Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast - EP 187: Ketch Secor (Old Crow Medicine Show)

Episode Date: August 30, 2022

Andy catches up with his long lost co-host, Nick over Zoom. Will the magic of their tea transfer over thousands of miles of internet tubes? Will Andy get thrown in jail for sharing his mushrooms?? Will Brian ever be proud of his boy Andy??? Most importantly, we got Ketch Secor of Old Crow Medicine Show on the Interview Hour! He is one of our favorite musicians and his intellect and musical prowess is astounding. Watch out, this one is a ZINGER. Follow us on Instagram @worldsavingpodcast For more information on Andy Frasco, the band and/or the blog, go to: AndyFrasco.com Check out Andy's new song, "Puff Break (Believe That)" on iTunes, Spotify  Get yourself some good medicine: ketchsecor.com Produced by Andy Frasco Joe Angelhow Chris Lorentz Audio mix by Chris Lorentz Featuring: Brian Schwartz Arno Bakker

Andy, it's Nick, just calling to say, man, I see you out there working hard. Looks like you're doing really good, selling shows out all over the place. I just wanted to call and say I'm really, really proud of you, and I beg you. Hey, it's Schwartz. I'm glad you didn't answer. I'm pretty fired up at the moment. I'm not happy with you. I, you know, my problem used to be making sure you didn't

take drugs from the crowd and do them on stage and thereby get arrested. And now I have to fucking tell you to not give drugs to the crowd? What kind of fucking world are you living in? I'm on the ambassador's page and I see you're handing out what looks like

mushrooms. I hope they were fake. Is that a thing? Fake mushrooms? I don't know. But Andy, I am not fucking joking. You cannot take drugs from the crowd and do them on stage. And guess what? You cannot take drugs that are already on stage and give them to the crowd.

You will get arrested and you will go to jail and then you will be fucking bumming and you will kneecap your entire career and you will not go to Japan and you will not go to fucking China and you will not go to Canada. And it's a bummer. We're working too hard.

You work your ass off. What the fuck? Who gives shit to the crowd? I've never seen this in my entire life. It's Andy. You got to rein it in. Can we clap? And we're live. Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast. I'm Andy Frasco. On location. And we have my co-host sitting in... What? Is that a lazy? You have a lazy boy at your house? It's like I have a couch with a recliner in the end of it, you know?

Wow. Look at that. Look what money brings people. Some people buy instruments. Some people buy lazy boys. How we doing, buddy? Doing great. I just got back from Secret Dreams. I'm hanging out with Kino now. That looked like it crushed. It crushed. Especially the electronic stage.

Yeah. It seemed like there was a shit ton of people there. For the first... I don't want to talk about... I'm pretty sure they definitely hit their goal for their first year. You know what I mean? Oh, for sure.

I don't know the exact number, but I know they sold over 7,000 tickets, which is pretty wild for a first-year festival. Let's fucking go, boys. That's what we're talking about. The Gerlach book. They got the Gerlach book. Oh, boys. That's what we're talking about. The Gerlach book. They got the Gerlach book. Oh, fuck. I am beat up. Once again, it seems like

you guys have been going hard as fuck lately. Oh, God. Seven shows in a row. Aren't any of them private? One was a private for Deep Eddie's. And one you bombed. And one I bombed, yeah. I was, what show? Oh, Cape Cod, I bombed.

That was the first time I bombed in a long time. Was that like a hard ticket show? Like, what was going on with that? It was a hard ticket show. It was a Sunday on the Cape. It was just kind of like, I don't know. It was kind of like. All the kids went back to school.

Yeah, it was like a bunch of old people. And no disrespect to old people, but I just wasn't landing anything. Nothing was landing. I got a couple claps from some songs. It was just really weird. But you do have old fans that go hard, too. You know what I mean? I know.

Maybe it was just an off day. Maybe it's just those Cape Cod rich people, and they don't want to let loose. I don't know. It definitely humbled me me i would love to see you bomb i have never seen you bomb before it's got to be hilarious i've only seen like 800 people carry you on their shoulders like you just won the super bowl i've never seen you bomb before it sounds awesome yeah it was definitely a humbling experience um you know when you when you're on a a roll and all of a sudden you have a shitty show. And I was just in my head and I was like, damn, do I still got it? I'm like, oh, I needed this.

I needed to learn from this. It's good for you. It's good to bomb. I think it is good to bomb. Oh, definitely. Every comedian says it's like, first of all, it's the worst thing that ever happens to him and the best thing that ever happens to him. Here's the thing about you hecklers out there. If you really want to get back at a comedian instead of heckling them, just sit in silence.

I think that would affect them way more. Don't you think that's true? What would you rather hear? I would almost rather be booed than have no reaction. Yeah, you're right. I would rather have someone go, you piece of shit. You went too far. Well, at least I did something. You know what I mean?

I wasn't making everybody chant drugs at Secret Dreams during my set. It was so funny. Oh, I got yelled at too. I guess there's a video flying around the Fro Ambassadors of me throwing mushrooms in the crowd hey and quick uh quick message to the fro ambassadors we love you let's not narc on andy guys let's keep it to a let's keep it to a fan relationship we don't need to be sending brian videos and

narcing on andy or there will be no ambassadorship left to engage in. It's going to be Andy's real estate company. You want to be able to get a real estate license. Oh man. Cause we were already, you know, he was already, you know, pissed that we're having a bender, you know, we've been on a bender, but have you guys been bending? We've been bending a little bit, bending a little bit. Yeah. That I like that. Oh yeah. About, about you guys though. Binging whenever you guys are in one place, which you were in one and Nantucket for a week, you know, it's going down, you know, it's going down to the fresco boys. You can't, you can't have that being a one place for a week and a luxury like vacation spot of all places.

You're right. We were keeping it. We stayed at the studio all week. But yeah, we were ripping mushrooms all day and having IPAs. That's healthy. I think mushrooms, I'm pretty sure they're healthy at this point. You know, that's the thing I was thinking about too. I guess I could get in trouble for throwing mushrooms in the crowd. You could.

Definitely, you could. I could go to jail for a long time, you think? I'm not a lawyer or anything, but it just depends on what state you're in, I guess. Maybe in Colorado, you might not, because I think they're decriminalized here. But where were you, Massachusetts? They're pretty chill about drugs, actually. So I don't know. No, we were in Rochester, New York.

Oh, well, they got way bigger things to worry about there than some Jewish guy throwing mushrooms. George was like, cops listen to music too, Andy. Do they they though? I don't know. They're not listening to me. Can they hear it over the sounds of their fists hitting? Nevermind. Shut the fuck up.

Come on. Come on. Come on. Come on. Come on. Chill, chill, chill, chill, chill, chill, chill. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding.

Just riffing over here, guys. I don't. Anyway. Memphis is fun. What was it? I'm in Memphis right now. Was Rochester the show you... the festival you did with Lettuce?

No. That was... We did our own outdoor festing in a farm. And they're fucking... I was worried because it was like the fourth time we've been in that area. And we still brought like 700 people. Let's fucking go. They love us up there.

