Andy & Ari On3 - Michigan responds to the Big Ten | Arizona coach Jedd Fisch | James Madison coach Curt Cignetti

Episode Date: November 9, 2023

Michigan responds to the Big Ten | Arizona coach Jedd Fisch | James Madison coach Curt CignettiThis episode is sponsored by Rhoback, makers of the most comfortable hoodies, Q-zips and polos on the planet. In fact, Andy is wearing the green performance hoodie that allowed him to make a one-handed catch in the 2022 Texas A&M-Alabama game. Visit Rhoback.com and use the code STAPLES for 20 percent off your first order.Thanks also to Gametime for sponsoring today's episode! Week 11 is days away, don't miss your chance to watch your favorite team. Download the Gametime App and enter code: STAPLES for $20 off your first purchase, terms apply. Last Minute Tickets, Lowest Prices, Guaranteed.(0:00-25:26) Dan Wetzel Joins to Update on Michigan (25:27-43:35) Arizona Head Coach Jedd Fisch Joins(43:36-45:55) Dear Andy, Can JMU Be Bowl Eligible This Year?(45:56-56:38) James Madison Head Coach Curt Cignetti Joins(56:39-1:02:12) Would a Harbaugh Suspension Boost or Hurt TV Ratings?Want to watch the show instead? Head on over to YouTube and subscribe! https://youtube.com/live/BsaUB2Bs-RIMichigan's attorneys sent a 10-page response to the Big Ten outlining the reasons they believe coach Jim Harbaugh should face no disciplinary action from Big Ten commissioner Tony Pettiti in the signal-stealing case that has now entered its third week. The Wolverines threw out a variety of arguments, some more persuasive than others. Dan Wetzel of Yahoo! Sports obtained a copy of the response, and he joins the show to explain how Michigan plans to fight any potential action.Will Harbaugh be suspended? Or will the conference wait for the NCAA to complete its investigation, which likely wouldn't happen until after the season?Later, Arizona coach Jedd Fisch joins the show to discuss how his team became one of the hottest in America. The Wildcats, who face Colorado on Saturday, required a roster rebuild similar to the one the Buffaloes are undergoing. But Fisch explained how Arizona's rebuild had to be done differently and why being forced to build through high school recruiting and the transfer portal might have helped the Wildcats lay a foundation.Next, James Madison coach Curt Cignetti joins to discuss his undefeated team. The Dukes are not bowl eligible at the moment because they're only in their second season in the FBS, but James Madison's president and athletic director are petitioning the NCAA board of directors to allow them to play in the postseason. A waiver would make JMU eligible for the Sun Belt title game and a potential New Year's Six bowl.Next, it's Dear Andy, where Andy answers your questions.... on tomorrow's show!

Welcome to Andy Staples on three. It is a packed show. Packed show. We've got Jed Fish, Arizona coach, the coach of the hottest team in the country. We've got Kirk Cignetti, coach of an undefeated team that is not allowed to go to a bowl game because they got too good too fast. And of course, there's the huge news. Michigan's response to the Big Ten.

Jim Harbaugh's response to the Big Ten, a separate document. Big news, we bring in Dan Wetzel from Yahoo Sports, who broke those two things, has those two documents, has allowed you to read them at Yahoo Sports. And how are we doing, Dan? Doing well, Andy. Long day, day but yeah doing great you thanks for doing good no problem i i appreciate it this is uh this is quite a quite a document that michigan has said is a 10-page document basically they throw a lot of defenses out there they go from uh we would like due process to you've not used this sportsmanship policy for this purpose before to why would anyone listen to Connor Stallions? What was the most compelling argument from Michigan, you think, to the Big Ten?

Yeah, you know, I think the two things would be that they are going to extraordinary lengths to use this sportsmanship policy which is basically almost never used and if it is it's for like you know some kind of incident with a referee or mascots are are actually mentioned in in the bylaws. Mascots, bands. They're trying to use sportsmanship to come in and punish Michigan for allegations that have not yet been fully investigated, let alone adjudicated. And there's really no... it's purely punitive. There's no existential threat, right?

They're not, everyone knows Michigan probably has their signs changed. I mean, if you're walking in with the same signs against Michigan, you pretty much deserve to lose at this point. So I thought that was fairly compelling. Like this is just over the top considering what, you know, what are we doing here? There's also the part where really the,

the clause that, so the, the NCAA has a thing called strict liability for coaches now, and it's a first year and it's never been applied until now we will see, but the big 10 does not. It has a strict liability for institutions. So the Big Ten, the Big Ten is trying to use an NCAA rule to overrule their rule while trying to. It gets kind of convoluted on all of that. And I thought that was it.

The biggest thing to me about this and with the Tom Mars letter, Jim Harbaugh's attorney. What I hate about the NCAA is they put a gag order if you're accused. Right. You don't have the right to remain silent. You have to be silent, except to them. And so we don't get like the great Dateline NBC, you know, little interviews and stuff. No, they don't have a chance to explain maybe some points or reasoning that would change the public discourse. And this is the first chance we've really had for either Michigan or Harbaugh to put out their side of the story,

at least a little in the parameters of this. They're still, they're still kind of held back. And, you know, look, maybe even a Ohio state fan might be like, yeah, that isn't a bad point there. Right. But we've never been able to hear that because there isn't there isn't that opportunity in a vacuum. You know, everybody's guilty. It's a huge conspiracy, all of that. So that's what I found most interesting. Whether this is going to work, I have no idea. I mean, they're probably still suspend them but hey at least we we learned some stuff well what is what is jim harbaugh's defense according to to tom mars well i'll just give you one example there were a few different ones this is i thought a very good example so one of the things i think all of us said all right you got this guy connor stallions now it's not against the rules for connor stallions to have stolen the signs right runner stallions everyone's like we're standing right next to Harbaugh. Yeah, Harbaugh knows he's the sign stealer.

Every team has a sign stealer. There's literally a guy designated on these teams to be the sign stealer. It was Connor Stallions. They said, well, he had to have known Connor Stallions was sending his buddies around the country and filming these things because Connor Stallions was so good at getting the signs, right? He's the sign stealer. Right.

