Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast - EP 100: Taylor Goldsmith (Dawes)

Episode Date: September 29, 2020

Andy is back again for the 100th time to remind y'all: YOU GOT THIS. And on a very special Interview Hour we welcome golden voiced rocker, Taylor Goldsmith from Dawes! Taylor and Andy talk about growing up in Malibu, genre, and what legacy means to them. Dolav laments The Jazz and Shawn & Beats sing a song. This is EP 100 and we love all your guts. Thanks for listening in on our madness. Follow us on Instagram @worldsavingpodcast For more information on Andy Frasco, the band and/or the blog, go to: AndyFrasco.com Check out Andy's new album, "Keep On Keepin' On" on iTunes Spotify  Check out the undeniably excellent DAWES and catch their new album, Good Luck With Whatever out Oct 2nd Produced by Andy Frasco Joe Angelhow Chris Lorentz Audio mix by Chris Lorentz Featuring: Shawn Eckels  Dolav Cohen Andee "Beats" Avila Arno Bakker

He's interviewed dudes, time after time He's talked about feelings, he's probably cried He had a co-host, yeah maybe a few Ended up kicking him off because he's a solo too. I think it was on and on and on and on. The 100th episode, forget. The world saving podcast, my friends. The 100th episode of The World Saving Podcast. Dick jokes and cold songs and interviews with rock stars. All right.

And we're back. Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast. I'm Andy Frasco. How's everyone doing today? How's our heads? How's our minds? Are we staying out of trouble? Are we not letting the booger sugar's our heads? How's our minds? Are we staying out of trouble? Are we not letting the

booger sugar control our lives or whatever addictions you have? If it's whatever you feel insecure about you doing too much, just know that you're in control, that you're in control, that you're in control. And no one else is going to fight your demons besides yourself. Because until you believe that you have demons, how is anyone else going to believe that you have demons? So if you got something going on in your mind, or if you've been being afraid to talk about something you've always wanted to talk about with somebody, let that shit out. Suppression, suppression will kill people because it makes us feel that we're alone. And it makes us feel that we don't have anyone to go to when we're feeling alone. That's not true. Just stay present. People aren't going to judge you for having flaws. And

if they do, fuck them. We don't need people in our life that judge us over some bullshit. Tell them to fuck off and be the person you want to be because it's episode 100. And fuck yeah, everyone. We made it to 100 episodes. Wow. Unbelievable. We made it to 100 episodes, guys. Three years of you listening to me talk shit. Unbelievable. I just want to say thank you so much. I brought this up in the beginning because I think about the person I was on episode one and the person I am on episode 100.

And I wouldn't be the person I am now if I didn't start becoming honest with myself. And this is why I started the podcast. This is why I wanted to have this outlet because I was too afraid to express how I feel to my loved ones and my friends and my bandmates. So I had to do it publicly to know that in my head that I could do it because you know me, I have fucking intimacy problems. in my head that I could do it because, you know, you know me, I have fucking intimacy problems. I got a commitment problems. It's hard for me to be vulnerable in front of people, like in front of really close homies. And, uh, I'm more vulnerable in front of strangers and, you know,

cause intimacy scared me. And that's why, um, on this special episode, first off, we got Taylor Goldsmith from Dawes on the show, big show tonight. He's putting out a record this week. And so we got him on the show to talk about it. And I grew up listening to the Dawes. I was always into that type of music. And I grew up in the same town as him. So to finally have a full circle conversation, because I went to competing high schools with him.

And to have a full circle conversation, it's going to be special. So I think you're going to like high schools with him. And to have a full circle conversation, it's going to be special. So I think you're going to like this interview a lot. And then after, going back to my intimacy problems, I had one of my friends that I actually, we used to hook up a couple years ago. Her name's Taylor Nix, great singer. She's from Dallas, Texas.

And we got drunk and talked about my intimacy problems and if I was a good lover and stuff. So it's going to be a fun episode. I think you're going to enjoy all of it. We got a cool halftime. It's 100 episodes. Wow. I look back at myself and I was a fucking mess starting episode one.

I was talking about all my... I had Yeti, my co-host, and I had, didn't, I was just confused with if I wanted to keep doing music. I felt, you know, scared of just, you know, finding out who I was. And, you know, I didn't, you know, I was addicted to coke and addicted to drugs and addicted to sex and all this stuff. And when I first started the podcast and then I got to talk to 100 amazing guests to help me understand that you got to love yourself. You got to love every inch of you because the minute you have any vulnerabilities, the fucking haters are going to peck right through that shit

to make you bleed out. So if we're confident with ourselves, then no one could fuck with our aura. That's what I'm talking about. Do I have to put on the Eye of the Tiger music? No one could fuck with this shit because 100 episodes later, I found myself through brick jokes and mental health talks with people.

But thank you for rocking with me for a whole hundred episodes. It's really special. I can't believe we're here. I can't believe we did it. Like you know before, I'm a commitment phobe. And I normally give up on shit if it's relationships or if it's dreams. The only dream I haven't given up on is music and this podcast. It's special to see the fan base growing and growing and growing,

and for that, I thank you. But shout out to Fourteener, Weed, Denver, Colorado, Boulder, Colorado. Colorado area weed. Great weed. Smoking that stuff gives me retrospective on, you know. I smoke that when I kind of need a break, you know. I don't like psychoactive weeds. This doesn't have any psychoactive, so I'll smoke a joint.

I used to smoke a shit ton of weed I used to smoke all day but weed got me all fucked up and then I started testing out this 14er weed and I'm finally smoking a little more and I don't feel crazy in my head you get older and the things you used to love

they don't love anymore it's hard as you get older so shout out to 14er for bringing me back into the weed game where I don't love anymore. You know, it's hard as you get older. So shout out to 14er for bringing me back into the weed game where I don't have, because normally when I just smoke weed by my, without booze, I have definitely have anxiety. But when I start drinking and smoking and have this, like, it doesn't work. Maybe, I don't know. I don't know how that is but so i started testing out smoking weed without boozing again and uh threw out this 14er weed and it's been working so shout out to 14er if you're in the colorado area go get yourself some because they're good guys and

they take care of us and they take care of the podcast so let's take care of them guys um what else do i got oh we got a tour going on, because I didn't really push anything during the Taylor show. I'll do all my plugs right now. We got a tour, guys. I'm fucking pumped up. October 12th, we're in Omaha. October 13th, St. Louis. I think there's only like five tickets left, so by the time this comes on, it might be sold out, but give yourself a try. October 14th, Indianapolis, same deal. Almost sold out, so go grab tickets. Then October 16th and 17th, I'm in Roanoke, Virginia for the Go Outside Fest. Then I'm playing a drive-in on the 18th, Richmond, Virginia. Then on the 20th, I'm playing Lexington, Kentucky at the Burrell. 21st, I'm in Nashville. All my Nashville homies, go get yourself some tickets.

Our basement in-show sold out really quick. And this is half the size. We're playing at City Winery in Nashville on the 21st. So go grab tickets. October 22nd, Atlanta, Georgia. And then I have the day off on the 23rd. I think I'm going to go to Charleston early. Brendan Bayless and Ryan Stasek are playing on the beach, so I might go over there and go party

with them. Then our show is on the 24th at, I don't know, I forgot the name of it, but it's Into the Woods, you know, where that Into the Woods festival is. They're throwing, I don't know if it's a private party, but just holler at me if you live in the Charleston area. I'll try, excuse me, I'll try to get you in. But yeah, two week tour with the band. Wow. Things are slowly coming back to normal. A hundred episodes. It's going to be a good one. I just want to say, I love you. Thanks for rocking with me. Thanks for being with me. You're going to love this Taylor interview. Two Taylors, one podcast, Two Taylors on the episode, one podcast. Are you ready to rock? Because I am. Oh, and I got to say, shout out to Joe Angel Howe. Shout out to Chris Lorenz. Shout out to the guys who basically helped me with this podcast. It's not just me

spin shit. It's like it takes time briefing these interviews and it takes time building the shows and i wouldn't be anything without uh my boy joy joe angel how from buffalo new york and our bass player chris lorenz from san francisco so this group of people and sean eckles for fucking writing all the theme music i mean it's a, and we wouldn't make it to 100 episodes without all of us. So shout out to everyone on the squad, Brian Schwartz, Rachel. I love y'all. All right, you ready for the podcast?

