Andy & Ari On3 - NFL DECLINES Brendan Sorsby for 2026 Supplemental Draft: What will former Texas Tech QB do next?

Episode Date: June 24, 2026

As the Brendan Sorsby saga continues to add more and more layers to it, some news happened on Tuesday regarding the former Texas Tech QB. The NFL has decided to decline Brendan Sorsby for the 2026 supplemental draft, meaning Sorsby will have to sit out of football for the upcoming fall. Are there any last ditch efforts the former Red Raiders QB can make? Andy & Ari discuss on today's episode.   (0:00) On Today's Episode (0:55) Intro: Sorsby & the NFL Supplemental Draft (9:35) NFL's Hammer, Boutte Discussion (16:42) Could he sue the Big 12? (30:22) Have you ever seen Chad Powers? (32:55) NCAA's five-to-play-five model (40:15) NC State head coach Dave Doeren joins (43:21) Doeren on the five-for-five model (49:51) Building a roster in this era (58:53) Doeren's longevity at NC State (59:56) Closing out with Dave Doeren - Rules for Life (1:03:06) Wrapping up: Do you go to the movies?   Once the guys wrap up the Sorsby situation, there is some more news to discuss. The NCAA has approved the new age-based five-to-play-five eligibility model. Andy & Ari breakdown this substantial piece of news for college sports and what it means moving forward.   Later, NC State Wolfpack head coach Dave Doeren joins the show. Entering his 14th season in Raleigh, Doeren discusses how he's been able to build such a consistent program in the midst of so many changes throughout college football. He also gives his thoughts on the NCAA's latest five-to-play-five model and why he prefers it in this new age of college football.   Join On3 today! https://www.on3.com/join   Watch our show here on YouTube! https://youtu.be/IObM07p4Khc   Hosts: Andy Staples, Ari Wasserman Producer: River Bailey   Interested in partnering with the show? Email [e-mail] Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

On today's episode of Andy and Ari on three, the NFL has denied Brendan Sorsby the chance to be in a supplemental draft. So who is the former Indiana, Cincinnati, and Texas Tech quarterback going to sue now? We'll talk about that. Plus, a big NCAA rule change, one, that the coaches like, but two, is going to make things a little more practical and easy to figure out in terms of eligibility. We'll talk about that. Also, NC State coach Dave Doran joins us. He's going to the year 14 in Raleigh. He talks about all the changes he's had to deal with since he got to NC State

and how his outlook on the game, on the sport has changed. He's entering year 14, but he is a he's rare to go. Talk to Dave Doran on today's Andy Nari on 3. Welcome to Andy and Ari on 3 and Ari of Brennan's saga will never, ever, ever, ever in. It is funny because I don't know if people were getting tired of talking about it, but it felt like we had some finality to it. And now it's reared, it's beautiful off-season topic head again.

And obviously, if you're listening to this now, you're probably aware that the NFL has decided not to have a supplemental draft, which now has basically been a one-year suspension for Brendan Sorsby as he's not able to get into the NFL until he goes through the draft process next year. Obviously, there's still some stuff that needs to be ironed out. Their lawyers are coming for bear on Twitter. There was a thought process about maybe he would try to attempt to return to Texas Tech, which I think we should break down.

Although I don't think that that's likely. Yeah, it doesn't sound like Texas Tech is that amenable to it either. Yeah, this is interesting because the NFL does not have to hold a supplemental draft. They haven't held one since 2019 or they haven't had anybody selected in it since 2019. It's up to them. And really, this is where the crux of the issue is because Jeffrey Kessler, who's the lawyer representing Brennan Sorsby,

who has tangled with the NFL before and beaten the NFL, threatened to sue the NFL when this happened. This is a little bit different situation. Now, very famously, Jeffrey Kessler beat the NFL in the case that resulted in unrestricted free agency coming to the NFL.

It was the Freeman McNeil case in the early 90s, and basically the tactic they used that Jeffrey Kessler used was they decertified the NFLPA so that all the players could sue in a class action lawsuit. And they won. And the NFL capitulated and now they have under strict free agency. This is different. This is different.

Jeffrey Kessler says it's a violation of the collective bargaining agreement. And that really is what it comes down to. If the NFL is acting within the terms of the collective bargaining agreement, And I'm not sure there's anything they can do about this. I'm not sure there's anything Kessler or Shoresby or his team can do about this. So here is for Mike Floreo yesterday, the relevant section of the CBA. I'm going to read it to you. If a player who is not eligible for the draft in any league year becomes eligible

after the date of the draft, he will be eligible to be selected in a supplemental draft. If the league elects to conduct such a draft on or before the seventh calendar day prior to the opening of the first training camp of that league year, No player may elect to bypass a draft for which he's eligible to apply for selection in a supplemental draft. In other words, British Or if he cannot just go sign as a free agent. He has to go through the draft process. You have to request the NFL to hold a supplemental draft. And according to their CBA, which they made with the players, the league is the one that gets to decide whether there's a supplemental draft. Yeah. And the reason why this rule exists too is so that

people don't skirt the draft altogether and choose where they play. Like, that's why, like, there has to be a stringent rule about that. So, you know, I was reading yesterday a lot of the stuff. And Pete Nacos, of course, on three, did another wonderful job of helping break it down and getting pertinent information as it regards to what the next step would be. Because the first thing that I thought in my head was, oh, my God, he's going to go back to Texas Tech. Because Texas Tech and him just literally mutually parted a week ago, or what's

been 10 days. It's not like he missed any practice or anything, like he could have gone back. And then that opened up Pandora's box about what that would look like. Now, Andy and I, you and I discussed on the phone last evening that, you know, it's important to bring our listeners up to speed if this is where they get most of their information, which is while we were on vacation last week, Brendan Sorsby dropped his suit, which. Right, the one that got the injunction granted. So his lawsuit against NCAA, they had the hearing. He got the injunction. That's what would have allowed him to play.

He had to drop that lawsuit to then become ineligible again so that he could apply for the supplemental draft. Which then means he's currently ineligible. So if he wanted to go back, he would have to, I believe, Andy, and you're our resident lawyer on the show. Would he have to re-sue and win again? I would think you'd have to win another injunction, yeah. And I don't think Texas Tech is ready to go through that again.

Yeah. I don't know. Would it be the same judge even? I don't even know how that would go. But Andy, I'll remind you, since you reminded me yesterday, we are like, what, five weeks away from fall camp beginning. There's not a lot of time. And I think just in theory, this seems like a highly unlikely thing.

Now, if he wanted to try to do this and be a scout team player, so he stays in shape or whatever throughout. the next year in order to prepare for the draft. Maybe that's an avenue he'll explore. I don't know. I don't know. I mean, there are rules against practicing ineligible players too, but if he never played, would they care?

I mean, Texas Tech. Again, I don't know if that's worth the circus either. Texas Tech was very adamant about their actions being in the best interest of Brendan Sorsby. Yeah. So if Brendan Sorsby had a. a desire to return to Texas Tech as a student and practice with the team to stay sharp, I think that they would probably have to be on the hook for that.