And the only way to get it would be this cheating method. And Mars points out that the story in the AP and ESPN saying, you know, Ohio State and Rutgers sent Michigan signs that they had acquired, presumably through video and in-person scouting and whatever they had to do, but not illegally, like during the game. And Ohio State denies that they sent it, but they sent it to Purdue to use last year, the big title game. Well, Mars points out those signs were 100% accurate. Rutgers had the signs 100% accurate. Ohio State had the signs 100% accurate. Ergo, it's not that hard to steal the signs legally.

So why would Jim Harbaugh, because Connor Stallions can do exactly what Rutgers, someone at Rutgers and someone at Ohio State can do, why would Jim Harbaugh be presumed to have to, you should have been suspicious. Why would he be suspicious? It's not that hard to do. Connor Stallions was just choosing this method to do it. I hope that makes sense. I thought,

all right, that's a pretty good explanation. As long as there's no paper trail, which we don't know. There's no paper trail, but you're like, okay, that makes some sense.

I had never thought of that point. Right. So I hate the gag order because sometimes there's just basic stuff of like, someone could go, yeah, yeah, that's not it. What about that? And you go, oh, well, all right. That might be it. Right.

So I'm always looking for information. Um, I thought that was a reasonable point. I mean, Harbaugh has been dragged for three weeks. Everyone's screaming, you had to have known because how else would this guy be able to do it? And you go, well, actually every other team could do it legally. Why would we think it must be attained illegally? Why don't we just think, oh, this guy was able to do it. I will point out that Ryan Day said Wednesday night that nobody at Ohio State, he denies that anybody at Ohio state sent those signals. Uh, Greg Shiano at Rutgers, I believe he said, not,

uh, not going to dignify that with a response more or less. And we have other things to do, which is not no, but, uh, it was, uh,

it, it is interesting because, you know, the Ohio state fans will say that's what about ism, but the, the Michigan fans pointing out. And I think, you know,

Michigan's own response points out if you're using the sports fans pointing out, and I think Michigan's own response points out, if you're using the sportsmanship policy, is it not also unsportsmanlike for teams to gang up on another team and hand over things to help yet another team beat that team? You know, this is the problem with sports. I don't know what sportsmanship is. And neither does the Big Ten. If you read their bylaw, they have no, there's no definition. Is that unsportsmanlike?

I think some people would say that. Other people would be like, hey, fair game. It's college football. I don't really care. It's not unsportsmanlike to me. Yeah. But I get their point. football i don't really care it would it's not on sportsman like to me yeah and really it's point yeah but the michigan fans see what they want to see in it the ohio state fans see what they want to see in it and the michigan state fans see what they want to see in it and you know it all that really matters is what tony patiti the big 10 commissioner decides to do and then what Michigan decides to do in response to that. So he has the authority

to suspend people within the Big Ten for up to two games. There's a committee that can approve something longer than that. And he may or may not do that. And so what do we think is going to happen here in these next couple of days? That's the thing. And that would be Michigan's point. You don't have that right because Jim Harbaugh has done nothing on sportsman-like because nothing has been proven that Jim Harbaugh knew, or you have any proof, or you even have an investigation complete that he did anything. Connor Stallions, probably suspend him. Jim Harbaugh, no. So whether he has that right, believe me,

it will find its way into a courthouse. Look, there's been a lot of pushing of Big Ten saying suspend him indefinitely, which would essentially be until the end of the NCAA investigation, which would take Jim Harbaugh out for the rest of the season. He could certainly go this two-game route. Is it Penn State and Maryland? Does this get done by Penn State? Is it then Maryland, Ohio State?

I think any suspension, Michigan will fight and try to get an injunction. Could it just be a fine? It's interesting, Andy, because I get the sign the, the, the sign stealing and the cheating. It's, it's fun. And the stallion stories are incredible. Uh, this guy's just a world-class character in this character driven sport. Um, all of it's very interesting, but long-term to me, the most interesting part here, and I know I probably don't approach this all the way, cause I'm not a fan of any of the,

of Michigan or Ohio state or whatever, is the response by the NCAA and the Big Ten and how they did it. And I've argued all along, the precedent here for the Big Ten is super dangerous for them. If they go hardcore on Jim Harbaugh right now, whether you think he deserves it or not, whether you hate Michigan or not, the idea that you'd just start wailing away on a guy like that without due process,

guess whose coach it's going to be next time. Right, it'll be your team's coach and you will feel the same way. The other thing about this, Dan, we've seen when the NCAA has gone faster than its process allows. That got dragged into court. That ultimately got overturned with Penn State. I would assume if any sort of suspension comes down for Harbaugh or for a coach that Michigan feels like they need, whether it's an assistant or Harbaugh, they're going to sue, try to get an injunction and then just, you know, run out the clock until

the season's over. At least the season's over. Do they then, you know, Harbaugh get an extension and stay? Cause look at Michigan has been extremely loyal to the guy. Does he go to the guy does he go to the nfl possibly um you know i don't know and then you you take whatever ncaa penalty is eventually coming uh i mean connor stallions violated the rules here i don't think there's any question on that and jim harbaugh is already locked in his own ncaa investigation which was his own doing and and he dragged on longer jim harbaugh has made numerous mistakes to put himself in this this position and at some point you get like the a stiff penalty on like the lifetime achievement award of of keep finding yourself here so there will be probably additional punishment additional suspensions he's not helping himself but does he

stay and say hey i'll serve that next year now next year second week of the season it's not like this year where it's man they haven't played a tough game yet right uh texas is coming to ann arbor too so that could be a simple well you know we'll get to that but i think right now harbaugh's goal is to keep coaching his team he's got a very good team he's got it certainly got a chance to make the playoff again. These next three weeks, though, are it. At Penn State, Maryland, Ohio State. What happened? So they're trying to run out the clock and deal with it later, but they also feel there is a definite feeling at Michigan and certainly with Jim Harbaugh that, look, there's not going to be anything.

