Andy & Ari On3 - Drafting the TOP head coaches in ALL of College Football: Curt Cignetti, Kirby Smart, or Ryan Day?

Episode Date: June 29, 2026

It’s vacation week for Andy & Ari, but before they head off for the week, it’s time to draft the top current college football head coaches. As Curt Cignetti led Indiana to the national championship in his 2nd season as the Hoosiers’ head coach, has he already solidified himself as the no-doubt first pick in the draft? What about Kirby Smart or Ryan Day? Does Dabo Swinney even get drafted? Watch here as Andy & Ari draft their top quarterbacks before taking off for vacation.   (0:00) On Today’s Episode (0:30) Presenting Sponsor (2:33) Intro: Previewing Draft of Coaches (4:33) Round 1: Andy’s first pick (11:48) Round 2 (18:49) Round 3 (24:03) Round 4 (27:01) ZenAI (28:11) Ari’s Round 4 Pick (31:22) Round 5 (36:04) Round 6 (40:43) Round 7 (45:13) Round 8 (48:07) Round 9 (51:44) Round 10 (57:51) Full list: Thanks for watching!     Thanks for watching! See you next week!   Send your questions to: [e-mail] [e-mail]   Check Zen AI out: http://bit.ly/zenAI_bpp_itf   Our show is also presented by BetMGM!   If you haven’t signed up for BetMGM yet, use bonus code CFB and you will get up to a $1500 First Bet Offer on your first wager with BetMGM! Here’s how it works:   1. Download the BetMGM app and sign-up using bonus code CFB. 2. Deposit at least $10 and place your first wager on any game. 3. You will receive up to $1500 in bonus bets if your bet loses! Just make sure you use bonus code CFB when you sign up!   Make this college football season one for the history books. Make it legendary.   See BetMGM.com for Terms. 21+ only. This promotional offer is not available in DC, Mississippi, New York, Nevada, Ontario, or Puerto Rico. Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or 1-800-MY-RESET (Available in the US) . 877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), 1-800-327-5050 (MA), 1-800-BETS-OFF (IA), 1-800-981-0023 (PR). First Bet Offer for new customers only (if applicable). Subject to eligibility requirements. Rewards are non-withdrawable bonus bets that expire in 7 days. In partnership with Kansas Crossing Casino and Hotel   Check out Zen AI here: http://bit.ly/zenAI_bpp_itf   Join On3 today! https://www.on3.com/join   Watch our show on YouTube! https://youtu.be/jIAGeJw8_oc   Hosts: Andy Staples, Ari Wasserman Producer: River Bailey   Interested in partnering with the show? Email [e-mail] Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

On today's episode of Andy and Ari on 3 presented by BetMGM, we're drafting coaches. A couple of weeks ago, everybody got on 3 ranked the coaches in each conference. We didn't put them all together. And Ari and I decided instead of ranking them and having very similar lists that would probably both start with Kurt Zignetti, we're going to fight it out in a draft. Who are the best coaches in America? We'll find out right now. On today's Andy and Orion 3, presented by Bet MGM.

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Rewards are non-withdrawable bonus bets that expire in seven days in partnership with Kansas Crossing Casino and Hotel. Welcome to Andy Arion 3 presented by BetMGM. We're having a little fun. It's the middle of summer. It's time to do another draft. We didn't do these every Friday, but we're going to live it up your Monday. Because Ari, like, three weeks ago...

I love drafting with you. I love it. Drafing, too. While we're on vacation, everybody on three, including us, did rankings of coaches by conference, which is always fun when you have to rank someone number 17 of 17, because that makes everyone happy. But we didn't put them all together to see who's the best of the best. start you know and if we both did lists i think i've like come to understand that while we do

disagree about things sometimes very passionately that we've come to view the sport very similarly over the years so why why make two lists that'll look this i mean like if one person has coach x at five and the other one has them at seven like there's no difference between those two things so let's fight let's argue let's do let's see what we can do let's try to get a winner here And the cool thing about this too is that there's no defined, it's not just about titles or wins or whatever. No, it's like you can pick based on feelings if you like. And I like feelings. Yeah.

So we'll do that. But I'm excited. And the cool thing about doing it on three, you know, all the national writers have one conference each is that you also get varied opinions and varied viewpoints, which I think is actually kind of cool and makes for fun offseason conversations. but a little competition never killed anyone. There's also one coach who definitely fits in the top coaches in America, but his team's not in conference. So where's Marcus Freeman going to land here? Yeah.

Okay. Enough dilly dallying. Let's figure out who gets number one and who gets our guy. You know what, Andy, since your name comes first on the show, and you've had to deal with a lot of the crap that I've thrown at, you the last few weeks with scheduling issues and things. I'll give you the honors of going first. All right.

Listen, I'm not, I'm not turning down a chance. Yeah. To take the man who, if he had been hired as a power conference head coach when he was 45 or 50 even, we might consider the greatest coach of all time. Like,

can you imagine if the man I'm about to take Kurt Signetti, Indiana coach Kurt Signetti, number one pick. Imagine if when he left Alabama, he had become a power conference head coach within the next few years. Like, would Kurt Signetti versus Nick Sabin at the height of his power has been the greatest rivalry in college football ever? Yeah. So I have a lot of thoughts about this. Okay. And I don't want the show to be three hours long, but I think that there's some things that we should dive into and Signetti is an interesting. person because I have one thing to say. Okay. Because there might be two or three people left who are going, I can't believe you

pick Signetti over Ryan Day and Kirby Smart and Marcus Freeman, blah, blah, blah. I'm going to say this once. This is all you need to hear. He won the national title at Indiana. There's no other argument after that. Andy, I had the pleasure of getting a. signed the Big Ten in our five-week-long journey through listicles. And I put Kurt Signetti number one.

