Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast - EP 60: Anthony Thogmartin (Papadosio)

Episode Date: October 1, 2019

This week we're back in action and oozing with insight thanks to our guest co-host, Kenny Carkeet from AWOLNATION & Fitness. Kenny is producing Andy & the U.N.'s next album and he sits down with Frasc...o to discuss the process. The interview hour features Anthony Thogmartin from Papadosio! The guys talk meditation, mental health, and guess what else? MUSIC. EP 60 live NOW.  Follow us on Instagram @worldsavingpodcast For more information on Andy Frasco, tour dates, the band and the blog, go to: AndyFrasco.com The views discussed on this podcast do not necessarily reflect those of the guests. Follow Kenny Carkeet at kennycarkeet.com And catch Papadosio online at www.papadosio.com Check out Andy's new album, "Change Of Pace" on iTunes and Spotify Produced by Andy Frasco Joe Angelhow Chris Lorentz Audio mix by Chris Lorentz Featuring: Shawn Eckels Andee Avila Floyd Kellogg   Ahri Findling Arno Bakker 

Transcript
Discussion (0)
Starting point is 00:00:00 Hey, it's Schwartz. Listen, I'm looking at this photo going around the internet of you doing whippets or eating whipped cream or whatever it is you're doing at a festival in front of 10,000 people. It's really fucking funny to do, first of all, and even more funny that you're posting it and proud of it and saying you can't run for office. No shit you can't run for office because your head's in your ass. And stop calling it Nas. Nas is a rapper. It's not a whippet. And just get your shit together, dude, seriously.
Starting point is 00:00:35 Again, schtick is only going to get you so far. It's good schtick. I love it when you're not doing drugs in front of an audience, that is. But all the other shit, the whole row, whatever you want to do, focus on music, not whippets. Pull your head out of your ass. Your mom's not going to fucking like it either. Wherever you go, whatever you do, I will be right here wasted with you. Let's have some drinks and make glasses click. I will be right here wasted with you. Right here wasted with you I wonder if we should call your guy And get high
Starting point is 00:01:30 Cocaine But in the end we should get some food And go to bed instead Wherever you go, whatever you do I will be right here wasted with you Let's have us some drinks and make glasses clean I will be right here wasted with you Let's start the show. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:02:11 All right. Here we are. Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast. I'm Andy Frasco. How we doing today, everybody? How's our minds? How's our hearts? Feeling good?
Starting point is 00:02:25 We're about to skull fuck this week, like we always do. I got a very special guest. He is actually producing half our record. He's written songs. Did you write Sail? I co-wrote and produced and engineered it. And you're in the AWOL Nation. Now you're in a band called Fitness, and you're producing.
Starting point is 00:02:41 Yes. So it's fucking killer. We got Kenny Carkeat. New friend. New friend of the Frasco gang. What up, new friend? I feel like we're family now, man. I. So it's fucking killer. We got Kenny Carkeet. New friend. New friend of the Frasco gang. What up, new friend? I feel like we're family now, man. I feel like we are too. We've spent a lot of time together.
Starting point is 00:02:50 We've made some cool shit together. We're buds. Bro, this is such an honor. We both wear short shorts. I feel like I hustled you. Like, yeah, yeah. I work with Ari. I work with Ari.
Starting point is 00:03:01 Like, yeah, bring him in. Bring him in, bro. Dude, no. I tell you, I was pleasantly surprised. It's not every day that you get to work with Ari. I work with Ari. Like, yeah, bring him in. Bring him in, bro. Dude, no. Man, I tell you, I was pleasantly surprised. It's not every day that you get to work with people that you become friends with. Yeah. Honestly, it's kind of rare that you work with a band that, A, you like as musicians and an artist, and then, B, you like as people and you can just fucking hang out.
Starting point is 00:03:18 And, like, it's been a great experience. I'm super happy. Hopefully, we're writing good songs, too. We're writing really – yeah. On top of all of that, we're actually writing really really good shit i think we've got some good stuff going down kenny tell me about your life so you always wanted to be a producer you wanted to be a guitar player my my goal in life was to always be a guitar player in some like rock band ever since i was like 10 that's what i always wanted to do but you know one thing you grew up in the valley no i grew up in florida fucking orlando
Starting point is 00:03:45 florida butt rock capital of the world and that's where like newfound glory is from instead kind of yeah they're from like just i think we've got creed we've got matchbox 20 and backstreet boys those are our orlando clander frames yeah uh yeah i was in florida playing in bands and shitty Orlando claimed a frame. Oh, dude. And you got Kenny fucking Corky. And Kenny fucking Corky. Yeah. Yeah, I was in Florida playing in bands and shitty gutter punk garage bands doing little tours and like Honda Civics and shit for years. And then, fuck, I guess like 11 or 12 years now ago, I moved to L.A. on a whim, said fucking moved out here and cleaned toilets at studios and washed people's cars and slept in my car and did all that usual LA bullshit. How long did it take for you until you made money?
Starting point is 00:04:28 Probably. I always, about two years and two years until you make any money. Like when I first moved out here, I was a runner for a production house, unpaid using my own gas to drop off hard drives all around town just to get in the business. But like there,
Starting point is 00:04:42 I met the owner of a studio at rob deardex fantasy factory and then that led to me getting a job as an engineer with the studio rob deardreck has a studio yeah that's the guy from dc yeah exactly that's what i'm saying in la you just have to come out here and like eat shit for a little bit and like find your way but yeah i always tell people about two years it took me about two years before anything started happening four years before you can like actually survive and live what was the big first big band that you're like that was it a wall yeah a wall was definitely yeah i played in many bands before that and when i moved out to la i was playing acoustic guitar for free for random singer songwriters and
Starting point is 00:05:19 then i met the singer of a of of a wall he and and I would write these pop songs for girls ages 15 to 23 for like 50 bucks a piece. We would split a taco, one taco because we were so poor, me and Aaron. And then, yeah, one day we were supposed to do that. We didn't. And we wrote Sail instead just as fun without any aspirations. And then... Was AWOL a band before that? No, no.
Starting point is 00:05:48 AWOL was a band well after we wrote Sail. We must have had four or five songs before Sail was starting to get recognized by enough people in the industry that we were like, we need to put a band together. So then we started scouring and finding people. And then like, we were still playing... So you were pitching that song to other people? And they said, fuck it, I want this song. We were pitching it to the industry. People around the industry, like managers and labels
Starting point is 00:06:12 were starting to find the song sale and starting to like it, being like, who is this band? We had to put a band together. Did you have a record deal yet? No. We put a band together and we were still playing some of Aaron's last band songs, because we only had four AWOL Nation songs. So we were playing four AWOL Nation songs and two Under the Influence of Giants songs.
Starting point is 00:06:30 And we played three shows, and then somehow we got lucky and Red Bull Records signed him, Aaron. Why didn't they sign both of you? Well, it was always a solo project. It was always going to always a solo project it was always gonna be a solo project and i just happened to be a part of the beginning infantile stages for all the way through you know playing fucking arenas with fallout boy and prophets of rage and shit that's crazy yeah it's a crazy journey you just woke up one day 100 it was so fast that it felt like you just woke up like when we first started touring sales sales started getting really big. Then we started doing Austin,
Starting point is 00:07:07 Austin, Toby Keith, one on one X legend. He's the guy that started it all. Hands down. Everybody knows it because there's some battling between who actually started playing at first. It's Toby. Anyway.
Starting point is 00:07:19 And so Austin was always good, but we started touring after that, but we didn't even, we were so poor. We didn't own guitars. We didn't own keyboards. We didn't own own drums we had to rent everything everywhere we'd go we'd do a 10 show run with different guitars and different amps every night just renting shit and so like that's where it all started and quickly became like we gotta buy gear we gotta
Starting point is 00:07:37 get this and then we're in a bus and then we're in this and like before you know it you're like what is happening you know you're fucking broke yeah you know what i mean it's like what the fuck is happening right that's how it is when you grow like that it's like it costs so much money to be a big band so a lot of people would be like hey kenny from my hometown like how much would it cost to get you guys here and i'm like i don't know probably like 100 grand and then they get all fucking mad at me but i'm like you understand it costs 40 to fucking get there yeah you know what i mean and then 40 to get back because we've got 2 000 pounds of gear and all this shit yeah it's expensive my buddies you know the revival love love and uh so they're getting on that level yeah where it's like they it just costs too much to do these one-offs and like they have to do these radio things right like it's important to do them but it's like
Starting point is 00:08:19 they're losing money on it's where it's funny that that's really where the bread and butter of the money is now coming in in the touring world. You have to have a good touring situation these days. It's crazy how expensive it gets. So that song sale blew up. Was the plan always to be a producer? No. The plan first was to just move out and work in music.
Starting point is 00:08:47 And then it was to be an engineer, you know? And then it was... No, but like now, this point in your life. From now, yeah, yeah. Once you got a big song. Oh, for sure, yeah. Because it's like, like you, I've done 250, I've done 300 in a year. 300 shows in a year for three years straight.
Starting point is 00:09:02 Like, I've done that. Like, pop punk band? Like, just like that many shows. Like, 275 shows all around the world every year for four years. Like I've done that crazy shit. Right. After doing all that. And now I'm starting to really get a nice foothold in producing. Yeah. I think producing is my vibe, man. I like me, you know what I mean? Like I like being home. I'm surfing, coming to my studio, hanging with my dogs. Like it's pretty good good, man. I've been enjoying being home. So let's talk about that.