Because I am. You ready? Let's fucking go. Taylor Goldsmith up next. All right. Next up on the interview hour, Big Band. Taylor Goldsmith from Dawes.

He's putting out a new record this week. We got to talk. He lives in LA. Just recently married to Mandy Moore, too. Yo, Chris, play a new Dawes track. I just listened to it. Schwartz let me listen to it. My manager manages Dawes as well.

And it's fucking good. And it's and it's the lyrics are always good i mean this band this guy these guys write great fucking songs um they did that record uh with like uh my morning jacket dudes and oh basement tapes the basement tapes about you know bob dylan's like tracks that didn't get released or like lyrics that didn't have music and it was like a guy from bumford and sons uh taylor and it was uh my born jacket uh with jim james it was a great doc about um i forgot the producer's name but uh go check it out and they got a new record so ladies and gentlemen we talk a little bit about everything talk a little bit about everything. We talk a little bit about living in Los Angeles,

talk about his new marriage, he's making more, and all that good stuff. So enjoy Taylor Goldsmith. Catch you on the tail end with Taylor Nicks. And it'll be fun. All right, guys. If that holds you back from anyone that cares for you

Who, who do you think you're talking to? What do you want me to say today? Frankly, I think we would be remiss If we don't remind ourselves to share the painful memories too So baby, tell me who Do you need to be alone? Can you find your own right home? And is that still the house that you can't bear to leave?

Does this car hang in the hall? Are these pictures on the wall? And is there one on this here train that I see? Oh, baby The trains will all stop running soon I don't know how long it's been Since you walked away And after all I said so far

The tender of this bar Says the only people left here, man Are me and you So buddy, who? Who do you think you're talking to? What do you want me to say to this? Frankly, I think we would be remiss If we don't remind ourselves to share the painful memories too

So baby, tell me Who do you think you're talking to? Who do you think you're talking to? Who do you think you're talking to? Who do you think you're talking to? Who do you think you're talking to? Who do you think you're talking to? Who do you think you're talking to? Who do you think you're talking to?

Who do you think you're talking to? Who do you think you're talking to? How we doing, Taylor? Pretty good, how you doing? Dude, we actually grew up in the same town, kind of. I grew up in the Valley. Did you grow up in the Valley? I grew up in Malibu, so we actually were probably like not allowed to be friends back then. The beef. I grew up in Calabasas.

Oh, right on. Tell me about your childhood growing up. Growing up in Malibu, trying. Oh, right on. Tell me about your childhood growing up. Growing up in Malibu trying to be a folk singer. Tell me about that. Yeah, it was weird. Because I never... We moved to Malibu when I was like 11. So I didn't get there early enough to learn how to surf and learn how to be a beach guy when everyone else was

because they just grew up there, so it was never a second thought. And for me, I'm just naturally an unathletic person. So me trying to expedite that learning curve wasn't going to happen. I went to the beach camps in the summer and stuff. I'm like, Mom, I'm so embarrassed and I'm so chubby and I just want to stay home. And so I got into music. And I had a lot of wonderful friendships in Malibu, but I just never felt like I was part of that crew. So by the time we started playing music you know i was working with um my buddy blake mills who uh we grew up there together and you know we were listening to steely dan and dave brubeck and

just queen and just different stuff and um and the we played the malibu wind with like a bunch of bands we'd be one of the several bands um and it would be like simon dawes which is our band and then face humper was one of the bands and then um and then like white star was the other band was cisco adler is like one of the lead singers so we'd go up there and try to play our like nerdy jazz like like rock whatever it was and then they'd go up there with no shirts and boas and makeup and like and just and all the young girls were just going crazy for them like it was the kind of thing where my mom's like once your set's over you come straight home oh really yeah so it was really funny being there because we and and because we were like you know

16 it was that that kind of thing where it felt like these are the biggest bands in the world you know like these bands are about to be, they're going to go from Malibu and straight to Staples because our perception of that was totally off. And Malibu also, all due respect, it just is a bit of a bubble. The way we were all dressing and the way the community was so insular that it felt

very separate from LA. So if you were white star or even Simon Dawes and you had enough people showing up at the Malibu end, you felt like we're on the verge of something, even though like outside of that, like no one's ever heard of you, you know, it was really kind of deceptive in that way.

But like to your credit, I mean, there's something must've been in the air because you guys got successful. Cisco Adler got successful. Like Dwayne Betts got successful. It's like, does isolation have something to do with it? I look at Blake this that way too like Blake oh yeah Blake yeah Blake just you know works on killing it yeah just works on the new Bob Dylan produced the huge Alabama Shakes record making his own amazing music um and he yeah he's he's I think he's the kind of guy where anybody that was around him was sort of propped up and and it goes in all directions like Blake uh worshipped Dwayne you know and and Dwayne was in a band with Alex Orbison and we all worshipped Alex. Like it just and then Alex was in our band for a while.

Like I think like when there's enough like strong personalities that are like destined for some version of greatness, it forces everybody else to sort of rise to that. Like I went to elementary school in Glendale and had I stayed out there, think it's really likely that i wouldn't have gotten um better at what i did and i wouldn't have been challenged by those around me and i think i'm not saying like you know i think malibu had something special going on at that time the same way that any place does at its respective moment that just happened to be a thing then where I look back and it's like, wow, this many people are doing amazing things now. So yeah, I think you're right. I think there was just something going on in that moment

that just, it had maybe less to do with the community, but more to do with the installation that you're talking about. What started giving you angst about growing up? I mean, it's funny like i i yeah i think there is something that like i never felt like i was from there and like even i went we moved there and i was in sixth grade by the time we were i was in 12th grade i still felt like the new guy that doesn't know like like doesn't have a pair of board shorts you know i just never even though

those were my bros like i felt welcomed by any community in the in the school know i just never even though those were my bros like i felt welcomed by any community in the in school but i just never felt like i belonged anywhere except with blake you know and a few musician friends um but like that aside honestly like like a friend of mine once said to me like dude like your music sounds so sad and you are like you're like and this was earlier i like to think there's more humor in my music now. But like on our early records, like this buddy of mine was like, all you're ever doing is joking. All you're ever doing is laughing. And if anybody just heard your music, they would assume you're like the saddest sack that they'd ever want to meet.

And it almost like hit me like a challenge. I was like, that's not right. And it almost like hit me like a challenge. I was like, that's not right. Because, you know, you, if you meet anybody that makes art, you're trying to like get across the, the complete picture of your humanity to, to some degree, you know, to share, to share all aspects of you. And, and I don't like it when, when, like my, like when someone is, is only one thing or the other.

