Andy & Ari On3 - Lane Kiffin WATCH: Mindset of Rebels’ coach as Ole Miss prepares for Florida Gators, CFP run | Wake Forest's Jake Dickert joins | Head Coaching Status of Auburn, Florida State

Episode Date: November 12, 2025

As week 12 in college football rapidly approaches, one of the more entertaining games of the weekend could be in Oxford, Mississippi, as the Ole Miss Rebels are preparing for the Florida Gators coming to town. With a number of job openings in college football, Lane Kiffin's name has been swirling for quite some time now. Watch here as Andy & Ari breakdown Lane Kiffin's comments from his press conference and what is going into his decision making process. (0:00) On Today’s Episode(0:59) BetMGM(3:38) Intro: Kiffin ahead of Florida game(8:05) Coach Kiffin’s Comments(20:50) Previewing Jake Dickert(22:24) Gametime(23:54) Jake Dickert joins(29:37) Matchup vs North Carolina(30:51) Living in Fargo, North Dakota(33:06) Winning at Wake Forest(37:27) First year thus far at WF(38:58) Closing out with Jake Dickert(41:25) Living out west?(44:11) PaniniAmerica.net(46:58) Mike Norvell’s Status at Florida State(55:44) Auburn’s Search Latest(1:04:40) Dear Andy & Ari tomorrow(1:05:30) Ari’s CFP Nugget(1:08:13) Thanks for watching! See you tomorrow! Later, Wake Forest head coach Jake Dickert joins the show to discuss his first full season in Winston-Salem as the Demon Deacons prepare to host Bill Belichick and the North Carolina Tar Heels. Afterwards, Andy & Ari take a look into On3's megaboard and discuss threads on Mike Norvell's status at Florida State and the latest intel on the Auburn head coaching search. Would James Franklin be a good candidate to take over on the plains? Send your mailbag questions in to:[e-mail]@on3.com Our show is presented by BetMGM! If you haven’t signed up for BetMGM yet, use bonus code CFB and you will get up to a $1500 First Bet Offer on your first wager with BetMGM! Here’s how it works: 1. Download the BetMGM app and sign-up using bonus code CFB.2. Deposit at least $10 and place your first wager on any game.3. You will receive up to $1500 in bonus bets if your bet loses! Just make sureyou use bonus code CFB when you sign up! Make this college football season one for the history books. Make it legendary. See BetMGM.com for Terms. 21+ only. US promotional offers not available in New York, Nevada, Ontario, or Puerto Rico. Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER (Available in the US). Call 877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY). Call 1-800-NEXT-STEP (AZ), 1-800-327-5050 (MA), 1-800-BETS-OFF (IA), 1-800-981-0023 (PR). First Bet Offer for new customers only. Subject to eligibility requirements. Rewards are non-withdrawable bonus bets that expire in 7 days. In partnership with Kansas Crossing Casino and Hotel. This show is also brought to you by Gametime! Take the guesswork out of buying college football tickets with Gametime.Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code STAPLES for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply. Swipe. Tap. Ticket. Go. Download the Gametime app today! Visit Gametime.co. We’re also brought to you by Panini! Panini delivers the most collectible sports cards and memorabilia on the planet. Check out the new exclusive Arch Manning collection or the Panini Prizm Draft Picks College Football series. Visit PaniniAmerica.net to start your collection today.Join On3 today and get one full year of access to The Athletic included! https://www.on3.com/subscribe/C Watch our show on YouTube! https://youtu.be/JXTSqMeWEUo Hosts: Andy Staples, Ari WassermanProducer: River BaileyInterested in partnering with the show? Email [e-mail] Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

On today's episode of Andy and Ari on 3 presented by BetMGM, Lane Kiffin is about to coach against the team whose fan base wants him to come coach them. Yeah, it's awkward. It's real awkward. We'll hear Lane talk about Florida, potential interest from both schools, having to make a decision, whether he has to make a decision, all of that. Plus, Wake Forest head coach Jake Dickert joins the show. he is about to play against North Carolina. The Demon Deacons are bowl eligible. They've got a big game against Bill Belichick and the Tar Heels this week. Plus, we've got Megaboard threads on Auburn and their coaching search. And what is happening at Florida State? Mike Norvell fires back this week as his team prepares to play Virginia Tech. What happens next in Tallahassee?

We'll talk about it all on today's Andy Nauron 3 presented by BEDMGM. we are presented by bet mgm all the lines and totals that we talk about on the show come from betmgm and you can very easily join up with bet mgm with a very special offer it's very easy download the betmgm app sign up using the bonus code cfb that cfb is in college football deposit at least ten dollars and place your first wager on any game and you will receive up to fifteen hundred dollars in bonus bets if your bet loses. Just make sure to use the bonus code CFB when you sign up and you can get up to a $1,500 first bet offer. Also, if you're already signed up with bet and GM, there's a lot going on this week, a lot of special little goodies for you. We've got a college football odds boost token

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Sign up for BetMGM. If you're not already signed up, if you are signed up, obviously plenty of fun stuff ahead of you this weekend. Make this college football season one for the history books. Make it legendary with BetMGM. See bedmgmgm.com for terms 21 plus only. U.S. promotional offers are not available in New York, Nevada. Ontario or Puerto Rico. Gambling problem. Call 1-800 gambler in the U.S.

Call 8778 Hope N.Y or text Hope N.Y. 4673369 in New York. Call 1-800 next step in Arizona. Call 1-800-327-5-0-5-0-0-0 in Massachusetts. Call 1-800-bets off in Iowa or 1-800-9-81-0-2-3 in Puerto Rico. First bet offer for new customers only, subject to eligibility requirements, Rewards are non-witrable bonus bets that expire in seven days in partnership with Kansas Crossing Casino and Hotel. Don't forget, if you haven't signed up for BetMGM yet, use the bonus code CFB and get your $1,500 first bet offer today. Welcome to Annie and RON 3 presented by BetMGM. It's a megaboard Wednesday. And I would say the vast majority of the recent threads,

on the Grove message board at OM Spirit and on the Swamp Talk message board at Gators Online. I've been about Lane Kiffin. Obviously, OM Spirit is an Ole Miss site, so they're talking about Ole Miss's coach. Gators Online, they want Ole Misses Coach. Florida is going to Oxford this weekend, and they're going to play,

and Lane Kiffin will be in the same vicinity as the Gators. The Gators will be in the same vicinity as Lane Kiffin. And man, is this awkward, Ari. I picked one thread, one thread. I picked Keith Niebuhr's thread on Gators Online. Quotes and context with Lane Kiffen, because I thought the context piece is very important because you can take quotes and do anything.

You didn't strike me as having to work that hard to find something on this topic, did you? I did not. You actually have a thought, and it kind of, you know, I mean, maybe the reason why Ole Miss is in this position is because they're having a good year. But doesn't it kind of, of stink that Ole Miss is having one of the best seasons in program history and the fans are

more wired about what's going to happen to their coach than enjoying the moment that they crave. And I'm not saying that they're wrong for being concerned about it because the reason why they have this moment is because of their coach. But it does suck because it's just like you should be rep. Like this is the whole, this is like the dessert course of being a football fan. Like this is what you should be enjoying. And the part of it is like this is their second year that they've been in the playoff mix. their second year they've been in one of the best teams in the SEC in a row.

