Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh - Michael Malice on Soulless Political Demons, Voting Being Useless, & Why Trump Won’t Win

Episode Date: May 23, 2024

Yerrrrr, Michael Malice came through and had to explain some things to us. Is Biden running the country? Will Trump be in the General Election? Why he is an American Anarchist. & Much much more. INDULGE 00:00 Malice is a hipster - music, shoes + shiny suit 2:58 Malice getting ghosted TWICE 5:19 US is the best country on Earth + Alexx = Team China 6:52 Malice is still a New Yorker + Akaash is a Texan traitor 10:33 Malice loves X, steelmanning “censorship” + can’t police the internet 15:11 Politicians are depraved and evil + unsatiable lust for power 19:13 Is Biden is running the country? + “we’re not voting our way out of this” 21:54 Noam Chomsky + what is permissible within acceptable opinion 23:54 Malice: DON’T VOTE, impact what you have control + defining anarchy 31:20 Steelmanning gun control, exile people + “places we’re least safe are gov. controlled” 39:20 We need more security, feeling safer in Texas + freedom as the default 41:31 Malice’s thinking, Communism doesn’t follow socialism + people LOVE to snitch now 45:33 Covid proved people’s willingness to conform + Malice thought the US would be different 51:47 Trump & Biden might not make it, Trump ain’t saving you 56:46 People are in love with narratives, Trump’s narratives + trolling with 0 change 1:02:41 What do Biden voters want now? Hillary will replace Biden before Election 1:09:08 Gorbachev’s importance + US and USSR didn’t want to press the button 1:11:16 People getting triggered, Some people don’t have souls + corporate Media already prompts you 1:21:04 We use logic to justify our feelings 1:24:15 People want to be Cypher, security over freedom + the State targeting/politicising children 1:30:09 Media enforces the state, Corporate media are demons + Huberman’s hit piece 1:38:19 Elon becoming more political + Malice wants to slide into his DMs 1:38:56 Michael’s writings, triumph of good over evil + Malice’s next book about National Divorce

What's up everybody, welcome to Flagrid and look, the world is in chaos and there's only one man who can probably make sense of it all and we got Michael Malice. Hey! Thanks so much guys. Michael, thank you so much for coming here and being so opinionated about your musical taste. I walked back from the bathroom and there's like a, there's a, there's a p***y riot going on out here because Mark assumed you liked Simon and Garfunkel and why was this offensive? Because it's like a blood libel, like I mean Simon and Garfunkel, why was this offensive? Because it's like a blood libel. Like, I mean, Simon and Garfunkel... You're a big old Jew! Yeah, but I have good musical taste.

Some of the Jews? Yeah, but I have good musical taste. Yeah, but you don't think the Jews have good musical taste? The Jews, like, I'm not here as the representative of the Jews. Well, then stop the pot. Oh, yeah. This is what we need. What's the point of this?

What we need is... Get Rabbi Shmuley in here. Get Shmuley to come. I don't think I listen to... is Get Rabbi Shmuley in here Get Shmuley to come I don't think I listen We need Rabbi Shmuley I don't think I listen To any music that's older Than I am from 76

Anything before that I don't really like Just give us something Give us something that you like X-ray I mean okay Here's the thing Here's the trick

I'm not even joking Okay Yeah The key Don't give me that face I'm just saying There's a lot of explaining There's a lot of explaining

Going on I just asked for a group And you could just tell me the group. You're not going to have heard of them. How do you know I haven't heard of them? No. X-Ray Specs. I listen to X-Ray Specs. I was there.

I was at the concert last night. She died in like 94. There's a Recovered band. No, there isn't. Yes, there is. There is a Recovered band. No, they're recovering. Who are you thinking of?

They're recovering. MRI data. Okay. They're recovering. MRI data. Okay. The point is, the key to being a good hipster is listening to music

other people have heard of. Are you a hipster? Yes. Is that what these shoes are about? I need to understand. Listen, listen, listen. We got to cut this out. The Bumblebee fives, bro.

This is nasty work right now. Transformer 2s. You are not ready for this. Nasty business right now. I need to understand what was happening before. It was hard to find a shoe to match this retro print. So you stole a homeless guy's shoe? No, I've had these shoes for 20 years.

20 years? Yes. That's a Russian shoe. No, it's not. This is a bowling shoe. This was given out at a brand launch. But it's like Russian. You think they have color in Russia?

They have yellow shoes? Yeah, probably not. Maybe, okay. Maybe, maybe not yellow shoes. Are they Pumas? No, they're GBX. Come on, dude. You don't know a fucking GBX guy?

Your music band also makes sneakers? Okay, listen. Can we make sense of the world now? That's a thing, isn't it? No, but he wore a shiny suit for Diddy. Oh, hell yeah. Oh, my God. We had to explain that you weren't Diddy to him

earlier before the podcast. Which some people could say is racist. I wouldn't say it is. I still think you're trolling. I'm not really sure. Do you think this is where Diddy's hiding? The one place nobody will find him. I'm on a run right now.

He's Alex Media. Listen, he's either Diddy or Trudeau. It's one of the two. It's good. The man is good. The man is good. He does both. He does both. Miles, can you make sense of the world. It's good. The man is good. The man is good. He does both. He does both.

Malice, can you make sense of the world? No. Come on. We brought you here to be completely serious and not use sarcasm at all. No, you didn't. Yes, we did. Yes.

That's all we want from you. This is a serious business. Just give us facts only. Can I tell you a back story? Yes. Because this is actually really, really funny. Okay, good. So there's a difference between being angry

and having your feelings hurt, right? Yes. So if I lend a friend money and they don't pay me back, I'm angry, right? But if I ask someone for a favor and they don't want to do it, my feelings are hurt. But I get it. They don't owe me anything, right? Yeah, yeah. So there were two shows that I wanted to do when I was doing the Roller for the White Pill.

People who I thought had a good relationship. No one owes me to be on their show. People ask me to be on my show all the time. I don't do it for whatever reason. No one owes me shit. Yeah, yeah. We had a good relationship. There's two people. I reach out to you. I'm like, hey, I me to be on the show yeah people ask me to be on my show all the time i don't do it whatever reason no one owes me shit yeah yeah we had a good relationship there's two people i reach out to you i'm like hey i'd love to do the show and like hey what's the book about i'm like oh the rise of all the soviet union he goes wow that's not even the funniest one but i get it because i'm like this is a serious topic hold on hold on yeah the other person yeah i text them they don't respond i run into them in austin i'll

tell you who it is off the air and i'm like dude i thought we were cool like any reply goes you couldn't be nicer you're messaging my old number here's my new number i'm like i felt so bad i text them your number blah blah i'm like damn it, I thought we were cool. Can we guess who that was? No, I don't want to tell you, because I don't want to call them out. They don't owe me anything. Right. But you were a little upset about that. Hurt. Not upset, hurt. But now are you hurt?

Now I'm happy, because now it's even funnier. But you know what? I asked you to come here for no reason besides you're being great. Well, okay, I can't fulfill that. Think about that. But I can talk about you. Wait, but think about that i know we can't we can talk about the soviet union oh there was a uh there was a horrible terror attack i saw in russia yeah yeah what do you mean you saw on the internet okay that's the other thing do you think i'm putin but you could be you could be controlled opposition you're here to cause anarchy who does that serve

more than china and russia israel or israel a jew that was sent here to cause it what the fuck wow this is the problem with smart guys like you we never know like us andrew don't pull me into that are you smart are you a fucking Jewish spy? Are we Mossad? Do you think that we would work well? Yes. You don't think so? We would clearly work.

Maybe we are. People tell me I'm in control of the opposition online. I always say I'm Mossad. And then they don't know if I'm doing a double troll. If you were to be controlled by one government in the world, what would it be? America. 100%. Yeah.

The best? Why America? Because we're the best country on earth. Talk that shit. Team China. Talk that shit. Team China all day. Yeah.

Really? Yeah, you see it. I can pass. I'm sorry, is that now? He says this every week. Tell him, Team China, we got this. What do you like about China? Just the best.

That's it. That's it? Yeah. Just like America used to be the best we got... What do you like about China? Just the best. That's it. That's it? Yeah. Just like America used to be the best. I was trying to get on the wave. We the best. He calls himself

a Chinese synthesizer. That's what he says he is. That's how he says it. And he talks vertically? Yeah, exactly. Okay. How do we even... Okay.

So you would be... Yeah. We were on a pro-America rah-rah-rah thing. Good. Okay, because we love America here. Hell yeah. It's very important that we love it. Are you American yet? so you would yeah we were on a pro-america rah rah rah thing good okay because we love America here hell yeah

it's very important that we love it are you American yet? what the fuck's that mean? you came from another land when I was two yeah he's been here decades now

notice I didn't answer the question yeah I'm just shocked that you'd ask me let's move on yes of course I'm a citizen

100% okay and you got the citizenship test and everything no I was a legal alien which I thought as a kid was the funniest shit ever my parents take it and you become a citizen oh you get the easy yeah

you didn't really even I mean we did the easiest we were born here that's the easy way you don't know how hard it was for us you on the other hand we don't really know if you're loyal to America your parents yes but you we don't really know if you're loyal to America. Your parents, yes.

But you, we don't know. My parents probably more suspect than me. Why? Because they weren't raised here. Wait a minute. Are you still considering yourself a New Yorker now that you've abandoned us for Texas? I haven't learned how to drive yet. So, yes.

What do you do? I take Ubers. Yeah. Everywhere? Well, where I walk, yeah. Wow. Yeah. It's not that crazy.

Hey, do you get... I'm going to ask you a question. Do you get annoyed when people move to New York and then after five years, they're like, suddenly, I'm so New York, I'm a New Yorker. Does that bother you as someone who actually grew up here? Yes, but here's my rule. You know you're a real New Yorker if something happens on the subway and you know what plan B is without having to look at the map. That's my, when you know you're a New Yorker.

Well, the yes part, I kind of feel that way about Texans suddenly moving to Austin, which isn't even really Texas, and being like, Texas, I'm a Texan. I'm a Texan. I'm a born and raised Dallas kid. So I'm here.

I'm not a New Yorker. I'll never claim New York. This place, I hate. And Texas doesn't claim you. Texas claims me. Austin might not claim me because y'all ain't Texas. I'm not full sweatshirt, don't. I assure you. And Texas doesn't claim you. Texas claims me. Texas claims me. Austin might not claim you because y'all ain't Texas. I'm not from a sweatshirt.

Don't. I assure you. Damn. Damn. How do you reverse this? How do you uno-farm? I don't trust you because you're a New Yorker now.

From a New Yorker, I'll take that. But from a Texan, you're not a Texan. Can't let him do this to me. From a Texan, you're not going to say you're a Texan and then fucking shoes? You think you're a Texan and them fucking not a Texan. Can't let him do this to me. From a Texan, you're not going to say you're a Texan

and then fuck your shoes? You think you're a Texan and then fuck your shoes and then mint socks? Don't talk about my sweatshirt and mint socks, my friend. I'm not wearing these shoes in Texas. I'm wearing them in New York. You don't wear those in Texas? No, they were on a shelf.

You don't wear boots? I have my seal fur boots that I was going to wear here. Why don't you wear them? Because I couldn't figure out an outfit to work with the seal fur boots. I swear to you wear them? Because I couldn't figure out an outfit to work with the seal for boots. I swear to God. That's what you couldn't figure out? Well, the thing is in Austin, it's never cold.

