Are You A Charlotte? - The Music man with Craig Bierko... (S4 E3 "Defining Moments")

Episode Date: March 30, 2026

Tony nominee Craig Bierko is ready to share his experience on Sex and the City.His character met Carrie while she was out with her “friend” Big.Craig recalls what it was like to appear as a guest star and if he was similar to Ray.He opens up to Kristin about his career, his celebrity friends and so much more.That cat can play.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. I'm Lori Siegel, and on my new podcast, Mostly Human, I'll take you to some wild corners of the tech world. I'm about to go on a date with an AI companion at a real-world cafe right here in New York City. There's no playbook for what to do when an AI model hallucinates a story about you.

Mostly Human is your playbook for how tech can work for you. Anyone can now be an entrepreneur, or anyone can build an app. And it's very empowering. Listen to mostly human on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. You know Roll Doll. He thought up Willie Wonka and the BFG.

But did you know he was a spy? In the new podcast, The Secret World of Roll Doll, I'll tell you that story, and much, much more. What? You probably won't believe it either. Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been. Okay, I don't think that's true.

I'm telling you. I was a spy. Listen to the secret world of Roll Dahl on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Ready for a different take on Formula One? Look no further than No Grip, a new podcast tackling the culture of motor racing's most coveted series.

Join me, Lily Herman, as we dive into the under-explored pockets of F1, including the story of the woman who last participated in a Formula One race weekend, the recent uptick in F-1 romance novels, and plenty of mishap scandals and sagas that have made Formula One a delightful, decadent dumpster fire for more than 75 years. Listen to No Grip on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Bailey Taylor, and this is It Girl. This podcast is all about going deeper with the women's shaping culture right now. Yes, we will talk about the style and the success, but we are also talking about the pressure, the expectations, and the real work behind it all. As a woman in the industry, you're always underestimated, so you have to work extra hard

in a way that doesn't compromise, who you are in your integrity. You know, I like to say I was kind of like a silent ninja. Listen to It Girl with Bailey Taylor on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're trying to keep up with everything happening on and off the court, we've got you covered on the podcast, flagrant and funny. You want to start with the first special for the Big Ten Coach of the Year?

Oh, whatever. Would you like to? Yeah, she's not. So you're a Spartan, is that what I'm getting? Exactly. So whether your bracket is busted or you just want the real talk on what's happening during the tournament, open your free IHeart Radio app, search Playground and Funny with Carrie Champion and Jamel Hill, and listen now.

Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHart Women's Sports. Hi, I'm Kristen Davis, and I want to know, are you a Charlotte? Hi, everyone, welcome to Are You a Charlotte? Today, it's exciting. We have Craig Vieerico, who plays Ray King, the jazz guy. very, very, very exciting to talk to him. His first episode with us aired in 2001, June 10th, 2001, and it's called Defining Moments. And it was really, really fun to catch up.

He's had a really fascinating career. And we hear about some very interesting things that he has done in the past. He's really, really fun. And he's so great as Ray King, as I'm sure you all remember. So please enjoy talking with Craig Beirko. Let me just say, I'm so, so, so excited that you're joining us because I often think about you. I'm like, Craig Miracle came on our show at the weirdest time. You play the most injured, meaning like we were in, we were already in, we had big, we had Aden.

There were these long storylines. And then you just walked in the middle of it, you know, to play your fantastic jazz man, as we call you, who's technically your name is Ray King. It's a good name. So take us back. What was it like? What do you remember? How did it happen? Oh, well, at the time I was, I think I was on the last part of my year doing The Music Man, Susan Stroman had done a revival of The Music Man, and I had been doing that for the year. So I was sort of in that zone, just kind of robotically, not doing the show, but you know what it's like. Yeah, eight shows a week.

It's full-run. Eight shows a week. It's really something. And so I had been doing that for close to a year. And the call came. And as you know, if you're doing a show that's, you know, eight a week, you're never not completely exhausted. And nobody tells you that after you get over the thrill of being on a Broadway show, the single greatest thing about it is that you have license to say no to everything.

Everything. You don't have to go anywhere. You don't have to talk to anybody. You can be late. You can not show. And this came along in my, and a couple of things had come along. And I was really just too tired. It wasn't that it was that some of the things I didn't want to do. But some of the things I just thought, there's no way I could do this. And, and this came along. And I read it. And I, of course, I, you know, I wanted to do it. And. And, of course, I, you know, I wanted to do it. And when I read it, I thought, I can't not do it. I mean, it's, it's, it's, I've never read a part like this. I don't know that I've seen a part like that since, actually, which is crazy. But I had, I had such a great time. There were a couple of things that I, you know, I remember. I remember you guys were all unfailingly nice and welcome. Oh, thank God.

Not, it's not always the case, you know, and I've done a couple of shows where I, you know, I remember. was in your position. And, you know, it was it, I remember, you know, I wanted to, you know, pay attention to that example. It's important, I think. I think it is. Not only just because it's what decent human beings do, but also you're going to get the best performance from a guest. The sooner they feel like they're part of the cast. Definitely. And the more a cast can make them feel like a regular part of the cast. Yeah. Literally, little things like developing inside jokes and stuff like that, It matters. I think I had one scene with the rest of you guys where she introduces maybe. Right. Yeah, we didn't have enough stuff with you. We definitely didn't.

Nothing. I got no experience with the rest of the gals, which was too bad. But I didn't. I enjoyed the storyline. You're so good in this character. It's so perfect for you. Like, it's a perfect union. Don't you think? Is that what you mean when you said you haven't gotten that many scripts like this? What exactly do you mean by that? Oh, it is, yeah. I mean, if I love a script, it can be for any number of reasons. But for this one, it was what I recognized. I thought, you know, listen, it's a common affliction. I'm not ashamed of it, but I grew up with ADHD,

and I'd never seen it represented as anything but a comic conceit. And it is used as a bit of a comic conceit, but I do feel also like it's, I wouldn't want, something like that treated with reverence. I'd want to look at, and if I was going to inhabit it, I would want it to be as close to my own experience as possible. You know, yeah. This case was particularly intense. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But I can say there's nothing in that script that I don't recognize. Amazing. I love that. That's really interesting. I didn't realize that. I didn't realize that. But that guess so perfect. That's your writers.

and also in performance too. It was immediately comfortable. And it was that old joke. Like I had lived the trope of the very first job I got. They said, can you ride a horse? I was like, can I ride a horse? And then I went and had to take horseback riding lessons, and it was a...