And I think this is what actually makes this so interesting because the argument we're having over this is should Lane look at other jobs, should he stay at Ole Miss, is the ceiling as high at Ole Misses as these other places? And I think the answer is probably, yes, it is as high as Florida or as LSU. Like, I think you can probably win a national title at Ole Miss now. And so I think that would frustrate me as an Ole Miss fan that, you know, 15 years ago, yeah, you would understand. Like, your coach would probably have left for Florida, no question. But I don't think that's in it.

I don't think that's the situation now. I think it's different. The other thing, too, and, you know, when people listen to the Jake Dickert interview that's on today's show, they'll hear that he has been at times, you know, consumed by moving up the corporate ladder and chasing logos and all those things. And I sometimes wonder, Andy, if even if the ceiling at one place is the same as the other, if there's something special about going to one of the legacy programs that you dreamed of coaching at one day. And I'm not speaking about Lane Kiffin directly, but there are coaches who would be like, well, you know, the ceiling at Missouri and the ceiling at

Ole Miss in Florida may be similar right now, but man, I grew up and Florida was the team and I want to go there. I wonder if there's a pool to traditional powers or teams that have been in the mix or viewed as one of the best programs in the sport in the last 25 years. And maybe I'm just full of shit. I don't know, but if I were a coach, I don't know. I think I might be tempted by that, much as the allure of working at SI, have been coming up at this time or the allure of working at the new york time what if i had a job offer from s i and on three right now because it's kind of the same thing well kind of the same

thing i don't think that florida's s i right now but uh you know i i think that there are some teams that are more like current but but 15 years ago when i was actually well i was hired by s i 17 years ago i think that the better the better analogy is staying at the s i when you were there and going to the athletic at the time. Well, people thought that was insane. Yeah. I remember my wife trying to explain where I was going to people, and they thought I'd lost my mind.

So, but that's the thing. That would kind of be the same thing. I'm glad you brought it up this way, because Lane Kiffin was asked this week what he considers a good job and what makes a good job now in 2025, because I think that's an important distinction. So here's what Lane Kiffin said about that. What are the, the aspect,

that make up a good job for a college head coach? What's the top of your priority list? I wasn't ready for that one. I think that's evolved and changed, and there's different things in it. I've said to you guys a couple years ago, I think, and this was before Cap, but I said, I think that it's going to move to people used to say,

okay, you know, when people wanted to hire you or something in an interview and what questions do you have, where are your concerns? Okay, people used to say, you know, facilities, how many practice fields, you know, those things. And I said, I don't think, you know, I think that's changed, it's going to change, and it's going to be how much in IAL do you have, you know,

when it was all collective. You know, how is your collective, how is it run, how much do you have? Because that's, before this, that was the salary cap, meaning that's how much money you're going to have. I know some people sometimes think, well, okay, that's not a big deal, but just look at professional sports when it's not the same like baseball and the payrolls. And over time, who wins and who doesn't win? And somebody may have a year, outlier years once in a while.

But, and so now that's, that's a little equaled out, but there's still, how much are you giving to Rev, you know, to your football program? And then how much do you have collective-wise? You know, I think it's a big question, but, you know, people will talk about it's narrowed, like I heard Coach Saban say, and some stuff has narrowed, as I've referred to, because you can't stockpile, you know, at those whatever blue bloods you want to call it, refer to it. But there's still things there that you're still going to struggle to beat those guys because kids are still recruited and they see size of stadiums and tradition and Heismans and national championships and then your location. you know, two talents. So I think all those, all those are in there, but it's slid a little time over, you know, I think when that question probably earlier was that what is your assistant

coach's pool, now is what is your player pool? So after that answer, very insightful, by the way, I wanted to say, I want a message boards popped because you can interpret that however you want. Like, if you're a Florida fan, you can take the part where he says, if you've got, how many Heismans do you have, how big is your stadium? Like, oh, we've got three Heisman trophy winners.

The stadium is bigger. But if you're Ole Miss fan, you can take the last part. What's your player pool? Well, Ole Miss has been the one that said, you know what? You don't need to donate to stadium improvement. You need to donate to player payroll. Florida's got a $500 million stadium renovation still coming. How much do they care about player payroll?

They care as much as Ole Miss does? Like, those are the questions that you, and that's what the Ole Miss fans are going to say. So those are the questions you have to ask if you are Lane Kiffin in this specific instance, but like you said, it's very insightful because that's what every coach in this cycle has to ask. Yeah, and it's an interesting thought because it's like how much does the Heismans and the tradition actually matter? Like, that's the other piece of this too. Like, does that matter a lot in your mind or do you think that that's antiquated? When a player goes to think it matters nearly as much.

I want to be able to put the best players on the field. I've said this a million times. The best way to improve your stadium is to put better players in it. There's no luxury box or chairback that makes your stadium better than having a great edge rusher or having a really disrupted defensive tackle or an incredible quarterback. That's what makes your stadium great. I mean, I hate to say this, but most recruits weren't even born yet. or they were in diapers the last time Florida won a national title. So, you know, the thought process, too, of like, oh, I want to go play for Florida because

they win national titles. It's like, these kids don't even remember Florida ever being good at that level. So, like, you get to, you know, a certain point where it's like 15 years is not that much time for me and you to look back at, but for an 18-year-old kid, it's their entire life. So, you know, I thought that that was an insightful answer. I would really love to know and the real answer to what moves you, Lane. And that, I'm glad you said that.

That is what actually matters in this. And we don't know the answer to that. Because you can make a case for both, right? You can't. You can easily make the case for both. And I think going back to your SI athletic decision, you know, that's kind of the same deal. Like if he stays.

That was me, look, but I was at the legacy place going to the, but looking at what was going to happen in the future and what the future was going to look like and where do I put myself in a position to be better positioned for the future. He's not at the legacy place, but he is making the same exact decision. He is. He is because he's trying to decide. And look, here's the other part. I want to be fair to Florida here. We don't know what they are telling job candidates about what their... payroll will look like, their NIL structure will look like, how willing are they to push the envelope as far as the cap, the quote unquote cap goes? These are all things that matter

quite a bit. And if they are going to do it in a similar way to Ole Miss, then that would make the job more attractive. But Ole Miss has been doing it right almost the whole time. You know, like since the NIL era started, Ole Miss's administration has made the correct decisions each time. You know, and as you're breaking this down with Lane, I think it's important to acknowledge that, you know, on three just reported from Chris Lowe, Brett McMurphy, and Pete Nacos that Louisville is working on a contract extension for Jeff Brom.