Starting point is 00:09:26 What's your philosophy in a smash song? You know what? Honesty. Honesty is everything. I feel like an audience can even subconsciously tell, and I can very surface-level tell if something's not honest. You know what I mean? It has to be good, of course,
Starting point is 00:09:49 but like, if you're faking anything, if you don't mean what you're saying, if you're trying to get the perfect guitar, whatever it is, like, I'm all about honesty and I think that's what makes really good records. Yeah, dude, because you could tell. You could tell when it's bullshit. Like, now you're at a point where you're writing with a lot of people every day. Yeah. So like, you could tell when it's bullshit Now you're at a point where you're Writing with a lot of people every day
Starting point is 00:10:07 So you could tell when it's Oh 100% so a lot of people Especially in LA I guess I don't know if it's because it's LA Everybody's writing for the hit Nobody is making music Just to make what they love It's rare that you see that anymore
Starting point is 00:10:23 So that's what I try to gravitate towards and like same with like my new band there's just fitness fitness yeah i work i work with so many artists who are like oh so and so behind the desk at the label is not gonna like this song so we can't do it and it's like what the fuck does that mean yeah like who the fuck are you to tell me what i think is cool or whatever it is so like you think that's a downfall the music industry huge downfall because nowadays they're giving out record deals like candy for like 10 g's which is really nothing when you have five guys in a band and it all has to be paid back and like yada yada yada so like they're just giving out 10 g all over the place all over the place all over the place and if it doesn't work whatever but now your band is stuck with that label and you're at the bottom of the rung and they don't care about you won't release you and
Starting point is 00:11:06 so like a lot of these bands are just trying to appease the higher-ups so that the higher-ups will actually work their music you know i mean i guess it's like any industry hustle it's a hustle it's like any industry and kind of how the music industry has always been but we as musicians always try to find our way and navigate through that and so when i find artists like yourself and other artists who don't give a fuck and will just make what they think is cool, that's the honesty that I gravitate towards whatever
Starting point is 00:11:31 I'm listening to. So it's basically we're not making art anymore. We're making a product. You're making a product. Yeah. We're compromising for just to make money. Get this. There's now probably a hundred studios Yeah, we're compromising for just to make money. Get this. There's now probably 100 studios in LA that are in somebody's apartment where they have a band that they write for that's themselves, but they're not actually a band.
Starting point is 00:11:55 They just get sinks and placements on TV or whatever and pretend like they're a band and just make their money that way. So now you've got this whole other side of just people making music pretending to be artists and they'll have five different artist projects, but really they're just hoping to get sync licenses around town. It's an interesting... It's almost 2020 shit. I guess it was always going to get weird and convoluted. Why?
Starting point is 00:12:19 When did you start seeing it? Over the last few years, I started really seeing... Maybe the last five years, I've seeing like maybe the last five years i've started seeing a lot of fake bands and by fake i don't mean like oh they're trying to be something else don't mean like fake like they're not actually banned it's two guys who write music in their studio and and put it out on this platform and then once that gets a sync they work on a different thing in a different genre or whatever it is and And it's tough because there's just so—
Starting point is 00:12:46 And they're not touring. No, no. Fuck no. Because I see that. I see that. Like, a lot of these guys who have, like, fucking 100,000 streams or— Not 100,000. 100 million streams.
Starting point is 00:12:55 Yeah, yeah, yeah. Probably can't even tour. 100%. They don't have a fan base. Here's the crazy thing. Think about this. How many social media platforms or profiles do you see that have 30 million followers? And how many Spotify playlists do you see or artists that have 15 million on a song,
Starting point is 00:13:10 but you've never even heard of them from anybody? No, it's not saying it's fake. I'm just saying that there's so much out there that is massive, and we don't know about it, and that's crazy. It just means that the way people are consuming is so different because for an artist to be as big as having 100 200 million streams and me have never heard of them before yeah you know i mean 90s that wasn't heard of in the 2000s i wouldn't have been heard of somebody selling 100 million 10 million records and you never heard of them so what is it is it
Starting point is 00:13:39 singles now like oh for sure how do you get a platinum record? Is it still the same amount of units or I heard it's less? It's different, yeah. So they figured out the digital download version. I don't know what the number is, but it's less than a million to get the platinum status. Or maybe it's more. I don't know how it works,
Starting point is 00:13:59 but I know it's not exactly a million. So how are people living off these royalties? Because you're not making that much royalties off sinks. If people are worrying about sinks and stuff, they're not giving that much money out. That's why it goes back to touring, guarantees, selling merch, selling tickets. Yeah, but I'm talking about those guys
Starting point is 00:14:18 who are building fake bands. Oh, right, yeah. Well, I know one in particular he does maybe he lands maybe one sink a year three four hundred thousand dollar sink he does it in his own studio so he owns the master he owns the writing he wrote it by himself so there's money there's money and the sink's really kind of where there is if you're not getting a great touring base sink is kind of where there is money because streaming as you know it's 0.0034 of one penny per stream which works out to about 5 000 for every million streams 5 000 split that between the band minus
Starting point is 00:14:52 commissions for the manager whoever owns the master label recoup a million streams is unheard of and it makes you nothing zero dollars man isn't that doesn't that piss you off oh my god so much and they're trying to fix it but like it's going gonna be a long road there's like what are they trying to fix they're trying to fix the songwriters union essentially we're like artists who don't write the music are getting way bigger cuts than the songwriters themselves and they're trying to flip-flop that because it's becoming more open and free that big artists like a Dua Lipa or Justin Bieber or whatever don't write their songs everybody everybody pretty much knows that so now they're trying to like get those songwriters to come up and like make more and own a piece of whatever
Starting point is 00:15:35 yeah I used to work with Ian Kirkpatrick oh yeah right yeah okay exactly he did Dua Lipa he wrote a lot of those songs yeah but yeah it's just so fascinating. So it's basically, it's the producer's world. You could be a band. You are a band. Right, yeah, yeah, exactly. I do it all exactly. But you're touring. That's why I fucking love you, dude. And that's what I had. So I used to
Starting point is 00:15:58 split a studio with somebody. Actually, I used to work out of somebody else's studio. The way it works, whatever's written, half the money goes to whoever owns the recording. Half the money goes to whoever owns the recording half the money goes to whoever wrote the song i was writing all of the songs and losing half of the money because i didn't own the studio so in the producer world i had to figure out that like fuck it's worth it to pay and have your own studio so that you can own those recordings and like actually make money oh so that oh go back to that so like if you own your own studio you own the i own studio, you own the masters.
Starting point is 00:16:26 Right, exactly. If Fitness was signed to a label and they paid for our recording time, they own those masters. They get the first 50% of any money that comes in. With Fitness, we own our own studio. You guys just make records and then pitch it to labels or pitch it...
Starting point is 00:16:41 Pitch it to whoever. With the label thing, we kind of don't want to talk to any label unless they approach us we're not really trying to go fishing for a deal what's your philosophy on record labels think they're bullshit yes and no there's good ones and bad ones just like all of them what people always ask me would you sign a deal with fitness and i always go depends on the deal yeah you know what i'm saying? What's top of a major? Say a major label came to you and you're the same philosophy. They give you big money,
Starting point is 00:17:10 but they'll shelf you still. Right. Totally, yeah. So would you rather find a label or just do it yourself? And hopefully the song sticks. Right. So it's harder to DIY, but man, there's something.
Starting point is 00:17:24 We talked about the honesty, right? So in fitness, I make the artwork. I make the flyers. We do the socials. the song right so like i it's harder to diy but man there's something like are we talking about the honesty right so like in fitness i make the artwork i make the flyers we do the socials we do the radio book like when we try to get songs on the radio we're not hiring a team or having a division of the label reach out we are reaching out to the label to the radio stations personally and they love that so like there's something about the diy that where if you can fuck a label you know like yeah if you don't need it but i mean like money's money and i get it why is the dream to be on a record label it's just a bank with a big interest you know what it is to me honestly it's less about the money it's more about like people don't know how to market their music
Starting point is 00:17:58 to become successful so they need to use the labels sync team marketing team digital team all that shit to help them build this brand where like some of us that's all in my head i don't need somebody else to tell me what it should look like i don't need somebody else to tell me what it should be like you know so yeah fuck a label as much as i can until they come at me with a fucking million dollar deal with no pub and fucking one record you know what i mean then you're like i'll sign that all day yeah do you think rock and roll's dead no i think i think the disco era is happening i think rock and roll is getting outplayed currently by electronic indie fucking alt pop bullshit um and rock is always there it's always been there there. It's never left. But I think it's just now starting to poke its head back around the corner. Because you'll take bands like Sleigh Bells or something. That's like a big electronic band, but they've got distortion guitars and live drums.
Starting point is 00:18:54 And even the fucking Chainsmokers are now touring with a live drummer. And I feel like it's kind of starting to come back and pick up a little bit. I hope so. And I don't mean like butt rock. I mean like give me some fucking Butthole surfers Or some more Beck Or some more You know shit like that
Starting point is 00:19:08 Wow Kenny We're gonna do this a lot My man I'm always down In November too I'm always here Quick question What do you think of our band?
Starting point is 00:19:16 Andy Frasco in the UN? Yeah And our songwriting And how we How I You come from A very pop And rock stuff I'm coming from A very pop and rock stuff
Starting point is 00:19:25 I'm coming from a very entertainer side So for us to meet in the middle Because I still have a message I want to say Do you think we're writing okay songs here? A, I think you're writing great songs B, I was introduced to you via a Spotify link And I hadn't seen what you do live So my first introduction to you was that.
Starting point is 00:19:45 Then we started writing songs. And I was like, cool, I can kind of take this vibe and maybe trim a little bit of fat, add a couple of things and move it a little bit more into like a new radio scene. And then I started seeing videos of you guys live. And it was like a fucking light bulb that went off in my head because my show's crazy.
Starting point is 00:20:03 And so when I see you guys doing very similar shit to what we do, I'm like, oh, we're the same. I fucking get it. I completely get it. And now the writing has gotten even better to where like, I know what the goal is. I know what the vibe is. I know who you guys are as people.
Starting point is 00:20:19 I know what your personalities are. And like all of that can very easily translate in the music. And I think it is. So you're telling me there's a chance, Kenny god i think there's a fucking huge chance there's a great chance these songs are undeniable man they're fucking awesome and you guys are undeniable you know what i'm saying man i i really appreciate you taking a shot on us i know it's like of course man i'm happy to do it see you ever do this shit with bands and it just fuck it just sucks all the
Starting point is 00:20:42 time all the time well that's what we I was saying at the beginning of the podcast. That like, my job is to work. I mainly work with up and coming and breaking artists. That's about where my foothold lands. And that doesn't always mean I get rad artists. You know what I mean?