Connor Stallions acted alone on this. He was an up-and-coming assistant coach who was trying to impress his bosses. He's not telling anybody what he's doing. He's just trying to pretend he's really good at stealing signs like the coaches at other schools that are good at stealing signs and have great job security because they can do it. Stallions obviously violated the rules though. So where do we go from here? I don't know. It's going to be interesting. Big Ten, when you're an organization, when you belong to an organization, it's hard to voluntarily sue that organization and win.

So Michigan could lose here also. I really have no idea. Well, I don't think Michigan would care about suing and winning. I think that's a matter of you want to get that injunction so that like you don't want that to go to discovery or anything like that. You would just as soon get the injunction and then you drop it the second the season's over and then you deal with whatever the NCAA. Because my whole thing about this, like when this initially happened, because I was not thinking along the lines of the rest of the Big Ten would try to force the conference into doing something right now.

My assumption was this will drag out. The NCAA will do what it does. The NCAA wants scalps. They want individual scalps. They know it's bad PR to punish schools' programs now. So they would go to Michigan and say, okay, we would like to suspend Jim Harbaugh for some ungodly amount of games with the hope that they'll just fire him. And then they can say,

we got this scalp and that's that, like that would make the most sense based on history and based on how they're trying to do things now. And I just don't like, but this now, this pressure for the Big Ten to act now, like, I agree with you. I don't think they've considered what the consequences are for that. Because here's the other piece of this, Dan. This is what I keep thinking about. This is not Indiana. This is Michigan. And you can say, well, they were voluntarily a member

of the Big Ten all you want. They they were voluntarily a member of the big 10. All you want. They could voluntarily be a member of somebody else tomorrow. If they'd like, if the big 10 doesn't want to have them anymore. Yeah. Or independent. Yeah. I mean, Michigan's a big enough program that they could, they could secure a Notre Dame like deal perhaps even better. Greg Sankey would probably sit there in Birmingham.

I think a Santa Odo call, Santa Odo on line one gets through real quick into Birmingham. But yeah, I mean, that's down the line. Are they this frustrated with it? You know, look, I think the way the Big Ten has jumped, the NCAA roaring in like this was this massive thing. I think a very experienced NCAA, we have a rookie president. We have a rookie commissioner of the Big Ten.

I think a more experienced commissioner handles this a little differently. The moment I, again, whatever happens, it goes. But I found it notable when they're having conference calls between the commissioner and the other coaches who are then suggesting punishment. Like, wait, what? Like, who cares what these guys think? Like, if something happened in East Lansing or Columbus, the last person I would care for their opinion is Jim Harbaugh. We know they don't like him. They always want to run them out. I was like, you're really having, and they're yelling and you've got to do something. And this, I don't know that he's got enough to be like, Hey, you guys are all stealing each other's signs and you're sending it around.

Purdue ends up, okay. Nobody sent Purdue, Rutgers and Ohio State's signals. Well, they apparently ended up with them. I don't know how. It must have been just a bird dropped them off. I will say, though, these things happen every single week. We have not litigated. What is the definition of in-person scout? Hasn't been litigated.

We haven't thought. They ran in saying this is a grand conspiracy. And like I said, Harbaugh had to know because this guy was so good and tom mars is going there well you know why why doesn't brian dace suspect his guy i i don't know about you but i i found that when it's something that not like there there are some things that are against the ncw rules that most coaches do or are perfectly willing to upset. They're just like, eh, whatever. But if it's something that not a lot of people do, then that's where it gets weird like this.

This is one I don't think there's a lot of people who send people to other games. Just like they got really upset about what Arizona State was doing during COVID. Yeah. Cause they were like, we're actually for once we're actually trying to follow the rules and these guys didn't. So yeah. Yeah.

Which, you know, the Michigan, that, that particular one cheeseburger gate, I actually am somewhat sympathetic toward Harbaugh, but when they hit, when they hit you with the receipt,

probably don't say, I don't recall again. Like, you don't say you recall, but here's the thing. Like, that's not an, that's a rule that they would have in the NFL. If, if, if, if on March 1st, you can first speak to free agents and you, and, and, and someone's meeting, um, you know, Sean McVay's meeting with the one on February 22nd, go in it. That's a Sean McVay catching a stray here. Um,nd. Go ahead. That's a, no, no. Sean McVay catching a stray here. Um,

just, yeah, sorry. Just picked him out. Um, you go, wait, you can't do that. Right.

You'd be punished. So like Harbaugh violated those rules. Like those were, those were dumb rules to violate. They say you can't meet with them. You don't meet with them. It's, it's,

it's a calendar. What I'm saying is an admission of violation of those rules. Probably is a slap on the wrist. Oh no. He gets education and nothing, but he didn't. and it drags on it's a hardball there's always drama but i i agree with your basic point and and i you know i wrote a column it's i what what purdue did by having two schools or some mysterious entity send him two schools stolen signals of michigan isn't any different than what con or Stallion did. It's just one of them is

accepted practice by coaches and the other isn't. But at the end of the day- Well, and one of them is specifically banned, but not for the reason you're thinking. I don't think any of, I think both are specifically banned. It's what's your definition of an in-person scout? Now, all it says is you you're saying is the person from the other school acting in their capacity as a coach in that game is but then when they give it to you every coach at an ohio state and and so okay it just says you can't go in person scout that's really all it says it doesn't really, it never defines who is you. Well, obviously, it doesn't say, hey, you can't have your Army buddies

or your Marine buddies go to games and film. It was 1994 they wrote this thing. But I think it's a fair interpretation of the rule to say you can't do what Connor Stallion did, right? Right. I do enjoy, though, that when they wrote that rule, if you wanted to bring a camcorder into the game, it's like shoulder mounted.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, so dumb. All these rules are very nebulous. They're poorly written. I mean, you read the rule book, you're like, wait, that's it? That's insane. But look, let's take Rutgers. Rutgers has figured out Michigan's signs.