I almost got killed. But everybody's got stories like that. And there's something about getting on... And another joke that I've always heard, but I hadn't experienced. until then was you meet somebody and you jump right into bed. And you shoot the most intimate scene. And we had some pretty intimate.

I mean, you guys got kind of bawdy on the show, which is great. Yes. But to jump inside of that. Yeah. I know what I mean. Yeah. It's a lot. And I remember thinking, this is sort of, I wonder if this is, they throw you into the deep end of the pool.

So because there's so much, because once that was out of the way, And it wasn't any. I actually didn't feel uncomfortable because she was so much fun and made it so light and not about what it was. And it was technical and she really knows what she's doing, obviously. Yes. And I felt, I just remember walking onto the set and I certain, I'm not an arrogant person, so I didn't feel like, all right, line up.

I just felt like, I felt very at home and comfortable and creative. And that's the most important thing. Like, oh, whatever they've hired me to do, I feel like all my pistons are firing. I'm ready to go. Yeah, I mean, that's what I see when I watch you. And that's also, I think, such an interesting thing to think about because one of the things that we've talked about amongst ourselves and on the podcast, it was when we started the show and the guys would come in and you were, I think, like you were, I mean, but this is just about you as a person too. Like you're on Broadway, you're doing the music man. You're coming in for this part that you already knew it was however many episodes, right?

Like was it, I can't remember it was two episodes, but I love that this is one of those shows where people are like, that was a, I loved you on that season. Oh, good. I mean, because that's how I feel about it too. I felt like it was longer, right? Because, like, you came on and were immediately able to be fully present. And that's why I think the character stands out. Like, there wasn't like a ramp of learning. Like, you were just there and you were 100%.

Yeah. It was very wise. The whole thing was handled very well. And you'd have to tell me if that existed before and after in the series and the movies and stuff. But it was very wise to bring me in. And I met with Saragestka. Yeah. We just met.

We talked. Right. And I think we both learned much more doing that than if it was just a conventional audition. Absolutely. And that wasn't always the case on our show. Sometimes, like, when we, Kyle, they just hired. And, of course, I was like, oh, my God, come Bucklands here. And then with Evan, who came on later as Harry, he had to read with me.

So it was maybe like his third callback or something. And I remember you're just dying for those actors because, of course, we've all been there. You're just like, it's so nerve-wracking. Difficult situation. Yeah, I would have so. You learned a lot, though. 100%. I mean, definitely.

It's very, very clear. Do it and get out. Yeah, yeah. Don't, don't. Do you need to see it again? None of that stuff. I learned that was the first thing I learned. You just do it and get out.

Even if you lay a big stink bump, just get the hell out. That's genius. You don't want that? You're crazy. Yeah, yeah, I agree. And that was definitely how Evan was, you know, in terms of like he didn't, he wasn't asking for a lot. He just was like, this is what I'm going to do. And it was, of course, brilliant.

But I would have loved to talk to him too, right? We didn't really get that. Like, I think I went out into the to the where they were waiting and tried to chat. He's a fascinating human being. He's very smart, sensitive, great guy. It's so true. It's so true. But so are you.

I think at this point in time to come on our show and be able to just be present with Sarah, you know, and she's, she's been going through these long storylines with, you know, John and Chris, right? And like,

you must have been such a breath of fresh air. I don't mean that in a negative way. But like, you know what I was saying? Like, it was so different. And when you're re-watching it or watching it the first time, because I don't really remember this part of the show that well,

which is interesting. Some I remember a lot and some I don't. you're you're i'm it's so exciting right you're watching the show you're not thinking that she's going to do anything she's literally on a date with big but not a date like a non-date date and you're on stage and you're flirting with her which i also thought was very bold right of your character and then she's she's into it and you're just so relieved as a viewer that she's into someone new you know thank god thank god i thought it was so so good and i really I didn't have any sense.

I didn't have any sense of that. You didn't. No. Okay. Something that worked for me was, I don't know if it would have made a difference ultimately, but so meeting you guys, I was really meeting you guys. I had seen the show. And my girlfriend at the time, of course, was completely obsessed and loved the show.

I didn't have any time, but I also just was, it didn't feel like my show. But any time I had seen it or I watched it with her, I enjoyed it. But not enough to have so much familiarity that when I walked in, I was like, that's the lamp. Right. That's a good thing. Right. There wasn't any of that. Like, I was familiar with the apartment and all that kind of stuff.

And I knew who Mr. Big was. I knew all you guys were. I basically knew the idea of it and the tone I got, which was the most important thing. Right. Especially when you're coming in. Yeah. And your, you know, your character hasn't met any of the other people. So you're sort of like, you haven't landed in this nest, and in each nest, they have their own way of communicate, like any group of friends.

You have your own secret language, your own, you know. And I think that even translates in a show or a play where you're just representing a group of friends. So there was very much that. It was a very complete organism. Yes, yes. And I actually felt like, oh, this is a great. I mean, it's definitely a job. I'm not crazy.

I know I'm playing the part. but there is this experience of actually meeting these people who I only sort of know, but there wasn't enough familiarity to go, oh, she's doing that thing. She always does. Right. Right. That's great. That's great to have the kind of a balance.

Yeah, yeah. A balance of like to. A lot of people don't work like that, but whatever's right in front of me, that's what I, that's what feels the most alive to me. I think 100%. Yes. And not all men were good at that. And that's what I wanted to say earlier, but I got off my own track.

