And The Writer Is...with Ross Golan - Ep. 204: Wiz Khalifa

Episode Date: January 21, 2025

Today’s guest is a true jack-of-all-trades—part artist, part entrepreneur, and full-on icon. From nurturing a die-hard fanbase to dominating the charts across genres, he’s built an empire over the course of his incredible career. This diamond certified superstar is the pride of Pittsburgh and has proven time and time again that you can do it all—and do it well. And The Writer Is…Wiz Khalifa! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Chart metric is proud to sponsor the upcoming season of And The Writer is. As the go-to-stores for up-to-date global social streaming and audience data for artists and music industry professionals, chart metric strives to ensure everyone can have a successful career in music. They're easy to understand and powerful analytics on over 10 million artists and 100 million tracks will help answer all of your questions from tracking your stats to discovering new talents. Throughout this season, we'll be showcasing chart metric data to reveal insights about our featured artists. Plans start as low as $10 a month. Learn more and get started today at chartmetric.com. Welcome to And the Writer is with Ross Golan.

There are millions of singers, thousands of artists, and only, 40 songs per genre at a time. These are the stories of the hottest creatives, the most venerable legends, artists, songwriters, executives, and more. Follow our socials and share your music with the And the Writer is community. We'll see you all there, and now.

Here's this week's episode. Welcome to And The Writer is. I'm your host, Ross Golan. Today's Diamond Certified Superstar is as much an entrepreneur as he is. an artist. He went from nurturing a tight-knit fan base to celebrating countless smashes across various genres in just a few short years. Now, he's got a number of business ventures in multiple industries, including weed, man. Anyway, I could start listing all his brilliant collaborators,

but we'd be here forever. This pride of Pittsburgh is not only one of the most decorated writers, writers, rappers, musicians of the past decade, but he's also a good dad. And the writer is Wiz Khalifa. Yay. What's up, man? So, you know, you've done a bunch of interviews

and some that are really extensive about a lot of things. So I appreciate how candid you've been in a lot of interviews. I just want to tell a little bit of backstory for our listeners. And, you know,

ask questions about music. You know, the things that we do as musician folk. So let's start from the beginning. You're born. Yep. What's your first memory? My first memory. I think a lot of my first memories come from pictures, actually.

Yeah, yeah, right. Because I don't feel like I remember being there, but, like, I watch videos. Like, my parents have a lot of home videos and a lot of pictures, and I moved around a lot, so different houses are just, like, engraved in my brain a little bit. Which ones? Like, I know you were all over the place. Yeah, you're an Army brat. Yeah, I was born in North Dakota, so I don't remember anything about North Dakota.

I was super young then. Then I moved overseas to, like, England, Germany area. I do remember that. I remember my dad had a house with a pond, and I remember my mom's neighborhood because I learned how to ride a bike there. And then I remember when I first moved to Pittsburgh. I remember what my auntie's apartment looked like. We lived in the projects. But I feel like everybody did.

Well, not everybody, but a lot of people like us did back then. It was very common. But I remember that apartment, like sleeping in the same room as my cousins and my aunts and all of that stuff. And so, like, I guess around like two or three years old is when the memories started kicking in of, like, you know, family and places. You guys traveled all over the world. Uh-huh. And you're a musician. how much of world music would you listen to

or was it more because you were on bases that it was all American music even when you were in Germany, Japan? It was really difficult to get music overseas like in Japan for sure. They were like really behind when it come to Americanized stuff. And I think they do that on purpose.

Like you got to dig really deep to find it and I was a teenager when I was there. So the majority of my musical experiences happened with my parents. I was born in 87, so I'm growing up in the 90s and they listened to, you know, all 90s R&B, all early hip hop, everything that was breaking through at the time, all of the movies at the time, you know, New Jack City and Ministers Society and all of that stuff. So, you know, I was able to just digest what they digested and what they were fans of and kind of, you know, and I had a lot of older cousins as well, so they just put me on the game.

Do you remember the first song that you would, you know, sing around the house? I do, man. It was my aunt. She put me on a slick Rick, a children's story. That was one of my favorite songs that, and I got my first Walkman. It was like the tape player. You know what that is. And, yeah, I would just listen to that shit over and over and over and, like, sing the lyrics.

My Aunt Rachel. It's hard to explain what it was like to have, you know, the Walkman and then going into, like, your disc man. And what, you know, we're all traveling. around with like a book of CDs. So just trying to explain that to a new generation is so hard. Like when we picked an album, we wore it down because that's what you did. You didn't have so many options. You know?

And we never thought that shit was going to come to an end either. Yeah, totally. Like, what the fuck? Well, that's like, that's a big thing right now. And people are freaking out about, obviously, you know, if you're a universal artist and you can't play music on TikTok. and you're doing all this stuff. And some of the things are like,

I mean, how many, when you came up, you know, you came up right at the probably tail end of like MySpace, where people were probably like, man, you've got a friend to people on MySpace. Like, that's how you make it in the music business. And the thing is, it all evolves. Yeah. I transitioned through all of that, like just,

I come from the mixtape culture. Right. So we were trying to make mixtapes to sell in the stores or on the corner out of our trunk or whatever. whatever, whatever. And then MySpace came. And that was a way to, you know, grow, but you still had to bring your audience to you. And it wasn't really about, you know, your network of people. It was just about, like, who kind of knows you, how many clicks you have. Like, you would put your songs, like, you know what it was. You put, like, a couple songs on there, and you had, like,

your friend's list, and that was it. And then it transitioned into Twitter and YouTube. And I remember the day YouTube came out. Like, I was still in high school. and that's where I was able to flourish the most through Twitter and YouTube. But yeah, physical CDs and, you know, burning actual CDs and print covers and all of that stuff. It helps because we were able to figure out what our real taste in music was and dive into it. And I love when MP3s first came, like when you were able to download off of like Napster and lime wire and things like that. because it definitely made it easier to go back and get early 90s rap like Illmatic or find out about Big L or hear classic big pun freestyles that you would never hear.

