And so it's tough to stand out from the crowd. But I stood out for the crowd because no one at boarding school was saying that. They all said they want to be an accountant and a lawyer. Yeah. The naivete when you start working or when you aspire to work in the music business, how essential that is is understated. because now you wouldn't necessarily call, you wouldn't cold call the heads of every record company

and be like, hey, you know, you should listen to this. And then when they hang up, you wouldn't call back. You wouldn't show up with this. You wouldn't do the things. You wouldn't do it now, but you would do it then. But then you'd be like, yeah, I mean, what's the worst thing that happens? I'm still broke. Yeah, totally.

And I saw a TV news clip about a new band who had been signed. and it listed the A&R man who'd signed them. And he walked record label. And so I wrote to that guy, pretending to be someone else. Yeah. And pretending that I'd met him. And pretending that I'd met him. I wrote in as a guy pretending my name was Johnny Blenkin.

You know, when can I play you some music? and the guy called my parents' house saying there's a guy called Raz for me, am I? He wants to speak to your friend Johnny Blenkin. And, you know, so you're prepared to do anything to get yourself through the door. Yeah, it's your story, not mine, but I did the same thing.

One of my dear friends, Mike Thompson, and I used to say I'm Mike Thompson from Raw Songs Records, which was a made-up record company. And I had this book called The Yellow Pages of Rock that existed in like the 90s, and probably maybe before that, and they would have direct lines to everybody in the business. But it was like a $2,000 book,

and so somebody gave me theirs from maybe 1996, and this is year 2000. So you're just calling these numbers, and I don't know who any of these people are. I wish I might have it somewhere, but it's just crazy to, you just direct dial and be like, hey, I'm Mike Thompson,

and I end up with a bunch of meetings with people just lying my way in. So you go, that's funny. I actually don't know anybody else who did almost the exact same thing. That book, that book is a bit of memorabilia gold. Yeah, totally. Did Raz, is Raz the guy who signed you? No, he didn't.

I got myself through the door. I brought a guitar. I played him through half a song. He stopped me halfway through and he said, hey, hey, you've got to listen to this. And he reached over to the tape record. He pressed something, you know, a button and it started playing. some music and over the top of it was a guy talking, you know, who's kind of just speaking over the top of some music going, I was walking down the street, you know, thinking I can't remember my name and all I was thinking in my heart was cocaine. And that's, you know, what Raz played me. And then we said goodbye and that was pretty much it. But I felt, you know, it was a step into the door and I can get myself here.

and there were other times I used Johnny Blankin again to get myself into Is that totally made up or was there someone you knew? He was a friend of mine called Johnny Blankin. Does he know this story? He does. He got me using his name got me into many, many doors, different lies. So I mean obviously we don't have to talk about

your beautiful too much because you've done a million interviews about it. But the short of it, of going from I have a record deal, I'm in the music business, did you think that when you record it, we're like, this is a smash? Did you think that was even the single?

Yeah, I think when I finished writing it, I'd seen the girl in a subway, I went to the army barracks, I wrote the lyrics in about a minute and a half. And then I flew to Los Angeles where I was doing some demos, with a guy called Sasha Scarbeck.

And we heard, he went into a coffee shop on the way back to the airport to buy himself a coffee. And I heard Las Siena just smiled by Ryan Adams on the radio. And as it started, as you hear the introduction to that song, I could sing the lyrics. I hadn't got a melody at that stage. I just had the lyrics, but I could sing the lyrics to your beautiful over Ryan Adams' song. And so as then Sasha arrived at the car, I said, Get me home.

Get me to the house now. I know where I've got the song now. And so with Ryan's four chords in my pocket, you know, and they're the same four chords as everyone, but they're played in a particular way. I went home and said, you know, this is the song. And like that, it was finished. And he did, Sasha did turn to me as we finished it and just said, it's a good song, man. It's a good song.

