Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard - Colin Kaepernick

Episode Date: October 19, 2026

Colin Kaepernick (The Perilous Fight, Colin in Black & White, I Color Myself Different) is a former NFL quarterback, author, and civil rights activist. Colin joins Armchair Expert to discuss growing up Black in a white adoptive family, finding belonging in a Modesto barbershop, and choosing football over Major League Baseball prospects. Colin and Dax talk about the racial code words used to evaluate quarterbacks, reaching the Super Bowl in his tenth career start, and the teammate who helped turn sitting into kneeling. Colin explains why loving parents can still have blind spots, how reading Malcolm X reframed his childhood, and what happens when your daughter inherits your refusal to back down.Start your 2 month free trial today: https://youtube.com/premium . Terms Apply. Cancel Anytime.Check Allstate first for a quote that could save you hundreds: https://www.allstate.com/ See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Welcome, welcome, welcome. Now, I'm chair expert. I'm Dax Shepherd. I'm joined by Lily Padman. Hi. Hello. Today we have Colin Kaepernick on. You know who Colin Kaepernick is. I don't have to tell you, but he is an activist and a former professional football quarterback. He has an incredible book. I love, love, love his book. It's called The Periless Fight and it is out now. And it is the story of his life leading up to the moment we are all quite aware of. The Neil. The kneel. Yeah, kneeling during the anthem. And then the fallout of that. Really interesting, man and story. Incredible. Incredible. And very, very revealing about the experience. Being a football player. A professional athlete going into the NFL. Yeah. Yeah. Really wild. I enjoyed the hell out of this. Please enjoy Colin Kaepernick. He's an object.

How's it? Good to meet you. Good to meet you, too. Welcome. Oh, thank you. Hi. So nice to meet you. Great to meet you. Hi. This is your spot. Great set up.

Oh, thank you. This is good. If we hadn't had the camera over a little further, we might be fucked right now. Oh, that's true. We might have some blockage. It's true. Well, that's okay. Look like you're hiding in the bushes speaking.

Everyone gets half on my face, which might be preferred. That's fantastic. Yeah, that is preferred. We don't need to be on camera. No, no, no, no. We don't love seeing ourselves. I was excited to meet you and see how we compared physically. And you are taller than meets of my disappointment.

How tall are you? A lot, Monica. Sorry, I noticed it. I almost wore my red wings today. I'm like, I could use another inch probably. Seven inches. How tall are you? Six, five.

Six five. Yeah, but you actually read like seven. Oh, you do. Oh, because we have a theory about this. Once you hit six feet, each inch is exponential. We think it's over six, too. I think it's over six feet. I think it's over six feet.

Each inch actually accounts for an extra amount. So it's why you look like really, really, really tall. I presume you've met Shaquille. Yeah. So Shaquil is 7-1, so he is seven inches taller than you or eight inches taller than you. Yep. Did he not feel like he was 14 inches tall? than you? Very tall. I'll say apart with him is also how big he is. Oh, he's massive.

You're not supposed to be that tall and that big. Yeah, it's true. We got pretty distracted by the hands. Yeah. I was like, my lord, that hand is as big as my whole torso. The first time that I met him, it was some award show. I was talking to someone, I felt someone's hands go on my shoulders. And I was like, I don't like this. Whoever this is is a big, Big human being and I don't like it because I know they're bigger than me. Yeah. And it was him standing behind me. Do you know we had almost the same first experience with them,

which is I was walking 20 years ago into a movie premiere. And he was behind me. And I said from behind, I'm sorry, sir, you're going to have to leave. I like to be the tallest people at premieres. And he turned around and he was laughing. And then he put his hands under my armpits. And he picked me up like a baby. And I was like in the air, I was like, fucking how strong is dealt.

And you can just lift 200 pounds up like that. Yeah, that's different. The other person I met more recently was Wembe. He's between like 7-4 and 7-6. Oh, my God. So I met him while on Nike's campus training. He had just got drafted at that point. I walked over to say hi.

And I was like, I don't like the fact that I have to look up like this. Yeah. I had a moment of, man, is this how people feel they're like mid five feet talking to me? Yes. Looking straight up your nose. I'm like, this is terrible. Yes. That's how I walk around the nose.

I'm five feet tall. Everyone I'm looking up at. I'm seeing in everyone's nostrils. Everyone. But back to the exponential nature of it. Yeah. What was interesting is we took a picture, right? So it's Shaq, it's me, it's Monica.

Well, so Shaq is 11 inches taller than me. but I'm 13 inches taller than Monica. But the gap between me and Monica seems insignificant, but this gap above seems insane. Yeah. It's like that 6-3 mark. Now I'm like, okay, you're tall. I agree.

6-2, 6-1, I'm like, you're solid height. Still tall, but like... Respectable. You haven't hit the point where I'm like, oh, you're a tall person? Yes. Couldn't agree more. That is the number.

I think everything north of 6-4, you're exceptionally tall at that point. I'm comforted that you. have put this much time and thought into it because I certainly have and I imagine it's all from envy, but you're a phenom as well. And it's very comforting to know like, oh, no, you're, you're in what's going on around you. Okay, well, I just want to say, I really, really enjoyed your book. As much as I don't think you could be alive in 2016 and not be aware of you, I wasn't terribly aware of any backstory. I didn't know anything about you. I don't follow them NFL all that

much. I'm a lazy fan. I watch the playoffs. Or if Detroit's doing good, I watch the So, yeah, I really didn't know any of your personal story other than what I saw and then saw, of course, the media frenzy that surrounded that whole event. So I really enjoyed learning about you and I really enjoyed your book, just for starters. Thank you. And it's fun. I do recommend people listen to it because it's very well produced. You're reading it. There's music.

There are real clips. If a historical clip exists, it's in there. It's very Malcolm Gladwell. That's awesome. How did you enjoy writing it? It was a process writing it. It's interesting because I've done children's books in the past, which are like, all right, distill everything down to like its simplest form.

This is obviously a much more elaborate process. You do have to go back and relive situations and go through that process. At the same time, it's balancing how the story is going to ultimately connect. What are the things that actually readers and listeners are going to want to engage with that you think are important and balancing that with the level of depth and detail that you want to go into in each of those. What about the stress of having to write about your parents and write about your childhood? What I was trying to accomplish with the book is giving this context of I know my parents love me. I know they want what was best for me. They did things that

set me up morally, gave me great foundation, allowed me to go out and be successful. At the same time, there's this dynamic of acknowledging my blackness and navigating my blackness and what that means for me showing up in the world that they just didn't understand. They're ill-equips. Yeah. They don't have the lived experience of it, even if they're trying to understand, they're not ever going to have that full experience. And in doing so, it's like, you obviously want to make sure that you're, for me, trying

to protect my parents in that relationship. Yeah. But also, I have to be truthful about the experiences. otherwise it doesn't do the job that's supposed to in not only telling my story, but hopefully giving insight to other people in relation to how to be able to navigate this in the future. That's actually been an interesting part for me is the amount of other adopted people that have come across, even in the last week or so, that have been like, yes. Yeah, that's me.

You're like, yes. Yeah. So it's just start because I don't know that everyone would know because I certainly didn't know. You were adopted. Adopted in Milwaukee at five weeks old. my biological father was black, biological mother was white, was adopted into an all-white family. My parents had two other kids. And I got it, not to be mean, but super white family.

I mean, dad's like a cheese executive. And this is Wisconsin. Is that like Louisiana white folk or, you know, we think of white folks. We're like in Minnesota, Wisconsin, northern Michigan, you know. I didn't know that either. That's very unique. And they had two white children. Yes.

And two biological children. What ultimately led to them adopting me was they had two other children that had congenital heart defects who ultimately ended up passing. So the recommendation was you probably shouldn't try to have more kids, but they wanted to have a larger family. And that led to me being adopted. I mean, right out of the gate, I go, these are really sweet people. Yeah.

Of course. You know, we're starting with some well-intentioned people probably, you know? Yes. You start the book, and I think it's a great jumping off point. So it's about this experience you had when you were eight. The family, when you're five years old, you guys moved to four years old. We moved to Turlock. Okay, Turlock, California, which is a dead center of California.

Great place if you're white. Dad takes a great job as a VP of production at a cheese place. Yep. Cheese. What an industry. I know, I'm starving. So it's a very, very white neighborhood you're living in. And then what happens when you're eight?

Is any eight-year-old, I'm outside right around, plays sports every opportunity I get. And one summer day, I'm on the way back from playing in the street with everyone. Sun's about to go down. So streetlights are about to come on. It's like, all right, we got to make it home. And on my way home, I see a few of the kids that have just been playing with. Maybe we have a chance to keep playing. Like, competition goes on.

But I go up to them to see what they're doing. And they grab me, tie me to a rose tree, call me a nigger in the process. and it was a moment of like, I'm not sure what is happening. At that point, I hadn't had anyone like sit me down and talk to me about racism that I'm going to be facing in the world and how that may show up. So these are kids that I had seen around the neighborhood. In my mind, I was like, well, we've been playing together, so we're friends. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And that obviously just was not the case. It got to a point where, you know, I'm running home and backtrack. Before I actually start running home, the only reason they stopped was a neighbor drove by and was like, hey, what are y'all doing? Didn't stop? Just kept rolling by. But they ultimately ran the house. I was able to get out of the road, run home. But this goes into some of the conversation of my parents not understanding my blackness and the dynamic there where when I get home, I'm like, I can't tell my parents.

I don't know if they're going to have my back in this situation. I got to deal with by myself and I ran upstairs, got cleaned up and came downstairs. Like, nothing happened. Yeah, mom asks, do you have fun playing? You're like, yeah. Yeah. This will be hard to answer in a sense. But what do you suppose you were afraid would happen if you told them?

What did you fear they might say or feel that you were trying to avoid? I think the core of it is like, would they have my back or would they believe me? in part because I knew this was around me being black. I didn't have a full context, but understood, all right, they're calling me to end word. At that point, I had heard them say the word before. But there wasn't really any other black folks around to be like, all right, this is what is? This is how you should be thinking about it. Don't ever let someone call you that.

Exactly. Here's the history of this word. You just knew it was kind of a bad word. I know it's a bad word. I know it's related to black people. Right. But that's all. But I don't have the historical context.

The depth of the word. And also what can come alongside of it. Yeah, because you also had an experience when you're like three playing with your older sister and a bunch of kids and cousins. And one of the little girls says, catch the N word as they're chasing you. And then your mom says, don't say that. But then there's really no debrief beyond that. It's just like, that's a bad word. Don't say that.

Yeah. I mean, that was one that I didn't even know until I was in the NFL and my mom was recalling this to me. Wow. And I was like, oh. Like what? It gave me context around some of those experiences, especially reflecting back. Even at a young age, I remember going to kindergarten

and my mom bringing up, I was constantly targeted for playing aggressive. Those were moments that even she called out. Like, he's just out there playing. Why are you singling him out? Yeah, yeah. I was taller. I was a tall kid.

But those things showed up early on. This is a tricky question, but it did cross my mind. I was enormous. It looked like I flunked. Other parents thought I was a dumb, dumb. I also was dyslexic and I was a dumb, no. I couldn't read for a long time, right? So I had a lot of stuff coming at me, but I was like, oversized.

And other parents were afraid of their kids around me. How do you begin to parse out what all the variables are that are resulting? I mean, does it even matter? I'm just curious. Like, there's probably many, it's a dynamic situation. Yeah. And how I try to break this out. is like, yes, I was taller.

I know that was a factor, but I also wasn't the only tall kid in the class. Yeah, right, right, right. By the way, I'm not trying to minimize what was going on. I think one of the cruel aspects of being different is like, it's hard to know what thing is going on sometimes. Oh, yeah. Right?

Is this a normal dust up between people or is this element on the table? Like in this situation, there has to be a bit of confusion often about, like, what is the thing that's happening right now? How do I figure out? I know something different's happening right now to me than other people. Well, part of it also is culture, like the culture you're in and what you're exposed to. Like, you do know innately. Like, oh, this is about, I mean, we talk about this sometimes.