So open up a whole world and a whole generation of people that were educated about music and that's where I really come from. Yeah, the bootlegging of music was crazy. When LimeWire came out going through, like even now, it's, It's not like Spotify has all this, you know, all the live music that, you know, some of these great musicians would travel around and the fans would just record every performance. And in LimeWar, you could go and get everything. Yeah.

Kind of what you'd get from whatever other normal social media now. But like the fact that you could find it all in the same place you'd find the Masters. Yeah. It's pretty crazy. Yeah, it was just wide open, bro. It was wild. Here's like, we have friends at Chartmetric. And I don't know if you know what that is.

But they, these are some crazy stats for you that might be interesting. That your combined audience, I don't know if you know this, like over Instagram, YouTube, Spotify, TikTok, all that stuff, is 85 million people. Oh, wow. And so when you think that that's like, you know, how massive of an audience that you've created from diving into like the, okay, well, we're going into Twitter, going into YouTube and all that.

just so many people. I mean, that's, you know, it's a third of our country. That's really cool. Follows you. That's kind of wild. That's pretty awesome. Actually, I kind of like,

I just go through this anyway, just because these are kind of wild stats, but do you know what your most listened to city is? No, I don't. Sao Paulo. Oh, that makes a lot of sense. Why does that make sense? Because they're crazy.

Like, they're really supportive in Brazil. It's just fascinating. It's not there. It's not like English is their first language and your word smith. Yeah. So it's like, you know. It's just hard to like, there's certain artists that are like with the trends. And then there's certain artists who define the culture.

And to people in Brazil, my name is one of those names that just defines rap. Like if you say like 50 cent, Eminem, Snoop, Wiz. It's like, you know what I mean? It's very, very high up there. So I'm not surprised. It's amazing. Yeah. It's why, I mean, you know, it, people latch on to whatever cultures that,

especially outside of America. And that's the thing about, I feel like I've had an advantage from live in other places is I do know how important it is to connect with people in other countries. And, you know, luckily just being raised the way that I was raised and being able to communicate with people, my music does that too. Of course it's going to translate in America, but the trends go up and down so much. But out of other different countries,

they only have a certain idea of what American culture is, and they stick to that. They don't move in and out with the trends as fast as we do. Well, you know, it's so strange to think worldwide, but when you also are talking about, you know, you start from mixtape and mixtape culture, the mixtape culture is literally like now when you think of mix tapes

everything seems digital but when you're starting out you're literally like you were saying burning CDs and probably getting either people to buy it or giving it or whatever it is but mixtapes are like hoping that other people burn them and that it goes through like one person at a time

truly word of mouth but then to think worldwide where it's like to go from you know the the first mixtape Yeah. You know, all the way to Brazil is just a wild. Yeah.

The concept that we come from for mixtapes is for promotion. So you're promoting yourself for the big moment. And I dropped fucking 20 mixtapes before I had my big moment because I never stopped. And I was always putting in the work. And I'm like, if people don't understand me, I understand me. And this is what's going on in my head. And, you know, these are the things that I'm going. I'm going through and this is how I'm, you know, turning it into art.

And, you know, I'm still the same way, but music is digested a little bit differently. And I have so much of a catalog, people can catch up to where I'm at. Like, there's still generations of people who are diving into my old stuff. Like, you know, you might hear the things that are on a commercial level, of course. But I have so much, yeah, I have so much that you could just dive into and get lost and find your own. personal favorites to where, you know, the mixtapes helped to build all of that by just, you know, subconsciously, constantly creating. I heard you mentioned that, you know, your uncle was the first person who kind of showed

you that you could actually write. Yeah. That, like, anybody can write a rap. What's the first rap that you wrote? Do you remember it? I don't remember the whole thing, but I remember what it was and what the name of it was.

What was it? It was called Cool Cat. Okay. Because, like, my uncle, he had wrote a verse for the same song. Was it a beat that I already had a hook on it? It was no beat, honestly.

I don't even think there would, I don't think we had a beat because this was in the mid-90s, so either you had to buy the tape and get to instrumental, or you had to loop it up yourself. if you knew how to do that shit, or we would just, we would download lyrics from the song so we couldn't get the actual beats at that time.

So when we were writing, I don't remember what we wrote it to. I think we just wrote it to like our own cadence. And he had his verse already. And that's when you grabbed me his verse, that's when I was like, damn, that shit sounds all right. And he was like, you could write a verse to it too. And he just taught me how to do it. You taught me how to start it and what to do in the middle. And I don't think it.

Did you go to freestyle or do you teach you how to, like, there's a difference between, obviously, freestyling and writing in the way? Was it natural to just start freestyling off the top? And was, was that the process? No, it was a process. It was more like learning other people's songs first, like getting my timing down, Pat. And then I started writing my own shit based off of that. Like, I would write, like, fast shit because I like bone thuds and harmony and I like Twister. So, like, I wanted to be the.

fast rapper. Yeah, bust the rhymes and shit. I want to be the fast rapper. And then it comes to like, you know, you're around everybody. Now the beats on, you might have one written or it's like, let's just make up some shit. And then that's when the freestyle start to happen. And then, you know, when we got older, that's when we start battling each other and battling other people because it gets competitive. But it's really just a process of like, you know, figuring that shit out. How old were you when your uncle showed you that? I was in like second or third grade. Yeah, and you were just like...

