Andy & Ari On3 - WAR EAGLE: Alex Golesh plans to run the piss out of the ball at Auburn

Episode Date: February 6, 2026

Happy Friday! As a decision is expected in the Charles Bediako case on Friday, it’s a Dear Andy & Ari episode to send you on into the weekend. Before we get to our incredible listeners, we have an interview with Auburn’s new head football coach in Alex Golesh. Coming over to the plains from USF, Golesh plans to implement a winning playstyle and run the piss out of the ball. How many games can Auburn win in 2026? Watch here as Alex Golesh joins. (0:00) On Today’s Episode(0:48) Presenting Sponsor(3:15) Intro: Previewing Alex Golesh Interview(6:22) Alex Golesh Joins(11:25) How much things have changed(14:16) DJ Durkin’s impact at Auburn(17:10) USF’s talent now at Auburn(21:52) Golesh Playcalling Philosophy(24:15) Running the piss out of the ball(28:01) Closing out with Golesh(29:22) Winter Olympics(30:33) Charles Bediako Update(31:37) Explaining Injunctions(37:07) The physical age of athletes in eligibility(40:31) Greg Sankey’s Words + Nate Oats(50:40) Tennessee’s 2026 Outlook(1:01:11) Thanks for watching! See you Monday After Coach Golesh joins, it’s time for some incredible questions from our listeners. While the topic of the week has been eligibility cases, Andy & Ari receive plenty of questions surrounding the eligibility cases of Charles Bediako, Joey Aguilar, and Trinidad Chambliss. While all three are currently in court cases, who knows what’s next? To wrap up Dear Andy & Ari, Shea asks: “What’s Tennessee’s outlook with or without Joey Aguilar on the roster?” Andy & Ari dive deep into expectations ahead in Knoxville. Do you agree? For Dear Andy & Ari, send in your questions here:[e-mail]@on3.com Our show is also presented by BetMGM! If you haven’t signed up for BetMGM yet, use bonus code ON3 and you will get up to a $1500 First Bet Offer on your first wager with BetMGM! Here’s how it works: 1. Download the BetMGM app and sign-up using bonus code ON3.2. Deposit at least $10 and place your first wager on any game.3. You will receive up to $1500 in bonus bets if your bet loses! Just make sureyou use bonus code ON3 when you sign up! Make this college football season one for the history books. Make it legendary. See BetMGM.com for Terms. 21+ only. US promotional offers not available in New York, Nevada, Ontario, or Puerto Rico. Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER (Available in the US). Call 877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY). Call 1-800-NEXT-STEP (AZ), 1-800-327-5050 (MA), 1-800-BETS-OFF (IA), 1-800-981-0023 (PR). First Bet Offer for new customers only. Subject to eligibility requirements. Rewards are non-withdrawable bonus bets that expire in 7 days. In partnership with Kansas Crossing Casino and Hotel. Watch our show on YouTube! https://youtu.be/vS62_5rQitw Hosts: Andy Staples, Ari WassermanProducer: River Bailey Interested in partnering with the show? Email [e-mail] Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

On today is Andy and Ari on three presented by BetMGM. We are joined by new Auburn coach Alex Golus. She explains what F.E means. He also explains how you run the piss out of the ball. Plus, it is a dear Andy, dear Ari Day. We have a great question about all of these eligibility cases, be that. Joey Aguilar in Tennessee, Trinidad, Shamblinson, Ole Miss, or Charles Betiaco, the basketball player at Alabama, who, as we are recording,

is in court trying to figure out if he still gets to keep playing college basketball, even though he's played the G League. Plus, we get a great question about Tennessee football in 2026. Talk about it all today on Andy and Orion 3 presented by BetMGM. We are presented by BetMGM. All the lines and totals come from BetMGM and is a big week in the sport of football. Big week for BetMGM. Of course, you need to get signed up if you are not already.

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The big guest continue. Hello, Ari Waserman. How are we doing? Yeah, you've been on a roll this week. People seem to be liking it. I think that we are at least able to promise that we are going to talk, try our best to continue to get head coaches on.

Because I think it's just cool to hear from different people, different perspectives, different levels, different areas of the country. You know how it goes. The more people you get from diverse backgrounds in different areas, the better picture of paints of the entire sport, and it's been really awesome to watch. We had a really fun one with Brett Beelamy yesterday,

but I'm really loving the new head coaches, the first year guys. We had Will Stein from Kentucky earlier this week. We had Brian Hartline from USF yesterday. Today, it's Alex Golish, the new head coach at Auburn, who left USS, F, which opened the job for Brian Hartline to take.

And Golish inherits a program that Ari, can you believe that Auburn hasn't had a winning season in how long? I want to ask you. This is your trivia question. When was the last time Auburn had a winning record at the end of the season? Are we going back into the late 2000s? I'm asking you. When do you think that was? That's my guess. I don't know.

You would be correct, sir. You would be correct. So Gus Malzon was fired after the 2020 season. He was six and five that year. They have not had a winning season since then. It is shocking. Absolutely shocking to say that. Because it doesn't feel like they've been that bad.

But Auburn has struggled quite a bit. And you know, you can blame the Brian Harsenhire. obviously you can blame the Hugh Freeze hire, but Alex Golish's job is to pull the Tigers out of that. This is a program that expects to not only compete in the SEC, but to compete for national championships, to make the college football playoff on a regular basis. Hasn't made the college football playoff yet.

They played in the final BCS championship game. So they played for the national title after the 2013 season. But yeah, it's crazy because I don't think Auburn's that far away, even when we say stuff like they haven't had a winning season since 2020. You know what I think it is, Andy? You know, my entire life of following college football and just Auburn football in general, they've always been a very boom or bust place. Like sometimes they would have some pretty bad years and sometimes they'd have some exceptional years.

