Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast - EP 70: Oteil Burbridge (Dead & Company)

Episode Date: January 14, 2020

We're BACK & kickin season 3 off with a LEGEND: Oteil Burbridge! Oteil sits down with Andy in his hotel room for a life spanning conversation. They talk about his time playing with Col. Bruce and The Allman Bros; the highs, the lows, and the music in-between. Ahri reviews 2019 and Caleb Hawley shares a song with us. This is Episode 70; live NOW. Follow us on Instagram @worldsavingpodcast For more information on Andy Frasco, tour dates, the band and the blog, go to: AndyFrasco.com The views discussed on this podcast do not necessarily reflect those of the guests. Check out Andy's new album, "Change Of Pace" on iTunes and Spotify Follow the Lord of the Strings himself, Oteil Burbridge   Produced by Andy Frasco Joe Angelhow Chris Lorentz Audio mix by Chris Lorentz Featuring: Caleb Hawley Ahri Findling Arno Bakker 

Hi Andy, it's. You left so early this morning I didn't have a chance to wish you a happy new year. Last night was amazing and what happened was totally normal. You don't have to feel ashamed. I've heard it happens to the guys all the time. Maybe you were just a little drunk or just felt a little anxious but it's totally normal the next time you come into town I know somebody who can get me some blue chews and I would love to just give you three or four

blue chews and spend six or seven hours together just naked in bed happy new year I miss you hi auntie it's again I just saw that you left your underwear and the penis pump that you brought at my house too I'm not sure if you want me to mail that back to you or just keep it for the next time you're here I kind of want to keep it so that I can smell you okay call, call me. Let me know what you want me to do.

And we're back. Andy Frasco's World Saving Podcast. What's up, everybody? I'm Andy. How we doing? What's up, everybody? I'm Andy. How we doing? Yo, 2020. 2020 vision up in this biz right now. I'm pumped up. It's going to be a great year, guys. Season three is ahead of us. We are on episode 70 of this fucking podcast. I can't believe it. Y'all are listening. Y'all are sticking with me, we got some, a lot of great things coming up, we got fucking killer interviews, it's gonna be a good year, guys, I got a new record coming out, I just bought a house, I'm in it right now, it's crazy, it's empty, didn't realize how fucking stressful it is to, you know, move into a different city, but, you know, Denver's been fucking cool, everyone's been helping me out.

I'm doing construction. I'm living in a construction yard in this house and picking out exactly what I want for everything. I'm feeling really good about it. I can't wait to live in it. It's going to be badass. Denver's been treating me good. But yeah, guys, this is a big episode. Starting the season with O'Teal. Wow. We've come a long way. It's just unbelievable what we're doing with the scene and how people are getting aware of mental health and getting a little taste of who else is on the show and who else is dealing with stuff that might not show it through their social medias and stuff. It's beautiful. But yeah, things are rocking.

I start my tour with Big Something in a week. I'm opening for Gary Goldman. I'm doing stand-up comedy. I'm fucking nervous, dude. 15-minute set. I'm playing in Boston where I've already had, and I don't really have a good rep in Boston with all the Lakers shit I wear. So we'll see how it goes, but I'm playing at the Wilbur Theater. If any standup people want to help me, not help me, but come out and support.

I'm opening for Gary Goldman, the legend. He's getting so much buzz from the Great Depression. Just so excited to see him seeing all these New York Times and everyone saying that it's the best comedy special of the year. And for me to be a part of this, it's just very special. So shout out to Gary. Thanks for letting me open. I'm going to be doing three songs, acoustic on the piano. I got Ryan Montblew backing me up. So we're just going to do a duo, tell some jokes. Hopefully I'm fucking funny. You know, it's hard. Shout out to comedians, dog. We got a lot of dope comedians coming on the show this season. But shout out to you guys. You know, when people are forced to, not forced, but like expecting you to be funny that's like

it's a hard it's a hard game once you see all these guys who are just so smart and like just attack their jokes so well this is badass so if you're in boston come see me we're doing panic on the playa too which is going to be dope. And then we start our tour with Big Something. We're doing a wrestling themed us versus Big Something. We're going to fuck shit up. We got like 20 dates. Tickets are kicking ass. Grab tickets before they sell out.

All right, I'm done pitching. Ladies and gentlemen, you're going to enjoy this interview. I think I almost cried when i was with him you know and then i got to go hang out backstage with him and go walk down the forum tunnel they played the forum it was oh my god where the lakers used to play i was i came i i was gonna come my pants but i had to be professional you know uh otil gave me such great hospitality but just surreal just seeing the machine that is deading company and how many people work and take care of things and shout out to ben baruch and all the crew for just making me feel like home when you know i literally just met the guy two hours before and he's like come to the show. We went backstage.

I got to, you know, fucking hang out. Meet Jeff Ross, who's one of my idols. He was backstage. Bill Walton. What the fuck, dude? I was starstruck, dude. But, you know, that's how it goes. All right, guys.

Let's do it. Season three. Get ready. Get pumped up. This is going to be a big, big year for the podcasts and for all of us. Let's do it. All right. Talk to you soon. All right. Next up on the interview hour, we have Oteel Burbridge, Dead & Company, Allman Brothers. Played for Colonel Bruce. He is the bass player of bass players. He's a great dude. I got to catch him at his hotel in LA while they were playing the forum.

And just instantly, it felt like we were kindred spirits. He's a good guy. He's got a good heart. He's had a lot of death in his life, a lot of band members dying and his brother passing. How he views life is just super inspiring and how it goes through the dark parts and how he's still so optimistic is very beautiful. Chris, play some Dead while we're getting ready for the interview. But yeah, here we are, Dead & Company, guys. Let's enjoy it. Let's hear what Oteel has to say.

It was one of my favorites. He got personal with me, and we talked a lot. It's a longer interview. We didn't cut too much because there's so many gems. Well, I hope you like it. Ladies and gentlemen, Oteel Burbridge Thank you. Here we are. What's up, Botil? Packin'.

Packin'. Sorry about that. Is that your life? How many days in your life do you feel like you pack to go somewhere else? Less than... Well, I can't say less than ever, How many days in your life do you feel like you pack to go somewhere else? Less than, well, I can't say less than ever, but in my adult life, less than ever. Really? Yeah, I'm not nearly on the road as much as I used to be.

And I'm really grateful. I'm lucky because I want to be home more and be with my wife and kids and stuff. And I'm getting to to so that's awesome you know what's uh let's talk about the i mean you've had such a career man like i i'm really close with vince herman and yeah and we talk a lot about uh bruce hampton i want to know what's some philosophies you learned from bruce like in the early years. He always talks about intention. Explain intention to me. Well, everybody has an intention whether they realize it or not. So I guess his thing was he wanted you to realize what yours was or wasn't

so you could make a thoughtful decision about what you want it to be. Because it's like people that sit on the fence just because you don't want to make a decision. Well, that's your intention. You don't want to make a decision. You don't want to make a decision. And so sitting on the fence, while it's fine as an intention, certainly that's not what he wanted. He wanted you to choose. So with that philosophy, what was your intention in the beginning years of your career?

Well, I think all of our intention is pretty pure when we start. It's like being a kid i mean you just want to play and it's fun yeah and i keep that in mind as i try to navigate all the career stuff because the music business is different from playing music and does that uh give you burden? Absolutely. But I also accept God hasn't let me become independently wealthy yet so I guess I'm still supposed to tour.

And I accept that. It's so funny you say that. With playing with the Alambro's, with playing with Denco, and we still feel that we're we we aren't financially where we want to be what is that do you have high standards for how you want to live no in fact i make more money than i ever you know when i first started playing music actually and this gets back to your original question about intention. I just wanted to do a job that I didn't hate.

I saw people doing that and then getting in traffic. Just the traffic part would have got me. But then to actually go through that to do something that you hate. So I thought, as long as I don't have a real job, quote unquote, I'd be happy. Because I could play music, whether I made a lot of money or whether I didn't. At least I would be happy at work.

