Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast - EP 50: Mike Cooley (Drive By Truckers) & Danger Ehren McGhehey (Jackass)

Episode Date: June 25, 2019

Episode 50 is live and it's a heater. Danger Ehren and Andy start the show wasting no time... things get heavy they talk about how Danger nearly died... a lot. Mike Cooley is on the interview hour. They dive into the Drive By Truckers history. It's a great hang and we're happy to still be here with y'all after 50 episodes. Tell the world: we're still here, kickin it. Follow us on Instagram @worldsavingpodcast For more information on Andy Frasco, tour dates, the band and the blog, go to: AndyFrasco.com The views discussed on this podcast do not necessarily reflect those of the guests. Keep up to speed with our pal, Mike Cooley & the Drive By Truckers at www.drivebytruckers.com Get some Danger in your life, follow him on twitter @dangerehren Check out Andy's new album, "Change Of Pace" on iTunes and Spotify Produced by Andy Frasco Joe Angelhow Chris Lorentz Audio mix by Chris Lorentz Featuring: Beau Gunn Brian Schwartz Dolav Cohen Arno Bakker 

Hey, it's Schwartz. Listen, reminder, uh, Mountain Jam Saturday set is family friendly. We agree to it in the contract. You can't curse. You can't finger the sacks. You can't air fuck. You can't do mushrooms on stage. You can't do most of your shit. So you better come up with, uh, some alternative set plans. Um, just please, this is, again, put it on your podcast. I don't care. Respect the kids. Make some balloons for them or something. Okay?

Thanks. Bye. And now, at 4 a.m. on a Tuesday night. One more verse. One more verse. Here in this bar since 1803. There's been some characters coming around here. That aren't you or me.

Way back in the 50s and the 60s. Don't you know? This bar was full of spies. Steve, you know what you know. This bar was full of spies. It goes in. It's only 30 miles from that Iron Curtain. It's true.

That's what my Italian friend said to me. It's David Schicchi with the great mustache. He's not a Super Mario, brother. But he looks a whole lot like me. But he looks a whole lot like him, you see. Luigi! Luigi! Luigi! I see my light come shining.

Mario! From the west out to the east. Come on, Luigi! Luigi! From the west out to the east Come on, Ricky! The Rangers! Any day now Any day now I shall be Ricky Yeah!

I love you, Ricky. I love you, Andy. Oh, shit! And we're here, Portland, Oregon. Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast. I am your fearless leader, Mr. Andy Frasco. This is a very special day for me because we have Danger Aaron. What the fuck?

Did you really get a nickname? Why did you call Danger Aaron? What the fuck? Did you really get a nickname? Why did you call Danger Aaron? Well, to be honest, one time when I was a kid, I didn't have a Halloween costume, so I wore all of my prior injury things like my neck brace and my arm sling,

and I went as Danger Aaron for Halloween. And then I showed up for the first time we ever went filming for Jackass, and I showed up in my Danger Aaron for Halloween. And then I showed up for the first time we ever went filming for Jackass and I showed up in my Danger Aaron outfit. Explain to the audience what that is. Oh, actually, it was just a jumpsuit with a shitty helmet that I painted scars on the back and that's pretty much that was it. What did Jackass teach you now that you're older and out of it?

Oh, I mean, we're never out of it, are we? Never. Like, I mean, it's not like I can go back and say I didn't, you know, do all the things I did. I'll always be a part of it. Were you partying? How did you get through the pain? Were you taking drugs and shit? No, most of the time I was like, well, I drank a lot.

That was something. And then, you know, smoke weed. That was something. And then, you know, smoke weed. But like in the 90s when opioids and all the drugs that were going out with the doctors that were insane like that. So I knew as a kid when I broke my neck for the first time when I was 18 that I was going to have a long haul and it was going to be a wild ride. So I basically just chose to not take the Vic in and stuff that the doctors gave me because- That bus just saved your life.

It did. Because you would have been on my airwaves. I've had 27 surgeries now. So like imagine each one of those where you- 27 surgeries, Aaron? Yeah, I've broken my neck three times. From what? The stunts you're doing on Jackass?

All the stuff. Everything. Yeah. What do you love about it? What keeps you breaking your neck? Oh, I don't like breaking my neck whatsoever.

That's the worst. The worst thing. Like, that's not the joyous part of it. It's, you know, the entertainment. Like, I like to entertain people, but more than that,

like, you know, we just go through life like doing the same thing over and over again. Like, we put the banana peel in the trash can and then it goes away. But there's so many things we could do

with the banana peel and with the trash can before it goes away. You just have to be creative. And that was what inspired me the most is I wanted to be creative and do weird stuff that people weren't doing and then make them just kind of like stop and look and be like, well.

What's your banana peel? What do you think your banana peel is? And what's your trash can? I mean, I could wipe my ass with the banana peel and then lick the banana peel. That's a skit. And then throw it and then jump into the trash can and then float down the river. So you want to use every part of life. Yeah.

You know, we're talking about this, this cyborg idea you're telling me. Yeah. Explain to the audience a little bit more about this. So you're thinking that our bodies, it's all about our consciousness. And our consciousness, we can record that on a hard drive? So our consciousness is who we are as a person. And that's based on our memories and our ethics and our morals. And from those, we choose then what we are going to choose for our future choices.

Like if you woke up tomorrow from a coma or you're in a coma, you just woke up at a hospital, who are you? Like what is – you don't know who you are. So what good is the body for anyways? You don't need your body. You just need your consciousness. And you can create those conscious memories and the ethics and morals, record them, put them on a hard drive. And then from that, you can base what choices you will make in the future because that's what we do. We go to sleep, wake up the next day, and we make choices based on who we are.

We're not all of a sudden just going to start doing crack cocaine unless, you know, like something crazy happens. I mean, we do what we do because of who we are from our memories. Duncan Trussell talks about this a little bit, where like every time you put something in your body, it's kind of like if you're smoking or something, it's just these energies. And all these energies are in different levels. Like if you drink, if you eat enough protein, all that builds up.

If you smoke too much, that builds up and then turns into cancer. It's kind of the same thing with consciousness. Like you're learning throughout your life. Yeah. Is that, but like what made you think this way? Were you in like, were you broken? Like is your body giving up? Like what made you think this way? Were you in like, were you broken? Like was your, is your body giving up? Like what do you think?

Yeah, well that inspired a lot of like motivation like to work on this more rapidly. But since I was a child, like I grew up in a mortuary for 12 years. My dad is a mortician and I saw so much death that I realized that the human body will not survive. It will eventually fail no matter who you are or what you've done. And so I started trying to document and create as much as I could so that I could then have

some... So I didn't know technology was going to be able to suffice what I believe is possible. But technology has – it just – basically, I think that technology in our lifetime will be available that we will be able to like exist without our bodies and be conscious about who we are based on all the memories and everything that floats around as information through the web or whatever it be. We don't, like the earth is not going to survive forever. The earth is like, it won't last maybe another 50 years. So how do you survive in a human body when you can't breathe air, when you can't drink water because it's poison? You can't go to Mars. You can go anywhere in the universe with information and memory. And you create

the information. You can live through yourself from the memories that you've already experienced. And other people's memories also. That's what all this is. Why do people go on Instagram? They want to see people's lives. But now you can live it. Be there.

It's like Terminator. It's way gnarlier than Skynet. It is though. Okay, it's like Terminator. It's way gnarlier than Skynet. It is, though. Like, okay, here's an idea. What about... I wanted to write this down. I'm going to do something with this, but here's an idea. Why did fucking the Terminators, why did the robots turn on us?

We created these things. At what point did they say, fuck you, and start turning on us? How many years went by before they were made? It didn't just happen overnight. It wasn't like they did Skynet. They had this arm, and then all of a sudden, which, by the way, came from the future. Yeah. So how do you even know that time travel doesn't already exist?

Do you think time travel exists? Of course it does. It doesn't in our... In this existence for us, maybe. But someday... Have you ever met a time traveler? Well, when I was in college, my thesis paper was on time travel. It was a persuasion class, and my goal was to persuade people to believe that time travel exists.

It will be possible. Of course it is. Just like the earth is round and it's not flat. Just because we don't know something doesn't mean it's not possible. The truth is time travel is possible. We're just looking at it the wrong way. Like the speed of light at 186,000 miles per second. We don't create that direction or we don't get that velocity in one direction. If you were to take a train and put it on track, on the track, and you took two different trains and you went 100 miles an hour the one way and 100 miles the other way, how much force is on that track?