And granted, I understand that I have a lot of Ohio State followers given where I covered in the past. There was a lot of outrage, like more than I anticipated in terms of who should have been number one. And I don't know, like, if there are SEC fans out here that have a few coaches that are their eyes right now. Like how many people do you think are pushing back at this? Because if I had the number one pick just for context purposes, I would have taken him to. So, what do you think? Like, do you think college football fans in general are up to speed with

this thought process? Or do you think you're going to get flack when the graphic comes out? I think the smart ones are. I think the stupid ones aren't. He won the national title at Indiana. And here's the other thing. Don't need to say anything else. I'm the king of analogies. And I love analogies and sometimes they make sense. Sometimes they don't. I don't know. Icebergs float in the ocean and you see the tip of the iceberg. But sometimes the iceberg beneath it is massive. And I'm wondering if Kurt Signetti's head is the tip of the iceberg and we're going to

come to find out in 15 years of more context that what he did becomes or is viewed less remarkable later on than it is right now. like are we at the beginning of a trend where if you hit the the calculations right you get the three or four good players that you need not saying that it's not great don't get me wrong but if other teams because as of right now it's unprecedented what happened here but what if it becomes precedented at one point okay I'm going to say one more time I'm just pushing back to the title at Indiana so okay if If somebody was either Purdue, then sure. I mean, but do you think it's possible that like in eight years, the national champion is like, I mean, Vanderbilt was really good. Like, it's not like he's the only one that's got, like he's gotten over the top. I think the thing that's most remarkable about this.

Vanderbilt was 10 and 3. He went 15 and 0. Andy, the thing that you're leaving off of your sentence, which really just slated to 16 and 0, sorry. It's just that he won the national championship at Indiana. He won it in year two. It made the playoff in year one. So, like, I'm with you.

I'm with you. I'm just trying to, like, contextualize this in a way that it's just like, yes, this is the most unbelievable story in the history of sports, but will it become less unbelievable if other people do what he did? Because the thing I don't know is, is, would Kurt Signetti be Kurt Signetti if he had, if he landed Indiana in 2016 and had to recruit high school classes? Like, that's like, so it's like, it's a little bit different. the way you build is different now.

And I'm, as we draft these, I'm wondering how you're going to weigh coaches who have done both. If somebody wins a national title at Purdue and somebody wins a national title at Mississippi State and somebody wins a national title, like, if that happens in the next 15 years, then I will take all of this back. We will do a show.

I'll come out of retirement. Well, that's not a show either. And I'll say, I'm sorry, I was wrong. These rankings change every year. So for the time being, this is all the information that we have, and this is the correct, this is the correct pick.

Yeah, he won the national title at Indiana. Okay, let me go now. Andy, the king of overthinking is not going to overthink this one. Give me Kirby Smart. I'll take, good choice. No crazy, no crazy curveballs,

no weird thought processes here. Although I did mention last week on an episode, Andy, that I was a little bit wary of where Georgia was headed, we are talking about the two-time defending SEC champion. We're talking about a coach who, in the old era, won two national championships and looked like he was at one point going to be the era parent to Nick Saban and the guy who was, and I firmly believe that if the sport didn't change,

Kirby Smart would have another national title to his name by now. But he's also done a pretty good job, if not a great job, of keeping Georgia afloat while they're dealing with the changes. I think there are other coaches at other places who accomplish similar feats during the old era of college football who have failed to keep up. I think Kirby Smart has done a good job modernizing his program and keeping Georgia at the top. And I know that I got a lot of flack two weeks ago from my Texas viewpoints, but if I'm taking a coach to lead my program right now, I cannot believe it's Kirby Smart's

the number two overall pick because six months ago, it's number one without even a second thought. I am more than comfortable handing over the keys to any program in the country to Kirby Smart right now. And that's the thing. I don't think Kirby Smart is on a down swing. I don't think he's lost his fastball. I think the game has changed. There are lots of other teams that can now put together rosters that look like the roster Kirby Smart has. They are still there.

They are still winning at a very consistent clip. They're still producing draft picks at a very consistent clip. So I suspect they will be back in the national title game or hunt. And if it goes five years and they don't want, win a playoff game or they don't win another national championship we can revisit it but i think it's too close you can't the cc is still a very deep league uh the cc is still a very good league and they've won it two years in a row and a coach that is going to be drafted pretty high on this list uh at texas has yet to beat him so um i'm comfortable with this pick and i think that most people will see that this

is the right move this next pick's going to be hard for me because i there's two guys i feel like really deserve this spot and There's different reasons. I feel like one's degree of difficulty is a slight bit higher, but the other ones accomplish more. I know who the two are. And I gave you the number one overall pick because I knew you were going to have to make this choice. Yeah, I'm going to pick Ryan Day.

Okay. I'm going to pick Ryan Day. It was very hard not to pick Marcus Freeman because I think his degree of difficulty is probably tougher than Ryan Day. But what Ryan Day has done is really interesting to me because we keep saying you can't make super teams in this era. You can't do it. You can't do it. Can't do it. Their talent level is still above pretty much everybody else. Ohio State still collects talent better than everybody else. And maybe that tails off as we go. But Ryan Day seems really good at managing this. And in the transfer portal era, like when he goes and gets somebody out of the portal, they make an impact.

I think Ryan Day is very complicated. And I think this is a good pick. but the thing that I don't know about him is twofold. One, how do you feel about the fact that they lose with all the players they've had? They've lost games with really good deep teams, two teams that they should not have lost to the last few years, I think. One Michigan game is the only one. And that might have been one of the worst losses in my career for it. It is one of the worst losses in Ohio State history.

I agree. They also won the national title that year. So I don't, I'm not going to kill Ryan Day because here's the thing. You can have a really good team, but sometimes you will lose to other really good teams. That one Michigan game is the one instance where he's lost to a team that he shouldn't have lost to. His friend's sister, Urban Meyer, did that more often than he does. Two other, because I just like talking this through. And I think I might have taken day too, just, you know, for that I struggle with is one,

if you were to hire him at a place that wasn't as built, what would it look like? I still think he'd be really good. Because if he'd really been born on third base, like somebody said one time, they wouldn't still be doing this. They would have never won the national title when they did. They would have fallen off.