You're good for 700 in Rochester. Let's fucking go. They love us up there. You're good for 700 in Rochester at this point. Let's go. I like it. Take note, promoters. That means you should be getting at least $14,000 guarantees at festivals in that area. $20 times 700. Speaking

of shows, Repsy.com. You haven't done the pitch in a while. Why don't you do the Repsy pitch? I've been following Repsy.com. You haven't done the pitch in a while. Why don't you do the Repsy pitch? I've been following Repsy. It looks like they're blowing up a little bit. I've been seeing all these crazy frat parties. They've been

advertising this. They have the South on lockdown right now, especially if you're a party band. Like 10 years ago, you're not where you need Repsy right now. 10 years ago, you're a little like, you don't really, you're not where you need Rebsi right now. 10 years ago, this would have been perfect for your brain. We would have fucked. I wish we knew Rebsi 10 years ago. Cause we would have played all

those frat parties. So, so if you look up to the frass, Andy Frasco in the UN and that's the kind of career path you want, I would sign up for Rupsy right now. Let's go. Wait, I'm just being funny. That's a good pass. You guys are touching it right now. You're right. We are. I was surprised. I was worried about all these turnouts being shitty. They've been fucking killer. Every turnout's been killer.

I was going to say, you were whining and crying and complaining a month ago about how these shows aren't doing well. Every time I go online, there's a fucking huge crowd of people. Ryan Dempsey's laying down in the grass drunk or something. I don't know. I interviewed Dempsey. We're putting that

out next week with his wife. She's seen aliens too. Of course. You can't marry someone who sees aliens and not believe in aliens. That doesn't work. That's like being a different religion or something. Some to some things have to cross over you know anyway back to repsy back to band if you're a comedian if you're a magician sign up they'll get you gigs here's the

thing you have literally nothing to lose it's just like a personal injury attorney you don't pay them unless they get you some money okay same thing and thing. And if you already have an agent, they're not going to double your fees. So you're good here. Just sign up. The worst that can happen is you are where you are right now. But from what I've been seeing on their Instagram, you're going to crush it and definitely make more money. So sign up. That was a great pitch. I'm going to clap to you. Yeah. I've been working on my marketing. clap to you yeah i don't work on my marketing how's dinner you miss me yet uh i it does get a little boring without you around i like to talk to you on this podcast yeah it's great i i was thinking we've never done it over zoom isn't that insane because we have the whole pandemic and everything i know well you know we're attached

to the hip now i was like oh yeah I thought something was up. I thought your Twitter account got hacked when you were saying how much you appreciated me. I love doing that to people. Every once in a while, I give you a little something to hold on to. I was like, who the fuck is this guy? Especially on the Disco Biscuits fucking Twitter page, which was

even more funny to me. I know. I made it funnier. Anytime I can be sincere with brownie in between NFTs. It's good. Every once in a while, I got to throw you a bone. It's Tuesday. Usually, you're pretty

depressed on Tuesdays. Yeah, it's true. You haven't gotten paid. It's the farthest day between paychecks. It's Tuesday. Usually Saturday is your last gig and then your next one is Thursday. Usually.

You guys are on a grind right now. Dude, it's non-stop. We're making money. You are making money, which is nice. Remember the days when you used to grind like this and lose money? Yeah. Yeah.

That wouldn't happen if you had Repsy back then. Every big band I talked to was on salary. Yeah. I mean, that's the way to do it. It's better for taxes, I think, too. Oh, man. I'm getting fucked up the ass with taxes, dude. You're going to vote for Ron DeSantis

in the next election, aren't you? Just pay some taxes alone. Jesus. It was just like one thing after another. Low dopamine from this bender. The fucking Schwartz legit yelling at me. Like legit yelling at me about the drug thing. I know. You sent me his voicemail.

Yeah, I think I'm going to play in the front. You're mad. I think I might play in the front of this episode, but he was fucking pissed. And then... Dude, he sounded 6'2 in that voicemail. I'm already in the doghouse, dude. I'm trying to get out of the doghouse.

Hell yeah. Just like... Bonjorno never yells at you for partying. No. Bonjorno doesn't. Shout out to Bon. Thank you. He understands me. Not like I'm doing it on purpose.

Kind of, but you know. Drugs in the cat. Were you high on edibles? Yes. Dialed in gummies. Those things get me rocking, dude. Hell yeah. I've been mowing those down. How many have you been taking? I do in like 3 or 4 nights

I'm holding on to these year cans from the last shipment with my dear life trying not to eat them oh you know what you could do you could go into my house tomorrow I have like 10 cans I have 3 cans I'm holding for you oh sick

I got about 10 cans. And I can't... I mean, I ran out on tour. So this is the first week. And you can't ship them. That's illegal. But Dialed and Gummies. Grab some Dialed and Gummies.

Another sponsor. The best. Keith, you're the best. Keep rules. They signed up for another four months of the podcast. Oh, yeah. We're back. Oh, yeah. We're back.

We're back. We said we are fucking gummy slingers. Bro, they are flying off the shelf. They're flying. People have been sharing me when they buy them and stuff now. Me too. The fall, we're going to have a world-saving podcast gummy collab with them. We're going to make some. We've got to figure out what flavor we want to do.

Should we do a nasty flavor? What about marshmallow or something weird like that? I would like... The sweet ones are just so good. Yeah, candy is so good. I love candy. I fucking love candy, too. I lost eight pounds. Look at, too. I lost eight pounds.

Look at my body. I lost eight pounds. I know. Don't I look skinny? You do look skinny. From what? I don't know. I'm just, you know, when I'm on the road, I lose that 15 pounds to the freshman. I just don't really eat.

It's weird because there's carbs in those drinks you'd be drinking. I'm not drinking beers that much. I'm only drinking Jameson. Yeah. But the great thing about mushrooms, I've been taking mushrooms every day. And the great thing about that is I don't really drink that much on them. I like the natural energy that mushroom gives me. Also, the mood lift.

The mood lift is good for me. Yeah. I've been dealing with a lot of personal shit, too. the natural energy that mushroom gives me also the mood lift the mood lift is good for me yeah i've been like dealing with a lot of personal shit too and like oh that sucks yeah it's just been so it's i've been like in a real sad mood so like the mushrooms i've been taking um they've been really helping me so that's good they're they're good for that yep so get yourself some dialed in gummies and um get yourself on a mushroom regimen if you're feeling sad microdose mushrooms i'm telling you it makes you feel better i know everyone has their own things about you know you know pitching drugs and shit but

for me psilocybin is the way to go so if you're feeling sad go get some psilocybin yeah in your body right you don't like it you don't have to do it again yep oh man i'm going to barcelona tomorrow barcelona why does everyone say with the th because because that's like the barcelona accent of the spanish language that's how they say i'm going to barcelona they're like barcelona barcelona yeah yeah it'll be good shout out the virgin voyages for giving me my friends a free trip that nick did not want to go to i'm like you fucking dumbass why didn't you want to i'm working what are you doing i'm working all that week so i'm going on a vacation guys so um oh yeah don't bother me nick you could

bother me i don't know if uh i don't bother you very much i you could bother me. I don't know if... I don't bother you very much. I know. It makes me sad because I miss you. I'm out here alone in these streets. Just text me first and I'll chat it up with you. I don't like to bother people when they're working. I know.