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Peer Music is a leading music publishing and neighboring rights company that has been championing songwriters and artists for nearly 100 years. Their musical journey began with a revolutionary ANR man named Ralph S. Peer, who is widely credited with the first Latin requirements. recording, the first blues recording, and of course the big bang of country music, the Bristol Sessions. Peer music has built their company on their unwavering devotion to music creators and performers, and to this day is still championing songwriters and promoting songs of cultural importance. Pure music represents some of the biggest names in music, including our former guest

Pooh Bear, David Lee Murphy, David Foster, Nothing with These, Gabby Moreno, Shian, the tragically hip and many, many more. And peer music neighboring rights represents 300 record labels and more than 3,000 artists, including Billy Elish, Imagine Dragons, Martin Garricks, David Gettit, Metallica, Megan the Stallion, Her, and Stromé. So, if you want to learn more about a global music publishing and neighboring rights company that moves with integrity and treats their roster like family, go check out, peer music.com or follow them on social media at peer music. If you've listened to this podcast over the past few years, you know about LAMP.

LAMP is Los Angeles Academy for artists and music production, located five blocks from the beach, in Santa Monica. They have a state-of-the-art campus featuring a classroom of 45 in real-life students. Common Area is a live stage where they host open mics. They have 15 real recording studios. They have a world-class one-year intensive high-level music program founded by the super producers, our friends and guests, Stargate. They've been responsible for songs like Firework and What's My Name, diamonds, irreplaceable, a ton of hits. Think of Lampas as this. nine-month high-level songwriting camp featuring world-class mentors

from the music business, including Benny Blanco, Circuit, Emily Warren, Neo Diplos, Stargate, Jimmy Naves, Kenny Beats, a bunch of our guests, some presidents of publishing companies, major A&R executives, you know, superstar managers like Jay Brown, who has Rihanna,

you know, top-rated mixing engineers, vocal producers, lawyers, business managers, all sorts of music professionals featuring on their Wednesday, Thursday workshops. So they're going on their fourth year, and those are just examples of people who might be your mentor if you get accepted to LAMP. So if you're interested in being one of the students who learns how to write and produce songs every single day, which is the norm for them, then you should visit lampmusic.com. That's L-A-A-A-A-M-P-Music.com. And thank you, L-A-A-M-P-N-P-U-C-K-K-L-E-N-B-E-R.

We are fans of yours. Now we released a song called Hi as my first single. I loved the song. I thought it was going to be like a big cold play hit. But we knew we were slowly, slowly building up. So then we released Wise Men. We got some first airplay with High. We got the song and the album into the charts, the top 20 with Wise Men.

But when we dropped your beautiful, yeah, we knew that was the biggest hope. That was the great hope. I didn't know how big it was going to be. And, and, you know, and when it did, that genuinely scared me. Why did it scare you? Well, when the record label radio rep called me, and I was in a hotel in Switzerland, I was just about to support Jameriqui at a festival, and he said, you know, it's the song and the album have both gone to number one, and you've knocked off Coldplay off the top spot.

I never thought I would get to number one. and I didn't know if I had prepared myself emotionally for that. I thought it would be number two. Number two would be great. You know, no one's going to know your name. They know the song and no one's going to intrude on you. You're just going to be like, you know, a musician. And yeah, you know, he had a...

But when you get to number one, then you suddenly change from being a musician. To being a son. Yeah. And I wasn't really geared up to that. And I wasn't ready for that because then suddenly it's... You get a whole lot of other stuff that comes along with. Is anybody? Is anybody geared for that kind of success?

Yeah, I'm sure some people, I'm sure some people really want their name to be out there. But, you know. And the anonymity of being, you know, the, I can't remember the basis name to Coldplay. You know, like, you can walk into a play, because you're under, you know, there are people on the planet who don't know Chris Martin's name, but they know who Coldplay is. and you can hide a little bit under a band name. But if you have a hit and you're a solo guy, that's vulnerable, you know. Yeah, and you know, and I experienced that firsthand

because Your Beautiful was really, really big. And then suddenly my name is out there. Suddenly I'm playing these huge places. But with that, with Your Beautiful in particular, there was a big backlash. And so when somebody says they don't like my music, When they say they don't like cold play, you go, oh, okay, you don't like cold play. But when they said they don't like James Blunt, it's the person.

It's not the band. It's specifically the person. And that's, it hits in a different way. And so that's why, number one, yeah, it was a scary moment. I think, you know, when you look at actors, you often say, like, I don't like their, this movie. Even your favorite actors, you can look at a movie that they did. And people are like, I don't like that movie, but they don't. don't say, I don't like Merrill Streep.