So I have these fucking boots that I got through from Estonia and they're fucking sitting on my shelf and I don't know what to do with them. Got it. Buy cowboy boots. That's what you wear with a suit as a Texan. I can't pull off cowboy boots

because just because I'm a Texan, it's because I'm a cowboy. Oh, there are other versions of Texans. Yes. See, as a Texan. I can't pull off cowboy boots because just because I'm a Texan is because I'm a cowboy. Oh, there are other versions of Texans. Yes. See, as a Texan, I'm understanding. You're an Austin Texan. That's the kind you are, which is not really...

Not really. But you're here. I know. You're here. I know where I am. Talk up. You got to go in a different angle. And you pronounce it Houston Street,

whereas it's Houston Street. You actually said it earlier as Houston Street. Yeah, because I'm in New York. Now that you're on camera, don on, hold on. You pronounce it Houston Street, whereas it's Houston Street. You actually said it earlier as Houston Street. Yeah, because I'm in New York. Now that you're on camera, don't shift it up. Wait, you called it Houston Street? Yeah, he tried to do a joke and he called it Houston Street. Okay, okay, just making sure. He was like, I've been in Texas so long,

I call it Houston Street. I fucked it up off the camera, but I fixed it on camera. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're a fraud, dude, and I'm on you. You're a fraud. You really fucking riled our costume? I haven't seen him this riled up in ages. Yeah, why do you. You're a fraud, dude, and I'm on you. You're a fraud. You're a fraud. You really fucking riled Akash up? I haven't seen him this riled up in ages.

Why do you rile everyone up? Yeah. Why do you rile everybody up? What is the purpose of all this? What are you seeking? What is it you really want? Entertainment. All right, guys.

Life tour announcement. Atlantic City, man, thank you all so much for selling out the show. At the end of the summer, we are adding another one. So we're adding a second date. Very excited about that. We have more dates that are up another one. So we're adding a second date. Very excited about that. We have more dates that are up right now. I will see you guys at Rancho Mirage,

the Agua Caliente Casino. That's going to be crazy. A bunch more dates that are available for you guys to go get tickets for those that are not sold out yet. Man, thank you guys so much for buying all these. And dandrashills.com. Go grab it. Also, guys, dates real quick. May 31st and June 1st, St. Louis.

June 7th and 8th, Indianapolis. June 21st and 22nd, Raleigh, North Carolina. June 28th and 29th, Buffalo. July 26th and 27th, Jacksonville. September 6th and 7th, Vegas. September 12th and 13th and 14th, Miami, Florida. Guys, get your tickets for those shows and more at akashsingh.com. We're going to keep adding.

We are not fucking stopping, guys. We're going to keep going. I'll see you out there, akashsingh.com. What do you think about X? What is the future of X? I love X. Yeah. It lends itself to your skills, though.

Yeah. Thank you. I think the great thing about X is people are always like, look, a majority of people don't agree with us. We're fucked. I go, you don't need a majority. You need an alternative.

So if there had been one social media site, for example, during COVID, where scientists could be like, this isn't making sense. I don't mean us randos. I mean, people like Dr. Drew being like, I don't understand this. And without having fear of being censored, right away, the whole dynamic changes. Can you walk me through the logic? Okay, walk me through both logic. Logics? Okay, walk me through both arguments, right?

Walk me through the argument that's like, hey, the Don Lemon argument, which is like, hey, this platform should be responsible for the information on it. And then walk me through the opposite. I know it's an eye roll, but just take me through the thinking for both of them, and if you could make your best argument for both. I can steal, man. I just don't want to call it the Don Lemon argument because I think Don Lemon is like a soulless demon.

Sure, sure, sure. And who's just a very evil, malevolent person who's imminent homeless. In a rational society, he'd be like living in fear for his life. So let's not call it the Don Lemon argument. I love this. Let's just call it the blue pill argument. You're getting more texts in the morning. Yeah.

You better run, boy. You're not in a position to make that. Just fucking dig in the grave, dude. You've got to stand up for yourself, man. I'm too much of a New Yorker now. I can't stand up for myself. I'm listening to you all. I can't stand up for myself.

That's so not New York. I'll lock down. Okay, go, go, go, go. So the argument is, it's a not complicated argument, that crazy ideas are often attractive to people because they're innovative, you've never heard it before. And it's like smoking cigarettes in school. You want to be the ones like, look at me,

I'm smoking a cigarette in school and getting away with it. So it can snowball and lead to crazy kind of consequences, which especially people who are marginalized in some way, they're the ones who are going to pay the price because they can't speak up for themselves, right? That's the not Don Lemon argument. That is the argument for some form of censorship. For some form of consensus, right, right.

The other argument is, the person, and this isn't the argument that's popularly made, but it's the argument I would make, the arguments popularly made but this argument i would make the smartest person on earth is going to be ignorant of 99 of knowledge yeah so even if you're brilliant like i can know i can be a very smart guy if i go to a farm that farmer let's suppose there's a farm where the guy's really dumb he's going to run circles around me yeah about the farming and produce and all these other things not even gonna be a question or any other circumstance where someone who may be not as bright as me can run circles with me in any field.

So when you have someone who's going to be the censor, how are they, like any filter, you want to keep out stuff that you don't want and allow stuff that goes in. But it's going to be really hard to set up that field to make sure what gets through is what should get through. And how do you make sure those people aren't corrupt? Right. So it's really this kind of very arrogant

attitude that doesn't really work. And the other thing is, these people are living in a world where the internet doesn't exist. Because if you just control four or five outlets, you can't just censor the internet. If we could, we wouldn't have child porn. But that's a really obvious example. A complete consensus consensus or until five minutes ago that child pornography

is an abomination we can't have it but the fbi doesn't have i think it's the fbi ca whatever group it was they don't have enough agents to fight babies videos of babies being assaulted so this is if you want to talk about free speech and like set like this something we all agree on or most of us, the sane ones, and yet we can't even control that. So they think they have a monopoly on the mic, and they don't. So then, just so I can clarify, the argument is essentially, it is impossible to properly police speech, therefore the better option is to not police it at all.

Well, especially when it comes to political discourse. Yeah. Got it. Okay. So then it's not really this argument of, or this discussion about. And I'm also going to say, we got to try what we can to fight. I'm not saying we should have child. I'm just saying.

No, no, no. I just want to be clear for everyone. I didn't want to position you in terms of child. I want to position more, because I think a lot of people obviously are looking at this as a binary. Censorship's only good if it actually works. And it's impossible to get it to work. Right works. And it's impossible to get it to work. And because it's impossible to get it to work,

the lesser of these two, and I don't even want to call them evil, but the lesser of these two situations is a complete lack thereof. Right, and that's assuming that people, right. I think that's a better argument, and I think that's way more digestible because I think a lot of times the way it's positioned is this leads to all good and there are no problems with this at all. And then people start chipping away and go, hey, there are some problems. People don't understand tradeoffs in this country.

But the other thing is this is also assuming. Is that an American cultural thing? Yes. Just one more thing. People also assume. That's also what I just said. Assumes that the people in power are genuinely good people who want everything well as opposed to they should be hanging from lampposts. Can you look up the C.S. Lewis quote, C.S. Lewis conscience? If the worst thing about our government

is that it's like people are getting bribes, we'd be in a utopia. Really? These people in power are so beyond depraved and exist on a level of evil that we can't wrap our heads around, that if it was just like someone's hiring their brother-in-law and getting a kickback, this would be fine. Can you read the quote? I want to get it exactly right. Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons, corrupt people, than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber barons' cruelty may sometimes sleep, but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end,

for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. So I don't think the people in government are corrupt. I think they are fundamentally evil and depraved. And one of the things I talk about in my book, The White Pill, is they were covering up genocides. And there's no question of like, let's suppose, God forbid, we did something where millions of people died and we fucked it up. We would be like, even if we're just chefs, we undercook a chicken, someone dies. For the rest of our lives, we'd be like, how did I fucking get this wrong? The next day, we got to sit down. This can never happen again. But there's never this thing of how do we fuck it up? They don't

feel guilt. They don't feel remorse. They are fundamentally depraved. And I think part of the work I've been doing is people in America who are naive about the nature of evil, who think it's a guy with a mustache banging his fist on the table, when it's really that bureaucrat who won't give you medicine just because they have that little bit of power, they're starting to realize, oh, it's not just fucking Hunter Biden getting a fucking job. These people are fundamentally... Here's another... And you think, sorry to interrupt, but you think it's because they've convinced themselves they're doing it for our own good. Vivek said this about the-

Manjuro class. The man called it. Yes, but here's another example. Let's talk about this kiddie stuff. I was thinking, okay, maybe it's like someone's got a crush on high school cheerleaders, and there's a conversation about the sexualization of teens in America. And then you see a CNN producer was arrested because he was bragging on a message board, not even talking about how this message board exists, about the infants he was assaulting. And it's like, guy, I tried to meet you halfway. But that is a level of evil that I don't think anyone in this room can wrap their heads around. Yeah. Yeah. I think most of us assume it just doesn't exist. Right. And it exists a lot. And I think these people do it just because they can,

this Epstein Island shit. Yeah. Yeah. Continue on this. This is actually really interesting. So you're saying that there's a group of people, and not a group of people that even know one another, but they all have that same lust for power, and they have the same sociopathy that allows them to have no guilt or remorse about people they hurt? And they do evil because they can, and they enjoy getting off on it. But is it pathological?

Yes. I don't think it can fix them. Interesting. Meaning, doing evil, does it in some way bring them joy or making the decisions... It makes them feel powerful. And they are powerful. Because if I kill someone and I get away with it, I'm at a whole other level than normal people. Can you give us names of people that you think would fall under this description that we would be aware of? Congress? I think many people in Congress.

But I mean, I think a lot of times Congress is just the public face, don't you? I think most of them are. But I think that just because you're a public face doesn't mean that you don't have a lust for power. I think if you get into government, there is a lust for it. I agree. I think if you get into government, there is a lust for it. I agree. I think if you look at powerful names in Hollywood, some of these rumors get through, you know, these names get named.

Yeah. And I think that a lot of these people's faces, we wouldn't know. We wouldn't know. I bet you if they released Epstein's book, we wouldn't know half of these people's names. You're saying the true power brokers that we don't understand. Because there's the power of like, look, I'm a celebrity, I'm famous. Which is not what they're interested in. Of course. Right.

Because it's not real power. Right. Does anyone really think Biden's running the fucking federal government? Who does run the federal government? I don't fucking know. Isn't that interesting? Yeah. Does anyone really think it's Biden?

No. No one thinks this with a straight face. You could say Trump sucks, I want Biden, I want sanity in the White House, but he's not making these fucking decisions. He's only deciding when to ring the bell when his diaper's full. He's ringing it a lot. I don't think anybody's making, even when Trump was president, I think that there are a bunch of people that are assisting him in making the decisions. I think that that would be the same case for any business, right? You're going to have a board of executives that are going to help you make these decisions. And ultimately, you're going to have to make the

fucking tough ones. And that is the responsibility of the president. I don't know if Biden is even doing it. Sure, he's a figurehead. Fine. The fact that we don't even know the people that are advising him is a little bit concerning, right? I mean, would it make a difference if we did? I think so. How? What power do we have? It's not about power. It's about holding people accountable. There's no accountability. No, no, no. I'm saying us as voters. Oh, God, voters. No, no, no. Listen, listen, listen. In some of this, you have to submit to the illusion of the democracy, right? You can submit all you want. I'm the one getting the blowjob. Not submit, meaning you have to take part in it, but in order to properly communicate

with the people that are reading your books, they believe in a system, right? So you have to at least meet them halfway at the system they believe in before you can tell them, hey, all this shit is bullshit, right? The most effective communication. Sure, sure, yes.

