Andy & Ari On3 - ANOTHER legal earthquake for college sports | Phillip Dukes talks Auburn | Oregon DL Brandon Dorlus

Episode Date: February 6, 2024

Tonight's show is sponsored by Fanduel, America's No. 1 sportsbook. Visit fanduel.com/Staples to sign up and receive $200 in bonus bets if you win your first bet of $5 or more. Check out Fanduel's Super Bowl specials for a ton of fun ways to spice up the game.With a little more than a week remaining before two states take on the NCAA's NIL rule in court, a National Labor Relations Board case involving an Ivy League basketball team adds even more intrigue to the mix.(0:00-11:53) Intro - NBLA Declares Dartmouth Basketball Players to be Employees(11:54-14:23) 2024 Early Season Win Totals (14:24-17:49) Alabama 2024 Win Total: 9.5(17:50-20:59) Colorado 2024 Win Total: 5.5(21:00-26:03) Boston College Head Coaching Search(26:04-53:08) On3's Newest Host Phillip Dukes Joins!(53:09-58:47) Oregon's Brandon Dorlus Joins(58:48-1:00:09) Conclusion Since we're all craving some football talk, Andy discusses Fanduel's two season win total releases to this point. Both are very interesting. Alabama has the lowest win total (9.5) since 2016, and Colorado's 5.5 total means bettors must decide if Coach Prime can engineer a two-win improvement in year two (and in a new conference).Next, On3's newest hire Phillip Dukes joins Andy to discuss his new show Five-Star Flex as well as the current recruiting landscape. Dukes also talks Auburn, where the excitement over the incoming receivers is tempered by concerns about quarterbackLater, former Oregon defensive lineman Brandon Dorlus joins Andy to discuss why some rivalries shouldn't be set aside -- even in all-star games.Want to watch the show? Head on over to Youtube! https://youtube.com/live/JJ7YW76aXvEMust be 21+ and present in select states. FanDuel is offering online sports wagering in Kansas under an agreement with Kansas StarCasino, LLC. First online real money wager only. $5 pregame moneyline wager required. First online real money wager only. $10 firstdeposit required. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable bonus bets that expire 7 days after receipt. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com.Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG in Colorado, Iowa, Michigan, New Jersey, Ohio, Pennsylvania,Illinois, Kentucky, Tennessee, and Virginia. Call 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 in Arizona, 1-888-789-7777 or visitccpg.org/chat in Connecticut, 1-800-9-WITH-IT in Indiana, 1-800-522-4700 or visit ksgamblinghelp.com in Kansas, 1-877-770-STOP inLouisiana, visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland, visit 1800gambler.net in West Virginia, or call 1-800-522-4700 in Wyoming. Hope ishere. Visit GamblingHelpLineMA.org or call [phone] for 24/7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8HOPE-NY or textHOPENY in New YorkFollow us on Twitter https://twitter.com/on3sportsFollow us on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/on3/?hl=en Like/Follow us on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/On3Sports/

Welcome to Andy Staples on three and I promise we're going to talk some football today. Promise. We're going to talk a little Auburn later in the show. We're going to catch up with former Oregon defensive lineman Brandon Dorlis. We're going to talk about a couple of win totals, two win totals to be exact, that are already out there this early date, but they're very interesting. Both of them, really interesting. One of them is the lowest Alabama win total since 2016. We'll talk about that. But first, we got to talk about another earthquake for college sports, another legal issue for college sports. The National Labor Relations Board, a regional director in New England, declares the Dartmouth basketball players to be employees of Dartmouth College.

And this is a very interesting one because we've talked about this with the USC case, which they had their hearings a couple of weeks ago. Remember, the USC people were trying to claim that they didn't actually have any rules for the basketball teams, which we know not to be true. But this one's different because the Ivy League doesn't give athletic scholarships. So all of these players are, you know, walk-on is probably not the right word, but they basically are. The Ivy League operates similar to Division III, where there are no athletic scholarships. You can get a financial aid package based on need. But it's a different animal. And so this declaration feels a little bit different.

But I will point out, this is something everybody was saying, bye-bye NCAA. When this news came down on monday everybody's saying oh the ncaa ncaa is done bye to ncaa you're done back off slow down slow down hit the brakes so here's what you need to remember as crazy as it sounds 10 years ago it was 10 years ago this happened but the northwestern football team, those players were ruled employees of Northwestern University by a regional director in Chicago of the NLRB. That was appealed by Northwestern, as this one will be appealed by Dartmouth. If the USC one goes the way we think it will, it will be appealed by USC. And it was appealed to

the full National Labor Relations Board. So in 2015, the full board said, no, no, no, we are not going to declare them employees because they didn't want to upset the competitive balance of FBS football. And then the reasoning behind that was because while Northwestern is a private school, most FBS universities are public schools and the NLRB has no jurisdiction over public institutions and employees at public institutions. So that's where that was the hang up. And now a lot has changed since 2015. NIL is around now. You've seen the court strike down the transfer rules. You may see the court strike down the NIL is around now. You've seen the court strike down the transfer rules. You may see the court strike down the NIL rules.

That's coming next Tuesday where there's a hearing for that. And the Attorney General from Tennessee and the Attorney General from Virginia are going to argue that the NIL rules are a violation of the law. So all of that stuff changing may change the final outcome on one of these cases. But until we see that final, final ruling, I wouldn't say this is it. Now, here's another reason why this is interesting. Because if you are Greg Sankey and Tony Petitti, the SEC commissioner, the Big Ten commissioner, we talked much of the show yesterday about those two getting together to try to chart a new path for college sports because they basically have said, look, the NCAA, the old structure, the old way of doing it, it's not going to get it done. Nobody seems to care that we're up against a deadline here. And I'm sure those two called one another today and were like, see, more stuff. And the thing about it is, this is the weird part of the union discussion.