Speaking of that, I got to get the sound check. Oh, yeah. This was short and quick, but... Actually, I don't think it was as quick as you think it was 15 minutes pretty good we got catch from Old Crow Medicine show on the show

hell yeah I remember I researched him he's so smart I felt like a fucking idiot because he's just too smart dude he's just he's like he went to school with like the guy, I'm not going to say his name, but the Z word. We don't say his name.

From the F book word. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We don't like saying his name. He went to Harvard? He went to like prep high school with all these geniuses. Damn. And he wrote that Wagon Wheel song, or he wrote half of it at least yeah he made that he's made he made that money baby let's go that's remember how big that song was huge and then um

darius rucker just re-recorded and then he just you know probably made more money on the shout out shout out to writing good songs hell yeah that's a good way to make passive income i know i'm hoping this new we're almost done with this record i think it's a good way to make passive income i know i'm hoping this new we're almost done with this record i think it's really good we just put one out an hour ago i know because i'm fucking you know you're a workaholic i'm a workaholic and um maybe that's why i'm so tired i'm just using my brain on both sides of the spectrum and then trying to have fun with this band music thing because if you don't have fun with it and you just let the business side just take you

then it fucking sucks. Yeah. Hey, don't get into music for the money unless you want to work with Repsy. They might help you. Yeah, here's my motivation. Don't get into music for money because you're just going to get let down. It takes a while to make money

and for how much work you put into it, you're never going to feel like it's enough. So you have to take a step back and realize it's for the art. It's for the art. All these musicians out there who listen to this podcast, a ton of them, don't worry about it. Money will come, but do it because you love music. And I'm falling back in love with music.

Hell yeah. Music's tight. I've been writing. I'm feeling good. I'm ready to go to Barcelona for a couple weeks. And then I got to fly to Canada for two shows.

And then we go to Sea Here Now in Asbury Park. Then I fly back to Europe for our fucking european tour i'm going to that and you're coming with me buddy this is gonna be fun are you excited for that i think so i'm getting there a month away i know that's how i felt about this barcelona trip i wasn't excited about it until now i'm leaving you know in two days or three days and that'd be cool right how far is that flight um it's only from new york it's only eight hours eight hours that's not that bad it's not bad yeah it's good so it'll be fun um and then i got three days in barcelona until we hit

and then we're doing like the the island hop on the virgin cruise and i gotta be a social media i'm a i'm i'm an influencer for 10 days nicholas on a cruise ship they really know you speaking of the old people demographic it's an all it's a it's an adult cruise i wonder if they have like some freaky shit like some like oh definitely like that's what half the people reason people go to cruises is to have gang bangs i think i'd be tight i've never been in a gang bang maybe i'll do be in a gang bang hmm i feel like that would either go really well or really poorly for you you know who's been on a tear actually i can't even say it. Let me guess. Who? Will you bleep it out? Yeah.

Yes. Bro. I'm impressed. And he is getting ass. And it is awesome. You know, he's having fun. He's having fun. He's got that, like, energy to him where girls just, like, want to be around him, you know?

I know. It's like multiple threesomes. What? Yes. How do you even? But a couple of them were just these one-night stands. I'm like, God, let's fucking go, my guy. We said we weren't going to say it.

We said his name at least seven times. I got to go. I got to going to say it. We said his name at least seven times. I got to go. I got to go to soundcheck. But Nick, I love you. Your favorite, soundcheck. Oh, yeah. I've been trying to be a team player lately. Oh, you've been actually going to soundcheck?

Yeah, every night. I missed two soundchecks because I'm getting tired. It's like you don't have to go to line check, but you can go to sound check. It's the very last 10 minutes. I feel bad for Bo. Bo's kicking ass. Jason has been on vacation for like four days. So Bo is like doing the load out by himself.

Oh, my God. Shout out to Bo. Bo's killing it. Yeah. Yeah, he is really good at that, it. Yeah. Yeah. He is really good at that actually. Yeah.

All right. I don't say what, if he got another real quick, if he got another job after you, like another tour manager job, like any job would be easy. You know, he's ready for any job now, basically.

Yeah. After managing you guys. Oh yeah. He was tour managing one band. I'm not going to blast it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Right. Yeah. He was like, this band is so fucking boring. I'm like going to blast it. He was like, this band is so fucking boring. I'm like, yeah, boy, we tainted you. You'll never. You got to go.

I got to go. All right. Nick, I'll talk to you this week. Yeah. And yeah, be safe. Have fun. And yeah, out there. I love you and I miss you.

Take care, everybody. You're not going to say it? I love all of you except for Andy. I'll talk to you guys later. I'm ending this. Goodbye. We're saving it for the brand. All right.

Later. Later, bro. Bye. Later. Get out of here. All right. Next up on the interview hour, we have Ketch from Old Crow Medicine Show. Yes.

I love this interview so much. Not only is he a genius, but they are one of my favorite bands of all time. I saw them play about 14 years ago at Hangout Fest, and I was hooked ever since. The energy, the songwriting, the whole nine. It's just perfect. So ladies and gentlemen, hey Chris, play some Old Crow Medicine Show while we're pimping out catch. He's

brilliant, brilliant songwriter. Great front man. He's got it all and I can't wait for you to hear this interview. Alright, ladies and gentlemen, next up on the interview hour, Old Crow Medicine Show. the interval or old crow medicine show every time i kiss you girl tastes like pork and bean even though you're wearing those uptown high heels i can tell from your giant step You've been walking through the cotton field

Oh, you're so down Homegirl I've been looking forward to this one for a while. And I'm thankful that someone reached out to make this happen. Ketch, how you doing, buddy? I'm doing great. I'm glad someone reached out to make it happen, too, because I got to meet you. Yeah, I've heard, you know, you're one of the first reasons why I play music.

Just FYI. I've heard really a hundred percent, man, your live show and how you, I saw you play maybe at hangout fest seven years ago, 10 years ago. Oh, sure.

And down in Alabama, right down in Alabama, you're doing this side show and And I was working for Spin Magazine. And I saw you perform. And you were one of the greatest front men I've ever seen. And it inspired me to do what I'm doing now. So I just want to say thank you. Well, man, I'm glad to do it.

I watched some great front men in my life. And heard them on the radio. And watched them on film and on stage, but mostly on television and modeled my whole shtick after what I saw. And so I'm glad to pay it forward. And now you get to go up there and break a sweat, hopefully not an elbow. Let's talk about that first before I heard you don't have a smartphone or a laptop. Well, that's how I was when you saw me at the... What's it called? Up until about...

Oh, I guess the... I got a smartphone right before the pandemic. And it was the best choice ever. It's kind of like I just started smoking in my 40s. You know that feeling of like... God, where have you been all my life? Yeah, exactly. This is great.