Whether he plays or not, is another thing. That would be putting your money where your mouth is. That's it, right. Although not, probably not actually your money, because if he can't play, you're probably not going to pay him what you're going to pay. Yeah. Well, I also, I think too that if, if Brendan Sorsby, and this is like, we're just in hypothetical land, this probably 99% isn't going to happen.

but if Brendan Sorsby did sue again, got the injunction again, went back to Texas Tech in time for fall camp and played, do you think that we would pick up right where we left off with screw Texas Tech or do you think that at least they made the good effort to move on from it? Now we're actually... No, I think the Big 12 would try to ban him from the ban Texas Tech from the conference title game. Yeah.

I think they made it clear that that's what they want to do. So here's my main takeaway from yesterday, Andy, is that people were upset at Texas Tech for the obvious, right? They were going to try to skirt the gambling rules in court and play a player who's very good and try to help them get over the hump in the CFP. Right. And the Texas Tech people will tell you, but he sued Texas Tech didn't.

But we all know if Texas Tech said they didn't want them on the team, he wouldn't have been suing. But I have a theory. And my theory is that that anger was misplaced anger or the aggression of that anger was placed on Texas Tech as college football's community collectively more the idea that the NCAA can stop anybody from doing anything. Like if you can't stop a player from gambling on his team that he's on and then playing. Texas Tech had the choice to support him in this or not, and they chose to support him. So they earned it.

Right. But the point here is, though, that even if he would have succeeded and let's just pretend he played at Texas Tech all season, people would have resented Texas Tech for playing him. but I think the real fear and the real reason why there was so much outrage from people who have no dog in the fight is because Brendan Sorsby also provided a blueprint to anybody else who did the same thing that he did in order to play again. And I think that the NFL did college football a huge favor on Tuesday in providing another barrier or something to think about for anybody that is even having a thought of placing a bet they're not supposed to place.

because Brendan Sorsby, his story's not over. Even if he doesn't get in until 2027, he might be a late round pick next year. He will have a career, and if he's good, he'll find a way back to the field. But if I'm a player, I can no longer say, well, the NCAA got sued and I'll get out of it. Because this is a major consequence. This is the hammer that I think everybody wanted Brendan Sorsby to get hit with when he did this. And the hammer came from the NFL's arm, not the NCAA. And I think that it's interesting because I'm sure.

sure his legal team is going to argue, well, what about Kishon Boutte? For those who don't know, Kayshan Boutte played receiver at LSU. He finished his career at LSU. He went to the draft. He was drafted in the sixth round. After that, later, he gets charged with illegal gambling. I mean, it's legal to gamble in Louisiana, but he had gambled underage. But he had also gambled on LSU while playing for LSU.

And so he was not punished by LSU because he was already gone. He was not punished by the NCAA because he was already out of college. The NFL didn't actually punish him for it either. Now, the charges got dropped because he agreed to a plea deal, or a pretrial diversion, something like that. And the NFL didn't end up punishing him for it. And so if I'm Kessler, I'm going to try to attack it that way. But again, I do not think, this is why I keep talking. talking about if college sports could figure out how to collectively bargain with the athletes,

you have a much more lawsuit-proof situation because courts are very reluctant to interfere when you have a collective bargaining agreement. When you have both sides agree to this and everybody's following it to the letter. And if this clause is written accurate, then the NFL is following the agreement they made. Well, the NFL was able to, with a heavy hand, say, gambling on your team is wrong and we have no tolerance for it. Right. And I think that's what people were craving from college.

If you're going to go, okay, but what about the time you didn't? Yeah. Which was very recently. And the thing that I think is interesting about the Kisham-Butei situation is the timeline of the whole thing. Right. And I think that's what it was. he kind of slipped through the cracks.

He slipped through the cracks from a timeline situation. If he would have been in the same position, I have no doubt out of my mind, the NFL would have probably acted similarly. Like I, you know, so maybe there's just a beneficiary of that. I don't know. And I don't know.

The other thing is obviously a very talented attorney. So like maybe he can use that as a way. He's the best sports antitrust attorney out there, one of the best antitrust attorneys in the country. And people are like, oh, he's just doing this for publicity. the man brought free agency to the NFL. He doesn't need publicity.

He beat the NCAA 9 to nothing in the Supreme Court. He doesn't need the pub. He's getting paid a lot of money for this. That's the other thing with Sorsby. Does he have enough money to keep this up? Jeffrey Kessler is not cheap. Sources being sued by Cincinnati for the buyout. We know he's not going to get all of the money

he was supposed to get from Texas Tech. So he's the only getting a portion of that. he's probably burning through that pretty quick if i'm sorsby i'm trying to preserve my capital go get a condo or a place to live on manhattan beach do the beach training videos on post of the twitter continue into a gambling program whether you view that necessary personally or not from a PR standpoint i think you do that and you post about your journey for the next year to show people that a you're staying in shape you're working out but b you're working on yourself and the reason why you're in that position. Get ready for the

2007 draft. I'm assuming he'd be invited to the combine, right, Andy? I would think so, yeah, yeah. And work out and try to get drafted and get your career back. I think that that would be the course of action I would do if I were him. But I also know, too, that, like, being out of football as a quarterback for a long period of time can have a negative impact on your ability. So, like, I do think that this is a serious, I mean, Andy, let's call it what it is. It's a suspension, right? And it's a pretty big one.

It's a de facto suspension, yes. And it cost him income out of college. And maybe the right thing for him was to just win the injunction and everybody at tech and him just not speak. They didn't do that. They kept extending the story. And I think that exacerbated a little bit. But I do think that this is good for college football because you want to have as many roadblocks

in the way of anybody who even thinking. about participating in this activity to feel like there's no coming back from it still. And if it's not the NCAA, which is going to be facing challenges until they collectively bargain in court for everything, then the second arm of this is the NFL. These players will respect anything the NFL does because that's the ultimate goal. That's the gravy train. So, you know, I laughed because somebody tweeted last night during the NBA draft, Andy, that these players don't even cry anymore because they're already rich.