So I sort of took that as like, well, you know what? I'm not cool with that. And I, and so I, that. So I've tried to bring some of that, whether it's joy or confidence or whatever, I've tried to bring that into more recent stuff. I also feel like, to your question, some people

have told me, I mean, I'm not tooting my own horn, but fans will say shit like, wow, he just seems such a deep, wise guy. Actually, i feel much more confused than anybody else i mean i think i'm just willing to like ask the question yeah so it makes me sound like i know more than you do but in fact you probably you know someone else might be way more like adjusted to a certain aspect of reality than i am so it's it's funny

that the impression that one leaves when one creates art because it seems like they know more when when the reality might be the exact opposite. Do you think it's like judging a book by its cover? Yeah, maybe. You see a certain group of factoids, like, oh, this guy writes folk songs. Oh, he doesn't mind talking about heartbreak. Then you maybe assume someone's a certain way, and it turns out that's not accurate.

Why do you think that is in the mind state? Do you think it's because we have to categorize everything? Genre-wise? Why did we have to make genres or put musicians in a stamp? Why can't we just be the people that we want to be at that time? Yeah, man. I mean, like, I feel like when critics will ask me, like, so do you hate, like, when people say your band is part of the Laurel Canyon sound?

Or do you hate, like, they'll just come up with some, like, phrase. And I'll, I try to be nice. I try to say, like, you know, honestly, like like if you want to call my band a punk rock band, like thank you for talking about the band, you know, I don't, but the reality is like no artist, like to your point,

no artist is ever going to appreciate being reduced to some tagline, to some, to some like pull quote. Nobody wants to like embody a genre because then that creates confines. They have to live up to. Like, I don't think kirk cobain appreciated being called a grunge artist i don't think any artist appreciates being called

anything that's why we all love these like big broad terms like rock and roll that's something that we could all like accept because it's big enough that it includes everyone um but like when someone wants to say like oh your music music is this Doesn't matter who you are You're going to resist that Why don't you just listen to it Stop trying to like Try to sum it up in two sentences Yeah it's kind of fucked up

Because I get that too My band's more of a live band So they'll view me For drinking fucking Jameson And getting wild and crowd surfing Not listening to the lyrics it's like we're judging people in 10 seconds i think it's the add culture man we like everyone gives each other 45 seconds shot to like something yeah and it's like and they're rewarded by that like if you if you give the version of an article that is like the most sensational like if someone like is

going to review my record and they're going to be like here's why it's like really solid and here are the things that i don't like about it and it's you know it's it's like i feel like if you see that link on twitter with like the headline of whatever that would be you're gonna be like i don't really care about reading that but if someone says best record of the last 10 years or biggest piece of dog shit made by human beings then people want to click it so it's like you it's like the simpler and more sensational we can make it like you know reducing your music to just like the the simplest most extreme vert like thing that isn't even true to what you do yeah Yeah. They get rewarded for that. Yeah. Does that,

what bums you out about the music industry, if anything? Um, I mean, man, it's, it's tough to answer that because like, I do feel like one of the luckiest people in the music industry.

Um, you worked your ass off, bro. I, I, I appreciate that. And I, yeah, I do feel like I've worked hard,

but I also feel like, um, like a guy that makes the kind of music i make like should not get to do what i've gotten should not have the career that i have i mean i don't like i've had friends of mine who are also in this say to me like dude if this was 1992 we would be millionaires yeah you're probably right like we're not and we maybe we would have been had we been around a different time but it's hard to live in that kind of like what if of the past you know because the reality is the idea of me playing writing songs that are like five minutes long or six minutes long they have a bunch of

acoustic guitars and words and there's no and it's really slow like the fact that like i can carve out any space at all feels pretty insane. So, I mean, yeah, there's aspects of the music industry that are a bummer. I'm sad that every way that people tend to digest music now is not supportive of the record. It's sort of like the way we hear music has taken away the medium in which personally i like to make music yeah and so i could say that but the reality is like that's the kind of fan we've ended up with is the fan that does want us to make records and not just for singles or eps so it's hard for me to like gripe about stuff that like because of the community

that that is like that that has been created around us we're actually still getting to experience so that's what i mean when i say like it's hard to answer that because i feel so goddamn lucky yeah i mean how how important is authenticity to you um i mean it's everything i mean i don't think i mean i i i feel like we were in this amazing position i think it's because of the people that we had around us and just are like, you know, under current submarine connection as four members of a band where we never thought about it.

We never thought about like, what's, what is, where's the culture at? Where's the counterculture at? Where, where do we exist in this? Like for us,

it was like, how do we keep making music we want to make that feels true to us and like and who's gonna keep paying for it and who's gonna keep letting us and and and you know i think it wasn't until recently like i think like on our last record or something where we kind of came up for water and we're like well we like built something without even really realizing it like it seems like we were you know incredibly insistent upon only being true to our artistic visions when the reality is like we were we kind of had we were in a our own little world together our own little bubble together so like i think that authenticity is yes number one because

i feel like when someone isn't isn't staying to that, I feel like the audience will hear it before the artist will. Well, yeah, it's like saying fan emulates artist when artist is authentic. When we're not, when we're chasing the rabbit's tail to try to write songs for the scene, I feel that's when we start getting trapped in our head as songwriters, like what we want to be. Do you believe in legacy? Do you think about legacy a lot? we want to be you know do you believe in legacy do you think about legacy a lot um i do but i try to remind myself that like it doesn't matter as much as i like to think it is like i think it does like i think i think it's a i think it's sort of like um sort of like instagram or something where there's like this dopamine hit when you think about it but the reality is like it doesn't really

matter does it's just sort of this this dream or this this ideal that you might have in your head but it's never going to look like that like but with all that said like the artists that i've always drifted towards most whether it's like writers or filmmakers or musicians it's always been the artists with like deep catalogs like i've never been the big fan like not not like mad at it but like those amazing songwriters or bands that come around and they make one record and they disappear like i love those stories but like and i get into those records it's not like that whether or not you make one record or 20 has any bearing on how good your writing is but in terms of the ones that

i really like dig in with and really want to emulate, it's typically those artists that their whole career suggests a life dedicated to the art. So in that sense, I do really think about legacy a lot. But I also try to – we just announced a couple days ago that we're going to have a kid. Let's fucking go, big guy. Let's go. That's what I'm talking about. Get that baby, dog. We'll talk all about this i'm so psyched and i think it's moments like that where you start start to think like you know i want to take care of my family i want to i want to be a happy person

but these ideas of like legacy and stuff they they don't mean anything compared to being close to the people that you love you know yeah you know when did have you ever had a kid before no first kid first kid how old are your kids oh not that i know of i hope and uh but uh have you ever had any low moments in your life like maybe like you're just burnt out or any of those type of moments i think like it's always in hindsight it's always like afterwards where like where i look back and was like wow i was really like desperate to you know be like like be around people be go whether i was meeting friends at bars or trying to date like i think there was moments in my life only looking back where i was like that didn't seem like

healthy behavior and i didn't even block it in the moment yeah I don't know I mean is that something that you've dealt with a lot yeah you know I think it's when you stop being present you know because when we're dealing through depression presently you there's no time to retrospect right right like have you ever had points in where you just wanted to quit the band or quit playing playing music? I mean, like, never. I guess because I felt so, like, I felt so terrified that it was all that I had. Yeah, yeah. So for that reason, I never felt like I could quit.

If anything, I would be scared of how much I needed it. And so, like, in those moments, I'd be like, man, this I can't imagine this selfie like other people like have like other people, you know, when we all left high school and college or whatever, and we're all starting to tour, all these other guys and bands are like, yeah, and then I met my wife and like when I got another job and then I or I still tour, but it's not what it was whereas like we were still like sleeping on people's couches and we were still like like just never home and we just and and and i start i felt that i was perceived as crazy i felt like well i have to do this i don't know

what my options are other people have other options like even like i mentioned blake earlier blake was like we were in bands early on and he's like, dudes, I don't want to tour. I can't tour. Was he producing back then? He wasn't, but he knew he could because he's such a fucking genius. So like, he knew that like, he'd already had little glimpses of like being a session guy in LA and being a producer in LA. Not, maybe not a producer, but being a session guy. And he knew he wanted to produce. And for me, it was like,

I don't have that skill set. I'm not good enough. I do what I do. I write songs and I play guitar and I sing. I don't produce. I don't play on people's sessions. So for me, it was just like, man, I wish I had your menu. Wish I had your list of options because I just don't.