But I'm so glad I didn't start when I was 12. Instead, it's the other way around. I did start smoking when I was 12, but I didn't engage in screen time, social media dysfunction until I was 40 something. And I think that's smarter because I feel like we get way more addicted to the social media than we would of smoking cigarettes.

No, I disagree. Yeah. I mean, for me, it wasn't smoking cigarettes. It was chewing tobacco, which I also started doing when I was 12. And once I started chewing tobacco, God, it's like, just, I never wanted to quit that. I would have died doing that, but I've since stopped. And I've since started doing social media, but I could take it or leave it. Moderation is one of those things that's like an elusive dance partner. You're always trying to make sure that she is top of your dance card.

Yeah. And how hard is it to have moderation in your life, Ketch? Well, I work in bars for a living. I go to bed about four o'clock in the morning and that's normal. But there's other aspects of my life that keep me straight and narrow, like I have children. And I'm a community activist in Nashville, Tennessee, and I'm involved with all kinds of things. And so I have a professional hat that I put on sometimes. But even when I'm wearing my professional hat, I'm still doing it like a tobacco-spitting front man with a violin tucked under my elbow. It's true. And you know, let's talk about that. You know, 12, you know,

12 years old getting all these things thrown your way, like cigarettes and chewing tobacco. Tell me about your childhood a little bit. Where are you from? And I thought, aren't you from Canada? No, but I'm, I'm, I'm so touched that you say that. No, but I'm so touched that you say that. My resources are too exhausted to even bear mention how glad I am that you said that. But no, I'm sorry about that. I digress. I lived in a whole bunch of different states. By the time I was a fifth grader, I lived in five states. And that's when I had moved to Virginia. And that's where I think of myself as being raised, even though there was a real kaleidoscope of other places when I was a smaller kid, including Louisiana, St. Louis and New Jersey and Missouri. But once I got to Virginia, things really kind of stabilized and my family quit moving. And that's where I learned a passion for music. But really, it started in community theater and in plays in school. I just wanted to be up on a stage and memorize my lines. And I really wanted to kiss the girl at the big end of the show.

Well, that's perfect. I mean, in that sense, maybe you got adjusted to traveling so much because growing up, you were traveling so much. Yeah. And as soon as I was of age, too, or even before when I was about 14 or 15, I would just ride the train everywhere. And that's when I first played on the street corner. I went out to work in this commune type of place where they lived in teepees and grew a lot of different things, including vegetables, which we sold at the farmer's market. This was out in Washington state. So I took the train out there and the summer I turned 15 or 16. And that was, um, when I first played on the street corner, it was, it was, um, I had about 12 hours to kill in Chicago

before the, the, um, before they put the double decker trains on. Cause you know, when you go West, you got to stop at Chicago first. Yeah. What did you like about being on the train? Well, I've been on the train since I was a kid. We always chose Amtrak, and we happened to live in a bunch of Amtrak markets when we were kids. So none of my peers ever rode Amtrak. But to me, it was the most normal thing in the world to go out of your way to drive to a train station at 2 o'clock in the morning to catch a train with your mom and dad and your sisters. Fucking cool, man. What did your parents do growing up?

They were teachers. They are teachers. They're retired. They're both alive. Happy, healthy 70-somethings. They were born and raised in Toledo, Ohio. And dad was always pretty nostalgic, dude. He was always talking about the past.

pretty nostalgic dude. He's always talking about the past. He's always talking about his German Omar who lived at the Plaza Hotel in Toledo, which was basically federal housing. But he made it sound like it was a turkey dinner every night, even though she was probably eating out of cans and smoking generic cigarettes. Do you think that's who taught you how to be a storyteller? think that's who taught you how to be a storyteller i think my dad my dad always said he wanted to go into radio i mean my dad is a is a is an elementary school principal so you know my dad is very like girls and boys you know he's very articulate and has a voice that has that draws you in and makes you feel because when you're in the school business it's kind of like country music your demographic is mothers and not older mothers yeah yeah it's it's like uh you know 29 to 49 year old white women that's who country music has decided is the demo they need to serve that's who everyone is serving ask darius it's true. So it's actually, you're spot on about that.

What is it about country music that older women become so intrigued with? Well, it's a highly commercial format. And it's, you know, that's nothing new. It was that way when I was a kid, but it had much more of a connection to its older honky-tonk twang self. And nowadays, you might hear an artist occasionally who has a throwback, but oftentimes the throwback is really put on because throwback is kind of like a major on-brand thing for country music to do and has been you know since the whole genre got started i'm convinced that um that that suburban white housewives tend to be the demographic of country

music because um because country music is a really safe bet and country music prides itself on this quote-unquote accessibility but it's this kind of American's outdated sense of accessibility. Who has the privilege to access this? Suburbanites. Middle class. And then who else would like to access this but can't? And then you start exploring the sociology of the white South and also white rural places, and you see that the interplay between Trumpism and the fans of country music are, you know, bedroom buddies, right? Everyone wants to be successful. And if you don't have a hand on the, on the cultural ladder,

if your closest rung is a super Walmart, 25 miles away from your mobile home, you're want to hold onto that real tight. And you want to listen to the that real tight and you want to listen to the kind of music that makes you feel several rungs above that right if you know what i mean so why are we so fascinated with this illusion still oh man i i think it's just age old americana not in the genre sense not at all but in the in the in the ways that we like to tell ourselves the story to feel better about the harsh reality that it costs the price of this freedom, the price of becoming the leader of the free world and whatnot. It didn't come easy, and the life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness was not available to everybody.

Right. So now that it is kind of available, is the American dream dead? The old idea of American dream? Or is it kind of brought on something else? Well, that's a great question for us all to be thinking about in times like these. I think my answer would be that, no, the American dream is very much alive, but it's possible that it's being dreamed somewhere outside of America more successfully and with more passion and drive. Right. So why are we still believing? Why are we still believing in the illusion? Disney and Leigh Iacocca and Donald Trump and all those made- up stories about grandeur and rags to riches, man.

We just love that tale. I know. You know, I think of that in the music industry, too. When you think about when you first started music and stuff and like the idea, the dream was to like maybe, I don't know. Actually, you should tell me this before me, you know, analyzing something that you, what you're about to say. What was the American dream for music for you, Catch? I think it was really informed by Pete Seeger and Bob Dylan. Probably the most influential people in terms of my developing the kind of, you know, I can't remember if it's the id or the ego.

Do you remember which one of these we're talking about? Yeah, exactly. The ego. Okay. So, you know, in my egotistical construction of myself and the mirror of life, I wanted to be like Pete Seeger because I wanted to be a proletariat. because I wanted to be a proletariat. I wanted to speak for the people and to the people with the language that the people had created. But I also wanted to be like Bob Dylan, which was to say whatever you wanted

and be more of an iconoclast, like John Milton, like go wayward and be T.S. Eliot one day and P.T. Barnum the next and Jimmy Swagger three weeks after that. Bob got to shape shift and do a whole lot of things. Pete is an incredibly consistent performer. things pete is a incredibly consistent performer yeah it's fascinating because like you know you look at you know is is that a push and pull inside yourself of who you want to be the between the two egos let's say oh maybe um i think that it all probably happened when i was about 12 and i just

settled on the path that was unfolding. I'm not really wrestling with a should I, shouldn't I kind of thing. I've been in a band for 23 years. So I think that's, you know, um, an indicator of my confidence that I picked the right path. Um, but I, you know, that I'm here in my middle age years now and I'm like, hell, I can do whatever the hell I want to. I don't got to get on that bus and go to Philly to that damn radio convention. Yeah, it's true. So tell me about the path when you were 12 years old.

