Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard - Flightless Bird: School Cafeterias

Episode Date: July 25, 2023

This week on Flightless Bird, David Farrier goes behind the scenes of the food that’s dished up to 30 million American kids at the school cafeteria. Back in New Zealand, they don't have school cafeterias, so all he knows is what he's learned from Euphoria and Saved By The Bell. In Hemet, Farrier meets Kate Kloet, assistant director of nutrition services for Hemet Unified School District. Donning a hairnet, she takes Farrier into the industrial kitchen where food is made for 23,000 kids in the area before the pair drive to a local high school to experience the cafeteria. What do the kids think of the food and what do they think of the American high school experience? Farrier goes back to school to learn all he can about the American high school cafeteria. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. Now I'm sure, like me, you've had times when you've felt uncertain about where you were going in this great big thing called life, how to navigate it, or just why you keep repeating the same silly behaviours again and again. The fact is, sometimes we're faced with tough choices, and the path forward isn't always particularly clear, when friends' advice may no longer be enough and you need a fresh outsider perspective from someone who knows what they're talking about. Whether you're dealing with decisions

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Let therapy be your map with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash bird today to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp, H-E-L-P dot com slash bird. I'm David Farrier, and New Zealand are accidentally marooned here in America and I want to figure out what makes this country tick. Growing up in New Zealand most of what I absorbed about American life came from American TV and American movies but there was nothing more weird and alien to me than watching American kids eating their American lunch at the American school cafeteria. Ugh, Salisbury soup again? My Joe isn't sloppy enough. Talk about weak coffee.

When I was growing up in New Zealand, there was no school cafeteria. You'd bring a packed lunch to school with you in your school bag. We didn't have school lockers either, so your bag would be as heavy as a St. Bernard dog because it would be filled to the brim with textbooks and your school lunch. Come lunchtime, there's no school cafeteria, dog because it will be filled to the brim with textbooks and your school lunch. Come lunchtime there's no school cafeteria so kids just go outside and sit under a tree to eat the food they're brought from home. There were no tables of freaks or geeks or jocks because there were no tables because

there was no high school cafeteria. I wanted to learn what it's like for American school kids because over 30 million of them a year are fed at the school cafeteria. To learn how all this works I'd have to go to a high school cafeteria to witness the feeding frenzy firsthand. So grab your tray and hope the lunch lady is serving up something delicious because this is the School Cafeteria episode. Flightless, flightless, flightless bird touchdown in America. I'm a flightless bird touchdown in America. Morning, Monica.

Good morning. How are you? I'm good. You don't sound convinced. Well, I have high cholesterol. How high? Too high? Skyrocket. You're sucking back a green smoothie over there right now.

It's bad. I mean, I'm trying to be so healthy. But I have a problem because I'm going to Houston's tonight. Uh-huh. And that isn't the healthiest, healthiest healthiest it's the best yeah best food best food in the whole world absolutely but maybe not good for the cholesterol just pack that smoothie in your handbag take it in drink suck it back in there never that's your life now that is that's your life now. That isn't. That's your life. I'd rather have a heart attack and die. I said it. I'd rather have a heart attack and die than not go to Houston's. Yeah. Okay. Not go to Houston's. I'm just saying that. And you've also had a rough weekend. Yeah, we have both had health problems. My back, there's some disc issue going on. As I sit here right now,

I'm on muscle relaxants and tramadol, and I'm actually feeling sweaty and quite gross. So if I seem a bit out of it, I'm on all these drugs. Yes. So Dax is revving up this really big buggy outside right now. Sometimes I think he's pranking us because he knows we're recording, and he's like, I'm going to test this big buggy right outside the attic. Oh, God. But my point is I'm on all these drugs right's like, I'm going to test this big buggy right outside the attic. Oh, God.

But my point is, I'm like on all these drugs right now and I'm like, I'm so sweaty. It's disgusting. It's like my body is really going through it at the moment and I'm set up like this in this position. I'm so sorry. You do look really uncomfortable. Maybe we should put something.

I'm okay. I'm like, no, honestly, I'm perked up. I'm just giving you the background. So if you're like, I'm looking a bit sickly, that's why. Rob is setting you up a really nice cushioning back pad. That was really kind, Rob. Thank you. Oh, yuck.

There's gross stuff under the cushion. Oh, there's absolutely foul under there. Okay. So we're both got our shoes, but it's okay. We power on. Oh, my. We power on ding, ding, ding. He did that for that joke it was really good what was your school lunch experience like oh man take me through it okay well first

before we begin that can i ask what happened in new zealand if someone couldn't afford to bring their own lunch because there's school lunch lunch programs in the US. Do they have that? Yeah, well, no. In New Zealand, they do now. But they're not funded very well. But it's much better now than it was when I was at school. But it was a problem in New Zealand because kids would come to school without lunch.

And they'd just be hungry. And when you're hungry, you obviously don't learn as well because you're just thinking, I'm really hungry all the time. Well, also, I think also more, you don't have nutrients to feel your brain. No, and no nutrients to operate your brain. Yeah. So some kids would have really fancy lunches and you'd look at them and be like, oh, my God. And everyone would trade.

Yeah. Sometimes bullies would steal the nerds' lunches if they had really good lunches. Yeah. But this whole idea of arriving at school and the school feeding you when i was at school which was a very long time ago it was just a whole foreign concept to me and still there'll be school lunch programs but it's not like you walk into a cafeteria where you go you form a line and they're serving up food so what do they do they give you a little bag wow okay so the cafeteria is where all the shit goes down.

