Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast - EP 24: Peter Shapiro (Relix Magazine, Brooklyn Bowl, Lock’n)

Episode Date: October 23, 2018

Hello world. Meet Andy Frasco. Him and the boys got a new song debuting on this episode, and we'd like y'all to treat your ears holes to this sonic delight. Also, very excited to welcome LEGENDARY concert promoter, Peter Shapiro on the interview hour! Andy picks his brain and we all learn what it takes to build a music scene from scratch. Dolav comes back to the halftime show for some more sports yelling! We love you and your anger management issues, Dolav. This is Episode 24.  To keep up with the podcast, follow us on Instagram @WorldSavingPodcast For more information on Andy Frasco, tour dates, the band and the blog, go to: AndyFrasco.com The views discussed on this podcast do not necessarily reflect those of the guests. Follow our guest, Peter Shapiro and Relix at www.relix.com Produced by Andy Frasco Yeti Joe Angelhow Chris Lorentz Audio mix by Chris Lorentz Featuring: Dolav Cohen Ahri Findling Arno Bakker

Hey, it's Schwartz. It was great seeing you last night. The show was really strong. Loved, loved Come Down. Loved seeing that in the middle of the set. That was really, really great. Hey, listen, only one critical thought, and that is you got to stop wearing this Laker shit everywhere.

I mean, you had on a sweatshirt and then you had a jersey on over it. And I'm just sort of trying to wrap my head around this. You're not on the fucking Lakers. You're a musician. Kobe is not going to see a picture of you wearing this jersey and then call you or LeBron or whoever's on the team.

Nobody gives a shit about the Lakers except you. You want to be a fucking basketball player? Quit your band and go try out for the Lakers. If you want to be in a band, start dressing like it. I'll talk to you soon. Later. What's up, guys? This is your boy, Andy. How are we doing today? I wanted to start the show off with something really special. We are world premiering our new single off our new album. The song's called Up Down. You might know

it. It's actually, I've been teasing it all season long on the podcast. It's the intro song, but now you get to hear the whole song, which is even cooler. Hope you enjoyed. I'm really proud of this record. Me and the boys have been working our asses off trying to finish this while gigging and doing podcast life and everything else. I'm just really proud of it. The song's called Up Down. New album coming out. We're going to release a single every month until that baby comes out. And then we're going to be releasing them on Apple and Spotify and yada yada.

But first, you guys get to hear it first. So here, enjoy the world premiere of our new single, Up Down. Enjoy. I woke up to a hurricane the other day I didn't think I could make it out Screaming and yelling, that's a thing I did I don't even know what she's talking about The tides are getting deeper as the swell moves in

And I haven't even brushed my teeth Then she says she loves me for the way I am Then asks me to reel it in You know I'm so up and down Your love is up and down You know I'm so up and down Your love is up and down When I'm on the come up, she puts me down

Then kisses the top of my head When I'm cruising downstream, she fakes a drown Just to get back in my bed When I'm trying to lay low, she wants me She wants me aiming high And I think I love you, but my best is just alright Your love is so up-down Your love is up-down

Your love is so up-down Your love is up-down Your love is so up-down Your love is up-down Your love is so up and down Love is up and down Love is so up-down Love is up-down Love is up-down

Love is up-down Love is up-down Love is up-down Love is up-down Oh, Jesus. Here we go. Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast with Yeti. What's up, Yeti? I'm smoking a cigarette in the van. I'm on a fucking...

I don't know why... Okay, Yeti, you need to tell me this. Yeah. How are we going to make a thought-provoking episode when we have to do a podcast right after I get on stage because you only get to be here for one day. I know. We're going to do it. You know why? Yeah. Because we're fucking amazing. It's a world-saving fucking podcast. You sound like you're on Adderall. I'm ready to go. You're jippy. I'm jippy. Jesus Christ. Is that a real word? See, I'm not on speed. So like all the drinking I drink after a show.

Yeah, yeah. This is where I'm like the most drunk. When my adrenaline stops, like 45 minutes after I perform. That's the drunkest I am all night. Shit. It's crazy. Well, I think that, you know, like, I don't know what I was going to say. I remember what I was supposed to do though but

I don't know we're playing with the pigeons playing ping pong guys right now this is dope this is a good show day three it's hard to open for a band what's that like? you don't do that often it's hard dude I don't do that ever no band lets us open for anyone.

And these fucking guys are badass and they let me open for them. It's weird because the first 30 minutes, no one's at the show. Right. Comparatively. Right. Yeah. Because Jam Kids show up like right when the headliner shows up. Right.

By 30 minutes. Well, not right when the headliner. Like they'll show up halfway through the opening band right and so we play you know i have to like trigger my set now instead of like hitting them hard in the beginning is like warming up into okay 30 minutes now the the room is packed with a thousand people or 700 people it's really a different way of thinking. What's that like to like you you're used to one thing.

You're used to a longer show, number one. You're used to being in a later time slot too. So what's that like to put all that effort out there for that and then is it because you're looking past where you are right now? You're like, yeah, I'm opening but it's because these guys are dope.

Yeah. No, I think it's, you know, these guys draw a lot of people and they could help me build a fan base. I mean, it's a gamble, right? No gamble. A little bit. Like you don't necessarily, I mean, anytime. Because I'm not headlining. Yeah.

Anytime you put yourself out there, like it's a little bit of a gamble. You don't necessarily know what you're going to get back. You hope you sell hard tickets. You know, you hope people show up to that soft ticket event. Yeah, you do it for out there, it's a little bit of a gamble. You don't necessarily know what you're going to get back. You hope you sell hard tickets. You hope people show up to that soft ticket event. Yeah, you do it for the experience. I've never opened for a band before, and it's nice to be the opener. It's a double-edged sword because I get fucked up now really bad.

Yeah, it's like it's not even 10. And I have like rev the engines as opening bands you don't get shit like you don't get like the hospitality like you don't get free no we drink like assholes yeah i have to like go i have to go and have like three shots of jameson at like seven o'clock at some like fucking dive bar out here. Like I'll take three shots just in a row. I got to perform in like 45 minutes. I got to figure out how I'm going to do this.

Yeah. It's hard. Playing an hour is hard because you got to get to the point, you know, we're a band that's, you know, like takes, you know, we like to entertain for a couple hours. So like I have to like really cut the fat, hit the stuff because most of these people don't know who I am. Right. entertained for a couple hours. So like, I have to like, really cut the fat, hit the stuff because most of these people

don't know who I am. So like, I have to go back into like, like, into like all the heart, my banger stuff. Like,

that I, that I know I could, I could crush. Yeah. Go back to the things that you know kill because you only have 60, 55 minutes.

I got 60 minutes to impress a thousand people. And like, this is really important for my career because you know, like we've only drawn 10 people in these cities. I'm at a point in my career where it's like, I know it's going well and I know things are going good. So now I have to really dial in on what I love about music.

You know? Yeah. I'm at that point where it's like talking about risks and stuff. Like now I need to stop going into autopilot and say, okay, fucking crowd surfing works and try to test myself and how to be a front man for everybody. Instead of like when I get nervous,

oh, fuck, fuck, fuck, go into a dick job. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know? Well, and like that's your competitive as fuck and you're competing with yourself, which is dope. I think this is awesome. I'm like, go on, man. Yeah, do it.

I want to see this. Like, this is great because I think like what you've said, like you were even saying it tonight before this show, that you need to, you know, this is close to the next place you're playing, so you might need to change tonight before this show that you need to you know this is close to the next place you're playing so you might need to change it up

so that's cool yeah I'm thinking I'm thinking differently like instead of like trying to do the same set like I'm now like playing

with these jam bands like this tour it's like okay how these guys these fan base travel so I need to think about three different schticks.

I can't fucking do the horror all three nights where one fourth of the crowd has been to all three nights. I got to do some different shit. And that's what's really, really what's making me interested about opening for bands and stuff is seeing what I can do. What's it like coming up in this jam scene? Because you talk about it in the interviews.

You talk about it with these people. Fucking stressful, dude. I've been hanging out with the Pigeons guys and seeing those guys fucking think for three hours over a set list. We don't have a set list. We've never had a set list You just say Or if you're in town Like don't say pussy

We gotta say booty Yeah or like If I'm contract obligated Like you can't say fuck Or pussy or dick Or something I will You know

Not say that shit But Those guys There's so much pressure Like every You know like God I feel so bad For these jam kids, dude. Not jam kids, jam bands.

Because they have to think of a new set list every fucking night. Because the pressure of all these live recordings coming out and stuff, that's why I appreciate the comedians saying, all right, get off your phones. I'm testing out new material right now. I'm going to bomb on some stuff. That's why I appreciate like the comedians like, all right, get off your phones. Yeah. I'm testing out new material right now. I'm going to bomb on some stuff.

