Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard - Cristin Milioti

Episode Date: June 2, 2025

Cristin Milioti (The Penguin, How I Met Your Mother, The Wolf of Wall Street) is a Grammy Award-winning actor. Cristin joins the Armchair Expert to discuss growing up in the place of origin of the Jersey Devil, the great equalizer being her acceptance into the safe space of drama kids, and being on the greatest show of all time The Sopranos. Cristin and Dax talk about how theater at its best feels like a communal place of worship, the magical experience of being nominated for a Tony for Once, and how profound but intimate it was to play opposite Leo DiCaprio in The Wolf of Wall Street. Cristin explains being a true disciple of Batman before getting her role as Sofia Falcone, reflecting on a few deeply humbling moments of her career, and the immense gratitude that her trajectory has been long and steady as she approaches 40.Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. Watch new content on YouTube or listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free by joining Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ now.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad free right now. Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple podcasts, or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. I'm Dak Shepard and I'm joined by Monica Padman. Hi. Today we have Kristen Milliotti on.

She's a star. She's a star, she's hyper talented, she's a force of nature. She's been in everything. She's been in everything, incredible career. Palm Springs, How I Met Your Mother, Black Mirror, Made For Love, The Resort, and her incredibly standout work on The Penguin,

which we are here to talk at length about. She's so good on that. And we're gonna announce our Armchair Anonymous prompts. Okay, great. Okay, so get out your pen and paper, get ready to submit. Tell us about a crazy jury duty experience. I'm so excited for this. Yeah, my friend Tim Lovesdead texted me and said,

hey, I wanna tell a jury story. Oh, great. Yeah, so we're gonna have a friend on for that one. Tell us a crazy story about finding a foreign object in a patient's butt. You can be a nurse, you can be a doctor, you can be a- Can you be a civilian? Sure, yeah.

All right. Tell us about a crazy Fourth of July disaster. Hold on, the butt one? I bet we're gonna get some moms. Oh, it's kids putting items in their butt, maybe. Just keep it, like, make sure you ask your kids permission, actually. Yeah, don't spit it out.

Just don't say their name. Okay. Tell us about a crazy Fourth of July disaster. Tell us about a crazy sleepwalking experience. This is a part two. We had a really exciting episode previously. Tell us a crazy cop story. Woo, woo, woo.

Wild card. This is, you know, everyone collects these. Yeah, we love the wild card. We love wild cards. So tell us a crazy wild card story. Ah, without further ado, please enjoy Kristen Milioti. The Shaw Festival presents Anything Goes, a dazzling production of Cole Porter's timeless musical set on the SS American. Follow the antics of a nightclub singer as she navigates love triangles and hilarious

hijinks on the high seas. Anything Goes on this ocean liner. Featuring spectacular tap dancing and hits like You're the Top. Don't miss Anything Goes at the Shaw. For tickets, go to shawfest.com. He's an out-champion. He's an out-champion. He's an out-champion. He's an out-champion. He's an out-champion.

He's an out-champion. He's an out-champion. He's an out-champion. He's an out-champion. He's an out-champion. He's an out-champion. He's an out-champion. He's an out-champion. it's productive, it's helpful, and then it's destructive?

Do we know the cutoff? I've yet to find it. I still, after all this time alive, haven't been able to find the line. So you do go too far sometimes? Oh, all the time. Oh, wonderful. Yeah, I did it this morning. You did?

Yeah. And what was that intake? Well, I had a canned latte from the hotel minibar. Oh, great. Because I don't live here. And then I walked to Erewhon. I'm like a moth to a flame, unfortunately, with that, because we don't have anything like that in New York.

And then I got a regular coffee. I don't go there, but I did go in there one time because a friend of mine who was also sober was like, you gotta go get this smoothie there, it's cocaine, and it's not a relapse. Which one? I can't remember, but it was like a 21-bath. Bieber, probably Bieber.

Yeah, they're all like that. You are aware that you're being actively bamboozled, but it's a little bit like, I feel when I walk in there, I'm in agreement with it. You're bamboozling me. It's a casino for health food. You're gonna give me a great juice. I know you're hosing me.

Yes, you're bending me over. And I'm gonna just buy it because I do want the taste right now. It reminds me of like an FAO Schwartz because I know all the sections and I get excited. Now back to your coffee though, the thing I'm gonna say about it is it's a little bit like taking pot brownies

before everything was legalized and you knew what was in them. Where it was Russian roulette. You don't really know. You're gonna get the brownie with like a hundred milligrams of THC or one. Because Erawan's like a single batch from this mountain.

Ecuadorian often. It could have like six X the caffeine you're expecting. But that's the gamble. That's the fun of it. I think one time we went on Postmates and went to Erawan and was creating the most expensive smoothie we could. We didn't order it, but we just wanted to see

what could you get to, because there's all these add-ons you can do. And I think we got to like $43. Yeah, sounds about right. So I'm gonna say of the many people I've researched, over 800 at this point, I've never gone to the early life and not one word about the parents.

Oh, really? Are you parentless? No. Oh, thank goodness. Oh my God, not at all. I'm so relieved. No, no. Cherry Hill, New Jersey? Cherry Hill, New Jersey. Of course, when I think of New Jersey,

I immediately go, oh, it's gonna be a suburb of New York, but no, a suburb of Philadelphia. Suburb of Philadelphia, and I don't know how much time you've spent in New Jersey. We get kind of like a weird rap. I think most people, and this is very much in our blood, they associate us with the Sopranos or with the Jersey Shore,

and that element is definitely there, but I couldn't wait to get out of New Jersey when I was growing up there. And now as an adult, I realized what a special place. There's like something in the water there. It's very spooky and mystical. And there's a lot of big emotions there. And we have the Pine Barrens,

but then we also have the ocean. What's the Pine Barrens? The Pine Barrens is where the Jersey Devil allegedly lives. The Jersey Devil. It's in the Sopranos. They go kill people there. They take the Russian there and then they get lost. Yes.

A lot of schools in New Jersey take you there to teach you about the land you're on. You go through these swamps and bogs and it's really legitimately like the forest and beauty and the beast where he can choose one of the two roads and he's like, the spooky one. Yeah, yeah. But it's really cool.

Okay, so what did mom and dad do? My mom, she's a banker and then my dad works in IT. He handles tech for small businesses. Okay, siblings? Younger brother. How much younger? Seven years. I have an eight year gap.

Were you cruel to him like Monica was to Neil? I think I was early on. Cause seven years is you're two different generations. You were an only child. Right, but he is one of my favorite people in the entire universe. Okay, he grew into someone. He's just fabulous.

Do you think he benefited from having an older sister? As I've seen many boys who had older sisters turned out better. Maybe, he's like a golden human being, but I don't know how much I had to do with that. You should take him. You're allowed to take credit. I'll be afraid.

The big fun turn in your life happens at Long Lake Camp. Wow, you guys dove deep. Or the art. Yeah. And now this is an East Coast thing. Monica and I are always perplexed by, anytime we interview someone from the East Coast, camp life.

Are you West Coast? No, Detroit, Atlanta. Yeah, the South. So many of my cousins, I grew up going to like Kennesaw. Oh, sure. For Christmas. What's Kennesaw?

What's the vibe there? It's a little more rural there, I would say. Marietta too. That's more suburban like where I grew up. Did they introduce you to any weird country shit when you were there? No, not that I can recall, but I just love the accents down there.

They're like a warm bath. Yeah, but were they setting fires and stuff more? No, there was no fires. No ATVs? No, no ATVs. You have an ATV out there. Several, very well stocked with ATVs. All over the country.

But not around LA. Yeah, we have the best sand dunes in the world outside of Dubai and the Middle East in Glamis, California on the border of Mexico. 400 square miles of huge sand dunes. But no, he doesn't drive it down Los Feliz Boulevard. Yeah, that's what I was pretty sure of. He just did.

The RS1 last week, he actually just got back from getting the turbo tuned. Can you get pulled over? Is it illegal? Yes, highly illegal. Oh. But the city, I don't know if you've noticed, this is happening in New York where everyone rides dirt bikes on the street now with no helmet, and they're doing wheelies. There's been some movement, and everyone's just like, we're just not going to deal with

it. We have, every now and then, at an intersection, like eight tricked out. They're not motorcycles, but they're doing wheelies. There's been some movement and everyone's just like, we're just not gonna deal with it. We have every now and then at an intersection, like eight tricked out. They're not motorcycles, but they're not dirt bikes. Four wheelers. But then sometimes there's just one long wheel. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They'll take over an intersection and do donuts. And do like, rrrr, rear up, and then they'll disappear.

When you see that, what is your thought? And you're not allowed to use the word horny. That's the only word you're not allowed to use. You're allowed, of course. Don't worry, that word doesn't come to mind when I say that. Okay, so do you think it's cool? When I see allowed, of course. Don't worry, that word doesn't come to mind when I say that. Okay, so do you think it's cool?

When I see that, I have a little bit of like a, aw. Okay, you have some pity. Like you feel bad for the boys trying to be manly? But I also get it. What? Whenever I've done like a go-kart somewhere, I feel like the king of the world. Yeah. Yes, yes.

And so I also can imagine what it must be like. I'm a real fan of pedicabs in New York. Pedicabs, how do they do it? They're only in Times Square. It's the bicycle with the, they're like $10 a minute. It's a really poor investment, but they let you choose the music and they blast the music and they ride through all the taxis.

And it's like thrilling. Yes, yes. And obviously that's a gentler version of riding an ATV through Times Square. Yeah. But I do get it. It's the loudness that I don't like. It's only the volume.

Things are moving into the electric space. I just am getting my very first electric dirt bike. It's in route right now. But you've kind of nailed it. The appeal. Two things. So both my daughters ride motorcycles. The youngest one just recently actually got into it in the way that you need to get into it.

We were riding in the neighborhood and she was like riding next to me and she goes, oh my God, dad, I get it. What's so cool is you're in total control. And I'm like, yes, that is the whole thing. I tell to do this and it does that. Then there's also, it's a break from the given reality. Like you're on a street, you're supposed to make a left turn,

it's in a grid and then you have this thing with suspension, you can drive on the sidewalk, you can split between the traffic. So it does feel like a superpower as well.'s in a grid, and then you have this thing with suspension, you can drive on the sidewalk, you can split between the traffic, so it does feel like a superpower as well. That's a part of the appeal. I've never explored this topic as in depth. It is just the noise that bothers me. It is intrusive.

It's obnoxious, and yet I live in New York, I'm surrounded by loud noise, but there's something about that like, ra ra ra, because everything else, I'm like, oh, I would love this. And it feels probably a little toxic. It's a little aggressive. Yeah, or something.

It's the scary side of maleness maybe. That part of it seems so unnecessary and it scares dogs and it scares kids. It sets off car alarms. I know. Selfish. It feels selfish. It's like you like this thing so much that you don't care that this is bothering

the entire city with your noise. But I wrote a moped in Paris once. It was like living inside of a song. This is so transportative and it's such a precious memory. So I get it, but mopeds aren't allowed. The experience of traveling briskly is just taken for granted. And in a car, you're kind of removed from the sensation.

But when you're on two wheels with nothing around you, it's as close as you get to riding a horse somewhere. Yeah, I bet. You're very aware of this neat gift we've gotten where we can go places quicker than we would otherwise be able to. Yeah, I've never ridden on a motorcycle. Well, after this interview, we're gonna hop on.

Yeah, but it would scare me here, just because of how everyone's texting and driving. For sure, watching movies, smoking weed. I see guys watching pornography on the way home and I just think, my God, it's that bad. We've really rotted. Yeah, I see stuff. He's really taking a turn.

I have a really good glimpse of this city because of lane splitting and just seeing what everyone's doing in their cars all the time. And very few people are driving. Yeah. Yeah. Oh God. That porn one really got you there.

Yeah, it did, well, cause it hurt my soul a little bit. More chimpanzees that are in mechanized machines. Oh God. That porn one really got you there. Yeah, it did. Well, cause it hurt my soul a little bit. We're chimpanzees that are in mechanized machines. I know. So that's why I'd be afraid to ride a motorcycle here, I guess. Okay, back to long lake camp. So that's kind of a thing we didn't experience.

I'm very envious of it. I know. It was cool. How did you end up there? Something my parents suggested, and I didn't have a lot of friends. I don't know this for a fact, but I think they were like, we're going to just make you be social.

And I was bullied a lot during that time in my life. But at camp, I was there with a lot of other kids that I think were also experiencing that. And I was king of camp. It was run by hippies and I was only there for I think two weeks. It became this beacon where I, for those two weeks, was fully accepted and so confident and my full strange self. Was it an arts camp? It was, they did sports as well,

but it was mostly artsy kids. Okay, got it. It was just really special. Well, first of all, I wanna know what your explanation is for why that was all happening in public school. But then also, yes, just to visit some place and go, oh, okay, so there will be places I will fit in. It's got to be the most optimistic thing that could happen.

It's such a helpful thing. It buys you hope. It gave me these little bursts of confidence too, where I was deserving of not being shoved into a wall or something. Okay, so why wasn't it working? It actually kind of all happened at the same time. I definitely had friends. I was a soccer player and I was just like a regular kid

in New Jersey suburban elementary school, but I had different pop culture references. I just didn't totally fit in. And then I went to this camp for the first year, had this incredible awakening where I felt like I was king of camp and the hottest girl at camp that summer was from Venezuela.

She was 16 and she shaved her head at camp. And it was like the coolest thing that had ever happened. And the entire camp was like, and she had a nose ring, no makeup. It was like Sinead O'Connor. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. So then I got home from those couple weeks and I shaved my head.

