Andy & Ari On3 - Oregon Ducks coach Dan Lanning CLAPS BACK at Mike Gundy | Bill Belichick's Debut at North Carolina vs TCU

Episode Date: September 2, 2025

As week 2 rapidly approaches, the slate may not look as good as Week 1's, but it will be sure to provide some storylines. One storyline ahead of week 2 involves the game between Oklahoma State and Oregon. As Oklahoma State has taken a slide the past few years, Oregon has been on the rise, in a big way. Watch here as Andy & Ari go through Mike Gundy's comments on Oregon's quarterback and spending habits in Eugene. Later, Andy & Ari hear from Dan Lanning to hear his thoughts on Gundy's comments. What do you expect from Oregon and Oklahoma State on Saturday? Will it be a close game? (0:00-0:36) On Today’s Episode(0:37-2:18) BetMGM(2:19-7:37) Intro: Mike Gundy’s flash(7:38-20:59) Gundy comments on Oregon(21:00-25:47) Dan Lanning’s response to Oklahoma State(25:48-35:12) Are Ok State and Oregon playing the same sport?(35:13-36:39) Huel(36:40-38:23) Academy Sports + Outdoors(38:24-43:11) Revisiting UNC vs TCU(43:12-51:24) Did Belichick know what was going to happen?(51:25-52:09) Trivia Time(52:10-54:59) Picks Record after Week 1(55:00-59:12) Recapping South Carolina vs Virginia Tech(59:13-59:52) Conclusion: Dear Andy & Ari on Thursday! After hashing out Oregon vs Oklahoma State, the guys take a visit over to Chapel Hill to wrap up the discourse on Bill Belichick's debut vs TCU at home. Will Belichick be able to turn it around in Chapel Hill? How much stock should we put into the Tar Heels' debut? To close, Andy & Ari visit their current records against the spread. Then, the guys revisit Atlanta to recap South Carolina's win over Virginia Tech.  Join On3 today and get one full year of access to The Athletic included! https://www.on3.com/subscribe/C Watch our show on YouTube! https://youtu.be/b8p0-zPf1EQ Hosts: Andy Staples, Ari WassermanProducer: River Bailey Interested in partnering with the show? Email [e-mail]

On today's edition of Andy and Orion 3 presented by BetMGM, we have coaches trading barbs, Mike Gundy versus Dan Lannning, ahead of Oklahoma State's game at Oregon on Saturday. We also have more fallout from North Carolina getting Molly whooped by TCU. We have Bill Belichick's comments after the game. What did he say? And they're on to Charlotte. we're on to week two it's time for and ari on three we have teamed up with betmgm this season we'll be using betmgm lines to make all our picks and we'll have special offers for our listeners each week when you join bedmgium you get access to a variety of parley selection features

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We are on to week two, and we've already got intrigue. We said it yesterday. You said it. You said it's always these weeks where it doesn't look like there's a lot of enticing games that some crazy stuff happens. And we already have crazy stuff happening. We don't know if it's going to affect the game, but it's sure going to make the week of the game interesting.

Ari, let's take a look at Mike Gundy talking about his first significant road experience as an Oklahoma State quarterback. I think I played on the road. road Thursday night in Lincoln because it was 15 degrees in sleeting. Is that on the schedule? You lost 30 to 10. Yeah, there was the week after Illinois State. Okay, so that one I thought, I don't even remember the Illinois State, but I remember that one because it was sleeting. And we came out of the locker room and I was, you know the movie Christmas story? You ever watch that? Yeah. Well, that's how I came out. And when we broke the huddle, like Nebraska's

defensive line had their shirts by there. I thought, this is not good. But I do remember that. So, all right, go ahead. Flash in the camera already! I love Mike Gundy. And you'll understand fully why, as we keep going. Yeah.

I've always wondered about the flex of exposing your skin to very cold weather. I was, like, amused by what Tennessee did before the game in Columbus, the playoff game we went to. last year. I'm also, is that like a source of toughness, you think? Well, it's a show of toughness. And it has to be more organic, is what Mike Gundy's saying. Like, what Tennessee did was very contrived. When they were in Columbus, they come out with their shirts off, they're dancing, you know, jumping around, dancing around. And everybody was just like, no, that's not really how it works. What Mike Gundy's talking about, and we were talking about like late 80s, Nebraska. So just badasses of badasses. And they just

got the shirts kind of rolled up showing the midriff in 15 degree weather like that's what he's talking about hey uh river will you put the mike gundy uh picture back up and i think that you are missing something that is a joke here that i'm not sure you thought of but i'm going to hit you with it and you're going to think it's brilliant okay if you could pick one coach in college football to recreate this today who would you pick in Bob Chesney, Bob Chesney at JMU. I pick Ryan Day. You want to know why?

It wouldn't answer so many questions. You're right. I know that it's supposed to be like a Saturday only joke and we move on. I'm not moving on from that. Until somebody definitively proves that the man's nipples aren't pierced, I'm not going to, I'm not going to drop it. But, you know, hey, what if Ryan Day just sends you a shirtless selfie? Just be like, Ari, shut up about this on your show. Yeah, that would be incredible.

Not for publication, but shut the hell up. I may or may not have drafted. See, like that picture, like they're not pierced anymore. I don't know what was going on in that picture. It might have been edited. But, you know, we have taught a lot, thought a lot this week about coaches' nipples. And I think when you look at the fact that there's only one-length.