But somehow in music, there's this, this, people feel the, they feel like it's their right or they're allowed to vocalize their, like how they feel about the human who creates this music. It's really bizarre. And I suppose it, it drums up quite strong emotion, you know, when someone says, you know, I like this.

Some of people say, I just hate that. and you know I suppose that's what music is though it should be it is emotional but it's but when you're a solo artist and it has and you're and it's a thing

and I have experienced that yeah I mean you know we don't have to again like go into too much of even the social media stuff but your responses to people are priceless you know is

whether it's a defense mechanism or it's just your humor but it seems like you enjoy, you know, it's like, I don't know if you search it out, but it seems like you enjoy going after, you know, people who have comments about you or your music. Yeah, I think I, you know, I did these interviews to begin with when I first, you know, hit big and I, and I would mess around and I joke and the journalists never put the ha-ha at the end of my joke. And so I just came across as a very earnest guy with this very earnest guy with this very earnest.

song. And then they invented Twitter and suddenly I was given this voice where I could respond directly and it was just a fantastic moment. The record label said, hey, you can promote your album with this thing called Twitter. I thought, you know, stuff that. I'm not promoting my album. I've got some answers. And I just, I just, you know, laugh at myself and laugh with people and at people for taking their opinion so seriously. and voicing their opinions so harshly. And, you know, and yeah, because, yeah, and so it was just really nice to have a voice and I've enjoyed it. After you're beautiful, you have so many songs and singles that are smashes in the UK, really big in Europe, some that do pretty well in the U.S.

do you aim for a market as a label, as an artist, or is it sort of, it's out of your control the minute it's out? It's totally out of control, out of my control. And, you know, it's always really surprising. I mean, I'll go through Italy, and they just start singing all the words to a song that no one else in any other country is singing, and they're all going absolutely mad for it.

And, you know, so it's, again, it's a kind of eye-opening moment where someone will say, hey, that song's a failure. The Italians will sing that's the biggest thing they've ever heard. So, you know, one person's failure is another person's success. And it's... Is that unique in the outlier, the book by Malcolm Gladwell, a lot of it is about when you're born dictating how your life is? It's like we're all playing this infinite game.

there's no you know the game wins and so you walk into it and you start releasing music now and it seems like streaming is the same in every country and that i know that it can be slightly different but it seems like you were able to release music and enjoy the different regions differently I don't know if I've ever met an artist who has such different responses to different songs in different regions. Yeah, I think you're probably right. I'm very lucky that right around the world. There'll be one song that, you know, just got put in a TV show there

and for some reason got some, you know, some visibility and the way it is. You know, I suppose there might be another thing which is maybe it's because I sing songs that are about human emotion that everyone can connect with. I'm not singing, there are lots of UK singers who sing about where they come from in a town in northern England, and it's hard to relate to.

And maybe songs about, you know, West Coast America are hard for some people to relate to. And because I'm singing, you know, fairly, you know, the human emotion is connecting no matter where you are from wherever country. And I'm singing it in a language that is, lucky enough to be understood by many, many people. Maybe that gives me a huge advantage.

After those first few albums, you know, you obviously have your beautiful and then you have a bunch of hits after that, do you start thinking it's easy to maintain a level of success? Or do you feel like it gets harder? I think it's always up and down for musicians, you know, and also for me, You know, Your Beautiful is my biggest hit, and I'm never going to have another commercial success like that. So whilst I then, you know, I have just different levels of success in different places,

so I guess it just puts things in perspective. When did you come to that conclusion? Well, you know, I had a backlash very, very quickly to that song, and the negativity within the industry and within, yeah, was very clear, very quick. And so if you're suddenly putting out new music, you can see there's a bigger mountain to climb when the general public aren't open to a new guy. They already know you and lots of people are being told it's that guy again. This is an example.

When in my second album, I put out a song called 1973. And in America, the record label said, we don't want to call it 1973 here. Because that sounds a little bit dated, which is a great statement. So we think we should call it, here we go again. And I was just, I begged them. I said, look, I've just had this mega hit. There's a backlash that's come down the line. People have braced off of the song.

