Animal Spirits Podcast - I Want To Be An Advisor, What Do I Do?

Episode Date: July 12, 2025

On this special episode of Animal Spirits at the Morningstar Investment Conference in Chicago, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Michael Batnick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ben Carlson⁠⁠⁠��⁠⁠⁠ discuss best practices on starting a career in the modern world of finance, their own backgrounds on how they arrived at Ritholtz, how to navigate the current state of the industry, the importance of developing your niche, what jobs will (and won't) survive AI, and more! Sign up for The Compound newsletter and never miss out: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠thecompoundnews.com/subscribe⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Find complete show notes on our blogs: Ben Carlson’s ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠A Wealth of Common Sense⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Michael Batnick’s ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Irrelevant Investor⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Feel free to shoot us an email at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[e-mail]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ with any feedback, questions, recommendations, or ideas for future topics of conversation.   Investing involves the risk of loss. This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be or regarded as personalized investment advice or relied upon for investment decisions. Michael Batnick and Ben Carlson are employees of Ritholtz Wealth Management and may maintain positions in the securities discussed in this video. All opinions expressed by them are solely their own opinion and do not reflect the opinion of Ritholtz Wealth Management. The Compound Media, Incorporated, an affiliate of ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ritholtz Wealth Management⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, receives payment from various entities for advertisements in affiliated podcasts, blogs and emails. Inclusion of such advertisements does not constitute or imply endorsement, sponsorship or recommendation thereof, or any affiliation therewith, by the Content Creator or by Ritholtz Wealth Management or any of its employees. For additional advertisement disclaimers see here ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ritholtzwealth.com/advertising-disclaimers⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Investments in securities involve the risk of loss. Any mention of a particular security and related performance data is not a recommendation to buy or sell that security. The information provided on this website (including any information that may be accessed through this website) is not directed at any investor or category of investors and is provided solely as general information. Obviously nothing on this channel should be considered as personalized financial advice or a solicitation to buy or sell any securities. See our disclosures here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ritholtzwealth.com/podcast-youtube-disclosures/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to Animal Spirits, a show about markets, life, and investing. Join Michael Batnik and Ben Carlson as they talk about what they're reading, writing, and watching. All opinions expressed by Michael and Ben are solely their own opinion and do not reflect the opinion of Ridholt's wealth management. This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon for any investment decisions. Clients of Ridholt's wealth management may maintain positions in the securities discussed in this podcast. Hello. Welcome to Animal Spirits with Michael and Ben.

We are live from the Morningstar Conference on Navy Pier. It only took us 26 minutes to walk all the way back here. My lordy. So we are, how would you describe what we're in? We're in a booth. It's like a fish bowl. A fishbowl. There's people with headphones looking at us.

I'm just going to look at you. You have my full attention, okay? All right. We are very close. So today's episode is going to be able to be able to be. a little bit different than the normal shows. And it's going to be a little bit self-serving because there is a conversation that I have on repeat and the volume ebbs and flows, but it's something like, hey, love your guys'

podcast. I want to get into the business, the industry. Here's what I'm doing. What would you recommend? How would you recommend I break through? And a lot of times, it's people who are completely out of finance. Sometimes it's people in finance who say I want to go from this track to this track. Yeah.

A lot of times it's, listen, I love this stuff. I follow it all the time. What do I do? Yeah. So I've gotten pretty good at this, not to brag, because there are only so many different variations of a story that somebody can tell you where they're coming from whatever background, whether they're in the industry and want to pivot, if they're at a large company.

Like I know what to say to who I'm talking to. And so this is self-serving in the sense that anytime I get this, I'm just going to forward them this link. So I had a call earlier last week, and the person was our age-ish, three kids. Middle age. Middle age. Approaching middle age, not quite middle age. And so I'm like, so tell me your story.

And they exited their previous career. And sort of like I was in 2010, what do you want to do? I love the market. All right, well, cool. What do you want to do? I just, I love stocks. Right, I follow this stuff religiously. I hear all the podcasts.

I read all the books, all the blogs. So here, so, all right, so what are you doing now? He said, I'm actually prop trading. Oh, boy. Okay, that's... Wait, wait. Personal capital or like for an actual firm? Because that's, there's a difference.