And like, as the week's days, whatever games go by, where Lane Kiffin has not signed that extension or a report like that happens, you have to start becoming more and more worried, I think. So obviously... And here's something an agent brought up to me that I hadn't thought about. And this is something that Keith Carter,

the athletic director at Ole Miss, really has to think about. This is a very active carousel. There's a lot of due diligence that must be done if you're Keith Carter, in case Lane decides to leave. and so you need to know who your pool of candidates is and the question is how soon do you need an answer from lane yay or nay before you lose your potential pool of candidates because

john somerall is going to going to probably take a job you know some of these other guys that would be in the mix are probably going to take jobs and they're not going to leave jobs after three weeks so you are going to have to figure that out and so you are going to have to figure that out And so you probably do have to ask, Lane, at some point, what's your decision here? Yeah, because, like, I think that we have a general estimation of what the salary is going to be. Is it somewhere between 13 and that? I think Florida and Ole Miss can pay exactly the same. I don't think that's really interesting.

So my question, though, is can Ole Miss offer him something right now that he has to say yes to? Like, what can Ole Miss give him that takes the choice out of his hands? You know, I think a lot of times with job, job markets, it's like, well, you know, when on three came and got me, they gave me something that I didn't even have to think about, right? Like, this is the package that I'm looking for, and they gave it to me. What would that package look like for Ole Miss? I don't think there is one. Financial. I don't think either of these entities can do that.

That's why I keep saying it comes down to where you want to work. And the other thing to consider, we haven't talked about yet, is NFL jobs. The Giants job just opened. They're just, the Giants are building around Jackson Dart. Who did Jackson Dart play for in college? That'd be wild. Okay. The Dolphins job may open.

If he, and Lane's been an NFL head coach, if he ever aspires to do that again, that also is something that could be on the table this year. So if you're Lane, you have all the leverage, all of the leverage. So you can stretch this out pretty far. Is there any part of you that thinks that he would give the NFL another shot? I don't know. I don't know. Again, a lot of this comes down to what does Lane Kiffin, the human being, want to do?

And the only person who knows that is him. And he's not giving a lot of answers. So he got asked a little more directly at his press conference about Ole Miss and Florida both want you. What do you have to decide? If Florida wants you, and if Ole Miss wants you, it'll necessitate you making a decision. I was just curious, like, with the portal opening on January 2nd, do you even have time to think about that? Or how important is it to come to whatever decision before the portal opens? I don't know.

I'm not that far down the road. I said it last week, you guys think I was joking or the South Carolina? Like, everybody wants to talk about other jobs and everything. and I think you're two or three weeks away from coaching for your own job, so you better make sure you're doing really well where you are because as we've seen out there, I've said one win put you out of the top 10. Now two wins might put you out the top 25 and three might get you fired. So I ain't figured out all that out.

I'm trying to keep our winning streak, get to eight and no at home. Shoot. And like I said, I think last week talking to Landry is really cool that if, I may have forgot the stat now, if you're a junior here, you know, and you've gone to all the home games, you've seen one loss. If you're a fifth year senior, you've seen three losses, I think, in five years. So that's a pretty cool thing. So it'd be awesome to finish this home run for this season with our last home game here. So that's the right answer for him at this time. He pays people to think about that stuff, though. Yeah.

not shocking that the most important question is the one that was most evaded though right like i liked the introspective like here's what makes a job good and all these different things but when push comes to shove like he's not ready to talk about it in any way and like i understand it i understand it any more than we would want to have public conversations about our career would be impossible i can't even imagine having this play out publicly like having one of my job deliberations play out publicly can't imagine not to mention that you're still in the middle of having to finish your most important project at your current job you know like they're not out of the woods yet i think they're out of the woods in the playoff race i think they're going to get in no matter what and when i say no matter

they can't lose to florida this like losing to florida this week would be bad bad it would not eliminate them it would not but it would be bad bad don't don't do that and remember florida knocked them out of the playoff last year an inferior florida team knocked them out of the playoff last So they don't lose to floor. That's especially this version that just got whipped by Kentucky, don't lose to them. But, you know, the things that I've heard about Lane, though, and Chris Lowe knows him, you know him pretty good. Like, being the head coach of the Dolphins really does strike me as something that he would enjoy. I don't know why, but that would be a pretty good life.

See, I don't know. I'd be curious to ask him about, like, you know, give him truth from him, ask him about did the Raiders experience sour you? on the NFL in general or are you a different coach now and would you consider that again because he was like 14 when he was coaching at the racer he was at 34 when he coached the Raiders like I wouldn't have hired me to run a Wendy's at 34 yeah he's an NFL head coach it's a it's a wild uh wild career arc but I think that we all would agree that he is a much different coach in person than he was during those times too yeah speaking of different coaches and different people. Jake Dickert from Wake Forest has come a long way and in a long, and in a pretty short time.

He's a young coach. He's 42, but he's had a very diverse and very career. He's been in the Dakotas. He's been at Washington State. Now he's at Wake Forest. He grew up in Wisconsin. He's been, he's been all over the place. And now he's got the Demon Deacons in a really good spot. They play in North Carolina this week. This is going to be, as the folks at Inside Carolina said, on their message board they are predicting a rock fight here these defenses are both very good and getting better by the week it seems the offenses have struggled quite a bit so you're going to see a probably low scoring game bet mGM has the total i'm looking at uh is that 38.5 it is take the under take yeah like this may be remember the wake forest virginia tech game near the

ended the Frank Beamer era. It ended, regulation ended zero zero with Beamer celebrating. Yeah. Overtime is the enemy. A little of that. Overtime is the end of me of the under, though.

That's, this is true, but not in the new overtime, not this under. Imagine like losing because they went back and forth with two point conversions for five rounds. Listen, it, Jake Dickert says he wants a great atmosphere. If you want to be part of that

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There's some good seats available for that game. You can get some pretty good ones in the high $100 range. And again, you'd see exactly where you'd be sitting at Accruiter Stadium. The price you see is the price you pay. You want to go see Texas and Georgia and Athens? Yeah, you know you do. They got tickets for that on game time. They get tickets for Oklahoma, Alabama, and Tuscaloosa on game time.

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Game time, swipe, tap, ticket, go. All right. Let us talk to Jake Dickert, who is in a very interesting situation. He's playing as Bill Belichick this week. His team just beat Virginia, handed Virginia, their second ACC loss, which, or excuse me, their first ACC loss, their second loss to an ACC team because the NC State game was a non-conference game. Wake Forest already bowl eligible, but they're setting that aside.

New challenge, rivalry game. It's against, you know, guy with six Super Bowls. No big deal. Here's Jake Dickert. We are honored to be joined by Jake Dickert, the first, first year coach in Wake Forest history to lead the Demon Deacons to bowl eligibility. And I know you guys were celebrating that after you beat Virginia Day Coach and very quickly said, we got to stop thinking about that because now the time turns to North Carolina. How do you, when you're having a season like this, get everybody refocus?

Well, I think the biggest thing is you learn from failure. You know, we had the big win a couple weeks ago against SMU, turn around and really play our worst football game of the season. So I think we learned from that moment. And obviously, big part for our program, big part for our university. No one gave us a shot guys to get this football team in a position to go to a bowl game. We've done it through nine games. And there's a lot of opportunity left, two rivalry games, a senior night at home.