It was hard in the beginning because in a lot of ways the men are castes the girlfriend parts, like what had traditionally been the girlfriend parts that we were very used to doing, right? But it seemed strange for men to be in that position. It was great. I know you did just the best job at it. And it was great for me in a way that like vitamins are great for you. Yes. Here's what it's like to, you know, to come in and you're basically, I mean, it's a very well-written

show, but coming in as a guest on shows that are not as well put together, you know, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, uh, it's, it's, it's, uh, it's, it's, a, it's, a, it's, uh, it's, uh, it's, uh, you're, and you, and you, and you, and you, and, you're, done or whatever, but you, and you're, I decided that I wanted to kind of, even after the show was on, I wanted to go and be in different situations. So I went on Will and Grace as a guest star. I went on friends as a guest star. You know, I had been on Seinfeld already before the show as a guest star.

You know, each totally, totally different experiences. Because each, you know, environment, eco-cosm, whatever you want to call it, they're different, right? And the vibe is different and the part is different. But the thing that would really frustrate me is that sometimes, especially in the multicameral, they would rewrite your part as the week went on. And you're just like, I don't know what I'm doing here at all. It's hard.

It's really bizarre. There's so many things that like, nobody's going to ask an actor, hey, if you're going to restructure the network, how would you do it? But, hey, some actor. But I really did think after I'd been around the, you know, around for a little while, and I'd auditioned and tested and even done things that I just thought, I remember reading a book and I read that the Marx Brothers, I'm a huge Marks Brothers fan,

and their best movies, they kind of, they went downhill a little bit towards the end, but their best movies, they toured as shows. Wow. But they were Broadway, you know, they toured them,

not just on Broadway, but in the boonies. And I always thought, if you've got a pilot and you're investing millions of dollars into it, and you're taking a risk with all the cast, and all that kind of stuff.

Why don't you have your... Don't say anything. Don't promote the show. Just have the writers say, we're going to pick it up, write four episodes. We're going to go to Eugene or wherever. And we're going to run it for a month.

Wow. We're going to find out where the... And we're going to run four episodes together. Cool. And just have an evening. I mean, they do it now when they bring shows back and they do them live. I mean, sort of as a joke and it's campy.

Yeah. But sometimes they're not campy. Sometimes they get the original cast and they do them live and they tour. It used to be big, but it's not that big anymore. But I was like, why wouldn't you want to, I mean, it's so great that there's a sex in the city, but you're really just spinning,

you're rolling the dice every time you put show up. That's totally true. You're definitely. All the elements could have been there, but what if you didn't have the right director? What if the casting wasn't right with one part? What if, I mean, anything could have happened. Wouldn't you want to iron out all those problems?

It always been, and also, you've tested for stuff, obviously. Yeah. Why are we testing in Eric's office? Why don't you build us? I'm going off now. Oh, I know. Build a facsimile of a soundstage so you can see what we do. It's true.

It's hard to really even imagine that anything ever works. Yeah, it is amazing. Yeah. Well, it's an explanation for why so little does. That's true, too. That's true, too. But, yeah, we were very lucky in that HBO really just trusted us, which was wonderful. That was a magical.

I'm Drew Barrymore all of a sudden, but that was a, that was a, it really was a unique time. Yeah, it really was. We were so lucky to be there. Yeah. HBO was, it was closer to almost what theater was. Yep, yep, yep, yep. They were like, just go. Just go. Do it. Let's see. Let's see what happens. You know, Roldahl, the writer who thought up Willie Wonka, Matilda, and the BFG. But did you know he was also a spy? Was this before? He wrote his story. I must have been. Our new podcast series, The Secret World of Roll Doll,

is a wild journey through the hidden chapters of his extraordinary, controversial life. His job was literally to seduce the wives of powerful Americans. And he was really good at it.

You probably won't believe it either. Okay, I don't think that's true. I'm telling you, the guy was a spy. Did you know Dahl got cozy with the Roosevelt's? Played poker with Harry Truman and had a long affair

with a congresswoman. And then he took his talents to Hollywood where he worked alongside Walt Disney and Alfred Hitchcock before writing a hit James Bond film. How did this secret agent wind up as the most successful children's author ever? And what darkness from his covert past seeped into the stories we read as kids. The true story is stranger than anything he ever wrote. Listen to The Secret World of Roll Doll on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Bailey Taylor, and this is It Girl. You may know me from my It Girl series I've done on the streets of New York over the years, Well, I've got good news. I am bringing those interviews and many more to this podcast. Yes, we will talk about the style and the success, but we are also talking about the pressure, the expectations, and the real work with the women's shaping culture right now. As a woman in the industry, you're always underestimated.

So you have to work extra hard, and you have to push the narrative in a way that doesn't compromise who you are in your integrity. You know, I like to say I was kind of like a silent ninja. Each week, I have unfiltered conversations with female founders, creatives, and leaders to talk about ambition, visibility, and what it really takes to build something meaningful in the public eye. Because being an it girl isn't about the spotlight, it's about owning it. I think the negatives need to be discussed and they need to be told to people who maybe don't do

this every day, just so they know what's really going on. I feel like pulling the curtain back is important. Listen to It Girl with Bailey Taylor on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Why hasn't a woman formally participated in a Formula One race weekend in over a decade. Think about how many skills they have to develop at such a young age. What can we learn from all of the new F1 romance novels suddenly popping up every year? He still smelled of podium champagne and expensive friction. And how did a 2023 event called Wagageddon change the paddock forever? That day is just seared into my memory.

I'm culture writer and F1 expert Lily Herman, and these are just a few of the questions I'm tackling on No Grip, a Formula One culture podcast that dives into the under-explored pockets of the sport. In each episode, a different guest and I will go deeper into the wacky mishap, scandals, and sagas, both on the track and far away from it, that have made F1 a delightful, decadent dumpster fire for more than 75 years. Listen to No Grip on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're trying to keep up with everything happening on and off the court, we've got you covered on the podcast, flagrant and funny. You look at the top four number one seeds. What do you think UCLA is going to do?