And it like always feels like it's either one or the other. So maybe the exceptionally bad years just don't stand out for them the way that they do for other places because you always just assume that one of these years are going to pop out and go a national. Yeah, the boom's coming, but the boom hasn't come lately. So that's the amazing part. But Alex Golish is coming to bring the boom back to Auburn. Here's Alice Golish. We are joined by Auburn head coach, Alex Golish. And so when they were setting up your shot, coach, I saw something that popped up when we talked to you last when you were, you were at USF. the chemical symbol for iron right behind you, the F.E. Now, one, you said that nobody had ever asked

about that when we did because you didn't think anybody knew what it was. But two, I don't know that we got the real meaning of it. I heard you gave Dusty Dvorchek the real meaning. Yeah, I think I probably did. He got me at the right time. Oh, this is the wrong time? We don't get it now? Man, at the end of the day, it could stand for a couple of different things, but the initial intent was when we got to South Florida was F everybody. I love it.

I think we still live in that world right now. I was going to say, you kind of have to live in that world, don't you? I mean, this is, hearing you talk about roster construction in your national signing day press conference yesterday, it was amazing to be thinking about just how cutthroat all of this is because you were talking about when you were, you're meeting with current Auburn players.

You're just getting there. You're getting to know them. You're trying to figure out who's going to be on the team and who's not. They're dealing with their own transfer opportunities. Their agents are out there looking, you know, trying to get deals. And you had to sit down and say, hey, look, do you want to be here or not? Are you in or not? How tough are those conversations?

Yeah, I think it's fascinating, Andy. you know, when you're evaluating these opportunities, you're evaluating these jobs, you have a certain perception of what it is, right? Like you, obviously, coaching college football for over 20 years, you've covered it forever. Like, and then being in this league, being out of this league, you know, you're not paying a ton of attention to everybody else, but you do know what's what's going on in the college football landscape, especially regionally. And so what's fascinating to me is you come in and every single young guy has a different perception of Auburn, a different perception of what college football is.

I think that may be even more so than Auburn specifically. If a young man's only been here, well, his perception of Auburn is what it has been for him. right? And his perception of what college football should be is only what he's experienced. Good or bad. And so I think as you sit down with these guys, every single one of them is individually different in terms of what they think it should be. And as you present a plan and you try to get to know these guys in very much a speed dating type atmosphere, you have to realize that, man, maybe somebody doesn't see Auburn as a national championship type team. Or maybe they grew up and all they think about is Auburn as a national championship team.

There's such a wide spectrum of every single thing you could ever imagine. And the one thing, if I learned anything through the process, man, take nothing person. Like just be yourself and take nothing personally. And I think going through this once before as a head coach gave me the confidence to go through it and at least know that, man, I'm going to be comfortable. I'm going to be myself. And the dudes that are attracted to that will stay. The dudes that aren't attracted to that won't. And the ones that need convincing of it, I'll work really hard to convince them.

But at the end of the day, I'm going to be really real about what this is about to be. And, you know, I think you look at it, I think the hardest thing with all of it is you're making real-time decisions. And you don't know if this guy stays, you don't know if you got to go get one. Truthfully, you're trying to figure out, do I want him to stay? And as you're making those decisions, you can't second guess yourself. You've got to have the confidence to do it. Again, I think my South Florida time gave me the confidence in a lot of ways. I think going through it at Tennessee two years prior in a little bit different era,

but had a different unique set of challenges there. I think all of that prepares you to walk in and say, this is how we're doing it. This is the plan and we're going to execute it. We're not going to veer from it at all because if we do, you're going to create extra variables. And at the end of the day, at least at this point, you know what you're going into the season with and it's February.

So you were at Tennessee with Josh Heiple when you guys got there. He was his OC. You go to USF to become the head. coach. When you left Tennessee, NIL was happening, but it was kind of in its infancy. You come back into the SEC and it's a lot more evolved.

How different, like, how much has that changed since you leave Tennessee, you know, following the 2022 season and come back after the 25 season? Yeah, it's drastically changed, but Andy, it's changed drastically in the last six months. You know,

I think, I think when And when the rev share piece got added last summer in July, what people were doing last May and June totally reset the market. And when the market got reset the entirety of our industry from a talent acquisition retention, quote unquote fair market value, it all changed last May and June. And so the one portal window changed because at least you, you use. three years ago, you would say, man, give me the spring and see what the heck this really is. Figure out if what I'm telling you actually is true or not, you don't have that luxury. The kids are making real-time decisions with advisement from a lot of different people for next year. And it's December and they're trying to make these decisions.

And so it's changed obviously quite a bit in the last three years, but I would tell you in the last, what would be seven to eight months it's changed more than it ever has and so what was the the most difficult part of putting this roster together yeah i think more than anything um when you come in and you're you're looking at not just the starting 22 but uh but certainly somewhere around 65 guys that are are immediately ready to help you right now and then the the back end of the roster that also you got to have it and it's the future of your program and you feel like man can i get really really good players that are young to fill the rest of this thing out i think just the entirety of of putting one through 105 together in a really short period

of time while at the same time not totally knowing who's going to actually be here that's currently here whether they want to be here or whether we want them here trying to figure that out at the same time. And I would tell you the timing of all of it is if you're asking, man, what's the hardest thing? I would tell you it's the timing of it all. Like, if you're against the clock in terms of getting kids into school and having them get started because the one thing everybody forgets, Andy, in our industry and in your

industry is that they do, like, they got to be in some sort of school. Yeah. Yeah, it's funny how we were just sort of forgotten about that part of it. But so you have DJ Durkin who had been the interim head coach. He was the D.C. last year. And it was interesting. Why I saw you at the Senior Bowl last week, you were explaining to me that you guys go way back. Ohio, you know, Ohio roots.

He's tight with Matt Campbell, who used to work for it at Iowa State. And that you may have been working together, whether you got the Auburn job or not, you and DJ Durkin may have been working together this year. How big was it that he's there and has a bead on that roster? as you come in. Yeah, I think it's been huge. You know, once we made a decision, hey, we're going to move forward with this, man, he's been as all in in terms of, man, what do you need?

