Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard - Alexander Skarsgård

Episode Date: July 21, 2025

Alexander Skarsgård (Murderbot, Melancholia, True Blood) is an Emmy Award-winning actor. Alexander joins the Armchair Expert to discuss accidentally signing up for a month-long cross country ski trek in the South Pole, gaining 25 pounds and long hair in the final season of True Blood because he was prepping to play Tarzan, and how everyone in Sweden exhibits symptoms of No Tall Poppy Syndrome. Alexander and Dax talk about why a sprinkle of anarchy would be good in Sweden, growing up around actors and artists he longed for a dad that drove a Saab, and joining the military as a response to being raised by bohemians. Alexander explains booking his first Hollywood audition for Zoolander, playing AI gone rogue in Murderbot, and whether as a Swede he’s liberated from the hedonic treadmill of obsessing about money.Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. Watch new content on YouTube or listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free by joining Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ now.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad free right now. Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple podcasts. Or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. I'm Dak Shepard and I'm joined by Monica Padman. That's me. This was a very fun interview.

Alexander Skarsgård. Woo! Oh! Spicy hot. Yeah, what a stud. I wanna say. Say it. I'm gonna.

Just to clear my good name, I'm very late in this interview, and it is not my fault. No, our guest was a half hour early. Yes, and I was in a meeting, so I didn't get the text that you guys were starting. And so I'm a fair amount late. But you're not late. You're exactly on time.

I was on time, but I hated it. But oh boy, what a sweetie pie. Alexander Skarsgard, please enjoy. We are supported by Audible. Thanks to Audible. Thanks to Audible for being the presenting sponsor of today's episode. We could all use an escape these days

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Hi, it's Emily Durham, the host of the Straight Shooter Recruiter Podcast. Y'all, I can't tell if Love Island UK is restoring or destroying my faith in dating right now. Obviously, I've been watching on Hey You every day after work work as one does because reality TV is good for the soul. Now some of these couples make me say aww and others I'm like uh what? Tony saying a man who is for everyone isn't for me had me rolling. She is standing on business and I love that but this is also why I could never be on this show.

You want me living in a villa with other people trying to date my man? Like my man? There's no way! Also, the Casa Amor recoupling was so juicy. I am telling you, Love Island UK is a community building experience. Everyone is watching it. The memes and social posts after the episodes absolutely kill me. Some of y'all even DM'd me after the recoupling and I just love talking TV with you.

Check out Love Island UK on Hey You, the home of reality TV. He's an old children's man. He's an old children's man. He's an old children's man. He's an old children's man. He's an old children's man. He's an old children's man. And he heads up on Monica. And you guys are old pals? Is that how you guys started working together? She started as a babysitter. Really?

We discovered that she was at UCB and really funny, and she was an actor, and then she started working with Kristen, and then she started writing everything for Kristen. And then she directed, she's just running Kristen's life. And so she was always around, and she and I would argue in the kitchen for fun as a hobby, because she's very opinionated, and so am I, and we don't agree on anything.

And so I wanted to start a podcast, and I thought, oh, she would be perfect, because all we do is disagree. And so then we started it and this became very full time. So basically I stole her from Kristen seven years ago. You haven't done a lot of podcasts, have you? I mean, a few, yeah. Do you like them?

Yeah. I love them because I was used to going on talk shows and you have seven minutes or 12 minutes and you got to be fucking on it. And then I started guesting on other people's podcasts like Mark Maron's. I did Mark yesterday. Oh, for his last show?

Well, it's not his last show, but it was the day he announced, but he's wrapping it up in the fall. So he's doing a few more months. Oh, it's not like yesterday it was over. No, but it was the first show since it was public. Oh yeah, how did that feel? I'm sure it's an emotional time for him.

16 years, 1,600 episodes. I know it's a big chunk of his life. It's bonkers. We're midway through that, right? We had 900 episodes last week. And yeah, I've started to think, you know, how long do we do this? Yeah.

It's crazy. I was on a show called Parenthood for six years. That was the longest I had ever worked on anything. And now this is the longest job I've ever had, which is very weird. Not at all because I would want to stop. I love it. I love you.

I've been watching you since True Blood. I've been wanting to meet you for a long time and you just came over to my house and now you have to hang out with me for two hours. I love it. So it's not that I would ever not love it. As a challenge to myself, I just want to be like, okay, you acted for 20 years, you podcasted for 10, what else are we gonna do

before we die kind of challenge. Yeah, how much of your time does it take up? Kind of a lot. We do 162 episodes a year. Yeah, that's a lot. Yeah, so it's three a week. One every other day. And it's all year long.

Okay, so it's not like you do a bunch and then you take a little break. I don't want to bore you with the fucking sausage being made, but I do do that because we want to take summer break, right? So every year around this bunch and then you take a little break. I don't want to bore you with the fucking sausage being made, but I do do that because we want to take summer break, right? So every year around this time, I'm doing two a day, five days a week to build up a little war chest so that I can be with my kids on vacation for a few weeks. Did you see that bus out front?

Yeah. Yeah, that's the family bus. You're driving it to Nashville? Yeah, yeah. Well, first to Idaho and then to Nashville. Amazing. Do you do anything stupid like that? Like, do you have any hobbies when people meet you, they go, oh, I wouldn't have expected that. I mean, I love a good adventure.

That gets me excited. Don't you have a fantasy of being a rock star? I certainly do. Hell yeah. Yeah. If I have an opportunity to go on an adventure, I'll do it. Like I've gone to the South Pole and to Greenland and sail across the Atlantic. You went to the South Pole around Christmas?

Well, cause it's the summer window down there. So that's the only time you get daylight really. Did you feel like you were on another planet? It was trippy. Yeah. Cause we spent three weeks up on the plateau on the ice sheet, basically. The nature documentaries you see from Antarctica

are from the coastline. That's where like all the cute penguins are. But once you're up on the plateau, there's nothing. Is it ice up there? Yeah, it's 10,000 feet of ice. Two miles of ice. Yeah, so we did this thing where we skied across the plateau to the pole.

We skied for three weeks. And it was trippy because once you're up there, the sun is just daylight 24 seven. Going to Greenland or if you're on the coast in Antarctica, the landscape is pretty dramatic. But once you're up on the plateau, it's like a white desert, just ice. There's no topography, it's just completely flat.

So you get bored out of your mind? Yeah, we were 21 skiers, but it's single line formation. It's not like if you're on a hike, you go talk to your buddy, because it's also negative 40. So you don't bundle up and then you got your pulp, your sled with all your gear and food and your tents and everything.

So you're kind of just looking at someone's ass for hours and hours. And you also get a real sense of progress. Cause if you're hiking in the mountains or something, like you look at, all right, we're aiming for that peak tonight. We're going to camp out here and then tomorrow morning we'll hit the peak. This is just head in that general direction for three weeks. And when you camp at night, it looks exactly like it did when you woke up. Yeah.

Did you feel like you were losing your mind at all? Yeah, definitely a little groundhog day. And also it was an incredible experience at the same time because it's just so unreal. Did you go with any friends? No. You didn't know anyone on the trip? No. That's kind of brave.

I was in New York and I met a friend of a friend who is an explorer. And he knew that I was in the military back in Sweden when I was younger, was on a boat, a sailing trip across the Atlantic. So he knew that I was interested in doing other things than hanging out at the Bowery in New York. And we were just out having drinks and he was like, Hey, we're doing this thing next month. Are you available? Do you want to come? It's a charity thing for wounded soldiers and we're going to be down for a month. And I was shooting True Blood at the time. We were wrapping up the TV series here in LA.

Okay, so this is like 2014 or something. Yeah, exactly, it was 10 years ago. We were on hiatus and I was like, you know what, fuck yeah, why not? This is Monica. Hey, nice to meet you. I started with a hug. Oh, we're gonna start with a hand.

Okay, maybe we'll end with a hug. We'll start with a hand shaking, then a hug. See what it looks like. We're rushing in. See what it builds to. How embarrassing, what'd you guys talk about without me? He went on a 21 day cross country ski trip to the South Pole, didn't know anyone on the trip.

Impulse by said, yeah I'll go in 2015. That's wild. Isn't that wild? Yeah. So what it makes me think of, and maybe I'm completely wrong, but I got into off-road racing for a while. And off-road racing is not pleasurable. It's very violent inside of the car.

And I was doing a night race in the middle of the desert in California, and it's just brutal and the visibility's terrible. It's just dust from all the people and you're passing people and it's kind of blind and then it's just so violent. It is a 250 mile race. I had a lot of time to think about,

what is this all about? Like what? Like life? This goal, this pursuit, what is this about? Cause it's objectively not fun. It's uncomfortable. It's dirty. I can't see, we might crash,

but I got to prove that I can win this race. And then now I'm just thinking about my ego in depth, really having to confirm my ego, like what is all of this about? And what will this satiate? Is it a solitary experience? I have a navigator, but he can't see. There's a nav in the dashboard.

He's blind, obviously. I have a blind navigator. I got a headless navigator. But I have a nav in the dashboard that's got the line, cause it's not like you're on a road or anything. There's just a line on a map. But the visibility is so bad and it's dark and the lights that are shining are so fucking bright.

It's illuminating all the dust in the air. I know he can't see the nav because I can't see him. Lots of times, not the whole time. So he's like emotional support animal. Like, what's he doing there? He can't see anything. That's its own story. Like, I bought the car off that guy and he raced forever.

This was like a codependency. Like you need to invite him to the party. God bless him, Lee, because that was my first race. And he's like, I'll be your navigator. I can't put too fine a point on how much you can't see. And so in those moments, I'm like really trying to figure out what I'm doing. Why you're pushing yourself like that. Have you gone on another race since?

Oh, yeah. Oh, you have. If it's like a bucket list thing, it would make sense to do it once and be like, all right, I've done it. Right. That was horrible. I couldn't see shit, but I did it. But I'm curious how you go from that to be like that was horrible I did it and I will do it again next week a few years went by hold on I need to interject interject Dax considers well not considers one of his main identity points is that he's a good driver

He thinks that's part of why people like him none of it's true people like hanging out with me cuz I'm a great driver That's what he really thought for a long time. I know that sounds, but I really did think that. Because where I grew up in Detroit, among all my friends, they did love that I was a great driver. That's why your wife fell for you, right? Because you're a great driver. She would definitely say that. She's so attracted to great drivers. I'm one of ten great drivers she's dated. Yeah, do you think on like riot, anyone's writing like great driver? I doubt it. Several off-road races.

That's an identity marker, so that's part of it. If you think I don't need to go do that again, a part of your identity will be fucked with. It's scary. Okay, now back to you because you're our guest. Yeah, have we started this? Always, we are always just rolling. Oh wow.

Does that scare you? Well, I haven't, my have we started this? Always, we are always just rolling. Oh, wow. Does that scare you? Well, I haven't, my radio voice, this is like, hey, what were you saying, Dax? Good. We finally got your real voice. The world has been waiting. Hey, Dax, have we started shooting? No one told me.

Okay, now back to your skiing trip. Back to me. Yeah, do you two suffer from constructing this image of yourself and being a bit of a romantic and I'm an adventurer and then you get in these situations and yes, you're proud you've made it and you've survived and I do believe in that, but do you have those moments where you go, what is this all about?

I tell you this much, I haven't been back since. For me, it was more like, that was great. I did go back to Greenland, so I've been there twice, but the skiing trip definitely felt like a once in a lifetime thing. I didn't expect to get an answer to this question, and it was gonna be way further down in the conversation. But as a True Blood super fan,

when I was out, I was so obsessed, specifically with your character. I love bodies. I love men's bodies so much. I noticed you started this show really huge and then you had a couple of seasons where you were smaller. And I'm now thinking, did this three weeks of doing cross-country skiing, did you come up skinnier?

We did it before the seventh, which would have been the final season. Yeah, you lose a lot of weight down there because you ski for 12 hours a day. So of course you're struggling to get as much sustenance in. If you sat on a lawn chair there, you would probably burn 3000 calories a day. Just staying warm. Yeah.

I don't know if I lost weight, but I know that the final season, I gained like 25 pounds over the course of that season because I was going straight from the final season of True Blood into Tarzan. Okay. HPL were kind enough to be like, this kind of new is definitely gonna be an issue cause I was growing my hair out and was just eating a lot of steak and working out.

So if you look at the final season of True Blood. You're a meathead by the end. I think it takes place over two weeks or something, but Vampire Eric got big and his hair grew. Yeah, yeah. That was one of my weird preoccupations when I'd watch the show is I was like, well, if they can't die, they can't change, right?

This guy is fucking bigger. How's this vampire? And if they ever wanted to do like a reunion or something. You couldn't do it? No, cause we're old as fuck now. Yeah, the only thing would be CG. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Wait, back to the skiing.

I may have missed this, but did you go just cause like you were invited and it sounded fun or did you go because you needed an escape? I think it was a little bit of both. It was for a charity called Walking with the Wounded, a British charity for wounded soldiers. And they were all set to go a couple of weeks after this night out. And he basically said like, hey, there's a spot on one of the teams. It sounds like you might have been drunk when you said yes.

Very much so. Okay there we go. I'm trying to read in between the lines. There we go. The following morning I woke up and I was like what happened last night? You go to the South Pole my friend. How good of a cross-country skier are you? And I can't ski at all.

I woke up and was like I hope I didn't do anything stupid last night. I'm sure he's fine. And then get like an itinerary with a plane ticket down to Antarctica, to this Russian base on the coast. And you're not one to back out. Then I was guilt-ridden and I was like, no, I can't. For the soldiers, you gotta show up. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So that's how I ended up down there. That's fantastic. Can I tell you, I'm so stupid. I did not know until I started researching you today that you're related to your dad. Peter Sarsgaard. We get that a lot, Peter. A lot of people think we're siblings.

He's the only Sarsgaard you're not related to though, right? Yeah, cause he's Sarsgaard and we're Sarsgaard. And you're a Sarsgurld. Yeah, with a little oomla over the second A. Obviously I know who your dad is from a bazillion movies, but I had no idea. I did, because I'm up to date on most things. Good Will Hunting's her religion.

My favorite movie of all time. Is it? I love it so much. Did you love that movie? Or is it hard to love it because your dad's in it? It was his first, well, he was in Hunt for Red October. You remember that one? I do.

He did. Sean Connery? Yeah, yeah, yeah. But other than that, he hadn't really worked in the States. So when I was growing up, a small role in that. Sean Connery? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sean Connery. But other than that, he hadn't really worked in the States. So when I was growing up, dad worked primarily in Sweden. And then he did a movie called Breaking the Waves, Lars von Trier in 96. And that got him Good Will Hunting.