Yeah. But like, don't judge me because I can't have a band practice. I'm playing six nights a week. So like for me to test out

new material, like if it's some jokes or if it's like a cover, like I'm trying to put Madonna in our set right now. Yeah. Just, you know, just like Madonna in our set right now. You know, just like,

just like freak people out. Just like, what the fuck? You know, just do those things where it's like curve balls and like left and right. Those risks are what make you a better band. And those risks are what make you a better artist because you're not staying in something that works. You're trying to,

okay, that worked for the moment. Let's see what else can work. So you could build this whole portfolio of what you can do. And then by the end of your career, you'll, you'll have a full circle of stuff. I mean, you got into this jam scene. I mean, it's been this year for the most part. What, what'd you expect getting into it? Did you have an expectation? Did you think, oh, I'm in the jam scene? I mean, it's kind of been a progression.

I mean, like my manager keeps telling me, you're not in the jam scene. This is just another scene. You're in. And I hear that. But like these guys are the ones who are going to stay with me through everything. These guys are going to see you in 20 years. Yeah. Yeah.

If I don't fuck it up. You know, hopefully. That'd be an amazing career. That's what Brian says. I don't want to manage the estate of Andy. Yeah. Because I'm here out fucking drinking at Cowboy Bar in Bend, Oregon by myself. Because, you know, I need to rev the inches quickly.

Yeah. Jesus Christ. Do you think I'm an alcoholic? Well, I mean, by definition, yes, but I don't think you're an alcoholic. I mean. Well, I mean, okay. You want to go down there? Man, I took a physical.

Yeah. I just took a physical. Oh, that's right. How'd that go? That scared the shit out of me. Yeah? I test out of my dick, test out of my blood. I told the doctor, I'm like, listen,

you know, I've been on the road for 12 years. I've kind of been a whore. I've done cocaine. I don't do cocaine anymore. I could just imagine. He's like, I want your job. Was this at home?

Yeah, my mom. I was so worried because my mom set me up with this physical. And she's like, you need to check your blood. You need to check. I mean, I've been listening to your podcast. You're having sex. And I don't know if it's protecting. I'm 30 years old.

My mom. I'm 30 years old. I got this. She's like, no, no, no. God damn it. I already set you up with Dr. Rosen. You know, the Jewish doctor. The Jewish doctor, yeah.

And he was respect. Legit Jewish doctor? He was legit Jewish doctor, Evan Rosen. He was a baller. And I'm like, listen, doc, you're going to have to check out everything part of my dick. You're going to have to check out my lungs. Check out my blood. You know, I know I don't have anything.'t have anything but like i just been hit it hard just take yeah i need i've been doing coke

i'm like i was just completely honest with him he's like i'm like man i wish i had your life oh my god i'm out here fucking taking touching old wrinkly balls and shit yeah i'm like this is my guy this is my, this is my guy. This is my guy. This is my guy. This is my guy. So, yeah, I took a physical,

but it's been nerve-wracking, but like, they haven't hit me up for a week about my blood, so I think I'm fine. Okay. No news is good news. Yeah.

It is important. I mean, there's two things that are important, getting tested and voting. That's pretty much it. Yeah, that's shit.

Do all of that. What, okay, so back to what we were talking about you're not in the jam scene but you're a part of it I mean I'm in whatever scene they want me to be in

I'm not trying to pigeon hole myself, I love the jam scene and I love the acoustic scene, I love the alternative scene I feel like I want to reach more people, I want to reach more people I want to reach everybody with whatever I can do

you know that's the risk of like when I play for like a bunch of cougars like I can't talk about you know

doing fucking ketamine and shit you know you have to yeah you have to you have to curtail your show but that makes me a better entertainer.

Right. You know, like, I'm not trying to be pigeonhole. Oh, here he is. Like, cool, I drink. Whatever. I'm proud of who I am. I'm not going to hide it. Yeah.

I think it's just people are scared to go outside the bubble, like with these bands who get a single and then like, oh shit, I have to try to write another single that's close to this. That's what's ruining the music industry.

That's what's ruining creativity. We're so worried about maintaining this lifestyle that we're afraid to take risks anymore and that's what shapiro talks about like he owned wetlands right you know the venue wetlands and you know about this i did don't bullshit i did look it up after i listened to this interview okay as i was prepping for our segment this built the scene yes new york ridiculous. He got it given to him at 23. And he made payments to the guy.

It's just nuts. I mean, he was saying, like, I'd slept there. Okay, we don't want to spoil the interview, but seriously. Peter Shapiro is one of my, I didn't know he was going to be my role model until I just learned background of him

and then I talked to him. And he's totally ADD like me. That's the guy. If I wasn't a musician, I was going to be Peter Shapiro. A hundred percent. That's dope. And you got to sit down

and have a conversation with him. Yeah. Yeah, that was really special. Man, I've been getting so many good interviews. It's been really good and people have talked about it. People are pumped. Bands are pumped.

Yeah. All of it. Sorry, I'm having an and Baxter. Yeah. Like, all of it. Sorry, I'm having, like, existential, like, pump-up moment. I'm wasted. You and I both. No, we're on cloud nine right now. We're going to make, we're going to go this interview. What's something that you had to risk on, Yeti?

For me? Yeah. I mean. What'd you take a risk on? I mean, you were open about your buy-ness. That's pretty risky. A little bit of a risk there. How do you feel now about your bindness that's a little bit of a risk there um how do you feel

now about that i feel good like it's one of those things like i don't feel like you've been fucking any dudes lately nothing lately yeah yeah nothing lately what about um you've been trying to no threesomes no threesomes no nothing nothing going Man, my libido's been fucking horrible lately. Why? It's like... I don't know what's wrong with me right now. Do you think that you're... Are you still microdosing? No.

I stopped for a little bit because I feel good. Yeah. I've been... I have too much work to do for the microdose when you're microdosing like that and it's not on a creative level

that you're working on oh you just got pencil pushing work I have like interviews I have like we're finishing up

the album artwork like our new album like I mean like we just released our first single I mean you heard the first single today

it's great so I was excited about yeah first single Updown finally came out. So I was excited about. Yeah, first single, Updown, finally came out. It's on iTunes and Spotify. Yeah, finally.

Andy Frasco. But it's just been, been doing that. We've been getting all this exciting news with the podcast. You know, bands are pumped up about the band

and I'm just trying to like start thinking about my new album too while I'm promoting for an album that i'm putting out in february right you know oh yeah the next album right yeah it's always and that's that creative process and so trying to do that but it's also having the pressure of like i have to write new bits for this fucking pigeons tour yeah and i'm like you know trying to like. Because it's a jam tour. Yeah. And like people want.

They want fresh. They want fresh. You know, and that's what's really keeping me on my stuff. And then, you know, as this podcast has been getting bigger, you know, I want to dial in our, you know, our segments and stuff, you know. So it's like I had a lot going on right now. It's busy working, micro dosing when you're. a lot going on right now it's busy working micro dosing when you're because when you micro dose you're sometimes going to these like fades okay you just like all play uh video games for three and a half hours oh jesus i get absorbed in mario yeah you know i just bought a nintendo switch i'm

really doing you you get it you told me you got this new Nintendo what? Dude, it changed my life. Nintendo what's it called? Nintendo Switch. Nintendo Switch. Okay. I never had a childhood. I was 13 booking bands and shit. Right. Yeah.

You know, like I never got to play video games. You have an adult childhood. It's great. Oh my God. I couldn't believe it. Like I have to stop spending money on child shit. Like I was like, I was like, oh, cool. This is so cool.

Target and Nintendo Switch. So that'll be $450. And I don't want to look like a pussy and like, oh, no, I don't want this anymore. So I got to suck it in. Put it on the credit card. Just put it on the chase card. I'll get some points on it. Hopefully, management doesn't look at it.

Well, too late sorry Brian sorry I'm late on your commission I had to buy a Nintendo Switch but Yeti I don't know man I'm working hard I'm tired as fuck but you know it's all about taking chances on life

I knew that I wanted this life and I knew that I needed more from what I was getting from my career. And I knew that the only way to step it up is to, you know, just dial it in and stop. You know where you could be, you know? And if you know where you could be and you still don't do it then you're wasting

time yeah you're just letting yourself down yeah and i don't want to waste time anymore right i'm at that point where you see your dreams and you see that you're capable of achieving your dreams because you've achieved part of those dreams already because who knows maybe one physical i do die or i do get cancer i'm serious you know you never know and it could happen quick and you know i don't want to put this on a bad note but you never know my lifestyle and i don't you know i don't want that to happen and i will try my hardest but sometimes the universe has different reasons for you yeah and you got Yeah, and you got to leave it on the table. I mean, you got to roll the dice and take that risk.