And you want radio presenters to go, and here's James Blunt with, here we go again. No, please call it 1973. Anyway, around the rest of the world, it was a global number one. It was a number one around the world, apart from America where it wasn't a, didn't hit the charts. And of course, the label said to me,

well, you know, we told you. Yeah, of course. You should have called, should have done what we said. And you know, immediately you kind of get, okay, I get used to it where some things are going to hit and some things aren't going to do that. But, you know, I suppose the battle is not to think about it and just write songs, just write songs that mean something to you. And if you're honest enough, someone's going to get it.

It's so funny because maybe because I'm not. you, I never thought of there being backlash. Like, it doesn't seem like that. It seems like one of those songs that still is played all the time. I remember talking to, we were talking to, um, uh, uh, Bobby and Kristen Lopez who wrote Let It Go. Yeah. And, and she was like, well, the problem when you have a song like that is that you have

people coming up to you being like if I hear that song one more time I hate that song and it's like this weird thing where at first it's kind of cute and then after a while you're like fuck you like I get it I get it you know but you're like no it's

it's a weird thing when you have a song that's just so big but I don't I don't think I you know I had a similar song like that as a writer where I think I got I heard a lot of that and, you know, I think in the end I look at it as just a giant compliment. Exactly. Hey, we're all gagging for that big song.

Yeah. You know, and I'm a 10 of times, you're sick of playing that song. And I go, no, I'm bored of the question. I'm sick of the question. You know, it's an awesome song to have had. Shit, the Rolling Stones are still looking for that big one, aren't they? You know, and that's the cornerstone of my career. I won't have the same commercial success ever,

but I've got other songs that are just as rich and as deep and that I'm just as proud of. Moving on to other songs in that vein, like, you know, 10 years later, when you start doing songs like Bonfire Heart, that's when I think I met you. It was around then, moon landing, like the making of that.

And it felt like a conscious sonic change. At that point, like when I listened to the music before that, to then, it felt like, to me, it feels like it was a real shift. Was it the co-writers or was it the time? Because that felt like a conscious choice. I think it was a little bit of a realization that, okay, I can write these songs on a guitar and they're all, you know, or a piano and they're all quite mordling and morose and introspective, but actually, you know, life is good. I've got a band. I've got other people to play with.

And so in the writing process, I've just found myself embracing a sense of upbeat. And yeah, and so it is definitely co-writers, the ability to be in the studio with people who are giving it some more energy, you know, just by the nature of being with them. If I'm on my own, just playing a piano, there's just my... I gravitate towards something slower, lower, and more moody. But if you're in the room, I can say, hey, let's have a shot, let's have some fun, let's talk about this and that energy, and it just shifts the songwriting for me. And I think there was a moment, okay, you know, life is good.

I've got loads of musician to give me that energy. I've got a band now. Let's write some up tempest. Yeah, I mean, I know we talked about it before we started the interview, but when I find love again came out that's a big thing for any writer to work with an artist and then the song actually, and having a song actually come out.

Because like you said, you write 100 songs for an album, and for you, you're picking your 10 best, and here we are, we're trying to give the artists their 10 best, their 5 best, and most of the time, you're in that 90,

you're in that pile of 90 songs to get cut. We've probably written maybe three, four songs and it's like, so for one to come out is always exciting, especially if there's a music video around it. So, you know, even if you don't recognize it in the moment,

when you release a song, your co-writers. Obviously, that song is special to me because I just got married at the time and we shot the video and my wife is in the video because that was the only honeymoon I gave her. So, definitely

But I suppose that's the mad thing as a songwriter, is as you say, there's a big pile of songs left behind, aren't there? Yeah. The don't make it kind of mad. That's sometimes the frightening thing is you find a really good idea, really good emotion. And if the song doesn't quite hit, you think, wow, can I, can I, shall I start again on the same emotion, you find a different way of doing it? Does it inspire you to write for other people more?

I know you said other people have cut your songs, but once you start having, once you start, befriending other co-writers who do that for a living and other producers. I mean, I think being an artist sounds awful, because it is hard as shit. And you have to deal with so much other stuff. And as a songwriter, I got a session tonight. I'm going to write my ass off, and then I'm going to go home, and I'm going to go to sleep, and that's my day. And there's so much that gets wrapped into.

the song you release, especially being James Blunt and not a band name, is like people are going to look at you and they're going to say, well, this is him. So there's just so much more pressure for you. But do you love writing for other,

how does the artist who does co-writing as well as you do? How do you not just say, fuck the artist's career. I'm going to just write songs. Well, maybe because I haven't expressed how much I really have an amazing time as an artist. I really, really love it.