Rob. What? Oh, yeah, you have it. Okay, you have it. So you do. Oh, wow. So shave my head. This is among the cutest photos

I've ever seen of a human on planet Earth. I know it's really cute. That's a week into a new middle school. Sixth grade. Seventh. I don't know a lot of the kids. I'm stressed. Do you know what I mean the kids. I'm stressed.

Do you know what I mean? Yes, I think this is really, really sweet and so cute and I have almost five. Because you know exactly what happened when that kid walks in the door of a middle school with 2,000 other kids. Right, the high school you ultimately graduated from was Cherry Hill East, which implies.

There's a West. Right, so this is like a huge district. Giant sprawling suburb. Okay, so for the listener who can't see, it's a buzz cut. Cause shave is not. Yeah, it was a buzz cut. Cause my mom took me and to my mom's credit

and my dad's credit, I didn't do this myself. I came home and was like, hey, I want this. And they were like, okay. It felt really mean, but I did want to say, you can't tell when you say I didn't do this myself. Oh yeah, I want this. And they were like, okay. It felt really mean, but I did wanna say, you can't tell. When you say I didn't do this myself. Oh yeah, I get that too. I know, you can't tell.

Picture day is halfway through the year, maybe a couple months in. Yeah, it had grown out a little bit. It's grown a little bit. I love you. Do you know what makes me so sad about it? Tell me. And I want our listeners to really think about this.

All of our middle school listeners. No, no, our adult listeners. When I see that, I know me as a middle schooler, everyone's just trying to survive middle school and make it through without getting shoved into a locker. That I know, and this is so regrettable and sad, that if this sweet, sweet child walked in, I would turn, I can't be friends.

Oh, absolutely. I'm saying that with heartbreak. No, and I know that. They're doing something you're afraid to do in a way that's scary. I mean, you can see my eyes. I was like a tender. Yeah, you're a little bambi.

Yeah. Now here's what's deeply unfair about the world. So I too, in seventh grade, I had a mohawk, but because I'm a boy, and it was so not what you were supposed to do, girls were like, oh, this guy is so confident. In a man or a boy, that kind of quote, bravery was rewarded. I was like, he's bad, that's cool.

And that's unfair, but I'm promising you right now, I would have a hundred percent been friends with you. Really? Oh, absolutely. I would have been drawn to this, like a moth to a friend. I would have seen what you were up to, and I was doing a similar thing, and I would have been drawn to this like a moth to a fly. Wow. I would have seen what you were up to and I was doing a similar thing and I would have been like,

all right, I'm gonna pass you notes in class and we're gonna get through this. Well, it was such a 180 of feeling so good for those few weeks over the summer and then coming in and I was like silent for months. I was like afraid to talk. You were reminded of the other world. Tenfold because at least before I had long hair,

I could kind of... Blend. Blend. And I of course was aware of the social situation too of that age, it does feel like Lord of the Flies. If you think I'm stupid, look over there. I get it. So sad that that's how humans are.

I know. Yeah. Well, I love her. I do too. This picture made me so happy when I saw it. And you should have been absolutely rewarded. You should have skyrocketed to number one status. I do too. This picture made me so happy when I saw it and you should have been absolutely rewarded. You should have skyrocketed to number one status. I really did not.

What's the opposite of skyrocketing? Clummeting? To the Mariana Trench. Was it girls who were mainly? Both. It was both. That was the other thing, all the boys thought I was a young boy.

So they would truly like throw me into a wall and then be like, oh. Oh, you have girl parts. It was both sides. I truly was a unifier in terms of people picking on me. You got to experience what unfortunately the smallest boy in a class experiences, which just any kid trying to earn his stripes

is gonna shove him randomly. Exactly. Oh boy. Yeah. Did it level off? Did you find a sweet spot in your schooling? The way that it leveled off was that the only kids that were nice to me were the drama kids. There were a couple girls in the middle school theater department, which, oh my God, what

I wouldn't give for the footage of the plays that we did. But they were like, you can hang with us. And I started going to these rehearsals and drama classes and I was like, oh, I love this. I can have fun and disappear probably. Also, these kids are nice to me. And it was like a version of camp. You're right. There was a little tiny safe space.

In the cafeteria where we would rehearse after school, I felt this grand relief and that I could giggle again. It just was a respite. And so it was a really actually fortuitous way to find myself in acting. A famously stable industry. Yeah, yeah. Full of mentally well people.

We're successful, heal all those wounds magically. And then you went to NYU. Yes. Right out of high school? Right out of high school. Okay, now you shared this in common with Kristen. I think she left, maybe you left a little earlier than her.

I left halfway through my sophomore year. To go do theater? No, just to take a leap. Get the fuck out of there. I was like, get me out of here. Yeah, what didn't you enjoy about it? I wrote down a quote you said about it, wildly unhappy. Well, I was like, oh God, what did I say?

Sometimes interviews make me really nervous because things are read back to me, and I'm like, I don't feel that way anymore. And it's very strange to adhere to, and also who cares, no one's thinking about it that much, but it's sometimes an odd sensation to be like, oh, oh God, I did? Huh, when did I say that?

I agree with you. I think it would be easy for people that read interviews to think the answer that was given was one that was well thought out, as opposed to I'm obliged to answer this in some way immediately. Yes. And so I'm gonna do my best at it. And it's not necessarily your walking opinion of anything. Totally, it's me trying to figure something out

in the moment. Also you can evolve. The way you think about things changes. Totally, but wildly unhappy. I wasn't wrong. I'm just saying that. And this one I'm saying, it's actually pretty accurate. I knew that I was accruing debt

and I was in a musical theater program. I was at Tisch, I was in cap 21. That's Kristin as well. Really? I didn't know that. I don't know what her experience was, but I was doing some stuff every day that I thought was cool, like tap dancing class. But then I would be in the middle of tap dancing

and I'd be like, I'm going into debt. To learn to tap dance. I'm never gonna tap dance, I'm not good at this. I love this as an experience, but I'm not going to be in Anything Goes. And then we would do scenes from Chekhov. This sounds so theater student-y. But I was like, oh, I love this. And then they'd be like, well, that was the 20 minutes

we gave to Chekhov. So now we go to ballet. And I get what they were doing, but I felt like a square pegging around hole a little bit. Were you lonely? Going to New York, even though that's where I've like wanted to live always and I will never not live there, it was overwhelming for an 18 year old. I also wasn't a great student and I didn't understand that NYU is like a liberal arts

program, so you have to take regular classes. I thought it was a conservatory. Imagine my surprise also why didn't I research that? But I just wanted to be an actor in New York and I showed up and they were like, okay, you have tap dancing class on Thursday and then on Friday, you have to study French history. And I was like, oh, sorry, I didn't wanna do that. And they were like, well, that's the program. And I was like, huh, interesting.

I didn't realize that. Yeah, you're gonna take some biology. So I think that was part of it too. And I was like, this is not what I thought it was. And so then I left. Were mom and dad at all disappointed or scared? They were really supportive. They were definitely like,

listen, you've made this decision, we support it, but you have to now go support yourself. Last question on that. Yeah. Is it also possible that you had had an expectation or a fantasy that it was gonna be like camp? You were gonna land in your group and be seen, and then you got there and it was like,

no, I'm lonely here. Music has always been a huge part of my life and I love musical theater so much, but I didn't quite fit into that world. I've done a couple of musicals, but they've all been not- Conventional. Yeah, they're not like Thoroughly Modern Millie

and I say that as a huge fan of Thoroughly Modern Millie. They're different, I sound different. So I think I also just felt like I was in the wrong place. Yeah, I don't know how to say what you're saying without it being a pejorative, but yes, there's a kind of type of musical theater performer. It's a very specific kind of thing that works really well.

Which I also love. Like Fiona Apple's not gonna be. And that's my girl. That's right. And they're not, by the way, gonna end up on Sopranos. Sure, sure. Okay, so yes, in 06, shortly after you've left NYU, now I can't imagine anything more exciting

for a girl from New Jersey to be on Sopranos. Clearly, everyone in your family's watching it. No, we couldn't afford HBO, so I had never seen it. I just watched The Sopranos for the first time two years ago, it was wasted on me, but thank God. Best show ever with the best performance by an actor of all time. I had resisted it because I was like,

certainly it can't live up to the expectations of being the greatest show of all time. It is the greatest show of all time. And thank God I didn't know. Because for me, I just was like, whoa. I knew who they were, but the most exciting part of that experience for me was that Steve Buscemi directed it. I grew up watching the Coen Brothers films with my dad.

We would watch a lot of movies together, him and I, and certainly movies that I probably shouldn't have been seeing. Yeah, sure, sure. That's how it should be. Yeah, and so I was like a huge Steve Buscemi fan. And that was actually the part that I would start shaking. Yeah. Yeah.

Did you see him in the studio? Are you watching the studio? Yes. Buscemi. Yeah, he's so wonderful. He's wonderful in everything. Yeah. Did you see him in the studio? Are you watching the studio? Yes. Bushemian. Yeah, he's so wonderful. But he's wonderful in everything. And he was so kind to me. How old were you?

19. It was your first job? Yeah. First time on TV in Sopranos. Yeah. And like really not knowing. Missing it. Like missing it.

No, not missing it. I knew it was a big deal intellectually where I was like, I see the posters on this show, on Russ's, I know of course who all these people are. If you cared, you wouldn't have booked it. At that age when you walk in, you're brand new and you're obsessed with the thing, it wouldn't have happened.

Yeah. I watched a clip of it today. You did? I'm not good on it. Yeah, you are. You're really good. When I watched it, not that I had forgotten that I was on it.

Oh, right, right, right. And then when you were watching it as an adult. But when I was rewatching it, like that episode started and I was like, it, not that I had forgotten that I was on it. Oh, right, right, right. And then when you were watching it as an adult. But when I was rewatching it, like that episode started and I was like, wait, why have I seen that before? And then I was like, oh my God, I'm about to appear on the screen.

And it took me a second. And then I appear and I'm so young. And I'm such a little baby. And I'm like holding that cigarette and I'm yelling my lines like I'm in a theater. But it works. What do you play? I'm like a mob boss's daughter.

Ironically, no. Ironically, yes. But I pop in. I show up in a later episode too. You did three, right? With a shaved head. Oh! I don't know that far.

Your life is really full circle. Okay, so I did Sopranos. I didn't work for a long time and I did a bunch of odd jobs. And then I booked this Martin McDonough play called The Lieutenant of Inishmore and I was an understudy in it. It's how I got my equity card in the play. The character has a buzzed head. They buzzed my hair and I only went on one time in like an eight month run. I was just going to say as the understudy, couldn't you be like, well, let's wait. It

doesn't take long to buzz my hair. It's also the power of a good agent. My agent at the time was like, oh yeah, just buzzer. She'll do it. And I would have and did, but as I was in the middle of that, we filmed a third episode and I showed up and they were like, your hair's gone. Surprise. When I got to that episode, when I was watching it, I was like, no one knew that you were his daughter. It's so random, I'm in a room with a buzzed head.

Well, they didn't put a wig on you. They didn't put a wig on me. And I'm sitting, I don't want to give anything away, on the edge of his bed. And I was like, well. What a delight though, for you to later watch this thing and go, that's cool. I was in the greatest show ever made. I was in the greatest show ever made.

You're in like the godfather of TV. Kind of sim. But I did a play also, a Martin McDonough play, The Pillow Man. One of my favorite plays. I loved it so much. Me and these two other girls kind of played these ghost type characters.

The ones that are in the terrifying part. Yes. She had this whole vision of us. And she was like, whoever books these parts is gonna have to shave their head. And I was like, sure, I'll say that, but I'm not really gonna do it. And then I booked it and me and this other girl were like, we're not shaving our head.

We had this huge conversation with the director and she was so pissed, obviously. But I was like, I'm in college. This is for one play here? Those parts don't require it. It was her vision. In The Lieutenant of Inishmore, it's because she's militant.

Yeah, she's supposed to. She has like a gun and she's got the aviators and the shaved head. That's just artistic liberty. It was, but I also was like, am I gonna be able to do this as an actor? I'm not even willing to do this. Yeah.

We ended up doing bald caps and hats and all that. Oh boy, I bet they look great. I don't love theater. You don't love getting scared? Theater. Theater? I don't. But you've seen great theater.

You haven't seen many straight plays. You get dragged in. Those ones I'm the least favorite. When theater is great, for me, there's nothing like it. But when it's bad, there's nothing like it. Yes, yes. I feel like it's fish, like people who love fish. Yeah, yeah, show me.

And they're like, no, no, you gotta get the right, the possibility of failure is so high with fish and with theater, and then you're really there. Anyways, I respect it. My issue is, are we pretending we're seeing this or are we acknowledging there's people in front of us doing it? Interesting. I can't get into the paradigm of's people in front of us doing it? Interesting.

I can't get into the paradigm of it. I've never thought about it that way. I went to Lion King with the next girlfriend's family in Seattle and everyone was so delighted and I was like, I'm confused. Is everyone buying into it? The animals are talking and they're not in front of us. Or are they going, what a cool production.

It's so beautiful and look what the humans can do live. That would be one way to view it. And I'm caught between, I'm not sure what I'm supposed to do. I really find that so fascinating. I would think that if you were watching the animated version too, where you're like, am I supposed to believe Zazu's real? Yeah, why is the movie better?