200. So we can take all these different dimensions directions and force all that into one big giant 186,000 miles per second then the molecules will split and time basically could stop

but we don't know I don't know how to control it like I don't have a flux capacitor nor do I have a DeLorean I got a bitching Camaro though maybe that's fucking that would be the real version of the DeLorean

is my fucking 1970 Camaro that says danger for the plates. Do you have any regrets? No, most of my regrets come from, or any regrets usually come from not doing something. Yeah. Like, that's sad. Do you regret fucking up your body on this jackass stuff? Oh, I mean, I was already busting on myself apart, you know, probably since birth. I came out backwards with the umbilical cord wrapped around my throat.

So this is just always, what? Yeah, I died when I was born. Hello. Damn. Yeah. Really? That's true? That's true. So maybe that's this like sense of fearlessness ever since you were born because you've already died.

I don't know. Deep thoughts. You might die twice. I've already died. I don't know. Deep thoughts. You might die twice. I've already died more than twice. Can you tell me the experience of when you died? What did it feel like? What happened? Explain. The one that was the scariest.

I was skydiving. I never went skydiving before. The parachute didn't work. Then the guy was going in a G4 spiral. Then he cut that parachute. I thought I was going to die for sure. DMT released into my brain, 100% true. And I lived my entire life from birth, basically, from my last first memory all the way through as if in five seconds, I lived 40 years. Vividly, every one of those experiences, pretty much.

And then at the very end, I let go. Did you black out? So here's the thing about life is when you reach the point at which you no longer can have it is that the one thing that we all should live for is to be able to let go.

Like if you can let go peacefully, then you're successful. You can go to whatever heaven is you think because you're able to let go of the conscious, like who you were. You were like, I'm a happy person. I did a good job. I did right.

It's the people that are constantly talking about or doing crazy stuff that's like hurtful to other people. And they can't let go on their last breath and just say, you know, I did it right. They're thinking, I fucked that person. I fucked over that person. I fucking, I'm a horrible person. And no matter how much gold you have or how much whatever, everything, none of that matters. or how much, whatever, everything.

None of that matters. It's about that last breath to be able to let go and truly say I did the best I could as a human being. I'm a good person, and that's it. And that's all it is. Did you feel like you're a good person when you're having that last moment? So when I was taking my last breath, dying with no control, I let go, and I was at peace. But then this thought in my head triggered

where i said the worst thing is or i was like but i didn't get to say bye it my way like i because i have this idea that i'm like you know um privileged enough to be able to say goodbye to the world what was your way well what how'd you want to say goodbye i just i wanted to be able to say goodbye to the world. What was your way? Well, what, what, how'd you want to say goodbye? I just, I wanted to be able to say goodbye to everybody that I know, like, and just be like,

I love you. It was great. What I like, I'll see you again through energy, but it was instead just me dying and people die every day, all day long. Like, and they never get that last chance to say,

and I felt like that that was huge that was the one thing that i pretty much couldn't let go of and then i lived and then you lived he pulled the chute the reserve chute what'd he say was he talking dude his name they they they paired me up with this dude and our weights matched to do a tandem because I'd never skydived in my life and I haven't since. I'm not going to. I don't need to. I already experienced it to its max. Think about it. I can't do it any gnarlier.

I mean, I'm sure, but not. Why would I? I pretty much died and survived. He pulls the chute and we go into a G4 spiral. It's tangled up. And then my eye pops. It was like spies like us when they're in the G-forces. And I'm screaming, oh, shit.

And he's like, oh, shit. And then he cuts the parachute after about four seconds of us in the spiral because he couldn't focus because it was so G-force. It was 170 miles per hour as a human being floating down. How long is this taking? But then also rotating. You understand? Yeah.

You're going 170 miles straight down, but then also rotating at another 50 miles an hour. It was like, oh, it lasted. That lasted for about four seconds uh and then he cut it and then that's when i was conscious enough to like be like fuck this is it this is it i'm gonna die strapped to a dude whose name was steve-o i'm not even kidding his nickname was steve-o and they had no idea i was even coming there that day. Oh, my God.

There you go. I survived. He pulled the chute. What did he say? He pulled the reserve. It worked. And he starts screaming, we're going to live. We're going to live.

And I'm like, what the fuck? Holy shit. Are you serious? Yeah. And then at 100 feet above the ground, I would have jumped if I had to. And I broke my yeah and then and then like at 100 feet above the ground i would have like i would have jumped if i had to and i broke my legs and everything and survived because that's how gnarly we drove we jumped from 15 000 feet i fucking our parachute the second reserve didn't deploy until i think 4 000 which means we had like 11,000 fucking free fall to halfway.

And then my girlfriend at the time, she was tied to this other dude doing a tandem. And she said, that guy's like, uh-oh, that's not good. And they watched us fall to our death. And then the reserve came out, boom, and we lived. And when I got to the ground, I grabbed the biggest handful of dirt like that was in the field and I ate it. And I didn't just chew it, I swallowed it biggest handful of dirt that was in the field and I ate it. And I didn't just chew it.

I swallowed it. All of it. Because I was so happy to be alive that I just wanted to eat the earth. Are you fucking serious? I'm dead dog serious. Are you fucking Until next time, Andy. The stories will be vaulted.

Okay. Oh my god. Let's will be vaulted. Okay. Oh, my God. Let's leave it at this. So from that, do you have better relationships with everyone that you care about since you died once? I already feel like I did. I already had this feeling of just do the best you can, you know, be good. So

I'm, I'm grateful for every moment. We all should be, who knows what's going to happen. Wow. We're, we're fucking ants on a hill. Wow.

We're not even standing on the beach in the universe. Aaron. Think about how many grains of sand there are. I say that, let's say it's true. It's a fucking many, many, many, many, many, an infinite amount of universes and possibilities.

And we're on this one called Earth in this Milky Way. Are you still happy? Are you happy right now? I don't know. What is happy? Yeah. You can make yourself be happy doing whatever.

Like you can be happy in prison. Yeah. There's a lot of people that aren't in prison that aren't happy. Yeah. You can make yourself be happy doing whatever. Like, you can be happy in prison. Yeah. There's a lot of people that aren't in prison that aren't happy and there's, you know. I saw you smiling

at our show tonight. Hell yeah, I smiled the whole time. I feel like I got TMJ lockjaw something because my laughing's so hard. That was a wild time. All right.

Go Blazers. Go Blazers. One more thing. That DMT thing. Oh yeah. When the DMT went into your brain when you're about to die. Have you ever taken recreational DMT? No, I have never taken it.

But I talked to and I researched a bunch about it. And it's what happened. It releases in your brain. It's an endorphin or whatever. I can't dip the balls deep is the name of it. Dip the balls deep. But it's actually in your body. And I think it's in almost every living thing is what I don't know for sure.

But if, if you think about it, it's in plants and they've found it. That's how we make it synthetically and stuff. But I don't suggest doing it frequently, but it would be a good thing to know that this is real. That when you experience something you can't normally experience without hallucinogenics, I guess, at some point, or by nearly dying, that it would really shock people to like take it more seriously i think yeah like not as like a thing to do all the time but like you know taking a test like you pass the test

you get to survive yeah yeah aaron thanks for being on the show um i'll see you on the road i'll see you on the road rocket hey hold on one thing yeah if you could tell 18 year old or 20 year old Aaron what 40 year old Aaron knows now what would you tell him oh man I would say honestly

to be without joking or anything I would just say don't have surgery just take the time to let it heal properly honestly, to be without joking or anything, I would just say, don't have surgery. Just take the time to let it heal properly over, you know. Like when you're 18 years old and you're a pro snowboarder, you want to get back on the, you know, the shred, brah. Yeah. And so you don't have a surgery. Like I would just say, holy shit, man.

Slow it down a little bit maybe back then because what you do with your body will live with you for until you don't until you die yeah i'm 42 i've had 27 surgeries i'm fucking jacked but um but it's also not a bad thing because it's helped me be more healthy. Like I don't drink, I don't smoke, and I don't do anything other than marijuana. And so I maybe would be a fucking not so healthy of a person if I had the ability to not just get wasted all the time. It hurts too much to wake up hungover.

And cigarettes killed me after all that time. I bet. So anyways. Love you, buddy. Safety first. I'm glad you have a good head on your head. Oh, yeah. And I'm glad you're fucking staying healthy.