What was that path like when you first picked it? Well, I went upstairs to my attic because I don't know why. I went upstairs to my attic um because um i don't know why i went upstairs to my attic oh because my uncle had moved to the philippines uh to be a teacher and um and then all he brought all of his crap to our house and upstairs in the attic suddenly was all this new stuff and um and anyway i there were all these records all these records and these records were so cool, man. There was like Stevie Wonder at age 14. It was called Stevie Wonder's Greatest Hits.

The kid's greatest hits came out when he was 14. It's insane. There's nothing on it that you've ever heard. None of those songs are hits at all. But they were on Motown. They were on that label and they were in that marketing conversation that they must have had up there at the Motown building when they were on Motown they were on that label and they were in that marketing conversation that they must have had up there at the Motown building when they were like let's call it

as great as tents that's so true it's like so those are the guys that are inspiring you I mean seems like your parents were you know really deep into education I mean as I look you know later on in your life you were alumni at Phillip Exeter Academy. It's insane. Yeah, it was a really good high school experience.

So by the time I went away to school, I already had found the records. I already had found an old guitar. And then the other important thing that happened is that I'd already had a paper route, which meant that I had to get an alarm clock. And I happened to get the alarm clock that had an AM radio. And just like my dad grew up in a kind of illusion that the past was somehow saintly and beautiful, I did too. And so for me, listening to AM radio when everybody else was listening to Nirvana's Nevermind, not that I didn't listen to that also, but I also listened to a lot of like seed and grain reports from the great planes, you know, at, you know, at one o'clock in the morning on the AM dial, you could hear the whole country. And I was about 10 or 11 listening, tuning in. It just, I felt so connected with the, the, the traffic in Cincinnati and

Toronto. Everything was, I could listen to the radio in New Orleans Toronto, everything was, I could listen to the radio in New Orleans and St. Louis. It was all there. And anyway, so I got to high school and that's when I started to learn to play the banjo. So going to this like prestigious school and you telling your teachers and your,

you know, your friends and stuff that you wanted to play music, was that shone upon or did they want you to do something else? No, I mean, I think they... I was a scholarship student. I think being a Southerner, it was actually a kind of diversity for them. It was an extremely diverse community.

There were kids from all over the world. I mean, lots of international kids, lots of kids from Asia, lots of kids from the Middle East, lots of European kids. There were kids from Africa, and then kids from all over the United States. I went from the poultry processing capital of the world, where I was in middle school, to this elite boarding school lineup on the seacoast of New Hampshire. So it was a hell of a trade-off from like the polarized you know everything is black and white you work at the plants you don't work at the plants latinos come and work at the plants or they don't work at the plants or your middle

class or your upper middle class whatever so it was it was um i didn't find right immediately that i fit in to high school but but music and celebrate of becoming a Southerner while I was in New England kind of helped me sort of foment these insecurities and turn them into strengths. Like, I was different than everybody. And it never occurred to me to, like, have a twang or, like, wear overalls. But I did as soon as I was, you I was 14. And then I had dreadlocks. I learned a lot when I was up north. I went to fish shows and I saw the Grateful Dead and I went to all these Dylan concerts and all that stuff. But in my heart, I was always going to be a fiddler. Tell me about those years between 18 and 21 when you started developing your craft.

Were you busking then? Yeah, I was playing on a lot of street corners. And in the beginning, I had a couple of different bands, some from my hometown. I moved to Greensboro, North Carolina to get close to the music right out of high school. And then eventually I started Old Crow in Ithaca. But ahead of that, I was playing basically anywhere. I really enjoyed working in agriculture, you know, and I was really into the kind of confluence of music and ag. To me, it was like the same thing to, you know, like put in a really beautiful row of beans and watch them come up as it was to learn a song. Right. You know, and like i worked at a lot

of farmers markets so like i would always play at the market and i write little jingles about you know what i grew or you know if the lady that was selling sweet rolls across the way was real cute you know and i'd have my saw horses up there and i'd lean against them with my overalls on and my silly, like 18 year old awkwardness, newborn cult kind of attitude of, you know, smoking merit cigarettes and singing my songs. You know, when you talk about this mission, I feel like, you know, you say that, you know, Woody Guthrie was talking to you internally and stuff. What was Woody telling you during those years, beginning years of being?

Oh, just like, just everything I read, you know, I would read these books of his and, or study up on his songs or read, you know, Steinbeck or whatever he was reading. And I just feel like I wanted to be where those things were happening. I really wanted to be at the, um, at the site of, uh, of, um, an uprising. And I wanted to be at the site of a, um, uh, of hard scrabble people scratching out a living. I wanted to explore traditional life pathways and see what was left. Cause I knew that, you know, I read a lot of books that were from the 70s in which the back to the land movement had really inspired a lot of literature and, you know, lifestyle changes. So like, I was super into communes when I was 18. I wanted to live on one. I had lived on one. I wanted to go to more. Intentional living was something that was, you

know, attractive to me. And when you look at where those ideas came from, they're really from the 1970s, late 60s, as a kind of result of the counterculture movement. And I always felt like a 60s kind of kid. So did you ever feel like you never wanted to be a sleepwalker? When you talk about living, you talk about living and like having a full purpose in life. life, so you're basing it on maybe people who just live life without having passion, without having drive, sleepwalking a little bit. Yeah, I definitely was never at risk of that. I can barely rest.

Yeah, I'm the same way. what's so important about living to you? Uh, you know, one thing is coming clear is that it doesn't last forever. And it's all you get. Right. So you might as well, like really live it up.

Yeah. You know, try and take your life and do, and give us as much to other people as you can enrich others and be you know generous and kind as much as you can because you only get this one crack at it so you know i just have a you know i'm not a i'm a person that's often like stopping to talk to children right sometimes the dads like yesterday i was i did this gig and then i was out in this mall this pedestrian mall this i was looking at this kid and

i just was like what a beautiful kid and then i saw the dad looking at me like i was some sort of freak and like putting on this real protective skin like puffed up as he like held his daughter's hand closer and like that you know i get that but you know i was just looking at that kid and thinking god isn't life beautiful look we start this whole thing out with all this wonder about what is this amazing world that we're living in where it rains right and the wind just feels so cooling oh my. Oh my God. Right. No, it's totally true. Do you ever, you ever in your career with your band, you know, like with that philosophy, sometimes we forget to do that to the people surrounding us.