Break down that for me, my friend. Obviously, Yukon is the overwhelming favorite in this tournament. But I'll be honest, I think people are kind of sleeping on Texas. Experts are suggesting that UCLA is the number one challenger to Yukon and that right after that would be Texas. S&C is so deep and so thick and just about everything. It really is annoying. So it's UCLA, Texas, South Carolina, LCon.

LSU, only ones that could possibly upset Yukon. On Flakron and Funny, we're giving our unfiltered takes on the biggest moments the conversations everyone's having. So whether your bracket is busted or you just want the latest on the tournament, we got you. Listen to Flakron and Funny with Kerry Champion and Jamel Hill on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHard Women's Sports. I became a millionaire overnight but lost everything that actually mattered.

Wait a minute, Sophia. Did you just say he lost everything? That's right, it's inheriting too much drama week on the OK Storytime podcast, so we'll find out soon. This person writes, I just inherited a fortune after losing my mom, and now my girlfriend's entire family is coming out of nowhere with their hands out. One sibling wants me to fund their whole lifestyle. Another vanished for four years and suddenly reappeared, and my girlfriend is already giving my money away.

Hold on, Sophia, so the girl he wants to marry is already sending money out the door. And that's just the beginning. He makes a plan, sets up a trust, and finally thinks he has everything under control. Okay, so things work out then? Let's just say the people he trusted the most are the ones who ended up shocking him the most. So does the money end up being worth going through all that? To find out, listen to the OK Storytime podcast

on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So this episode, I don't even think I said what it was called. It's called Defining Moments. It aired June 10th, 2001. Let me just ask you a brief question about 2001. This is how I remember the summer of 2001, because we would have gone back

to filming in like February, and then the episodes would have aired, you know, kind of as we went. And I remember this summer as just being this incredible, kind of like intense time of everything was amazing in New York in the summer of 2001. It's a great summer. Do you remember that? The weather was beautiful. Things were just exciting. It was right before the world went nuts.

Exactly. Exactly. It was like, yeah, that's how I felt as well. And I just feel like it was, everything was like brighter. you know, it was almost like a technical summer, you know? Yes, yes, it was a beautiful summer. Yeah, before things changed. So I'm glad that you were a part of our world in that, in that glorious summer.

Yeah. What was the response after you were on the show and it aired? It's immediate. It's the close, I mean, I'm not, not in terms of quality, but it was the closest experience I ever had to, like maybe being on a soap or something, of the level of familiarity and the sense of propriety that people have with these characters. Definitely, yes. They're people walking around thinking you're their actual friends.

And so when I went out that night, at that point, when the show aired, I was living up on 86th Street. And I went out for a walk right afterwards just to get something to eat. And a woman walked right up to me and said, are you going to hurt her? I was like, yeah, it's not a great question to ask of large man in New York City. Totally. Yeah, and I realized, oh, she meant Carrie. And I went, oh, and she wasn't crazy. She just said, please tell me what's going to happen.

I said, I really have no idea, but I wouldn't count. And that was when I realized, I think any guys that aren't Mr. Big are essentially different grades of the guys on Star Trek with the red shirts. We're going back down to the planet, but we're not coming back. Oh, no. We're not coming back. Oh, no. I mean, you never know, right? You never know. I guess you were right. I guess you were right.

So was it, were people ever mad at you? Like about what? Oh, no. No, no. They love the show. And to this day, if I get, I can usually tell, now I've got, I've accumulated a a body of work, I can usually tell, here comes the sex in the city person, I can usually tell. For sure.

And the thing, as I get older, the thing that pleases me most, of course, is that it's like, I must be within the weight range. I mean, we all feel this. Okay, we all feel the pressure of that. You look terrific, actually. Thank you so much. You really look terrific. Thank you.

So do you. So do you. The hair. You've got great, great, great hair. Okay, so let's talk about the episode for a little bit. The thing that's funny to me about this episode is the incredible cast. We've got yourself. We've got Kyle, of course.

We've got Sonia Braga comes on, which is like, how on earth did this even really happen? Right? And then we've got Jim Gavagan, who's playing this kind of like slightly horrible, man. At least that's my whatever. But I remember, I knew of him and his stand-up, but like he's done so incredibly well. Like, it's so wonderful to see. and he's a sweet guy. I'd see him.

I auditioned with him all the time. I don't know why they always put us together, but a couple of times we auditioned for things together. Interesting. Such a good actor, very good actor. Yeah, he's a good actor. A very nice guy, and I'm happy for him too. Me too.

Yeah, that was an incredible cast. I couldn't believe who was there. I know. I mean, like, it's pretty exciting. And I got to work with none of you. I know. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

You were siloed into the carry world. That's all right. I was a happy camper. Definitely, definitely. And it's so great. So basically, Big, we start the show. Big and Carrie are friends because she has called him on her birthday because she feels bad that no man cares about her on her birthday, which is very relatable, of course. But Big is back, but they're friends, which is weird to watch, I think.

And they go to the monkey bar. Why did you think it was weird to watch? I think it's weird to watch, I think, because we have invested so much into the Big and Carey relationship. they've been through so much. So to see kind of like a light version, you know, because the chemistry's still there, obviously, but also she's trying to protect herself. And he's being his charming self,

you know, there's many aside of him. Yeah, he's obviously. I mean, I watched that scene again in the car, and I just thought, oh, he's hurting. Definitely. This is what guys do when they're hurting. Definitely. I love that scene in the car so much.