Starting point is 00:20:57 I won't say any names, but like sometimes you work with people who don't have anything to say. Right? Where you're like, no lyrics. But they're up and coming. But they're up and coming. Right they're up and coming, right? But that doesn't mean that they've made it.
Starting point is 00:21:07 That means that somebody's taking a shot and you know what? I think it's not going to work. You know what I mean? That kind of thing. So yeah, you guys have something to say. You guys know who you are and that is light years beyond
Starting point is 00:21:17 more than half of the people. With you, do you think that's because of touring? Yeah, yeah. Because you're the same way, right? Yeah, exactly. We've both done thousands of shows and we both know that, like, man, you really figure out who you are
Starting point is 00:21:31 when every night you're with a different set of people trying to accomplish the same goal, trying to win people over from song one to song ten. And you take that to the studio and you know who you are. And I think, yeah, I think touring helps a ton. One last thing. Are records important now?
Starting point is 00:21:49 I don't know. I don't know the answer to that question because Fitness put out one record because we were told, let's do singles. Singles are the way to go these days. But while we were trying to choose a single, we had like 30 songs, 10 of which we were in love with. And so we were like, fuck it.
Starting point is 00:22:04 We have our own studio. It doesn't cost us anything. Let's just put them out. So in that case, the record was great. It was a cool statement, I think, that a new band was like, fuck it. Here's a whole record. Now, after doing that record and how much time it took and seeing how three of the songs were the important
Starting point is 00:22:18 ones and the other ones were whatever, now it's like, okay, maybe it is a singles game so we're trying that. I don't know. It's like Game of Thrones out here. Somebody moves this chest yeah, no, somebody moves this chess piece, and you got to go around it over here, but like, it's what we do, we're survivors.
Starting point is 00:22:35 So we need to, so, to break it all down, bands need a tour. Yes. Bands need to fucking write songs. Yes. What else do bands need to do? They need to get out of their heads. They need to get out of, bands need to get out of their heads. They need to know out of bands, need to get out of their heads. They need to know who they are,
Starting point is 00:22:47 know what they look like, find their inspiration, have something to say. I can't stress that last one enough. Like have something to say. Right. So I'm so fortunate and I don't want to say that in some sort of egotistical way because literally I have nothing to say, but my singer has a lot to say and I'm so grateful. Why don't you have nothing to say, bud? It's just that I've never, I've never been a singer. And so it's never, I've never crossed my mind what I want to say to people. You know what I mean? I've always been like behind the keyboards or behind the guitar, which I love.
Starting point is 00:23:15 And I love to thrive back there. So I feel so fortunate to have a singer, Max, who has lots to say and is very good at saying it. So having him set that bar for me, now I want everybody I work with to have like, what do you want to say? What are you trying to say and is very good at saying it so having him set that bar for me now i want everybody i work with to have like what do you want to say what are you trying to say you can't just say nothing i can make up a song about a fucking vampire fucking whatever too you know what i mean but like what do you want to say what do you you know like you have sustenance yeah because i agree man the song right the art of songwriting is something i am so passionate about you know and yeah i like entertaining but i want to master songwriting and it's all about just being an
Starting point is 00:23:51 open vessel and being 100 and being vulnerable with how we feel right and right and right i always like in what i do there's not always money to be made but i always say if i'm not writing i'm not getting better anyway. So, right, so like if it's a day off or whatever, go in and write another one and write another one. And when you write a thousand songs, you're that good. When you write two thousand songs. So it's ten thousand hours, same thing. Ten thousand, yeah, hundred percent ten thousand hours.
Starting point is 00:24:15 Do the work and fucking things will work out. If you fucking want to do it, Tunnel Vision. That's it, man. If you want to write fucking indie songs like Floyd does, then fucking indie songs like Floyd does and fucking write them? Floyd! The key to your car. That's why I'm here.
Starting point is 00:24:29 You got the keys to your fucking... Yeah, here. Thank you. Fucking hell, Floyd. Jesus. All right, guys. We'll listen to Anthony from Papa Dojo. Thanks for being on the show, Kenny.
Starting point is 00:24:36 I'll see you. Let's get back to work, boys. All right. Here we go. All right. Next up on the interview hour, we have Anthony Thogmartin from Papadozio. First time getting to meet this guy.
Starting point is 00:24:52 We just played together. Oh, fuck, what was that? Oh, Resonance Fest. That was last week. Yeah, killer band. Totally, they're all about finding these weird-ass tones. Chris, play something on Papadozio while I'm pimping them out. Yeah, they're really good guys.
Starting point is 00:25:09 Anthony, first time meeting him, you know, he's had some things with anxiety in his past, and he's fighting through that and helping it through meditation, you know. Talk a little about mental health. Talk about gear. Just talk about living on the road, you know. This guy's a good guy, and Papadocia is a big band in our scene. So, ladies and gentlemen, please enjoy Anthony and me talking about life on the World Saving Podcast. Gwna'i roi'n fawr yn y llaw, Mae'n fwy o fawr. Mae'n fwy o fawr.
Starting point is 00:25:52 Mae'n fwy o fawr. Mae'n fwy o fawr. Mae'n fwy o fawr. Mae'n fwy o fawr. Come on From the land All now content Come on Hey, Anthony. How you doing, buddy? Good. How are you? Papa Dojo. Yeah, Well, give me a little background. Where are you from? You guys are from Asheville? Ohio, actually. You're from Ohio?
Starting point is 00:26:46 Yeah. Okay, cool. All the way down in Ohio, yeah. We started in Athens, which is kind of like the OU campus kind of thing. Okay. And there was a jam that happened every Tuesday night called the Open Jam at this really hole-in-the-wall bar. And there's 20 guys that would come in and out and play different stuff and the only rule we had was we didn't want any singing and it was all improvisation and one
Starting point is 00:27:09 day we were like hey you guys want to like maybe practice for once and come up with some songs sort of we never took anything really seriously but you know so what was the purpose of music for you then if it wasn't serious like what what were you doing it for just to be express yourself you know what i mean and just however however that comes together and i honestly like it picked up meaning for us it didn't really start that way you know we like kind of came out of the primordial soup of being like a wily you know hammered like you know 20 year old person you know what i mean and then it became over time like oh you can do good things with this, you know?
Starting point is 00:27:45 Let's go back to expressing yourself. Like, was it hard to express yourself when you were a kid? You know, I think, yeah, it's the American culture. You only get, you have a certain option. You have a subset of options about how you can express yourself, and then you're really limited in other ways, you know? And so, like, I think that music is a great, like,
Starting point is 00:28:07 vehicle to free that up, you know and so like uh i think that music is a great like uh vehicle to free that up you think this is why people are are uh you know this is why mental health is running or people are with hot are growing high anxiety and high anxiousness because they feel like there's only four ways to live life that's got to be a component of it you know what i mean that they feel like kind of closed into a certain persona you know what i mean do you ever feel that way do you ever feel absolutely i mean but what's funny is uh you know we we can delve into this and delve right out of it but like we we're we we're up in a situation right now where literally half the country thinks the other half of the country is legitimately insane yeah you know what i mean so we both think each side is insane.
Starting point is 00:28:45 Exactly, and that's insane. That's the real Kool-Aid right there. You know what I mean? Like, what? So, I mean, I understand it. I know why it's happening. You know what I mean? But that's also the job of music.
Starting point is 00:28:54 It's up to the artists to give people a chance to reconnect. You know what I mean? Yeah. And what about, like, even deeper than that? Like, what about, like, when, like, say, you wanted to have this career? When it's fucking, I want to be a musician. To your parents
Starting point is 00:29:10 or someone who has these ideals of how they're going to live life. Those four standards. How hard was that to say, no, fuck it. I'm going to be a musician? To be honest, man, I had the best parents. They were incredible. But they were kind of giving me the whole,
Starting point is 00:29:26 really? Don't you want to have a family? You know what I mean? It was pretty hard, but it reinforced my desire to do it. It kind of drove me to be like, well, I'm going to show them that I can do this. You know what I mean? And I came at it from that angle.
Starting point is 00:29:41 Was there a moment in your... What was the moment in your career where maybe they saw you play Red Rocks? Exactly. That was actually it. It was amazing. It was amazing. Imagine my parents,
Starting point is 00:29:50 they're like, you know, they come from this small town in Ohio and they come to see this epic thing, this huge wall that you stand. I mean, it's less of a like flat crowd thing. And, you know, for your listeners that haven't seen Red Rocks, it's like a big wall of people,
Starting point is 00:30:04 of all the people you've ever met in your life. Yeah. Because they've come to see your big show at Red Rocks, right? Yeah, exactly. And I could see them clear as day. You can see the first 50 rows. You can see everybody's face. You see everybody that's looking at you.
Starting point is 00:30:14 And I just see them just like wide-eyed, like, look at this. Look at, like, I can't believe this. And, you know, they came back kind of dumbfounded after it, you know. They finally got it. Yeah. People are smoking like footlong spliffs and they're just like, wow. Like,
Starting point is 00:30:26 you know, it's crazy. And they're just like, wow, this is really amazing. And like, I, I get it.
Starting point is 00:30:31 They, they, they went under and saw all the like, you know, signatures and I showed them where the Beatles had played, you know what I mean? And it's just, you know,
Starting point is 00:30:38 it's sweet. So from there, they're like, I get it. Yeah. How was it? I feel like a sense of relief because we're always trying to, it's like some Freudian thing where we're always trying to, I get it. Was it a sense of relief? Because we're always trying to... It's like some Freudian thing where we're always trying to...