Does that make sense? Do we ever regret any of the times not doing that with the, some of your band members? Uh, I mean, no, I mean, I was i i wish if i if i got any regrets about how it all went down it's a personal one that in my 20s particularly in early 30s i was just really really stressed out about this this lifestyle and gig and you know it was i was so worried i just could barely enjoy any any part of of what i was building very successfully for you know somebody that was going to play the fiddle for a living i was charlie chaplin you know like this is i don't know how you get better off than you know when you

can play the violin in cross-tuning and be a self-taught player and turn your journal entry songs into you know hits or anthems or whatever and travel the world i mean i don't you know like yeah maybe i could get like a second bus or like i could you know i could fill an arena or something but i I'm cool with where things are at. I just wish that I could have enjoyed the ride a little bit more, especially when it was so dicey. Yeah. Talk about those years when it was dicey. What was making you not appreciate the life? It was a really dysfunctional collection of human beings.

collection of human beings. It turned out that the people that I had assembled to help me do this mission, who are all in different parts of their own lives and journey, were not overwhelmingly a cast of characters who were going

to be able to pull off the mission forever. Now they might have for some time, or an intermittent in and out know in and out in and out kind of thing like right i'm in the band for a little while now i'm gonna go sober up or now i'm gonna go work on this stuff and then i'll come back and so there was that or there was just you know i mean from the minute we started the band there was somebody new in and somebody old out yeah so that part of it was just part of the evolution of it.

But yeah, interpersonal conflicts, I think were probably, if anything was going to sink us, it wasn't that we sucked or that we weren't going to get a big break. It was that we were going to self-destruct. Self-destruction was, epidemic in the old crow in the early two thousands. Yeah. Did it put pressure on you? Like, cause this is your baby. This is your dream child.

And to feel like it's hard to find a group of guys to envision the same thing you envision. It must've been overwhelming at times. Yeah. I always kept like a lot of, um, um, pots on the stove at the same time so and i'll often sort of keep things compartmentalized as a as the way my brain works right uh and so maybe i maybe i wasn't really sharing that with anybody i was just sort of taking it you know yeah maybe it's a shield

because the thing that you have so precious and that you cared about forever you didn't want it to be fucked up from someone who didn't care as much as you did yeah but i also didn't want to punish anybody for not feeling what i felt right uh and so some of the relationships, they just went on too long because I didn't know how to say, Hey, I think you might do better off doing your thing. Were you scared to say that? Oh yeah. Terrified.

Why? Um, well, it didn't seem like, uh, I don't know. I, you know,

it took me about, I guess about 35 years to say no to anything or anyone. Yeah. I mean, I said yes to some pretty untoward advances. Like what? What's the worst one that you still think about? um you know when you have that dream about you know when you have a dream in which you find yourself like going to a really dark or inappropriate place and you're like oh man i'm so glad this is a dream i would never have made this choice in reality right um you know i i you know i felt that i did make that choice in reality and

you know um sometimes found myself in a you know really compromised state you know whether it was sleeping out of doors with you know um in a sketchy situation with drug addicts, um, you know, I remember one time being in Buffalo, you know, it was a snowstorm and I ended up with, you know, in this, you know, needly kind of part of town and I was, I slept there to happen is because I made some friends. Yeah. You know, because I rode Greyhound. And, you know, I mean, I was 26 and people came up to you and I had a nice or good enough backpack. Yeah. So, you know, I just felt like I sometimes there were parts about my personality that had a little bit of a target. And yet I put it up there. Do you feel like you get taken advantage of a lot no no it's not like that it's just that i didn't know how to say no

until i was 35 yeah it's crazy man uh were you getting into like drugs heavily in your 20s no i mean not really i mean i was always around it, you know, had my own little bouts with, with it, but it wasn't ever something that I didn't have control of, but I, you know, I did have a drinking problem. Yeah. What, um, do you think that self-constructed, self-destructed, not constructed, self-destructed the band a little bit because everyone had their own addictions? Well, self-destruction was the issue with the early days of Old Crow, and everybody had their own way of making that manifest.

For some, it was to escape. For others, for some, like me, it was to escape the band. And for others, it was to escape. For others, it... I mean, for some, it was... Like me, it was to escape the band. And for others, it was to escape the demons and, you know, that they were hearing. Yeah. But everybody was looking to self-medicate and, you know, figure out how to cope with pain. Yeah.

And discomfort. Yeah. And, you know, it breaks my heart to think that you weren't comfortable in your own band. Why weren't you comfortable with those guys? You kind of talked about it a little bit, but

maybe we could talk about it a little more if you don't mind. Well, you know, I guess I didn't, I mean, it's really hard to go into it all and not be like, you know, super explicit about it. And I've sort of saved some stories. I've just kind of saved for myself to tell when I feel like, let me tell you one time I was working on this thing with Ken Burns called country music. And, and I said, Ken, why does the movie stop in 1999?

I mean, it's 2017. He said, Oh, cause I think it takes about 25 years to understand what happened. And I don't like to tell a story until I know it. And, you know, the news is in. And the, you know, the, you know, this is called literary criticism. The lit crit types.

So, you know, I'll be ready to tell those stories, you know, but they're still even hard for me now. Yeah. It's like a brotherhood, have you ever like had any public fights like on stage you ever used to beat the shit out of each other um no i think we kept things pretty much within the sphere of ourselves and our band community, which was troubling because it was so internalized. I don't think anybody knew.

I don't think my mother knew how unhappy I was. Yeah. Did you have a girlfriend back then or like a wife or anything that knew? Uh-huh. And I don't think she knew about it either. When did you guys start getting successful as a band? How old were you? Well, success always felt immediate because we were buskers. So, you know, we were starting without even a gig. So we'd go into a town, like say we'd play Ottawa.

We'd go into Ottawa, 1998. We'd go set up downtown, wherever there was some tourists or something going on. And by the time it was over, we'd have a case full of money. We'd all be about two, three beers in and we'd have a gig the next night because that's what somebody would have tipped us with was, hey, you guys should be on the stage. And so the success felt immediate.

And it was, you know, addictive isn't the word because it was just so beautiful. It was miraculous is what it was. Yeah. Yeah, it's beautiful. So do you feel like those are the best times of your life when you're busking with your band versus playing theaters and having a hit? No, I like it better now, man. Life's so much richer. There's so much happening and so many ways to shine my light and to be the recipient of the lights of other people around me and that of the world.

I mean, I love that it happens when it did. And I have wonderful memories of being a street corner performer. And, you know, I do it every night. It's the same act. It's where I learned how to do everything. Right. I'm a self-taught musician and entertainer. And I learned how to do it by traveling real hard and living real hard and, you know, sleeping in all those crazy places and homeless shelters and meeting all them crazy people and turning them into songs and you know i just feel like my access points to

that part of me is is will be with me my whole life like i'll never not be able to write a song because there's so many song worthy things I've already seen and done and many of them I did like before I was 23 yeah and it's probably the harder part is to just remember all the fucking stories yeah I actually have a really acute memory

so they all you know I wish I written stuff down because what I don't have is a very good spatial memory of like when it or chronology but like I can remember like dressing rooms

that I built in 20 years ago the color of the walls and stuff is it a blessing and a curse to remember everything? No, I think it's just a blessing. I mean, I don't really cringe about things in the past anymore. I did for a long time.