Because the movie is very removed, and it has this filter over it, which is the screen. And so yes, I can buy into like, I'm watching Godfather and I can believe this world exists. I can't touch it. Do you know what I wonder or I don't know, I'm just trying this on. You'll get quoted later that this was your permanent opinion.

This is not necessarily how I feel in a week. I kind of like in theater and I can't reiterate enough when it's bad, there's nothing like it in terms of a torturous experience. And I'm someone who's also been in some awful plays. And when you are in an awful play and you can like hear the seats going up as people leave, you can just feel it. And it's just excruciating.

It's why you do it though, cause those are the stakes. Those are the stakes. You know, if it didn't have that, then when it works, it wouldn't have the elation. When theater is great, it reminds me of, I'm a very avid concert goer. I see everything. And you cry through most performances.

I do cry. When you saw Joni Mitchell, you cried for three hours. I cried for three hours. Wow, where did I share that? Yeah, it's really emotional, and I think it reminds me of a place of worship, where I can be in communion with an experience that is so individual to that one moment in time,

with the people who I'm seated next to and the people who are also communing things. I wasn't raised with any organized religion, and I have wondered if that's what that, at its best, is supposed to offer, that there are things moving through us that are bigger than us that unite us. And I think when theater is good,

my own heart and memory and life is in communion with a stranger's and with strangers in a dark room, like we've gone to pray or something. I'm being so lofty. No, but it's good. It's right. It's cool to believe that. And I think that's maybe sometimes easier

to do with a concert, especially because that music is something you listen to in private moments. That's what makes those things so gorgeous and emotional. But you're feeling it. You know, when I saw that got me, the Fleetwood Mac one, stereophonic. Beautiful. That was fucking radical. You begin to feel like a fly on the wall.

You know what? I get what you mean. Maybe I have just a, because I've been inside of them too, and I just really like theater as an art form. I am really being lofty. No, you're not. Stop self-policing yourself. Yeah. Be who you are.

You're loved and you're valued and you're liked. Come on. I do think the fly on the wallness is also what I like about theater. You can feel like you're in the experience with them. Again, if it's really good, it's the difference when we do this show in person, the people in it. If somebody was a live show versus if they're watching it

on YouTube or when we did Zoom interviews. That was still great, but the electricity that's happening between people, you can't feel. Yeah. Okay, now I talked way too long to you about theater, but oh, six-year-and-sopranos, and then without discrediting anything, it seems like the next moment for you is once.

Yeah. You were in it for two years? I was in it for a year and a half. Is that kind of a record? Sometimes people are in things for like five years. Oh really? 10 years. Oh.

It was like a year and a half when all of a sudden done between doing it out of town, doing it downtown, and then doing it on Broadway. I performed over 500 times. Wow. And you got nominated for a Tony. Okay, that's so thrilling. And you won a Grammy for it? I did.

Oh my God. Well, that's so exciting. You won an EGOT. Oh, this is so exciting. You're halfway there. And then you are on Glenn Hansard's album. Yes. Okay, so he was on an episode of Parenthood.

He came and recorded at the Luncheonette, which was a studio we had in this fake world. What a sweet dude to spend a week with. Did you love him? He was lovely. And that music, I'd never seen the movie before I did the musical. Intentionally?

At that point, I hadn't seen it, and then it became intentional. You know what, I'm gonna just do my own thing. And the play was different in a lot of ways, but getting to sing that music night after night, it was a really magical experience. Yeah, well, I wish I would have seen that. Okay, now we go to TV, 2013.

You play Mother on How I Met Your Mother. Yep. Big reveal. Another show I'd never seen. Oh. I'm in that camp with you. I hadn't seen it. I loved it. I had never seen it. I am glad that I hadn't. I don't think I understood.

The weight of the mother. I didn't understand the weight. And I don't, so tell me, the show's called that, and I guess I'm glad that I hadn't, I don't think I understood the weight of the mother. I didn't understand the weight. And I don't, so tell me, the show's called that, and I guess I'm learning today if you appeared on season eight and then nine. I'm in it for like six episodes. Yeah, the premise of the show is he's telling his kids about how he met their mother.

And he goes back in time at the beginning of his story to tell it. So you don't know throughout the whole series who the mother is. And new people are coming in and out, new girlfriends. And it's like, oh, it's probably Robin, the best friend. And then turns out it's not. It's Kristen.

Yeah. Yeah. And you didn't know. She comes in at the end. With a shaved head. I burst through the wall like the Kool-Aid man. And I go, oh yeah. And then the show ends.

Oh yeah. I'm glad you didn't know. Because that is stressful. Because I bet, I mean, you'll tell us, people had strong reactions to that. They surely did. And you know, I am pretty good about staying very far away from the internet. It's not a good place for a human brain to be. Agree.

I also was pretty good at sheltering myself from that as well. But I definitely didn't understand the way. Yeah, because people are like, what? We don't even know her. Yeah. We've been here for eight seasons. It's a very famously contested finale.

Yeah. Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare. This is Nick. And this is Jack. We're best friends, ex-finance guys, and resident 90s experts. And every week on our podcast, The Best Idea Yet, we're bringing you the untold stories behind your favorite products. For instance, can you guess which billion dollar fashion company went viral thanks to

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Okay, now this is where I become aware of you is Fargo. Oh yeah. Betsy. Betsy Sauverson. She has cancer. Yep. And she's Papa Ted's daughter. I love Ted dancing. What a man.

You racked up pretty quickly some pretty significant co-stars. You also did Wolf of Wall Street. Yeah. Being opposite Leo. Do you get nervous? I did then and I do now. OK.

I get nervous with, like, any job. I go immediately to a place of I'm going to fail or something. Imposter syndrome. Imposter syndrome, yeah. But I was certainly so nervous on that set. That was such a huge set. It's a great test of an actor. Like, if you can be in scenes with Leo

and you're just as captivating. Thank you. That's a tall order. People need to think about it a little bit like you're playing one on one with Jordan. This person is gonna be riveting. That's why they're who they are and you're gonna have to carry your side of it.

Oh, I've never thought about it like that. That's very kind of you. But it's true. It can also be a help because if they're that good. He's an extraordinary actor. Yeah, you can sometimes get carried into their bubble. I've been carried into people's bubbles.

I wish I'd been less afraid in the beginning. I mean, I'd never been on something that big. And then just by way of the energy of those sets and you're working with people who are at the top of their game. They already work together. Yeah, but it's actually quite intimate. But the first two weeks, I was not in my body.

Yeah. Not even remotely. When we talk about missing the Sopranos, I mean, that's probably what you really missed, being able to be like, wow, I'm really doing it because you're so nervous. I'm with one of the best drug users to ever live. With one of the best actors to ever live.

It's very wild to be in those situations. It can be a disassociated experience. It can be, but obviously this those situations. It can be a disassociated experience. It can be, but obviously this is like a huge understatement. It's so profound and it continues to be profound. When I find myself in spaces with people whose work meant so much to me growing up, every time I am so shocked.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now we're just gonna zip through. So Fargo, you were great. I loved you in Fargo. Thanks. I love that show very much. Okay, Palm Springs. Love that as well. The next show I watched was Made for Love.

Oh, you watched it? I did. Okay. I loved it. Not everyone did. I have such a warm spot for that show, especially because the cast is so outrageous. So much of what we explored in that show is now reality. You had an implant in you. Yes.

From a tech billionaire husband. I was like married to like an Elon Musk that we explored in that show is now reality. You had an implant in you. Yes. From a tech billionaire husband. I was like married to like an Elon Musk and it really examined that whole thing as well as having a very complicated father daughter relationship with the astonishing Ray Romano. There was so much in there

and you know it's just sitting in a vault. Why? We were part of the tax write off that Warner Brothers did where remember they've ripped a bunch of stuff off the platform. Oh, they did and just counted it as a loss or something? As a loss.

It was like us, Westworld, that was the whole Coyote Acme, what is that movie? And like Batgirl, we were part of that. So you can't even watch it. Oh no! You're kidding! You cannot watch it. Can you not watch Westworld?

I think you can finally watch Westworld, but I know you can't find Made for Love. And it's such a bummer. Okay, so I'm a little bit aware of this strategy. I used to work for General Motors, and so they have a fleet of cars that they loan to journalists so they can review them. And then this fleet of cars,

when it's done being lent out, they can't really sell it because it would be a liability. It's been driven on racetracks. I used to drive these cars to the crusher. They just crush them? Like brand new Corvette ZR1s, I was 16, I was like, oh my God, how do I get this car not to be crushed? Oh God, we're so tired now.

But yeah, they would crush it because then it's a total write-off. I don't know if they still do this, but that's what they used to do. But yes, it's a complete write-off of the full value of the car, now the car doesn't exist. I didn't realize they could do that with movies

and TV shows. Yeah. That's heartbreaking. It's heartbreaking. You wanna make sure fucking work vanish? Well, yeah, we worked on that show for three years. Wow. Oh. It's two full seasons. That's the most you'd ever sure your fucking work vanish? Well, yeah, we worked on that show for three years. Wow. It's two full seasons. That's the most you'd ever been given, clearly, right?

I mean, that show is you. I'm going through a ton. I just had never seen like a world like that either. There's so much that exists in that hub where it's all virtual reality. They just were exploring stuff. There's also stuff on it that is just such a big swing. I don't know if you watch season two,

there's a character that has an affair with a dolphin. Oh, wow. It's really out there. I loved it. It's going there too. That's where our tech's gonna go. It's like AI is gonna let us talk to dolphins. People are gonna fall in love with dolphins

and vice versa. This is like what it was exploring. We've done more content on human dolphin affairs than any other show in history. We talk a lot about dolphin love. We've got a whole conclusion. Well, then you're gonna want to petition to get paid for live back in the yard. than any other show in history. We're obsessed with it. We talk a lot about dolphin love. We've got a whole conclusion. Well then you're gonna want to petition to get

paid for love back in the year. Yeah, because I'm setting. We decided the only ethical version is a male dolphin is allowed to date a female human. Huh. You did, I'm not fully on board with that. I don't trust a male human that the female dolphin's in love.

But a dolphin male is gonna decide whether they are intimate. I don't like the collab. Yeah, I get that. Yeah, I would just prefer to keep it. Think of the laugh you and your dolphin husband will have in 20 years when you're listening back to this interview. We had a armchair listener write in

and tell us about his experience. He fell in love with this dolphin at an aquarium. They had like a moment. Yeah, but he was like, it was real. I knew this dolphin. It knew me. We had a real connection. He didn't seem crazy.

I really believed him. I can get behind that. I can't totally get behind like. The sex part. Yeah, obviously. I understand I even feel that with my dog. Where I'm like, oh, we're really connected and you were found on the street That's wild. Do you think maybe you knew your dog before? I don't know

Asking I'm starting to really take on that theory. Yeah, we've known some of us. I do believe that I think it's real you don't It's okay. You don't have to. I'm happy for you and love that you're open to astrology and you're open to that notion. That makes life more fun and interesting. I'm almost envious. It's not necessarily lovers. It's like the dog where you're just like,

this is not the first time. Totally. It's just like how people find each other. How do you find each other on this big planet? It would make sense to be like, we've met before. I don't think there's enough, wow, I'm really gonna go out on a limb here, atoms to go around? Isn't there like a whole thing with like atoms

and molecules that you can't get rid of them? Yeah, energy can't be created or destroyed. So like we've shared atoms anyway. Sure, sure, they're forming and reforming, yeah. I can't tell if you're glazing over. No, not at all. I have kids, the closest thing I can't tell if you're glazing over. No, not at all. I have kids. The closest thing I can experience spirituality

is through the children in that I very much agree with the very common cliche, which is when you have kids, it feels like they've existed forever. And that very much feels like there's no way these two little girls didn't always exist. They also kind of did. They lived in their mom that lived in the grandma. It's very cool.

Yeah. It's cool. There's some spiritual stuff going on. I'm coming to, yes, embrace that notion of, you think of it as so split between my father and I, but there's no split. It has the illusion of a boundary, his body and my body, but they're so the same thing.

I'm open to that part. Yeah, but not open to astrology. Not at all. No, that's hard washing. Where do you land on astrology? Where do I land on astrology? I can understand that the time of year we're born can affect us. I don't put a ton of stock in it.

That's fair. But I also sometimes will read about traits. I'm a Leo. Okay. And I'll read the trait of being a Leo and I'll be like, ugh, that's me. Nailed it. Nailed it. And I'll read the trait of being a Leo and I'll be like, oh, that's me. Nailed it. Nailed it.

And in a way, I think that sometimes makes me feel less judgmental of myself. Yeah, yeah, forgiving. Yeah. That's a great quality. Where I'm like, oh, okay. That's very Leo to do that. Yeah.

Yeah, when I read the Capricorn description, I'm like, yeah, that's spot on. But I also think if I read any description you told me it was mine, I would find- Yes, you can completely do that. Yours is so spot on. You're like a triple cat. What are you?

A Virgo, and I'm double Virgo. I'm laughing, it's so important. I know, but sometimes I love those conversations too. Isn't it just the amount of times? I'm gonna hold an unauthorized biography of you, and there's gonna be chapters. One's gonna be The Pit. Have you watched The Pit?

I haven't watched The Pit, but I keep hearing about The Pit. It's great. I'm gonna bring up The Resort simply because I just wanna say William Jackson Harper is like the sweetest royal live. I love him so much. We've played husband and wife twice. You have?

Yes, in a play. Hey. Which I don't know if you would have seen. We have played a married couple on the brink of divorce twice. And he's one of my favorite people on the planet, one of my favorite actors. Yes, he's brilliant.