And I was like laughing because it's true. but I also think that I don't care how much money these guys get paid in college, that making that NFL money in that roster and living that lifestyle is still the ultimate goal. And, you know, I think that gambling is a serious thing. And my hope

is that at least if there's five people out there that have thought about doing this, that they're dissuaded more as a result of what happened. I don't know. I just, I don't know that he's done suing people yet. Like, suing the NFL, like, Jeffrey Kester's not afraid of the NFL, but I don't

know that he has a case he can win. Like they say if, you know, if the law is on your side pound, the law, the facts are on your side pound the facts that the, if neither are on your side pound the table. He's doing some table pounding here. I don't think the NFLPA is going to help him out because Brendan Sorsby is not a member of the NFLPA. And when when Brendan Sorsby gets a job in the NFL, ultimately, he will displace a current NFLPA member. And so my guess is the NFLPA will probably not act to protect Brennan Sorsby. We've seen cases like this where the CBA's been challenged. Maurice Clarette was a good example, and he actually won in federal district court,

and it was overturned in federal circuit court, and the CBA held up. Yeah. Could Jeffrey Kessler challenge the notion of the draft itself? Maybe. I mean, I think drafts are one of those things that if they didn't exist before and if they weren't now enshrined in collective bargaining agreements, you could never get away with starting one. Do you mean because of the inability to control where you live or where you're employed? Correct, correct, correct. But they're collectively bargained. So it's protected. Like it is very well

protected from legal challenge. So that's something. The other possibility, I guess, is you could sue the Big 12 for loss of earnings and say he would have been in the NFL this year or he would have been making this money at Texas Tech this year, if not for you. And that would be interesting because we said it last week when the Big 12 filed that lawsuit in response to the Texas Attorney General. If the Texas Attorney General had never put his fingers on a keyboard and opened his mouth, the Big 12 would have had no way to sue and no way to effectively close that situation with Brennan or put the pressure on Brin and Sorsby

and Texas Tech to make a decision. Yeah. The Big 12's lawsuit may actually give Brin Sorgeby a way to sue them. Yeah. You know, and I actually don't know how interested people are. Andy, you tell me about what kind of money he can recoup. I think people are probably more interested of whether he'll be successful in playing it in.

Oh, I don't think they care at all about that. I think they care about will he play somewhere this, year or not, the answer is probably not. Yeah. And of course, I got tons of texts yesterday when this happened. They just said the UFL's Houston gamblers can do the funniest thing. They could. They don't play until next spring.

So that'll be during pre-strap season. Andy, we didn't mention this, but I think it's important context that the NFL general counsel, the NFL management council, like sent Brendan a letter. And I was a smack up. Lawrence P. Farazini Jr. Yeah, I'm going to I'm going to just go and read an excerpt.

That's a word I can't pronounce. Sorry. Exert. Exert. Exert. Exert. Of that. Yeah. Under our collective bargaining agreement,

the league retains sole discretion to determine whether it is appropriate to conduct a supplemental draft in any given year. The league has not conducted such a draft for several years and prior to your submission, the league had no plans to do so this year, as no other player has sought entry. Your petition filed three days before the deadline without any supporting information or documentation, and only after abandoning your recent litigation efforts to avoid NCAA sanctions does not prove a basis for the league to alter those plans. The issue presented

presented by your petition are too significant and too closely tied to the league's core integrity interests to permit meaningful review within the timeline presented. The sole reasons identified in your petition for seeking entry into the supplemental draft are that you have been declared ineligible by the NCAA, have exhausted all of your avenues to continue in the NCAA and want to now play in the NFL. The petition provides no information regarding the basis or timing of the NCAA's decision. Public sources, however, indicate that in May 26, the NCAA issued a determination declaring you permanently ineligible for participation in college athletics based on a sustained pattern of improper gambling activity during your collegiate career at three different universities. That's a, when you read that, like, that's like, uh, it was a smackdown. Yeah, it's hammered. And interestingly enough, it apparently was released to the media before it was sent to Sorsby. So let's not paint everyone, anybody here is the good guy. Like, everybody's grandstanding in one way, shape, or form.

But, yeah, I do think, I think the NFL probably feels pretty good. about where it stands because the CBA says you have the discretion to do this or not. And they're like, nah, we're not going to. Because like the three days before the deadline, who cares? It's a deadline. You made a deadline, whether he sent his application in three days before the deadline or three months before the deadline, doesn't matter. That's the point of a deadline.

Yeah. But I also think, too, that the NFL probably saw what he did, which was, voluntarily make himself knowledgeable. Yeah, if I were his lawyers, I wouldn't be like, here's why. Yeah. I'd be like,

yeah, you Google. You Google. Why? But it's reserved for ineligible and Sorsby made himself ineligible, which would be a pretty unique circumstance in and of itself. They all made themselves ineligible somehow. No,

I'm saying like opted to choose to be ineligible. Correct. Like that's not. Yeah. Yeah. Like that's not. I mean, that's something that is unprecedented because it's new.

But like, it's still kind of funny to think. that he voluntarily made himself ineligible after earning his eligibility back in order to try to get in. So, you know, I do think that, you know, by and large, that regardless of whether the NFL is the good guy or the bad guy or the big bad, you know, monster at the end of the road, I don't know how you want to do it. I don't think the NFL is a monster. I just think the NFL's, you know, grandstanding a little bit. But I think the NFL did the dirty work that needed to be done in order to send an additional message that that, that behavior. It wasn't dirty work. That's the thing.

The NFL collectively bargains with its players. They've decided how the rules of this thing work. Both parties. Neither party seems to be ejecting it. Now, if the NFLPA comes out and says, NFL, we think you did something wrong, then there's something to be discussed. But I don't think that's going to happen. And unless that happens, I don't know that there's anything further you could do.

here. Yeah. And what would the contention from the NFLPA even be? That it was an arbitrary reason to not hold the supplemental draft, that the supplemental draft comes down to eligibility for the draft or ineligibility to play in college and not a moral decision on the part of the NFL. But again, I don't think the NFL is going to do that because unions tend to protect their own members. and if you do something that lets this guy get a job, he's going to displace a member. Yeah.

I also don't think that the NFLPA in its basis is to protect the athletes in the NFL, and I don't know what happened here. It's not a fight worth picking for them. Yeah. He's not even a member yet. Yeah. So.

And anybody who is affected by this rule would be an incoming member. It would never impact anybody that's currently in the NFLPA ever. And that's the thing. You got to remember, it's why there's a draft and a rookie salary scale. You know, back in the day, Sam Bradford was the last number one draft pick that got to negotiate his salary. And the current players at the time were like, why? Why are we allowing this to happen? That guy hadn't done anything in the NFL.

And so the players were, the players and the teams were more than happy to negotiate a way. and I believe the current players obviously got more money out of it, but they were more than happy to negotiate a rookie salary scale. But when that happened, that benefited the majority of the league. I mean, that benefited. That was one of the rare instances where everyone was happy. But I think that the best part about it was that the players that were veterans in the league that actually earned second and third contracts were the beneficiaries of that.

So, yeah, that all made sense. I just don't, I tried to think about this last night. I read a bunch about it. We spoke about it on the phone. I don't really see a path or an avenue for any playing. Producer River asks how far could they take the Kashan Bhute argument. I'm not sure how far you could take it. The CBA says what it says.

Yeah. Like it says the league has discretion to have a supplemental draft or not. Yeah. And we can look up the word discretion on the internet, but I think I know what it means. It's my choice. Exactly. So, yeah, unless the NFLPA wants to take up issue with it,

which again, I don't think they would, then I don't know. I mean, if I'm Jeff Kessler, I'm calling the NFL, I'm like, hey, remember, remember what I got you free agency? I'm going to need that favor back. You know, and Andy, I think that it's important to note, too, that we are recording this a few hours before it goes live. And Kessler, a very talented and crafty attorney

could be coming up with the defense that you and I can't conceive, which is why we aren't millionaires. And then if he, if he does file that, We will either, you know, talk about it later on in the week or we'll come back and edit this. But just, just be aware that, you know, things happen quickly as quickly as they, yeah. We had a discussion about this. Should we record this now or will Jeffrey Kessler make us look stupid? Yeah.