Yeah. They're still great every single year. They're still the best team in terms of talent pretty much every single year. He hasn't fallen off. And the thing is, he's been given every excuse to fall off, every reason to fall off. Because like we just said with Kirby Smart, everybody, not everybody, more people can make a team like you can now. But more people don't make teams like Ryan Day does. I just don't think it's possible to be Ohio State's coach and not be in the top five because if you're not, you're fired.

I agree with that. So like that, that, you know, there are a lot of inherent advantages to being Ohio State's coach. And I don't think that anybody could say that Ryan Day hasn't done the best job of maximizing those things. I do think. And I think this is also true for Urban Meyer that Ohio State, their ingredients should have equated to more wins in my opinion. but I also think that I'm probably pretty hard on them because I've been there and I've lived there for a while. So, but I think that going with accomplishments in a draft like this

is probably more important than theory. Well, you're going to go with theory next time, and I'm going to agree with most of your theories. I'm going to tell you that right now. So the layup here is Marcus Freeman, right? So those are the two that you were battling between. With all of the things that I just got done saying about Ohio State and all the advantages that there is to being Ohio State's coach.

Marcus Freeman had his Notre Dame team, a team that had a two-decade-plus postseason bowl game drought against good teams, on the same field as Ohio State in the fourth quarter of the national championship game two years ago. And I understand that Notre Dame did not make the playoff last year. I also understand the fact that like Ryan Day, Marcus Freeman has also had some pretty head-scratching losses. but given what Notre Dame was, and I think you're going to see this as a theme throughout my draft,

I have a great appreciation for the coach that evolves the program. What Notre Dame is today is not what they were when Brian Kelly was still there. And I know that they haven't broken through and they haven't won the national championship yet. But if you change the place, it's not too long ago where everybody was like, I don't blame Brian Kelly for leaving Notre Dame. he got them to the top. He got them to the best that Notre Dame can be in the era.

Yeah, we thought he'd got him to the ceiling and Marcus Freeman prove that wrong. He's burst through the ceiling that Brian Kelly and he still hasn't crashed through the ceiling that he created, which is national title. And I think that there are inherent challenges and still a lot of advantages, you know, being at a place that is historically one of the most recognizable brands in all of sports and, you know, Notre Dame is a special place. But I also think that the private school thing and, you know, the lifestyle. that you have to live while being there is a little bit different than most, you know, Power 5 schools, Power 4 schools.

He has turned everything that could have been a negative into a positive. He is very young in his career. I think we forget, too, that he hasn't been a head coach for very long. And I think that he has exceeded all expectations tenfold to the point where he could have been an NFL head coach right now. I would take Mark, and the thing that I think I would 100% say is I would take Marcus Freeman to build anywhere. Yes, I think that's important thing.

What he does would work anywhere. His degree of difficulty at Notre Dame is probably higher than, say, Ohio State, Georgia, Alabama, Penn State, schools like that. So I'm with you on that. That's why the decision was so hard for me, Day or Freeman, because I think if you put Freeman at Ohio State, he's kicking ass. Yeah, and if there ever became a time, and I don't know, he would be the ideal candidate for Ohio State. state's job depending on it. And the other thing, too, is both of these guys. And I think that Ryan Day may be less so even because Marcus Freeman was in the

throes of actually negotiating and hearing what NFL teams had to say last year. There have been thoughts that Ryan Day could potentially test NFL waters at some point in the future, too. So, you know, given with the show that we had last week, Andy, about, you know, what Dusty May did and stuff, maybe we'll come to fruition a little bit faster than it would have maybe otherwise. But I do think that both of these coaches, depending on your viewpoint, belong in the top four and I'm happy we both got one.

So I have a feeling this next round will be an either war for both of us too. Like if I take this one guy, you're going to take this other guy and vice versa. They're the same except one's younger. Am I right? I think we agree. I think we agree. I'm going to go with Steve Sarkesian here. I'm going to go with Steve Sarkesian because I watched so much.

failure at Texas for the 10 years before he got there, which there should be no excuse for, but it seemed unsolvable at the time. Like, why can't these people make draft picks? Why are they taking five-star talent and churning out eight and four seasons? What is going on here? He makes draft picks now. They make the playoff. They finish near the top of, at or near the top of their conference now. Like, he's doing all. the things you're supposed to do. Texas has great players every year. They're getting players drafted really high every year. Everything you're supposed to do. Now he just needs to finish the drill and win a national title. But, you know, I think, and Steve Sarkisian is an interesting story.

Because like another guy, one of his former co-workers that will probably wind up on this list somewhere, he's been through it. He got fired at USC for a reason. He had to deal with that. he had to go through the Nick Saban witness protection program. He came out a better coach on the other side. And I remember the reaction to what it was when he got hired. Like how did people react to that? Remember? Guys never won 10 games.

He sucks. He had a drinking problem. Like all the things that people said about him, I think that he has come through the other side, a better man, a better coach, and certainly a better steward for a program. Like Texas was a dysfunctional, I mean, like our genesis of our show was arguing about Texas and why it stinks and why I couldn't get rid of it.

Like that's not. And they have all the resources. And that's what everybody always says. They have all this stuff. Okay, they do. But for whatever reason, people couldn't unlock it. Mack Brown, who actually did unlock it, couldn't figure out how to, you know, the door shut and he couldn't figure out how to get back in. And then Charlie Strong couldn't do it.

Tom Herman couldn't do it. Sarks figured it out and that is not easy because if it was easy one of those other guys would have done it yeah Andy I'm actually having a crisis for my next

pick uh oh Ives and I know that you will take the other one can I ask for help or is that faux paula in draft I'm happy to help make my draft better what I think everybody think that I'm going to take

Dan Lannie and I'm not. That's what I thought you were going to do. What about the person who left Oregon? That's a good choice. I'm having a hard time. Well, one made the national title game and the other one hasn't yet. I'm going to take Mario Cristobal here.