That's how I always felt, whether or not that's true. How long were you in a band with Blake? We met when I was like 12 and he was 11, I think. And you were playing music that young with him? I mean, I feel like he's told this story. So I mean, I have to just accept the fact that it's okay. What's your side of the story of it, though? Well, it's true.

He's not wrong. I mean, we met because I was 12. I was a normal 12-year-old, and he was, like, a freak. Because when we met, like, my parents were like, why don't you sing that song you sang with your voice teacher? And I think I sang something from, like, The Lion King or some shit. And they're like, Blake, why don't you play him some of the guitar stuff you're learning?

And he played Eruption by Van Halen. Like, notes for himself. Fucking lot. Taylor rocking the lion. What did you like about him in that point in your life? Were you like envious of his openness or? We, we didn't,

we didn't connect then. We did. It was just sort of that my parents had met, they introduced us. So we clocked each other and then we just started going to school and we, I would see him around. He was like, he was like this bad boy skater.

Like he was really good at skating. There was actually a point in his life where he, um, said to me that like, he's like, I was skating so much and I was playing guitar so much that I had to decide. And I think honestly, had he decided skating,

I think he would have still been the skater. He is like, he's still like, he just, it would have been, it would have been skating instead of music. Like he's still like he just it would have been it would have been skating instead of music like he's that he was like that good so what was the first moment then when you guys like i don't i don't i wish i remembered that like when we reconnected i think it was like a talent show was coming up and we were like oh i remember in high school

at this point it's still middle school yeah okay but but i think like with him i've always and i still admire this about blake is that he always had this quality of like he could he could he could say like i don't care about this tour or i don't care about like this school or i don't care like i don't care about like having a hit like fuck these record labels that want to tell us we need something more commercial you know yeah whereas i've always been a little bit i mean i hate to admit it but i've always been a little bit more the kind of guy like this is how it's done this is how people tend to do this so like if we're supposed to tour 250 days of the year then like let's start booking it where he's the kind of guy to be like i'm not i don't want to and i'm perfectly happy like discovering a new way to do that same work

and and he's always landed on his feet because he's so smart and he's so talented so and i i've always envied that for me it's always been like what like what's the right way to do this like i i and i want to be like a maverick i want to be a wild man but and i and i feel free in a lot of ways i feel free in the way that i make music and in and the fact that i can do whatever i want in that regard but in terms of how that's like delivered to the world sometimes i feel like i i'm not as like um i'm not as free as guys like that yeah it seems like a yin and yang situation why didn't work out with you guys being in a band because he didn't want to her and and it really

it's really what it came down to and i mean you know i will for sure admit like we were at that point early 20s and like yeah like we were we were we were finally becoming separate beings like i think when we met that second time and started writing songs together we really were like this we were we were depending on each other like you're the guitar player i'm the singer we write everything together and then as time went on we both started to feel like we you know we started growing up into fully formed humans and we started being intimidated by like what the other represented i think blake was like i'm actually a songwriter and a singer too and that obviously threatened me because i'm like i was an insecure singer so i was like well if you sing then what am i good for

so i would like sort of buck against that and and he would buck against me wanting to like write a song by myself a little bit I mean I'm not gonna like it's it's it's I'm so grateful that we're friends now again like we were friends pretty soon after but we were we're very close um but yeah I mean I'm not proud of the way I I communicated in those times with anybody with my parents with girls with blake like it was just i was i you know i think when you're in at those ages early 20s you're not at least in my experience you're not quite aware yet that other humans like are people too yeah yeah right it's like the world revolves around you you know yeah and you just don't really understand like yeah you're like well this is what i need to do for me so i'm gonna do it like you don't always think about

ramifications um and then as you get older that all like pours in and you're like oh my god i was like a bull in a china shop when i was 22 years old like i'm so glad i didn't kill anyone where's the where do you think the angst comes from when when we're that young i feel like i wonder i wonder if it's just like our brains aren't fully formed like and we don't know how to like we don't know why other people are telling us like we we feel like we're the smartest people on the planet yeah i feel like we have the answers to everything so when other when other people when they so like when our 20 year old versions hear a podcast like this, they're like, fuck everybody. I know who I am.

I know what I need to know. And then you get older and you're like, oh, wow, that wasn't so accurate. And I'm sure that'll continue to go along. I'm 35 now. I'm sure when I'm 45, I'll be like, wow, I was a dope at 35. I think that's a good thing, I hope. It is halftime at the Andy Fresco

interview hour. Hello, everybody. Welcome to Sports with Dolav. He's talking shit about the game. He's got a weird fucking name. It's Sports with Dolav. Woo-woo! He's got a weird fucking name In sports we don't love This week we're going to be talking

Some NBA Finals Episode 100 NBA Finals Edition First time since 2010 Fucking Lakers back in the finals My phone fell My fucking phone fell Fucking Lakers back in the finals. My phone fell. My fucking phone fell. LeBron James, the motherfucking Lakers, made it to the finals.

They did it. My fucking jazz. What the fuck? We showed some fucking grit. Love me some Don Mitchell. Love me some Moody Govans. This is supposed to be our year. Nah, fucking COVID. Mother be our year. Fucking COVID. Motherfuckers.

All right. Who they playing though? Who they playing? The Heat. Who knows? The Celtics. Who the fuck cares? Sports doesn't matter.

Doesn't matter. Andy motherfucking Frasco. Episode 100. Episode 100. World saving podcast. Holy shit. Clippers. Trash.

I'm literally parked outside of my house in front of a trash can, a huge trash can. And that's all the Clippers were. They were trash all along. We all fucking knew it. I tried to hype them up. I did. But all for nothing. Fucking trash cans, dude.

It's Sports with Doloff. Episode 100 You keep on saying like I had to do the right thing I had to do the right thing For doing the right thing Were you putting away other things That you wanted to do?

That's one thing I've never felt Which I'm very grateful for I've never felt like I missed out on for i've never i've never felt like i missed out on so i mean i'm you know i'm sure that'll rear ted at some point but you know it's almost like like i i think about it in terms of uh birthdays you know i know some friends of mine that hate birthdays and i kind of love it because i feel like it each birthday i'm able to like look and see say to myself like all right i turned 35 and i'm cool with this so far so that's a win yeah like if i was if i was turning 35 and i was like where things

were at 12 years ago and i was still like you know like sleeping on couches and all that then maybe i would be like i don't i'm not comfortable um so in that sense i've felt very very lucky um but you know there's things that i would love to do that i'm too scared of like i got a i got a saxophone recently fuck yeah let's go and i haven't even opened it like i'm scared i feel like i just know that like like when you're learning how to do something like when we were learning how to write songs i feel like we were young enough to not know how bad we were. And then by the time you've done all that training that you've needed to do to be good, that's when you're sort of like your tastes are developing and you're waking up a little bit. So like when I sucked at writing songs at 15, I didn't have to deal with that reality.

I just thought I was good because I was 15. I didn't have to deal with that reality. I just thought I was good because I was 15. So then when I was like 24, 23, and I started to really know how I felt about what a good song meant, and I looked back at that, I just like winced. But I don't know if I could go through that at 35. Oh, I can, but I just feel like it'd be that much harder.