I was about to say we were kids. You know what I mean? We were just children and shit. It was like mid-90s I got a task cam four-track from... Oh, okay. From... Yeah. Whatever.

I didn't get my first task game until 2001. Yeah, that's like... That's pretty late for a task game. Feared you getting a four-track tape. But that was definitely like... Well, I'm obviously younger than you. Fair enough. Well, not so obvious.

I look pretty good. You said you had your task game in the 90s. Okay, fair enough. I still have it in my garage and I'm just like, it's like that thing where I kind of want to bring it out and use it. But I also am like so scared of what it may like hold. But yeah, I mean, there's something about that, like having to learn on the fly and the kinds of people who aren't in L.A.

who don't necessarily have access to recording studios whose parents might not be in the business. And you're trying to figure out, well, I kind of like doing this. And if I don't get this thing, I can't do it. Yeah. There was no concept of what that shit looked like to us. We were just like, we've seen rap videos and that was it.

Yeah. You know what I mean? So what gets you from there to, you know, hey, you know, those videos. whatever, to get there, you got to go to a studio. I know you intern at a spot. Uh-huh. You know, like, who says even go intern at a studio?

Well, it was a, like I said, it was a process. So I moved from Pittsburgh to Japan with my dad. So my rapping days were kind of freaking, you know, put on a whole late 90s to about 2000. I mean, to mid-90s, like, well, I think it was like 98, 99, and then by 2000, I moved back to Pittsburgh. So in 98... So when you're in Japan, you're just like...

You don't even think about music because you're like... It wasn't like... I'm just a kid in Japan. No, no, no, no. It wasn't like that. It was like I lived in Pittsburgh. I was with all my cousins from the projects. I moved to Japan with my dad.

He was like, what the fuck are you listening to? Took all my music away. And... Because it was... I was a kid. He took all my music away to have cussing in it. He did what a good parent would do. Because I was listening to some crazy shit.

But he ended up liking DMX. That was one of his favorite ones. He was like, I like this one. I'm gonna take this one. Yeah. But in Japan, it was hard to get new music. It was really hard to get it. So I had to go without, we didn't have music videos.

We didn't have shit. I wasn't up on shit for a few years, like at least two or three years. Then I moved back to Pittsburgh in the year 2000. And then that's when I started rapping again. I was with my cousins. The, you know, Napster was out. I was able to download MP3s. We was able to download.

instrumentals, we was battling each other. We were fucking hip hop heads, figuring out, finding out Wu-Tang, like, you know what I'm saying here, and experiencing all of that shit for the first time, too. Then I moved away again from Pittsburgh to Oklahoma with my dad. That's when I started working in the, that's when I got my task camp. That's when I started working in the studio with him, uh, writing my own songs, making my own beats, producing my own albums. And just really practicing. I was a 14-year-old kid, so it wasn't on a level where like, fuck. fucking Clive Davis was going to hear it. I was just a kid in Oklahoma practicing, sharpening my craft.

Then I moved back to Pittsburgh. That's when I started interning at the studio because I would pay to go there. But based off of my skill, they were like, damn, bro, you're better than the adults that come in here. Like, you record fast, your voice sounds good. You know how to stack. You know how your timing is good. They just noticed a real level of skill in me that they didn't have. at that time.

And that's what allowed me to, you know, flourish in that studio. And then that's where I became who I am. Those people from, you know, your uncle, your cousins, your friends, the other people that you were coming up with, were they envious of you? Or were they... And were any of those people, people that you'd be like, man, they deserve a shot? Uh-uh. Like, where any of them, are any of them really talented and just were never discovered?

No, it comes down to the work ethic. Yeah. I outwork the shit out of everybody that I was around. Like, so there was no envy because I involved everybody. Like, every step of the way, I was making mixtapes with my uncle. Everything that we did, we did as a group. When we did shows, when we did whatever, whatever, if I got booked for some, or if I was doing a mixtape, I made the cover, I made all of that.

And it was a group thing. So the separation was I just worked harder and just went. You know, I think for music, it doesn't just take talent. You have to be like, all right, am I going to repeat this over and over? Am I going to, you know, travel now? Am I going to, you know what I'm saying? There's a lot of things that when you start to add on the layers, less and less people want to do that shit.

Yeah. I'm just the one who's crazy enough to want to do all of it. Well, there's this thing about how you can't teach taste. Yeah. And like when you're born, you're kind of born with a certain level of taste. And people like you, I'd like to think people like me. But where you, when you, the first stuff you're recording is kind of shit. It's not terrible.

It's enough to keep you going. But you're hearing like the icons on radio. You're hearing these people. You're like, man, I know I can get there. So I'm going to just keep doing it. Because there's something in there. And you listen back and it. It feels good when you're doing it and you think it's a smash.

And then you listen back and that was shit because then you listen to the radio and you're like oh that was way better than what I'm doing and it's just constant like the taste and drive

are really somehow connected it's like those who have really refined taste and can look at themselves honestly can be those are the ones who improve and become like

you know have a discography when they're older because they got past the shit yeah for sure I mean, a lot of people get stuck in the shit and anything that you do,

you have to practice and you have to get better and better. If you're a fighter, you start out getting your motherfucking ass beat. And then you get better and you turn into a champion. So it's the same thing with music. A lot of people just don't get past getting their ass whoop. That's probably the best advice we've ever had on this podcast. How soon after, you know, you're getting this, you know, studio, time in Pittsburgh, you're recording these mixtapes.