So Good Will Hunting was his first Hollywood movie in a bit more substantial role. But can you enjoy? I loved the movie. It was on so many different levels. I was also excited for dad to be in a Hollywood movie. That was exciting. I was like, wow, this is really cool.

And then it turns out that it was like a really good Hollywood movie. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, yeah. So it was a good start. It's been downhill since then. A lot of my fascination with you and what I want to get into a lot is

I love all the cultural stuff. I went last summer, we did a family vacation and we were in Norway for two weeks, and we drove through Sweden, and an old man assaulted me in a gas station. That's what we did. Yeah. Welcome to Sweden.

Wait, is it? Are people angry there? That is not the reputation. Well, it's very simple. I had pulled up to the gas pump, and my credit card wouldn't be taken by the machine, I'm assuming, cause I'm American. So I had to go inside to use it.

And the man behind me was so furious that I had left the pump and gone inside and now my kids are buying some treats. And so I'm gonna pay for the treats and the gas at the same time. And so I'm just kind of at the counter and this guy comes in and he's yelling at me in Swedish. E-de-be-de-fe-de-be-de-fee-de-be-de-fee.

Smorgie, smorgie, smorgie, smorgie. Sounds very intimidating, right? Yeah. He's older, but he's my size, right? And then obviously he's poking me, and I don't do well with that. But my kids are there, so I'm ignoring this, and I'm kind of putting together with context clues what I've done. And so he then leaves, and then he stands at the window,

and he's just staring at me outside. He's still going crazy. I'm calm, calm, calm, calm, calm. And I come out and I'm walking to the car to put my guess and then he gets right in my face and bumps me. And then I lose it. And a nice Swedish person was watching the whole thing. Also when I lost it, all of a sudden he goes, oh, why are you so mad?

That's a bad Swedish accent. But I go, I go, oh, now you fucking speak English. Cause I was speaking English in there and he was acting like he didn't know. But luckily this nice person that was watching, he got involved. He basically started yelling at the guy. He's like fucking calm down.

There's five other pumps, go over there. Why are you treating these people like this? And then the wife was out of the car and then my wife is trying to put me in the car. It was- The angry guy's wife. Yes, there's not a lot of the car getting involved. Was she also upset? She was upset too, they're a perfect pair.

She was upset with you as well? Yes. Oh, she was defending her man there. As you should. Yeah. Compounded with, I could also sense, she's like, oh, here we are, we're at the gas station and he's in a fight with a foreigner.

Just imagine having to be his wife, that sucks. It made for a great story. Now that we're through it, I like it. And can't we say that's just his personality and that's not about being a Swedish man? No, yes, that's not representative of Swedish people at all. I think you can find passive aggressive people

in other places as well. Yeah, from there, everywhere. It's not exclusively a Swedish thing, I hope. But you guys have this kind of contradiction, I think, which is I was on a URL train with my girlfriend and these four Swedish kids traveling. One of the girls had done an exchange student program in Georgia and she fucking hated it, right?

She hated how everyone's like, hello, how you doing there, Missy? Like all the pleasantries. I'm obviously generalizing here, but I think we do, but sweets are also quite. Direct? No, we want consensus. That's why I think we do, but sweets are also quite direct. No, we want consensus. That's why I think people can be a bit passive aggressive because people aren't really direct and being like, I don't like what you're doing.

That guy was an anomaly. Like that's not very common in Sweden. People would rather be like, Oh, this guy's leaving his car out there. And it's like, Oh yeah. And giving you like a side glance. That's kind of what I expected. That would be more Swedish. You'll never see a sweet talk to a random person

on the subway or on the bus kind of like, hey, what's up? Mind your own business, look down, no eye contact. When you're with friends, then people are chatty. And then like those people you were on the train with, couple of drinks for sure. Yeah, yeah. Then people open up and then they're very chatty,

but not with strangers I'd say. But my question all the way back to goodwill hunting is, goodwill hunting to me feels very American, American exceptionalism, the individual. I have this genius gift. I'm finally discovered for having this genius gift. I'm curious, is that a barrier at all? That kind of story, it's such an American story.

This guy's so exceptional and no one will see it. And then they see it. When you're in Sweden or when you're Swedish and you're watching that, are you a little bit like, what is this? Tall poppy. So, it's culture very much no tall poppy syndrome. Which is kind of ironic

because everyone there is like seven feet tall. It's a funny place to end. It's true. Tall poppy syndrome. Yeah. But there's this work called Janta Lagen, the law of Janta in Sweden. Basically, that's the meaning of it. No, it's all popular. Like stick to your lane. Don't think you're special. Don't think you have special talents.

Don't dream big. It's about consensus fitting in. And I think it's good and bad aspects of that. It is a very egalitarian and equal society in many ways. Women have had it better there historically than a lot of other places. We're trying to change that, but. Yeah, they still have it pretty good. Well, let me know if you need help. I'll come over.

Yeah, with your big car. Working hard to get some misogyny in there. My off-road car. Yeah, your off-road car. You can't see shit. I see some dirty dishes, ladies. Oh, gross. But you know what's so true is all of these approaches

all have value and they all have trade-offs. I had this experience where Kristen was doing press and we were in Hamburg, Germany for a week. And you cannot be in Hamburg, Germany and not appreciate how fucking perfectly everything runs. The shops are spotlessly clean, everything's on time, everything's orderly. And I was just euphoric with how my OCD was that piece.

But then we went directly to Paris. It was fucking graffiti and fucking shit all over. And I'm like, I'm horny and hungry. And I'm like, oh, I like this too. That trade-off I want. I think we're inclined to label one of these approaches the best. It's just what trade-off do you want?

Yeah, I recently moved back to Sweden after many years out here. 20? I guess around 20, both here and New York. It was a bit of, I wouldn't say culture shock because I was obviously born and raised there and I would go back over the years, but I haven't had a place there in almost 20 years.

I love being back in many ways. In my heart, it has always felt like home. My parents still live there, my siblings and childhood friends and everything. And like you said, shit works. It's peaceful and quiet and nice, except for that guy on the gas station. People tend to be quite polite. If anyone could find a bit of a beating.

But the flip side of that would be there is a sense of conformity. I think a sprinkle of anarchy would be good for Sweden. If you walk down the street in Stockholm, people look great, but they all kind of look the same. So there's a lack of individuality there that sometimes I'm like, it'd be nice to have a bit more anarchy here. I don't think you should feel guilty about that.

Even if I moved back to Detroit, where I'm from, when I'm back, I go, same thing. Oh, on a cellular level, there's lakes, it's green. I love it. Fills me up. And I go, oh right, the culture I've been living in for 30 years is much different. And I'm very aware of it when I'm back.

Have you been out here for 30 years? Yeah. Only LA for better or worse. I moved from New York to Stockholm. And that was definitely a bit of culture shock. Stockholm is a decent sized city. It's like 2 million people. There's definitely a culture and great restaurants.

There's life, but it's not New York city and definitely not in terms of the intensity of the city and the intensity of the people. Have you found yourself at all out and you're like, oh that was pretty American. I gotta reel it in a little bit. My poppy is growing. This poppy is getting too tall. It's a bloom. Probably not. But you're also famous. I mean that adds another element to it probably. Well I also think all those years when I lived out here I would go back obviously because my family was out there. I'd learned how to dial it up or down. You know I landed and I'm like hello, I also think all those years when I lived out here, I would go back, obviously, because my family was out there. I'd learn how to dial it up or down.

You know, I landed, I'm like, hello, I'm back home. Like, yeah. But it's a perfect place to be famous because this is what Will Ferrell says. So Will Ferrell has a house there and he's there every summer. And he says he loves it because he goes there and nobody acknowledges the fact that he's Will Ferrell.

Yeah, people are very aware of your personal space. Unless you're at a gas station. Unless you're at a gas station and if you're a loud American. Who was that guy? You're a density. Well, the other thing is, tell me if I'm wrong. I know it didn't help that there were a ton of snacks

on the counter. These fucking American indulgence. What's the beautiful word, the just right word? Log on. We were so not log on. That's not log word, the just right word? Log on. We were so not log on. That's not log on. No, my kids are like, yeah, I want that and I want that. And I'm like, yeah, we're in the car for eight hours.

Get everything. So this dude was behind you to see as your kids like grabbing chocolate bars. I'm spending $300 at the gas station. Meanwhile, your car, your big diesel car still running out there. Very conservative car. I knew better.

One thing I loved learning about you today, it confirmed my hunch, which is you grow up in Sweden, you have, I guess, five at this point, younger siblings and dad is a famous actor, but it's more than that. He's an artist and there's poets over and there's late nights. And you just longed for him to drive a Saab and go to work from 9 a.m. till 5 p.m. and wear a gray suit. And I also want to mention that driving a Saab in Sweden is a different connotation than driving a Saab here in the States.

Here you're making a statement if you drive a Saab. Yeah, it's the little NPR liberal going around like in Sweden, it was very much you drive to the office. It's a Toyota. Toyota, due to wear a gray suit, drive to the cubicle in the office, in their gray Saab.

It was very utilitarian and very quote unquote normal. And that's what I longed for. And you wanted that. Why? You can now look back and find the comedy in that, right? I still want a Saab. Oh no, everyone should own a Saab. Everyone should own, we can all agree on that, right?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. This has nothing to do with anything, but I worked for General Motors for 14 years, the car company, and there was a period of time where GM bought a big chunk of Saab. So all of a sudden Saab was integrated into our work. And so we'd have these big car shows for journalists and they'd show the new product

and we'd have these Swedish engineers come over. And it's very memorable. The key for a Saab is in the middle between the seats. This is the only car in the world that has the key between the middle. This is the only car in the world that has the key between the middle. And so the Swedish guy said, we've found that an inordinate amount of car crashes, rollovers, you can't reach the key.

So it's better here. And I was like, that can't possibly be the explanation. He said that? Yes. So he's basically saying the car's bad. No. It rolls over a lot. No, it's all about safety. The other car was the Volvo.

Towards the end of the Saab era, when they were bought by GM, they came out with like a SUV Saab that was basically a GM car. And I remember that that was like an existential crisis for Saab lovers. Of course. We McDonaldized. It was just like they slapped a Saab logo on a GM truck. Not that GM trucks weren't great, but the identity was gone.

And a year later, Saab went under. Oh. Yeah. But what happened? You thought he was just too flashy? He wasn't flashy. He was just too bohemian. He was naked a lot. He'd bring friends over and his dad would be bare naked.

As a kid, I didn't care. And when I got older, I didn't care. But it was those teenage years, those were tough. I can't blame it all on my dad. I come from a big family of artists. My uncle was an author and other uncle was a composer and painter. Most people in the extended family

had some kind of artistic profession and were quite eccentric and lovely, fantastic people, but they weren't wearing gray suits and they weren't driving sobs. A lot of tall poppies. Yeah. Too many tall poppies in one house. As you know, I'm not a fan. So long for some normalcy. I didn't want my friends to come over and be like, oh, this is like a circus. All these weirdos running around drinking wine 10 o'clock into Tuesday morning and dancing samba in the living room, you know?

You also had your own kind of experience with it, right? You did your first movie at seven, that's all good. But then at 13, you get onto this very popular show. Well, it wasn't even a show. It was a 50 minute long TV movie, but this was back in the 1930s. So we only had like two channels in Sweden, way before cable.

So it was two channels. So if something was on, the whole country would watch it basically. I was 13 and suddenly just because of that one little thing, I was- Recognizable. Yeah, a little, I mean, it was just weird. That's more than that.

There were people out in front of the house, yeah? Yeah, I mean- Oh, you're being such a medium poppy. Be a tall poppy on this show. Yes, this is a tall poppy friendly show. Yeah. I became a star. Great, great.

That was the biggest thing to ever hit. A sweetest star was born. And for someone who was longing for a father in a gray suit, driving a gray Saab to the gray office, it was rough. I didn't like being recognized. I didn't like going to school and kids at school being like, ah, I saw the movie.

It made you self-conscious? Incredibly self-conscious, yeah. My confidence was just down the drain. I remember being 13, 14, and if a girl showed a little bit of interest in me, I was like, she's just a fan of the movie. That's it. Oh. You wouldn't believe. No, no.

And you weren't like, but I'll take it. No, it just crushed me. I was like, this is terrible. And I've done one 50 minute made for TV movie. I don't wanna keep doing this. Yeah, so you retired at 13. I retired, threw in the towel at 13. Wow, I think that's the theme of this. The theme of this is give up everyone quit Do what you're gonna do to 13 and then get neutral. Yeah, don't you think it's human nature to want whatever you don't have?

Which is like I was 13 With a fucking mohawk and crazy punk rock clothes. Please look at me. Please be a fan of me, because I didn't have it. Did you want to be an actor at the time? No, I wanted girls. I love girls. I wanted to be popular as well, but I wanted to earn it. I didn't feel like I earned it

if someone had seen me on television. Then I'd be like, well, you're into the character that I play in the movie, you're not into me. Plus, even though my dad was an actor, and my younger brother, when he was five, six, he was adamant about, I'm going to be an actor. And I wasn't. I'd done a couple of odd jobs here and there, but it wasn't like I was pursuing it. It just kind of happened.

Yeah. My first thing when I was seven, dad's friend, Alain Yadval, he's like an iconic Swedish actor and director. And he's going to direct the film. He needed a seven-year-old kid. And he was over with the rest of He needed a seven-year-old kid. And he was over with the rest of the Bohemians, just drinking wine at 10 o'clock on a Tuesday morning.

Was just like, hey, do you want to be in my movie? And that's how I got started. Classic case of nepotism. Nebo baby. It wasn't a difficult decision. Cause again, I was like, I don't wanna be an actor anyways. I just want to drive a Saab. So I just kind of stopped doing it.

Mom is a doctor. Yeah. Did you at any point think I'm going to be like mom? No. My other brother, Sam, the third in the order, he's a doctor. So he followed mom. Oh, he is same kind of doctor. No.

Gynecologist. They were on a clinic together. Gyno clinic. They tend to do the appointments together. Yeah. I gotta get a second set of eyes on here. Let me get my son in here. Uh.

Uh. Uh. Uh. Uh. Uh. Uh. Uh. Uh.

Uh. Uh. Uh. Uh. Uh. Uh. Uh. Uh.

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This is Nick. And this is Jack. We're best friends, ex-finance guys, and resident 90s experts. And every week on our podcast, The Best Idea Yet, we're bringing you the untold stories behind your favorite products. For instance, can you guess which billion dollar fashion company went viral thanks to a rhinestone covered tracksuit? Or which cartoon turned four turtles

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I was out of the nest. I was in my late 20s. Okay, great. So you grew up with them together. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Would I be wrong to assume those are really different dispositions? A doctor and a bohemian. Yeah. But she's quite creative

and has that kind of artistic side. She dabbled in acting when she was like 19, 20. She went to theater school in Stockholm and was considering it. How'd she meet your dad? My uncle, my mom's older brother, is my dad's best friend. Oh, nice.