Okay. Dan Lanning was my initial gut reaction. But then you started talking about having stuff. And, you know, Mario had all that stuff too. And I think you can make the case that Oregon is better than when Mario. was there now, which is what makes this complicated because Dan Lannning is the coach that took over. But would Mario have evolved at Oregon the way he evolved at Miami? Probably. You'd probably see them in a similar spot. Both of these places are rich. And both of these places have done a very good

job of recruiting high schoolers and doing the portal very well. I got to say, as much as I think Oregon has a chance to break through maybe as soon as this year, why would I take the potential over the over the outcomes already. Like Miami was 40 yards away from winning a national championship last year. And you want to talk about a dead program? Like when Mario got there, like everyone was like, if he can't do it, no one can. Stick a fork in Miami. It was two long decades of sucking.

And he has made that program back into a national power in a relatively short amount of time. And I don't know if this is going to be controversial. and I think I would hire Dan Lannning for any job in America. I'm obsessed with him. You know this about me. But buddy, deep playoff runs and slaying narratives is what this is all about. Dan Lannning still has to slay those narratives and has to get, and I'm sure he will. But as we're drafting today on June, whatever day it is, like, I'm taking the guy that was in the national title game last year in the ACC.

They have less money from their league. they have harder challenges when it comes to keeping players at home and changing the narrative of what they were. I think they've done all that. I think they're also going to be awesome in 2026. Give me Mario Cristobal. I'm not going to argue with that. I'm happy to get Dan Lanning.

So I will take Dan Lanning, Oregon coach. I agree with you. But I also think Dan Lanning has a really high ceiling because Miami had, or excuse me, he takes over for Cristobal when Chris Ball leaves from Miami. You saw in game one when they had to play Georgia, how far he really had to go when he took over that team. Now, you can probably argue that they still had that far to go

after the semi-final game against Indiana last year. But I see what they've done in terms of building the roster, in terms of producing NFL players, in terms of success over seasons. They don't lose games. They're not supposed to lose. When they lose, they lose this,

does somebody really good. So he's going to break through. He will break through. They've lost the eventual national champ each of the past two seasons. The breakthrough is coming, maybe as soon as this year. If you look at Oregon's roster,

they're stacked. I get the Texas is too, and Ohio State is too. and you know, Georgia is too. But Oregon is right there with everybody else. Now they've got the veteran quarterback. I just, he's built it very similar to how Kirby Smart built it with a lot of the same questions that have come along the way,

but he just keeps knocking on the door. Yeah, I agree with all of that. And the worst part about my pick was letting you get Sarg and landing back to back. And I fear what that's going to do to the grass. for me. But Christobal, I see, I think Christobal is a really good choice. I don't, I think if we,

we look at some of the way the other people have ranked it, people are still, I think people still maybe a little more down on Christobal than they should be because of. I saw enough. I don't know.

Yeah, I saw enough. I think, so here's where I will back your pick. Well, I also think Dan Lannning knows how to build a roster in this era. But I think Mario Cristobal has kind of given everybody else the blueprint on how to do it with homegrown recruiting and portal recruiting. Like his his mixture is the best formula that we've seen so far. Yeah.

And by the way, might have laid some of the blueprint too for for landing at Oregon of like how. He was like definitely, was definitely like building teams the same exact way while he was. Yeah. It was 20, end of 2021, going into 22. that they switched. And so it wasn't like now where if you leave, the whole team goes with you, it didn't work that way.

Laning benefited quite a bit from what Christofal have been doing at Oregon. So I'm with you. Before we go forward, before we go to the next pick, I want to talk to you about Zen AI. Zen AI is the home of vibecasting, a new way to capture and share conversations. In the same way vibe coding apps like Lovable

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That's zen. com.a, zen.a. Okay, Ari, who is your next selection? Let's get weird. I'm going to go Lane Kippen here. I was hoping to forget him. I would not forget. How could I forget him? He's literally been the pulse of our show for the last six months. I think this is a risk.

And I have been falling back on accomplishments more so than potential. And I think that there are other players, I mean, other coaches that will come on this list that have more concrete, proven assets on their resume than Lane does. He has yet to win a power conference as a head coach, and he has yet to break through on the biggest stages. That said, he has unequivocally proven in my mind that he can not only fare well in this, but excel in this new landscape of college football. He's a great portal master.

He's a good evaluator, and the best thing that he does is take a bunch of new pieces together, put them together, and make a functional meal. I think he's going to do that with. LSU. I don't know if it's going to be this year, Andy, but given what we know his skill set is and the resources that LSU is going to give him to back through it, I think it's inevitable that they're going to win a national title. When he said on the podcast last week that I wrote about that he's going to win what at LSU, like I found that to be believable. So this might be a list that looks a little funky to some people when they see it on Monday or Tuesday. But what I do

know is, is that in three years it's going to age well, I think. So I'm with you on this. And he lifted, because I do think degree of difficulty has to be accounted for here. And he lifted Ole Miss to a place that they'd ever really been before. And yes, Pete Golding coached the two playoff wins. So that's fine. We don't have to give Lane credit for that. But we can give Lane credit for getting them. He got Ole Miss to the playoff.

He turned Ole Miss into one of the best programs in the SEC. Like when Matt Luke got fired, the idea of whoever came next, turning them into one of the best programs in the SEC would have sounded crazy. So he did an amazing job. And like Sarkesian, you have to kind of separate the early part of the career from the latter stage of the career.

He learned quite a bit. Yeah. And then came out a different coach. The thing that scares me with him is that if this was a rankings of people I would hire first, I don't know if that would impact me because I do think that he has a tendency to create a scene. And I'm not sure that that's something I would want to sign up for.

But what I do know is that if you win a national title, they can light the place on fire and start over again later. Titles live forever. LSU is playing for keeps here. And I think that while I thought everything was a circus that happened, like I totally understand LSU's viewpoint on this and the investment in the roster and the coach and the buyout, all the things that they've had to do, they're doing because they won a title.