There's a difference though between getting people to listen to the mixtape and then them taking that mixtape and spreading the word for you. That word of mouth is everything, especially in that culture. Like, when did you have that first mixtape? Because it's got to be before, you know, the Kush and OJ. Like, what's the first mixtape? What's the first song

people like, hey, no, there's some, those guys that you're saying, like, they heard that you had the talent. That's still a different level than when some random person's like, hey, have you heard this? This is incredible. Like, what's the first thing where it's like the word of mouth was doing it for you? My shit was so organic that it wasn't just a song or a tape. It was me. It was always me.

Yeah, yeah. Who is Wiz? Why do people want to chill with Wiz or party? with Wiz, and I was doing shows, and it would happen through the internet, and it was thanks to YouTube. I would do college shows, and it might or might not be cracking, but I always recorded the footage and put it on YouTube. And that's what booked me more shows, because people would be like, wow, they look like y'all had a great time. We want to party with you too. And then that's where I would release my music based off of where I was at and just start doing

mixtapes. And you know what I'm saying? So it was all really just based off of interaction. And that was the moment that it all started to come together. Because I had a lot of music before then. I had Prince of the City, too, Prince of the City, Star Power, deal or no deal, or show improve. I hadn't dropped Deal or No Deal. So I had a lot of projects out, but people weren't really connecting the music with the name. But when I was able to go do shows and put the footage on YouTube, that's what made me more of a, you know, person that people wanted to reach out to and be like, have you heard whiz? Well, this is what, you know, we do when we put whiz on, oh, we smoke to it.

We party to it. Oh, yeah, a bunch of chicks is going to come out. Invite Wiz. We got a budget for a blah, blah, blah. We want to spend it on Wiz. That's when that shit started happening. And then, you know, just the brand built more than anything. Was it, is it, you know, at what point are you, are you with?

At what point do you say, like, what did your mom call you? She calls me Cam. And when did, what's the point where you're like, no, I'm Wiz, to everybody else? Well, shit. Just growing up in Pittsburgh, everybody's going to call me Cam, like, just naturally because that's them as the people that I went to school with. But being in the studios, like, I'm not Cam, I'm Wiz. So that's when it really started to happen. Is it a, are you an alter ego?

the studio? Do you think of yourself as like, are you like, do you put on a cape when you're in the studio? I think just me performing and showing my real talents is something totally different from me when I'm chilling and talking. Like, I'm two different people when I'm doing on. Yeah, on stage, it's like a whole thing. Right, right. You see the passion. You see why I'm good at what I do. But if I'm just reggae and when I'm Cam, I'm just a nice guy, I'm as you could tell I'm somebody when you look at me. Like, that's why people were entertainers. They're like, he'd do something, but it's like, I'm not fucking performing at

Dunkin' Donuts. Like, you know what I mean? I'm in and out and I'm chilling. He's so rad, though. Okay, so here's a segment we'll call What would Mike Karen ask, Wiz Khalifan, and the writer is? And Mike said, and we'll go into the Cush and OJ thing here,

he goes, were you in a euphoric state when you chose the beats like Wake in, Baked, and Memor? on Cush and OJ, or did the beats bring you to that place? A euphoric state, like on drugs? I don't know. I think the idea of like those songs are so good that I think the idea is like, did you hear the beats?

Like, did you come at it and you were like, yeah, maybe it was on drugs? Yeah, I think you try to say it was on drugs. I love my, what euphoric state when you? I love him. To be like a nerd about it, I'm super duper sensitive. to feelings and emotions. And at that time, I knew exactly what feelings and emotions I wanted to bring to the music. So if the beat didn't sound like that, I would turn it off.

But if it did, I'm diving straight in. And to be specific, the beat, the feelings and the emotions were at the time I was traveling a lot. I'm smoking, I'm drinking, I'm partying, and it's waking up the next day. And it's like seeing the scene. It's like feeling the feelings and it might be the sun going down or it might be the sun coming up. You know what I mean? But it's really like the appreciation for the moment of where you're at and what's going on. And that's what those beats would bring out of me.

And that's why I chose those to be like the backbone of cushioned orange juice. Yeah, it's so good. Yeah, yeah. He also asked, what songs did you spend the most time writing, which ones were the fact? Like freestyle? Um, the songs that I probably spent the most time writing was like never been. I spent a lot of time writing that one. Why did that take so long?

And what does that mean to you? I think that one took so long because, um, if I remember I had recorded a lot of songs up to that point and I just didn't want that one to sound just like everything else. I wanted it to make sure that it's, I intentionally wanted that one to stand out. So I took my time when I wrote that one. Mesmerized was one that I wrote really, really fast, like instantly, just super fast. Kid Frankie, I wrote really fast as well. Were you just talking about cushioned orange juice or just in general?

I'm just reading my description. Oh, black and yellow. I wrote hella fast, bro. Like, I surprised myself how fast I wrote that one. It's so frustrating when, like, I guess I have a couple songs that really worked out where it turned out. It was the freestyle that, like, created the chorus and whatever. But, like, when I think of you writing it really fast, I think you literally, like, just wrote it, like...

Straight through, like, bro, like... Like, as fast as it takes you to say the lyrics, how fast it took me to wrap it, like, each bar. I just did one bar, did another bar, did another bar, did another bar, did another bar, finished that verse, did the hook, did the second verse the same way, did the pre-court, I mean, did the bridge, we was out of there. Well, I think as you just mentioned it, we'll just go to the next segment, which is what would Stargate ask Wiz Khal and the writer is?

And Tor McHale, they said, what's up, Wiz? What's heading? First, we just want to say that when we were kids in Norway, we always dreamed of making a real rap song. You made that dream come true when we made black and yellow together. And for that, we'll always be grateful. So shout out, McHale and Tor for that. They have some questions for you.

