And The Writer Is...with Ross Golan - Ep. 34: Sir Nolan Lambroza

Episode Date: November 13, 2017

Our next guest is a Berklee College of Music graduate who has worked with some of the most noteworthy pop artists of the past few years. With co-writing and production credits including the #1 hits “Good For You (feat. A$AP Rocky)” by Selena Gomez and “Jealous” by Nick Jonas, this multi-platinum writer and producer is paving the way for an unstoppable career. Additionally, he has penned the top 10 hits “All In My Head (Flex)” by Fifth Harmony and "Feel This Moment (feat. Christina Aguilera) by Pitbull, as well as “We Own the Night” by The Wanted, “Body Say” for Demi Lovato, Rita Ora’s #3 UK hit “Poison”, “Believe” and “All Around The World” by Justin Bieber, and Daya's recently released single “New". He was raised in London and moved to Los Angeles by way of Boston after college. This determined songwriter (and master cold-caller) is an inspiration for any writer and is now one of the most sought after producers in pop music at the young age of 27! And The Writer Is... Sir Nolan Lambroza! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hey guys, this is, and the writer is, and I'm your host, Ross Golan. I've written with hundreds of artists and writers over the years, and my favorite part of each session is the first hour when we catch up about life, the industry, politics, composition, whatever. So this is a journey of learning why people write songs, how people write songs, and most importantly, who the people are who write the songs. I'm producing this with the Great Joe London, big deal music publishing and mega house music management if you want to listen to the songs we

discuss in this podcast follow us on our socials find out about special events or buy some of our merchandise go to our website www www.andthe writer is.com oh and if you enjoy this podcast please rate us on iTunes or whatever your preferred podcast listening site is we really appreciate that effort welcome to and the writer is I'm your host Ross Golan. This week's writer is a multi-platinum producer with multiple top tens, including a couple number ones. He went to Berkeley School of Music in Boston as a guitar player, and last week when I went to his house, he was playing Beethoven on piano. So it's no wonder that his first huge hit was with Pitbull. He's had all this success, and he's only in his mid-20s. This geographical

mutt is hysterical, sarcastic, and truly too smart for his own good. And the writer's, and the writer's is kind of from London, Sir Nolan Lambrosia. Hi. Hi, how are you? Good, that was a good intro. Yeah, thank you. For the record, we're drinking mimosa's. That seems like something we should be doing.

I don't have one. What? What's that then? Oh, okay. Or is that yours? I'm going to drink some of yours. Do it. You can drink all you want.

So, let's start from the beginning. You are Nolan. Yep. You were born here. I was born in Washington, D.C. Yeah. When did you move to London? It was after I moved to Sweden.

Wait, what? I moved to Sweden when I was about, fuck, four years old. Like Stockholm? Yeah, like Stockholm for two years. Why were you moving around from D.C.? Was your dad in politics or something? No, he was a professor at Georgetown. And then they offered him 10-year, and he decided he won,

wanted to do something different. And he said no and went to, he had a friend or something that had an opening and a finance company. And he, the first opportunity was in Sweden. So we just packed up and moved to Stockholm. Do you remember it? I remember Stockholm. Yeah, a little bit. I remember it gets very dark around 2, 3 p.m. in the winter and it's incredibly cold. And I had to wear this hat where the, you know, like the earmuffs with the earmuffs, you know, they go over. I look really stupid. And that temperature, you don't care what you look like. And I remember my brother went to an all-Swedish school for some reason, and one of the other kids bit him really bad.

And then, like, I just remember that. I was, like, old enough to go to, like, the mixed, like, international school. But he had to go to all-Swedish school, which I don't understand why. No one spoke a word of English. So I remember that. That poor guy. Yeah. My sister was born there.

I kind of remember that. I think my mom told me it costs like thousands of dollars to have my brother and I in the U.S. And like, you know, $100 to have her in Sweden with the exact same, like quality. Yeah, with the exact same quality. So we were there for a year and a half. And then my dad got transferred to London. How old were you at this time? I must have been like six.

Yeah. And then, yeah, we arrived in London and set up camp in a county called Surrey, which is like, 40 minutes south of London. When did you start playing piano? I assume piano was your first instrument. It was. Everyone in my household had to try to learn how to swim. We had to try a sport and try something musical.

Just to kind of see what we gravitated to so that in our off time we had something to do. What was your sport? I never really had one. I guess I played like some tennis and soccer, you know? But you swim? Yeah, we just had to learn how to swim. Oh, it wasn't like, you have to be like a swimmer. It was like you just had to learn not to sink.

Yeah, exactly. So no one in my family will sink. And some of us no sports and some of us no music. But, yeah, piano was my first instrument. But I hated practicing it. I passionately hated it. And so I picked up a guitar and started teaching myself that and learning that. And then eventually went back to piano when I felt like I didn't have to practice.

never been good at having to do something. So were you playing all through your childhood? Were you writing through your childhood? No, I didn't really understand. I mean, I was in a small town in England. Like, I didn't understand what a writer or producer was. I didn't even understand what an A&R, any of that stuff was until I was around like 19, no, 20 maybe.

I remember I taught guitar a lot. And I would write, like, you know, guitar pieces. you know like trying to like faux classical pieces and like that kind of stuff. Oh so classical kind of guitar? Well like yeah mixed with like heavy metal I don't know like I would like trying to combine them and you know all that kind of stuff I was like really into shredding guitar and so that was what I spent some of my time doing this is really uh there's a good program called like guitar pro I think it's cold or something like that and it's like the crappies midi you know twangy sound and I would spend like hours putting like little and shitty notes in and

like trying to make something sound good, you know? So that was my first writing experience, I guess, was with, on guitar pro writing like little guitar ballads and stuff. Did you have long hair? Were you, like, trying to be, like, super metal? And I had, like, this, I got made fun of a lot because I had this, like,

leather jacket. It was really way too big for me. Like, way too big for me. It was the only size they had left. I really wanted it. And in England, you get, like, one day a year. You get to go in regular clothes, and it would be the worst day.

Because I would wear, like, the panty shirt, like the extra large leather jacket and it would be torturous but did you did people really make fun of you oh yeah ball on why did they make fun of you i think anyone that's different is always singled out i always feel like kids have like this primal instinct to smell fear and insecurity you know and without even knowing why they like are able to form a group against a certain individual you know yeah and the older you get i feel like the more that kind of is subdued a little bit in, you know, civilized culture,

but something kind of very innate as kids that we were able to, like, single out, you know? And I don't think I was super confident in myself, which is also what made it, you know, it's like shark smell, fear and blood in the water, you know? And so because I didn't, like, conform to, like, the rest of the way people's hair was or dress code or music, you know.