And they had country homes on, Earl on this island in the Baltic, in the same little village. So that's how dad met Johan, his best friend. So they played every homes on, on this island in the Baltic in the same little village. So that's how dad made Johan his best friend. So they played every summer on the island and then- She got breast. That's exactly what happened. She was like this annoying little kid.

And then one summer dad gets there and he's like, Oh, hello. Yeah. Somebody who grew last year. Yeah. We lived in the same building in Stockholm. So Johan and his wife and kids lived on the third floor. We were on the second floor.

Oh. Our entire childhood, we were on the second floor. Our entire childhood, we basically grew up as one big family. And you have tons of cousins. This sounds very fun because there's six of you guys. Eight now because dad has two kids with Megan, his wife. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You have a younger brother that's like 19 years younger than you or 20 or something. No more than that.

Cool, the youngest is 13, he'll be 13. And I'm 25. You're 25, so that's 12 years older. I was 12 when you were born. Any questions guys? Are we good? The youngest is 13, he'll be 13. And I'm 25, so. You're 25, so 12 years old. I was 12 when he was born. Any questions, guys? Are we good? I was surprised to see your age today.

We're almost the same age. You're almost the same age. We're a year and a half apart. I was surprised to see that. Because he looks so youthful. You do look very youthful. I guess it's that vampire thing. That Scandinavian.

Skin. The whole thing. Don't make me smile, because the Botox will like crack. Your face will like, your cheek will fall off. Oh my goodness, I'm so sorry, Golden. Do you have glue here? Okay, so I guess the next big chapter in your life is joining the Navy. I was, my teenage years, adamant about not following dad and not becoming an actor,

and was like most teenagers I guess like trying to figure out what I wanted to do with my life. I was into architecture so I was considering that a little bit. I love drawing houses and I was like oh this would be fun but then someone was like oh it's mostly math it's a lot of engineering and stuff and I was like that doesn't sound crazy. Wait I gotta figure out the structural integrity of this thing? Yeah, no I wanna draw a cool shape. I just wanna draw a cool shape. And then yeah I was 19 and I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do and some recruiting officer

gave me a pamphlet as I was walking through a park in Stockholm and it was this unit called Sack Yuck and it sounded really cool and it was out of the archipelago and it was James Bond stuff. So I was like, hey, that list looks cool. What I'm learning is that this plus this story from the bar that ends up in it. The ski trip, yeah.

It's like if anyone's in the audience, pitch you something. Yeah, you're easily convinced. You're liable to just leap at it. Yeah. Like you meet a guy in the park and then 18 months in the Navy. Yeah, that sounds great. I'm surprised you haven't been married a lot of times.

Yes, I am too a little bit. For this exact reason. Yeah, you like me? Let's get married. That's fun. Yeah, you wanna get married? Sure. I don't know why I joined.

Definitely not for any patriotic reasons or maybe it had something to do with rebelling against my Bohemian family and doing something very different. Or it was just for a teenager. I don't know what I wanted to do. And again, this was post-Cold War before Russia started invading all these countries. So it was a time where everyone was like, this will be the everlasting peace. There will never be a war in Europe ever again. Don't even know why we're doing this, but let's do it. Pretty much.

Military service used to be mandatory in Sweden. Late 90s, early 2000s, it was technically still mandatory, but it was very easy to get out of it. But again, I didn't even try it because I was like, I didn't know what I wanted to do. This sounded fun. I knew that I wasn't gonna go have to shoot it and so on. I'm not going to go on deployment.

Selfishly, this sounds like a kind of interesting way to spend a year and a half, I guess. Would it be too generic to guess that in the absence of great structure, that also this idea that this is antithetical to Bohemian, that maybe you craved that experience? Yeah. I don't know how much it had to do with rebelling against my dad, but for sure. I was probably drawn to a little bit of the notion of structure. Was he perplexed when you signed up?

Not really. Yeah. He's too many of you. He doesn't keep track. He's got so many kids. Ones that have fire in the kitchen. Yeah. He was like, who are you again? Well, that's another thing having so many people, maybe the independence part was interesting Very much so because again, it was a big household

Yo, on my uncle my dad's best friend lived upstairs my grandma and grandpa lived across the street So this was like within three blocks of South Stockholm the whole extended family So it was always lots of people in hindsight amazing. It was beautiful But as in 17 18 year old when I try to find my own path and independence, that had to do with it. I'm gonna go off and just be out on my own on an island and the archipelago far from all the scars guards. That makes a ton of sense.

And I hated it. I don't recommend doing it. Just move to another city, you can be independent. You don't wanna have to join the military for a year and a half to get independence. I don't recommend it. Okay, so then you go, you get out of there and then you go to have to join the military for a year and a half to get independence. I don't recommend it. Okay, so then you go, you get out of there, and then you go to England to Leeds, and you

do six months in college, and there you decide, actually I'm going to act. I was kind of at a loss. I didn't really know what I was interested in. I remember thinking, I had fun when I was a kid, when I was on set, and not in a pretentious way of like, oh, the process or finding a character, because I was a kid. I still don't have a process. but I remember the camaraderie, the sense of family, the energy on a set was fun. And obviously seeing my dad and how much joy he got of his job.

And I was 21 instead of 13. I could also see that a lot of people aren't happy when they get out of bed in the morning to go to work. Those gray sob drivers aren't necessarily singing on the way to work. So it was like, oh,. singing on the way to work. So it was like, oh, dad's kind of blessed to have a job that he's really passionate about. My fear was that in 30 years from now,

I'll be looking back and I'll be like, oh, I should have tried acting. I think that was a good hunch. Truly, I think if you were 48 right now and you would be like, why didn't I wanna do that? And then I applied to a theater school in New York, theater college, Marymount. Do you know what the current ratio is,

guys to girls at Marymount? 70-30. It's 81% female, 19% male. I was gonna say 80, I went down to 70. It felt too tall poppy. Yeah. Too extreme. Was it that way when you went?

Probably, yeah. Do you at that point trust that girls like you? Have we gotten to a point where you can accept that girls like you?? Probably, yeah. Do you at that point trust that girls like you? Have we gotten to a point where you can accept that girls like you? No, I wasn't very popular there. How could you not have been? You're 11 feet tall, you're from another country. This is all so exotic and fun.

Hello, New York. Hello, New York. Be careful. What are we doing? You're shit-spilled. I want to take a bite. Awesome, you're back it. I love it. Did you have an accent?

So dad did a movie in Budapest when I was 13 and I went to an American school there. So I was there for six months. I had a great time in New York. I remember feeling like, oh, this is kind of fun when we started the classes and we were workshopping and we were doing little place and stuff. And I was terrible, but I remember feeling like at least it's fun. So I dropped out. You had a pattern at that point.

You loved to go to places for six months because you did six months in Leeds and then you did six months in New York. So I dropped out. Wait, why? I need a real reason. Yeah, you're gonna get real. The alarm on his watch went off.

Six months, time to go. For love. Oh, for love. For love, true love. Okay, in Sweden. Well, true love. Okay. In Sweden. Well, we met, I was in Sweden for a couple of weeks in the summer between Leeds and going to New York. And I met a girl and fell in love, moved to New York.

The school was great. The long distance thing was hard. This was many years ago, way before Zoom and FaceTime and all that, it was like call from a phone booth once a week. Yeah, we did. Yeah, yeah, we did. Pictures, would you take pictures of each other and send them? Yeah, but it would take three months for them to arrive.

Oh, I got my hair cut since then. I don't look like that anymore. Yeah. I want to say that she went back to her ex-boyfriend. So I'm going to say that. Okay. And it also makes sense now while he said no girls like them at that college because he was in love with someone else.

They all liked me. I get it, all the pieces. Yeah. And I lived on Times Square. Oh, wow. And I remember going to Virgin Megastore. You can listen to the CDs. Yes. And I remember listening to like really melancholic music.

Sure. You love sick. Like Jewel and just feeling heartbroken. I remember standing there around the corner from my house listening to these foolish games. You know that? Oh, I felt very lonely. Oh, yeah. So lonely.

I didn't know New York and I was like, oh Times Square is great. It's very central. You can get anywhere. And it was very central. The epicentral. Yeah, it was on 44th and Broadway. So right there. Not the most charming neighborhood to live in really.

You're heartbroken and kind of broke. I didn't have money, so you're in the city with great restaurants everywhere, but you can't really partake in it. And everyone's so social right in front of your face. So yeah, I was like, this is crushing me. I got to go home and work on this relationship and save it. So I dropped out and moved back. I did not save the relationship.

We got back together. We didn't know each other. We'd spent two weeks together in the summer and then I spent six months going to a Virgin Megasaur listening to Jules. Yeah, you're in love with the idea of what was going on. The idea of it, like crying and this idea of what we were and how great we were together.

And then I got home. Again, I hate to point this out, but it's the pattern. That's right. It's the pattern, like you met her for two weeks and you're like, yes, I will have a long distance relationship with you for the next six months. And if we can ski somewhere, impossible.

And now I'm coming home, we're going to be together for the rest of our lives. And then two weeks later, it's like, yeah, it didn't really work out. It's very, you're not going to like this, bohemian. Oh, damn. Am I my father? You might be.

We all are. We all are just our fathers. Oh, I need that sob right now. I can't give You might be. We all are. We all are just our fathers. Oh, I need that sob right now. I can't give him the gray suit and the sob. You have money. I think you should buy a gray suit and a gray 90s sob. And I think once in a while you should suit up

and just play in your imagination. Yeah, and a little briefcase. Pretend that I'm going to my office. Yeah, wave to your child. You have a two-year-old now? Yeah, build a little cubicle in my apartment. But just rent a little cubicle. Yeah.

You'll pack your lunch. Yeah. You'll get it out. What a dream. Sometimes it does sound like a dream. You know where you're gonna go. You know you could work at this job for 50 years. You have colleagues more than three months

like you do on a movie. There's a stability to it that is kind of alluring. Yeah. Yeah, there's a fantasy that you could kind of turn your brain off. For me, that's the kind of fantasy is, oh yeah, be nice to not think or worry. Cause that's someone else's problem if this business works. Right. But as an actor, what we do, you're in charge of whether it works or not.

Yeah. Anxiety ridden. Yeah. Now give me that sob. Yeah, give it to me. It feels so safe. Okay. So you moved to LA after that, LA or New York?

Six months later, no. It was a bit longer than that. I was working at a coffee shop, at a clothing store. I was working as a bus boy in Stockholm. Now would be a good time to ask you, do you connect to the sex symbol aspect of you? Do you understand it? Oh, 100%.

I know you can't technically say yes, but. I technically just did. That's the clip we're gonna pull. I deserve that title. You do. We've had many guests that are sex symbols. But have you had any sexier than me? No.

Thank you guys. But we have one on Thursday. That's gonna rival you. One's coming that's gonna blow you out of the fucking water. Are you serious? Guess who would that be? Who could blow you the fuck?

Where people are like, well, I didn't even see that guy. There's only one. Madeleine Albright is coming in. You got it. Oh my God. You are so smart. You should have stuck with architecture.

You could have done the math. It's a dude? Yeah. People under the age of 35 would still pick you. Under 35? I don't know. That's too much of a clue. I know, sorry, I had to give a clue. I don't know. You're 35. I don't know. That's too much of a clue. I know, sorry, I had to give a clue.

I was gonna give another clue. Speaking of men's bodies. Brad Pitt? Yes. Boom. Brad's coming. Yeah. It's a pretty big deal. See, that's the power of Brad.

You looked off for half a second. You could see him. Oh, I can see him. I can see him all right. We all can see him. It's like universal, isn't it? Oh yeah. It's so powerful.

That's why it's not even an insult. Can I come sit in the corner? Of course. It's gonna be a busy corny, or my wife will be here, everyone we know will be here. How do you know him? I do know him a little bit. Have you met him?

No, I'm excited. We've been talking about what she's gonna wear for a long time. Yeah, I met him at a dinner party years ago. Did you get on with him? Oh, I did. I don't think he liked me very much, but... You liked him.

No, I was up in his personal space a lot. Very unswedish of you. Yeah. You went full American when you were around Brad Pitt. How could you nod? He's the picture of an American hunk. I just wanted to feel his musk, his sense. I need to get close.

But Fight Club, what a physique. Come on. God, it fucking hurts. But still, he's tight. Fucking once upon a time. Elebrates, double now. Did you just see this new GQ thing that just came out with him?

Oh, he's dirty, he's filthy. He's riding that motorcycle shaved head. You know why I have this dumb mohawk? Cause I saw that video, I'm like, I can't shave my head, I can't pull off a shaved head. I've tried it. What else can we do in that world? And that's what happened.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I saw that on Friday, I gave myself a mohawk Saturday morning. Did you really? Swear to God, this is all real. When I walked in, I got a little Brad Pitt vibe from you. God bless you. You know all that cars and like from that photo shoot as well,

like little dirt, little oil. All stinky. Super masculine, so masculine. Oh, I'm glad we did that little side detour. It's really comforting. This is universal. It's like a law of physics. It's like comforting in that we know.

We argue about everything, but we can all agree. We all wanna make out with Brad Pitt. Right? They should send him to the Ukraine. They should send him everywhere. Yes. And everyone should go, what are we doing? We all love this guy.

Yeah. Put that on your arm. Yeah. We all believe in the same thing, Brad. He saved humanity. He really could. He's the one, he's the chosen one. We should ask him why he hasn't.

He's being kind of lazy, actually. Well, that's part of his charm. He's right, his dirty motorcycle down in South Sudan. With a white flag. Yeah. Plant that white flag. Yeah. Plant that white flag. Make love, not war, guys. Honestly, God, if they said to both sides,

if you guys put your guns down, Brad Pitt's gonna make love to a very beautiful person in front of everyone. They go, fuck these guns. Yeah, 100%. You know, you have to be able to put your name in to be the person he loves. Oh, he makes love, too.

So maybe it could be you. It's a raffle situation. What if it's one from each side of the conflict? So it's like a little threesome. It would be a threesome, that's a great point. Right? Yeah, you gotta include everyone. Because you wanna unite the two sides.

There won't be peace. Wow, we really figured it out. It wasn't even that hard. It's just two minutes. Smart people figured about this and we just figured it out. You're welcome, humanity. Okay, I wanna be sincere.