Personal capital with, I guess, leverage from the company that he's working for. No, no, no. It's not a professional. I just think it would be funny if an individual called their own trading account, like my Robin Hood account is a prop. Right. No, no, no. Actually, you know what? Yeah, no, I'm pretty sure he's working like at a place. Okay. Because that'd be a great thing to fudge on your resume, like prop trading. Yeah, yeah. But it's like your Roth IRA. Yeah. So I love trading. It's a ton of fun. And the seduction of you're going to turn your account into, you know, a lifestyle obviously is not real life. We know a lot of people in and around this industry. I don't think I know a single person.

that trades for themselves, that doesn't also have income from either a course and zero disrespect, but nobody is putting food on the table who is reliant solely on their profits and trading, because once you do that, you introduce all sorts of different pressures. It influences how you trade. It's just it's not possible. Or if you're that good, you go do it for a hedge fund. Exactly. But wait, do you think any of those skills in trading translate into wealth management? Because I'm not sure that they do. Well, it depends on the personality. The skills, and I will use that word very generously or very liberally, no, of course not. Trading has nothing to do with what we do.

So, no, not transferable at all. So anyway, I'm like, all right, well, he's not delusional, right? Like, he's having fun. He knows that this is not going to be a future for him. But he wants, so paint me the perfect role for you. What if you could snap your fingers and create a job at a thin air, what would that job be? And he's like, you know, equity research, PM, I'm just about to sign up for the CFA. And I'm like, timeout, the world that you're describing, the role that you're looking for died about 10 years ago.

And you also think AI is going to take over for a lot of analysts. That's your take, right? I know it is. We referenced Mark Rubinstein, his substack net interest. He said that he was looking to hire people, and AI has made that so that he doesn't have to. Rex Salisbury just put on LinkedIn that perplexity launched a finance assistant. Same thing. He said, I was getting ready to hire one or two junior analysts.

I don't need to anymore. So, but that's not even, so that role is gone. And the CFA, I'm like, dude, the CFA still has value. if you are at Penn or any other of these Ivy League colleges and you want to get into private equity or you want to work from one of the big banks, sure, do the traditional path. So, but you think that like sell side analysts are a dying breed then? Oh, for sure. But particularly for what this person is describing, the equity research, the PM, he's like,

I just want to get my, you know, get my, roll my sleeves up and do some fundamental work, maybe some tech. dude, it doesn't exist. We are at Morningstar, the Morningstar Conference, and... Well, part of it is, too, the index funds in ETS. Yeah, it's still a large industry, gigantically large, and in fact, I don't know if it was Jeffrey Patak or Ben Johnson or somebody at Morningstar, I believe,

said that even though the flows into active mutual funds or out of the active mutual funds has just been a perpetual title wave the revenue is still going higher because the tailwind of the market. Yeah. Even if the flows aren't, yeah, the market value is still climbing. It's still a large industry, but it's not growing the way that it once was. Obviously, index funds have played an ETFs have played an enormous role in changing the trajectory.

Beating the market is hard. And now AI, it's just like the final nail in the coffin. So I'm saying to this guy, like, you are so lucky that you got to me because he's like, I was just about to spend $1,800 on the. CFA course. And I'm like, dude, you have three kids. You don't have the hours. Takes a lot of time. You are going to waste the prime earning years of your life chasing a figment of your imagination. So what do you tell them to do? The role that you're describing does not exist or it does, but not for you. And it did it for me, okay? Because I was,

I was him in 2010. And I was such a pathetic loser that I was willing to go to San Antonio. to be an internal wholesaler. What? That's an internal role. Why would you leave New York City? Because I, there were no doors that were open for me. Now, in 2010, like the world was in a different place. There were different challenges, but it's not going to happen.

So you're welcome. Let's talk about what can you actually do. So this is a tangent here, but Bern Hobart on his, on the diff, wrote a piece a couple weeks ago called What Happened to Working Your Way Up from the Mailroom. God. Because all these stories about, Bear Stearns, I started out in the mailroom, or Lehman Brothers, I started out in the mailroom, You cannot do that anymore.

There's no mailroom. No. And all the hedge fund managers say, listen, I wouldn't hire myself when I was 20 because all the people I hire now are in Ivy League schools or whatever. You're right. It's, that doesn't exist anymore. He's like, all right. So what about what about what you guys do?

I'm like, all right, well, you have a decent personality. Like, would you, do you want to give financial advice? And he's like, sure, tell me more. Like, how do I do that? In the past, my answer was, and it's not a bad answer is, first of all, stop, don't send your resume. You have no resume. Like, you were in a different career. I don't even look at resumes when they come in, honestly.