No, I get you. You talk in their house, not your house. Exactly, right? And then once they understand your house, now you don't need to talk about your house at all. You at least need to invite them in. Yes. So the idea for—

That's a great way to explain persuasion to people, yes. So it's like— Superb, yes. So right now we have, for this Biden situation, I think the average person is probably the closest they've ever been. The average person that's in their house is the closest they've ever been to your house, meaning they're knocking on the door going, yeah, the Biden— I'll tell them in one sentence. We're not voting our way out of this. What does that mean?

It means just think about it. Like if you think that this choice you make in November, like if you make, you have to look at it really carefully. And if you make that right choice, this problem is going to be resolved or even ameliorated. If you stop and think about it for five minutes, I don't think anyone who's quasi-rational with a straight face would be like,

wait, that makes no sense. But explain what you mean by- Meaning that if you have Biden again, or if you have Trump- We're in the same predicament. Right. So you don't see Trump as this great escape, this great rescue from-

We ran that experiment. Like, I don't understand. It's not like he wasn't president before. So why do people see it as such? Because they're told that there's this binary, right? And if you don't like this team, you've got to like the other one. People were told with a straight face that if you vote for Jill Stein,

you're a Trump supporter, like Green Party people. So, and you're... What's his name? Noam Chomsky, who's another anarchist who is waiting to die so I can climb the ladder and be... Top anarchist? Russell Brand standing in my way. So it's Noam Chomsky, Russell, and then me.

So at least I'm on the platform. Noam Chomsky has this whole point about the way to control a population is to have a very intense debate, but within strictly delimited parameters. Right? So the answer is always going to be between like five and six and one through five. And it doesn't matter who wins. Right. Oh, it's genius. So give us an example.

I'll give you one example. Yeah, give me a real world example. Who was a great guy. I don't know if you've got him on the show. I had him on my show. He goes, it's like you turn on CNN and the question is, do we bomb the fuck out of Syria or do we bomb the living fuck out of Syria? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And that's the range. Like The View, you know, the Karen mothership. That was Jimmy's example that he put together? The Syria. But The View, let me talk about The View. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was just going to give Jimmy credit. Oh, Jimmy's great.

Yeah, yeah. Jimmy's amazing. So on The View, Kurt Metzger, who I'm sure you've heard of. Oh, yeah, let me talk about the view. I was just going to give Jimmy credit. Oh, Jimmy's great. Yeah, Jimmy's amazing. So on the view, Kurt Metzger, who I'm sure you've heard of, he goes, there's a reason I call the views. The view is you have Whoopi and Joy hard left on one side, and the closest thing you had to a Trump supporter was Meghan McCain, who denounced Trump at her dad's eulogy.

But that's, if you're watching this as a female, that's your range of acceptable opinion. So a way my friend put it was, CNN is what you're supposed to think and Fox is what you're allowed to think. But other than that, like that's your little box. And labeling these other sides as extreme left or extreme right, is this all part of that?

Exactly, that's the end of the box, right? You know where the borders are. So what are some solutions? Because you sound very black pill no i'm it's white pill uh this well the first step is diagnosis right once you realize a lot of this you can't start treatment for the cancer if you don't admit you have it right yes or recognize you have it yeah that's oh that's really interesting we're debating something in such close proximity that if there were a powers that be

they really wouldn't give a fuck which side it went to you guys know magicians right so the guy's dangling his keys here while he's picking your pocket oh my well look at these keys yeah so do we not have a civic duty to vote come to our house come to our house first come on you're just laughing at us we can't go into your house if you just laugh at us come to our house. Come to our house. Come to our house first. Come on. You're just laughing at us. We can't go into your house if you just laugh at us. Come to our house. There's some kid that's listening that just turned 18. It's like, man, I can't wait to vote in this election. He's involved in his community.

Yeah. We just got the right not too long ago. Yeah, exactly. Chinese people can vote now? Come on. Talk to me. But not in China. No, no, no.

Oh, no. They can vote from now. All right. Yeah. I would never tell. I'm not in China. No, no, no. Oh, no, they can vote from now. All right, yeah. I would never tell, I'm not even joking, I would not tell someone, especially a black person,

not to vote because it does mean something for certain communities, like in all seriousness. Yeah. But the opportunity cost, that time it spends you to vote, you could be adopting a dog,

reading to an old person. Bombing a postal office. Not the, I can't advocate, like, violence against the government on camera, but I also don't know how to finish this sentence. Post office bombs. Zero people dead. Who bombs up

fucking postal office? They don't go to work. They go postal. Have you ever heard the expression imagine? They went in there as just the co-workers. Yeah, but that was pre-Amazon. You gotta bomb the Amazon. Don't do it. Don't do it.

It's not good. Michael Malice's fans. Don't do it. In all seriousness, the alternative is local. And be the best person you can be. Be an asset to your community. Be a good dad or friend or whatever. And that is the alternative to this facade.

And not buying in. There's not that much. The lie of democracy is this idea that like the president really cares about what you think. Like there's, how can he care about 300 million people? It doesn't make sense. So have the kind of serenity prayer,

know what you have control over and maximize what you have control over to the best of your ability. Tolstoy had a book I read. He's also an anarchist. Yeah. Anarchist. The kingdom of God is within you, which is we don't need government, but essentially we all follow Christ's nonviolence. And if

everybody buys into that, then non-government is possible. But you still have kind of some authority there, which is God, Christ, whatever. This is how we should all act in a moral way. And now we don't need government. You don't seem to have that. And I really do like what you're saying theoretically, but there's nothing higher that we are called to to act morally. Does that make sense? That's exactly correct. Well, I haven't, there's a Tolstoy essay in the Anarchist Handbook. He was, it's garbage anyway, he was a Christian anarchist. Yes, he's a Christian anarchist, and that's, I remember reading that book and being like, yo, this is great, and he also seemed to kind of solve the problem of what still ends up governing our authority, which is God.

But I mean, the other issue is government is doing a very good job, especially in cities, of protecting criminals from their consequences, not protecting law-abiding citizens. Yeah. So as a Texan, one of the reasons I lived in Texas now is if someone breaks into my house, I don't have to worry about protecting my home. You can shoot them. where I could shoot them. Whereas here, I'd be the one going to jail. And that's a complete inversion of basic decency of any society. Now, I'm not questioning your disdain

of the government. I completely get that. What I'm asking for is... We need security. A lot of people think anarchism means if you abolish the government monopoly on policing. I'm just clarifying for them. That's like, oh, you think everyone's going to be nice and no one's going to be a criminal. No, I'm just saying. I think it's important to clarify.

Yeah, it's just important to know that, like, no, criminals aren't going to be able to be on the street every five minutes. They're going to be dealt with. My fear of what you believe is the more you dive into it, there's still, like I've heard you say, music is anarchy. There is no governing body in music. But the second you try to make money in music, the music industry is incredibly corrupt. Diddy is being charged for unspeakable crimes. You are?

Really? Oh, don't put that Diddy jacket on me. If the jacket don't fit, you must acquit me. If the jacket don't fit. But in a capitalist society. I'm in my way bronco. In a capitalist society, especially once financial reward is there, everybody's very corruptible. And local government even then can be just as corruptible as.

I'm not for local government. What do you mean? Or local governance or whatever. Whoever is that power within that small tribe, whoever gets power is essentially a dictator. I think he's saying no power. I think he's saying be a good neighbor. Let's talk about the music thing. So I'm saying that music is an anarchist system

because you don't have to listen to any music. You don't want to. Anyone can create music. No one's saying it has to have four-four time. It has to have an F clef, whatever, S clef. I don't fucking know. So cuisine is another example. These are systems where millions of people over centuries

voluntarily interacted, each contributed. You can take part in it. You cannot take part in it. Cuisine is not completely anarchist. Yes, it is. No. How is it not? Who's the government?

The FDA. There's a difference between cuisine, meaning recipes, and you can create whatever you want. The point is governments interject themselves themselves but they're not creators or the ones who are making the system i thought you're talking about currently what is happening in the culinary arts in america so there are things you just can't eat okay there are things that pasteurized cheese right my point is sure that then there's that weird cheese from uh italy with the maggots point being cuisine how it, cuisine, how it was created, language, how it was created, music, how it was created. Historically, sure.

I thought we were talking about- So people say, where does anarchism exist? Anarchism is a type of government. Got it. It is a relationship. And the creation of these systems across time, across the world, across centuries, are examples of anarchism in practice.

So for example, with food, if you sell people food that kills them, eventually people stop buying your food, and then that restaurant, that food booth, whatever it is, no longer exists. Sure, but that's not really an example of cuisine. I'm just talking about the way that French cuisine developed, the way that now I can cook French cuisine in America if I just follow these recipes. No one's putting a gun to my head. No one's forcing me to add eight sticks of butter if I want to make a croissant.

These were all developed voluntarily through mutual interaction over time. So that is what anarchism means in practice. People always say, well, it's never happened, doesn't exist. It's not a type of government. It's not a type of country. It's a type of relationship where there's no governing authority overseeing its development. Language is another example of this. And I'm not even trying to pick at you. I'm actually trying to make the connection just for them also. I don't disagree with what you're saying. I just, in my. And I'm not even trying to pick at you. I'm actually trying to make the connection just for them also. I don't disagree with what you're saying. I just, in my brain, I'm struggling with the practical application, especially with capitalism. With capitalism, doesn't there need to be some kind of governance?

Right. But the point is, security is far too important to allow it for any monopoly, especially a government monopoly. It's absolutely insane that in 2020, the police said, we're not protecting you. And the people who did try to protect their communities were the ones who were arrested. That's what happens when you have a monopoly on security. If you have a monopoly on food, people are starving. If you have a monopoly on education, people don't know how to read. So when you say cuisine, when you say music, you don't mean how they're distributed within a country. You just mean the creation, the history of these things. Got it. That's where I was a little bit confused.

Because within different countries, there are different rules about cuisine. In Canada, you can't have a medium rare hamburger or something like that. But anarchism teaches that these rules are not morally legitimate. Right. Got it. Got it. Okay. Now I'm understanding. So there are these things that exist within the pure anarchist system. Yes. And then your argument would be governments corrupt them. Yes. And even the most pure anarchistic

things can still be corrupted by a monopolistic approach from the government. Right. Just like it's insane that in New York I can't defend my own home against a violent intruder. It's absolutely crazy. And it's only government that can make that happen. And give me the argument.

If you were to make the argument, I know this is an eye roll, but if you were to make the argument for the government, what would you say? My strongest argument for government is food stamps. In that specific one about defending your own home, what would your... Okay, if I had to steal, man... So here's the other thing. I'm going to answer the question one second. A good way to know if someone is full of shit or if they're someone worth talking to is, can you give the opposing position as strongly as possible? And if they can't, walk away. Because they're full of shit.

Because they're either full of shit or they're in bad faith that their brain doesn't work that way. I can make the case. The case is, we all know, just walking around New York, there's lots of crazy people. There's lots of people who just broke up with their wife and they want to come back and do something about it. There's lots of kids. Do you want it to be the case where every crazy homeless person has access to a gun? No one's going to get killed? So that's the steel man argument for that. And then you would even acknowledge that there is some sense to that. Yes, of course. Like, I don't want every little crazy person to be in a position where they can just go and shoot up a school with no repercussions.

Another example is in New York, for example, like building laws, right? Maybe I'm sure in Texas or other places where you just have your property, you can more or less build whatever you want on it. I'm sure there's some bureaucracy you have to deal with. But in New York, everybody, somebody's next door above you, below you, you have to consider them a little bit more. The fire department coming in, there might be a closet that you put, but it's not on the map, etc. So there are other people that deal with the repercussions of your building negligence, if you will. So you acknowledge that maybe in certain cities or certain places, do you think should have more regulation? Or how would you solve for that problem?