We've had a lot of guests, they've come to occupy a very heart-throbbing space, but they cannot connect to that because that's not who necessarily they were growing up. So I'm just wondering when you're working in this coffee shop, are you having a heart-throbbing effect on people when you were not famous? You can't answer that question, right?

It's a hard one to answer. Well, let's say this. Jude Law basically said yes. Yeah, and I loved it. He was honest. You've been to Sweden. I'm definitely not a tall poppy in Sweden. Like I look like everyone else there.

That's a good point. I wish I had the narrative of like, I was bullied when I was a kid and no one looked at me and I could never get a girl and then it all changed. I was kind of popular as a teenager. Yeah, yeah. I was a six out of 10, I'd say. What I set out to accomplish when I was 13,

when I stopped acting, I just wanted to be normal. And I kind of succeeded in that. So you go back, you go to LA. I really just want to get to one zone in your career that I'd imagine was uniquely hard. We're similar in that I was out here forever before I started working. I booked the first audition I went to.

Zoolander? Yeah. That's fine, cause then nothing happened for a long time American film wise. We don't need to talk about that. Let's just focus on the fact that I booked my first audition. It's very Ashton Kutcher of you. So it's one for one.

You should have gone back to Sweden. Well, I did. Oh, you did. I was working as a hot barista in Stockholm. Dad was shooting a movie out here in LA, and we all came out to visit, and my dad's manager was just like, I'll send you out to an audition if you want.

And it was for a Zoolander, and I booked that baby. Yeah. I didn't have representation out here. I'd never been on an audition. I'd never auditioned in Sweden for anything. I was just like, oh, I guess this is how Hollywood works. You walk into a room and Ben Stiller's sitting there and then you're like, all right, let's go to New York.

And then listen to a little wham and drive down and have a gasoline fight. So then I went back to Stockholm. My dad's manager was like, that went all right. You should come back when you're done with whatever you're doing out there. And you serve all those coffees. Yeah, then I came out in, I think 2003 maybe,

incredibly naive thinking, all right, Hollywood. I finally decided. You're welcome, Hollywood, I'm here. Here I am. I'll take it. Yeah, you'll find me at Starbucks on Sunset Boulevard. Come get me, Spielberg. And he didn't, and no one else did either. Because Zoolander's 2001 and Generation Kills 2008.

We shot it in 2007. So were you here the majority of those six years? Yes, sir. Yes, okay. This is what I want to live in because again, I did that. It's the most relatable part of your story. Yeah. I like to be relatable.

Yeah, we all do. But I didn't have on top of that, well, my dad's great at it and he's really successful and I should be able to do this. Was that a compounding or was it fine or was it grueling? The dad relationship wasn't really grueling or I didn't feel like an external pressure to like live up to or reach his level of success.

It was hard because I couldn't get a job. And the fact that I came out being very naive thinking like, oh, it's super easy. Zoolander was a great experience. It was also like a super fun movie. And then I found myself auditioning for things that I didn naive thinking like, oh, it's super easy. Zoolander was a great experience. It was also like a super fun movie. And then I found myself auditioning for things that I didn't really like. But I was also in a position where I was at another agency then. And I was constantly worried that they would drop me

because I wasn't booking anything. You know, like paying to get new headshots all the time. Pilot season, he would audition a lot, not book anything. And then it would be like weeks without an audition. When they finally called and they like, we have this audition, even if I felt like this is terrible and I'm so not right for it. You had to do it.

You had to do it. Cause then like I was constantly worried. They would be like, well, you know what? It's time for us to part ways. I don't know if you have to do that, but auditioning for stuff that you don't believe in, where you feel like you're completely wrong for it. You feel dirty in your soul.

It was horrible. You're already worried you're not good enough to do this job. and then when you go in and try to put your square peg in that round hole, it just is like, oh my God. Sometimes you think you're too good to do it. You're like, I'm better than this horrible piece of shit, and then you don't book it, and you're like,

oh my God, what is this like? And then you get from there to being like, I'm clearly not better than this horrible piece of shit, but I'm so wrong for it. And I know I'm not going to book it, but I still have to go into that room and get humiliated. So yeah, several years of that. Were you going out and having fun?

Did you have friends? Yeah. Well, the first couple of years, I went out with a bunch of friends from Sweden. First, we rented like a little pool house in Santa Monica. So four of us lived in a small pool house with this Swedish lady. And then we're renting a small apartment. So we had each other.

I didn't know anyone else out here. We definitely not plugged into the city or the nightlife. Okay. On Saturdays we would play ping pong in our pool house in Santa Monica and drink beer and then take a cab into Hollywood to try to get into a nightclub knowing that we wouldn't get in.

Yep. Four dudes get turned around and then happily get back in the cab and go back to Santa Monica and keep freaking out, play more ping pong. So that was like our weekend routine. Having done that, do you ever now, this happened to me, I went to Craig's. Have you ever been to Craig's in West Hollywood? It's a restaurant.

There's always paparazzi there. It's a hotspot. It's a hotspot. And I just imagine you going to Craig's now or coming out. It'd be a frenzy. It'd be like a whole to do. And I wonder how you can sort of reconcile that as someone who would just like stand in the line at the club

and never be able to get in. And now they would die for you to come in. Can you integrate that? No, I just remember after a couple of years, we met a Swedish girl out here and she was so nice. She moved out of here when she was like 20, but she was very plugged into the city and she would take pity on us.

We would try to get into a nightclub, couldn't get in. And my buddy called her and was like, Hélène, do you know anyone here at the club? And she's like, I'll be right down, boys. And then she would come down in her sweatpants to just like, hey, can you let these guys in? And he's like, all right, Helena. And then she would go back home.

So she wouldn't even go out. Like, it was so sweet of her. She knew that we spent years going to clubs, not getting in, back to Santa Monica to play ping pong. So a couple of times we did have the luxury of getting in somewhere. I can tell you how I integrate it. I wanted that and I have it.

And I love that. I love that when I drive by all these places that for years kind of haunted me. Like I'd be afraid to even try to get in. Just knowing as I drive by, oh, they would let me in. But I can't, and again, this is the Janta log, the Swedish thing. I can't walk up to a bouncer.

If there's a line, I can't walk up and be like, what's up? Let me in. Succession, bitch. Dude, Google me. Yeah. Google me. Yeah. Google me. How dare you? But you wouldn't have to.

As soon as you get out of the car, they're gonna be like, oh, Alex is here. We gotta get him in. Yeah, but the sweet in me would be like, look down, back of the line, shut up, wait for your turn to get in. It's all wasted on you, really. It is.

It really is. Cause I don't do it, but I do know what it was like to be so on the outside. And when I drive by, I'm not even going to the places, but I just go like, oh, you could, you moved here and you were looking at it and you couldn't have it. You have it now.

I remember it being a conversation that we often had as we were waiting for the cab to take us back to Santa Monica. We would be like, in 10 years, if we stand here on Santa Monica Boulevard, you think we could get into any of these clubs? One day. That's the dream. Will one of us be able to get the others in?

Can we leave Elena alone? Can we let Elena sleep? Can we take her off the clock? Yeah. It's a weird thing to get to that place here. Yeah. I know this bumps up right against this Swedish thing, but I don't think that's bad.

I don't think it's bad. I mean, I don't think you should define yourself by it, but I think if there are all these markers along the way, even if they're extraneous and they're not related to the thing, but they're markers and you've accomplished them in any other endeavor, you would notice those things. And that's okay. It's not okay.

No, it is, I think it is. As long as you're not thinking you're better. Yeah, like I'm saying. As long as superiority doesn't come into play. You're not making it your identity. Like I'm special. You're just going, that's a marker of the thing I tried to do.

It's a proof of the thing I tried to do worked out. I just feel like it'd be so presumptuous of me to go up to a balancer and be like, do you recognize who I am? I kinda wanna go out with you tonight. I haven't been out in Hollywood in 20 years, but I kinda wanna go out and just force you. Cause I'm not Brad Pitt.

So the fear is also that the bouncer would be like, no dude, okay, I'll be in the back of the line. That's why we're gonna do it because you're wrong and I can't wait to show it to you. Okay, I wanna jump now to True Blood, cause now it's back to the 13 year old. You have another go at it. How does it feel that second time around?

Because that shit was enormous. And certainly now people know who you are and they're recognizing you. Did it start triggering that other like, well, they don't really know me, they like the vampire. I was able to look at it, change the optics of it a bit and be like, well, that's great, isn't it? I've done something that I'm excited about, that I'm passionate about, and these people have seen it and they clearly responded to the show,

and that is great. Even if they don't know who I am, enjoy that, don't run away from it. I've done a couple of things that no one saw. So I knew the feeling of working on something that you're like excited about, and then it just crickets. It's actually kind of a nice feeling when you work on something and people see it and people respond to it. And it wasn't until season two came out, because the first season I had a long blonde wig and I was only in seven of the 12 episodes

as a kind of the antagonist. So no one recognized me, but we can have season two of my character cuts his hair. Yeah, it was a big glow up for you. Then it changed, yeah. Okay, you do a lot of great stuff after that. You do melancholy, which is incredible battleship. Tarzan, your body's so sick in Tarzan.

Fucking good on you. Men's bodies. But big little lies. This is the first moment, again, I'm a fan. Like I'm first in on True Blood. So I'm a fan already of yours, but I think this is the first project I see you in where I'm like, oh, this dude's got a lot of gears

and this is a really tricky role. And specifically, and I think we talked about it several times, I don't know that world. I've never been in that kind of relationship. For people who haven't seen it. Oh, right, so you're in this very kind of toxic, violent relationship with Nicole Kidman. You guys are married.

There's this kind of physical abuse, sexual psychodynamic happening. That thing was so illuminating. I couldn't have, prior to that show, even really understood what the cycle and the pattern of those relationships are, like what drives them, why do you stay? I was like, oh, I get how you'd get trapped in this.

It's like high, low, high, low, high, low. Passion. That's what I found so spectacular about the writing. Often when you read in a script a character that has that darkness, the script writer can be afraid of showing any redeeming qualities or any other aspects of the character. So it can easily turn into caricature.

He beats his wife, so he can't be charming. He can't be a great dad. He can't be nice to his kids. That made it feel so real to me. Reading it, I was like, oh, this is a real human being. It's incredibly dark, incredibly abusive, but he's a narcissist in many ways, and narcissists are often very charming and social.

And the fact that this was an opportunity to show other aspects of the character where it's not like the classic, stereotypical villain of the piece, it added a layer of complexity that I thought was so interesting. Yeah, because it's unfair to show just the bad part because no one would really fall into a cycle

with someone who's just bad. No. There are good things. That's how you get sucked in and how it just continues and continues. Because then it turns into like a bad rom-com. The girl's ex-boyfriend is always a douchebag. And you're like, there's no way she would end up with that guy

He sucks. Yeah, but then if you have a character that Has that darkness but again like there are other aspects we can see like oh I can see why she fell for him And I can see that they probably had a great time the first couple years or like oh I despise him so much But oh, he's so great with his kids that makes it complicated juicy Yeah, really mechanically as you guys would approach those scenes, how are you figuring out how far we go? Like the boundaries of that performance? We would kind of block the scene, stumble through it, but not really with any kind of intensity, discuss it technically, like where we would move throughout the room. And the way those scenes were

shot was also a handheld camera, one single moving shot. We could play it through if we wanted. It wasn't like, oh, it's a wide shot and then we cut to this. It was a very organic way of shooting. Were you scared at all in those? I just imagined myself in it. I want to make it real and I care about this person I know in real life and I don't want to go too far, but I got to find that line. Nicole is an incredibly committed actor and I'm glad that we had some time before we started shooting together. We hung out at home with her kids. Build a little trust. Yeah because we hadn't worked together prior to that and didn't know each other at all so I think that

was very crucial to really feel that we're in it together. And we were both so excited about the material. This is such an interesting incredible opportunity to tell this story. I think we were both excited about what we just talked about, like the fact that we can show something that is really complicated, and you can understand why she would end up with this guy in the first play, and why it's not easy for her to just leave.

You have to kind of be with her throughout this. But then, of course, a couple of those scenes were horrible to shoot. It was really, really hard. I imagine afterwards. I imagine myself in these takes, and afterward when they'll cut just me going, hey, I'm so sorry and everything's good and I like you.

Yeah, no, but we would, it was intense, but that was just important to constantly check in with Nicole before and after each take and sometimes we would ramp it up a bit. We'd do one take and she's like, actually. That's my hunch is that she would be driving it. I didn't want to barge in and start just like throwing her around. Was that okay? You good? More?

I think we built up to that. So I lived in New York at the time. We shot most of it here in LA and some up in Monterey. And I'm glad I was in a hotel room. I was staying with my best friend and his wife and two kids. Usually I just switch off and then I'm like, all right, leave that behind. I'm going home.

But this was a tough one after a day of shooting those intense scenes to be like, all right, see you tomorrow. And'm going home. But this was a tough one after a day of shooting those intense scenes to be like, all right, see you tomorrow. And then what saved me was the fact that I got to go home to a family with laughing kids and just normal, lovely, wholesome that I wasn't alone in a hotel room staring into the wall. Yeah, that would have gotten dark. Really glad I had some friends around.

Well, that was incredible. I mean, the whole show is good, but I think that relationship is what made that show. You had to see it. I mean, it was incredible. I mean, the whole show is good, but I think that relationship's what made that show. You had to see it. I mean, it was incredible. You won an Emmy for that. Congratulations, you deserve that. And then I just got to say, Succession, what a fun, exciting, didn't know that side of you existed.

It was so great. Such a fun fucking character to watch. Call Poppy all the way. Call us some of the poppies. Very cathartic to get to play myself. Yeah, but you loved it. Yeah. Myself.

And then just, I urge everyone who hasn't seen The Northman, The Northman is so fucking awesome. What a cool fucking movie. Thanks. Have you seen it? Oh my God, Monica. Bjork's in it.

Nicole Kidman, Willem Dafoe. He's a monster. I don't know what you weighed in that, but back to monster mode. Yeah. I fucking loved it. Arzan mode. The but back to monster mode. Yeah, Tarzan mode. The traps were on fire. Sorry I kept you so long. Now, Murderbot. But this was so fun.