Like, where can I help? And the guy that's been a head coach, been a coordinator in this league, been a coordinator at high level for a long time, you know when he talks, it comes from a place of, of deep, deep experience. He's highly intelligent. He sees it very big picture. It's not obviously cares about the defense at an incredible clip,

but it's so wide ranging in terms of he, he understands, man, there's guys that have special teams value. There's guys that offensively will fit this place. He's got a really, really wide, vast knowledge base of what the heck is going on. And I think when you really, when you put it all together, the experience is priceless. And you could be as good of a football coach as have whatever background you want. The experience of going through it, being in it is so huge.

And when you've been a head coach and you look at our staff, we've got guys that have been head coaches on both sides of the ball. We've got guys that have been coordinators in this league on both sides of the ball. I think when you put it all together, you're trying to bring in people that, one, are more experienced than you to be able to shortcut mistakes and or get rid of mistakes, but you also have to bring in people you trust. And DJ is a guy that I trust. To be honest with you, looked up to him when I started my career in a lot of ways as he kind of climbed the ladder and really, really quickly. he was another Ohio guy that you look up to. And you say, man, like he went from being a GA to a full-time coach to a coordinator really, really quickly. And we have so many mutual friends that, to me, that hire was really, really important to then be able to build a staff around him with people that I'm comfortable with, that people he's comfortable with.

But from a roster standpoint, he gave you a ton of insight. one of the other things speaking of comfort i asked you this last week in mobile and i love the answer because i was asking about you know byron brown coming and play quarterback who played for usf but also cole best who was your center at usf and and what it was like to have those guys and you said it helps you sleep at night and how critical like when you're near one knowing you have well the quarterback thing is obvious everybody knows how important you the quarterback is, but a center who knows what you need. Yeah, you know, in what we do offensively, the center is, is the quarterback of that

offensive line. And the more experienced he is, the better he is in terms of from a mental side, from an ID side, experience there, just like quarterback is so monumental. When you've seen the stems, you've seen the fronts, you've seen the indicators for pressures. You can't replicate that. Like there's no, you can watch as much film as you want. There's no replication for having your hand on the ball, knowing that that snap count is coming at any moment. And can I make a quick decision here or can I not? That part of it is, is priceless. And that was not an out-of-the-box statement, Andy. I'm telling you, it has helped

me sleep at night. I'm not surprised. That's, Because I would think until I saw it in spring practice, if it was somebody I hadn't seen before or was a new guy that hadn't really started before, I would be up all night. You'd need to see it in action and you've already seen it. Let's talk about Byron, though. I mean, you developed him at USF into a very good quarterback. Where is his ceiling and what does he need to do to reach it?

Yeah, I think with Byram, him playing really early and seeing where he started, I think makes you appreciate where he is today. And when you say I developed, man, I would tell you the staff with Coach Gordon, Coach Kingston, like the amount of time they have poured into him was only matched and honestly upped by Byram himself. I think Byron playing early, having a lot of success early, but also being so intelligent and so self-aware to say, man, like, as much as I had numbers were really good, statistics, rushing, passing. He's like, man, like, I haven't even scratched the surface. Like, this is Byron admittedly to himself, having the self-awareness to say, man, I got so much to go. And what we've seen over the last couple years as he's grown and obviously time on task experience, all in the same.

offense, all with the same verbiage, all with the same coaching. I feel like he should be a spokesperson for modern day college football of how much you can grow and develop when you've got the same strength coach, the same dietitian, the same certainly offensive coordinator, quarterback coach, assistant quarterback coach, head coach. He's a young man that's just taking it and run with it. And as much as he's developed mentally, he's developed physically, like you see pictures of him three years ago and you're like, oh my goodness, like, I can't believe this is the same kid. He's over 230 some pounds now. He's developed so much from a physical standpoint. And every year he spends time, I guarantee you he's sitting in there watching film right now. Like guaranteed,

like you could stamp it that that's what he's currently doing because that's what he does every day. Watches, goes out, tries to perfect his technique. He's constantly looking for ways where he can improve. he's figured out how to take care of his body in terms of what every single moment of every single day looks like, whether it's cryo, to needling, to cupping, to what he needs pre-workout, to post-workout, to stretches. Like the kid's a pro, but he's also like almost to a nauseam obsessed with his process. And if you mess with it, he's going to have a problem with it. And he does it in a very friendly way, but he's learned to say no to things.

He's learned to say no to people. And he's just as Uber, Uber, Uber locked into his process. He's a young guy that when he gets his opportunity to be a pro, he's going to be really, really impressive in an NFL locker room, and NFL building because he's mature beyond his years in terms of his own process and his own self-awareness. So you mentioned Joel Gordon, who is Byram's position coach and your offensive coordinator. Joel talked yesterday and he said he calls the plays but you occasionally inject a touchdown or two.

Is that, is he sucking up to you or is this, is this real? Like you see something like, okay, that's touchdown right there. Man, I would tell you very much collectively as an offensive staff. And I do, I'll keep track of whose touchdown it was. And now I'll bring it up in a joking moment. It's so much a collective effort, Andy. And it really is. I have learned, and I've had to learn and grow as a head coach too,

that when I say something on a headset or I say something in general, it's taken as Bible. And so early on, when Joel took it over, it was like, man, I'd say something. What do you guys think about this? And then that would be the play call. Or, hey, have you thought about this and that would be the play call? So then I learned really quickly, like, man, if I say it, it better be what I want to do because I'm the head coach.

And it's just going to get called. And so I was going to say when you said that to Josh at Tennessee, it was merely a suggestion, right? Well, there were times where on the flip of it where Josh would say something. I'd be like, man, does he mean this? Or are you telling me? Are you asking or are you suggesting where are we at? Now, Josh was awesome in that sense as well. But I think probably just like he learned, I had to learn, man, like when you speak, it's about to happen.