They play a game. During the game, the coaches see that their signs work, or they add, or they maneuver it a little bit maybe, whatever it is. The moment Rutgers plays Michigan, those signs are now in person. That is an in-person scout. They are there in-person scouting and then handing their information it is if they give it to somebody else it's not if they don't someone else yeah if they don't know if it's before you go well we didn't play him this year but what do you think hey uh you know that's fine

but the moment they play you can this has never been litigated this is the problem what is an in-person scout i think a big 10 coaching staff is a heck of an in-person scout and so it's talking to some lawyers this is this is the problem is they haven't the big 10 is walking into something like that and you go well what's an in-person scout and they go we don't know yeah well okay so you know it's just it's not no one is thinking this thing out because until three weeks ago, not one person in this entire sport cared about any of this. Or had thought about that rule.

So coaches are saying, these coaches on the conference call go, oh, it's perfectly fine to send the sense up to your buddy. Now, maybe these guys are saying they didn't all of a sudden, but everybody else admits that they share all the information because that's just the way we've done it. We don't consider it a violation. Well, whether you are whether the people doing a doing something, consider it a violation does not has no bearing on whether it is or isn't a violation. And again, asking the coaches what they think was like sign one that this thing was off the rails well i i cannot wait to see what happens next because this is the dumbest funniest story maybe in college football history i i want the connor stallions movie i don't know who plays him i haven't quite figured that out yet but i'm on a stallions the

funniest part is connor stallions has made a fortune in the last three weeks like he's so much money. I'm buying the manifesto because it's like he doesn't even have to public, like he doesn't even get to work on that. He can just send that to a publisher. He sells his interview to whatever documentary company will, and you got a Netflix deal or a, you know, Amazon deal or whatever. He's made a, of all the stupid sport, this guy just made a lot of money.

Now he may never coach again, but he made a lot of money. So I don't know. I don't know where it's going to end up other than court. But it's been pretty, it's been interesting. It's fun. I think most people have lost the plot at this point, but hey, whatever. Well, once the vacuum cleaner showed up, I was, I was just hooked again. It's like, why is he repairing vacuum cleaners? We all have odd jobs in our twenties. You gotta be,

you know, you're just doing it. I was a flag football ref once. Yeah. You know, whatever you got, whatever it takes. I don't know. You cannot make this guy up. Dan Wetzel. Thank you so much. Thank you, Andy. Oh my goodness. This is, the story is the gift that keeps on giving. I don't know when the next shoe drops. I would assume the Big Ten makes some decision at some point. Like, do you make the decision now? Do you make the decision next week? I suspect no matter what happens, there will be a response from Michigan. If anyone is suspended,

that Michigan will respond with a lawsuit, with a request for an injunction to keep that suspension from happening until after the season ends. So either way, there will be lawyers. That's really all there is to it. We got to talk about some other games. Michigan Penn State obviously is going to be off the charts crazy because we still don't know what's going to happen. But we hit all the Coach Prime games early in the season.

We're going to talk about the game that Coach Prime is coaching in, but not about his side. Colorado has the misfortune of playing the hottest team in America, the Arizona Wildcats, winners of three in a row. They're now bowl eligible. They were playing pretty well before that, just couldn't quite get over the hump. And then the dam broke, and they have looked awesome the last three weeks. Coming off a win against UCLA, we're going to talk to Jed Fish, the Arizona coach. But first, I want to tell you about Roback. You see this beautiful

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All right, it is time to talk to a guy whose team has just gotten better and better and better every week. Arizona is heading to Boulder this week. Now, Wildcats coach Jed Fish. Joined now by newly bowl eligible Arizona coach Jed Fish. Jed, how's that feel knowing, for you coaches, I just imagine knowing the extra practices are coming is very satisfying. Yeah, it's been a couple of years with no extra practices.

And when you have a chance to get those 15 practices in, you know you're just going to get better as a team. So it's really exciting in that regard. I think it's also a big goal of ours. We have a goal to play 13 or more games. And to be able to hit that goal week nine of the season is pretty awesome for our players and looking forward to these next three games. What have these last few weeks been like

for you guys? Because you were sitting there at three and three, you know, you lost by a touchdown in Washington, you'd lost in double overtime at USC. And then all of a sudden you break through against Washington state and it feels like it's just kind of rolled from there. Yeah, triple overtime, actually. Oh, that's right, triple. I'm sorry. That's right. You were in penalty kicks.

Yeah. So, you know, we lost overtime to Mississippi State on the road week two and then lost by seven and then lost in triple overtime. But after, you know, I think our guys just, you know, we went down 14-0 to Mississippi State, and we went down 14-0 to Mississippi State and we went down 14-0 to Washington. And both times we came back and outscored both teams after that, the second, third, and fourth quarter.

And we finally realized that we're a good team. I was trying to convince them of that all year. And then when you realize that and you feel confident being able to go out and play games, I think they really got excited about the next opportunity and after the game against usc when we lost 43 41 um they couldn't wait to get out of practice and there was just a different bounce in their step and uh they wanted to take on we knew that we had three opponents ranked in the top 20 coming up um on our schedule and they wanted to uh which would have been five which was five in a row yeah and they just wanted to really kind of turn

the corner and they were excited about it and they started playing some really good ball is is that how it flips within your locker room from maybe we can win to we expect to win yeah i mean it's it starts flipping when you get to a point where you're confident in your team, you're confident in your buddies, your locker mates, the people that are next to you. You're confident that the defense will get a stop. You're confident the offense will get a score. You're confident your special teams will make a play.

When you start feeling that way, you just want to play football. You want to just go out there. You want to go be a part of it. And, you know, our guys started sensing it last year when we ended the season two and one, the last quarter of the season, and, you know, picked it up where we are right now. So I heard you talking this week about roster construction because you're playing Colorado. So naturally you're getting those questions because you kind of inherited a similar situation to dion in terms of roster but not a similar situation in terms of what the school would allow you to do and and so i i don't think people understand that first time head coach or first your first year head coach rule basically

you're allowed to to cut players but you have your school has to be willing to put them on scholarship and not count them toward the 85. You didn't get that opportunity, right? That's right. So we took over 0-12, 0-5 in COVID, and then a seven-game losing streak the year before. And the last game that was played before we got here, they lost 70-7. And they went ahead, they signed the class that was committed.

