Are You A Charlotte? - Maybe we could be each other’s soulmates… (S4 E1 "The Agony and the Ex-tacy")

Episode Date: March 16, 2026

This is the episode that Charlotte offers the suggestion, “maybe we could be each other’s soulmates…” and everyone is emotional over it.Kristin shares her thoughts about that iconic statement that really shaped the entire series of Sex and the City.We’re now into Season 4 and more than halfway through the series and Season 4 is starting off STRONG!Plus, who doesn’t love Friar F*$k!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. I'm Clayton Eckerd. In 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. But here's the thing. Bachelor fans hated him. If I could press a button and rewind it all I would. That's when his life took a disturbing turn.

A one-night stand would end in a courtroom. The media is here. This case has gone viral. The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. Listen to Love Trapped on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hi, it's Joe Interesting, host of the Spirit Daughter podcast where we talk about astrology, natal charts, and how to step into your most vibrant life. And today I'm talking with my dear friend, Krista Williams. It can change you in the best way possible. Dance with the change. Dance with the breakdowns. the embodiment of Pisces intuition with Capricorn power moves. So I'm like delusionally proud of my chart.

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Get to know Ego. Follow Thanks Dad with Ego Wodom and start listening on the free IHeart Radio app today. Hey, I'm Jay Chetty, host of the On Purpose podcast. My latest episode is with Hillary Duff, singer, actress, and multi-platinum artist. You desire in family like this picture. And that's not reality. My sister and I don't speak. It's definitely a very painful part of my life.

And I hope it's not forever, but it's for right now. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Chetty on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Kristen Davis, and I want to know, are you a Charlotte? Okay, you guys, guess who I have to rewatch with me? our producer technician, extraordinaire Easton. Hi, Kristen. It's so great to be back. Thank you for being with us. I'm such a big fan.

I know you're the sweetest, sweetest fan. He knows so much, you guys. He knows more than I know, I feel like. Like when I don't remember things, he remembers things, which is so helpful. And this is fun because this is our first episode of the fourth season, which as you've heard me say I think of as an extended version of the third season. Like if you ask me about the fourth season, I just draw a total blank. But of course, when I watch the episodes, like, these are some of the best episodes.

I thought they were all in episode, season three. But no, we are now in season four. And we come out with a bang. A bang. And these are both the 401 and 402 are both written and directed by Michael Patrick King, which is how he likes to roll and how he then ended up doing our films and just like that. This is the first time, I believe, that we're seeing him writing and directing both. So writing and directing two episodes is like, it's like doing a film, basically. Oh, yeah.

You know, your prep, your post, all of the casting, you know, you're in it, but that's how he loves to be, right? And he wrote such beautiful episodes, and they're so different. And apparently, we aired them together, which is also really smart of HBO, because they are kind of different, like the agony and the ecstasy, the first one is a little bit more introspective. Harry's turning 35. She's thinking about soulmates. And then the next one is the real me with a fashion show and a fashion roadkill, which is funnier and bigger.

It's like a big set piece to have that fashion show in the middle of it, right? Yes. And this one, I mean, I didn't remember half of what happened. So I was really into watching it and it was really, really good. I did not remember that poor Carrie goes to her birthday dinner and we don't go.

Oh my God. That part is so heartbreaking. I know. And she really takes. it well. But what I remember, I'll just say this first, this is my big, well, I have two memories of filming of these episodes. I remember that I, Charlotte, go to Carrie's apartment when we haven't gone to her dinner. I didn't remember that we didn't make it because of, there's like a New York City traffic situation. There's a lot of construction work on Fifth Avenue. Right,

the repaving, which is, which is crazy and very real. Like if something major like that happens, you can't get to a different neighborhood. Like it's wacky unless you take the subway, which apparently none of us were going to do. But also where El Cantonore is would have been a bit of a challenge anyway to take the subway. But anyway, they don't make it. But they make it late.

And then they want to go to the coffee shop. But then she's not answering her phone because she's in a dark emotional hole as she describes it. And I remember that I had to go to her apartment when she's in the shower and she had all her makeup running down her face. And, you know, she was soaking wet. And it's always a big deal to get anybody wet at work, right?

because you can't really recreate it. Yeah, you got like one shot. Right, right, pretty much. And I remember the stress of that and also the stress of what she was going to actually wear, right? Because I had to like, you know, we had to like open the shower curtain. They do that kind of cool shot of me through the shower curtain and her through the shower curtain. And then I had to open it and we have kind of an important conversation where I'm like, we're all, we want you to come. You know, we feel so bad.

It's your birthday. I remember that and I remember Sarah just soaking wet and like freezing. like shivering freezing. And I was so worried about her. I remember that. And I also remember that there was a lot of stress about the outfit that Charlotte would wear. They all go to this party.

And they feel like they're the only single people there, which I'm sure they were because I've had this experience, you know, many times. And then I end up going to Tray's apartment, which becomes my apartment, but isn't yet my apartment. And I have to wear that just for a really long time. And he also has to try to kind of have sex with me

or convinced me to have sex with him. And then this thing happens on the dress. And I was really stressed about what would show or whatever, how we would pull that off and not have it be revealing or uncomfortable or whatever. And then also it was freezing because we would go back to work in February. So if you notice, like, Samantha has some major coats on. Yes. And we are all, the rest of us are wearing a lot of leather.

This is historically when Pat would be getting the furs out. but I think that they didn't think that party we were going to was like fancy enough to be a fur moment, right? So we're all just wearing a lot of leather. And I still have that coat. I'm wearing like a, it's a Richard Tyler leather trench, which is really pretty. In terms of like when you, when you're filming it,

are they setting it to be basically the time of year of when you're shooting? No. Because it aired in June. No, yes. No, we're supposed to be in June. Oh, man. There's always a lot of stress. Yeah.

Yeah, wow. Because we're trying not to look like it's February, but New York, February is completely different than New York June. And we were just always freezing. You know, it was very, very cold. But we had to wear like June-type clothes, right? And luckily, we would get some kind of coats, you know, because also New York fluctuates so much.

But that's where we're wearing the leather because it's kind of shiny and it has a life to it. You know, and I guess that was what was in at the time. Because we're still in the year. Now we're in 2001. Got it. Oh, wow. 2001. Oh, my God. So the other thing I remember about this in general, though it wouldn't have been

happening yet in February, the summer of 2001 was like the most glorious summer. And in so many ways, it was like the height before the fall. Yeah. You know, like every, the weather was incredible. The colors were incredible. Like people were so happy and out on the street and there were just parties everywhere. It felt like, oh, so I think because this is success of the show, right? It was like busy. and vibrant and, you know, happening in so many ways. And then, of course, September 11th, you know, that all came to an end. So that's what it's like the glory, the glory times. Wow.

Yeah. Yeah. I was just thinking about like what it must have been like in the city during that summer. It was beautiful. So beautiful. The city in the summer is so, so beautiful. And back then, you know, it was like innocent-ish in a way. I don't know how to put it like, it's never really innocent, I guess, because it's

the city. and there's like a lot of whatever, but I'm sober, so it's, you know, like the parties and things were more about interesting people and kind of like the fashion world, the art world, like different mixes of people would be at New York parties.

Whereas if you go to a party in L.A., it's probably the entertainment industry, right? But in New York, you've got, and then there's the tech bros, probably not then, though, there would have been the money people, the stock guys. Wall Street people and stuff. Yeah, the Wall Street people, definitely.

But it is interesting there, And it was certainly interesting in those days because I feel like it was just the height of all the things. You know, like we were all going out to the beach on the weekend. You know, I rented a place. It was in the woods just to be calm. It was beautiful. So beautiful. I know.

The golden days. The olden days is crazy to think about it. Okay. Let's talk about this episode, The Agony and the Ecstasy. Did you tell me that you just rewatch this like separately? Yes. Or you've rewatched it for us? I had rewatched it probably.

a year ago. Oh, wow. And I mean, and we'll get to it, but let's just one of those episodes that, there's so many great moments in this episode, I cried twice. What? I cried twice watching this last night. When? I cried twice a year ago. When you say, when Charlotte says, we can be each other's soulmates.