I love working with him. America will know him as Chidi, if you watch The Good Place. I just love him. Okay, alas, we have landed at the Penguin. So how did you get this role? No, yes. I also wanna hear the Wicked Audition story,

which I think is fantastic. They reached out to me and asked if I would meet with Lauren LeFranc, our showrunner, Matt Reeves, who did the movie, Craig Zobel, who directed our first three episodes, and they sent me just the first episode, and I sat with them on Zoom for two hours, because I'm a huge Batman fan.

Oh, you are? Yeah, huge. How would we define huge? As a kid, I had posters and outfits. I was like a real disciple of Batman Returns. Oh no, were you in your cape while you had your shaved head? A cape would have really made it.

Put a bow on it. Yeah, no I didn't have a cape then. But Batman really attracts outcasts. When I look back on why would I have loved that so much as a kid, not that I want to analyze it too much, because I also love Beetlejuice. I really love big worlds. And you know that Tim Burton Batman Returns,

you're like inside of a painting. Yeah. Michelle Pfeiffer, it is truly like, I'll show everyone who's ever bullied me. Yeah. That is kind of the vibe. But like Superman's the jock in high school. You're gorgeous.

But Batman, it's almost like Will Hunting too. He is an outcast, but he has superpowers and he's got all this wealth. Wait, what's Will Hunting? Good Will Hunting. Never seen it. Oh! Sorry.

You gotta go. I think we're gonna end this. You gotta go. Sorry, I can't continue on. Never seen it, but I've seen a couple scenes where they're like, who did this problem on the board? Oh no. Our notion is that we're different, but we're special.

It's a very appealing archetype. I'm not terribly familiar with the Marvel universe, but I think that there's a real good versus evil in the way that Superman is. And in Batman, it's like really blurry because he's going out. Yes, Batman himself is on the right side of justice, but he's also going out dressed in a costume.

He's so traumatized and he's looking to put himself in these dangerous situations to right a wrong that was done to him and so are the villains. And because none of them have superpowers, interestingly with your relationship to theater, like I wish I could fly and I would love to and I think it's so cool. But now we're in a completely different reality.

Batman's seemingly could exist in reality and so could Iron Man seemingly. It's like why I think, oh my God, get ready for this, but X-Men, I was always like, yeah, because I was like, I could see you could fill someone with an exoskeleton. Oh, uh-huh, right. There was like something around it.

Not that I need to be 100% believing something, but yeah, Batman seemed like it could happen. We're living in a world run by villains, it feels like sometimes right now. They may not have capes or specific... Lairs. Yeah, lairs. Although I think they all do have lairs. They kind of have lairs.

But it seems real. And did you have to read at any point for them? Yeah, I had a test with Colin. And was he in the full garb? He was not. We read a scene together, the scene in the first episode where we have lunch and martinis and it's this long sit-down and I was incredibly nervous. And then I found out a couple days later.

But he's a sweetheart too, right? He was probably helpful. Salt of the Earth. Sweetest. Very Irish. I've really lucked out with co-stars. Have all been really golden hearts. He is an extraordinary actor and an extraordinary human being. The first time you saw him in the suit, the penguin character? It was surreal. It was at a camera test.

That makeup is so incredible. Oh my God. But like I watched the movie. It was sort of like, oh, the guy from the movie. Right. You know, I didn't see the movie. It's really, really great. Who's our Batman?

Robert Pattinson. I love his interpretation because he really leans into the blurring of the line between someone who's so damaged going out looking to feel things. Yes, it's a great movie. Hearing that description of Batman, which I think is right, I'm really surprised you aren't more into Batman. I do love Batman and there's no reason

I haven't seen the recent one other than my kids probably wouldn't have watched it at the time and I get to see very few movies. How old are your kids? Ten and twelve. It's dark. Yeah. This is the other thing Matt did so brilliantly. Burton is very heightened and you're almost in an art deco.

Matt's film feels like it's right now. Darker than Nolan? Cause Nolan went dark too. Those Nolan ones are fucking great. Yeah, Nolan went dark too. No, I would say they're of a world. They're different, but they both feel like you're in New York current day. Yeah, and you're scared. Okay, so you play Sophia Falcone,

and you're the daughter of my boss, Carmine. You've spent 10 years in Arkham. You're in there for 10 years, you're tortured. Yes. And you've got a pretty sizable axe to grind. Yeah, wrongfully imprisoned. Okay, and I hate to have to always, and if I were you, I would kind of be annoyed by this,

because you got to talk about Colin every time we talk about this, which is, I think, in a weird way, unfairfully imprisoned. Okay, and I hate to have to always, and if I were you, I would kind of be annoyed by this because you gotta talk about Colin every time we talk about this, which is, I think, in a weird way, unfair to you. I don't know that Colin has to talk about you every interview he does. Right, sure. So that part feels unfair.

But I'm gonna bring him up only to say, A, he's insanely talented. He is one of the greats. Andy has the benefit of this enormous artifice, this huge prosthetic everything. So it's a very attention grabbing scene partner you have. But I wanna say this, it's such a testament to you. You don't have nearly that amount of stuff to work with

and you're blasting him in scenes. You're just so fucking powerful and terrifying and subtle and plain opposite. I mean, you're the one everyone has been talking about since the show came out. Even though he's him, everyone's talking about your performance. That's very kind.

And I just think it's harder because you're up against a force of nature in a huge costume and you're just blasting and scaring all of us. And it's so impressive. Would you be afraid to say you're proud? Are you proud of that? scaring all of us. And it's so impressive. Would you be afraid to say you're proud? Are you proud of that? I am proud of it.

Good. I feel like I am proud of so many of the things I've been in, which is different than being like, I did a good job. Whenever I've watched things I've done, I've been like, I would have done that differently. You can tinker with it forever. But I'm certainly very proud of that experience and of that character. I love that character so much. I mean, it's a real two-hander in a sense.

The upside is 10, 12 years ago, this show would have been about the son of Carmen. Yeah, one of the other things I'm really proud of with this show, and this is a real testament to our show and our Lauren, is that I've had a lot of interactions with people about Sophia and it's with people who would not usually be part of the demo of watching a show that's

in the Batman universe. Like the old woman at the concert. Yes, like an older woman, actually women. Yeah. Women. That's been really profound and it is because she is such an outsider and she does this thing she'd been very hurt. We like that. Yeah, and then she lets everybody have it.

There's a real escapism and obviously because you understand what she's been through, but to see her absolutely annihilate everyone who's ever wronged her and that she's in this world that keeps telling her that she's crazy and that she's not worth anything. And so I think that has reached a lot of people, which is very profound. It's very of the moment. Or that you're in a subdomin relationship

with the doctor. Yeah. It's so twisted and I kind of love it. I did too. Even Colin and I, I haven't seen a relationship like that. There's a real chemistry there but what is that chemistry? It's like the only other person can feel each other's pain. Yes and knows how to twist the knife. But I don't know like how you would categorize the chemistry of those two characters. They should get married. Well, yeah, that is what the most intimate partner

does have that ability to know your weaknesses. But it feels like familial, or it's a kindred spirits is how I would describe it. Yeah, it's just two very wounded people. They probably knew each other in another life. Yeah, sure, sure. I mean, I guess we're circling back to that. With the doctor too.

How do you quantify, I thought Lauren did that so beautifully. There's like these relationships where you're like, what is this? And not in a way where you're like, oh, and this is this and this is that. Yeah, ambiguous. It's ambiguous.

There'll be season two, right? We don't know. How could you not know? It's a big hit. What are they waiting for? I don't know. Isn't it a huge hit? You gotta get on the phone. I gotta call somebody.

Yeah. Not that that shoot wasn't a challenge. It's like the middle of winter in New York all nights. Really intense material. But I gotta say, it was such a golden experience. Our crew was incredible. The cast was incredible. From people who would come in for a day to like recurring, we all really loved it and

believed in it. It must have taken a long time to shoot because it looks impecc recurring. We all really loved it and believed in it. It must have taken a long time to shoot because it looks impeccable. We also were shut down with the strikes for the six months in between. So it was eight months total or something. So it was like four months, then six months off,

then four months. Okay, for eight episodes. Yeah, long. Yeah, I just love it because again, yeah, I'm not a big into superheroes. This is like a mob show to me. Yeah. It's like a mixture of both, which I really like. Cause then there are these moments where you're like, oh my God, I'm in Goth because again, yeah, I'm not a big into superheroes. This is like a mob show to me. Yeah. It's like a mixture of both, which I really like.

Cause then there are these moments where you're like, oh my God, I'm in Gotham, it's Batman. That's like what I loved about a lot of the Arkham stuff. For me as a fan, I was like, oh my God, the uniform. Oh my God, we're back. Some of the other characters in Arkham in the comics go on to be other villains. It's a breeding ground.

Yeah, it's so cool. Okay, you got nominated for a Golden Globe, you got nominated for a SAG award, you got nominated for Critics' Choice Award, and then when do they nominate Emmy people? Soon, I think. Soon. Soon.

Okay, will you please tell us this wicked story is so funny. Oh God. You don't have to, you don't have to. No, I will, I just feel like I've told it so many times. Okay, then you don't have to. No, but now I wanna know. Shh. Basically, you've auditioned. There's nothing more embarrassing.

It's really something. And sometimes you go in on these things. I knew I couldn't hit that note. Do you know Wicked? Yeah, the movie and the play. Are you talking about the play that you auditioned for? No, the John Choo movie and for Alphaba. So she's got...

You got to hit this, you know the one. Do it, do it, do it. I can't do it. I refuse that riff at the end when she transcends essence and transcends. Yeah, I knew there was no way I was going to hit it, but you have to say yes to the opportunity. And then absolutely. And do you start working with a vocal coach or anything to try to get yourself?

This was deep in COVID. Okay. So like, no, it wasn't on. Short answer. No, it was in person for John. Yeah. Who was so lovely. Yeah. What a sweetheart. Oh God. And was it on Zoom? No, it was in person. For John. Yeah, who was so lovely. Yeah. Oh, what a sweetheart.

Oh God, and is it one of those, you're in the waiting room? You're like hearing. Oh, people fucking. People crunch it. Bright glass. Yeah, yeah, bright glass. Shrinks breaking.

Uh-oh. It's a nightmare. I spent so many years auditioning for musicals before once, and once matched the way I sing. Yep. But before that, I would be in these waiting rooms for years going in on these big musicals and just hearing through the door.

Chris and Chenoweth. Exactly, that type of voice. And then I would go in and I'd be like, I'm singing. A Bob Dylan song. Yeah, I would sing Oh Darling by the Beatles. Oh my gosh, how sweet. I used to sing Carbon Monoxide by Regina Spector. Do you know that song?

Oh, I know her. I don't know if I know that one. To me, sounded musical theater-y, but it's about killing yourself. Oh, wow. I would go in because I was like, oh, I can give them a journey or something. And so I would be hearing glass breaking from behind the door.

And then I would come in and I'd be like, I will be singing Carbon Monoxide by Regina Spector. You would just sort of slowly see them. Yeah. I mean, I tried and it eventually worked. Yeah, exactly. I've heard her tell it. She's just haunted by the,

ah, ah, ah, ah, for weeks. For weeks, that's all I could think about. Cause I know it so well. And she goes in and she said the noise that came out. Tight. Tight. Vocally tight. Oh.

Go through any YouTube compilation of national anthems gone wrong. Yeah. And it's like that. When they try to get to like, and the rock, like, but they've started it too high. Yeah, oh God.

Yeah. They started at the very top of the range. When you can hear in a national anthem when someone's like, oh, say, and you're like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, you're not gonna get there,

you're not gonna get there. And it's that. I knew there was no world in which. Were you like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, you're not gonna get there, you're not gonna get there. And it's that. I knew there was no world in which. Were you like, can I start over? Mm-hmm. And it was again, again and again. Oh, I'm so proud of you for putting yourself through that. Yeah, you gotta keep doing it.

I remember I auditioned a bunch of times for girls. Oh. Oh, okay. New York actor. I could see, yeah. Every 23-year- old girl in New York City was gunning for that incredible show. And I auditioned a couple times for it. And then I remember watching it and I was like,

oh my God, I was way off tone wise. Oh. I don't know what I thought it was. Sex in the City? I just saw Sex in the City for the first time. I had also not seen Sex in the City until recently. Another one of the greatest shows ever made. It's such a good show.

God, what was I doing? I was remembering going back and thinking about my audition and I was playing it a real like, well, what do you have, we're like four gals in New York. And I watched it and I was like, oh my God, Kristen. Flapery? Yeah, I guess, which was like totally not what it is or just like four girls in New York

just to try and get around or whatever. And then I watched it and I was like, oh my God, I really. Yeah, it's a Sundance movie. Yeah, like no wonder. I have to say, I'm impressed that you went in for Wicked at this stage in your career, knowing this is going to be hard for me.

Because I think so many actors and actresses once they hit a certain level are not like, you got to. They're like, I can't and I don't want to embarrass myself. And now the stakes are like hot. Things are going well. I was like, I can't and I don't want to embarrass myself. And now the stakes are like hot. Things are going well. I was like, I can sing a lot of these songs. You do this delusional deal making with yourself where you're like, well, I love that musical so much.