And I think that they have all the assets, including the head coach, in order to accomplish that and say what you want about him. You might not like him. He elevated Ole Miss, and he illustrated some of the same things that we were talking about with Sarkesian and some of the coaches that were drafted higher. And now he's at a big boy place. So I think that's going to probably bode well for people in Baton Rouge here in the next few years. So with my number five pick, I am going with a veteran, the veteran presence,

a guy who's done it, who's been around the block a few times. I'm afraid. But like some of the other people we've talking about, degree of difficulty matters, where you are matters, what your opportunity is now matter. You just talk about Lane Kiffin. Lane Kiffin's expectations at LSU were different than Lane Kiffin's expectations were at Ole Miss.

But we saw him do something at Ole Miss that gives us the idea that he can do great things at LSU. I know who it is. I am selecting Kyle Whittingham of Michigan. with my number five pick. Kyle Whittingham did things at Utah that we didn't think would be possible. Now he goes to a place where the expectations are higher, the resources are much better,

and he's expected to win national titles or compete for national titles. And probably right away, probably not any grace period here with Kyle Whittingham. And look, he's in his 60s. He probably doesn't expect a grace period. So I am fascinated by this. And I know I've said this a bunch of times on the show since the move was made.

I cannot believe Utah ran him off. Now, maybe that will make me look stupid if he doesn't. Well, can I ask you a question? Yeah, yeah. Girls here. Sure. If he was Utah's head coach right now,

would you have drafted him here? Probably not. And that was something. It would have been close to this. It would have been right around this. Because that was something. One more spot, I had him in the top five of my.

big 10 rankings and people were like, oh, so a guy just shows up at a big brand and you just give him all the credit in the world. And I think that there is a level of projection. For 21 years. I know. I think there's a level of projection here because you're counting on his past of those 21 years to tell you what's

going to happen next. And I think Michigan's a very interesting team. You're pretty freaking good last year. I mean, breaking through and going all the way or being a deep run in the playoff. They were very good. He is very good. I'm not pushing back at you.

No, no, no. Yeah, you're right. There's projection here, but he's never had a roster like this. So what we got to, you got to take some swings in this thing. You can't just go with everybody else's list. All right,

can I swing then? Yeah. You ready? I think it's a good pick. I think that that, I'm getting somebody that I'm obsessed with. And that I just, I think is going to be good.

It has been good. I'm going Mike Elko here. Is that a reach? Is that a reach? Nope. I don't know if it's a reach. every single thing that comes out of this man's mouth I agree with. And that's not very typical for me because my brain doesn't operate properly.

But let's be honest with each other. He's already done what Jimbo Fisher, a national championship winning head coach, could not do. He has broken through. He got Texas A&M into the playoff. And frankly, as bad as it seemed when we were in College Station that day, off of no sleep, they played a team that went to the national championship game down to the wire. there. They were all the way there with a chance to win the game.

He is 12 and 4 in the SEC in two seasons. His teams are becoming progressively more talented, although I know this year is kind of a question mark when it comes to the ags. I just think that Mike Elko gets it. And I think part of the reason why he gets it, Andy, is because he has such a wealth of experience at all different types of places. You know, like he's been in the SEA.

he's been at Duke, he's been at lower levels. He's in the Ivies, I think, right? He went to Penn, but he's, I mean, he's been at Bowling Green. He's been, he's been, he's been everywhere. FCS. He's been in a lot of different places. And I just, I feel like A&M is a very complicated place. It's not like everywhere else. And I know that, you know, when they hired him, there was a big circus around, you know,

Mark Stoops and all the stuff that happened there too. And A&M has spent a lot of money doing some dumb things in the past. And I think that the Mike Elko might be the most functional thing that A&S A&M has done in a long time. And I think that he epitomizes that place in a way that I'm not sure people who even went there understood. And I think he's done a tremendous job. A&M is one of those teams that is on the cusp of trying to break through.

A&M has been the butt of jokes for years and years and years. We talk about battered Aggie syndrome. I think he's putting a rest to that. They're different right now. And that might not manifest this year, but I think that Texas A&M is going to have a team that makes a deep playoff run during his tenure in the next few years. and I am very happy to buy stock in this man, even if it's a little early and a little high on this list.

I think that's a very good choice. The next choice I'm going to make, I think, is going to be kind of a lightning rod. Okay. This guy's done some really great things already. Okay. We're not sure about the job he's in right now. We're not sure how well he's performing,

though I think if he were somewhere else, we would be more sure about him. that's Kailan Abor. I thought you were taking somebody else. I wasn't ready for that. If it was the person I thought you were going to take, I was going to freak out. But I think this makes sense.

So Kailen Abor takes Washington to a national title. Was excellent there. Was good at Fresno State. Two years at Alabama. He just misses the playoff year one. He makes the playoff year two. He wins a game on the road in the playoff in year two. had Penn State and Michigan wanting to hire him,

Alabama wanting to keep him, and then they get blown out by Indiana, and it's like, are you sure? And I remember, we said this, because all of that stuff was going back and forth, the Michigan stuff was happening. You knew that they'd agreed to an extension in Alabama and raised at Alabama,

and I said after they lost the Rose Bowl, watch everybody freak out when they announced this extension, and everybody did. everybody did because he's not Nick Sabin well nobody's Nick Sabin maybe Signetti would have been Nick Saved I don't know but he's not Nick Saved

he's still a really good coach and you like think about the guys we've been talking about if you if you in your first two years in the SEC you go nine and three and then and then 10 and two and you make the SEC championship game in year two at seven and one in the league like we're taking that we're taking that yeah um i do think it is funny with him how current location messes with the signals

for what should be uh proper evaluation should be easy it's it's more difficult because of the job that he took and i think that i give him credit for taking that job knowing those signals will be mixed like i think he knew that this would be more complicated than what have you done and i i give him credit for that especially because he could have state at Washington and been a hero there forever and not been under the street. He chose this. And he gets my respect for that. All right. Let's see what's next here. This is this starting to get difficult and I think that we are going to start. Yeah, because there's a lot of is this, are we picking them for what they can do now and going forward? Or are we picking them for what they've already done?