I think the regulation is a big problem in terms of you're not allowing enough people to build. So the rents are going to be artificially high. And this fucks over poor people the most. Oh, no, no, not in that regard. Like, how would you solve that problem? Like, you have the gun one in the city where these crazy people could get guns. So you want to limit guns in some way for your safety. Would you just take the risk?

Well, no. I think the issue is you have to limit the crazy people. So the fact that you have these public streets and these guys can walk around when nothing is being done to them is the problem. That's interesting. Okay, so that's interesting. What was that guy who got Jordan? What was his name? Jordan Neely?

Who was the one who was that kid? Yeah. He just punched an old lady in the face and broke her orbital socket then he's out in the street what the fuck are we talking okay so who decides crazy and how long you should be locked down for being crazy well i don't know if we lock down i think it'd be much more function of if society's private then you just can't walk around wherever you want what do you mean by that meaning like public streets force you that literally anyone can do anything on the streets and you have to put up with their bullshit.

If it's like a bar or if it's like Costco, you got to make sure you pass a certain criteria to be able to even step foot in here. So exile would be a very good way to get rid of it. So what would New York City look like in an anarchist, ideal anarchist system? Oh, this is fun. It would be a crater.

No, no, no, break it down. So like New York, the thing is, like I can't answer that question, This is fun. It would be a crater. No, no, no. Break it down. Like New York, the thing is, I can't answer that question, but I'll answer in a way that you'll be happy with my non-answer. After communism fell in Eastern Europe, right? Let's suppose the capital of Budapest, Hungary, right? All the restaurants had been government controlled, right? Then the free market came in. If I asked you how many restaurants agree in Budapest, what cuisines, you would have no idea. And neither would I. We don't know. We

know there would be restaurants and we diverse and maybe there'd be some Russian ones. Maybe there'd be Chinese ones like you like or whatever. Who knows? The point is you can't, if you could plan what people would decide to do, it would be a lot simpler, but we can't predict that. You know what it's like? It's like when you have sci-fi and people go to other planets and it's like snake people and all their buildings look like scales and tails. It's like, we don't have buildings that look like hands and feet. We don't know what that would look like

in a society built by snake people because we haven't run the experiment. So we don't know what a New York would look like where it's far less regulated. Yeah, that's my only, you use the term, wrap your mind around. That's my only struggle with this idea of anarchy is I can't wrap my mind around what it would look like. And that is terrifying to me because it quo. So the concern is that it might lead to anarchy where people are burning streets, like cop stations down and burning down the street and no repercussions to them. We saw that.

That happens now. Yeah. So for me, it's not about what it looks like. It's what it looks like privatized, because I think that was the solution that you put forth. So is Times Square essentially privatized? Yeah. And then entrance to Times Square is decided by whoever owns Times Square. Or it could be just large. Like a Disneyland or something like that. It could be the default as anyone can go. But a lot of these stores, once you get arrested, you're trespassed.

You can't go to Walmart. So you break it once, you're not going back. Right. Interesting. Or it could be twice. Or it could be three times. You know what I mean? Whatever that group that lives in Times Square decides.

It's just, these are one of those things where it's like you thought out these thought experiments and the average person has not considered it at all. So I'm just trying to like build foundation. But I'll just give a very easy metaphor. The places where we are least safe, all of us, are the places that are under government control. The subways, alleys, public parks. Whereas places like hotels, where everyone doesn't even live there, bars full of young drunken men, full of alcohol, are still safer than these places where the government has control over security.

Can you give us an example of a place that is frequented by as many people that is private, that is not as dangerous as the subway? Because I think that that's also just... Yeah, there you go. Burning Man. Yeah, yeah. Burning Man is amazing. It is anarchy. But it's still not even close to as many people as a subway.

I guess what I'm saying is these public Walmart. These public places that you're mentioning are frequented by millions of people, whereas the private ones you mentioned- McDonald's. If McDonald's- McDonald's, they ain't just a shit. Hold on, hold on, hold on. If McDonald's was allowed to have private security,

if restaurants were allowed to have bouncers who could actually do something, you wouldn't have any of this fucking craziness. How about malls? Because malls have have security and i think there's been shootings and malls and movie theaters what's the what's the argument for them not having private security because the government has a monopoly but what is the steel man for them in that situation i don't i don't know i don't have a good steel man on this one maybe i'm full of shit but i don't even know the argument about how why it's not allowed because bars have them

but they don't have like security in the sense of arrest powers they could just kick you out got that all they can do is control entrance

they can't really which you can do so I don't know what the argument I'm sure there is a fairly decent one I don't know what it is that's interesting

because that seems like an absolute no-brainer right because we have versions of this right you have a doorman for a building the doorman

yes well I know what it is I think it's that level of security it's like if you just hire anybody off the street to be a security guard and then they that power goes to their head now it's like oh i'm shooting somebody just because they oh if you're giving them the authority yeah it's like but that's just describing the cops but but yeah but at least they go through formal training and even that sometimes lets them down imagine if you go through zero formal training and then you know but they would i would imagine like they would have this kind of licensing right some private license so then that's then that would be some

criteria yeah now that's somebody controlling but that thing is right no but it's like but there's like like ex-military people right there's a lot of them who could be doing great jobs in their communities also trained by the government yeah sure but the point is they have the capacity to provide security i mean i learned if somebody learns if someone learns how to read in like a government school like it's not like everything that they write as a novelist is going to be a function of the government right yeah yeah okay okay okay no this does make sense it's also i think we need more security and i think it's the government's job to keep us insecure and that's something as a texan i've appreciated that a lot of people i walk around are packing and i feel a lot safer in austin than i do here really yes interesting do

you feel culturally like when you're in texas you don't feel safer in texas no really there are more mass shootings and i'm an actual texan and there are more mass shootings in texas than most states yeah but a day-to-day like i do not feel like the same way on the subway here as opposed to walking around there but you're not even seeing big guns on people's hips like that scares me okay that's not something i want to see that like go to the park and just see ak-47s like there's a shopping center in allen i used to go to a lot as a kid. There was a mass shooting there a year ago. And it's crazy. My parents live five minutes from there. And now I went back after we had to go do

something. We just went to the area. It's a fucking ghost town now. There was a place where everybody's allowed to have guns. There was a mass shooting. Now no one goes there. All these businesses are suffering. Even in kind of a you govern yourself type of place where it's like, yeah, we all got guns, open carry. The idea is anybody pops off, there's going to be somebody here with a gun, something popped off, nobody was there. And I'm not a super gun control guy.

So the subway station that was across you from my house here in Brooklyn, that I lived for like 17 years was the one that the guy shot up, like after I left. And how you shoot up a subway station and not kill anyone, now're a real fuck up right yeah uh point being i don't have a good answer for this and anyone who says they have an easy answer is full of it we have mass shootings in areas like that we have mass shootings in areas here where there is the strictest gun control and i don't have a good answer i don't think anyone does your argument is i'd rather the freedom if it's going to happen in both places. Yes.

Which I think is reasonable. If we found out that it happened the same amount, if we found out that it happened way more on one side, let's say it happened way more here. We go, hey, we're doing something wrong. Maybe we should let some people have guns. I don't think people would. I think people just double down. Of course.

I'm not saying what they do is rational. I'm just saying we could look at some data and then we could adjust it accordingly. Yeah, this is interesting. Okay, okay, okay. I kind of saying we could look at some data and then we could adjust it accordingly. Yeah, this is interesting. Okay, okay, okay. I kind of want to learn more about this. What are other – where do you come up with this? Where do you come up with your ideas?

Yeah, no, no. I'm trying to like – how does this enter your brain? Like you're a kid who grows up in Brooklyn. Sure. There's no reason why you should hate bureaucracy if you're going through what everyone else is going through in the city. Is it your ties to Russia and your parents being from there? That's from Assad. Yeah.

Exactly. This is what Israel tells you. No, I mean, it's like your parents leaving a place with tons of governing government authority and then seeing how that went. No, but I think there's plenty of Russians who left the Soviet Union who don't think like I do. So that's not really... Are you familiar with Cubans in America? Oh, of course.

Okay, so Cubans, they're awesome, right? And they have this, obviously, they hear the tales of what happened in their country. And because of that, they're usually very conservative, right? Because they're like anything even close to socialism, nexus communism, then we're fucked. I remember exactly. One of the greatest moments of my life was being able to tell my Cuban friend that Castro died. It was a great, great day. I'm like, dude, he's dead. He's like, what? He didn't even know? He didn't know. I was the first one. I'm like, dude, dude, dude, dude. He's not gonna get on his WhatsApp, yo. Okay. So is this the same for you

or it enters you in a completely different way? It's, okay. It's a very boomer thing that this idea that socialism leads to communism. Yeah. That's only happened in Venezuela. Yeah. It's never happened anywhere else.

Yeah. And communism always comes about as a volatile revolution. And it's kind of this Greta Thunberg hockey stick. Eventually, socialism becomes communism. That's never actually happened. There's no examples of this. It's always a revolution. So that's not a big concern of mine.

But my big concern is a totalitarian mindset that is spread very consciously throughout the population. that is spread very consciously throughout the population. And we saw it pretty much on COVID, where one of the things I learned when I was writing the white pill is when you had these like secret police in these countries, I would have thought, okay, Andrew's arrested. He's being held at gunpoint. They're like, name names.

He's like malice. He's like, I gotta name a name or else they're gonna kill me and my family. It's not even hard. I don't even blame you. What I learned is people are tripping over themselves to snitch. They couldn't wait. they weren't given a lot of money they wanted someone to they wanted to feel important this surprised you about humanity though yes and they

wanted to feel heard uh and then when covet happened we saw it it's power people like people were bragging oh i got this person fired or kicked out of the store like put them on fucking social media they were ecstatic. Yeah, I think it's a couple of things. I think they want to feel important. They want to feel heard. But I also think it's you've given power to a group of people that have had none.

Right. And a lot of power. Yes. Fire someone. They finally feel important. Cancel someone. Yes. Yeah.

Destroy somebody. Yes. Like, that is intoxicating. Especially for white women. it's tied to an idea like an ideology of morality yeah yeah yeah yeah you get to be a hero while you fire these people it's not just data it's like if you do this you're a good person right so they weaponized morality and but i would say that this is just human instinct and they found a way to put the carrot in front of them yes and so and then they

gave him the sticks they don't isn't that crazy we'll do it all you don't even need like human beings will do everything it's not like you need to make all these phone calls and have this like people think that the cia is tapped into every single school and every single country and they're all these computers and everything is no no no it's you just need to put the carrot in front of them and we will walk towards that fucking carrot no dictatorship ever had like a huge percentage of the population as the police you can't afford it yeah it's always going to be a small number than everyone else picks up the slack so even the soviet union where the idea is that everybody was listening on every phone call it wasn't that way at all well no they were listening in but the point is in every like if this was the soviet union one of us would be kgb like they would they would flip one

of those and once you got one what's yeah you're set or what they would do in east germany the stasi they would put someone in here some that person be like we should overthrow the government the rest of us were like dude you're crazy but then we're all arrested because we had someone in our in our group saying we should overthrow the government. So it was intentional setups. Yes. The whole thing. I talk about this a lot in the book. All these tactics they use, they're very, very clever. So were you not as cozy to anarchist ideals before COVID? No, I mean, the anarchist handbook came out before COVID. COVID just demonstrated to what extent inside every slave beats the heart of a tyrant, to what extent the hung, inside every slave beats the

heart of a tyrant, to what extent people who are low on the totem pole are desperate to find ways to climb that ladder at the expense of the fellow man. It's like to see it played out in America was to that extent was very surprising to me. And how quickly and easily it was. How do you think COVID would have looked had everyone had more of an anarchist relationship within them? Well, kids wouldn't be wearing masks for no reason in school, for one. I think there'd be less, there'd be children who can't get COVID have to get a shot that they don't need every six months for the rest of their lives. And I don't understand how you're going to make this case to me. Shots are traumatic for kids. It's not fun. We all were kids. We all had shots. I can't wrap my head around it. Yeah. And the fact that there wasn't a place where people could push back on any of these ideas is a little bit frustrating jimmy kimmel yeah uh who is whatever was on tv joking and the audience laughed about if you're not

getting vaccinated you shouldn't get medical treatment if you have to die well that's too bad ha ha ha. That is evil. Yeah. Like if you're just joking about people like regular people, let's suppose they're idiots who just got brainwashed because Joe Rogan ate horse paste. Yeah. And you're like, well, you're going to die.