The same goes for like I would love to write a book. My favorite thing to do is reading. I've never, I've only written songs. The only thing I know how to write because I, I'm terrified of that period in which I would just suck at it, you know? So the fear of starting something new as your brain is a man.

Yeah. It's like the idea. And that's, I mean, that's, that's the hardest thing. So like now you're at a point in your life where you're like, you're committed to family and you're committed to having a baby and congratulations on that. Does that scare you as well? Because this is new to you

as well. Um, yeah, you know what, that's, that's a cool way to look at it. That's a cool question, like to put it in that lens, like why shouldn't this scare me? Everything else that I'm not good at or don't know how to do does once you – yeah, relationships is a really good analogy. Because I think that in early relationships, I would – if anybody would say to me, like, so you guys are going to live together? I'd be like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I don't want to talk about that.

I have no idea. We haven't discussed that. I don't know how to do that. I've never done that. Like, I have no idea. We haven't discussed that. I don't know how to do that. I've never done that. And like, geez, like I would really like, it would terrify me and I wouldn't even engage with the thought. And then-

How old were you at this moment when you're thinking about this? 25, 26, 27. And then when I met my wife, I was 29. And I attribute 90% of this to her being the one. But I think 10% was also just me getting to a place of like, whatever, let's do this. And I think I was, and again, I wouldn't have done, I'm not trying to imply like, I would have just fallen in love with anybody at that point. That's not the case.

would have just fallen in love with anybody at that point that's not the case um but it's but i there was this feeling of like i don't really know this person and she's gonna fly out to tour and hang out with me for eight days sounds like a recipe for disaster but let's fucking do it and and then when by getting home like oh it seems like we're like staying every night with each other like either she's at my place or i'm at her place every single night seems a little early for that don't care enjoying this just gonna roll with it and then when it came time to like actually like move in together and actually get engaged like I kept kind of looking at it like this might blow up in my face but I want to do this and I don't know how to do it and so I'm just gonna dive dive headfirst and maybe the same thing it maybe the same thing should go for

writing a book or playing a saxophone. I'm just like, I don't know how to do this. It might blow up in my face, but all the more reason to just go the whole hog. Yeah, it's like taking fear out of the equation. When we take fear out of the equation, then I think we're the most powerful.

We're the most vulnerable. We're an open vessel. Yeah, and it's cool to hear you put it that way because taking fear to the equation doesn't take your risk of failure out of the equation. No. The risk of failure is still just as high. Yeah. But you're willing to accept that in a new way

that you weren't when you held on to so much fear. Do you have that philosophy or that idea of self every time you put out a new record? I do now. I didn't before. Why now? I think now because I feel, I don't know, I just know what that looks like now, I guess.

I think when we were putting out our second and third record like what a certain magazine wanted to say about it really carried a lot of weight for me but really like i'd really want to make sure i was that people approved of what i did yeah and um and then you know some people would like it and some people wouldn't and it would hurt or it would feel well actually this is actually interesting like a friend of mine who's actually a really successful songwriter said to me once like you can't read the reviews because the bad ones destroy you and the good ones are never good enough yeah yeah that's what i'm gonna ask you like i mean like you probably look at a thousand fucking people thousand reviews and everyone loves your ass and you'll look at that one motherfucker dude that's why like that's why i don't love reading any reviews like i you

inevitably read a couple because it just they come across your eyeballs and you read it but i did go out like like last with our last record passwords i got we got a bad we got our first review on pitchfork which is funny we've never been reviewed by them. What? Yeah. Well, it's just like we're not their bag. We're not an indie cred thing. So funny. Yeah.

But they didn't like it. And I was like, I knew they wouldn't like it. Yeah. I would have rather than just not even – if they haven't acknowledged us for five albums, might as well stay the course. And I never read it. Because I feel like that would have given it power in my brain, you know, would have given it like validation that you still care about what people

fucking think. Yeah. That I gave a shit about what they think. Like, and I, I, I welcome what they think. I think like if they hate my music,

I'm, I'm down because I, I hate music too. There's some music that I hate and I'm, and I'm entitled to hating it. And, and if some, so I'm not, I don music too. There's some music that I hate and I'm entitled to hating it. And if some, so I'm not, I don't begrudge a bad review, right? It's like, please, like you're a critic. There's a lot, I think there's a lot of responsibility with that role.

I think art depends on good criticism, you know, people are really paying attention to that stuff. But like, I don't know, not when it's like, like Pitchfork has made it very clear where you know how they feel about music so i don't anyway no disrespect to pitchfork um but it's just like it was just like the idea yeah and even if it because i also like there's the maya angelou quote of like if you don't pick it up then you don't have to put it down like if i don't if i believe the good stuff then I have to believe the bad stuff. Yeah.

So if I am able to look at a good review and be like, that's one person's opinion and it doesn't reflect how everybody might feel, like, I have to say for the good and the bad. That's why, like, I really just try to not – I try to just do it for me and do it for, like, Dawes fans. And we're so lucky that Dawes fans dogs fans are like the best fans because we don't have hits and they don't care and we don't have we don't do the same thing twice and they don't care like we like when we don't it's not like when you go to a dog show it's like oh yeah they play like 70% of that second record that

blew up and then they don't really play if they want or two from everything else it's not really like that we like play at all like we cover the same amount of ground on all of our records I don't know how common that is i mean maybe you care you don't have a single um it's one of those things where like i think over time i figured out how to like be cool with it yeah um but like obvious and and so i'll say like you know in a conversation like this of like no it's, no, it's good. You know, it's good to not have a single, but like, I would welcome the opportunity, you know, like if,

if a song of ours like blew up, I would love to see how we've navigated that. But I have been around like in 2013, we opened for Bob Dylan and, um, and his production manager, this guy named Al was really cool. He, at the, he was our pal and we would always hang with him backstage. And at the end of the whole thing, he was like, you know, guys, I want to tell you something. And he took us into his office, and he's like,

if I could give you any advice as a young band, it would be don't have a hit. Because he looked at Neil Young's experience with a hit and the Grateful Dead's experience with a hit, both artists that he like worked for. And, um, and it was like really hard and really didn't make sense for the kind of

music they made. It makes sense when you're Bruce Springsteen or you're Tom Petty because you keep delivering the hits. But when you're like Bob Dylan, Joni Mitchell, like these artists that like, aren't even trying to play that sport but then inevitably have

a hit anyway, it's like people expect you to follow that up. And that's like an unrealistic thing for an artist like The Dead or Neil Young. You're totally right. I mean, like after your second record, the pressure of like, what was your most popular record, you think, to date? I don't know.

I actually don't know. Maybe that or the fourth one. You're 26, full of fucking... Yeah. And then the next record after that, not having the same effect in your brain because it was the same effect to your fans. Did that fuck you up? Yeah.

Yeah. And then you start to do this backwards math of like, well, what should I have done? What could I have done? Because you always hear these stories. And people like these narratives. I mean, I did an interview yesterday where like, oh, you're releasing your seventh record, like, when Pink Floyd did their seventh record, that was one record before Dark Side. So maybe your next one is going to be a masterpiece. Like, whoa, like that's ridiculous. Like, I mean, that'd be cool. But like, that's just every band has a different road to like the promised land. And I don't, I've stopped angling for that. I think on our third record, there was a part of me that was like, man, I was hoping for that, like, that that tune or that song or that that or that album that was going to take us from whatever venue we were playing. I think we were playing the Fonda in LA. So the Greek. And that didn't happen.

And I think I've stopped trying to follow that path. I've stopped caring about where that path is. Because the fact that it's 2020 now, we've been in band for 11 years and we're putting on our seventh record. It's like, that's a win. That's insane. That's like, no one gets to do that. No bands fucking stay around this long anymore, bro.