I knew that was in no way, shape or form a reality, but I was like, I'm gonna try. Yeah, good for you. I think that's great. It's such a strange part of our jobs. Sometimes there's a comfort in it because sometimes I'll do jobs where Sometimes there's a comfort in it, because sometimes I'll do jobs

where they've just offered it to me, very blessed to be in that position, but then you show up and you're like, hope you like what I've been working on. I remember there was a, my God, this is so embarrassing. I did an indie film when I was 25, and it was like the first time I'd been offered something

without having to audition. And this woman had seen me do an episode of 30 Rock, but I play this really big character. And it was like the first time I'd been offered something without having to audition. And this woman had seen me do an episode of 30 Rock, but I play this really big character. And it was like a small part, two or three scenes in this movie, and she was like, I'm giving you free rein to be a character. And I was like, oh my god, this is my dream. For weeks with these three scenes, I was like, OK,

she's going to be this pill-addled sort of stumbling on heels. I was going for Catherine O'Hara crossing the field in Best in Show. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I got there and we did the first scene and I began and she was like, stop. What are you doing? And I was like, what am I doing?

You're like great. Yeah, I feel like and like I'd watched clips of Anna Nicole Smith. She was supposed to be this party girl that always said a loud thing at a party. Like a Samantha type? Not even. Samantha's more together. Just really out of it. But I'd really missed the mark. And so they held for a second while she took me aside and she was like, yeah, I don't think you can do that. Can you just do a Southern accent? And I was like, yeah, yes, absolutely. A Southern accent. A region or you're so humiliated. And then I was like, yeah, give me five minutes. And then I ran to my honey wagon.

I'm gonna cry for four of them. I'm gonna cry for four of them for a minute. I'm gonna just try to be like, well. We gotta bury the body. We gotta bury the body. And also people aren't stupid. It was a group scene. It was a group scene of a dance at someone's house too,

where my character walks onto the dance floor to no music, everyone doing that horrible shuffle. And I walk in to be like, hey, such and such, heard about the thing. And then they were like, ah, cut. So also everyone else is now gonna see me do take two with an accent. Yes.

Oh. Ah. So anyway, deeply humbling. What an endeavor. Well, this segues perfectly into my last question, which is you're being thoroughly recognized as you deserve, but it's happening 20 years into your career. You turned 40 this year?

Yes. I guess my question is, do you have gratitude that it was delayed? Immense. Tell me, how would 25 year old you or 30 year old you have handled? I'm immensely grateful that it's happened in stages. I've gotten to be a part of things that I have genuinely believed in and would watch

and worked with people. And it's been a long but steady ride. When I look at the pressure on people in their early 20s who get recognized in a way you've been to award shows. They are really intense. Oh yeah yeah yeah. There are many things at once. You're seeing people that you haven't seen in a while who are friends and it's very joyful,

but you're being filmed the whole time. You're wearing clothes that you wouldn't wear, that you're not comfortable in, but that you feel fabulous in. Everything has a dichotomy to it every step of the way. To stand on a red carpet and get your name screamed by 80 people is extremely unnatural. And every time it happens, I walk away being like, I feel that feeling when like your car goes over a hill.

It feels dangerous a little bit. Yes, and then each time I have to be like, oh yeah, that's not natural. Not a position you would normally find yourself in. Yeah, like it's okay to not get used to that. Yes, if I were in those situations when I was younger, it's pressure. I'm so glad that I got to be in my early 20s in New York,

just messing up. And I think I also understand too more in a way that I may not have when I was younger, the chaos of it all and the beauty of it all and the machine of it all. I've peeked behind some curtains at this point, and that doesn't make me any less grateful for those curtains.

Yeah, yeah. Back then when it was happening, when you were in all these things, but you weren't necessarily on the cover of all these things. Sure. Did you have resentment then? Were you like, why am I not?

I mean, all these things, I'm working all the time. No, I had that when I was working really consistently in huge off-Broadway, you know, Lincoln Center, Playwrights Horizons, New York Theatre Workshop, institutions in New York. And I was broke. Couldn't afford an AC unit. I couldn't afford my cell phone and I couldn't understand how I was working but starving.

And I remember feeling real frustrated at being like, but I don't know what else to do. And certainly when I would lose out on certain jobs, I would audition in pilot season for anything from like a sorority sister to dead body in trunk. And I wouldn't get them. And I would be like, what am I doing wrong? Why isn't this not even happening in a why aren't I

such and such, but just why can't I afford a cell phone? And yet I'm getting the validation of being in all these plays and working with these incredible people. So I would say that- There's a lot of dissonance. Yeah, that was very frustrating. I'm very grateful that I've been able

to take the time that I have. It's kind of the theme of the year a little bit. Like Goggins- I was about to say, so Walton Goggins. Yeah, it's very Walton Goggins where it's just like, oh right, I now remember that this guy's been great for the last 20 years. Exactly.

And I've been observing. He's been in everything and been great in everything. And now people are really starting to say his name. Yeah, 51 years old. He's on the cover of everything. I also forget, this is not the first time I've been asked this. You've been at this for a while.

And maybe that's a layer of the imposter syndrome or something, but I consistently think I've only been at this for a couple years. It's so odd. And then it's only when it's presented to me. Yeah, how do you hear that observation? I'm so touched by it. I think it's that thing of in my head,

I always feel like I'm maybe 27. Right, right, right, right. I don't know what that thing is called. Is that called being alive? And that bar go was four years ago. Right, that all feels very fresh still. I constantly forget that I'm 39. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Always, I'm like, oh me? No. Yeah, way to your 50. Well, this has been a delight and you've so earned all this attention in fanfare. You're just fucking crazy talented. Thank you. So I'm really happy for you. Thank you. We're happy for that little girl when you're 10. Yeah, I am too.

I am too. You should go to the Emmys and recreate that exact look. Yeah. Maybe even get reverse Invisalign. Now the irony, because you do have a ton of status, everyone would be like, oh, she's so cool. Oh my God.

Yeah. She gave herself an uneven buzz cut. It's like the Venezuelan. What a gangster. I know, I wonder where she is now. Yeah. Well, Kristen, delightful meeting you. So nice to meet you too.

Yeah, it's been a pleasure. Thank you so much for having me. Everyone watch The Penguin if you haven't already. We didn't spoil anything, even though I wanted to. Yeah. Yeah. Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare. I sure hope there weren't any mistakes in that episode, but we'll find out when my mom,

Mrs. Monica, comes in and tells us what was wrong. What? Nothing. Talk to me. No, nothing. Off the record, talk to me. No, everything's great. Everything's golden.

It's just busy. Busy? Yeah, you had to not come to a movie last night. I know, was it great? Yeah, it was great. It was great, yeah. I'm sad about that. I was the right decision, I will say that.

But I do really wanna see it, but I'll just see it in the movie theater. I wonder if you'll see it earlier than that. But yes, you would, well, let me ask you. No, I can't ask you, because then we'd need to say it. Yeah, we don't wanna see it, but I'll just see it in the movie theater. I wonder if you'll see it earlier than that. But yes, you will, well, let me ask you. No, I can't ask you, because then we'd need to see it. Yeah, we don't wanna give it away, but we have a guest coming up that we are-

People are kind of guessing. Whatever. Okay. We're so excited about. Yeah. And- Slash scared. Has been a long time coming and is a scaly one.

A scaly. And we were invited to see a movie. That she's in. And we were invited to see a movie early. That she's in. We were invited to see a project early. And I... The timing was great because my brother and sister-in-law are visiting

and I got to see them like a real shooter. Like, hey, do you wanna come to the screen with me? It's a movie they're dying to see. So I felt like I was so cool. You're the cool brother. I felt cool for those two and a half hours. Yeah, but I had to miss it because of work. Work, blam, blam.

Yeah, it's just a busy week. We're heading into the summer. Have I publicly thanked you already about editing? I mean, I tried to occasionally, but I'm in a wave right now, really having renewed gratitude. Oh, thank you. Right, but I'm in a wave right now of really having renewed gratitude, right? Cause I'm editing and it's miserable. Editing is miserable.

It's absolutely miserable. There are days, so yesterday I was going to edit two and I was in one and I started at 130 and I ended at six. And I was like, I actually like, I can't do it. I can't do another one. And I don't think if you haven't edited, you don't understand that feeling. It's like, well, you could have,

you could have pushed yourself and you could have, but your brain will shut down. Well, I'll add too. And do you have this experience? So I'll do these chunks on days off we don't have, I try to do two episodes in those days. Yeah, and it's like seven, eight hours of editing. And what happens is for me,

I slowly start hating everything I hear. Like, it's just like, I don't know, towards the end, I'm like, just cut everything, I don't wanna hear anyone ever talk again. And so like, you're wondering if the decisions you're making are the same at the end of the episodes as they were at the beginning. Yes.

Yeah, I mean, you probably don't have that because you do it so much. Yeah, I don't have that because there is no, there's no end, right? Right. Like you're editing a project that's- Yeah, I'm doing 12. You're doing 12. And then there's an end in sight. There's an end in sight? Like you're editing a project that's- Yeah, I'm doing 12. You're doing 12.

And then there's an end in sight. There's an end in sight, so I could almost see that being in some ways worse, cause it's like, I just, I gotta be done with this part. I haven't accepted that I have to do this. Yes. Yeah, there's still that like, yeah. But I am, it is funny that you brought that up

and we're talking about it because I'm also, as I warned you on the last fact check, I think I am PMSing this week. This week? I thought that was next week. Nope, this week. Okay, so right now you're- The period will start hopefully on Friday.

Do you have your Nixies? I have my Nixies ready to go. Yeah. They're laid out like a flat man. They're just sort of stacked up, ready to go. Yeah, they're prepped and ready, go. They're laid out like a flat man. They're just stacked up, ready to go. Yeah, they're prepped and ready, folded. They're on deck. Yeah, but along with the Ziploc baggies.

You gotta have them. No, I don't wanna be on the record saying, I don't do that, cause I don't need it. I did though. But it's great for people. So it was a very polarizing debate and people landed on all sides of it. Some people agreed with me, most people agreed with you.

What did they agree with you? What did they say? Like I'd be way more embarrassed about undies falling out than tampons. Which some people are like, fuck now, you know, it's much more, but a lot of people were like, yeah, I flow heavier than Monica. Like I can't get away with one.

I understand that. I've heard that as an explanation for why you should use the cup. If you got a ton of. Just, yeah. So anyway. I would see that as a sign of great health. Just my proclivities.

I wonder how I would deal with having a menstrual cycle because my greatest days are like a day and one just happened or it's like, I go number two. Oh my God. And it's so robust. Of course. Where I go, oh, I must not have been going the last couple of days.

This is like, where'd all this come from? I love that or a big bugger. Or a big bugger. Okay, listen, part of that's because then you feel better after, like you feel lighter, you feel, that doesn't happen on a period. It's not like you had a heavy flow and now you feel better. But I will say, so thank you for bringing this up,

I do struggle mentally sometimes with a light flow. Like I'm like, oh my, I'm done. Like this is a sign of perimenopause. Like I'm definitely in perimenopause. I'm probably like about to hit menopause. The eggs are out, now the blood's out. Exactly, and we're done now. Like we're heading towards no period.

But that's my hypochondriacal inclination and I don't want that. So don't reinforce that line of thinking. Last night, I thought maybe I had also a new disease. Oh, what new disease? Because my foot, sometimes my foot has like, kind of this numb, like this side of my foot here. Yeah, the inside.

The inside. Where your step is. Sometimes has a numbness or like a weird tingly feeling, a weird feeling. Some kind of neuropathy. Yeah. So yesterday I was starting to slip into, oh, I think it's.

And you started Googling. I didn't Google. But I was like, oh, I think it's. And you started Googling. I didn't Google. But I was like, oh, I have ALS. Oh, you went straight to neurological disorder. Yes, and then I, but then I immediately thought if I think it, I'll get it, so I can't think it. That's right, can't get psychosomatic ALS. But then that's, you know, that's its own thing.

So I put socks on and I ignored it. Oh great. That's a ding ding ding. I have entered, and I think this is a real period of life. Period ding ding ding. Period, pun intended. I have, and I've embarked on my slipper phase of my life. Whoa.

Yeah, I got a pair of like, I just like, I was recently feeling, there's all these times I wanna run out to grab food from the driveway or whatever, and I don't wanna put on my tight shoes. Seemed like I was time and I got a pair of really comfortable slippers. And I'm realizing, oh, this is a whole era of your life.

Once you start walking around in slippers. It's, oh, wow. Oh, this is a whole era of your life. Once you start walking around in slippers. It's a wow. I'm shook a little bit. Like it is a real indicator of age. It's an end to an era maybe. Yeah. Yeah.

Like I'm prioritizing my comfort. Wow. I just- And I hate bending over to put shoes on so I can just slide these on. Like it's definitely a harbinger of probably bad things to come, but also I kind of love it. I played volleyball in my slippers. It hurt my shoulder. Yeah, that's not good for volleyball.

No, but it was, I was in them and they're comfortable. Dad, can you practice? And then I'm just playing in my slippers. Yeah, but slippers can be slippery. They are. are comfortable, dad can you practice? And then I'm just playing in my slippers. Yeah, but slippers can be slippery. They are slippery. So you definitely should not play volleyball, okay? Okay.

And then additionally, as I said, my brother and my sister in-law, and she's been in her slipper phase for seven or eight years. Oh wow, post-menopause. Or middle of, I don't know, probably maybe related. Oh, wow. Post menopause. Or middle of menopause, probably maybe related. Okay, yep. But I realized like,

oh, she's really knows how to do it. The second we get home, like anything post lunch, if she gets home, those slippers are on immediately. So she packs her slippers on trips. She is in the full center of her slipper face. And so I'm finding I'm with her at like 5.30 in the evening. She has her slippers on, I have my shoes on, and she's like, you should already have your slippers on.