They wanted to honor all of the commitments. And then we did not have the ability to do the other move, which would be cut players. So, you know, I felt like that's okay. We're going to just develop everybody we we have coach everybody we have see what we can do with what we have and uh we were 1-11 uh we had I think seven or eight games that were one score games in the fourth quarter um we lost a couple games by a touchdown or less and we just kept battling and then um from that point on that was I would say the recruiting class that we signed after that 1-11 season will go in down in the history books.

Well, and that's the thing. I mean, so TMAC, your receiver, was the highest rated recruit in Arizona history. Noah Fafita, who's starting at quarterback for you now, is in that class. Your two starting offensive tackles were in that class. And I'm curious, because you became a college head coach after all the transfer rules changed so so you've you've known it this way only as a head coach how is how is what you've seen from this class kind of informed how you build the roster from this point forward yeah i think we have uh 16 of our 22 starters or 15 of our 22 starters came from the signing class, the recruiting class of 22.

And so that makes them either redshirt freshmen or sophomores. And, you know, I just believe you build your team through the draft in the NFL and you build your team through high school recruiting in college. And then you supplement your team through the transfer portal. When you start trying to do it otherwise, I think is when you get into significant culture problems. Now, that's not to say that what they're doing in Colorado is wrong. I mean, they've done their deal, and Coach Prime is really good at what he does, and he knows exactly what he was looking for. For us, we didn't have that same opportunity, so we made the best of our opportunity. But in the end, you know, I just felt as if, like, I just want to build it with young kids and make them older. How did you sell that dream to the class of 2022 when you didn't have the results on the field to show them?

Yeah, you know, that was the thing that I would say. I mean, Jacob Manu, I think, leads the Pac-12 in tackles. He was in that class. The four kids from Servite made a huge difference. So when we had T-Mac, Noah, Key and Burnett, and Jacob Manu all on our team or coming to our team, more and more people were comfortable with joining on. And then when Ephesians Price Sock and Takario Davis, our two starting corners, committed. And then you had, you know, Jonah Coleman, our running back, and Jonah Sevena, a tackle.

And you start naming these guys. We went to programs and we just sold our vision. And our vision was very simply put. We're going to do everything we can to programs and we just sold our vision. And our vision was very simply put, we're going to do everything we can to help you become a professional in life. If that means an NFL pro, great. If that means a professional with a graduate degree, great. But we're going to fight to make you a pro and we're going to give you more access to the NFL than any other program in the country. And we we stuck with that how much was it choosing successful high school because you just mentioned servite you just mentioned uh you had

a st john bosco player in there you you had st louis which where you're starting right tackle that's the the school in hawaii that produces tons of players how much was finding programs that have a history of success and then selling the entire high school program on here's a place you can send your guys? Yeah, I told our coaches, no high school kids are losing records. We just, we needed to bring winners into the locker room. I think we signed three kids from Mater Dei, four kids from Servite one from bosco one from saint thomas aquinas um obviously we brought jayden in as a transfer jayden delora who was a saint the

quarterback at saint louis that was the only quarterback ever at saint louis to go undefeated two years in a row um and we took him from washington state where he was the pac-12 freshman of the year so the the idea was, okay, how can we surround these kids? We took three kids from Hamilton High School after they won the state championship in Arizona. And that was our goal, because you needed to bring in players that knew what it felt like to win games. So when you were in the locker room, they could hold the other players accountable for how you worked with. So now that you've, you've had this level of success and you just mentioned these guys had success in high school, but they haven't had it at this level like this, where all the attention's on them, the eyeballs are on them. How do you keep them focused on the next game and

not thinking about, Oh, what can we do down the road? Yeah. Um, we don't shy away from what the future could bring if we're successful here regarding wins and games and playoff races and, you know, ability to, you know, I told our guys like now, you know, now you play for seating. Now you play to see what bowl game you get to go to. Now you play to see if you have a chance to get to the Pac-12 championship game. Now you play to see, you know, who wants to join our program. The more you win, more players want to come. So we don't really shy away from it. I've looked at it more in terms of, you know, you got to put a stamp on it. You got to answer the question, are you for real or not? You know, are you for, you beat Washington State. Okay, are you for real or was that a one-time hit?

And we've kind of talked about that each week and we'll see what it looks like this week we got a heck of a challenge I can tell you that how has Noah developed you know he had to come in for Jaden when Jaden was hurt but it seems like he he's become very comfortable leading the offense yeah I mean the thing about Noah that was so uh special throughout it was his preparation, that he was always ready. He was always going to be ready to come in for Jaden if we needed him. You know, if we were down by three or four touchdowns against Utah our first or last year, I think it was, and we put Noah in, he drove us down and scored a touchdown.

When we were down against Mississippi State by 22 points at the end of the game, we put Noah in there. He drove us down, and we got to the one-yard line. And he just has the confidence to do that. And then now we've got two quarterbacks, as I like to say. And two is better than none. And I feel really good about now that we've got two healthy quarterbacks, which is the first time all year.

Now we've got a situation where, you know, we're very fortunate. How much does the reception change now when you go to a survey to St. John Bosco, St. Louis, and you have one proof of concept that you're winning, but also that you're winning with freshmen, redshirt freshmen and sophomores. Yeah. I mean, initially you needed to have, it's called confidence without evidence, you know, and you just had to explain,

Hey, this is going to work and believe that this is going to work. Now, what you can do is you can go in there to St. Louis high school, for example, and you could say, we brought Jonah seven in, you know, the, you can do is you could go in there to st louis high school for example and you could say

uh we brought jonah seven in uh you know the the a couple of offers he had was hawaii and san diego state and he was a freshman all-american and he started every single snap as a freshman and he started every single snap now as a sophomore trust that we know what we're doing in that regard um we can go into servite and we could go into modern day and we could say Jacob congaika um was going to come here as a walk-on and we gave him a scholarship two days before and he's now starting at nose and you got to get people to believe in that and it's a lot cooler to be able to do that I would imagine so and and also how did you guys, I mean, I assume that you hired a staff in part based on their evaluation abilities, but how good has this group been at nailing? I mean, 14, 15 starters out of one recruiting classes is pretty unheard of. Yeah. I would say that, um, they've done a

marvelous job, you know, at finding. And they're not all – it wasn't like we signed all five-star players. You know what I mean? It's – you were able to sign guys that you saw or our staff saw had a certain talent. And they felt really comfortable with it. And they said, we don't care who else is offered them. This is the type of running back that can help us win. We don't care who else offered us. This is the type of running back that can help us win. We don't care who else offered us.