River, please clip Ari saying we've thought a lot this week about coach's nipples. Just clip it, add it to the soundboard, put it right next to Jordan Hudson. We are talking about this. Do you think that the word nipple makes it funnier? It's just a funny. So much funnier. Yeah, anyway, we're just having fun today. We don't have, we know that Saturday is going to be wild. We just don't know why. I'm not going to pretend like we could sit here right now and tell you when it's going to happen but whenever you have this many teams playing teams that if they lost to um it would be a major major major major story and there's 20 of them in the same weekend the odds of them occurring are higher which is why that

always happens um so you know we'll see but you know Mike Gundy also I think uh you know is the topic of a more serious conversation we're going to have today too I don't know how serious the conversation is because I also think Mike Gundy does this stuff a little bit for fun. I think some of this is him enjoying, messing with us in the media, prodding the opponent. So he was on his radio show last night, and the discussion of what Oregon spends on its roster came up. And here's what he said. You know, Oregon is paying a lot, a lot of money for their team. So from a non-conference standpoint, there's coaches saying they should play teams that are spending the same amount of money.

So what do you figure they are? Probably triple what you pay, ballpark? Well, there's revenue sharing intact this year. Yes. So that makes a difference. Yeah, so some, but they haven't got their hands on it yet. Gotcha. So the last three years, you didn't have revenue sharing.

right right so and it's funny you mention that because i guess that the last three years that we spent around seven million over the three years and um i think organ spent close to 40 last year alone wow wow so that was just one year okay now i might be off a few million but uh oh what's a few million among friends well what i'm saying is is um they're spending a lot of money they spent a lot of money you know and there's some schools that are doing that pretty sure he's off by a lot of millions i i don't remember anyone reporting estimating that this was anything close to 40 million dollars yeah i never heard the number 40 uh but even if it was you know i try to sympathize

with coaches because, listen, I think it would be very frustrating to exist in a world where you're playing a game against teams that just are playing a different sport than you. And I understand that, but the thing that is not new to college football, the money's new, but the thing that's not new is the resource discrepancy. And like Oklahoma State, I think is probably by my estimation, and you can, can correct me if I'm wrong here, Andy. Every bit is capable financially or, you know, ability-wise as the teams that they're directly competing against, which is the other teams in the big 12. You know, and I know that, you know, Sunny Dykes and, you know, might have some more money

and Texas Tech clearly has more money at the, you know, but I don't know if you went down the list, like, how different is Oklahoma State from Arizona? How different is it from Cincinnati or Kansas state or Utah. I mean, I don't know. You Salt Lake City is a big city. I don't know. I don't know everyone's, you know, NIL capabilities. But what I do know is, is that Oklahoma State playing against Alabama would have had a same discrepancy or Alabama or Oregon is trying to beat Alabama. They're not trying to drown out Oklahoma State. So like, there's always been that discrepancy. And I feel like if you are underperforming, um, in relation to your current your usual production in the big 12 it's easy to point the finger at

Oregon when like people should be focusing on where you are in the big 12 no one's even comparing Oklahoma State to Oregon well and the thing is so you know that he mentioned elsewhere in that interview Phil Knight the Nike chairman who obviously is bankrolling Oregon and has been well Oklahoma State had its own billionaire sugar daddy back in the day T-boo and Pickens and when When Tee Boone Pickens was turning Oklahoma State from a very much under-resourced athletic department to one that was one of the nicer ones in the Big 12, I didn't hear Mike Gundy complaining about discrepancies. So obviously they still didn't have as much as Texas or Oklahoma, but they were very well situated within the Big 12 of the time. Now they're still pretty well situated in the Big 12, but they are not well situated.

compared to Oregon, compared to Georgia, compared to Ohio State? The thing that I think is the most important here is how are you situated in relation to your peers? And I think if Oregon wants to win a national championship and it's not situated financially to its peers, then it won't. If Oklahoma State wants to win a national championship, it can't because it is not situated in relation to those peers, but is completely situated evenly to its peers. So, like, there is this, you mentioned this at the beginning of the show, and I think it's true. Like, there is this like pearl clutching of like, we're going to do things the right way. We're not just going to go buy players in, you know, we're going to lose with no, we're going to be noble while

losing, right? Nobility is this important. And it's like, I just feel like on one hand, I can understand why Mike Gundy is frustrated because he had a lot of success during a time in which maybe it was a little bit even. It might not have been legal, but like you could navigate the rules of the game, you know, at Oklahoma State a little bit easier than you might be able to now. But on the other hand, too, I feel like it's less likely to be taken seriously nationally when it's coming at a time in which Oklahoma State's had a pretty bad run. And it feels more of a deflection than me than an actual commentary on the game. And I don't know how many more years he has left or how much he even, you know, desires to do it.

He seemed to me, like, he's like the coolest guy, right? Like, I'm not trying to attack him personally, but he seems to me to be very resentful of the direction of the actual sport. He's been one of the more outspoken coaches, you know, about NIL since this began. And I think it might just be possible that this new world's not for him, you know? And that's okay. But it's, you are what you are, you know? Well, right. And the thing is, this is all within the rules. And that was what bothered me. It was actually before the show started. So the thing you were referencing me saying, I did not say on the show, but I will say it now. There is no nobility in being a cheap skate. Like Pittsburgh Pirates fans are not happy that the pirates are wasting the early years of Paul Skeen's career by being cheap. They would rather them pay for a competitive roster.

and be competitive. Like, this thing in college football, because people got brainwashed by the NCAA and the schools who wanted to keep all the money away from the players, that you're only winning nobly if you're cheap, well, that's just stupid. That's not how it works in the walk of life. You know, and there also is a distinction between cheap and just not having it. Like, you could be a millionaire who, who, you know, brings a total. didn't have it, but that's also, you can go raise it.