And you know what? I don't want to jump ahead too much, but the big moment. The big moment truly made me cry. I have to say, I really liked him. He was very likable. I was happy. I felt happy for her in a good way. It's a good payoff.

It's a good payoff that you really don't think you're going to get. You're prepared to not get it, just like Carrie is prepared to not get it. So we'll obviously go on order. But yeah, it's a good one. I'm so glad. That's a really great episode. I mean, I think that what I love rewatching it about that coffee shop scene, which is the birthday.

Is it the birthday scene? Wait, no, maybe it's not. It's earlier. No, it is. Yeah. Yeah, near the end. What I love is that we are all individually upset because she's upset, which I had forgotten about, you know, because you see that when I say like, this is a crazy idea, you guys,

but maybe we could be, you see that taken out of context, right? And you don't remember the bigger picture of why I go to that place. I mean, first of all, the whole episode is an examination of soulmates and whether that's real or very annoying something. Like Michael Patrick is a very funny line. We'll find it. But like super annoying like torture mechanism or whatever, something like that,

which I think is a really, really good question that I do think about a lot still, right? But I love that she's upset because of what she's gone through on her birthday. And it's like such kind of a big admission for her to say to us that it feels bad not to have a man who cares about you. Like she feels embarrassed by that feeling. but it's obviously so incredibly relatable and sweet. And then we're all upset.

And obviously we've missed her birthday dinner and, you know, all of that feeds into it, but we're upset that she's upset. And that's why I say that, which I had totally forgotten about. And it does work just so beautifully. It does. And also for where Charlotte's at,

because she thought Trey was her soulmate. And he's really kind of obviously not at this point, even though she hasn't totally given up. But then she's also just said that maybe she should keep looking. And I'm like, yes, yes, you should keep looking. God, thank God you know this. Like it's one of those surprising things. I don't remember all this, right, of the storyline, right?

That Charlotte really had to decide, am I still going to be hopeful? You know? Yeah. Even after this disappointment, though it's not totally over, but you can kind of tell that it's just not, like, it's just not working, you know? Whatever she tries doesn't work, right? It's sad. It's sad.

Trey is a little bit sad and disappointing. But it's good that Charlotte can go through that. still say maybe he's still out there, right? Like, that's pretty quick, too, in a really interesting way. But I think that's also, and I mean, this is obvious, but I'm going to say it anyway, because for me, I'm reliving this, right? I think it's because they don't have a great sex life. It's almost like she wasn't married.

Yeah. Because they're not really deeply connected, which I think is also why she can, like, go to his apartment and say, I have this list, and we've got to talk, and he tries to have sex with him. She's like, no, no, no, but things aren't worked out. Like, I'm so surprised by her. You know what I'm saying? Like, on the one hand, she's kind of innocent and slightly immature and he won't talk about it, right? But on the other hand, she's trying and she's going to stick to her guns.

But then she maybe isn't, but then he, you know, finishes whatever before they can start, which is, again, just so frustrating. She's like, yeah, I've got to go. You know what I mean? Like, it's kind of strong, I think. Yeah, absolutely. It's interesting. I just jumped all over.

But anyway, let's go to Carrie. So, oh my God, I totally forgotten about this whole, like, singles mailer. Yeah. And it's such a precursor of the apps. Yes. Right? I was thinking that too. What is it?

And I do think it's definitely like that we, last season, we had done the speed dating, which was a very real thing in New York. I mean, I remember all of our writers talking about it. And I was like, I'm definitely not going to go, but I want to hear all about it, right? It's such a fascinating way to meet somebody. It's bonkers. But the good thing about that is that at least you're in person. Yes.

So there's no pretending like the apps will, like that won't be current pictures or whatever. Like they're right there. And so at least you can feel a bit of a vibe, but then it's timed. So what do you actually know if they're interesting or not interesting, right? Yeah, yeah. And then the flyer that she gets, I mean, it's so funny. Like how would they know that she's single? It's so funny.

And then they like single her out, right? Like, dear single. It's so embarrassing and weird. But I also think it's so funny how when, And everyone's like, we're going to fill this out. You know, it's like when your friends try to force you to be on the apps. Yes, exactly. So much so.

I'll make your profile for you. Yeah, all of it. It's right there. The precursor early days, early days. But I love the conversation about the soulmates. I think it's so funny that Miranda thinks they don't exist. And then I also think it's so funny, of course, that, you know, Kerry thinks there's more than one, which is where I would come down, right?

And then Samantha's like, well, I have hundreds. and it's unattainable, which I think is great. And then I think it's so sweet. I did have a weird feeling when Samantha was suggesting the birthday party. I was like, I don't remember this, which of course now I know I don't remember it because we don't show up. But also I was like, wait, I don't think Samantha's the one who should be planning the birthday party. You know what I mean? Yeah?

Well, because I know she's in PR. I mean, it just seems like something's going to go awry. I don't know. I don't know. And also, because I didn't remember it happening. I guess, because obviously it doesn't happen, which one, now we know why. But also, I was just like, this is so unusual. It seemed like a role switch in a way.

Yeah, yeah. Like a caretaking Samantha. You know what I mean? Yes, I get you. But it was adorable how she talked her into it. Yeah. You know? And I did, you know, again, not to jump ahead to the dinner too much, but like I liked that it

wasn't like Samantha told everybody the wrong place. It was, they all had, they all affected by the... I did think it was that. I did think it was that. I remember thinking it was that too. Right. then Stanford does go to the wrong restaurant. He gets confused.

Which is adorable. Everyone else is somewhat affected by the traffic of the construction in different ways. But it was, if done off for the construction, it probably would have happened without Stanford. Well, the other thing is because she doesn't have her cell phone yet. Yes, and that's a very funny moment in the voicemail. Get a cell phone. Get a cell phone. Yes, and I think pretty soon she gets that little sparkly, Schwarowski crystal cell phone that she has through the end of the show, I think is coming quite soon.

But yeah, if you had had a cell phone, all of this would have been solved. It's like they say, what, 98% of Seinfeld plots would have been solved by cell phone. It's like one of the- I didn't never hear that, but that makes total sense. Yes. Oh, my God, the way life is changing. It's cuckoo crazy. So we're, we've got, you know, we've got Carrie. She's talked into a birthday party by Samantha.

Then it is kind of funny how Samantha says, oh, should I invite big? And she's like, no, what do you mean? He's still in London. Like, she's got her whole thing. But then she's sitting in her bed waiting for the clock to hit midnight when she picks up the phone and calls big. Very planned in her mind. Very adorable also. And also like that kind of thing where there has been time that's passed.

So it does feel kind of fresh, like not so emotionally heavy or whatever that she could reach out to him. But then also you do really feel. like she's so not over in any way. But she's fun, but she seems happyish, right? Like happy, like, you know what I mean? Like, not suffering. Yes, yes, exactly. Yes.

When I was watching her wait for the clock to strike midnight, I thought she was waiting because London is like, see, I was thinking Pacific time, right? It's like eight hours ahead. I was like, oh, she's waiting for it to be 8 a.m. When it's like a reasonable hour. And then I'm like, oh, no dummy.

She's waiting for it to be her birthday. Totally, totally. And it is kind of funny because she's so honest. Like it's my birthday because it's midnight. I mean, you've totally given your whole thing away there. But that's okay. That's okay. That's all right.

But I liked that. And I thought it was very winning. You know, like that's Carrie at her like kind of. I mean, I don't know if the internet would agree. But, you know, I like that part of Carrie where she's got a plan and she's going to execute it in a cute way. I mean. I do too. Yeah, good.

I don't know. The whole doorway memes. Like, I get that if you take them out of context and chop them up of her appearing at the doorway in different outfits or whatever, that it looks very needy. But it was over time and it was fun. I love all the memes that come out of Sex and City, but I also think that they hurt the show sometimes. Also the biggest movie to Paris thing. Yes. Like that.