Yeah, you take the risk. You try to give life everything you can every day. So if that time ever comes and if it's too soon and you have to accept it, you gave life the best shot you can. And I think that's why Peter Shapiro is such a fucking inspiration to me. He had every opportunity.

He's like, all right, this opportunity just came to me. You know what? Let's do it. He never said no. And that's why he is where he is right now. He's got relics, wetlands, locking. This guy's a seeing guy. Brooklyn Bull?

He invented Brooklyn Bull. Which is everywhere now. Seems like. He's the man. I really was inspired by this conversation. I was inspired by this conversation too. Listen to it. I feel like all my dreams, if I put it in my brain,

will go With hard work With risk You have to put it out there And that's like me Doing the same thing That's why I'm so proud of this record This record is not what I normally do I wrote songs for myself this time

I didn't write songs Like this song Up Down is about how I'm such a commitment folk. You know? Yeah. This song Up Down really means a lot to me. Ernie played this groove and I wrote the lyrics that it just sang to me and that was the start of this record. And I'm really proud of what we did in this year and a half of making songs because we did this shit on the road. We had no time to write this.

We wrote these songs on set break and fucking hotel rooms, everywhere we can. This is a real record. This is from my heart. And I'm really proud of it. And I can't wait for you to hear all the other songs. We're going to be releasing a song every month until the record comes out, only on the podcast.

Only on the podcast. So you got to subscribe and listen. Yeah. Should we listen to Peter Shapiro in a minute? Do that transition thing. We are fucking here, ladies and gentlemen. New York City.

It's cold. It's not cold. It's just rainy and muggy. It's not good for Jews, but I got two Jews running the music business. What's up, Pete Shapiro, dude? What a life, buddy.

I want to first, okay, this is crazy. Because you've had, you're a Sundance nominee, right? Yeah. You own multiple venues. Yep. You have so much going on. Festival organizer, magazine founder, concert promoter, philanthropist, and a super freak of music. I'm actually a magazine publisher.

I didn't start Relics. You're a publisher. Relics is old, but guess what? You brought it back together. I did, 10 years ago. That's still part of the vibe, baby. It counts. I want to talk about this.

That's a lot of work. That's a lot of stuff in a life. It's like I wanted to be you before I even know who you were. I started at Capitol Records. I was booking bands in sixth life. You know, it's like, I wanted to be you before I even know who you were. I started at Capitol Records. I was booking bands in sixth grade.

I was booking the pop punk scene and then I didn't start playing music until I was 20. Sixth grade? Yeah, I was working at

Drive Thru Records in sixth grade, faked my age at 18, learned the promotion business. Then I, in high school, I started my own company and then I worked

for the Key club in la and i worked for capital and i was doing new media like i basically i was reading your box i i know from brooklyn bowl on because that's when i met you but then i studied you the days yeah dude you're a fucking legend bro so what is it is it? Okay, so I got a couple. Let's start with the childhood. Let's start with the childhood. Who gave you this drive? Did someone beat you up?

Like, what happened? Why were you so driven so young? It's just in you. And it's like, I try not to think too much. I just do. Yeah? So what was the first thing? Because if you think too much about things,

especially now, like when you're trying to do big things yeah trying to reunite the grateful dead or make a movie with the man you too you start thinking too much you'll come up with the reasons like i can't that's not gonna happen yeah so just doing and i guess i just got that drive to do in high school i had a public access tv show what was it called? It was actually Dalton Sports Network or something. It was a high school sports thing.

Which means, you know, sometimes you're working on stuff and it's like not the coolest thing. I tell the interns here, like, you may not be doing

the coolest thing, but guess what? It counts. Yeah. Like, it's all on the path. Yeah. You know,

and something big happened for me. A, I had a, I went to a show while I was in college. I was a film student. I was really into video and film at Northwestern in Chicago. In March of 1993, March 9th, I went to a show while I was in college. I was a film student. I was really into video and film at Northwestern in Chicago.

In March of 1993, March 9th, I went to a concert. It was snowing at Rosemont Horizon. I went to a Grateful Dead show, second one I've ever been to. And I had one of those experiences. Left the concert because I was so, whoa, whoa, whoa. They did spoken word, Ken Nordine guest. And he was like, whoa, whoa, echo. And I left the show.

And it led me on a path that I went and went on the road, made a film about what I had never seen anything like that. Kids, drum circle, not going back to Northwestern, not going home after the show, but on the road. So I went and made a film about that scene. I lived in a van with another kid because it was 1993

and that summer and video cameras were new. We had a big one but pretty good. By the way, we showed up in an all white van on tour. We just lived in a van.

So you got funding. Yeah, I found a kid from school who owned a camera. Perfect. That's a good way to get some funding. Convince them into

coming on the road with you. Yeah, you want to get some funding? Find a partner who owns the camera. that's a good way to get some funding yeah you want to get some funding find a partner who owns the camera exactly and then go to the parent side and say i need a van for a month please actually we rented the van and when we returned it was an all-white econoline van no wind and we drove on tour with the dead and we returned it at so many thousands of miles and the guy was one of these unlimited guys like what happened here and what we do and we actually showed up at the first show at auburn hills in michigan in an all-white van and doing this documentary about the scene around the grateful dead and little did we know that's not the best thing to show up when in the parking lot it was

like dea dea oh i bet yeah what about... But that led me real quick to like, after that film, and it's ironic, I couldn't get any of the Grateful Dead guys to be in it to do an interview. Which is funny because then 20 years later, I did their anniversary, but I couldn't get them to be in it. But it led to me taking over this great rock club

in New York City called Wetlands in 1996. And when you have a venue, and I was fortunate, and I just had a gut instinct that owning, it was already famous. Did Larry Block help you with that? Larry Block, the original owner, he passed it on to me. He made it

possible. He gave it to me. How did you meet him? How did you feel like he believed in you? Because that did lead to how I learned. Because I got a stage that I owned when i was 23 and i could try shit and do it you and i could sit here right now like yo let's do this and we could be like okay we're gonna book that we're gonna do it next month yeah and we're gonna do it like and i have to say so so what happened was i mean i was showing my film at a college after garcia died in august 95 i was an intern here in new York at New Line Cinema Film Company.

And I went around to some colleges showing my Grateful Dead documentary. And I went with a Grateful Dead cover band and the bass player. This is true. Bass player Marty from Tiberius said to me one night, yo, you should take over Wetlands bro like Larry were you making money at 23

like what was going on I was living at home you're living at home after college by the way something I had bought like if you want to go make your dream come true

then go live at home after college yeah because don't spend that money or you got to make money for rent yeah exactly

but if you want to dream like it's hard to get the dream going and have money yeah it's easy so I just dream going and have money. Yeah. It's easy. So I just went and lived at home focused on it

so I could do an internship. Were you taking drugs younger? LSD? Experimenting? What was going on? I experimented. Yeah, totally.

And that's part of it. Yeah, totally. It's part of the experience. What was that parking lot experience like the dead? That was dead. It was snowing

that night, March 9th. And I had never seen anything like that there still really isn't anything like it no when you go to a show now and you go see the Chili Peppers

or Metallica or U2 or McCartney or even a Harder Edge band or a hip hop band or Phish there's still

nothing like the parking lot at a dead show were you trying to do that what about the 50th anniversary? I mean, we tried a little bit to create some scene. It wasn't like that? I thought there was elements, but it was almost such a big event.

Explain the elements. Tell me about the parking lot. Everyone talks about this. Those years, it changed people's lives, man. It's like traveling circus. Yeah. They would show up in the lot. People selling things.

Dogs running around. People selling things. Dogs running around. People shaking things. The crystals. A lot of shakers. I got a shaker here. I was going to give you the noise. Take it. In the background. After the show.

Grilled cheese. Grilled cheese here. Wow. People making grilled cheese. But it was an economy. Crystals here, crystals. Get you this, get you that. I know a lot of people started businesses from the economy of the dead.

Well, it was just a traveling scene. And some of those people wouldn't even go in the show. Yeah. And I went and made this documentary about that scene and it helped me it was a great place to kind of grow up a little bit and listen there were you had to watch your step because some of the nature of it got a little dark yeah because there was drugs and money and like some people oh people robbing people and shit? I mean, I'm not robbing, but you just had to, it was big boy

kind of scene. But there were also kids running around in school buses and hippie like, it was pretty cool and it traveled and it moved. You know, so it would go and I got the opportunity in the summer of 93 and then again in the summer of 94 to move with it and to join that circus

and that helped me and Larry Block at Wetlands knew it and to join that circus. And that helped me. And Larry Block at Wetlands knew I had... He saw my film. And he was like... Because he was a deadhead. And he built Wetlands. It opened in 1989. What was the cap there? Legal or unofficial?