And I'm like, I know I'm- She's teaching you. I'm not fully like, I haven't learned the lifestyle all the way yet. The lifestyle. I'm not putting them on early enough. You know the lifestyle is swinging. You know, yeah, that's my lifestyler move is I wear slippers.

I may start wearing them in here on days that we don't have a, how do you feel about that? Okay, I have a question about slippers. Now your house is tricky because even though you hate to admit it, it's large and made of tons of houses actually. Okay. So you have to walk outside to get to places, to get like to your gym or to whatever.

My garage. Yes. This studio. This studio, exactly. So for me, if a slipper touches the outside, it's thrown in the garbage. That makes sense. It's a house slipper.

It is meant for inside the house, specifically so that you aren't dragging in stuff. That makes sense. It's a house slipper. It is meant for inside the house specifically so that you aren't dragging in stuff. Yeah, and so you're outing me, but yes, I'll own it. We are a shoes on in the house family. Yeah. And people will think that's disgusting. Sure.

But what's funny is I'm actually having a harder time wrapping my head around. I might want Nashville to be a shoes off house. Whoa. Because I'm thinking there's gonna be kids there endlessly, a yard to really play in and get dirty. Okay. And do I want this whole brand new house

to be filthy outdoor stuff? And then I'm like, we're so not a shoes off people. I can't even, like what that's challenging to my identity is way bigger than it should be. Because it's like the white Christmas lights. It is, it's like snooty and fancy. Yep. And what do you take your shoes off?

What are you talking about? Yeah, why do you need to fucking take your shoes off? The shoes. Yeah. Yeah, I feel that I'm a shoes off. But I want that. I want shoes off at Nashville. And I'm afraid to declare that.

Well, it's coinciding. What would be, when you come over this summer and I say to you, hey, shoes by the door, I gotta figure out something cute to say. Yeah, I think you're gonna need some sort of cute phrase. Don't let our shoes get lonely, put your shoes with them. That would need some work. What would be your first thought when you heard me say

you can't wear your shoes in the house? If we hadn't had this pre-talk, I would have laughed. Yeah. At you. I know, who are you? Yeah, well, and then for me, that triggers my own stuff. He's changing, I don't know him. He's changing, I knew it.

I knew that as soon- This money would infect him and destroy him. Not as money, this Southern life. Oh, you would chalk it up to this is a Southern thing. Just like, oh, he has this extra house now. So white. And he's extra white in the South. And he's hoity-toity in the South.

All the people that made me feel brown. Now he's like one of them. And I thought I knew him, but I don't even know him anymore. And then I would cry. You're teasing and you're not. And it's really, it's true. People just assign whatever previous baggage they had to any situation, that's the explanation.

Like you've got like a handful of explanations in your life, me, all people. And then no matter what situation, you're like, oh, it's that thing that I already figured out when I was 12. No, but not really. It depends on who it is. If I go to a random house and they say shoes off,

I don't think that. I'm not like, oh, hoity-toity. I don't have that. I'm like, oh, they just don't want dirt. But with you, because I've been around you so many times where you wear shoes in your bed, okay? So the fact that- Don't say that, but- I've been around you so many times where you wear shoes in your bed, okay? So the fact that-

Don't say that, but- Well, I've seen it. That I would be like, what? Just to be clear on that. On top of your bed. On top. I have on top of my bed and I very rarely, but there's occasions I've got like my cleaner vans on,

and I'm like, I'm not gonna put my head at the bottom there at any point. But it's not. See, even this, you're even getting self-conscious about this, and you used to not care at all. I'm changing. I'm becoming an old white man who wears slippers. With you, I want you to wear slippers outside

because it's keeping you still kind of dirty. Shit head, yeah, shit bird. You're not elite. But I have a friend who's also very famous. So anytime anyone who's really famous does something, I'm quick to associate it with them being so famous. I think that's really normal. Okay.

Like something's different and then you go, your brain just quickly catalogs what else is really different about them. So that might well likely be the explanation. Like, you know your friends are Orthodox Jews and you're at their house and they say, could you please hang the towel on his side. You know, just something that's different.

And you go, oh, I bet it's about them being Orthodox. I was like, anything you don't understand, and then you know there's this one thing different about them, you're like, oh, that's probably part of being Orthodox. I guess that's true. I think it's a little different with religions because there are like rules and stuff,

that being famous, which is just, you're still a person. But there's also just cultural stuff. Like I would, if something happened in your family house that was abnormal to me, I would probably go, it's probably because they're Indian. I would think it's from like something that your parents did, you know? It'd be a high probability gas.

Oh my God. That's different than racism. It's stereotypes. Well, it is, I don't understand this custom. This custom wasn't around me where I grew up. And I know that he's from India. This custom must come from India. Even though I grew up in the United States.

No, this is not, not your house. I would never be in your- No, I know, at my parents' house. But if I was at your parents' house and your dad only ate toast out of a cereal bowl, let's say. Okay. So nobody eats toast out of a cereal bowl. That must be Indian.

What could explain it? Okay. I bet in India they eat their toast in a cereal bowl. Do you think that would be like the highest probability guess? But this is what I am actively against. You're fighting this, I know. Yeah, that you just make, not you, the royal you,

but you, you're calling yourself out for this, I guess. And not the TV show you, which you also talk a lot about now. That anything a little different is associated with being a different type of, a different ethnicity is bad. Anything. So if I go to a nuclear physicist's house

and there's something different, I go, oh, I bet this is something the engineer, I figure out the thing that I don't share in common with them and I explain the other thing I don't share in common with them as the explanation. Okay, but how come if my dad is eating toast out of a cereal bowl, you're not saying, oh, it's cause he's an engineer.

Okay, so I might, but I'm going probabilistically. I'm first going, well, he's from a totally different country. There's 23 years of his life in a country that I don't know any of the customs on. And if I said, oh, Ashok, I noticed you're eating your toast out of a cereal bowl, that's unique. Is that an Indian thing? And he would go, no.

Then I would go, okay, what's the next thing I know is he and I don't have any overlap on? I think what I would love is, let me coach you, okay? First of all, let's never say, is that an Indian thing? You think your dad wouldn't like that? I don't like it. I know you don't. And I don't like it on behalf of him. I know, but, and I would never say to you, is that an Indian thing. You think your dad wouldn't like that? I don't like it. I know you don't. And I don't like it on behalf of him.

I know, but, and I would never say to you is that an Indian thing. I don't want you to say it to him. If I overheard that, you'd get this. I'd be in trouble. I know, I know. You'd get this at me. I would, I know that, and I know that would happen,

and I wouldn't do it in front of you. Is it possible though that your dad wouldn't care about that? And that Pari wouldn't care it in front of you. Is it possible though that your dad wouldn't care about that and that Pari wouldn't care about that? It's about the very specific phrasing. I guess you could say, first of all, my dad doesn't care about anything. So yes, you could say whatever the fuck you wanted to him.

He's not precious about- Anything to maybe detriment. But I think if you were gonna say it in a way that I would feel comfortable. Yeah. Did you grow up eating your toast in a cereal bowl? I've never seen that before. And so, yeah, I would have phrased it right.

Like that would be the correct way to phrase it. But all the other stuff really just happened because it's very logical. It bums me out. Maybe because I'm in my luteal phase. Well's very logical. It bums me out. Maybe because I'm in my luteal phase. Well, I understand why it bums you out, because that's an inane example of it, and then there's really bad examples of it.

Okay, hold on. It's inane to you. It's not inane to me, who's been othered by that my whole life. It's not inane to you. I think it might be inane to your dad. Okay, we can't use him. He is not a good measure. He is not a good measure.

He's not a good man. Now, he's too good of a man. He's too good, really. Now, how about this? If I was at your house, and you ate your steak with your hand. Right, like it were a potato chip. Yeah, exactly. when you ate your steak with your hand? You like picked up your steak. Like it were a potato chip.

Yeah, exactly. No, like more like a hamburger. Like you picked up the steak with two hands and bit into it and ate it. And I'd be like, whoa, I've never seen that. Is that something that happens in trailer parks? Well, first of all, I don't mind that question. Okay, what if I asked Aaron?

Yeah, he wouldn't mind either. You would mind if I saw Aaron do something. Oh, if you said that to Aaron. And I said, oh, is that like a trailer park thing? Yes, true. Point received, but would you agree? Trailer park is never used in a positive way. It's only a burn. I think you agree. Trailer park is never used in a positive way.

It's only a burn. And you have a gut feeling of any questions about India are implicitly negative. Whereas I don't associate, is that an Indian thing? Is that a trailer park thing? To me, there's a hierarchy of judgment in is that a trailer park thing or is that an Indian thing? Indian things is like a cultural national thing.

Because you know people who were judged for living in trailer parks. I don't. Right. I know people who are very insecure about being, yeah, from a trailer park. It's the same thing. But I think for you it is,

cause you're insecure about that, rightly so. But I don't think your dad is. Like I don't think it's an insecurity of your dad's to talk about stuff that was normal in India and different here. That's fair. I know, but you're using him as such a, you're- I'm hanging a lot on him,

but I would also hang a lot on Pari. I wouldn't feel comfortable with you being that open with Pari, like, is that an Indian thing? We don't know him well enough. I don't feel comfortable with you being that open with Pari. Like, is that an Indian thing? We don't know him well enough. I don't know his whole relationship to being Indian. Obviously he likes talking about it and he's comfortable with it. He's comfortable with it.

But these things are complicated. They are complicated. But it does start with what is your own feeling about the topic being brought up. It should be the person who's experienced it that gets to dictate it. Absolutely, which is why I am conceding and saying I wouldn't ever ask you that. Oh my God.

And I am making a prediction of how I think your dad would take it, which maybe is right or wrong. So how do you think Aaron would take it? I don't think he'd mind. Okay, but you would mind. I would be nervous, Well, not around you. No, if I said it.

Yeah, if you said it, we're fine. Because Aaron knows you, and he knows you want the best for him, and you don't think poorly of him, or that he's a low life. No. But wouldn't you be like, what the fuck is she doing?

You would, and you should. Me having, knowing your background, knowing his background, knowing that those things have been used against him, it would be so insensitive for me to be like, hey, is that a trailer park thing I don't understand? Just cause I don't understand it. And that's the different thing about us.

For sure. And also, there are some stuff you can say about trailer parks. I mean, there's a reality in the world. As I've said before, like the average level of intoxication on a weekday afternoon in Aaron's trailer park was much different than the average intoxication rate elsewhere. Right.

You know, that is also a reality of it. So it's like you're kind of, I think what you're trying to do is be honest about the world you live in and not hurt people's feelings. And sometimes those things are against one another, if that makes sense. If you're curious, you can ask it in a way that's not implying that it's something so,

like if I saw him eat a steak with two hands, maybe I'd be like, actually, I mean, I know me, I would just be like, well, that's how he eats it. He's a caveman, look at him. No. Look at this guy go. When you do grow up as a minority, everything's different.

So you don't have the luxury of being like, oh, that must be different because of this, or that might speed, it's like, yeah, it's all different. Everything's different. Now, let me ask you this, if you walked into, like you had had your experience of living with other girls a lot as roommates. And I even went to your old apartment where you had a bunch of female roommates.

And like you guys would like cook dinners together sometimes. And there's all kinds of stuff that's kind of predictable in that scenario. Oh sure, yeah. And I'm sure if you walked into an apartment that four dudes lived in, and you're like, oh wow, X, Y, and Z is different. There's a bong on the table.

There's dishes in the sink. Your brain would logically and rightly so, I think go, well, this is a much different scenario when you hear what's different. And it would be right for you to go like, oh yeah, this is boys much different scenario in here. What's different? And it would be right for you to go like, oh yeah, this is boys. Yeah. Right? Like there's an explanation for it.

And I think you would be right and logical to start with what's the biggest difference between you and your three roommates and these four people. Well, this is four dudes and that's four. But the difference is that's correct. The toast out of the bowl and the eating the steak with two hands are not because of what you're-

We don't know though. Well, I do know that that's not an Indian tradition. Well, I know, cause it was made up. He doesn't do it. Yeah, and either is eating steak with two hands. But the whole point is like, cause what you're bringing up is something that you really don't under, you're like, oh, that's new.

Seeing a bong in a, basically a frat house isn't new. I've seen it. Right, but if it's just trashed inside and you're trying to figure out why these people live in a trash place and you and your friends don't, I think it would be right of you, if your life depended on it, to make a prediction of why it's different, to assume it's because they're boys and you're girls.

I think if you came into my parents' house and they had a picture of Krishna on the wall, I think you could probably indefinitely deduce that that's because they're Indian. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't think you can see like a bouncy ball in water on the counter and say, oh, that must be Indian too. For sure.

I think what both things are true and absolutely legitimate is A, you should treat people as they're an individual and the thing that you're experiencing could be their own individual idiosyncraticness. That would be the fairest way to treat everyone. And that's valid and I agree. Also, groups of people have patterns, also a reality.

They do, but for the most part, we know those already. Like we've been taught those and told those already. So like, yes, if my mom is making curry, yeah, you could say to yourself like, like it would be reasonable to think, yeah, that's because she's Indian and she grew up eating curry and that's an Indian dish. All of that makes sense.

And those are stereotypes, so that's tricky, but it's real, that's real. Yeah, it's just, yeah. That's normal. I'm fine with that. I'm just not fine with arbitrary, that's different. So it must be because of. I understand your objection to that.