Love them. Yeah, I would do too. You know, the first question they said, can you name three big decisions that you made that had a real impact on your life? That's a crazy question because that's like super deep. But they asked the question. So what would your answer be? Three big decisions. Making music.

Having my son. And letting them arrange the hook on black and yellow. That's amazing. That's an amazing answer. And the thing is. if you've worked with Stargate, you totally get that, you know, those guys understand what a real chorus is and their songs live in a chorus. Yep.

It's a lot of chorus. There's a reason why they're so consistent. Yep. And they, they, the way that they presented it to me, because I had rap the chorus and they loved it, but they were like, this part goes here, this part goes there. And they were like, like they said, they never worked with a rapper or they never had the the rap song before. So they didn't know if I was going to be open to them moving my chorus around.

So they played my version. And then they were like, your version is cool. But if you wanted to be a hit, this is going to be the version right here. And after they played it, they were like, you know, don't argue with us. But I was like, bro, I want a fucking hit. Like, let's go. I'm going with your version. Like, we don't got to go back and forth about it.

Well, that's a really interesting change because I think that's like one of the hardest parts with a young artist and at the time, that's your first hit and it hadn't been a hit yet. Right. So you didn't have a hit. Right. And a lot of times we get pushed back when we're talking to a young artist who were like, hey, you could do that, you know, try it like this. They think they know the answer all the time. Right.

Right. That's like a really humble place to be able to say, you know what, I'll take your word for it. Yeah, for sure. That was the breakthrough for me. Was it that session or did you, what did you have, were you, were you, you, you, going into that session being like, all right, I'm ready. It was that session because I was already really hot from the mixtapes. And I had a lot of money and I was doing my tour and things.

I really didn't feel like I had to listen to anybody. But I respected them and I respected their opinion. And I felt like they were really trying to help me. And that was the moment where I was like, this is how you do this shit is you listen. Like you bring what you bring to the table. And then you let the people who are great at what they do do. And I really trusted them and I understood what they were trying to,

the road that they were trying to take me down. And I really appreciate them for keeping it 100 with me like that. And like I said, that was the moment right there. That's a good moment for me because I felt like I broke through as an artist. And it changed a lot. Our good friends at Chartmetric have all the data you need to power your music career. From playlist placements to stream counts to follower demographics and many more. It's never been easier to understand how your artists fit in the music industry and how they can grow.

Chart metric does the work for you, providing actionable insights and visuals on their up-to-date global data that covers over 10 million artists and 100 million songs. So there's no math required. Use it to find out things about your favorite artists and any of the artists and writers on this podcast. Plans start as low as $10 a month. Learn more and get started today at chartmetric.com. Yeah, my first two, you know, hit hits are with them. And Samo loves crazy because the track was all major chords

and on a guitar. and it kind of sounded like a Kelly Clarkson song, which was fine. But then they like stripped the track. And by the time we heard it next, it was this vibey, that whole other world. They just don't give up.

If they know there's a hit in there, they'll just cut, cut, cut. So here's our appreciation podcast for those guys. Oh, they also asked the question, we're also skinny trying to bulk any meal plan tips. Steak and rice, chicken and rice. two to three protein shakes a day. Are you consistent at that?

Yeah, yeah. Do you work out every day? Five days a week. With a trainer? Yeah, yeah, I got trainer. But sometimes I just work out at the crib, too. He might just send me my, you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah.

I do MMA as well. So if you really want to get right, add the MMA. Are you good at it? Really good. Do you compete? In gyms. Yeah. Yeah.

There's some sparring that goes on. Does it ever get out of hand? It hasn't yet. There's a lot of respect in that world. Like the, you know, people who are really good at martial arts, like part of the ethos is to almost invite people in. So you treat people with respect if you're better. If you're way better, you don't try to just kill the guy.

Hell no. You know, you try to, like, help them. Help them get better. You don't feel it, you know. Like, a lot of the times. you don't want to make it too easy on them because the best way to learn is to feel it. Yeah, like none of us want our dads to let us win.

Right. But if it gets too turned up, there's control. That's the word that we use. So sometimes you might get a guy who's a little bit, you know what I'm saying? So instead of returning his energy, might fall back a little bit. Or you might let him know, hey, bro, I got it too.

And then now we take it down. What was your martial arts that you've? and, you know, that you studied. I do taekwondo, moitai, and jujitsu. And I also do boxing and wrestling. So when do you have time to do anything else? If you're doing five days a week of working out

and doing all those things, like you're spending like two hours a day working out. Yep. It's got to help your performances when you do shows. I was already good at that. No, no, no, no. It's not like I'm envisioning you, like, kicking on stage. I mean, I'm just thinking like, just like, you're, you know,

I really think you're able to get there to a two, I'm for sure you can get there a two-hour show. I think it's the reverse. I think being able to have breath control on stage helps me perform when I'm doing martial arts. I think it's the reverse. So I know he kind of got a little off topic. So I'll just like go a little bit further, you know,

you know, the mixtape stuff really kind of blows up. You kind of get signed by. You have record deals that get you to the major record deals. But shit really changes once you have, you know, once it gets on the Atlantic train. Why did that change from Atlantic improve your career path over when it was originally signed through Warner? Because Julie, Kaiser, Craig, Mike, my... A&R's V at the time. Even...

Love Sve. You said what? I love Svee. Yeah, Zvi's cool as hell, right? Even Riggs, when he took over. Who else? Marcia. All of those people, Manny, all of those people really, really understood me and let me do me.