So, and especially with the tempo we play at. But I don't know. I jokingly, because Joel brought it up that he had mentioned that. So I've got our analysts. They're tallying up what calls didn't. But Joel said in his calculation, over 90% of my calls the last two years have been touchdown. take it for what that's worth. Yeah, I would just tell the analysts to stand down and stick with 90%. I don't think you... If it's 90%, the next question would be, well, how many did you call?

But we'll figure that out later. Yeah, sample size doesn't matter. 90% sounds good. Last question, how does one run the piss out of the ball? Yeah, it's a relentless drive to just keep calling run plays until somebody stops it. I love that. I appreciate that. And I've talked to coaches about this. And I've had coaches in honest moments say to me, yeah, sometimes I get a little too cute.

And sometimes I don't. But what is how does that work? Because you've been a play caller. You know, do you get caught up in your own head saying, maybe I should do this, maybe I should do this? Or when you get into a groove, when something's working, do you just say, again, again, again, Again, again, again.

Yeah, to be honest with you, I think you grow in that aspect. I think naturally you have to know where your faults are as a play caller. I could tell you early on, I was really impatient in terms of, man, like this running the ball sometimes is kind of boring because it's four or five yards and I just want to see something crazy happen, you know? And that's just the truth. I think you have to have people around you that you truly trust and rely on when you're a play caller. Like Tyler Hudenic, our offensive line coach and our run game coordinator, like hoodie sat next to me for a long time in the box when I called plays.

And so then you know, he knows exactly your rhythm. Joel Gordon and I were together for a really, really long time. We were together for four years at Iowa State. we've obviously been together for three years at South Florida. Like Joel knows how I think and I know how Joel thinks. Cody Burns was with us our first year at Tennessee. And I would tell you, Cody coming back last year after his time in the NFL, he drastically, won how much he grew, but how much he grew our offense.

And now you've got a chance you bring in a guy in Larry Scott, who's been an offensive coordinator in this league, he's been a head coach. Been a play caller in this conference. You bring in a guy in Larry Porter, who's been a special teams coordinator, been a head coach, has coach tight ends, as coach running backs, has this incredible vast amount of knowledge. And you add in our analysts and young coaches who the majority have been in this offense. Both guys, my running back coach, my tight end coach from South Florida are here in senior leadership roles on offense as well. you bring all these guys together and you open the floor for people to have opinions and thoughts and you put it all together to be honest with you that's how you evolve that's how you grow offensively

but ultimately as a play caller you got to know when when there's a voice that comes in on that headset that whatever whatever is being told to you you have to you want a split second to dissect if that's also where your mind is but truly split second. to say, man, I agree with that. Let's go that way. And then having the wherewithal to own whatever just happened. And I think the ability to own what happened and not ever point the finger at somebody else, I think is what makes really, really high-end offensive coordinators and honestly brings an offensive unit together. And there is, there's a science to it. But I think there's a huge gut feel to it as well. But surrounding yourself with with high-end people that you

trust but have also been there and been through those moments and have failed and grown from it and have succeeded and learned from that as well. I think all of that you put it together and that's how you effectively can call plays on offense. And that young coaches is how you get a 90% touchdown rate on your calls. Yeah, only call the ones that score. It's really not that hard. Just call the touchdown play. It's that simple. Alex, thank you so much. I appreciate anything. Thanks for having me on him. That is Alex Golish telling us how to run the piss out of the ball.

We'll see if Auburn runs the piss out of the ball. But that is the sort of thing that the Auburn fans do enjoy hearing for sure. Is the word piss in Alabama used there more often than it is in other states? I'm just wondering. I don't. I feel like it's used fairly universally across the states. You're just talking about that Alabama fan who doesn't give a. piss about nothing but the time. I don't give a piss about nothing but the time.

Now, in fairness to Alex Golish, in the same press conference, he said they would run the heck out of the ball, run the piss out of the ball, and run the crap out of the ball. So there's a lot of stuff coming out of this ball. What term is not used enough and should be used more is piss missile. Well, maybe Byron Brown will throw some piss missiles this season in Auburn. Is this a good segue into the Olympic doping scandal right now, or should we just touch base on that one next week? Possibly the greatest on three graphic of all time. I believe it said it was penile injections, was the on three graphic.

So apparently I was like joking because I tweeted when I first saw it. I was like, how do you discover that this works? Apparently if you inject your member, you go further. But apparently it's about the aerodynamics of the suit. You make the suit. I don't, well, this is not on a Winter Olympics podcast, but we may have to dive deeper into this. I'm sure we get some sponsors. You know, there's a lot of companies like that that sponsor podcasts.

So we've got to call our sales team and just say, hey, look, we're going to go really deep into this Olympic ski jumping penile injection scandal. And so if you can find some advertisers that might want to marry their products with that, now's the time. I feel like we're poor podcasters or we don't at least try. I do think that there is at least one company that tends to sponsor a lot of podcasts that might be interested in that. But no free ad, so we're not going to tell you what that company is. Not going to tell you which company it is. Good stuff. What we are going to do is open the mailbag.

Dear Andy and dear Ari, we love it when you chime in and help us. And I've got two to start out with that are about the thing that we've been talking about all week, the eligibility cases in college sports, be it Joey Aguilar at Tennessee, Trinidad Shameless at Ole Miss, Charles Betiaco, the Alabama basketball player, who as we're recording this, is in court for a hearing on the injunction that he's trying to seek that will allow him to keep playing for Alabama. If the judge grants the injunction, Bettyaco gets to keep playing, if the judge denies the injunction, that's it.

Like, they play Auburn tomorrow, and Betiaco won't be playing if the judge denies it before then. So I think we'll find out about that. And it also may not be immediate. By the time this podcast drops, you may know more. But it may not be immediate. He may take the information he gets into account and make the decision at a later time. It brings me to our letter from Mike. And Mike is an attorney. And I really appreciate Mike helping us out with some stuff here. So he says, Annie and Ari, enjoy your show and appreciate the depth of your analysis. I know that you've gotten caught in lots of legal issues with all the suits by athletes.