So our guys just need to refocus on what's important. and that's being our best for this big four football game this Saturday. Coach, when you take over a program and you take inventory on, you know, what you have, where you need to go, what needs to be accomplished, how much can you actually visualize what a ceiling for a team can be and how quickly do you come to that realization? Yeah, I mean, I actually had that question today in the press conference. And if you ever hear the old, you know, Caterpillar story or not Caterpillar, but Grasshopper story where, you know, you put them in a jar, you know, with a ceiling on it. you know, eventually they learn where their height is and they don't stop jumping once you take the top off the jar. I don't like put ceiling on players. I don't like putting ceiling on teams.

And we just keep believing. We didn't get here until December 20th, right? So there was no secret that we were behind the eight ball. We had to evaluate A, our personnel and retain, you know, every best player that we possibly could. And then we just went right into like, we can't have any success this season if we don't win the line of scrimmage. So I think in the first portal period, we signed over 10, you know, offensive and defensive lineman. That's been the staple of our football team. And then we kind of, you know, supplemented some of that talent in the second portal.

So, you know, I think we've done a really good job of evaluating, but also, you're not sweeping under the rug the guys that were here and saying, hey, those aren't our guys. Heck, yeah, they're our guys. And they stayed here with a passionate and purpose, and this purpose was to get to a bowl game just like we are right now. So you talk about nameless, faceless opponent, and that's something that you said,

was a failure, you know, following SMU going into Florida State. With, in this situation, with the players in, you know, North Carolina is almost all new. It's, it's a little bit different. But in your coaching matchup, that's probably the hardest thing to make this a nameless, faceless opponent. Because I want to ask, when you were a senior in high school, watching Bill Belichick beat the Rams in the Super Bowl, if I had to tap you on the shoulder and said, Jake, you're going to coach against that guy someday. What would you said? Well, I would have said, is he coaching, like, the local high school or something?

Because that's what I thought I was going to be doing at that point in my life. Cool opportunity. You know, we've gotten a lot of text messages, like, about that kind of same thing. I think at the end of day, thank God it's not me versus Coach Belichick one-on-one. That's too bad athletes going at it, right? So good thing. It's our players going. And you keep the main thing, the main thing.

And it's been his messaging kind of throughout his whole career. But really cool. I'm not going to say it's not to say that you're standing next to, you know, one of the best, if not the best coaches in our game. Definitely one of the best defensive minds, right? So I think it's a great opportunity for us. But, you know, once again, we're not the ones playing. Thank God. I was a D3 wide receiver.

I look like a fullback now. So it's one of those guys, but we're just excited to get out there. Yeah, I think that it's interesting from two aspects. One is you're going against them and are going to be, you know, across the sideline from him from an entire game. but you're also taking over a program in the same conference in the same state at the same time. Like, do you ever have a thought process of like, well, if this is a race to, you know, ACC supremacy that I'm going to have to get through Bill Belichick's build in my own state, too, right? When you start, like it's not just about the game.

It's about the build, I think. Yeah. Prize race horses, you know what they do, guys? They have blinders on, okay? So they don't miss a step, right? So they're not looking to the horse to the left and the right, and they're just sprinting. Okay, when we got here, we were just sprinting. I wasn't even thinking about what North Carolina was doing.

Still don't. You know, they have different resources. They have some other things. Like, we have what we have to a high degree, and we're excited about maximizing everything that we have. So I think that's where people get in trouble. I mean, you just, you got to run your own race. You got to understand what's in your lane.

But you got to understand, like, this was always possible in our minds. And we knew it was going to be hard. We knew it was going to be difficult. When we found the right people. I'm on a search for great people that have a high passion and degree for what it takes to do a really hard game and I think that's what Wake Forest represents

that's why we're here that's what we've found and that's how we're going to create success for us and I think that's the only focus that we need to have do you know much time I spend thinking about other college football podcasts and how many viewers they get? Well, yeah, I mean, you know,

it's a blinders. You guys are five resources and trust me, on three, you guys are doing great. So just keep moving forward. Ari and a prize racers have never been compared before. So this is a first on the show. In any regard, yeah. I was watching your press conference this week, Jake,

and it was kind of one of those only in 2025 moments because obviously you're a new staff, they're a new staff, lots of roster turnover. But there is so much familiarity here because you guys had to play against Steve Belichick last year when you were at Washington State. He was at Washington. You guys played against Andrew Simpson,

their linebacker when he was at Boise State. You're O.C. Rob Izel coached their quarterback, G.O. Lopez at South Alabama, like, it's weird how everything overlaps now. Yeah, it is. And I think it's a new thing where we all have to get used to, a, play in X players. I think that's a, at first in my career about three years ago, that was really odd. But now it's part of what we do. And I think familiarity is good in this game, you know, but obviously even Steve Belichick has evolved their defense to their new personnel. So it's, there's some similarities. There's some strengths at weaknesses. You know, you ask Coach Ezel about GOs, like, hey, what can he do? How does he read coverage? What does he like? Where does he roll into? What's his go-to?

But at the end of the day, it's new teams, new structure, and you just got to go out there and find a way to win a game. I was looking at your coaching history. And every single place you've coached in where you were born and where you went to college has been freezing cold. I've never been to Wake Forest, actually. Like, is this the nicest area in terms of, like, weather and scenery? that you've been on i guess the dakotas have some pretty beautiful places right in wyoming absolutely

but like is this the mildest climate guys i don't know if you understand like when i lived in fargo north dakota we had three weeks where it didn't get above zero degrees winchill okay i'm talking three weeks like you don't even understand what that feels like we had a practice today and it was 35 degrees to start it's going to be 60 today and our guys from the south acted like that was cold i just just it's all perspective right i mean we're going to have a we're going to have a we're have a November 15th game. It's going to be 70 degrees on Saturday. I've never heard of it, never dreamt of it. Like, it's actually happening in real life. So I'll take the heat and humidity any day over a negative blizzard in Wyoming that shuts the highway down for three days.

I was going to say, how does the recruiting process change for you when you're talking to people? I mean, I imagine not getting the, you know, what do I do if my engine block freezes question is nice to not get anymore. Guys, when I was a young G.A. and I went up to Fargo, North Dakota. I got to the first apartment. I pulled into my parking spot, and there was a plug. And I was like, what is this for? And you realize you need an engine block heater so your oil doesn't freeze. So it's a whole other world that people don't understand what that's even about. You know, of course, we got an apartment with one underground parking spot. That's where my wife was, right? So at 5 a.m., I'm out there freezing and letting my thing warm up every morning. So, you know, It's definitely a journey. Yeah, recruiting here has been great. Yeah. I think human beings were really late on the automatic start invention.