And that was the whole thing about me signing over there was we're going to let Wizz do Wizz. and I think that was really I was really fortunate to be in that situation and it hadn't been done like that before they trusted me and still do trust me but I'm not on Atlantic anymore but they just trusted me as an organic artist and somebody who knows my own fan base

and can make my own best decisions for myself and literally just got behind all of the things that I believed in and made sure that, you know, my fucking Taylor Gang Dreams came true. And that was the difference because, you know, when I was signed to Warner, they really didn't have any idea what to do with me or, you know, what my look was, what my crowd was.

But for Atlantic to be doing so well at basically, like, putting together their artists and then let me come through and just decide whatever I want to do. And it worked was like crazy, you know? And it was unheard of. It was unheard of. People weren't doing it. And I just feel like that was the reason that it was as successful as it was because we were a team as opposed to them saying, Witts, sit down. This is your blah, blah, blah. This is that. This is who you can and can't work with. They let me write my records. They let me pick which producers I want to. They let me direct my videos. They let me direct my photo shoots. All of my, you know, know, marketing and packaging, whatever I wanted to look like, let me do all of that shit. And it just really, really helped to have a successful run while I was, you know, on Atlantic.

Yeah, I think them recognizing that you don't need to have an external person do that is as good as a record label job as somebody who's like, if you don't have any idea what you should look like, that they can, like, actually help build a team around that. kind of artist. But if you have an artist that really does know their aesthetic, like what they want their tours to look like, all the whole thing, to encourage them and to support that, that also is a really good, you know,

that's amazing because not every record label does that. Hell no. When black and yellow becomes successful, there's a difference between, you know, even selling out shows from all the YouTube stuff, from all the mix tape stuff. A number one song,

a number one song across radio formats is a whole other thing. You know, did you start thinking that it was going, like you go on this crazy run, did you feel like you kind of left a part of you behind

once you get to that number one song? Or do you feel like you have to bring all the history with you? No, I don't think I've left anything behind my main thing was always like physical just being around people. So I was always touring. Like even when black and yellow came out, I think after that I stayed on tour for like three,

maybe five years straight. So I was just going. Yeah, I didn't have no time to like really soak it all in. Did anybody tell you like, hey, you should slow down? No. I mean, my wife at the time. Yeah, fair. Because she was like, bro, what are you doing?

But I had no concept. I'm like, it's fun. I love this. I love my fans. I'm enjoying myself. I'm building a brand. And you were also like young. Yeah.

And like that makes sense, you know? Hell yeah. I was like, you know, it was probably from like 22 to about 26 years old. Yeah, that's what you're supposed to be doing. Yeah. Just tore my ass off. When, you know, you start going on this like this whole run after. black and yellow is obviously huge.

But it's getting on payphone at the same time. And Young, Wild, and Free. It's like the radio is just like a giant. This is really nostalgic because it's right when I started, when I first meet Mike, it's right when I start working in music. And it was just like my peers are all like, you know, or people I aspire to have as my peers are all working with you. And you just had like hit after hit after hit.

So it was really kind of fun to like, at the time, it was really cool because a lot of what I was doing was aspiring to, like, work amongst the crew that you were in. Thanks. But you were really able to bring people from all different genres into, you know, like, I don't know what genre that was. I missed in a way, like, I love the Wiz Khalifa genre. It was like somebody who got some rock bands, some. You know, it's like pop writers, Bruno. Yep. Obviously, you know, I know your relationship with Snoop now.

But, like, you start bringing all these people together. I guess, like, what it, you know, that really defined an era. And we can go through the songs, but everyone knows those songs already. The music industry kind of, like, goes and does different, while ups and downs and different things. And all of a sudden, it's like, after that era of, like, five huge six I don't know how many huge hits you had in a row

a lot of the industry started doing this like sad boy mumble rap started getting into it wasn't like the shows weren't the same as like the show you would put on it wasn't music wasn't the same

did you feel like you started that you would have to adjust the way you do music to go with like some of what was becoming popular afterwards? I don't think I felt like I had to adjust. I think I would have had to be more consistent. And there was things that was going on that was blocking the consistency. Like what? I had left my former management, Rock from Records.

So my catalog, not what was really on freeze, but it was at a point where we were like separating, you know, what I can have. Yeah, you know, that's a real legal thing. Because I was with him since I was 16. So that happened. A real divorce happened. You know, me having a kid and just wanting to spend a lot of time with my kid and raise him correctly and be a part of his life. You know, I slowed down on touring. You know, so, you know, COVID, just a lot of real things that put time in between those eras where, you know, if you don't have the people who are like consistently leading that and championing that, people sort of just, you know, they kind of forget about it.

And I feel like that was the main thing is I was really consistent at that time. I was back to back to back to back to back. so you know what the lifestyle is, you know how necessary it is. But the necessity kind of went away and the trends changed. And it just becomes necessary for other trends at that time. I have a toddler and a baby at home right now. And it's like how many people have to tell you also at the end of their careers 40 years after when we're at now that are like, I wish I spent more time.

working less time with my kids. Nobody ever says that. Right, right. You know, and so I think like, you know, and I think it takes like a, it takes a grown-up to be able to say, like, I'm going to slow down a little bit on tour and make sure I'm like a present father. Yeah. You know.

Because there would be days, you know, at the studio or like just waking up late from doing shit where it's like, I would much rather be present for this than feeling like this right now. or making an excuse for shit. And it didn't take long for me to realize that shit. It was almost instant where I was like, bro, like, nah. Y'all can have it. You know what I mean? Like, it's cool.