Yeah, but how about my shoulders, eh? Later, buddy. Andy. Andy Frasco. Hey, Dave School's here. You know, your old buddy, your producer. Look, I hear that you've got Mike Cooley of the Drive-By Truckers on the podcast this week. Great job. You know, I'm going to take the introduction right out of your hands because, you know, you might bobble it, kind of like the Golden State Warriors did.

Anyway, Mike Cooley, Patterson Hood, together for years, now along with the rest of the drive-by truckers, weaving a web of goodwill and great songwriting around the world. You know, don't ask Mike about growing up in Alabama. He's got nothing to say on the subject. Don't ask Mike about his shenanigans in the old fan days. You know, we've all been there. Do we really need to go over this again? Anyway, let's hear some truth.

Let's hear some goodwill. Let's hear about it from Mike Cooley, right here on the World's Saved Podcast. Blowing from the red square light. Gates at the border being slammed down tight We're moving into the perilous night, my friend Something's got a hold of a feel alright And we're fucking here with Mike Cooley. Out of control in the appetite Wow.

Birmingham, Alabama. What made you come out here? Well, I grew up in the Shells area, Muscle Shells area, just up in the northwest corner. And ended up here. I met my wife in a college town south of here in Auburn. And we ended up settling here. I was starting to get on the road. We moved out of state for a while and Drive-By Truckers was getting started. We were on the road all the time but not really making

any money yet. Yeah, I know that feeling. So how many shows were you doing a year in the beginning years? A bunch. A couple hundred? Close to it, yeah. Were you booking yourself and stuff? For a while. Yeah, for a good while and that was, of course, in a van,

sleeping on the floors of the kindness of strangers. So yeah, we ended up back here. She was a lot happier being close to home. So you met her in Birmingham? Yeah, well, in a college town in Auburn. At a show? Kind of, yeah. We were playing a house party.

Oh, nice. Were you guys doing a lot of house parties? Because you guys were, I mean, you guys have like punk influences. Oh, yeah, yeah. In your music. Like, is that what you were listening to early on? Didn't you start a project with Patterson about a punk project early, early on? Yeah, we started playing together in 85.

In 85? Yeah. We've been doing this a long time. Y'all haven't killed each other? well we came close so what was that right around the time i met my wife we were about to kill each other what happened uh well we were trying to be roommates we'll never do that again oh yeah why why do you why do you think you say that because you live with him on the road and then like you have no yeah at this at this point we're uh we weren't in a good place back then. The band we had had just called it quits. We weren't really planning on calling it quits.

It just kind of happened, and we were just kind of floundering. We didn't know where to go then or how to find our voice or where we fit in. And so the frustration was just eating away at us. Was it like, what kind of frustration? Was it like you're not making any money? Were you guys kind of sleep deprived from boozing and fucking being on the road? And I was going toward my late 20s. I don't think anybody's happy.

That's true, right? Why do you think that is? I have no idea, man. But 27 is that magic age that kills so many of us. Yeah. Do you think it's like we we thought we were gonna be somewhere yeah i think it is you know you you you you you feel like you're supposed to have your shit together yeah and if you don't you feel like you failed and there's no hope for you you know i don't know but it's but like how many years were

you touring you're like oh this, this ain't working? Well, we never did back then. We didn't really start touring for real until we started Drive-By Truckers in like 96. The band we had, it was called Adam's House Cat, we just pretty recently put out the one record we made. It was Lost in the... Hold on, so you never released it? No, it was Lost in the Vault you never released no no it was lost in the vaults

for years where was it it turned it turned up in the studio in athens georgia david barbie studio where we uh have done most of our recording and we still don't know for sure how it got there because we recorded in muscle shoals muscle shoals sound got bought by Malico out of Jackson, Mississippi. Malico's facility got destroyed by a tornado. Are you serious? All of a sudden, the tapes were right under our nose. It's like finding a fucking, like a hidden treasure, dude. We're pretty sure Patterson's dad probably brought them with him. Yeah?

And just forgot he did it. Handed them off to somebody at the studio. So what's it feel like, like, now that you're, like, deep, like a really heavy musician, hearing those tracks from when you were a kid? Was it fun? It was fun. I was 24. Does it still resonate with you?

Oh, sure, yeah. Okay, dude, that's dope. We've done a few shows. Our old drummer, we got back together with him. Until then. How was that? Oh, it was great, man. I've seen him like twice maybe since the band quit.

Really? In 90, around 1990, 91. And it was great. We got together with him. We're going to do it again pretty soon. We're doing like a long kind of residency thing at the Brooklyn Bowl. What happened, you think? I don't know.

We never really knew how to go about getting a band on the road back then. We didn't really have anybody around that could tell us how to go about it. And, of course, back then there was no internet. So you couldn't just build a website, put your stuff online, and build an audience that way. You pretty much had to go through the channels. None of the labels wanted to touch us. Really?

Oh, no, no. There were a few people that tried to manage us some good, I mean, capable, well-meaning people, and they couldn't do anything for us. What do you think it was, though? Do you think it's just the scene you're in, like that punk rock fucking songwriter, you know, like that? Because was Wilco like that too early? Maybe. Well, they were still Uncle Tupelo.

Yeah, yeah. When we were doing this, we opened for them once and didn't know who the hell they were. They were like on their very first record, very first tour. The record hadn't taken off yet. It's fucking funny, man. But that's how it is. You know, when you're doing these,

it's not as like, all right, we're on tour with this one band for two months. It's like, all right, we're doing these, basically these one-offs with all these other bands and just try to build kind of like guerrilla marketing. Yeah, I mean, I don't know if ourselves, and there are a lot of other people you can say this for too, not necessarily bands, but comedians, actors, and whatnot,

that probably wouldn't have built an audience and had a career if it weren't for being able to go directly to the people online. Yeah. That trying to break into television or try to get a label to give you a deal or get studio time. You know, it just wasn't going to happen for everybody. We were one of those, you know. Yeah, it's fucking crazy. It just takes time for a band that's a good live band

who has great songs, have these, like, grassroot following. You know, it's like, we're never, my band, too, I've been doing 250 shows a year for 13 years straight and, like, just, you And just fucking grinding and grinding. And now, after 13 years, we're starting to see a fan base that is diehard. Oh, yeah. And I feel like, is that the way to go? Is just keep touring?

Well, it's for us. Yeah, I mean, we've got this really dedicated fan base. They follow everything we do. They've kind of become a community among themselves. Yeah, I see the chat rooms and shit, dude. They fucking analyze everything. Everything. Is that pressure?

Only if you pay too much attention to it. I try, you know, I think we see it through a completely different lens than the audience and the fans. Sometimes I try to look through their lens and I just don't know what I'm looking at. No, totally.

I don't even recognize it. Who takes it more to heart, you or Patterson? He probably follows it more than I do or keeps up with it. I hardly ever have a look at what everybody's saying. And I'm glad. That's their thing. They have fun with it. I hardly ever have a look at what everybody's saying. That's their thing. They have fun with it. That's great. I don't need it in my head.

We're already thinking too much. I listen to your lyrics, bro. You're thinking, bro. Yeah, I would be. If I went and read that stuff every day, I'd be so self-conscious I'd never be able to walk out there. I know, dude. That's what it is.