Like, people email me. It's funny. I don't either. A resume might or might not be attached. I don't look at it. And if I do, it's only sort of like by mistake. I don't know, proficient in Excel and word. Right.

Right. Ooh. So I said what you have to do, and this is universal advice at this point, go. into somebody's branch. Ask to speak to the hiring manager, have a nice smile on your face, go into somebody's office and see if they're hiring, and maybe give them your resume physically.

So the advice that I had done was getting a job at an RAA with no experience, pretty tricky. But there are always companies like Vanguard, like Fidelity and Schwab and Morningstar that are hiring for all sorts of different roles. We talk to college students all the time that go start as a customer service

associate at Vanguard and learn the business and work their way up and then move on to an array if that's the path they want. Each one of those paths have different opportunities, different challenges, but that is a viable thing to do, right? Like you can get a role maybe. Not saying it's going to be easy

because you are competing with people that are younger than you, that are cheaper than you, that have less baggage than you. So it's not going to be easy. Here is advice. If you want to get into wealth management, now it's tricky because this wouldn't work for us,

but. You gotta have rich parents you can bring on as a client. Right, so let's assume that doesn't happen. How do I get my foot in the door? Right? How do I get my foot in the door? Is the question. You start at the client service associate level. What is a CSA?

A CSA is an operational role. You learn about all the different account types, all the different paperwork, what the steps look like, cashiering, you learn how to talk with people, you work for the advisor, and you learn the business slowly. Now. Yeah, because you get to do a lot of stuff in that role, right? You get to. So that is the type of role that it's hard to come by. It's like we are always hiring for that role, and it's a difficult role to find. because for the most part, unlike advisors who get a paycheck, who we can talk about if you want,

for CSAs, it's mostly a lateral move financially, right? And so things have to be going poor where they are for them to turn over. So there's much less turnover amongst that industry or amongst that job seeker than there is with advisors. So you go in there and you say, here's a deal. I don't know anything about this industry, but I have aspirations to be the best that I can at this particular function.

I am willing to put in whatever time it takes. I will be the best CSA that you will ever hire, and I'm willing to dedicate myself for X number of years and learn the business. And maybe somebody will say, you know what, I like your attitude, I like your smile, you seem sincere and genuine, you're saying all the right things,

you're not bullshitting me, you're here to learn, I'll give you a chance. And then you stay in that seat until they pluck you out of it. You put your head down and you be the best CSA possible until somebody recognizes your talents and says, you know what, would you like to do something else? So that's a family feud. Good answer. Thank you.

Okay. So I had a guy come up to me. Actually, I was speaking at a CFA event. You think CFA is dead, but I still speak at their events. I don't think it's dead. And a guy came up to me and said, listen, I was one of the guys who asked you like three years ago. I wanted to break into the industry.

I think he was a tax something. he said, I asked you what to do, and you gave me advice, I don't remember what I told him, but he said, I'm working for an RA now. He said, what did you do? He said, I beat down every door in my town that I could. And I said, I'll do anything you want. That's, he's, if someone finally took a chance on me. That's it.

So when, when people are talking to me or us about working for Riddell's wealth management, the number one thing that I'm looking for is personality and drive. And email etiquette. And email etiquette and don't be annoying. And I don't care where they went to school. I just want somebody who's like, listen, because this is how I was. I said to Josh and Barry, I will do anything you guys need me to do. And I meant it.

And that's mentality that I had. And that's the type of mentality that I respect and admire that I want to work for us. That's kind of funny because, yeah, your role actually was at CSA, even if it wasn't called bad at a time. Yeah. A little bit. Yeah. All right. So I want to talk about more wealth management when you're in the industry.