Both. We can do like 6, 7, 800. 6, 7, 800. So who was big in 93 that you were filling in six eight hundred people well I took over in 96 I shot the dead thing in 93

like so Wetlands was well known for the early the first jam scene band scene of like Blues Traveler Dave Matthews

Fish Spin Doctors they are the like 90-91 89- 90, 91 scene. Kind of the first generation of jam bands. And Wetlands was the home for that in New York, which on the East Coast became the home almost nationally. They'd play different places, but like that was the home in New York,

aka the home nationally for the whole thing. So that first generation of jam bands came out of of wetlands and knows not in like 90 91 the second generation and widespread is probably a little bit part of that in the early then like 92 93 94 is like god street wine mo yeah um medesky martin and wood you know and then i come in in like 95 96 97 and 97, and it's Disco Biscuits, String Cheese Incident, Galactic. And you've grown with those bands. Yeah. So I end up being 23, taking over in 96, being able, no family.

So I was a good owner. I think that's one thing Larry Block saw in me. What was the deal? What do you want to do? You have a family. You can't stay all night every night. But I could. I was so young and I didn't need to make a lot. I was living

at that point with three other people at 77th and York and a rental for 500 bucks a month. And I didn't need to make a lot of money. Which is helpful because the place wasn't built to make a lot of money. And if you tried to make a lot of money it wouldn't be wetlands. And you'd fuck it up. So I was able to be a good owner of wetlands

from 96 through 911 because I ran it the way wetlands should be run as the priority versus just economic commerce stuff. If you try to pull money,

if you need to pull money out of something, you make really a bunch of money, you have to do certain things. Did you buy it from him? What was the deal like? You're getting right to it. He let me pay him over time. I paid him once a month for four years. Once a month for four years?

Yeah, like 48-month thing and X a month. I forget the exact. I swear to God. I paid him. Here's another thing. Why did he want to bail though? Because he was fried. He started 89, you know, doing it seven nights a week. Yeah. Seven years.

That'll fry you out. He got divorced. He wanted to move to Vermont. Different lifestyle. Wanted to find somebody who would continue the mission of the club. The other reason he gave it to me was i agreed to continue the environmental mission so this was a place the idea was well who gets involved in activism this is remember eight nine nine eighty nine this is pre-internet so it's like well young people okay well where are we going to get young people to have a meeting amnesty International is having a meeting. Rainforest Action Network is having a meeting. Where are you going to

have the meeting? Like the library? The school? The local deli? Coffee shop? You know, or the rock club? The fucking rock club. So that was the big idea behind Wetlands. Yeah, did you know that? Yeah. They had meetings there and I agreed to fund the environmental center.

Two employees and meetings and stuff. The meetings would be before shows. Pre-ininternet you couldn't just do meetups and all this there was no it wasn't happening in 90 91 92 93 even 94 wasn't fully baked were festivals because now it's not really no not as big like wetlands is big you know what was big then? Dead Tour coming to New York in September at the Garden for eight nights. And the whole jam scene is starting. Fish, Dave, all that. But they weren't doing festivals back then? They were just doing clubs?

I mean, Horde. Yeah, Horde Tour. Remember Horde? You were traveling to the amphitheaters. Horde was going on. Lollapalooza was traveling. Yeah, that was traveling. But it wasn't as much.

Remember when Bonnaroo comes In like 01 It was like a big deal Yeah You know listen There's Gathering of the Vibes So Ken Hayes did that I think the first year

That's like 95 or 96 Right after Jerry Pass So this is like the start Of this festival movement I think he started Gathering of the Vibes Called Dead End Heaven actually Right after Garcia died So maybe 96 was here To celebrate that this festival movement? I think he started Gathering of the Lives called Dead in Heaven, actually,

right after Garcia died. Uh-huh. So maybe 96 was here to celebrate that. But a lot of those festivals come later. And Wetlands was in the middle of it. I got to grow up, right?

So I'm 23. I got all these bands. Garcia dies. So a lot of people who just listened to the dead now are forced to like splinter off. And that was the birth of the real or a birth of really i think the jam band scene really happens wetlands

well after the passing of jerry garce yeah well it's how was that big role because it was the home for that in new york how old were you when Jerry died? 25? No, 22. 22. Oh, so this is right before Wetlands. You started getting the gig. Yes, he dies in August 95. I take it over in 96. Wow. And one reason I thought that Wetlands would have a good run was because

all these bands now would have people who before would just go on Dead Tour or would just listen to the dead who are 22 years old and go to boulder or go to portland maine or portland oregon or whatever you know or go to william a lot of there's a big scene and when you're 20 and in any part of the country there's a certain chunk of people hanging you know yeah playing frisbee yeah exactly listen listen to the grateful dead but now that's gone. So they were like,

some went into jazz side, Maneski Martin-Wood, some of the more bluegrass side, string cheese, some of the more maybe electronic. Remember DJ Logic and stuff? And the Biscuits, the whole Jamtronica stuff.

So Soundtribe, Bisco, all that. New Deal was a band back then. New Deal, really? Remember those guys? Yeah, fuck yeah. They were playing wetlands.

So that was all. Mo then. New Deal, really. Remember those guys? Yeah, fuck yeah. They were playing wetlands. So that was all. Mo was more the Americana side. Widespread, the Southern Rock side. You know, if you look at the jam band scene, Galactics, the New Orleans side. You know, Soul Live was starting around then. And Lettuce, Acid Jazz. You know, Schofield Warrens doing stuff. A couple of mules growing out of that time period

um so you look at aru is around that time period jimmy herring's man with colonel bruce you look at like that scene fishes goes mega like that happens that's because of garcia's passing yeah in a way it's that you know it's garcia called garcia's passing. Yeah. In a way, it's that, you know, Garcia's passing caused the birth and the growth of the Jam scene. So was Fish basically handed off Grateful Dead's fan base? I mean, I don't think they could say, it's just like me, was I handed,

well, you got to take the ball and go with it. But yeah, was that an opportunity that people who went to like six dead shows a year? Did you know that though? Did you feel that through the first couple years that Fish was going to blow up? Fish already was past

Wetlands in 96. But did I think that there would be a healthy scene of bands playing Wetlands regularly in the period after Jerry died? Yes. Yes.

They needed something to do. Because I had spent all this time on tour with the Dead. You knew them. I went to Louisville, Kentucky. I saw how many fucking people were in Louisville. I saw how many people were in Detroit. I went to Buckeye Lake. I didn't just go to Giant Stadium.

I went to Eugene. I went to Shoreline. I got into Vegas. Yeah, I've been around. I went to Highgate in Vermont. I went to D.C. to see them. I went to Highgate in Vermont I went to DC I went to Louisville So what was your conclusion on that?

There's a scene Those kids are not going away He may have gone away But the scene of people Who love that kind of music That's not going to end So they're going to want to go see Music still And experience that kind of music, that's not going to end. And so they're going to want to go see music still and experience that kind of feeling that you get

when music is improvisational in nature and the artist is trying to find a place where it doesn't always work. Yeah, totally. But when it works, that's what they want. Yeah. You can go... And one cool thing about our scene

of people like the fans they love I feel like they have a real appreciation for other kinds of music yeah for jazz

or anything even go see Timberlake live and have an appreciation but like that kind of show Timberlake's great to see in an arena it's just different

because it's so coordinated and organized and choreographed but people are looking for magic that's always going to be there. Any bands in the beginning years that didn't have a healthy 20-year career that you thought that was going to blow up?

Good question, bro. Frasco, good question. I got one. Tell me. The band Strange Folk. Who's that? From Vermont. I thought they were going to be it.

They could have been, you know, and they were the band were the band, like I booked for new year's 97. When I took my first real year. Yeah. And multi nights, they got signed up mammoth records, which was all, you know, the cool label. And I was really close to that. They were my favorite band and it just didn't happen. What do you think? What do you think it didn't happen? Why? You know, as a promoter now or as a visionary of the scene. There's a lot of moving parts to this stuff.

And to have it happen, you got to get lucky. But you got to put yourself in a position to get lucky. Ted Williams once said, you know, it's funny. He goes, the more I practice, the luckier I get. So you talked to her that I've been able to pull off a lot of shit but there's shit i didn't pull off yeah so you're right dry like you gotta try if you try like it's not necessarily gonna happen but it's not gonna happen if you don't try yeah and like they try but like they didn't you know they didn't put themselves they weren't hungry they were but like they were elements that just didn't connect to enable them

to be in the right position to fully just get lucky you know i wanted to you know they had some interpersonal stuff where one guy wanted to maybe just be like hey i want to go study i want to do a different thing yeah and so if that happens you're not touring all year yeah true and you can't the other so when the so if you can't tour you know it just becomes harder right you got to put the work in yeah and even if you put the work in may not happen totally but it ain't gonna happen if you don't put the work in totally you know it's one of those like i got another one for you it's like this is simple stuff but like if you're not there you can't see it. Sometimes I'm tired.