It's so weird because being as good as you are at guitar and piano, I would think that kids would admire that, but I don't think that kids, recognize how incredible talented musicians are as children. Like it's something that you grow into where people start to recognize how crazy that is. But when you're in junior high, nobody understands that, oh, yeah, this guy can play, you know, 250-year-old pieces of music and then also shred on guitar. That's pretty nuts.

Yeah, I think the reason I got so good at those instruments is because I wasn't invited to any of the parties. or any of that stuff. So I spent all my nights and days playing. And I remember there was one moment, though, in my high school where I played, like, a sweet child of mine or something in this, like, talent show or something. You know, it was like one of those cheesy moments. And I played the solo. I'd learned it, like, behind my head, you know, play the guitar. And then the next day, like, everyone was, like, really stoked on it. And that lost it about a day, but that felt pretty good.

That was when people recognized, like, oh, he's actually doing, like, something, you know. At that point, did you want to be in a band? Yeah, I was in one. too. What was your band called? I don't even remember. We did like a battle of the bands. I forget. We played like all covers. Everyone else played original. So we won.

Right. Because everyone wanted to hear those. Because if the crowd were all like, fuck yeah, like and singing along and they knew it all, you know, it's way harder to play originals. Yeah. Well, I mean, that's that thing of like, you recognize how valuable a song is when you're starting to play at a battle of bands. And, you know, they start to like the hit songs. They don't want to hear that. shitty original. No, the biggest artist in the world, all they do is do covers all night long. Like, songs that people already know. Whether it's from them, it doesn't really matter, but, you know.

That's interesting. I guess it's true. It's like, you know, every time you pitch a song and an artist cuts it, it's a cover. And then every time they perform it, they're doing a cover of their own version of the song that somebody else wrote. People are always going to love it. That's why people want to hear hit records, you know, played live. Yeah.

So how did you end up going to Berkeley? I assume that's when you moved back to the U.S., right? Yeah. Is your family still in the U.K.? No, they're out here now in Boston. Okay. So they all moved out with you, or you guys moved to Boston and then you went to Berkeley? I moved to Boston by myself because my sister and my brother were still in high school.

And when my sister graduated high school, she and my parents, my brother's already in university out here, but she and my parents then made the full move over here. when we've written before we've talked about you know like John Mayer who's also a Berkeley grad and how much that kind of like influenced you at the time was that that's the right era though right right when you started going to Berkeley is that when he was sort of at his peak

oh yeah yeah yeah that was like when continuum was out yeah yeah and so is that why you went to Berkeley or is it totally just a coincidence it's a coincidence I mean I did this program and it's like a one week program when I was like 15 there because I had heard about, I think my dad had told me about music school like Berkeley College music and I needed something to do during the summer and my parents were

coming out here to see extended family and I did it and it like was mind blowing because it was the first time where I literally had something in common with every single person at the school every single person I could talk to you know at the base level yeah they were also the guy who stayed at home and played music they're all super losers like me and uh I just found that it was really awesome. And I actually felt like, you know, it sounds cliche, but like fit in, you know. And it was kind of intoxicating and I wanted to go back. So I went back like the following year to do, there's like a five week.

Like you can do a month summer. It's like a summer camp, you know, there. And then after that, I was like, I have to go here. So it's the only school I applied to. So crazy. And I didn't get in twice. Is that right? Yeah, they denied me twice.

So what did you do during that time? I mean, how old were you then? 17. So what did you do after they didn't? I was really sick. That's crazy. You were so determined that you didn't care that you were being denied. You're like, I'm going to get in.

It wasn't like fine, then I'll go somewhere else. No, when my heart is set on something, I have to do it. These days I'm a little bit more patient, but back then I wasn't. They do this thing called the 12-week program, right? I'm laughing only because I don't think of you as being the most patient guy. I'm very impatient, but I'm much better than I was. Yeah, that's for sure. Yeah.

I remember I really wanted, like, Green Day tickets, and my parents told me that I didn't have any money when I was younger, and I had to, like, clean the kitchen, you know? And they'd pay me, like, you know, $10 or something like that, 10 pounds. And so I remember, like, cleaning it three times in one day, which didn't really make sense, but then I expected, like, cash, you know? Yeah. But, yeah, I'm much more patient now.

I clean it three times. Like, kind of. Yeah, you clean it once, and then, like, many wiped things. Did you go to the Green Day concert? Yeah. I still went here like three times at this point in my life.

I used to go see bands all the time. I've seen Journey like five times for some reason. Really? Jovi maybe five or six times, yeah. That's crazy. I mean, you could probably write with some of these people now. Yeah, I wrote with Desmond Child, which is cool. I haven't worked with John Bon Jovi yet.

I know you have, right? Yeah. That's pretty cool. Yeah, you know. it didn't work out. But it was actually pretty cool because you know, you only do,

how many songs do you do karaoke of, you know, and like six of them are Bon Jovi songs. And so it was like the first time where I had this, I had a song written and, you know, I'm scrolling through this iPad

that I have right here and like showing him the lyrics and we were going over the song and stuff. And then, you know, which is basically him just doing karaoke of a song that I wrote. Yeah.

You know? I mean, it didn't make the last record. But it was definitely a moment that was pretty rad that he was seeing karaoke to a song I wrote. It's incredible. It's kind of like a weird cosmic mind fuck. But I was probably about 20 years late

for having a Bon Jovi hit. I try to jam like artists' biggest songs with them, you know, for fun in the studio. Yeah. To say that I like, because it's fun, you know, you're a big fan. I'll just like pick up the guitar and play something and you know. Do they sing? Who have you done it with? Enrique and

Nick and. Do they actually do they sing along with you when you're doing it? Or are they just looking at you like, oh, stop doing it. No, I love it. It's great. I always feel like that when you're writing with these guys. I mean, I've sung duets with literally, like, the best singers in the world

sitting at a piano where, like, one of us is singing harmony, and we're looking at each other, and you're like, Michael Boubley, I love you. Like, why are we singing harmony with each other? Okay, so you're at Berkeley. Is that where you start writing or producing? So to back up... Oh yeah, that's right. You didn't get in.

So they have this like, you know, if you're going to transfer from another school or you wanted to take summer credits at Berkeley from another university, you can go and do it. And you can do some liberal arts in like the basic first semester courses. And I got into that because I just really determined to they let me do that. And I got really good grades in all of the different courses, which are all first semester courses anyway. And so they let me in. I was just really, one of my additions I had like the flu or something

I'd go like straight to the hospital afterwards and at the time also they were auditioning the auditioners weren't the same instrument as the one you were playing so like I was auditioned by two trumpet players you know and like I was doing like heavy rock I remember I played like some dream theater piece

or something like that and they were just not about it so it's really I mean we've talked about this before but I have kind of I have a love-hate relationship with people who play in classical orchestras or jazz bands because they look down on, they traditionally look down on pop music. And even though Dream Theater isn't exactly pop music, you know, Bon Jovi is.