Starting point is 00:30:49 I don't know, trying to impress our parents. Why is that? I don't know. I think one thing is that we are an extension of them. They're our genes. Exactly, yeah. So they want to see what happens to them. Because when they're gone, we're carrying whatever they are on.
Starting point is 00:31:03 You know what I mean? I don't have children yet, so i don't really know what that is like you have a girlfriend wife or anything i have a really yeah really great girlfriend she's in the scene sweet melissa she is doing that mural down i don't know if you saw the mural where you played down there there's a big like painting mural she has kind of like a painting band oh cool it's pretty cool they all they go to festivals and they paint together in collaboration. It's cool. That's fucking awesome.
Starting point is 00:31:28 How many dates do you do a year? We do a lot. 200, 100? We used to do that many. We're trying to focus on big events that are like kind of destination style, really fun, like crazy things. We just played in that cave. Did you hear about that cave in Tennessee?
Starting point is 00:31:40 There's this cave. You've got to do a show there, man. You've got to. You'd have the best time ever. It's amazing. I heard it's radical. Yeah. So we're trying to do a show there, man. You've got to. You'd have the best time ever. It's amazing. Yeah, I heard it's radical. Yeah. So we're trying to do stuff like that.
Starting point is 00:31:47 So, yeah, talk about that game plan. You're a band now for, what, 16 years? What, 2006? So 14 years? Yeah, I guess so. And talk about that. Once you're a band, you finally get to this level where it's like you're selling tickets. And how do we maintain this fan base and grow musically and grow spiritually yeah like what's your like what's
Starting point is 00:32:11 your game plan for the next five years let's say if i'm trying to like not tour so much but like do shows that are important to you or write music that are important to you like what's your game plan well i think that we we kind of noticed're like, we're an improvisational band. But when you do a string of 14 to 15 dates in a row, night after night, the 15th show isn't going to be as good as your first one because your brain is mush. You know what I mean? So it was more like a question of quality. Like we want to bring like a really awesome show every time. And as an improvisational act, 35% of the show we make up on the spot. So if it's not, if we're not firing, if our wires are crossed and we're all like, you know what I mean? So we can only do so much. And so we decided, you know, we want to do cooler things. And, you know, yeah, how do you keep
Starting point is 00:32:56 the boat afloat? You know, doing less dates means you bring in less. So you got to figure out how you're going to make that work. Volpec does that good where it's like, we're only playing 10 shows. Well, I mean, they're incredible. They made their whole thing a totally different way. Becoming viral on YouTube and doing these throwback style videos.
Starting point is 00:33:14 I mean, their whole, I guess if you want to go into the marketing side of it, they were super smart. You know what I mean? They nailed it. What do you think why they got successful through social media? What do you think they did? I Through social media What do you think they did
Starting point is 00:33:25 I just think that it struck a chord in people And they saw this Aesthetic That people want And they delivered it And they keep delivering it They're just a fantastic act They got the sound
Starting point is 00:33:40 They got the chops too To back it up I don't know. I don't really think about marketing probably as much as I should. Yeah, you're all about the art. Well, I just don't want to have that section of my brain go that direction. I'd rather be like, all right, does this work musically? My left brain should be doing that, not like, you know.
Starting point is 00:34:04 That's a good philosophy because my brain, I need to put put it everywhere i'm doing a fucking podcast i'm doing fucking everything because i just want to learn as much as i can about the industry that i'm in so like let's talk about improvisation then if that's like i heard you're a gearhead too big time yeah talk to me get nerd out with me i don't know anything about you dude like like what if you're trying to talk to a guy who, um, what's the most important about, um, a sound like in whatever tone instrument, like, well, how important is that to you over anything else? Well, I mean, if I could even make it like maybe even more general, I think you just
Starting point is 00:34:36 need to have a spark on, on what you're doing. And what I'd like to think are one of our band sparks is, is our, we make weird timbres like timbres that haven't really been listened to before you know so we'll try we'll try to run this through that through this through that box and see what happens at the end of it and then we'll take that on stage so maybe you know a spark of a band that doesn't focus on that is a great like stage performance like i've heard you're a great stage performer you're doing all this wacky stuff on stage that's a spark you know i mean so whatever So whatever the spark is, is what you need. So for example, Dave Tipper, that guy makes super wacky sounds, man.
Starting point is 00:35:12 Like really crazy, kind of like brain-opening sounds. This guy, he's one of the headliners here. Oh, cool. So yeah. And then you've got Umphreys McGee. Their spark is this perfect chops. So I think that every musician... So what's your spark?
Starting point is 00:35:25 I don't know. I feel like it's making, it's making sounds and then being able to like improvise with them with, with the, the band and like try to like make something that's really weird kind of work. You know what I mean? Like come at it from a really strange angle.
Starting point is 00:35:38 And, uh, maybe I might have to ask the fans. I don't know if we even have one. Now that you're asking me this, I'm like, we gotta be, we gotta love ourselves and love the art that we have before we give it to our fans or
Starting point is 00:35:48 we become hollow you know the minute we start thinking about the fans first i mean i don't want to be fucking self it's all about the fans i know it is but but like to make real art that yeah you know we're vessels like you're a singer too right yes so how important are the words as well as the spark of the of the music and like how important are melodies to you like you know melodies i think we're coming up in a time where like the melodies are becoming secondary or or even tertiary to like the the beats and the bass lines and stuff like that of of the scene so uh i don't know i think it's because we we like to explore rhythm and i think it's accessible for people.
Starting point is 00:36:26 I don't really talk about general. Why do you think, cause that's happening a lot in all the music that's coming around, like a lot of beat, a lot of pulse, right? Well, I think a percussion is like,
Starting point is 00:36:37 it's the foundation for stuff. And I think that music education in general, in the, in the high school levels is, is on a decline. So people aren't being exposed to quarterly complex things. You know what I mean? So I was raised listening to like John Williams and shit.
Starting point is 00:36:49 You know what I mean? Like, so I was listening to really wacky stuff. Like, that makes sense with your fucking band though, dude. Because you have the people, keep going. Sorry, I'm talking to him. It's all good. It's all good. I mean, there's a lot of bands that are doing that though.
Starting point is 00:37:01 Like you go to a talk show, I'm Freeze McGee. Like there's these, These acts are dope-a-pot. They're doing all kinds of really cool modulations, and the notes are really wild. And I think people are picking up on that. But I think for a while there, we needed to explore their stuff, mainly because people weren't being exposed to that kind of music. Coming up, I was raised in the 90s,
Starting point is 00:37:21 so I listened to the radio hits were sometimes 10 minutes long. It was crazy. We had a section section there you know what I mean we're like I mean you know Pearl Jam songs were super long like they play the whole song yeah they play the whole thing yeah and they keep playing it you know and and so I coming up now you listen to rock radio is just uh it seems weird like they're doing a bunch of like throwback songs like they're going back to like kind of the early days because they just don't know what to do they're like what what do we play you know what i mean because the music that's like coming up now is just not as quarterly complex but i think it's coming back you know what i mean we're having like another 90s resurgence we we dipped into this whole like kind of repetitive thing and we're like all right what are we gonna do now you know
Starting point is 00:37:59 what i mean like and if you're president of music what would you what would music, what would be your approach to fix the music industry if it needs fixing? Yeah, I guess I don't know if it needs fixing. I think we need those waves. But I guess if I could say anything, I would just say people just need to be genuine. You know what I mean? And stop trying to imitate the last thing that worked. You know what I mean? Because the minute you start doing that, it's already gone.
Starting point is 00:38:24 Right. Yeah. the last thing that worked. Because the minute you start doing that, it's already gone. Right. And every artist that I've met that has stuck to their guns and just played the long game, they're still doing it. And they're doing it and they're supported. They may not be the biggest thing ever, but if you go for the biggest thing ever right away, you're going to burn out in three seconds.
Starting point is 00:38:40 Why do you think we always... Before I ask that question, let's talk about the long game. Have you ever beat the shit out of your band members? Or got any fucking... You know, like anyone beyond... I mean, I do it. I don't have... Never beat anyone up in my band.
Starting point is 00:38:53 But, you know, anyone ever try to like, just like strangle you? I mean, I think people don't realize is that when you're in a band, it goes from a deep friendship to more of a, you know, sibling brotherhood kind of situation. So when you're in a band, it goes from a deep friendship to more of a sibling brotherhood kind of situation. So when you have brothers,
Starting point is 00:39:08 you get in deeper fights, but you also, there's better love. You know what I mean? There's understanding there because you've been through all the shit together. You know what I mean? All of it. You have way more in common
Starting point is 00:39:19 than you could ever have not in common. And you know, I wish I could say we've had some glass smashing crazy shit but it's never happened you know what i mean like it's past that it's like it's that it's i'm going back to mental health it's like when we're afraid to suppress our feelings right right and we just keep that shit inside and it festers and it festers then it blows up and then you're fucking yelling and stuff like being a complete open vessel, like that's the importance of being in a band for so long.
Starting point is 00:39:46 Right. Cause you can't fuck, you can't fucking, you know, you get all these emotions. You guys share such beautiful times with each other. There's gotta be a release. There's gotta be that balance that,
Starting point is 00:39:56 you know, let the wave that's, you know, you gotta say it's music, isn't it? Isn't it? Isn't it that like, I mean,
Starting point is 00:40:01 moments I've been frustrated and music, you know, we've got a show. Yeah. You get frustrated. You can take it out on your instrument. You know what I mean? You can take it out on, on, and, and, and sometimes you can turn, you can turn it into
Starting point is 00:40:14 something else. So like, I'm feeling this way, but by the time the end of the show, I don't know if you experienced this, but I get this thing called like, I call it stage health. Like I don't feel that great, but if I get on stage and i'm playing music like about 15 minutes into it i feel like 30 40 better just because i'm on stage there's something about it and i think it when you're talking about mental health i think for me that's like a good release yeah it's gotta be i mean like this is why we're doing it we wouldn't kill we wouldn't beat ourselves up living in a van like there's too much bad shit that happens on the road to our bodies and our
Starting point is 00:40:46 minds and our fucking hangovers that we live for that two hours you know it's true yeah so when you have a shitty two hours it must be do you take it does it does it hurt you i mean like what was the worst show you ever played oh man i try not to remember those you know what i mean give me one what happened how about this i'll do you one better i remember having played one a really bad set and then i remember having played a really good set in my head and i walk off stage after the really good set or after the really bad set and and this kid's like you changed my life tonight man like you really you guys you know he like lost his mind and then i walk off stage like i fucking nailed it tonight hell yeah
Starting point is 00:41:30 like and i walk off stage and one of my friends that has seen us a lot he's like you guys have done better huh probably weren't that you know i'm just like shit on my parade you know what i mean it's it's hard dude i mean i remember like you know like I'm you know like you said I got a lot of stuff like like shtick stuff and sometimes
Starting point is 00:41:50 when you're playing two nights and you don't want to be autopilot and you want to really give them a full expression and you don't
Starting point is 00:41:57 I beat myself up I think about that I think about that like like what about when you're like what's your like game plan when there's like when you have to do like three fucking shows at a festival?