I think we could have maybe done that a few decades earlier. Coach, I know this is, I don't know how much you listen to the show, but I'm the guy who takes it off the rails. Have you seen the show Fargo? I have actually when I worked there, like one of my aunts and one of those secret Santa, like give a gift thing, like gave me the movie Fargo. And it's really depressing. And it actually part of the great community. Great city. They don't all talk like that, but they definitely have the accents.

I didn't know how accurate the movie in the show is. Is that how life is there? No, it is a great city. Passionate fan base, go in the summer so you can enjoy it. Otherwise, it is just a white out with wind that the wind is just incredible. It can ruin your whole day. So good to know they only use woodchippers for wood there. That's good to know.

Yes, exactly. It's based on a true story. I don't know if you know that. so jake you said something about this team after you guys beat virginian i thought it was really interesting you said this is the way we win now and we got to stop apologizing for that and and that's that's who we are and for those who don't know you won 16 9 like you beat smu 1513 on a walk off field goal is it nice knowing what the personality your team is knowing how your team wins Yeah, I mean, I think it's more so realizing the grit our team has earned and shows, you know, in the daily response.

And what I love about it is it is team wins. You know, we did go at the end of the Virginia game on a 16-play, 48-yard drive. I don't even know how the math goes on that. And took out nine minutes on the clock, okay? So as the defense is sitting there, you know, and we celebrate the heck out of those things, okay? Is it to where we want to be? No. Is that the way we always want to win, no.

but it's great to be capable and we'll never apologize for winning. When we beat Kennesaw to open the season 10 to 9, everyone's panicking. I said we will not apologize for winning. All we'll do is keep learning, growing, and getting better. And I think every week besides one this season, our team has done just that. So we've got to take those learns. We've got to apply them to this week. We've got to be able to handle success like we talked about.

So we're weren't too crazy of a world to ever worry about after you win. one thing that you said about your team after that game too that I loved is if you give your defense an inch to defend they will defend it with their life and that's been you guys all season and what what is that like as a head coach knowing that it's fourth and inches and you you're probably going to stop these guys well I would say this it really stems from this I'm a defensive guy right so always have an eye on that but But I've been around these guys for now eight months, and this is the most unselfish defense I've ever been around.

And it's just doing your job. It's trusting that the man next year is going to do his. And we're rotating eight guys up front. We're rotating four linebackers. We're rotating three corners. And no one's coming into my office saying, coach, my agent says I need to play more. Right? I just, there's power in that, guys, and it's rare.

And that's why I bring it up. And we point it out, we show it. These guys have incredible energy every day to the process and the preparation of what it takes to be great. And even last week, they hit a 60-yard run down the sideline. Our corner who messed up, didn't quit on the play, runs it down at the four-yard line, and we hold into a field goal. That's how you win tough physical football games in the ACC. Coach, I've been watching your games, and it looks like Robbie Ashford is, you know, playing maybe the best football of his career. And I think when you have players who have been to,

what is this, this is fourth stop, you know, people lose track or give up on a player. what has it been about his personal makeup and, you know, the ups and downs of his career maybe that have him playing at a higher level in the moment? Well, I would say this, you know, Robbie's stories out there. Everyone sees four schools and assume he's the problem, right? There's been a bunch of different situations. Things have worked out. Things haven't worked out.

You know, we've helped work with him to own that so he can be the best version of himself. And I would say this is if Rob was here, every day isn't easy. But I'm proud of the kid. He's got a banged up knee, he's got a banged up hand. He's playing extremely physical, and he's doing what he's capable of doing because we believe in him. And, you know, I told him from day one, the best player is going to go out there and lead the team. And I think he's taking that, you know, with stride. I think he's always waited for his opportunity.

It's tough, you know, especially in our society, as soon as quarterbacks don't play, you've got to move, you got to find something else. There's something greener out there. So just proud of the kid for keep gut it out and keep playing and hasn't always been easy. even this season. So the future is bright for him. I'm really happy the way he has really responded throughout the course of the season. And then we just been really honest with him.

And I think when you do that with players, they know what we expect and they can respond to it. You mentioned earlier about how the guys that stayed from Coach Clausen's regime, they're still your guys. When did you realize how well the guys who stayed versus the guys who came, that they were going to work

well together that they were going to they were going to be a cohesive team we had this in 2017 when i went to wyoming we walked into a defense that everyone came back had tons of experience in the year before they were awful right so they came in like sponges and the very first meeting we had here i don't care if you came with us from washington estate you were a wait for us holdover you were a transfer you know the the term we used to do it this way cannot exist in our environment They're like, whether you came with us or not, whether you were here or not, we've got to recreate the culture and the vision of a new program, and everyone has to buy into that. Okay, unfortunately in our society today, everyone wants to dip a toe in the water and then

wait for the result before they commit. Okay, we demanded that these guys commit right now to a vision that's going to be awesome, and we're going to create it and navigate the challenges together. And I think that's what inspired our football team, right? Nick Anderson, you know, he's unbelievable. I get all conference safety could have played anywhere in the country first call I made to him he's like coach what do you want me to call I'm all in let's go get this thing and he's he's just been a catalyst for our success and there's a lot of stories like that I just think we got a real special connection in this football team but it takes a lot of sacrifice to get there because I support individuals but you got to work within a team confine and I think that's what our team is doing really well the most terrifying nightmare that I've ever had in my entire life was waking up in the middle of the night and the demon dinkin was in the corner of my bedroom that's a terrifying we you know we got some AI versions of some things we use with like waking

the demons and some of the things that we do that these guys can be a little crepe i mean you got to be nasty got to be tough yeah no i mean the whole nature of the demon deacon is uh is great so he's not the angel deacon there's a reason for a scary mascot i would not want to be a lot to be a little alone in the dark room with everyone's while i see the little kids kind of you know go to high five them and they're kind of yeah i got two things before we let you go coach first one i just want to you know equal time uh are you going to take the new york giant's job i'm just focused on north carolina the good good answer good i just want to make sure both coaches in the game got to ask that question um the other one in i think we may have asked you this

when we had you on earlier but i i'm not i'm not sure did we ask you the rules for life question because sometimes I forget no no we didn't okay great what is your rule for life what what is your rule that you live by hmm that's like I mean you guys gave me some prep work on that I should have that that's my fault that I forgot to ask you when you were on before and I forgot to prep you for it this time I think the biggest thing is like in my life I've learned so much in the last four years being a head coach guys you know I just think you got to be lifelong learners you know just the moment you think you got to figure out. That's when your ass gets knocked down. And my journey's been unique. It's been different.

I've coached for 17 years. I've had 11 different jobs. I've moved my family all over the country. And fit is really important to me. I've learned that through my journey. I was chasing logos and money and other things just like everybody else. And you just got to be around really good people. So the one thing I'll never do in this game is compromise myself, my core values, my family. I never want to be called a fraud. I want to live the way that I'm capable of living and do things the way I think holds up to a high standard. And that's not easy in today's world sometimes. So I know I went on a rambling different deal there, but those are some principles that I think kind of guide, you know, my decision making and my action.