I have like a spidey sense about that too. I'm like, oh, this is about race or this is about being a woman. You know, there's all these things that you get used to when you're on the other side. But I could see if you are not that, that you're just like, well, maybe they just think this. or maybe they just think this. But I think it's just like an eight. But even, yeah, for you, you can be in situations where it's like you're young and you're wealthy. So that's triggering to some people.

You're also a woman who's got power. That's a whole thing. And then you're brown. So that's one thing. And it's like when you're in that situation, I guess you're saying you just intuitively kind of know which of these things is triggering this person. In the way you have a spidey sense about like men being violent. It's like I think when your other, you really get granular about the way people are. looking at you and talking to you and you know what it is.

Uh-huh. To that point, I think you start picking up all of the cues that lead to behaviors. So you may not be 100% this is what it is, but you may pick up on, oh, I've seen these behaviors before. I've tried to look at patterns. Yeah, we're all pattern recognition machines. Exactly. You can't not notice it.

So, I mean, when you have explicit instances like the one I had, that becomes like, okay, that's a defended milestone and like benchmark to be able to look at. What it also gives you insight into is, all right, what were all of the other interactions that I had with them? And are there signals that I can pick up there that I'm seeing in other places that are producing the same outcome? Right. And be ahead of it for your protection, right?

That is one of the things coming out of that situation. As traumatic as that is, is also a realization of, oh, I'm not going to get got like that again. Looking back, there was always a little bit of, of like, oh, I don't fully know what they're thinking. Like, there was a little bit of like, I can't quite read you. Whereas other kids, it was like, oh, we're just playing. And I can tell you're just enjoying playing. Yes. Yeah. And like, that's the only thing. And at this point, I'm eight years old. So I have a limited number of experiences. Yeah. But I'm like, I don't know,

maybe they're having a bad day. Maybe they're just a little bit meaner or they have a different attitude. I don't fully know. Now on the tail end of that, I'm like, Oh, okay, noted. If someone's responding or engaging with me in this way that they're a little more pulled back or a little more reserve or a little colder in this, let me make sure I'm aware of the situation and what I'm walking into and the surrounding environment. For me, I don't ever want to just jump to that assumption. I want to assume everyone has good intent.

It's going to approach things that way. But I'm also not going to ignore the signals that I'll pick up over a lifetime now. Yeah, yeah. You can't be naive. Yeah. So that event happens. There's others, again, if we can make a good faith argument for your parents. I wonder what they thought when they adopted you. I wonder what they thought like, well, we're going to have to address this or were they just like, no, people are people and we'll raise them and love them like our other kids and everything will be fine. Do you think they just maybe were naive about what was coming down the path? I think to some extent, my parents are great people. I think they were doing it with good intention. I don't think there was any malice of like, oh, we're going to kid him and we're going to like.

We're going to put them in a fish out of water situation and just watch. That's not what it was. Yeah. But I do think it was a sense of, they had done things like, oh, they got me a black my buddy doll. They'd give me an insight of like, hey, this is where we think you're from in Africa. So like, there wasn't a question of like, hey, you're not black. But some of those like superficial things are the areas that I think they took actions that were like, oh, this is going to help.

And I was like, those things did, but the depth of everything else that followed then became cultural differences. And I think that's where it was like, well, this is how we were raised. They can't pass on what they don't have. Yes. But I think it's also having the insight

and wherewithal of, hey, we don't have this. Exactly. Like, we need to go find that for you. Correct. Yes. And when that does show up, we need to support you in it. Those are areas where culturally where it comes up is like hair, clothes, music. What age are you when you fall in love with Alan Iverson? He's like your first hero, yeah.

I'm my middle school. Okay. Four or five years after this incident with the rose tree. Yeah. You see him and what does he represent to you? Someone who is unapologetically himself. He shows up in a world that tells him to conform and tells him to assimilate. And he's like, no, this is who I am.

His peers, other franchise players, Jordan, Pippen, they're wearing suits to games. Yep. That was kind of the standard at the time, right? If you were a franchise player, you showed up in a suit, you did that thing. Iverson just did not do that. And at the same time also went out and was the best at his craft. It wasn't a, I'm showing up as who I am, but like performance isn't backing that up. Yeah, yeah.

It's like, no, I'm one of the best players. in the NBA. Going back to the size conversation, ask someone who's undersized at that. He's better looking than everyone, so we got to adjust there. We got to give him some points there. He might have been the prettiest player in the league,

so that helps. He has the swag, the presence, the order, like, all of it. So you have that. And then for me, I'm seeing him having to combat that and having to fight just for who he is at the NBA level.

And for me, that translates into, I feel like I'm fighting a similar fight, just in how I show up within my house, within my community. Yes. And that becomes a parallel of like, I can look up to him and model some of what I do after him. We also see this with Randy Moss in football. And we see it with Ken Griffey Jr. and baseball,

where they show up and they're the best at their craft. But culturally, they shift the entire league. And they shift the culture. And you see other players following. Well, they get permission to the other players to continue to be themselves. Exactly. But in the process, they take a lot of heat. Yes.

I don't love it. I don't know if that's a process of change. But I wish it didn't have to be in a space where they had to navigate and go through that just to show up as who they are. Yeah. Back to not really sharing with mom and dad what you're experiencing and being isolated in this kind of loneliness and this awareness. Like, oh, yeah, massively different. Everyone's aware of it. We're pretending it's not a big issue, but it is.

You know, keeping that in. were you at all thinking, oh, these people adopted me, I don't want to be a pain in the ass to them. Like, was that in your mind at all? No. It's good. Yeah, I wouldn't think that's healthy, but I could imagine an eight-year-old thinking that. This also speaks to just how they approach things. It was never like, oh, you're the adopted son.

Right. It was like, oh, you're just our son. I think part of that bled over to like, oh, you're just our son. We don't be a think about like all of the black. elements of you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like how we nurture that. That wasn't a factor or something that came across my mind.

Yeah. It was more so just on a base of what is the response going to be? What are they going to say? You might have known intuitively they weren't going to offer any help. They weren't going to be capable of offering any help, really. Yeah. Were you worried they were going to like blame you or be like, what did you do? My assumption was, oh, what's going to come back is, you know, what did you do?

See, yeah. Why did you put yourself in that situation? And it's like, well, I didn't do anything. I was trying to play. You're a parent now. I'm a parent. I do think parents inadvertently victim shame their children. But behind it is like, we got to prevent this.

I'm so scared this is going to happen to you all the time. What happens so we can figure out how it cannot happen again? Yeah. Which definitely comes out as victim shaming. But I do think, again, there's like fear on the parent's side of like, oh, no, how do we prevent this? This is terrifying to think this is happening to you. You're left to figure out. what you did to justify getting attacked.

Yeah, because also in some ways you're protecting them by not telling them because then they have to sit with, oh, no, our son is dealing with this. This is horrible. What do we do? We don't know what to do. In some ways, you're protecting them by not telling them. And that's really too much for an eight-year-old to shoulder. On the other side, though, it gave me useful skill sets.

Obviously, don't want to go through that situation. But it does build a sense of resilience. in a sense of like, if I have to, I can navigate anything by myself. I've gotten comfortable now walking in spaces being like, if this is just going to be me, like, I've done this before. Yeah, yeah. You've got some earned confidence. When you deal with difficult situations, you get through them, come out the other side.

Then it becomes, in many ways, that's a source of strength. Because you went through that, it builds some of that resilience or character. And also going back to pattern recognition. You build some of that pattern recognition of like, I'm going through something difficult. I've already been through things that are way worse than this. I can navigate this. Yeah. You're having some moments where you do get to interact with black culture, right?

You go to the Pop Warner tryouts when you're 10. And there's a black mom there. And she kind of immediately wants to single you out, right? She wants to check in with you. I was eight years old trying out for the football team. The teammate I had, Joey Addaway, he was 10 years old. Oh, right. He was a big boy.

He was the star running back. He is also, unfortunately, the person that one of my first tackling drills ran straight through my face. Not my favorite experience. But another moment of you get back up and keep going. It was his mom, Mrs. Hadaway, who, again, I don't know if this was like instinctual for her or if she was consciously like, I'm going to make sure I reach out to you. Yeah. But anytime I saw her, she's like, hey, baby, come here. How are you doing?

Are you doing good? and always just so loving and so warm. Yeah. And Turlock having so few black people that made everything. Was there something visceral in those exchanges that felt, for lack of a better word, right? Like, oh, this feels familiar without any reason for it to feel familiar or something. Very much so. It's almost like a sense of community and familial connection.

If something happened, I know I could go Miss Addaway and she would be like, tell me what happened. We're in to make sure things get right. She had your back. You knew that immediately, even though with your parents, you're like, I'm not sure. Well, my guess would be she understands immediately what you're experiencing. She's a black woman living in a Turlock. And she's got a black son who she most certainly has observed other things that you've gone through.

She knows what's happening with you without having to even ask you, probably, right? Those become parts where it's like culture shows up. There's immediate understanding. Yeah. Tell me about going to the barbershop because that's a similar one. That ties in similar playing football. It's one of the other black families in Turlock, the Clay's. And Ryan Clay was the younger brother.

Marcus Clay was the older brother. And Ryan had come to practice, and he had his hair braided. And I was like, this is my shot. Yeah. I have someone I can ask. Because prior to this is like, there's literally no one around me. I can even ask where to start. This is like pre-internet era that we are living in now.

So it's not like, oh, you can quickly Google it. Cornwall's near me on Google. That did not show up, especially not in Turlock. But that became the opportunity for me to ask. And he was like, yeah, I'll set you up with a woman that did mine. There's a young woman that was in high school. And he was like, no, you got to grow your hair to be about three inches long. So I'm going through this process, growing my hair out.

You go through like that in-between phase of like short hair and a little bit of, longer hair where you're like, this doesn't look great, but like, you got to get through it. You just got to get through it. That leads to me going to the young woman's house, trying to get my hair braided. Now, at that point, my hair wasn't quite long enough to be able to braid. Also, my curls in my hair are a little bit looser. So she was like, I got to work with this a little bit. And she was rubber banding throughout to be able to make sure that everything stayed.

We get about halfway through. And I think it was her sister that came in. I was like, oh, we need to go to mall. Oh. Like, we got to go right now. We got this event tomorrow. I don't remember what it was. I was like, all right, well, we got to jump in the car.

It's like you were at urgent care in there. Like, we actually got to go to the hospital. I just go outside like this. Yeah. I got half my head braided. In that point, it's like, well, I don't really have any other options. So, like, all right, I guess we're getting into the car. Oh, my God.

First time I have ever met them. Yeah. Yeah. I was like, candidly, now sitting here as a. parrot. I'm like, I probably wouldn't love that. Yeah, exactly. But drove to Modesto, they jumped out, got their stuff from the mall. As we're leaving, this is also my first crispy cream experience. Oh, okay. Yeah, very memorable day. Yeah, yeah. Were they hot? Was the light on? The hot light was on. Oh, baby. What a day to hit it. Yeah. We were leaving.

They're like, oh, the hot light's all. We got to go. What an incredible gimmick they figured out. I can't tell you how many times I've eaten it when I didn't even want them because I saw that hot. So I know. And it's such a universal. It's like the bat signal. It's like, you just got to go. That was the day I got put on game.

But then drive back, finish my hair up. The other part, just going back a little bit to the Mrs. Adaway kind of connection. The comfort to just jump in the car with them

and being like, all right, I know I'm going to be all right. That connection was there. Got back, finished, doing my hair. We're supposed to have my hair braided

and then be back home. Modesto is. was 30 minutes away. So we're probably gone for an additional two hours. Come back, finish my hair, call my mom. I was dreading calling her. Yes, of course. I'm like, I know I'm getting yelled at right now.