Why do you, I mean, like. It's like, damn it, that was a great show. You all agree it's a great show, but you're fixated on the one song I forgot the words in. And they'll do that. Not the 15 that I played perfectly, you know. It's so true. People are so, they don't realize they all it's i mean this is that troll um generation we're like it's not like saying trolling is a bad thing it's more like

everything is on a mic it's human nature it's really human nature the um the thing that i found and everybody who does this if you do enough interviews with anything that's going to appear in print or text, I guess I should say, no matter how many great answers you give, no matter how many really smart things you say, the one kind of controversial, sensational, or kind of dumb, the cuff joke you make yeah is good that's going to be the headline that's going to be in the bull print that's going to be their clickbait yeah the kind of the dumbest thing you said even if you didn't say anything that dumb they're going to find the dumbest fucking thing that came out of your mouth yeah and that's going to be what that's going to be what and but you going to be what, and, but you know, the press does that, but you go, when the people are left to their own devices, they do the same fucking

thing. That's why the press does it. Yeah, exactly. It's giving, you know, it's giving the people what they want. Do you think it's less of a miscommunication now that there's like audio, audio senses of news instead of just when it was just like interviews where you read the words when you're reading it you don't have the benefit of tone of voice and body language if it's video so yeah some of that does get lost I think the context really gets lost if you don't have the

benefit of tone of voice I didn't realize how much we communicate that way you know like if you can hear my if you can hear my voice or see me expressing it you know if i'm joking yeah or if you're just reading it you might not yeah that's that well that's the thing it's the same thing when people just read your lyrics yeah you know like they don't know if you're just having like a comedic satire with yourself or if you're really this sad you know like No one knows. That's the beauty of it. If I'm actually able to get it on paper and I like it and I feel strong enough

about it, I'm usually feeling pretty good. Regardless, if I'm actually feeling that bad, I'm not creative at all. Do you think self-sabotage for the sake of making us feel good in our art, do you think that's a way of us like coping and releasing what whatever suppression we have in our body maybe yeah yeah

it's crazy i mean writing songs now that are more meaningful to me instead of writing songs for fans and trying to write songs for myself more yeah and like you and like these are really sensitive it's that's a hard thing to do. When I'm going through, like I have been lately, going through these dry spells, it's when I'm breaking all my own rules. It's when I'm thinking all the wrong things. What are you thinking? Well, one of the greatest quotes, and I keep this out in the front

all the time, I heard Neil Young say it once, is people don't want to hear a song I think is cool. They want to hear a song I wrote. Wow. That's absolutely true. And that's the self-sabotage. I start thinking too much about how is this going to come across? Oh, so you're thinking the finished product. Yeah. Are people going to like this?

Do I think it's cool? Is it the kind of song? Does it sound like I want to sound right now? Until I can shut that up and just do it, it's not going to happen. Yeah. I'm just breaking all my own rules. Yeah, and that's, in a sense, freeing, right? Yeah.

Because when I'm trapped of thinking like, oh, the fans are going to like this, then I don't become full expressive of the artists I want to be. You're either not going to do anything at all, or it's just going to be garbage. It's going to be that thing you look at the next day and go, oh, my God, what was I thinking? Did you have any bad experience, like records, where you're thinking like, oh, I tried to write this record for the fans Like looking back at your discography

There's probably several songs that Like which ones? There are songs that I let go on records That I kind of wish I'm not ashamed I put them out there I'm not ashamed of them at all I think it would have been a better record If I'd left a few off you know

Because you know I mean Especially if you're up to like 17 tracks, you know. You put 17 tracks on a record? At least one. Oh my God. Yeah. Mike, that's awesome, dude. I don't know how the balls would do that. About five of them probably could have.

And, you know, you kind of need, you need B-sides, you need outtakes because the way people follow you now and consume stuff, they kind of like to have something new, something different coming out all the time. I think when CDs became the format, all of a sudden it was just unlimited. You weren't limited to two sides of a record. So everybody started going a little nuts. But then they made two Vitals, so it was like four. Yeah, and now everybody's kind of pulling started going a little nuts. But then they made two Vitals, so it was like four. Yeah, yeah.

And now everybody's kind of pulling it back a little bit. It's like, no, man. Remember when some of those great albums had like eight songs on them? Yeah. You can still do that. Why do you think we need to like overgive in a record? I've started realizing that now. I think fans stay more engaged if you can just put a single out.

Yeah. Unannounced every now and then. Or have something that comes out. Have a few outtakes from a record. Do you think that's just like the ADD generation? Maybe. No one can pay attention longer than a fucking minute. Oh, I know.

In these videos and stuff. Yeah. Pop music's being just engineered for streams. Yeah. And it's getting shorter and shorter and shorter. Yeah. It's crazy. Why do you think, where do you think pop music is going in the next fucking time?

Oh, I don't know. I don't really follow it. Sometimes it's kind of fun, you know. Yeah. It's, you know, I think the best movie about the music business has probably been that stupid Josie and the Pussycats. I love that movie because so much of it nails it. What, just the backside end of the music industry?

I got to look at that. Oh, it's hilarious. But it came out in the 90s. I know. It's terrible, but it's terrible in all the right ways. You think it's still resonant? We're really at a point where most of the big pop hits you're hearing are written by one or two guys. Yeah.

You know? It's true. It's all kind of been boiled down to that. Wouldn't you love to be one of those one or two guys for a minute? You know? Can we talk about Muscle Shoals? Yeah. So, like, were you there? Like,? Can we talk about Muscle Shoals? Yeah. So, like, were you there?

Like, were you guys recording? Because that was a big deal, like, in the 70s, right? In the 60s? Yeah, the early to mid-60s is when it really got rolling. So, you got in there in the 80s when things were kind of slowly slowing down? Yeah. So. They were still recording.

They were still having some hits. But, of course, the 80s. Which ones in the 80s? Does Aretha still do anything over there? Not there, I don't think. I mean, they were – well, they did all the Bob Seger records there. That was mostly late 70s into the 80s. And then there were some of those really lush kind of top 40 pop hits like Torn Between Two Lovers and things like that were done there.

I can't remember what else. But the heyday was definitely winding down. So what was the mentality there? Like survive? Like, hey, I need to get bands in there hourly? It was, well, they were in, they had a publishing company there as well. Fame and Muscle Shelter Sound both had publishing companies. Did they give you a publishing deal?

Not us, no. You just recorded there? Yeah. Yeah, we were allowed to basically use the studio when it wasn't being booked and pay the engineer. Oh, so it'd be like graveyard shifts and shit? Oh, yeah. Yeah, all night.

Yeah. Oh, dude. How are you staying up? Are you guys doing like blowing shit not then nothing no yeah not like we were like that was like the time where you're still like really excited oh yeah yeah i was in my early 20s and yeah it was just we we were just having a blast yeah and it was kind of hard but it took us months to finish. Working during the day and then recording at night? Yeah, we had lousy service industry day jobs that didn't pay much.

You and Patterson? Yeah. So that's been your guy forever. Yeah. Dude. So is there any songs that Patterson wrote that you'd want to sing that you relate to so much because you lived with the guy for so long, or vice versa?

There was one on, what album was that? How many records do you guys have now? About 13 or so, 13, 14. Fuck! It's crazy. Yeah, I did end up singing one of his songs. We haven't done it much live. I keep forgetting about it, but yeah, it was on the English Oceans record a one of his songs. We haven't done it much live.

I keep forgetting about it. But yeah, it was on the English Oceans record a couple of records ago. Because people tell me that, here's a quote, Isabel said this, Cooley pretty much gives everybody shit about everything. Talk to me about that. Are you very particular about how the sound should be,

how the band should be, how you tour? I don't really know which particular shit he's referring to. He's not wrong. But, like, are you hard on yourself? Not as much as I should be, probably. There were times when I was a lot harder on myself than I am now, and it didn't do me any good. Like, what were you doing?

Like, what examples of stuff? Oh, just, you know, you just get mad for no reason. And, you know, at the end of the day, you got to do what you do and let it be. And if you don't want to keep doing it, quit. You grow up, you know. Yeah, totally. Like I'm going through that. I had to stop doing all the blow and shit and stop doing the one-night stands and shit

because that was making me sleep-deprived. Oh, yeah. And then you got to be happy and entertained in another city where everyone wants to be. No, it's never made anybody a better person. That's for sure. But how do you maintain, like, you know, when everyone's kissing your ass and you're really, like, when you're really striding, like, how do you maintain this sense of self and not, like, get, you know, when we overabuse, you know, we overabuse. But how do you get out of that circle?

I've off, you know, I see some of these young guys who become really successful at a really young age, and they kind of make asses of themselves. And I cut them slack because I would have been every bit that bad, if not worse. Yeah. There's no doubt. I mean, you know, for me, we had an audience and finally were able to, you know, I was able to pay my bills with this. This became my job.

I was well into my 30s. And, yeah, I behaved pretty badly a number of times, but nothing like what I would have been if I'd— You think if you got famous in 21, you would have died? More than likely. Yeah. More than likely. I mean, I was not going to—

Younger years were you? I wasn't going to let not being a rock star at that age stand in the way of anything. I certainly tried my best. I couldn't afford to kill myself. Yeah, it's true. Did you always have a relationship or were you just living the vagabond life on the road? I didn't really start going on the road until about a month after I got married.

Really? Yeah, and I've been married for 22 years or almost 22 years. Shut the fuck up. Yeah, yeah. Wow, what luck. I know. I was like, yeah, if I'd been doing that single.