I wrote this for SI back in, I want to say 2014. I think it was after the regional director's decision on Northwestern when we obviously didn't know what was going to happen with the schools, the commissioners would be begging the athletes to unionize because they might want to have a collective bargaining agreement so that the athletes would stop taking them to court. I actually think they're at that point. Now, the presidents of the universities still don't want them to be employees. And I imagine if you're Greg Sankey, if you're Tony Petitti, your school presidents are telling you we still don't want them to be employees.

But if you are them, you are telling those school presidents, we may not get that choice, guys. So if we don't get that choice, how do we handle this? What do we do? Because there is a potential outcome that could be beneficial if this all goes down that way. If the athletes are allowed to unionize, if they're allowed to bargain with the schools. And here's what it is. Do you want a salary cap? Do you want rules that govern player movements so that they're not free agents. Players aren't free agents every year now.

They're free agents every week, basically. They can go old school hostage for NIL money. But if you didn't want that to be, if you wanted a situation where they could only move once every two years or once every three years or however you want to structure it, there's a way to do that. The way you do that is you bargain it with them. You get them to agree to it and then they can't sue you or they can, but it'll get kicked out of court pretty quick. That's what the NFL has.

That's what the NBA has. That's what Major League Baseball has. Now, they don't all do it the same way. Major League Baseball has an incredibly strong players union. They have fought a salary cap and managed to successfully fight it off for years and years. The NFL has a hard salary cap. The NBA has a salary cap, but good Lord, what a life if you're like the seventh guy in an NBA rotation. So it is different in every sport. And I talked about this a few times and I actually talked about, I was on Cole Kubelik's podcast,

my friend Cole Kubelik. He does a very good podcast, The Cube Show. And I was on his show over the weekend and we talked about this and he brought up something that I've mentioned a bunch of times over the years that I think the players have it as good as they're ever going to have it right now. This is as good as it's going to get because they have all the leverage in this particular situation.

There will come a point where the schools wise up and they'll either negotiate with them or they will figure out a way to make rules that will not get them sued into oblivion. I think the way to do that is bargain with them or they will figure out a way to make rules that will not get them sued into oblivion. I think the way to do that is bargain with them. And if the players end up having a representative association that bargains for them, and obviously they would have their people representing them, I don't think it would be a particularly strong union. I don't think it would be as strong as the major league baseball or NFL or any of those unions. Till sweat drops down my balls says, how to 22, how to 20 year olds unionize? Would there be a pension? Like how far are we possibly going here? Um, well, 20 year olds are older than 18. So they're legal adults, so they can unite unionize all they want. And how far you go just depends on how far you want to go. And like if I'm the schools and the government says I have to treat them as

employees, then I'm going to, well, one, I'm going to ask some questions about Title IX because I'm going to go, okay, I'm not paying the ones that don't make me any money or I'm not paying them nearly as much because that doesn't work. That's not how you run a business. So if you're going to tell me they're employees, I'm going to pay the ones that make money. So that's one thing I'm going to do. But the other thing is I'm going to create rules that actually work. So I think that's the thing. The coaches, if you ask them now, they're like, whatever. Don't care if they're employees. Don't care if they're this or that. Just make some rules. The school presidents don't feel that way quite yet, but they might get there at some point. They might. They might realize that it is probably the only way. Now I've talked to some ADs about

this and, and one very smart AD at one point told me, okay, the way you do this, because just like the, the, and I know we're really deep in the weeds here and I'm sorry, I promise we're going to talk some football in a second, but this is a pretty big deal right now. And also by the way, tease on Wednesday's show, Michael McCann from Sportico, law professor, great sports law expert is going to help translate all of this into English for us. Because as you guys have figured out, I am not a lawyer, but back to what you might do. So very smart AD tells me this. And I've thought about this ever since. This was about three years ago. So this is something that people in the business have

been thinking about for a while. And this AD says, make them employees of the conference, because you do have a lot of issues with labor laws if you're talking about people at public universities, because heck, there are some states where public employees aren't even allowed to unionize. So you wouldn't be able to have a union chapter representing that particular group. But if they're employees of the conference, which is a private entity, then that solves one problem there. And also it solves the issue of conflicting labor laws in different states. They would be under the labor law of the state where the conference is based. So like the SEC, you're under Alabama labor law, the big 10, you'd be under Illinois labor law.

That is potentially how you get some of this done. And again, we don't know. We don't know what happens down the line because we don't know what the final ruling is going to be. Again, this happened with Northwestern football 10 years ago and it was overturned a year later. So there's no guarantee that it gets upheld. And you know, I'm pretty straight with you on this stuff. Like with the case going to court next week with Tennessee and Virginia against the NCAA, I don't think the rules, the NIL rules have a real good shot in that case. Whether that's the temporary restraining order issued soon, or it just ultimately loses because they say we're gonna we're gonna do the case and a few months from now or a year or so from now it just loses that's a different i feel like those

rules don't have much of a chance but this one i don't know because again we saw this happen 10 years ago and we saw it overturned nine years ago. So we'll just have to wait and see. We will wait and see. Speaking of waiting and seeing, we're waiting a long time for next football season. There's one more football game left from the 2023 football year, that's the Super Bowl in the NFL. After that, we don't get another football game until they start playing preseason NFL games or we get week zero games, but we can start thinking about the 2024 season right now. And our friends at FanDuel are helping us out. So go to FanDuel.com slash staples. You can sign up, make one $5 bet, win it, get $200 in bonus bets. That's the Super Bowl special.

They've got a lot of Super Bowl special bets. We'll talk about those in a second, but I want to talk about a couple of college win total bets. So you can do Alabama or Colorado. Those are the two that are out. And both of them are very, very interesting. Alabama, nine and a half wins. Colorado, five and a half wins. That Alabama one is the lowest Alabama win total since 2016. We're going to talk more about that in a second, because I don't know that everybody remembers exactly what the circumstances were going into the 2016 season. We've also got a lot of Super Bowl specials.

We've got Patrick Mahomes and Brock Purdy to combine for 50-plus rushing yards, plus 150. That's fairly likely there. I've given you the one where Harrison Butker has hit a 62-yard field goal, and there's a 60 plus yard field goal. Either kicker hits one. It's a plus. It wasn't plus 4,000. It may have not. Oh, down to plus 3,500. People have been listening to my Harrison Butker stat. How about this one? Plus 5,000. Either QB to catch their own pass. Lamar Jackson did that in a game just recently.