I mean, we had the discussion yesterday because we recorded our show yesterday like 40 minutes before this news dropped. But I'm happy that we had 24 hours to let it sit because I do think that there are moving parts here. And, you know, I think it would have been a, like this is a. Well, that's the thing. Yesterday, a lot of it, so this, this dropped, like, give you a little peek behind the curtain here. Our show drops at 3 p.m. Eastern time on weekdays. Usually we have to have it done by two so that producer river can get everything edited

and encoded and uploaded. And so this dropped, I think, a little bit after two Eastern. And so it was one of those things, do we, do we scrap it? Do we go live? and it was all moving so fast and there was so much stuff that came out over the next few hours. I'm kind of glad we didn't

because it allowed us to kind of digest everything. Because Brendan Sorsby is no longer at tech, this is an NFL story now. We cover college football. We would have had to redo it if we got a sense from the on three reporting that he was trying to play at tech next year. Because I think if he was trying to come back

or there was a realistic chance for him to re-sue. And there was a moment on Tuesday where we thought maybe that was possible. And then the door seemed to close. I was perusing the message board on our Texas Tech site today. And the sense I got from most of those fans, now obviously they're not the ones making the decisions, but was, hey, let's just roll with Wilhelmine here. Let's not stick our hand in that fire.

again. I saw some Texas tech people on Twitter saying, Daddy, come home. So, like, I don't think that was everybody. But it is interesting because there would have been a lot of legal wrangling that would have still had to happen all over again. And it would be the most college football thing ever if Brendan Sorsby resued for the injunction. Oh, my, I had to go back to the court in Lovick County. They found another judge who'd grant the injunction. And then he just And it's just like Groundhog Day. That would be incredible. I don't know if I've said this on the show and I don't know if it's a bad look,

but we'll edit it if it is. I don't think that Texas Tech thought he was going to win the first one. And it would be very curious how they would react if he actually tried to do it again. Well, I'm not sure he, yeah, I'm not sure the invitation to be on the team would still be there. Yeah. And I think you would need the invitation first before you spend more money. Like, you may have to find another school and given everything that's happened, I don't know that you'd be able to find another school.

I mean, you might be able to find another school. Neil Brown taking over at North Texas. Like, hey, there's a few that comes in your hometown, buddy. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know that you have to be willing to take the missiles that were aimed at Texas Tech. I just not sure.

I actually think that if Texas Tech took him back after all this, that they would actually be better off as a PR standpoint than they would have been had they just kept going. Well, if they took him back not to play, but to just work out with them. Right. Yeah. And then they could just say,

if he plays, it all happens again. Yeah. But I do think that there would be proof that they were being genuine when they said they were in it for Sorsby, but because the invitation's not there. If they were truly being genuine, they just pay him what they said they were going to pay him

and he could be like a team manager or something and they could just support him all, way through. You know, you know, that tells me that's not what's going to happen. Genuine only goes so far before paychecks and money start mucking up that, that whole situation. It's so much easier to be genuine if you're paying someone. Exactly.

Exactly. Rules for life. Rules for life. Everybody has an opinion until it impacts their pockets. Yeah. Dave Doran on the show later, first time guest will ask him his rules for life. But, uh, but that's a good Ari rule for life. Yeah.

He's to be genuine when you're not paying someone. Yeah. I actually think that we see this a lot in the world where people feel a certain way or act a certain way, but then when it, you know, impacts their own personal finances, then all of a sudden the opinions, which is up pretty quickly. So, you know, I don't know. This is a good discussion. And, you know, I don't know if we'll talk about them again. I'm sure we will.

Something else will probably pop up. But it would have been the most funny college football redoing this all over against circus. Because like once you think, because that's the thing that I have come to understand about the sport, Andy, is the second that you think that things are going to be normal, it's going to get weirder. Yeah. There's like, there's no. And the second you think anybody's going to learn anything, they just find the same brick wall and bang their head against it again. Yeah.

That's what they do. Our friend Ryan McGee from ESPN with a very funny tweet. y'all see where this Sorsby thing is going right and it is it's just Glenn Powell as Chad Powers did you watch that movie or me did you watch that show I well I got through two episodes it was very bad I like Glenn Powell he's a good actor that it's that show is bad the cringe on it is unbelievable I watched the first few episodes and I was entertained by it and I fell off not because I didn't like it but because I just you know that happens from time to time I would watch it like as like a as like a mindless thing to

His running man reboot was great, not a fan of Chad Powers. I'm trying to remember what happened in the first episode. Did he like punch somebody in the face and hit a cat on? I don't know. It was, it was a much more expensively produced, but not nearly as funny Blue Mountain State, basically. Yeah. What he did was he scored like a, he scored a game winning touchdown, but he dropped the ball before he crossed the goal line. He played for Oregon.

Play for Oregon and Georgia returned it for a game winning touchdown. and like a kid that was dying of cancer is in the end zone and he's like Chad Powers you're still my favorite player yeah I remember how turns around ends up hitting the dad and wheelchair falls and it's mayhem yeah yeah and then he and then he dresses up like this is much funnier yeah but did you guys see that speaking up speaking of um dressing up as somebody that you're not in order for your own personal game there was a guy who like dressed up as his deceased mother to to collect her pension and it was like a modern day real life mrs doubtfire like this was a news article i was reading online like the other day

and he looked just like her unbelievable that that probably happens more than we know people won't may not get caught as much as we think yeah i'm going to hop back down now yeah yeah go ahead of Yeah. Once you should die a Doubtfire, there's the conversation, Rivers out. I have been. Maybe I'm a bad parent,

but my daughter, who was three, got hooked onto Mrs. Doubtfire and we watched that movie 9,000 times. So I know it by heart again. And trying to explain to a three-year-old. It was a run by fruiting.

Who. Nope, was on the way, dear. All right. But trying to explain to a three-year-old what was happening in the dressing room at the restaurant at the end of the movie was kind of a weird.

Yeah. I'm glad my kids are older. All right. We have a new rule change in the NCAA. This is a big one. And we're going to have Dave Doran on later, the NC State coach. And I'm interested to ask him about this because this affected his team in the last couple of years. He's had a couple situations with quarterbacks where they've had to deal with the four-game redshirt rule and the kind of unintentional consequences of what happened to the four-game redshirt rule.

after NIL came into play. And so now you're going to get five years to play five. Now, there will be lawsuits for the guys that just finished playing who played only four years and got four years to play four, or five years to play four, I guess, but didn't redshirt. They'll suit. That's going to happen. Everybody knew that when they proposed this,

but this is something that coaches have been trying to get past, I'd say, I want to say for like 20 years. Yeah. They really wanted it. And basically, the rule is you have five years to play five years. There is no more red shirt. If you would like to get a waiver to play more years, it's the three M's military service, mission work, maternity leave.