Okay. But do you also agree that that might be the highest probability explanation just across the board. No, I don't. Like I had to be friends with lots of Jewish people before it went from, I noticed one friend had this thing hanging

in his door frame and he touched it every time he went in his house. At first that was just, oh, John has a thing he's hung up that he touched. Sure. Then four other Jewish friends along the way who have it. And then I go like, oh yeah, that's a Jewish thing. Yes.

So I think that's the right train of thought. You see it and you assume that it's actually individual to the person. It's just John's thing. Yes, and then over time, you see a pattern. Then over time you're like, oh, this is cultural. But that's the correct order, not the other way around. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Yeah, sometimes life's moving really fast and you got like one stab at it. No, you don't. And you kind of go the highest probability. No, you don't. No, you don't. Okay. Okay.

Okay. The Shoke, I love you. I love you, dad. And, you don't. Okay? Okay. The Shoke, I love you. I love you, dad. And everything you do, I love. And if I saw something I didn't understand, I would still love it. I just would be curious if that was his own unique invention,

or if that's like he's fourth generation of toast and a bowl. Well, look, here's an interesting, so a lot of Indians do, they eat with their hands. Okay. So they eat like rice with their hands. Mm-hmm. And they got the naan going too,

they're scooping with some bread, they get their fingers in there. Yeah, depending, sometimes there's naan, there's, but sometimes not, like they're eating with their hands. That's a very common way to eat in India. My grandparents did that. That's how they ate.

Well, they did. Yes, and my dad too, although I haven't seen that in years. Not really quick. So when you were over there and you noticed, oh, grandma and grandpa eat with their hands. Were you like grandma and grandpa are interesting or were you like, oh, it's gotta be an Indian thing? I mean, I was so little. There's no way for me to know that. Were you like grandma and grandpa are interesting or were you like, oh, it's gotta be an Indian thing?

I mean, I was so little, there's no way for me to know that. So anyway, I guess I would hope that you would have seen it a couple of times before you assumed it. Yeah. But this is an interesting one because it's true, you know, it's real, that's a cultural difference. Yeah, that's right. And that's what you're trying to

beat out in your head and figure out what, you know. I think your impulses are like explain stuff. I mean, I think, well, let's start with like things we agree on. Everyone's impulse is making sense of reality around them. Yeah. Like that's just your number one job from the second you wake up. It's like, oh, I came in this room and this is going on.

Why is this going on? I need that, you know. I think approaching it with like true curiosity I was like, oh, I came in this room and this is going on. Why is this going on? I need that, you know. I think approaching it with like true curiosity that doesn't have any judgment or otherness around it. Like I do think phrasing it as, did you grow up eating toast in a bowl or did you grow up eating with your hands

is different than is that a insert group thing. Just for anyone who wants to practice. It's a lot, look, life is a lot of phrasing. It's a lot of judgment calls, it's a lot of how you phrase things. Yes, it makes a huge difference. Yeah, and I'm just trying to be honest about acknowledging what the real process is in my head.

Like I'm trying to be honest about the fact that when I see something that I've never seen before, my 100th of a second, right? Like I'm not even, the frontal lobe's not even involved. It went, huh, that's different. What could explain it? What's the other thing I know about us that's different? Maybe that's the explanation. That is just like, from almost the what could explain it, what's the other thing I know about us that's different, maybe that's the explanation.

That is just like, from almost the moment I see it, that math happens. And then the frontal lobe goes, well, is that a stereotype? Is that offensive? Is that this? Is it that? And then you hope to land with a high percentage

that you were on the right side of it. Well, hopefully you just keep your mouth shut until the second part of your brain has done the other thing. That's the goal. The space between your emotions and your actions. We can't control the initial thought. That's all I'm trying to cop to.

I have no, I have no, there's nothing we can do about our initial thoughts. Okay, great. I get a little scared that I even like, my initial thoughts are offensive and then I'm kind of just a bad, like you think I'm a bad person. We all do this.

I commit to like working through all the other steps. Yeah, that's all that's being asked in any of these like racism or stereotypes or any of these things. Like you can't help your initial thought, you have it and then you think, is that right? Yeah. And that's how you get to having,

I think those thoughts less over time. Yeah. Anyway. I think when you and I talk about race openly, it's wonderful. Me too. Yeah. We can, because there's trust.

Yeah. And I think, hopefully it's good for people to hear because it's hard to find someone you trust to talk about race with, because there's a lot of explosive. It also, again, it's so much of where you come from. It's like Joy grew up with her people. And like, so she loves to talk about it.

She's happy to engage in it with pretty much anyone, whether or not she's even earned that. And it's simply so what you'd be inclined to think is like there's something predictable about being a minority in this country. Well, no, there's something predictable if you're a minority in this country and you're surrounded by the hegemonic group

and there's something to be said if you, you know. Yeah, but also she, if she was talking to certain people, I mean, the way Joy talks about it, she does, she's with you, there's like fun and it's funny and stuff, but she can get very serious about race. Oh, she's dead serious about the inequity. Exactly, and she is not gonna be afraid to say it.

She likes to, cause she's so skilled at pointing these things out. But to, cause she's so skilled at- Exactly. Pointing these things out. But yeah, but she's never seemingly, she's never triggered in some inferiority way. Right. She's like, oh, you think that that's broken and I can't wait to, you know, there's like, she doesn't seem to,

but she got to grow up with her people. She did, but she's also lived a life, she went to an Ivy league school. She lived a life where she was around a lot of white people. Yeah, so- She did boarding school. I'm sure there's elements of that. There's some complication for sure.

Yeah, I don't think you can be a minority in this country and not have some level of like- It is just fun to think about what your homeostasis would be if you grew up with all Indians in the neighborhood. And what would my homeostasis be like if I was the only white person in all Indians or all black people or whatever. It just, I think it proves the point

that we are always saying, which is like, you're not you, you're a product of. So many things. Yeah. Yes, I agree. Okay. that you, you're a product of. So many things. Yeah. Yes, I agree. But real quick, speaking of cultures, Callie, Max and I went to Dan Tanna's, which is an institutional restaurant in Los Angeles.

Which I've talked about a bunch on here, because I like to go with Nate. Yeah. And what did you think? I loved it. You did? Yeah, I loved it. Okay, I need to know more

because what I like about it, as I've told you, is it is time traveling. It is, it's old school Italian, it has mob energy. It's super Hollywood 80s. Yes. I mean, the steaks are named after famous actors. You got the, the Debney steak, you got the. I thought, oh, I didn't notice that.

Do you not notice all the, all the- I didn't look at the- They're known. What ones? I didn't look at the meats. Oh, you didn't? No, cause it's an Italian place. I'm getting pasta.

They're kind of known for their, what's the thing that people are against eating at cow? It's a big veal. And there's like eight or 10 veals on the menu, but all with different movie stars names. And famously James Woods was behind us eating the James Woods. Yeah, that's right.

I thought that was a Mousseau and Franks. No, that was Dan Tanna's. Oh, fun. But you liked it. I loved it. Were there any 85 year old men with 21 year old women? Oh, shoot. Cause that's still thriving there,

which is so fascinating to see. I didn't notice, but at some point in the night, a group came in that was dressed like to the nines looking mob, kind of mob bossy. Ooh. And then our server, who obviously had been sort of like a lifetime server there,

he was giving us the intel that they come at like nine or between nine and 10 every night and they order the same thing and they get fettuccine for the table. I love it. I know, it was really, really fun. Did you have a cool cocktail? Cause that bar.

I had a martini. Maybe the coolest bar in all of LA. I mean, more shit has happened at that bar than probably any other bar in LA. It was so fun. And one bad thing happened. He'll probably be mad at me for sharing this cause it was a blunder.

Okay. Thigh Guy? Yeah, Thigh Guy Max. He's kind of like you, I think, in a, I'm worried things are gonna run out. Oh, sure, sure. So I guess last time they got a Caesar. Uh-huh. And he was like, this is not enough.

Wasn't enough, yeah. This is not enough Caesar. Scary, yeah. I can feel it. So for his entree, he got double Caesar salad. Okay. And Callie and I got individual Caesars as our starters. So they bring our starters.

And I look at this and I think Max is getting two of these. Because it was huge. It was huge. And then he had trapped himself because he was like, it is, that wasn't the size of it last time. It was huge. And then he had trapped himself, because he was like, it is, that wasn't the size of it last time. And the Caesar that arrived was so. It was like a large pizza.

It was enormous, it piled up so high. And he couldn't really wait for his, like he was like too hungry. So we had some of mine and some of Callie's before his enormous Caesar arrived. Oh wow. Okay? And then.

He really painted himself into a corner. He did, cause then he was like, I have to eat it. Like I made this crazy mistake. Yeah. And it looks crazy if I don't, like the people are gonna be pissed if I don't. No, I love that we think that. Cause if they're thinking at all about what we do.

Well, no, then our server came, because he said, is this the size it was? And he said, yeah, that's always been the size. Yeah, the guy in the back was like, two? Okay, so they are judging. Anyway, he ate pretty much all of it. He had to leave a little bit, but when you factor in the fact

that he had some of mine and Callie's, he had more than two Caesars. And what do you have for an entree? That was his entree. He didn't go to a steak either. He, no, he didn't. We got some appetizers, but. Okay.

I'm so glad. When was this? Last night? Oh, it was- Couple months ago? Yeah, it was Sunday. It was Sunday. Yeah.

Okay. It was really fun. Yeah, that's a fun place. I need to be better at not, like I wanna go back tonight. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then I wanna go back in five more days. Like I've been doing that with Sunset Tower.

I've been going a little like a lot. Okay, yeah. And I ordered, I order an interesting martini. I order one with a lemon twist and an orange twist. Unconventional, I invented it. Okay. And so- Never been done.

So when I went last time and I ordered that, he was like, oh yeah, I remember you. Oh, now he's got you. Yeah, and he was like, yeah, when were you here? Like two weeks ago? And I was like, yeah, but really it was like. Five days ago. Yeah.

I had to lie. Is he a suitor now? Sounds like he's a suitor. No, he's not, he was a nice man, but no. Anywho, I guess that's it. I do have a maybe an update. I haven't decided if I'm gonna share it, so that's TBD. Keep listening.

Sure, sure. All right, let's do some facts. Yes. Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare. Okay, facts for Kristen. It's so weird that her name's Kristen. Is it weird for you? Well, because it's spelled the way it is.

There's a lot of leeway in the way where people are spelling Kristen. I don't think of her as Kristen because of the way it's spelled. Right. But then when we were saying her name, I was like, oh yeah. It is actually. This is a dumb story.

No, that's a good one. But Kristen, C-R-I-S-T-I-N. I know what you mean, I think the same exact thing. I didn't realize it was even pronounced Kristen. Yeah. Yeah, C-R-I-S-T-I-N. Now this goes with this, my ex-girlfriend, Brie too. She had a very novel spelling of Brie.

Yeah, how'd she spell it? B-R, still does, B-R-I-E-G-H. B-R-I-E-G-H, yeah. Everyone gets to do it however they like. Parents get funky when they're making spellings up. I know. Yeah, it's an interesting impulse. It's like, I'm gonna give them a name

that a lot of people have, but I'm gonna spell it uniquely. Yeah, you know what's funny? Well, Callie has that a little bit. She always has to say Callie with a K. In an I? Well, so. Uh-oh. So now's.

That was a great time to tell you. Actually, I think every time. I have stress every time I text you about Callie. As I'm like, is it K-H? Is it K-H-H? See, yeah, it's a, look, it's a hard name. I actually find it very endearing because I think it's a, look, it's a hard name. I actually find it very endearing

because I think it has to do with your dyslexia. Okay. Because you always spell it K-A-L-I, and you're so close. Oh, what do I need? It's K-A-L-I-E. Oh, easy, I can. But I always think it's funny because you do it,

and then I'll respond back with her name, kind of on purpose, spelled correctly. Yes, try gently tell me. Yeah, like, oh, I think one day he'll see that he has been doing that wrong. And then- Yes, I was with Callie, instead of saying I was with her.

Yeah, Callie said this. And then you haven't noticed that. But so I guess now the cat's out of the cow. I noticed it and then I don't remember it. Yeah, that's fair. Like a month later when I wanna text about Callie, I don't try to go back and find it. Okay, I think this will be the learning moment

where I get it, I.E. I can handle that. I have this same issue with Seth's wife, Claire. Every time I seem to write Claire, I pick the wrong one. How does she, why? Well, because you could go C-L-A-I-R or C-L-A-R-E. Oh. And it's one of those two, and I generally get it wrong. C-L-A-R-E is unconventional.

That's hers. That's hers. Okay, so she's unconventional. Yeah, and Seth will, he doesn't say, he doesn't do what you do. He's even more direct. He's like, it is, like he corrects me. He gets upset, do you think?

I just think he's- Do you think he gets defensive? No, I think he's a very like respectful integrity person. And he wants to correct you if you're not spelling his wife's name right. Wow, okay. Two sides of the two different coins, I guess, because I feel like I'm being respectful

by not telling you because I don't wanna hurt your feelings. I think they're both valid. They're valid points of view. Okay, what is interesting about the way people spell names is sometimes the spelling does make me like the name in a way that I didn't previously like it. Sure. In fact, Claire being one.

I really like the spelling C-L-A-R-E. That changes it for you. Now I love it. Yeah, maybe you'll name your daughter Claire. We spell Calvin weird. How do you spell it? C-A-L-V-I-G-H-N. No, you don't.