And they look down on that as being lesser than Miles Davis, lesser than Bartok. But when you think about it, those guys were just, you know, they were Bon Jovi's of their time. They're not like, I mean, Miles is a little higher than that. But, you know, like those guys, I mean, you could argue that some of those guys, Coltrane or someone like that is on the same level name-wise as what Bon Jovi is to rock music, no? Yeah, you could say Coltrane is to jazz, what Jovi is to rock.

I mean, it's weird, but like on some level, people who, you know, you talk to a trumpet player, and they're going to look down on the fact that it's like, oh, yeah, well, you write with. whoever the pop artist is and you're like, well, wait a minute, what do you think those people are? Yeah, pop you know, pop hits like of their day.

Yeah. Like the magic flute by Mozart, number one record. Sick record. Yeah. I mean, it's not quite pop music. I'm not comparing, I'm not saying that the Bieber records are the same as as Mozart, but I'm saying as far as

what popular music is, that they're still in something of a cover band. They're also in a cover band. Right, they're playing, yeah, big kids. Anyway, so you get in, you start playing for the... You play for the trumpet guys, they don't like you. The last time you play, you finally play for a guitar person.

Yeah, and they didn't even make me audition the last time I just had to do the courses, the summer courses. So I just went, and I was still in high school at the time. So I had to, like, fly back and forth a bunch to make sure I got both... I graduated high school and I got into Berkeley. So I did that. and then it felt really good to be accepted there

because like I said it's the only place I applied so yeah started there and you go through your first semester thing of meeting all these new people and then by like the second year you don't speak to any of them anymore you have a whole new group of friends and I think Berkeley was great for

more than learning anything just more socializing you know interacting with people on their own for the first time being an individual learning how to navigate social waters and all that kind of stuff. Yeah. So were you in a band there?

Like how did you... What's the transition that gets you from being... I'm a guitarist who's playing Dream Theater to like, oh yeah, here's a song, or here's production. I guess someone, is that where... Are you learning this at Berkeley, or are you learning from other Berkeley people?

Or like, what gets you from there to Los Angeles, California? Yeah, a couple things. So, you know, I was really... probably, you know, as big fish in a small pond where I was in England, you know, like probably the best guitar player in the school, all that kind of stuff. And then when you go to musical like Berkeley, just like when you come out to L.A. and write songs, all of a sudden you're like this little dwarf, right? And then you have to decide, okay, is this really for me?

Is this really what I want to do? Because these guys are so much better than me. And I decided, yeah, being guitar player is not like what I want to be anymore. I really love playing guitar. but to get to be as good as these guys, I have to go through a whole bunch of hoops and obstacles that I'm not really interested in doing, you know? For satisfaction, the reward would be, you know,

being able to improvise really, really well or be what is the best thing you could be, like a great session musician, maybe? Like, you know, I mean, there's, it's an honor to be that great at an instrument, but for some reason, for me, it wasn't, didn't feel like at the time it was the right trajectory. So I was in a band

And It was kind of like a hip-hop Pop thing And we go play around And I played guitar in the band And It was hip-hop? Hip-hop

Slash pop Yeah Oh cool Hip-hop What was it? Hip-pop? Yeah, I'm not going to tell you Why?

Because there's music out? Yeah So Are you for real Not going to say it? So I'm going to have to track it down And make it part of the intro? Crush Club

Hey! Actually, that's how I I first met like Damon Bonetta and the Bonetta is through Crush Club. For real? Yeah, Katie Wellie too. A lot of like people in the beginning, beginning. Crazy. So you guys started playing around Boston?

Yeah, we played around Boston and then we played around L.A. And the other guy in the group, who actually is now in the Lost Kings, like that DJ duo. For real? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Do you keep in touch? Yeah. I mean, obviously, because we've, that's crazy.

Yeah. Okay. So it's kind of like a super group? no it wasn't a super group. Why? I mean, you gotta be kidding. You're talking about people who have no credits end up in some sort of band out of any school

and they both end up having success independently is pretty crazy. And the other guy, the lead singer, Bryce Vine, he's an artist that I signed too, and that's doing his thing independently too. So we all still stay in touch and make music, but

that's crazy. So, did Damon Benetta Did Julian Banana, did Katie Welley, did they fly you out to L.A.? No, we just came out here because one of the guys, so I'll tell you, so one of the guys lives out here. But I was in the band, and Nick, the guy in Lost Kings, was kind of producing everything. And I really was interested in that because I hated being on stage.

I hated being in front of everybody. And I didn't want any of the limelight, and it was so scary to get up on there. And like, I couldn't let loose. I couldn't relax ever. And so I. I kind of dived into the production side of things. I was really interested in that. And I really loved the arrangement.

And I started doing, like, making beats by myself and stuff on my laptop. And the first couple of beats I made were for Kanye West. And I wouldn't let anyone else have them because they were for Kanye. But you didn't have any access to Kanye. No, it was stupid. And they were probably terrible. It's just one of those things in the beginning. You feel you're so precious about everything because you've only done five things.

Once you don't have 500 things, you know, you don't care anymore. Right. Do you still have those beats? Somewhere. Do they have titles to the beats? I don't know. Probably. Do you know what the titles were?

I honestly can't remember. Okay. It was like seven computers ago. Yeah, yeah. Were you using Pro Tools? No, Logic Express. Ah. And reason.

There you go. Only way to make Kanye hits. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, for sure. So, yeah. And then I remember one, it was one semester that we were all going to come out here, right? and do a whole bunch of shit in LA with the band. And my dad, being a professor, wouldn't let me not be in college still.

So I had to do internships out here for credit. And right at the last minute, everyone bailed. And I was the only one left coming out here. I came out here by myself, and I was like, fuck it. I'll make some connections. And I interned at a whole bunch of different places, like RCA and Sony ATV, Atlantic, interned. for a studio that Mike Flynn owned.

What were you doing there? Where? At any of these places? RCA was in the publicity department. Atlantic, I was in the radio promo department. Sony TV was an A&R and film licensing. And then I was like a runner

at this studio called Harmony. Yeah? Which is actually where they recorded Adel's... Someone like you? Someone like you. Yeah. That's crazy. Yeah. So that's, I mean, how valuable is that?

as like an entrepreneur to then have sort of been introduced to all these different things. It was great. Were you ever trying to tell them, hey, I want to be a songwriter, a producer, or were you not sure what you wanted to be? Did you think about joining that side? After my internships. Yeah, I did. Just kidding, guys, who are listening.