I also am like, I ain't really have too much control over the situation. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that very quickly led to if we're doing this, we're going to find someone that's a professional then. Oh. And that led to, okay, we're going to the barbershop and found a barbershop and found a bar. barbershop in Modesto and going to the barbershop, it feels wild saying this now. Middle school going to the barbershop was the first time that I walked into a black barbershop. I'd been as supercuts previously.

They're just shaving my head. There's nothing else to it. And going to Modesto, Modesto has a larger black population than Turlock does. So walking into the barbershop, I was like, oh, there's a whole community of us in here. Like, yeah, yeah, yeah. This is a whole new experience. Walking into the barbershop was like being at peace. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. I didn't know anybody in there. Well, it's your first time not feeling different, presumably, in your whole life so far. Yeah. And it's also everyone within the barbershop, culturally, we're looking at things very similar. I'm going to say exactly the same, but like, for most part, it's like, oh, okay, we're all on the same page. Now, I'll say with this barbershop, the front half was not a barbershop. The front half was a clothing store. In the back of it was the barbershop. So it was like, all of the clothes

that I was trying to negotiate with my parents, I want to get these. We're all in the front of that. It was one-stop shop for everything. Yeah. Yeah. Turnkey. Whoever the owner is, well done. That became another pivotal moment for me because I got to experience culture in a different way that hadn't previously. Even within that, when I walked in and it's like me walking in with my mom who's white, she is the only white person in this store. Yeah. I could tell the people within the store were like, okay, like, hey, we got you.

We know what's happening. It's interesting looking back. I know I do it now. If I see kids or if I see particularly adopted kids, it's like, yo, you're good. Let me make sure I'm looking out for you. And whether they knew it or not, like what that meant to me, just to have a sense of community. You don't even have to explain, like, you're good. And when you come from a space where it's constantly like, you have to try to justify why you're here or like, oh, you walk into a room.

It's like, all right, I have to explain the family dynamic, whether people realize they're not. Every one of those conversations is like, oh, I know you're different. Yeah, of course. When you get into spaces where it's like, oh, you don't have to explain. explain yourself, the sense of relief that comes along with that. Well, it becomes rote. You, like, literally have a script you respond to. Like, I have, when people are like, where are you from?

It's like, okay, well, from Georgia, but my parent, you know, it's like, yeah, it's like this whole thing that just comes out of your mouth because you've said it so many times. Yeah. Stay tuned for more armchair expert. If you dare. We are supported by Allstate. Checking Allstate first could say. you hundreds on car insurance. Not checking if your alarm is actually set before you go to bed,

you could have sworn you set it. Even remember looking at your phone, but apparently looking at it and pressing the button are two different things because now you're waking up to sunlight and panic. Yeah, checking first always makes sense. So check Allstate first for an auto quote. It could save you hundreds. You're in good hands with Allstate. Potential savings vary subject to terms, conditions, and availability. Allstate North American Insurance Company and Affiliates, Northbrook, Illinois. Now, the sports that you were drawn to, you were good at all sports, and you were particularly really good at baseball. Do you think you had more aptitude in baseball or football? In high school, baseball.

You were getting scouted in high school, yeah? Yeah. I had offers from major universities across the country. Major League Baseball came and sat in our living room, said they wanted to draft me. Yeah. Going to the Area Code games, which is like the All-Star game for baseball, where they do it by regions. Went there, pitched in front of MLBC. Scouts, I believe that same competition or tournament, Clayton Kershaw was pitching as part of that.

Not saying I was Clayton Kershaw in high school, but like those were the type of players that were playing and competing with. So it was like baseball, I was just in a different conversation where football was like, will one of y'all please give me a scholarship? In fact, they rank, you were saying in the book, it's out of five stars, they rank these potential athletes for schools. and it's out of five stars, you were a two-star ranking. Yeah. That's not ideal to get a full ride at a D-1.

No, it is not ideal. Okay, no, looking back, do you ever model out what your life would have been if you just done baseball? A, you could play longer, you'd be less injured. There's a lot of benefits to that sport. Longevity seems on the table on that sport more. It definitely is.

Pitchers, you have to be careful of shoulders. Well, you would have to, what is it, Tommy John by now? Probably. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But at this point, where science is, is like Tommy Johns, you'll be back pretty quickly. Right, right. It's just crazy. But going down the baseball path is so hard to project out because there's so many levels within baseball to actually get to the major leagues and just a lot of variables within that.

Yeah, you can get hurt in the minor leagues. I don't know the full politics of the different levels and dynamics there. So what would happen? I don't know. I was in a great position in high school as far as a foundation. to go out and be successful, just a lot longer journey there. Also, a lot of opportunity for development because at that point in time, I was like 6,4, 170 pounds. So we were talking about heights and builds.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. There was a lot more development to be had. But you enjoyed football more? I loved football way more. Well, in the book, there's two elements, right? You found the camaraderie to be much more significant in football. And then also football's blacker. Yeah.

You're in search of that, right? You want to be immersed in that after a life of not being immersed in it. How do you find the community that you were a part of? I found that in football. I didn't know this stat until I read your book, but NFL's 70% black. Yeah. And major league baseball right now is bound to decline from my understanding in relation to a number of black players. Do you blame the Japanese for that?

We'll cut that. There's so many great Asian players now. I was going to say, Japan is. producing incredible baseball players. Yeah, they really are. Currently, the best baseball player. Yeah, exactly. Oh, it's all.

Dude is so fucking serious. It's so ridiculous what he's doing out there. So serious. Like, I don't even know how to put that into context for people. It would be like Tom Brady also being the best defensive player to ever play. At the same time, it's like, that just doesn't make sense. Yeah, yeah. But interesting, to go to the Japanese baseball side,

one of the parts that I learned went and visited Nintendo in Seattle. And part of what opened that pipeline was, I believe it was the founder of Nintendo, bought a stake in the Mariners. And that's how Itiro came over from my understanding. So they have, within Nintendo's headquarters, they have a section for Ituro as part of that. And I believe that's what opened up the pipeline to Japan. But on the baseball side, I think a lot of the drop in black players within baseball is actually tied to the economics around it.

It's gotten so expensive to be on these travel leagues and all this. Travel leagues, baseball gloves, baseball bats, cleats. The bar that you have to be as far as financially is drastically gone up. So to fast forward, you send your DVD of your highlights to every single D-1 school in the country. And you end up in Reno at University of Nevada. You get in a fraternity there. You make some best friends there. You have a 13 and one season there.

You get a gun pulled on you there. you get in a icy car exit. They're like, tell me from how you entered college coming out of Turlock to when you leave, how did you change and evolve in that section? That's a lot of shit to happen to somebody. Well, for me, it feels like a normal college experience because it's the only thing I know. Probably not the norm. But one of the big pieces is as I went to college, one, you have the independence there,

but two, you now have a space where I get to choose everything. I get to choose when I show up, how I show up, where I show up. And some of the early connections and relationships I built were obviously through the football team, but that quickly expanded into some of the broader community. And that turned into one of my teammates, asked me to go to church with him, took me a second Baptist church in Reno. You'd only been to white church before that, right? Which was a Lutheran church, I think you said?

Yeah, I grew up in a Lutheran church. Baptized Methodists, raised Lutheran, you sit in church, you listen, you stand, you sing to him. You suffer. You sleep down? Yeah, you go there and you prove you can suffer for an hour. It is very like. Rigid. Then going to Second Baptist Church, for the most part, all black church.

But also was a culture shock in relation to what church looks like and what that experience is. Obviously, I had seen black churches. I hadn't been to one. And this was the first moment of me walking into a black church. Can you have fun in church like this? Everyone is so hype in here. I was like, I've never seen this energy in the church before. I can come back to this.

Yeah. Now, the other part, Lutheran Church, it's like 8 a.m. to 9 a.m. You're done. Baptist Church, when it ends is TBD. And I don't know how yours was, but I went with my grandparents who were all from the South. And yeah, it ends. And then there's a potluck after. So like when you go to church with them at 9 in the morning, you come on at 3 p.m.

It was like the whole Sunday. It's a full day experience. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you all have potluck afterwards? They did sometimes. But if it wasn't that, then it would be the friends in the church, be like, oh, come over for lunch. And one of my close friends, Mike Smith, went to that church. And he was one of the first people I met in Reno.

His family, I'd be like, oh, come over. We'll do lunch. And that was like another space that was like, oh, this is family. community. You never knew when it was going. You couldn't make plans on Sunday. And then you get like, take your time, pastor, take your time. You're like, we've been in here for three hours. So you get that experience. But it also gave me a space where it was like as I was playing in Reno and got to a space where more and more people knew me because of the success on the football field, that also became a space that was like, yeah, you're just calling in this space. So I

didn't have to show up as like the quarterback for the wolf pack. It was like, oh, just show up is who you are. You're worthy of love without any spectacular. Because prior to this and I should have mentioned this, you were very drawn to anything quantifiable where your value could not be questioned. I got this grade on this test. I like math. I get these scores.

I get these points. I have data. You can't deny me. and to experience that you didn't need any data is lovely. Yeah. It's interesting because I think there's a decent amount of people, whether consciously or subconsciously are drawn to spaces where it's like, if you try to tell me I don't belong somewhere and I can find a space that makes it so definitive

that you can't tell me I don't, then it becomes like, oh, well, those are spaces I'm interested in because now it's not just like whether or not you like me or whether or not I resonate with you. It's just like. It's proof. No. This is what it is. Yeah.

All of this, there's so much obvious comfort that came with this. Were there challenges in friction? Like, I can't imagine this isn't a fully faceted experience where there's also moments of confusion and challenge or no. One of the first moments was the first time I walked into church and I was like, oh, I am not dressed up to the standard here. You have experiences and learnings in that way. Were there any parts you didn't like?

Were there any parts of this black culture you were getting to immerse yourself in that you didn't like or that you were shocked that you didn't like? In college, there was such a tight community there. It wasn't something that I was like, I don't like this or I'm going to try to run from it. Did you ever feel too white? You get the color conversations of like skin tone and all that. What's interesting, my experience is typically that comes from a space of have you assimilated and are you rejecting. like black culture and rejecting your own culture? Or are you actually embracing your culture?

And I think that's a lot of where that conversation comes in because there are people that are, well, I would just say black folks that may be lighter skin, but they may be mixed or biracial. Oftentimes that experience is one of two extremes. You either fully embrace black culture and that's just who you are. Or the flip side, you just go all in on like assimilating and trying to prove your proximity to whiteness or, hey, I want to be accepted.

I think that's where that normally comes in. I also think you can get left without a country. I have a really good friend, and she got to go from the Bronx to a boarding school in Connecticut because she was brilliant. And so there she was fucked because she was the only black kid there.

And then she'd come home to the Bronx, having been there for eight months for school, and those kids thought she was fucking snobby and shitty now, but she wasn't. and like it somehow made her someone without a country. And I'm like, well, that's so cruel. I'll say I haven't had that experience. I also take the spaces of like, are people going to crack jokes?

Absolutely. Am I going to crack them back at them? Absolutely. Yeah, yeah. I think it is also people with tests to see like how you take things and are you going to take in stride. And I don't take offense to those things. I think some of that also comes out like the space of football where it's like you're constantly going to be challenged. That's just part of the environment.

It's the nature of it, right? Oftentimes, those are some of the closest relationships is when you are challenging each other, whether it's our running back in Reno or our tight end or our linebackers. People that have phenomenal relationships with, we would yell at each other and be going back and forth in practice, trying to make each other better and push each other to our limits. You get thick skin if you're in a team sport.

Yeah, you can't not. I'll also say this is just insight that I've gathered after having trained with players across the country and different trainers. I think the time period that we're in Reno, it was just a different culture and mentality. The way that we trained during that period, we were nuts. All of the players that came off of that team that went and trained to other places, what were y'all doing? Because just the mentality of it was a little bit absurd. So we had our defensive end go out and run a 4-4 at the combine. We had our tight end break the tight-end vertical jump at the combine.