Starting point is 00:42:08 We have anchors in the song. So like there's a section that breaks off and it's all kind of sectioned out so that like we have a part that we're going to come back to. And we all we can we can like count down to it or make some weird face at each other. So we know that's going to happen. But in terms of like structuring a show, I mean, one thing we were talking about sticks earlier, one thing I feel like, or sparks or whatever,
Starting point is 00:42:28 you know, but one thing I think we like to do is, is take it really, really down and get real quiet so that the loud parts seem a little bit more. And that's what, that's why we get the, one of my favorite things that people will say,
Starting point is 00:42:39 like, I like Papadosio, but sometimes they're like elevator music. And I'm like, sweet. Cause man, I've gotten some elevators before and been like, damn, i wish papadosio was in my elevator like if you go to atlanta for example i don't know why atlanta has this but the most jam and jams i've ever heard
Starting point is 00:42:53 are in elevators in atlanta it's like yeah so every once in a while you know like we'll we'll really take it down there just to try to so that when the big loud part comes it's like whoa you know what i mean and so that's one thing we definitely try to do at least once a set. That's totally, if we had one like trick, you know what I mean? It's that, you know,
Starting point is 00:43:09 what do you want to prove with your life? Like, what do you want to be remembered by? I don't know. I just hope that people find a home in the music that we made, you know, like, so that like,
Starting point is 00:43:23 cause I feel like we're just weird and like there's a certain type of person that might like feel like better by like listening to what we made because it it's a place for their brain to be you know what i mean if i could do anything it would be just to give them a home yeah and in their in their head you know what i mean like i i feel like we we play some some of the stuff we get to every once in a while. And sometimes you don't get to choose because it's improv. We'll hit a certain thing. And I'm like, yeah, that's the thing, whatever that is. You know what I mean?
Starting point is 00:43:51 That inexpressible, ineffable section of music that I haven't really heard before. And it just gives people a place to hang out. I don't know if that makes any sense at all. No, it totally makes sense. But that's what I'm going with. No, let's go back to that idea of home. What is home to you outside of the stage like what is home for you i guess we're i guess we're like all things meet you know what i mean like i think when you're on the road and you know what
Starting point is 00:44:14 this is like you know what i mean like home ends up becoming more of a concept than it is a place you know so how do you get through that i don't know i remember being like younger and like going through like you know for example like you know psychedelic voyages and having to get... Acid or mushrooms? Whatever. I was on arrowhead.org a lot, so whatever was there, you know what I mean? What is that? I was an idiot. What?
Starting point is 00:44:34 You remember that? No, tell me about it. There was this hilarious website back in the day. You could order whatever was hanging out. And they had all these different trip reports. What's it called? Arrowhead.org. Arrowhead.org. Arrowhead.org. I mean, all the chemicals that they had on there,
Starting point is 00:44:48 like we were, we were idiots, absolute idiots. Like what kind of chemicals were you taking? Like baby wood rose seeds. What else did we do? I'm not, I am not advocating for any of this.
Starting point is 00:44:57 This is a really bad idea. This is the past life. Don't worry. Don't worry. Anyway, we would, we would, we would order just random stuff and there would be all these these people talking about what it was like if you did them.
Starting point is 00:45:08 And so we'd try them out. You know what I mean? And we got into some serious, ridiculous situations because of it. Like what? Oh, I lived one night in reverse. That was pretty wild. What? Don't explain this.
Starting point is 00:45:20 Reverse? I'd go crazy. What do you mean? explain this reverse i'd go crazy like how what do you mean we uh we had a party uh and a friend of mine and i like ate way more than we were supposed to of these baby woodrow seeds and like uh like i remember waking up in the bed that i was gonna sleep in that night at the top of this hill at his house and then the next scene i wake wake up by the fire and i keep waking up in all these different places i'm like this is strange and then he comes after me with this log, like trying to hit me with it because he had ate the same stuff. And I remember running through the woods like away from him.
Starting point is 00:45:50 Is this a hallucination or is this real? It's not real. I mean, it was a, yeah, it was a hallucination, but it was like, it's a, I think it's a disassociative. It's like a really just, it's just a horrible thing. I would never. I want to talk about this. I just remember just like the events of the night had rearranged themselves. It's like that Arrested Development. You watch Arrested Development where he
Starting point is 00:46:11 movies himself every night. So he doesn't remember. Right. Exactly. It is halftime at the Enni Fresco interview hour. Welcome back to another episode of Review. I'm your host, Ari Finling. Today, I am reviewing fatherhood. I'm talking about becoming a father, not some shitty fucking TV show on TNT or TBS. Let me first say that my daughter is the greatest thing that has ever happened to me. Now, having said that, what the fuck did I get myself into? I haven't slept more than three hours a night since she was born. I'm running on like 60 fucking ounces of coffee a day, which my doctor says will literally stop your heart. My daughter pisses and shits like she's a fucking
Starting point is 00:46:59 horse. I should have named her fucking Barbara or Seattle slew. The other day, I swear to God, I went to smell her diaper, and she farted, and a little bit of shit got in my mouth. No one preps you for how to handle your daughter shitting in your mouth. But when she looks at me and smiles, ooh, boy, that'll melt your heart. This has been Review. I'm your host, Ari Finling. Good night.
Starting point is 00:47:23 This has been Review. I'm your host, Ari Finling. Good night. At the end of the day, we were doing all these really dumb things. But through that, what we kind of discovered was that there is a section of the brain, and there's a section of music music that like is sort of unexplored and fortunately i was able to meet like a bunch of other uh musicians that like kind of had that same like idea uh oh yeah there is this whole like unexplored section and and maybe the psychedelics had something to do with it maybe you know like i'm definitely a different person because of that you know uh and coming out like the other end of that and like i focus way more i meditate a lot that's kind of like my main what like transcendental no no no more like uh i don't know if you ever listen to like uh like tick not han no like he's a it's more of like a just how do we
Starting point is 00:48:17 even put this like it's less specific uh i really, really enjoy his teaching. He's a great, great guru. Just a wonderful guy. Tell me his philosophy. What is philosophy that you love? Centric to Buddhism is kind of like where he's coming from, but I'm kind of less religion, more like just trying to get centered. You know what I mean?
Starting point is 00:48:39 And I needed it because it used to be, I used to turn to substances back in the day. And after having discovered that, like it really changed like my approach to life and I only need 15 minutes if I ever get out of my head and it's like bad. I only need 15 minutes to get back there thanks to like having like practiced
Starting point is 00:48:57 because it's just one of those things you can practice, like riding a bicycle. You can sit there and breathe and turn the mind off for just a second and you can feel better. You can. It's really not hard. Anyone can for just a second, and you can feel better. You can. It's really not hard. Anyone can do it.
Starting point is 00:49:06 What do you think you were running from when you're deep in that? I have no idea. You had a good family. You had a good childhood. Amazing family. That's what I'm talking about. I was supported. I'm the same as you.
Starting point is 00:49:17 What do you think we're running from? Well, I think that, again, Terrence McKenna said something really cool. He said, culture is not your friend. And I really like that statement because culture is like this, like, it's this where we get together and we sort of agree on certain behavior sets. Yeah. But we can't, like, change fast enough to, like, address the changing times. And so, like, when he said that, like, I really connected with that. And I think that people that are on the periphery of culture, this is like a subculture that we're in.
Starting point is 00:49:46 It's like a very small subset. And so we're kind of leaving mainstream culture a little bit and going this way. And we're taking a step in the right direction. But then even the people within this scene that are taking another step out, they either teach people or we learn how we shouldn't be. You know what I mean? There's the naked guy that's covered in mud and he's got blood all over him. And he's like, all right, what happened to this dude?
Starting point is 00:50:06 Not that guy. No, no, no, not that guy. But then there's somebody else that steps out and says, Hey, have you ever tried to meditate instead of doing drugs? Or, Hey, have you ever tried to like do a week of like, like a cleanse or something? And, you know, just try not to drink for a week or something. Just see what happens. You know, like, that's what I'm talking about. There's like these people that like everyone else looks at them like they're crazy, but there's like something for that. So I guess like when you asked earlier about like, what could music do for you or for the world? What are you trying to deliver?
Starting point is 00:50:31 It would be that, you know what I mean? Like that there are more options for us. You know what I mean? There's more to life than just, you know, this or that. There's more to life. And I would love to do that with music. It's fucking awesome. Like how do we get, you know,
Starting point is 00:50:44 we're talking about this subculture we're in, like the people that we get, but how do we get the people who don't get it, who are, if we give them the full experience, they'll be fucking scared. Like, no, no, no, I'm not going deep into that rabbit hole. But how do we like approach that in our music to get these people more to understand
Starting point is 00:51:00 a different way of being present? Because everyone, you could see like, there's no difference people taking drugs and staring at your phone. Like, the same you're you're you're running away from from the present exactly so like is meditation for you to keep you present yeah well the the idea the idea of meditation is to just be with what's actually happening as opposed to what you are putting on the world like the layer like when you when you walk around and even i just just just earlier i saved this video on youtube there's a there's a systems theorist who just got this this equation that's sort of proving that not only our colors
Starting point is 00:51:34 that we see and like physical like the reality like those are like layers that our brain makes up like so when i see green or whatever but. But he's postulating now that like even physical objects like heavenly bodies, like the moon, for example, are just being created by our minds. And the way that we interact with reality, what we perceive as objective. Is that quantum physics? It's system theory.