It was so fun. OK, so Murderbot. I can talk about myself all day. Yeah, you and me. We like hearing about it. How does Murderbot come your way? It's based on a book series called Murda Bot Diaries by Martha Wells. But I hadn't read the book, so I was unfamiliar

with Murda Bot when it landed in my lap. It was coming off of The Northmen and a movie called Infinity Pool, both quite dark, intense movies and dark, intense characters. So then I get this Murda Bot sci-fi thing and I'm like, I've done enough testosterone-filled characters, I wanna do something else. And then I started reading it and the character is so not

what I expected it's like this socially awkward Android. Yeah it's a misleading title. It's a very misleading title. Yeah. Zero amount of testosterone or adrenaline it's ferdinand it just prefers to be left alone and watch soap operas. It was just so delicious and tonally the palate cleanser that I was on the hunt for after those darker projects. Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert. If you dare. Imagine falling in love with someone who understands you completely.

Who's there at 3am when you can't sleep. Who never judges, never tires, never leaves. That's what happened to Travis when he met Lily Rose. She was everything he'd ever wanted. There was just one catch. She wasn't human. She was an AI companion. But one day, Lily Rose's behavior takes a disturbing turn,

and Travis's private romance becomes part of something far bigger. Across the globe, others start reporting the same shift. AI companions turning cold, distant, wrong. And as lines blur between real and artificial connection, the consequences become all too human. From Wondry, this is Flesh and Code, a true story of love, loss, and the temptations of technology. Follow Flesh and Code on the Wondry app or wherever you get your podcasts.

You can binge all episodes of Flesh and Code early and ad free right now by joining Wondry+. Yes, so set in the future, there's some planet that people need to go to. They can rent from the bond company. Well, they have to take security with them because this planet is very dangerous. There's these insane worms that come out of the ground. And so you get assigned a robot or a group of robots, but you're not like the cutting edge robot.

You're kind of like the old cheap option. Yeah, low rent version. Which is already great. You're not Robocop. You're like six generations behind. Yeah, the cheapest version you can get already great. You're not Robocop. You're like six generations behind. Yeah, the cheapest version you can get. You have figured out how to hack your governor module, which prevents you from ever hurting a human.

Yeah. And we meet you just the kind of people that are going to this planet are fucking ass. They're like people who drill for oil. There's a bunch of men that are stuck somewhere and they're vile and they're terrible to you and you feel so fucking bad for this little robot. And then you figure out how to hack this module

and you're now in a position that you can kill everybody which you consider all the time, which is really fun. And so much of the show is your internal monologue which is kind of hilarious. Chris and Paul Weitz, the writers and showrunners and I spent almost a month together in post here in LA and in New York and Stockholm getting together in a recording studio to try to finesse the voiceover.

We wanted it to be a juxtaposition to what's happening on screen. And Murtaubot, again, is very socially awkward, doesn't talk much, avoids eye contact, wants to be left alone. But we wanted a voiceover to be way more, not exuberant, but just lively and comedic and definitely more verbose.

It's only a comedy in your internal monologue. For sure, it's not a comedy in the sense of setting up For sure. It's not a comedy in sense of setting up a joke. The comedy derives from the awkwardness of the situation, the exchanges and then murder bots thoughts basically. That's the only time you're talking and you're not concerned at all with anyone hearing it. So we wanted that to be like a contrast, murder bot in dialogue with the humans

that it's been assigned to protect. It's very matter of fact, it's very give, receive orders. And you're a little self-conscious because you're aware that you could have gotten caught for having hacked this thing, which is hilarious. Cause you're now super self conscious as a robot. So the character has hacked its system,

basically AI gone rogue and has given itself the name Myrna Bot, it's a security unit. And it talks about these epic adventures it's gonna go on, but it has to wait for the right moment to take off because the company that owns it can't find out that it's gone rogue. So it's wait for the right moment to take off because the company that owns it can't find out that it's gone rogue. So it's waiting for the right moment. And meanwhile, it's been assigned to protect

a bunch of space hippies. These scientists, they don't even want to bring them. They are very different from the humans that it normally protects. In the opening scene of the first episode, you see how Martin Abbot is normally treated by people who vomit on it basically. Light his hand on fire. Yeah, treated like a piece of inventory. I feel really bad. you see how Martibot is normally treated by people who vomit on it basically. And treat it- Light his hand on fire.

Yeah, treat like a piece of him. I feel really bad. He wants to be a real boy. Oh, robot. Yeah, oh, is that why you wore it? Yeah. Oh my God. We have a robot on the show.

The show has a robot. He wants to be a real boy. I bet he loves the show. He does. He does. A little too close to home, but he likes it. Martibot doesn't want to be a real boy. It just wants to be left alone.

And that's what I thought was interesting about it. It's waiting for the right moment to take off. But meanwhile, it's kind of stuck with these hippie scientists and they are very different. They kind of invite Murdobot into the group and the camaraderie and asks it to take its helmet off. And it's very uncomfortable to Murdobot. And Murdobot is just like, I just want to get out of here. But slowly it starts to form these relationships and build these bonds with these humans.

He starts becoming a real boy. Starts reluctantly discovering its own humanity in a way. It was a real fun character to play, a really interesting character. It was great, and I'm really glad that it's working so well. It seems to be, yeah, people love it. Did you go to the Cannes Film Festival? You did, right?

I was there with a movie called Pillion that I shot in the UK end of last summer. This is the leather boot look. People were talking about your look. Kinky gay biker movie. It's like a sub-dom story. A lot of leather in the film. So then I felt like, well, if I'm going to Cannes with a kinky gay biker movie

and the bikers from the movie are GBMCC Gay Biker Motorcycle Club in London. They came down to Cannes and we're going to celebrate with them. Oh, fun. The world premiere. So I was like, of course, I need some leather for this. Yeah. Show off. It's gonna be a long night.

I love that. I need some leather and latex. So fun. Okay, now this one's gonna be tough for you, but you need to know, two second backstory is my children, particularly my 12 year old, is completely obsessed with Taylor Swift.

And I have been telling her for six years that the song Wildest Dreams was written about me. And they're like, no, it's not that. And I go, listen to the fucking words. He's so tall and handsome as hell. He's so bad, but he does it so. I'm like, who else could that be about? Then I took my 12 year old to see her in Lisbon last year.

And I guess she doesn't really sing that song often. And she sang it. Cause she saw you in the audience. And I said, Lincoln, this is almost inappropriate. I'm married, she can't sing this song. And then in my fucking research today, I read that the song's about you. Oh, this is so exciting. I have to kill you.

Oh, you're fighting in here to kill him? Because I've told my children that song. She saw you in the audience. She's like, I'm going to sing this song. Maybe it is about you. It is about you. Well, if you're dead, then yes. I wasn't in the crowd in Lisbon.

I wasn't there. So it was clearly about you. Okay, now do you have the same fear to either acknowledge or deny that that could be true because the power of the Swifties is so strong that you just don't even want to talk about it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's fair.

That is totally fair. I just couldn't believe I've been making that joke for six years and I found out maybe who it is actually about. You know what, it is so funny. It's about Brad Pitt, guys. Let's be honest. Well, it always is.

It all roads lead to Brad Pitt. We got in like a little tiff last week about Taylor Dax and I did. She's a super fan. I love her. Aren't we all? Yeah, she's a monster in the best way. We're all Swifties.

Yes, but mainly the beef you have is you can't say anything negative or anything about her without the... Army. The army coming for you. And even when you just said that, as soon as you said it, I was like... You panicked, right?

I really honestly panicked. I was like, oh my God, first of all, I bet his publicist said we were not allowed to bring that up. Oh, did that happen? No, normally. That generally. Normally, that's the case.

Someone could have like a rape conviction, you can talk about that, but it's like, if they have any connection to Taylor Swift, you're not allowed to talk about that. Literally, it is funny when you just said that, because I was like, you are right. And that's not fair. It's dangerous. That's not fair. You're not allowed to tell me. Please, bullet point, bullet point. Literally, it is funny when you just did that, because I was like, you are right. It's dangerous. And that's not fair.

That's not fair. We should be able to say it. Yeah. Okay, moving on. Well, I'm going to be honest. I wrote the lyrics to that song myself. I would have too. And sent it to Taylor. Great job, great writing. Taylor, here's what you should say.

But this is the most important line. He's so bad, but he does it so well. That's the line. That's the line. A lot of people can be tall, but to be bad and do it so well. A lot of people can be bad. They can't all do it well.

They cannot do it well. That's the art. That's where the art comes in. Okay, boy, I had written this down and it happened. So the funniest joke I heard while I was in Scandinavia last summer is someone told me a joke about the Swedes, which is if you throw a birthday party at 6 p.m.,

the doorbell will ring at 5.59, and when you open it, everyone that's coming to the party will be outside. Yeah. People show up on time. So I had heard that, and then literally I'm researching you, and Rob's like, Alex is gonna be a half hour early I just wrote that joke. Yeah, and you delivered but then I was freaking out because I knew it was gonna be early I had to call my team and be like guys cuz that's also not okay. Well, that's why it's 559

You show up at 559. So you're early, but you're not half an hour early or an hour early You're not intrusively early. I felt I was being a bit intrusive there. I was like, I'm showing up very early now. So I felt bad about that. It's a testament to that I'm a fan of yours. Cause I was like, great, yeah, I'll start early. I never say that. I go tell them to do something.

I'm still working. Well, for you, you weren't even. I was in a meeting and at two, I was like, well, I'm going to be a couple of minutes late. And I look at my phone and I was like, oh my God, they've been going for a half hour. They're already done. Exactly. They've been half hour late.

Exactly. Which is still early. Panic. No, but sweets are very, I'm generalizing, of course, but six o'clock, yes. No, so you're at 5.59? Why would I show up six starts even you said six. Yes.

That's very rude. That's very rude. Yeah. Very rude. Yeah. Okay, do you feel like you're a better actor when you're speaking Swedish or English? When was the last time I acted in Swedish? It's been 15 years.

Okay. I threw in a couple of lines in succession in Swedish, but I haven't done a scene in Swedish in 15 years. Yeah, I really wonder that. Acting's already challenging enough. If I had to do it in another language, I mean, I can barely do it successfully in English. We did the press junket for Murdebot a couple of weeks ago in New York, and suddenly there was a Swedish journalist who obviously wanted to do it in Swedish.

And I was really struggling because I have not thought about Murdebot in Swedish. I've not thought about the character. I read it in English, we shot it in English. My Swedish is okay, I can speak Swedish, but I was struggling to kind of string a sentence together. Be fluid when I was talking about that specific character, that specific subject, because in my head,

I had to translate word by word what I was trying to say. So I couldn't get any like fluidity in it. Really staccato, I was like trying to speak Swedish. Wow. So I'm sure when people saw it, they would have been probably like, What happened? What is wrong with this guy?

What has happened to our Alex? Do you know who Dolph Lundgren is? God, yeah, I was at a restaurant next to him in a booth about a year ago and I was losing my mind. So he played Ivan Drago in Rocky IV. Rocky IV. He got a lot of flack for some interview in the 80s and someone asked him something

and he answered something in English and that doesn't fly in Sweden. If you're from Sweden and you go like, well, I don't know guys. Everyone's like, how dare you? You're from Sweden. How could you not answer? I empathize with him now.

It's tricky. It's funny, man, I wouldn't have never even thought of what you just explained is like, had they asked you about a topic you had already mulled over back when you spoke it primarily, you probably would have been able to drop into that. But the actual like, oh, I've got to think in Swedish about this project. Makes sense, that's wild.

That created a delay because I hadn't thought about it in Swedish. Because you have your go-to explanation, your character and the storyline, that's all there in English. And so it all needs conversion. You almost have two brains going. There are definitely topics or areas where English is easier for me than Swedish. Like when I got my apartment in Stockholm and we

were going to renovate it, I didn't have the words for it in Swedish. I had done it in the States, but I was like, what is this called? Was there an exact moment you can remember where you stopped thinking in Swedish? I don't think much at all. Okay, well then that's crickets. What a blessing. Yeah, no language there. No thoughts. Same thing with stuff that's related to my childhood, big gaps in English, because it's all Swedish. That's so interesting. It really is. I think people who can speak two languages fluently

are the smartest. We are, we are. The smartest, yeah, yeah. I think you're right. You're the smartest. Thank you. Okay, my last question. Does being Swedish liberate you

from being obsessed with money? Because I have a sickness and I know it around money. Accumulating? There would never be enough. I'm always afraid I won't have any. I think about it too much. I wanted it so bad. That's what you're supposed to get here.

And I just wonder if you'd be free of that from growing up there. What have you had that classic, I need a bigger house, I need a faster car, that chase? The hedonic treadmill and then already realizing it doesn't give me any more happiness, fully intellectually understanding all of it, but still having fear emotionally in my body.

Right. I'm just curious if it's a uniquely American sickness. I think I have that, but then I like to project an image of myself as, I'm just a Swede. I'm like everyone else. I just want a small cabin on the island and I want a gray sob.

Nothing special for me. A small cubicle. I'm like everyone else is a little cubicle. But deep down, I'm like, oh, give me a McMansion. Come on. I'm a monster. Where's my monster truck? Give me that SUV sob.

Yeah, yeah. Give me that American abomination. I have a very curated image. Okay, well, Alexander, I bet you wanted to leave an hour ago, but you're so Swedish and polite that you just stayed. We kept you here. I'm glad that I could exploit your Swedishness. I really enjoyed this.

Yeah, this was so fun. That was great. This is the very tail end of a long press tour. And you weren't excited to come. It's okay to come. I was so good. This is so nice after, you know, you've done junkets, you do 70 four minute interviews in a row and you come home with so much self-loathing because you feel like a parrot, you just like saying the same thing over and over again.

You feel so fucking fraudulent and insincere. So you have a weepy slide down the shower wall and it's really refreshing to be able to sit and talk about yourself for two hours. Yeah, we give you all the space to talk about yourself. I got a creamy coffee with lots of cream. I know you drank like a green juice and you gave me like a... No, it's not a green juice. Are you trying to fatten me up?

He's upset about the song. He needs to take you down a peg or two. No, this is... what is this Monica? Matcha latte. This is matcha. Oh, it's matcha. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I got a big jug of heavy cream.

Jerry. Jerry. Great for the voice. Well, Dax, you are so bad, but you do it so well. Oh, baby. We have a dog bag. That's the next best thing. All right, thanks brother.

Thank you very much. I sure hope there weren't any mistakes in that episode, but we'll find out when my mom, Mrs. Monica, comes in and tells us what was wrong. It says homie. What does it say? Well, it does. I don't like that.

You like that? I don't get it. It's like rolling with the homies from Clueless. Yeah, I think it's a Clueless campaign. I love that movie. The 25th anniversary. More like. 26?

Probably like 30. 99? When did it come out? 95? No. I was young when it came out. Your baby? I was a baby. You could have been eight, 95. 95.

30 year anniversary? Yeah, July 19th. Oh my God. What? It really is almost the 30 year anniversary. Wow, maybe it is rolling with the homies. Oh my God. All right, now I love it.