And so the fact that I was able to just make a living playing music, I had succeeded. I won already, you know. And that was up and down you know as I found out and still is like one of us who of us have security unless you are independently wealthy yeah but like right now I've surpassed by far what I ever thought I would have hit when I started out and but that was my original intention you know yeah what about like when I would have hit when I started out. But that was my original intention. Yeah. What about when you were with Bruce, when you were touring with Bruce?

Were you gigging a lot with Bruce? Was it nonstop? Yeah, we were gigging a lot and making zero money. And the intention there was the music business part had really just brought me down and it had not worked for me. What part of it brought you down the making no money part you know because you know it's like i mean there's there's been heroes of mine that you know played with miles that i saw at a wedding band you know at a wedding i went to

you know now maybe they had a drug problem or whatever. I don't know what the circumstances are, but there's plenty of great gifted musicians that are geniuses, and they just make zero money. Why do you think that is? Is it luck? Because art, not every artist,

it's like visual arts. You have to have a unique skill set. It's like being arts. You have to have a unique skill set. It's like being president. It's a unique set of various different things that all have to come together in that one person to be an effective statesman. And so you have artists, visual artists,

say that made no money, but then you have artists like Salvador Dali and Picasso they're like yeah I'm making my money now you know what I mean but they have that mindset you know like they're good at that I'm not good I wasn't good at like being ambitious in that way money

wise I was just ambitious about I wanted to be really good on the bass So how'd you meet Bruce then? You didn't have ambitions. Were people coming to you? Was the universe giving you gifts or how'd that work? No, we were just playing original fusion stuff that nobody wanted to hear. You know what I mean? And I was playing like other gigs just to try to make money and they weren't you know paying anything but you know I would play with a reggae band a salsa band I'd do funk I'd do jazz I would do whatever rock country I'd play anything just like to

keep the bills paid you know this was when I was living in Atlanta, and so I was just gigging locally. And I was just miserable. And the drummer, Jeff Sipe, turned me on to Colonel Bruce and said, man, a lot of cats I know go to play with Bruce to get their ya-ya's out. He's a crazy person. So I went and met him.

And he guessed my birthday within three minutes of when I was born. And we probably known each other like 20 minutes. Okay, explain this, how you're feeling. Like, you knew this guy's a crazy person. You've guessed your birthday. Well, I meet him and he looks, you know, not like, he looks like a crazy person or a homeless person or i don't know you know he's just not anything that you would expect like oh you gotta go this musician you gotta go see wherever and um he was so funny man and i thought okay because i like crazy and um and we were talking just like this and he goes

august 24th at 2 in the morning and i was born at 157 i was like oh shit okay this dude is what all right so we were standing out at the parking lot uh in back of his car he was giving me one of his albums called arkansas that was in he had in the trunk and i was like i'm gonna go listen to this record because this dude is like wow that was impressive you know three minutes did he know you were a bass player yeah he knew i was a bass player i'm not sure he knew what my last name was to get within three minutes is like you know so eventually we talked and we hung out and i think i went to sit in and and he was like look man you're miserable and you're not making any money right now he said you're not gonna make any money with me but you're gonna have a shitload of fun so why don't you come play with me i was like what do i have to lose you know

i had plenty of time on my hands and man we just had the funniest gigs man i couldn't even believe it took me a while to figure out that it really wasn't about music totally you know it was literally just about your intention yeah so what were the funniest gigs like what was like you're like why where the fuck am i he would try to like sometimes he would want us to clear the room he was like i want all the people that don't get it to like just let's get rid of them and then we'll be left with the people that really do get it and then we can like really turn it all the way up

you know so you know we would do this well you know we were just playing around Atlanta and they all knew Bruce

so they you know they knew what they were getting themselves into you know he would always have us play on a Monday night for 99 cents he insisted on giving everybody a penny back so it was the worst night of the into you know he would always have us play on a monday night for 99 cents

he insisted on giving everybody a penny back so it's the worst night of the week you know whatever he's like you could be we might and he and bruce had his little contingent of followers you know like all the freaks you know would come out we had all the witches and, you know, crazy artists and crazy musicians. And then like, you know, also a lot of the top players in town, studio and otherwise, like from out of town. Like he introduced me to a few of my heroes, man, like Ralph Towner and Treelock Gertu and people I didn't think he knew. I was like, you don't know them.

And then he would introduce me. I was like, shit, how does everybody know about this guy? He's totally crazy, and I'd never heard of him. So yeah, but he was, you know, they didn't call him the Colonel for nothing. Like he beat us up, you know. How so? Like musically? He used to call me and Sipe his 20 percenters

because he had this whole thing where it's like your limited concept of what you are is really narrow and what you really are is like limitless and as big as the universe and he would always tell me specifically you're not good enough to lie to me so you should tell the truth you know yeah oh my god what's his thing was like he wanted you to strip down all of your preconceptions of yourself and be naked in front of everybody. Like the most terrifying thing. And so all the things you do, practice to clean up all your little flaws because you don't want to smell bad and you don't want to have, you know, you not be manicured perfectly or whatever. You know, like, he was like, fuck all that, man.

I want the real you, the fucking smelly butt smell you. Like, you know, also, not just that, but I want the whole thing. With that philosophy, though, so you look deeper into yourself, right? Were you comfortable? I didn't even know. I was like, you know, he always told me, you need a higher butt level consciousness it was always couched in humor too you know but i was like i don't know how to get to what you're talking about now we're talking about stuff that's not even musical but yet it was would it frustrate you at first? Oh, my God. I was like, I don't get it.

I don't know how to merge something that has nothing to do with music. But I did. I never thought about it in those terms. So he would turn me on to cats that howl and woof, man. You hear blood. It's like he just says, good evening, ladies and gentlemen, and then he slashes his wrist and bleeds all over the whole room. But that's intention, right? Well, yeah.

I mean, when you've been through what, you know, of course the old blues guys have been through just the worst shit on earth, man. So they couldn't even help it. And that was a big part of his philosophy. He was like, people that are broken, he called broken people. Did he consider you broken? No, I wasn't at all then, but I didn't realize. It's a complicated question because of my age then.

I was 26 or 24 when I met Bruce. But people that are broken, if they don't commit suicide and they turn it in the other direction, they can make some incredibly unbelievable art. And music, a lot of his favorite musicians, you could tell these people were cracked. I mean, some of them were just aliens. Sun Ra or any of the blues gods.

Cecil Taylor, James Blood Ulmer, blues guys you know uh cecil taylor james blood ulmer you know like um ornette don cherry um all the you know people you could tell they've been through some heavy shit why do you think he liked broken because it was real because it was real yeah it's real it's not perfumed perfume is fine you know we need all sides of it he liked all sides of it he needed all sides he liked uh great classical music as much as anything you know yeah but there was and and there's some really i mean there's some heavy classical music where you can hear the composer, like what they've been through, you know, whatever tragedies hit them. And he's like, I want to hear all these sides of your life. I want to hear when your mom died or if your parent hasn't passed yet.

There's something that broke, you know, something tragic happened to you. You don't get to 24 years old without the cat dying or something. Or when you've embarrassed yourself or when you're funny or when you're super joyful or super sad or super whatever. I had a guitar player in my band named mark kimbrell who was just like no matter what he was feeling that day you would hear it coming out of his guitar and i thought that was the greatest kind of consistency because he was inconsistent as far as like how we would judge consistency but he was was 100% consistent with his intention and what played.

I could tell you exactly what was going on in his day just by him playing the guitar. And I thought, that's a true artist or a true being. It's not even art at that point. You're basically being present. You're expressing yourself. And revealing. Yeah. And revealing.