Oh, my God. Constantly. And I'm like, oh, my God. It's not. I know. I mean, it's entertaining what people do with it. Right? Like, like, if you can separate it from the actual show, like the actual what we were doing, and just look at the creativity that people use with it. I like that. But it is like, like, sometimes the, they're trying to make Carrie seem like her most narcissistic or whatever, which isn't really fair. Right. Exactly. Right. Right. Right. Right. But that's okay. That's okay. I get it. I get it. It's a meme. It's fine. It's fine. It is what it is. You know, Roll doll.

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In the middle of the night, Saska awoke in a haze. Her husband, Mike, was on his laptop. What was on his screen would change Saskia's life forever. I said, I need you to tell me exactly what you're doing. And immediately, the mask came off. you're supposed to be safe. That's your home. That's your husband.

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I'm Clayton Eckerd, and in 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. Unfortunately, it didn't go according to plan. He became the first Bachelor to ever have his final rose rejected. The internet turned on him. If I could press a button and rewind it all I would. But what happened to Clayton after the show made even bigger headlines. It began as a one-night stand and ended in a courtroom with Clayton at the center of a very strange paternity scandal. The media is here.

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of lies. Listen to Love Trapped on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Quota is your host for the 26 IHart Podcast Awards, live at South by Southwest. Hello, is anybody there? Raised by a single mom, Ego may have a few father-related issues.

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Get to know Ego. Follow thanks dad with Ego Wodom and start listening on the free IHeart Radio app today. Hi, everybody. Let's do our Hyundai Hot Take for the Agony and the Ecstasy, episode 401. This one was a toughie, but I'm going to go with Carrie in the middle of Fifth Avenue, late at night on her birthday, dropping her birthday cake into the freshly repaved pavement that she has, also walked through while the guys who are the construction crew scream at her.

And then she goes the wrong way and then she goes back and then she drops the cake and then she tries to scoop the cake up and her purse is open but it doesn't spill. And her dress almost flashes the guys and then she's trying to pick up the cake with the cardboard. And it's just so classic. So Jessica, talent like talent on talent, on talent, physical talent, her vulnerability, but also being funny and so charming and funny and so real and oh, I just love it. And it's just Sarah Jessica at her best. And Michael Patrick writing for Sarah Jessica to do her best work. So celebrating

iconic moments, bold moves and unforgettable style just like Hyundai. So then we, I had fully forgotten about the fact that so with this repaving of fifth, Carrie walks into it with her birthday cake that she's had to buy at El Cantonori, which is a great restaurant that we all still love. And then she walks through the newly paved street. And these really mean, guys start yelling at her. I mean, look, I've been yelled at in many ways by many construction guys in New York. It is a thing. But, like, they get so into it.

What are you doing? I know. They go on and on and on. And then she goes and they're like, no, go the other way. And then she tries and then she drops the cake. and then she's trying to pick the cake up with the cardboard. Like, why? Leave the cake there.

Yeah. Like, it's such a mess, but it's such like Sarah Jessica's super talents are on display there. She's vulnerable. She's doing her incredible physical activity that she's just so great at. But also, she's funny somehow within all of that vulnerability and upset. Yes, yes. It's such a funny moment, but I was so sad for her at the same time. I was balancing those two emotions.

And then when she leans over to try and scoop the cake up, her purse is open. And I'm like, oh, no, her purse is going to like empty out. I know. And then at one point she has to like cover it. Like she's in like a weird squat just like cut. Like there's so many things going on. Yes. Oh my God.

And the funny thing is as an actor, you could have made that easier. But Sarah Jessica will never make it easier. She'll ask for more props. Like she's so skilled at it. And she knows that the way to do it well is to make it hard. And she can also always make it. match her actions, which is impressive, right? But that watching, I was like, the bag is open, the skirt is up, the heels are,

are they sinking into the street? Like, I was so concerned on so many levels. And then I was like, leave the cake, leave the cake. I'd forgotten all of this. And I think that should be a meme. I don't know if it is, but I think that should be a meme of like your day's gone horribly wrong, right? Your day has gone really horribly wrong.

And your birthday cake that you have alone as you're walking down the street is now in the newly paved Fifth Avenue. Before she leaves the, or before she's told she has to pay for the cake. When she's sitting in the restaurant, she thinks everyone's late. She hasn't been there that long. Thinks everyone's late.

And then they bring another cake out for somebody else. Horrible. That part got me because it's a very big cake. Huge. And they bring it to a table of two people. I saw that. But there's like 10 people bringing the cake. So it's like a surprise,

but where are all those people going to sit and eat? Yeah. I was confused. But it was, I think, this might have happened in Michael Patrick. I feel like there's an actual story that relates to this that they used. And we'll have to ask him when he comes back. Yeah, I do think there's a real story, which is just, of course, so sad. So sad to think about. I know. birthdays are so funny because you really like, you know, you get built up in such ways. I mean, I'm ancient, right? So I don't

really care about my birthday, but my kids really, really care. But we were supposed to have a call and I was picking up my own birthday cake. And it did make me laugh. I didn't remember this episode, but I was like, yes, I'm driving to pick up my own birthday cake so that my kids will be disappointed. I know, it's kind of silly.

But whatever makes it kids happy, it's good, right? Okay, so she's, I also love that the little thing she wears on her head. And then you know that she's getting really despondent when she takes that little velvet, whatever the heck you would call that off her head. Which also, I feel like it's been a while since Carrie's wearing a half. Like, I don't know why they gave up on the hats, but I love to see a hat come back because you know it makes her happy, right? And then she takes it off and she's just playing with the velvet thing. You know, she's just like, oh, I'm so despondent.

And I can't even wear my hat, which is sad. So then she gets home and there's 14 messages. And then we hear everyone's a different version of where they are and why they didn't make it. And for Stani, is at some, you know, Mexican restaurant or something? El cantonoro, I think is where he went. Really, really, really funny. I hadn't remembered any of that. But I did remember that then Charlotte, I have a key, and I let myself in, and she's in the shower, and her mascara is like majorly dramatically down her face.

I was like, wow, so impressive. And very sweetly, thank goodness, I come and convince her to come to the coffee shop. Thank God, right? This is the kind of friend we all need. Yes. Definitely. And we get down there, and this is when I say, maybe we can be each other's soulmates. And then we could let men be these great, nice guys to have fun with.

Good call, Charlotte. Thank goodness. A very deep insight on Charlotte's part. Yes. One of the iconic section of the entire show, Sex and the City, that is one of those moments. I know. And it's so funny because I thought we were on the stoop when I said it. Yeah.

I don't know what I thought. Like I get the different important things mixed up sometimes. You know, and I hadn't remembered that was in this context. But leading up to it, I was wondering, wait, Am I about to say it? I wasn't sure. But like Samantha's even upset. Like everyone's upset because Carrie's upset.

And because Carrie admits that it feels really bad not to have a guy who thinks she's special on her birthday, which is just kind of painful. But I want to be like, it's for it's okay, Carrie. So then we have this amazing, you know, kind of bonding situation at the coffee shop. And she's walking home in a different cape, I believe. We have two capes in this episode. It's pretty exciting, pretty exciting times. Walking home, and she looks pretty happy, which I was really happy about, right? Like, she's to the place of, like, yes, the day took twist and turns or whatever, but I'm happy, which is so great.

And that's when she sees Biggs car. And Biggs driver, Raoul, smoking his cigarette. And it is adorable. And I forgot the balloons come out. The balloons coming out first of the window. Yeah, it was great. It was really charming. And then at the end of the show, I think, we do a photo.

shoot with Ellen Bon Earnworth, where we had Sarah walking across the bridge. Maybe it was for the last season. She's walking across the Brooklyn Bridge with balloons. And I took pictures of it myself, like personal pictures. And I sent her one in a frame one time. Yeah. And I think they're red. And I had not remembered that there was a reason why or whatever.