Yeah. You're not part of the dark side. You're our friends. Wait. The executive side? Yeah. No, what I mean? Like, did you ever think about joining a label or a publisher or something?

I mean, for a minute I did when I was there. I thought it was pretty cool, but I was way more interested in producing. And I think, like, being there and having songwriters and producers call and onto the phone of them and have to put them through, I was like, holy shit, this is cool. You know, there's like, you know, sending songs back and forth. I like the whole process, and I was super interested in it, and I wanted to figure it out. So I just started producing way, way more and, like, emailing and tweeting and, like, whatever I could, everybody in sight to see if I can get, like, one.

response, you know? The only, like, I'd say the only people that I remember actually having a dialogue with ever, and I'm sending out, like, hundreds of emails and Blaze track and PMP worldwide. Like, every fucking, like,

outlet you can have as a new producer I took advantage of. But no, there's three people. One was Casey Robeson, who was had a writer-published relationships at BMI, and I lied to him and told them that someone that he knew thought it was important that we'd meet,

like we should meet. So I like called you. Who did you say? I'm not going to say the person's name. That's really funny. Yeah. But I just lied and I said, oh yeah, you know, this person said that you and I should really talk and he's like, oh yeah, I love that guy.

Yeah, for sure. We should meet. And so that's how I whizzed my way into Casey's office. He's one of the producers of this podcast. So I get the feeling that we can find the answer. I won't love your spot though. Okay, so then he opens the door for you then. Yeah, he just kind of, you know, embrace me a little bit and help me out,

make some decisions and set me up with some co-writes early on and help, you know, mentor that part of my life. It's weird how, like, a lot of young writers always ask for advice, you know, how do you get in or, you know, they send you music and all this stuff and you're like, I don't know, call BMI, call AskUp. To be honest, that's how, like, you got started with Casey, I got started with Casey, you got started with Casey, the guy below us got started with Casey, the guy in the next room got start of the Casey, you know, like

you send music to your PROs, they have departments that are made for helping connect dots, you know? No, seriously, and I was signed, I remember Samantha Cox signed my band, like, out of New York one year, I didn't give a shit about any, I was just like playing shows, I didn't get

the songwriting community or whatever, and I realized, like, oh, I'm with BMI, like, and it's not exactly like a difficult thing to sign with BMI, you think you just send Yeah, you can just, you automatically can, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, I reached out there, DJ Frankie, funnily enough,

was one of the only people that, like, consistently have a dialogue with me. And I'd send him... Wow. Did Casey do the introduction? No, I just, like, found an email online,

I just emailed him. And he was cool with it. I called him. I emailed, like, hundreds of people. Like, I'm not even kidding. At the time, you're talking about DJ Frankie must have, you know, yeah,

three times. And it just come off of, like, six huge hits. I mean, he's just a massive producer and you're like, Cole, that stuff. Yeah.

Yeah. He didn't get back to me every time. And I was like, I find that super respectful. Do you respond to all the emails that people send you? I try to because of that reason. And I think being in the position I am now, I know it's not as easy as flipping a switch

and then taking some zero to 100, but all I cared about was that the guy was just get back to me. I felt like, oh, there's some feedback, there's some sort of dialogue, it's okay. It's all that's good enough. And then the only other person to get back to me was Nazary and his brother Nile. and they invited me up to the studio

that day I hit him up and that was kind of the beginning of our relationship in my first publishing. So it was a cold call to the messengers? I think I just tweeted him. A cold tweet? Yep. That's crazy.

I mean people who tweet or send me messages through Instagram or whatever I barely know how to check it let alone respond to it and have a dialogue and that's like an incredible thing that you can actually meet basically through a cold tweet.

Yeah. Hell yeah. So did you send them like a link in whatever and then they're like come on up? I think so, yeah. I told them I went to Berkeley and that helped because

Nashville's partner Adam is like a super a plus musician and they are all their music all their songs of voice has been musical and had you know involved play,

you know, high level playing in some way. So he liked that. Wait, so you're out of Berkeley at this point. Yeah, this is like once I've graduated. Like literally like in the first couple months since I've graduated. I mean, you only graduated, what, four years ago? 2011, I think.

Whoa, six years ago? Yeah. Wow, you're getting old. Quit. Retire soon because it's only downhill from here. It's not, I'm kidding. I graduated like 35 years ago. Nice.

It's like you wouldn't be in my sunlight of the year. Yeah, exactly. I peaked for sure. Okay, so you're starting right with the messengers and all of a sudden you end up with, like, how soon till you end up with, you know, feel this moment, which becomes a top five record? Yeah, fuck, I work like every day.

They gave me like the small studio in Van Nuys and I worked every day and every night tirelessly because they were going to work on the Bieber record. Yeah. leave. Did you know who? I mean, obviously you knew who Bieber was at the time, but. I knew who Bieber was.

Yeah. I was very, you know, I knew a lot of people. I knew songwriter, producer's names. You know, I was invested and I wanted it. Yeah, you wanted it bad enough for that. Yeah. And I was, and they had done some stuff with Bieber, so I knew that there was an in there, and I worked really, really, really hard.

And finally got a track and Naze wrote over it and, you know, sent it to Bieber. Beber. And I was like, fuck yeah. finally like I put in so much work and I got one cut right which was the song it was called I'll make you believe uh-huh it didn't make the album and I remember Nazary coming out of the studio one day and I was feeling so good and so tired and he just said like super quick band-aid style like not on they don't take the record scooter doesn't like it's not happening go back make some more and I was like devastated but wow that was my first like real feeling of like you know that deep in your

chest like bummed out because you just right you had something um and then I just but got up, went back and worked super, super hard again every night, every night, every night. And we wrote all around the world, which made it on the album, you're on that same album with the same melody. I was going to say, like, that's one of the notes I have. That's like one of my favorite things because people are always like, people are always so nervous about, you know, other people having melodies and people stealing shit. And that's only new to this generation of writers, you know? Yeah.