Because that's the scary thing man what's scary about that i don't know we're just such a like why do we all wear clothes yeah yeah you're right you know what i mean you can't show nipples yeah or you can't you know like there's and i'm sure maybe there's some hygienic reasons and maybe even temperature reasons or where but you know like why are we so, is our culture. Why are we afraid to express ourselves is what we're saying. Reveal ourselves, you know. Why are we, you know.

I don't know. I mean, I don't know. I mean, that's just a matter of history and the time we live in this particular culture and how it formed the recent history of that you know how was your childhood were you did you have a good childhood oh man i had the best childhood you know we grew up in southeast washington which is a really poor neighborhood but i went to these really rich private schools because they wanted black kids from the hood if they could compete academically. Washington State, right?

No, Washington, D.C. Oh, you lived in D.C.? Okay. Born and raised. So I went to St. Will Friends, a friend's school. It's like where Obama's kids went. I went to Potomac School when I was a young kid out in McLean, Virginia. Just all like, you know, State Department people, CIA,

the Kennedys went there, you know. I knew... Were you the poorest kid in your school? Oh, yeah. Well, I don't know. There might have been a couple. I think we were. You ever had any awkward situations where you couldn't go out with these fucking politician kids

because you couldn't afford it? Well, I mean, you know, it was more like, you know, I lived way on the other side of town. Like all these rich kids lived in Northwest Washington and then like Northern Virginia and Maryland on that side. And I lived in Southeast, like on the exact opposite side in the poor side of town. But I grew up with these kids since first grade. So I didn't really feel differently.

But like we got to junior high and high school and there would be like a school you know the school is doing a ski trip or a trip to France or what you know like I couldn't do that we didn't have the money for that but I was used to being around rich kids and I didn't I don't know I just never felt like it wasn't a problem that I had less money than them was there any like form of with like richer demographics was there any was there more racism with more wealth not really I mean aside from I've never talked about this one I've never talked about this one. Talk about it, bud. Other than with my friends. The only fight I've ever been in was when I hit one of the Kennedy kids.

Yeah. Chris Kennedy. What happened? Tell me about this. Well, he's a really good guy right now, so I don't want to say what he called me. But I didn't take kindly to it, and I hit him in the face. And it's funny, I was just telling this story to a friend of mine at lunch. Like the custodian, this old black dude called my mom was like, man, I'm sorry to tell you this, but it's curtains for your kid. He hit one of those kids.

Like, you know, but my teacher, Mrs. Edelson, saw the whole thing happen. So I didn't get in trouble for it. I can't remember it. Were you in anger? I guess. Because if you blacked out, you fucking punched the fool. I just can't remember a lot of my early childhood. But I remember my teacher not busting me for it and then their mom I can't

remember her name I think it was Rose called my mom and like apologized and all this stuff and we were invited out to their place or a bunch of kids went out and they were riding horses and all this stuff and yeah I mean it was like, you know, it was crazy. But that's literally like the only racism I experienced. And I can't even remember. It was that one time. So it didn't scar you. No, it was a very neoliberal, in retrospect, a very neoliberal environment.

Like they were very, policy-wise, everything was racist. But just in society as we talk to each other, oh, no, no, no. Yeah, I feel that. Yeah, you know what I mean, but it's like, you know. I grew up in a wealthy area, Calabasas area, and I was definitely the poorest kid out there. And I could feel, I'm being Jewish and not white Christian. And you get the same vibes. I had the same story.

Someone called my mom a kike or something. I beat them up. I don't know. I don't know why we think but like maybe it's crazy man were you playing music back then yeah i played since i was five i started drums at five and uh i didn't pick up bass till i was like 14 years old because uh i was actually doing dance i wanted to be a dancer and i had to stop because i got hodgkin slatters and so what's that it's when you're um you have a growth spurt and your joints uh your cartilage doesn't grow as

fast as your bones and so all the points like knees you know wrist elbow can be but mostly knees for me which was that heartbreaking for you because you loved it so much? Super heartbreaking, but in retrospect, that's a short career, man. I saw UB Blake play at 99. There's no dancers out there, you know, shuffling out on stage at 99, you know what I mean? So it was meant to be, and I had done music first, you know, certainly. Do you believe in that? Everything's meant to be. And I had done music first, you know, certainly. Do you believe in that? Everything's meant to be?

To a certain extent, yeah, because I don't know, like, why does music come easier to me than other people, you know? And so,

we kind of, like, I'm not sure of anything. The one thing I know is that I don't know but my hunch is my suspicion is that

there is a reason even if we go beyond what you're meant to do the fact that we can think and wonder why the fact that we can think and wonder why, the fact that we can have a question means there must be an answer. Why do you think we overthink, though? Do you think it's bad to overthink?

Yeah, but it's also part of the process right like you got to go too far to pull it back and even know like what is overthinking that's relative so for you if you overthink way too much you can go well i know what overthinking is for me so let's try to pull that back over here you know and then you can like use that to judge other people. But everything's relative. What do you overthink the most in life? Oh my gosh. Everything.

I shouldn't say everything, because there's some things I really don't think about. I don't have time. Once you get past 50, it's like, okay, half the sands of your hourglass are gone and you don't get those back. So how am I going to use my time better? So I'm not going to overthink a lot of stuff, actually. Moving forward?

Yeah. But it's hard not to think about, I mean, I just had my first kid at 50 thank you I have a whole set of other things about like to think about like that I never

had before I had no intentions of having kids and if I hadn't met my wife Jess I almost surely would not have and I'm really glad that I did because just every day I'm like, oh my God, I was going to miss that. Oh, I was going to miss that. But each phase of their life from the beginning presents new things

that I have to think about that I never counted on. Like what? Even things not having to do with what they might do, like my behavior. Like my behavior has to change because I'm a fiery person, you know. Are you selfish? I mean, who isn't, you know?

Some people think I'm not. I think I'm selfish about certain things and completely unselfish about others. What are you fiery about then? I get pissed off about politics. I get pissed off about, you know, apparently somebody called me a bad word, I hit him. You know what I mean?

It's just like, but I can't keep demonstrating that to my son because he's now mimicking everything I do. Yeah, mirror. That gives me a lot to think about. Fortunately, I have a great wife and she's like, you know, man, you got to stop doing that. Like, that's not cool. So then I have to think about it because I trust her. She has my best interests at heart, you know? And, totally. And so, and she's got Nigel's best interests at heart. Yeah. And now we adopted a little girl, Kavi. She's got her best interests.

So I know she's, her intention is pure in that sense. And so I got to figure out how do I change this? So, you know, I mean, it's like, but there's a hundred things, you know, like visiting schools and how is Nigel doing and, you know, this and that and watching kids' development and, you know, career. A music career is never secure, you know. I overthink that. Can we talk about that a little bit?

Like, is there any point in your life, like, where you felt like you're at your lowest spiritually and musically and anyone just, like just helped you keep going? Was it Bruce? Yeah, that's right, before I met Colonel Bruce. It was right then. And I was like, I don't know why. Where were you?

I was in Atlanta. I was 24 years old. I started out, and it was really easy money-wise. I left home at 19, and I got a gig in Virginia Beach. It was like a cover band that played five nights a week. The money was completely steady. And then you do whatever you want all day long. And so we would write music and play music.

And I was like, man, everybody was so worried about the music business. This is a piece of cake. And then I ended up getting fired from that gig, which is a whole other story. But then I moved to Atlanta, and then I experienced the real music business. And that was like, wow, this can be rough. And at that point, I wasn't making any money. And it was just hard. And the music that I was playing to make money, I wasn't having fun doing it, you know?

And I was like, now if it becomes a job, then I lose, right? That's why you didn't do music for a job i wanted to like going to work yeah you know but nobody wanted to hear the stuff that we were writing and really into you know which is fine and they still they still don't you know i mean you think that i mean you know sun ra and j James Blood Homer is still, you know, like, I mean, Sun Ra's passed now, but you know, these guys are not getting rich. Yeah. You know.