I think he did it in the AFC Championship game. Brock Purdy or Patrick Mahomes catching their own pass plus 5,000. There's a lot to work with. Fanduel.com slash Staples. $5 bet. $ 200 and guaranteed bonus bets if you win it's gonna be a fun one but let's talk about these win totals so you can go to fanduel

right now and and make a wager on these and the alabama one so the the lowest Alabama win total since 2016. And it's amazing that it's... I was actually a little surprised. I was going back because I was thinking it was going to be 2008. Because remember 2008, they're coming off the seven and six season where they lost to Louisiana Monroe.

But it was actually 2016 because remember they win the national title in 2015 and they lost a lot of really good players off that team. A lot of the defense and then obviously Jake Coker, Derrick Henry, Kenyon Drake, I believe was done after that one. So it was a, it was a, a little bit of a talent drain, although Alabama at that point always had talent. So here's how the years have gone. 2023 was 10 and a half, 2022, 10 and a half, 2021, 11 and a half. We don't count 2020 because pandemic and they didn't play 12 regular season games, uh, 2019, 11, 2018, 11, 2017, 10 and a half. So 2016, you don't know who the quarterback's going to be. And remember, Blake Barnett was the opening day starter.

So going into spring practice, you're thinking, is it Blake Barnett or Cooper Bateman? Because remember, Cooper Bateman had started one game in 2015, that Ole Miss game that they ended up losing. But Coker came in, kind of bailed him out. They realized, okay, you're our guy. But Coker was done after 2015. So they're trying to figure out what was going to happen.

Jalen Hurts obviously comes in as a freshman, takes over in the second quarter of that USC game, the season opener, and then takes it the rest of the way. That Alabama team won the SEC, went to the national title game, lost to Clemson on that last second throw to Hunter Renfro. So obviously they went way over the nine and a half there, but this is a very different situation. No Nick Saban. It's Kalen DeBoer running the show. And you saw, you lose Caden Proctor, you lose Caleb Downs, but they still have one of the more talented rosters in America. If you look elsewhere on FanDuel, their national title odds, Alabama has the fifth best national title odds right now. But it is going to be Zach in the chat.

Really? You're not going to count the 13-0 title season? How is it any different than Michigan winning after? Zach, I'm not, not counting it. I'm not doing the wind, the preseason wind total. Cause there was a pandemic and nobody knew if there was going to be a football season or how many games are going to play. That's the reason. Stop trying to get your feelings hurt, Zach.

Man, people are sensitive, but so where are we going with this one? That's the thing with me is do we think that Nick Saban, like how many wins is Nick Saban worth when the roster is barely similar? It's not identical. But it is interesting. So the over is still a little bit better odds than the or excuse me yeah the over is still a little bit better a little closer to even than the under but it's not much it's over over nine and a half is minus 106. The other one that is interesting is Colorado.

So five and a half. So basically you're deciding, can Coach Prime engineer a two-win improvement over last season in a new conference? And with the way they finished, with the way the coaching staff changed, I remember what we were talking about last season is okay. Coach prime went and got a lot of coaches with a lot of experience. He got Sean Lewis. It was the head coach at Kent state. He got

Charles Kelly. Who'd been the DC at Florida state and Alabama, or not at DC at Alabama, but he'd been an excellent recruiter and a position coach at Alabama. He'd been to DC at Florida state and Charles Kelly's at Auburn now, Sean Lewis, head coach at San Diego state now. So there are a lot of question marks for Colorado and they got a lot of players out of the transfer portal, but we don't know if they're going to be significantly better. Are they going to be significantly better on either line of scrimmage? Because that seems to be the big question for them. And I look at that season opening is North Dakota State. That's one of those that you got to count as a win.

If you're going over five and a half, I'm not ready to count that as a win. I'm just not. So that one, that one's a little tricky right there. And that one, the, the over five and a half is, is plus one 25. So that's the one they think is less likely, but it is, it's, it's interesting that they threw Dion out there. They threw coach prime teams out there, prime team out there right now, just to see, hey, can we get anybody to bite on this action? Does anybody want this action right now?

The Bama one's interesting too, because I'm curious to see what that number, does it fluctuate? Like post-spring practice, if Alabama suddenly has an influx of big 12 or big 10 or ACC players who are good from the transfer portal, they're like, Ooh, there's some spots open in Alabama. I want to go play for the tide. Like, does that change things a bit? And again, we don't have a Michigan one yet.

That's one that I think could fluctuate quite a bit because we see what they bring out of the portal. Auburn's one. Did they get a quarterback out of the portal? We're going to talk about Auburn here in a few minutes with, with Phillip Dukes, our newest hired on three, but those numbers as they come out are going to be very interesting, but nine and a half is a fascinating one because again, the lowest Alabama total since 2016, the question is, does it, does it change? Does it go back up? Does it drop again? But this is very exciting because I like thinking about these games because I'm excited about the 2024 season. It's going to be something completely different,

something we haven't seen before. New blood in the SEC, new blood in the Big 10, new blood in the Big 12, new blood in the ACC. Everybody's got different schedules everything changes 12 team playoff so time to start getting excited now one team still does not know who their head coach is going to be what we think we don't we don't think any other head coaches are leaving but not entirely sure yet but boston college still needs a head coach. Pete Thamel from ESPN reported on Monday that they have in-person interviews scheduled with several candidates.

They hope to make a hire by the end of the week. And really, if you're Boston College, there's not a huge hurry on this deal because you're the only one hiring right now. You're not in any competition with anybody else. You have a chance to go make this as right as possible. Bill O'Brien, current Ohio State offensive coordinator, obviously a candidate. Paul Chris, former Wisconsin coach. His name's out there.