Love it. Love it. Love that you're focused on this game and not in New York Giants job. You're on to North Carolina. And Jake Digger, thank you so much. well thank you guys for having me on you guys do an amazing job really appreciate it and go deeks appreciate you thank you for being here all right that was spectacular did you did you know no woodchippers being used for any purposes other than shipping wood and fargo that's that's good

news yeah and i think that people need to know that i'm aware that fargo actually isn't based on a true story but it does tell you that it is at the beginning of the movie and the show the cohen brothers do that too. But yeah, I'm happy that's not true. That's a wild scene. I've always wanted to go there. Well, yeah, I want to see a game in the Fargo Dome. I think that'd be so much fun. I've seen a game in the Kibby Dome at Idaho. I love small domes. I think we should do like an entire year. I don't know if our bosses would ever sign off on this. It's like small dome tour. Or just like, you know, places that have are in like a typical settings, you know. I like it.

And we have a loyal listener named Ben who reached out to me this week and asked if we would like to come to a BYU game because he heard on the show that I'm, that's a bucket list game for me. And it's like if you have mountains or snow or you're in an area that's hard to, you know, like Wyoming, Idaho, BYU. UIU is not hard to get to, by the way. Saul Lake Airport, 45 minutes away. I know, I know. Easy travel. Is there an airport in Provo? I don't know.

You can fly into the very large airport 45 minutes away. Yeah, it's only 45 minutes away. I thought it was an hour or an hour and a half or something. It's closer. No, if there's no traffic. You're focusing on the wrong thing here, though. It's just like scenic areas that like aren't, you know, why are there or a place that you wouldn't end up going for of the reason outside of football?

Like, why would I ever be in Provo? Why would a random person ever go to Provo? Like, to see football? Like, I don't know. You might end up being in Atlanta for 90 different reasons. It doesn't make their stadium iconic. I want to go to a place where that is the destination. I tell you, the one I want to see is the brawl of the wild.

Yeah. Montana versus Montana State. We can do it in Bozeman. We can do it in Missoula. Either one. And I don't know if I'm sick for this, but like, I actually have no interest in going to these places in the summer. I want to go when they're, like, snowy and they are, like, that's like, the spirit of the game.

Well, and if we do an at Montana State brawl of the wild, I mean, we have to dress as Yellowstone characters. Oh, yeah. Like, I mean, we have to both dress as rip, I think. Yeah, you would probably be better at that than me. I don't have those. You have the brunt work boots. I don't. I can't grow a beard, though.

That's my problem. Can you, like, yeah, what happens if you grow a beard? You can't get it going? It just won't go. It won't fill in. Yeah, sucks the sign. Puberty has not finished, I guess. Yeah.

My friend told me nobody gets everything, Andy. Just remember that. That's exactly. But you know what you can get everything in? You can start your collection at paniniabrica.net. Panini, the makers of the most collectible sports cards on the planet. Early in the week, Ari was showing some beautiful cards that he's just added to his collection. I am going to rip a pack of Donorous football right now.

This is 2025 Donner's football. We have a shot. we might be able to get an auto might be able to get a patch card here so we're going to see what we got we're looking for the rather elusive but highly lucrative and valuable downtown insert yes all right we got gino stone alvin camera Oluafimi Ola Dehu Michael Pennix Jr. One of my favorite players,

Derwin James. Dog. Got an all-time Charles Woodson. Got an Abdul Carter. Ooh. Okay, here we go. Checklist here. Oh, I'm sorry.

The champ is here. There's a checklist here. The champ is here. Jalen Hertz. Okay. He is a champ. Tijer Spears, Tulane Great. And the guy with the best accent in all the football,

Carolina Panthers receiver, former South Carolina Gamecock, Xavier Lajette. He will give you a recipe to cook up some squirrel. What you got there, Ari? There is a 2025 Padini impeccable Dan Marino with a gold bar. I mean, a silver bar in it. And he's ripping packs. I'm showing you the nukes that I have on my desk. That's a ounce of silver, which I think is worth 60 bucks by itself if you rip that

or out. You know, precious metals, we've talked a lot about on the show. But Dan Marino, NFL legend, that card's a pretty big card. So I've got to go through some of the ones that I've hit recently. You know, remember Mason Taylor came on our show? Here's a... Absolutely. impeccable 25 Mason-Taylor draft patch with the 25 on there

and then Matthew Golden was also on our show and here's a patch out of origins this year so I can keep going but you know we don't want this oh one last one just to marry yours with mine here's Xavier Leggette contenders optic rookie card very nice very nice yep all right

Panini, America.net, to start your collection today. One guy who may have quite a bit of money to start his collection, Mike Norvell. So let's go to the War Chant Tribal Council Message Board. North Vanol has a thread called Any Support to Retain Mike Norville has disappeared. And I think if you watch the Clemson game, that is probably a very understandable sentiment.

And I, you know, talking to people at Florida State, reading, you know, what the folks write on the message board of War Chant, it does seem like any support he had has completely eroded. It's not just that last year was awful. It's that they do not seem to really be getting any better. And that is really frustrating Florida State fans. Yeah. And, like, not really getting much, much better from last year is really bad. You know, it's one thing if you're 8, 4, 8, 4, 8, and 4, 8, and 4, and 4, and you're not getting any better.

But to go from absolutely awful to just awful, I guess it's a marginal improvement because you can't take away what happened against Alabama, but the rest of the years looked a lot like last year. Now, last year they were completely like. North VA, Noel brings it up, the way they start this thread is a good point. says a few days ago the boosters sent out their annual email to solicit ticket renewals for 2006. I was not amused at the timing. And I get that. I get that because you are frustrated. Now, when this one, when this renewal came out, this was before the Clemson loss. It was coming off

the Wake Forest win. And it's probably, I'm assuming the seminal boosters were probably like, okay, now's the time. Let's get this thing out here. but that's the problem when even after a win this sort of thing and this sort of thing is a season ticket renewal which is something you have to send when it's landing and insulting people you know you're in a bad spot yeah because people can't even think about the idea of spending more money to go watch that product and like you've always said this and it's true like if you lose people's desire to go to games or to purchase tickets, then what do you have? Yeah.

Now, I will say we talked about Mike Norville's sideline demeanor in the Clemson game and what we've seen from him this year. And it is looked, I don't even know how to describe it. It seems like someone who kind of knows the end is near. But interestingly enough, this week, Mike Norvel came out with some fire. And it reminded me a lot of early FSU Mike Norville before the build, before they ended up winning the ACC title in 2023, as they were working their way toward that.

And this is the first I've seen this version of Mike Norvel in a while. And so we're going to play the clip. I want you to watch this, Ari, and tell me, does it feel different? Does it matter? But here's Mike Norvel this week. And I'm fully aware of the outside narrative around our team is not. good. Around me is probably not good. That's fine. I don't, I mean, that will not affect, right,

the job that I'm going to show up and do. The job I'm going to show up and do is I'm going to everything I have in this team with a championship expectation, right, for us to go, grow and be better. And why I can say that, because I've actually won a championship. I've done that, and we're going to do it again, and we're going to do it here, right? And people, that might piss people off, so be it. They'll be celebrating when we're hoisting a trophy and it will be the belief and that I see from our players, the belief that I see from our coaches, that talent that I know that our players have

and the guys that are coming to be a part of this, I mean, I've got elite level confidence for what's ahead of us. And I know not everybody wants to hear that. I don't care. Like, I know what it's going to be, and I'm grateful for the opportunity that I have. Also understand it has not been good enough, right?