Does that make you sad? No, it is what it is. I mean, you have to choose what you want to choose. Do you want to choose art or do you want to, like, you know, I want to do both if I can. I want to make decent money, but I also want to play great music. And I got super lucky. With Colonel Bruce, I only got one of them. And then I got the Allman Brothers gig.

And I was like, man, I get to play Latin jams, funk jams. I get to use jazz shit and dreams. How did you get the Allman gig? That was through Butch trucks which and really honestly if i hadn't played with the colonel that whole thing wouldn't have happened you know duane allman got colonel bruce his first record deal back in 69 with phil walden yeah yeah yeah he knew all those guys So now you hanging with the almonds, what did they think about Bruce? Did they thought he was special?

Dickie loved Bruce. Greg was scared to death of Bruce. Really? Greg was? Yeah, because Bruce is an alien and he knew. He was like, that's Bruce and Bruce doesn't do any drugs. I have this theory that Bruce, that DMT is in our brains. And so

they say it gets released at death. But I think some people it gets released probably on a regular basis. So he didn't need acid. He was tripping hard some days. Like super hard. I would feel for him. I would be like, are you okay today? Is it bad

today? He's like, yeah, it's's just like what would he do in those bad moments well i mean that's the world he lived in you know he would like cling to like numbers or like whatever you know i mean he was a regular human too but he also he had some extra and and greg correctly perceived greg yeah his alien nature and he was like yeah something's up with that dude i was like well you're totally right but you don't have anything yeah but like from moving from bruce to greg what were what's it aren't there like two different people are they kind of in the way the same? I mean, they're both unique products of the South, you know? Yeah. Like, why were neither of them racist?

Greg's two closest friends that I knew were both black, Floyd Miles and Chank Middleton. And, you know, Greg is like the blackest sounding singer, white guy, the country's probably ever produced. Yeah. Yeah, you're right. And like Dwayne had that same kind of thing.

And Colonel Bruce, like, you know, came out of this military family. They started calling the colonel the colonel when he was three because he has some of the youngest officers in like military history, apparently. I don't know their names, but he told me that. And a lot of the things were lies, but I think that one was true. But so you were like, I said, well, how did you turn out this way? And he said, I was six years old and I was at this restaurant on Ponce de Leon I think it was and I jumped up on the table and he said I realized everyone in there was crazy

and he told me he was screaming you all are all crazy he felt that they were like walking around kind of like in a zombie state like not really living like just just moving doing what they're told and being like sheep or just an automaton

or you know what i mean like not really and i don't know how he saw that at such a young age but he did it hit him like a ton of bricks and he was never the same after that jesus what about so what did you learn from greg and dwayne though? What were they? Well, I never met Dwayne. Dwayne passed when I was seven years old or something. But what about Greg? You know, Greg and all of them, J-Mo, Butch, Dickie. I didn't know about, here's the funny thing with them. I knew nothing about pop music.

I knew about funk because of Southeast Washington and the generation I grew up with. My parents were big jazz heads, really into classical. So I didn't really know about blues, and I didn't know about rock and roll. I didn't know anything about those things. So Colonel Bruce kind of prepared me by teaching me about the blues and bluegrass. And then when I got the Allman Brothers gig, having that exposure to those folk musics kind of prepared me to play in the Allman Brothers, prepared me to play in the Allman Brothers, which was actually pulling in other stuff like Latin music, funk, jazz, stuff that I was versed in.

You know, that was my background. And so when I got with the Allman Brothers, that's when I really learned about more of the history of rock and roll. But they would just use people's first names a lot of the time. So Greg may say something about Eric, and then I realize 15 minutes later, oh, he's talking about Clapton. It's crazy. Oh, Jill, you're hanging out with all these fucking legends, man. Dude, my whole life has been like this, from going to school with the Kennedys to, like, I'm just, like, some passenger on this crazy train

just, like, checking it out. Like, I don't even know how I got here, you know? But then there's a lot to learn, you know, from these guys. What to do and what to listen to and what not to do what not to do you know i mean well all their shenanigans are legendary so you know you could see it is halftime at the Andy Fresco interview hour. Welcome back to Review on the Post, Ari Finling. Today, I am reviewing the year 2019.

The year started off pretty shitty with the longest government shutdown in history, which, without exaggeration, I think lasted 380 days. The U.S. women won the World Cup. Congratulations. Guys, team, what the fuck are you doing? They're making you look like shit. A bunch of morons stormed Area 51 for no fucking reason. Notre Dame Cathedral burned down for no fucking reason. And 900 Democrats declared their candidacy for president for no fucking reason. R. Kelly finally got charged for fucking and pissing on children. I mean, it's been 30 years. What the fuck's going on? Jeffrey Epstein also charged for fucking kids, went to jail and allegedly killed himself in prison. And Becky got arrested for paying for her daughter to get into USC. USC and Becky was there no better school in the country. We had the first all female spacewalk. That was pretty cool. And Trump locked a bunch of immigrants in cages because why the fuck not? cool and trump locked a bunch of immigrants in cages because why the fuck not and more importantly our podcast reached 300 000 downloads so from everybody here at the podcast we just wanted to

say thank you we love you and keep listening in 2020 peace did you ever were you ever into drugs do you ever have a drug you know i was super lucky that i've always hated needles so that took care of heroin and did and was too naive to realize you could smoke it or snort it um thank god too but i also remember you know like i also remember a song about heroin that james brown was like rapping to and he said it didn't like you didn't even want sex anymore and i was like well i definitely don't need to try anything that good yeah you know like i know i've got an addictive personality so let's not do you think your addiction was women absolutely but it was enabled by alcohol so now yeah if i avoid alcohol i can be my horns stay retracted and you know i can be a good boy.

You know what I mean? But it took me a long time. It wasn't until, like, I took a break from weed and alcohol that I was like, oh, wow. This is like, you know. And now it's just weed. It's like, just pick one, man. You know, alcohol is too hard. Oh, yeah.

When I was 17 to 19, I tripped a bunch. In high school? Well, senior year. Yeah, it was the end. So it was like right when we got done. And I used to only just like do blotter, like half a hit, which now I know as an adult is probably about 50 mics. And I think microdosing really can be super useful.

So I definitely had, and it really helped me form a lot of opinions or have realizations about things that stuck with me forever. I think that was not growing up in a religious household. That was my first religious experience. Was that kind of rebellious, though, growing up in a religious household? No, in a non-religious household. Oh, non-religious.

Extremely antagonistic, which didn't help me when I had a spiritual crisis. What happened? Well, you know, I just hit bottom. And fortunately, my mom, while she rejected the church, didn't reject her spirituality. So she planted some things in me that I reached out to spiritually in a spiritual crisis, and that saved me. But I do also think that while that's the primary thing and the root, that those trips I had as a teenager were really important, really important.

And what I realized is still true for me now. Have you ever tried to commit suicide back then? No, no. And fortunately, I'm not a suicidal person at all. I was just miserable. I was like, well, this is how I felt when I met Bruce. I was like, well, I guess I'll just play music because at least it makes other people feel good.

And then when I'm done with this ride here i'll be done but i wasn't going to end it prematurely i just it's not in my makeup and maybe there is some hopeful part of me that i didn't realize is what was there because i sure wasn't finding it yeah intellectually you know uh or emotionally were you happy in the Allman Brothers? Yeah, I was really happy to not have to worry about money anymore. And I was really happy that I got to actually use what I like to play in the band. And it was very scary in a lot of ways. Because unless you've dealt with big rock and rolls

that scene and the iconic people in it it's a weird trip you know what I mean? it's a weird trip because do you feel like you weren't good enough to be in that type of band? no I knew I was good enough musically what I had to is let the challenge was to latch on to what is their story

which bruce was like after being with him i was like that's the object of the game like that's why they're so great because you do hear their whole story yeah you know they are revealing they're up there naked revealing their story and everybody loves a real good story and i say real good not like real good but a real and a good story were you in the band when greg passed yeah well he passed away after the band was over well you were still playing with him and stuff right no i wasn't playing in his solo band no but um i did every almond brothers gig with him and uh he passed a few years after it was over were you there were you at that gig when bruce passed no i couldn't make that gig dude i um i was playing with Medesky and Johnny Vodakovich in New Orleans,

and Bruce was coming to Jazz Fest right after that. I was like, man, I'm so sorry I can't make that gig. But I'll see you at Jazz Fest in a couple of days. Did you have a feeling that he was? No, I had no idea, man. And, you know, oh, man, I couldn't believe it. But, you know, maybe that was a gift from God. That might have been too much for me, man.