Al Washington, former Boston College player, current Notre Dame defensive line coach. He's another possibility. The question is with the Bill O'Brien one, if it's him, what does Ohio State do then? And I still, I'm not ruling this out. This is, this is one of those things that you hear whispered about in the agent circles, but it's, it's become more public really since Ian Rappaport reported the other night that Chip Kelly had interviewed with the Raiders about their OC job. And remember, weird stuff happened at UCLA post-Arizona State game. We talked about this with Jesse Simonson last night.

After the Arizona State game, it sounded like there was an effort being made to oust Chip Kelly. And then following that win against USC it died down and it could be that maybe Martin Jarman their AD was told from on high like no we're keeping Chip he's fine but if you're Chip you don't treat that the same way you look at that as like uh-oh something's up and so if he's looking at NFL jobs understandable also Chip has been very adamant that does not like the situation in college sports right now. Does not like having to recruit the way you have to recruit now. He was never a huge fan of recruiting in the first place. So this is one of those deals where if O'Brien were to leave, you have Ryan Day, who used to work for Chip Kelly, who I believe played for

Chip Kelly at New Hampshire. I mean, there's a relationship there. He would need a play caller. Ohio State can pay a lot of money to a play caller. Would that be a possibility? Or would Chip say, no, I'm good at UCLA? Remember, Chip was recruiting, took a verbal commitment Sunday at UCLA. So it's not like he's just bagged it and is out of there. He may be staying. But if Bill O'Brien leaves, the most obvious choice or the most obvious phone call you'd probably make if you're Ryan Day is to Chip like, hey, would you even consider it? That would be the easiest thing because they understand one another.

They understand what each one wants offensively. But that's the thing. If Bill O'Brien does leave, Ryan Day has to revisit something that was not an easy decision to make. The giving up of the play calling the deciding how you wanted to do it and and we've talked on the show like when we talked with bobby carpenter the former ohio state great linebacker he was explaining how big of an influence kevin wilson was when he was at ohio state as a former head coach former you know great play calling offensive coordinator who could be

a sounding board for Ryan Day. And Ryan Day just hasn't had that or didn't have that last year. And so Bill O'Brien could be that person. If you were to lose Bill O'Brien, do you get somebody else who can be that person? Fascinating question, but we don't have to have an answer to it tonight because we don't know who Boston College is going to hire just quite yet, but they got to make a hire soon. So we'll see. We think it's the last head coaching opening. We think in this cycle, but who knows? At this point, nothing would surprise me. We do have a big surprise for you though. We have the newest employee of on three Phillip Dukes. Hopefully you've seen him on video before he's fat. He's just great. He's awesome. This is a guy who started out covering Auburn,

covering Auburn recruiting and has expanded throughout the South and he's going to be nationwide now at On3. He's on the On3 Recruits YouTube channel. He's going to be on this show quite a bit. He's awesome. We had an incredible chat about his journey here to On3, about Auburn, where they're at right now with the great receivers coming in, but not real sure about the quarterback situation and about the state of recruiting in general. So get settled down. Enjoy this one. Make sure you're subscribed to the on three recruits channel on YouTube so that you can watch Phillips videos, but Dukes is awesome. And I cannot wait to do more stuff with him. Here is Philip Dukes. Big week here at On3.

New show debuting. The five-star flex with Philip Dukes. Welcome aboard. I just wanted to make sure we talked and we told everybody how to find you. But I think the people are going to be fascinated by how you got here and what you're doing. So Mr. Dukes, welcome. Andy, thank you, man. Huge fan. And it's just a pleasure to be here. Well, I was watching some of your older stuff. So for those who don't know, Dukes has been covering Auburn, he's been covering recruiting, he's, you know, has been covering Auburn, been covering recruiting. He's been doing videos

and the casual flex, the old show. And I watched one episode where you were talking about what you were doing on a daily basis. And it reminded me of the Kevin Gates song. I don't get tired. The, the, the, and the chorus of that is I got six jobs. I don't get tired. Right. How many jobs did you have as you were trying to build this career i mean at minimum four uh sometimes got to five just depending on what i was doing um but the biggest thing is i would say i was doing a lot of things but only one really felt like a job and that was being an operations manager at a warehouse where i was making pretty good money but it just wasn't where my heart was.

So as far as mentoring, which I volunteer with multiple nonprofits, at one point in time, one of the coolest things I've ever done was once I started to make a buzz in Auburn, I just went out to like during during a pandemic. I went out downtown Atlanta, Piedmont Park, where a lot of the homes where the homeless population really resides and i just started giving out coats and blankets and the auburn family was just like dukes i want to help and we raised probably we raised like 13 000 in like two and a half weeks and uh that is crazy yeah yeah man like it's crazy like the power of social media and when people see you doing right right follows you so man that's basically it just working hard and doing what you know following my heart so how how did you decide to get into because you know like with me it was a much more traditional path where i went went to journalism school and worked for a newspaper and all that like how did you

decide i want to get involved and i want to cover recruiting. I want to cover Auburn. How does that while you're still doing a real full time job that takes and family and everything else? Man, so I have so I have some buddies. I went to Auburn and I was pretty plugged in with some guys who are currently involved with the program at the time. And we would just talk ball regardless. Like, man, you won't believe this kid I'm about to get or you won't believe this coaching move we're about to make. And I was hearing this stuff before it came out. So one day we were just talking.