I mean, that is where the fights happen. That's where the gossip happens. That's where boyfriends ask girlfriends out and girlfriends ask boyfriends out and girlfriends ask girlfriends out and boyfriends ask boyfriends out. Wow. And there's cliques. There are tables. There's cool tables. There's not so cool tables what was the consistency of your table when you would sit down cool table were you on the cool table that's so

well i was a scholar athlete okay your face when you said that that sounds i don't really know what that is but it sounds really good there are are cliques and groups in high school. There's straight up popular. Then there's nerd, I guess. And there's burnout. This is all speaking very generically. No, we have to speak generically about this. There's kids who drool.

Yeah. There's the jocks. Yeah. No, no have to speak generically about this. There's kids who drool. Yeah. There. There's the jocks. Yeah. No, no, no. The jocks are mainly in the popular. Oh, they're in the popular category. Right.

But then there is a niche category. Yeah. That we called scholar athletes, which essentially. So you made this up. This is a made up thing. No, don't you kind of get what I mean? I mean, it depends on how you're trying Like elementary school cafeteria was different

Oh yeah, no, I'm talking high school Middle school, high school time when you're really coming into your own Elementary school, we can't even Yeah, you're saying it's like your class Yeah, and that's like you bring a thermos Once you're in high school, you're not bringing a thermos anymore okay what was your table where were you rob i was always in the art room doing stuff during lunch i'd bring my food in there and making podcasts work on stuff oh you

didn't sit in the cafeteria no we didn't have that option you couldn't go somewhere else for lunch you had to be in the cafeteria. Off-campus lunch ever? No, no. That would be considered skipping. Oh, because we had junior and senior year we're allowed off-campus lunch. Oh, fuck. No.

What, you go to McDonald's or something? Or Arby's. Beef and cheddar. What kind of food did you get? Was your school good or bad? Well, because I wanted to blend so badly I had a major phobia of walking around with a tray To me, that's

It's a recipe for disaster It is Someone will trip you I've seen prison movies Exactly And then everyone stares at you and laughs And you're the butt of the joke for the rest of your high school. You can't move forward from that.

Oh, once that's happened once, you're socially out. That's the end. And so I always brought my lunch for that reason. Ah. Yes. I never wanted to be the person who bought lunch. Right. Except then in my senior year, we ended up having these salads.

It was this weird. That's healthy. It's very forward thinking. They were like. Michelle Obama would approve. She would. There were these little cups with basically shredded lettuce and like those stupid shredded carrots that aren't. Stupid shredded carrots.

They're like not real carrots. Horrible. Yeah. And then ranch or whatever. And for some reason, we all got into that for a bit. But let me go back to Scholar Athlete because it is critical. Scholar Athletes were popular, but there was a crossover. We were both popular, but also in good classes.

Right. And normally, we played a sport. That's why it's athlete. Oh, so you covered the coolness and the sport and the academia exactly so it's kind of its own niche like i didn't sit with the regular popular kids but all those kids were my friends oh so you were like a beautiful intermediary between all of those sort of groups and i worked really hard of all the worlds i had to put in a lot of stressful every day it was oh my god and this is what you have the worlds. I had to put in a lot of effort. It would be stressful every day. It was stressful. Oh, my God.

And this is what you have to do if you want to blend in. You have to not buy lunch. You have to be on your toes at all times, a risk of getting tripped, metaphorically and literally. It's a war zone at school. One event can change the rest of your year so easily. It is chaotic. I mean, I was a huge nerd at school. I had braces. I had really bad glasses. I had pimples.

What age did you have braces? I had braces when I was 15, 16, 17. Oh, wow. That's late. Yeah. So it was late. Yeah. So I was one of those kids that went on Ryokutain, which was that pimple medication, which like completely wrecks your entire body. And I'll probably drop dead when I'm 50 or something. But it got rid of the pimples, which was good. I was a huge, I wasn't a librarian, I was the nerdier level up where I was called a computer monitor, and it was my job

to look after the computer rooms and make sure all the computers were running and all the kids were looked after. During lunch? Oh no, just in general. I'm just saying, oh, but a lot of lunch times I was in the computer room. Oh really? Absolutely. Yeah, because we didn't have cafeterias. So we would go after the art room or the computer room or whatever. Or climb a tree or whatever. Did everyone at the whole school have lunch at the same time? Yes. So that was a different My school was huge. Oh, so you'd stagger. We had, there was A, B, C and D lunch d lunch oh my god that was mine

there was three lunch periods yeah and they were quick we had like 20 minutes or something for lunch which is now in retrospect is not enough time it's such a different experience that we had your lunch period was shorter than your regular period i think or that doesn't really make sense does it no fuck man i forget stuff it's a long time ago let's call her because callie understands the tray issues hi hi um you're on air oh okay you're on flightless. David, say hi to Callie. Hi. And Rob. Hi, David.

Hello. Hi, Rob. Okay, so we are doing an episode on American lunchrooms. So I had to call you because you remember it well, I'm sure. One thing I need to clarify, how long was our lunch period? I think it was very short. I think it was like 20 minutes. That's what I said. Maybe they had like two lunch periods per regular period. Rob made a good point that doesn't make sense.

Since they were staggered, wouldn't it have been the same amount as a normal period? Because how would they have done this? We had lunch and then we had the longer class that had homeroom in it, study hall or something, but it definitely wasn't the length of a full class. Okay. It was definitely shorter for us in our structure, but yeah, I don't remember why. I know the memories are fading. Now, what is your biggest memory of the lunchroom? The food fights. Food fights. Food fights.