It was like 43 or 44 inches. Yeah, you said when you got there, your 40 was slower than some of the defensive players. It was bad. Yeah. And you couldn't squat 225. No. And you were humiliated. And it was time to get serious.

So the tight end who went out and jumped, I think it was like 404. 44 inches at the combine. That's crazy. He was my roommate when I first got to Reno. He came in as a receiver at 6263, 220 pounds, probably like 7% body fat. I'm like,

you're a receiver? I'm like, I have to get together immediately. I go and try to squat 225. I get buried. He's over here squatting 315 plus. And I'm like, I need to figure this out immediately.

But he was also the person that was like, this is what we're going to do. Every night we're doing push-ups. When we go to the weight room, here's how you're going to train. Like, this is what helped get me here. So you build this camaraderie of like, yeah, I saw you get buried, but I'm also going to make sure I help you prepare for the other side. In that process, they're also definitely going to talk shit to you.

Right, right, right, right. You're going to get made fun of. That's where some of that thick skin comes in where it's like you don't take offense to it. You learn to be able to push back against it to be like, these are moments I have to rise to occasion now. Well, there's a rad anthropological thing happening, which is you guys have all declared. It's so declared unlike the rest of life.

You are in in-group. It's us against everyone else. And once you're on an in-group, we know instinctually there's love, support, and dedication. And so now I can receive all of this teasing and ridicule because it's safe. That's where you're able to thrive and grow to level set. You're like, I didn't know I would be able to get to. this place. My college teammates, we just went back for our Hall of Fame induction and immediately

interacting with all of them was like, never missed the beat. And because you have this experience of in many ways you go through hell together to try to accomplish this goal. And when you do, then it's like, we're forever bonded in some way. Like that connection is there. And that's one of the pieces that was beautiful within that too was the dynamic coming out of it. And when I went back, was like, a lot of my teammates, if people saw me walking down the street with them, it'd be like, all right, how was this relationship built if no one had a background? Uh-huh. I have teammates that now are like, hey, I do gun therapy in South Carolina and live on a ranch. Yeah.

And it's like, it's probably not the first person. People would be like, oh, you're walking down the street with. It would be like, that's one of my good friends. Or one of my teammates, Mullet living in Arizona. Probably voted for Trump. Maybe. Yeah. Like, I don't know.

But you don't care because he's... I don't know him in that regard. Right, right, right, right. We went through this of like, hey, we're trying to accomplish this goal. We're in the trenches in that way together. You know something way more significant about him than whatever opinion he might have on this other thing. Yeah. I just know them as phenomenal people that in moments of adversity,

they showed up. If I got in a situation and I had to call them, like, I know they would show up. That becomes the bond that you build as part of this. I think that's substantive. I think when you align because you have the same opinion on a topic that arose three months ago and that's the union, I don't think that's terribly substantive. I think the other thing is the action showing up for each other, having each other's back, being there when you need someone to pick up the phone, those things are real things. What team sports gives you in addition to what you were saying. It teaches you to rely on other people.

It shows you you need other people. If everyone isn't coming to the table doing their best, the whole thing falls apart and it is such a good life lesson. You need each other. Especially as a quarterback. Your physical well-being is dependent upon everybody doing their job. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They need to protect you.

Your confidence there has to be so high. So that trust in that relationship. You more than anyone. How many guys are coming at you? 10? Depends on the play. Okay. 11 on the field, but any play, it could be anywhere from three to eight people running at you.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, you've got the target. You also know if anyone has an opportunity to take a shot on you as the quarterback, they're going to take it. Yeah, when you're like at the arcade and you're shooting the things and one says 200 points, and one says 500, 100, once it's 10,000. Like the quarterback is worth 10,000 points. I want to find out the transition or go through the transition.

I think a couple key things happen. The Combine in particular, this was very informative to me. And I think a lot of people have limited knowledge of the Combine. And even if they watch it on TV, they're seeing a very small piece of what the Combine is. So just tell people briefly, what is the Combine experience? You get out of college, you go to this thing, you get evaluated. How does that work? Think of the Combine like an interview process.

Basically, that's the football interview process. To your point, what everyone sees is the final day of the Combine, which is, your 40-yard dash, your vertical jump, all of the skills in the drills. 40-yard dash, debatable. But those are things that actually translate to playing football, your ability to go out there. The three days prior, a lot of that, candidly, is just nonsense. You go through the medical exams, which that makes sense. The extent of it and some of the process around it is a little...

Actually, you had a bunch of fucked up shit, right, that they didn't catch there. I had stress fractures in my left shin that I think they did catch. They just didn't tell me. Oh, okay, okay, okay. Later, the Niners were like, here's your x-ray from the combine. Like, we're going to put a rod in your leg. Oh, wow.

But I didn't hear about that until months later when they drafted me. So at that point, I didn't even know I had stress fractures. Coming out of college, they're like, just deal with the pain. You'll be all right. There's that component. Then there's the actual interviews that you do. They're a free-for-all. They're wide-ranging.

I had interviews like I did with the 49ers. that were purely football. How much do you understand running an offense? Here's your offense. Here's this coverage. What are your reads? Why are you going through it? Why are you making these decisions?

Like, what's the progression? It was also like, well, here's our playbook. Repeat this playback to us. Uh-huh. Which the first time going through this came out of a spread offense. We did a lot of signaling from the sideline. Our play calls were very short. So that process was interesting.

There's other interviews and these have been reported on, whereas I, hey, are you gay? Whoa. Is your mother a prostitute? What? Is it real questions from the combine? After 2016 in the protest, how do you feel about Colin Kaepernick? Oh, my God.

As I heard you detail it when you were talking with David Resnick, what you observed was many of the questions are to really find out how obedient you are. Yeah. are you someone that is going to be combative or push back on these ideas or will you just accept them? Now, the part that I think makes this a little more nefarious is this is the turning point for a lot of these athletes that is going to be whether or not you get drafted, where you get drafted, it has direct financial implications and you are one step away from realizing your dream. that you've been working for 15 years at. Yes. In that moment, also, you're probably going to be somewhere

from like 21 to 23 years old in this process. All right, well, how do I respond to this? In most instances, this is like your first job interview that you're going through. And the stakes are so high. All right, whatever you need me to do, like, I'll do it because it's the last hurdle. And I also don't know what the NFL process is.

So I guess if you're telling me this is the process, all right, I'll go through it. And that also shows up with you have to strip down to your draws and walk across stage. Yeah, so like, wait, there's this moment where you have to walk across in your compression shorts. What do we suppose is the ostensible goal of that? And you said you're standing there, right? You know this is fucked up. You're asking other dudes, this feels a little weird, no?

Everybody knows it's weird. Yeah. And it's so reminiscent of what? It parallels slave auction blocks. Literally. This is the thing that I want to make clear because I see people put. back on this. No one is saying like, hey, the NFL is slavery. But there are very similar practices that they have that mirror or parallel slave auction blocks or slave trade in that regard.

And having that in a league that is approximately or approximately 70% black. And it has no direct correlation to your ability to go out and perform the job that they're asking you to do, which then begs the question, well, why does this exist? Yes. What is the purpose of it? Yeah, why are we doing this? Yeah. That's my hang up in life.

It's like, anytime I'm like, hold on a second, why are we doing this? I get so distracted by that and uncomfortable and I want to rage against that. Like, any time this is arbitrary and makes no sense. And when it's public, when it's humiliation, like, why have someone walk across the stage in their underwear? That's just so crazy. And if someone else at this point, a woman to do that, we all know at this point to push back. on that. Yeah.

But I don't think we're doing that with this. Why am I walking around in my bra on underwear across the stage? Also, you have like these well documented cases where these team owners, you know, like the Clippers team owner who would have this event, like his new recruits. He's got friends feel his biceps. You know, it's very fucking reminisce. It's like, these are my guys I own. You know, it's hard to deny.

Yeah. The parallel of like, come check out these new guys I've got. It is a culture that. exist within the sport. At this point, I'm a little bit amazed that there hasn't been a definitive stance taken by the players union. Yeah, we're not doing any of this anymore. Like, what do you we'll jump. What do you talk about? Like, we'll go do all the skills drills. Like, you need the medical records and exams. I understand that. That's your physical ability to go on and perform. But like all this other stuff that doesn't make sense. Like, no, we're not doing that.

Yeah, exactly. So this is still going on, 2026. This is happening. To my knowledge. Wow. I don't know if Monick would know the history of this, but let's briefly talk also about the history of the black quarterback in the NFL. The history of black quarterback is basically the quarterback position is viewed as like the CEO position. And that largely has been reserved for white people or white men in this instance. There's been a lot of struggle for black quarterbacks to actually remain quarterbacks as they reach the professional level. there's a constant push of like, oh, you're really athletic, you know, you freak of nature.

We can put you at receiver. Yeah, many of these guys enter the draft as a quarterback and then the team tries to turn them into a receiver. Yeah. Because it's like a smart. Is it like a because it's like they can't think? Because they don't think they have the mental capacity to run the offense. Use the words. The terms that are used constantly, you'll recognize them in they're kind of undeniable.

So how do they describe white versus black quarterbacks? Yeah. So white quarterbacks, they'll be like, he's a student of the game, he's a field general, he's a coach on the field, he's the CEO of your team. You'll get all of these phrases. For black quarterbacks, you'll get like, oh, he's a freak of nature, he's athletic, he's a raw talent, he's a beast. So you'll get all of the fiscal descriptions for black quarterbacks, all of the intellectual descriptions for white quarterbacks. And that historically has been the push to be able to maintain that position for white quarterbacks. I believe it was warm move, but it was one of the black quarterbacks early on.

I was like, I intentionally ran a slower 40 time to make sure that they didn't move by position. Wow. Well, he was that tactical about it. Wow. The level of awareness to be like, I know what you're going to try to do. This has continued to persist to today. Now we are in a position today where there's more black quarterbacks, in part because it's become so undeniable. Yeah, if you can have someone that can sit back there and throw the football,

and also run a 4-4, yeah, we're going to get the best of both worlds. But that has been a long history and a long battle. It's still one that continues today with how quarterbacks are talked about. Also, the grace that is given in relation to their performance or the critiques of their performance. So we still see it play out. There's a lot of bias within that. You are constantly facing and navigating. Yeah.

And then let's jump to. So Colin joins the team in 2011. you get this operation, your rookie are kind of awash. 2012, the starting quarterback gets injured. You're put in, your 10th start of your career is the Super Bowl, which is crazy. Oh, my gosh. Yes. But you have this really extreme situation you're in and you fucking rise to the occasion, right?

You set a record that still stands for most rush yards in a playoff game. How many yards was that? 181. As the quarterback. That's fucking nuts. When you're playing fantasy football and you've got a running back, that runs 100 years. Yeah, yeah.

But tell me about the article that comes out in response to your leadership of the team. I think it was David Whitley. Wrote an article at that point in time, I think it was for AOL. Basically, the article was like, would you want your quarterback

to look like he just got paroled? After this outstanding accomplishment. So embarrassing. It was everything from like, all right, you're a black quarterback to I have tattoos to I would wear like a snapback. and press conferences.

Everything about it didn't fit that stereotypical, like, white quarterback profile. It was fascinating to me and gave me early insight into what I was going to be facing. Because at this point, this was on that run to the Super Bowl, but this was after my third start, fourth start, and we're playing well. And it's like, why is this the conversation? And as you said earlier, like, you have been indoctrinated to do things that are quantifiable, and you've done that and then still they're finding a reason. Well, what you know is that dude had that article in the chamber ready to fire.

And he was waiting for the person to arrive. He already wanted to say that for two years or whatever it was. It was like your third game up, oh, good, I got the dude to say this thing. I want to say, I hate how these guys are representing my team. That is very much what it felt like. But you come out the other side of it. My response to it was the next time I scored a touchdown, touch my skin, my tattoos, and ultimately kissed my arm.