It's like, we have a problem here. Yeah. Hmm. So suspicions you had about humanity are confirmed. Not just me, but now everyone else. You can't deny this. Sure, sure. I'm just saying.

So they're confirmed. Did you think that culturally America was different? Yes. Because that's why it was so surprising? Okay. I thought. What did you think was different culturally about us? The independent thinking?

I thought there'd be a lot more Texans who were like, fuck this. We're not doing this. And how easy, and the thing is, whether by design or not, a lot of very, very evil people have a lot of very useful information about the limits of American submission and docility. What does that mean? Meaning they learned, they ran the experiment,

how far they can push things and have no one do anything about it. Like they've got that data. It's like, that's, that's something I'm very concerned about. Because now they know how far they can push it. Yeah. They need to. Yeah. And we've done it once. It's really easy the second time. All right, guys, let's take a break for a second. I got to make sure you got the best wallet on the planet. And oh my God, they just put in a nice little secret compartment that you can keep whatever you want in that. I'm not going to say what I would keep in it, but one could keep whatever you want in. And the compartment is based so that, I don't know, little pills or something could go right there. I don't know what type of pills that

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Morgan & Morgan is going to take care of you. Now let's get back to the show. Does Trump win the election? I don't know that he's going to be the nominee. Talk to me. I mean, he's not he's no spring chicken.

Do you think he might not make it? I don't know that they're both going to make it. I mean, how old is he? 74? No, 78. Yeah, look it up. He's not a spring chicken. And I'm sorry. That's a lot of stress, 77. 77. And the stuff that they're putting him through, and if Tish James starts taking his house, like, I don't know.

How do you feel about Trump? I know you're not necessarily fan, can you expound on why? it's really kind of funny, so if you, what do you call someone who thinks Trump is dumb doesn't have the temperament of a president and kind of sucked as when he was in the Oval Office? A Trump supporter because unless you think he's the worst thing to ever happen

to America, you're a Trump supporter, those are the two choices, and if you criticize him in any way, you have TDS, like this is the fucking retarded binary i'm sorry this kind of binary we have where you either have tds or you're a trump supporter it's absolutely trump derangement syndrome like where it's just like oh my god uh you hate everything i'm gonna wear a pussy on my head and show him like okay yeah. I think he's done a great, great job at radicalizing people. I think he's done a great job at exposing the evil of the corporate press. That was one of his greatest accomplishments.

But if people think that Trump's going to save them, like, they're crazy. Do you think he's well-intentioned? No. Who thinks he's well-intentioned no okay who thinks he's well-intentioned i just want to hear i mean i think he loves america but in like he's looking out for number one more power to him but we saw who he staffed like this like this idea that trump at age what was it 78 77 is like learning from his mistakes the fuck like at what point do you stop getting do-overs like no one made him hire john bolton he hired omarosa yeah yeah like okay like what the like explain like this woman on his own show her whole shtick

was like being a snake why did you hire omarosa who is her it's not like she's strong in the black community it's like it's like it was like little kim or like missy it's like okay i get it like you're making outreach to people that people like fucking omarosa you're the only one that liked you're the only one who liked her yeah yeah so it's just like these and the thing is your entire name was spent on 12 years firing and hiring the right people so how are you fucking hiring and firing john bolton what are you talking about yeah so i'm but let's the other side it could be that at this point like who wants to work for this guy because as soon as i leave he calls on twitter and calls me a fucking idiot right so then nobody's willing to step up except for the crazies but the crazies are the ones who get things done

because the crazies don't give a fuck. Can you explain why John Bolton was such a peculiar hire? We used to see Bolton at Fox all the time. There's a picture of me sitting next to him giving him the death glare. Okay, so explain Bolton to the average Laker listener. Okay, I'm getting triggered because, no, no, here's why. I'll tell

you why. Because one of my books is on North Korea. I'm like a North Korea guy. And before he was hired in the Trump administration, he had an editorial in the Wall Street Journal, I believe. Okay. Where he's like, if shit hit the fan between North Korea and South Korea, like America has the right to fucking bomb the fuck out of North Korea without even bothering to tell South Korea. And he knows, and he says in the article, there's nukes pointing from north korea to seoul seoul is like what 20 miles south of board some short distance like you're willing to play roulette and kill in a minute millions of people and you're putting this in writing in the fucking

wall street journal so he never met a war he didn't like yeah uh he just wants to bomb the hell out of everything yeah uh i think that's the kind of thing that's got us where we are today secretary of state no he was he was um um that security advisor it was secretary of state um and it's and he fired him i thought he left whatever and of course john bolton turned on him but it's just like what the fuck do you expect yeah so the idea was that he's gonna go out there and clean the swamp and he's going to take outsiders, etc. And John Bolton is a pretty well-known political insider. How are you going to clean the swamp and your Secretary of State

is the guy who run Exxon? What the fuck are you talking about? I guess the argument with that is you're taking guys from the private sector and putting them in positions. But Exxon, come on. Exxon is obviously lobbying government. They're gigantic. They have a bigger budget than most countries. Government organizations here.

Yeah, yeah. I think that's the other thing that Americans are now a little bit more aware of. And maybe put him in Secretary of Commerce. He was Secretary of State, which is diplomacy. What the fuck are you talking about? Did he shrink government at all? No, he didn't even try it. He didn't even try.

Why did they think they're going to do it again? So if these things don't matter to people, right? If the data or the facts don't matter to people, one, why is that? Because people are interested in narratives, not they're interested in truth. And what is the narrative on Trump? Preach.

That they're seduced by. Which who, the Trump supporters? I'm sure there's different factions, but sure. I think one of the big narratives is, and they're not wrong, is he's the only candidate out there who cares about us who have been ignored for a long time. Which is valid.

That's valid. That's perfectly true. I think that's true. And if he does care about us, they can look past these other shortcomings because that— Before they see what's the alternative. I'd rather have someone who cares about me than someone who doesn't, right? Yeah, it's a lesser of two situations, like what we were saying before.

So yeah, he might hire Bolton, and he might put the Exxon guy in there for foreign affairs, I'd rather have someone who cares about me than someone who doesn't, right? Yeah, it's a lesser of two situations, like what we were saying before. So yeah, he might hire Bolton and he might put the Exxon guy in there for foreign affairs and that might help out all the oil companies and yada yada. But he's going to actually do something for us. No, I think people underestimate how for decades, the only thing conservatism care about is getting leftists upset. And they consider that a win. It's like, okay, I'm going to sterilize your kids. You get to call me a moron.

Which one of us is winning? Do you know what I mean? So the fact that he got people so upset is like, oh, I'm winning. It's like, what's this happening? You're not getting any wins. You're just getting people upset. Where's the policy changes? But now we're speaking to what people really want.

Like sometimes people don't want change. They just want to dunk on you. Yes, that's it. Trump's the dunker. And he's going to come in and he's going to... He really is. He's on the free throw line. Is that a rapper? Close. He's a basketball

player. That's what I said. Is that a euphemism? Basketball player? But no, that's a great... That is a great point. Can I say one thing? I got to say one thing. I'm serious. I was on the flight coming here. I was asleep.

I was like taking a ride. I was like asleep. The guy behind me wakes me up screaming, someone please help me. No. He has his hands around the person next to his neck. And I turn around and hand to God, I've been spending so much time uh airplane freakouts that i wasn't even scared i'm like oh cool i'm like i'm having a story yeah and i the first thought was should i film this wait what i was a ranger yeah my first i was filmed should i film this and i swear to god

my second thought was should i yell out world star he's supposed to film then do it he's working on it he's working and it's a long story short the guy's wife mom excuse me was having a seizure she couldn't breathe

and I've never seen someone having a seizure in person there was no one there it was like a statue it was very very scary so the hands around the neck were for I think he was trying to shake her.

Ah, got it, got it, got it. But is someone a doctor for the love of Jesus? He called out for Jesus and Jesus answered. You're welcome. She's fine, I think. You're welcome. That's my show, yeah. Okay.

Anyway, back to what people want from Trump. I think that's a really great observation. It's sometimes they want... They say they want all this change, but in reality, they just want revenge. They feel like they've been dunked on for so long by media, different pundits, late night shows. And all of a sudden, this guy comes out and he's shooting. He's taking down everybody and he's the best at it.

So it's, yeah, you feel this sense of, I guess, it's victory, freedom, revenge. Biden's the guy who comes in for garbage minutes and passes it on. revenge but the thing is if you're gonna the guy who comes in for garbage minutes and passes the problem with trump is if you're gonna storm their forts you got to rape their women and kill their kids you don't just storm the fort and be like you're a loser okay bye like what's the point maybe that was enough i think it wasn't enough look where we are but for what the people want it was enough for them it was their pound of flesh we're not talking about like it wasn't even a pound of flesh it's a picture that's all they cared about but that's all they cared yes and imagine being in a situation where that's all you need like that's a pretty dire situation where you're not

even like all right fuck change i don't even need change that's there's no way that that's actually gonna happen right just tell them they're fat yeah so that's a pretty do you feel the same way about like storming the capital that was a symbolic victory that people felt like they did something but it was completely trivial. This is another argument against Trump. These were your people, and you fucking let them sit in solitary? Fuck you. What kind of man are you? What do you think should happen to them?

They should be elected. You have a perfect answer for everything. It's not a real answer, but it's a perfect answer you got a little trump in you perfect answer you're fired I think that when

these people who didn't bring weapons were put in solitary confinement for a long time and he did nothing for them except like later he's like kind of bringing their mantle I think it's just absolutely fucking outrageous that they weren't charged for months at a time. The book thrown at them is just absolutely

crazy. And I think it's a good thing when politicians are afraid. I think that's a very healthy thing for America and for any country. So you think our politicians have gotten a little too comfortable? Gotten? I mean, they've been that way for decades. They're on planes. They're fucking teenagers on one of the best thing trump did and this is one of the

great moments maybe you guys could play the clip was a bunch of congressmen were going to afghanistan i think to a military base and trump as i had the executive branch pulled their permission slip he goes you can't use a federal plane and they had to circle the bus around and they drove him back and they all had to get off the fucking bus and they didn't know what to do he fucking why did he do that what was just the fuck with them but like because nancy pelosi was like you can't give the stay the union while this shit's going on he goes well then you can't get on a plane and like they just the bus ran around for like half an hour like what do we do and they all have to fucking get off the bus looking like so here's perfect it was hilarious but who cares

but this is but you like it. I like it. You like to see them getting dunked on. But I'm not a Trump voter. I'm not saying you are, but it satisfied that little itch that you had, which is okay, check these fucking- That it should be satisfied and I can't finish this thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But I hear what you're saying. Okay, okay, okay. And then now what do you think that, what do you think people on the left are feeling now or want now? I don't think the left is like a monolith. I really don't like that characterization because I think there's a lot of, like, for example, I have a lot of friends who are lefties. Like 2016, they hated Hillary. Okay.