Okay. Naughty. My biggest memory involves Callie. Okay. Uh-oh. Remember when you had a contest in the lunchroom? Yes, I do. Callie eats, let's preface really fast all of a sudden you look over

the whole lunch is gone and she challenged this nice boy he was annoying he was annoying at the time but now he's a very nice adult man i think um. He said he could eat faster than Callie. So there was a whole lunch dedicated at the end of the week to them having an eating contest. And what did you have to eat again? We had to eat sub sandwiches. Sub sandwiches. And how did it go? I lost miserably. Oh my. And you blamed it on something though. Well, I don't like mayonnaise and his was covered in mayonnaise. And so I felt like he had an unfair advantage with the mayonnaise lubrication. Yeah.

So these are the types of things that go down in the American cafeteria. I just wanted to bring you in as a fellow cafeteria mate, but also, do you think it's right to classify us as scholar athletes? You? Yes. Me?

No. Yes, you were. No way. But you, yes, definitely. Okay, that's really all I need to hear. Okay, needed that little validation. Okay, good. Anytime. All right, love you. You did that little validation. Okay, good. Anytime.

All right. Love you. Thank you, Kelly. Love you. Bye. Bye. 20 minutes. Your memory was correct.

I was right. So lunch for us, we had an hour and you'd get your lunch in as quickly as you could and then go and play a game of sport. That wasn't me. I was straight to the computer room. And what did you do at the computer room during lunch? You play games? Just in like Microsoft Excel, making spreadsheets and stuff, trying to learn how to code.

And it was real nerdy stuff. Do you know how to code? I did back then. But you don't. It's all gone now. Yeah, I used to be a real super nerd back then. I was building computers from the motherboard up. What were you coding?

Coding. I was in C, C++. Websites, programs? No, just like software i thought i was going to be a computer programmer when i grew up so i was trying to get into all that stuff i was terrible at it but i really tried oh anyway for this documentary i decided to go behind the scenes of a school cafeteria and actually rob's friend hooked me up with this when we meet her in the episode oh my gosh and this is like a never been kissed situation where you pretended to be high schooler.

I thought about it. But I also thought the creepy factor would be quite bad in that. That movie has aged quite badly. That's right. So no, I just went in as me. Okay. But I will say of all the episodes I've done, I found talking to high school kids the most nerve-wracking.

I felt the most nervous. You know, we've met some sort of big, you know, baseball sort of stars and stuff on the show. And I felt more nervous talking to these kids. Oh, my God. It was like you had entered this old environment where you felt insecure. I was the nerd again. Yeah, you felt like the nerd. I had those braces. I had the pimples, I had the glasses,

and I felt it, and I felt that they saw right through. Oh. And they did. Anyway, here we go. I'm excited. It was 7 a.m. on a Monday morning, and I had somewhere to be. A town called Hammett, to be exact, population 90,000, situated in the San Jacinto Valley in Riverside County, California.

As well as being home to the international headquarters of Scientology, a secretive fortress known as the Goals Base, Hemet is also home to 23,000 school kids. And in less than five hours, they'd be eating lunch. Hi, my name is Kate Cloett. I'm assistant Director of Nutrition Services for Hemet Unified School District. After a two-hour drive and a Starbucks coffee later, I'd arrived at a sprawling warehouse with Eat Fresh Express emblazoned onto the side. Kate is in charge of getting food to 26 schools and feeding about 23,000 students. She's a registered dietitian and plans out all the menus.

But school lunches had been around far before Kate came onto the scene. Back in the 1800s, certain schools in Boston and Philadelphia provided lunches for kids thanks to volunteers and charities. But it was the arrival of a giant war that saw school lunches become official in the USA. And with it, the arrival of the cafeteria. It's been around for a very long time, but it has definitely evolved.

In about around the 1940s, that's when they had the School Nutrition Act. It was around World War II when the government was like, hey, all these really nutrition-deprived people are trying to go into the army, and they knew that they had to start feeding their kids better. And then also, they were like, hey, this is great because we can start promoting some of our domestic agriculture as well through the school food system.

And has the food gotten better over that time? Some would say that it hasn't. It's gotten a lot more strict. Michelle Obama, she's the one that really kind of reformed a lot of the nutrition standards. But I am thrilled to be here with all of you today as my husband signs the Healthy Hunger Free Kids Act into law. Back in 2010, Michelle Obama stood radiantly next to her husband as he signed the Healthy Hunger Free Kids Act. signed the Healthy Hunger Free Kids Act. Suddenly vending machine snacks and cans of coke were under federal regulation and school lunches were set to become a lot more healthy. We can all agree that in the wealthiest nation on earth all children should have the basic nutrition they need to learn and grow and to pursue their dreams because in in the end, nothing is more important

than the health and well-being of our children, nothing. And our hopes for their future should drive every single decision that we make. Decisions like making sure school cafeterias had fruit and vegetables and that whole grain bread replaced white bread. The good old days of sodium, sugar and fat were over. I mean, it was kind of the Wild West. You could pretty much serve pop or sorry, soda, fried foods. There wasn't a lot of guidance there. When those reforms came through, were kids happy about that?

Or was it like, oh, we like all this terrible junk food. We don't want to eat healthily. I think the adults like it a lot better than the kids do. And it did take a couple years for manufacturers to kind of adjust the formulas for a lot of the food that we serve in the schools to fit those nutrition standards. Everything has to be whole grain. We have to cut back on sodium, sugar. The first couple years after the standards got put into place, the food wasn't as good, but it's really gotten a lot better.

Kate and I are briefly interrupted by a colleague who needs to discuss some new cardboard trays, as well as new packages for the sandwiches. There's a lot to think about when it comes to school cafeterias. Are kids generally embracing the school lunch, or do you get some kids that, like in New Zealand, would their lunch at home and like bring it in with them to eat? Does that ever happen? People do still pack their lunch.