You know? And it's a very, very charming scene. And you know how I have mixed feelings about big. But he was at his most charming. and kind of like adorably, like on the one hand sweet that he brought champagne and he brought balloons and he would kind of know what she would need, right? And on the other hand, she doesn't know how old he is because apparently he hasn't told her, which is interesting.

I was looking online and some people are saying that like he references it in an earlier episode. Like she does know. I guess he references it earlier. I don't know. Someone tell us. Yeah, yeah. I don't know. That's interesting.

I mean, remember how we don't know his whole name either until the end. But then you don't know if she knew, we just don't say it, right? Like there's mysteries about it, right? Which I think is good. I like that because this is TV. One of the things that I think about when I watch it back is like, you know, in the year 2001, like what was on regular television sitcoms. You know, not that there's anything wrong with them. They're hard to do, right?

But like Friends was on, you know, Seinfeld, I think was done by this point. Yeah. I want to say like... Gilmore Girls had just started. Yes, like everybody loves Raymond. Like things like that were on, right? So this was very, very, very different. Yes.

You know, very, very different. And I think important, like on television, they wanted you to explain things. And I think what was nice is that our writers had the nerve, you know, the strength to be like, we're not going to explain that. And we're not going to explain these people's parents. And we're not going to show where they came from.

We're not going to talk about it. We're not going to tell you how old big is. And so many different things. Yes. Right? And that's one of many reasons I love this show. And like, and sopranos is the same thing.

They give, they treat the audience with respect and like the audience are intelligent people that can think about what's happening. Yep. You don't need to be like, spoon feeding. The ham fisted exposition just kills me in movies and television drives me crazy. I agree.

And, and this is just so nice to be like. I agree. But I do think, too, if you think about it, I think, like, yes, streaming has upended our business, but also allowed so many more shows like that to exist, you know? Yes. Because people are going to find their show that they like, right?

So, like, you can, like, I haven't, Pluribus seemed really upsetting to me, so I didn't continue watching it, but, like, they just throw you right in. Yeah. There's no explanation. You're just like, okay, we're in a lab. There's a pandemic. I don't know what's happening. Right?

Like, I mean, yeah, I like that. That's bold and brave. It was too anxiety provoking for me to get through. But that's me. That's on me, not on them, right? You know what I mean? But I think that actress is great. But I love to look back and I am reminded of the time so much when I'm looking at it because New York looks so different and so charming and small in a weird way, right? And also I technically know how many years ago it was because obviously I'm alive then and I'm alive now, right? But on the other hand, it's timeless. And it's timeless, I think, because we didn't do all those things. you know, because we didn't overly explain. We didn't, like, there's still things that, like, that she doesn't have a cell phone. There's things that tell us that it was the year 2001, but not overly so. Yes.

Yeah. Absolutely. It's interesting. It's interesting to look at. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, so we're, we're, what, what were your thoughts about Carrie here when she's talking about soulmates? You, you that are happily married and have found your soulmate.

What do you think about this conversation? I'm in the camp that there are, there, you can have multiple soulmates. mates. I don't think everyone just has one. Me too. Because I always think it's funny to think like, isn't that crazy that there's one person that was meant for you and they went to your college? You know? Absolutely.

It just seems crazy to me. Absolutely. But I do believe in you know, when I got married, we had a friend of ours read that, I'm trying to remember the name of it. There's like a Greek story about the God split. Man was too powerful and they split him into two.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then they spend the eternity looking for your other half. So I like the idea of a soulmate. I do think you can have more than one. And I think that when you, I think it's abundantly clear to one when you meet that person that unlocks that part of you. Oh.

I mean, that's how I feel. That's nice. I can only speak for my own experience. That is so nice. Hmm. Gosh. That's interesting to think about. That's well put.

I think that's really nice. And I think that's really incredible that you feel that way. I'm very lucky, though. You're very lucky for sure. I mean, it's interesting because I know when I was younger, when I was younger, though, I was kind of cynical about relationships, which I know is weird because I play Charlotte, right? But I was like, I'm never getting married.

I'm never doing this. I'm never doing that. Because, I don't know, I just felt like there was so much pressure on everybody. Yes. I didn't want to like do that, right? And I didn't like the idea that you would be with someone because you felt like you should. I felt like you should want to be with that person.

That person should want to be with you. Not because like you're going to fit into some traditional convention, you know. Yeah. But I do think, I don't know if I really believed in soulmates. I'm not sure that I did. Like I don't know that I've ever said like I met. person and they unlocked. I don't know that I've ever felt that way, which is interesting. I've definitely felt passionately, passionately in love. But I mean, I'm pretty much unlocked. You know what I'm

saying? Like I'm an open, open, open person. But then you can find that person that gets you in a really unique way, which is powerful. Very much so. Like when they understand you, but that doesn't really mean it's going to work out, you know, which is always my thing that I come back to. But I'm really happy for you that I'm happy for everyone else that is working out for. And the only thing I want to say is that I hope that it, like I do feel, and this is now from, you know, being older, like my friends who are in relationships that I admire long-term, you know, marriages and whatnot, it takes work. Yeah. You know, like it might have been so magical and amazing and easy in the beginning, but like at a certain point that's not going to be how it is. Exactly. Right. And then like, do you love that person

care about your relationship enough that you're going to work on it. And that has to be true for both people. And this might be kind of out there, but Donahue, Phil Donahue, and his wife wrote a book about Marlo Thomas. Marl Thomas, yes, who was mentioned in this episode. Look at that. Wheels Within Wheels. They wrote a book about their long marriage, and they bring up the, there's like a stat that I don't even know if this is true or not, but that all of your cells and your body regenerate, after seven years, you're biologically a completely different person. So like they were saying like every seven years we do like a major check in with each other. Wow.

How have we changed? How have we grown? That's so cool. I think about that all the time. That's impressive. Yeah. See, that's amazing. That's very amazing.

And I think that those kinds of things are the things that we should be holding up in culture to say like, oh, look, this is what it takes. Yes. Right? Like you can't just coast. Exactly. You know, you have to think about like whatever. am I doing here? Have I grown? Have I not grown? Could I grow more? Should I ask my partner what they think?

You know, like different things like that. And that's for men and women, everybody, right? Yep. It's interesting to think about. Anyway, enough about that. But I do think, I do think that people really do torture themselves over this idea of soulmates. Absolutely. That it can be a harmful ideal that you're somehow trying to live up to or whatever. I don't even know. You know, like, that someone, something's going to be like, you know, that's your soul made, you know,

like. Yeah, I know, I always think about people that meet someone and their, everything is perfect, but then there's like one,

like, like, there's one glaring issue or something. And they're like, oh, this is, is this person my soul made? If they were,

they wouldn't have this part of them. But see, but, but see, this issue with this is what's ever going to be perfect, perfect,

right? See, like, that's where I get hung up. Yeah. Because in me, but this is my whole problem, it's like, I think I can work with anything, right? I'm like, that's okay.

I can deal with that crazy thing. And I can deal with that crazy thing because the vibe is so good. No, that's a terrible idea, you guys. Terrible idea. This is why I'm single. Well, it's one of the reasons I'm single. I have, like, so much room for everybody's stuff. It's bad.

It's bad. Don't have too much room. Yes. I mean, that's one thing I like about Charlotte, and I did just see something the other day on, Instagram because everyone's always, well not everyone, but like people on my feed because obviously I do this podcast. Someone was talking about how Charlotte knew what she wanted and she held onto her standards, but she wasn't afraid to try, right? So she dated so many people. Yes. And was like,

you know, she'd get upset like, oh, this one wants me to do this and I don't know if I should. And then this one wants to do this. I don't know if I should. And, you know, there was all that. But then also pretty quick, she'd be like, yeah, no, I'm not going to do that. You know what I mean? Pretty quickly without being particularly crushed. Like, I don't think that Charlotte was like, it's me. Yeah. It's me. I'm the problem.