I was like, bro, you mind if I tweet that out? And he was like, yeah, no problem. So I just made a random tweet. And I predicted somebody was going to some school or was going to Auburn. And nobody paid any attention so i go to a message board and they're like yeah lucky guess so i said okay come back again the next week do it again come back again the next week do it again i'm like whoa so what i did was i got on twitter and i said hey if i get 500 followers i'll tell you who's the next guy to

commit to auburn and some kind of way pick up streams and um so what i would do is i would make my page private and make people follow me in order to see so i would like put out it would be open i put out an eyeballs tweet and then people would be like oh here comes dukes here comes dukes with the scoop here we go and uh in probably about two to three weeks i had gained about 2 000 followers in six and maybe about six to seven weeks it was up to three and then before i knew it i had like 8 000 followers and i got a job and this i mean i got a job writing which i know not classically trained at all i did graduate from auburn but definitely not a journalism major

you could probably tell by all the typos i used to have no listen this is this is one of the piece of advice i give people now when when like i meet a high school student they say i want to do something like what you do what should i major in in college i'm like just whatever you love whatever you think is interesting do that because like with journalism they're just going to care what you do for work like so if you're doing podcasts or you're you're working for the school paper that's all they care about they don't care what classes you take so like in your case you're getting news that's the most important thing you can do right right and i think um being able to package it the right way uh creating some excitement some type of ground swell around it it makes people pay attention and i think that uh when you look at the music industry the way that it trans that that the way that it kind of translates

into today's game is that you want people who already have a following you don't want to have to build people up all the time and the guys who usually get first preference are the guys who can sell out a hundred people by themselves before they get ready to get the label behind them and sell out ten thousand and i think that's the approach that i took was i can show you what i can do with my platform now what do you think that we could do together with yours and it's worked for me so far we gotta get a street team now that i just realized we needed on three street team what do we sell it selling memberships out out of the back of the trunk. That's the way to do it.

So nostalgic. Put them on the side. Like roll out the blanket, put the CDs on. Absolutely. We'll go crazy. That's what, yeah, this show will be available on CD and DVD. Listen, I got nieces that are like 21 years old that are buying record players. So it's, it's possible. We're going to tap into that nostalgia. I do like that. So I do want to ask you because so you grew up in, in, in Atlanta, so grew up a Georgia fan and then went to Auburn.

So you suffered through all of the, underachieving georgia years never got to enjoy what just happened because you were an auburn fan by then yeah all right so my mom so my god brother is the director of player development at georgia uh jonas jennings so growing up we went to all the games and all i heard my whole life was oh you got to go to school with jonas and jonah's gonna take care of you So when it came time for me to go to school, I was like, you know what? I'm going to just go to Auburn. And they were like, why don't you just go to Georgia? And I've always been the type that was just kind of like, I'm going to do my own thing.

So that's kind of where that came about. So I got to kind of enjoy it a little bit because my family's there. But not the way that I would have wanted to. Now, the caveat to that would have wanted to now the caveat that that was i got to enjoy the 2004 season right at auburn and all where we should have won the national championship but and it's arguable to say right now i think that would have been the national champion in this uh iteration of today's championship picking. Well, that's what Mike Sly was the SEC commissioner at the time. That experience caused him to basically push to create the college football

playoff. Like, that doesn't happen. College football playoff doesn't happen when it happens. Yeah, absolutely. And then I think even piggybacking off of that, the 2010 Cam Newton year, I'm from College Park. I actually spent a year at Westlake High School. so seeing a guy come from college park to auburn sort of like me i kind of take a little bit of credit for it yeah absolutely i got to enjoy those years but

man it's tough dog like just walking through the airport with auburn stuff on in atlanta airport and you got out go dogs every every two seconds so i mean it's uh it's been tough but i'm happy for georgia and uh coach smart coach smart is super cool too so uh glad for the dogs well and that's the thing like you were you cover recruiting all over and and especially in your particular area every school in the country is coming in to recruit atlanta so when you're covering these dudes it doesn't matter where they go and i mean there's so many schools now that that want dudes from atlanta because i i my thinking is so i'm a florida guy i will always say the best high school football is in florida the best talent

is in florida but the i think the best combination of talent and coaching is in Georgia. Because Georgia actually pays coaches. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. They just had a stat that came out about how much the coaches were making in Georgia. And if you look at some of the facilities, like if you look at what Gainesville is doing, you look at what Carrollton is doing, where they've got these million-dollar indoor facilities, Buford is building a $60 million stadium. It's getting ridiculous. And I think that it's attracting the best players in the country

to want to come to Georgia. So I think as far as natural talent, I would still kind of side with Florida a little bit. But as you said, like the best overall, like the total depiction of it, definitely I would say goes to Georgia atia at this point now i will say this the little league scene in georgia really blew up about eight to ten years ago and even the founders who really turned that up kj bolden's dad kyle bolden was very instrumental in changing the way georgia looked at uh little league football this is the safety who just went to

georgia yep the safety safety in the class yeah so his dad literally if you look at all of the top players in the past two years 60 to 70 of them came through that program julian lewis uh damari austin jelani thurman aaron nolan like all of these guys at one point in time at least went over to their program to play for whether it would have been a day or two or a week they were there and uh he he literally said he borrowed a lot from florida so i think florida's influence definitely especially starting those kids young with high level coaching it really uh kind of changed the landscape and georgia just kind of took it to another to the next level yeah and and what you've seen with the University of Georgia is them tapping into that understand. Because I remember like I went on Feinbaum in 2015. This is Mark before Mark Ricks

last year. And I got asked a question about Georgia. And I said, listen, Georgia is the best job in the country. And if they don't win big, they got to start asking some hard questions about why they're not achieving the way they should be and people went nuts when I said that that was crazy I didn't make that up like you know who told me that Nick Saban told me that like that's that and and that was his thing is like if Georgia ever really gets going it's gonna be scary and of course he trained the guy who got Georgia going right I mean look at look at how history changed with Kirby Smart not getting hired at Auburn that year. I think they went with Gus Malzahn instead of Kirby. Right.

Look at the landscape of how college football changed. I'm not sure if Kirby would have been able to do what he's doing at Georgia at Auburn. And I know Auburn fans will probably be upset with me, but being able to pick out of Atlanta in your backyard and get to pick up the litter, you can still dip into Alabama, still dip into Florida, and you've got a rabid fan base here. And I think Auburn is good, but Georgia's the number one ticket in the state, which Auburn is still fighting for supremacy. So I think that that was the perfect combination for a guy like Kirby Smart, and he did what he did with it. So as someone who really understands Auburn,

what's the mentality now that Nick Saban is not at Alabama anymore? How much does that change? Because I think Kalen DeBoer is a great hire, but he's not Nick Saban. Nobody's Nick Saban. So what changes mentality-wise for Auburn with no Nick Saban in Tuscaloosa? I think it feels like now is the time. It feels like you've got recruiting where you want it. Hugh Freeze has done a great job of changing the landscape.