Let me change the question. The people that maybe voted for Biden last election. The corpses. Yeah. Like the corpses or the people who are like, I can't vote for this fucking Trump. Yeah, sure. But they're not these purple haired lesbians.

Absolutely. There's lots of them. Okay. What are they thinking now? What do they need now? Do they feel satisfied? Do you think that they're embarrassed? I think it's a mix.

I think a lot of people aren't going to vote for someone who's got a mugshot. I think a lot of people don't pay attention to politics. They see ashot they're like all right i can't do this so maybe they won't vote for biden maybe they'll sit at home that's a big issue so they sit it out yeah a lot of people the it's the supermarket and that's the power of the mugshot it's you fucking bring him in get his picture taken and that's enough for something yeah and i don't blame him like if i'm not paying attention politics, I know a guy's got all these charges. I'm like, fuck it. I can't bring myself to vote for him. Maybe this other guy sucks, but I can't do it.

So I can understand that. Supermarket's a big thing. Meaning the cost of goods. Yeah, it's just like, all right. Like, this is a problem. It was easier before. So that's a big, those people are going to vote for Trump.

I don't think we're going to know what the, what, I think, here's the thing, and this is not a particularly bold thing for me to say. I think shit's going to get crazy in a way we haven't seen before. Because if he's where he is in the polls now, Trump, where he's leading, which he never led at all in any poll in 2020. Yeah, it's kind of wild. It was like one poll.

He's leading in a lot of the polls. Things are going to get nuts. And one of the predictions I had is if they pull Biden, their plan B is going to be Hillary. Oh, my God. And she would probably win. Really? She got millions more votes the last time. Now that doesn't count in terms of Electoral College, but if I'm starting out with a faster

time than you, you know what I mean? And I just got to switch a few thousand in a few states, that's a really strong opening position. She doesn't have to defend Biden. She gets Newsom as VP, so he gets the suburban white woman vote she she would go on that debate stage go eight years ago you said i'd be in jail you're the one with the mugshot right and you even you laughed it's funny i just find herself wholly unlikable i and i didn't i don't know one thing or another about trump i just thought 2016 to 2020 there was so much fucking debate and everything was such a thing.

I kind of enjoy the relative peace, even though I don't think Biden's a good president. Hillary, though, I just find so, Biden, corpse or not, relatively sweet old guy, he seems. So as an uninformed guy who doesn't even really vote, to be honest with you, I would be, if I had to vote, I'd be like, all right, I guess just give me the fucking quiet corpse as opposed to the guy who's going to rile everyone up. But Hillary, I don't, I'm not voting.

Can they even swap somebody in at this time? Well, if he dies, or he's incapacitated, but he could just, they could just sit him down. Look,

what happened in 2020, mentally unfit, in 2020, to have your name on the ballot. Sure. I think you had to, announced by the doctor. Yeah,

I'll explain what happened. In 2020, in other words, just shut up. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not saying that. I'm not saying that. I'm just implying it. In 2020, there was something called Super Tuesday,

which is a bunch of primaries in the same day. And Klobuchar and Buttigieg got the phone call because Bernie Sanders is leading in every state. They go, it's Biden. They just quit. They're like, oh yeah, we trust Biden. And Biden swept it the next day. So I'm sure someone could give Biden the call being like, dude, you're losing to Trump. It's a wrap because he's a function of the party. He's a party hacker since the seventies. All right, guys, we're gonna take

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Wow. So this was a big theme of my book, The White Pill, when I learned about it. Because all these different countries in the Soviet block were calling him. They go, dude, shit's hitting the fan. Send in the tanks or it's all going to hell. And he said, nope. And why? Because he's like, I'm not having the blood of all these people in my hands.

East Germany with the Berlin Wall, where East Berlin was surrounded by concrete barricade and people were imprisoned uh they were having protests and they were saying we need another tiananmen square here like your favorite place and they're calling and gorbachev called the russians in east berlin he says we're not using force under any circumstances shit's going to play out on its own and he went to east germany and said in front of hanniker who was the dictator he goes like you're not a of, some people get lost in the past and some people move forward. So he was an example. And I'm not saying everything is, people have mousetraps in their head. When you say someone is an example, like, oh, he's probably saying he's Jesus. I'm not saying he's Jesus. I'm not saying he was a king of any kind. My point being, to me,

it's true though. When people have power and don't take their hands off the gun, that to me is, That's a great line. nukes at us and i press these buttons i'm killing like millions of people in minutes they're like yeah he's like uh-huh and he leaves and he's like i'm fucking putting a stop to this shit gorbachev was taken down to the bunker as well and he goes i'm not pressing this button even in a simulation if we're getting nuked when you're nuked i'm not fucking retaliating neither knew this so in the 80s they're playing poker with all these fucking nukes but both of them had committed internally like i'm not fucking fighting back like i'm not i'm not gonna read this story where is this from i mean it came out like one was reagan's aid the other gorbachev said it not publicly but said it he said it explicitly i mean what a cool piece of isn't it amazing how do you de-mousetrap people i want mousetraps well so you mean like oh you mean like oh you can't and what how do we get mousetraps in there in the first place? And just so everybody knows what we're talking about, the mousetraps are the trigger words that immediately shift someone's thinking and make them-

Stop their critical thinking. Yeah, immune to logic or, so the second you say- Trump. Trump. They've got a bunch of speeches. You say ivermectin. You know what the speeches are? We already know. So how do you de-mousetrap people?

Or why are people so prone to mousetraps? This is one of the reasons I'm not a Christian. Don't you fucking start with me. I don't think human beings are all fundamentally the same. I think some people, there's no one there. Interesting. start with me. I don't think human beings are all fundamentally the same. I think some people there's no one there. And I don't think you can make it that there's someone there. Do you think it's... You think, sorry, with the mousetrap

people there's no one there? For many of them, yes. I think this is their analog for thought, but if you take out the mousetraps, it's not like you can build a house in there. I would think it's a coping mechanism for the fact that there's so much to think about, so much to care about, quote unquote. They're not thinking too much. So we're just looking for the exit ramp, to borrow terminology. Yeah. So humans in general, a lot of times-

See, again, I'm not generalizing. I'm sorry to interrupt you. I'm sorry to interrupt you. No, that's fair. But I think there's a large swath of humanity that is like, there's a lot to digest, a lot to think about. If you can give me anything that gives me an exit ramp to not having to care about this issue, because my brain goes, well, that's what they are, then I'm going to take it. Because we are wired to not exert too much energy thinking-wise. So there's two things with that. One option, one reaction to that could be, I don't know, man. I just don't know. There's a lot I don't know, yeah. I don't know, man. I just don't know.

There's a lot I don't know, yeah. Right? The other reaction is, I need to say the thing that does not ostracize me from my in-group. Here is the thing. Now, that reaction, there's a neediness in that reaction. There's an insecurity in that reaction. There's like a vulnerable- It's a rational one. Pardon? It's rational. It's rational in that the importance of the in-group for your survival is crucial, right? This is baked into us primarily on that.

Yes, very much so. Yes, of course. But it is different than, man, I don't know. I just don't know enough. Do you hate Trump? I don't really know enough about it. Do you're a Trump supporter? You should be a Trump supporter, right?

If you say, I don't know, you're a Trump supporter. Right. According to those people. Okay. So then I guess what we have to figure out is what is the difference between the, I don't know enough people and the people who are, they're hyper concerned about being part of the in-group and you think it's just an emptiness. Do you think it's an IQ thing? Like what? I don't think they have souls. Come on. I'm serious. This is a whole psychedelics issue.

Talk to me. I'm serious. This is a whole psychedelics issue. What do you mean? Talk to me. Talk to me. Take me there. Take me there. I don't think they vibrate in 4D. No way. Yes. Are you being genuine?

Hand to God. And what? I'm going with you on this. I'm going with you. Why is that? Okay. So I can kind of, do you have a piece of paper? Yeah.

We'll get you a piece of paper. Miles, can you just ask him for one? Do you want a pen? I got a pen. I'm an author. Honestly. Who's this fucking guy? He has a pen.

Of course I have a pen. No other way to write shit. I haven't written a book with a pen in 20 years. Of course I have a pen. I got fancy pens and I have nothing to do with them, so I got to carry them around. Okay, okay, go, go, go. I just want to draw something quick. I'll draw the cup. No, okay, go, go, go. I just want to draw something quick.

I'll draw in the cup. No, no, no, no, no. We're going to get you a piece of paper. We're going to be here in like two seconds, I promise you. But this diagram is going to... I'll show you. I'll show you what I did. Oh, what about...

Nah. We'll get it, we'll get it. Did you text him? Yeah. Okay, is it crazy to draw on like that right there? Because you're going to leave these for us anyway. Oh, you want me to? Yeah, I would love to.

And I want you to sign it. He just stole his book, dude. Okay, let's do this. I mean, if you have to take them to your next thing, then... No, there's no next thing. Okay. Here comes the paper. I got it, I got it.

No, no, we got it. This is even better. This book is worth trillions. You'll hear, once I say it, then you'll be like okay okay so can we where's the camera we got it on his phone we're just okay i think we're okay we got it thank you tanya so what's this a picture of that is a that's michael malice michael malice that's right so point to him here yep and now point to him in real life right and what's this that's andrew schultz right so and what's this that's a house point to the house real life. Right. And what's this? That's Andrew Schultz. Right.

So, and what's this? That's a house. Point to the house. Where else is the house in real life? Right. So these are 2D representations of 3D beings. But this house only exists in 2D. Okay.

So I think a lot of people who exist in 3D don't exist in 4D where the souls are. So we're talking about one more dimension. Yes. He's using this as an example. It's like an allegory of the cave type situation. Not really.

Some people are just shadows. Yes, yes. But they're not actually the form that creates a shadow. Brilliant, yes. Yes. You thought he wasn't gone then? Right, I thought he meant

the people in the cave. No, no, no. This is good. Yes. That's what I think. I understand. So the frequency that... Yeah.

So do you think those people are worthy of human consideration? Yes. I mean, I'm not in favor of like... No one believes that buildings don't have souls, right? No, so I'm not saying... If someone says a building doesn't have souls, oh, you're saying we should break down every building? That makes no sense, right?

No one believes buildings don't have souls. Just because no one believes buildings have souls. Oh, okay. Or trees.? No one believes buildings don't have souls. Or trees. Oh, you think trees don't have souls? Are you saying burn down all the forests? Right, but you're not going to negotiate with a building. You're not going to have an argument with them, you're not going to debate them, and you're not going to care about that building.

We wouldn't let buildings vote. I don't believe in voting. That's fair. I believe in voting for anybody. To clarify, sorry, the differentiator between the soul having people and not is critical thinking, essentially, and not having those... I don't know what it looks like in there. But I think the more you go down these kind of rabbit holes, and people without inner monologues, people who are incapable of any kind of steel manning, incapable of literally any empathy.

I'm really glad that you steel manned. It's annoying when people come on with arguments and they're not willing to justify the opposition. There's also nothing wrong with saying, I don't know, because I'd rather someone think I'm honest than think I'm smart. Because I'd rather talk to someone who's honest than someone who's smart. Because then like okay i don't agree with you but i know you can be my friend i can rely on you also makes me i need to

come from place of truth who the hell are these smart people when you're around yourself yeah as obviously you've demonstrated yeah so so so i don't know why i'm like this i don't know why i'm like this i'm sorry i'm I'm sorry. I love it, dude. I love it. Never going to compliment you again. I'm excited about this. Okay, okay, okay. So then the question is, if you can be benevolent, right?