She wasn't really doing that, which I think is impressive. Very much so. Right? But I didn't really, I don't know that I realized that at the time, like the strength of her. You know? Yeah. It's good. It's good.

I like it. Looking back. It's very interesting. And then also, like, we're talking about, like, we'll get to the tray of it all. But, you know, the fact that she's intact, she's got. gotten the thing, she's gotten married. It's not going great. And is she going to torture herself?

No. It's kind of amazing. You think she'd be home just sobbing. Yes. No, she's very open to being separated and potentially she's the one who says. When we go back to the city, we should take time off because he's just playing that tennis and he won't talk to her.

You know, it's interesting. No, Charlotte's super fascinating. I think all of the characters are super fascinating. I mean, that's the other thing I think when I look back, especially on like really meaty episodes, like these two that we start the fourth season with, all the characters are fascinating. Yes. I mean, it's really good writing. It's incredible. They're so multidimensional.

There's so many different parts of them that everyone can relate to. And somehow, somehow we let it breathe. Like, we don't have enough time. Like, when you think about everything that happens in each episodes and they're not that long, but there's, breath in it. There's like time for you to kind of be with them. It's interesting. I don't know how we did it. It's hard to do. But okay, let's move on from Carrie to poor Charlotte. Poor Charlotte. Oh my gosh. She's at that party, man. She talks that woman's ear off because the person says, where's your husband? It would make me laugh in a way, though. It was, I love that moment.

You did? Yes. It's like, I feel bad for Charlotte, but it's, It's so funny and it's like delivered so well. Thank you. And I just, I love the two women. Like, don't talk to her. Don't talk to her.

I know. And then poor Charlotte. But it's interesting because like I would be like really devastated if I heard someone say that. Charlotte's just kind of like, oh. And then she, you could see the wheels turning. And then she's like,

oh, I need to go to Trays and I've got my list. Right? And I'm wearing this dress that I remember there being. That was what I was going to say earlier. I'm not sure if I spit it out. Because I go to the party. Then I go to Trays. Then we end up.

having this like weird, you know, makeout session in the hallway, right? And there's a lot of stress about what that dress would be. And it ends up, I think it's Blue Marine as the brand is like this little Pocodot. You know, Pocodot's very Charlotte. It's navy. But there's a lot of stress, like, was it dressing enough for the party? Was it? Like, it was a lot of one of those outfits.

And because I wear it like the whole episode almost, you know, until the end, Carrie's birthday. And I think I have it hang in my closet, because it's very wearable. You know, though, in reality. in reality, I can't really wear polka dots because they're so Charlotte, like unless I want to be, unless I'm, you know,

like at a worky kind of a thing. Yeah, yeah. Like if you go to Starbucks, like that, it's like, Charlotte's here. Yeah, you would not. I would not. And they're also kind of fancy, right? So it's not my Starbucks where,

but I do think I have that one hanging because I did really like it. But when I go to Trays and I'm banging on the door, I didn't remember what happened. I was really hoping we were going to have some good sex. Yeah. But no. No.

So sad. So I think back to, Kyle said like, oh, I, you know, when they pitch me the character, it's like, oh, he's a doctor. Like, you know, he tells that story. And then, oh, and then you find out he's impotent or whatever, like the high and then the low. And I was thinking about this moment because you're banging on the door. He comes down the hall. He's got his robe up and he looks great.

Like, he's got abs. I'm like, oh, my God, Kyle. He's looking. And then it ends with him prematurely. So sad. So incredibly sad, right? Charlotte, may I get you a hanky? I know. I know. And then I just look at him. Like, no.

And there's some voiceover about how he always has good manners. It's really tragic. It is. And if I were Charlotte, I would be way more upset. But it's good that she's not, right? It's good that she's just like, well, I tried it and it didn't work. Or maybe I should still try. But also it's so cute that she's got her list.

You know, like she's trying. She's trying. I can't, we can't talk about my list if you have a boner. I think that was a close. Yes, that's definitely, definitely what she said. It's like high school, but that's okay. You know what I mean? Like it's funny in a way, like the innocence,

but then also they just don't have the skills. Yes. You know? And he doesn't really want to talk. And she's trying to say like, but, you know, is it because we're not married and because I'm unattainable? And he's just like, I don't know. You know, he's like, oh, he is.

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He's incredible. I really 100% thought that Samantha was going to seduce Friar fuck, as she calls him. But I apparently know. No. He maintains his vows. Which is impressive, okay? And I really like this change. Like to see Samantha really going after it.

You don't know what I'm saying? Like shifting our game, depending on that he hasn't really like succeeded yet. You know, he hasn't bitten yet. Yeah. Right? And she changes it up and she goes and she takes the canned goods. And I mean,

he's just so beautiful, you know, to look at that you totally get. And I think the unobtainable thing is also part of it for her, right? And he's got his, you know, beautiful brown friar outfit on her. Your robe, I guess, right? It's all very, very likable. And it was so interesting that he doesn't compromise at all. I liked it very much. Yeah, that was kind of like Mandela effect for me.

I really could have swore. If you hooked me up to a lie detector, I watched this episode a year ago. I would have been like, oh, yeah, they have sex. Like, definitely. Right? I know, because I just don't think. we're ever used to Samantha not succeeding. You know what I mean?

It just doesn't really happen. And also like, Costas is just so sexy. Also that you, that's part of it, I think, is that you kind of, it's like tangible. And I think that's her,

that Samantha's feeling, you know, also. So she thinks she's going to succeed and that's why she goes home a masturbates for two and a half hours or whatever she says, which is hysterical. But yeah,

she doesn't, which is really nuts. And I did have part of me where I was wondering, like, did we ever have an alternate ending? Like, was this always the way? I'm not sure. Interesting. Yeah, we have to ask Michael Patrick and or Costas Mandelor.

So, Costas, if you can hear us, please, please come on. He's out in the world working somewhere. I don't know. We're trying to find him because he's great. And wait, were you telling me that what is his other thing? I knew him already, but I can't remember how. But I knew him already before he was on the show. But I can't remember why or how.

He's in two of the Saw movies. Not three. Wait, he's not the killer. Well, what? I've never seen a saw movie. He is a detective in Saw 4, 5, and I believe 6. He's a detective.

He's a detective, but the detective gets seduced by the power this killer has. No. Yes. I'm sorry, everyone, if I'm spoiling Saw 4 for you. Wow. He's in multiple Saw movies. I didn't know this. This is interesting.

Because the jigsaw killer in saw hunts down people that don't appreciate the life they've been given. Oh. And then he puts them in these traps and like how far will you go to live? Like, you know, you have to dig a, there's a lock around you and the key is behind your eyeball and you have to dig your eyeball and get the key. That's horrible. And so, Kossis plays a detective who sees it as a way to like extract justice on people that the system has like, oh, this person, killed a child and got away with it. Oh, okay, bad guys.

Yeah, I'm going to put him in a trap now. I get it. I get it. Yeah. It's gruesome. That's interesting. But I remember so vividly watching Saw and going, that's Friar. Oh, well, that's why we need to talk to Costas. Like, what was it like to play Friar Fuck and then have people talk to you? I mean, because that is a really different role on our show.

It's so different. Very different. He can be such a tough brooding guy in the Saw movies and they, And he's this, like, sexy, cool man of God in Sex and the City. I mean, he was on something. Because during the 90s, when I was trying to work, I came across so many people, right? Like so, so, so many people. And I definitely knew Kostis.

And I just can't remember. He was on Picket Fences. Oh, Pickett Fences was a great show. But I wasn't on Picket Fences. I just, I don't know where I met him, but I met him somehow. I knew him so nice, super nice guy. So I'm happy that he's out there working somewhere. I need an update.

Costas, please come on and give us an update. Yeah, it is pretty funny when Samantha goes and talks to us about how she masturbated for two and a half hours or whatever. And then everyone has to discuss who they masturbate to. And the Russell Crow moment. What did you think of that? I wrote, I was taking notes last night. I wrote down Russell Crow. L-O-L is what I wrote.