And the results, they matter. Right? But we're going to take that step and we're going to get the job done. It doesn't move me at all. That was what I was wondering, because I can tell you there's a speech just like that that he does. I want to say it was 2022, or might have been 2021. It was, I think it was after they lost, it might have been after they lost of Jacksonville State,

and it was not immediately after the game, but the week, you know, the weekly press conference after that. And he said it, the phrasing was very similar. and the fire was similar. And so that's what I was wondering, because that one, I remember rewatching that when they were in the midst of winning the ACs title in 2020. I'm like, man, he laid it all out there.

That's exactly what happened. But hearing it now, well, I just don't think he's going to have the opportunity to make good on that. And that's the thing. I think he's got to win all three games to even have a chance, all three remaining games to even have a chance of that.

Yeah, and by the way, if that spread is real, holy crap. BetMGM has them 13.5 point favorites against Virginia Tech. That seems like a pretty big spread for a team. See, the thing is they did beat Wake Forest 42 to 7 at home. I know, I know. That was kind of an anomalous result, but they do seem to be better in Tallahassee than they are away from Tallahasse. I mean, that's a difference between this year and last year. Last year's team just flatlined and never came back to life.

this year's team has had some really big lows but has had the highest of highs too so um you know I don't know but I do understand and the thing that like really should have stood out to you from the rant that you just played is we're going to win championships we've done it before just kind of like reminding people that like hey we've it hasn't been a crap sandwich I won the ACC two years ago that's that's what he's saying but the thing is I won the ACC two years ago, I think is completely erased by the two and 10 season you had last year. You don't really get to claim it anymore.

Yeah, I mean, I, you cannot let it get that bad at a place like Florida State. I mean, if you actually go around and look at Florida, Miami, LSU, um, A&M, Texas, Oklahoma, places that have been traditionally great, that have had some rough,

And maybe Oklahoma is a bad example because they really have. They don't really have those. But I'm just saying like when you think about legacy programs down periods, you don't see a lot of two and ten. You know what I mean? Like their down periods are six and six, eight and four, like to allow it to a road that much.

And maybe it's easier to, you know, happen in this day and age because you are losing players in a transient situation much more rapidly than you ever have before. But Florida State by itself, just the helmet, the logo, the name should always put you in a position regardless of who the coach is

to at least get good enough players or enough good players to never go 2 in 10. Right? Like 2 in 10 is just a low that I can't even fathom out of place like that. So, yeah. I mean, and then if you rebound it and what are they going to win?

Four games this year, five games? Well, they've won four games. So if they could go to a bowl if they win two of the last three. So they play Virginia Tech at home, then it's at NC State and at Florida. They are 0 and 3 on the road so far. NC State is playing well.

NC State just boat race Georgia Tech. I mean, if they win two or three and one of them is Florida, is he back? Maybe. I think he probably has to win them all, though. Like, you read that message board threat. That's one of many that say the same thing.

Oh, yeah. I mean, I don't even have to read it. I know what they're saying. Yeah. Because Florida State fans are fed up, they're done. They've given their last ounce of support for this. And I think I don't blame them. And I think Mike Norville knows that.

I think that's what that speech was about. Yeah. But I also think, too, that they are, sometimes I think fans can get a little carried away. And sometimes I think fans aren't rational. I don't think that Florida State fans are being irrational. I don't think this is being irrational either. I think this is incredible frustration for a situation that feels hopeless.

And they would like to feel some hope again. And that hope is going to be expensive. So we'll see what happens. Another fan base that also wants to feel some hope again, but they're going to get a change is Auburn. This megaboard thread coming from Auburnsports.com. Our Pete Naco's wrote a story. coaching search Intel latest on the search for Hugh Fries's replacement.

And of course mentions the usual suspect names Tulane's John Summerall, obviously is the one that we've connected to Auburn the entire time. The names that Pete has heard connected to the Auburn job, interim coach DJ Durkin could get a chance. USF's Alex Golish, former Penn State head coach James Franklin, Georgia Tech's Brent Key, Memphis's is Ryan Silverfield and Missouri's Eli Drinkwitz. Now, Ari, also Justin Hockinson. who writes for Auburn Sports had a really good story about the process Auburn is going through

and how while their job opened up later than some of these other ones, they have moved very quickly. And it seems like John Cohen, their AD, has talked to some candidates already. And they feel like they have a pretty good handle on the pool. Yeah. Is this a good time to, like, go on my James Franklin should go there, rant? Do it. I think that every single time a place like Auburn or any place in the SEC or Big Ten, for that matter,

hires a coach, you do so with the hope that that team person could not win you only a conference championship of make a deep playoff run, right? That's the ultimate dream. And I think that Auburn is a program that, you know, for as long as I can remember, and you're a better SEC historian than me, has been very, very low and very, very high. They are the most roller coaster experience for fans of any team. And I wonder, if you make this higher, does the goal have to be go get the person that you think is the highest likelihood of winning you a national championship? Or do you go get the person who puts an end to the roller coaster provides stability might win a national championship? But if he doesn't, will provide you the groundwork for your following hire.

to be the right person. I always wonder if whenever you make a hire, if it has to be one higher away, are you always one higher away? I don't think it's like that anymore. The example I always use because I covered it as a beat writer is Ron Zuck going into Urban Meyer at Florida. Ron Zuck laid the foundation for Urban Meyer. That's fine going from 2004 to 2005. That doesn't work anymore in 2025 going into 2026 because the roster might not be there anymore. They may made us all leave. Yeah. I wonder how much, and like,

I guess like foundationally, like how much of it is roster? Would you say it's 75%? If the roster, like, if you can keep the Auburn roster together, I think you, you feel like you're pretty, that's a pretty good place to start, right?

Yeah, I think so. No, I think so for sure. I think part of the reason why Hugh Freeze is not there is because the roster was better than the output. Like some people get fired, because their team stinks, and the reason why their team stinks is because they did a bad job of accumulating talent.

I don't think that's what Hugh Freeze did wrong. That said, like James Franklin might get an eye roll from Auburn fans because he got fired at Penn State for never getting over the hump and winning a national title. But would you take 10 to 13 wins a year at Auburn? And the answer is yes. If you're Auburn, you would want to be on that roller coaster and playing in the games that Penn State has played in every year.

and then who knows maybe James Franklin I just fundamentally push back at the notion that like a person who has had a hard time winning big games could never win them ever like I don't know like if I view it that We are of the theory that if you knock on the door enough times eventually you get through

I think Auburn should be hiring somebody who knocked a lot like he knocked a lot and you know has played has been a coach in that conference before and I think stability and year-over-year success is a pretty important aspect of being a happy fan. And, like, Auburn hasn't had that.