That might have been too much for me. To watch him die on stage while you were performing with him? Yeah, I mean, well, everybody thought he was joking at the time. So really, it would be to deal with him having died at the hospital. I think he was already, I think he was DOA at the hospital. Yeah, I don't know. But who knows? I can't say I wasn't meant to be there,

but I wasn't able to be there. Do you regret that, looking back? No, because I tried. i tried to get out of the gig you know and they said uh if you can get us another bass player you know they had like a short list and i called those guy and them from were available and so i just but i didn't know he was gonna die so i mean it was you know but do you think that's total bruce though to die. So I mean, it was, you know. But do you think that's total Bruce though to die on stage? Do you think he put that, what do you think about that?

You know, it's hard to say. I don't, you know, I don't think he chose it in any other fashion than having chosen it right before he incarnated here.

Like, he could see all the way to the end and was like, I'm cool with that life. Let's do it. But I think at some point he knew, even if it was just the moment before, although

I think it was earlier, but I could be wrong. But knowing Bruce, how could I not suspect that you know ahead of time right that's how i feel too i mean i'm really dave school is one of my closest friends yeah you know i'm becoming close with taz and i'm starting to convince her you know like these are my people that i look up to yeah and like they're just all products of Hampton. Yeah. And just how they think, it reminds me like, man, you never know. This could be how he wanted to go.

You know? Yeah. I mean, if I learned anything from Bruce, he was like, you have no guarantee this is not the last gig you'll ever play. Yeah. Fuck. It's crazy. no guarantee this is not the last gig you'll ever play. Yeah. Fuck. Crazy. So I really took that to heart.

It was like, man, you know, and sometimes I still struggle with that because sometimes you just don't feel like it. And I'm not the type of person like, oh, I'm just going to drink two Red Bulls and get out there and put on a show. You know, like I got to sit here and reveal myself to you. And tonight, you know, I don't have it to reveal.

But when then you remember, but what if this is your last gig? Well, then that changes your intention. You're like, okay, fuck that. Whatever. Getting out there whatever getting out there blah blah blah like I'll never forget there was a point in the Allman Brothers where you know we only did like 60 gigs a year so then I would go play with my band you know afterwards and get all my ya-ya's out you know and then there became a point where I was a little frustrated in the Allman Brothers And then there became a point where I was a little frustrated in the Allman Brothers. And then I had to remember, because I felt limited.

I wasn't playing my six string that much. It was all four string, which is great. I even chose that for the stuff on the first records because it just sounds like that. And then the stuff Woody recorded on on six string i would pull my six string out on but you know i didn't have the the musical freedom that i had in my band you know to go all out and so but it was like well what if this is your last gig and it's not an otele and the peacemakers gig what if it's the Allman Brothers gig? I was like, well, fuck that. We got to get on it.

You know what I mean? It was just like, and then I just started having a blast again with the Allman Brothers. I had been before, but then, you know, I was with the band 17 years. Yeah, that's crazy. So you always have to, like, check yourself. Yeah. I even wrote a song called that.

Really? That title, Check Yourself. Yeah. I have to do it constantly. You always have to check yourself have a kid yeah you're checking yourself all every other minute you know what's your take on death you know it's all like i mean i'm such a a believer in mystical stuff because mystical stuff happens to me all the time ever since I was a kid. So some things are just too coincidental or coincidence is too many times for it to be coincidence. So with that being said, my take on death is the mystical one like it's yin yang you know there's no and science

is saying that right now right like um that energy doesn't cease to exist it just converts right so now we're all in agreement that there is no death there's just a conversion like in the egyptian book of the dead the people that title that it's it's not the right title it's the book of the reawakening or the book of coming forth by day so it's the book of the transition it's the wheel the wheel is yin for 12 hours and it's yang for 12 hours yeah winter and then spring everything dies the very same things come back right so that's my take on it we see it mirrored in nature we see it in science we obviously see it in religion and religions and spiritual systems you know how hard was it when your brother passed you know it's it's been hard in the last two months is when it really has been clobbering me or it's i would say three months in the life he died in february

and there was such a huge outpouring of love from the music community um and from friends and family that i felt spiritually filled up you know like it really they buoyed me you know Were you like in shock at first? Absolutely. I mean, he had had an aortic aneurysm a year before. So he was super lucky to survive that. And so when it happened the second time, it wasn't like a total surprise.

But he made it through the second one. And I thought he beat the odds twice you know and then right before he got out of the hospital he went he had dialysis and they say your blood a lot of people's blood pressure drops or something when they do dialysis and apparently it's i don't know if it's common, but it happens. And he died during dialysis. And I just was like, we were on our way to India for the final court date to pick up our adopted daughter or to meet her at least for the first time. We probably were not going to be able to actually bring her home then. But we were trying to speed up the process.

And we had a two-hour layover in newark and we got off the plane we flew from florida to newark got off the plane turn on my phone my sister's screaming and so we got our bags and diverted to atlanta and just yeah went back on a plane did another yeah we were about to get on a 14-hour flight to india and we just went did a little two-hour flight to atlanta and um yeah it's just a complete shock but would you what were the things you learned your brother taught you about life oh god man i mean Oh, God, man. I mean, you know, he was my biggest musical hero and teacher. They discovered he had perfect pitch when he was seven. What?

I became a musician. He's older than you or younger? Yeah, three years older. And I became a musician because I wanted to be a musician like him. And also, I thought it was the one thing I could do that would be fun. And I was pretty good at it but mostly because I was trying to keep up with him

Is that why you played drums at first? Because you wanted to be in a band? No I just played drums because I was beating on everything and my dad was like you need to learn to play music and not make noise, right? So they saw I had an aptitude for it. But trying to keep up with Kofi really made me excel

because I thought he was normal. I didn't realize what a freak he was. Until I got to high school and started playing with other people. And I was like, man, these guys can't play. They don't even hear what they're playing is not right, rhythmically or harmonically or whatever. And that's when I started realizing Kofi was kind of one of the X-Men. Yeah, I was like, okay.

But that helped me excel. So, I mean, Kofi was like, jeez, man. I don't even know how to describe as an older brother and someone you're looking up to and have learned so much from and still never caught up with, not by a long shot. Do you ever take any of his lessons for granted oh no in fact you know so you looked up to him he was your he was your guy i mean to this day i would i would call him and kofi you know what's up with this you know like a musical question or

you know i found this chord I like. I'm not really sure what it is. What scale would I play over that? You know, like, because I'm just, like, messing around with stuff. Like, who knows what I found? I don't even know. I just know I like the sound of it. Maybe I couldn't figure out a scale that goes with it, you know,

because I want to play, well, how do I solo over that chord? You know, I really dig this chord. So, yeah, I mean, it's like impossible to even measure what Kofi is to me, you know. There's still stuff I need to ask him. Have you mourned his death? Well, three months ago, I started having really big problems with just dark cloud hanging over my head. And so I was like, well, here's the grief coming now.

Because I have so much going on with career stuff, a home. I'm totally plugged in to just a Nigel at home. When I'm home, I don't gig. I barely practice. I do anything. It's like all. And Nigel's developing super fast. He's about to turn five. So Nigel kept me in the moment. Adoption kept me in the moment. All these things. And we go to India and we get Kavi. And it's like there's just so much going on dead and company. It feels like the world's going 100,000 miles an hour. But that dark cloud came and sat over the whole thing.