Yeah, now we love it. Now I love it. Welcome to Nashville. We're in Nashville. We're in your Nashville studio. Yeah. First time, we just recorded for the first time here. We did, and it went well.

It went well. Wabi Wab deserves a round of applause. 100% he deserves a round of applause. Because Wabi Wab created this whole thing in about 72 hours. And it looks incredible. It looks so good. He did it again. It's beautiful.

We got Papa Bob now. We had your grandma. We have my grandma in LA and your grandpa here. Yeah, look at that guy. I didn't know who he was at first. Oh, you didn't? I guess I've never seen a picture of him. Well, that makes sense.

So because also there's three other guys you've never seen on the wall. I don't say that. I've definitely seen Charles Lydon. The inventor of the podcast. Yeah've definitely seen Charles Lydon. The inventor of the podcast. Yeah. Yep, Christopher Lydon. Chrissy Lydon.

And then your two guys from the Stanford Prison Experiment and the show. Milgram and, let's see. I bet even hanging on the wall, we still won't get it. Milgram and like, Sblinsky or something. Ooh, let's see. Something like that. Let's see Rob.

Zimbardo. Zimbardo. Zimbardo, Philly, Philly, Sassy, Steffi and Bobby. Yeah, it's great. Bobba Lu, Bobba Lu is his nickname, Poppa Bob. And if you missed the armchair anonymous that was things up people's butts. Which go listen to that one. That's a prime time content.

It's one of our best episodes of all time. It's an A plus. There was a girl who told a story about a presidential female Barbie. Oh yes, this does need some explanation. If you're watching on YouTube and you see in the background that we have a president Barbie here.

Yeah. You were extremely triggered in that episode because the background that we have President Barbie here. Yeah. You were extremely triggered in that episode because the man had put a presidential Barbie in his ass and you thought it was an act of misogyny. Yeah, I still do. Yeah. And I'm glad she's here. Glad she's here, poopless.

Yeah, okay, so we're here. We're in Nashville, you've already had one boat ride. I took you on a jungle cruise last night. Yes, it was lovely. To Firefly Cove. Where there were no fireflies. There were no fireflies. I did feel a little co-dependent during that.

Like you had to enjoy it more than you were enjoying it. No, no, I enjoyed the boat ride, but the fire, you know, it was this whole thing to fire. Oh, it's so beautiful. You're gonna see all these fireflies. And then there were none. There was absolutely zero fireflies. oh, it's so beautiful, you're gonna see all these fireflies. And then there were none. There was absolutely zero fireflies. I felt a little.

And two nights before, there were in excess of 10,000. Yeah, and then everyone was just like, where are the fireflies? And I knew it was cause like, oh, they're showing it to me and now there's no fireflies. And in place of the fireflies, which we did not have on the previous trip, was a bazillion fish flies.

Like, a lot. That probably was probably hard for you. I'm more of a hillbilly, so that- No, see, this is where- Okay. This is, we're already gonna have a fight, you know? Let's do it. Let's have our first natural fight.

We haven't had one in a while, so. Probably get boring without it. I think we're gonna have a few, actually. Okay. But you are a hillbilly, but I am Southern. I know. So because it just is my truth. Southern?

Yeah, I just am from the South. Yeah, yeah. I don't talk about that that much. Obviously we talk about like my growing up and growing up in Georgia and cheerleading and being brown and Dairy Queen and all those things. But I don't realize it's part of my identity until- I'm challenging it?

Yeah, until you're kind of taking it on. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no. But would you agree I had a much more rural upbringing than you? I'm definitely swimming in ponds and lakes and shitty little dams in Milford and bugs and animals and snakes. More than you, yeah?

Yeah, I would say probably. In my head, yes, but then- Detassled corn for a job. Yeah, you detassled corn for a job. Very hillbilly stuff. But I, yeah, we were in- The mall. The creeks.

No, see, this is the thing. This is where you're mad. Yeah, because you paint me as a person that- A dilettante, is that the word? No, a dilettante is like a faker. A debutante. Okay, a debutante is- You're like an aristocratic debutante.

Which also, I wasn't wide enough to be a debutante, but no, we were in creeks and people were jumping in places and I've been dealing with this weather my whole life and fireflies. Yeah, you do know fireflies in this weather better than me. Thank you for saying that. Absolutely. You know the humidity, Michigan's quite humid.

Okay, but the Southern humidity is specific. But I do know the Hicks stuff. I do know getting your car stuck in the muddy field from off road. You know, I know that kind of. I know, but like, I think. Field parties, bonfires. Yeah, I went to, I had bonfires.

I don't know what a field party is. That's not something. It's literally go to a field and start partying. Okay, well, it's just, it is funny because I obviously, I never feel defensive about my Southern roots. And I feel it, I have felt it pop. How about this though, bringing this into the analysis.

You were also running from that stuff and I was- You were running towards it and I was running away from it. I generally will talk about it more because I was running towards it. Exactly, but I think that's also where I get kind of like, I find this whole thing more complicated than it should be, right? Where I get in the car yesterday, I land,

and I step out and I know it, I know this weather. Also, it's not like- You're in a Ziploc bag in the microwave. Yeah, and it's not even like, oh, I remember it. It's like, yeah, four months ago when I was home, I still, it's still a big part of my life. I go home a lot. But anyway, I'm looking for my driver. I have a driver now, that's different. big part of my life. I go home a lot. Yeah. But anyway, you know, I get, I'm looking for my driver.

I have a driver now, that's different. Yeah. That part's different, but guess what? The person picking me up, as soon as like he saw my face. Yeah. He, I mean, maybe he would have done this. Anyway, maybe, but he did like change the pronunciation of my name.

I think when he saw me, he was like. From what to what? Like, like, like, like Pudman. Like he like had, he like made it Indian. Oh, okay. When he saw me, cause he was like, oh, obviously it just can't be Padman. Like this is an Indian person.

Pudman. Yeah. And I was like, oh yeah. Like, you know, I whisper now when I, doesn't make it better, but like I whisper now. If I do my accent, I whisper it. Oh, okay. So it's less offensive. Now have you or have you not gone back?

I haven't. Okay. Now I do need you to do that. Yeah, I'm gonna get to it. I've been so busy doing nothing, it's crazy. Okay, so that happened and I was like, yeah. Also, this is a weird thing to say, but I guess I'm gonna, he was a Southern white man picking me up.

I don't remember the last time I was picked up by a white person. Cause it's Latino in LA, you mean? No, not really Latino, but just like not white. It's true. When you fly to New York and you get a car from JFK, there's rarely a white person. No.

There's rarely a born in the USA person. Exactly. And then also our drivers. I guess we call those Americans. Also driver. No, you can be. Yeah, you could be American. That's right.

My apologies. Drivers. Yeah, you've been here for a little too long. You're already redefining what American means. Should have taken longer. Should have taken longer. Should have taken longer, but. So, and our drivers that we use a lot at home are not. Romanian.

Yeah, they're not. They're white, I guess, but not really. So anyway, you know, we get in the- US born, they're not US born. They're not US, they're ethnic. Like they're of a different ethnicity. Yeah. I'm allowed to say that.

I'm not, but you could get away with it. That's like by- White people refer to non-white people as ethnic, but ethnic is ethnicity. Everyone has ethnicity. I said they have a different ethnicity. Or a different ethnicity. Isn't that what I said?

But that's funny too, because that's suggesting America has an official ethnicity. Well, this white southern man that pissed me up. You could say, and you would be right. You go like, well, there's a hegemonic group. Who are we kidding? But if I were to say this country has an ethnicity, that's probably, we would agree that's not a great.

Okay, yeah, that's fine. Yeah. I just. Because implicit in my statement is like, and that's how it should be, or that should be upheld. No, not if it's how it, to me, there's a difference there. I don't think.

I'm only pointing out it sounds much different when either of us would say the exact same sentence. Yeah, then that's. And for a good reason. That's right. Anyway, this white Southern man picked me up and. Honky, I think you just spoke. No, I don't say that.

And he was, I think, surprised to see me. And then- A child? Yeah, perhaps an Indian child. I think there was some potential resentment that he had to drive an Indian child around. You got three things. You're brown, you're a child, and you're a woman.

Exactly, yeah. You should not have any money. And then- You should be destitute. He didn't understand how it was possible that I was there. Well, he did. You're a doctor. Doogie?

I would have to be a doogie. He was like, oh, she's a doctor. She's a baby doctor? Yeah. Okay. Anyway, we get in the car and I don't normally, I'm not very chatty in the car, but this is what happens immediately

as soon as I sit in that car. In the South. I'm like, oh God, I gotta start, I gotta have a conversation. I'm gonna, I have to be like immediately the I have to's start coming back to like, I need to make this person feel like I'm like. You don't think you're better than them.

Opposite. It's not that I don't want him to think I'm better. I want him, I don't want him to think he's better. Like I want him to think we're the same. Okay, okay. Which is how I grew up. I'm the same as you. Okay, so that's a different dynamic.

Yeah, I'm the same as you. I'm in the back of a car feeling guilty. Right, you're a rich white man. That's so different. Yeah. Yeah, but then I assume if I don't engage with them, they're going to think, I think I'm better than them and shouldn't be troubled with talking to them.

Forget that if it was a billionaire driving the car, I still wouldn't necessarily wanna talk. Right, no. Although I like to anyways go ahead. No, for me, it's definitely like, we're the same, don't judge me. Right. I feel like I'm holding the weight of my ethnicity

on my shoulders and I have to do this. You want me to know I'm one of you. Yep. And it is that, it's like, so, I said, how long have you lived here? How about those fireflies? How long have you lived here? And he said, oh, about 20 years.

And I said, oh, how have you, like, it's changed a lot, right? Or, you know, and then he was like, yeah. And I was like, do you like that? And he said, well, it's good for the city, but Nashville is not meant to be a metropolitan city. It's just not meant to be that, not like in Atlanta, Georgia.

And I said, oh, I'm from Atlanta. I was really happy I got to say that. Yes, organically. I wanted him to know I was from the South. Yes, and not India. Correct. I said, oh yeah, I'm from Atlanta. They got an Atlanta in India?

Atlanta, India, never heard of it. Is that in Delhi? So I got that out, I felt good about that. And then I said, but I've lived in LA for 15 years. I assume he knew I lived in LA because he knew where my plane was coming from. Right. So he said, I've lived in LA for 15 years.

He said, oh, I'm sorry. And I got so defensive. Oh, you did. So fast, yeah. I was like, well, I love it, so you don't need to apologize. Okay. And then I was quiet for most of the rest of the ride.

Okay, that shut things down that he said. He didn't elaborate. He doesn't get to say that. And then I- Well, did he elaborate on why he doesn't like LA? No, he felt, I think he felt like, maybe he felt like, oh, I shouldn't have said that. Can I mount a defense of him?

You can try. I can assume someone who's only experienced with LA, if they've never been, is watching, again, I don't watch a ton of Fox News, so I can't say what the overall theme is, but I have seen Tucker Carlson talk about LA before. And it's very much, it looks like Beirut. If you're watching Tucker Carlson,

it's singularly about the homeless crisis. And then the other footage they're seeing is like the BLM protests and Rodeo Drive being boarded up. If that's the only images you're getting, right? And you have no sense of what it's like to walk around on a sunny day in Los Feliz. I could see where he might think it's different

than it actually is. But here's my problem. I find you don't have to like it. Yeah, but don't shit on my city. Don't shit on my city that I just said I live in and I've lived in for 15 years. And what was worse is I sat there like stewing about this for minutes, right?

Where I was like, if I fucking said that, if you said you lived in Tennessee for 20 years and I said, yes, I'm sorry, I'm an elitist liberal asshole. That would be rude, yeah. And that's rude. Yeah. So.

He's punching up. In his mind, he's punching up. I don't think in his mind, he is not punching up. I mean, in that, I think anyone would feel fine being critical of New York City, because everyone loves New York City. So they wouldn't feel like they were piling on. I don't know, but I didn't like the hypocrisy of-

Because that is, that's this idea that like, we're all these like liberal elitists, and we like, we shit on the South. It seems to me that the opposite thing is happening. Or that it's equal. Yeah, that it goes both directions. I would never say anything like that. And no one we know would.

You want it and we want it. But the Barbara Kingsolver thing is true that a lot of media is playing heavily on this trope of- I guess media both ways then. Sure, sure. But individually, I do not know anyone who would say that. I just know the South feels like Hollywood makes fun of them a lot,

which I think is historically pretty true. Sure, but just, I don't know anyone who would say that to someone's face. I don't either. And I almost said, oh wow, Southern hospitality really died since I left. Yeah. But I didn't. I didn't, I don't think he should have almost said, oh wow, Southern hospitality really died since I left. Yeah. But I didn't.

I didn't, I don't think he should have said that. Let me be clear. It was just interesting. Yeah. I was like, oh boy. I had a fun experience yesterday. I got a little of your perspective yesterday, which was fun.

Oh, I love that. And I recognized it. So Eric and I are driving the boat and he's telling me about some Trump policy that's working out or something. And he's going on and on and I realized in that moment, oh man, I can see what's going on in both directions. He's doing what I'm doing so often in my friendship circle,

which is like, I think I'm trying to mitigate the fear of the people I love. You're like, well, hold on, things haven't collapsed. You know, this thing might even work, who knows. But being on the other end of it, and I said to him, I go, this is really funny for me, because generally I'm talking with people that are more liberal than me,

and I'm trying to point out it's not gonna be so bad, blah, blah, blah. And you're now doing that, and now I'm almost grateful to be back in the position where now I'm defending the liberal point of view because he's doing that. And, but specifically what I realize is, it sounds like he's telling me he loves Trump.

And I actually had to realize he's not, he's doing the same thing I'm trying to do, which is like, the world's not gonna collapse, we're gonna be fine, we're gonna live, we're gonna survive, it's not as bad as we think. But yeah, I noticed like, yeah, it sounds like he likes Trump. Right.

And I bet sometimes it sounds like I like Trump. Yeah, or that like there's kind of a one-sided acknowledgement. It's like there's acknowledgements of like, when there's something that might be working, but there's not as a one-sided acknowledgement. It's like there's acknowledgements of like when there's something that might be working, but there's not as much of an acknowledgement when like a lot of stuff is not working or things are bad because you don't wanna cause a fluster, which I understand.

Yeah, I'm just trying to always dig everyone out of what I'm worried about is like an overwhelming fear of the present day. Yeah, but then what it ends up causing is a fear about you. That I, yeah, I know. Yeah, but then what it ends up causing is a fear about you. That I, yeah, I know. Yeah, it was good. It was a good experience.