Let's say you're in this position of power. I'm not saying that you would want this position of power. But if you could be as benevolent as possible to these people who are soulless, according to you, could be as benevolent as possible to these people who are soulless, according to you, how would you help them understand what is, and can you even know what's best for them? Maybe what's best for them is to just wrap themselves around an ideology. And like Akash said, it's like way less intellectual heavy lifting. They get to be part of the group and maybe that is the best life for them. Not only the best, it's also unavoidable. I think to your point, we're taught in elementary school that it's really important for everyone to be an involved citizen and be

informed on current events. That's ridiculous. But then, so that's part of it. Now you've created a problem in the minds of literally everybody. And then the corporate press comes in and they're like, here's an issue and here's how you should feel about it. So right away, they give them a solution to the problem they've created. And I'll give you a very easy example. Everyone listening to this can watch it on their own. So when you have a play, at the beginning of the play, you have a cast of characters like Mercutio, Romeo's friend, who's got whatever, Lothari, blah, blah, blah. And you describe who they are. So if you're reading the play, you can go back to the beginning, who's this guy again? When the corporate press introduces a character into a story, they'll right away tell you whether you should like this person or not.

So if we were describing Joe Rogan, we'd say an objective description, like Joe Rogan, popular podcast host, or Joe Rogan, king of the the Bros, something like that, right? They'll say Joe Rogan, comma, who has a history of trans jokes, comma, that's the most important thing to define Joe fucking Rogan. So any article, when they bring a character onto the stage, they immediately tell the reader how they should feel about either the person or the event. So they create the problem in school where like I have to care about everything. No one has the capacity to learn about everything or to know about everything

so when they write the article like here's the facts but here's right away how you should feel about it. And right away everyone reading this be like I can pass because not only am I informed in terms of I know the facts I also have an opinion about it now. You're probably familiar with Jonathan Haidt. Oh, I think he's the most profound thinker nowadays. Once you read him, you can't go back. It's really interesting, this theory of logic and reason.

He has a new book out. Are you going to have him on? I think he'd be a really good guest. You'd love him. Yeah, I spoke to him at the Cellar. He was doing Gnome, the guy who owns the Cellar. Yeah, yeah, of course. He was doing his pod. Gnome is a great pod. You guys have great conversations. We went head-to-head.

It was really fun. Was it good? I don't know. Not really. Okay, damn. Well, he's a sharp guy. Yeah, he's in it. But he's like a boomer con.

Maybe, but he's well-read. No, I like him. I like him. We're just saying, we're kind of talking past each other. Anyway. No disrespect to Gnome at all. So Jonathan was talking about that, he had that original book. The Righteous Mind. Yes, The Righteous Mind. Everyone reading this

should watch that book. Fantastic, fantastic book. Even for my books. And you could probably articulate this better than I can, but it was this idea of logic and reason and what is being used and what is it? It's an elephant with a rider. And an interesting component I think that he's added to in the most recent book is the first emotional reaction that you have for something ends up becoming, I think, the elephant. So the idea is you basically use reason to come to your conclusion and logic to justify it afterwards. So whatever you feel about something initially is what you're going to try to retroactively justify. Just rationalize. I'll whatever you feel about something initially is what you're going to try to retroactively justify. Just rationalize. I'll give you two examples, one that just happened to me.

Okay, go. So, he ran these tests and he'd be like, okay, here's a scenario. By the way, another good way to know if someone's worth talking to is you give them a hypothetical, they're like, this would never happen. It's like, okay, great. So, you don't like fun. Einstein figured out one of his experiments. He's like, what would happen if you're running at the speed of light and you turn on a flashlight? And you know some people be like, you can't run the speed of light. It's like, okay, great, great, great.

Einstein's an idiot here. Wait a minute, hold on. What would happen? Nothing would happen. Well, that's what he started to figure. I was like, okay, what if you're running at the speed of light in a truck? And like, how can you figure out the speed? That's, you turn on that flashlight at the speed of light.

It's just a light hovering at the tip of the flashlight because you're moving at the same speed as the projection of the light. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This guy's pretty smart, this Einstein guy. Einstein guy, right, yeah. So, Haidt had these moral questions. What if brother and his sister had sex once,

they used a condom, they had a fun time, they never did it again. Is that wrong? And a lot of people would say yes. And he goes, why? And then people like, oh, and they start spazzing out. And sometimes they'd be like, what if they had like fucked up kids? But we know they didn't have fucked up kids. We set up the scenario. We know everything that happened because this didn't really happen, but they'll still try to find rationalizations to make it work. And this just happened to me. I have six. And she said we shouldn't have kids. And I'm like, you're right. She went through menopause. So I have six light bulbs in my bedroom. One of the light bulbs is out. And part of me is like i need to

replace this bulb i can't think of a good reason who cares there's only five light bulbs it's not like it's fucking dark there's no loss of utility but my brain is telling me you should replace that bulb i like the look aesthetically one being off do i really care symmetry i guess symmetry but i mean yeah i think it's that like i think you can care about it you clearly care about aesthetics yeah but it's the i mean the lights aren't off and on in the bedroom anyway they're not my point is my my feeling is stronger than the rationalization for the feeling sure yes like so that's like i like a lot of times people have a very strong moral opinion but their moral reasoning is very very weak yeah so so here's the because a lot of times you don't need strong uh you don't

need wait what was it the back end of lot of times you don't need strong, you don't need, wait, what was it? The back end of that? Rationalization. You don't need strong rationalization if you're in a group that all agrees with you. Yes. You don't need steel, man. You're done. Yeah. Isn't the illusion of power a little bit better than not having your voice felt at all? Take us down. Because now it's like, every time I disagree with a politician or every time I disagree with something, it's going to be January 6th or it's going to be... So what's the guy in The Matrix who was red-pilled and took the blue pill so he could go back?

That's you. Yes, it is. The bald guy. He's a great actor. Joey Pants. Joey Pants. Yeah, Joey Pants. That's you.

Yes, you're saying I want to go back. You would. You would go back. You would go back. I would go back. You would go back. If I'm Neo, I'm... But you're not.

You're not Neo. You're Joey Pants. You're Joey Pants. Maybe you can do more pants. Maybe. Yeah, I can do more pants. But yeah, you're right. It's like everybody wants to be Neo in the Matrix.

Everybody else in the Matrix sucks. Driving that stupid spaceship around the fucking sewage system. Because they're in their jobs. They have families. They have happy lives in the Matrix. Their lives are great. Everybody outside the Matrix is what he meant. Oh, yeah, yeah.

No, I'm saying in... Oh, no, no, sorry. Outside. Everybody in the movie that has already taken the pill, they're driving around these stupid spaceships. They're away from their families that are in this underground dungeon. They're just fucking miserable. Eating sludge. The one guy goes back,

Neo at least gets to be fucking Superman every once in a while when he walks into it. But every other red pillar is miserable. Yeah, but H.L. Mencken, the great newspaper man

for the 20th century, he has this great quote, he goes, the average man does not want to be free, he simply wants to be safe. And this is why we trade our freedom for security

all the time. We, don't say we. Okay, the average person. Yes, all the time. And, don't say we. Okay. The average person. Yes. And I don't think it's just those people that you were talking about. It's not at all. We saw it during COVID. It's a human.

It was a huge percentage. And frankly, I don't blame a lot of them. Here's the thing. Like I was saying earlier with my fans, if you're someone with a family and kids, like it's really, I'm not going to sit here and tell you to stick your neck out and put their fucking livelihood in danger. That's crazy. Yeah.

The, um. Martyrdom is overrated. That's another reason I'm not a Christian. I don't think martyrdom is always a good answer. I think it's often a bad answer. I can tell you, even just getting married, my risk aversion has gone down. The idea of safety has become,

as a father, I'm thinking about both for me one day. Safety becomes paramount. Yes, and that's appropriate. This is my freedom at this point, honestly. So let's protect that. Yeah. And this is what these countries did very well. They know if they get your kids, you're going to do whatever they want.

Yeah. So which countries did that? Eastern Europe. Interesting. Like when what became the KGB, they would arrest people. And there would be your kid's death warrant signed on your desk. Wow. And it's like, let's name names.

Because Stalin legalized the death penalty warrant signed on your desk. Wow. And it's like, let's name names. And this is because Stalin legalized the death penalty to like 12 or 14. Wow. So right away, it's like, if it's not you, it's going to be your kids. What's it going to be? Right? You're going to talk.

Oh yeah, I did 9-11. You're singing. Whatever you want me to sign. Yeah. So this is, so the great human experiment of the West or of America. One more thing. They did this with Canada. So the great human experiment of the West or of America. One more thing.

They did this with Canada. So the corporate press, who are literal demons, when those truckers were, I'm not kidding. No, the truckers. When the truckers were having their protests, there were all these articles saying the police should come and take their kids away because these protests aren't safe places for kids. Isn't that interesting? There was no violence. There was no threats of violence. There were a lot of honking and they were advocating and the cops were saying it.

We might have to come take their kids. You're telling me these people aren't demons? The idea that they were all white supremacists, like as a guy who knows a lot of Punjabis, I guarantee you a lot of them are Punjabi motherfuckers. No, you're 100% right. Hold on. No, seriously. If your choice is being called a white supremacist or having your kids taken away, I mean, this is...

It's not even a question. I guess what you're trying to say is the way that they were making them radioactive is that they were calling them Nazis or white supremacists. And what people don't realize is the truckers in Canada, a large percentage of them are Indian. Punjabis in particular often go into trucking and there's tons of them. But it's got to be the racism or climate change. Yes, of course. See if it's notukka and there's tons of them. But it's got to be the racism or climate change. Of course. Yeah. Should the state have any role in

child rearing at all? God, no. Are you kidding? Really? No. Child rearing? Or like, I guess, child protection. Well, that's the big issue. Like if there's like a faith healer, like a fundamentalist religious family and their kid has cancer and they're saying,'re going to pray this away we're not right so so let's talk

about this because this is a problem this is a nice tree that we've got a lot of branches this is this is a this is something i take very seriously i talk about a lot and i really hate when people politicize like stuff with kids because they're like oh all these people are democrats we're a molesting kid give me a break. The big problem biologically is that a lot of people who have kids shouldn't have kids. I don't mean the sense that they're bad parents. I mean that they're doing horrific things to kids that none of us in this room can imagine. And a friend of mine named Matt, and he told me to use his name when I was on Rogan, came out to me as a child, a victim of childhood sexual abuse. I talked about it and I said,

people shouldn't have to keep themselves quiet, right? If someone had a dad who was like an alcoholic 50 years ago, he couldn't talk about it. Now, if that happened to you, Andrew, it would suck. I wouldn't look at you any differently. People who were the victims of this, they feel like they're embarrassed to say something. They shouldn't have to carry that burden their whole lives.

They should be comfortable to say it and be like, dude, that sucks for you. I'm still gonna make rape jokes around you. You know what I mean? And when I talked about it in Rogangan a bunch more of my friends told me and a bunch of my strangers reached out to me and i'm like holy shit this is a big fucking huge problem yeah and the thing is i don't have any answer and if anyone tells you the answer is voting republican or having this kind of system or that kind of system the problem is it's in the family and there's no system where people

who have families have access to those kids and also these predators know how to pass they know where the prey is any animal so this is something i think about a lot i talk about a lot and i i really hate these kind of glib you just got to do this there's not one easy answer for this and i really hate these claims that this is all tinfoil hat paranoia. And you guys are making, if you're going to overreact about something, to me, this is another reason why I never identify as libertarian, because libertarians think it's just the government, or many of them do. This has nothing to do with the government. This operates independently of the government, and the system works very effectively and efficiently. And you just nailed it completely.