There are coaches, like Eli Drinkwitz, prime example. Eli Drinkwitz has worked his ass off to raise money for NIL and to, like, lobby the Missouri state legislature to pass laws that make it easier for him to get players. Like, he's worked very hard on that. We talk a lot about being a head coach and the, um, the job description now and much of it is actually coaching. And I feel like the percentage of actually coaching is going down more and more per year. But I do think that there are a certain aspect of being a coach, especially at a middle, middle tier to lower tier power five program, fundraising is a major

part of it. You know, get out there speaking engagements, do everything that you can to drum up excitement. Um, you know, and you might not, again, there's a lot of coaches out there that have been, you know what it kind of reminds me of? The newspaper writers from the 90s and the early 2000s that had three stories a week that they had to read more eight you're writing three columns a week and getting a six figure salary your salary and you have an expense report you can stay at the four seasons and eat whatever steakhouse you want and you have an engine at the end of the road and like I did not grow up in that era and I'm starting to see some of the older people in the press box now who grew up in that era who are resentful of what they're asked to

do or at the very least stepping away from their jobs. because they think it's not reasonable. Meanwhile, I think you and I combined for seven or eight columns over the weekend. Well, yeah, those people don't understand that they were stealing money back in the day. Like,

they thought they were working, but they weren't. They had it very cushy. And not to say that, I'm not saying that coaching college football in 2009 was cushy, but it's a lot cushier than it is now. It's a lot harder to do it now. Yeah.

And you also have like, what if like I had the, you know, my first job, you know, that wasn't, that was in the newspaper realm was a online first job. But I don't know if you know this, but when I worked at the Cleveland Plain Dealer in Cleveland.com, it was split up into two. Like there were employees of Cleveland.com and there were employees of the Cleveland Plain Dealer. And although the online stuff at times or a lot of the times ran in the newspaper, there were Guild employees that were just longtime. newspaper people and then there were like younger people like me and forward thinkers i'm very familiar with this already because i was hired by s i dot com and if you thought the if you thought the golf between the uh newspaper guys at the cleveland plane dealer and the web guys the cleveland plane dealer was big imagine the one at sports illustrated i can't imagine

they looked at the people at the website but the people at the website were asked to do more and the people at the newspaper were asked to do less and were resentful of what we were doing and I know there was an age discrepancy and you just kind of get set in your ways but if you are the type of person that gets set in your ways,

you're either going to have to retire prematurely or move on. And the reason why I bring that up is because Mike Gundy might not want a fundraise. Mike Gundy might not want to pay players. Mike Gundy might not want to discuss NIL behind the scenes. with the administration and trying to come up with reasonable expectations for Oklahoma. These are not part of the job description that he excelled in for a long time.

We're using Mike Gundy as an example because he's the one that said it. But there are a lot of coaches who have been tenured for a long period of time or at least been coaches in college football for a long time that are secretly resentful of the world that we're in. The problem with that is that the world keeps on spinning even if you don't want to spin with it. And what happens is if you don't spin with it, you probably get thrown off somewhere. And that's just kind of the way that it is. You know, like, so what about Nick Saban? Mm-hmm.

Yeah. You might not want to. Nick Saban recognize it, though. Nick Saban, Nick Saban did complain somewhat when he was on the tail end, but he also recognized, hey, this isn't for me. And you've heard comments from him since then, since he retired, saying, you know, it wasn't because of this, but no one was more adaptable than Nick Sabin. no one's better at changing with the times or the rules or anything else.

But Nick Saban got to a point where he's like, I don't want to change again. I don't want to have to adapt again. Yeah, and there's a difference between not being able to and not wanting to. Yeah. I don't doubt that Mike Gundy could adapt or that Mike Gundy could do all those things, but after coaching at Oklahoma State for what, two decades, two plus decades? He's not four coaches 2005. Yeah, so he's like one of the longest tenured coaches in college football right now.

He might not want to. He's a relatively young guy for a college head coach who's had his job for 20 years. But it's still, you know, he is a product of that era. And it's interesting. So he kept going, by the way, on his radio show. Here's what he said about Dante Moore, Oregon's starting quarterback. They say, whoever they is out there, they say that before he leaves there, he'll be the best player to ever play their quarterback.

Okay. Now, that's been said. Now, Justin Herbert that starts for the Chargers, we might have. Well, and Marietta. And, yeah, they've had a few dudes that are good. He's a good player. He's a really good player, but there's people in Brown there that feel like that they say it'll be the best one ever play there before he leaves. Wow.

And we'll get to see him probably. A lot of money to keep him. This is true. This is true. Okay. So I think that. plus the $40 million coming. I think that really set off

Yeah. It was the jab at the end. Did you think that he said the, I got, I didn't listen to the whole radio interview. I don't know if you did. But I got the sense that he set up the Dante Moore compliment so the,

for the jab. The jab was the point. Oh yeah. First part. Yeah. Listen, Gundy's a, Gundy's a wily veteran here. He knows what he's doing.

Now, we talked about Gundy and being a product of a particular era. Well, Dan Lanning, Oregon's coach is also a product of a particular era. Dan Lanning is 38 years old. He has to do this for 20 more years. So he's not going to complain about how the system works now.