This is the type of quarterback that can help us win. And that's what we went with. And it wasn't hard to evaluate TMAC, right? But when you go and you say, I'm going to take Jonah Coleman, and Jonah's offers, I think at the time were Fresno State and us. And then we were able to find a way to keep Jonah when people started saying, oh, this guy's a pretty good back. And now I think he's leading the country in PFF grade or something.

Well, and how much of that is just having a clear identity of what you want to be offensively and defensively so that when those coaches go out, they know what they're looking for? Well, the best NFL head coaches that I worked for, and I've worked for seven of them, had a very good plan in what they wanted their team to look like. When I was at Baltimore and Brian Billick and Ozzie Newsome were running the Ravens, just got done coaching in the Super Bowl, they knew exactly what they wanted their Mike Linebacker to look like in Ray Lewis,

their safety their tight end and Todd Heath their running back in Jamal Lewis their left tackle and Jonathan Ogden and you know Pete Carroll knew exactly what he wanted you know Bill Belichick knew exactly what he wanted and when you around those guys that just know what they want right and what they want their team to look like you just take it and one of the things that I feel like I've been so fortunate is when you learn from guys like them and Sean McVay and Jim Harbaugh that you're like this guy these guys know what they want in the team and I'm going to make sure if I become a head coach I'm going to know exactly what I want in the team and

then let our coaches know this is what I'm looking for. Now go find them. Do you have, because I know Nick Saban has the set of critical factors where it's basically written down, here's what a cornerback on our team looks like. Yeah. And if you look at our team, the biggest thing for me is I didn't want our team to look like this. I didn't want one corner to be 6'3 and one corner to be 5'9. I didn't want – so both of our starting corners are 6'2, 1'6'2 and a half and 1'6'3. I wanted our safeties to be 6' to 6'1.

I wanted our left tackle to be a certain size, our right guard to be a certain size. I wanted our X receiver. The best offenses I've been around, they had Brandon Marshall at X. They had Eric Decker at X. They had T-Mac at X. Same thing with Jacob Cowling at Z, Eddie Royal at Z. You start naming Robert Woods at Z.

You just start naming them and they all kind of look the same. And that's what we've been looking to do here. And I imagine when you're recruiting that person and you can show them, this is how I envision using you. It yeah. 100%. And get to show them that we run the same offense as the Rams run. So, you know, when they could watch Sean call play and they could watch us call play and the exact same play, whether he's mic'd up or not, they could hear it. They could see it. They can watch Matthew Stafford execute it it and i think that's a huge advantage to what we do here now you just have to find the guy who you envision in the aaron donald spot so find me him he doesn't fit any of those he's too short

but you'll take it anyway i know every now and then there's the exception to every rule. That's right. I appreciate it, Jed. Thank you so much. All right. Thanks, Andy. Thanks for having me on, bud. That is Jed Fish, Arizona, headed to Colorado this weekend. Very interesting spot for the Wildcats. They're already bowl eligible.

They just beat UCLA. They got a chance to keep this winning streak going and really interesting to hear how he built that team also very interesting this person who bet a million dollars tonight on Kent State plus 10 and a half against Bowling Green I my favorite part of this shows this time of year is I can have the triple Maction box up on the TV while the show's going on. And it's 28-6 Bowling Green over Kent State at halftime. So somebody is sweating right now. Just understand, there is somebody out there in these United States of America who is sweating over some action tonight. A million dollars.

Kent State plus ten and a half. Speaking of which, tickets to Maction. You want to go see some Maction next week? Get that GameTime app. Use that code STAPLES for $20 off your first purchase. Or do you want to go see USC play Oregon at Autzen? Just type Oregon football into the search box and then click the ticket you want to look at

and it shows you where in Autzen Stadium you would be. You want to go see Michigan Penn State? Hell yeah. GameTime's got tickets for Michigan Penn State. If you want to go on Saturday, if you want to decide right here on Wednesday night, you know what? I'm going to go see the biggest game of the week.

Well, you go to the game time app and you can have Michigan Penn State tickets with just a few taps. You want to move those tickets to your friend on game day? You just text it. Game time makes it very easy, stress-free. So get that GameTime app, use the code staples, $20 off your first purchase. I don't know if Connor Stallions was using GameTime, but I certainly hope he was. All right. It is a dear Andy night. Now here's the thing,

because that Michigan news hit tonight, it ate into a lot of our dear Andy question answering time. So we're going to move a lot of the dear Andy questions from tonight to tomorrow's show. Cause you got some good ones and I want to answer these questions, but we have one other interview that I thought was, was very important to have today. And this is a person who, you know, he's very much in the news. Kirk Cignetti, head coach of James Madison. And I will start with a dear Andy question that I got from Chris that is really relevant to this situation.

Based on projections that aren't going, there aren't going to be enough six and six teams to fill up the bowl slots and James Madison is going to end up bowl eligible. Could the committee start ranking JMU and then have them end up being the group of five automatic qualifier into the New Year's Six? So here's the deal. James Madison is in its second year in the FBS. The way the rules work is you have to have two years of a

transition period before you're allowed to play in the postseason. So James Madison went eight and three last year, did not get to play in the postseason. So James Madison went 8-3 last year, did not get to play in the postseason. Now, because there might not be enough 6-6 teams to occupy all the available bowl slots this year, James Madison could get slotted into a bowl even though they're only in year two. But James Madison is 9-0. They play UConn this week.

Then they've got Appalachian State and Coastal Carolina. If they were to win out, theoretically, they would be in line to potentially get the group of five New Year's Six Bowl bid as the Sunbelt champ. They would have to be able to play in the Sunbelt championship game, which they are not currently eligible for. But James Madison's president and AD sent a letter to Jerry Moorhead, who's the Georgia president, who's also the chair of the NCAA board of directors, to say, hey, listen, we need relief on this. You need to make us eligible this year.