The analysis of injunctions has been very good. As a practicing lawyer who does a lot of work in cases involving injunctions, I thought I would give you some additional details of the different types of injunctions and how they work. And to this, I say thank you, Mike, so much, because Mike is giving us here in plain English what Ari and I have been struggling to explain to you for a week. So here's what Mike says. First, temporary restraining orders, which is what she's, Charles Bediaco is playing on right now are granted on are granted back on affidavit testimony,

i.e. witnesses written statement of facts that are made under oath. Because TROs are decided on affidavits, the opposing party never has an opportunity to cross-examine the witnesses. Because there is no ability to cross-examine witnesses, TRO's last a limited amount of time, usually 10 or 14 days. And so Charles Bediaco is on the second 10-day TRO and can get one an extension of an amount of time. However, the parties can, by agreement, extend to TRO. Second, temporary injunctions, sometimes called preliminary injunctions, can only be granted after a full evidentiary hearing. That is what Charles Betiaco is doing as we're recording this. That's what Joey Aguilar and Trinidad Shameless are waiting to do next week.

Thus, temporary injunction hearings involve witnesses being called to testify and must face cross-examination. So, in Justice Charles Batiochco is right now, Now, Joey Aguilar, Attorney-Dad Chambleau, will then be cross-examined by NCAA attorneys, where they will have the opportunity to do that. Because the witnesses appear and testify, the judge gets to evaluate witnesses' credibility, your right that to prevail on a TI, the court must find the plaintiff, i.e., the player, is likely to prevail at trial. Moreover, because the temporary injunction is only granted after a full evidentiary hearing,

the temporary injunction remains in effect until the case goes to trial. Third, regarding judges, and I have a lot of friends who were in our judges, they typically take their positions very seriously and try to make decisions based on the facts in the law rather than based on who wins. I will note that judges in more than half the states are elected, meaning they run for the job or after appointment must stand in a retention election. Local voters in Mississippi and Tennessee are likely to consider a ruling on the state universities starting quarterback's eligibility in deciding how to vote.

Thank you so much for that, Mike. I appreciate that. The last part put me in a pretzel, Andy. Because on one hand, it's like, yeah, these guys take their work really seriously and want to do a good job, which I have no doubt of. I don't think you could live in America and not at least have blind faith that judges are trying to act in good faith most of the time, if not all the time. Right. But at the same time, if you are a person who likes their job and wants to keep it and your decision based on a decision that you make in court could likely or, most certainly in the state of Tennessee impact how people view you when you're on a ballot

next time. That also could be a conflict of interest. So like I, you know, but I guess maybe they live in that in that world at all times. They do live in that world. I mean, every case matters to somebody locally. Yeah. They're their judges in state court. They, you know, they probably work in the county. They live in. I just can't imagine that you're, you're ruling on the quarterback of the starting football team at the University of Tennant. Like, what case would have? have more general backlash or, you know, make. Well, right. And it's also, especially in the state of Tennessee, specifically,

it's one of those where it's easy to score political points if you do the thing that makes the balls happy. So it's, you know, it's easy to be politically vilified if you do the things that, the thing that makes the ball sad. You know, and I wish we could have Mike on the show because I find all this legal stuff very interesting. And I'm not going to pretend to be a law expert, although I think that you've done a very good job of guiding us through this with all the court cases that you've,

you know, read through all the years. Even when I was in the car with my dad yesterday, he was like, did Andy go to law school? So that means that you're doing a good job. I said, not that I'm aware of, but he's just one of these people that knows everything. And I don't know why it happened. Producer River, by the way, pointing out there is one, one entity in the state of Tennessee that would draw more universal either praise or condemnation if the judge picked the wrong side than the starting quarterback of Tennessee football dolly pardon well let's just hope she's not

you're all against dolly you're dead in this state so if you you think that more people are moved by dolly parton than the starting quarterback at Tennessee that's interesting yes yes I've never been to dollywood I heard it's a nice place to take kids I I've never been to dollywood either I've been to Pigeon Forge a few times. It's lovely, lovely place. But, no, I think, I think Dolly has the, like, universal cue rating. The thing is, the state of Tennessee, big long parallelogram. You got some, some Ole Miss fans.

You probably have some Bama fans that have moved to Nashville, Auburn fans that have moved to Nashville. So not a universal appeal for the Valls, though it is, it is almost universal. Dolly's is universal. So that's where it would go. Can I, I got another one from Lori, Ari. Okay. And this is our, I think Lori is one of my favorite question askers, period.

Lori doesn't have a question this time. But what Lori stated, I think, sums up how a lot of people feel on this issue. So I wanted to read this. For me, the thing that makes college football great is the fact that you have guys doing this who are very athletic and well trained, but the majority of which have not yet reached their physical or mental prime. Most of these freak athletes grow in size and strength past the age of 23. and it has been scientifically proven that the brain does not fully develop until the age of 25, specifically the risk-reward part of the brain.

If we let these guys play until past college age, it would change the game in ways that matter more to the viewer than the fact that they are paid or not or where they played last year. You asked today how we all feel, so I'm telling you how I feel. This is not a question. Also, Lori says, I have, however, been working on a question for about a month, just trying to figure out how to properly put it in words, which means that question is going to be a dougier. Yeah.

Because remember, Lori's the one who came up with the coaching carousel white elephant gift exchange, which we are just going to steal and make into a segment every single year. I call it the coaching carousel key party. But, you know, the concept is the same. I'm stealing it straight from Lori. But I think Lori put that really well. I think that is probably the feeling of most fans

that when you have people who've played in the pros or you have people who are trying to stretch their eligibility into seven, eight, nine years, it's we as college sports fans, like that does not compute with us. It doesn't work. The risk reward part of the brain, Andy, is that like, does that mean less grab ass?