He's going to work within the system as it is now because he's got to keep working. Well, Dan Lanning was not pleased with what Mike Gundy said, and here's what Dan Lanning said. Mike Gundy spoke quite a bit today and mentioned a lot about how much the resources are here, a lot of spending on the team here, suggested the roster cost $40 million last season. And also it said that non-conference scheduling perhaps should be more aligned with budgets.

I just didn't know with all of those comments if you had a particular reaction or thoughts about future scheduling or how much there may be a disparity between these programs. Yeah, it sounds like there is listening to him, him talk. Like I said, I got a ton of respect for Coach Gundy. Ultimately, how blessed are we to be in a place that's invested in winning? If you want to be a top 10 team in college football, you better be invested in winning. And we spend to win, some people say to have an excuse for why they don't, right? And ultimately, like, he's a great coach. They've done an unbelievable job, but I want to be a team that's competing at the highest level.

And we're really fortunate to be in that situation. So I can't speak on their situation. I have no idea, you know, what they got in their pockets over there. I'm sure UT Martin maybe didn't have as much as them last week and they played. So we'll let it play out. I love that attitude, Ari. Just don't be broke. You don't like it.

Don't be broke. Yeah. What do we think he was going to say? But this also got me thinking, too, because you sent me these clips right as I was getting in the shower. And you know what goes on in there, right? Like, that's where the deep thought goes. I don't want to know what goes on in there. You know, I'll tell you what goes on in there.

I stand underneath the hot water and I think about college football. You know, that's what I do. too. But it is interesting because we would find that Dan Lanning would be in the top five of everyone's coaching list if you were to do it right now and rightfully so. But then it also is like a reminder too of like part of where you land on that coaching list is also reliant on whether or not you are to use his word fortunate enough to be at a place that's willing to invest the money necessary to win at that level. But that I don't even know why he's like my was talking about Oregon.

But if I were Oregon's coach, I would have been annoyed by that, too. Well, and that's the thing. I'm not, remember what Dan Lanning said before Colorado came that first year, Dion Sanders was coaching in Colorado, was that, you know, they play for clicks and all that stuff. He's going to have them really fired up for this game. Oklahoma State is a 28.5 point underdog, which is crazy when you think about it. I wish we could have seen this game years ago.

Like 2011 would have been a great time for this game because that was Oklahoma State's best team under Mike Gundy. Oregon had played for the national title the year before. They ended up winning the league in 2011. They lost to LSU and USC were the only two losses they had the whole year. It was, this would have been a spectacular matchup back then. And it's a shame that they're kind of in two different stratospheres now. but, you know, I can't blame Oregon for trying to win the national title. Yeah.

If you don't like it, you can also try to win the national title. So you have to ask yourself, and I'm going to repeat myself, why is Mike Gundy talking about Oregon on his radio show? And I think that the reason why is because you have to prepare your fans and your team. I feel like that's a coach like crying for help saying, hey, you know what, this is going to get ugly and here's why. Well, but we don't know what it's going to get ugly.

I mean, I think he knows it's going to get ugly. You know, and it's maybe a little bit like Belichick. We were talking about as we were watching the TCU North Carolina game and North Carolina rolls down the field on the first drive and scores and the camera cuts to Belichick and he's just stoic. And you asked me, Do you think he knew?

And I'm like, yeah, of course he knew. Of course he knew. Yeah. And we had Gundy on our show at Big 12 Media Days, and he was very honest with us. And that's the thing. I don't want to bash Mike Gundy too much here because I appreciate his honesty on this front. They didn't pay for transfers in the transfer portal until this year. They're so far behind.

But that's also a choice. they made. Yeah. But I also think that you can take what coaches say in the week leading into a game and kind of try to read between the he leaves and like really what is he trying to tell you? They're playing a different sport than we are. That's the premise, right? And I don't know if it's a commentary on this sucks or that Oklahoma State can't do it or

that we're unable to do it. But you know what it is a commentary on? We're going to play a team that's playing a different sport than us. And if you really, you know, pull back the veil to that, that means we're not going to win or we're not going to be in this game. And the spread's almost 30. So, I mean, I think that's what the expectation is. But there's, like you said, there's going to be a big spread somewhere this week where the underdog wins. Yeah.

There's just too many games like that for that not to happen. I mean, Oklahoma had a quarterback in House Haney who got injured too. And I know they have named Flores. You know, they have another option there, but they're coming in banged up at a pretty critical position, although maybe one of them would have just won the job and it wouldn't have mattered anyway. But I try to think of like if I were Mike Gundy and I was a boxing champion in the, you know, middleweight class or whatever of amateur boxing. And I, you know, was very successful and went and had the same record as him. and then like, okay, now you're fighting the number one fighter in the world. And if you lose, people are going to criticize you.

It's like taking that boxer and then putting him in against the MMA champ in the same weight class in the octagon. Yeah, because they're not even playing the same sport, let alone, you know, the same weight class and stuff. Who is that guy that yelled to this day, to this day? You know what Wilder, I think is his name? Could you imagine, like, just me, like, you know, I'm doing boxing. as a recreational workout and I'm pretty good at it and I'm, you know, hitting other 40-year-old men and then they threw me in the ring with that. And then I was criticized or judged by how good at my job I am based on how I, that's probably how he feels. Yeah. You know, and some of it is

his fault and some of it is based on circumstance. But it's no different than, you know, coaches who coached at places in, you know, terrible, less advantageous geographical areas before NIL came into play. It's no different than UT Martin last week. It's no different than as Dan Land pointed out, yeah. It's no different. I mean, if you look at it, like Oklahoma State is different in the sense that it's P4 versus P4, right? But the entire slate is filled with halves and haves-nots this week. Yeah.