It would have saved your life. That saved your life. It did save my life. It did. Do you abuse? Were you used to abuse? Like, did you drink a lot? Oh, yeah.

What was the band's choice? It was mostly just hard drinking. And, of course, I smoked two packs a day for years. And, you know, I finally gave that up. Two packs? Close to it every day. Bill Hicks did, dude. Oh, yeah.

Unless Blow was involved, and then there would be more. Like three plays. Yeah, yeah, closer to three. Oh, my God. Because you're up all night. What are you going to do? Yeah, so how do you keep... I mean, you guys have...

Does that why, like... Yeah, do you keep... Like, who's singing all the high harmonies then? If you're smoking three packs of cigarettes and doing Blow all night, how are you getting through the next night? It was... You just barrel through. You just barrel through, you know.

No, that's... I mean, you could tell... Oh, man. About two weeks after I stopped smoking, it's like my voice just... Like, wow, is that always in there? You know, it sounded so much better just in no time. So, like, how many...

Like, what about when you're in the studio and, like, in the studio and you just got off a two-month run? You smoked 20 packs of six. Now you only have two weeks off to make a record. How do you get back into like, okay, just did it? Sometimes you didn't. Yeah. You ever get in fights with Patterson because you're wasting money at the studio time? No, no, no.

We don't worry about that stuff. That's awesome. When we were younger. You guys are fucking rock and roll as fuck, dude. Dude. It's exciting. So nowadays, what's keeping you going? What's the music?

What's inspiring you to keep traveling, to keep writing? I still love it. I still really, you know, I love it. We've been smart, and we've had smart people working with us, and we don't let ourselves get burned out, you know. So how many shows are you doing now a year? Right now I'm not sure, but probably not 100 right now.

Or, you know, probably not even that. Because this year we're in between records. We're putting something out in probably January, probably the first of the year. Oh, great. So we're trying to keep the band as, you know, out of sight. Oh, out of sight. Keep them on the.

Yeah, try to keep the band off the road. You know, we obviously still have to, to you know keep the lights on and you know you do some one-offs yeah we're doing one-offs and uh so what keeps the band not burnt out well uh we've always maintained a pace what we never stay out more than three weeks at a time and really we haven't been out a full three weeks in quite a while. So most of the time it's... You still love touring? Most of the time, 10 days, two weeks. Then we come home for a little while.

Yeah, I mean, we come home and we're home long enough that we're kind of ready to go back out when it's time. And yeah, I still enjoy it. That's fucking awesome. It is halftime at the Andy Fresco interview hour. Hello, everybody, and welcome to Dolab Sportscast. He's talking shit about the game. He's got a weird fucking name.

It's sports with Dolab. Hey, we. This week, we're going to be talking some NBA free agency. Anthony Davis traded to the fucking Lakers. In his prime. These motherfuckers. Pairing him up with the broad. And fuck them.

Fuck the league. This is the Gasol trade all over again. That's some fucking bullshit. And these fools heist the fucking league and then fuck you guys fuck you and what do you know one two three fucking championships some fucking bullshit god damn it fucking david stern where are you at should have nixed this shit in the butt this is a makeup call for that chris paul shit adam silver you've given the okay for this shit fucking bald piece of shit. On the real though, the jazz.

We gonna fucking take it. We gonna sign everybody. Maybe Tobias Harris, I don't know who. I'm drunk. I love you guys. Love you, bro. You piece of shit, cocksucker motherfucker. It's Sports with Dolove. Fuck you, Andy.

I want to talk about Dave's schools. You're a friend with Dave. We're homies. That's one of my biggest mentors. What do you know about Dave? Did he help you guys in any way? He kind of did, yeah. He kind of became...

Was panic big? Did he help you guys in any way? He kind of did, yeah. He kind of became... Was Panic big while you guys were getting going, or were you guys getting big at the same time? They were... Around the time our old band, Adam Southscat, was calling it quits was when Panic was starting to really pull crowds in theaters. They were about at that level then. So by the time Drive-By Truckers was going, they were doing the sheds.

They were doing the big rooms. Pretty big audience by that point. And Dave took a liking to us. He was still living in Athens where we were forming and playing our first shows, and he thought we kind of had something. And he and Patterson became good friends I got to know him he tried he tried to help us out he did help us out what did he do he loaned made us a loan for one thing he made you a loan yeah it was a small loan but for us it might as well have been you know a major label advance we were recording

ourselves how many records have you done before he gave you a loan? This was our second one. No shit. Yeah, we were recording our second one. And we were doing it all ourselves. So what was that conversation like? Oh, he was just cool. He was a friend, you know?

And he was like, look, I want to help you guys out. If you're ever in a position to help somebody else out, do the same. He's a cool guy. He's the best, dude. I else out um do the same he's a cool guy you know he's the best dude i mean that's the same thing with me he's like um he's producing now so like i just you know i'd never really heard widespread before and then i and my manager manages him he's like why don't you go meet dave he's a good guy i walked in there and all of a sudden like fucking aura is really big and he's just all about the music. And he's, you know, it's very special.

Yeah, it meant a lot to have you. Did you open for Panic a lot? We did a few times, yeah. Who is the band that you opened for or co-headlined? Or like, you guys kind of grew together. You guys played together. Oh, well, we did a lot with a band called Centromatic from Texas. And friends of theirs named Slobberbone, also from Texas.

Those two we probably toured with more than about anybody else in the early days or so. And we did a lot of shows with the Dexateens, and their bass player Matt Patton has been in our band now for seven years or something like that what was the moment where it was like oh shit we're actually doing this was it a show do you remember that like yes what was it yeah uh it was right after you know Southern Rock Opera was the record that year uh around 2000 After, you know, Southern Rock Opera was the record that- What year?

Around 2000. That was the one that kind of put us, you know, on the radar. It was around 2001, I think, when we really started touring behind it. Were you still like van touring or were you on a bus yet? Yeah, we were about a year or so away from maybe moving into a bus or getting a bus every now and then. And we went out to tour behind that record, and it was one night in Chicago at the Hideout.

Is that? Yeah, it's Solo. Yeah, I've played at Solo recently. We went there, and, you know, we knew there was a buzz out there. We were hearing it, and we played a few shows and a little bit bigger audience than we were used to. We went there, and the place was packed. It's a small place, but it looked a lot bigger to me at the time.

Yeah. Because you guys never packed a room before? Not outside of Atlanta. Like a big market? Yeah, yeah. That was the first outside of the South. We all kind of go back to that night as like, this is going to work, you know. Were they singing the songs and shit?

Yeah, yeah. They were, the owner of the club came out and gave us this amazing introduction because the record had really kind of hit a nerve with him. Under the hideout? Yeah. Fucking cool. Yeah. I mean, that was really the night for us. And Under the hideout? Yeah Yeah it was Fucking cool Yeah I mean that was really

The night for us And then After that You know One by one People started showing up Into other markets Other cities

We pretty much got The big markets Took us a while To get Minneapolis But New York Why is it so hard To get Minneapolis? I'm here dude

It took me like years I don't know I don't know. I don't know. But I do remember playing, I think it was the 400 Bar. And we were drawing crowds in New York, Chicago, some on the West Coast, pretty good. Denver Boulder's always been a real good area for us.

It was already happening back then. But we were at the 400 Bar bar there's hardly anybody there and i think we managed to chase who everybody who was there to the back of the room and we were like damn man what what is it with this place and i don't know if somebody there said no and hey guys don't worry about it it's just the the the right person hasn't told them it's okay to like you yet hipsters yeah yeah and it's i swear the next time we went um whoever that person was had written that article the place was packed oh my and i think yeah and i think we moved up to first avenue after that have been there ever since oh Oh my fucking, that's nuts.

So, so this was 2000, right? 2001. Around 2001, I think. Bansky and Popular, was this an independent record or did you have a label?

Yeah, yeah, we, at the time it was, it got picked up by Lost Highway, but. So now you got, you're like,

you're selling out rooms two to 300, 400 maybe in Atlanta or wherever you're doing. Oh my God. So, this is before Napster and LimeWire hit. So like, maybe in Atlanta or wherever you're doing. Oh my God. So this is before Napster and LimeWire hit. So like, was the expectation from here like,

oh, I'm going to get a million dollar record deal. Like I'm going to get some big thing or is that- We didn't know what was going to happen. We were, you know, the record was doing well. The audience was growing. So we were still just basically selling and hand-delivering these records ourselves. We sold a lot of merch during this time. Yeah, we were starting to break into getting a merch thing happening. And I can't remember how long the record had been out now,

but Lost Highway, which was a division of Warner at the time. They picked it up and gutted it out, distributed it, and things kind of went from there. So from there, what was the next record? Was there pressure? When you make a good record that's really noteworthy, now it's technically not your rookie record. You know you put it out.