So I've had probably four calls in the last three. weeks. And we have advisors reach out to us, ask for advice. Hey, I'm thinking about moving from this place to this place or I want to grow my firm. And I've had three calls in the last three weeks, four calls, a lot of people saying, listen, we're stuck. We're only getting bigger on referrals. We've reached our ceiling of what I think our growth can be. The older advisors, the gray hairs don't want to grow anymore. They're happy with where they are. They're happy with the clients they have. They've checked out, but they're not leaving yet. Us younger group, the next group, we're in our 30s, our 40s, late 20s. We want

growth like here's our plan what do you think or what can we do so i had one specifically and a lot of them ask you know we want to do content like you guys that seems like a good way to and i tell them that is a good approach even if they probably can't do what we do exactly but one guy said listen i'm walking into a potentially 800 million to a billion dollar r a based in the Midwest they want me to grow the firm beyond the 10 or 15 referrals they get a year what do i do is this person an advisor this person is a in the sales growth role he's coming from out of the ria industry and he said should i do this and i i said not knowing you've never worked in wealth management before that might be kind of tricky said well they're going to give me equity said well that that might change it

a little bit that's the incentive i guess that's a carrot on a stick but he said i'm trying to figure this out wrap my head like how would you grow a billion dollar firm into a five billion dollar firm yes beyond the referrals no but like not buying other a yes yes organically how he said how would you do this yeah and i said first of all you're probably not going to be able to do that it's very hard maybe you can but like temporary because he said i want to do this and i want to do this like in a one two three year plan i'm like i want to have goal posts okay and i said all right well just whatever they are pump the brakes kind of like any kitchen remodel you in your house it's going to take longer than you think like this is going to take a

a long time you have to get the advisors on board and can they close business and these things. And I said, I'm speaking from experience. The only experience I have in the wealth management is content marketing. But I do feel like a lot of RAs have figured out that's the way to do it. Even it's not like building an audience or building a substack or building a social media following or something, but it's creating a library of content for your clients that that's like that's the resume now, right? Because that's your level of expertise that shows you've thought about this stuff. I feel like half the time when we get questions from clients, what do you think about this geopolitical event? What do you think about

the debt situation? What do you think about interest rates or inflation? Half the time, they just want to know that you've thought about it. So they don't have to think about it. Yeah, but yes, and talking to clients, so doing content for the sake of being official with your time, if there is an event talking to all of them at once instead of sitting on the phone or sending emails one by one, is an effective strategy, but that's not a growth strategy, per se, right? Like, so you're talking. That's planning the seeds for a longer term growth. But yeah.

This person's talking about what building an audience and then attracting clients. Yes, but I kind of said, that's not, there's no way your mile markers are going to be reached to that way. No. So I said, can your advisors close business? Do they, do they reach out to current clients and ask for referrals or ask if they have more money? Well, no, they don't do any of that. I said that's part of it.

Part of being an advisor is selling and closing business, which is not something that they teach people. Some people are born with that skill. We know some of those people that they're naturals. Other people have to actually learn it. And we've seen that path with plenty of our advisors. Yeah. But like what would you tell someone in that situation?

Your best bet is buying other advisory firms? No, I would be honest. And I would say I don't think it's going to work. I would say, like, think long and hard about what you're going to do before you get there. Have a game plan, talk to people in the industry, and do a sanity check. Does this make sense? But we, I've had multiple conversations where we talk a lot about the inheritance that's coming, the inheritance wave from baby boomers to the next generation.

I feel like that push and pull, I've had a ton of those conversations about there's a group of young advisors, three or four of us, and there's a group of old advisors that they don't own the firm or whatever and them budding heads and they're not leaving when they said they would or I thought I was going to be handed the business. What do we do? And I think maybe the thing is you roll out into your own firm or something. All right. So before we get to that part of the conversation, financial advice is a, it's a weird industry. I heard Carl Hykenberg talking with Michael Sitchmore. It's a lonely industry in the sense that we are all very much doing our own thing.

Like, I've had... Right, it doesn't really feel like you have competitors in a sense. Right, so we do. We just don't see them, but we don't really interact with them. So we've made a lot of investments in young wealth tech companies. And oftentimes, I'm asked, hey, what other advisors do you know

that you think we should be talking to? And my answer is like, I know this sounds ridiculous. I really don't know any. I mean, I know one. I have like one friend in this industry outside of our firm. Now, we communicate with all of the advisors. Like, they listen to our podcast, but okay, fine.

Well, who should I reach out to? Who do you respect? Like, who do you think is doing a good job? I don't know. How would I know? It's not like the NBA where you could see, like, what teams and coaches and players are doing. Well, I guess the answer is, unfortunately,

it's probably the biggest firms are going to continue to get bigger. Because I still think that you talk about the CFA. When people ask me, CFA versus CPA, I say CIP, or CFP all day long. because I think there's a huge growth potential for advice in the years ahead. And there's also, there's a demand for CFPs. 70 million baby boomers. They hold all the money. They hold, you know, 60% of the wealth or whatever it is.