So we have 23,000 students and we feed about 22,000 altogether. But that includes breakfast, lunch and supper. So we serve all three of those. So we're doing about 22,000 meals a day. Kate leads me out of her office and hands me a hairnet, which I struggle with for quite a while as I've never worn a hairnet before. Then she opens a door and we walk into a giant industrial kitchen where school meals are being prepared for the week.

Our staff starts at 5am and they start making stuff at 5am to go out to all of our schools There are trays and trays of muffins in front of me And a woman's shoving a thermometer into one of them to check the temperature So just explain what I'm seeing here This is our central kitchen and not every district has a central kitchen Our district is lucky enough to have one And we can do a lot more freshly baked items. It smells good in here.

Yes, so today they are making a blueberry pancake bowl, a breakfast item, and then you can see that they're wrapping it. We make really awesome double chocolate chip muffins here. We make our own Kaiser rolls, biscuits. I find the word biscuit confusing in America. Back home, a biscuit is a cookie, like a chocolate chip cookie. Here in America it's an uninspired dry scone. And then we're

also known for our pizza. On Mondays we don't do pizzas because that's when the dough is thawing, but we do about 250 pizzas Tuesday through Friday and then they transport it to our schools fresh baked. About 30 staff work here in the kitchen in Hemet, preparing a variety of meals that will then be delivered to a variety of schools. No, it's like a full industrial kitchen going on. This thing's huge. These are big mixers where we do our muffin dough. We have these things called peanut butter pails, which are pretty much like a giant peanut butter cookie for breakfast. These are giant mixers for our

pizza dough. They hold up to, I believe, like 400 pounds of dough. And then these are big rotational ovens. So as you can see, it rotates to make sure all of our baked goods are evenly baked. Not all school districts have a kitchen this big and of course each school is fighting over funds for all this stuff, applying for grants to get the gear they need. Something I found fascinating about school lunches is that many of the American food brands have their own specific lines just for kids. They offer many of the same products, just a healthier version. Tyson is a really big one. They have a whole line of products that's just for schools. Same with like General Mills.

So a lot of those brands that you might see in the grocery store, they will have a separate school line that's formulated specifically for schools. Whether that's whole grain, reduced sodium, reduced sugar, baked, like baked Doritos. You don't really see those in the supermarket, but we serve those in school. I think of how picky kids can be and wonder how down they are with the flavor of a healthy Dorito. Doritos aren't even meant to be healthy.

Is a healthy Dorito still even a Dorito? What's a common complaint you might get? Well, the kids, they always want more of like the snack items they want takis and what takis what's a taki taki they're like the little rolled chips yeah they're a type of chip that kids love we do try to make some of their favorites more healthy like our pizza for example they love it but it's made with whole grain crust we make our own pizza sauce we even grate our own cheese. It's low-fat mozzarella.

So we try to just make it healthier. Same with like chicken nuggets. We still serve those, but it's just whole grain breading and not fried. With all this talk of health, I'm surprised when I pass a giant rack of corn dogs. Hundreds of them. What is this? Disneyland? That one I believe is a chicken hot dog inside.

We try to pick items that are a little bit healthier. Like, we use hot dogs. They're all beef, no nitrates. Kate leads me through another door, and we're in a sprawling warehouse space filled to the roof with boxes and cartons and packages. We're in the pantry. What have we got here?

These are some chocolate chips. So one of our most popular items on the breakfast menu is our double chocolate chip muffin, which sounds unhealthy, but we put banana puree in it. We put applesauce. And again, it has no preservatives. It's made with whole grain flour. Do you put pineapple on your pizza or no?

We don't, but we usually have that like on our salad bars. I see giant crates of Cheez-Its. I don't know much about America, but I know Cheez-Its aren't the epitome of health. This is whole grain, so it's specially formulated for schools. There's even cinnamon toast crunch back here. This is specially formulated for schools. It's reduced sugar and whole grain. As we emerge out the other side and into the sunlight, I wonder why they don't serve the kids' version of all these American products to the rest of America. There'd probably be less heart attacks.

But look, lunch is drawing near, and we have a high school cafeteria to get to. We jump in Kate's car. This little pocket of Californiaifornia used to be really big retirement community and so now it's just kind of a mix you can see we have lots of different trailer parks so as far as our population goes we do have a a high low income status in Hemet and as far as our ethnicity of the community goes we're about I believe 40 percent Hispanic. So we are going to be going to West Valley there's about 2,000 students there. So this is a high school? Yes so grades 9 through 12. And what age is that? 9 through 12. And what age is that? So roughly 14, 15 through 18. In New Zealand we call this secondary school. Where we don't have grades, we have years. So it'd be year 9 through 13 for us.

As we pull into the parking lot, my brain is replaying what I know of high school cafeterias, all learned from watching American TV. Who says that school cafeteria food can't be healthy, delicious and gourmet? Today we're going to be making the students my tasty baked ziti with basil and fresh mozzarella. South Park's up there with Chef. Then there's Napoleon Dynamite. I see you're drinking 1%. Is that because you think you're fat? And Mean Girls, which taught us about the various cliques found in the American school system. You got everybody there. You got your freshmen, rotzy guys, preps, JV jocks, Asian nerds, cool Asians, varsity jocks, unfriendly black hotties, girls who eat their feelings, girls who don't eat anything.

Now I'm finally here. The real thing. A real American high school with a real American high school name. West Valley. Wow. Walking down the hallway. It's just before lunch, so it's quiet. And already it feels like a TV show. There's the lockers, the posters for class president, and all the social clubs you can join. And there it is, in front of me, Radiant, the high school cafeteria. Are you getting flashbacks, Monica, so far? I'm so nostalgic right now. You got very nervous when she raised the cardboard tray that they were trying out in their school. Of course.