I don't want to go to this show or go to there. But I've had a lot of experiences in my life because I went, because I motivated. And that may mean traveling to a place and going for a night and flying there. And that's hard. Something happened that wouldn't happen or i'm you know or i saw someone and it wouldn't happen if i hadn't gone and that's just simple stuff like

sometimes like yeah i'm just gonna stay home yeah which is easier and it's like it's sometimes you need to sleep and stuff but like last night i went out i i went to i was in ohio i flew back went to a dinner. You know, I was near my house, could have gone home, but I went all the way to see David Byrne at the King's Theater. I only made the last four songs, and I went far from my house by going. But I think something may have happened there

that now could have real meaning. You know, and if I hadn't't motivated because I wanted to see it, I was going to see the last four songs. And if I tried to go 25 minutes there and a half hour back, several hours where I could have just gone home. We control our destiny, kind of. If we visualize what we could do, if we just do the work, like you said. You do and you don't, right?

You got to go. Like, I wish it was so. Partially. Yeah, tell me. Explain. Because, like, you can't fully control it. I sometimes visualize shit. It doesn't happen.

I will tell you this. Like, for my thing, I've learned, like, no's can become yes's. Bad news can become good news later. Sometimes to get to the, like I tried to do the Dead's 40th anniversary. Didn't happen. But I got the 50th. I tried

to do some other stuff in my career that didn't happen. But other stuff did. And sometimes I would try and make a request. I got one for you tell me so we opened the capital theater and we made a request into bob dylan to play the first year's like um new year's eve show not really a classic new year's eve act but we wanted to put the we did it after

and like they're like thanks but no not gonna, two days later, we got a call. And it was from Dylan's agents. And I was like, listen, New Year's Eve is not going to work. But we were thinking, and maybe they said they spoke to Bob. What would you think if Bob opened the Capitol? Opened? The opening night. Yeah, he did.

He opened the Capitol. Shut the fuck up. September 4th, 2012. Did you meet Bob? Yeah. He's been back. He did. He opened the cap. Shut the fuck up. September 4th, 2012. Did you meet Bob? Yeah. He's been back. Just did three nights last summer. So, like, we got him to open, but that wasn't the first idea.

No. We just had an obvious team. But we had tried for something else, didn't get it. And it came back around. And, like, that happens a lot. Like, you got to try. And probably in life for anyone is like you try one thing you got to keep your eyes out to be like okay well that didn't but did that did an

opportunity or a door maybe sideways just open that's still an awesome door to go through like a lot of the coolest things i've done gotten there it's not a straight line yeah you don't really sit there and be like oh i've got this it's really about how you react to the things that happen and adjust and pivot and that's a big part of stuff through those putting on a festival yeah or these big things and like things go like you can't control it all yeah you gotta do your best to put yourself in a position whether these festivals i mean it's obvious but like weather is even more important through the pivots and stuff what was what do you feel is your most proud accomplishment through it could be an event it could be a 50th anniversary yeah

fairly well was um why did that mean so much to you well just because i was created by it in a way i'm a creature of being at that show on march 9th 1993 the change i wasn't on a path to go become a grateful dead guy and promote i was not just was a film kid i never been to really dead show i went once didn't think about it at giant stadium no real wasn't going down that path till that night i actually believe i hadn't gone to that show, we wouldn't be here now. Because that thing led to another thing. The film. And that's how I met Larry Blossom.

It led to me going around to colleges and the guy being like, you should take over Wetland. I wasn't planning to be like, I want to own venues. It was not part of the plan. It just happened. So is that how Relics started too? Did you want Relics? So after Wetlands, and then Relics came? Yeah, I got happened. So is that how Relics started too? Like, did you want Relics? Or like what?

So after Wetlands, and then Relics came? Yeah, yeah. I got involved in Wetlands and like the period between having Wetlands and Brooklyn Volk. How many years? A bunch of years where I had no venue, but I was doing things like I did an IMAX concert movie. And then I made a movie with the band U2, a 3D movie. And I did the Jammy Awards, if you ever heard of it. I did all these collaborations.

Fuck yeah. I did Earth Day all around. I did a lot of stuff. By the way, I worked out of my house. Like, out of college, I lived at home. Yeah.

Then I, like, lived in the room. I worked out of home. I had no assistant. I had no office, no assistant, until I was in my 30s. Good shit.

Yeah, you just, you know, if you want to make it happen, like, live cheap. Were you making money in your 20s or no? I didn't really. When wet loans started making, going off?

Enough to survive without a family and five-year-old. Not much. Yeah. But I paid the monthly amount to Larry. But I didn't need money. I wasn't trying to save then. I think you had time. Luckily, that wasn't my strategy.

I'm like, I want to figure it out. And enough to just survive. And then luckily, I did this IMAX film and I was about to go out to get a normal job because the movie wasn't going to make any money. Deferred fees and I was going to get zero.

The movie's losing all its money. And then we got lucky. Actually, I keep this CD here. Maybe it's not here. Where's my all- cd it's here wait a minute i just saw it anyways this cd here it is yeah save my i mean i'm here because of this too because like what is this verizon they bought every cd for the movie no shit and it paid for the movie no it's true and the guy who put the money up for the movie then got all his money made a few bucks and then he gave me the money for brooklyn bowl oh that's killing one thing leaves the same thing and i was gonna have my

parents everyone's like okay after this movie and you did wetlands you do all that like you know like you have to get a real job it's done it's done the movie lost all this money it was done and then luckily this happened they bought every cd yeah and uh i got enough money to buy me a few more years yeah working at a home. Holy shit. Trying projects like the jammies, like Earth Day, like this. Then the U2 movie happened. Relics was after Brooklyn Ball? Relics came.

You ready? I took over Relics in 09, in the spring of 09. And Brooklyn Ball opened in 09, in July. So a similar time. So it's almost 10 years. It'll be 10 years for both next year. It is halftime at the Andy Fresco

interview hour. Hello, everybody. Welcome to Dolav Sportscast. He's talking shit about the game. He's got a weird fucking name. It's got a weird fucking name. It's Sports with Dola. Today we're going to be talking some NBA. Season's back, baby.

Season's back. Everyone's talking about everybody. Everyone's hyping up the fucking Lakers. LeBron James. Fucking sucks dick. LeBron James. Fucking sucks dick. LeBron James. Houston. Rondo.

Fuck those fools. Fuck all of them. No one's talking about the Jazz. However, the Jazz have the number one fucking defense. Can't fucking stop Rudy Gobert in the fucking center. Then we got the fucking Lakers. All the fucking fans come out of the fucking Woodward. Let's go, Lakers.

Let's go, Lakers. We fucking taking the chip. Fuck the Lakers. Fuck Lonzo. Fuck LeBronzo. Bunch the fucking woodwork. Let's go, Lakers. Let's go, Lakers. We fucking taking the chip. Fuck the Lakers. Fuck Lonzo. Fuck LeBronzo. Bunch of fucking scrubs. Fucking bitches they got.

It's Sports with Dola. Fuck every team. Fuck you. Woo-hoo. Let's go back to booking and developing a venue and a scene. What do you look for when you're booking a festival, when you're booking a whole show, a month of shows? Are you trying to book your friends? Are you trying to book...

Well, you want to book things that are going to bring people out. We're really only taking bands in that we know that they're drawing. We're at a bigger place. And I'm booking bands that are my scene. At first when we opened, luckily I had some... I had the relationships from Wetlands becoming friends with all these bands

that we talked about before. I had to turn to them and be like, yo bro, Mark Brownstein at the Biscuits or Eric Krasnow. Or we can go down the list. Like, hey bro, i need you to play a gig here at my new venue the brooklyn ball thing and they're like oh yeah i heard it sounds awesome bowling out there he's like are they gonna make it there like next year because at first all bowling

venue was like what and like i got a lot of like okay uh next year oh really, really? And I was like, I need you now. Like, how will this venue? I need you to do it now. And luckily, I could call that in. And then once people played it, they're like, this is awesome.

Yeah. I was able to do that with The Roots, The Biscuits played an early show. Same room over here? Yeah, Brooklyn Ball. Yeah.

Mule played an early show. They all did. They're all in the first few months. Krasnow did. Actually, I couldn't even get sold out all in the first few months Krasnow did actually I couldn't even get solo at first Eric Krasnow band but then I rolled in

a 10 nights of solo and everyone's like you're crazy they couldn't sell out two nights was Brooklyn popping over there yet or you were kind of like

we were on the front end especially that northern part of Williamsburg none of that other stuff that's there is there but you know my partner and I Charlie Charlie, we walked the streets. We found it.

This old barn from 1880s. And we saw it. And right away, I was like, yo. And just had this idea, thought it would work. We did not expect that you and I would be sitting here talking about Kanye, Jane's Addiction, Guns N' Roses, Robert Plant, Adele, Paul Simon, Elvis Costello, like go down the list. We've done it all.