It's fun. But like you said, it doesn't go in reverse where I would have wished that I worked more. I'm very happy with the time that I'm spending with my kid. He's 11 now. So he's at an age where he gets, everything. He understands everything. He can do a lot of things for himself. So I feel like, all right, now I could get back to work. But, you know, I gave myself that grace period where a lot of

people don't think it's possible to take your foot off the gas and then put your foot back on the gas. It's so weird because when it's your life, you feel like you're taking the foot off the gas. And when it's like, as an observer, it doesn't seem that way because this is the thing about hit songs. I go to Universal as like, it's like seven minutes from here, right? And we go there as like a playground. Yeah. You know?

We're literally there like once every other week. Right. Because where else can you run with like a toddler where they're safe, just wherever he wants to go. Right. The first song that you hear every single time you walk in and see you again. Yeah. Like the first song.

And so like it feels so present. Yeah. Like I know that that song wasn't written yesterday. But it's like, it's so current that it's, you know, all you have to do is put out new music. Yeah, exactly. And then it's like to everyone else, like it doesn't seem like you took your foot off the gas. 100%. Speaking of that song, See You Again.

Charlie Poohpoo being a friend of ours and all. That pre-chorus, I reference in sessions constantly. Really? Thank you. Constantly. And it's like the dorkiest thing to say. say that. Thank you. But like it's one of my favorite pre-courses because you, you are so patient. Nobody starts at the end of a measure. Everyone is so like, I need to be in front. Everybody wants

it's like, one, two, three, I need to start now, whatever. You do like, the fact that you like are so patient on the, how can we know, like, yeah, yeah. I bring that up all the time because everyone just feels like they have to jump on top of every measure. Every track has to be like, you know, before the one, before the one or on the one. If your Stargate's on the one. But that one, on that pre-chorus,

like, you're so patient in it. And, you know, people can, you can, you know, I'm sure you get, you know, people want to talk about that song all the time. But what they should talk about is the pre-course. Thank you, bro. Appreciate that. You know? You've done a lot of good work. Thank you, man. With the pre-corus.

Hey, good looking, bro. Just got to give it. Anyway. I really appreciate that. Isn't it weird though? Like when you're... Okay, so once you have that Stargate experience with black and yellow, and once you experience what a number one song is,

and they're like, hey, if you want a number one song, this is the arrangement you should do. And then it ends up being a number one song. There's a difference between rapping on records and then, you know, writing pop songs. Yeah. And when you're writing, you know, when you're doing a feature on payphone and Amar and Dano and Benny and these guys are writing this hook. And it's like some of that stuff is really well structured for you. Yes.

But like that pre-chorus is really well crafted. Where did you start thinking of like the craft of pop writing versus like I'm in a freestyle right now? Yeah, that's very interesting. Thank you. I appreciate that. Damn, bro. I just love different music and how it makes me feel and to understand where it goes

and what happens when it's appreciated. And I could do, try to introduce pop writing to rap music, but they just don't get it all the way. but when we're in a pocket where people appreciate that shit, that's when I can shine and that's when it comes out. So those are the, it's just using, like literally digging in my bag and coming out with what I know how to do at that time. And those are some of my favorite records to write

and to really build a song based off of that structure. But I don't always get the opportunity to do it. But you can make that opportunity that other artists can't. You know, this is your... This is like a real conversation. So the problem that I have is sometimes there's too pop for rap and sometimes it's too rap for pop. Of course. Yeah.

That's the only issue that I... It is usually the too pop for rap part. But I'm too rap for pop. Yeah. It happens like that, bro. Is that... Is that from radio, Spotify? I think it's more from a radio, radio, radio.

Because they want to... Like, I have to be, like, urban or rhythmic. But I don't write those types of records. Like, I write big songs structured, like what you're saying. Yeah. But it won't... Ugh! They will follow.

That's why I like working with like Benny Blanco. Yeah. Because like you said, it gives me an opportunity to fucking, you know what I mean, shine. So the more collaborations and the more I dig in that bag, which I'm going to do, let me get busy. Yeah. We'll get back there, man. But that's why I appreciate that, though. It's not just a we'll get, like it would, oh, it would, you know, the, this is, you came in the perfect time.

there's like this that that book Outliers by Malcolm Gladwell where it's like sometimes you're just born in the right place and born at the right time I should say because you obviously weren't

you know it's not like Pittsburgh was a hotbed of pop music shout out to our friends that are actual pop music from Pittsburgh there are a few but we won't get into that but the idea of like when you you end up coming here you end up getting going through the Atlantic

system and really that that, you know, the Mike Karen world of that stuff, right at like this perfect time. And like your skill set just like brought so much of those songs together. The fact that, you know, right when Bruno was not quite the Bruno Mars yet, you know, and all that, like, it was just such a good time. And we just, I think that like we all need to have a resurgence of like, you know, it doesn't have to be one or the other.

It's strange because we're in an era where there aren't really genres. Like you're not walking through a record store. Mm-hmm. You know? I understand radio is, but like we're not walking through record stores. So why can't we have more of that, you know, mashup? I don't get it either, bro. I wish I could fucking answer that shit.

I usually have like a concept of why or what is stopping it, but I really don't. Because I see music leaning, and this is just a real conversation, I see music going in that way where people want bigger, better produced, better written records. They want that shit. Like, and more variety, you know what I mean? And it's not like in a corny way where, like, it just means that people want, they're leaning towards bigger music. Yeah, it's like, I mean, I got, you know, it's that you want, I don't want to say like, you know, you know, I don't want to say like, you know, know, real songs in a way, but even like the, you know, I know you and Drake kind of come up around the same time and all that stuff. And it's like a lot of his songs were song songs.

Yeah. You know, it's like these song songs. Yeah. It's like can be really healthy and doesn't have to be. And maybe coming out of COVID will have like where people are quarantined. Like everyone has to sing like this because they're like little siblings sleeping next door or because they haven't ever performed a lot. Yeah.