A lot of them are going to need advice on their money. So the problem is I think a lot of the bigger firms are just going to get bigger. Yeah. All right. So here's my point about the industry and the fragmentation. Even though we don't directly see our competitors, it's, it's pretty rare for a prospect to be like, all right, I'm talking to you. and I'm talking to three other REAs, right?

It doesn't genuine, at least for us, it doesn't happen that way. But just because you don't see your competitors doesn't mean that it's not insanely competitive because you're not just competing with REAs, you're competing with wirehouses, you're competing with Vanguard and Schwab. They have low-cost solutions. And on the content side, you are competing with Netflix.

You are competing with Joe Rogan and the ringer. Like, it's insanely hard to get somebody to be like, Like, yeah, I'm going to listen to this person's podcast who's on their second episode, who doesn't know how to talk coherently into a microphone. Because we've been doing this for eight years now. And I had butterflies in my stomach for the first two years. It's hard. It takes practice.

We were shit. Yeah. Because I didn't go to broadcasting school. I don't know how to – I didn't know how to talk to a microphone. So it was difficult. And we were doing this on the back, let's be honest, of Josh and Barry. They had the audience. And absent them –

They helped build our audience. Absent them, we wouldn't have been able to do this. I don't know. So there's not really a good answer to that. No, there is a good answer. Figure out something else. That's the truth. How about this?

What I tell people all the time is find your niche. We just had a guy come in here before we started and he said, I cater exclusively to dentists. I think we talked to someone before who just does Delta airline pilots. If you really want to stand out, it's a niche in your expertise. Yes, yes, yes. Because it used to be, I'll just go to the place. down the street or in downtown and that's my advisor but now the pandemic blew this doors off of this your competition now is everywhere because people are willing to talk on zooms and find an advisor

somewhere else right it's not just the place down the street that you're willing to go anymore Josh put on LinkedIn the other day what would you do if an acquaintance of yours comes to you with a really bad idea that they're passionate about what would I do tell them no yeah of course so I would say good luck yeah you You would say, yeah, you would say that sound, yeah, sounds good. Yeah, good luck. I really enjoy being frank with people because most people, there's no upside to telling somebody that their idea is not a good one, especially if they're passionate about it.

Now, there's times a lot by my tongue, obviously, if somebody's like, you know, I've got totally, it's tricky. But for somebody like the conversation that I had last week, like, hey, I'm thinking about doing the CFA, prop trading. I love that I just saved that guy's life. The chances of that working on are very small. And had he not spoken to me, he would have gone down a really bad path. So I love being able to do that for people.

Now, I'm not always right, but I know what, like, I know when I'm right. So you want to start the CFA prevention hotline? Yeah, listen, my side gigs are a bald consultant. That's true. And no, the CFA is not for you. That ship sailed. We should mention we both have our CFA designation. You know, ironically.

It helped me get my second job. My renewal just came yesterday. I got mine too. You know. Badgering me about it. I've told this story before, but it's just so funny how life works. So for people that are outside who are not familiar with my story hour podcast, I was a jackass of all jackasses growing up in a college.

I kicked out of Indiana University, shout to Kelly, twice for just not caring. And so I felt very far behind professionally when I got out of college in 2008. I was like, oh, this is why people actually put time into their education, dumbass. So I went down the CFA route because I needed something. I had nothing. I had nothing going on. And I'm in an interview with Alions or Pimpco. I think it was when Alian's bought the merger, whatever it was.

And it was going great. This was for an internal wholesaler role. And my first interview was going wonderfully well. And I felt like adrenaline and excitement. I'm like, finally. like finally I found I found a home and then he introduced me to his hiring manager and the guy was like wait CFA this is not this is not the role for you this is an internal wholesale I was like no no no no no no like I'm only on level one I'll stop doing it and he was like no dude like you're in the wrong

you're in the wrong role I don't know what I even dot means I swear he goes apply for something else this is not this is not the role for you this is more of like a sales you know relationship role so had I not done the CFA I would have been in on much. I would have gotten that job. Like, I would have gotten that job and my life would have been very different. How about this, though? Sales is one of the few places where AI is not going to disrupt. If you have the ability to sell, AI is not going to take your job. Not yet. Well, you think AI is going to take all jobs. No, I don't. What are we going to do if no one has a job? Well, here's a role that's disappearing, and I'm sure of it, because I won't hire for it. The parlor

role, that is a very difficult role to fill because typically, not typically, not typically, always these are younger people who are new to the industry maybe they went from cSA to a power planner so they might have some experience but they need mentorship from the advisor and tutelage is that the same thing i think so yeah uh they need to learn they need to grow and develop just saying it's an investment they need to make more money they need to grow up emotionally like how to learn how to you know the soft skills and then heaven forbid they have success they leave the nest and the advisor has to start from zero, it's a horrible role. But it's a necessary role for young people to get into the industry.