Starting point is 00:51:58 And then, I don't know, I wish I could say his name right now because I don't remember what it is. But I don't know, maybe I'll share the link with you later because it blew my freaking mind but like it's crazy anyway long story short like the idea is that like and the idea of meditation is to remove the layer of what you're projecting onto the world like those people are judging me or you know that's blue and and all these things like the idea is like to take the layer away yeah to peel like the onion as as as they say, and get to the core of what's actually happening.
Starting point is 00:52:28 And that's why they say get centered. You know what I mean? That's the idea of it. When you're first doing the meditation and when you're first, like your body is telling you, it's starting to like, you don't want to do this. Not your body, your brain is just fucking just chatter, chatter, chatter. What were those first chatters about?
Starting point is 00:52:44 Who knows? You ever take ayahuasca? Yeah, chatter. What were those first chatters about? Who knows? Did you ever take ayahuasca? Yeah, yeah. What was that? I've never done it. That was down in Peru, although I don't think I would recommend. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:52:54 Were you in a bad spot? Not necessarily. I just wouldn't recommend that people go. There's so many ayahuasca churches here in the States that you can, it's just a better environment. It's kind of become a business all around the world now so you have to like really avoid like the the the traps why do you think people take that um it's like the the onion thing it's the same thing i think
Starting point is 00:53:15 it's the same thing i i i don't know if it's really for everybody i think people dealing with substance abuse problems like it helps it oh my god it'll change your life. How so? You get kind of audited by this thing. And it shows you who you are. And it reveals to you the ugliest aspects of you. It's almost like... What they reveal out of you? Oh man, so much. Like what?
Starting point is 00:53:37 So much. Now looking back, because you're a different person now, what were you? So I guess what i was before is i what i originally was was a person that liked to hike a lot and i'd be outside and i'd do things and like uh i really enjoyed nature and uh for a while there i got real caught up in like this music i'm making and that what my takeaway from that whole thing was like you got to walk in the woods more you got to be more with like the earth and And that was kind of like, that was my download,
Starting point is 00:54:05 but everyone gets a different one. I was there with some people that had some substance abuse issues and they were revealed to them. And you see yourself for like what you actually are, you know? Yeah. But you can do the same thing with, with yoga.
Starting point is 00:54:16 You can do the same thing with, but what if our substance abuse is music? I mean, that's expression, isn't it? Cause it's going back to that. Say like, I used to love hiking
Starting point is 00:54:26 why am I so absorbed it's like going back to the beginning of this conversation where it's like changing your mind state from I was doing music I love it now it's a job now I have to understand like maintaining it and like not doing as many shows like when we were young we used to play all the time
Starting point is 00:54:42 because we loved playing I think we forget who we like when we were young we used to play all the time because we love playing right it's like i think it i i think we forget who we are when we just entertain for people all the time right it's true it's true i want to get back to you we were talking about like what the the what you do with those thoughts like when you when you're coming up with the meditation like i i think that you know when a thought comes up for those that are just trying to dive into this whole thing like the first thought that comes up is you make friends with, you know, when a thought comes up, for those that are just trying to dive into this whole thing, like the first thought that comes up is you make friends with it. You know, instead of being like, oh, I had a thought. I'm trying to like clear my brain.
Starting point is 00:55:11 Like, damn it, another thought came up. The idea is instead of being like, oh, hey, thought. How you doing, thought? And then the thought goes away. Like you think of yourself as like an open house with no furniture and like your thoughts come into the house and they hang out and then they leave. Like if you, let's say you're feeling down or you're sad depressed it's just hanging out in your house it's a guest
Starting point is 00:55:29 it's not you like you're just a container you know what i mean that's that's the idea so like if you're sitting there and you're you know you're breathing you're just focusing on okay i'm breathing i'm breathing you know that's all that it is and then a thought comes in there and he's like oh hey thought are you gonna hang out what's going on thought like why am i having this thought is another thought that's coming with that thought and and and you start to unravel like what happens and then you start to feel your body like when you feel a certain thought you're like oh that makes my stomach feel weird or you know that makes my knee kind of jerk when i feel and then you realize okay these are these are potentially traumas these are like other things and You let them go.
Starting point is 00:56:06 Do you ever take therapy? I probably should. We're talking about mental health now. I think a lot more people should be doing that. The therapy I give myself is that. Meditation is the same thing. It's like understanding your thought. Trying to figure out... What are your patterns?
Starting point is 00:56:24 The empty house analogy I understand completely. it's the same thing with anxiety like if you understand like hey bud don't let it control you you want to be a guest be a guest but they'll eventually leave when they feel like they're not in control so like what that's amazing i gotta try i gotta and you aren't anything like people will say like i'm well i happen to be this way or i happen to be that way those are just tendencies you aren't anything you just are a person you know like think about your best show you ever played it was when your house was empty you were just on stage you're in the flow state is what they call it you're just doing it you know what i mean the last moment you don't even know what's going on the future moment you don't know it's coming you're just there you know yeah present so we have so happiness is just being present exactly it's just being there being there with
Starting point is 00:57:10 you you know having a conversation it's like you know it's it's here it's not there anytime oh check this out this is a good one uh any feeling of depression can be only described by a past and future comparison, right? You look at some other artist, you're like, man, I wish I could be that awesome. That's a past-future comparison. You're thinking about your past show, and you're watching them and thinking about the trajectory of their thing,
Starting point is 00:57:37 when you could have just been present, enjoying yourself. You know what I mean? That's the idea. Dr. Anthony up in here, dude. You're saving me. I'm just regurgitating stuff that I've read Isn't that education? I guess, I suppose So it doesn't matter, don't fucking own that shit, man
Starting point is 00:57:50 That's so fascinating I'm really deep into trying to figure that out Being a clear vessel Because you know it's like sometimes we'll go into autopilot You ever get that at shows? You go into autopilot and I'm like Oh yeah, that's just us not being present Yeah, right
Starting point is 00:58:04 So like you said, show 15 Autopilot, I'm like, oh yeah, that's just us not being present. Yeah, right, right. So like you said, show 15. How do you get out of that autopilot and get present again? I don't know. I think that there's a component of me aging. And I also am, I'm 35 now. Oh, cool. So I also think that like, it's not just that.
Starting point is 00:58:20 I mean, we all eat good. We used to eat like, you know, shit. Absolutely. Now we all eat, we used to eat like you know shit absolutely now we all eat we eat as well as we can we we all like have different like you know exercise we do like we have to in order to keep the energy up for the shows that we do but if we did 15 shows in a row i just we're not gonna that final night is not gonna be it you know what i mean our next tour is gonna be great 15th show make sure you know what I'm saying? But yeah, I mean,
Starting point is 00:58:45 there are physical limitations to it that we're recognizing now. You know what I mean? And like when we were like, you know, 23, we were sleeping on people's, you know, we would sleep at a party
Starting point is 00:58:55 behind the couch, you know, wake up three hours later and do like four nights in a row like that. You know what I mean? It's a wonder we made it. Those grew you.
Starting point is 00:59:03 Yeah. You know, made you who you are. We don't do this shit anymore. Yeah. Okay, I got a question. Okay. If you can,
Starting point is 00:59:08 you got time? Yeah. Dude, I love this. This is great. Yeah. Great to meet you, man. This is awesome. We're getting to know each other
Starting point is 00:59:13 on the podcast. I'm really nervous because I'm like, oh, fuck. I hate doing interviews after a show because I'm all fucking hyped up. I took a bunch of mushrooms
Starting point is 00:59:20 on stage. I'm like, but if you could describe your soul in a piece of gear, what would the, what, what,
Starting point is 00:59:27 what gear was it? Would it be? Oh man. And why? I think it's been changing. Now I'm into this like really weird, like spaghetti monster called a modular synthesizer.
Starting point is 00:59:39 It's like you, you have a little box that does one thing and then you have a little cable and you plug it into another box that does another thing. And they're just an arrangement of boxes. And so you plug all the thing, and then you have a little cable, and you plug it into another box that does another thing, and they're just an arrangement of boxes.
Starting point is 00:59:48 And so you plug all the boxes together. So you have all these cords and shit going? Yeah, it's freaking weird. And the performance part of it, it's definitely the wiliest thing that we use on stage and can absolutely sound horrendous, you know what I mean, if you don't do it right. You know what I mean? So it's kind of like a puzzle to solve, sort of.
Starting point is 01:00:04 So you're still trying to figure out your soul. I'm having fun, you know? I'm just enjoying it right you know what i mean so it's kind of like a puzzle to solve sort of so you're still trying to figure out your soul i'm having fun you know i'm just enjoying it you know what i mean so i don't know i guess at this point it's the modular but i mean then i'll i'll go home and that's really techie and then i'll go home and like i'll pick up my acoustic and i'll just play the acoustic guitar for a couple days and not touch anything else and i'll remember oh yeah that's me too though you know like but that's that same difference of you being in the fucking hiking yeah you just wanting to hike and you trying to like figure out what the fuck to do on stage right right yeah bro you are balanced as fuck dog awesome i don't know i'm trying no but like seriously for you to try to to even just try a lot of people are afraid to find out who the who they are they just go through life of people are afraid to find out who they are.
Starting point is 01:00:46 They just go through life and just, oh, just don't know who they are. I'm just going a nine to five because everyone tells me to or I'm just going to fall in love with a chick I don't love or, you know, blah, blah, blah. Why? I mean, how can we teach people
Starting point is 01:01:00 to just start being present? I don't know. I think we have to ask ourselves. One time I was having a pretty hard time. With what? I'm pretty sure at the time I was in relationship issues. This was years and years and years ago. And I had a dream where I was in the back of this train.