So was that sophomore record pressure on you? Not really. No? It ended up being... Which one was that? It was Decoration Day, and that's the one I... It's probably the fan favorite, if I had to guess. Damn.

It ended up kind of being the... I'd say the overall fan favorite. So did that take you to theaters, the second one? Yeah, around then we started really breaking into theaters. 2003? Yeah, somewhere. So when did Isabel join the band? He joined not long after Southern Rock Opera came out.

That record had, we were finished with it. He's not on it, of course, but we were in the process of getting it out and uh we had a shake up on that tour and he joined someone quit or yeah yeah so hard not really hard to have new band members when that's why i've always should be but we didn't care because it's a business right yeah yeah at the end of the day, so it was you and Patterson. You guys were the songwriter duo, and then would you hire out Rhythm Sections? No. We always, well, Brad, our drummer, has been with us for, gosh, well over 20 years now.

Nice. Well, yeah, well, the band's been, the band is 22 years, so he's been there most of that. So the three of us are kind of the core. So then you picked up Isabel when you had your other guy bail yeah and then what about bass player um yeah yeah we've oh my gosh so many bass players so little time i have the curse of the bass players dude we we did what we did for years and years. We finally, we've made, we're about to have three records with the same lineup.

Yeah. I mean, that's just unheard of. Yeah. We'd never done that before. Fucking Nate, that's improvement. I'll take that.

I'm going to high five for that. Yeah. Yeah. So. What do you think it is? I don't know. Some people get really lucky. You know,

there's this, I've seen some bands that have like this great bass player that was there from day one, and they're kind of sometimes the heart and soul of the band that hold it all together. Most everybody else. The Melvins, several years ago, were doing some interview about, how do you keep this band together as long as you have? I mean, this has really been going. I said, you've got to fire somebody every now and then.

It's probably your bass player. We died laughing when we heard it. I thought it would be like management. No, it's the bass player. It's probably your bass player. Oh, it's so true. I think they're misunderstood because they're always in the back. They're always in the backbone.

There's not a lot of flabbergastic bass players out there. It's like very few. We've had great luck with drummers. Yeah. Great luck with drummers. That's awesome. Yeah. So Isabel joined the band.

He was there for what, six years, five years? Something like that, yeah. How was that relationship? Two records. Was it like you guys were homies before? I kind of got to know him around the time he joined the band. I'd met him. I knew him.

So you did a couple records with him? Two, yeah. Two? Yeah, we did. And they were both, I'd say those two kind of go together. They're both kind of go-togeth you know fan favorites in a lot of ways when you um when you when you're always working with like one other guy and then you add a third songwriter into the mix it shouldn't work it shouldn't work it shouldn't work and it didn't in the long run

but uh it for for a couple of records it did yeah we you know i don't know how but yeah it shouldn't it should not have worked yeah so like So was there any tips while writing? I would be... We never wrote together. Okay, so everyone had their own songs they brought to the table. Right. You never tried writing together, all three? I've never been able to co-write.

It's never been that kind of thing. Is it hard for you? Oh, yeah. Why? I don't know. If I could figure that out, I'd write more. Is it like vulnerability? Oh, I. Why? I don't know. If I could figure that out, I'd write more. Is it like vulnerability? Oh, I get something, and I'll spend sometimes a couple of years

just coming back to the same idea over and over and over until I figure out where I'm going to go with it, what it's going to be. It's because I'll get something. I'll get some little piece of it, and it's like, damn, that's good. I know that's good. What else? And it takes forever, damn, that's good. I know that's good. What else? And it takes forever to figure out what else is. What's the longest

it's taken you to write one song? Which one was it? Oh. Well, it's hard to pick one. There's a song on the last record on American Band called Filthy and Fried. Not even one of my called Filthy and Fried.

Not even one of my... Filthy and Fried? Yeah. It's not even really a masterpiece by any means. It's not bad. But I had part of that song for over two years. Really? And we had finished the record and something hit me

and I was able to finish that song and we've recorded it. What hit you? I don't know i don't remember now do you think it's i want to go back to this the songwriter thing this open vessel thing like you know like you said like this writer block thing like when you all of a sudden get out of it like you're not like doing yoga or fucking meditate it just all of a sudden you just wake up and it's the vessel opens in a sense you're leaving that kind of stuff? Yeah. You know, it definitely comes in spurts for most people. Even, you know, I've found like even a lot of really prolific songwriters,

people who write a lot of great songs all say the same thing. They have the same trouble I do, even though I don't write nearly as many, is they can't write on the road. Really? Yeah. Why? Some people do, but I just don't write nearly as many, is they can't write on the road. Yeah. Why? Some people do, but I just, I can't get in that headspace. I heard Tom Petty say that once, you know, and he wrote a thousand songs a minute. Yeah.

So you think it's just like, you're just oversaturated with all this other stuff that you can't just like get to that, that zone. Yeah. It's, it is for me. And I've never been, of course, I've never been one to just have it hit me and just sit down and write the song right then and there. I hear about that happening. I'm sure it does.

Yeah. But it's never been that way for me. I can't think of one that just came really quick. Oh, wow. Yeah, same here. I think it's the songwriting. I listen to a lot of folk guys and Celtic songwriters and Damien Rice and stuff I like a lot.

I mean, they're saying the same thing. When you're absorbed with everything else in the world, you can't have the vessel open to wherever. Well, sometimes it can take, you know, it can be like, even if I'm by myself and I'm in, and I have the time, it can take sometimes several hours, most of the day to kind of get my head going in that direction. Yeah.

It's not like doing your taxes Where it has a beginning and an end Or you're gonna sit down and do this It doesn't work like that at all It's like the same thing with Do you think of life as a finish line? Oh, it's definitely got one Yeah, of course

But like for a song Like when you said, oh, this record, this is the finish. You know, this record's it. It's never it, right? No, no, no, no, no, no. Yeah. Like what keeps you from like getting depressed about that, that there's no finish line?

Oh, you know, I do sometimes. But I want to keep going. I want to keep doing it. I could go out there and play the greatest hits to the same size audience probably as long as I want, and I'm down with that, you know. But the pursuit of something new, the pursuit of the next idea is just, that's what keeps me going, you know. Yeah. When your record was popping, were you already writing the sophomore record? A little bit.

Yeah. Yeah, because back then, by the time we got around to actually recording, a lot of those songs had been written and were floating around for a long time. Because we were trying to get the money together and figure out a place to do it. We weren't getting studio time and no budget. So yeah, it was such a long process. A lot of the sophomore thing was kind of kicking around long before we pressed record on anything. Wow.

I want to go back to the Isabel years. Is it hard to see someone who left the band get that big by himself? Well, no, not really, because it's no surprise. You knew he added in oh yeah yeah and he he was he was meant to be a solo artist for sure really and and yeah you think that the end of the the truckers years with him was that did he have that mentality the last like two years like i always want to go solo and like was that i don't know angst i i you know he was he was still real young than himself i don't know if he really had you know a clear vision of

what he was going to do or wanted to do but yeah i mean he's he's a mega talent no doubt about it and you know it was he was meant to be where he is for sure so did i don't even know how you guys how he left like What was it like? He's not an original member, so it probably wasn't that hard for him to leave the band, right? I don't think so. I mean, he was putting out a solo record already, and he had most of what I think maybe the core of what his band still is was already kind of forming.

And he was getting out and doing a little solo touring. And he was definitely going in that direction. And we weren't the band to be his band at all. And he knew that. And we were still going to be doing our thing the same way. So, yeah, it worked out good for everybody. That's awesome because some of them could be bad breaks. You hear that horror story of one guy goes solo,

and then you want to kill the motherfucker. So it's like, that's good that you guys take it with you. Yeah, you can't let that drag you down. I'm happy for, you know, you guys. Yeah. You gotta, yeah. You can't, you can't let that drag you down, you know, but I'm happy for him. I'm real happy for him. Proud of him. Yeah. He's doing great.

Huh? Yeah. You still talk to him? No, never. Cool. Let's talk about the newer trucker stuff. It seems like you, I heard an interview that you want to go more political. Oh, we already have.