And the first time we met, I didn't even think about it, but track one, which was yours with, All around the world, right? Yeah. And I was four songs later. It's like, I can take you out. It's literally the same exact melody. Four songs away. And it's shocking how, you know, how oblivious people really are about, you know,

melodies being the same. It's like, ah, who cares? There's only so many notes and we all listen to the same, you know. All great songwriters and producers listen to great musicians, right? And it's like, in order to be a great chef, you have to eat great food. so you're bound to be influenced by the same things you're bound to run into the same notes especially when most pop music is only three or four chords

like you're bound to hit the same intervals also depending on the culture of the time people are very inspired by you know the music of the zeit guys the sound of the time and so we're all going to be kind of pulling from that so it's no surprise but it never ever has upset me I've never thought about like

No, that's like one of my favorite conversations ever. I think the first time we met, either you said it, somebody said it to me, but I'm pretty sure in our first conversation we ever had, you said like, hey, you had the same, we had the same song on the Bieber album. We sold like four million copies or five million copies. No, it was the biggest thing.

It was like a huge moment for him. That was the first time we had hits on the radio, you know. Yeah. And for you, that had to be huge. So that came out before Feel This Moment? Yeah. Oh, okay. So we did the Bieber stuff.

Did people start reaching out to you in particular? Or was there still sort of they were reaching out to Nazareth? Yeah, people didn't start reaching out to me until I started working with my manager, Lucas. Then feel this moment happens. Yep. And it's like a massive game changer for you. Yeah, we've got Christina's vocals and Pitbull on it and he did his whole, you know. Joe, you've had Fireball and, like, you know, all of his, like, tags and all of stuff.

and it's kind of awesome to get that. And it's like, it's honestly the best feeling ever, especially when you're starting or at any time when you have an artist that you want to get on, you know, work with or whatever, and you get their vocals and you feel so excited. Yeah. You hear something fresh for the first time. And honestly, he really brings a song in life.

Like, he's great. We always say, like, you know, for me, it's always like tone over skill. Yeah. You know, and he's skillful, but his tone is undeniable. And his performance, he makes you, Pitbull's, like, goal, and the song is, to make you feel happy and fun, right? And that is literally accomplished on almost all of his records.

You can't go to a club, and if they play Pitbull, everyone gets, like, bored and apathetic. Like, no, people get hype, you know? Sure. So he accomplishes that really, really well. So it was cool to be part of, like, a fun record, you know, like a club record. And so, yeah, that was, I guess it was a game changer for me. It was validation that I was able to be a part of a hit record, you know. It was a really nice credit and really nice to hear on the radio.

And how did that affect you personally? Like did that affect your ego in any way? Did it affect your? No, I think I, obviously, you know, my ego was inflated after that. But. Why do you say? Why do you say obviously? Well, again, because again, it's like a validation.

I think everyone that's really working hard is working for legitimacy, you know? Yeah. It's like, you know, maybe Donald Trump doesn't care actually about being the president of the United States. He just wants to be the president, if you know what I mean. and um that's interesting political stunts me but no no but that's true that's a good example of somebody who's like it you get there and you're like oh you a lot of people would just drive for legitimacy right especially artists you want the um adoration of your community right andy warhol like really tried hard for years to get into the art community like really tried because he wanted the recognition

from his peers and there's nothing wrong with that you know and i think when you have a hit you have success. It's kind of validation of all the work that you put in. And also, you don't really know where you sit on the totem pole of success in life. And those things are great milestones of benchmarks to kind of, you know, gauge yourself on, you know, because it's such a subjective industry that it's really difficult to tell, you know, creatively where you're at. Right. So, and I struggle with that a lot, honestly. What do you mean? Like not knowing where you're, you're, where you are in comparison to your peers? No, like how high you can go.

You know, like how, how do I put this the right way? I think that when I get upset with myself and I get down on myself, it's never because I did necessarily a bad production or a bad job. It's because I know I have so much more potential and I didn't capitalize on it or I didn't reach that potential. Do you feel that from once it's released or do you feel that before it even gets? No, for any situation. If a song doesn't work out, I figure there's a right amount of tweaks,

you know, left turns, right turns, that could have made it work better, you know, and I didn't figure that out. And it bums me out, not because the song didn't do well, but because I didn't figure out the answer, you know what I mean? And I have to go back into the drawing board and figure that out again, because I know I'm better than that. Have you ever had the answer? Do you know what I mean?

When you're saying, like, oh, when I have, you know, I've had the answer a couple times. It's worked out. I've had a couple of big records. Yeah, but even those huge records that you've had, do you ever look back and think, oh, man, I could have made that better? Or are you able to let go? I think I, when I know I've done a good job, I know I've done a good job.

Like a few. Even if it's not a hit. Yeah. Yeah. But I'm very honest with myself and I'm okay when I, if I don't do a good job, I'm okay with it. Like, you know, if I don't think I've nailed it, you know, we can only do as good as we can all do, right? Like, it's not a perfect science. And going back to feeling legitimate, I think, you know, with feel this moment, it gave me like a sense of like, okay, cool, I am good enough to be here.

I am good enough to be in this industry and I can go higher. But it was an eye-opening experience because I still wasn't being reached out to by anyone because I was an understudy essentially. and it wasn't until after that and after I realized that I wasn't getting a ton of work and also you realize that records like that which are fun pop-up tempo records don't get you as much work as the records that are more culturally influential

Oh, that's interesting yeah, I mean you ended up having those pretty shortly after that but is that when you met your manager Lucas? Yeah, so Nazary and Adam went to go start a band called magic. And that's what Nasi's goal was, you know, anyway. His whole life was to be an artist. And he already was an artist. So when they did that, I really didn't have anyone to write with. I didn't know anyone in the songwriting community. And as you know, it's not, you know, as simple as

picking up the phone and saying, let's get this person in with this person. Like, if they don't know each other, it's a very organic situation. You have to know people and you have to be in the community. And I just wasn't. So Barbara Kane, who I met through Casey, at BMI really helped me out and I told her I needed a manager and she introduced me to Lucas Keller and Lucas was just setting up his own shop and for the first time and just felt like he was really hungry and he understood me and I understood him and what we wanted to do and we kind of started off on that path. So much of being a writer as branding and producing. Did you have, I know this is something that we joked about.

about not talking about, but I am curious. You know, it's like, I am, I'm still in session sometimes. We're like, oh, yeah, yeah, I'm writing with Sir Nolan tomorrow. And they call you that. Were you called that before during the messenger's stuff? Or was this part of like the next step for you is to like, you know, people were, I met you as Nolan Lambrosia, you know? But people call you Sir Nolan, one way or the other.