Starting point is 01:01:20 Yeah. And the train's just going real fast through the mountains. And we're passing this sludge.udge looked like a tar sand situation. And there was this native Indian girl that was like the size of a boulder. She was super huge and she was like crying and and kind of like cry screaming at the at the train. And I took this to a friend of mine who interprets dreams. And I was like, what's going on? Like, what, what does this dream mean? Like, why am I having this issue? And she was like, well, are you in the driver's seat of your
Starting point is 01:01:49 life? Or are you in the back of a train, like letting your life take you somewhere? And I was like, wow, I guess I never really like thought of that analogy before. And then I realized I was like, I kind of need to take responsibility for my health and who I am. You know what I mean? That was kind of a turning point in my life when I realized I need to be proactive about how I feel. You got to do the work. No one's going to give you the work. Yeah, I think what we say is we say,
Starting point is 01:02:15 this happened to me. This person said, this person offended me. That's what mainstream culture is saying. We're kind of an offense culture right now. And we're saying, this is all happening to me. But really, nothing's happening to us. We're reacting is saying. We're kind of in a fence culture right now. And we're saying this is all happening to me, but really nothing's happening to us. We're reacting to things. You know what I mean? Like this is a field, like the world is just this, it could be anything.
Starting point is 01:02:32 Your brain is making up. I mean, and like I said before, science is probably about to prove that our brain is making a lot of this up. And like, so we're, we're interpreting what's happening as it happening to us. But like, let's say someone was like saying anthony you're like a shitty guitar player you know what i mean like i could i could i could laugh my way through that if i chose that but i could also choose to take offense to it and be like dude like what would you say that did you used to take offense to it yeah oh yeah big time
Starting point is 01:02:59 i think everybody does and i think that i still do i have to do the work it's it's like something that keeps going i have to remember that this is just it doesn't matter. You know, it's an opinion. It's just, you know, whatever. Like, who cares? Like, I can enjoy my life not contingent on what's being around me to I mean, and then to a certain degree, there are there are atrocities all over the world. They're difficult to deal with. But we have the tools to do to do a little work and make it a little bit better for ourselves and everyone else around us. Cause let's say I'm dealing with some horrible stuff that's happening, not to me, but it was just happening. I can try to make my way through it. And then everyone that's around me is going to have a better time because I'm having a little bit of a better time, you know? And that's all just the perception of how you're feeling in that moment. Right. So, I mean, I know it's been said a million times before, but I guess you're asking, like, what can we do? Well, I just feel like what we can do is do the work ourselves. And instead of telling everybody else what to think, if we do the work ourselves, we'll have the kind of energy or the air around us.
Starting point is 01:03:56 I mean, do you have any friends that when you're around them, they always make you smile and just feel good? Yeah. Like, I want to be better at that. There you go. Yeah. Shout out. Shout out, Dola. Yeah. Do, I want to be better at that. There you go. Yeah. Shout out. Shout out, Dola. Yeah, do you want to be that friend?
Starting point is 01:04:08 I want to be that for other people if I can. And I haven't been in my life. And I admit that. And I want to be, you know. So outside of your fans, because you're doing it to your fans. You said you just told me, like, your fans are crying after your fucking shows. Sometimes. And sometimes they're laughing.
Starting point is 01:04:22 But yeah, you want to be that personally. You want to be that lover or fucking friend that people could look up to. And that's hard to do when we're living on the road, right? Sometimes. Sometimes it can be if I'm not doing the work. But I think no matter what your life is, whatever you're dealing with.
Starting point is 01:04:39 Just do the work. Do the work, you know what I mean? And for me, meditation works. That doesn't mean it works for everybody. It works for some people. Maybe it's like being an athlete maybe it's running like a lot of people sweat it out yeah exactly you know whoever you are you've got there's something for you to do the work whatever that is you know anthony it's some deep shit though you are fucking you're a deep dude i was i was like nervous i'm like gonna have to talk about music i don't know anything
Starting point is 01:05:01 about your band i'm like fuck you were gonna have I tried to make it to your Cove set and got there when you guys ended. I think you were playing Rage. I think I heard it. During the day show. I don't know how y'all do it. Two sets are cool. I mean, I just am such an anxiety case when I have to play two times and fucking
Starting point is 01:05:19 You guys are fucking kings of that. We took the day off today. That's good. We're good. I guess we should talk about music You got anything coming out? I mean We have this like I can't say what it is yet But we have this cool rendition of the band coming out soon
Starting point is 01:05:34 That's different than what we've done before And I think we're going to dedicate an album to that Which will be fun You're like doing the Garth Brooks The David Blaine What do they What do Garth Brooks do? I don't know
Starting point is 01:05:46 Oh dude he changed his face But everyone knew it was Garth Brooks Oh really? It was awesome dude Oh we're not like going undercover Although that would be really funny That would be awesome That would be really funny
Starting point is 01:05:56 Dude just like completely changed What about it? You know what I want to do? I want to find like a Hollywood makeup artist To like make masks of each other So that we're like on stage And then we like halfway through the show Take off the masks so that we're like yeah i'm just really confused people so late night show right you know like sam's on the drums somehow and like billy's playing
Starting point is 01:06:13 the instruments yeah and then take a second mask off i'm not i would love that would be so amazing there you go that's probably the most expensive square garden that's gonna be your mask that's your red rocks when you've i've already ruined it no don't worry Square Garden. That's going to be your Madison. That's your Red Rocks. I've already ruined it. No, don't worry about it. No one's listening to this podcast anyway. It's all good. But Anthony, that's great, man. I'm very happy we're friends.
Starting point is 01:06:32 And I'm fucking, that's tight that you really advocate meditation. Because it doesn't matter what you do. To get you through your addictions, however you're going to get through to fucking like yourself again, that's how we're going to fix this thing. We've got to like ourselves, right? Yeah, we've got to at least take care of ourselves. Or try to like ourselves.
Starting point is 01:06:49 I think the idea is cultivating that. It comes out of there. Once you peel all that stuff back, all that self-depreciation, like I'm not as good as this person, or I'm comparing myself, or I'm having this issue, or why do I feel this way all the time? When you peel all that away, all that's left is just this weird body with this weird brain and this ability to express itself. And you have no real reason to not like it.
Starting point is 01:07:12 You know what I mean? It's like this neutrality thing. So what happens there is just, it's love. We're fortunate to feel love like that. One last thing. All right. Okay, then we'll let you go on. I got to fly to L.A.
Starting point is 01:07:20 One last thing. All right. Okay, then we'll let you go on. I got to fly to LA. So people, is it hard, this jam scene, is it hard to just like, how do you grow a band just strictly live music? Or is recording music important to you as well? I think it's more important now than it was before.
Starting point is 01:07:42 Why? Because, well, we were talking about Wolfpack. Like, they made, they got on Bonnaroo stage. That was like one of their first, like, big shows, you know, that they did. And they hadn't played that many shows before that, as far as I know. So they made themselves by really practicing, getting the chops up, and then, like, taking these videos. And, like, you know what I think it is?
Starting point is 01:08:05 Being just as creative about how you show yourself to people. I don't know why bands spend all this time working on this album or they spend all this time working on this live show, and then once it comes to getting the word out about themselves, the creativity stops. I know. Why? There's so much more.
Starting point is 01:08:21 Especially how easy it is now to be fucking public. Social media makes it so easy for is now to be fucking public. Social media makes it so easy for you to like get your fucking weird creative thoughts. And that's actually what it's for. Not getting on there and like, you know, shitting on someone else. And like what it's actually for is just for like you to let people know what you're up to. You know what I mean? And it could be a pretty good thing. And like musically, it's really fun.
Starting point is 01:08:41 Like the artists that I like, you know what I mean? I can see what they're up to and what gear they're using because I'm a nerd, you know, and I want to see that. So yeah, I think people, I think at the end of the day, if you want to grow, no matter what you're doing band or, you know, you're a solo producer or whatever it is that you're doing, like just being creative about how you deliver yourself just as much as just doing the actual performance, like have fun with all of it. Don't stop being creative. Your whole entire act from, like,
Starting point is 01:09:08 think about, like, David Bowie. Like, his last record was an ode to his own death. Like, talk about an artist. Fucking metal, dude. It's insane. That guy's whole life was an art piece. From the moment he woke up, you know what I mean, in the world, and then, you know,
Starting point is 01:09:22 he passes away the whole time. It was all art. Like, everything. And so, like, that's why that guy, you know, people mean in the world and then you know he passes away the whole time it was all art like everything and so like that's why that guy you know people connected with that they were like oh what's
Starting point is 01:09:30 what outfit is this guy gonna wear or like what you know what's gonna happen in this music what is the stage performance gonna be like
Starting point is 01:09:36 you know what is this and I mean I don't know if you listened to his last record I'm trying to remember what it was called
Starting point is 01:09:41 but it was like it was so crazy like listening it's like Blackstar maybe is what it's called I don't remember what it is I know what you're talking, it was so crazy. Like listening, it's like black star maybe is what it's called. I know what you're talking about. The record was right. I mean, he knew he was going to die. Yeah. And he, and he, he, are you scared of death? Not necessarily as much as I was before. I think everybody,
Starting point is 01:09:55 if they were really honest, they, they, to a certain degree, it's like, Whoa, I just feel like, and again, with the meditation stuff, I feel less anxiety around it you know what i mean like a little bit less uh it would be totally lying to say that you know i'm not scared of death and actually we were talking about ayahuasca one of the things when you do like a higher dose of it it's sort of like a simulation of death and so at that time i was definitely you know whoa this is whoa is this really happening like that kind of like feel you know so it was interesting to have gone through that and because again it really shows you That kind of feel. So it was interesting to have gone through that.