You and your homies have been kicking it for a long fucking time. And I'm going to give a shout out to Mazda. Let's go, bro. You and your homies have been kicking it for a long fucking time. I'm going to give a shout out to Mazda. Let's go, boys. Keep that dream alive. Go serious. Man, my question to you is, do you feel like having a kid and falling in love has put

less pressure on your brain to overthink success? Yeah, for sure. Because you start to realize what success really is. What is it um well that i think like like like peace of mind and and and right true connection and and and like obviously not everyone has to be married not everyone has to have kids but like but like wholesome connection with other human beings where and also like an acceptance of yourself and that's so

cliche but i think it's a fact like i know i have friends of mine that are like fucking stars like like very successful musicians and when i'm around them there's a little bit of like that anxiety and that fear of like how do i maintain this thing that i built and and it seems like and whatever i mean God bless those guys I love their music and I love them as people so it's not a it's I don't I don't I'm not I'm not trying to sound like I'm judging them um but I just see that like oh like their their bouts with anxiety and fear I have not been sorted out by their success I think we're going going through the same thing when we both allow ourselves to. And I suffer sometimes when a record's coming out.

I mean, especially with COVID. There was a moment where I thought I'm a year away from needing to go wait tables or something. It's just like, In your head, Taylor! It's crazy how we self-sabotage our dreams. Totally, yeah. But I don't think i'm an exception

like there's there's um there's like this this book where uh actors are interviewing actors and like robert redford not redford duval and robert de niro are interviewing each other this is back in like the 80s or something i think like after casino and like and they and one of them asked the other i forget who asked too um what's your biggest fear after you finish a film and the other one says like that'll never work again and the other one says me too and this is robert pinero i know it's crazy so i feel like this this this thing of like all of us fearing are like are in impending irrelevance like we all have a version of that it's just as much as like how much can we

like acknowledge it and get it under control and recognize like the bullshit that it is um or not do you think we need that to be great artists um i do think that there is a like a kind of fucked up relationship with ambition to be a great artist like i think you need to like because you know i can't control if i'm a better guitar player or or a better songwriter than the next guy um but i can control if i can't out hustle him yeah that is something i do have control over so i found for a long time like my my efforts towards wanting to be the best i could be would manifest as like write another song take another tour like i don't i don't give a shit we're singing we're playing for an extra 30 minutes like just that kind of attitude of like um just like yeah blind ambition and i and i don't think i think it's it's i think it's um

the opposite of like enlightenment like i think it's the opposite of like what it takes to like find peace of mind as a human being. But I do think it's a commonality among successful artists because I think like being an artist period requires a certain level of narcissism. You have to assume people get shit about what you have to say, which is a pretty incredible. You're totally right, bro.

You're totally fucking right. I never thought of it that way. No, it's so true. I mean, like, God, once we get out of our head, we need that. We need that to fuel it. But I also believe I'm the same way, Taylor, because I think I learned my hustle by living in Los Angeles. Really? Yeah, just being in front of all these people who scare the shit out of you.

All these labels telling you who the fuck they think you should be and like you haven't even what you you've listened to two minutes of my demo like what fuck you like yeah yeah yeah but i mean i've always loved that about la even though it hurts because uh you know if you and i were to move to like i don't want to name a place and bump people out but we we moved to some smaller town or smaller city. And we told people, guess what? Booked a tour. Going to go out for two weeks with my band in a bus and we're going to tour. I feel like your friends in a small town would be like, holy shit.

You're the best, biggest thing ever. That's amazing. And there would be so much celebration. And in that way, it would allow you to relax and be like wow you know i made it whereas in la like i could tell you like yeah man i just you know i just got hired to be in the new like coen brothers movie it's like the lead role and like your friends back cool man and like no so true dude because like we've all seen all versions of that and we all know okay i believe when I see it because it never happens.

And I'm not like it's not it's just back. It's not even like a cynical attitude. It's just like we all know we've all like it's all about how you maintain it and all about how well you do for yourself. And so sometimes like having all the friends that are just never impressed with anything and they all have this like we've seen it all kind of attitude. I feel like it's it's fueling, like you said, like it's like it's nice to be here because it keeps you motivated because it's never enough. Yeah. And the idea of never enough makes us want to keep creating. Yeah. Because this like you said, there's no plan B. I mean, the plan. Yeah. And I'm thankful we don't have a plan B or we would have done that plan B, you know? Absolutely.

If you make a plan B, you're going to live it. That's going to be your life. That's a good point. Yeah. Hey, we talked for 43 minutes. We haven't talked about the new record. Brian's going to be pissed. Let's talk about the new record here.

I love that we have the same manager. You're new with Brian. He's been with me for four years. He's the fucking best, dude. Yeah, I love him so much. He's so sensitive. He's a good guy. Let's talk about you got a new record coming out on the third right uh second friday second all right what do you what do you what are you talking about this it's actually not like in a weird roundabout way we've kind of been talking a lot about the

record because the whole thing's sort of about um kind of come into terms with adulthood it's the first record i made with um while being a married man and like and and and i guess like asking myself those hard questions of like do i still want to be getting on stage and acting like an 18 year old when at home i'm living a very different life like and how do i square that is that am i cool with that maybe the answer is yes and in fact it is like but i had to ask the question like i think um there a lot of the record is about like how do i like am like yeah like i you know when i'm around other people of my age like friends of mine that i went to high school with or or not i find that i i find myself in these conversations where they know so much more about like, just like money and how the world works and like, just like adult stuff.

And I'm like, wow, I don't know any of these things. And, and I think in a weird way, being an artist protects you from like growing up. And I, and I was scared that that was a bad thing.

And I think through the course of like writing the record, I realized like, that's actually something to be very grateful for. It's also a record about like, letting go of like my, my codependencies, like recognizing when like, I don't need to have an opinion. They know the one song is called none of my business. Another song is called good luck with whatever, like, there's a lot of that thing. Like, you know, it's not my place anymore to like, know what's right and wrong. And in fact, I feel like that can be oversimplifying.

Was it hard to change your attitude towards that when you've been like that your whole life? I think it happened gradually. I think like when I was like when I was younger writing songs, like it was, it felt really like, yeah, like back with like, like that we were talking about with narcissism, like assuming people give a shit. Like when I would write these, write like songs off our first two records, there's a lot of like heartbreak songs and kind of airing my dirty laundry of

like my relationships and stuff, just thinking like, why wouldn't people want to hear it? You know? And then as I gotten older, just slowly but surely being like i love those kinds of songs and i love writing those kinds of songs but i want to make sure that i'm doing in a way that feels like purposeful like and maybe that sounds annoying but

like but like just do it in a way that like offers something more than just like sad facts because like we all have that like um and so yeah sometimes i listen to a song and i'll want to cry and i'll be like i don't know if that was helpful like i don't like i like i i'm down to cry and think about sad stuff but like i just want there to be some sort of like offering along with the intel you know so like so so yeah so as i and i think that's just happened over time where now when i write and if i'm gonna go to those kinds of places i just i try to be mindful of like well what why am i doing this is there a reason or is it because i know how yeah and do when you're thinking about that whole telling the whole picture is that in a whole art of like a

piece of work or in a song in one song itself are you talking about a whole record you want to say something are you talking about from a a to b on the on a song i guess both like i love the idea that a record can have a like a an impression to it like a real like spirit like a like a thesis statement a mission statement um but i also that's something that i try to be mindful of within a song. Just try to make sure that even as one, if no one listens to the record and they only hear this,

that it just feels like it serves, it feels complete in of itself. Yeah, I feel that. Wow. Thanks for talking to me, Tay. You're the man, dude. Appreciate you. And I've always been rooting for you ever since, I mean, you grew up in LA, dude.