But the fact that they're both power conference teams also tells you why we keep talking about there's going to be more division, more coalescing at the top. this is why this is why we're talking about that is also coming into a season if you just want to remove the money aspect from this they're coming in to a season where a large portion of its roster didn't even

practice football until the beginning of fall camp with the team so on top of the talent discrepancy that you're going to see when they go on the road to Oregon you're also trying to see a team that's trying to figure out who it is or who they have and that's an inherent obstacle that a coach

has to overcome any coach would have to overcome and like Mike Gundy was like I would know exactly who my team was right now when he talked to us in July he says I have no idea what I have and I wonder to this day like does he know what he has going into it I think he knows he doesn't have Oregon's roster but you know that's that's the you know and this is a team that engaged in the portal for the first time like it's not like they didn't bring players in they spent this year he said they spent this year yeah but he they didn't spend in the same galaxy as Oregon but that's not Oregon's fault. Do you think the Yankees feel bad?

Pirates, that's what you said. They don't feel bad. They shouldn't feel bad. They're running their business properly and the pirates aren't. So there's no honor in it. If you want to compete, work to compete like the teams that are working to compete. Oregon was one of those teams that was kind of an also ran for decades and decades. Now, it hasn't been that way for a long time because I think it all start, like the climb

started under Mike Bellotti, and then it just kept going and going, going. But Oregon made a point institutionally that they are going to compete at the highest level of football. If you'd like to do that, do that. If you don't want to do that, don't beg to be in the same leagues as these people and then complain about it when you got to play them. Yeah. Well, the question, too, is what did Indiana do last year that Oklahoma State can't?

What does any team traditionally dominant? But Indiana has Big Ten money. which is different. Yeah, but the Big Ten money doesn't start mattering until this year. Well, the other, and the other, and the other Big Ten schools also have Big Ten money. So, yeah, yeah.

No, Indiana's kind of the answer to all of this. Perkins and Eddie is kind of the answer to all of this. But you're the person, and I know we have to move on to the next topic, but the last thing I wanted to put on your radar here, and we discussed, you know, how revenue sharing an NIL could level the playing field, and I think to a certain extent, it clearly has already.

NIL that is. It does it at the top. But your number one thing was that baseball or that NCAA football is going to become like major league baseball and that the pirates of college football could actually win. No, no, no, no, the royals, not the pirates. The pirates are the example of we're cheap, we're not even trying. The Royals won because they were cheaper, but they're actually still trying so the pirates the pirates are are a small market team that doesn't spend on purpose right it's not that i don't have it they just don't they just yeah they take their share of the tv money they're like all right sounds good yeah i'm trying to think like what the cleveland guardians would be you know a team that doesn't typically spend and you know when they have really

good prospects come up you know historically they've traded them to the yankees um but they also made it to the World Series, you know, in the recent. So, you know, I don't know. I wonder if like Oklahoma is being cheap or if Oklahoma doesn't have Oklahoma State or Oklahoma State doesn't have it. And that's a huge distinction. And I do wonder too, like if the pot of doesn't have it is bigger than we're anticipating and it isn't like money ball and it isn't like baseball.

No, I think so we talk. about the things evening out at the top, flattening out at the top. But it is creating a bigger list of have-nots. Because Oklahoma State wasn't a have-nought ever under Mike Gundy. Right. Or a hopelessness that you feel going into this game. But that said, I wouldn't call Kansas a have-not right now. They've got money.

They're figuring it out. That really blows up in his face. There are other teams in his own league that are in similar circumstances are doing just fine. exactly exactly it's it is a choice it is not all circumstance iowa state very competitive like if iowa state went to play oregon they would be underdogs would they be 28 and a half point underdogs nobody around 10 12 points maybe yeah and and will we be surprised if iowa state was in a game against organ or beat organ nope not in the least be surprising but it wouldn't be like earth shattering we wouldn't be shocked yeah it would be like oh

Oh, the team that played for the Big 12 championship last year is hanging with Oregon? Okay, cool. Yeah. And also, here's the last thing. At Big 12 Media Day, Brett, Your Mark's whole schick is how it's imperatively important. Is that redundant? I do that a lot. Impartive implies importance, for sure.

Incredibly important for the Big 12 to not only be competitive with each other. and to be competitive on the, you know, big stage, but for three or four teams in the Big 12 to rise to the top and be consistent, you know, top level performers, right? Like, he wants, you know, TCU or Baylor or Iowa State or Texas Tech to rise to top, Colorado, and be consistently good year over year like other conferences have. The no doubt about it's the role that Texas and

Oklahoma used to play in the Big 12. Yeah. And all I hear is Gundy is, we can't do that, which is a complete contradiction to what the commissioner is saying is possible in your own league. I mean, Texas Tech played Oregon tight two years ago. And Texas Tech was not spending the way it is now. Yeah. So anyway, I know people are super fascinated about this stuff or either hate it,

but I thought that was an important discussion to have. Also, Dan Lannning does not take any crap. He was not pleased. And I appreciate his bluntness on that. I said, I also appreciate Gundy giving us lots to talk about always and flashing the camera. So thank you for that. Yeah, Coach Gundy. I got to tell you, I'm going to flash the camera with this right here.

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He had a giant lip of chaw. A look of dip in his mouth. And we wanted to recreate that. That's exactly right. And we could do it with with gum. So it was perfect. I'll go to Academy. All right.