I love these moments where you're like, oh, yeah, he was like one of the, they also say George Clooney. Of course. Of course. You know, Russell Crow is like, oh, he's. I know. Was this, had Gladiator come out? I think it's Gladiator time. We should check.

When did Gladiator the first Gladiator come out? I feel like it was 2000, maybe. I mean, because, yeah, this is 2001. It would have made sense. We used to see a lot of Russell Crow, too, in the awards and whatnot. One time I was on a talk show when he was there, it might have been Conan. He was very nice to us. His ex-wife loved the show, so he was always very complimentary.

And there's other stories, but I've really, shouldn't tell. But very nice, very, very nice, very nice, very nice, very nice, very nice, very interesting, man, very interesting, man. Very interesting. Yes, Hannah doesn't have anything to say. Wendy Gladiator, come up. 3,000. You were right. Very good. Very good. Easton. Thank you. Easton knows everything you guys. I do remember that there was some discussion about who we should say. Really? Yeah. I think there was another time where we had to say somebody and there was a discussion also to make sure that we were all cool and we were kind of all putting in our two

cents or whatever, you know? Yeah. It's interesting though, because Charlotte doesn't say anything about Russell Crowe. No. She has one person in mind. I know. It's sad. I really, I just want to point out really quick. I love the sweater you're wearing at that scene at that lunch. It's like a pink. Oh, it's bright. Yeah, what the heck was it? Yeah. You're so funny. I told you I wore a sweater for you today because I knew I was talking to you because I do think of you when I picked my sweater. wetters. I was wondering to myself, what the heck am I wearing? It is the most thickest, like, pink chunk of wool or whatever, cashmere. I don't know what it is. I don't own it. I was wondering, because usually Pat would put me in, like, super tight things, you know.

But I think that was a coffee shop. And sometimes if you have a coffee shop and you don't have a scene before it or right after it, that's the only time you'll wear it. So it's more about the pop of color in the mix, because you have to think about how everyone's outfits go together. which is a whole situation, obviously. And other people might have scenes before or after, right? So if I was only at the coffee shop, then it would only matter that I had a bright color on. But to me, you know what I was thinking when I saw?

At first I was thinking, what the heck am I wearing? Then I was like, that's very, very chunky. Then I thought to myself, this is confusing because is that pink, a pink that a winter would wear? Because there's a lot of debate in my own head and also on Instagram about whether I'm a winter or like an autumn, I want to say. I'm very confused.

I'm very confused. And when I get dressed to come on the podcast, I'm like, I don't know what color I wear because, see, I used to think I was a winter. Like my whole life, I thought I was a winter

and I could wear solid white, but then they're telling me, no, no, don't wear solid white. But then I'm supposed to wear not solid white, but I don't think it looks great. What do you think? These are the pressing questions. It's so, I'm really,

I mean, the whole winter, autumn, summer thing, It's, it's, it is challenging. Isn't it? I, I think this pink looked great on you. Okay. The sweater you have on also looks great on you. I'm not washed out.

No, no, not at all. Okay, okay. I think if you've been wearing like, like I'm wearing a white shirt. Right. And it looks good. You might be a winter. Or maybe in autumn. I don't know.

There are people that do these analysis. That's their job. Yes. Yeah. We should get you to one of those people. Well, they have done a thing on me. This is why I'm confused, right? They have done a little video.

saved it so that I could reference it. Do you know what I mean? Pat field, I don't think that Pat and Molly ascribed to this. Okay. And I talked to my stylist Samantha McMillan also. And she said that she thinks it's interesting, but that sometimes they're wrong, which I also do agree with, because sometimes they'll do people like from an award show and they'll have what they wore and then they'll color it a different color that they think

would be better for them. And they'll be like, see, isn't that better? And you're like, no, it's not better. Like, no, right? Like, they don't generally like black. Only winter should wear black. And I really think I'm a winter. And if you are going to tell me that I cannot wear black,

I may ignore you. You know what I'm saying? Like, you can't take our black from us. Like, it's just wrong, you know? Yeah. Like, it's upsetting. But when we get into the other colors, I am open, right? So, like, sometimes with the podcast, I try different colors,

but because we have our beautiful lights on us and everything, I'm not sure that it's the best way to tell, I've been trying some fall colors lately because this one woman did like, oh, Kristen Davis. And they said Kristen Davis can pull off a lot of colors and she can dip into winter. I don't know what she said, but she basically said that I should not wear silver and I should not wear black and I should not wear white. I was just like, what? Silver, I guess I get. Black looks so good on you though.

Thank you so much, you're saying. Especially thinking back to there's so many great Charlotte black dress moments. I know. I know, but this is the other thing that I will say, and then we can get off this topic. So I'm not sure if people care about this or not. But it does, it does. My problem is that once it gets in your head, then when you look at things, you're like, oh, no, is this my color or not?

Like, it's stressful, right? Yes. Whereas you would just normally just pick what you felt like wearing, you know? And I do have many colors. Like, in terms of the sweaters to wear it to the podcast, I've got a many a sweater because I'm always cold, right? So it's really like a conundrum. But basically, some of those black dresses that I have are very open net, right?

So it's not right up by my face. And I might be tan because we usually film all summer. And even though obviously you're supposed to wear your sunscreen and not get tan, I would eventually get tan. And I don't know that that's the best way to judge, right? Now, to me, I love black. And I'm always going to wear black. I don't really care who tells me not to, right? My bigger question is like white, off white, I don't know, right?

And then like the other, like, dusty colors? or no or the bright pink. Like you're saying you like this bright pink. Right? It's interesting. I don't know. But I also, I'm just so curious, if anyone wants to tell me, if this makes it into our podcast,

do you guys believe in the color seasons? What do you think? Please let me know because I'm super curious. All right. Let's talk about Miranda. Oh, Miranda's just adorable. Just adorable. She kind of doesn't have like a pressing, pressing storyline here.

but yet I really loved it because she's at the party where we're all single and she starts telling jokes not that unlike what Charlotte does though I guess Charlotte's not even trying to be funny she's just rambling right but Miranda tries to tell jokes

and Carrie's like oh and then they go out on the street and Carrie's like what was that and she says well I'm just trying to avoid the pity party and then Carrie calls her Shecky which I don't know if people know that this like a Shecky Green was like a vaudeville comedian right probably a reference people aren't going to get, but she calls her Shecky, which is adorable.

And then later on, Miranda runs into this other lady on the street who, you know, also just so blatantly like, are you dating anyone? And I mean, it seems funny when you see it in the show, but people are like this. Yeah. I mean, it's kind of unfair in a way. You know, it's also like when people go like, well, what do you do? You know, like the other day I took Gemma somewhere. She's 14 years old, but she doesn't, she looks older, right?

And some stranger was like, you know, what do you want to start? in college and she was like, uh, and then she was like brain biology, which was so cute, but you know, that pressure of like having to explain yourself on the spot and like these kind of big questions, you know? Yeah, I always was, because that's the way I see in TV a lot. Like, oh, you've seen anybody? And like I've never once asked someone that because I feel like it's very personal. I agree.

Something, this is embarrassing. Something I learned I should not be doing because it went poorly for me was I was hanging out with a friend I hadn't seen in a long time. and he had brought his girlfriend. They'd been dating for about, I think, a year. Right. We're hanging out, there's the three of us. And then I go, so, do I hear wedding bells?

No. I thought it would be a fun, cute thing. And it went so. You're so funny. It went so poorly. Who would matter? Her or him? I could tell immediately this is a topic of contention between them.

And he was like, not quite yet. You know, we're just kind of getting, you know, just figuring. And I was like, oh, man. And I told my wife that and she's like, you should not say that. No, no, no. It's also just like don't ask people where in there having children. Yes, exactly. Which is what happens in the show, which I thought was so great.