Because that could buckle. Exactly. Couldn't it? Social suicide. Exactly. Couldn't it? It could. Social suicide. Exactly. Even though I'm for sustainability. Yeah, but is it going to like, is it going to ruin your... But is it going to kill some kids?

I know. It might. Yeah. Might lose some kids to that. I was blown away by the size of the kitchen. They were making 22,000 meals a day. It was crazy. Wow.

Giant. Giant thing to feed all these little bellies. meals a day. It was crazy. Giant, giant thing to feed all these little bellies. Who knew when I started talking today about my cholesterol that it would tie in to this whole episode? Yeah. I think you need to be eating some of these school-made branded things where it's like the same thing, but just a bit more healthy. Healthier. I agree with you that I really don't understand why they wouldn't sell this stuff or just make all the food like that. Totally.

I guess it's two markets. They can just have both markets cornered. But what's funny is they know one thing is healthy or healthier. Totally. And they know the other isn't and they're choosing to still put out the unhealthy stuff. It's so fascinating.

Did you find out how much is Hamet the norm across the country? Like, is that how most school districts are set up? Or is it California? Some are, some aren't. I can't be more specific. They're all competing so heavily for funding. Desperately trying to, like, keep their meals good so they get more money next year. But yeah, there are definitely other giant kitchens like this across the United States.

But definitely not all schools have a system that's that epic. I must have been living under, I mean, I was so naive, but I thought each cafeteria made its own food. I thought there was a kitchen in every school. I assume so as well, and it'll be out there doing their thing. And some schools would, like some schools would do that. But this is serving, I think she said in the end 27 schools. Or they're just

heating it up. Because there was a kitchen at our cafeteria, but they probably weren't preparing it at all. Yeah, there's a background area where they can keep it warm and stuff and bring it out. Yeah, I guess I just thought they were cooking it all back there. Which is so stupid. She sent me through some stats.

She said for every meal they serve, they get $4.92 reimbursement. That's from federal and state taxes. 48% of that goes towards labor, 47% towards food supply and costs, and the remaining 5% goes to the building utility. So essentially, for food and packaging, we need to make a complete meal. That's entree, fruit and vegetables, plus milk, plus packaging for $2.32. So they're under the gun to make these meals for kids with not very much, which is kind of miraculous what they come out with.

It is. And they're trying to keep it healthy. This is hard. Yeah, it's a balance. And she did say the richer schools do opt out of this program entirely if parents are going to pay more for fees then some schools they will have their own system outside of the guidelines serving whatever they want oh really but that costs a lot more money yeah

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depending on the model. Helix is offering 20% off all mattress orders and two free pillows for our listeners. Just go to helixsleep.com slash bird. This is their best offer yet, and it won't last long. With Helix, better sleep starts now. So yeah, let's enter the school cafeteria. Okay. So yeah, let's enter the school cafeteria. Okay. We've got to get ready fast because once the doors open, we get 400 kids through all at once. I'm talking to Debbie, official job title NSA2, Nutrition Service Assistant 2, like the assistant manager.

She's been at this high school cafeteria from 6am. They've done breakfast already and it's about to be lunch. In New Zealand, it well known that high school students, these are high school students is that the right term, very smelly. They're not wearing deodorant it's the smell. What's the smell like when they all come through those doors? Honestly I think it's the opposite. I get a lot of cologne. When masks came off I was like oh wow that's strong. And what are you serving up today? What's on the menu? Today we have chicken nuggets and we have a penne pasta with meat sauce. Sounds delicious. Do you serve any sauce with your nugs? We have, yes, we have ketchup, ranch, barbecue sauce.

Sweet and sour? No, sorry. That's an improvement maybe for next time. On the wall, there's a painting of a Mustang The school mascot And framed sports singlets hang on the wall too Then there's a line of serving trays Manned by three staff members ready to dish up the goods It all feels like a Hollywood set to me

But I have to remember this isn't a TV show It's real life And then just like that The doors explode with smelly high school students. They grab their entree, chicken nuggets, before dividing into two lines to get their fruit and veggies. Today it's free chip day, hot Cheetos, which helps get them in the door. I position myself next to Leslie, who's at the end of the lunch line. My job is to watch the kids coming through and putting their lunch numbers in, make sure they have their whole meal. They have to have the main entree, fruits and vegetables and everything to

make it a meal. You're really making sure they've got the right stuff. Uh-huh. And not taking extras or anything. Yeah. Do kids ever try and like slip some extra chips into a hoodie? Every time. Every time. You've got like eagle eyes down here. Oh yeah, we have to watch the line, we have to watch the computer. Yeah, we have to really watch everything. Yep. Thank you, love. Leslie is watching like a hawk, watching for thieves and also listening for any foul language. Oh, watch the mouth.

Zachary. Oh my goodness. Yep, you're welcome, hon. You get to know the kids as well right uh-huh and i work at other schools so i get to watch them grow up and come here yeah i've been here 29 years so i get to watch them come from the elementary school all the way up to here because i work at one of the elementary schools that a lot of them went to thank you love yep that's pretty special oh yeah it is i Hi, sweetheart. How are you today? You don't want a juice today?

All right, love. This lunch line is moving fast. And it's at this point I noticed that there's no indoor seating here. This is the first departure from the movies for me. Apparently, because we're in California and it's mostly always sunny, the kids eat outside, just like kids do in New Zealand. I say goodbye to the school cafeteria staff. I saw one trying to sneak some chips into like a pocket, but they got called out. Yes, we will do that.

We will call them out. And head out to meet some American high school students. And today we are trying out for Spirit Commissioners. We got a little game for you guys. Musical chairs. So we need 11 people to come down and fill up these chairs. This American high school appears to be much louder than the New Zealand high school. There's a bunch of students DJing for one thing. That doesn't happen in New Zealand.