I didn't remember it at all. I remember you being. there and I remember you wearing that hat. I remember your presence. I know. I know. I don't know why they mean you wear that hat. Why? I kept asking if I could take it off and they were like, they call you, you know, I was like, oh. Thank God you take it off when you do, okay? I kept taking it off and they kept telling me to put it back on. I get it, man. We have a whole hat situation in our world where the costume people love the hats, Sarah loves the hats. I get it. And it's a fashion forward Joe. It is. It is. I also don't know. I can't tell you how many times. I've got a friend who's got a much better sense of fashion than I do. And if I go, if I need a suit, I just take him and I buy what he says because I can't tell. So I, I'm kind of with you. Yeah. I'm not the best. I try to pretend like I am, but I'm not. But the thing about you is that you're so tall, right? So you're so tall. So to put a hat on you does really make you specific. Like from that perspective as a character, it very much makes sense. So I love that you're up there. Then they go, then, then, you're, you're. You know, you. You're. You

He takes her, for some reason, downtown below 14th Street, he says, to a jazz bar. And she doesn't know anything about jazz, which is also kind of funny. I mean, okay, Carrie. And there you are right in front of her playing the bass. Did you know how to play the bass? No. They gave me, and I still have it. Oh, I should have found it and dug it up.

But they gave me a tape to listen to of the song that was going to be playing. Cool. And then I think somebody, I think, I seem to remember there was a bass player who may have showed up the first day who told. told me, because there is a shot where you see I'm playing. Right. And it was, they wanted like two or three notes. So I learned those. Got it.

Okay, we had to learn trombone for Music Man. So I wasn't afraid of that. And also in the character, he, and this is, this goes for me, too. He can play a lot of instruments a little. Which is neat. Yeah, it's a cool character, right? And you make jokes about it. Like, oh, I own the bar, which is why they let me play.

And he's, I think it, he's kind of. kind of not beating himself up. I think he kind of accepts who he is. Right. I think it's very endearing. It would have been sad if he was like, oh, this always happens. Right.

He's just on to the next thing, you know? Definitely. And so he's a, he's detached. There was something sad about him, but I thought, if I even recognize the fact that there's something sad about him, that will have to be, that's something that exists for the viewer

or anybody else. But I think in his mind, he's just like, oh, that channel's on. Which is the experience if you have ADD. It's like there are five TVs on and you have to pick the TV that you're actually having a conversation with. Right. And just you learn to drown out the other TVs. Right.

And but it's, that's the fun part is that when there's nothing going on or something goes sideways, you're like, where am I going to watch? I think that's great. You get all the channels. Yeah, I love that. I love that so much. I love that. So when you're, so you're there and you're playing the base and they're sitting right in front of you, Big and Carrie, and you flirt with her, and she flirts back and then Big, big turns around and you send her a note. I was like,

wow, he's so bold. He's so bold. I don't remember any of this, right? It's like I was watching it for the first time. And she is like all giggly and adorable. Like very clearly, you guys have chemistry, which again, as a viewer, I was so relieved that she likes someone new. Thank God, right? because they're in this weird, like, friendly thing, but yet there's so much under-toe happening, right? You want her to have something fresh. At least I did. That's how I felt.

So then I was really glad, but I also thought that was kind of bold. Like if a guy and a girl are sitting right in front of you while you're on this stage, would you just hand the girl a note? I don't know, but it's cool. Yeah, I think he's the kind of guy. Like an idea crosses his mind,

and if he didn't do it, he'd forget about it. Got it, yeah. I don't know. But I, it's also, Yeah, I'm not that kind of guy. Me neither. But I have done that. I'm not sent notes, but I have gone up to women and just ask them out.

It's a really terrifying part of being a man. Oh, my God. I did it one time as, you know, obviously I'm a award. Oh, I admire that. Oh, it was terrifying. I was like, how do they do this? How do they do this? And it was a terrible, terrible idea that I had.

I was on location in Canada working. and there was this one guy on the crew. This is so big of a no-no, right? Like really bad no-no. There was this guy on the crew, but he just was that kind of guy where he was always watching. He was kind of quiet, but he was always watching

and like really good at his job, but not one of the ones where like they're loud and, you know, like talking to you. They're just like, he was just like kind of, you know, confident in his quiet self, which is always interesting. And I really liked to. him and I was so bored at this particular job.

Like I didn't have a co-star to hang with, really. So I was like, I'm just going to ask that guy out because I would just love to have a conversation with him outside of the set because he was so quiet on the set, right? Oh, my God, horrible idea. Horrible idea. Just because of the work situation, right? I think it's a great idea for women to try doing this because it's not that easy. I mean, maybe the world is different now.

But, like, also, you don't know their situation. You're just walking in. Like, I couldn't research him. It was before social media, right? I couldn't ask anybody, like, what's his deal? Right? And I never heard of mention a significant other or anything like that. So I asked him, and he just stared at his feet.

And then he was like, I'm really sorry. I can't. And I was like, oh, no problem, no problem. Because he had a girlfriend, right, which I wouldn't have known. And then the whole rest of the job is so awkward. But I was like, man. I've been there. I've been there.

You got to learn that lesson. Oh, yeah. Nobody can tell you, you've got to live it. It's so true. You've got to live that pain and realize I'm never putting myself to this again. I know, I know. But I thought to myself at the time, like men do this all the time. Like that is not easy.

It's not easy. No. It's not. No. I think you just got to, yeah. Yeah, it's not easy. No, no. I mean, now they're the apps.

So I guess you could just go on the apps, though. I don't know. Me neither. Okay, me neither. Me neither. I'm going to die alone with cats. I'm going to die alone with dogs, apparently. That's it.

That's the way to go. Well, that's good. We're in it together, but not. Okay, wait, let's talk about the show. Let's talk about the show. So I love when, so we're at your bar, which we find out is your bar because you walk by Carrie and Big, and they both chat with you. And the thing that I also thought was interesting because you're like a very cool character, right? And Big's wearing his beige shoe, which is like the worst side of Big, I think, the beigeish brown.

suit. I'm like, no. So he's wearing his beige suit. And she's obviously, you know, so much more kind of hip and cool and interesting. So you just talk to her. And then he's like, oh, man, you know, he's nice, whatever. And then you guys all end up in this cab, right? Is that, is that, night that you end up in the cab? He keeps inviting himself along, basically. He's like, yeah, let's get a cab. I know. It's horrible. It was hilarious. And I had forgotten that he, she gets out of the car and then drives away and she's looking after her. And he starts talking. He got out with her. I know. It was a really good reveal. I had totally forgotten it as well. I actually thought, oh, that's an uncomfortable ride home. I don't remember shooting that,

you know? I don't remember watching it. It's so great, though, like to see you guys sitting there in the back of a real cab. And he's like, cab suck or whatever he says. Cabs are bad or whatever. I'm like, oh, be quiet. Cubs are great. The old big, big, big, but you're in like a decent size cab. I love that. Yeah, we're big men, too. Yeah, yeah. I know, you are guys, big guys. So then she gets out and they're close on her and you don't realize that he's also gotten out. It's just great directing. It's so good.