So instead of thinking, who's the coach that gives us the highest likelihood of winning a national title, I think I would go for the coach that gives me the most likelihood of winning 11 games every year and playing Alabama in meaningful atmospheres over and over and over again until you finally break through. Like, that's how I view it. And also, James Franklin, like John Summerall seems to be. the layup here, right? And I don't have a single bad thing to say about John Summerall. But has John Summerall done anything in his that makes you feel like he has a higher likelihood of winning a national title than Jim's Franklin? He did

essentially some of the stuff that Franklin did early in his career. Right. But like there's no national championship on his resume. No, no. He won the Sunbelt twice at Troy. In both years, he was there. He took Tulane in the American Championship game last year. They didn't win it. may take Tulane to the American Championship game again this year. He might make the playoff this year. Five years of going to your conference championship game or winning it in five years of being a head coach, which is pretty good. It would be four and four and four.

Yeah. It's pretty good. That sounds like a Wendy's deal. It does. Hey, if you want to come back, Wendy's. You missed the spicy nugs, dude. I'll tell you. You just got a free ad there.

I will smash those spicy nugs. Those were actually like really good. They were very good, very good. Well, we usually tell you afterward if we didn't like a product that we had a sponsor for, but we love that one. I think Wendy's has a real real case for being the best fast food nugget out there, depending on what you prefer. But anyway, I think I'm an attractive candidate. I am with you on that. I think if Florida State makes a move, I think he should be considered there.

I think Auburn should be considering him. I'm pretty sure Virginia Tech is considering him and would love an answer if he'd like to come. I think he's going to have a job next year. I just don't know where he's going to be. And I hope for him that he's at a place that actually gives him an opportunity to play in those games that Penn State played. I think he's worthy of a top 15 job in America still.

I think you're right. I think you're right. And I am fascinated to see where he ends up because this cycle is so, there's so much going on. There's so many jobs. open and like we kind of touched on it we'll touch on it more as the as the weeks go by but you're starting to see the NFL cycle start spinning there actually aren't a ton of obvious coordinators in the NFL that are just guaranteed to get head coaching jobs so you may see NFL teams dipping in

college football too this is going to get pretty wild here in the next and it might be nice for James Franklin to not live in a constant world where he's being directly compared to one of the most bulletproof and sustained successful programs in the country every year. What? I was just saying, like, being compared to Ohio. I don't want to go to Auburn is what you're saying. Yeah, maybe not Auburn. I was like, wait, are we talking about Auburn or Penn State?

No, no, no. Auburn would be a bad, bad fit if that's the case. But if he gets one of the other six jobs that are open, he doesn't have to get compared to the best program in college football every day of his life. Yeah, and that is the issue when you are up against Ohio State or up against to Alabama as an annual arrival. So, yes, that is the problem. Ohio State has been more,

it probably feels like we'll be more consistent for the 10 years out now, too. I don't know. I think Kailin DeBore's doing all right. So he may have Alabama in the same place. Who knows. But I'm with you. I understand exactly what you're saying there.

And I do think, given the number of jobs, we will see James Franklin somewhere. I just don't know where yet. and that is going to make the next maybe that's month yeah I'm now very funny because I was thinking about writing a column and I'm like maybe that's the case

why he's not a good fit for their job uh oh you talk yourself out of it already no I'm just saying like if he failed once because he couldn't get over the hump by playing an immovable object as a rival

uh that would be the same exact situation, except the rivalry would be even more heated in Auburn because Penn State and Ohio State isn't the Ohio State Michigan. Right. It's not the Ohio's of Michigan. Yeah. I don't know. We're talking stuff through. It's a podcast, man. Exactly. Yeah. I'm glad I helped you workshop it. I appreciate that. Hold on here. You hear that? That's the delete button. So listen, we love when you help us workshop this show. Send us your questions for Dear Andy and Ari. Andy Stapleson3 at gmail.com Ari.wasterman aton3.com.

We've already got some great questions. There's one. Well, actually there's two. There's one that just said the subject line was like, damn it, Ari. That one's getting read. Yeah. There's another one that really ties into this coaching carousel

from our friend Arthur, who emails quite a bit. That's going to get red. I can tell you right now. But if you would like to grab one of the other spots on the show, Andy Stapleson3 at gmail.com. Or ari.wasseman and on. And I wanted to preview what it's kind of like because I have met people through this job that have direct lines for questions and thoughts. And I wanted to read a text before we get out of here that I got from somebody involved in the college football playoff.

Okay. He listens to our show. He said he's a very big fan of the show, but he wanted to correct us on one thing. Uh-oh. He said the college football playoff committee does not use any of the ESPN metrics because they don't have transparent formulas. Our protocol prohibits that. You guys say that we use strength of record. You could be confused because we did construct a resume metric in the off season that we are calling record strength that is similar,

but completely different formula and mathematical framework than the strength of record that you would find on ESPN. That is a very good correction, and I will take that into account. Although I think it's the same thing, kind of. Well, it may not be the same thing. So we need, but now are they making theirs available? Well, I'll have to check with CFP people because if they're beef with the ESPN one is they're not publicly available, which I think is actually a really good argument against it, I'd like to see the formula they're using. I think that would be very insightful. Yeah, I think that we use the ESPN one because that's the one that's available to us.

And I don't know how similar the results are. But it's the thing. If they're not similar at all, it doesn't really matter. And we are not helping the discourse by saying that. So I will, I'm going to call those guys and see if we can get a copy of their methodology. I don't know if we'd be able to do it. I already responded to this person. Yeah, we're a bad at math podcast.

So I'm sure I couldn't do this myself. So hopefully someone else can. But yeah, I'm with you on that. I would like to see exactly what they're using so that we can compare apples to apples because I think that would be very, very instructive for the audience as well. I mean, and it also kind of just brings up the one gripe that I have with the college football playoff in general is that there's zero transparency whatsoever. And if you go read, and like, and this isn't a Mack Rhodes insult, this is just the reality of it. If you go read any transcript of any post-reveal interview that you do with the committee chair, there's no information there at all.

No, and the person's in an impossible position because they're speaking for 13 people who all have different opinions. I think, and I don't know if this is ever possible, I think they should televise the deliberations. Oh, I'd watch. Like, I don't want to watch the Made for TV show. We have to because we have to tell you what the rankings are. But if I were an actual viewer who is trying to decide whether to vote my spare time to this, that I'd watch every second of it.

They'll never do it, but I'd watch it. Yeah. Because I don't want you to watch it. tomorrow's show. Dear Andy, dear Ari, send us your questions. We will do our best to answer. John Ewing from Bed-MGM will also join us. Every time he's come on, he's thrown out some really interesting insights.

And maybe he will help Ari and I as we decide on our mulligans because Thursday is also Mulligan day. So we'll decide who gets the mulligan. Who's taking more points? Who's flipping sides? Maybe Ari's flipping sides on a game. We'll find out. Until tomorrow.