Yeah. I'm going to go with somebody that I've just always really admired. I'm going to go with Kalani Sataki here. Good choice. And I don't know if it's the sexiest pick. Obviously, BYU, you know, has had a kind of a glass ceiling when it comes to tech and some of the more talented teams in the country the last few years. But they're 23 and four over the last two seasons. They've been in the Big 12 championship both years. And I get a lot of credit, too, because like stability and culture at a place like BYU, excuse me, you would think would be easier because of the honor code and the things that people sign up for. But the types of athletes that you can bring in is much more limited than anywhere else.

And a year ago at this time, they lost their quarterback and Jake Retzleff, and then they go back to the Big 12 championship after their program was blown up by the honor code violation. Like there's a reason why this guy was the prime or first candidate for Penn State's job when it opened. And I know that there's always going to be location issues as it pertains to how we perceive someone. We just got them talking about how that impacts Kaylin Bora.

I think it impacts Sataki in the same way. he has not made the playoff yet, but I don't think it's out of the question that if BYU continues to have this mentality, that hard-nosed thing that just drives BYU to wins, like here's the other thing too. I don't have any stats off the top of my head, but BYU knows how to win close games, man.

Every time they're in a close game, they figure out a way to come out on top. And you want to know something when it comes to actual like X's and O's coaching and mentality, like a lot of times I think that coaching shows up in the margins. And those margins are what determined games. like I would hire this guy anywhere in the country and I would know exactly what I'm getting

and I think it would have been a great hire for Penn State I understand that there's like geographical differences and culture differences and all those things but what he's done at a place that has more challenges maybe than anyone else in the country I don't think you could speak enough about how awesome he's done so I had to do the ACC rankings when we rank the coaches

my next selection will be the guy I took at number two in the ACC behind Mario Cristobal James Franklin. And he's either going to make me look great or stupid here because either last year was the anomaly and Penn State should have been more patient or last year was the sign of something. I'm going to say last year was the anomaly

and it's back to the guy who won nine games two years in row at Vanderbilt who was consistently winning double-digit games at Penn State who didn't quite get over the Ohio State Michigan hump, but upgraded Penn State's talent, upgraded their expectations. And now he's at a place where they're starved for wins. If you win 10 games there, they'll love you forever. I think James Franklin is actually probably in a spot

where this suits his personality pretty well. I have a theory. This suits the chip-on-the-shoulder mentality, maybe even better than Penn State. I have a theory about James Franklin, and I think that the remedy for this theory is a fresh start, which is what he has. I think that James Franklin was ultimately swallowed by the narratives that defined him.

I think that his teams shouldered the burden and the pressures of not being able to top top five teams, and I actually think that last year when they had Oregon on the ropes at home, and they ended up losing early on in the season, that's something within that roster, that team, that locker room snapped, and that they couldn't just deal with that anymore, even though they still had their entire season ahead of them. It was just like the last straw, I felt like.

And you want to know where that's not going to exist? Virginia Tech. So I think that this is a pretty good pick. And now I'm going to move on and I'm going to do something that I'm unsure of. You mentioned that you did the ACC, and I don't recall off the top of my head where you ranked this person. I bet I've ranked him number three. you're telling me that what are we in I have this is my seventh pick so for you know

seventh round here eighth round I'm going to go ahead and take the coach that's one two national titles I'm going to take dabbo Sweeney and I understand the risks involved in this I understand that things seem to be coming to a head in Clemson last year was an absolute nightmare for him and his program and their fans but I have not given up because they had a team in this era that produced eight draft picks. So he has already proven. He's already proven to me that at least he can assemble a roster with good players. I would be more alarmed if they went seven and six with bad players, although that makes

no sense because it's a coaching malfunction. But like, do you think Gabel's just forgot how to coach? Like, do we think that he forgot how to coach games? I thought he forgot how to build a roster. but I think this is kind of a value play and this might look bad in a few years I don't know where things are headed but give me a person that I have the utmost respect

for a person that did something that very few coaches on this list have done anywhere and I will just do my best that this doesn't age poorly but I think that from a value standpoint not taking him this late in the draft I'll take him and put him on my list. Yeah and that's the thing he still has a good roster

like I did the ACC playoff picture last week. I put Clemson in there as a serious contender because the roster looks like a playoff roster still. Yeah. And I think that there's a case to be made that if we're going to do a 10 round draft and we have 20 coaches, like I don't think it's unforgivable to not take him at all. Like if you were a person who said, I have all the respect for this guy in the world,

but I just don't think he can do it anymore. I think that you have a case to make, certainly. but I just, you know, some people might have taken him in the top three because of what he's done. And I think accomplishments come into play here. But he's one of the very, what is he, one of two active head coaches with multiple national titles. Yeah. Like him and Kerr, I'm going to give you seventh round. I'll take it.

So, you know, we'll see how it goes. But very complicated pick. And I felt for you when you had to do the ACC rankings because you had a few coaches in there, like Dabo had Bill Belichick. I had Bill Belich and unfortunately. That was a hard list. to put together. So I feel for you on that.

But, you know, I'll take the heat, but I think this is a rational place for him. Well, I'm going to go with the guy who I had right behind him in the ACC rankings. And this is a guy who's charging up fast. He's only been a head coach for three years. The first year, he won his league. The second year, he made the conference championship game. In the first two years in a new league, his team is 14 and two in conference play. Is he down the street for me?

SMU's Red Lashley. That's exactly right. Yeah. I think Brett Lashley might be a pretty damn good head coach. I think he may be a natural at the whole head coaching thing. Listen, they are a last minute drive at Cal last year away for making the ACC championship for both years there in the league. They shouldn't have messed that up. They should have played for the ACC chair.

They probably would have won it. Maybe. I mean, I don't know if they would have beaten Virginia, but they would have made the playoff if they could have gotten in there and beaten Virginia. So he was on our show a few weeks ago. He says this is probably his best team at SMU yet. And I believe. I believe them too.