Oh, I forgot to say, this is directed by Alan Coulter, who we love so much. He's the best. He's the best. I did a couple of things with him. And there's always something like that. You don't normally see that on TV. It's true. I know it wasn't TV.

It was HBO. It's true. You don't normally see that. Something like that was a really well-timed visual joke. that you could see in a movie. So true. Yeah, so true. It was really, really good.

And then you're also like, Big, what are you doing? Like, you know, I was very much with Carrie. Like, what are you doing? But then, luckily, she goes upstairs and you call her right away. Good one on you. Good, good, good one. And you play her jazz, which is adorable. Like, I like all of the Ray, the Ray, you know, seduction.

I think it's really likable. But then, of course, big calls while she's on the phone with you, which is like, ah. Like you need to just shake them off at this point, right? But then luckily, you know, you guys have great, great, like, initial chemistry. And you go out to the opening of Tao, which is kind of funny. And I think we filmed there also later, like maybe Bigg and Carrie's engagement party, I want to say. Because that place was huge, right?

It was huge. And you could do that aerial shot, you know, that's a cool, cool shot. What a great shot. I know, it was a great shot. And I remember when Tao open. Like it was a whole thing. You know what I mean? Like it still is, obviously, but it was a whole thing.

And you guys are there. But of course, Big is there also with a model named Shea or Shaw or something bizarre. And she's in the bathroom doing cocaine. And you're just like, oh, Big, just go away. And then you very smartly decamp to the bar. I thought that was a good move because you don't make a big fuss about it either, right? You just go over there and she finds you. And you're like, yeah, I'm not going back to that table.

And I just have to love the lack of drama. You know what I mean? Like you're just like, this is where I'm at. Obviously, there's something weird going on. You don't even really ask a ton of questions, which I also love. Yeah. Ray is very likable. Yeah, the lack of questions, that can mean a couple of things.

And it's actually now that I think of it kind of intelligent because if he's, it's sort of your first clue. if you watch it again, if you go back and look it. I don't think you can tell, but it's very subtle of going, he doesn't live in that world. Yeah. Information is just like, he's not going to just, you know. I think he says things as he thinks of it.

And he is, his, his baseline is kind of cool. I agree. I agree. And avoids he, I don't think I played this, but he avoids over-stimilar, you know, he likes jazz, but he doesn't play anything frenetic. It was nice and easy. And in a restaurant like that, that kind of environment, it's a lot of noise, it's a lot of stimuli. It's really hard to focus.

And part of that made sense to me, too, that he sort of has to deal with, you know, this is a step deeper. Maybe it's something just for the actor to carry around. It's nothing that's, I mean, the story tells itself. The script is going to tell you everything. But I think for me it was like that made sense to get away from all the noise. And also there's a bit of a situation here. Just keep it as simple as possible. Yeah.

I love that. I love that so much. It's really interesting. And it's just so nice because it's just so different, right? Yeah, and it was a nice scene too. A really good scene with her. It was excellent. It really is the first time they talk.

Yeah. It was really, really good. And you guys have such easy chemistry. It's just easy. Yeah. Well, she's wonderful to work with. I know. It's very, very easy. And she's very present.

Very present. Yes. She really, really, really is. And when I look back to, I mean, she's so present and so her instincts are so good. Yeah. You know, all the time. Like, so dependable. You know what I mean?

Yeah. Obviously, we know this, but it's fun to talk about it. So let's just talk about Trey and Charlotte. Oh, they're trippy little cell. Oh my gosh. I don't even clearly remember this part at all. I remember Kyle in general, obviously. But at this point, we're having this bizarre thing

where we're having sex in all these weirdly unusual places like a bedroom at a cocktail party with all of the doctors that he works with. Like, it's not, it's not like, Shirley, there's times when I look at Charlotte and I'm like, Charlotte's just, she's not that mature in certain ways to understand why that would be something he would want to do.

like she's like, I don't understand what's going on. She keeps saying to her friends, well, because obviously he's, he's, he's got baggage about relationships, right? And like marriage and all the things that are expected of him. So it's much more fun to have sex in a cab. Yeah. You know, that's not like real or whatever. Yeah.

But Charlotte's kind of like, I don't know what's happening and I'm just so happy that he wants to do anything. It's very interesting. It's interesting to watch. But it's also such a kind of like topsy, turvy. like turning things upside down, right? Like she wanted this wedding, she wanted this wedding, she got the wedding, then of course there's going to have to be problems. But now there's like confusion, which I think is also really interesting to see her in.

But I think that I had totally forgotten about. We're all shopping somewhere, some vintage place. And Charlotte has a hicky. Totally forgot about all this. What on earth, right? And then also Samantha comes over and she's like, oh, look, you're having a good, healthy relationship. And Charlotte's like, oh, no. oh, if Samantha thinks it's healthy, that's a terrible sign.

Like, really funny, really funny. And I didn't remember it at all. So then Charlotte goes to him when he's trying to have sex with her in a very interesting, like Indian decorated cab. And she's like, no, we have to, you know, wait five more blocks until we get home. Like, why can't we do that? And then he calls her later and apologizes, which is very sweet. But also the thing that I think about watching it back is that. is that the main problem is not the sex,

it's that he cannot seem to talk about anything. That's a tough one. Isn't it? I'm Bailey Taylor, and this is it girl. You may know me from my it girl series I've done on the streets of New York over the years. Well, I've got good news. I am bringing those interviews and many more to this podcast.