We got to put a bow on the North Carolina discussion. I don't know how much we're going to talk about North Carolina the rest of the year unless things change dramatically and they're much more competitive when they start playing Power Conference opponents again. But that was a straight up ass whipping. Yeah. I mean, the spectacle of it is all. all about Belichick, and if you're interested in the spectacle of it, in our instant reaction to it,

there's a video on this channel from last night that I think was more than 20 minutes of going into it. In order to make this new, for people who watched that already, Andy, I want to ask you something or show you something. I wrote a column last night, and I took the Warren Buffett rant that I went on and I led with it. I think it makes sense. But here's the crux of the issue more than anything to me, and you outlined this at the end of the show last night. And that is, that the breakout player of the game was an Idaho receiver transfer at TCU named Jordan Dwyer, and he had, you know, a ton of receiving yards and a touchdown. And he went to TCU, committed to TCU, 11 days after Belichick was hired.

And then it got me thinking, a Charles Power, one of our national scouts on three and I were DMing about this this morning, and he made a really good point. It's true. The NFL thing that we are talking about, about being superior to college because you won Super Bowls or any NFL coach coming down to college means that they're going to coach circles around the coaches in college because they were up at the highest level and how that's kind of a fallacy. Mike Lombardi's making a million and a half. And I'm not saying that he doesn't know how to evaluate that. He's not a good person for the job. But do you know how much support staff or how much of a personnel department you could build out

with that much money. Yeah. No guys don't make that much yet. And I think they resent it, and they deserve more. But like North Carolina doesn't seem to be playing the personnel game the same way that other ACC teams are and we're back on relying on the NFLness of this. Now, the one aspect of this that is crucial is that if you look back at the way that Bill Belichick's tenure ended in the NFL, and this is the truest thing.

and Charles is a smart guy. It wasn't that he doesn't know how to coach, right? Right. It's that he was drafting poorly and he couldn't be trusted with. He was the GM to the personnel decision maker. So you go to college and you can be in charge of the personnel. And I wonder if like, that's not the right way to do it. How many coaches in college football are the main personnel?

grinders they make the final decisions they know what they want but they have an army behind them they have an army of people behind them breaking down jordan dwyer's tape does north carolina have an army of people breaking down jordan dwyer's tape yes they have a personnel department they have the same thing that that other schools have they just didn't find him and that's the problem it's not that they don't have the apparatus they have the apparatus i think they thought it was going to be a lot easier or that they were going to evaluate circles around these idiots in college. I don't know what they thought, but the fact of the matter is there are people in college who are really good at this. Better at it. And they know where

to look. And I think there's a distinction between being really good at it in college and being very, very good at it in the NFL. I think you could be a genius in the NFL and not be the top 10% of it in college because you're doing different things. It's not the same thing you have to know where to cast the net and how to cast the net because the NFL is a much more controlled environment how many players are we talking about in the NFL each team has 53 players they've got you know their practice squad players there's 32 teams we're talking about less than a thousand people or a little over a thousand i think you add all the practice squad players yeah i think preparing for college football you're talking about over 10,000 people i

think the fundamental thing that I think here is that there is a difference between watching Xavier Worthy tape and knowing that he's worth a second round or a late first round pick and knowing that Jordan Dwyer is going to hit in college as a transfer from Idaho. Like those aren't the same job to me. It's a much harder job probably than they thought it was. And now they know. And I do wonder, like, because we talked about it, did Bill Belichick know what was coming

after they scored in that first drive? He knows TCU is going to be able to adjust and just completely shut them down. I think he did, because I think he's obviously a smart enough football mind. He's coached enough football to know that when he turned on that tape, he's like, this isn't what we see on the practice field. We're in trouble here. And now, North Carolina has one of the easier schedules in the country, but there's going to be other teams that they're going to say that about.

And, you know, I'm just, I'm curious to see, all right, let's, let's call it North Carolina's schedule. I want to see now how many teams will they say that about an, oh, by the way, Cal's on their schedule, Ari. We haven't talked about. Are you going to try it? Are you going to try it? You're going to try to. Geron Kiave Sagapolitelli. Jaron Chiave, Sagapolitella Freshman QB at Cal

was originally, you know, was committed to Cal, flipped to Oregon, signed with Oregon, was going to enroll in Oregon, and then decided, nah, I'm going to Cal instead, won the starting job. He looked amazing against Oregon State.

So like now, when I look at that game on North Carolina schedule, well, I'm not calling that a North Carolina win for, for sure. Do you want to, do you want to test, rivers producing ability right now. I'm going to do a quick aside. I know we're talking about North Carolina here, but do you have Cal's schedule?

He just nodded. It's coming right up. He does? Look at that. What a wizard. You want to talk about making Indiana? Check this out when he gets it. It's coming. It's coming.

It's loading. It's loading. Oregon State. Oh, logo. Texas State. That's Michael Strayhan's alma mater. Wait a second. Or Texas Southern, sorry, Texas Southern. Yeah, that's not Texas State, but Mexico Southern, yeah.

San Diego State, BC, Duke, North Carolina, Georgia Tech, Virginia, Louisville, Stanford, SMU. Now, there's some tough games on there to Duke, Jordan Tech, SMU, Louisville, all tough games, Minnesota. If your QB's a dude, you got a chance in any of those. Yeah, but

now I think Cal might be better than we gave them credit for because no one even thinks about Cal the Calorhythm is humming again. That's another. By the way, the Calgarythum tried to tell us. I don't know how, if you were getting tweets from the Calgary throughout the summer,

I was about, about JKS, Jaron, Kiave, Sagapolitelli. I was getting tweets from them and they're like, you just don't understand, you're going to see. And I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then Oregon State game happened. I'm like, oh, my God. God, they were right.