And a rowdy game of musical chairs is going down. I notice the kids are wearing the sorts of clothes I was wearing in the 90s. Things are very baggy and there are a lot of hoodies. I see a goth kid which makes me very happy as I thought all the Goths had gone. I head over to a table where every kid is huddled around a Nintendo Switch. I like it here it's pretty cool yeah I'm actually the president of the gamers club and it's pretty cool that's why we were playing this match right now explains why literally all of you have a switch pretty much This is like the gamer table Honestly, it's pretty cool. I head to another table which has zero switches these kids aren't gamers

I'm not sure what they are, but they seem nice. What's the quality of the food like? Yeah, I mean, it's okay What have you got today? Take me through this. I got a PBJ sandwich They are. But they seem nice. What's the quality of the food like here? I mean, it's okay. What have you got today? Take me through this. I got a little PB&J sandwich, Cheez-Its, chocolate milk, and apple juice. The girl next to me appears to be ignoring her lunch entirely. I've got an entire tray of chicken nugs in front of you, and they don't look eaten. Is there a problem? You want to try one?

All I've wanted is a chicken nug all day. Do you mind? I take a nugget, dip it hesitantly in some sauce, and take a bite. We nibble. It's no McDonald's nugget, but it's better than nothing. It's OK. It's all right.

It's OK. What's wrong? Those taste fake. Those taste fake. Every lunch, the food is so terrible. Thank you, what's her name? Michelle Obama or something like that. Michelle Obama.

Thank you, Michelle Obama. Thank you so much. I guess Michelle Obama really did make an impact with that Healthy Hunger-Free Kids Act. Since then, about 75% of schools in the US have signed up for the National School Lunch Program. Some private, richer schools don't opt in, so they can serve whatever they want. No health guidelines for them, but also no government funding for their food. Thank you for the random slabs of meat, they're really hidden. It's funny, because as the kids insult the food, Kate is standing with me.

They have no idea she's in charge of all this. I feel kind of bad. I mean, of course the kids aren't going to shower compliments on their high school lunch, they probably want McDonald's. Most of them anyway. Are you enjoying it? I do, I am enjoying it, actually. It is pretty good. I'd come to talk lunch, but I found myself wondering what these kids thought of the high school experience here in the US of A. What's high school like in America?

I mean, I like it, but there's a lot of, like, procedures. Kind of like, we have metal detectors when we walk in. We have occasional lockdown drills, because there's a lot of stuff that goes on in America high schools. It could probably be better, but I think anything could be better. There's always room for improvement. But yeah, I don't know. I'm honestly just like vibing. I'm living my best life. I don't know. I try to see the up because seeing the downs is not always a good idea for me because I know I can get into like a loop of very bad thoughts.

So first off, we're going to start with the teachers. The teachers, they're, hey, hey, the teachers, they're crazy. All of these tables around me have a very different vibe. This one in particular is full of born performers. They're gangbangers, bro. I'll tell you, everywhere I go, there's a gangbanger, bro. I can't do nothing. Oh, no, I'm joking, I'm joking, I'm joking, I'm joking, I'm joking, I'm joking.

The chicken nuggets forgotten as they talk to this old man from New Zealand. You know, everywhere I go, there's these good-looking females everywhere I go. So I try to holler. I get rejected every time. But it is, hey, it is what it is. Is this guy your friend? I mean, I know him. As we talked about the high school experience,

I wondered what they thought of America, this country they were here readying themselves for, readying themselves to go out and work and make change and do whatever they end up doing. It's kind of troubled. But at the same time, I'm excited for life in general, just to be positive. I think half of us are doing okay, but half of the kids here don't want to do anything. Therefore I'm worried about half of this future for us.

I made this observation a couple of days ago. I was talking with my dad. The kids who actually want to try are placed into college classes, but they're not really prepared for the college level, for the work that it entails. And the kids that don't want to try are just put into normal classes where they can just fail, and it wouldn't really matter. And I found it very unfair that I wanted to try, but I wasn't prepared. I'm a little bit skeptical. In this economy, I can barely hold my own house if I wanted to.

So I don't know. I'm skeptical about the future of America. It's definitely not amazing, but it's not bad. So it's just kind of like hanging out and see what happens. It's all you can do. Yeah, basically, yeah. I look out from my tray of borrowed chicken nugs. They are growing on me.

And I see a student carrying a pink sign that I recognized from the corridor when I walked in. Maddie for president. I guess this is Maddie. So you're campaigning for president? I assume you're Maddie? Sophomore class president. What are you campaigning on? What are your policies? My goal is just to make next year really fun and memorable for everyone because I know this year there was a fire here in town, so a lot of things got cancelled and pushed back. So I want next year really fun and memorable for everyone because I know this year there was a fire here in town so a lot of things got cancelled and pushed back. So I want next year to be really fun for everyone and include everyone.

If they have an opinion, then I can speak to the actual ASB president about it and maybe get it approved. And who's your big competition so far in the race? Definitely Angie or Jalissa. Good luck with the campaign. I hope you sweep in with a victory. With lunchtime about to wrap, a few other kids have gathered around the microphone.

And I figure this is the time to raise the question that's been on my mind this entire time. A question about the modern high school experience here in America. My only reference to American high school recently has been the HBO show Euphoria. How similar is the experience to Euphoria? Not at all.

Not even close. That inaccurate. No, it's so inaccurate. It's so bad. That's so funny. Probably depends on who you're asking. For me, it's not accurate at all. But I know there's some friends who smoke and stuff or some friends who drink, yeah.