It's like the Lakers, dude, where I'm rooting for you. And I appreciate it. Very nice to meet you. I got one last question for you. I know you're not really down with legacy, but let's say you were. And what do you want to be remembered by? I guess I want to be remembered by? I guess I want to be remembered. I mean, that legacy part of my brain wants to be like, want to make 20 records as Dawes and have a whole body of work to show for it.

But I'd rather just, and I feel that way, but I think at this point in my life, the idea of people looking back and saying, that guy was pretty patient and pretty kind and pretty easygoing and a joy to be around. And he didn't start smelling too bad until he was super old. That would be great. You're on the right path. And thanks for being on the show.

And don't be too hard on yourself. You're a good guy. Thanks, man. Congratulations. Go Lakers. Let's fucking go, baby. be too hard on yourself. You're a good guy. Thanks, man. Congratulations. Go Lakers. Let's fucking go, baby. Talk to you soon, Taylor. Have a good one, buddy.

Later, bro. That was great. Taylor Goldsmith, everyone. Wow. Big band. Humble dude. Coming out of Malibu. Shout out to LA.

All right, guys. I'll catch you on the tail end with another Taylor. And we're going to talk about my love life. All right, here we go. Now, a message from the UN. Off your throne and leave your body alone Somebody must change And you are the reason I've been waiting so long Somebody hold the key But I'm near the end

I just ain't got the time oh and I'm wasted and I can't find my way home ooh

ooh ooh well I Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, I can't find my way home Well, I can't find my way home Yeah, well, I can't find my way home And I ain't find my way home. Yeah. And we're back. Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast. I'm Andy Frasco.

How's everyone doing? How's our hearts? Our minds? Are we staying out of trouble? Do I have to play the fucking music? Do I stay powerful? Our minds? Are we staying out of trouble? Do I have to play the fucking music? Do I? Stay powerful. Stay strong.

If you got addiction, stay away. Say no devil. No devil. That's all I got to say for that. I got a co-host tonight. I got Taylor Nicks, singer-songwriter from Dallas, Texas. We used to fuck. And she came to Dallas, Texas. We used to fuck. And she came to visit from Dallas to Denver.

And so I thought I'd bring her on the show and see how bad of a lover I am. Am I a bad lover, Taylor? First of all, I just want to say thank you for the intro. Happy to be here. We used to fuck. But you but you're the only one of the only girl and i mean not one of the only girls because i like i'm a respectful man right and but like we've we've had a friendship after we fucked right which is rare it's hard it's not for everyone why is it hard do you think to have relationships after vagina meets the penis?

Well, you know, let's just be catching feelings. I mean, men catch feelings, too. All the time, you know? So I think, you know, we're just rare birds like that. We can just tiptoe back and forth over a little. Do I have intimacy problems taylor absolutely yeah yeah i think what do you think i need to work on i mean all of us do to be fair you know like i wouldn't say you're the only one who's fucked up most people are fucked up or have intimacy issues

trouble with commitment i'm one of those people you know yeah 100 but I think what matters is that like you're either in therapy seeking awareness you know what I mean yeah uh but it's you know am I fucked up I don't know I'm not gonna be so bold to say you're fucked up I think you're lovable and I think uh I think you're gonna be just you don't have to be Oprah on my show aww well I'm trying to lift you up you don't have to lift me up on this show

no I don't think you're fucked if you're fucked up I'm fucked up so why do you think why do you think we can't keep relationships um because we haven't

either we haven't like dealt with the right shit on our own terms yet pass me that wine we're drinking we're drinking we're talking about this shit we're drinking tell us uh tell our friends the the kind of wine we're drinking here we're drinking a nieva york pet not some bubbles uh benny and zoids wines from denver nice stuff nice

little plugs yeah but it's from new york but yeah go ahead and plug that thank you um why do you think uh we can't keep relationships yeah why because we're not we're not meant to yet i think every like everything timing wise is divine and we have other shit to be dealing with you fucking the neighborhood too in the neighborhood do i like are you are you hooking up oh in my neighborhood you? In the neighborhood? Do I fuck people? Are you hooking up? Oh, in my neighborhood. You fucking? Yeah.

Multiple people? A couple. Yeah. I like to switch off. Yeah? Yeah. What do you like about having multiple people? It doesn't require me to get too emotionally deep with any one person.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. What do you think? Because I can keep it a little surface level, you know? If I only see you biweekly, then, you know, it's just like a, it's transactional. Okay, so when you do that, it's fine. When men do that, is it?

Fine as well. It's fine as well. Yes, absolutely. So why do we have to put characteristics on intimacy? Why can't we be intimate with more than just one person? Well, I think communication is usually lacking. So you're not being honest,

right? Either you're not being forthcoming about what you are expecting or your partner is not being forthcoming about what they're expecting. Either they're telling you like, yeah, I'm totally fine with this transaction, but really they're hoping that they can lock you down and make you want to get married. Like that's not accurate or, you know, very fair communication. That's obviously a huge lack of manipulation. Yeah, essentially. fair communication that's obviously a huge manipulation yeah essentially so you know you you're setting yourself up for failure essentially because you're not communicating how can you tell

when people are lying shouldn't people just be honest if they're trying to be should be intimate with somebody yeah it should be but obviously but are you honest sometimes not all the time what's the shadiest thing you've done? Shadiest thing I've done? Yeah, like with a man. I mean, besides lie to him? Yeah. That's pretty much, I think that's as shady as it gets,

is to lie to somebody. Yeah. So why do you think we need to lie to keep a relationship? Well, we lie to protect ourselves from- Put the microphone close to your mouth. Some kind of- Thank you're welcome we lie to protect ourselves from being vulnerable probably you know from like actually having to be super honest with ourselves and with somebody else um i think where you can get into good transactional relationships when both of you

know exactly what the other person desires from the relationship and like doesn't have any expectation to exceed that or change that in any way so it's like for us for example you know we can appreciate and love each other as people and not have those added expectations not that we're still fucking but no you know what i'm saying that we in the past neither of us had unrealistic expectations you know what i mean yeah i came in i came into your life like a bat in hell right you did too same do you have expectations did you want to be my uh girlfriend um i think i was interested in you as a person like i don't think i had an agenda per se but i think that i enjoyed our chemistry and our banter and like the general honesty and friendship did i bail after we had sex uh bail as in like become distant yes yeah

yeah yeah yeah i'm sorry about that that's okay it's an intimacy thing yeah i still don't know i don't i don't think i understand intimacy well do you uh i'm like I think I do I have been intimate successfully you know like in relationships and I have experienced a close level of trust and honesty with somebody else like where I felt completely comfortable with them you know physically emotionally mentally so yes I do know what intimacy is and like I've experienced it but at this stage of my life I'm not sure what intimacy real intimacy looks like I'm kind of either not ready for it or not seeking it out I kind of rely on the superficial nature of I kind of rely on the superficial nature of kind of... Intimacy, like the idea of intimacy. The idea, yeah.

I just like to keep the room light right now. That's circumstantial to where I'm at in life. So I'm like not into commitment. I'm kind of afraid of it right now. Kind of not making sure anybody knows I'm really not seeking that out. But that being said, that kind of attracts making sure anybody knows i'm really not seeking that out but that being said that kind of attracts people that like i'm sure guys experience this all the time like the more

you're like oh i don't want a relationship the more people come out of the woodwork wanting to change that about you yeah and that's like that's a scary that's not a fun place to be in well i kind of told you that story about getting peed on a couple nights ago you know you did and i'd love for you to dive into that once again for our listeners i think it's so i went on a date with somebody and i got um let's say something nice about her first before we let you sweet okay good sweet okay sweet she's got really drunk and uh happens to the best of us yeah and one thing led to another we we hooked up and stuff and then yeah she thought she was uh orgasming and she peed she thought she was all over me squirting all over the place and and then i you know sometimes like a little thing like that will kind of

and then i you know sometimes like a little thing like that will kind of um in my head like ruin everything in everyone's head i think in everyone's head that would ruin everything i don't know maybe not maybe some people are cool with like having accidents happen maybe people like to be peed on. Yeah, well, I think it's deeper than that. I think we are looking for a perfect something. And this is why we can't commit. You think it's perfection that we're after? I think it's the impossible we're trying to catch. You think? I don't know.