We have proven that we are serious about being the FBS, that we're going to resource our program adequately. Obviously, they just keep winning. So that is what's going on with James Madison. And if the NCAA wanted an easy win, they could say, hey, James Madison, you're good to go. You can play in the postseason. And the Sun Belt would let them play in the championship game if that happened.

But that's got to happen. That hasn't happened yet. So we talked to Kirk Cignetti, the head coach at JMU, about this situation and just about a team that has been great all season. Now by James Madison coach Kirk Cignetti. Coach, you are undefeated playing UConn this week. And the big news, obviously, is your AD, your president, sending a letter to the NCAA saying,

hey, we may have only been in the FBS two years, but we deserve consideration for bowl games, for CFP rankings, that sort of thing. How much do you have to think about this stuff, address this stuff with your team? Well, I ask the players to eliminate the noise and the clutter throughout the season. And we all know that every week when we continue to win, it grows, grows. It's great to know the university has our back,

the president, President Alger, Jeff Bourne, who've been great leaders at this university for a very long time. And it's why our program, a lot of other programs here are at a championship level. So, you know, in this day and age, I think everybody reads social media, but the key to what the preparation, So, you know, in this day and age, I think everybody reads social media.

But the key to the preparation as we get into Monday for everyone is to sort of shut it down a little bit and focus on the things that affect preparation and positive performance. And that's the one thing this team has done a really good job of up to this point. You know, every day you have a choice, you know, you can choose to do what you want to do versus what you need to do. And if you want to be average, you'll choose what you want to do. And if you want to be great, it's what, because, you know, the margin of victory in this business, highly competitive, is very slim. I have heard those words before from a guy who used to work with in Tuscaloosa. You were on Nick Saban's original staff at Alabama, I remember. And I know you guys, you process-oriented guys,

always talk about that illusion of choice and that there's not really a lot of actual choices. Your team has made all those right choices this season. What is it about this group that they've been able to stay focused? Yeah, you know, this has been a special group. They're very close, very united. And, you know, in our first team meeting, we talked about uh you know the things that we could accomplish knowing that we were at that time uh ineligible uh for conference championship or

bowl game but you know we wanted to make it hard on the decision makers um and you know these guys listen better than any team i've had to the and apply them daily on a practice field, the game field. Now we're not perfect, but we do it really well. They do it really well and compete hard on Saturday, play discipline football and really buy into the team. And, you know, there's been a great culture here for a long time. I mean, 54 and three at home, you know, we win conference championships every year. And so there's standards and expectations.

And these guys, you know, when the game's on the line at the end, they expect to be successful, and they do the things they have to do to be successful. We've been in a number of close games this year, probably more so than any year since I've been here. Yeah. But, you know, we find a way. And so it's been really a good team to coach. Well, and that's the thing that, that is interesting. And I know you, you sent out a tweet last week where you, you showed an ESPN graphic with the strength of record statistic,

which basically this is how you are ranked versus what an average team would do against your schedule i i don't know that people appreciate the depth of the sunbelt as it is right now but what is it like going through that league right now yeah and you know it's not only the sunbelt but the way our schedule laid out this year uh you know we were on the road second week at virginia then we went on the road to play last year's conference champ. Boy, yeah. That's who we would have played in the conference championship, but we weren't allowed to play it.

And down there where they hadn't lost in a long time and beat them, got back at 4 in the morning. Then on the road again to Utah State, 8 o'clock at night, Eastern time, get back at 8 in the morning for a 12 o'clock kickoff against South Alabama, who won 10 games last year. And a lot of people were picking to win the West. So that part of it in terms of the fatigue, the travel fatigue on the team and the staff was significant. But the Sun Belt is a lot like the SECc uh west in you know in terms of you gotta be ready to play week in week out uh you don't play really well you're gonna get beat well that's what i you

took over this team when when it was still in the fcs you were competing for national championships there you immediately start winning getting into the FBS what was the the transition like the getting from 63 equivalency scholarships to 85 headcount ones how did was it as smooth as it looked from the outside or how hard did you guys have to work to make it look as easy as you have well you know nothing good comes easy. It all takes hard work, organization, and discipline. But it was a move that we were prepared for as a football program. And I think this year, 41 for me, and I've been fortunate to work with some great people and have extensive backgrounds as a recruiting coordinator also and coach. So knew what needed done and I'm fairly impatient.

It's just you know make it happen so that we could be successful. So we never did get to 85 scholarships year one. We could have and I think we got up to about 82 and then with attrition we finished the year about 78. We started at 85 this year there were a lot of unknowns uh playing uh teams that we had never played before i knew that we would be highly competitive and uh in this day and age with the transfer portal and nil you're over a large larger percentage of your roster than the past you know know, we're breaking in a new quarterback. We opened the season at home against Middle Tennessee and, you know,

beat them, I don't know, 45-7 or so. And then, you know, the first Sunbelt Conference game was down to that after they beat Texas A&M. And, you know, we're down 28-3 in the second quarter. And I'm looking and I'm thinking, wow, these guys are pretty good. But, you know, our guys compete. They play with poise. They never give up. They never, you know, they're resilient.

Yeah. Well, and they've got to be. What you're dealing with right now, you just lose Jalen Green to injury, your best pass rusher who's been unbelievable for you. How do the guys handle that and continue to play as good a defense as you have been? Yeah, it's the next man up mentality. I mean, you know, we've lost both starting offensive tackles. You know, Nick Kidwell's our best one.

We lost both starting linebackers at Virginia. We lost two starters in the opener. And now Jalen Green, who's having a phenomenal season, you know, is going to break the national record for sacks. And I feel, you know, terrible for him. But I'm also happy that he caught the attention of the NFL scouts. So, you know, we'll do some shuffling around, and some guys will get an opportunity for increased reps.