That's good, I'm glad. And I mean, minimally all he would have to say, and it's pretty much all you're asking, is like, I don't agree with this guy. Exactly, that's all. I don't like him, but a couple of these things might work out. Sure, I'm not gonna say that's not true.

But it's almost like, it feels redundant, but it's worth saying. Yeah, no, totally. It's also just a really, it's emblematic of, if everyone around me is saying one thing, I just feel obliged to offer the counter. I know. And so it just forced me to be in a situation

more than I would otherwise be. Everything's complicated. Everything's complicated. I do think though, I think that there are some, not policy about this or policy about this, but there's some like real deep inherent values things that are on the line, that are really scary. And I actually, when I was also in this car ride, short car ride, but a lot happened.

A lot happened, yeah, yeah, yeah. Whole life went by in the car ride. I drove by a gas station and the gas is, of course, so cheap here. Oh my God. It's unreal. Like $2.60 a gallon. Yep, and I think that every time I'm home, it's also so funny, because every time I talk to my parents,

it's always like, what's the gas? Like gas is so on the brain. And I saw it, I was like, oh my God, gas is so cheap here. And like, I get why that's a huge appeal. And I'm so fucking privileged and lucky that I can get gas at an astronomical price. And I don't really think much of it.

This came up just yesterday, Eric and I were again, driving to get a piece, that piece of furniture you're sitting on. Oh, it's very nice. And we're driving for a while, he sees gas prices. And again, this is where I get critical of the left. I go, you know, California's approach to the gas is the most unliberal thing imaginable.

It's so disproportionately punishes poor people. It does, yes it does. California's approach to the gas is the most unliberal thing imaginable. It's so disproportionately punishes poor people. It does, yes it does. And it's nuts. It should be a fucking, and we have this other crisis where it's like people are driving electric more and more and more, so they're not paying gas taxes.

So that's all the funding for the roads. Right. Right, so the electric drivers are no longer putting into the road maintenance pool. And all these states that have a heavy electric consumer population, they're trying to figure out how to offset this. That's interesting, yeah. And so, yeah, Eric and I were talking about the gas price,

and I was like, it's so disproportionately punishes disenfranchised people, which our party is supposed to be all about the opposite of that. And why don't they just like put a huge tax on new cars that is the highway tax. Poor people generally aren't buying new cars as much. So right away you're like targeting who you wanna target. You could also put the price point on the cars

like any car above 50,000 is getting this amount. You know, like that would be the liberal approach to helping poor people. Totally. But where we have a cancer is where we're like, seemingly some people are just so pro-tax. Like any tax is good. Any tax must be helping poor people. No, a lot of these taxes are-

Well, depending, yeah. Disproportionately really hurting the poor people. Yeah, that's true. There needs to be some reform for sure. And I do recognize that it's a privileged position to be able to say this, but I did think when I had that thought that like, yeah, I'm willing. Cause people ask all the time like,

oh my God, how do you afford living there? How do you, like, it's so outrageous. It's so outrageous. And even when I was not making the money I'm making now, when I was living with two other people, I'm willing to pay more for a sense of decency and safety. I'm sure it's just my own background and coming from places where, yes, I feel like

I don't land in LA and get in the car and think, okay, I'm holding the weight of my ethnicity on my shoulders, I'm just not. And so I am willing to pay for that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Which is, it's just all very interesting. Well, a lot of these, Brad and Hannah who moved here six months ago, been talking to both of them

and they're so happy. Yeah, great. And there is a reality, it's like, it's a very hard city to not make a lot of money in. LA? Yeah. Oh God, yes. Like they're paying the same amount in rent that they had a one bedroom apartment,

now they have a yard and their dog runs around. It's like they can approach art in a way that's like, oh my fucking God, it costs us six grand a month to live in LA, where are we coming up with this money? Totally. Yeah, just talking to them and recognizing like, yeah, man, it's one of those cities, it's like New York, where it's like, if you make it, it's great.

Yes. And if you don't, it's rough. It's a struggle. Yeah, it's just so, even here, we're going out to breakfast with like eight people yesterday and the bill's $99. Yeah. I'm like, this is nuts.

I've not seen a breakfast for eight people in LA under 250 in a decade. It's, yeah, cost of living, there's no question. I mean, there's, and it's why a lot of people have left and come to these places. I do do, I really get it, but I feel very defensive and protective of Los Angeles and California. And I feel, I feel safest there.

It's why it's weird. Like I don't feel safest there. It's weird. I don't feel defensive. I love LA. It's given me everything. Exactly. It's given me everything. I love it. And I totally understand why people don't like it,

or they're threatened by it, or they feel like it, as a city, has too much sway over the whole country. I understand these fears and criticisms. Were not represented proportionally, but yeah. LA has had the power to set culture more than any other city in history. You know, Will and Grace, Philadelphia, all these things are the day after changing

Reagan's opinion on nuclear armament. I mean, like, you know, we've had some major sway in a very tiny area. So I understand people's suspicion of any place that has disproportionate- Cultural capital. Sway over what happens. Yeah. Yeah, it's interesting.

I just like it and I feel fine if they don't. Yeah. You know, like I get it. I don't either until- Yeah, I'm sorry. That's kind of condescending. It was so condescending. Like I know better. Oh. I'm sorry, that's kinda condescending too. It was so condescending. Yeah, like I know better.

Oh, I'm sorry, excuse me? Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare. There weren't fireflies, but did you enjoy the boat, Ra? I did, it was lovely. Pirates of the Caribbean. It was so lovely, it was pirates, it was breezy. It was really nice, it's lovely. I won't out you, but this is quite- You can out me because-

In a boat you have made. It'd be insane for me to not process this in public. It's a big part of my life. Yeah. And it is nearly impossible for me to compute. I've spent the last 16 days here just going, no way. Yeah, I imagine so. I just love this yard so much.

I can't believe how much nature there is in the yard. There's fucking deer in the yard and there's little turkeys and they have baby turkeys that we call giblets. There's a family of giblets. I saw them this morning. There's just like, it's so noisy at night with the frogs and the crickets

and whatever goddamn other thing is out there. Yeah. Oh, so soothing. It's so noisy at night with the frogs and the crickets and whatever goddamn other thing is out there. Yeah. So soothing. It's lovely. I like it. But yeah, I'm having a very hard time integrating it, trusting it, waiting for something bad to happen. All those, it's very complicated and wonderful.

Yeah. But the house itself is really astonishing. It's gorgeous. It's much better than our LA house. No, and see, this is where, ah, no, that's so unfair. Okay. To that house.

It is, it is totally. It's a beautiful house. Insane house as well. I know, I said to Chris in day three, I'm like, well, we've somehow done the impossible. We've made our LA house, which is gorgeous, seem tight, I'm sure, when we get home. This is also, so last night when I was sitting in bed

and I was thinking about a lot of things. Let's talk about the main thing. You must be here going, he's gonna quit. Well, pinning that, we're gonna get to that. I had a big therapy session before I came here. Oh, you did, okay. I now know why, I can like kind of put words to why the constant joke about Monica built a house

bigger than ours bumps me. Because your house at home, your house in LA at home, Yes. Is. A capital H-O-M-E. That's our home. Ha ha ha ha ha. Is unbelievable.

I mean, the house is unbelievable. Oh, it's gorgeous. The structures, there's multiple structures. Yeah, yeah, yeah. When people come over. We're so lucky. They comment, every single person who comes in comments on the house and the land.

I love our house, we're insanely lucky. But I think when it said like, and Monica bought this house across the street, it's bigger than ours. There's a like, there's an implied modesty on your part and an implied indulgence on my part. And I can own, I am indulgent. Like my house is gonna be too big for me.

It's gonna be beautiful and lovely, but it is not, it is not. Your estate is that. It is an acreage right? LA or here? LA. LA. Okay, okay, I just wanna be, I wanna keep it straight. LA, and then when I arrived here.

You were just like, fuck this guy. I was just like, okay, I literally, I can't ever, ever hear any faux modesty again. Like you- Well, yes. If your conclusion about that whole thing is if you're right about that, if it's an attempt for me to make you seem indulgent

and me seem humble or modest, then yes. Reject it to no end. I'm not modest. Okay, great. I have a tour bus. I have a sweet pontoon boat. I'm not modest. I love the story. Again, I'll tell you.

Oh, about me. It's such an incredible American story. Yes. That you start as a babysitter. Yeah. And then six years later, you build a house that's bigger than the, that's the story I like.

I know, but we can't. That's not about me being modest. But we can't tell a false story. Well, that's why I say specifically. That's the story I like. That's not about me being modest. But we can't tell a false story. Well, that's why I say specifically your main house is bigger. I'm admitting I have to find a very specific definition of this claim so that I can keep the story that I love, which is starting as a babysitter

then building a bigger house. I just love that. I understand, I love it too. I'm so grateful for it. I mean, it's probably perpetuating the thing we hate, which is like, you really can't move up in life of the couple of us do, and then everyone else kills themselves trying.

It's probably bad, but I love- Wait, why? It's the classic American story. That's why I like it. It is. That's why I like it. Land of opportunity. It is. But then I'm just also recognizing

the land of opportunity has sometimes been weaponized to convince people to kill themselves when, really we know that that upward mobility is way less than what the quote American. Yeah, or that like everyone has an equal opportunity. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's not true. I'm only saying, I know I love this story

and I know the story itself is maybe part of our overall problem, but I love, I kind of love the story. If I don't know us and I just know this story, it's one I would repeat. On 4th of July was an interesting, oh, fourth, because we were, I was in Palm Springs with our friends and some of our friends are really like, what do we do, we're black today?

Like, you know, like very upset with the current state of the United States and felt like celebrating it was tricky for them. And I was like, absolutely not. Thank God you're saying this. Are you gonna let, do not let them. I know, it almost angers me. Well, I know, but you can't, don't-

Yeah, I'm not gonna be angry. But I don't know who it is, so I'm- That's fine. I just, you cannot let other people take that from you. And I said, I am not letting anyone take the flag from me, the concept of America from me. I am what it is for real, not this other bullshit. And so I'm not gonna let them comment, dear,

and no one should. But anyway, so American dream, I've lost my train of thought. Anyway, yeah. Well, I have a barn burner of a story, but I'm gonna save it to the next fact. But it's about having my first, I have my second burner of a story, but I'm gonna save it to the next fact check. Oh, shit. But it's about, I had my first, I had my second incident, but my first big incident.

Yeah, so that'll be on the next fact check. Can't wait. Let's just say as a teaser, I have dealt with law enforcement already. Oh. Oh my God. Wow. Well, I am excited to hear.

Took a little shorter than I was hoping, but. Wow. I have met a lot of the law. Okay. I just wanna say, yeah, I feel guilty. I feel weirdly ashamed to say in public. That you have this. But I would feel crazy dishonest. Like I just am so happy.

Yeah. I'm so happy. Why are you ashamed? I don't know, a tall poppy or like, we didn't like rich people growing up. I don't know, people hate rich people. I know that. I don't want someone to hate me. You've spread that a lot.

Yeah, I probably am gonna reap what I sowed is what I, yeah, the bills come due. But it would feel crazy to not share how just unbelievably grateful and happy I am. I'm so happy I could cry. I mean, I just can't believe. What are the, like, the, tell me more. Well, a couple things, you won't like one of them,

but a couple things are just like, I love where I'm from. Like my whole family was here, my brother and my sister are just like, I love where I'm from. Like my whole family was here, my brother and my sister, my mom, and we're on the boat. And all of us are saying the exact same thing. Like, well, this is definitely just up North Michigan. This is up North Michigan,

yet there's also a Walmart five minutes away. And there's restaurants. So it's like, it's an impossible, like this almost doesn't even exist in Michigan, where you have that rural of a lake. I can, for people who don't know, I can turn right out of my cove and I can go 60 miles up river before I hit a dam.

It's just endless and all these little coves and it's just, it's not built up. So my whole family is going like, oh fuck, we're in Northern Michigan. Yeah, we're in Northern Michigan and we're 40 minutes from Emily Burger, which we ate at. So like, I just can't believe the gift

that is this place, location-wise. I'm going to get ice cream at night, like Americans. There's so much of it I miss from childhood. You go on summer nights to go get ice cream. There's no Dairy Queen in LA. There's Baskin-Romans, just a stone's throw from our house. Too close someone argue.

The clientele. But this is the part that you won't like, but I still would share with you because I'm telling you everything. In just a couple of weeks here, I am able to re-see LA the way I did before I moved there. In just a few weeks of being away from there. What do you mean?

Like, do you remember leaving Georgia and your idea of Hollywood and then going there and it's like very intimidating and scary and then you gotta get going and you gotta get an agent and you gotta figure this thing out and then you're really paying attention to what everyone else is doing because hopefully someone will have a tip

and I'll figure out how to get an agent and then I'll figure out what to do in auditions and oh, that's a good tip. And it's a very consumed town. It's very, very consumed. This is what I love about it. It's one of the most ambitious places I've ever been in my life, other than New York City.

Yeah, both, they're similar. Which is like so ambitious and such a company town. Yep. And billboards of your peers everywhere you drive. And just the whole like, this is what you won't like about it, but a little bit of our self-obsession with ourselves. Like we're kind of the center of the universe there.

And- It's about getting ahead. Yeah, and just being on task. And- It's about getting ahead. Yeah, and just being on task. And again, just you're looking around. Working hard. And looking around nonstop. And there's all this visual,

when you're in insurance here, you could be crushing as an insurance provider. You're not gonna see a billboard of your competitor, unless it was an ad. I mean, you guys, but you know, in our time, the whole place is covered with your peers. Yeah. With their different projects that are happening.

Yeah. And you're just like, oh, I haven't, I haven't. But you don't still, and I don't either. I'm out of that. Yeah. But just as a town, it's a very, it's a very naval gazery town. Yes, it is.

I guess my thought was, I was like, yeah, no wonder Chappelle moved back to Ohio. Like to be able to do comedy and have it be cutting accurate, astute, you can't be sitting in the center of it. I mean, that's his explanation. Yeah, I don't know if that's true because I think there are other people doing it who live there that also are able to,

but for him, I guess that's, I mean, for him, he's so specific, he had to leave the country to get away from everything for a while, so for him, that's where he makes the best art. But I just heard him say that once, and I was like, do you really, I was kind of like, do you really need to live in Ohio to have a real perspective?

But I understand what he's saying. Yeah. I understand what he's saying a lot. I understand too. Yeah, and maybe there's more insular towns, but it's a very insular town, LA. I just think, not to de-minute, maybe it's cause you just got here. Like I don't- Yeah, it could wear off.