You know, is that a decision at that point? there was a young artist I worked with and back years ago my English accent was heavier so he would call me Sir Nolan I thought I was funny and I didn't mind the name and Adam and Nazary originally said

oh you should have it as a brand you know it's good to look there you know Dr. Luke and Stargate and Red One Dude people would much rather write with Sir Nolan than Nolan Lambrosia on paper right like you don't you want to write with the god this guy's knighted yeah i wish but like

oh yeah sorry i didn't mean to interrupt no i'm definitely not knighted but maybe more than so and i brought it up to lucas when i started working with him and he thought it was a good idea to keep it and again it's to help establish the brand and also creates a little distance from who you really are as to what to what you do which is kind of nice you know um so that's i mean the name came about organically and i didn't i introduced my i don't say sir nolan ever sure but did that

So then Lucas is going out connecting dots, though, introducing this guy's a hit writer. He's done feel this moment. And now you're working outside of the messengers. And what's the next step from him going from, you know, let's work together to the hits? So the first thing he did was bring me to this party, the AAM Friends and Family event,

which is, is it around the Grammys? Yeah, Grammys, yeah. And, you know, because they're trying to meet people in the community. And so he introduced me to Dan Battelle, who's a manager in town, and his client, Simon Wilcox. And we met briefly that night. It was kind of

very impassing. We didn't really speak. And they set up a session, and Lucas was like determined I needed to work with Simon because he had worked with Simon on Breathe Carolina. And so Simon and I got together and remember the first thing, one of the first things she said is that we wouldn't be very good. writing together. Really?

Because I said maybe we should do something for Kelly Clark's and she's like, I don't like to write with an artist in mind. So I don't think it's you and I really going to make that good music. It's really fun. And I'm sure she left that part out of her story. We'll add an amendment. Little asterisk. So we started, yeah, we started working together and we did a couple of cool songs

work with this girl Poppy on Island. Again, in the beginning you take whatever you can, you know. And not in a negative way. that was just like an opportunity that came up and we was excited to work on it and we did some awesome songs with Poppy and then they brought up Nick Jonas because he's also an island and they'd like what we had done with Poppy and Simon's manager Dan was consulting at Island and we worked with Nick and again didn't think necessarily much of it because just taking whatever came our way and Nick was super talented and they wanted to find a real space for him as a solo artist

and we wrote a song and the only session we ever had with him was that one day we wrote jealous and didn't rethink anything of it, you know? It's probably pretty humbling because for sure there are songs where like I've written a hit and they don't go anywhere

and then to be wrong so positively. Oh yeah, I was worried too. Why were you worried? Because I didn't know I couldn't wrap my head around whether there was a hit or not and they wanted it as the first single and I was like, I have no idea if this is going to work or not.

But I think I was just, back then I was overthinking everything. I still overthinking everything. That's your forte. Yeah, but I think I use my ears more than my eyes now. Oh, that's interesting. What do you mean by that? I stop, I just, you know, if you want to know if a song is going to be hit or not, all you got to do is listen, you know.

You got to just listen and feel it in your body and feel it, you know, feel the groove, melody and see what emotions pop up, you know, naturally, organically, as opposed to thinking about who wrote it or when it's going to be released or who it's going to be released against or if it's going to go to radio, you know. Yeah, none of that makes a difference if it's a hit, right? So then jealous ends up being your first number one song on, and you're doing it on your own and you're really the sole producer on it. I am the only producer on that record.

So, and there's not, you know, even feel this moment, huge song. a lot of people attached to it. One way or the other. Artists, features, writers, producers, there's such a huge community of people that make that song work,

which is great for that. Then jealous happens, and it's like, this is Nolan. Yeah. That had to be like, that's when, like,

the phone must have been just kind of nuts. I mean, it still is nuts because of that song, and you've had other songs since that. Yeah. It was nice, you know, I'd work with Adam for three years,

and Adam is probably the most talented producer I've ever worked with. And he is, you know, a genius and really good at delegating and explaining things. So he helped me go from a co-producer to a solo producer, you know. I probably even sent Adam jealous and said, what do you think, you know? Yeah. I think to his credit, it was maybe even his idea to do that weird sound that, you know, the, well-o-wow-w-w-w-da.

Like the little, yeah, or do something like that, you know. So I was great to have that awesome creative ear at my disposal. Yeah, I don't think people actually produce songs. 100% from the beginning to the end without showing another human. Like at some point an A&R guy hears it or the artist hears it or somebody's going to hear it and be like, hey, why don't you

try blank? And that may or may not work, but somebody's going to have an opinion. I don't think there's ever, you know, and the fact that you only had one person that you went to for an opinion. And I knew one person. Yeah. Yeah, right. So, yeah, I produced that.

It's why I was saying, you know, before he gave me the tools to be able to do it by myself. And at that point, I was able to do it, and I didn't even know what a finisher was. And then they label you as like a finisher. Like, you can finish a production, which I think is kind of bogus because as soon as you put a record out, it's finished, right? So what is this? Like all these hip-hop records that are streaming on Spotify, crazy, the biggest records in the world? Are they finished by masterful producers? No, they're just, you know, they just feel right and they put them out, you know? Ah, that's interesting. The whole labeling situation just makes it

easier for certain people to navigate, you know? Yeah, of course. But the truth is, I wasn't a finisher until I did jealous, right? But because you were a finisher, I mean, in a lot of wise, that's what opens the door to the next hit. It is, but I think that I was lucky, and Ireland really took a chance on me on that one, and it paid off, but there's a lot of other producers out there that aren't necessarily giving the shot to be a finisher because they've never been one before.

but it's a catch-22 because how can you ever be a finisher unless you're given the opportunity to finish a record, right? Right. So it's kind of annoying because a lot of people, and again, it's the only way to really navigate the industry, but everyone looks at things on paper and uses the eyes

and not always their ears, and I think a little faith goes a long way, you know, or can go a long way. So I was lucky to have that opportunity to be given a record. Like, let's say if I would have been working on, like, a Rihanna record, no way in how they would have let me do the process. production. If jealous was a Rihanna record, they would have added somebody.

I wasn't a proven producer, so they would want to, it's like insurance, you know? Right. It's funny you say that now that, like, you know, you're now, some of your closest collaborators are people who do a lot of work with Rihanna. You know what I mean? Like, because you're a guy that they know they can finish records with. It's so weird. Yeah.

I mean, I know that I'm skipping over a lot of songs out of the, you know what I mean, you're a guy. but the next really big one is good for you. Yeah. Which, you know, I mean, to bring you in on a song like that, I remember at the time that was right when there was this debate over his same old love the first single. Oh, yeah. You know?

And it was something where in her personal life, it's not really something she wanted to talk about as a first single, and she really loved good for you. And it was a thing where at the time it was like, oh, this is going to be a feeler record. I don't think that they thought this was going to be a smash. They thought it was going to be something that they can release and start the buzz again. It's a new label.