I think if you'd asked me that 10 years ago, I'd say blessing and a curse. But now I feel good about all the things that I used to get squeamish about. I mean, too, yeah, I could still get a little squeamish. Yeah. Yeah. What about your relationship with like Willie? Are you guys on good terms or how'd that fall out? Yeah.

Willie Watson and I, you know, we didn't talk for a while and we parted ways and that was unpleasant and everything, but it's not really like that anymore and we've really found peace and harmony we've sung together and corresponded and talked on the phone and you know we text each other now i i was in touch with him at moral fest this weekend he was the day before us i you, um, I'm trying to book a show with him right now. So yeah, I mean, we're, we're pretty good there. Do you hold grudges? Are you a guy who lets things go eventually? Um, I think that, uh, I'm a person who has a hard time moving on, you know, stubbornness. Yeah. So it's not so much like i'm like holding resentment it's just that i you know i'm so used to the i mean the bus just rolls you just get on board it doesn't even matter

if you're happy or sad or if your kid just learned to walk or crawl or you just got into a fight with somebody you love or you you're worried about something money or something you just get on board and then you just ride and then you go play a bunch of shows and then people all react like you know like you're a great dude so yeah it's true it just keeps on happening again and again and so as long as they keep reacting that way, you can sort of live in a bubble of, well, everything's pretty placid on the road at least. Yeah, it's fascinating to me because do you know Vince Herman from Leftover Salmon? Sure, yeah. You know, he's a road dog too, and he's been like that his whole life.

And that's one of my mentors. And, you know, I talk about, he talks about like intention and what, you know, do you know Colonel Bruce Hampton too? Do you, familiar? Yeah. I saw Colonel Bruce when I was 14. I wanted to be just like him. Yeah. Tell me about that.

What did you see in him? Because I'm, I've never got, I was unfortunate enough to never meet him before he passed. But all my mentors was a big, he was a big inspiration for me. Yeah. I loved him I saw him just one time because I was in high school and he was on the Horde tour 94 you know

Horde tour was great that year it was like Panic, Bruce who else was on that oh Blues Traveler yeah Blues Traveler yeah Blues Traveler was the headliner all the ones

that you mentioned plus All Good was the other one oh yeah All Good yeah it's so funny those are

I mean that was the original festival traveling festival felt like I know for me it felt like I was

bearing witness to whatever remained of the 1960s with Sword Tour 94. I thought it was so great. Dude, it's badass. What do you think of the music industry in 2022? What's your take on it? uh we just put a new record out and it's been our most um fun and seemingly successful launch you know that nobody buys records anymore so it's hard to calculate it in terms of

you know like um did you make a bunch of money did you sell a bunch of records it doesn't have the same kind of quotients any longer yeah but if um but if you look at it just in terms of uh you know like the joy quotient i never had so much fun putting out a record i love my lineup i i was on a major label last couple album cycles and they were cool but it wasn't a great fit. And so now I've gone back to ATO and that's been a great and welcome return. I love ATO. I feel like I'm a part of a community. I've got this great management deal cooked up

with basically one of my best friends is my manager and she's amazing. And she's in partnership with Red Light, which is part of the you know stakeholders of ato and it's just all kind of working out and then i got this great lineup with um this particular lineup of old crow members is this the best it's ever been i mean we just have so much fun together it's light that we light. We didn't pay for it in blood, so it's a lot lighter. Well, you did, but those guys didn't.

We actually played with you guys last year at Hogs for the Cause in New Orleans. Hogs for the Cause. Yeah. Yeah, I remember. Yeah, and Molly Tuttle. I mean, what a sensational find, man. Where did you meet Molly? Yeah, and Molly Tuttle. I mean, what a sensational find, man. Where did you meet Molly? Yeah, and Molly is amazing.

She's got a brand new record out called Crooked Tree on None Such Records. I just want to put a plug in for it because I think it's the best bluegrass record that's been made in 10 years, maybe 20. Yeah, do you- I agree, man. With the guys, there's so many bands that you guys inspired. And now I feel like there's another upswing in bluegrass music with the Billy Strings of the Worlds and the Molly Tuttles and the Green Skies who are doing this experimental traditional music.

And I really think you guys are one of the frontiers in that. How does that make you feel that these guys are getting inspired by Chica Ketch? I'm honored. The people that inspired me were just the most beautiful souls. Some of them are gone. A lot of them are gone. They don't make them like John Hartford anymore. No.

Or like little Jimmy Dickens. Like that guy was incredible. Right. What a heroic dude. Right. Or Charlie Pride. You know, like Charlie Pride held my kid. Well, they both did.

I mean, both of those men have walked my kid to the bathroom before. So anyway, I think having the good fortune of being in Nashville, I always felt like I was late to the party, you know? Yeah. Like I wanted to be at Woodstock in 1969. I wanted to be in Nashville when Bob made, you know, John Wesley Harding. to be in in nashville when bob made you know um john wesley harding yeah you know i wanted to be at at the selm i wanted to be at the pettit bridge in selma alabama when they marched across i wanted to you know push medgar evers out of the way when they murdered him from behind a tree you know i wanted to be there for those moments right um but i got this moment this is the moment that i was

brought into and i always felt a little bit like I'm late for the party. I'm late for the, you know, the moonwalk of life. It's already happened. And yet it turns out I was really brought into it in the right time because I've gotten to, you know, mix it up with a lot of people who aren't on the earth anymore. a lot of people who aren't on the earth anymore, you know? And, and like, for example, going to see Jack Clement, who was the guy that was, it was like saying into the mic, have you got anything, anything, a little bit of coach, a little bit more. And that's when Jerry Lee Lewis was like, Oh, I can play this. It's insane, man. You know, it's like, you talk about like wanting to be part of an uprising, you know, and like we really haven't had a really an uprising until the last couple

years, maybe. What do you think? Have you been a part of any uprisings in the last 20 years? No, no, not at all. Yeah. There were, I think we're living in a, we're living in a, in a dip, in a cultural dip. I think we're living in a dip, in a cultural dip. Explain that. I think when they talk about this time, I mean, to extrapolate the Ken Burns-ism of takes 25 years to tell a story. I mean, it takes 500 years to tell a story, too. And so look at Shakespeare.

There's a 500-year-old story we're still telling. So what are they going to tell the story of in 2522? I mean, I don't think it's going to be about Americana or Nashville or Bluegrass. It's very true.