So the woman who asked Miranda, well, are you dating anyone? Miranda says, well, what about you and Joe or whatever's name is? You've been married for what? And she goes, oh, five years. I'm sure you're going to ask me where the children are. And then Miranda has this moment of like, oh, everyone's got their thing. And I'm going to laugh because I'm going to be kind, which is so nice. because everyone's got their insecurities

about what your expectations are and they're just trying to get in front of that and like do a song and dance if that's what they've got to do, you know what I mean? Because it's just a lot of pressure to have to explain yourself all the time. Yes, it is.

The part where Carrie, when she and Carrie on the street and Carrie's like, so what was that about? I thought that was weird of Carrie to react that way. Oh, really? Because I, during that moment when Miranda's telling her, she was so funny. Right.

And so charming. And I was like, oh my God, I want to be in this conversation. I want to be at this party. Definitely. And we do all kind of do that a fair amount. I did think that as well. But I also did think about the fact that Miranda is sometimes just like painfully honest, right? Like she doesn't always care about other people's feelings.

That's true. And that's what I thought was different in a way. because like if you think about how Miranda is with just the friends is different than how Miranda is with like strangers or not that the people at the party were strangers but like they're not the girls right so like she's one way with us where she just tells her things or like when when we're all talking about the soulmates

and she's just sitting there you know like you just have to look at her face you don't even have to hear her say anything you know what she's going to say she's just like ah yeah and she because she's freely just going to say her truth right So I think that's what it partly is, but I do know what you're saying in that like Carrie does clock it in kind of a big way. Yeah. But I think that's really Miranda's only storyline.

So that's why that's happening. Do you mean? Right. That makes sense. Right, right, right. Because I did kind of go like what's going on here. But I also think that I think that important thing. And of course, this is because of my own singleness, right?

It's so amazing what we're saying about being single and the expectations that you're not going to be single and the pressure that everyone, everywhere puts on everyone because of society's expectations, right? And this is a million hundred years ago. And I do think, I don't know for sure if Evie was here we'd ask her, I do think that there's less pressure now. Like someone was telling me, oh, Mary Beth. Remember when Mary Beth came on? She was like, I keep telling everyone about how I want a boyfriend and they keep telling me I'm crazy. I was like, good for them. And she was like, no, but I want a boyfriend.

Like for the young people now, at least some of them, the expectation is that you won't be doing that, right? That you're going to be out and with your friends and having fun and pursuing whatever you're pursuing in your job or whatever, I guess. Which is also interesting. And then there's the whole like being embarrassed to have a boyfriend thing that went on this past year, which was super fascinating. Like if a woman was on, at least on social media, like it was definitely a social media-centered conversation, right? Like if you were showcasing the boyfriend, that that was kind of almost like a lesser-than position.

You know what I mean? Like giving away your power, I guess. Which is super, super interesting. Very much so. But I do feel in my own life, and of course this could just be because I'm so used to this for like ever, right? I do feel like the assumption is why, like, why are they single? Like, what is going on that they would be single, right?

Like there's a weird question mark over your head if you're single, which is so stressful. Yeah. I don't like it. Me either. No, I don't like it. You know, Roaldol, the writer who thought up Willie Wonka, Matilda, and the BFG. But did you know he was also a spy? Was this before he wrote his stories?

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and start listening on the free IHeart Radio app today. I did like this moment with this other person who starts talking about, the Instagram is about not having children because my wife, like we have decided we're not going to have children, my wife and I. Do you tell people this?

Like if you're at a dinner party or something, do you talk about it? If they ask us, yeah. Like we don't hide it. But then it also is, it's awkward because, you know, do people try to convince you otherwise? They do.

Yeah. They do. And they keep saying like, oh, you would change your mind after it happens. Right. And, you know, and then it goes. But that doesn't make sense.

No. That's not the way we should be going about this. You should have your total freedom. Not to be having children. I think it's very, very respectable. Sure what I'm saying? Like more people in some ways should be choosing this. Yeah.

I mean, that's kind of where I'm at. And it's hard to, because I also don't drink. And I kind of run into this too when I talk about that. Like if people ask you about that and you say, oh, I'm not going to have kids or I'm not, I don't drink, then they sometimes they interpret that as like, oh, well, you're not going to like me because I have children or I drink. Sure, sure. They might. That's true. And so it's, it's a really awkward thing sometimes.

But it's like everyone's living their own life. 100%. But also, I mean, this is what's so interesting too about people, right? like that you, you know, if you choose something slightly different, right, like just slightly different. Like it's not that. Like there's a lot of people who don't drink. You know, you realize this as you go through life, not drinking, right? But it's not the norm, you know?

So like if you're in an event or whatever, like most people are there drinking, you know, that's just how it is. That's what they do. That's what they like to do. More power to them, right? That's just not me and that's not you. But then, so that, so one thing is kind of interesting. interesting, right? Like, they might go like, oh, that's interesting. Like, you can tell on their face how they are going to feel. But then if they hear two, they're just like, oh, what? Do you mean? Like, oh, now for me, I go, that's super doubly interesting. Let's hear about this. Or maybe let's just think that's an interesting guy. Because then, like, do you have to explain yourself? Because that's also awkward, right? Like, having to go into it. Do you know what I mean? Awkward. Like, you shouldn't have to do that. But then also, I think that's really interesting. And I think it's interesting also that people wouldn't automatically think, well, that's

an interesting person. True what I mean. Yeah. I'm with you 100%. Right. I think that social norms are fascinating. And I think that they change very slowly. Right?

So like we might hope that they're changing or think maybe because of social media that they're changing. But they really just change really, really slowly. But like, you remember when you were talking to Jenny Bix and she was saying when she wrote the episode about Miranda buying her apartment, that that was based on Jenny's story. And I was saying, look, I've gone through this myself. where like you're just having to check boxes.

Like even with my kids who are in school, you know, I'm a single parent, right? All of the school forms are two parents. And they get very upset if both people don't sign because they don't want a divorce couple, for instance, to somehow leave out the other divorced person, right? But you have to like jump through hoops

if you're a single parent to be like, no, no, I am the only responsible person. Like it's just so not the default, right? Anything that's not the default is like, ah, exactly. It's a whole drama. And they don't ever think about you because you're not the norm, right? You're the exception to the norm.

But it's very interesting and somewhat, you know, annoying. But then like with Jenny talking about the single women buying houses now, that's the single biggest group of house buyers, single women. So that's 25 years, but yay. Yep. Right? It took 25 years, but yay. And then also I think the marriage, you know, like when we did that Time magazine cover,

which would have been like 2001 or two or something like that, maybe three or four, I don't know, but early 2000s, who needs a husband? That was like shocking, right? That's why they put it on the cover, right? But now, you know, the rates of, first of all, divorced women who don't remarried, which I love so much, super interesting,

but then also just people waiting to get married, you know, women not marrying. Like, there's many, many options now that are much more prevalently happening, which is great. Because everyone should get to choose. Exactly. We should take the pressure off.

We've come a long way. We still have a lot more track ahead of us. But I'm, yeah, when you think about in the 25 years, how we look at those things, it's incredible. I know. It is incredible. It is interesting because sometimes you feel like if you're in one of those moments, like, where you're having to fill out the forums or when someone's like, what do you mean? You don't want to have children. Like people really do have their own.

Like it's their, it says more about them than it does about you, right? But like they get panicked, like confronted. you know what I mean, with something different, right? And it says, like, in their mind, you can see, like, what does this say about my choices? Yeah, yeah. Right? But when you're in those moments, you do feel like nothing's ever changing.

You're like, oh, my God, it's exhausting. But I do think things are changing slowly, right? Yeah. Yeah. It is interesting, though. But I love, that's what I love, I love when it's rare that all characters in the show are single, and I do love it.

I mean, it makes sense that it doesn't last forever because also that would be weird also, right? And you do want people to try things out. But I love that we start this season with everyone, you know, pretty much single. I mean, Charlotte's still not totally unhooked from Trey. And obviously, Carrie emotionally is not unhooked from big. But Miranda seems to not even be remotely thinking about Steve, which is interesting because we know it's going to happen.