And I also know there's other some friends who like smoke and stuff or like some friends who drink, yeah. And I also know that there's other people who've definitely screwed around with other people, but I wouldn't say it's like euphoria. I have never experienced anything like this show. And I don't think that's like the actual high school experience. I'm sorry.

I do think that there is a lot of drug issues in school, but it's not to that level. Not to that extent, in my opinion. I've seen people do drugs in class. I just haven't seen people do cocaine. I was kind of relieved that these kids weren't living the full euphoria life. Indeed, it was the opposite. The teenagers of America, not that different to the teenagers of New Zealand. Some kids I talked to even packed their own lunch to bring in,

kindly stockpiling the school-supplied snacks for their friends later that day. You've got so many apples. You've got about 10 apples here. What's going on? Yeah, I always ask my friends for apples because I like to give my apples to some of my friends in chemistry because they're always hungry by then, and also just because I like the apples. With an attitude like that, I figure the future of America is in pretty good hands. And as I drove away from Hemet, I thought back to all the apples my mum Pam had packed into my high school lunch back in New Zealand. With no high school cafeteria, it was all on her.

And it dawned on me how many school lunches my mum had made for me over the years. Hundreds of them, maybe thousands of them. So I decided to call her. Face-timing, my dad picked up, trying to put the call on speaker. Technology figured out, he got mum. Now, I have a question. I'm making a podcast episode at the moment about high school cafeterias in America. But then it occurred to me, of course, in New Zealand, certainly when I went to school, we didn't have that. And I was mainly fed thanks to years and years and years of my poor mother having to make my lunch for me. I know. I just, I've never really talked to you about that.

And first I wanted to say thank you, which I don't think I've ever really said, because it's sort of dawning on to me on what a massive task that was. I know, and it's so good when it finishes. But it's just something that you had to do it was often hard to know for a bit of variety what to put in your jolly sandwiches i remember peanut butter and jam was a good one yeah peanut butter and jam ham ham i might do some maths and calculate how many years I was at school and how many meals you would have made me. You could calculate it from five years to 17, something like that, 17 years. No, it was just something that all families did, David. Yeah.

Well, I just wanted to say thank you for doing it. I've never given that another thought. Okay. Okay, said my mum, who for over a decade served as a one-person high school cafeteria for me and my brother. Okay is a classic line from Pam when trying to wrap up a conversation, sick of talking to me,

sick of me rambling on. It's a bit of a Kiwi thing, I think, the okay, and I react accordingly. No, thanks, I know that you're very good, but thanks for that. accordingly. No, thanks, Mom. No, you were very good. Thanks for that. Okay. Okay. There it was again.

Okay. I get it, Mom. I'm going. I'm hanging up. I'm hanging up on her, and I'm hanging up on this audio documentary. Okay? School lunches. Oh, that was really, really, really fun.

Aren't the kids pure? Oh, I love the kids. that was really really really fun aren't the kids pure oh i love the kids also when you started talking to them i got sweaty i felt so cringy yeah yeah well at the way at my interactions oh no so i was struggling right you got better over time but those early ones, I felt like, why are you acting so uncomfy? Yeah, it made me nervous. I was afraid they would see me as a nerd and beat me up. Oh, my God. Like I just reverted back.

And then I was trying to be cool, but that failed, and it just got worse and worse. And I did get into it a bit more. Yeah. But I was stressed. It did feel like you became one of them because you tried to neg that girl about her apples that felt weird yeah the balance is weird because it's like a different species it's the

first time i'd clocked in ages how old i've gotten i turned 40 last year in my mind i kind of stopped at like early 20s maybe sure yeah and suddenly being around kids everywhere and there was a DJ DJing loudly and it was just so hectic. It made me feel so fucking old. That part about the DJ, we did not have music in the lunchroom. I think there was some special thing going on. It was spirit week. Oh sure, because leading up to the election. And so they had some DJs and they were, I sound like an alien describing what I saw. There's DJs and it's this musical chairs game. I think maybe the DJs were trying to be some sort of social presidents or something.

Oh, okay. To like wear like this, I don't know. Fun. Or it was a campaign promise. I'm going to bring DJs to lunch. Yeah. And speaking of, wonderful Maddie, her campaign promise of just wanting to make things more fun. Isn't that, I can get behind that.

That was so good. Like, who doesn't want to have more fun? One other piece in America, normally, your mom stops making your lunch at some point. You have to make your own lunch. You have to pack your own lunch. She's still making it. It's part of growing up. Yeah.

At some point, your mom says, if you want to take your own lunch you better pack it. With that known, my mom still made my lunch for way too long. Yeah, same. I was cared for way too much. She drew the line at one point and said, do your own. So I did. You're 25. Get your own lunch. She still makes my lunch when I go home. She still makes my sandwiches. No, same.

Yeah, the last time I was in New Zealand, I go back to visit them. And yeah, mom still makes the same sandwiches and cuts them up and serves them to me. She's still making my school lunch. I know. It's so cute. But she stopped. She said, make your own. But then I think she realized I wasn't doing it packed lunch from home, my lunch would be a meat and cheese pie, which you've had. Oh, yeah. That would be like $2.50.

A cookie time, which is a big chocolate biscuit. It's called cookie time? Cookie time. Oh, my God. I've got one mince and cheese pie. I'll have a cookie time and reprise microwave it for 30 seconds. Is that a brand, cookie time? Cookie time.

That's a brand, though? Yeah, it's a brand. Oh, it's a brand. It's a type of cookie. Oh, I wouldn't say cookie time. That's a brand, though? Yeah, it's a brand. Oh, it's a brand. It's a type of cookie. Oh, I wouldn't say cookie time. No, no. It's cookie time for David. That's what it sounds like.