When you look at what's been going on previously with the previous regime with Brian Harsin, where it seemed like recruiting wasn't the focus and the focus was more X's and O's. You can't – I mean, we talk about the O's saying X's and O's – I mean, excuse me, Jimmy's and Joe's over X's and O's. You can't win. I mean, we talk about the O's saying X's and O's. I mean, excuse me, Jimmy's and Joe's over X's and O's. And I think now you're getting that combination of Jimmy's and Joe's and X's and O's. So now it seems like the time you've got a guy from the Pacific Northwest who may not be as familiar with the landscape in the Southeast

where Auburn is making his bones in recruiting. So it just feels like you've got a new jumbleotron going to the other side of the end zone. Money is pouring in. People are talking about how much money Auburn has in NIL. It feels like the perfect storm. You're bringing back Charles Kelly, who's a world-renowned recruiter. It just seems like the time is now. I think there's going to be a little bit of pressure on Coach Freeze this year

just because of Nick Saban leaving. But I think you have to temper those expectations and still realize it's year two. But, yeah, when you talk to Auburn fans and around Alabama, it's really – it's palpable to say that people are just like, hey, it's time for Auburn. We were playing Cam Coleman video last week on the show, and I hadn't watched his highlight tape in a while.

And I was just like, good God. Auburn hadn't had anybody like this in 15 years, or maybe longer. Having a dynamic receiver, especially like you go through Hugh Freeze's past. This is a guy who had DK Metcalf, AJ Brown, Evan Ingram at Ole Miss at the same time. I don't know if a lot of people remember Antonio Gandy-Golden at Liberty, but that dude was awesome. To have somebody like that in this offense feels like it could be

a new beginning here. Yeah, absolutely. I think the flip side of that is what people don't realize is Q Freeze is always going to want to run the ball first. And if you look at the consistency in those receivers that you named, you look at Gandy Golden, who was about 6'3", 6'4". You look at A.J. Brown, who's built like Batman. You look at D.K. Metcalf.

If Brown is Batman and he's Superman, what can they do on the perimeter? When you look at the outside zone scheme blocking, what do they do with a 6'1", 180-pound cornerback? Yeah, they face plant them. And I think that's one of the reasons why you see Hugh Freeze have a consistent presence on his perimeter receivers, and you're going to have guys in the slot that can move around,

and that's exactly what he built in that first receiving class. Well, that's a good point because who has the abundance of six, two long corners, Georgia and Alabama. That's what Kirby recruits. That's what Nick liked to recruit. LSU is going to have those for whatever reason, LSU doesn't have it right now, but LSU is going to have those for whatever reason lsu doesn't have it right now but lsu's gonna have those guys because they usually do like that's how you you handle that because but the corners just got bigger and more physical right absolutely and and when you're sending out the 510 to 511 guys and i'm a shorter guy myself and so no disrespect to the guys who may be a little bit vertically challenged but it's just harder when you can't get your arms out. These guys, if you look at the press,

if you look at the way, even when they play press bail on a perimeter, they're still hitting you in the face and then running. You can long arm a guy at the point of attack and still be able to make plays in the backfield on a perimeter, and that's hard to deal with, but when you bring in these larger,

these bigger-bodied receivers, you can't do that. And you have to kind of accommodate for it by bailing earlier. And so by being able to take pressure off the line of scrimmage on the perimeter, by having bigger body receivers, I think is something that Hugh Freeze is doing on purpose. And I think he's doing a great job of it. And shout out to Marcus Davis, the wide receivers coach at auburn uh up and coming star and i think he's going to do really well in that position well okay we've talked about who catches the ball but now we talk about who gets them the ball because yes see that look on your face okay it was very interesting to me the rhetoric going into the bowl game does it sound like very much a

vote of confidence for Peyton Thorne? Like, okay, we like the way things are going. We kind of figured some things out offensively toward the end of the season. And after the bowl game, it was like, oh, God, no, no, no, no. We're going to have to do something else. Yeah. So going into – I was privy to some conversations that were going on with some of the receivers that they were recruiting out

of the transfer portal. And what I was hearing was they were showing how Peyton Thorne improved as the season went on, how his reads got better, and how he wasn't getting the most help from his receivers when it comes to opportunities that they were missing by dropping balls and not running Chris Rouse. So when I heard that, I said, okay said okay i can kind of when i went back and looked at the tape i did see that you know when peyton thorne was was on schedule and playing with pace he was a much different quarterback than when he was looking over his shoulder and kind of jumping the gun because he was afraid of the uh afraid of the pass rush that uh Music City Bowl, you would hope, was more so of an aberration and not pretty much the norm.

But for an Auburn fan, you can understand when you see multiple games under 100 yards passing, how that looked more consistent than the positive games. So I do feel like Auburn is not going to overspend for a quarterback when they have somebody that they feel can take that next step in the second year with a spring under his belt. But I also feel like after spring, if there's a quarterback that they feel can run and pass and has the capability to lead a locker room and deal with the pressure of coming into a job with the presumed starter, then I think you could see Auburn make a move.

Well, and that was kind of Peyton Thorne's situation last year. Now, he wasn't guaranteed the job at Michigan State, so he goes in the portal and winds up at Auburn. That could definitely happen again where you have some situations around the country where somebody's going to come out of spring, go, I'm not sure if I have this job or not, but I think I might be better than what they got. This spring's going to be wild. It really is. I think that when you look at the sec the sec rule i think that's one thing that's handicapping the uh the conference as a whole uh because there are going to be some

guys at sec schools that probably would be a great fit at auburn in a quarterback role to come in and compete and look for more of a job than you would be able to get at their current institution but it just won't be able to happen so uh auburn would only be able to get at their current institution, but it just won't be able to happen. So Auburn would only be able to look at other power five. Big 10, Big 12, ACC, yeah. I can't see a group of five guy that has that type of talent leaving after spring because he's probably already the guy. Right, exactly. You had the UNLV quarterback who committed to Georgia and then signed with USC ultimately.