And we've talked about hitting big and a backlash. But the backlash hasn't superseded the amount of fun I've had. You know, I've toured, I've done eight world tours. I'm on my, that's including a greatest hits. You know, I shouldn't be on a, I shouldn't have a greatest hits. It should be called greatest hit. Greatest hit is what I wanted to call it, greatest hit and songs I wish you'd heard. And, you know, I've toured the world with a band.

I live in Ibiza and in Switzerland. And when I do write with people, you know, that musically on an emotional front, on the whole, I go in with an idea, with a feeling, just something's gone in my life. And with the guys in that studio, normally get an emotion out that I've struggled to convey

while I'm sitting with my mates with a pint in our hand. And if I, you know, whether it's come from me or whether they've enabled me to get it out and help me get it out into the best rounded song I can. And then I can go home and say, this is how I feel. And I can stand on a stage then and sing how I feel and really nail it, whether it be that song Monsters, whether it be Bon for Heart for its energy in life. But on this new album, you know, I've got songs to my wife that are really, really beautiful

that I can say, you know, this is how, this is a bigger statement, as I say, I've got a song on here. We had aspirations to start. family, we've succeeded in some ways, we've struggled in others. I've written a song called The Girl That Never Was. I take that home and my wife says, you know, wow, that's just captures exactly what we're going through. Word for word, note for note. It's a bit of magic to capture. And then I stand on the stage and I can sing that around the world and people will come and see me and say, that's how I feel too. I'm really lucky. I'm really lucky to have people like you in my

life who can make that happen for me, you know, and I really love the life that comes with you enable me to do my passion of getting up on stage, singing around the world. I sleep on a tour bus. It's an endless bar of alcohol, never dries up with my mates. There's a spare bed for you come along. I'm very lucky to have the job I have. I will probably take you up on that.

I might bring my kid too, and then you're going to be like, what? Why did you do that? I'm going to be like, you know, it's fun. When you start featuring on other people's album, you know, DJs and other projects in the last few years. That's got to also feel totally different. Cosonically, it goes places you've never been able to go as an artist.

For me, it's been a really weird experience. My biggest hit like that is with Robin Schultz, a song called Okay. And I wrote it with Steve Mack, who you've written with as well. and Mazzela was with us. And we wrote this song called Okay, because, you know, like, the shortest word, the most catchy thing you can think of. Okay, we're going that generic. And we wrote it and we finished it and we produced it.

And I just did not like the song. And I thought, come on, I'm the guy who's come from, you're beautiful. You're beautiful. And I'm just going to, you're okay. You know, it seems like a major emotional step down. And I said to the label, I don't like it. they kept on saying it's going to be a huge hit. And I said, I don't care. I hate it.

I don't want to put it on my album. And they said, well, you're an idiot. And then I was in a Beathor at home and I was going out to the clubs as I do. And I bumped into Robin Schultz. And he said, hey, James, how are you doing? I've been past your song and I'm putting it out next week. Oh, cool. You know, that's great, Robin.

And, you know, I get that track. And it's my, it's my vocal. It's my piano. It's my guitar. And it's Robin's, you know, it's Robin's drums on it. basically. It's a much better production, by the way, than I think, you know, I'd done. Don't give me wrong, but it's the basis of your song. And then it's really funny because you go, it's Robin Schultz Brackets featuring, featuring James Blunt. You go, well, you know, okay, that's interesting, you know, and that's, it's, it didn't necessarily feel like it

stemmed that way, but at the same time, I know that song has hit way bigger than if I'd put it out. I know, I know, whenever the record labels, it was a massive, massive hit. And although I hate the song now, wherever I am, I have to sing that song. When I'm on tour around Europe, they're all streaming for okay, and I have to play that song. So no matter how much I ate it, that's, thank you, Robin Schultz.