Do you remember when it came? No, but I remember, you know, part of it was exacerbated by my cholesterol was really high and I started taking this cholesterol medicine and it gave me nightmares every night and I didn't know it was the medicine. Oh, shit. So I'm taking it right before bed.

Oh, God. So this was the straw that broke the camel's back. After a month of nightmares every night like super vivid what were the nightmares about? nothing just like you know

I knew they weren't it was just fantastical yeah stuff yeah but I just like

I told my wife I was like I gotta go see a grief counselor cause this is this dark cloud I just can't take it anymore. I wake up in the worst headspace. And then the rest of the day, the actual stuff that I was dealing with, with Kofi, was weighing on me. And so I went to see a grief counselor.

I actually was the same counselor that did our adoption. Oh, really? It was funny. Yeah, it ended up being the same person. She's awesome. She gave me a couple of books and helped me start to sort through it. What's the name of it? I'm listening to them on audiobooks. I never look at the book cover. Text it to me.

It's okay to not be okay, I think one of them is called. There's two of them. But I will, for sure. And then I also realized the state of our planet, where the planet is and our country is. Even just we take the country, but the whole planet also. But where our country is uh politically spiritually economically uh emotionally uh you know on every in every

category we're like not doing good yeah i know the economy's doing good. Like, for who? Yeah, exactly. You know, like, so that weighs on me a lot. And, you know, like, for a while I unplugged with that, unplugged from all of it, and I'd just be with the family, and my wife loved it. But then, you know, with, like, school shootings and stuff, you know, we're dealing with that in Florida. Parkland kids are in Florida. We have scares, not weekly, but we've had scares since then. So my son, I don't want my son to get his head blown off in school. I didn't have to deal with that shit when I was in kindergarten. Like, come on, get out of here.

And nothing happens. One school after another gets shot nothing happens yeah so i worry you know and all this is weighing me down kofi and all you know and so i'm just like wow man what do i do and so i i go back to what if this is your last day with Jess, Nigel, and Kavi? What if this is your last gig tonight with Dead & Company? What if this is my last conversation with you? Like I walk out of this, you walk out of here, I have a heart attack and die. It's happened to younger people than me. Yeah. Right? So I just, you know, being happy is also a decision and not just a feeling. Yeah.

So I decide right now I'm going to try to be honest and get some meaning out of this conversation. And try to really connect with you. Mm-hmm. Reveal myself to you you know did that help you get through that dark cloud with that i'm still in it yeah i'm still in it i bet man you know and i couldn't talk about it for a long time because of the adoption process which took two years i had to tell people stop do not ask me anything about lsd or mushrooms or psychedelics or anything i can't have any of this out there the judge might google me and you know yeah and it'll come up you know so but i was like maybe it's time to fight fire with fire,

and I need to microdose a little bit. Have you been microdosing? If I'm not feeling super joyful that night and I'm about to go on stage, then yes. And I don't do a lot of gigs in a row. So we'll do two, have a day off do two have two days off yeah and it's just microdosing you think microdose helps you i microdose uh psilocybin and because i'm i'm fighting depression that's what i do i i like just organic i don't

want the i used to love blotter but I just want mushroom extract. What does psilocybin do to your head? It helps you get present again? That's all it does for me. It literally is just like I'm doing enough that most of the time I'm like, am I feeling it? And so I'll do that little bit much again, and I'll be like, okay, I think I'm definitely feeling the beginnings of it. And I'll do a little bit more.

Excuse me. And I'm just like, basically opening the window, you know, or drawing the blinds and looking out the window, maybe cracking it, let some of the air in. But I'm not kicking the door out and just throwing myself out the plane. Because it's medicine, right?

I'm not in it for some fantastical experience. I'm in for that little bit of heightened awareness. And it does put me in the moment. heightened awareness, and it does put me in the moment. And I know, like, and I feel things more that I close myself off to, like all the joy of the people. You know, they've been looking forward to this concert. This is a really big deal to them. This is like night 289,000 to me.

You know what i mean but this is like i am other people's thing that they have light yeah you know what i mean and so i feel it more i feel that more when i microdose i'm like oh my god there's so much joy and love coming at me and it stirs all of it up inside of me and then i just throw it right back out and then it just like creates this feedback loop and then it's it's really beautiful and i think uh i think it could save this country man i 100 you know like people need to get out of their regular that mindset i'm I'm not saying it's bad, but it's not all that there is. I know. You know what I mean?

And if we can lift ourselves up, it helps me like zoom out like you do on Google Earth and go, oh, wow. Yeah. oh, wow. I think it's like we put that microscope and we try to analyze that little thing so fuck. What is that doing to us? Well, if we only do that, we're supposed to do that. We're given the left brain objective side for that, but that's 50% of the ballgame.

The other 50% is that right brain where we look at it that way. Man, you're totally right. Man, you're helping me out here. That's why I never poo-poo religions. I poo-poo people's interpretation of religion. But religion is stories and poems. It's like what Alex Gray is talking about it's art but we forgot to look at it that way now we want to make it like

we want to be left brained about a right brained thing right science looks at it and says I think reality is like this and it uses equations. Right? Do you agree?

It is. It's true. I think scientists are looking for God too. Just in a left brain way. They're looking for the truth, right? But the right brain says, I think reality is like this. And it uses songs, poems,

stories, you know, in terms of religion. So music and in religions that it's not banned, visual artwork, you know what I mean? It uses art. And so that's why, you know,

I'm like, okay, so now if I look at religions like that, all of them, I get the good out of all of them. Like the Book of the Tao, man, I was listening to that this morning, and it straightened me out. It just straightened me out, man. You got to send me all this stuff. That's the first book Colonel Bruce ever gave me, man. Book of Tao?

The Book of the Tao, Lao Tzu. And you know what struck me this morning? I never caught this. I got to keep track of the time because I don't know what. Two o'clock. Oh, we're totally good. It said in the introduction, the guy that did this translation said, the legend is that Lao Tzu, who wrote the Book of the Dow,

saw that his country was in decline and so he left it and I was like yeah that's how I feel now like you guys don't want to change these guns and just watch your own kids get killed I'm out of here

where would you move to it's so hard because we live in South Florida now we're allergic to the cold now i love comparatively the canadian government and canadian people they don't have these the health care issue they don't have the gun issue they don't have the military industrial complex issue to the level that we have it yeah and just a lot of a lot of stuff that i just think it's you know weeds legal they outlawed private prisons you know like if they got rid of monsanto i might even deal with just the cold and i don't even know what their situation is with

monsanto but it's probably not like costa rica which is totally outlawed it so but it's just too cold man i just can't do it and my wife saw a thing where like 80 of the bahamas is going to be underwater i can't remember the next 30 years the the next 50 years, but somewhere in there. So that was one plan that I had just to go further south. So maybe Costa Rica. I don't know, man. I don't know. All I know is I'm fearful that with all these guns here and things not getting better,

regardless of people say how good the economy is doing, it's not. That's the half of the country that's living on $18,000 a year or less. I'm crazy. So I don't know. I don't know, but I'm not going to have Nigel get his head blown off in kindergarten. Amen to that. I don't know if people want to start another. If there's too

much gunfire, that's how I look at it. I'm gauging it by the gunfire. We'll leave it at this. By the way, good luck at the forum tonight. I'm so glad we met. You're a great guy. I understand now what everyone

says about you. You're a beautiful man, O'Teele thank you i'm sorry to leave on such a dark note let's leave it this what do you want to be remembered by when it's all said and done bud you know i don't give a shit what other people think about me i care what my kids think of me, what they say. I remember seeing one of my jazz heroes interviewed. His daughter was interviewed. And I won't say what his name was, but he was a drummer. And they asked her, what was it like to have such a famous, iconic dad for a father? And she goes, well, he wasn't no kind of father. He was never around, and he wasn't there for our child.