Yes, we will talk about the style and the success, but we are also talking about the pressure, the expectations, and the real work with the women's shaping culture right now. As a woman in the industry, you're always undempsyching. So you have to work extra hard and you have to push the narrative in a way that doesn't compromise who you are in your integrity. You know, I like to say I was kind of like a silent ninja. Each week, I have unfiltered conversations with female founders, creatives, and leaders to talk

about ambition, visibility, and what it really takes to build something meaningful in the public eye. Because being a it girl isn't about the spotlight, it's about owning it. I think the negatives need to be discussed and they need to be told to people who maybe don't do this every day, just so they need. know what's really going on. I feel like pulling the curtain back is important. Listen to It Girl with Bailey Taylor on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Why hasn't a woman formerly participated in a Formula One race weekend in over a decade? Think about

how many skills they have to develop at such a young age. What can we learn from all of the new F1 romance novels suddenly popping up every year? He still smelled of podium champagne and expensive friction. And how did a 2023 event called Wag Ageddon change the paddock forever? That day is just seared into my memory. I'm culture writer and F1 expert Lily Herman, and these are just a few of the questions I'm tackling on no grip, a Formula One culture podcast that dives into the under-explored pockets of the sport.

In each episode, a different guest and I will go deeper into the wacky mishaps, scandals and sagas, both on the track and far away from it, that have made F1 a delightful, decadent dumpster fire for more than 75 years. Listen to no grip on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You know Roll Doll, the writer who thought up Willie Wonka, Matilda, and the BFG. But did you know he was also a spy? Was this before he wrote his stories?

It must have been. Our new podcast series, The Secret World of Roll Doll, is a wild journey through the hidden chapters of his extraordinary, controversial life. His job was literally to seduce the wives of powerful Americans. What? And he was really good at it. You probably won't believe it either. Okay, I don't think that's true. I'm telling you.

The guy was a spy. Did you know Dahl got cozy with the Roosevelt's? Played poker with Harry Truman and had a long affair with a congresswoman. And then he took his talents to Hollywood, where he worked alongside Walt Disney and Alfred Hitchcock, before writing a hit James Bond film. How did this secret agent wind up as the most successful children's author ever? and what darkness from his covert past

seeped into the stories we read as kids. The true story is stranger than anything he ever wrote. Listen to the secret world of Roll Dahl on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're trying to keep up with everything happening on and off the court, we've got you covered on the podcast, flagrant and funny. You look at the top four number one seeds. What do you think UCLA is going to do?

Break down that for me, my friend. Obviously, Yukon is the overwhelming favorite in this tournament, but I'll be honest, I think people are kind of sleeping on Texas. Experts are suggesting that UCLA is the number one challenger to Yukon and that right after that would be Texas. S&C is so deep and so thick and just about everything. It really is annoying. So it's UCLA, Texas, South Carolina, LSU,

only ones that could possibly upset Yukon. On Flagrant and Funny, we're giving our unfiltered takes on the biggest moments the conversations everyone's having. So whether your bracket is busted or you're just, just want the latest on the tournament. We got you. Listen to Flakrant and Funny with Kerry Champion and Jamel Hill

on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. A silver 40-caliber handgun was recovered at the scene. From IHart Podcasts and Best Case Studios. This is Rorschach, murder at City Hall. How could this have happened in City Hall?

Somebody tell me that. Jeffrey Hood did it. July 2003. Councilman James E. Davis arrives at New York City Hall with a guest. Both men are carrying concealed weapons. And in less than 30 minutes, both of them will be dead. Everybody in the chambers duct. A shocking public murder.

I scream, get down, get down. Those are shots. Those are shots. Get down. A charismatic politician. You know, he just bent the rules all the time. I still have a weapon. And I could shoot you.

and an outsider with a secret. He alleged he was a victim of flatdown. That may or may not have been political. That may have been about sex. Listen to Rorschach, murder at City Hall, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You know, I was free watching this episode,

and I've gone through each one of those experiences. Oh, wow. They're very relatable, which is part of obviously the soup of the show. It's why it connects so much, is that there's so much to connect to. There really is anything that was just, it didn't seem like anyway, for me, certainly in that episode,

there was stuff that was really funny, but it all came out of character and stuff that was really, it seemed researched. Like I told you, I really appreciated that. And also the fact that, you know, yeah, I've been, I've been there. It's, you know, it's, but I've been on both sides of the,

why ain't you talking? I want to talk about this. But it didn't hit me. Not when I saw the show, but when I did it, I was, what, 36, I guess. And now I'm 111. It's different. It's different, you know, when you're mature and you've had some experiences or maybe even been humbled a little bit and say, and then you can see something like that episode and go, yeah, I was non-communicative.

or oh, it's very, it's like a validation to see something on a show that you're familiar with and you love that tells you it's okay. Yeah. This happens. Yeah. And here's a way to deal with it. Like, it is, it can be kind of instructive. Oh, I agree. It's super interesting from that perspective.

I actually had that. I thought, oh, this will be nostalgic, but I looked at it and thought, I'm glad I saw that because, you know, I had a, well, no, I had a re-success. I was the one who. there was somebody else who just wasn't a talker. They just weren't. Right. You know? And I like to get in there and understand things.

Me too. But it just wasn't that person's style. Right. And I saw that. It was instructive. I saw that. It's frustrating, but it's okay that it's frustrating. Right.

I wish I didn't kill them. That was wrong. That's true. I also think, and I hear this from fans a lot too, like if you watch it, you know, for instance, we were all in our 30s when we were. were filming this originally, right? And so you're at a certain place in your life then, and you have those experiences that you're thinking of. Then if you might watch it a decade later, you're going to have a whole different set of things that are going to come into

your mind when you're watching it. And certainly that's true for me now, 800 million years later watching it. But yet, it holds up and it's relatable. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, that's why, I mean, if you look at the really great shows, like some of my favorites anyway, or Dick Van Dyke. Oh, yeah. I actually like the old Andy Griffith show. And I noticed years ago, I was watching it as an older person. And I just thought, there are no jokes in this. There's not one joke. Good point.