Well, yeah, I mean, that's so great. I mean, it has 400 million streams. You know, it's, there are a lot of, that's a, that's a legit. A big song, and you know, and so, And so Robin, you know, thank God for Robin Shilts. He gave you a little bit of magic that I didn't have. I didn't like and, and, you know, and I was wrong in way and lucky in others. It's a really weird experience.

It's been a really weird experience, but hell, I'm in. Yeah. And I play it and I play it. And I no longer hate the song because of its success. And I think, come on, let's play okay. They're all going to jump up and down. Before we get to the new album, one thing you said was, oh, my greatest hit should have been called Greatest Hit and Songs.

I wish you heard. Of all the songs you've released, and this is kind of like one of those, it feels like a reporter question, so take it with a granite style, but like, what song should have been a hit that wasn't? I have a song called Smoke Signals, and it was on an extended version of,

I think of Moonlanding, maybe. And, you know, they always put extended versions towards the end of the kind of album's life cycle, when maybe near Christmas. It's come out in September, and September next year they try and milk the album for the last drop, and you tuck on three or four extra songs.

But those songs, you know, they're kind of lost in the ether slightly. And I wish Smoke Signals had been a single on the album after, because it's a beautiful, beautiful song. And for me, one of the most beautiful songs I'll ever write. That's so interesting. It didn't take you two seconds to say that. You knew that that's the song.

That's like the girl who got away. kind of thing. Yeah, yeah, totally. Can you ever, there are some artists that do, especially in this era, there are no rules. Can't you just redo it and re-release it? Yeah, I mean, maybe you're right.

Like, reproduce it a little bit, or like freshen it up in some way, or maybe not, and just be like, this is my new single, and like most people are not looking. I mean, maybe you're right. The reality is like I am right and I'll tell you why also. I know of a couple other of our friends and a couple other artists that we can talk about offline that are about to do that.

That are about to release singles that are basically 10 years old that never came out or they're 15 years old and they weren't produced right. And most of the fans appreciate it. and most, you know, and everybody else doesn't have any clue. Yeah, amazing. Well, you should tell me how they're going to do that afterwards, and I'll see if I can beat them to it then. But, you know, again, I've been really lucky. We talked about monsters already.

I had this amazing moment where I was telling the record label, that should be a single. They said, no, it can't be a single. It's not got enough bells and whistles for radio. And I said, but I promise you, it's the song off the album. And then I begged them enough to say, look, at least do me a favor and make a video for it. it. And we did this video with my father in the video. And I don't know if you've seen it. I'm

singing to camera and then halfway through up pops my dad. And that's the song then that has been passed around and bubbling under. And then a guy, E.M. Tonghi is his name, a beautiful spirit and soul, sang it on American Idol. And suddenly everyone heard it. And suddenly that song, you know, it's got a ton of millions of views and that's never been released as a single. So there can be life. It's so good. Yeah, and that's something you can't control

and you can try to create that. But, you know, and that's the idea of things that are viral. You have a bunch of, you know, people trying to create a viral moment. And in reality, what makes it viral is that it was unpredictable. Yeah. You know. Yeah, well, also not, you know, viral. it shouldn't be instigated by a record label or institution

with considerations because it just feels good. It just applies somewhere. The new album that's coming out soon, what are the beside you video is great, singles out, what are the expectations right now for this album? Obviously, I know the meaning of everything. How do you feel about the process? this time, you know, compared to where you started from.

You know, I've had this major shift, as I say, you know, getting married with children, my parents getting old. Suddenly I've got a ton of stuff, my place in the world changing, so I've got things to write about. And with that, it means writing the album has been easy. Producing it has had a purpose and has been exciting. And I've worked with, you know, some young producers and given it. a kind of life and now I've kept the spontaneity of the demos.

So I've really loved that. And then you go into that debate with a record label, which singles are we going to do? And they go, okay, the one that they've got, beside you, because it sounds like everything else on radio. And so you go, okay, it's not going to move the dial on emotion, but it'll get you some airplay, which is fine. But I've had this healthy argument with them,

and the second single, they had got lined up. And I said, you know what, I'm just actually for once in my career, putting my foot down and saying, I'm going to go with a different song, and we're putting out a song called The Girl That Never Was. And it was, I tell you what's really weird, this is the experience I have with the record label. They listen to the album and they say, God, we love song number one, song number five, and song number seven. So as singles, we're going to release song number two and song number three. And you go, but you just really love the other ones.