This guy is awesome. He was throwing darks out there like it was a laser show. And he had some downfield throws that hit receivers on the face mass that were really difficult throws that were just dropped that aren't going to be a part of the highlight tape. But now you drop that on the North Carolina schedule. And all of a sudden, that Clemson Cow back to back on the road at Berkeley is maybe not as easy as we thought it would be. Now, again, overreactions from week one, maybe that's the case.

But, you know, a team that gets, that wasn't competitive against TCU. could lose to every team on its schedule that's in the ACC at least. UCF's a heart game. I don't know what I'm assuming that they'll get back off the mat with Charlotte. But, you know, I don't know. It's Virginia this year. Stanford, I don't know. Stanford's a tough watch right now.

But like there are, you know, the path to eight wins isn't as easy, I think, as we thought it would be. Which is why I said take the under seven and a half. I think you nailed it. Yeah. Because I didn't think they were going to have a very good roster. That's all it was. That is all it was.

Now, Max Johnson did look better when he came in at quarterback, and maybe they make a change there, and maybe that changes everything, because who knows? It's just... I mean, the pick six is what did start the game unraveling. Yes. Yes.

That doesn't happen. I will say that giving up the long touchdown run right out of the gate in the second half was probably worse. but they did everything wrong. They were in the game. They were in the game. They were in the game. Then the pick six going right into the locker room knowing that the other team is getting the ball as a backbreaker.

You know, you're right. The second the long run happened in the second half, that was ball game. So I grabbed Bill Belichick's press conference from our friends at Inside Carolina. The app I use to download clips like that, to rip clips like that from the internet, malfunctioned today. And for some reason grabbed the French dub of Bill Belichick. Are we going to play it? Yeah, it was way more interesting than the English one. So here's the French.

Here's Bill Belichick and French. And then it was a super ambience for the match of this night. The fans had an energy incredible and we had endued to manatee, but we didn't have not been able to impugnire this level. We have both of work to do. We have done a better work in terms of entrainment. Jue their pro-phase of the match were not at the heighter of our

attente, and I know that we are better than that. We have to work on these aspects and the montres Saturday for re-enversed the vapor. The TCE has made

the good work and is clearly his team this night. He merited a victory and they've been the manner

decisier. I know it's a miracle technology and that AI just translated that into French for us, but I want, want to imagine that there was this little French guy in a beret sitting in a room in the

suburbs of Paris, watching Bill Belichick's press conference at three in the morning Paris time and translating Bill Belichick into French. You know that even if they didn't watch the news conference, the people listening to the show could tell you exactly what he probably said. Well, I can tell you what he said because here's the English version. Well, it was a great, you know, a great atmosphere here for the guys. game tonight. You know, fans are a tremendous energy and we take competitive way, but then just couldn't sustain it. So obviously we have a lot of work to do. You know, we need to do a better

job all the way around coaching, playing all the three phases of the game. Just wasn't that's what it needs to be. And I know we're a lot better than that. So we need to, you know, need to work on those things and show it on Saturday and quick turnaround. But, you know, we're a lot. The TC credit that came in, they did a good job. And they're clearly a better team tonight. You know, they deserved to win, and they did it decisively. That's the only sentence I know in French. Wee, I know that.

Who we? Okay. Which is actually a New York Times crossword puzzle. Clue. I just, if I blew it. Look at you, Mr. Highbrow. I can't only do Monday once. And it's the craziest thing about me is.

that I don't know anything about anything, and I'm terrible at trivia, but I'm really good at the Monday crossword puzzle. It doesn't make any sense. It really doesn't. I mean, everybody's really good at the Monday crossword puzzle. Yeah, I don't know that that's true. They get harder as the way goes on.

Yeah, but Sunday's impossible. If you know how to do the Sunday one, yeah, you should be good at crossword puzzles too. I can't do the Sunday New York Times. I don't have patience for it. And actually, if you watch that documentary on the people do the crossword puzzle they it's a more mathematical mind than being a reservoir of trivia or anything like that like if you if you're a math science person if you if you have a mind that

that sees the world in numbers and math you're going to be better at crossword puzzles than someone who just knows a bunch of trivia what is a six letter word word for what is a six letter word for O-T breakfast cereal that starts with an M-N-N-N-E-S-L-I. Musil-I. M-U-S-E-L-I. M-U-S. I don't know. I've never heard of that breakfast cereal before, but we'll... Oh, no. I wouldn't eat it, but that's...

It's, oh, I'm sorry, M-U-E-S-L-I. Okay, yeah, that's right. I never would have gotten that. That was, now I can't take credit for solving the puzzle, but I was struggling with that one. It's the Monday puzzle. You don't really need to take credit anyway. Quit belittling my, I feel good about myself. Can I have anything? Yes, you can have you beating me in the picks, because you are beating me in the picks,

though we both got TCU right. So I'm still only two games behind you, but if you listen to the PIC show on Monday, and if you haven't, go back and listen, we are on the other side of a buck, bunch of different games. So this could be moving week for me, but also I could be moving way down. So that's the other problem. Yeah, uh, eight and four in the first 12, I'll take it, you know, uh, I don't know how long that's going to last, but, you know, for the time being, not being very, very, very, very under 500 is, uh, a good thing. And I think that us being on the opposite side is healthy because at least we won't just get swept together. Like,

at least one of us will look smart. So, yeah, and that one will be you, not me. I actually, like, play a lot of games, though. So I feel like this is more, this is easier for me than it is for you. Because I'm like, I do it with my real money all the time. Also, I think you're a little more of a math mind than me. Maybe. Talking to people who do this a lot, who like people like Tyler Shoemaker,

they're looking for the mathematical advantage. they're not necessarily looking for that one piece of information that's about the team that's going to tell you something. And I struggle with it, too, because this is a show that people listen to because they want analysis and they want to hear about breakdowns of the game and stuff. And I think that you're better at that than me. But the thing that I read about over the weekend that you don't consume at all, which is what are the numbers and where they hold? Like, for instance, like we picked Duke in Illinois this week, right? Like, I picked Duke. And I'm probably, I mean, I don't know if I'm going to.