I know he did all these great things. And I had no intention of having kids at that point, but man, that just really hit me hard. I was like, damn. And she wasn't saying it in a bitter way. She was just saying what it was. He wasn't around. He was touring all over the place and not being engaged as a dad. He's engaged as a drummer and as a jazz musician. And that's who got him, not me. And so when I did have kids and was thinking, even when we were talking about it, I was like, that's what really matters. None of this crap matters.

Eventually, we will be forgotten about. But we may live on in the lineage of our children. But we may live on in the lineage of our children. So whatever good I pass to him is going to get passed down through the generations if we survive that far. And that will matter more than what people remember me for for playing music. It was like, what kind of a dad was I? It all comes down to that.

music it was like what kind of a dad was i it all comes down to that and i and it's terrifying because you realize what a not good person you are when you have a kid man don't let him get that from you well i'm glad you found peace if uh you know at the other half of your life and i look forward to seeing what the other 50 years fucking brings to your life. And I really, you are going to fight this dark cloud because you're stronger than that. It's just like, we're here for you, bro. You helped me do it, man. People like you, these are my people.

For you to just to reveal yourself like, hey, I struggle with with depression all this stuff you know i think it helps other people that you know they don't feel alone it's like wow you know i mean look at all the super people whose lives on paper are way better than mine that killed themselves it's crazy you don't escape it you know why do you think the they are they don't want to be not misunderstood but they feel like they can't talk to anybody? I think they lost a spiritual battle. That's what I think.

I think they lost a spiritual battle. Everybody's case is different. But I know in my case, like, you know, we have such incredible willpower. Like when someone says I can't quit smoking, I was like, I'm like, man, you can do whatever you want if you want it bad enough. Like, you just have to want it. So how do I get to wanting it, you know? And when you get spiritually empowered, it comes with a lot of injection into your willpower. Positive injection. Because there's negative, you know, you can kill yourself. You can kill yourself with addiction.

You can kill yourself slowly can kill yourself with addiction you can kill yourself you know slowly fast so the thing is to like engage your willpower and on that positive track and supercharge it you know and it gets low sometimes the spiritual gas tank gets low but i think that people they got their gas tank low and they they just thought, it's hopeless. I can't do it. Which is bullshit. We're stronger than we think it is. It may be true for them at that time, but I wish that something good

could have happened for them to change that belief. Because I think it's a belief. And in that sense, when you say it's bullshit, I agree with you. I'm not saying their feelings aren't real, because that feeling is real to them. It's just not the end of the story. It's also true that you can flip that feeling.

You can take that same energy and convert it to the other. Or keep reading. Polarity. Yeah, or just hold on for another day until your moment comes. Like Bruce said that about career. He was like, 99% of success is just showing up and I was like what the fuck does that mean but he was right because I saw over a long period of time

like you know somebody gave up on their career and then their moment happened and they weren't there when the ship came in you know they left the port and they were like it's not coming and then it showed up afterwards but you weren't there to hop on and it's the same way with suicide. It's

like, man, if you could just hold on one more day, I know it seems like it's been a lot of days, man, but it didn't happen for me till I was 40. So I struggled from basically 19 till 40 years old, and then it happened. Yeah. Wow. And then I got a break. I got a miracle. Yeah. A full-on miracle. And so that's what, you know.

But now I still, the world is the world, and it can pull me back down. And even with all these great things happening in my life, like we talked about, there's a lot of crap going on in the world. My brother just died. All these people died, you know. Greg died. Then Butch Trucks died.

Then Colonel Bruce died. And people just kept dying, dying, dying, you know. And it just piled up on me. And so then I need to spiritually recharge again, you know. And so getting with you today, reading the book of the Tao, talking about it, you know, a lot of people, you can't talk with this stuff about. Talk with about this stuff.

Do you have a friend in Dead & Co. that you could talk to about? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think I can have a really deep conversation with every single one of them, for sure. John, too? Absolutely. These guys have been through stuff yeah john's been through some shit man he's put him oh he's put his own self through some shit yeah which we all do you know yeah but you know not most people aren't that famous at 23 years old and stuff you know that's a whole whole other set of stuff to deal with. It's like athletes who get famous at 19.

It's super good. You're lucky to survive it, man. I think more people have a hard time surviving that kind of success than surviving failure. Yeah. You're totally right. But it's a, I think, I just hope that people will hold out for another day and just don't write off completely half of your brain, your right brain, the subjective, the side where the subjective comes out of,

where art comes out of, where God, which is just a depiction. It's a picture. That's all it is, man, because we have to use words. That's all we've got. So the only, you know, how do you define the undefinable? You make a word called undefinable. You know what I mean? You're fucking right.

I mean, because that's only what i have to communicate with you right but that thing can save you everything comes out of nothing out of the unknown yeah and so that's where you're the solution to your problem is also going to come out of the unknown out of nothing seemingly but it does man it did for me it can't just be only i mean you know everyone it go it's got to be everybody it is man it's the way we're made we're made like why okay to me the ultimate question is why? Like we were talking about the fact if we can form a question, right? So why is it bad to murder someone or not?

Yeah. Right? Like, you know. It's crazy. Yeah, I totally get that. You know, I mean, the fact that we can even think about, like there's something inside of us that knows it's wrong. Where does that come from?

The unknown, like you said. I mean, I don't know. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know where it comes from. We call it our conscience, which has the word science in it, which I'm very fascinated about. You know what I mean? Because all those words are like when you pick them apart,

and I need to do that with the word conscience because it's some link between the subjective and the objective there. Yeah, totally. And that's what we're trying to figure out, this link. How did our brains get separated in here when they're in there smushed together? Right. So you think the conscious is the middle part of your brain? Trying to understand each side?

In the metaphorical sense, this is where we are God's children. Where God says, you're made like me. And so these things, these laws, which a lot of people don't agree with. They're like, it's fine if I murder you and take everything that you have, and then I win and you lose. What? The lion doesn't care what the sheep thinks. That's what Lannister says in the Game of Thrones, right?

So in his reality, on that side of the wheel of yin-yang, he's right. It's true. So it depends what side of the wheel of yin-yang, he's right. It's true. So it depends what side of the wheel you're on. So I wonder what happens to his conscience. Yeah. Right? What happened? Is it there and he ignores it?

Does it torture him? Does he not have it? Did it shrink and die? Did he get replaced by something else, evil? I don't know. But I know mine kept me up at night. I couldn't continue to live the way I was living because I felt it made me feel shitty.

My conscience was grieved. And so that's the God part that writes these stories about religion saying, you know, don't do this. Don't do that. You know it's wrong. Don't do it. Because you already know it's wrong, like you said, because it's inside of us. Some of us. I don't know what happened to Dick Cheney.

But, you know, seriously, like, you know, a lot of us, though, it's like we couldn't sleep at night. Some people just suppress. And we're not people who suppress things. Or was it wounded out of them? Yeah. You know? That's true. Right?

Yeah, you're right. Most pedophiles were victims of pedophilia. You know what I mean? We don't know people's stories. They're past, so we should be gentle. And sometimes you have to just be gentle with them while they're in jail. But you know.

You know what I mean, but still not to write anybody off because people can change. If they can't, then I'm doomed. Then my son's doomed. I should have never had him. Well, I'm glad you're giving out peace in the world bro

i'm serious you're a good guy and i'm trying we're all trying we're we're all trying that's all we can do is try yeah like i'm trying my hardest i you know i'm trying to show people that there's another side of just the music because we could have talked about music for an hour and a half yeah but fuck we always talk about music let's talk about something else let's talk about us so you're definitely known for uh bringing people joy i just love your vibe just like seeing your face i'm like i've never seen your show before so i might roll over tonight dude come tonight i've never been i've never seen i'm never good i never i didn't grow up with uh Dead or Allman or nothing. Me neither, man.