And, you know, the Questlove would do 300 gigs. You know, I think Soul Live, Eric Krasnow's done 100 gigs, like 70 with Soul Live. Joe Russo's done 100 gigs. Probably, you know, I don't know, 50 with Joe Russo's Almost Dead We Creat probably you know I don't know 50 with Joe Russo's Almost Dead we created you know

Talib Kweli's done a hundred gigs yeah you know and DJ like we just thought it would work but it just came together

and really worked you know and we I got to rebuild this wetland scene I think actually between wetlands closing on 9-11

yeah and Brooklyn Ball opening which was like seven, eight years, there was no real home for that scene. And it's kind of cool now that Brooklyn Bowl is located in the heart of Williamsburg,

the hipster place of the world. And I laugh, and pigeons playing ping pong are there, or like Twiddle, and it's packed for three nights sold out. And people come off the street, if it's not sold out in advance, and you get all these hipsters coming in. I laughed because thank God

that happened. I think it was good for the scene because otherwise, I don't know if those bands are playing in the heart of Williamsburg. Hell no, they're not. Honestly, seriously. Was that the goal, though? Was it to make Wetlands 2.0? Oh, yeah. A little bit to make Wetlands 2.0, yes.

You know, like... But better sidelines and wood. If you notice... You had money now. And I don't know if you've seen Wetlands. Like, it's got... It's similar color tone. Yeah.

Wood floor. Yeah. Brick walls. Like, a lot of that, yes. But better sidelines, add the visual. Remember, it's less about the bowling than the video stuff. I'm a film guy. Yeah. I love Ironman. I add the visual. Remember, it's less about the bowling than the video stuff. I'm a film guy. I love Ironman.

I love the visual stuff. That's why the Capitol Theater, if you see the walls, what we do on it, a lot of it's about the visual candy. What the bowling lanes enable, the layout of the bowling enables what you can do on the screens. Like that kind of stuff. Yeah, exactly. And just thought it would work. But when we first were building it, Ron Delsner is like the screens. Like that kind of stuff. Yeah, exactly. And just thought it would work.

But when we first were building it, Ron Delsner is like the legend of concert promoter. Yeah. He came to see me as we built it. Was that your idol as a concert promoter? Looked up to him. Bill Graham is the guy. But Ron's the next guy.

And he sees what we're building. It's a construction site. Show him. Stage is over here. Lanes are over here. Bowling. He's like, Peter. He's like, come here.

Come here. He puts his arm around me. He's like, kid, I'm worried about you. You got a goddamn fucking bowling alley next to the goddamn stage. No one's going to fucking play. What the fuck? fuck? Like, you know what you're doing? Because it's raised a lot of money. But you know what the truth is? You don't know. And a lot of people use the word think. I don't think. I don't think. And like, and same with Capitol Theater. When we're painting certain things, people are like, that's not going to work. But like, you don't know until

you do it. Exactly. And I thought, and the truth is, you don't really, you have a hunch. Luckily, I had enough credibility, I guess, that I built up to get the money to try it. Thank God it worked. And it just worked. We just saw it with great PA sound. When you turn that up, it's not even close. You don't hear it at all. And the visual makes it awesome.

It just works. And it's supposed to be a little bit like New Orleans. Supposed to feel like two in the morning. Supposed to feel like after jazz fest every night, especially every week. You've been at, you know, and it just,

and it worked. And we got to bring all those bands who were at wetlands in. And, and I think it's been good for the scene. It's a second home. Yeah. There's a, it's a scene.

It's a home. And like, it's cool to see when we do a grateful day cover band think it's been good for the scene. It's a second home. Yeah. It's a scene. It's a home. And it's cool to see when we do a Grateful Day cover band and it's packed and it's hipster cool, Euro, in a place that it wouldn't. That's good. Yeah. And they love it, by the way. Yeah, totally. Vegas doing okay?

Yeah. We just got one top. Yeah. Hard at first. Yeah. You show up in Vegas. It was big. 80,000 square feet.

Is it a different mentality of who you're going to book there? Yeah, a little bit. But you know what's been cool? We brought that scene there. Didn't really have a home. We're doing Preservation Hall or Galactic. And hopefully we'll do Andy Frasco. You did me.

We did it. Okay, Andy Frasco. My bad. Good. Or String Cheese. And we're talking to Mo right now about two nights. And we've done Phil there. And Randolph.

And I opened it. I did like 12 nights of Galactic. I kind of wanted to be like at 11. If we put a Galactic on every night at 11 p.m., 1130, New Orleans Jazz Fest in Vegas. Like, I got to know if that's going to work.

So we did it like the second week. And like, it didn't work. Yeah. But like, I wouldn't have known. If you had just done one night, I got to know if that's going to work. So we did it, like, the second week. And, like, it didn't work. Yeah. But, like, I wouldn't have known. If you had just done one night, I'm like, I'm not going to know it just one night. I got to drop 10 or 12. And, like, because the marketing and, like, really know it's there.

But it didn't work at all. Now maybe it would be better. We just didn't have the email. You know, when you show up alone. Yeah, it's true. No email list. No socials. Brand new. It's $80,000. That's hard, man. We just didn't have the email. You know, when you show up alone. Yeah, it's true. No email list, no socials, brand new. It's 80,000. That's hard, man.

It's a big room, man. It's like 1,500 seats, right? 25. 25? Yeah. It's huge, man. It feels like a house of blues in there. It's huge.

It's huge. And we almost didn't make it. But you know what? We did. That's what I'm fucking talking about. What about London? How's that going? That one's less.

We paused so far away it was just in a weird spot at the arena we paused it now while they're doing work at the O2 arena ton of work around us which is gonna make it

completely impossible it was already hard but it was it's tempting because we built it up and we were bringing our scene to London you know but now

actually we've got a new bowl coming that I can't reveal fully here but there's one coming it's in America hopefully actually were bringing our scene to london you know but now actually we've got a new bowl coming that i can't reveal fully here but there's one coming it's in america hopefully actually two but um people will be psyched you know and the capitol theater's one hard when we reopened it where porches or what even though they've been famous and now cranking you know we got neil young coming next week and um it's just happening. We just did Gary Clark Jr. for a couple nights.

And now once you build up a venue, same in Vegas, New York, then you get your email list. Once it gets to 100,000, which takes years. Like you announce a show, it sells. The socials are big. But when you start, it's at zero. That's hard. That sucks.

Just like being a band, I'm sure. Anyone's doing it. Starting at zero, hard. at zero. That's hard. That sucks. Just like being a band, I'm sure. Anyone's doing it. Starting at zero, hard. Sucks. Terrible feeling. But you build up. Lock-In, my festival. I want to talk about that too.

Yeah. It's happening now too. Look at the social. The socials. The email is big. North of 100. All these venues now are north of 100. It takes years.

Let's talk about Lock-In. Six, you know, to build it up. Because you do a certain thing where you have musicians collaborate together. Like, what is it for you to feel like it was a successful festival, other than numbers, musically? Like, what do you envision in the lineup? I can feel it. Yeah? Yeah, I'm just done this.

You know, that's why I've gotten pretty good at it. But what about the first couple years? Who were you booking the first couple years? How many years has Locke been? Six years. Six years. But we've done Grateful Dead kind of oriented stuff each year

in some way, but then we do other things. And the first year we did a cool thing. We had Zac Brown with String Cheese. The Zac Brown incident. But we've had like...

One thing we've done is not, like Derek's done it five years, Derek Trucks and Susan Testy. Spread does it too. Widespread's done it five years. Warren's done it, I think, five years. Keller, I think, has done it six years.

And Phil Lesch has done it five years. Bobby Weir's done it five years, I think. And we keep consistency. But then within, like, Widespread's done it five times. But one year with Jimmy Cliff. One year with Stevie Winwood. You know, one year now we've done it with Margo Price. Oh, yeah.

She's cool. She did Margo with Widespread. I saw that. Right. One year we did Widespread with Fogarty. Oh, that's sick. You know, we've done Petty. Like, I'm proud we don't change.

Or we change tweaks. Do bands do a solo set? Or they always have to play a collab? No, no. A lot do a solo. Sometimes there's an announced collab. Like, Twisted Mate did one with Taj Mahal. Cool.

It was pre-announced. Yeah. Sometimes it's surprise stuff. Yeah. Like, when Derek sat in with Omfrees. Yeah. You know? A lot of both.

And, like, it's just reflective of that same wetlands spirit and scene and like being at wetlands and we did a lot of collaborations it was loose it was like the soul eye bow live thing with guests like just that magic moment like it doesn't always work like that's what people want

and now these festivals the other festivals and like I went to Bonnaroo 10 times I love Bonnaroo but like they started doing more, you know, different kind of stuff. And so we went to try to be that, you know, that world, that scene, that music. There's room for a mega one, I think a big one. There's High Sierra and there were a lot of great ones

that are no longer around. All Good, Gathering of the Vibes, Waka Rooses of the world. There were a bunch that are not even here anymore. And luckily, you got to stick with it. It's hard. You're not going to make money your first year in a festival if you do it right. Get the right bands.