That's how you get waivers. That's the only way to get waivers now. Oh, boy. And I think this probably will cut down in the lawsuits. It will cut down on the lawsuits, but I cannot wait for our inevitable emergency podcast in 2029 about a paternity leave. Oh, going to happen. Going to happen. Because there's plenty of people in college football who have kids.

And if the things aren't going the right way, you leave the team in the middle of the year to go take care of your child to get an extra year. Like, that's going to happen. But I do think that it's going to be very much cleaned up in comparison of what we're dealing with right now. Yeah. So the Trinidad Shambliss thing is a good example. It would not happen. Trinidad Shambliss would have been done after last year at Ole Miss because he would have spent four years of fair estate,

one year at Ole Miss, five years, that's it. Yeah. How do we refer to them in their classes and articles? I was thinking. I was wondering about that because we would call, we would call them fifth year seniors or redshirt seniors in the past. Yeah.

But now that there's no red shirt, are you still call it fifth year, I suppose. I guess you just like refer to them by the actual year they are in college with, say, a sophomore with four years. of eligibility left. Or a second. You could do it like Virginia does. Virginia doesn't do freshman, sophomore,

junior, senior. They call them first year, second years, third years, and fourth year. Yeah. Fourth year edge rusher, whatever.

Yeah. It's going to be kind of hard to keep track of that stuff. But I also found that figuring out what class someone was in the last two years was a pretty strenuous activity too. So, yeah.

Yeah. But so I mean, I feel like this is something that everybody's kind of been on board with. Like, is there any down, are there any, are there any, like,

unforeseen consequences to this. The only downside was everyone knew the people who were not going to get that, who would just finish their careers, we're going to sue. Like, you're going to have to get through that wave of lawsuits. And there are multiple lawyers that have already promised those are coming. You can't institute a rule without people getting, like, affected by it immediately. Yes.

You can't start it at any point without this being the byproduct of it. So just get through it. Yeah. And if you're in college now, basically, whatever will be better for you is the one that they will honor. But the thing I don't know, and I was waiting to talk to you about it on the show, is if these people who do sue win, what does that mean? Are we going to have a wave of people returning to college football, or is it going to be? Is it going to be that many is the question? I think it's more basketball than football.

that because I think the four to play four guys who went to the NFL are in the NFL and they're not worried about coming back. There's probably some guys that did, that played four years and they're done who would like that fifth year. And maybe they get it. Yeah. Maybe it maybe kind of a one-time shot. But also small consequence to pay to get a more functional system long term.

Yeah. I think it's, it'll probably be bumpy for a year or so. as they get it figured out. But it should be a lot cleaner going forward because the waiver process caused a lot of these problems. And the NCAA not applying it evenly caused a ton of problems. And so you take the waivers away

and you make the rule very simple, then that helps now. I should point out the age part of it because we were mostly a football show. The age part of this does not affect football nearly as much. as it affects basketball. Basically, your clock starts either when you enroll in college or on your 19th birthday.

So you turn 19, you have until you're 24, basically, to play. Like you have five years. And so what that is aimed at is stopping the European basketball players who play pro for two or three years in Europe and then come over. It may affect Aussie punters in football. Yeah. They may have to decide that their rugby career, their Aussie Rules football career is over sooner if they want to come over here. We're not going to have 36-year-old people playing college football anymore.

Probably not. Now, it does affect the ex-minor League baseball player who wants to come play. It does not affect, was a Nate Boyer, the former Longsnapper at Texas, who served in the military before. before he went to Texas. It would not affect him. How long is it a Mormon mission two years? Two years, yeah. So it's possible that BYU will have teams in six years from now

that have half their roster two years older than everybody else on the field. Which would be consistent with BYU for the last 40 years. Yeah. So, yeah, that's, that is something that they've, they've dealt with that. But there will be no offsetting age on the other roster this time. Right, right. But it's interesting because I was reading, you know, some fans talking about this.

And they're like, well, Indiana, you know, made use the sixth and seventh year super. No, they didn't. They're always players were fifth year guys. Like, yeah. These guys are still, like, these people will still be available to you. Yeah. No, I think it's great. It's one of the rules that everyone's, like, you'll see when, when Dave Doran comes on.

Like, we're pushing them for it. We're happy that it happened and it'll be easier to manage our rosters moving forward. We saw them deal with this with M.J. Morris a few years ago. They had to figure this out. They had to figure it out with C.J. Bailey, their current starting quarterback because I think the plan a couple of years ago was to redshirt him. And then there was an injury and they had to play him and burn the redshirt. So now C.J. Bailey has more eligibility, has one more year of eligibility than he would have.

So that's probably good for NC State. So, but yeah, we'll ask Dave Doran how he feels about it. My guess is pretty good. So here is NC State Coach Dave Thorne. We are joined by NC State Coach Dave Doran, fourth longest tenured head coach in the FBS going to year 14. How are feeling, coach? I feel great. 54 kicking 20-year-old ass every day, man.

Seriously, having a good time. I really enjoy the players I have. staff chemistry. It's been a lot of fun. There's been some ups and downs for sure and some evolution needed with a landscape of college football. But I feel like we've kind of hit our stride here and found a way to continue to be relevant. It's interesting. So I'm 47. So I had seven years difference from you. And I remember thinking how old 47 or 50 seemed when I was 20. but now I don't I don't feel that different than I felt when I was 30. I mean, is that what it's like for you?

Yeah, I feel better right now than I did, you know, five or six years ago, to be honest. And, you know, I don't know if it's, we're all probably chasing our health at some point in time. But, you know, workout routines and different things you do. But also just understanding the ends and outs, you know, when you're a head coach, I think I'm going on my seventh. 17th year or 16th years ahead coach, you get used to how you do things. And then, you know, when NIL and the portal started, all of us had to re-evaluate what we're doing and how we do it and come up with the best way to do it within, you know, the framework of our budgets and our donor bases and everything else.

And it took a few years kind of to recalibrate. I think that's where you saw a lot of coaches maybe step out. And, you know, for me, it's once we figured it out and we evolved, I'm really excited. I'm thankful I've had the support that I've had here through the process to get this thing where it is. Coach, some coaches, when they got to that intersection, decided this was no longer for them, some evolved. What was that crossroads like for you personally and what made you want to evolve and keep going? I get all these text messages and phone calls from my former players and just had one last week.

Blake Sorensen was a linebacker that played for me at Wisconsin and asked me to get on a call with him and his leadership team. he runs a business and I was just talking about the things I did to help him become the leader he is when he played for me. And those kind of conversations hit deep. And that's what still keeps me going is, you know, the servant nature of this profession, the ability to mentor and help young men grow into the people they want to be and inspire them to do better things with their lives. You know, obviously I love to compete and I love to win. And since 2020, we're the second winning this program in the ACC and are tied for second most conference wins. And so I don't like second.

And so there's meat on the bone. I want to be first. And so competing and getting this place to, you know, that next step is a big part of what drives me as well. So nothing stops changing, though. Like something changed yesterday. The NCAA passed this new rule. It's five to play five. How does that change your, because like you've been doing camps.