So tell me about this. I'm very interested in how to do this. It's always been there. Yeah. You know very interested in how to do this it's always been there yeah you know it's it's always been in there but the the last record uh american band we really put it out the forefront and to tell you the truth i don't think i i think the perception of it as being the as political in the way is, and especially the backlash, you're going to get backlash if you really go out there hard, has more to do with what we said about it and how we talked about it than what's actually on the record.

I wonder if going back, if we had just not done any interviews, not said a word about it, no bio, no nothing, just put it out there. If anybody would have even... Knew it was a political record? I just wonder, you know? And was that part of the pitch when you're promoting the record? Were you trying to make it... Yeah, we made it real clear. Yeah, we made it real clear.

Do you regret that? No, no, not one bit. And, you know, and the stuff we're doing now, it's not as political straight through, but where it is, it's probably even more biting. Did you lose some fans? Maybe a few. But not many. Nothing noticeable. Honestly, I think the overall size of the audience grew.

I think we might have lost a few of the guys who were out there feeling up girls in the audience unwanted and more people showed up. Seriously. I mean, I bet. I mean, you know, yeah, they fit a profile. A lot of aggro alphas you probably, you know. Yeah. know southern rock opera um some of the stuff maybe led people to believe that we were uh i won't say right wing but maybe a little less left wing yeah than we actually are you know what i mean i think they might have gotten the wrong idea in some of the the way some of that

stuff sounded uh like what? Explain that. Like what? Like how you approached the phrase? Maybe, yeah. You know, well, we did Southern rock opera, and of course, real early, people were kind of showing up with Confederate flags in the audience,

and we told them, That ain't happening. Yeah, so, you know. They were showing up with Confederate flags? Yeah. Where? Even up north? They'll do it anywhere. But, yeah, it, you know. They were showing up with Confederate flags? Yeah. Where? Even up north? They'll do it anywhere.

But, yeah, it wasn't much. It was just a couple of places because I think they thought we were, you know, doing some kind of Southern rock revisionist thing. And, you know, a lot of those bands back then, I don't think they meant anything by it. It was a lot more a part of pop culture back then. But, you know, they used that imagery on some of their stages and their album covers and their merchandise and everything. And I think they may have thought we were tying ourselves to that a

little bit. And of course, a lot of those guys went on to become pretty hardcore, outspoken conservatives too, you know, as they left their Charlie Daniels. Did you ever hang out with, like, Ted Nugent and those guys? No, no, no. God, no. God. So, like, yeah, because, like, I don't, I would never consider your music political. Yeah.

You know, it's like beautiful songwriting about love. Yeah. There were, I mean, it's always been there You know But it was It may be like Here or there There may be one line Where it's referencing Something that's more of a A socio-political issue

Or something But yeah On the last record We really kind of Made it real clear And What about during Like what was the banter like

On stage During that during that album year oh were you going political a little bit a little and you know a backflip a little bit what was the worst um honestly the worst probably the most and it wasn't bad but as the the most visible was in san l Obispo, California. Out of all places? Not the South. Not the Midwest.

Where'd you play at? Theater. The theater, yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's the first and only time we've been there. I grew up in Ventura County. Okay, yeah. I couldn't believe you got flack there.

Yeah, yeah, a little bit. And they pulled a Mike Pence. What happened? They came to the show for the purpose of making a big deal out of walking out. Oh. I swear. We heard that later. We found that out later. So they bought tickets.

They bought tickets. I'm not giving you your money back. No. Fuck yeah, man. Fuck yeah, man. Fuck yeah. You know, of course, it was after that that I watched Straight Outta Compton. And there's this scene where they're pulling up and these people are out there stomping their CDs and burning them and everything. And I think it was Easy East. Yeah, well, they bought them, didn't they?

That was the first thing I thought of. Wow. So what about this new one in January? Are you still going political? Yeah. What are you talking about? Well, you know, the last record was written, recorded, ready to go before the 2016 election. No shit.

Yeah. Are you serious? election no shit yeah are you serious and it was about we i i think we were kind of like diagnosing the problem without realizing just how bad it was kind of felt like the first doctor you know that had an aids patient because this guy came in with the flu but he's dying what am i missing here you know um so yeah this is all it was happening during the 16 election. Oh, we had. It took you a year to make, right? We were mastering this thing in March of 2016. Holy fuck. So this is an interpretation of the shitstorm that went down.

We thought we were delivering a eulogy, but the monster was just waking up, you know. Did your fans understand that? I think so. I mean, the record came out in September. So you had to make it that year. Two months, yeah. Yeah, we were touring during the election, you know. Holy fuck, dude!

Yeah, yeah. So what were you doing during the election? Were you talking? Were you politically charged? We played, oh gosh, what is the show? It's, now I can't remember. It's in Philly. But we did the, it's an NPR show.

We recorded that the day of. And then, so we were in philly that night you know and then we played philly the night after and that was an intense show one of the most intense why because we everybody there was just in shell shocked you know and you had to play yeah and what'd you say what you talk about we didn't talk about anything we We just, you know. Did you feel in the crowd too? Oh, yeah. Yeah, it was something. Not too long ago, I saw some footage. I didn't know there was footage, and I was like, whoa, we were intense. What was your set list like?

It was no different than any other night. You just felt it. Yeah, just releasing it, you know. I've never felt like that before or since, you know. Holy fuck, Mike. It was something. That's crazy. just releasing it you know it i've never felt like that before or since you know holy fuck it was something that's crazy yeah and then we finished the tour and you know wow yeah so it as it was were you like angry or what were you what was going yeah just processing it's like what what has gone wrong with the people around me it's like you know

what has gone wrong with the people around me? It's like, you know. Fuck. Yeah, I mean, most of the record we made was, you know, kind of, it was mostly thinking about all the really just backlash, bad behavior, and everything we saw as, you know, as a result of, you know, a black guy having the audacity to win an election. Yeah. And we were turned off by that.

Obviously, wanted to call it out, call it what it was. And then, like I said, it was just going to get worse. And it did. And it did, yeah. Fuck. I don't think we've hit bottom yet. You don't think so? No, no.

What? What do you think? What do you think is going to happen? If you want to see the bottom, look up, you know? Yeah, right. Oh, man. Do you think we're in trouble next four years? Do you think he's going to get elected again?

He could. And I think there's going to be a surge in violence in this kind of what we've been seeing, whether he wins or loses. He's totally set that up. It's like separation. It's like anything. It's like, I think it'll be a civil war for sure, maybe.

Yeah. I mean, it's, you know, look how bad, you know, at Charlottesville, you've had this and, you know, the mosque shootings, the synagogue shootings. And that's a result of him winning. Crazy. You know?ville, you've had this, and the mosque shootings, the synagogue shootings. That's a result of him winning. Crazy. Yeah, you're right. And he was totally setting these people up to riot when he thought he was going to lose. Do you think he's doing it by choice, though, or just to keep the fan base that voted for him? voted for him well um yeah he was uh he was basically claiming it was going to be rigged because he like everybody else thought he was going to lose yeah and he was you know i don't know what his reasons are behind doing that but the result is going to be rioting yeah

no matter what you've got to know that left or right yeah it'll be a riot. You've got to know that. Left or right, he'll be a rioter. You've got to know that. And if he loses, he's going to be free to do what he loves the most, is go on tour and hold basically Klan rallies from coast to coast and keep whipping these people up. Yeah, because he's not showing up in New York City or where he was fucking raised. He hasn't been back. No, no. Because he didn't know how to get his ass kicked.

I mean, let the record show, though, the dumbest redneck I've ever seen is a New Yorker. Fucking Mike, dude. It's been nice to meet you, man. You're fucking awesome, man. I can't wait to watch your band. I can't wait to, I'm going to just gush about you to meet you, man. You're fucking awesome, man. I can't wait to watch your band. I can't wait. I'm going to just gush about you to Dave because, I mean,

Dave has a good sense of who people are. And I got one more question for you. If you could ask young Mike at 22, or let's say young Mike at 28 when you just got big. You got big in 28? I was close to 38. 38? No, close to 38 when you got the big record? The record that moment in Chicago, in the moment in Minneapolis.

How old were you? Mid-30s. Mid-30s, okay. Let's go younger. Let's go 20s. If you could tell yourself any advice, like while you're working hard on whatever you're working on, what would it be? Hang in there. Someday you're going to have a porno machine in your pocket that also makes phone calls.