a win or not, but I think that that is the right side of the bet to be on. But when we are talking about it from the analytic perspective, which is Illinois's got Luke Altmire, they've got all these guys coming back from Benin Wednesday. It's easier to talk about it. Sometimes things happen in football games that are hard to articulate or to predict. I would convince that Virginia Tech was going to either win or cover the South Carolina game because of what people were doing with the line and for much of the game it was it was trending that way and then it just the dam broke with the nick harbour touchdown at the end how would i have been able to articulate that uh nick harbour would drop a touchdown pass or that a safety would happen like all these grab-ass things that

happen in games that are the difference between winning and losing aren't going to be found on this show and aren't going to be found on any show and i actually think that it's it's pretty remarkable that these math wizards always figure out how and where the book are weak and then attack the book as if they're able to see that safety coming. And if they wouldn't have returned that punt, like Virginia Tech was the correct side of that game. And we both, I think, laid the points last week and we're right. But if you bet South Carolina, which, you know, a lot of people did and you won, you won.

But just being winning isn't always being right in gambling, which is the frustrating thing. And losing happens all the time when you're on the right side of it. Well, I'm glad you mentioned that punt return because we didn't get a chance to talk about it on the show. the Vakari Swain, 80-yard punt return touchdown. If you've not seen it, if you've not watched that play, it is one of the greatest punt returns you will ever see. Well, that's I've ever seen in real life, for sure.

The sheer burst when he sees the opening was incredible. And then he gets inside the 10-yard line, and there's like three or four guys that have a chance to tackle him. He jukes one, he breaks a tackle, and then dives over another potential tackler to get over the goal line. It was an incredible punt return. I mean, if it doesn't happen, Virginia Tech covers that spread. Think about the game.

South Carolina Open, I believe, is a nine and a half point favorite. A lot of people jumped on that at the beginning of the week because they thought they would win by 10. But there were two plays in this game that were the difference between winning and losing. And that's a punt return that was done on a re-kick and a long bomb to Nick Harbor. There were two plays. But the entire game, Virginia Tech was. was hitting him back and then there was also the play where nick harbour appears to catch the touchdown pass doesn't survive the ground there still is a world where the replay official

doesn't overturn that and that counts as a touchdown for nick harbour uh so it's it's it's that stuff it's just it's a combination that stuff and and by the way i'll point this out because we didn't we didn't get a chance to talk about this either i was fascinated by shame beamer talking about why he made them re-kick he said an old special teams coach not my dad by the way, told him years ago, nothing ever good happens when you have to kick a second time. And so he's always wanted to re-kick. He said he goes back to 2009, the Clemson game, when he was an assistant coach at South Carolina, where he was a special team's coach and basically got talked into re-kicking by

the members of his coverage team. And against his better judgment, he re-kicked, and I think Clemson ran it back. and so he in his mind if he has an opportunity to make a team re-kick and what happened was virginia tech punted they had an illegal formation and the officials just assumed oh they're going to enforce this at the end of the kick whatever bemer calls them over like no no no no make them re-kick he's always going to do that and that's why uh yeah that was a really really good game and i'm excited to watch south carolina it was cool to see the freaks up close the three freaks and i think we should do a segment sometime this week of the three freaks you're gonna have a freak off we're gonna have a freak yeah we're gonna have a freak you bring the baby oil okay but like no tomorrow tomorrow let's let's try to make the list of like who are the true freaks in college football obviously we have we have bruce felvin's freaks list but that's more weight room numbers and that sort of thing i'm talking about the people who

on the field affect the games the most because they are aliens because they they are not like everybody else on the field. The alien list. Carolina has a couple guys like that. I think that there is a distinction between being an actual alien. Because, like, Nick Harbour's an alien, but hasn't been a productive college player yet. Correct. Dylan Stewart, on the other hand, is a game wrecker.

Yeah. Stewart is physically unlike everybody else and is a game wrecker. Dylan Stewart's an alien. DJ Lagway's an alien. I'm talking about those type of players. Ruben Bain. Ruben Bain's an alien. Not just good players, because you can find good players that aren't aliens all over the place.

How many teams have three legitimate physicals that should donate their bodies to science when they're gone type people? And South Carolina, you could see up close has three. And being on the same field as them standing a foot away from them, you don't have an appreciation watching on TV what these people look like in real life. I love it. I love it. We're talking about that tomorrow. and also on Thursday, Dear Andy, dear Ari, get your questions in.

Andy Stapleson3 at gmail.com. Ari.com. R.e. Dot Waserman at On3.com. Send us those emails. We may answer your question on the show. We love it when you help us guide the show. You're very smart, often much smarter than us, and we do appreciate all the input.

Ari, time to start making those alien lists. We'll talk tomorrow. Thank you.