Is that what that means? You can watch an NFL game and see how much more efficiently they play. And you can say, oh, that's because they're all better, which is partially true, but also probably because they are professionals. They have been doing this for a very long time. They are the best of the best at what they do. And yes, their brains are fully developed. So you see fewer just like, holy crap, how did he make that mistake?

You still see it every once in a while. But you rarely see it in the NFL, whereas you see it all the time in college. You know, and I wanted to go back to Mike's portion real quick, too, since we're kind of bunching these two together. And I just wanted to ask this because it's something that I, you know, I think that I'll always be honest with the, with the listener and you about things that I don't understand. And the thing that I've really struggled with when it comes to the Bettyaco case and what is coming up with Trinidad Chambliss and others is, Andy, in the evidentiary hearing when the witnesses are able to be cross-examined, what questions are being presented in those hearings that are

revealing information that we don't already have. Like the credibility of the witness, like, I don't understand. Like, we know that he played in the pros. You could ask him if he played in the pro's, but like what other personal questions could be asked to Bettyaco and others. It's going to come down to this is, in this case, it's a lot less about, it's not like a he said, she said, it's like, do you believe this person or not? It's, do you believe this entity is behaving in the way that it says it is supposed to?

And in this case, and here's where it gets really interesting. So Greg Sanky, the SEC commissioner, inserted himself into this case, filing an affidavit with the court, asking the court to side with the NCAA against SEC member Alabama here, which I think is really interesting. And in his affidavit, he wrote, inconsistent application of the NCAA eligibility rules challenged in this case through court rulings or otherwise fuels disruption in college sports. Sanky also wrote, permitting former professional. athletes to return to competition creates a competitive disadvantage and fundamental unfairness for current student athletes who have not pursued a professional sports career. And so I find this really interesting because this is Greg Sanky, the commissioner of the SEC, coming out against one of his own schools in court. That's pretty significant.

Yeah, but I also think that it's regardless of whether it was Alabama or Fresno State, and I understand it's one of his member institutions. but Greg Sanky is one of the most, if not the most powerful person in college sports. And trust me, he knows the shitstorm that's around the corner of this. And can I explain why he has to do this? Sure. Because if Alabama will sue the NCAA, what's to stop them from suing the SEC? So they're a member of both. And so if you're Greg Sanky, and remember, they've talked about if the NCAA can't really enforce this rules,

could they do it by conference? Could the Big Ten have a set of rules that it enforces and the SEC have a set of rules that it enforces with its own enforcement arm? Not if the schools will sue you. Yeah. So that's something he's got to take up now. You asked what facts will be disputed,

what opinions will be disputed. I think in the Bettyaco case, as well as the Aguilar case and the Shambless case, though they're different, it will be the NCAA being inconsistent in how it rules on these things. And that's where, like, Bettyaco's attorneys would come back really hard at what Sanky said about inconsistent application of the NCAA eligibility rules. Like the NCAA has been more inconsistent than anyone.

Yeah. Is that, this is what Darren Heardtner posted on his, he's an attorney that's, you know, representing. He's involved in a Bettyaco case. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He pointed out that if you want consistency in NCAA eligibility standards, then you should start by being consistent in your decision making when you're ruling on them.

Because like we don't really know, you know. Yeah. And here's the thing. And so, and this is what Nate Oates, the Alabama coaches said all along. If actually, I think River, do we have the quote? Do we have the Nate Oates video? Let's let's just play the Nate Oates video. You play in anybody that thinks this thing through logically.

to see all the former European pros that are now playing and all the former, really not interesting, but former current, there's a bunch of current NBA free agents playing in college basketball right now. So to me, you go through everything else. It made sense for Charles. It was what's best for him, was what's best for our program.

I'm gonna do what's best for the kid every time what's best for our program. I didn't think it would be as big a deal because we've already had all, I mean, any coach, with a European pro on their team, it is pretty hypocritical when they're talking about Charles, to be honest with you. So I thought most guys that could think through this thing logically were really, there's really not a big difference. I mean, we've already had G League. We have James Notchie's

rights are owned by the New York Knicks, and he's been drafted in the same draft. And I, I mean, there's other guys too. Like the fact that it took a court to get him, that that's become fairly commonplace. We just played a kid tonight. night. Rashon Aegee is only playing because he went to a court in Texas on it. So that's Nate Oates with our friends at Field of 68, Jeff Goodman and Company. That's what Charles Betiaco's attorney is going to argue in court today. They're going to say, look, these guys who played pro in Europe, no different.

James Noggi, the player he mentioned, plays for Baylor. He went through the draft. He just never wanted to play in in the G League or. And if you look at what he's done since he got eligible at Baylor, it's because he's not that good. Well, I want to go on record, though,

and say that I also think it's just as stupid when the European players playing in college too, like a European pro. Well, the reason they give for that is their systems different. Like, they don't have college over there to, if you're identified early as a good player,

you go into the academy of the pro, of the pro team. And so it's different. But, that's the issue. So you're right. And here's the other part of it too, Andy, that I think needs to be, there needs to be a distinction on. Did that person play for your team? Did they leave to pursue pro sports? And then did they return to it? Like, I know that everybody is like, I mean, I don't, I'm not an expert.

It doesn't matter if they played for your team and came back. They could play for your team and then come back and try to play for some other team. It's all the same thing. It played in college, left to pursue a pro career and then came back to play. I think it's a little bit different. I'm not an expert on European high school basketball and how that plays out. It doesn't exist. What I do know is that there are players that have gone most players when I was covering basketball 10 years ago that didn't make it to the NBA, went to Turkey or whatever, Spain for a year and made a ton of money and did the European thing. Anybody who's done, I think if you have exhausted, I think you should forfeit your right to play college athletics the second you leave college athletics in order to pursue a professional career in it.

any more than I would want to go work at the student newspaper. And I think that is the common sense definition. I think that's how most college sports fans feel. I unfortunately don't know if that's legal. Yeah. I mean, like that's the whole thing, right? Like how we view the sport in the way it should work is certainly being, you know, challenged in the court of law based on what is truly legal.