And of course, Samantha's free because that's how she always is. But I liked it. I liked it. And it made me think like this is why the show is so unique. You know, and that it can talk about this stuff. Like when Carrie says to Miranda, we were the only people in there who were single. I mean, yeah.

Yeah. It's interesting. I just want to shout out Yule Vasquez. He plays the agent that Samantha is talking to at the party. Yeah. And he's like, just kind of being like typical, like, you know, like 90s, like agent. Yeah.

So he and Sarah Jessica were in a show together. I know he looked familiar. He was called divorce. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He was in divorce. Yes, he was. Oh my gosh. I recognized him from Seinfeld.

No way. Yes. Who did he play on Seinfeld? He shows up in three or four episodes, but there's these two characters that are, they're these very fabulous gay men, but they're described as street tufts. Like they're like kind of like, like they, there's a part where Kramer is supposed to be watching Elaine's Armour on the street. Oh, yeah.

Remember this. Yeah. And then they also, they do the AIDS walk and Kramer won't wear the ribbon. Oh my God. You're not going to wear the ribbon. This guy won't wear the ribbon. Oh, my God. He was one of those guys.

That's really funny. I knew he looked so familiar, but I couldn't think of who he was. He's got these great eyebrows. Yeah, yeah. They're impressive. Definitely, definitely. I also thought, like, has he been on the show before? That was what went through my head because he looked so familiar.

That's interesting. Also, I was like, oh, my God, I'm so scared. Like, that kind of aggressive agent. I'm just like, oh, Lord, oh, Lord, no. Oh, Lord, no. I also thought he was going to be like a finance bro, but no, he was an agent. He was a TV agent. I fucking love it. That guy, right? That was funny. That was really funny.

Yeah, sometimes when we have our little party scenes, there are people that I'm like, I know that person, I know that person, I don't know how I know them, you know? Yeah, it's a great showcase for the character actors to come on and do this stuff. Definitely. And also, sometimes there are people that we just know from the peripheral world of New York, which is fun. All right, the agony and the ecstasy. I feel like there's things we missed. But wait, do we fully discuss the end scene? So basically, remind me how it ends with Big. So he's there. He's likable. He's come to deliver her birthday balloons and champagne. They have a very sweet time. But then she just gets out of the car, right? Yes. And that is

something I love about this, is that he doesn't have, he's not like, come on, Carrie, let's go out, let's go out dancing or something. No, no, he's just coming by to celebrate her birthday, give her champagne, give her balloons, and then be gone. Oh, he wants to do to celebrate her. Which is nice. No expectations for her. Yeah. And I just think after the night she's had, it was such a great little moment.

And also, we haven't seen him in a while, right? Like, I can't remember when we last saw him. It was a while. Yeah. Is it when they fell in the pond, in the park? I think so. I think so, too. Oh, that's good.

That's very good. That's very good. Because, yeah, he's going to move to London at all right at that time. But I also love when he asks. her in the car, did you have a good day? And she says, yes. That was so great. So I was like, see, that's maturity. No one ever talks about Carrie's maturity. But look, there's a mature moment. You know, she had a great day because she went through all the different things and then she ended up with her friends. And then she was content walking down the street. And then here he was a surprise,

just like it should be, you know? Exactly. Like just a cherry on top. It was interesting, though, because in the sound, you know, voiceover, doesn't she say something? about like calling back to Charlotte saying then they can just be nice guys that we have fun with. And I'm like, well, that's not a good description of big. But okay. I mean, he was nice in that car scene. But you know what I mean?

That's not. I wouldn't think of him in that category. But that's okay. That's okay. That's me nitpicking. But I did think like just as a beginning of a season, how incredible. Like Michael Patrick King.

Oh my God. It's a grand slam right out of the gates from season four. And I tried to figure out if this is when he wins his first individual Emmy, but I don't think it is. But I do think I need to figure out better because we win our Emmy for the show in September of 2001 because it was the Emmys that we called the semi-emies because they didn't happen on time because we had declared war in Iraq. Oh, yeah.

And we felt like that would be weird to have the award show. And then when we had it, only Kim and I are there to get it. So it's just Kim and I holding the Emmy together. No one else is there because we were, I think she was living in L.A. I think she was living in L.A. So both she and I are there. I don't know if Michael Patrick's there. He's not in the pictures with us for some reason, which would imply he wasn't there.

But if we won in two, that would mean we did win for season three, which aired in 2000, because there's always a little delay. You know what I mean? Like you qualify the season before, right? But amazing that this is the season that we come on with, you know, in the season that we're going to win. And I also think in my mind, that's why season three and season four are mashed together. Because I also think we made so many.

And I think that this is when, like the show in general, it was almost a year-round job, right? Because we had the golden globes and the winner. We had the this, we had the that. There was this event. There was that event. I mean, maybe it really wasn't, but in my mind, and I think I might have, maybe this is when I went to Canada and worked with Rob Lowe. I can't remember. But like you would do things in between, right? But I can't remember what it would have been. Like you were trying to get little jobs in between that you would, you know, could do, make extra money or whatever and, you know, hopefully have some fun. But then you just had like, you know, the Golden Globes or like there were just big things that you were just living the whole year. Based on that. There's always something going on.

Yeah, which was so much fun and so great. So, so, so great. But I think that's why the whole, like, the season, three, season four in my mind are one. You know? Yeah. There's not really a break. But a glorious season, a very long and glorious season. But quite amazing to look back and realize that this is Michael Patrick really coming into,

to his own in terms of, like, directing, writing, both of them. It's pretty major. And he's so incredibly talented that he can do that. that and do it well. I mean, he's just, he's one of the brilliant minds of television. I know it. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I can't wait for the comeback. Yeah. It's going to be super interesting. Also, we got to get them back on the pod. We got to get him back over here. We have many questions. We're going to write them down and try to remember them all. All right. Thank you, Easton. Thank you, Kristen. I'm not even going to ask you for you,

Charlie, because we've asked you. Oh, yes. You should just come up with a surprise answer for us one time. No, I'm not. You're adorable. Thank you for being with us. You always have such good insight. It's so fun. I'm glad. Yay, yay.

Thank you, everybody for joining us on Are You a Charlotte? I'm Clayton Eckerd. In 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. But here's the thing. Bachelor fans hated him. If I could press a button and rewind it all I would. That's when his life took a disturbing turn. A one-night stand would end in a courtroom.

The media is here. this case has gone viral. The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. Listen to Love Trapped on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, it's Joe Interesting, host of the Spirit Daughter podcast where we talk about astrology,

natal charts, and how to step into your most vibrant life. And today I'm talking with my dear friend, Krista Williams. It can change you in the best way possible. Dance with the change. Dance with the breakdowns. The embodiment of Pisces intuition with Capricorn power moves. So I'm like delusionally proud of my chart. Listen to the Spirit Daughter podcast starting on February 24th on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcast.

I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 2 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two. families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpbright became the victim of a random crime. The perpetrator was sentenced to 99 years until a confession changed everything. I was a monster. Listen to Burden of Guilt Season 2 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. EgoWodda is your host for the 26 IHeart Podcast Awards, live at South by Southwest. Hello. Is anybody there?

raised by a single mom, Ego may have a few father-related issues. Are we supposed to talk about your dad? Her podcast, Thanks Dad, is full of funny, heartfelt conversations with actors, including fellow S&L alums, comedians, musicians, and more about life and their wonderfully complicated relationships with their fathers. I think and hope that's a good thing. Get to know Ego.

Follow Thanks, Dad, with Ego Wodom, and start listening on the free IHeart Radio app today. Hey, I'm Jay Chetty, host of the On Purpose podcast. My latest episode is with Hillary Duff, singer, actress, multi-platinum artist. You desire in family like this picture, and that's not reality. My sister and I don't speak. It's definitely

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