Yeah, yeah, but for radio, that's better. And so that's why I've said, okay, I really need to debate because the song I'm going to play you now, have a listen. And they'll start crying in the meeting and say, this is, you know, moving is so much that some of them will have to leave the room, but they're not going to put it as a single. And so, so I'm forcing my hand. I'll put it out. We'll see what happens. Maybe that again, like with the Robin Schultz song, OK, the record label will know best and they'll prove me wrong. But at this stage of my career, I think, you know what, I would rather force the songs that really mean something to me to be the ones that I heard. So at least when I stand on a state,

I'm not just playing the song that was forced at radio that doesn't mean so much. Instead, I'm on stage, and it may be a failed single, but there's still the likelihood that those people there in the concert will know the song. This is the part that's exciting about being an artist, is that you get to, on some level, curate your discography. You get to curate your set list, and you can choose to play whatever songs, you want live and you get to

tell the story you want to tell. And as a songwriter who gets to work with an artist like that, you want to go and dig into what the emotion is so that way you can maybe get something that they want to perform live.

It's one of the things that we talk a lot about is when you write drama, drama comes from or Aristotle Poetic, is the beginning of drama and you talk about intention, obstacle, and tactics.

You need to want something because when you want something, that's how you get, that's where all the pain comes from. So if you're in a session and somebody's writing a song that has no meaning but sounds good, that song is eventually going to be something that artist won't play.

But if you can get to some sort of emotion, which comes very naturally to you as a writer. But if you can get to that place, you then actually have, no matter where you are in your life, you can empathize with the person who wrote that song. Even when older you can, you know, like, I want to have this girl, but I can't because I only saw her in a subway,

even if that's so far removed from where we are right now, you still can relate to that person of like he didn't get the girl. Yeah. You know? Like the tactic was when you, the plan is the strange thing in that song that you, maybe had, I don't know if it's been articulated before, but you have the want, you have the intention, the obstacles that she's with somebody else, and the tactic is the plan. And if you, if you can create that in a, that's how scripts are made, that's how plays are made,

as some musicals are made. And a good song achieves those things. And without even really knowing it, you know, maybe you knew it. But without really going for it, you articulated all three of those things from the outset of that song. It's brilliant.

Totally. Yeah. And as you say, then it's going to make you want to play it again because you feel something for it. You have an emotional connection to it. Okay, well, real quick, we're going to go to the next, the next segment.

We're going to do a five for five. I'm going to just lift five things, five, and you can just tell me what comes out the top of your head. Yeah. Number one, Abitha. Nightclubs. I write songs on a guitar and a piano that are miserable and morose, but I actually really love dance music.

And I build a nightclub at the end of my garden called Blounties Nightclub. I have a big neon sign saying Blundie's Nightclub, where everybody's beautiful. And it's where I want to die, Not soon, but eventually. Carrie Fisher, what's that relationship? Yeah, you know, I lived with her throughout my recording time while she was alive when I recorded in Los Angeles.

On this album, it's taken me years to write, but I've written the song called Dark Thought, and it's about the time where I was back in L.A. I was homeless because without her being there, I didn't have a home to live in, so I was staying in the park suites where my band used to see. stay where I still remember, you know, there's stains on the floor I remember making from 10 years earlier and stuff like that. And, uh, and I just was battling with her not being there. So I thought I'd drive up to the house. I drove up the hill just to say goodbye and all that I, uh, was it, let me think about it. I drove on the hill just to say goodbye, but all I found was a for sale sign.

Put my hand on the gate and there's tears in my eyes and all that's, all that's been left since the minute you died were the chandeliers in the trees, ceramic bees, and now they're just covered in leaves. She had chandeliers in her garden, out in a garden, and ceramic bees there. And I put my and I put my hand on the gate, and I just started crying. And I just have eventually found the words to say to carry, some like seven years after her death, I suppose, no. But I lived with her throughout my time and I recorded goodbye, my lover in her bathroom, was with her the day before she died. she's my American mother. Yeah, amazing.