And that led into what became known as capper-nicking. It turned into people being like, oh, we're capper-nicking, we're taking photos doing it. People were doing it internationally. So like the moment of how he was trying to attack actually turned into a moment where people were supporting. Now, the part that I didn't fully appreciate or understand at that moment was I took it as a very personal attack about me being in that position. As I got later in life, I looked at this as more so,

oh, he wasn't trying to just attack me individually. He was trying to attack the idea of someone like me in this position. And how could you take an opportunity to make a sweeping statement across an entire population? No, you can't play in that position. So it got me to a space of better understanding, like the individualism versus collectivism within that conversation. Yeah, I think when you're inside of it, it would be impossible not to take all this stuff

personally. Yeah, of course. Just as a human being, I mean, it is directed at you. Yeah. Stay tuned for more armchair expert, if you dare. So that happens, the combine happens. You've had your own experience, but in 15 you meet Nessa at the NBA All-Star game?

Yep. So you meet Nessa, who's now as well. It starts with her giving you the autobiography of Malcolm X. Yep. Okay, so you've got all these like anecdotal experiences, but it seems now in this period, you're able to place those in this kind of broad, systemic, historical context of what's going on.

Yeah, this is a bit of an awakening period. It gave me all of my lived experiences, context from a historical perspective. Now, growing up, Malcolm, the Panthers, they were demonized. So me reading the autobiography of Malcolm X gave me a deeper understanding of him, also what he faced and had to navigate,

but also the understanding that then tied into the black power movement, black pride, why that showed up the way it did, and gave me some of that insight. Now, with that context, then became, I can now look back at all these moments and they aren't just moments. They're part of broader systems

of actions that have been taken, against black folks. Now having that came a space of, well, now I have this insight, what am I going to do about it? Yeah. Yeah. And had you seen at that point, the 1968 Olympics, had you seen that demonstration at that point by Tommy Smith and John Carlos? Were you aware of that moment? That's the famous one of people don't remember the dudes got first and third in the 200 at the Olympics and they had the black power fist. It was a moment. Absolutely. You were aware of the power athletes could have in the right time and place. Yes, but I also didn't have the full context around those moments as well.

So that's where understanding or seeing the moment is one thing. It's a completely different one to say, oh, I see the moment, but I also understand the whole picture, the context of like where society was. Yes. And what led to the moment. Yes. Not just like, oh, that was the moment. Now, I've had the opportunity to be able to talk with and sit down with Tommy and John

and get deeper understanding of some of what they went through on the back end of that as well. And that also becomes context of what these moments are. I presume people are like you betrayed your country. It's not your time to do this. You're representing the, is that what the backlash was? The attacks, the attempt to isolate. I got to experience something similar, but they're doing this. in the 60s. They're in an environment. They have paved the way for us to be able to have the

interactions that we have now because of how severe the interactions they had to go through. Yeah. But all of those get put into context during this time period for me. And that becomes so powerful because these don't become one-off moments in my life now. They make a lot more sense. They're all connected. Also, the part I would say that I love and appreciate about Nessa is she also is someone that even early on in our relationship was like, I will fight for you in this as well. You'll never be alone again in this. No. I remember a conversation around at this point in time, I was growing my hair out again.

And that became a conversation of like, you need to cut your hair. I remember Nessa got pulled into that. And it was like, don't you think he should cut his hair? Doesn't he look better with short hair? And she was like, no, I love his hair. I love his curls. I think he should keep growing it. That was a moment of like, oh, even if she's put under pressure to try to go against me or, hey, I need you to say this.

And they're making it easy too, right? They're good at making it easy. It's also so leading. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know the answer we want. To your point, that was like, oh, I know I'm never going to have to walk alone. Yeah, you won't be at the dinner table saying I had a good day by yourself. Exactly.

Yeah, yeah. simultaneous to this self-education you're going through, then Mario Woods starts getting headlines and you become very aware of all the stuff that's happening. A couple of things I didn't know about the actual protests was that it had started in preseason as just you sat. You would sit on the water cooler. Yeah.

Now, please educate me. The national anthem and the Star Spangled Banner are the same thing, right? Our national anthem is the Star Spangled Banner. Yes. Tell me there's a same thing. section I heard you talking again to Resnik about this. Like what there's a section about the slaves. What is known as the national anthem is just the first verse. The third verse includes language or verbiage within it. That's basically like no slave will escape. Right. Like everything's good.

The slaves won't be escaping. Most people don't like to acknowledge it. Yeah. All right, if you're going to take the song, take the totality of it, which is like, it's racist. Yeah, yeah. You like the song? You're obligated to know what the song is. Yeah. It's not like like a debate. Oh, dude, I'm reading Malcolm Gladwell's new book that's not out yet. And it's all about the Second Amendment. And it's all about the notion of militias. The militias were not to defend us against a tyrannical government. The militias were to keep the slaves from fucking having another Sonos rebellion. That's what was happening. Yes. It's cut and dry. It's fucking nuts. And those are the parts why history matters. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Tell us why reading matters.

Mm-hmm. Education matters. People can read. It's also why fighting against book bands matter. Yeah, exactly. Because, like, we should be able to engage with the content that gives us the context to be able to understand how we got here. Yes. And ultimately, how we move forward. Okay, so tell me about Eric Reed, because, again, I don't know this part.

I don't know the Nate Boyer part and I don't know the Eric Reed part. So originally you're sitting, you're sitting during preseason games. And then how does it evolve to taking a knee? After the third preseason game, Steve Weiss, who was a NFL reporter, came up, asked me why I had been sitting. I gave him that rationale. It was around police killing black folks, trying to address that issue specifically within the larger systemic oppression that black people, people of color are facing. On the back of that, a lot of backlash, also a lot of support, but my teammate Eric Reid, who was our first round draft pick out of LSU, was the safety,

came up to me before our next game. I was like, hey, can I talk to you? I believe in what you're doing. I also see some of the pushback that you're getting, let's talk through this. And through that, there's like, look, here's my thoughts. People are saying you're separated from the team because you're not up front with them. They say you're being disrespectful. Let's go take a knee up in the front. And we'll address both of those concerns so we can get everybody focused on the issue. Smart.

I mean, not that worked with smart. If you're doing things in good faith, like, hey, we're addressing the issue. Oh, guess what, we have a new issue. Exactly. From that point, yeah, let's do it. So Eric is now in the protest and we're going to be going out that night to do it. After that, the 49ers had asked us or asked me to meet with Nate Boyer who had written an open letter. He had played in Seattle, I think for a short period of time, was a Green Beret.

And they're like, hey, he's in town. Would you sit down and talk to him? Like, all right, we can talk to him quick. So I think we had like a 20-minute conversation. Was he supportive? Yeah, supportive. He had some of his critiques around it. He had that outlined in his letter. In that conversation, we told him we're going to go out and take a knee at that point. He was supportive of that. Also said he was going to go out and take a knee with us. We're like, okay, great. You want to join in? More of the merrier. Now, we went out that night right before the Star-Spangled banner, he came up and was like, I took an oath. I actually can't take a knee with you. Okay. Because of the green brain us? Was that the explanation? Who knows? No one knows. I don't know what changed between that meeting and that night. What it felt like is this is much more of a photo op than like, hey, I'm going to be in this with you.

So from that point, he went around saying like, hey, I told them to take a knee. That was part of the conversation that went on out there. Really quick. Do you think his intention was to take credit for that or was his intention to say, I've co-signed on this? How it came off is both. And I think the both part of it, one, it was opportunistic that very quickly led to like movie roles coming out the other side of it. But it also became a much more convenient narrative for people to engage with.

It was like this white man, a vet came in and told them what to do. So like that's more acceptable in our eyes. And I think that speaks very similar to like the black quarterback conversation of, well, who should be leading? If it's this white man that's helping lead, that's better. Versus these two black men out here who came up with this and are trying to address a larger issue, we don't like that as much. Well, and then we know everything that happened after that event.

I guess my last question for you is, I don't know about you, but having kids has forced me to re-examine my own story. in all these wonderful ways, illuminating ways, you know, things that I would have said that were the result of nurture, because I grew up in a very chaotic place. Lo and behold, these kids have the same nature as me, right? And they don't, you know, so I'm like, oh, I guess that's a bit of my story. I mean, maybe genetically I might be a lot this way. And I just wonder, just huge journey you've been on having this baby girl is it made you poke at certain areas of it that you had totally. conviction about. The first one that it makes me think of is when we first had our baby girl,

I was like, she is her own person. I almost got defensive when people are like, oh, she looks like you or she's doing this like you. I'm like, she's her own person. Like don't try to make her beat. Just like I was my own person my whole life. And now there are things that she does. I'm like, oh, hard to deny. That's pretty on the nose. So she is a very determined when she is locked in on something, she is locked in. She is also, and we've tried to instill this in her, but I think she instinctually has this too of like want her to be independent and want her to be willing to like push the bounds on things.

And recall this moment of, and this was just a few months ago, sitting at the dinner table, she hadn't been doing a great job listening. How old is she? Sorry. She's three. At this point, she was three. She just turned four. in August. Yeah, she's young.

Bar is high. So I'm sitting there. I'm like, all right, she's not listening. Sitting at the dinner table and she's like, can I play after dinner? I'm like, no. One, you haven't ate your food. Two, you haven't done this. Three, you haven't done this. And this little girl goes, what's four? And I was like, oh, you don't care. You do not get. These kids.

She is willing to challenge. And it's also okay with the consequences on the other side of it. And I'm like, this is fascinating to watch. Colin, I had the exact same moment. People have heard the story. But our littler daughter, her whole life was these Paul Patrol toys. She carried them around everywhere. She talked to them.

Her whole life was these things. And they were in the bathtub. She left them all in the bathtub. And then we had friends over her. She would not stop coming out of room. And she was like three, like your daughter's age. And then like 12th time. She will not just stay down.

I pick her up and I take her into the bathroom. I've snapped. I'm not proud of this decision. I grab all the Paw Patrol toys and I throw them in the trash can. And I say, if you come out of your room again, this trash can is going to the outdoor trash can. And she looked at me cold and goes, Daddy, you forgot one. And I look and sure not there was one in the top. And I was like, oh, I'm fine.

There's no like mono and mono battle with her I'm going to win. We've got a completely changed course right now. Oh. Because this is untenable. This is not going to work. I had a same experience. Try to like take stuffies away from her. Mm-hmm.

And she got to a point that was like, oh, are you going to take this one? Yeah. Let me offer it to you. Are you going to take both of these? Yeah. Here you go. Isn't it cool though?

It's beautiful because she has no fear. Yes. And it teaches you like, listen, your stubbornness and your bravery has. served you and served so many people. It has. And also, you don't pick when it's useful. You're also a pain in the fucking ass, I guarantee.

Oh. As soon as you have one of yourself, you're like, oh, man, I'm also a pain in the fucking ass. That is Ness's favorite part. Yeah. She was like, you have to deal with you now. Yeah. She's like, it's just honest.

Enjoy. But she's not going to get pushed around. It's so great. That's also a part of it that I'm like, all right, she's going to be a little light-skinned black girl. Yeah. She's going to have Kaepernick is her last name. She's also tall. I know she's going to have to face things. She

ain't asked for. So I'm like, you have to be prepared. I'm going to have prepare you earlier. It sounds like you don't have to do much for parent. Oh, man. Sounds like she might already have it. She is just walking in it. Yeah. Good for her. I love it. I'm also

like, don't direct it at me. Yes, exactly. No, that's for the enemies. That way. That's for all of our enemies. That's not for us. Well, Colin's been a delight to meet you. The book is called The Periless Fight. And again, I really do recommend listening to it.

It's a very well-produced and fun listen, informative and specific, and I loved it. So I hope everyone checks out The Periless Fight. It's been a delight having you. And hopefully next time we meet, I'll be taller. I appreciate it. This has been incredible. And also, congratulations on all the success. Oh, thank you, man.