So they don't even know the idea of like, oh, I'm going to have to project over, you know, 40,000 people in a stadium. That makes sense. You know, like, they just don't even have, they're writing from a place of, like, doing everything here in front of their task camp. Yeah. Their equivalent of that. That makes sense. And they're not writing in front. They don't, they've never experienced performing in Sao Paulo for 60,000 people.

Right, right. Right. And they don't even think that way because they're writing in their bedroom. Yeah. It's true. Anyway, we just need more of you. It's all I'm saying, bro. Got you, bro. It's on the way.

All right, cool. Let's talk about some of the other endeavors. Yes. You know? You know, obviously you've got weed line. I know you're getting in this shroom stuff. Yep. Does that, it feels like that industry is really saturated.

And yet I know that that's coming from someone who lives in Los Angeles, I know half the country hasn't even experienced it yet. They're still like having to do it how we used to, you know? What is it, like, what should we expect from the industry of the weed industry? The thing to expect is just more recreational use of weed. That's basically what it is, bro. Like the laws are changing. A lot of places are still medicinal to where you have to have a card.

But my brand isn't like weed stores or anything like that. It's actually shipping to places who have a constant customer service. So we're in Philadelphia. I mean, we're in Pennsylvania. We're in D.C. We're in Florida. We're in Arizona. We're in Colorado.

We're in a lot of different places. where it's not just like a mom-and-pop weed shop. Like, shout out to them. But it's moving away from as hippie, as weed shit looks and scenes, and is becoming a more of a corporate everyday thing. And that's what my brand is gearing up for. What's applicable from your music career that helps you run a weed company? Like you said, my taste.

People trust my taste in the plant, and that's what sells my product. Do you smoke other products? No. I've only been smoking mine for 10 years, well, not 10 years, but for as long as we've had the plant. Right. And it's 24, so almost 12 years, yeah. I sold trams in college. What's different from the trams I sold in college to the trumes that you...

Right now, the psychedelics. Because hydraulic mushrooms aren't legal. Right. So these shroom kits are more like mental, you know, lions mane and shit like that. And these like homegrown, they're starting out with these more natural untrippy shrooms. Right, of course. And there's other countries where the trippy shrooms are illegal. So, you know.

So are you guys doing both depending on the country? It's good to get ahead of the game. Got it. Yeah. Do you guys, do you go to D.C. see it all? Like, do people go and actually campaign for changing laws and whatnot? Do you guys get involved in that?

Yeah, we do tons of conferences and things like that. There's a lot of different cities where, you know, they're releasing people from jail for weed crimes, things like that. We're behind all of that stuff. Yeah, that's crazy. That's a whole other

conversation. It's cool as hell of that it's happening. Yeah. Because if weed becomes legal, then, you know, everyone who did a crime based off of that shit, shit. He released. Yeah, probably. Can't make money off of us no more. It's real.

Well, okay, so last segment we're going to do. We're going to do a five for five. I mean, just name five things and, you know, tell me what comes off the top of your head. All right. We'll start with Pittsburgh. Five things that come off the top of my head. Well, just one thing that comes out of your time. I mean, that's five things.

Oddly, I just thought about Mac Miller. Oh, wow. Yeah. He used to live right here. This was like this is the like... Oh, he did live off of Lower Canyon. Yeah, yeah. This is where all that, yeah, it's crazy.

So yeah, it was strange, but when you said Pittsburgh, that's what I thought of. Were you guys friends? Yeah, hell yeah. It's my little homie, man. Hell yeah. Khalifa Kush. Best weed in the world. What do, you know, like other people who also have their weed,

Do you know other people who smoke your weed instead of their own? They don't smoke mine because it's too strong for them. Is that right? Hell yeah. Niggas is scared of my weed. That's so good. Taylor gang. Worldwide.

Yeah, I like that. Yeah, yeah. Your mom. It's my everything. I know he passed away, but you're dead. No, my dad's still alive. I thought he... My brother passed away.

Your brother passed away. Yeah, yeah. It was your dad. My dad is my biggest influence. Amazing. Yeah, yeah. What's go with your brother? Let's go with my brother.

We'll add that too. Um, I still feel like he's here. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Never, never left. Well, thanks for doing this podcast. No, I thank you for having me, man. I really enjoyed myself.

You know, it's like, it's that thing that I was. saying before, it's fun because when you're when you come up in this space of like that community that was really into the idea of like there are no genres right now.

It was so inspiring and really there aren't a lot of artists who can bring that kind of thing back or keep that thing alive. So I'm putting a lot of chips in your games. It's going to happen, man. I appreciate you. I appreciate you too, bro. Thank you for

I need that energy. That energy is going to push me. There we go. Hell yeah. Since our interview, our guest has been up to quite a lot. He's gearing up for the release of Cush and Orange Juice 2, the highly anticipated sequel to his 2010 mixtape, with heavy hitters like Cardo, ID Labs,

Michael Made It and Juicy Jay behind the boards. Singles like Khalifa's home, hide it featuring Don Tolliver, and Bring Your Lungs featuring Smoke Dizza have already dropped, with stunning visuals directed by Maya Table. Outside of music, he's expanded his Caliphah Cush Line into new markets, launched a wellness brand called Mr. Cap for natural mushroom kits, and made waves in MMA with the Professional Fighters League.

Plus, his award-winning gin, McQueen and the Violet Fogg, continues to stand out in the spirit's world. He's balancing it all with his entrepreneurial spirit, while never missing a beat in his musical journey. This episode is produced by Joe London, mega house management, and myself. See you all next week. I'm Ross Golan signing on.