It's their first song with Interscope. And then, you know, but then they're like, okay, well, we got to make this song work. When you got that song where the composition is, it's not like, here's a smash chorus. It's not the jealous chorus where you're like, here's the chorus. When you got that, were you like, yeah, this is going to be an easy thing to produce and tighten up because I get the feeling that this was the most incredible feat to make what was

supposed to be a feeler record into a number one record is kind of crazy. Yeah, so I could explain it. That song Julia Michaels had played to me the demo after she did it. Like

it was a few months before I worked on it even and she had played it to me and I was like, holy shit, I think this a fucking smash. Really? You loved it. Well, after jealous, like I said, I really wanted to open my ears up because I was so

I was so overthinking that whole process and not listening to the song and I felt like the song didn't sound like anything else on radio. So I was very compromised by jealous and I really wanted to make my ears better and I really just wanted to figure out how to hear a great song.

And so she played me the demo and I was like, this thing is incredible. It needs a little production work. You know, it needs to be a little faster. It needs to have a little, the vocals need to be thicker needs to be more parts, but I think this is a huge chorus. And actually, I called Aaron Beechuk about it, like, the next day. And just to not even to work on it, just to say, hey, man, like, I think you have this amazing song.

And it's called Good For You. And he's like, yeah, we like that song. I said, no, I think it's like a really big record. Like, if you, you know, I think it's just a really big record. And he's like, yeah, we might put it out as like a feeler record, like you said, a vibe record. And I was like, okay, like, I think it's bigger than that, but okay. and then go back to what you said

Selena switched her first single the good for you like two or three months later I had that conversation with Aaron and he called me and said hey I know you really like this record and have a vision for it you know it's not going to be the first single

do you want to take a stab at it and I was like hell yeah and I knew exactly what to do yeah there's a few times in my career where I could say like I sat down and knew almost exactly what I needed to do and Aaron actually you know

talking about listening to other people and stuff Aaron came by the studio and after I had done my initial first draft of it, kind of went through it with me, and we took certain parts out, you know, and switched certain things around. Like, collaborating like that is super important. Yeah.

So we kind of finished it up together, actually. He's a very trustworthy A&R guy. Yeah. You know? Absolutely. Which is a huge difference, too. Yeah. So that comes out, and it kind of does exactly what you hoped it would do.

And it's a three-week number one. I remember thinking, I thought it was going to get as big as two-on did or something like that. I don't know why I thinking that record. Maybe that record was out at the time, but it'll probably get as big as two on. I didn't think it would be a number one record. We were in, so this is kind of crazy.

So you and I were in Miami working with Enrique and Julia. Right. That's when it went number one. When it went number one. And it was, I want to say it was week two or week three that it was number one. And we were eating brunch. I remember. And I think Julia said like, hey, congrats.

It's number one for like the second week or second week or third week. And you were kind of like introspective about it. Like it almost like, it was almost hard for you to hear that. And then I remember the waitress coming by with pancakes and you were like beaming with joy. Yeah. And it was this moment where we've talked about that since that this moment. this moment of like the anxiety that's attached to like a smash record versus like the joy of pancakes

you kind of would assume that somebody would say hey your song's number one for the third week and you'd be like drinks on me but instead you were like yeah yeah and then the pancakes came you're like ah pancakes everybody's got to take a bite yeah why is that i think you know it's a little pessimistic to say but you know when you're in songs number one there's only one way for it to go you know and that's down and that's it's kind of a scary

thought because you know all of us we start from zero every January essentially right holy shit how do I figure this out again and again and again and it causes a lot of anxiety and a lot of disconcern because there's no one way to do it and you keep having to adapt so I think at that point I was like

that's cool but where the like I don't have a record on the way up right now what the hell do I do like how do I figure out that next look how I get the next record to come up. And, you know, it's like this feeling of, it's bittersweet, you know. The bitterness is not, it is, the problem is that those records give you such a high, it's just a good feeling, you know? And when it's like a drug, and when it's taken away from you,

you kind of left feeling a little empty and like you want more and you don't know how to get more. So I think at that moment, it was the same with jealous. And it was like an overload of, like, excitement followed by like a huge crash you know and as the record peaked the more you know and the more notoriety it got the more i felt nervous and upset and like feeling like i need to figure out how to do it again you know it's so weird because you know demi's body say or nick jonas you know uh whichever one it was the uh bacon you know some of these records that were singles but weren't really reacting you totally were like

well they're not really working out you were kind of disappointed but you were like you put in the time you like the songs they should have gone but they didn't and you're on to the next one and you just kind of like your personality was so different in the way that you were addressing those

compared to the ones that you were like oh my God this is number one for the third week in a row which is absolutely like astronomically difficult to do I think it also goes back to that legitimacy thing and feeling like you know holy shit maybe now everyone's going to figure out that I'm the biggest fraud of all time

you know this is your third huge hit though I know I still didn't feel like I you know what I mean still felt and today even I'm going to go write a song today and I still feel like holy shit like how am I going to do anything good today I have no idea yeah so

I think it's that feeling like okay it's like super exposed you know and having to find confidence and self-esteem to make sure that you can get up and do it again. Because failures and rejection is so scary, I think. And I talk about with Nick, Jonas, a lot. We talk about and Simon about being a songwriter. It's like if you think about building house and then selling it,

you have to want to build the house more than you sell it because you're probably going to end up building a lot more than you sell. So you have to get up every morning and want to just go hammer the nails. you know, then catch the check because there's a lot more hammering the nails than there is catching the checks. And we see it because we all write in this room in general,

songs that don't get placed, but the outside world only sees the highlights. No one sees behind the scenes. And there's the toughest part because behind the scenes, you know, you struggle with a lot of rejection in the music industry. A lot of songs don't make it. So you have to figure out a way

to get up in the morning and do it again and again. And the only way to do that is to actually love the building process. Yeah, trying to explain to people that, okay, so if you have a 95% failure rate, that makes you one of the best songwriters in the world. Yeah. So, you know, no other sport, no other business,

do you walk in knowing that only one day a month on average, one, you know, whatever that is, 1.3 days a month, you're going to write a song that has potential. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Yeah.

Actually, there are only 20 work days in a month. So one day a month you're going to write something that has potential to make money and that would mean that you have 12 songs that make money in a year. So if you have 12 cuts, you are at the very top. And if any of those are hits,

you're in the upper echelon. That's one of the things Max always talks about too is like, you know, if you have one song a year that's a hit, you're one of the biggest songwriters of all time. Yeah. You know, if you can do that, if you think about it like that, all you need is one hit a year.

year, you know, makes you one of the biggest songwriters of all time, not right now of all time. Right, because of the percentage of how many people write songs, right? Yeah, it's crazy. Yeah. And you work every day, every single day, just for one glimpse. Yeah. But it's good. Right now, you're kind of on a run.