Appreciate it. We have a ton of admiration for you. Thanks for coming. Thank you. He is an armchair expert, but he makes mistakes all the time. Thank God Monica's here. She's got to let them have the facts. How are you doing?

Did you have a late night? I know you went to a party. I did go to a party. It wasn't supposed to be a late night, but it was a late night because they could not find my car. They lost your car. It was really very upset. setting, but we can get to that later because you have stories. Oh, well, I just wanted to give my update on the very special trip to Las Vegas.

Yeah. Which, Monica, it couldn't have been a better trip. Go on. Well, I mean, where do we start? We go out to eat on, we all arrive on Thursday. We go out into a steakhouse. We get a bonkers delicious meal. We gambled for one hour.

And when we were all done, we were up $25, which is. That's great. Nothing feels better. Yeah. If you can get an hour. of entertainment and I walk away, $25 a head. You've done great. We're in the right frame of mind to go now to the show.

Uh-huh. And I got to add that the show just kept getting better and better. The Metallica at the sphere experience just kept getting better and better, which was first off, I had just begged Marcel to see if he could get tickets. It was sold out. Kristen's publicist. Yes. And he's also a publicist in Nashville with a lot of musicians.

So he has a lot of great music connections. Yes. I always beg him to hook me up with someone. So whatever, I just bought tickets. Then I'm kind of interacting with some folks about those tickets. And then they said, like, well, hey, we can have someone meet you at the entrance and show you to your seat. And I'm like, that sounds great. Yes, please.

Then a day later, the next email was like, hey, as it turns out, we can put you in the suite. And I was like, oh, my Lord, this is incredible. So it went to suite. So then we met this one. wonderful woman at the door, and she took us up to the sweet level. And this is where this really involves you. The merch counter up there wasn't open yet. No one was there yet. And it was on the sweet floor. And she said, do you want to go to the merch table? And I said, oh, my God, yes. You just learned you had to go. I've never had a party at a merch table the way this party

unfolded. There was the most incredible Filipino woman about 50 years old who she and I, immediately had a thing. It was so fun and exciting. We were going bananas. We got everything. Great. Tirel, it was me weekly and Tyrell, the two errands. And it was so much fun buying this merch. And when we walked away, Tyrell said, I think you just healed like a good chunk of my childhood trauma. Because he finally got. You can't get, well, you're not allowed to get merch when we were younger. And only did we get merch, we got all the merch. It was so excited. Wow. I want you to reach behind the cushion you're leaning against.

Oh, boy. There's a hidden present for me, I think. Hold on. You can do it. You can do it. Wow. I even got my friend. Thank you.

My new vintage shirt. Yes. That was the small size they had. It's great. You'll have to fold it up at the bottom or something. No, it's cute. I'll tuck it in. It says life burns faster.

Sure. Yeah. And it's what in. And that's the truth. As the band members age and I age. Oh, wow. Yeah, it just starts going faster and faster. Oh, it's also like the back is kind of spooky for Halloween.

Uh-huh. It would be a great Halloween shirt for you. Maybe I'll just wear this on Halloween. As you see, I put on the same one so that you would have it. Yeah, I love it. Thank you. Because you said get me merch and I laughed in your face. I'm like, I'm not going to wait in line for an hour to get merch.

Yeah. And it hurt my feelings, but it all worked out for everyone. That's why this relationship works. Talk about under promising and then over delivering. Yeah. Oh, wow. Okay. This is exciting. Okay, I can't wait for- Now go into the suite, Monica. Okay. Which immediately we're like, are you fucking kidding me? There's yummy food. Mind you, we just ate so much steak. We didn't care. We started eating immediately. Oh, sure. We meet Bill, who, I don't know, he's the manager of the place or he seemed very official.

And Aaron kept saying, Weekly kept saying, he thought Bill owned the place. That's how officially felt. Okay. He said, do you want to go on a tour of the sphere? Well, first he said, do you want to go down to the bottom and see what it's like next to the stage? Of course, this is before the band's playing. We're there early. So we go down and we check out that scene.

And that scene is really cool. It's such a different perspective than being in the middle where we were as far as seeing the screens and everything. You can kind of see the whole audience. And it's quite huge. Yeah. And we're getting to walk around the way they've got the stage built. You can be behind them or in front of them. It's very creative.

And then he's like, okay, do you want to see like how this thing is. works. And we got to go see. You're not. You're probably not supposed to share secrets. I don't think I am, but I need to say it's the most impressive thing as like an engineering nerd. There's 120,000 square feet of screens in there. Wow. There's 53,000 panels. It's 16K. They have more power than my house does. Oh, per every hundred square feet, I think. And I was saying, what happens when these screens go out? There's 50 some thousand screens. They must glitch.

And he was saying, yeah, they do. And someone on the floor shoots a laser beam. And then the laser beam alerts someone who repels down to the screens to reset them and fix them while the shows going on. There's people repelling inside of that place. That's crazy. And then we got to see the inside of the exoskeleton, the thing you see on the strip, the big outside display, which is completely different. screens. It's all these like big diodes. So we were in hog habit. We could have left. We got done with the two and we're like, trip totally worth going to Vegas if we left right now. I left out a

very special part. On the flight there, I had a friend who from the program who wanted some advice. And so I go, oh, I'm just getting on this airplane. Give me five minutes. I sit down in my seat before we take off and I call him. And we have like a 15 minute conversation about what he's going through. And apparently there was enough AA-type language happening that when I hung up my phone, the guy next to me goes, you sound like a really good sponsor. Oh, that's nice. And I go, oh, man, that's so sweet. I'm not a sponsor. If anything, it's a co-sponsorship. I'm often calling him. But then I was like, oh, are you in the program? I learned, I talked to this guy is like from takeoff to landing. Oh, that's nice. He was going to be at the show.

too. Wow. He'd been sober for like 28 years or something, a musician. Then he was in the suite next to us. So now we're hanging with this sweet dude I met on the airplane. Wow. I feel like everyone there was sober because they were all, it went so hard. Everyone either died or got sober. Yeah. Who was at Metallica. Yeah, who was like Metallic was the religion as a kid. Yeah. That's a great observation. Probably a high sobriety. Yeah. The show is fucking spectacular. It's crazy. They play fade to black. They, I mean, they play search and destroy. There's, I mean, it's, it's so awesome.

How long is it? I think it's 90 minutes. Oh. It's supposed to be around 90 minutes. Not very long. Perfect. Great amount of time. You know you.

You'd be out of there at 91 minutes. Oh, yeah. The cream on the top. Oh, cherry. You must remember the cherry on the top. Thank you. You must remember the three of us have known each since we were little kids. I know.

It's so cute. We love Metallica. Yeah. You love it. After the show. Lars invited us back to hang out. Nice. Wait.

This is a, whoa. This is also a ding, ding, ding. Because you just told a story about how you were with Lars and that you met. 2012. Right. And that you met the other guy. Yeah, the lead singer. And he didn't really like you.

This is on the Adam Grant episode. Yes. And I came full circle and recognized. Of course. I was bringing in energy. Is he alive still? He's the lead singer of the band. Okay.

And I just. I've got to say, I want to give him a shout out. He has kept it beastly. He's older than I am, but he still looks like the lead singer of Metallica. He has kept himself burly, and it works so well. And did he like you this time or what? He wasn't around. Just Lars, I know Lars-ish.

In fact, I was so flattered to invite his back because I'm like, I doubt he remember. That was 14 years ago that I hung out with him through Bradley is why I was there. Oh, Bradley Cooper. Famous actor. Yeah. V.C. famous actor. Extraordinary director.

So anyways, the fact Lars invited us back. The fact that he was talking with Tyrell and Weekly, so engaging. Yeah. And we just spent like half hour hanging out with our fucking favorite drummer. Yeah. And then. And then the big battle of, and this was the highlight of the trip. The battle, once you're leaving the sphere, is I think there's like 17,000 people,

some kind of capacity like that. And you're all going to, what, get a cab. back to your hotel. So we bounce up this side door. I'm like, we're just going to have to walk really far and get away from this place. Well, as soon as we bounce at this door, we see if one of those fucking bicycle taxis. A rickshaw? But it's a bicycle.

A rickshaw, I think they're carrying you with their feet. Yeah. Not a tuck tuck like Lincoln and I did where the guy drives. This guy's on a bicycle and there's a bench and back belt for two, I think. Okay. But all three of us got on. Sure. We take off.

We're going about 100 yards. And all of a sudden I see the sign, it says $100 a passenger. And I'm like, oh, now I'm like, wait, wait, this is nuts. This is nuts. I go, whoa, whoa, wait, hold on. It's $100 a person. And he's like, yeah, I'll give one for free. Okay.

And I'm like, oh, right. I mean, whatever. You were going to get an expensive cab or something. I was going to get a $25 cab versus. I bet they would be surging. Well, the cabs don't surge. They should. Yeah.

All to say, we were on this thing for a half hour. We were very far from our hotel, as it turns out. Oh, we're much farther than I. That's weird. Were you on the strip? Yeah, but at the very, very end. Okay. And so this, um, this bicycle cab ride through heavy, heavy traffic and construction zones and red lights and U-turns and drunk people was the most fun we've had in a decade. We were laughing so hard. He was blasting Metallica so fucking loud. He's pedaling his ass off. Midway through this trip, I'm like, this trip's worth much more than $200. Like this guy is just, he's,

peddling his brains out. Yeah, that's too much for him. He has three big people on his side. For a half of a, yeah, you had 600. Yeah, that's, you owed him 300. 60 pounds on the back wheels. That's too much. I gave him more than he asked. It should be a dollar per pound. Well, we couldn't have gone that far. That's. Yeah. I think that's a great way. A dollar per pound. A great way to charge. It's just a baby on back. Yeah. A $10 fare. But this, this bike ride, we were like, I want to take a bike taxi everywhere I go now, if it's with those two. Yeah. Okay. So then we go back to the room and we're watching the JZ documentary all together. Yeah.

You have to watch it. He's the most beautiful fucking human being on planet Earth. I don't know how this guy did all the things someone does in AA without AA. Like incredible. Yeah. So the three of us who are trying to better ourselves, we're just loving this role model. So that's delightful. You love it.

Next day, as you already know, I had a. wake up early to get the breakfast because I had a credit. This is a big, this was a tactical blunder. I did it two mornings in a row. So I never got enough sleep while I said I think this is, even though I'm not one to generally do what I'm about to do, which is like gender things. Yeah. I feel like the free breakfast is gendered. It's really a dad thing. I think men, not necessarily dad's like men feel that they have to capitalize on the free breakfast. For sure. And mind you, it wasn't even free because it was a credit, which of course, we. blew way the fuck past the credit.

Yeah. Yeah. It makes no sense in retrospect because I did. The only downside of the trip is that I got back with a level of exhaustion. I have not known in years. But it doesn't matter. We're not there yet. Oh. We hit that breakfast.

Then we hit the pool. Oh, great. We go to the pool. That's fun. That's your update that you go to the pool. We're not pool types. We go to the pool. You are pool types.

What are you talking about? The three of us in our friendship, we haven't spent any time. Kind of pools. That wasn't our thing. You have a pool five feet away. Yes, I go in the pool. The three of us have never been on a vacation and gone to the pool for two hours. Great.

Okay. It was really more fun than we were expecting. Fun people watching. Okay. Then, best friend Roy Choi's restaurant. Everyone has to go. I love Roy Choi. I love Roy Choi so much.

This is the luckiest weekend I've ever had. Oh, I got to add, too, because this is a merch weekend. Uh-huh. The band also sent some merch. After we had bought all the stuff, the band had sent up some merch. Okay, I have a question. Is this merch that you got me? Like, you can only get it there?

Yeah, it's a sphere specific one. Right. Like, you can't get it online? I haven't looked, but I don't think so. Great. Thanks. What if you said? I think you're going to line you through in the trash.