I don't know about you, but I think with me sometimes. As far as a person or an experience? Okay. Because if something is going to deflect me from doing my dreams and stuff, then it's got to be a fucking unicorn. Yeah. and stuff then it's gotta be a fucking unicorn yeah but am i just making my standards too high and i need to get that out of my head that no one's perfect yes yeah i think honestly what it is for me i can't really speak to your fucked up issues i can't really only speak to my own,

but I think that it's hard for me to truly love somebody else because I have a hard time truly loving myself sometimes. And I don't think I can actually see someone else as like, okay, you're good. If I'm never fully...

Okay, I hear you. You know what I mean? It's like I don't give myself a break. It's hard for me to be like up to my own standards of perfection. So how could somebody else ever possibly measure up either? So maybe we just hate ourselves. It's like a self love thing. I think.

So you don't think we love ourselves enough to be loved? Correct. It's like. Fucking sad. Yeah. So that's why the work really requires us to go inward before we can ever so what how do you go inward meditation all right journaling not enough of that no come on i'm fucking serious i hear you about that that. How do you go inward? You have to ask yourself some tough questions

and actually give yourself a little time to respond. Maybe write those responses down. Kind of like when you say something out loud, it becomes more real to you than it did before. But sometimes you don't actually articulate how you feel. So when you're telling someone else, it might be the first time you're ever saying certain things out loud or coming to terms with some of your own feelings is when you actually articulate them and hear them out loud. So I feel like the same thing is true about journaling.

If you're not going to be talking to someone, paying a therapist or a friend to listen to you, then you got to be doing some other kind of homework. It's called, you know, self esteem. It's esteem of the motherfucking self. You know, you got to do your own work and like look out for your star player. and look out for your star player. But if you're not willing to invest that time, you're going to be probably lonely for at least a little while longer. You know what I'm saying? Do you think I could live like the Leonardo DiCaprio life and just be single until I'm 50?

You could, sure. You can do anything you put your mind to. As my friend, do you think no as my friend you think that would make me happy no no no i don't i think that you'll i think that if you allow yourself to go inward and like examine some things about yourself that might be blocking you from connecting with somebody on a really deep level um maybe trusting somebody else like on a really deep level like trust it yeah you're right i don't trust anyone i know i know people that i mean like yeah i know i know that about you and i think that there are people in your life that have proven themselves to be trustworthy

but you know maybe if you spend a little time focused on you and actually doing some of these harder tasks like meditating you know what it is I think I trust people

with everything except my heart. Yeah. Honestly, some guy will tell me, here, drink this. Yeah, I'll drink it. Right. Or eat it. Yeah, I'll eat it.

Yeah. Or like, you know, but like, you know, here, I want to tell you something intimate. Like, whoa. Whoa. Hold the phone. Calm down. Calm the fuck down. Yeah.

I mean, same. Oh, hold the phone. Calm down. Calm the fuck down. Yeah. I mean, same. I just went on a fucking stupid date with somebody that I'd never met before. And I'm like, oh, sure.

I'll come share a home with you. Fucking Taylor went. I got to tell this story. She got flewed out. Taylor got flown out to basically a dick appointment. Yeah. A glorified nature. You knew that this this is gonna be a booty call no actually i was fully prepared for it to not be but taylor i mean do i know myself i know you're trying to

be sweet right now but come on you didn't know that i had a dude wanted dick i'm sure well he didn't want a dick the dude wanted a vagina he wanted yes yes i knew what he wanted but i wasn't i did not feel obligated to provide let me put it that way however you know a woman has needs and given the right circumstances and you wanted a vacation you know i wanted a vacation more than i wanted the dick to be completely honest i had dick at home that was doing just fine for me but i wanted to go to colorado so when someone said hey let me fly you out to come hang out for a weekend did i jump at the opportunity yes you called me the day after saying get me the fuck out of here.

I sent you the eyeball set. She's over it. So why? Okay. But that's what I'm saying. I was saying I'm willing to take this risk and trust this person with my life, essentially, that they're not going to chop me up into a bunch of million pieces. But when he was wanting to cuddle and kiss me in the middle of the night I was like that's where I draw the line

sir I don't trust you for all that okay so you'll just like a fuck but you don't want intimacy I do but I won't give that to just anybody I don't even try that with just anybody but you fucked this dude on the day one

that's not intimacy that's a transaction yeah it's transactional it was transaction for me we want what we don't have at the present moment yeah yeah like we have i think we i don't i think we have what we need probably right now i think that timing is divine i think that we'll be ready to have what's meant for us like when we're ready like we're just not ready right now and that's okay it's okay that you're 32 33 you're about to be 33 yeah um i think that when you're ready for that you'll know that you know what i mean i think when i'm ready for that i'll know that i think i need to do more soul work i think you probably could benefit from a little bit of going inward you know maybe doing maybe doing mushrooms by yourself i do that all

the time you do that's good i think that's a good practice i think i do that when i'm trying to like dive a little deeper with myself and address some like shadow cocaine no no no arrow no no uppers at all no wow taylor taylor nicks man it's fucking hard yeah i gotta admit i had a little relapse uh on my vacation yeah not a relapse but i did coke for a couple days i've been tempted to do cocaine i did honestly i did somali recently but i haven't done cocaine or adderall in 11 going on 12 months wow Wow. October 3rd. We're proud of you. Thank you. Thanks for coming to the Ho Memoirs. Confessions. Confessions of a Ho. Podcast.

Episode 1. Thanks for being on the show again, Taylor. Thanks for having me, Andy. Do you think we'll ever get away from it? One day. Yeah? Yeah, maybe. All right.

I look forward to it. Have a good night. Good night. God bless. Good night. God bless. You tuned in to the third season of Blissful Blah at Andy Fresco's World Saving Podcast,

produced by Andy Fresco, Joe Angel, I'm Chris Lawrence. Please subscribe, rate the show on iTunes and Spotify so we can make this a worldwide phenomenon. For info on the show, please head to Instagram at worldsavingpodcast. For more info on blog or tour dates, head to andyfresco.com. Check out the new album, Keep On Keepin' On, or let any entertain you at a thursday night online shit show or at this crazy saturday night wanna dance with somebody

dance parties oh right summer season is here no festivals no music so instead of trying to keep the lip going and hoping to find some shitty patron born at juba gigs this summer i decided to reroute building closets and wardrobes build a tiny summer house and do some painting it will hoping to find some shitty paid trombone at JubaGigs this summer, I decided to re-route. Building closets and wardrobes, build a tiny summer house and do some painting. It will be October in no time. And yes, I sort of hate it compared to the wonderful life I live, but I'm also thankful that people trust my skills or my good looks or whatever. They have my back and I manage to make some money.

Big danger in this line of work actually, it pays a lot better than being a musician. All right, how are you doing? Making ends meet? Worried? No work? Putting on a virtual dance party every week? Let's make sure to carry each other, get one another's backs, keep each other safe, keep each other sane, keep each other healthy.

Let's unite, for it will be a long road ahead. See you next week.