But, you know, we'll be all right. So let's hear you talk about your quarterback this week. Jordan McLeod played three years at USF, two years at Arizona, so he's playing his last year with you guys. And you were talking about him in the Georgia State game, which was, you know, a win against another one of the Sunbelt's best teams. And you said it looked like he's really having fun out there now. He's really comfortable in the offense.

You know, when did you feel like he was really comfortable in the offense? Well, you know, it took him a little while because he hadn't played football in two years. But we put him in the third quarter of the opener. He actually didn't start in the opener. And he did well. He started against Virginia, which was a big in-state win. And he's improved every week. And now he's playing at a level where everybody looks to him as the leader,

believes in him. He's playing with confidence. And he's making plays with his arm, his head, and his legs. And, you know, I still think there's another step he can take, and he's playing great for us right now. When you're dealing with the transfer portal, and you've already got this great established culture of players who go back to when you were playing for national championships in the FCS,

how do you decide who you bring on, and how do you decide that they're going to fit with what you've already got going? Yeah, well, it really is a little bit like the NFLfl now um so you know you've got your needs right everybody's and you're going to lose a couple guys that you didn't expect to lose on big nil deals to power five sec schools i've interviewed that someone like that so yes yeah exactly but uh you know i put a high character i'm i'm a little bit old-fashioned my dad was a coach you know i'll still look at a transcript look at how many absences a guy has we've had great success with guys that have played at the fcs level uh you know they actually a lot of those guys have done a lot better than the P5 transfer.

So, you know, you're looking for a guy that's got the ability to be a good player, but also has the character, work habits, and will fit in. But one thing about when you've got a great culture like we do, these guys assimilate well. Yeah. Well, Coach, it seems like they've assimilated very well on this team. I know you got UConn on Saturday, so good luck. Appreciate it, Andy. Thank you.

That's Kirk Sidnetti. They're trying to figure out what their situation is. They're waiting to hear it from the NCAA. Hopefully the NCAA will relent on this thing. Now, if you're holding a Sunbelt future, you may not be real thrilled about that if that happens because it does change probably who's in the Sunbelt championship game. But it's only right. I mean, clearly they belong at this level.

Normally, this is the part where we go to Dear Andy and we answer your questions for a while. Obviously, we've gone quite a ways on this show, a lot going on. I'll add one thing to the Michigan conversation. Chris Ballas of TheWolverine.com posted a story tonight that said there's a, he quoted sources saying there's a, quote, 99.9% chance that the Big Ten tries to suspend Jim Harbottomar and Michigan would then go to court and try to fight that. So we will see what happens on Thursday. That's going to be fascinating,

but I do have one dear Andy question about that. The rest of the dear Andy questions we are going to save for Thursday's show. And if you send in a good one, don't worry, I'm going to get to it. And there's some great ones, but this one's a good one, don't worry. I'm going to get to it. And there's some great ones. But this one's a good one from Charlie, and it definitely fits the conversation tonight.

Would suspending Jim Harbaugh really hurt the TV rating for the next few games or make it go up? So that is one of the questions is, you know, would the Big Ten mess with one of its golden gooses in this particular case? Because anything that hurts Michigan and maybe keeps Michigan from competing for the national title also hurts the Big Ten. And a suspension of the head coach probably makes it more difficult for Michigan to compete for the national title. Obviously not as difficult as it would be if they tried to ban them from postseason or something like that. But I will say, if there is drama, if Jim Harbaugh is suspended, if there is courthouse drama over this,

all it will do is increase the ratings. As long as Michigan beats Penn State and Maryland, and Ohio State beats Michigan State and Minnesota, and both of them are undefeated going into the game in Ann Arbor, the rating for that game is going to be monstrous. If there is drama surrounding Jim Harbaugh, it will be even bigger. So here's some perspective. The Michigan-Ohio State game last year drew 17.1 million viewers. It was the most watched game in the country with the exception of the college football playoff games. The Fiesta Bowl with Michigan and TCU was slightly, just a tick higher. And then the Peach Bowl and the national title game were both higher by a pretty

decent margin, but nothing else was even close. Like not even the conference championship games it was the most watched the next one down was Tennessee Alabama and so this is going to be I imagine that this might set some records this game as long as both teams are undefeated when they get there because all of this is only created more juice around the game, more energy around the game. And it's weird and funny and makes Ohio State fans angry and makes Michigan fans angry. It's perfect. I mean, as far as whipping up a television broadcast, this is everything you could dream of. So if there is a suspension, now, like I'll give an example. I think no matter what happens in the real world, if the Big Ten tries to suspend Jim Harbaugh, Michigan and Jim Harbaugh take that to court,

maybe a judge gives an injunction and he gets to keep coaching and they just run out the clock on the season. But let's say they came out tomorrow and said he's suspended for two games, which if you read the Chris Ballas story, they suspect it'll be longer than that. But if they did two games, which is what the commissioner is allowed to impose without getting that committee approval, he would miss Penn State, which getting pulled from the Penn State game two days before would be crazy and it would drive the ratings for that game through the roof. He would miss Penn State, which getting pulled from the Penn State game two days before would be crazy. And it would drive the ratings for that game through the roof.

He would miss the Maryland game. And then he comes striding back through the tunnel like Jim McMahon for the Ohio State game. Vince McMahon. But also Jim McMahon. Jim McMahon probably strode out of the tunnel very dramatically for the Bears at some point. But yeah, that Vince McMahon gif where he's coming out of the tunnel with the giant shoulder pads on the suit. And like that is how I imagine Jim Harbaugh coming out of the tunnel. And maybe he jumps to touch the victor sign. Maybe not.

I don't know. But it would drive the ratings absolutely bananas. It would just send it skyrocketing. So Charlie, yes. No matter what happens, as long as the two teams keep winning, the ratings for this thing are going to be boffo.

So that's the part of this that, like, that's good for business. Taking your team out of the national title race would be bad for business. But I don't think that's on the table. Like I said, when we were talking to Dan Wetzel, all these people want are scalps. They want to see somebody, preferably somebody famous, punished. They don't want to see players punished. So Michigan's going to play. The question is if Jim Harbaugh is going to coach him. I guess we'll have to wait and find out. What a week. What a story. We'll talk to you tomorrow.