But yeah, those guys typically get recruited out in the winter period. Well, it's funny I say typically. This has existed for like two years. Like we don't know what's going to happen. Learn it as we go. Exactly. I tell you, as somebody who talks to recruits, regularly high school recruits, how do they, has the way the portal works and the way NIL works, has it changed the way they choose a school at the outset? Do they look at it like,

well, if this doesn't work, I can just move on? Yeah, absolutely. That's definitely something that the recruits are talking about. There are guys who used to be fringe SEC guys or power five guys, more particularly that have to go to group of five schools. And in the back of their mind, they're thinking, well, I'll just go here and ball out. Now I'll go to the SEC next year. That is 1000%. And I've even heard coaches say, Hmm, I can't take this kid now I'll get them out of the portal. So, so when you, that, that,

that ideology is going on with the coaches and the recruits. But in particular, the recruits are feeling like it's a one-year contract. We'll see how I do. Which is so funny because that's what it used to be. It used to be a one-year renewable scholarship. Now it was real one-sided because if the school decided to dump you, you still had to sit out a year. But now it's kind of back to that.

But you're exactly right. And you can do the bet on yourself thing. I tell people there might never be a better time to walk on at a power conference school. Because if you get in one where they lose a bunch to the portal and they can't bring in a bunch you may wind up with a scholarship and some playing time yeah and there are some schools um that use their preferred walk on status they that supplement their preferred walk-ons with nil money from the collective yeah so there are going to be guys who what they feel like you know what we don't have a scholarship for you but you make us better as a whole so yeah i would absolutely take a pwo offer with some scholarship money uh excuse me with some

NIL money, make sure that my school is taken care of and take a shot at it. Yeah, it's it's amazing. And it's funny how like, the recruits are so fast to adjust to this. There's so much faster than the adults trying to figure out how to do everything. But it's these these young guys are they smarter or is it just because everything's changing so fast they just have to learn it fast i mean if you think about it that's part of it but also i just think that the that the the youth today

is smarter like if if you look at a baby they're working an ipad by the time they're two years old with no help uh right now uh that's just that's just the way the world is going. Sometimes it still takes me a long time to log into my computer. Exactly. I can't remember all your passwords. Right. Exactly. So when you just look at the speed in which the world is turning,

it kind of reflects in the college football world as well. Well, it's been fun watching the recruits outsmart everybody. So I'm enjoying that right yeah i mean when you hear um how some of these recruiting stories and they're long winding and the coaches are frustrated you're going to see more and more coaches go to the nfl i hear it all the time yeah and i'm tired of this i can't deal with this dog too much no i'm going to the league i'd rather go to the league and uh and it's because you're once you recruit a kid you don't recruit you do not stop recruiting a player until they

graduate or until they go to the league like if they're if they sign with your school you have to recruit them every year because they have the option of the portal and whether you like it or not they have relationships that they built and so so the number two team, especially for a real ball player, is just sitting there licking their chops for you to mess up. Because as soon as you do, you know, throw your name in the portal, you're going to just see a huge wave, especially for somebody who has documented production. So, yeah, it's a tough time to be a coach,

but I do enjoy seeing how the recruits that educate themselves in the right way get the right people around them uh have been able to capitalize on the new situation but conversely is really really tough for those who don't who haven't taken the time to educate themselves on the rule and sometimes overplay their hand because if you look at i'm not sure of the exact stats but there are a lot more people in the portal uh without homes than with homes you better know you can play before you give up a good situation like and that's that's a hard thing that's a hard you it's hard to look in the mirror and realize this is probably the best i can get right now and nobody wants to think that i mean when when when when you've been told you're you're michael

jackson your whole life like oh you're the king of football you're the best ever you can moonwalk down the sideline when you're told that from the time you're five years old then you you get recruited and then you have to de-recruit yourself in order you find out you're actually rockwell and you need michael to sing the hook because that's that's the only way you're going to get a hit and thank you very gordy i love the rock well man but absolutely dog like that's exactly how it goes dukes it's been a pleasure all this stuff's going to change by the way we're going to have to talk to you about that too as it's changing but uh we will be checking in regularly please please keep me in mind for the five star flex i was I was a zero-star walk-on. That's all right. I would be honored

to be on. Where can everybody find you? First and foremost, find me on the On3Recruits YouTube channel. I'll have at least two pieces of content a week, probably a lot more, but original interviews, I'll be talking to players and coaches. Andy Staples

will definitely be a part of it where we'll talk recruiting. On social media, find me at DukesTheScoop. You see it in the tagline. Thanks for having me. I'm super happy and super stoked to be a part of On3. We're going to be seeing a lot of each other. Appreciate it, Dukes. All right. For sure, man.

I cannot wait to see what Phil Dukes does at this company because, man, he's already a star, but he's going to be a bigger star. And I'm going to really, really enjoy talking football with him over the next few years. And I'm so glad that we went out and got him. It's going to be great. So, little news. Little news. Our friend Ross Dellinger at Yahoo reports that the commissioners have finished their CFP meeting and not anything earth shattering. They've not come up with any sort of grand sweeping anything and may not for a little while

for beyond the current contract, which ends after the 2025 season. But they did figure out what they're going to do about SMU. Remember SMU is joining the ACC, but not taking any conference revenue distribution. They're like, nope, we just want to, we just want to be there. We'll bring our own money. We're SMU. Don't worry. We have plenty and we just want to be there and so the question was would they get a full share as another ACC member would or would they get a reduced amount it sounds like according to Ross they're going to get a reduced amount and again I think they're okay with that that's they just want to be in the club they just wanted wanted to get in the door, and they got in the door.

One man who is kicking the door down, though, our friend Brandon Dorlis, former Oregon Duck. You saw him on the show this season. We talked about his golf. Remember, Brandon's dad is a golf pro in South Florida, so we talked about Brandon's golf. Killer short game. He's a 300-pound dude, but you're not worried about his long drive. He's going to kill you around the

greens. So ask him how it's going with that. He's training in Tampa. He's playing a fair amount of golf, but he's also playing some very good football. He was at the senior bowl last week. We talked to him about what he can be going forward and about his career at Oregon. Here's Brandon Dorless. Joined now by Brandon Dorless, Oregon defensive end. Does it feel like college lasted forever? I mean, I feel like I'm still in college right now. I'm one of the college best players, players I've seen a lot in college.