And I understand now, you know, this would be an insane thing to be arguing about, you know, 10 years ago. But now that there is this much money. on the table, you also have to get into a place where, like, who am I to decide whether Betty Aco can make a good living? Like, I don't want to get in his pockets. I don't want to live in. And I'll point out, we always talk about if they just did a CBA, which I know is not easy.

But the NFL CBA, the NBA, the NBA CBA, they define who's allowed to be a player. Like, they don't allow football players. who've been out of high school less than three years to play in the NFL. The CBA bans that. The CBA and the NBA bans players under 19 years old. And like Maurice Claret challenged the NFL one. He won in the original court, the district court, and then the circuit court overturned it.

And so that NFL CBA, their age limits, survived an antitrust challenge. And that's the thing. If you have a CBA, you probably can't. can set these rules pretty clearly and no one can challenge them or they could, but a judge is going to go, no, this was agreed to by labor and management. You don't need, there's no case here. So that's the thing.

We should make that might be the only way. Lead back to CBA, which is the Canadian. Well, I also think, I do think that's one of those if they went to Congress and said, just please help us give an antitrust exemption for just the eligibility rules. like we're not asking you to give us any control over how much we can pay or allow us a set of salary cap or anything but just let us set eligibility rules without with an antitrust exemption i think they might get that but what is it in what's in it for congress to you know to acquiesce to that they like the product the way it is and want it to be the way it is yeah or the way it's intended and i don't i don't think much of the public would there i don't think be a ton of public outcry over that. Like if there's a significant portion of people, if Congress said, we're going to give you this antitrust exemption and you can set whatever

salary cap you want and you don't have to get that approved by the players. Like, I don't think a lot of people would be cool with that. I think there are some people who would be, but I don't think the majority of people would be cool with that. I do think the majority of people would be cool with them saying, you know what? If you've gone pro, you can't come back to college. Yeah, gone pro. Or if you've had five years of eligibility, you don't get more. I can see them saying that and most people being pretty cool with that. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's like Lori wrote in because I asked the other day, how do you guys feel about this?

Tell me how you guys feel. And I think most people feel the same way Lori does. Yeah. I don't think there's a big outcry for, oh, no, we need all these 27, 20, 28, 29-year-olds playing college football. And it is one of those deals, too, or so let's say that Trinidad Chambliss is, Chambliss' quarterback next year.

Ole Miss fans are going to be happy about it. Everybody else is going to be like, what the hell? But if Trinidad Chambliss played at a different school, Ole Miss fans would also have the opinion that they are fighting against. Like, it's kind of one of those deals where it always... Oh, yeah, it's all politics are local. And by the way, Charles Betty Aco has left the courtroom.

a decision is expected later today. So if that decision comes before the podcast is scheduled to be released, we'll tack on a little extra saying, here's what happened. If not, we'll come back when they have one. But we've got to move on to our next question. All right. This one comes from Shea.

Hello, I know there's been discussion on the potential for Joey Aguilard to return for another year on Rocky Top. While it is still an uncertainty with legal question, I wanted to get y'all's opinion expectations for the big orange if they get Aguilar back next fall with a full offseason under his belt and hopefully a better defensive unit with new DC Jim Knowles. If you had to predict a record for them, what would it be and what is the best case scenario as far as wins? I also want to pose the same question if Tennessee is without Aguilar and the starting signal callers either Frazon, Brandon or George McIntyre. Love the show and the discussions. All right, Shea, Tennessee is a tough one.

So I went on Nashville radio with my pals, Will Bowling and Ramon Foster on Friday morning. And they asked me the same thing. Ramon, you know, played offensive line at Tennessee, then played for the Steelers. They were wondering what I thought Tennessee, what their outlook should be for this year. And I got to say, Ari, there's a lot of the SEC that I have a hard time handicapping. And Tennessee is part of that, whether or not they get Aguilar back. Yeah. No, I mean, I just, I think that doing it in February used to be very easy.

Who's on your team? Who's returning? There's a, there's a projected depth chart. We're still trying to get our arms around who's even on the team. You know, like it's just, it's so much more. And especially with them, because we don't know who the starting quarterback is. Right. But if Brandon's the starting quarterback, I would say undefeated national champions because he's a five star.

But, you know, I think it's funny that you say that there, just because that doesn't happen much anymore, it's going to happen again where some five-star freshman shows up on campus, becomes a starting quarterback, and he's awesome immediately. Like, it will happen again. I realize the sport is moving, moving toward older and get old, stay old after watching Indiana play, you know, play for the national championship. But I'm telling you right now, like, it's going to happen again where some freshmen, just shows up and is awesome.

Yeah. And I think they did pretty good in the portal, right? 21 incoming guys. And a lot of this is, you know, predicated on, you know, the new defensive coordinator and how things go. But you know who is an interesting one that like has had zero fanfare whatsoever and is directly in the middle of this quarterback situation? Is that they got that Ryan Stobb kid from Colorado?

Yeah. And remember when he, like had a really good few outings last year and it looked like he was going to be i i wonder he was throwing bese dion dion basically got got tired of the the situation he was dealing with with where he had you know the liberty transfer and the freshman and then he tried stop but then that also didn't work very well either and it might have just been the whole thing was was messed up but yeah i i think it's more than just george mcintyre or phazon brand and stob is going to is going to factor in if they don't get Aguilar back.

I still think there's a good chance they get Aguilar back. Yeah. Just because of the strategy. I very much am always curious of like quarterback who showed signs of production at lower level goes into system with better players and a good offensive coach that has always got. You just described Joey Agil. Yeah. So, you know, I don't know.