That's a lie. Robin is lies. He tells so many lies. And when I'm watching you, there's so many lies to juggle. Oh, so yours is swimming in deception. Yes. Speaking of when I asked if he's protective, Seth,

the guy in you, he's so protective that he has to murder. Too protective. Yeah, I could see you sliding down that scale a little bit. Absolutely, yeah. I kind of want you to watch it to see if you kind of can relate. We had an expert, he's coming up, and it's really fucked up the whole way

I process the world, and I'm frustrated by it, and I know it's the right thing to do. But a guy, we're having an expert on about rage addiction. And once it's fully framed for you, what's going on in your head, and the science behind it, it's a bummer. Because I do like the right, there's some level of vigilanteism I like.

Look, we all do, we all love the story of like Robin Hood a little bit. But again, this circles back to our other fact check, in reality, no. Like, no. Revenge is bad and it's a poison. Yep, and forgiveness is very good for your brain. It stops this back and forth cycle.

It's just the right thing. And I kinda hate it. It's taking the fun out of, you know, like these movies that are just great. It's like you kidnap Leon Neeson's daughter and he's gonna fucking kill you. And we love that, that's so clean. You should get killed if you kidnap someone's daughter.

When I was home for Mother's Day, I was watching Dateline, obviously, with my parents because they just can't get enough of that. Yeah. Are they particularly into Keith Morrison, the way we are? Do they not have preferences? There's no preference.

Oh wow, I don't like that. As much as they can consume, they will. In fact, I probably can't say this, but there was something happening in the family-ish, a good thing, but that my mom was like, well, you gotta be careful because people can get really crazy. And she like devised this whole plan in her head of how.

Someone would get murdered. Yep. Yeah, yeah. It could lead you to believe there's more murders going on than there are. Correct. Yeah, yeah. There was a man who killed a girl,

like a 18 year old or whatever, who killed another 18 year old. Okay. And, or maybe he was 19 or something, whatever. He killed someone and like, you know, he's up for, he's up to get out a lot, but the mom and the sister keep going in and basically making sure he stays in jail.

Yeah. And I respect, I understand, of course I understand, but there was a part of me, you know, and I was like, I mean, maybe it's time to let him out. And I was saying that, and my mom was so disturbed by me saying that. And I was like, mom, his brain wasn't even developed. It's not developed till you're 25.

And she's like, well, if you were the sister, and I was like, of course, of course, if I'm the sister, I want that person to rot in jail. That's right. So I get it. Yeah, but it's been taking the fun out of some normal fantasies I play with. Yeah, like having like empathy,

having empathy kind of ruins vigilantism. Yeah, just owning what's going on in my brain. Can you give an example? Well, just, I think of all these scenarios all the time. I just, that's what I fantasize about. Killing? No, but like, protecting. Oh, right, yeah.

Forcing someone to apologize, you know, all these just like, taking care of everyone and sheriffing. Right. And so I have all these bizarre fantasies. And then I just have to now go like, right, so you're hurt or someone else is hurt and your inclination is not to soothe, it's to hurt.

And that that'll somehow erase the hurt and it just, it doesn't and it won't. And it's no less fun, my imagination now. And I'm kind of angry. Kind of like I couldn't- Oh, it's a cycle then. Yeah, like I couldn't, I had, there's so many things I've had to stop doing on the show.

Like be disparaging about BDP people, be disparaging, right? Even the sociopath, we had a sociopath on, I am like, fuck, I kind of feel bad for sociopaths. Yeah, you're, we're, yeah, we're- But I don't like it. I mean, I like it. No, we like it. I think it's good, it's a good direction, but I also.

I've been thinking about this a lot. I think this show has fundamentally made me a fully different person. I was so, I was so, yes, that person needs to rot it. Like I would never have ever thought for a second, like, eh, maybe it's time to let that guy out. What's our goal? Or do we want to punish or keep people safe?

Yeah, and I think it has to do with the amount of stories we've heard, the amount of people we've gotten to talk to. Yeah, I wonder who I'd be without it. I didn't know, my mom and brother, we were at dinner, So yeah, I wonder who I'd be without it. I didn't know, my mom and brother, we were at dinner and I was doing this about somebody or something. And they were like, you always see the best in people.

Like they were saying it kind of annoyed. Yeah, like you're naive or. Yeah, or just like, we know you wanna look at that perspective, but this is what we wanna talk about, the bad thing. And I would never, I am not someone who was born thinking the best of people. Right, right, right, right.

So that's something new and I'm grateful for it. So I wouldn't even say mine is that I now think the best of people. It's that I much more understand, or I think I understand how bad the person had it to begin with that ended them there. Yes, that some things aren't choice. I still think they're bad, but I think there's,

you know, I think they're, well, I'm not bad in quotes, but. Well, yeah, I guess that's the lesson. Like, I don't think people are bad. I think you become, who you become based on experience and things you can't control. Yep. So.

Yeah, it's hard to. It's hard, yeah, it's hard after you know that. Yeah, I feel like I can only be like, ethically judgmental of someone that's got the exact same scenario as me. Like I'm free to say, no, you should be doing better with this set of circumstances. But beyond that, I really have no business saying

what someone should, what level they have, should have risen to. Yeah, and that applies to everyone. That applies to the person whose family was hurt. They've been through something that causes them to act the way they act. And that applies to everyone. That applies to the person whose family was hurt. They've been through something that causes them to act the way they act. Anyway, okay, so some facts.

What is the Jersey Devil? What is the Jersey Devil? In South Jersey and Philadelphia folklore in the US, the Jersey Devil, also known as the Leeds Devil, a legendary creature or cryptid said to inhabit the forest of the Pine Barrens in South Jersey. The creature is often described as flying biped. It looks kind of cute actually.

With hooves, but there are many variations. It looks kind of like a smiling reptile, but with ram horns and chicken legs and dragon wings. Yeah, bat-like wings, it says. Yeah. The origin of the legend. Though a woman named Leeds was giving birth to her 13th child and exclaimed,

let the child be the devil. The child, though born normally, immediately grew wings, tail, and claws and flew out of the Pine Barrens. That's all you gotta do is say, let him be the devil and that you can convert your- If you're Mrs. Leeds. Oh wow. Yeah.

How much is a petty cab ride in New York-ish? Through Times Square, a short ride within Times Square might cost 15 to $30, while a more extensive tour could range from $40 to $150 per person. It's kind of steep. Pricy way to get around town. Yeah, but fast. Super fast.

Cause you get to go in between. Right. Record for how long someone was in a Broadway show. The record for the longest time spent by an actor in a single Broadway show is held by George Lee Andrews, who performed the Phantom of the Opera for 23 years. Oh my Lord. From 1987 to 2011.

Whoa. He performed a total of 9,382 performances. Oh my God. During his tenure, he played multiple roles, including ensemble members and the roles of Montseuvermuntmann and Monture Andréser Ferman and Monture Andre. 9,000 performances? Yeah.

I'm like, still so proud of us for 900 episodes and now I feel like a weekly. Yeah. And do you think, it's one of those things when you've done something so much that if like he forgets a line in his 7,000th performance, he's probably so afraid of dementia. He's like, how could I, I've been doing this 7,000.

I bet he could most certainly do that role, soup to nuts and never once be present on stage. Like it completely in his mind thinking about other stuff, I'm sure his subconscious could do that performance. And he's just probably in La La Land for two hours. But he loves the theater. Or he's addicted to that cheddar. I don't think that's what he's addicted to. I think he's addicted to cheddar.

They don't make much money. But that reminds me, sometimes I forget the gate code to your house. And I think every time I forget, I think like, oh, I'm ill, like something's wrong. How could I possibly forget this thing I do every day? I then have to look it up. Sure, sure, sure.

Yeah. Isn't that scary? Yeah. I get scared like that, yeah. And that stuff happens to me. Does it? Yeah. And now we're being monitored.

So it's like, I have the thought, it's like, I cannot think of a name of someone I know very well. Yeah. And then I go, well, I guess the next cognition test we have for our Alzheimer's thing is just gonna show that yes, I am indeed. Declined.

Yes. Yeah. It's weird. Yeah. Like, I don't know if it's comforting or not comforting that we will find out. I can't decide that. Like normally you'd just be having these thoughts

in a vacuum and then you'd probably convince yourself later that you'd be thinking sharp that day and be like, oh no, nothing's going on. But we're gonna be told. Well, unless we don't decline. Correct. Which is the goal is to be doing all these other things. I mean, we're gonna decline.

But not to a scary, hopefully not to a scary level. Some days it feels like it's happening at a scary pace. I think it's when it's like gloomy out. That's when you. It's more weather based. Okay, this vault, this Warner Brothers situation where there are shows that are gone is true. And yeah, you can't watch Westworld.

I looked on Max today. You can't find, it's not there. You can like go to Amazon Prime and buy it. You can. Yeah, but you can't watch it on Max. That's so weird. I know. Also now it's HBO Max again.

Did you hear this? No. Now they've gone back to... Yes. By the way, I always said HBO is the crown jewel, not Max. I don't know why they didn't. Exactly. But I think, well, I heard it was just some guy's idea

who had power and then they did it. And then obviously it never worked. Like people wouldn't say it right or everyone would just. You still say it's on HBO. Yeah, people would say it's on HBO. And so it's HBO Max again. And if we have to re-download that shit, I'm gonna be pissed.

But it would be like Mercedes buying Dodge and then deciding to rename all this Mercedes Dodge. That makes no sense. You wanna stick with your most prestigious name. I know. Home box office. I think maybe they got excited that Mac sounds like the maximum amount of content.

Well, they didn't want it to just be HBO, obviously, because there's more there. Right. But HBO Max seems good to me. TJ Maxx. But it was HBO, then HBO Maxx, then Maxx, right? HBO Go. HBO Go.

Oh yeah, oh my God. John Oliver does a whole bit on the last episode of all the different names. Oh, that's really funny. They are having fun with it though. They have like obviously some like Gen Z person running their social media because they're like putting funny. Burning themselves running their social media, because they're putting funny.

Burning themselves? Yeah. Okay, that's good. But it's been making me sign in a lot lately, and I wonder if that's related to this name change. It's been challenging. Probably. Do we have to download another fucking app,

or are they just going to update the current one? That's what I just said. We're so intolerant. It used to be like you had to catch the show live, or you didn't see it. Now it's like, I had to sign in. I know. Okay, I was gonna play just a teeny, teeny clip

of her on 30 Rock. She mentions a character she plays that's like wild. I knew I smelled sausage. Yes. Abby? I'm Liz. Liz! Thank you!

Oh, our nips just touched. Liz, thank you. Our nips just touched. Mine are so hard. Mine are different sizes. That's all I'll play, but yeah, she's a very silly. That, 30 Rock is such a fucking good show. Yeah, it's almost like in some ways underappreciated. Yeah, there she is. Oh yeah.

Our nips just touched, is that what she said? Yeah. Yeah, it's a great show. Tina Fey, one of the great talents of all time. Okay, I've found this weird thing. She said, what's it called when you feel forever 27? Mm-hmm, that has a name. So then I looked it up and it said,

the phenomenon of feeling forever 27, or experiencing a fascination with the idea of never aging beyond a certain age, is often connected to the 27 club, a cultural concept referencing celebrities who died at the age of 27. Yeah. The idea, while rooted in tragedy,

has also become a symbol of a certain rebellious energy and a desire to hold onto youth. Live fast and die young. I guess, isn't that weird? Who's the list? Hendricks, Janis Joplin. Amy Winehouse, Jim Morrison, Janis Joplin, Jimmy Hendricks. Well, we know that Belushi and Chris Farley made it to 33,

the age of Jesus. Mm-hmm. So they're not on here. That's good. Yeah. Okay, we did talk about astrology, so I did real quick wanna just real quick. Yeah, of course.

Do today's astrology. Postar is the app I use. Let's see what it says today. It's my preferred app. One hour ago. You don't have high standards. You just want someone who, Capricorn, will discreetly tell you if you have food stuck in your teeth.

Wouldn't everyone like that? You'd like that, right? No, I might. I'll be embarrassed. I do want it. You'd rather have food stuck in your teeth? No, I don't. I want it, but I don't want it either.

Okay. You don't want the solution to it. You don't have high standards, you just want someone who, me, Virgo, reliably uses the correct there, there, there. Oh, sure. Okay, that adds up. Wait, Rob, what are you?

Gemini, I think. Oh, Rob. Actually, that makes total sense. Oh yeah. That makes total sense that you're a Gemini. The twins, one's a rascal. Aren't they the twins? I think they are.

You don't have high standards, you just want someone who shares the passwords to all their streaming accounts. I think people tell me I'm more of a cancer than a Gemini, because I'm right on the edge. You just want someone who shares the passwords to all their streaming accounts. I think people tell me I'm more of a cancer than a Gemini because I'm running the edge. Okay, you don't have high standards. You just want someone who can listen without sharing a tangentially related story. Who can listen without sharing it.

I don't think so. I don't know many people like that. Kristen's a cancer and my mom. She only tells tangential. Well, but she wants, no. So this is saying she wants to be able to tell you a story and you not go on a tangent with your own story. Basically everything we do here.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I don't think that's true. I don't know if that's true of Aaron either, but maybe I'll ask him. I think he likes a tangential story as well. I'll ask Anna, I'll ask my mom. So many cancers. I do have a lot of-

July and August, big, big birthday months. Yeah, they are. Coming up. That's right around the corner. All right, that's it. That's it? Yeah. That's it for Kristen? Yeah, that's it for Kristin with the seed.

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