You've been evaluating players for the 27, 28, 29. classes. I think about your quarterback, C.J. Bailey. I remember your original plan was not to play him his true freshman year so you could redshirt him. Now you actually have three more years of eligibility with him. How does that math work for you guys? You know what? That was a change that was something we wanted. And so sometimes, you know, things are thrown at us and no one asks our opinion. No one cares if we're going to be able to handle that change. They just said this is the new rule figured out. In this case, we've been trying to get five for five. has had coaches for a while. And, you know, when the play four games to Redshirt rule was created, it was pre-NIL. It was pre-Portle. It was created to help your freshmen get a little bit more under their belt and help them develop. And post-Portle, post-NIL, it became something that agents were using to leverage players and coaches with.

And that wasn't the intent of the rule at all. And so I'm happy that this rule change happened. and, you know, I probably went through it in a tougher situation than most head coaches. You know, a few years ago, we had a starting quarterback that opted out to Redshirt. And so, you know, to me, that wasn't the intentionality when this was put in. It was a developmental rule. And so five from five, I think is great. I think it actually fits academics better.

It takes kids more time than four years to graduate. In most cases, it's four and a half. And, you know, it just gives you a little bit more. runway gets rid of a lot of these waivers as well where you see the six, seventh, eighth, and ninth year guys playing college football. Well, and your medical staff never has to worry about game fiveitis again. Yeah. No, that was a tricky thing, the last, you know, since NIL.

And I think it's healthy for these guys, too. They know when they step on campus, they've got five years to complete their mission and to develop into the best version of themselves to help the university. that they've signed with and to help themselves to get their degree. And it just, you know, gives them a path and a runway that they see the ending of. Yeah, when that happened with MJ, that was a pretty big deal. And I'm wondering behind the scenes, that that happened more often than we as, you know, consumers of the sport think?

Like, I mean, we always theorize, well, this season's not going well or this guy's season's not going the way that he planned. I mean, how often do you think this is actually occurring across the board? Do you have, like, stories or colleagues who share that with you? Yeah, I think it happens a lot. I mean, and the conversations happen a ton. With staff, at least, on, hey, where are we out? Because, you know, you're going to sit in your meeting room every week

and talk about your roster. And this guy's played in one game, this guy's played in two games. Our special teams coaches really track it because, you know, their population of players they can use is based on that. And whether it's, you know, a guy that you're trying to redshirt or not, we're going to do the best we can to make the best decisions for these guys' futures. And so now that conversation being off the table is huge. And, you know, I can't speak for other coaches.

But when we get in our head coach's meetings, I know a lot of us felt like the leverage that that four-game rule was where kids were opting out to save a year because their agents were telling them to do so. That's not why it was created. And so just give everybody five years and get all that stuff off the table. You know what just occurred to me, Andy? and I don't know if you thought about this before today, but coach made a good point about special teams.

You know, there's a lot of wacky things that happen in special teams in college football on a Saturday. You're coaching. You're not watching. It's an alternate jerseys and whatnot yet. Yeah, like, I wonder if there's just going to be more competent special teams across the board now that that's one less thing that, like, you just, like, you field your team and you just roll with those guys that are best for

for the position rather than rolling people in based on what their eligibility might suggest. Well, and the other part of it, too, you know, they've shrunk our roster. So, you know, really, eliminating walk-ons once this grandfather rule disappears. We were at 125 with 85 scholarships. You're now at 105, and you can go to your Title IX number and tell, you know, basically this grandfathered rule runs out because once it does, any kid you had to your team is in the 105, whether he's on scholarship or not. And so your number of bodies that you have to play special

teams with has shrunk. And so now taking that forward five-game rule into effect and allowing your entire roster to be available is a nice benefit for special teams and for the depth of your team. So I'm curious, because you did just finish camp season and you're planning these recruiting classes out, have you changed your recruiting philosophy? Because you've always been a developmental program. And, you know, I think about the, especially the big guys on the line of scrimmage, rarely are you going to find somebody who can just come in and play. But do you want to pay top dollar for somebody who may not be able to help you on the field? How do you balance that?

How do you decide who you're going to go after at a high school? Does that change have you shrunk how many you want to sign out of high school? Yeah, I mean, we've put 22 linemen in the NFL since I've been here on both sides of the ball. And I have the same strength coach that I started with. He and I have a great relationship. And our recruiting staff understands what we're looking for. And there's measurables that really matter in our formula. When you talk about their arm length and wingspan and hand size

and all the things that we look at, how they can bend and their flexibility. But to me, the money is different program to program. And the bottom line is at NC State, earned, not given, is a big part of our program. It's jersey numbers, it's everything. And when you have a guy that's played really well here and has become an all-conference player and All-American and leads our team in pancakes, for example,

if he's an O-Lignment, he's going to get rewarded here. They're going to take really good care of him. But coming in the door, I just, you know, I look at the NFL model. You know, the rookies make less than the vets. And I think that's what's best for your locker room, unless you're a team that just has a blank check and you can do what you want to do. And not all of us have that.

The thing I think is interesting about the evolution of the sport and, of course, in turn, roster assembly is that, you know, there seems to be a lot of experimentation, a lot of influence about what worked for the most recent national champion and all those things. How many times do you guys have to revisit how you want to build, how you know, the numbers from high school and portal and all those different complicated things on a year-to-year basis.

Like I'm assuming it evolved big time when the sport changed, but how much is it change every off-season? Well, you know, we all study each other. And Indiana is a great one to look at. You know, Coach Signetti did a phenomenal job. And I think it's a great study for schools that are changing, you know, coaches. Because, you know, when I got hired here from Northern Illinois, we had a really good team in Northern Illinois.

I think we were tied with Alabama for a number of wins over two years, and we were going to the Orange Bowl. And when I came here, I couldn't bring any players with me. At that time, they would have had to sit out a year. And Coach Signati had a great team at James Madison, and he goes to Indiana and brings 20 plus guys with them, which was great for him to be able to instill his culture and add talent and help that football team become what it was.

And so, you know, for me, comparing what we have to them doesn't really make sense because I'm not coming in here, brand new. But the one thing you can learn from Indiana is they were an experienced football team. I mean, they were the oldest team in college football. And that's one thing as a coach you can't do is you can't just instill experience. You know, guys have to be out on the field to get those reps. And so that definitely is something we saw as a staff. Does that make you go more portal heavy? To me, no. Retention heavy too is part of that, getting older, is retaining guys you want

retain but i think haven't experienced healthy players matters and indiana definitely shows you that well and with with you guys you've said it we've seen it guys have gotten bought off your roster it's happened but but it seems like you've been pretty strategic about who you've been able to retain cj bailey the starting quarterback obviously a big one but like duke scott's an interesting one to me you just gave him the number one jersey we've talked a lot about hollywood smothers leaving but you look at Duke at the end of last season and especially that the Georgia Tech game, where he just sort of bursts on. And I'm sure you guys saw that in practice. But do you, is it, is it where you get to an end of the season and say, okay, we have some really good players. We can't keep