Starting point is 01:10:26 Because, again, it really shows you every part of you. The layer, dude, the onion. Yeah. There's a lot more, man. What would you tell yourself? This is the last one. I'll let you go, Ray. Y'all, you're fascinating.
Starting point is 01:10:34 I could talk for hours. Oh, shit. What would you tell young Anthony, high on fucking anxiety or whatever, fucking high strung, pissed off at the world? Stupid drugs. Stupid drugs. Taking fucking fighting drugs, synthetic drugs.
Starting point is 01:10:47 Anthony, what would you tell him now from Dalai Lama Anthony now that you are now? I don't think I'm Dalai Lama Anthony. No, but to me, I'm like, your fans are going to hear this. You're a very spiritual dude, dude. I know you're fucking woke as the fuck. I don't know, man. No, but what advice would you
Starting point is 01:11:05 give him i could have you woke up from that fucking anxiety tree young anthony you know you could get you could give yourself an easier time than like doing all this wacky stuff like you really could just dial it in a little bit sooner man like you don't have to but that's what made you who you are man it's true it's true and to be honest, I feel like I have a better understanding of what some other people are going through because I've been through some stuff. I haven't seen it all. And I had a great upbringing. I was really supported.
Starting point is 01:11:33 So I don't know what it's like to be motherless, fatherless. I don't know what it's like to... We didn't have any money, but at least I had better wealth than that. I had a solid family. So I don't know. I guess I would say, yeah, I don't have to go through all this wacky stuff. I could have been focusing in a little bit more and should have just started playing guitar a little earlier maybe and all that stuff, whatever.
Starting point is 01:11:55 Everyone meets in the middle and I'm so glad to meet you in the middle, buddy. Yeah, man, you too. Thanks for being on the show, man. Yeah, thanks for having me, bud. Later, bud. having me, bud. Later, bud. Hey, man, I just wanted to say that you inspire me like crazy, dude. Like I saw your show this weekend and you're like so free on stage, just doing whippets and smoking weed. You're like a peacock man that flies. And I just wanted to say that when I grow up, I want to be just like you. I mean, I think I'm older than you, but I just, oh, man, I wish I could live your life.
Starting point is 01:12:32 I'm going to quit my job and break up with my girlfriend and just drive around this country in a van being like Amy Brasco, man. All right, I'll see you at the next show. All right, there we have it. Thanks, Anthony, for being on the show. Kenny, you're going to know what's going on in our new record land. Kenny's a smart dude. He writes hits, and I'm just honored for him to give us a shot and have him work on half the record.
Starting point is 01:13:03 So we got Dave Schools on one side of the record. And we got Kenny Carkeat on the other side. I'm really pumped. These songs are sounding good. We're almost done, guys. Can't tell you when. Because I don't want to fucking blow my load too quickly. But it is dope.
Starting point is 01:13:18 And I'm pumped up. Songs feel good. The band is feeling good. We're in a fucking vibe right now, and I'm really feeling it. What happened? Oh, I was at Resonance Fest. That was fun as fuck, dude.
Starting point is 01:13:32 I always do this to myself where festival shows, I'm like, give me all your drugs. Give them to me. And I would just start fucking hitting whippets. I got on the fucking Wook website for being Wook of the week, for fucking sucking down a Nas or whatever, a whippet without a balloon. They said, that's how you get frostbite, bro. I'm like, thanks, Wook, for knowing that knowledge
Starting point is 01:13:56 because I could have got frostbite. So shout out to those Wooks keeping me safe and whatnot. But residence was dope, man. We had Vince Herman sit in. We had Neil from dopopod oh man we had casey my um doppelganger we had a bunch it was fun it was all the bands got to hang out it was cool i got to hang out feel like uh hanging out with gray we're all hanging out together pigeons paid like 25 000 sets so we got to hang out with them all weekend.
Starting point is 01:14:26 And who else was there? Talk, got to hang out with. It was a lot of world-saving alumni. So it was dope just to get to hang. Those are the best part when you get to stay at a festival. You get to hang, get to have a good time, and bring it all home. But yeah, I fucking played,
Starting point is 01:14:46 did a bunch of drugs on the fucking I didn't do like just I ate too many mushrooms on stage and you don't really feel them until you literally get off stage and then I was tripping dick and then I had to and then we got and I sat in with Vince Herman and Leftover Sam and they played a 4am set with
Starting point is 01:15:02 Keller Williams and I um they had the whole band sit in So we were sitting in And I got Vinny to fucking crowd serve Which was tight as fuck I love when Vinny crowds serve Because he just kind of just levitates He doesn't really move around
Starting point is 01:15:16 It's the cutest fucking thing He's the fucking best So he was hanging out, we got to hang out with all the boys Great vibe I'm in LA rightA. right now recording. And I'm on my way. Well, I guess this is going to be aired after I play with Marcus. But I'm playing with Jason Esbel and Marcus King and Marcus King's family reunion,
Starting point is 01:15:37 which I'm pumped up about. But, yeah, the tour continues on. Let me tell you my dates. I'm on tour until November 3rd. You hear those birds chirping? It's still fucking 95 degrees in LA. Like, Jesus, fuck. The heat never wears away.
Starting point is 01:15:52 That's why I'm excited to go back on the East Coast where the leaves are changing and it doesn't feel like fucking Jerusalem. You know, me, Moses, rolling through the desert with just fucking Birkenstocks on or whatever. But yeah, here we are We are in Richmond, Virginia We're in Wilmington, North Carolina
Starting point is 01:16:10 We're back in Charleston for two nights With John Modeski and fucking Vinnie Herman I got John Modeski I'm interviewing That's gonna be dope Then I'm doing Bethel, New York Like Woodstock area With Big Something, our boys We're about to announce something really dope
Starting point is 01:16:25 But I'll tell you later because I can't talk about it Then I'm in Cincinnati, Lexington Pittsburgh, Roanoke Then flying to Colorado Then on my way to Hulaween And then we tour with Pigeons for four days We're doing Philly, Boston New York, Baltimore
Starting point is 01:16:41 And that gets us to November Then I have three months off. Holy fuck. I'm close to buying this house in Denver. So I'm going to be a Denver resident. Hopefully it should be done by November. But, you know, I keep on saying that and fucking bad luck or whatever. But I'll get somewhere.
Starting point is 01:16:57 But I'll probably be in Denver three months. So I'm going to interview some people. I'm trying to get Nathanael Rateliff on the fucking podcast. I think he's going to go on. So we'll cross fingers with the rock gods. But that's it, guys. Hope you had fun with us this week. Papadocio, Anthony,
Starting point is 01:17:11 he's a good fucking guy. He's really trying to be conscious about mental health and be conscious about living in the moment. You know, we got to work on that shit. It's not going to just all of a sudden, oh, I'm healed. We got to, it's just like working out or fucking beating off, you know, get the poison out. Once we get the poison out, then we're
Starting point is 01:17:30 fucking fine. You know, so figure out a way to get good with your mind. You know, let's stay together. I'm only an Instagram away. Um, yeah. Facebook. If you still have my number, shoot me a text, whatever, but that's it guys Stay healthy Wear condoms Finally got health insurance I feel like a weight has gone off my back Just in case I'm a fucking hypochondriac I'm Jewish as fuck
Starting point is 01:17:54 So I'm just always thinking about if I'm going to get ill So if you have any thoughts in your mind Speak it out Talk to a therapist Whatever you're going to give Have closure with something That's why I got health insurance Just in case your mind. Speak it out. Talk to a therapist. Get, you know, whatever you're going to give you. Have closure with something, you know? That's why I got health insurance, just in case. But that's it, guys. Love you. Be safe. I'll see you next week. I'm not sure who's on the show next
Starting point is 01:18:14 week because I'm not by my computer, but it's going to be a dope one. We got, it's slammed. This whole next three months are slammed. So keep supporting. Keep rocking that shit. It's good. We're helping each other. I see your messages every week, how I'm helping you guys. And you're helping me just be a fucking voice box for me to get through my fucking crazy dreams. So be safe out there. Arno, give us something philosophical.
Starting point is 01:18:43 Don't talk about the impeachment because I don't want to hear anything. I'm not a political guy, but I know he's about to talk about that shit. And I don't really listen to the liner notes until it's live. So, Arno, please, God, don't be political. All right. Love you guys. Be safe. And I'll catch you next week.
Starting point is 01:18:56 Bye. Well, thank you for listening to episode 60 of Andy Fresco's World Saving Podcast, produced by Andy Fresco, Joe Angel, and Arvind Gresh, Lawrence. Please subscribe and rate the show on itunes and spotify so we can make this a worldwide phenomenon for info on the show please head to instagram at world saving podcast for more info on the blog and tour dates head to
Starting point is 01:19:15 andy fresco.com you can still listen to change your pace it's our latest album this week's guest is anthony thog martin from papadosio find them online at papadosio.. This week's guest is Anthony Thorg-Martin from Papadosio. Find him online at papadosio.com. This week's special guests were Brian Swartz, Ari Findlings, Sean Eccles, Ernie Chang, Andy Avila and Arno Bakker. And we had a special co-host, Kenny Karkiet from bands like AWOL Nation and Fitness. Did you know the name Karkiet originates in Holland? It's a small bird, a karakiet. It translates to a reed warbler. It lives hidden in swampy, reedy marshes. Interesting, right? So many great things originate from Holland, like we, the Dutch party, porn,
Starting point is 01:20:05 freedom of religion, your constitution, even New York, Sean Eccles and me. You didn't know? Well, some of that is actually true. But as far as the name Khaki goes, both Siri and Google lack answers. The dictionaries of English and Middle English give no help. And the Cambridge History of English is not available online. So I had to make it up, didn't I? Make up your own truth. Sing your own song. Why not? And you can choose to chirp, to clock or to caw, to hoot or to twitter.
Starting point is 01:20:31 But I prefer a bird that whistles. Well, more cackling next week. See you then.

There aren't comments yet for this episode. Click on any sentence in the transcript to leave a comment.