And I've had 20-some years of big fun playing this music. It's really rich, man. I love the Allman Brothers music. And I love the Grateful Dead's music. The songwriting is amazing. And I love the Grateful Dead's music. The songwriting is amazing. And the fact that they provide those vehicles for just as long a jam as you want to have. If the jam wants to do, we let the jam be what it is.

It has its own life, like Nigel. And we don't put it to bed unless curfew makes us. It's really, I hope you come out and really enjoy it. I'm going to come out tonight. It's beautiful. And I always tell people, for people that don't know Grateful Dead music, I'm going to post, learn these 10 songs and you will be a fan. Because they're deep.

I want them played at my funeral, along with Howlin' Wolf. you will be a fan. Because they're deep. I want them played at my funeral, along with Howlin' Wolf and all the other stuff. I'm looking forward to seeing you in your element, bro. Thanks for being on the show. Bless you, man. Cheers, bro. And now, a little message from Caleb Hawley. Love's not the way that you're talking at me

It's not the way that you make me feel It's not the way that you try to plead And apologize When you go right back into it again Cause I don't wanna be a fighter I'd rather be a friend So can we get a little higher So can we get a little higher Let a little love in

Let a little love in Let a little love in Alright, and there you have it. Wow! All right. And there you have it. Wow. Fucking star-studded event. Oteel. I really feel like I got to know Oteel in that interview.

We talked. He talked about some heavy shit, man. And for him to open up to me, who was a stranger at the time, it's fucking cool, man. so shout out to otil thanks for giving us a juice um wow it was a great one caleb holly at the end i'm pumped up you know i'm still here in denver it's a monday day before podcast release and i'm just fucking pumped up looking at this house, looking at 2020, and thinking about optimism. You know, 2019 was fucking weird, man. I was going through some heavy shit, and as my career was, you know, slowly getting bigger and bigger, and started this podcast and hearing people's stories,

and it made me some made me spiral sometimes like well fuck maybe i am fucked up and uh then i look back at it and i survived we all survived because we're stronger than we actually think you know look at look at otil a man has been through deaths upon deaths in his life with people he loved, you know? Kofi, Colonel Bruce. It's just nuts. And for him to have this optimism, even when he's going through a dark time, is fucking inspiring, you know? We could change.

It's okay to change, you know? I was just hanging out with my friend. My friend came over who I've known since middle school. And we were just fucking wild dogs in middle school and high school just just fucking everything and getting wasted fucking our teachers it was just it was a wild time and uh you know i don't get to see him as much anymore as i get older in life. And, you know, it's like, we change, you know, he was, he hasn't really changed much, you know, he's still chasing pussy and like, you know, just like from high school, but like we were hanging out, you know, I'm like, yeah, fuck, maybe I can show him, you know, who I am now as a 30 year old man. And I'm not really

thinking about that as much anymore. And I'm showing him my hood and you know it's amazing how much you change if you want to you know I look at myself now and I look at like the weekend and what we were talking about wasn't it was the same shit we were talking about in high school and I was like not really as interested as I used to be about it you know I love him I always support him like, it's amazing how we change and it's okay to change, you know? We don't need, it'd be boring to feel the same feelings every day, you know? I don't want to feel the same feelings

I felt in high school. I was fucking insecure as shit in high school. I used to like beat off to like porn silently. I giggle thinking about that because it's true. I used to like beat off to like porn silently I giggle think about that cuz it's true I used to like beat off to porn but on mute because I didn't want anyone to hear that I was beating off but you know as a kid you don't you think you're more clever than you think you are you know I bet you my parents were hearing me beat off and shit I was just chronic masturbating fucking high school. But I look at myself now and how much I've changed

and how my interests are. Even when I started playing music, it was like, oh, I just want to fuck chicks and just be a rock star without putting in the work. And now I look at myself 15 years later and actually putting in the work and hearing what these musicians have to say about, you know, being patient with your craft and working your craft. And every day it's got to,

you have to do this shit every day or it's not going to work out. Don't get, uh, down on yourself because your buddy is more successful than you are at the moment. You're going to make it too. Don't worry about that. Stop thinking that you have to judge yourself over other people. Life is too short. And we only get to be young for so long. I was at the Denver Central Market. I fucking love that place. I've been there like three or four times now.

it. Uh, you know, I fucking love that place. I've been there like three or four times now. Um, and I was just, you know, just hanging out with my boys and there was someone, it was next to me. Uh, this old man was reading a book to his, it looked like she was about to go. Her neck was, you know, she couldn't really walk and you know, he just is reading a book to her in a public place because just to make her feel good, you know, that's, that's the shit that warms my heart. You know, don't worry, we're going to make it. Just give love out, try to be as optimistic as you can. And we'll make it through this, you know, mental health, depressions. Don't be afraid to talk and don't be afraid to feel these feelings. Don't suppress feelings. You know, my therapist always says that. Feel something, Frasco. Feel something. Don't just, if it makes

you sad, fucking get out of it. No, feel it. And that's what Oteel taught me on that interview. No, feel it. And that's what Oteel taught me on that interview. Feel things. Because sometimes we're afraid to mourn. Sometimes we're afraid to change. Don't be afraid to change. I feel great now.

Not like judging. I used to be so fucking judgmental about everything. You know, it was fucked up. It was making me more hollow. And now I just got to let that shit go. And just worry about ourselves. You know, and our friends and our loved ones. And just stay optimistic. Because we're going to fight this fucking depression.

2020s. The 20s. We're back in the 20s, people. Where people were smoking cigarettes and wearing risky lingerie. Think of it like the 1920s. Let's smash this shit. Let's love life. And let's just be the people we want to be. All right. So next week, we got G-Love. Fucking great story. You know, he's the man. I just got to meet him. He's got some swag, dude. If I was a chick, I'd fuck him for sure. He's got swag.

So can't wait for G Love. Arno, before we get Arno on his rants, just always wear condoms. It's season three, baby. We're going to fuck this shit up. We're going to rock. We're going to heal each other through the art of talking and through the art of dick jokes and pussy jokes, whatever you want to do,

whatever, I'm not judging, whatever you got to do, and let's just live, let's be happy, this shit, you never know what's going to go down, fucking Trump's trying to start a war, and you know, people are trying to take away our freedom, but not in our hearts, so let's fight this shit with open arms. And let's fight mental health. Alright guys. Love you. Wear condoms. And let's fuck. Skull fuck 2020.

A new year. The third season. You tune in to the familiar informational mayhem of Andy Fresco's World Saving Podcast. Thank you for listening to episode 70. Produced by Andy Fresco, Joe Angelou and Chris Lawrence. Please subscribe, rate the show on iTunes and Spotify so we can make this a worldwide phenomenon. For info on the show, please head to our Instagram at worldsavingpodcast.

For more info on the blog and tour dates, head to andyfresco.com. Change of Pace was last year's album. It's still available with online media streamers, soon to be replaced by a new album. This week's guest is Oteel Burbridge from the Ormond Brothers and Dead & Company. Find him on oteelburbridge.com. O-T-E-I-L, Oteel. That song was by Caleb Hawley. It was called Little Love Inn.

This week's special guests are Ari Findlings and Arno Bakker. So, we made it through the podcast winter break into the new year, talking about mayhem. Crazy parties, Christmas parties, fireworks parties, burning parties, guilty parties,

third parties, and probably even political parties. What a blast it has been. And now that the smoke clears out, it seems there is a lot more party on the horizon. So put on your dancing shoes and step into that future. Choose your parties, choose your friends, find your steps, find your moves. Find your own choreography. Dance at the dinner table. Dance in the streets. Don't shy away from the dance battles, for it's time to dance your heart out. Don't grumble, Grandpa. Grumble. Be engaged, be safe, and we will see you next week.