And that is, that is disappearing because that role is being replaced by AI today. Disagree? No, I think it makes sense. This is back to the established advisors and the established firms. Those are the ones that are going to get bigger, I think. I think you're right. We're hollowing out the middle. We have five minutes.

What's on your mind? Well, AI is not going to disrupt conferences, right? People are still going to want to meet in person more than ever because of all the technology. I keep saying, I've noticed in the last few years, I think people are more excited to come to these kind of events than they were in the past because a lot more people are working remotely. All right. This sounds like filler talk. Let me, I've got one last time for us.

Okay. Right? I mean, we have anything else at our conferences? Yes. All right. So I wrote about this recently. Advisors Want a Paycheck was the title of the post. So in 2017, 2018, Chris and I were having weekly conversations with advisors about joining

RWM. Now, at the time, we were really not, we did not have the foundational infrastructure to be able to offer a compelling reason for why these people should leave their jobs and join us. Like, we just, we weren't there yet. The people who came to us took a leap of fame. Huge a leap. So Jonathan and Brian in Chicago, like, they saw the future.

but they took a risk. Yeah. Right. By the way, I took a risk. When I told my family that I was joining Ritholtz, they were like, so you know these guys on the Internet, and you're leaving like this billionaire family to join them? The guy who owns the firm says they can't even afford me,

so I got that going for me. We couldn't. You took a risk. Josh says that me and Chris took a risk. We were laughing the other day that he always says. I was like, dude, took a risk. Hmm, should I stay unemployed forever? Or should I work for the one person who I wanted to work for more than anybody else in the world?

That's why I didn't think it was a risk either because I wanted to work with you guys on that. Unemployment or maybe something. But anyway, so and then I would say a combination of two things. COVID disruption, people weren't going anywhere. And more importantly, the mega, the 800 pound gorilla in the room is private equity. And it got so competitive and is so competitive that all of the advisors who would have come to us were getting cold called. And heaps of bags of money thrown at them. and it was very clear to me.

I had this conversation with Chris many times where the advice, I'm like, dude, I'm not making this up. Wake up. This is what's happening. And this is why we're having one call a month instead of 11. Okay, fast forward to today. And the people that were talking with us, a lot of times it was, listen, I've got this PED on the table, but I want to talk to you guys too.

There's a lot of those. And what did you know? And most people are capitalists. And so we don't give paychecks. And so, you know, they made their decision. I probably would have done the same thing. All right, now, fast forward to today, a couple of things are happening. Number one, and we have two minutes, so I'm going to make this really quick.

Number one, a lot of the money came with strings attached, right? There is no free launch. And so there are certain incentives and pushes to either sell product or to get more efficient, make more money, whatever the case is. And there's a lot of people that got swallowed where the senior advisor got money, the junior advisor, who's now 40, they didn't get money. Like, why am I still here? So who's going to be looking when these deals, some of them won't work out, obviously?

Who's going to be making you look to switch faster to clients or the junior advisors? Probably the advisors. Like, whoa, I didn't know what I was signing up for. I would say the advisors. So we're starting to hear from them a lot more frequently. We're also hearing from the advisor, who is now our age-ish, who hung the shingle, tried it. And it was like, wait a minute. I want to get financial advice.

I don't want them on my own company. Right. I don't want to do the trading and the rebalancing. And so we are now having way more conversations with advisors than we did in the past few years. And I suspect that this is not a flash in the pan. I think this is not a countertrend rally. I think that this is a regime shift. And the next couple of years are going to be very interesting. Yeah.

It's going to be like consolidation to breakups. Yeah. There will be. We're going to be there for the rebound. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Any closing thoughts, Ben? Thanks to Morningstar for having us.

Great event. Thank you, Morningstar. Thank you listeners. Thank you people outside who are staring at us with headphones on. Animal Spirits at the compound news.com. Personal emails, personal responses. We'll see you next time.