them all. Well, yeah, I wish I could keep them all. I mean, all those guys I lost like, they're great dudes, man. And I wish them all well. But in the case of the running back, we're excited about Duke Scott. And he totally embodies number one for us as an athlete, work ethic leader, student, and talent. And so, you know, there's an opportunity for him. And, you know, there's choices and consequences with everything we do. I think your decisions that you make, a lot of them are based on, you know, we need this guy to come back. And what are we like if he doesn't? You know, when you look at CJ and, you know, being a third year starter in our program, the type of leader he is, the type of emotional stability he has and how competent he is with the guys in the locker

room and how much funny is to be around. Like, no, this is it needs to stay at NC State. And, you know, the depth we had a running back, different conversation. Not that we didn't want Hollywood to stay. We love Hollywood. But there's depth in that room that's very, very talented that was ready to play and proved that it was ready to play. And so it made you feel differently about, you know, if this guy leaves, at least we have,

you know, some important pieces. coming back behind them. But it's, you know, one position, one player at a time, you go through a lot of tough decisions that you didn't have to use to make in a college football head coaching position. But you also, like, it giveth, too. And I find it interesting. You've actually surrounded CJ with some of his best friends through the transfer portal. Like Jojo Trader comes from Miami.

They played together in high school. And Davy Goss was at North Carolina. And he was one of his high school teammates as well. Yeah, you know, I kind of embrace change. And one of the things that happens, change is going to happen. We know that. And if a coach leaves, you know, I have a good coach leave to be an NFL coach or a coordinator or a head coach or whatever it may be, I look at it as an opportunity to grow and get better.

And it's no different when a good player leaves. Like, you hate to see it. You wish them well. You care about them. But there's now a new opportunity. And when we lost a couple receivers, we knew we needed to go hunting for wideouts. We lost running back. We had to go hunt for running backs.

And that's part of this deal. You start looking around. You're like, hey, this guy, you're looking for contacts and connections. Because as you know, this portal window is small. And it happens like that. And so if there's a kid you recruited really hard in high school, you already have a relationship that helps. If there's a kid that has great ties already to players on your team,

and he's immediately going to feel like he's at home because he knows guys. Those are guys we target. And we look for geographical connections. We look for historical connections. in recruiting or we look for guys that we know are friends with guys on our team because they're going to feel at home when they get come on the visit because otherwise if you have no connection in any way it's hard it's hard to get that guy to want to come to your school in my opinion unless you're just writing on the check that other people aren't you know as we're discussing the future i am somewhat amused at the notion that there's a likelihood that one of the better players and stars of your team's name is duke state. Well, and your backfield may have a guy named Duke and a guy who played at North Carolina. I know. Yeah. That's weird. When you left Northern Illinois and left Chandler Harnish and company behind, hey, you could, like, with this rule today and that you could have taken Chandler Harnish for

one year at NC State now. It would have been Jordan Lynch at that time. Oh, it did Jordan Lins? That's right. That's right. We had seven guys on that team go to the NFL and Jordan Lynch went to the Heismund. That's what I'm saying. Like when you look at what Eric Morris is about to do, bringing 24 guys, I think it is from North Texas to Oklahoma State. And, you know, you can flip a program a lot faster when you're bringing all your dudes from your winning roster. And I wasn't able to do that here. You know, we had to build it from scratch. And so it's different now. And I think that's, you know, when you say studying other teams, this program has been built on development and will continue to be with the influx.

of some older players here and there. It is interesting, though, because I think there's just this general notion that, well, who would want to bring a bunch of G4 players to a power program? And it's like, well, the top 15 players on those teams are actually probably very good. Yeah, really good players, 100%.

A lot of guys go overlook still, man. You can still find guys out there and kids are still late bloomer, three sport athletes, undernourished, didn't have a good strength program. They developed at, you know, Northern Illinois or Toledo or South Alabama. wherever it may be, and they turn into really good football players.

And so, you know, a lot of the guys we've taken were guys from the G5 that performed at a high level for us, and we're still doing that. We've got some guys this year that we just took out of the G5 that are really playing good in practice. And that's kind of been the history of your program at NC State, too, taking guys out of high school, where you've got the things you're looking for. Some of those things may not have expressed in a way that make that guy a five-star recruit, but you can get them and in two years later you've made them into an NFL player. So it seems like all that stuff still works.

It's just how you manage it. It's different now. Yeah, you just got to retain them. Exactly. Yeah, I think there was a stat a few years ago. It came out and it was Iowa, Utah, and us were the top three in college football at developing three-star players or less into NFL draft picks. And I thought it was a really cool stat that just showed developmental success.

And so we're still doing it. I mean, the recipe hasn't changed. Even if I only have a kid for a year, like we're trying to make them into the best version of himself, you know. And I really applaud our strength staff or nutrition staff, training room staff, because we do a good job, you know, it's not always that way. Not everybody's in step and drinking the same Kool-Aid, and we have that here, and so it's been helpful.

Andy began this interview with a question about, or at least a statement about your being the fourth-longest tenured coach in college football. I mean, when you look around, it's kind of a bloodbath out there, you know, for your colleagues. And then a lot of people, did somebody say, Andy, on the show that the average lifespan of a coach is three and a half years or something? That is a Thursday guest, Butch Jones. Okay. Butch Jones said that. We were talking to him. Okay. Yeah. Sorry if I spoil the future, fun fact for a later episode. But how much pride do you take in just the longevity and the ability

to stick at one place and to, you know, have success long-term doing it the way that you were doing it. Yeah, it's kind of surreal. You know, a million things have happened since I got here, but it's gone really fast. We were talking yesterday, Sarah and I about something that happened. We're like, well, when was that? And we figured out it was eight years ago, and they're like, oh, and cow. I mean, like, some of the things that are going on and, you know, former players now coming back. And I think I got seven of them working on my staff.

I take a lot of pride in it. And, you know, to be the winning as tech coach here and to be able to, you know, do the things that we're doing inside this building, have a lot of pride in it. To say that I raised three sons in one city from elementary school to middle school to high school, was great for their upbringing. And so you don't always get to do that. And obviously, I've had to stay. I've had opportunities to leave.

And they've had to want to keep me when I've had a couple down years. And so I think there's been loyalty on both sides that hopefully is appreciated. So every time we have a first time guest, we close with the same question, Coach. What is your rule for life? Or if you have a couple, that's fine too. I have three, never complain about free food, never complain about free beer, never skip legday. I feel like you do those three things, you'll be happy. But do you have one or two that you just live by?

That's a great question, man. You know, I don't know that I have a rule per se, but I try to abide by, you know, faith, family, friends, fishing, football, and really good music. And like that, those are the things that make me happy and that I try to, you know, live up to. And at the end of the day, I think you learn this the hard way in coaching, comparisons to the football joy. And, you know, you just, you really try to lean into the people that you care about

and not worry about the people that don't have anything. to do with your success or your failure. So you're heading to the lake for some well-deserved vacation. Okay, so I'm sure fishing's going to be maybe involved in that. The music, what are we, as we get in the car, get ready to head of the lake, what do we turn it on? You know, there's two kinds of music in my car, country or western. So you'll be listening to one of those that come up. And I do love throwback country music.