There's no, like, there's three to the page, you know. Yeah. We were doing sitcoms. But this was, they were, it was all on character. It was exceptional writing. And you realize most of the people who ran shows back then came directly out of the theater, first generation. Yeah. And then years later, it would be the,

their kids. Yeah. And now it's just people who only know TV. Yeah. And it's, and it gets softer and softer. That's true. That's true.

That is true. I mean, now we also have people where they're kind of creating themselves online somehow. It's a whole new thing. And I'm sure good stuff will come out of that. Yeah.

I mean, if you look at Quinta Brunson, who created Abbott, we talked to one of that cast. You know, she created her own self online first, but then also created Abbott and learned how to write in that format so brilliantly. And then also, I don't know if you know Benito Skinner, who does overcompensating on Amazon.

No. He is a great. He's young. He's young. He's amazing. He created himself online doing like spoof spoofs of the Kardashians, basically, on Instagram during COVID. But he's super talented, super smart.

And he's written, he has a podcast. he does he I don't know if he actually does stand up or just does spoofs he has a whole show that he's written like an actual single camera basically his life in college, trying to pretend he was straight, trying to make sense of it all, overcompensating in every way. And you just think about, you know, good for them, that they're finding their way in this new crazy world that we live in. But yet they still are really, like, they're studying everything. Like Benito's watched our season.

He watches each season, like, as a, you know, technician trying to take it apart, you know, and learning from what we did and then also bringing in people to help him who are, you know, more schooled or whatever, you know, in the profession. But I love that. I love the freshness of it and trying to find your way because it really is no set way. No. Yeah. No.

And all it is, you know, everybody keeps saying, well, the world is changing so much. It's radio and then it's TV and now it's the internet and now it's vertical. It's like it's all they are is tubes that information's coming through. The people haven't changed. No. And the stories haven't changed. It's kind of depressing how little we've changed. Right.

So the stories, it's still about story. Yes. And it's just the format that you have to, and I actually find that interesting. Me too. I agree. As soon as the internet started coming in and there was this, they're going to be web episodes. I was like, well, that was exciting. I want to find out what that is.

And I got in, my hands dirty. And I think it's a very exciting time. And it's all it is is just, it's a new plot of land that you have to learn how to work. That's all it is. I agree. And if you don't, you're going to starve. Right. So don't, don't keep returning to the old field thinking that's because that's what gets me depressed as we're like, I just, I don't think it's going to go back to what it was. I know. That is, it is depressing.

It's a little, a little bit, but it's also exciting to, to, um, be straddling to, I mean, not everybody has a life where they're straddling two errors. That's true. We had the whole sort of like TV and very familiar with that. We did it. We did it. Yes. It was exciting to grow up. You watch Welcome Back Cotter and then you're go and do a sitcom.

That's a big exciting. Yes. Yes. I love that. Yeah, I agree. And then you're like, there'll never be another Welcome Back Cotter again. They'll probably never be the stuff that I did or that we did. It's not going to be the same way. Right.

It's going to be made a different way because people need stories. Definitely. But then also Broadway is still doing. great, right? I hope so. I don't know. I don't follow that as closely. Yeah, maybe they're not doing great, great,

but they're still there. Let's put it that way. I think it's driven by a celebrity, which is... That's true. It's not always a bad thing. Right. And it always has been. It's not like it hasn't been,

but that's what's preceding. Like, you can't get a show done. That's a good point. Yeah, that's a really good point. I wouldn't have been cast. I wouldn't have been cast in Music Man today. Oh. I don't think so.

I don't know. Well, I don't think so. It's possible. And I know even then she was taking a big chance. Wow. But she felt very strongly about it. And, you know, she has my allegiance for the rest of my life. Absolutely.

Absolutely. You guys, this is so much fun that we are going to have to have a part two. So join us later in the week on RU.S. Charlotte. I'm Lori Siegel. And on my new podcast, mostly human, I'll take you to some wild corners of the tech world. I'm about to go on a date with an AI companion at a real world. right here in New York City. There's no playbook for what to do

when an AI model hallucinates a story about you. Mostly Human is your playbook for how tech can work for you. Anyone can now be an entrepreneur. Anyone can build an app. And it's very empowering. Listen to Mostly Human on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Ready for a different take on Formula One?

Look no further than No Grip, a new podcast tackling the culture of motor racing's most coveted series. Join me, Lily Herman, as we dive into the under-explored pockets of F-1, including the story of the woman who last participated in a Formula One race weekend, the recent uptick in F-1 romance novels, and plenty of mishap scandals and sagas that have made Formula One a delightful, decadent dumpster fire for more than 75 years. Listen to No Grip on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Bailey Taylor, and this is It Girl. This podcast is all about going deeper with the women-shaping culture right now. We will talk about the style and the success, but we are also talking about the pressure, the expectations, and the real work behind it all. As a woman in the industry, you're always underestimated. So you have to work extra hard in a way that doesn't compromise who you are in your integrity. You know, I like to say I was kind of like a silent ninja.

Listen to It Girl with Bailey Taylor on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You know, Roald Dahl. He thought up Willie Wonka and the BFG. but did you know he was a spy? In the new podcast, The Secret World of Roll Doll, I'll tell you that story, and much, much more. What? You probably won't believe it either.

Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been. Okay, I don't think that's true. I'm telling you, the guy was a spy. Listen to the Secret World of Roll Doll on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're trying to keep up with everything happening on and off the

court. We've got you covered on the podcast, flagrant and funny. You want to start with first pleasure for the Big Ten coach of the year? Oh, whatever. Would you like to? You're a Spartan, is that what I'm getting? Exactly. So whether your bracket is busted or you just want the real talk on what's happening during the tournament,

open your free IHeart radio app, search Plagrant and Funny with Carrie Champion and Jamel Hill and listen now. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Hew. Amen.