Taking it all in, I feel like players I've seen a lot in college. So, you know, taking it all in, I feel like this is my last college week of football. How much fun is this, getting to play against some of the best players in the country? It's something I've been looking for ever since I got into college. You always see the senior bowl, the best of the best. You walk around and see the 75th anniversary dudes like Aaron Donald, the best of the best, Clay Matthews.

So to be able to be here in the same shoes that they was in, know it's a blessing for sure i was i was here when aaron donald was here and he tore it up i think he only did one day and and the but it's only it's the only thing anybody talked about the rest of the week because you know like he was awesome like you're talking about a guy who had so when he was a senior at pip they played georgia tech option team he had six and a half tackles for loss against an option team. Like, you don't do that. And so he gets here and everybody's like, you're six feet tall, you know. Okay, you got a good number. First day, they're like, nope, nope, first round pick.

No question. Oh, yeah. But that's what you can do with, you know, some of the competition you're facing. It's got to be a rush. No, yeah, it brings the best out of you man you know you see guys that they all talk about he's first round projected so you know it's like you want to go against that dude so you can show them that okay these guys are going against he's also first round yep yeah so i love it man so it's i imagine it's a little weird though playing with some guys that you

played against i saw so i saw this at at practice you probably didn't see this because you were you were off in another part of the field Pennix makes a great throw and Jackson your center Jackson Powers Johnson from Oregon does the bow and arrow celebration Are you allowed to do that? I mean, I still kind of feel a way how Washington beat us. Me personally, I'm not doing the bow and arrow, but nah, this is Michael Penance. And we knew he was a great quarterback. And just seeing up close and personal, I was like, this is serious. So now you're seeing those same guys, like Roger Rosengarten,

their tackles here. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. He's like Oregon State. Yeah. This is amazing going against that team again. Is it weird to think that y'all kind of closed out the Pac-12? I mean, the Oregon team next year is in the Big Ten. Yeah.

So now it feels weird because now everybody's like, they keep asking me, like, how do you feel about the Pac-12 being gone? I'm like, it's all right. I feel like it's time for Oregon to be showing on these big stages, you know, against teams like Ohio State, Michigan, you know, Michigan State. So do you wish you could play one season in the Big Ten just to see what it's like? Nah, because that traveling is terrible for sure. I want to play in Rutgers one day and go out and fall back to Eugene.

You can play in the NFL. You can fly across the country too. Yeah. But I feel like it's different because, you know, college, you know, the schedule is different. Oh, yeah. But it is – it's going to be so weird when Ohio State shows up at Autzen. Yeah, yeah.

It's going to be – I'm still trying to get used to seeing, like, the Big Ten logo on the jerseys for Oregon. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it's weird. So your time at Oregon – and you came back to be here, to have a chance to do this. And how fulfilling was that time? I mean, you're a guy from Fort Lauderdale. You went all the way across the country to go play college football.

How did it work out for you? I mean, I guess I did it right. Since I'm sitting here. But just the coaches trusting me. Today was weird i saw coach crystal ball again oh yeah so you know just see him again you know just brings back you know good memory they had a great talk you know he said he's proud of me i said coach appreciate you for this man you know you got me all the way out for a lot of them yeah give me this opportunity what was

that like when he's recruiting you because obviously he's a miami guy so he he knows how to talk to the south florida guys but I mean it's a long way that's that's a you're getting on that flight mom and dad are five hours by plane away what is that like uh you know you just you know you get homesick sometimes yeah but you know he's done a great job for me to make you feel like I was home at Oregon yeah you know I never felt like I was so too far away from home I always kept in communication my parents they did it always they always came back to see some games, you know, so it was tough, but I'm happy that I chose that spot.

So you're training in Tampa now. Yeah. Who else are you training with? There's a couple dudes here, you know, Gabe Hall, you know, Rowan Wilson from Michigan. Got dudes from Penn State. So, you know, it's different. Got Dylan Johnson out of Washington down there.

So I see a couple dudes I already know. Does Dylan talk trash? Oh, man, I told him, man, told him we're not talking about those games so what is it like when when you are training for for the job and we always talk about this being like a three-month job interview but is it does it feel like there's that much pressure on you or does it does it feel like okay i've i've put this much on tape now i just gotta to answer some questions and work out. Honestly, that's how I feel. I feel like my tape speaks for itself.

At this point, I guess teams are just trying to get to know you. They want to know the knowledge that you know. See how smart of a player you are. They want to make sure. If they invest a lot of money in you, they want to make sure that it's the right investment. So when you talk to these guys, what do you tell them they're

getting if they take brandon orless position facility a dude that does everything for them you know i'm not dudes gonna be selfish i'll be selfless and i'll do everything you ask me to if i gotta play d and i'll play d and d tackle i'll play d tackle so i'll just be a person that do anything you ask me to. All right, you heard that. Draft Brandon Dorless. Yes, sir. That's Brandon Dorless. And yeah, he did see Jackson Powers Johnson do the little archer celebration with Michael Penix Jr. at practice last week. And I don't think those rivalries do stick a little more with some people. And Brandon, you could tell it's still hurting,

the two losses to Washington this year. But, man, it will be exciting to see Oregon in the Big Ten, Washington in the Big Ten. When we talk about this stuff, and talking about Alabama andado earlier in the show like i cannot wait to see what this all looks like and obviously there's a lot of what this all looks like but the stuff we talked about at the very beginning of the show also but again i'm not a lawyer wednesday michael mccann who is a, is going to join us and talk about that.

But who knows? Tuesday might bring even more. That's why we're giving Michael a little cushion just to make sure nothing else wild happens before we talk to him. It's just never stopping. There is no offseason. The field, the court, the courtroom, you name it. We'll talk to you tomorrow.