You have a, I feel like you've got, you're starting to get a lot of singles out, and it's like, you hear all this buzz of these songs, and I know some stuff that you have coming out. do you are you able to is it exciting to be in a place knowing that you have songs that are on the rise and songs that are coming out or does that just or are you just keeping your head down while you walk into a studio um i think it's i think the only thing that that counterbalances the nervousness the anxiety of that is knowing that these are really good songs i think we all feel the same way when you there's nothing better than writing a really good song and you're like oh shit this is really song and it feels good and you know when you when you have a really good song does a lot of the work for you

like we're talking about earlier uh you don't want to have a mediocre song and have to do a fight an uphill battle to get anything from it so it's been nice to have spent a lot of time this year just writing with great people and writing really good songs and having these songs start to you know find their way out you know into the light and it's a good feeling it's like i said it's both it's it's it's it's it's It's a good feeling to know that they are great songs and I'm very proud of them. And that gives me a lot of confidence and makes me feel good. And it's also very nervous because if they don't work out, then it's figuring out how to do it again, you know? And again and again and again.

Still got to go to that session. Yeah. So I got to write. Well, that's where the idea of like when you're writing with your friends, you're just like, yeah, okay, cool. Well, then it's like, so what? Who cares if we don't write a hit today? At least we had fun. Yeah.

Yeah. And, you know, I did a record with Stargate called Flex, the Fifth Harmony record. And that was like, I thought that was a good record. It was an important record just to keep things moving and it was a hit. And it was good, but I'm really looking for my next, like, you know, flagship record. Yeah. Well, hopefully it's one. Not to say anything negative about that.

No, I just hope that it's, I just hope your next big one is the one that we're, we have coming up. Oh yeah, that's true. That'd be nice. But I won't say anything about that right now. Maybe by the time this podcast comes out, it will be. So then I can put that in the intro. You have a publishing company now.

Yeah. You're signing producers. You've got a record company. You've got an artist who does very well streaming and whatnot. Do you see yourself now starting to move over to the other side? Or is it just like this is just a blast and you're just making music? whatever happens next happens. I think like, you know, the more successful you get, the more you have to manage success.

So I think you're automatically going to have to go into some sort of a managerial executive role, make decisions, you know, be administrative. And I actually think the thing that some of these guys struggle with most is how to keep, you know, quality at an all-time high when you're having to manage, like, a whole empire, you know? Yeah. And so I'm on a very small scale building, but it's all, you know, start to the creative process. and goes back to it, and that's the foundation of all my relationships. So with the producers, it's less about being a publisher as it is helping being a production mentor

and helping them understand how to get better and having them help me on things and just gathering different perspectives on creating music. It kind of makes you a better producer when you're constantly telling these other people what would make their productions better. It reminds you very quickly to be like, Oh yeah, why am I doing that? I wouldn't tell myself that. Or I would tell myself to make it better. It's like, when you have people underneath you, it's also like, makes you a better writer. It's also challenging because not a lot of times you can explain things, right? You just do them.

So if you, you know, if I hear something that's wrong, I'll just fix it. And it's so much easier to just fix it than it's figuring out how to explain to fix it. Because a lot of it, you can't really explain, right? The energy isn't right. It needs to be grittier. Like what are these? It needs to be more urgent. Like all the buzzwords. that you hear, like, having to explain that in actual, like, you know, when an A&R says, I need more urgent, okay, what I think of, I think of, okay, tempo, I think, maybe not just the vocals a little bit firm, maybe, like, a little more, less attack on the vocal, so that the punch comes through, you know, and then maybe more of a 16th note rhythm, like, you know, there's a thousand different, you have to think of literal things to say instead of just doing

trial and error, so it forces you to understand what you do a little bit more, I think, because it's a very, it's an intangible, you know? Sure. or we're going to play a game where I list five things and you're just going to tell me the first thing that comes off the top of your head. Okay. I'm naming some of your co-writers and artists.

So, first one, Enrique Iglesias. Nicest guy ever. He's so fun. Yeah, he's awesome. Nazary. Mentor. I feel like you have to do Adam, too, then, Adam Messenger. Yeah, the same thing.

Yeah. Julia Michaels. Probably the most special woman I've ever known in my life. That's awesome. Other than my mother. Ryan Press, our publisher. He's got my back, like 100%, you know. Yeah.

Simon Wilcox. Friendship. Yeah. And then finally, what's a message you have for up-and-coming writers? I'd say, reach out to BMI or your PROs, you know? Like no inspirational shit, just factual. reach out to PROs and start making connections there. It's very easy. Focus on what you do best and figure out what your voice is as an individual as a writer and producer. Try not to make

things that sound like they've already been out because by the time your record comes out, it'll be done and you need to have your own identity anyway. And working hard always gets you further than natural talent, honestly. There's a famous quote and I think they, I heard that it was Jack Nicholson, but I think it's like 50 people. credited with this, where they were asked, what's your, what's advice you give young actors in Los Angeles? And, and, and he said, take fountain, which I think is great. It's like, you'd much rather know, just hit up BMI, hit up ASCAP. Like, there's nothing, there's no magic bullet. Yeah. You know, like, you better, you know, you have to learn your, your songwriting, but we know a lot of

people who are successful because they have ambition more than talent. Yeah. So it's like, you know, I would say, you know, try to keep pushing the ambition part. Yeah, just works super hard. Well, Nolan Lambrosia, you and I have become friends over the last few years and genuine friends because I think you're honest and you're funny and you're satirical. And I think you have grown into somebody in the music industry. You know, it's hard to be young in the music business. and you were so young when you joined as a producer

and there's only a handful of producers that have been successful from whatever 22, 23 years old and younger and for you to have to grow up in front of the industry and handle the pressure of being a finisher at a young age to understanding how to communicate

with all kinds of artists, writers, producers it's really difficult and I see you becoming a really important person in this business and I'm proud of you and it's so fun that we get to work together on a regular basis and thank you so much for doing this thank you I appreciate it man all right thanks for listening to this episode of and the writer is if you want to hear music from this songwriter I just interviewed be sure to check out our Spotify playlist or visit our

website and the writer is dot com if you like what we're doing please subscribe to us on iTunes. You can also like us on Facebook and Twitter. And The Writer is, is produced by Joe London, edited by Miles Bergsmah, and published by Big Deal Music. A special thanks to David Silberstein from Mega House Music and Michael White. On the next episode, we sit down with Babyface. Until next time, this is Ross Golan.