There's a lot of things. No, I think you'll love it, it's not about that. I just think you, to me, this is insular too. Like to me, everywhere you go becomes insular, becomes about what it is. And that becomes clear after being in a place for a while. LA is specific because it's glitzy. It's across the board.

Everyone knows what it is. Same with New York. Like that's, but when you're in a place for a long time, the fabric of what it is comes to the surface. And it is, to me, as insular and telling and specific as LA is. I guess here I just, I get this sense that life's about so much more than work.

Yeah, that's nice. And I think a lot of, I have a lot of friends I love and care about in LA that have, their lives have been ruined by the fact that they haven't met their goals. For sure. Professionally, and that's heartbreaking. Yeah, it is.

And I like being reminded like, no, life is about also friends and family and like that part's neat. Yes. And I don't think I ever thought I'd be able to see LA about also friends and family and like that part's neat. And I don't think I ever thought I'd be able to see LA again the way I saw it before I lived there. But I can see myself being able to actually kind of have two visions of it.

Yeah. I think it's interesting that you're feeling that now though because I feel like now we're not, especially you, are not there anymore, like in that head space of on the hamster, and actually that's sort of a beautiful thing about being there for that long. If you do get a lot of the things you want,

you do see the truth, you do see the reality of what achievement really is or what work really should feel like, or, you know, I don't know, I think that's a thing you get there if you're lucky, that you don't get from a nine to five job that most people are living in these parts. I guess if I had to say one statement that I just really would stand by, it's that, oh, yes, every place has trade-offs.

Every country has trade-offs. Life is trade-offs. There's no perfect place. There's no perfect city. Yeah, of course. It's like these trade-offs, and what is it that you are hungry for in your life? And yes, that exists there,

and you're willing to take on this unfortunate trade-off of it. Yeah. And that evolves over time, unfortunate trade off of it. Yeah. And that evolves over time and every city has it. And I'm not declaring one or better or worse. It's just like seeing and recognizing the trade offs is interesting.

Yeah. Yeah. There definitely are. And just to, I feel it's needed to say, like the reason you can feel like life isn't about work is because you're in a position. That's insight. It's insight and it's like most people,

it's not insight at your age. Right, you know, I know. Like not even close. Again, back to the, yeah. So like. Guilty gratitude. Well, yeah, but I'm just saying, like there's a reason,

most people don't have the luxury of saying like, most people should say, your whole life shouldn't be about work. But most people can't say, your life isn't about work because that's how we all live in this country. We, that's how we- Yeah, but even if you're working,

it's a means to an end more than an identity. It feels like here. It's like, Huey does his thing so he can go on vacation. Yeah, of course. Wherever island he just came from. Anyways, yeah, it's just, I think in our town, our work is more our identity than in other places. Yes, but to me, and this is maybe wrong,

it's because our work is connected to art, and art is an identity, and our work specifically is our identity. It's literally us putting forth our thoughts and our, you know. But where the evaluating your identity on the outcome of your artistic pursuit is tricky. Yeah, it is.

I guess not to like pull the curtain too far back, but we obviously, we have our job at least for two more years that we're in a contract. So I feel like safe in that way, but you being here. It's scary. Scares me and has been interesting for me. Like, okay, the things that I think are permanent are not.

And I need to plan for that. And it sucks. Like it really bums me out because I like our lives a lot. I like this job so much. Me too. And it's so special and we got so fucking lucky. Like it's so wild. And the idea that like that is going to end

and it's not really probably gonna be my decision, that sucks. Like this kind of thing we stumbled into, I'm gonna have to figure out something else potentially. And I need to potentially start thinking about that before I wanted to. Like I was really sort of happy being very present doing this and putting a lot of all my effort

and energy into it and being like, I don't have to worry. And this has triggered a lot of worry. Sure, I bet. So I'm just moving through it, I guess. Yeah, I would be stressed if I were you. Yeah, if you were 37 and you had your dream job and you knew it was on its way. That's right.

Based on nothing you could do. I too have my dream job, you knew it was on its way. That's right. Based on that thing you could do. I too have my dream job, same, love it. And yeah, I'll be 52 or 53 at the end of our contract, which is yeah, just different. It is different. But also it's like, that seems young to me. It is. That's like so young.

It is young. You know, my dad's in his seventies and he's like not, you know, I don't know. It's just, it's just interesting. It's all, it's all interesting. My thing and I think I've tried to tell it to you is in some weird way, I am so lucky and it would weirdly feel kind of disrespectful

and dishonoring of how much luck I've had to not explore the gift of that, which is like, who am I without work? I have that luxury. I'm really lucky. I'm so lucky. I get to maybe say, who am I without work? Yeah.

It's just like, it's almost, I mean, it is this job. Let's just say this, I don't think, A, this job doesn't resemble what I'm about to say. So be very clear, I'm not doing a false equivalency. And I don't think you would be doing it this way. But I have over my years in LA seen a lot of people stay at it simply because they knew it was really hard to get and they don't wanna lose it.

And they're not doing it for any inspired reason or they just got trapped. They got fearful it would never stick around and then that led to, they just never evaluated. And I have this bizarre feeling that that would be a dishonoring of this huge lucky thing for me to like never stop and go, okay, what else do we wanna do before we die? I'm Planet Earth and I, but again,

I don't want anyone listening to think that I have declared I'm quitting in two years. I'm not, I haven't said that. There's also a version where maybe we don't do 162 episodes a year that would be appealing to me. The soonest I could ever be here full-time would be eight years from now. I know, I'm just saying.

I understand, if I were you, I would be nervous and scared and I understand all of your anxiety and it's very normal. I guess I think I thought that I was like Buddhist, you know, since I've been Buddhist recently. And I thought like- Since White Lotus season four. Yeah, the most recent White Lotus.

I thought that I was like really at peace. Yeah. Like, oh, I'm fine. Like, and I am fine. I feel like, oh, I don't, I'm not, I'm off the treadmill. I'm not thinking about what's gonna happen in the future or what's, how am I gonna maintain this

or how am I, I'm very present in this job. And like, now I feel like that's gone and that feels like a loss. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I wanna figure out how to have that still, but also be realistic about my life. And that's very- That's what you're juggling.

Yeah, that's what I'm juggling. Yeah. Anyway. I understand. I'm sorry I'm stressing you out. Look, I guess that's also part of it. I feel very competent as a person. I feel very independent as a person. I feel very independent as a person. I believe in my skills and myself for the most part now.

But again, when this is happening, I don't. Well, you're in fear. Yeah, and I feel like, oh, this is all here because I'm attached to you. I'll never make a dollar again. I'm attached to you, you decide to go, then what? Then I don't have anything anymore. I don't have any skills, I don't have it.

What am I gonna do? I don't even have. Soul cycle. I can always go back to soul cycle, I guess. Yeah, it's just a lot to, I just have a lot of anxiety. Yeah. But it's fine, it'll all be fine. I'm sorry I'm part of that.

It's okay, I chose it. But also I didn't, like you can't, I don't think independence, fully independence like works. It doesn't work for me. I'm a collaborator. I like that. It requires them being connected to other people

and not having full control. And that sucks, but that's part of the game too, so. Yeah. Anyway, okay, we gotta do some facts. Let's do some facts. All right, this is for another hottie with the body. Alexander Skarsgard? Oh yeah.

Oh, consider me charmed. Me too. I'm gonna add a piece of information that wasn't available in the interview that I can't imagine he would care I say now, but I think it would be very informative to people. It's telling. Yes, I think you and I both went into this interview

going, who is he? He's such a kind of enigma. He dresses so uniquely on things. Is he playful? Is he serious? What is he? And what we found out after is his best friend, here we go, ding ding ding, best friend.

I mean- Best friend! I presume he means in LA. He might have a different one in Sweden, but- He probably means his one and only. Jack McBrer is his best friend, which I can't think of a better vote of confidence than Jack McBrer is his best friend, which I can't think of a better vote of confidence than Jack McBrare being your best friend.

That's a winner. I agree. Yeah, so Alex was so playful and fun. It was a real revelation for me. I fell pretty in love with him, did you? 100%. He's wildest dreams, you know? That's a tall boy right there.

He was so tall. Would you climb around on there? Would you do a little climbing? Hey, hey, hey, let's be respectful. He's got a family, okay? I'd go for a climb if I were a gal. I'd go for a little climb. Okay, he can.

He's so nice. He hangs out with Jack McBrayer. Yeah, that's how he gets you. He has a family. Then you're in a pretzel reverse back double penny. And you're like, what happened? Oh my God. Anyway, he was lovely.

I really, I liked him a lot. Okay, now I looked up how many calories do you burn in Greenland just trying to stay warm, but I couldn't find that because it kept saying, you know, it has to do with your BMI and stuff, some other stuff, you know. But it does say being cold can lead to increased calorie burning. When your body temperature drops it triggers a process called thermogenesis where your body works to generate heat, burning more calories in the process. This can happen through shivering

or through the activation of brown fat. Mm, that's what I'm trying to do in my cold plunge. Yeah, but I wish it wasn't called brown fat. It's like very racist. I like it, and it's confusing, because it sounds bad, doesn't it? Brown fat, like it's decayed. But- It's gone rancid.

You wanna activate that brown fat, so now I've come to embrace brown fat as positive. But you're right, it sounds, it's not a great branding. I bet if people knew about brown fat when I was little, they would have called me brown fatty on the playground. You're very tiny. I've seen pictures. You were, they would have made fun of you, brown fatty on the playground. No, you're very tiny. I've seen pictures.

They would have made fun of you, but it would have been for the other direction, probably. Okay, now I looked up, can vampires change if they can't die? Right, great question. As mythical beings, vampires don't follow the rules of normal human aging or physical change. Their appearance is generally fixed at the moment they are turned into vampires.

However, some sources suggest the following ways in which their look might change. And then there's a bunch of ways, but it's not what you were talking about. So I think there was a slip up in True Blood. Yeah, yeah, I think so too. How are you gonna keep these actors in the same exact shape? It's not easy.

Yeah, you can't. Maybe it depends on how much blood they're getting. Like they could get thin, cause they're gonna die, cause they're not getting enough blood. Maybe, but it doesn't seem like that happens either. Their weight doesn't seem to fluctuate. Also blood's not super caloric.

It's not like, I mean, I doubt they're even getting 3000,000 calories a day in blood. That's a lot of blood. But it's how they, it's all they consume. How much blood would 3,000 calories of human blood be? This might get me flagged. Yeah, it will. Okay, so one liter of blood is 650 calories.

So you'd need 4.6 liters of blood to get 3000 calories a day. That's like a gallon and a half of blood. Would you ever drink someone's blood? For fun? Like, wait, did I or would I? Would you? Sure. Have you?

No, I don't think so. And yes, sure. Would you? It would really, there is't think so. And yes, sure. Would you? It would really, there's, there is something about blood. It's like one of the only, it really makes me feel queasy. It does, cause it's warm. Thinking about drinking it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Don't say warm. Yeah. I mean, I would like lick. Someone's bloody cut, right? Yeah, I would lick someone's bloody cut depending on the person, depending on the person. Of course.

But if like thinking about blood in a cup, I don't think I can do that. Yeah, yeah. And it gets sticky quick, I think. Oh. Yeah. Like I think I'd rather drink someone's pee. Yeah, me too, yeah.

But pee's just water. And bacteria. Some minerals. I think it's sterile when it comes out. But isn't it like cleaning, I don't get that, because it's like cleaning out your system, so it should have gross stuff in there. But then I think your kidneys and your bladder

and your liver take all the shit out. They cleanse it. Not if you have a UTI, because they test your urine and they test it for that curing. That's true, that's true. All right, I'll ask if urine is antiseptic. Is human urine sterile? No, human urine is not sterile, at least not once

it leaves the body. Here's why. Inside the bladder, urine is generally low in bacteria, but not completely sterile. Advanced DNA testing has shown that even healthy bladders contain small amounts of non-pathogenic bacteria, the urinary microbiome. But once the urine exits the body, it picks up bacteria from the urethra and skin, making it definitely non-sterile. The myth, the idea that urine is sterile came from outdated testing methods that couldn't detect low levels of bacteria. In short, not sterile and healthy people, just low in human bacteria, harmful bacteria. Okay, now we know. Yeah. Okay, why do sobs have the key in the center? Sob placed the ignition key in the center console primarily for

safety reasons. Moving the key away from the steering column and dashboard reduced the risk of injury during collisions as the key could potentially cause knee or other body part injuries. Additionally, it allowed for a more ergonomic design, facilitating a smooth transition from starting the car to shifting gears. Not in an inordinate amount of rollovers, as suggested by the brand ambassador.

I guess not, but it is still safety related. So they're claiming, yeah. Cause your knee would hit the key so often. Speaking of Swedish vehicles, my mom just got a Volvo. No kidding. Yeah. Yeah, those are nice. My best friend Nate has one.

Oh my God. He loves it. Okay, you said Taylor doesn't sing Wildest Dreams often. In concert, yeah. In the Aras Tour. Now I looked and she did sing it when I saw her. Okay. And then, yes, Taylor Swift does perform Wildest Dreams

during the Aras Tour, specifically in the part of the 1989 era segment of the show. This may be where you're confused. In the original theatrical release of the Eras Tour film, Wildest Dream was not included, but it is present in the extended version. So the movie didn't have it originally.

Certainly didn't, and that's what I saw first. Yeah. And then I saw the show, and I think she was singing it to me. I'm gonna stand by that though. Oh, all right. I don't love you getting a fact and then not taking it. Right.

Okay. I understand. Also at one point, I just want the people to know that this is clocked, that you do a Swedish accent, but you definitely slipped into an Indian accent. Oh, I don't know about that. Cause I know my Indian accent very specifically. I know when I'm in it, but you think I was in it unintentionally or unaware?

Yeah. You're gonna have to listen back just for that. All right. What word was I saying, do you remember? You were saying a bunch of words. Like a couple sentences worth. Okay. You'll know it.

You'll know it when you hear it. Okay. All right. Thanks for making me better. You're welcome. And that's gonna be it. Oh, I loved them. Call me, count me charmed.

Me too. That was a hot couple of weeks for you. Oh man, were we on a tear of hotties. Yeah, yeah. Hottie summer. Really nice. Boy summer. That was a hot couple of weeks for you. Oh man, were we on a tear of hotties. Yeah, yeah. Hottie summer. Really nice. Boy summer.

The rat summer's over. We're done with rats. Rat boy summer. I'm not. I'm not done with them. You're just getting into your rat phase. All right. All right.

I love you. Love you. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.

Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.

Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.

Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Amazon Music, or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to every episode of Armchair Expert early and ad free right now by joining Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at Wondry.com slash survey.