But even take that in regard of American history. I mean, our country is such a new country that if you're talking about this 500-year philosophy, then we don't even know what America is. I think that the 20th century was one of the most astounding and destructive periods of time, the most volatile and shocking and beautiful and tragically flawed and ruinous times that have ever come. I don't think there's a more glorious century and a more despicable one. So I don't know why they'd bother telling any other story than what happened from about 1900 to 2000. I know it's, it's,

it's insane. And like, why are, why is it harder to be like an uprising songwriter? Why can't we talk about these things? We can. And it's beautiful because there's a whole lot of fresh ears out there. Like that little girl that I scared her father or made him feel like he had to growl at me

last night. Like that little girl, she's never going to know that Bob Dylan's saying, how does it feel to be on your own with no direction home, a complete unknown, like a rolling stone? She'll never hear that. I mean, maybe she will someday but not feel it bar on her phone when she's 23 but in terms of music affecting her that's a voice that we have the power right now to be the you know to be the expression of to put a song in somebody's ear for the first time. You know, for kids today to hear a song that makes them challenge authority and feel strength inside and want to rock out

and feel the power that music has the ability to instill in you. I mean, those are voices like yours and mine. We have that ability now. Yeah. Is it harder for you to see the bigger picture as you get older and, you know, more miles on your body about what, what is the meaning and why I'm doing this? No, no. I think it's gets simpler you do it because because you're in the service industry

yeah you you took an oath to provide a good time right and you might have a good time doing it and that's great yeah you know that is so true it you know it's like I had this talk with one of my favorite songwriters John Craigie and he taught these songs aren't for us or maybe they are these songs for you or are they for them I mean they're coming from me so

they're for me in as much as you know they're they're a way for me to focus experience and feeling and passion. That's all very much of me. But I write a lot of topical songs that are about things that aren't me. Or it might be like one of my favorite songwriters, when I first heard my uncle's record collection up there in the attic,

was a guy by the name of phil oaks phil was always sort of like a like a lesser bob you know like um you know like in the in the patriarchy would be like bob donovan phil oaks tom paxton yeah a whole bunch of others yeah uh and anyway um i always loved phil oakes before i heard bob dylan which is i think what a lot of people thought too so anyway phil oakes been gone a long time he wrote topical songs he wrote songs that you know straight out of the newspaper bob wrote these to a lot of a lot of folk singers wrote these um you know you're you are the news you're the you know you're a kind of memorable CNN.

Right. And why is it so... I talked about this too, like topical songs, topical songwriters. Do you ever get a moment where you feel like it's a great topical song and then a year later,

it's just like no one cares about that topic anymore? I think the pandemic had that a little bit. Yeah, I remember you had that COVID song, which was funny. It was great. I mean, the lyrics were awesome a little bit. Yeah. I remember you had that COVID song, which was funny. It was great.

I mean, the lyrics were awesome on it last year. It was like something about something about sneezing or something. God, I can't remember. Yeah. It was called, I'd like to kiss you,

but I'm quarantined. I love that dude. Can you still play songs like that? We did it all last year You know There were still a lot of face masks at the show Yeah But yeah, I mean, things change

And you don't, you know The times change And look, I got a brand new record out And I want people to like these songs But they all want to hear the old songs And I don't blame them You know, when I go see Bob Dylan Who's like the only ticket that I really buy Yeah I sure as hell don't want to hear the old songs. I don't blame them. When I go see Bob Dylan, who's the only ticket that I really buy,

I sure as hell don't want to hear what he just recorded. God, no. It's true. Your charms of freedom. Does it bum you out that you have to play old songs? Did you hear that?

Does it bum you out that you have to play the old songs? No, I just... Sorry. It actually doesn't bum me out at all to play old songs. I understand why people want to hear what they've already heard. They're buying a ticket because they want to hear the way they felt when they first heard it. They might have room in their brains for something new,

but I think more so it's a feeling of give them what they want. Service industry, remember? I know, fuck. What about serving us? Hey, will you hold on because there's somebody at the door?

Yeah, no problem. We talk about always serving everyone else. And then the idea of what serves your soul? Serving others? Yeah, I like that game. I like to play that game. I really like social media for this reason. Because you can feel like you never felt I'm new to this, right? So I haven't done this except for in the past couple of years.

But like when I send two flames and two banjos above those two flames, I really mean it, man. Yeah. Like, my emoji sending is really heartfelt. Yeah, with intention, like Colonel Bruce. Probably like Colonel Bruce. God, I loved him. He was awesome, man.

Yeah. You know, I didn't buy any records that day except for Aquarium Rescue Unit. Yeah, the best with Oteel and stuff. I mean, those guys really learned a lot from him. And I could tell with like, even with Molly, man, like ever since she's been playing with you guys, I mean, you could see her attitude is completely different. And I just think you are inspiring so many more people than you probably even know.

Cats, you are the man, dude. Well, thanks for saying so. And, and thanks for giving me an opportunity to Jimmer Jammer with you a little bit. Yeah,

man. And get the word out there. Thanks for the press, man. no problem. You know, it was my, my bandmate said I had to do this podcast.

Oh, awesome. Well, awesome. Because Mason Vai is a big fan of yours. So there's a big swirl of gratitude happening. Well, Mason is the shit, and I'm so thankful you have this band. They all love you, man. I'm rooting for you, bro, always and forever. You were one of the first guys that got me to think about music

other than just playing songs, but doing them with intention and doing them with entertaining and just being yourself and being completely authentic with who you are. And I just want to say thanks, man. You really inspire me. Thanks, man. Appreciate it, bro. Glad to do it.

I got one last question. We talk about legacy. You're a history buff you know and when it's all said and done what do you want Old Crow Medicine to show and what do you want

you to be remembered by oh I want them to think that I sold a lot of harmonicas and a lot of fiddles and a lot of banjos and guitars yeah I want them to think about me as a musical instrument dealer like the music man and a lot of fiddles, and a lot of banjos and guitars. Yes.

I love it. I want them to think about me as a musical instrument dealer, like the music man. Remember, he got off the train in River City, and they all said, there's no music allowed here. Mama don't allow that. But by the end of it, he had them all playing in the band. Yeah. That's what I wanted to be, the music man.

Well, I hate to break it to you, but you're doing it, bud. Well, you have a great day. Thanks. Be safe out there. Take care of the boys and the lady. And I'll catch you soon, buddy. All right, man. Peace.

Peace out, bud. Thank you. Fuck yeah. That was awesome. Thanks, Catch. Appreciate you, bud. Wow, that was awesome. God, that guy is smart as shit.

I was like, God, I don't even know if I'm smart enough for this conversation. You tuned in to the World's Health Podcast with Andy Fresco. Thank you for listening to this episode. Produced by Andy Fresco, Joe Angelo, and Chris Lawrence. We need you to help us save the world and spread the word. Please subscribe, rate the show, give us those crazy stars, iTunes, Spotify, wherever you're picking this shit up. Follow us on Instagram at world saving podcast for more info and updates. Prescott's blogs and tour dates you'll find at andyfrescott.com.

And check our socials to see what's up next. Might be a video dance party, a showcase concert, that crazy shit show, or whatever springs to Andy's wicked brain. And after a year of keeping clean and playing safe, the band is back on tour. We thank our brand new talent booker, Mara Davis. We thank this week's guest, our co-host, and all the fringy frenzies that helped make this show great. Thank you all. And thank you for listening.

Be your best, be be safe and we will be back next week no animals were harmed in the making of this podcast as far as we know any similarity instructional knowledge facts are fake is purely coincidental