I just got nervous because you said the other merch got sent up. Oh, it was the same. Oh. I ended up with a duplicate of a shirt. Got it. Okay. Which is great. One 111, Nashville.

I've already got a whole game playing for my second one. Great. I might also cut the sleeves off that one. Okay. No, be careful because remember these are vintage cheese for the picture. Best friend. Okay. Yeah. Best friend, this restaurant, Roy Choy's restaurant, is so good.

You've eaten there, Rob? Yeah. Oh, I want to go. Rob, will you get me in there, too? Yep, you got it. Okay. Not only is it impossibly good. This fucking fried chicken we had there.

Oh, there was so much insane good stuff and everything tastes so original. Roy was there. He's not always there. Oh, fun. Did you remember you? Yes, he came and sat with us for a while, so we got to catch up with him and I was reminded like he is the most beautiful fucking dude. Guys, for real, if you have not listened to his episode, it is one of the best one. I know I'm been throwing that around.

I told him when I saw him, I said, I want you to know that I've been around Monica over a hundred times when she says that you are her favorite episode we've ever done. Guillermo did. He tied. It's like top three. I think it's Roy Troy, Guillermo, and Kihei Kuan. Kihei Kuan, he's up there. Okay. This trip is already impossibly.

You also have to remember from the perspective of Tyrell. Yes, he lives in Michigan. We're going places and like Lars is inviting us to hang out. It's very fun. We go to this incredible restaurant. The chef comes in hangs with us. They hand us a bag of merchandise. Does it say best friend?

Yes. And Aaron Weekly, best friend, Aaron Weekly. And I was a sweatsh. It looks like he has his own merch. I was going to say, okay, that makes more sense. You know, I don't eat dessert. Okay. Can't even.

I'm so nervous. I have too much stuff to get out really cool. No. Tell me about dessert. No. It wasn't even about dessert. Go on. It was about best friend merch?

Yes. Tell me about it. Tell me, please. I just, it does make sense that Aaron has merged, but I, that would have also been appropriate for me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Go on.

Okay. Dessert. I don't order dessert. Right. I always feel bad if I eat dessert, so I don't do it. Yeah. But they sent out three desserts. This upside down, did you have the upside down pineapple cake, Rob?

I don't think so. I would have never ordered a pineapple cake. Yeah. If anyone's listening goes to best friend, get six of those pineapple cakes. We tore into this pineapple. We were beside ourselves. We couldn't believe how good this dessert was. We ate all three desserts.

Yum. Yum. Then we go back to our hotel. Cool. We go to Cirque de Soleil Michael Jackson. Oh, how is that? Incredible. And again, I'm a little nervous.

My boys aren't like, this is my softer side who loves Circta solace. Who doesn't like Circtosolet? Well, that's the thing. I have a hunch. Everyone does. as if they see it. But I don't think most dudes are like, we got to hit up Cirque to Solace.

Right. It's incredible. The show starts, there's like 300 drones inside of the auditorium with you flying around your head and doing all sorts of crazy light stuff. And were they doing acrobatics? Oh, yeah.

Okay, good. Casino. But in tons of dancing. Okay. Because it's Michael Jackson. Of course. At the end, you get a hologram of Michael Jackson.

And I got to say, we concluded that if you saw this show in 1980, you would not know that was a hologram. Like, we know one enough. to know that's a hologram. Right. But I think you could have fooled people in the 1980s. Okay.

That's how convincing it looks that Michael Jackson's on the stage. Also, just one second on Michael Jackson. These dancers in this show are insane, right? And they're doing all the stuff he does. But they're showing a lot of clips of Michael. Yeah. And I got to say, I don't know that there's ever been a better dancer in the world. Even if you're doing the same moves as Michael Jackson,

he had a little bit of toad and just a little bit of fucking spunk on every move. I know. It's unreal. Yeah. He was a one of one dancer. That's true. Well, that concludes my trip. It was the greatest trip ever.

We went back to the room. Yes, we watched more JZ documentary. And then we all came home on Saturday. And it was just perfect. Good. I'm so glad you had a lovely trip with your best friends. Yes. The errands.

And that's just so sweet and lovely. We did an episode of Mom's Car with Tyrell. Yeah, I wanted to bring this up. There was a major sim thing that happened there. What happened? This is, this is. I mean, I have to say this is tied with Anthem Gum. Okay.

So we do an episode of Mom's Car with Tyro. Yeah. Tira has a very, very beautiful story. Then I'm really happy people will get to hear. Good. So it's a very special episode. Okay. We're all wearing our matching Metallica shirts.

Right. Yeah. And reminder to everyone, if they've not seen the show, we are actually Uber Eats delivery people. So we really pick up real orders and deliver to real people. And that's happening while we're interviewing someone. So we're hanging in the car. we get a pickup. Thank God we're in the Pacifica in the van. Yeah. Because we go to this house and it's this woman and she comes out and she's, she already looks a little frazzled, a little over her head. She's holding two

bags, good-sized bags. And I grab him, she goes, oh, there's 14 more. And I go, oh, okay. They don't tell you that. No, this was a wild pickup. I didn't know this was even on the menu. Yeah. You could, I think you could have someone move your entire apartment on Uber E's. God. So she says there's 14 more. So then it's like, well, everyone should get out of the van. Right. So now I'm thinking from her perspective, what has happened?

She ordered Uber. Now, three men get out. Sure. They're wearing matching Metallica shirts. The whole scene looks so ridiculous. But she comes out. She sees us in her things and she immediately goes, oh my God, you guys all look so cute in your Metallica shirts. Okay.

Great. So she likes it. Yeah. Thank God. It could have looked intimidating. Like, why are there three people on this Uber thing? Yeah, you're famous. but go on.

But again, I don't think she knew. No, go on. You knew who I was. So we load this van for a while, Monica. We load the van to the absolute fucking hill. The whole back is full. The inside next to Tyrell is full. All three of us are moving busy.

Yeah. It takes us 12 minutes to pack this van. Yeah. So then I just start following the directions to my drop-off, which is in the middle of the valley at a warehouse. Yes. So I pull up to this warehouse. I say, oh, 4B, that's it.

I get out. Well, we all get out. because there's so many packages. And as I'm walking out, two guys are walking out. And the one guy looks at me and he goes, oh, hey, Dax, of course. And I go, what do you mean? Of course.

I'm thinking he's going to be weirded out. I'm an Uber driver. Yep. He knows me. Why isn't he freaked out? I'm the Uber delivery guy. And I go, why, of course. And he goes, well, you're dropping off all the stuff for your wife's party tomorrow, right?

And I go, wait, what are you saying? He goes, all this stuff is all of the props. for the nobody wants this Facebook marketplace. Premier party. Premier party tomorrow. Yeah. I know. I go,

what? So how could we have picked up the fucking, all the props for the party by coincidence in a city of six million people? It's so strange. Right, like to the point where I'm like, is somehow Netflix's AI talking to Uber eats AI? I know. Is there some sophisticated patterns?

pattern someone recognized and put this together. I know. I delivered all the props you saw at that party. No, I know. Okay. And I found this out because I went to that. I went to the party. That's where my car was lost that maybe we'll talk about.

Yeah, we'll get to when you're done. And I get there. And actually, I look over and some people are putting up these trinkets. Okay. And I was like, ooh, what is that? And then whatever. You know, obviously I'm drawn to trinkets, but then I move on. The theme is like housewarming, right?

Exactly. The theme was housewarming because that's a part of this season. And all of our friends are there. So Molly's there and we're chatting. And then Molly, everywhere we go, if I'm ever somewhere with Molly, she knows someone. It's why she knows. It's definitely part of her AI. Okay, her programming.

Yeah. She knows absolutely everyone. And so she ran into someone she knew that what, that like maybe her daughter went to the school, blah, blah, blah, whatever. And in the middle, the woman. goes, oh, no, it's crazy. My husband arranged, do you know Dax picked up all this stuff? And then she was like, you know Dax?

And I was like, I know him. I've heard of it. And then, yeah, and then she was like, he picked about something. And I too, I was like, oh, I mean, yeah. He did her a favor. Yeah, exactly. And then she was like, he has some Uber thing. I was like, oh, Mom's Car?

Yes, this happened on an episode of Mom's Car. So weird. And then so Molly knows like that guy. I guess. That I delivered to? I think so, yeah. Okay. And he said, he did see her name and was like, is this, this couldn't be Dax Shepard.

So then maybe when he saw you, maybe he was like trying to, who knows. Compute. Yeah. Well, we told the lady, the lady's like, you know, you look so cute in your Metallica shirts, you guys all delivered together kind of a thing. And I go, oh, no, we record a podcast while we deliver. Like, we told her that. That's so weird. It was beyond kind of.

It's so weird. Yeah. Like it can't. That could not have happened. I know. I delivered all of the houseworms. By the way, there was a ton. Oh, good.

I'm glad. Yeah. The whole van was full. I did think that when I saw, when I found out what happened and I saw all those trinkets, I was like, how do they, that's a lot to ask. Yeah. I was glad I had two men with me and I was driving a van. You could have probably not, because a lot of those things ended up at our friend's houses,

because they were, they weren't props. They were things people could take. Yes, yes. I'm telling you that it wouldn't have fit in Kristen's car, which is what I'm registered as driving. Well, then, see, that's weird that it would pair you. Well, I don't know if she was fully honest about the amount of items. Or I don't know how that works. Huh, yeah. I just, I'm like, they really hit the jackpot.

There was three of us, and we had a van. Yeah. Otherwise, that's not working. That is so funny. So strange. So strange. Stay tuned for more. armchair expert, if you dare.

Okay. Did you have a fun time at the party? I did have a fun time at the party. Did you guys like by the pool? There was a pool there. It was Michael B. Jordan's old house. I heard that. Yeah.

So people wanted to go upstairs. So I was traveling. I was in New York. And then I was back. And all of that was great and amazing. Well, maybe we'll talk about that one day. Not one day. I'm kidding.

I'm kidding. I'm kidding. Like, I want to hear all of New York. No, I mean, there's not much to say. It was just great. So I've been tired. We've both been tired. We've both been tired.

But like, I don't know. And then yesterday I did another resi. Uh-huh. You're on fire. Another resi story, which was really fun. We went to a different area. Wine in the morning? It wasn't, well, yeah.

Oh, man. You love these resists. First, it was half a margarita. This is the perfect job for you. It's, you have to drink for your job. I know. This is heaven. And eat.

All these amazing. Amazing restaurants and talk. They don't even mean like being a cocaine reviewer in the late 90s. No, it really is perfect because I get to meet all these fun, like awesome chefs and eat their food and drink. Oh my God. It really is. Anyway, so I had that in the morning, but I'd wake up at 6 o'clock. I know a lot of people listening, that's like normal for them.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Sure. But I don't. And it is not normal for me. And I'm a late sleeper. I'm a night owl. Late riser.

I go to bed late. Even if I'm in bed early, I don't fall asleep until late. Yeah. So I was tired. I was really tired yesterday. Yeah. Yeah. And then we had this party.

And I really wanted to go because, of course, like fun party. And I wanted to support Kristen. I wanted to support Anna. It's big deal. And it was up in the hills, which like, they always are. I'm on the record saying I never want to go. back up there. I hate the hills. Sure, sure. Yeah, if you don't love driving and you get lost easy, it's not for you. But even if you, it's like, it's too windy, it's dark. Yeah, it's, ugh.

I hate it. Okay. So anyway, it's one of those things where you're driving and it was so trafficy because it was like around 630 heading that way. It was bad. And, you know, when I start to pull up and I missed a turn, you know, this horrible. And I'm like, should I just go home? Okay, you were thinking about Yeah, I was like, I think maybe I just need to go home. I'm tired. I don't. But, okay, no, I'm going to keep going. Okay.

Did you ever send anyone with you? You were driving solo. I was driving solo. Okay. And I get there and it's a valet. And so I, but there's like a lot of people. It's kind of chaotic, you know, whatever. Then I pull my car in.