Let's go with your parents. They've been my greatest champions of support. My mother is my biggest fan. I go on my Wikipedia page and change my age. And she changes it back in about two hours. She's just got some kind of alert on it, like an ultimate fan. And my dad left the army as a colonel.

He was looking for a kind of job, and I needed support and help and he's my bookkeeper really when my band invoiced me they send the bills to my dad and he pays them in about three minutes whereas a record label takes three months okay let's go with

your wife you know she's given me purpose she's answered so many questions in my life and and I suppose when you found that person it means yeah life is gravy after that it's all you know

I'm no longer this stressed lonely human being wandering around the world I found that person Yeah I love when you said I don't know if it was I already don't remember if it was before this interview or while we were talking about when you're talking about the new album That you're just in a phase of

You've answered You answered a lot of the questions that were presented in the first album And so that this is an acknowledgement Of where you all and that's amazing. Yeah, I write bigger songs than you're beautiful to her. Bigger statements. Yeah.

And then let's dumb this down to Twitter is number five. Yeah, well, for me, it was great to have a voice. I love what Elon Musk is doing. He realizes that Twitter is an awful space. That people are horrid to each other. So I think he's killing it from within. I think people haven't realized his cunning plan is to kill. a bird from within, and that's

only probably a good thing. Do you know? Do you know him? No, no, I don't know. But I think it's a pretty awful sphere. Awful sphere. Once upon a time, you know, our mothers did say, if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say it, and if you keep your opinions to yourself, and then they invented

Twitter and look what happened. It's so crazy. And when you first were on it, there were a few artists that were kind of championing it. It felt like it was, you know, John Mayer and you, and a few randoms but it was almost something where you could post

something and people would like it or they'd retweet it but the idea of replying was something cruel was rare and now it's like you can't post anything without somebody just being a dick yeah and so I've learned really to just laugh at that whole thing you know I'm really lucky I get to play to

you know I'm doing arenas around the UK and Europe and you know around most of the world. And why there are tens of thousands of people turning up every night. Why do I feel the need to go look in my phone and search out one negative comment and be affected by that? And so I find myself laughing at myself for being there and taking it seriously and taking myself seriously.

And that's how it has been my release. And then if I can just think, what am I doing? And right from that perspective, then actually it's, you know, then it's, you know, then it's, then it's in a funnier place. Well, thank you for doing this podcast. It's good to catch up. When I first met you, I believe was with Steve Robson,

who we spoke about earlier. And I remember we went to an after party at the Brits and fun was playing. Yeah. And it was right when we are young was big. and I saw Jack who I've known for a while,

so I was able to run up and say hi. But I felt like a real sort of intruder being at that place. And I don't know how much you remember that night or anything like that. But for me, I just remember I was drinking a lot. And you making me feel like I had a friend in a sea of people I didn't know. Well, that's the same thing. But that's because you're a good human being and I've loved your company.

And yeah, you know, they're funny. Any awards like that, the Brits are such a provincial thing, aren't there? You know, because we've got obviously, you know, the MTV Awards in America and the Grammy is these big things and then we make a big deal of this tiny little island in our little provincial awards ceremony. And it's the music industry is based on such pretentiousness rather than the music.

And as a songwriter, it must be. quite weird to be in that environment because you write songs, yet it's really the Brits are about the clothes. I mean, it was a straight up, it was a club, and you go to this, at least it felt like that, and we sat in a different section looking at the club, and I just

remember sitting in a booth, and I don't have a, I have a shitty memory, so the fact that I remember it says a lot, but looking out and just being, there's so many people crammed into this place, they can't they can't possibly be talking or enjoying each other's company like there's none of that going on and just like it's just that weird bird's eye view of

what is is uh you know the talking head song it's just like you know is this my life is it's like a real thing but i again man you were you're great i i'm i'm so happy that you're putting out music and not it's not putting out music still for the sake of putting out music. It's because like you said, you have something to say and it's deeper now than it's ever been. And that just takes, that's a real man there. I appreciate it. Hey, no, well, thank you. Hey, let's hook up and do it again. It would be a pleasure to find you in a studio and pull out a guitar and let's get writing. Perfect. This episode is produced by Joe London, Mega House Management and myself. See you all next week. I'm Ross.

Bolin signing off.