And like the whole financial thing is so interesting because they have a lot of money, but they're not getting a lot from the ACC right now. Not getting anything for the ACC. They said they wouldn't need it. And somehow has continued to put together a really good team. I like that pick. All right, Andy, this is kind of a chess move pick, but also I think very undervalued.

Maybe because this kind of goes, you know, in line with how his careers played out. But if you're going to take Kyle Whittingham as high as you are. Don't do it. I was hoping you'd forget this. Who am I going to take, Matt Campbell? Yeah. Dang it.

He's the best coach in Iowa State history. Yes. How many coaches on the list above him are the best coach in any program's history? probably not that many right right now he's going to a place that like whittingham is going to give him all the things that he needs i think you can make the case that pen state's probably even more impatient than michigan at the moment to get back to prominence given what they just did i think past behavior is a good indication of what's to come and they found him um and they put their trust in him with a lot of iowa state players coming with him to do that now i don't know what it's going to look like this year. I think he has a chance to get some really good early

returns because their schedule is favorable. But Matt Campbell has accomplished so much at a place that I think Iowa State probably, and you might agree with this as a harder job than Utah. And he did it with such grace, such class and such success and consistency, I much add. Now you're putting him at one of the three or four most expectation heavy programs in the Big Ten, I will take Matt Campbell and I will think, I'm going to label that to steal of the draft so far, I think. So I'm going to take a guy who grew up right down the street from you. Okay.

Arizona State's Kenny Dillingham took over an absolute dumpster fire. Like the end of the Herm Edwards era at Arizona State was as bad as it gets. the roster had to be completely flipped. He comes in. He wins the Big 12 in year two. Last year they go six and three in Big 12 play, even though they lost Sam Levitt halfway through the season.

Ari, he went three and one with Jeff Sims as a starter. Georgia Tech fans and Nebraska fans. Let that sink in. Or anybody who has eyeballs. Yeah, yeah. Let that sink in. this man can coach

what was the only game that Texas Tech lost in conference play last year with Arizona State that is they lost Arizona State yeah who had Texas on the ropes in the Peach Bowl I believe that would be Arizona State yeah Kenny Dillingham knows what he's doing yeah and there's a reason why he was a candidate

or at least was linked to the Michigan job when it opened and here's the best part when he was retained at Arizona State Andy he made a plea to get a huge influx of capital and that one person could change the program. He got that money, so I'm very excited to see. He had to donate $10 million.

He's like, here you go. He got the money, which is the most Scottsdale thing ever, but good for him. And I'm excited to see Arizona State. We talk about places that are different now than when a person got there. Arizona State is certainly different, and I think that's a good pick. Okay, my turn. River, strike up the music, baby. Strike it up.

You know who it is. Ball for life. I'm going to take Josh Heifel. Tennessee went 8 and 5 last year. And like, would you say that's the best coaching job that he's done during his time there maybe? Like, could you make that case considering what happened with Nico? Like, I don't know. Like, I have a soft spot for people.

I don't know. They could have been really bad. And they didn't do that very well. Yeah, I know. What I thought they were going to be. But he's done a great job. He lifted them out of a deep, deep, dark hole. that he inherited.

Does anybody argue with this statement? Tennessee is better off and better than they were before his arrival. I think that like without question, I think he did it faster than people thought he would, which I think also is making it harder for him. But I think that Tennessee has become consistently tough. They have made the college football playoff already, which is important to at least acknowledge.

And now they're at this, you know, place where they're hoping to break through again and not only reach the college football playoff, but do it more successfully, although they were on the train tracks of the wrong team when they did make it. I think he's done a remarkable job. I think he's been tough, put in tough positions

and navigated those positions pretty well. I thought getting Joey Aguilar in the portal last year and him performing the way that he did to the point where they were even interested in him coming back for another year is a pretty good sign of, you know, being able to make things work when put in a tough position. I think he's done a very good job,

and I think he's proven beyond the shadow of a doubt that Tennessee is lucky to have him. And I'm very curious, because I think that he's one of these coaches that's also in an interesting cross-section of his tenure because of the early results and kind of how things have gone the last few years. I think they need a big year again, but I can't imagine that there's a Tennessee fan out there that isn't happy he's their coach right now. I'm going to go with the longest tenured coach in the FBS.

I was wondering if this was going to happen. Kirk Farrant's. Now, I think we could argue that if Kirk Farrant's, was a little more creative offensively or willing to let somebody be a little more creative offensively that he won even more games. But if we talk about the degree of difficulty at Iowa, recruiting to Iowa, especially in the old days, and the amount he's won and the consistency with which he's won and the consistency with which his teams play, he has to be on this list. He has to be here somewhere. Yeah. It is interesting.

because I have a bunch of options in my last pick, a lot of which have very strong ties to previous success. And I think in terms of consistency over decades, like Kirk Ferrence is without question done that. But I also feel like you have to buy into the future. And like, I just don't know if Iowa is going to ever be better than they were last year. So, you know, that's what they were only eight and four last year. Yeah, I know, but I think eight and four was a pretty good year for them. The thing is the four losses. They gave some good teams hell in three of those four losses.

Yeah, they almost beat Indiana. I think all four of those losses off the top of my head, Andy, were one possession games. Yeah, almost beat Oregon, almost beat USC. The Iowa State games, the sort of unforgivable one, yeah. Yeah, but, you know, in terms of, of, you know, competing at the highest of high levels, I'm not sure that's in the cards for Iowa moving forward, which is what could be paused. But in terms of, like, resume and, like, decades of consistency, there's a reason he's the longest 10-year coach in college football.