Build the infrastructure, the roads, the grass, the staging, the sound, the lights. You want to add these lights for the trees? Okay, that's another $25,000. You want to do it or not? You want to do it. It's better for the event, but it's hard. Like you lose,

you know, you got to lose money. The first. Yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah. Why'd you pick Virginia? And a second.

And the second. When did you start making money on lock? And the third. This was the first year you started making money? Yeah. Yeah. It takes a minute. Yeah.

All these things take a minute. One good thing is now, because it strengthens, the awareness builds. People now all know it, you know? And the lists and people are on the socials. But when you start, there's no awareness. Like one reason I love taking over Relics

and taking over the Capitol Theater and taking over Wellions is it's cluttered. It's really cluttered out there. It's busy. The world's busy. I actually am not sure. Like definitely fairly well couldn't have been what it was

if we had done it today, in the world today, in 2018. Because we did it in 2015. Different president, different climate. Yeah. Actually, I'll get to the detail of, like, Paris happened a month after the terror, you know, where then security at stadiums changed forever.

They're all airport scanners. We were the last event at soldier field without that. Oh, Wanda different vibe. What's the airport scanner. You know, you walk through the scanner versus just wanding. Oh,

okay. We were the last thing at soldier field without an airport scanner, different vibe, different energy makes a difference. I bet. And I don't even know where we were. No, but yeah. No, no.

It's a different community. 2018, you can't do the fair. Oh, the 15. Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. No, I got it. Brooklyn Bowl. Yeah.

To launch something new now. In 18 versus 09. Harder. Twitter, Instagram. Shit's faster. more shit flying around the political stuff we had a bit of an open you know

it was also the recession we're in like a ton of places and like and I was lucky I had the background I had the relationship with some of these bands or we'd be dead

and we almost died in Vegas because you open you have no good luck 80,000 square feet set on a strip 200 employees giant rent you have no social you have no good luck 80,000 square feet set on a strip 200 employees giant rent

you have no social you have no email you're not part of the big company that's like been doing it for years and so that got a little close and you just gotta make it past that moment

where you can get strong enough and your platform's big enough and your awareness big enough, where people know when they come to Vegas that there's a Brooklyn Bowl. Let's go see what's playing. But you don't have that for the first few years, plural. You got to build that awareness.

That's blocky and tackling. That's blue-collar promoting. And that sucks. It's hard. Let's promote this show. You got to do it. Got to do it. But good luck in Vegas when there's 100 shows every night

yeah it's true and you're up against MGM Caesars Live Nation AG they're huge Elton Rod Stewart

Backstreet Boys 10 Cirque shows the Michael Jackson good luck bro some balls on you fucking throw some fucking in the Vegas

dude okay let's talk I want to talk about Relics in 2018 like how hard is it like you were saying it's a fast moving everything is coming so quickly how hard is it to be about Relics in 2018. How hard is it? Like you were saying, it's a fast-moving, everything is coming so quickly. How hard is it to be a publication company in 2018? Listen, we've got the print thing.

What's cool about it is because we have that, we're getting Chris Stapleton. I'm just showing you the end of the cover. Because we have print still, we're getting that back. Here's something else. By the way, 10 years ago, back Chris Stapleton, Leon Bridges on a new cover, like they didn't want to be on a cover at all of Relics. Yeah. It's just not like, no thanks.

I didn't think the dead guys wanted to be on it. I mean, God bless Relics, but it just wasn't. And one cool thing is the scene, the dead, the scene has become cool. You know, we call it indie jam. Like, but look at the national guys doing a dead thing. Yeah. The dead thing, like Vampire Weekend we're hoping

is going to be on the next cover and we think that stuff touches the new relics but we still do the dead stuff but like that didn't happen before and there's room for there's no other music magazine everything else is gone

there's room for one but they do like movies and celebrity. We just do music. And by the way, a big part of what we do is the digital, is the website, is the email, is the socials and events. We have a conference now. We do shit around my other stuff. Thank you for letting me be on that, by the way.

Oh, we crushed that. Yeah, we raised a lot of money. So that's like, and you know what? Relics has a name, had one. I thought it had a good vibe and energy. And we were able to take that a little bit to a new place, but benefit from not starting at zero. Yeah. Same at the Capitol Theater.

Like hard, and it's important just in New York, but like we weren't starting at zero. Yeah. Same with the Capitol Theater. Like, hard, and it's important just for New York, but, like, we weren't starting at zero. And so, like, that's helpful, I think. And it's one, you know. What about when you're trying to take a risk on a new band, like putting them on, not on the cover, it's a little too risky to put them on the cover, but if you're taking a big push on a band,

what is, like, what is your way of breaking a band? If you believe in a band, what would be your tactics in breaking a band? They still got to hit the road. Yeah. Got to get in a van. I don't think that changes. No.

And start when you're young if you can. Yeah. I meet people sometimes. I met a kid who came in. He's like, I'm quitting college. I'm going to go do the band thing. I'm like, yo, bro, stay in college. Be in a band college i'm gonna go do the band thing i'm like yo bro stay in college be in a band in college then go do your thing you know because that's an opportunity yeah high school or college like when you're young because like that's like free time a

little bit you get some time get warmed up work on some stuff and young people you know and like that's the same thing like still get in the van i mean listen there's gonna be miracles where people just break off youtube and that's the new way you know that's certain kind of music that's the same thing. Still get in the van. I mean, listen. There's going to be miracles where people just break off YouTube and that's the new way. That's a certain kind of music that's less our scene. Yeah. A pop act can break through that way. We can't.

Right. We need to fight. And it's hard. You've got to fight. And one cool thing for me now is I'm able to just, you want to do a show? Like, okay, we can do it. We'll do a Wednesday.

Like, Saturday night we might hold for a national touring who can sell out the room or do 800 pay, whatever. But like, I have some ability to do that. Or you want to do something at Relics or be in it? Like, I'll just make a phone. Like, I can do that now. Yeah. We'll just make it happen.

You know, okay, you want to do a lot, you know? And listen, it can be tough because everyone wants the right Saturday night at the cab. Everyone wants now to be on lock and see now the changes were like at first at lock and we were begging everyone because we're early new festival agents like wow we don't really know about you or man yeah like the location by the way we were in the middle of central virginia yeah not easy no not easy um, it's cool to be on the other side. I used to, my friend used to book

the Bowery Ballroom in the 90s when I had Wetlands. Wetlands is one of the great rock clubs of all time, but it was famous for having not great sight lines. And Bowery Ballroom's got great sight lines. So I used to join. And Wetlands is beloved now, but then people are like, ah, but Bowery Ballroom

was like you know in 98 everyone wanted to be there and I was like yo bro you've got a good like you just answer the phone

and take holds no shit and you're 5'6 deep every day hole everyone wanted to play Bowery Ballroom Wetlands like

we gotta work we gotta go it's kind of like the baby young band like you gotta work and you gotta convince bands to play there and it's like you know it's cool now well and it's beloved but by the way when it goes away it becomes more beloved yeah exactly like cbgb yeah things are but like bowery like he he could it was just coming in and that's cool it's much easier obviously

yeah when it's coming in oh yeah and and that's easier like also at first locking like begging people to come you also gotta pay more yeah right

you want them okay here now they all wanna come and like that's where it switches yeah you know and we're still

but these festivals I don't sometimes frustrating fans don't realize like we price tickets based on what the bands need yeah these festivals don't make money.

They're tough. That's why they all get sold to Live Nation and AEG. There's really two companies in this business, Live Nation and AEG. And then there's a couple of indie guys, someone like me and this guy, Seth Hurwitz in DC. There's a company in Other Planet in San Francisco, but really two big companies.

And sometimes you wonder, why isn't there a third? And the reason is, I think, and I've been doing it. I've been on a show every night now for 20 years. So I have a little bit of a perspective. It's like, because there's no room for a third. It's not a great business. It's a tough business. Skimming.

Yeah, it's little. And so if there was a third, the little piece, when you put on a show, I did a show in Central Park the other day. It was good. Like you can lose a hundred or make 15. Yeah. That's the business. It's sexy and it's fun and it's rock and roll.

But like, that's why there's more people making like dental implants. I don't know where that came from. Is that the reason why you're doing seven nights, seven shows a night? Cause you have to, to make. You mean all over the place? All over the place. You know, it does help scale. Once you have some more. Yeah's easier because we cross market.