The example I was talking about earlier with Roseanne is when I did my book on The New Right, I'd never met Holocaust deniers before, right? And what was fascinating to me as a Jewish person is that all these people who were saying the Holocaust never happened were all saying it should have. And I told that to Roseanne. She's like, oh my God, that's so funny. So she's on Theo Vaughn, comedy podcast, Theo Vaughn, who runs a popular comedy podcast. That's how an article should be. And she's talking about things like, yeah, you can't say, you know, the vaccine, whatever. And you can't say Biden had 81 million votes and the Holocaust never happened. So she's using examples of things that are like absurdities that you're not allowed to say.

They clip it. Jewish Roseanne, who identifies as a rabbi. I never said I was a good one. That's her line. And Roseanne Barr, Holocaust denier. And it's just like, you people... And the thing is, it's not possible to look at that whole clip

and not realizing she's being sarcastic. It's not possible. Another lefty example, Cenk Uygur, who runs the Young Turks. Who? Cenk Uygur. Oh, yeah, yeah. I didn't know that's how you pronounce his last name.

He runs the Young Turks. He had David Duke on his show, former Klansman David Duke. And David Duke is saying, I don't hate Jews. And Cenk Uygur goes, no, of course not. New York Times. Cenk Uygur had David Duke on his show. When David Duke said, I don't choose, Cenk agreed and said,

no, of course not. You can't watch that clip. This leftist is agreeing with david it's not you cannot honestly think this but when you read it the transcript yeah it sure looks that way this is my point about how it is often manipulated in and some people are lazy but a lot of times they know what the fuck they're doing and some of that sometimes both of them are the exact same thing correct the parameters create the laziness because if you have parameters okay yeah i don't yeah yeah i don't have to do anything the people that will

work there and work within these parameters are inspired really just by the carrot and once i have those perfect people that are inspired just by the carrot they don't give a flying fuck how the art comes out of course and now you've got control now here's the problem who the fuck is creating the parameters yes are multiple people creating them? Are multiple interest groups creating them? We'll tie this in a second. The parameters of Me Huberman article, the hit piece came out. And here's the thing. I feel right now that we're at the point that people immediately rejected it. They're just like, ugh, another one of these hit pieces.

This is clearly just a hit job. I've not met one person, and it might talk about the people that I hang out with, but not one person that actually was like, oh, this is a serious piece and we should look into this. When I say these people are, these corporate journalists are literal demons, by which I mean entities which are only biologically human.

Andrew Humerman's entire shtick is helping people with free information, which means it helps poor people more than people have money, how to succeed, to be better human beings how to sleep how to be better neighbors just thrive it's all positive no politics and this is your villain um so the hatred i have and what are they accusing him of just dating four girls yeah he slept around. The hatred I have for these... The incredibly handsome rich guy got some pussy? Is that the shocking information? I get why you're laughing, but my thoughts are with this guy whose entire career has been about giving people free information

to become better human beings. And now in this major piece, he has to know that everyone around him is reading about him hoeing around and looking at him differently. And it's just like, it makes me so angry. I don't like that argument only because like somebody can live their life

in the most positive way, but still do nefarious shit. But I don't think this is nefarious and it's not my business. I don't even know the story. What you're saying is just because you do good doesn't mean you can't do bad. I agree with that, but he's not doing bad. But here's the thing. One thing, I don't think he the story. What you're saying is just because you do good doesn't mean you can't do bad. I agree with that. But he's not doing bad.

But here's the thing. One thing, I don't think he's doing bad. And two, I think that people are eye-rolling these pieces because they've become so frequent.

It's almost like... Karenism. It's Karenism. No, Karen isn't. Oh, Karen isn't. Because there's plenty of uninformed people, like we talked about earlier,

It's also Karenism. where if you say, Andrew Huberman, oh, he's the guy who raped a bunch of women. Even though it doesn't say that in the article, that's what they're hearing. I think those pieces, I think those days are done. I think there was a time where- You're crazy. I think what often happens, though, and this is not to say that these people aren't soulless demons or whatever words you're using, but what often happens now, I think, is what I think you're going to find with Huberman is he's going to get more popular.

Because the people who are eye-rolling at these articles who do exist are going to go, oh, they don't like him, so I like him. I don't redistribute to him the slightest. My point is there's going to be plenty of people now in their head when they hear Andrew Huberman. All they know about him is like, outlawed. Here's the thing. I think there was a time that we— Because that's what happened with Rogan. Yeah, but I—

I had a friend from college. He's like, oh, I hate that guy. He could think of a reason. But I think that was a different time. I think there was a time that we grew up in where we didn't know that there was a thing called a hit piece. We just thought it was information. Now we know there are things called hit pieces.

Who's we? I'm telling you, there's a lot of people that still don't realize. We're debating the numbers here, right? You guys think that that number's higher. I think that number's lower. I'm not saying there's a lot of people that still don't realize we're debating the numbers here right you guys think that that number's higher I think that number's lower I'm not saying

there are no people I think it's a majority are I think 10% what temperature taking the face value yeah

it's like 60 I think it's I think it's closer to 60 than 10 I think the number's growing I think when we were younger

it was a lot now maybe it's less now. When you see what happened with Rogan, when you see what CNN, I'm not talking about some fucking online magazine. I'm talking about CNN changes the color of his skin in a picture. When you see that CNN can do that

and then you see this, or when you see what's happened with Portnoy, when you see this happen over and over again, you're like, oh, this is a trick. Andrew, people think Kyle Rittenhouse killed black people. Andrew, people think Kyle Rittenhouse killed black people. People think Kyle Rittenhouse shot black people. I thought that at first. I thought that until then.

Then I thought I knew the hero. Fucking hero. Fucking antifacist in Portland or whatever it was. G's up. G's is up, Malice. He's saying what we're all thinking. That. Up. Malice. He's saying what we're all thinking.

I feel like the whole... I'm going to text him again. He's back. I think the whole right has a distrust of the media, though. So I think that they can look at this with skepticism. There's no one of the right... A lot of the boomers believe in Fox. They think Fox is like the... You know what I mean? Sure.

But Fox isn't putting out the article. My point is, a lot of the Fox... The in fox they think fox is like the you know what i mean sure it's so but fox isn't putting out the article my point is a lot of the new yorker is correct but my point is that a lot of the right do have trust of some aspects of the media fair but the left-leaning media i don't think that they trust so i don't think anybody on the right is reading this article and believing it so that's 50 no it's not 50 because there's a sorry there's a huge percent of the population that doesn't care and they're like they're kind of floating around and they're the ones who are now in their head oh andrew humerman oh he's a bad guy and then i think he's saying the majority of people don't dive deeper than the sources they trust at large also cnn fox and also the the new yorker punches do you see how long the fucking article is also no i

don't want i'm just so the article is so long that you'd never read it. And I think it's by design. I think that they're just like, here's the headline. Look at all these... Oh, the cursor is still this small. Is it going... I couldn't believe how much... I had scrolled so much and this on the side.

All that to say you got some puss... My hope, and I don't think it's much of a hope, and I'm sure I'll be in a room with him at some point, is that this, like with Elon, really radicalizes Andrew Huberman and he realizes the depravity of the enemy class. Because with Elon, it was like, oh, Elon's from South Africa. You know they had apartheid there. And it's like, what the fuck are you talking about? Just complete shamelessness.

Yeah. Yeah, what do you think about Elon's very open political opinions on X? I love it. it. I'm pretty sure he's read The White Pill, which is really cool. I wish he'd tweet about it. He followed me, which is really, really exciting. I'm waiting to slide into his DMs. I'm waiting for that fucking opportunity.

I almost did the Jew hands. I almost did. I caught myself. I always did. I call myself. When I'm at home and from the mirror thinking about it, I do it. It's not like I cast a reflection, but I do it. Malice, we have books that you need, that people need to read, many of which that you have written. These ones are too...

Try that sentence again. Well, there are books that people need to read. Many of them you've written, but there's also books you haven't read that they should read. You should read first. I thought that was all. Which one should we read first? Who's we? Us, here at this table.

Whichever interests you more. If you want a collection of essays, it's the Anarchist Handbook, but I think The White Pill. I think The White Pill is my greatest achievement. That's the one everyone should read. It is about the rise and fall of the Russian Empire? And it's also about the victory of good over evil. Wow.

And that's something that I think all of us can be motivated by and the fact that it's happened in our lifetimes. You know what I mean? You're saying the fall of the Soviet Union and the rise of Russia. No, the rise and fall of the Soviet Union. Oh, got you. The triumph of good over evil.

Yes. And it's a very dark, but very beautiful story. Okay. I'm going to indulge in this. And then you have another thing you're working on. Can you talk about it at all a little bit? I do. I thought you were talking about the case for a civil war.

Oh. Can we not talk about this? It's not called the case for civil war. You were like, put black people back in the, what field? They were happier. They were singing their songs. They got jobs. Sometimes they're in the house.

Did you know much Disney're in the house did you know watch Disney Song of the South they're singing with the animals birds talking to them except for that rabbit fucking rabbits dude here's what's gonna happen

when the book's done I will text you and you'll say what's it about and I'll tell you and you'll go wow and then a year later you'll have me on the show

that'd be perfect and that other person will tell you about it in a second but I have I have heard you talk about this a little bit so you can

I think you might need to clarify it a little bit share the spirit America's in need for a civil war national divorce national divorce

how do you want to say I'm gonna be I'm actually doing crowdfunding for a graphic novel I'm doing that's kind of a pet project

but yeah I'm gonna be trying to get together my book about national divorce, which I started that whole bandwagon when I wrote our book in 2016. And you believe that that should happen? It's going to happen.

Based on? I don't think there's any mechanism in place other than extreme violence, which I'm desperately hoping to avoid, to bring America closer together as a country, as opposed to further separating apart. And I think that's kind of indisputable. I don't think anyone... And do you think Americans are so young and unaware of history that we believe that that's not just something that happens to a country every few hundred years? If you look at the size of the

nations in Europe, they've changed drastically sure over time i just think the difference is especially because of social media it's harder and harder to find a reason to talk to people whose worldview you disagree with and when that's the case what is the argument for having kind of this at least two if not more cultures under one roof especially cultures who genuinely despise each other yeah i. I guess the reason would be safety, but I think that Americans are just so far removed from the idea of a water border and why that's valuable. Yeah, I'm also much more worried about being invaded

by Washington than Beijing. Yeah. And also the invasion wouldn't be with personality. Invasion would be with culture. So the idea of having protection from invasion because you have water on both sides doesn't really give you the same advantages as it did back in the day. Yeah, this boomer argument that if America split up, then China's going to invade tomorrow.

It's just like they can— What do they want? And how? And Canada and the rest of the world is going to be like, well, they're divorced now, so I guess we're just going to let this happen. I'm going to talk about that in the book. It makes no sense to me. Okay, I want to hear more about it. You're a fascinating dude. Thank you so much for...

I really appreciate you coming, but I also appreciate you. And I say this again, the steel man arguments I think are really valuable. And I think that they pacify anybody who's consuming this bit of information that they might completely disregard and disagree with. All of a sudden you hear the perspective that they feel and you're like, okay, so that does make sense. And he sees my point of view but this other thing is pretty interesting as well i think it's really effective thank you so much you shared that man great pleasure thank you you are welcome yeah fuck your shoes bro