Like, are you comfortable trying to give a win projection right now? Like, I don't. I'm really not. Now, I will say about the Jim Nulls piece of it. One thing that's interesting with Jim Noles is historically his defense is viewed as fairly complicated. It takes a little while to really get going. Like he was pretty good when he got to Oklahoma State, but like that last year at Oklahoma State when everybody really knew the defense,

they were awesome. And then Ohio State, the second year in that defense, they were awesome because they're obviously super talented team. And then he goes to Penn State where their roster was pretty much set. They recruited really well. So he had the one year at Penn State, which is a little hard to judge because you had the issues on offense. You had them firing James Franklin. But I will say four transfers from Penn State on defense who theoretically know what Jim Nulls wants out of his defense. Yeah.

I think would help accelerate the process because that wasn't something he could do at Ohio State. And it wasn't really something he could do at Penn State because those rosters were pretty much set where they were. They didn't need to take a lot of transfers. And one player that I think I might have erred on, including in the list of impactful transfers, the top ten is Chas Coleman. He's a really good player and he's coming in at a position of great need for Tennessee and he's going to be familiar with the system. So, you know, I do think that there are certain pieces on both sides of the ball to really like.

You know, at times Tennessee looked very good last year and at times they looked a little discombobulated. But I have a lot of faith in Josh Heipel as the coach. So I think that anytime you go into a season, I think that these projections are going to be predicated in large part by what's the acumen of the head coach? Have they shown a proven track record of consistent output? And I think that Josh Heipel has done that. Now, if you are somebody who wants to hear that we think they're going to make the playoff or make a playoff run, like I'm not willing to go that far.

But I still think they should be, you know, a very similar team to what they were last year. And the thing is that they're a little bit better team than they were last year, then they'll be very much in the mix for the playoffs. They don't have to be much better. Yeah. I mean, all things aside, when you consider what Tennessee did last year and where we were last March, like I think that that was a pretty productive and successful season. Yeah.

And I think, you know, getting Mike Matthews back, he definitely came on, looked like he was supposed to look as a recruit. The offensive line has changed a little bit, but like David Sanders is back. and you hope that he's a year better and is what you invested in when you got him out of high school. And then we'll see with the Nol's defense, with the transfers. The schedule is really interesting that, you know, they got Georgia Tech in the non-conference. And this is start getting used to these nine-game SEC conference schedules. Like the fun for Tennessee begins with Texas coming to Neeland Stadium and Auburn coming to Nealon Stadium in consecutive weeks. goalish who was the OC at Tennessee under Heiple.

He's bringing his Auburn Tigers to Neela Stadium on October 3rd. Like that's a big game right there. Like you, especially if you drop the Texas game, you need to win that game because that's a, that looks like a Nashville Friday night, Knoxville Saturday day on September 26th. Hopefully I've never been.

Buddy, we're going to be in Knoxville Friday night too. We got to probably visit the office. tell you what we'll go to national on wednesday yeah uh i've never been to neelan for a game that seems pretty good just beat georgia you need to you need to see neelan for a game i don't know we'll have to figure this out but uh producer river volfer life says knoxville thursday night and i i tend to agree cc towns on thursday nights that that's kind of the place to be not the beer the beer is cheaper people are pumped you're watching a little you know you're watching some some Thursday night college ball.

You're watching a Thursday night NFL. Get a nice dinner. Go get some beers. Like that is, that's heaven right there. I have a road trip. Rogersville Wednesday. Okay.

Knoxville Thursday. Pop in the office Friday morning, you know, then drive back. Why are we driving two and a half hours each way to the office in that? Did you see the new studio that on? I saw it. We can do,

we'll go earlier and then we'll come in to Knoxville. Okay. So Tuesday. Nashville. Yes. Wednesday, Knoxville. Sunday, Nashville.

Yeah, we do our videos on Sunday in Nashville. No, we just stay in Nashville for like half the week and then we move over. We were at Rogersville Wednesday night to visit Rivers parents,

have them make us dinner. And then we had to Knoxville. Calhoun's on the river for Thursday night NFL. Just drinking beers looking out over the Tennessee River. Like that might be heaven right there. I just want to experience a small town southern bonfire. You think Rivers people are going to have a bonfire for us?

I think that they will, yes. It will be requested and I didn't say for us, these people always have bonfires. That's what they do. That's what he said they do. River, does you grow up on a CW show where you were you having a bonfire every weekend? No, but that was some common things we did. did after football games. Prong, we did it one night, big bonfire.

So, yeah, we can make it happen in the fall. Maybe we should go later in the year when it's cold and we can all go to like a bonfire. No, no, pregame in the Walmart parking lot, then bonfire. There you go. This is the Rogersville, we are not talking about Knoxville, by the way. Tennessee fans. We were talking about Rivers hometown. We are not talking about Knoxville.

This is what River said he used to do. I'm not, I've never experienced it. A place that is now back from my childhood, fully open and serviced well now is the golden dairy. And you got to get a giant golden burger and they have some nice soft serve ice cream with it too. Also, when I get you to Knoxville, when I get you to Knoxville, Ari, I'm taking you to Moonshine Mountain for cookies. Yes, please. Alamo Freeze in Tennessee is what I have in my head right there, right? By the way, thanks to the moonshine mountain people. I had tweeted about them.

they sent a box of cookies to my house. I have never seen my kids attack something so quickly. It was like watching Piranha strip a cow. I'm hungry. Oh, yeah, we got to get you to Neal Stadium for a game. It is one of the great experiences. And look, Texas coming to town, Auburn coming to town in consecutive weeks, come on.

Doesn't get any better than that. Ari, we've learned quite a bit today. As we adjourn, next week should be fun Monday the highest impact transfers in college football this offseason as judged by one Ari Wasserman I will tell him where he's wrong yeah he's mostly right but I'll tell him where he's wrong we'll talk to you Monday