You know what I mean? Does Brooklyn Bowl try and help Relics? Does Relics help Lock-In? Does the Cap help Lock-In? Robert Plant loved the Cap. We got him to Lock-In. We could book him with both. Did it help that I got fairly well that I had the Cap where I was Phil Lesh, so I could go meet with Phil Lesh in person?

Yeah. Yes. Shit. I don't know. Yeah. It's actually, it's hard, the irony of business. And probably, and the same thing being in a band, and the same thing probably anyone out there being, right?

It's harder when you're little. Yeah. And when you're small. And like Wetlands was hard because you still needed a sound guy and a booking guy and a production manager and like a stage manager

and a box office person and a manager and a head of security and a lighting guy. Now, we're 600 cab. Maybe we could squeeze seven sometimes in here. But like the venue that's 1,200, you know, it's's double the capacity,

but it's not double the staff. It's still a sound guy and a lighting guy. Maybe there's an extra stage guy. But you get what I'm saying? You still need one box office, pretty much. So it's harder, particularly in live music. That size is much harder. And just in general, it's frustrating.

Because the bigger companies, that's why the big Comcast viacom amazon you know they it's easier for them you can't compete with that yeah and save a live nation age they could take a loss and be okay with it you got it bro or they can go to a band and say yo andy we're gonna book you 40 nights and we're going to give you 10 grand a night there's 400 you know so let's say another band a venue one guy came to you and he's got one show yeah he can offer you seven or even if he could offer you 12 yeah for one show you're gonna take the numbers yeah you got it yeah question though okay so same with beer deals same with beer Yo, bud, you want to do a deal for 40 venues in one meeting? Or do you want to have 40 different meetings?

No, just one. Call it out. Do you think the oversaturation of festivals is making bands draw less in festivals? And I'll let you go after this. Yeah, I won. The iPhone move wasn't too sad.

We've been doing good. An hour, buddy. Yeah, we're in. I'm doing it. I didn't even realize I was surprised that much time went by. Yeah, oversaturation. Do you think the festival scene is oversaturated? Yeah, but it'll be like

Darwinism. It'll naturally come back. But that happened from all these big the big companies and then block booking them where like live nation would be like okay we own these 10 festivals here uh you know who they do like eminem you'll do everyone or outcast remember a year ago they did everyone and i do that and then they all people have seen it already and like it blew up it's pulling pulling back. I think festivals will have to offer Coachella, Lala,

ACL. They're fine. Talk about mid-level festivals. The mid ones probably had trouble because there were more. They just popped big. Lock and went through. Are radius closets getting smaller for bands

because of that? Or actually bigger oh bigger yeah oh yeah yeah it's actually wider

more yeah probably where festivals if they struggle they're gonna broaden the radius clause they're gonna strengthen

that radius clause then they gotta pay the band more money though and then they gotta pay yeah but then they're managing that and look a couple festivals

like FYF festival I think it's called not the thing in California like they just cancelled it remember that is it Lost Lands

or Lost Lakes we just did Grand Duesy in Arizona oh yeah Superfly it was good I mean but they had like fucking

Kendrick and you know a lot of expensive bands I don't think it was it's a first year like you said so well Stevie comes back

but that one in Arizona it will come back Super 5s well they had that one in Arizona they did want it out oh yeah you know

it's hard yeah maybe some cities aren't just can't do a big time festival like that alright one last question

one last question it's a tough game you okay you're a festival you're booking a festival like that. All right, one last question. One last question. It's a tough game. You, okay, you're a, you're booking a festival. You could pick six bands, dead or alive,

three headline, actually, yeah, give me, give me nine bands, dead or alive, that you put on a festival. Do like three for each day.

I mean, I, to be honest, there's one show I'd like. One show. Go. I just feel like one show, one beer. Which one?

Led Zeppelin. Fuck yes. Nothing else I want to sit here and talk about. Really? I don't know if it'll happen, but if you ask me, like, what would I like to do? Just that. Zeppelin. Yeah, because that's the thing that hasn't happened.

Yeah. Pete Shapiro, you said it all my man thank you dude good to see you thanks for always booking me love you brother love you hi this is mike in united baggage claim i'm looking for a mr andy frasco. This is in reference to a baggage claim ticket reference number 3685J. We have located a bag that looks like the bag that you had reported lost. The contents are several Los Angeles Lakers jerseys, a couple of LeBron James signed photographs, and three butt plugs. Just wanted to make sure that we have the correct bag. Please give us a call back at 1-800-235-5757 to claim your bag.

Thank you. And there we have it. Great interview. Wow. Go live your fucking dreams I'm out Dude, I'm telling you man That's like fucking

What's that movie Blindside? You were really inspired And then you were like Penis of Poo is by Sandra Bullock Oh yeah, alright You know Sandra Bullock Man, that made that put me up.

Yeah. He listened to me. He said I asked hard questions. Oh, yeah? Yeah. It's a great interview. He's smart as fuck. Yeah.

I was really proud of that interview. But, yeah, I learned a lot about the music scene, though. Because, you know, he's a tastemaker. He's the guy who will put you on the map I remember when you were talking with Kunj and

yeah Don Strasberg yeah and Strasberg they were talking he's just his he's just as big just east coast exactly

yeah exactly but I think Kunj was talking about Shapiro and just saying that guy just kills it and you know

it's ridiculous yeah that we had him on the World Saving Podcast. Thank you. We're getting big acts. Mr. Shapiro. We got a lot of big, I got pigeons. I just, I'm doing an interview with them.

Yeah. These guys are dope. It's been cool to kind of talk with them a little bit. I got Billy Martin from the Desky Martin Wood coming on. What? Yeah, we got some cool guys who listen to the podcast. Like, hey, I want to be on your show. I'm like, fuck yeah. Yeah. But guys who listen to the podcast like hey I want to be on your show I'm like fuck yeah but guys thanks for listening

thank you Annabelle if you listened to this thank you Cloud9 but that's it jam scene on seven more nights with the Pigeons band I'm excited I'm going to test shit out I love these guys these guys are sitting in with us now we finally broke the barrier because when you're an opening band

it's like bring it on. There's one band with their clique and their fucking outfits. The other band with their outfits. It's like that meme, Power Rangers and Ninja Turtles looking at each other. Like, hey, the fuck. That's how it is when it's like that. And it's not because we're all alphas. And maybe we are.

But we just don't know each other not because we're all alphas and maybe we are but it's we just don't know each other all we know is from Jam Crew so now that we got to be friends with them and now we're like okay tonight was the first night that we're all like

let's jam let's be homies let's fucking throw the best party we can together while we're with each other so it's teaching me a lot about myself and

I'm just happy that they gave me the opportunity And I'm just happy that they gave me the opportunity. And I'm just happy that I took the risk on losing a bunch of money to play with a band that's this dedicated to their craft. So it was fucking awesome. This is great. Yeah.

Live your dreams. Live your dreams. Or else. Take risks. Because I didn't expect. I'd be. Take risks. Because I didn't expect, you know, I'd be in an opening band. I didn't,

I knew I expected not a lot of people watching us at first. But now, word's out. They've been helping me promote. And it's just like, it gives me,

it makes me proud to be part of this scene. And people having my back. Because I have their back just as much. That's dope. Yeah. Follow the podcast. Support us. Subscribe us. out to be part of this scene and people having my back because I have their back just as much. Follow the podcast. Support us. Subscribe us.

We would love that. Give us ratings on the iTunes. And we got verified. We are fucking verified, guys. Follow me, too. I am Yeti. Find him a girlfriend or a boyfriend or both. Get him something I do just fine on my own, thank you

Yeah, that girl you've been running around with She's pretty hot, she looks like Steven Tyler She's like a hot She's like a girl Steven Tyler Fucking asshole Have a good day guys Thanks for showing up Yeti, I love you buddy Love you too

Steven Tyler Well thank you for listening to episode 24 Have a good day, guys. Thanks for showing up, Yeti. I love you, buddy. Love you, too. Bye. Steven Tyler. Steven Tyler. Well, thank you for listening to episode 24 of Andy Fresco's World Saving Podcast with Yeti. Produced by Andy Fresco, Yeti, Joe Angelhow, and Chris Lawrence. Please subscribe and rate the show on iTunes and Spotify so we can make this a worldwide phenomenon. For info on the show, please head to our Instagram at Fresco

and Yeti. For more info on the blog and tour dates, head to andyfresco.com For more information on our guest Peter Shapiro, please head to relics.com r-e-l- to relics.com, r-e-l-i-x.com,

suck it to me, suck it to me, and brooklynbowl.com. And yes, they are LEED certified green. Listen to Andy's new single, Up Down, on repeat. Head to all digital platforms where music streaming is available. The new single, Up Down. This week's special guests are Dolph Cohen, Ari Findings and pigeons playing ping pong.

May this week make your pee alliterate beautifully. And remember, a pink, puffy, painful, perspiring, appealing penis is not pleasant. Stay healthy. See you next week.