They're like, okay, leave your keys in the seat. They gave me the ticket. Great. Go in. Great time. But I'm tired. So I'm ready to leave like kind of early. Yeah.

So a bunch of us go to leave. We all give our ticket. I'm like second to give my ticket. So Molly goes, her car comes. So obviously my car should come next, right? No, it's not coming. Okay, weird. All right.

Then I'm seeing a lot of people leaving. Coming and going. Yeah. Who's cars, who they arrived much later than me. And then, obviously, Anna and Kristen get in their car. They leave. Erica and Amy, we're starting. Everyone's now starting to be like, huh, this is a little weird.

And then the valet comes up to me and is like, like, hey, what color? What's your car? And I was like, Mercedes. And he was like, yeah, he was like, what color is a dark blue? And he was like, okay, he goes, a lot more time is passing. And I'm getting, the anxiety is starting to creep up. Now, are you thinking my thought at this moment would be, oh, they parked it somewhere and it got towed?

I did. Because they're just parking on these mighty streets. Like, there's no magic parking lot they're going to. They're just street parking. is a beatdown. Yes. And did it get towed? That's what I would have thought.

So, okay. I didn't, I didn't think about that. Okay. So then still waiting. Erica and Amy's car comes. And they are like... Should we drive you home? Well, they're like, we don't want to leave her.

Yeah. Can you just move the car over? We're going to stay until her car comes. Yeah. And they were like, no, her car is coming. Don't worry. It's coming. I parked it.

It's coming. And like, they're basically making everyone. leave because it's so tiny, right? Yeah, sure. So then they go and not and then my phone is dying. It's on red, Ozana, a little red stick. One last red sliver. Yeah. And then the guy and the valley comes over and he's like showing me pictures of keys. Oh. And he's like, are the, is it, are these, are these, are, which ones your key? Oh, Jesus. Yeah. And I am like, I don't know. I couldn't really tell from the pictures. You're going on it. Okay. And I was. also just like, where is my car?

Like I was really, and then it was hard because there was all these, you know, there's other people there. And then now everyone's like, where's your car? Oh, no. Now you're getting attention for it. Too much attention. And then, but also no one's like, they're kind of taking it seriously, but also everyone's laughing.

And I just, and I am at full anxiety at this point. And I want to be alone. Yeah. And making wrong turns in your car. I want to be alone in my thoughts. I don't want to be trying to like. chit chat with people while my car is lost. That's right.

And so I think I'm nervous that I was like maybe a little like short with some people, which I didn't want to be. And also so Nicole's, they didn't want to be. Nicole's husband, Kevin was there and Kevin and I were chatting. And then, you know, his car comes. And he also was like, he's like, ugh. Like he doesn't really want to leave.

Yeah. People who know me don't want to leave because they're worried obviously, but then they have to leave. Don't you kind of want them to leave? Like I did. But then I want to. I had to cry because I was alone. Okay, so you want a lot of things.

Only for the people who I love. But like when it was strangers, I didn't want them to talk me. You just wanted inner circle. Yeah, but they all left. And I was afraid my phone was going to die and I wasn't going to be able to call anyone to come pick me up. Yes. A lot was going on.

Although this is a great, this is one of your many opportunities to go for a ride home with the valet driver and find out that they have a really interesting life story. This is kind of like your routine. I didn't want to do that because they were not. being all that nice to me. Oh, blaming the victim. Yeah, because then at one point I went back over and I was like, hey, man, what's going on? Yeah, yeah.

And he was like, it's there. There's nothing I can do. And I was like, there's nothing you can do? Get my car is what, you know. Did it cross your mind to say, hey, I'm getting real close to calling the police to say my car's been stolen? No, I didn't. I should have. Okay.

You really needed me there. Yeah. So then he, yeah, he was like, it's. It's there pulling all the cars up. And I was like, okay, but you know I've been standing here for a very long time. I did say that. Yeah, okay. And then the other guy said, I know, I know.

I'm sorry. But like they were kind of gaslighting me. Like, this is normal. We're just bringing cars up. And I was like, no, no, no. I'm aware that this isn't normal. Also, because this man is showing me pictures of keys and is confused. And then I heard them talking.

And the other ballet was like, no, I parked her car. Like the key, so he couldn't have lost the keys. And I was like, oh, my God. They might have lost the key. So it was so, it was really stressful. Everyone's gone at this point. It's like me and some stragglers are waiting for their ubers, you know. And I pull up with Aaron and Aaron.

Pick up all the trinkets to return them to the ladies' house. Oh, my God. And like one of the guys that came over, a straggler was Big Noah from the show. And like, and I love him. I'm a fan of him. I loved him. I loved him on girls. And he's great on this. And I like, I was just like, I don't, I can't even talk to big Noah.

Like, I, I just want, I need to, like, I wanted to cry very badly. Yeah. I'm sorry. But I was like, but I'm not gonna. I'm a grown woman. But like, my car was stolen. I know. I know.

I know. You should have cried then. I'm sorry I said grown woman. You would have cried if your car got stolen. I would use my other. be the same thing that you had. I just, my, my, my, my, my manifestation would be different. I know.

It would probably be rage. And then I was like, I want to text Eric and Amy, but how many texts do I have left? Yeah, yeah. And I knew I was like, I'd have to get down this hill on a red sliver. Yeah. It was a lot. It was sucked. How did they end up telling me what happened?

Eventually it came. It came. There was no explanation. Yeah. They obviously, you're maybe, maybe it did get towed. Well, no. And they had to go get it. No, that would have taken hours.

I mean, it took a long time. Yeah. How long? I wish I had time. So, what time did you get home? 10 after 10. I was expecting you to say midnight. No, I left.

It's not that late though. I know, but like we went up there at like 8.50. Oh, okay. And this isn't far away. No, no, no. You live very close to Michael B. Jordan. His old house. Maybe he'll move back.

Maybe. We'll see if it moves. Anyway, that was like, I really hated that experience. I'm sorry that happened. And I don't want to go back up there. Okay. I'm not going to ask you to.

Thank you. All right. Oh, some facts. Oh, yeah. We remember it to do some facts. Okay. This is for Colin. Kaepernick.

Great episode. What a brave man. What a lovely man. Yeah. But what he did was quite brave. Mm-hmm. And he stands up a lot. I see it.

I see it all the time. He's just like constantly a voice of, he's not afraid. to stand up for, I mean, ironically stand up. Yeah. Or kneel down. Yeah. For what he believes. Whatever the situation calls for.

Yeah. He's great. Yes. He was enormous too. Yeah, he was so tall. He really made me look tiny. Yeah. We talked about that in the episode because I was like, he's a lot taller than you.

Yeah, yeah. But he's actually not a lot taller than you, which we discuss again, exponential. Also, his afro is enormous. I know. So he's getting at least six, seven inches on me on hair. It's so cool. Yeah. Yeah.

It really is. gorgeous pro. Okay. So speaking of, ding, ding, ding, ding, the Modesto Barbershop to where he first went to. And he said there were clothes in the front and it was kind of a one-stop shop. I did Google this. Okay. And unless this is a different one, it says the shop you were looking for is live wire clothing store

and live wire barber shop. Oh, great. It's still one stop. I hope it's the same one. Yeah. How could there be a second in the same mall? Except that it's, no, it's not at the mall. The mall was the one he went to with the one, with the, with the girls.

Yeah. This one is owned by rapper J. Stalin. Okay. So I don't know if it's the same, but I hope it is. Okay. Tommy Johns. Oh, the surgery. Yeah.

It's a terrorist brain of the ulnar collateral ligament, UCL. Uh-huh. Which is the intermedial ligament of the elbow that stabilizes the joint. I'm pointing to it for the viewers. Watch on YouTube so you can see. Just even if you skip everything else, come see where I'm pointing. Yeah. Because you don't know where your elbow is.

No. Inside your elbow. It's like such a- I can feel it. Oh, I know. I hate that. It feels like your funny bone would be triggered permanently, right? That's what it feels like.

Oh, I hate that. Okay. Yeah, stabilizes the joint during throwing and high-stress arm motions. I looked up total recovery time because he says with science, it's gotten a lot better. Yeah. 12 to 18 months for pitchers and overhead throwing athletes. It feels long. It's long.

Yeah. But maybe it doesn't take you out completely from the game. Yes. How many black players in the MLB or percentage in the MLB, they make up 6 to 8%? That's no. That's, yeah. Only 6.8% of Major League Baseball is black. Yes.

Rob, does that feel right to you? Yes, I think it does. It does. Okay. Maybe it's because they're generally the best players that I'm like. I'm overinflating the numbers. Keek representation was 18.7 to 19% in the early 80s. Okay.

So it has gone down a lot. And probably that's when, obviously, early 80s is when I first started watching baseball. And probably when it ended me watching baseball. So I locked it in. That makes sense. Also, I'm just always aware when Mookie Betts is at bat for the L.A. Dodgers. I'm not like aware of a ton of players and I'm aware of like five. I'm aware of him too because his...

Your brother loves him. Yeah. Well, his name... I don't know if he loves him so much as... I mean, I'm sure he loves him. He must. Yeah, his Instagram handle is a play on his name. Yeah.

You want to give it out so he gets some followers? No, they can... Okay. They can get their own followers. Search Neil Padman, and we see one that sounds like Juky Betts. You can look at my... I think that's what it is Juky Betts. I'm going to cut that.

Oh, you can look at me on Instagram, and then you'll find a picture of... him, he'll be tagged. Okay, there we go. Okay. Scavenger Hunt. Did the founder of Nintendo buy a stake in the Mariners and that's how Ichiro came over? Okay. The connection comes

from Hiroshi Yamachi, the great grandson of Nintendo's founder and its long-time president. Hiroshi purchased a majority stake in the Seattle Mariners baseball team in 92 and Nintendo later signed Ichero to the team in 2001

facilitating his historic move to major league baseball. I'm a Tokyo giant like Ichero I am. Back to Jay-Z. There you go. All roads lead. Okay. Kids sports and their costs. Okay, average annual family spending on one child by sport. This is from playground equipment.com. I always go there for all my sports data. Ice hockey. Yeah, I nailed it, huh? You did. 25, 283. That seems low, though. Yeah, that does. One kid. but still, that's low. Anyway, skiing is after, I'm just, I'm not going to say the numbers.

I'm just going to say, we have ice hockey, we have skiing, snowboarding, we have field hockey. How is that expensive? Okay. Well, it says registration, equipment, travel. Travel, is a big part of that. Yeah, because there's not one on every corner. Uh-huh. Lessons and then camps.

Interesting. Gymnastics. Oh, sure. That'll get you. La Crosse, tennis, bicycling, huh. Well, bikes are very pricey. Right. But you only need one.

But remember, I bought a used one off of my friend who was competitive. Oh. And the bike was $21,000. Oh, my God. Yeah. That's insane. Okay. I paid $2,500 just for the record.

Okay, golf, swimming, martial arts, something else I can't read. baseball, so. Okay. What's interesting about our difference in eye degeneration. I know.

Is I need to get further back from something when I can't read it and you were leaning in and squinty. Yeah, because I have normal. I don't have age one yet.

Yeah. But that's not why. This is all fuzzy. See? Okay. It's not me. Was it Warren Moon, who he said

intentionally ran a slower 40-yard dash so that he wouldn't be removed as quarterback? Yes. It was. Wow. And it was.

was David Whitley. His facts were on point. He really knew his facts. Yeah. For Sporting News, an AOL Sporting News joint venture in November 2012, that wrote that article about tattoos and comparing the inmates. Do you want your quarterback to look like an inmate or something? Yeah.

I did read. I read part of it on CBS Sports and I was like, this is ridiculous. Anyway, those are the facts. Oh, thank you. Thank you for all your reporting. Your investigation and your due diligence. Thank you. All right.

Love you. Love you.