Mike, thanks for being on the show, dude. Have a great one, man. Thanks for being on. Cool. Hey, this is the promoter from Otway, North Carolina. I'm calling for Andy Frasco. Anyway, man, we were hoping to book you down here. I called your agent the other day or emailed him and called him.

And I got to tell you, the prices he's quoting for you, man, we were hoping to book you down here. I called your agent the other day or emailed him and called him. And I got to tell you, the prices he's quoting for you, man, I don't know about all that. I mean, he's literally pricing out like Keith Richard Simmons pricing, buddy. Anyway, we've got a gorgeous 37 cap room here. We're dying to have you play it. Honestly feel like if you guys give it your all one of these days, you could sell it out. And not sure if we can make it happen with the pricing, but we've got 150 bucks, man. We've also got all the pulled pork sandwiches you and the boys can eat. I've got a gorgeous Jewish girl who I believe would be into your music if you're interested. Not going to be able to give you guys booze. I've seen you before. I know how that story is going to end. I don't want to go in debt. Don't want to close the doors.

So you've got to cover your own beer. But like I said, the sandwiches are fantastic. $150. What do you say? Alright. Here we are. The end of episode 50. Thanks Mike, Aaron,

Vince Herman, Dave Schools for all being on the show today. Episode 50 is a big deal, guys. We made it. We made it past the hump. It's like 50 episodes is kind of like five years into a relationship. That's when it's like, oh, fuck, should we stop? Is this how we ran out of material or should we keep going?

I'm stoked you guys are still on board, listening to all the episodes. It's just, it's badass, y'all. 50 episodes. I can't believe it. This was a small dream to just basically get me off a Coke, and it turned into something so different, and I am so proud.

I'm so proud. I'm so proud. I'm so proud of this show. Shout out to Chris. Shout out to Joe. Shout out to the band for writing all these funny-ass songs. And shout out to all the guests who just want to be part of the show and are being vulnerable with us. You know, we're all fucking dealing through life.

It's hard. Life is tough. But if we all find out that we're in this together, then I think we are unstoppable. But other than that, it's been great. I got Billy Strings on the show next episode.

We're taking a week off. I'm a deal three a month, but I'm thinking of doing one every week for season three. I don't know how you guys feel about that. If you don't want to hear from me every week. But I think it'd be cool. I think enough people now want to be on the show

where we could, you know, start doing once a week. And we'll blow that up. But, yeah, I got a week off next week. I'm going to Nantucket It's my tour manager's birthday He's taking the week off So I hope he has fun I'm playing in St. Louis on the 5th I'm playing in Kansas City on the 6th

I'm playing High Sierra Music Festival on the 7th On the 12th of July I'm playing Levitate Music Festival Then I'm taking a couple weeks off I'm going to Lake Powell again Oh my god, I had so much fun Me and my buddy We call him Clark Griswold

We're going to Lake Powell with our crew We have like five people We have this like yacht And it's so fun And my homie He's just a great host And and he's the best dude. He always takes us on these nice trips. And it's going to be a blast, so I'm thinking of taking some LSD.

Last time we took LSD and tried to make a music video on jet skis. We made it to an hour until the LSD kicked in, and then we just started looking at shit. But that's how it goes. I love being in the water on drugs. I don't know why. I love the mushroom. I had so much fun being on a lake on LSD.

It was awesome last year, so I'm going to try it again. So I'm going to learn how to cook. They taught me how to make hamburgers last year. I think I'm going to go deluxe. I'm going to try to make some chicken for the gang this time, but I'm stoked to go to Lake Powell. And then what? Late July, we are in Buffalo. Buffalo Ironworks on the 25th. We're at Peach Fest on the 26th. Berlin, Maryland. Burley Oak. I don't know. I've never been here. Burley Oak Festival. I've never been to Berlin, Maryland. I wonder what's going on there.

Then I go to Europe. I'm in Europe for a month. And then we're opening for Blue Sky. Our Blue Sky. Green Sky Bluegrass. I'm going to get them on the show too. And then we start. Oh, fuck.

It's already. I can't believe. Guys. Life goes by so fast. It's already July, dude, or almost, right? Shit. This is crazy, dude. We need to slow down.

We need to think about ourselves sometimes and just fucking enjoy the moment we have because it just flies by. I was having this conversation with a friend, and we used to hook up. I was having this conversation with a friend, and we used to hook up when I was like 20, and we used to just have sex all the time, just fuck, and just fuck, fuck, fuck. And it was great.

I'd show up like once or twice, three times a year, and we'd just have sex, and then we'd go on. And then now it's like 10 years later, and, you know, we all change. Instead of having conversations about what position we wanted to, it was, you know, I got my first gray hairs or I got my, you know, I'm getting married now or, you know, whatever life throws our way. But, you know, it's like I remember that shit like it was yesterday,

hooking up and just having fun and just living in the moment and being young. I'm still young, but you know what I mean. It's tough. It's tough out here. Um, getting old's hard. So take care of your parents, take care of your grandparents. You know, you never know when it's your turn to say goodbye to them. So love them. Be with these old people because they're, you know, I'm telling you, man, getting old is fucking hard. There's no other way about it. I mean, like, we start losing all these things we used to have, if it was our looks, if it was our memory, if it was our joints or our bones.

You know, we start getting more fragile, you know, more sensitive. I see it in my dad, dude. My dad's 65 and used to be just like this man who was, you know, worked and never had a, not a sensitive bone in his body. Or maybe just kept it in. And now he's getting older and he's calling me and he's asking me how I'm feeling and just being, you know, human. And like, you know, I feel like getting old makes you vulnerable to, you know, the inevitable. So take care of your families, give your grandpa a hug, ask him all the questions you can. My grandpa's turning 90 next week and I'm flying in for it. And,. And I just want to have a conversation. I know he's, you know,

I can see in his eyes he's afraid to die now. He sees it, 90. So I want to just be there for him and just have conversations, pick his brain. And, you know, you got to do that because when they're gone, you're not going to be able to do it anymore unless you, like, go to some, like,

fake-ass psychic or something. But anyway, that's it for the, for the show today, guys, subscribe to the podcast. Thanks for being with us riding on this as I'm learning how to be a better interviewer. And as I'm learning how to be vulnerable and not just talk about, you know, you know, that what I always talk about, I'm trying to expand my brain, and I think we're on this ride together. So be safe. I love you. Wear condoms. Mono's in again.

Don't get mono. Make sure you're kissing people who are clean or not sick. That's how you spread shit too. But wear condoms, subscribe to podcasts, live your best life, enjoy your youth. And let's just be happy people. Because if we have that mentality every day that we're going to stay happy, then even through the ups and downs, even through our, because life's going to throw us fucking through whirlwinds and curveballs. If we just take a step back and realize what's more important,

I think we're going to fight this depression and this mental health and this overstimulation that our phone's giving us. So I love you. Be safe out there. And I will see you on the next episode. Or I'll see you at a show. I'll see you in the crowd or something. I'll see you.

All right, guys. Love you. Be safe. Well, thank you for listening to a happy anniversary episode 50 of Andy Fresco's World Saving Podcast. Produced by Andy Fresco, Joe Angelhow, and Grizz Lawrence. Produced by Andy Fresco, Joe Angelhau and Grizz Lawrence. Please subscribe and rate the show on iTunes and Spotify so we can make this a worldwide phenomenon. For info on the show, please head to our Instagram at world saving podcast.

For more info on the blog and tour dates, head to andyfresco.com. Our latest album, it's online. You can still listen to it. It's called Change Your Pace. This week's guest is Mike Cooley from Drive By Truckers. Go find him online at drivebytruckers.com. And this week's co-host is Danger Aaron from Jackass. This week's special guests are Vince Herman, Dave Schools, Dolf Cohen and Arne Bakker.

The area in the Netherlands where I grew up is called Freesia. Possibly best known for a 2,000-year-old breed of black and white spotted cows. Once important to USA, you managed to enhance the cow in no time into a more bigger moo. Must have been the Texans, eh? We all grow accustomed to the fact that more is better. Now, I gifted my mom with some chicks the other day.

Nice set of four Frisian chickens. Pantoms, like dwarf hens. She was happy-ish with the gift, but eventually confessed to me that she thought they were rather small. So she proposed some crossbreeding. The Texan way, I presume. She thought of a bigger cock. Well, cock-a-doodle-doo to you all.

I'm out of here. See you next week.