I'm a big Willie Nelson, Merle Hagger. I love those guys. I love listening to Whalen Jennings. And then, you know, the modern day musicians that have them as mentors, you know, Tyler Childers and Chris Stapleton and Turnpike Trubedores and all these guys that are such great musicians. So I love good country music. I'm not a big pop guy and I'm not a big pop country guy either.

It's more in that wheelhouse. do like some Southern Rock, Leonard Skinner, and things like that. But yeah, that's kind of where I sit on the music spectrum. So we're hitting the Outlaw Country button on Series XM. Yeah, some of that. And I'll turn on some Jimmy Buffett or Bob Marley, too, and sit on the lake and relax with that as well. Yeah, all right.

I can just picture it in my head because, like, I don't think that people realize this who haven't been there. But North Carolina, I think, is the most underrated state in the union in terms of just pure beauty. Stay away. It is an awesome place, man. I mean, two and a half hours from here, you know, you're on the ocean. Three hours you're in the Appalachian Mountains.

And then there's lakes all around us, you know. And then you have Pioneers to play golf. And there's thousand golf courses in this state that are awesome. And all kinds of geography that you can plan them in. And the fishing from ocean fishing to mountain fishing to lake fishing, the river fishing, you got it all. And I don't have to get in a plane. and you can just drive around and see all these things, you know, out of the window of your truck.

It's pretty sweet. Well, your mama didn't let her baby grow up to be a cowboy, but she let him grow up to be a football coach. And enjoy vacation, coach. Thanks for having me on, guys. Appreciate you guys, giving me your time. Yeah, appreciate you being here. Thank you. Yeah, have a great summer.

That sounds like a good vacation, Ari. You know, I've never been fishing? You know, I've never been fishing? You know, I've only done it. like I've done fishing once and I tried to throw the rod back and the hook got caught in a picnic table. Better than a part of your body. Yeah, I mean, but that's the extent of my fishing experience. I'm just imagining the scene from there's something about Mary.

Yeah. How'd you get the beans above the Frank? Well, that's a different scene. Yeah, my my 16 year old watched that for the first time last week. And he's on board, fully, fully on board. Yeah, I think that what's going to happen, not the, I mean, we're in a minute, we're after an hour now so I can get into my, can I get into my bag of bullshit real quick? Yeah, we're all friends here. I wonder if kids your son's age moving forward are going to gravitate to the comedies that we grew up with because they don't make them that good anymore.

Oh, it's, yeah, it's not even close. And now, I do think the longer we go without them, if they do start. all loving something about Mary, dumb and dumber, the hangover. That'll bring them back. Things that came out before they were born, that yes, that somebody will go,

there might be money to be made in this. Yeah, there is a lot of money to be made because also comedies tend to be lower budget. So, like, it's not, it's not,

you know, but I do think that, like, if your son has been raised going to the movie theaters, like in his peak time as being old enough to watch these movies now,

he's going to go back and watch the hangover. He's never had the experience in a movie theater of seeing a movie as funny as there's something about Mary. Right. Because I remember going to see the hangover when my wife was pregnant with him. That was the last movie we saw in the theater before we became the parents. Yeah. And there hasn't been a movie since as funny as that.

I watched Super Bad in the movie theater and your son cannot concede. And I'm trying to explain to my son. how hard we were laughing as a collective in that movie theater when they smashed cut to, we got a bleeder! Yeah. And like there is something about the community aspect of the comedies where everybody's like in it together. Like it's like a happy place. Everyone's laughing.

So I interned in Atlanta at the newspaper there, the Atlanta Journal of Constitution in the summer of 1999. I had a three week period where I saw in the movie theater. Austin Powers 2 American Pie South Park Bigger Longer and Uncut Touch me Jim Yeah

Come on I know I know I know The kids The kids now don't get that joy Of being in the movie theater And just Dying laughing

Like you got to see Super Bad twice Because you missed half the jokes Because people were laughing so hard Yeah Anybody who's listened to the show for longer than a year, especially going back to the athletic days, knows how I feel about

movies, and I don't want to delve into that rant, but they don't make good movies anymore, period. Sorry, they don't. And don't, don't hit me with Spider-Man, or I'm going to smash my computer against the wall. No, dude, he-man was awesome. He-man ruled. You're enabling them. Every time you guys

go to a comic book movie, you're enabling them. I'm going to see Supergirl this weekend, are you? That's great. Congratulations. Let me know how it is. Is it like all the other ones? Jason Momoa is Lobo. I've been waiting for this for a long time. long time. Don't be a hater, Ari. It's unbelievable.

Just producer river. Have a sense of imagination. Please. The comic book movie industry has ruined film. Well, Ari doesn't like whimsy. All I know is if you go look at Fandango, does that sell a thing? Remember Fandango? You have no idea.

Movie phone? I just remember Kramer trying to be a movie phone. It'll be a children's movie. It'll be a low-budget horror movie. It'll be a comic book movie. and it'll be a remake. It's those four over and over and over again. You're exactly right.

And it's just like, I'm sorry, but. There, but there are, I will say, I think, I think it's coming back around. I hope so. The previews last time we were in the movie theater. Now, we saw Declaration, Declaration Day, Disclosure Day, then the Spielberg movie. It's good.

Okay. Nothing most satisfying any, but good. We're going to take a little to see Toy Story. Like now we're, now like that we're in the childhood phase, Like there's reason to go to the movie theater again, which is to take your daughter to see movies that I would never go watch alone. And they're cute.

So we'll see Toy Story. And that'll be nostalgic. But again, I think Toy Story 5 needs to exist. But yeah, I understand. I know. I agree with you.

But like that's what we got. Like there's no other. Well, I'm telling you, now this won't be a preview when you go see Toy Story 5. Look it up online. The trailer for how to rob a bank.

That movie looks awesome. Oh, there's a movie coming. Oh, yeah. I'll go check it out. They don't even show movie previews on TV. That movie looks really cool. They don't even market them the same way. Did you see caught stealing the Austin Butler movie?

That was really good. I didn't see that in theater. The problem with it too, Andy, is that the budgets are so tight, and they're trying to make so much money that they can't afford the promotion. The marketing push. Yeah, yeah. There's movies that come out that might have been good, but I don't even see the preview. I'm going to give you some homework because this is, this one's on streaming. Go see or call up caught stealing.

Okay. It's a really good movie. I'm a big crime drama person. This would be right up your alley. Prisoners, which was the movie about the girl who got kidnapped with Jake Jelinehall in it. Have you seen that movie? I think it came out like in 2013 and I watched it by myself a few weeks ago. And I was like, this is the best movie I've seen in like 10 years. It was like a 15 year old movie.

I also just watch weapons. Now, that's a horror movie, but it was very good. All right. What was the name of that movie you said? Caught stealing. I'll go check it out right now. But thanks for listening to, we should brand. Thanks to listen to Annie Nari Talk Movies. Yeah.

Hey, the rewatchables gets tons of, uh, yeah, tons of plays. Maybe we need to branch out. I'll give it a shot. We'll talk to you tomorrow.