So I think it's a good pick. I also have like 17 options right now, and I don't know what to do because, okay, I'm not taking him, but Lincoln Riley probably could have been drafted, right? Like I- Yes, yes. But I don't know that I'm going to- He builds Heisman quarterbacks. And Jane Maiava, his current quarterback,

is one of the best quarterbacks in college football. like Lincoln Riley it's always going to be can he ever have a good enough defense and you know I think he was top five in the country on everyone's list four years ago I know but but he's had all the resources of USC and he's not been able to make the playoff with them um you know who I'm going to go with hmm god Eli Drinkwitz Jeff Brom Joey McGuire Willie Fritz Willie Fritz, yep. Help me with my last pick, Andy.

Who do you think I should pick? You can't do that. Don't help me. Can I give you one? Can I give you a guy that has won really big at one place, did okay at another, but then it fell off, and is now turned a place that we didn't think was going to be able to win consistently into it one of the better periods that it's had in its history? Brett B. Lima? Brett Bilemo would be under consideration. You know who I'm taking, though?

Who you got? Brent Venables. Good choice. I was wondering if we're going to get him because I think the job he did last year was pretty incredible. And I just got Rivers text that says you have to take Venables. That was, uh, oh, he said that. He, he took it to me personally. And I just.

What was that, was that like a, you have to take Venables because that's the graphic package I have queued up? I don't know what that means. He just believes it. I didn't do it. I drafted him before I saw it. So it worked out. but how much is it only head coach experience? This man was one of the best coordinators in college football for over a decade.

And I would argue still is. Yeah. I mean, it's his defense. It's like maybe I'm, Clemson was partially Clemson because of this man. Like, so it's not, he wasn't the head coach and Davosweeney gets to absorb most of the shine. But it's not just that.

Oklahoma made the playoff last year, and I think they're one of the most underappreciated coaches in college football heading into the year. And you pointed this out. What happened the year before is we want to know what was the real one. Was it the 24 Brent Venables or the 25 rent-ventibles? Which is the real Brent Venables?

What should we expect going forward more often, 24 or 25? And I think that's, like, if it's 25, he's way too low. Here's what I do know. there was nobody under more pressure coming into last season than Brent Fennebals. And they made some investments in their quarterback, their offensive coordinator with Ben Arbuckle, they brought in, they made the changes they needed to make from 24 in order to live up to those expectations in 25. I think it's inherently difficult. There are other coaches that came in last year that had similar expectations and failed to meet them because I think it's easy to crumble under the pressure.

I think you deserve some credit for answering the bell when you're in a win or go home scenario when they did that. And now they have a lot of return. That schedule, too. Yeah, and they had the toughest, what we thought was the toughest schedule at the time in the country. Nevertheless, they did enough and won enough to get into the CFP. Now, I do think that there are some strides that need to be made. I think they need to be more competitive in the Red River game.

Like, they can't keep playing Texas the way that they've been playing them. They have to, you know, obviously beat them, but they have to be more competitive when they do. But I think that, you know, last year with the Dr. and shin, you know, situation in the hand surgery and all that stuff. That was my favorite bit of last year. But, like, I think that, like, not everything's been perfect. They've had a lot of injuries the year before they lost their entire receiver room.

Like, you know, it hasn't been easy for him. And I think that in the SEC, you can get swallowed up by expectations, by fan expectation, all the things that happen around you. And I think that he did a pretty good job traversing that last year. And I think this is a team that can make back-to-back CFP. So I'll gladly take him with my last pick. That is excellent. This was a lot of fun.

We'll throw the graphic out everyone who yelled at us. We are on vacation at the moment. J.D. Pekyll is going to be filling in on Wednesday and Friday of this week. And we know how much fun his show is. Bruce River. How are we doing? What's up, guys? I think we need to read off this final list for the podcast listeners.

I'm also going to take this, Andy. And calling dibs now I'm going to make this our official, Andy and Ari on three, top 25. Or top 20. Top 20. I was to say top 20. Yeah. Okay. I'm all just like, I'm going to transcribe the draft and just say here's how we do. Perfect. I love it. That'll work. All right. Andy, you had the first pick. And you started off with Kurt Signetti at Indiana, Ryan Day at Ohio State, Steve Sarkeesian at Texas, Dan Landing at Oregon, Kyle Whittingham at Michigan, Kalen DeBoore at Alabama, James Franklin at Virginia Tech, SMU's Rhett Lashley, Kenny Dillingham at Arizona State, and Iowa's Kirk Ferrence, R. this is your team. You have the second pick. Kirby Smart at Georgia, Marcus Freeman at Notre Dame,

Mario Cristobal, Miami, Lane Kiffin at LSU, Mike Elko at Texas A&M, Kalani Sataki at BYU, Daboosewini at Clemson, Matt Campbell, Penn State, Josh Heifle at Tennessee, and Brent Venables at Oklahoma. And that's the list. I think we both did good. I don't know. I should not be embarrassed. I always like doing this for that. I think people will be furious at both of us for various reasons because hey that's what happens when you rank things I don't feel like I made any catastrophic mistakes which I think

is good for somebody who's in sight you didn't overthink it this time yeah I mean the Mario Cristobald Dan Lanning one was a was a maybe it overthought but I thought you I thought you reasoned that out very well and I think that they're going to be probably a 50 50 split among the people

listening and watching as to which one you should have picked and there's you guys you guys got to flip a coin there. You've got to pick one of them at that point. But allowing you to have the Steve Sarkesian landing back-to-back combo, like from a graphic standpoint, I'm not sure that's going to play well. But I feel pretty good about getting Matt Campbell, Hypo and Venables all at the end there. So there are a lot of good coaches out there. Like we left Willie Fritz on the board.

We left Lincoln Riley on the board. So there's a lot out there. Guys, we'll be back next week. Media Day start next week. nine month sprint for your old pals, Andy and Ari, we won't leave you again. We'll just every day, because it never stops. And if something happens, we'll probably bounce back. We'll show up. But I'm going to Vegas for one of the days.

So just hopefully it doesn't happen then. Pray for, pray for Ari. Happy 4th of July. Happy 250th birthday, America. I love that. Love that holiday. Enjoy the hot dog eating contest.

It's going to be spectacular. guys we'll talk to you very soon