No, no, it's a brand. Oh, okay. And I'd get it micro-raised for 30 seconds, and that would make the bits of chocolate a little bit melted. Sure. Yum, yum. And I would get a bottle of Coca-Cola, and that would be some days my school lunch.

That sounds delicious. What did your mom pack you? Well, she packed you ham and cheese. Yeah, ham and cheese. There'd be a sandwich, there'd be an apple, there'd be a couple of bits of fruit. Fuck, what were those snacks called? Roll-ups. Oh, fruit roll-ups. Yeah, fruit roll-ups. And another little thing, you peel it back and there'd be a cracker with some dip all in the little case. Yes. Dunkaroos. Well, that's chocolate, but they had the cheese ones, remember, and peanut butter. For me, what was packed was critical

because if you had something stinky, you're out. It's like a tray. You're done. You're like some fish. You're the kid that brings fish or some eggs, a boiled egg. Tuna. I think my mom made that mistake because I love tuna, but you're not allowed to love tuna when you're young.

It's so stinky. Disgusting. My mom didn't know that. The rules that you can only like tuna at your house when nobody's there, and she would pack me tuna sandwiches at one point, and I had to throw them away or look at it and then put it back, not open it. Not open it? Yep.

Anger. Other kids. Yeah, they would- They're going to tear you apart. Tear me apart. So then I got into Lunchables. That seemed very classic. You don't know Lunchables?

No. What are you talking about? Oh my God, Lunchables? You could do a whole episode on Lunchables, honestly. Okay. What is a talking about? Oh, my God. Lunchables? You could do a whole episode on Lunchables, honestly. Okay. What is a Lunchable? It's packaged and you have crackers, cheese, meat. There's a little compartment for the stacked cheese, a little compartment for the meat.

Is it like what you get on a Delta flight sometimes when you're flying and they bring you a cheese platter or something? You pay $10 for this. Kind of, but it's- Is it a bit like that? Less quality is not- It's a bit like that less quality is a bit dicier yes okay but they invented a lunchables pizza at one point and it was these tiny doughs like what is that like a crust but not really chewy yeah yeah this is like and then you'd have a pouch of sauce that you put on and shredded cheese and then so you make your your own pizza? I never did pepperoni.

I only did cheese because pepperoni could get... Girls weren't supposed to like pepperoni. They had the dessert ones too with chocolate icing and M&M's. Oh! Pizza? Yeah, they had pizza dessert. I don't think I had that, but I had Dunkaroos. First time I ever choked.

Come on, first time. But the Lunchables pizza, in middle school, we had a microwave. So I would microwave the Lunchables pizzas at the school. I'm surprised I even did that. That seems outside my comfort zone, but I did. Where do you get Lunchables from? Grocery store. 7-Eleven has some.

Wow, I'm fascinated by this. I've never heard of this before. I can't believe you haven't heard of it. It's huge here. I wonder if people still take Lunchables. The culture of school is so funny to me. The other thing I noticed walking around is that, of course, in America, you have lockers. And in New Zealand, at least when I went to school, there were no lockers.

Everything went in your school bag. All your books for the whole day. Everything. So you'd prep each morning, you'd take everything you need, and you would just have these little kids you'd see wandering around with just these huge backpacks. Exactly, yeah. No lockers.

That's a huge difference. That is. This whole cafeteria thing, DJs, we had vastly different experiences in our school, Monica. I know. It's really interesting. Lockers, I will say, are more romanticized in movies and TV shows. Because they're so big and kids open them and they lean on them and they're full of photos of who they've got a crush on and their books and stuff.

And people get shoved into them. You put the nerds in the lockers and you lock them in there. And I mean, I think things are regional and cultural. So it all depends. My high school was constructed a little differently than most high schools. It was kind of laid out as a college campus. So we had five buildings. And so what sucked is if your locker was in the 200 building,

you'd have a class in the 500 building, then you have to walk to the 100 building. You don't have time to stop by your locker. sounds so big like so vast it was and you had seven minute changes and so you were like rushing around and you didn't really have time to ever go to your locker so us we also just carried our whole fucking these insanely heavy books for the whole day you're just walking around with. Bad for the spine. Really bad.

It's probably why my spine is so messed up from those big buddy book bags. It is. You could sue. American suing. Jan Spohr was the cool bag of choice. We've talked about this before. Jan Spohr. That was awesome.

The other main difference that I clocked that I hadn't really thought about. In New Zealand, most schools have a uniform. So everyone looks like a student. And I think that's partly what I found so intimidating with these kids is they were all dressed cool. And that's what made me a bit nervous and like so on edge. The idea of a uniform is that all the kids are the same. So the fashionable kids, the nerdy kids, no one's going to get teased for not having the cool shoes because you're all in the same shitty uniform. Yeah. Because in New Zealand, uniforms are also really, really expensive.

So it's kind of like taking the mickey in a way. And some parents are like, we're sick of spending so much money on these shitty clothes. Right, that they can't wear otherwise. Yeah, completely, only at school. So in America, uniforms aren't really a thing they are private schools will do it catholic schools maybe schools definitely do it yeah so some schools but mostly and definitely public schools no but there was dress code the big thing i remember from my

school was girls had to have their skirts a certain length i couldn't be showing too much fingertips that was ours can't be shorter than your fingertips. People would like scrunch up their shoulders though to make it. People with like really long legs. Bodies are different. I feel like that's not a universal measurement. I agree. The other thing that I really glossed over is that hammock where I was. When I went to that Starbucks, I bumped into someone that listens to the show, and she was really lovely, but she said,

are you here for Scientology? I'm like, I'm doing a story about school lunches, and I'm going to go to high school. And she said, oh, the Gold Base is here. And I'm like, what? And the Gold Base is essentially the headquarters of Scientology. No. And it is the compound.

So here in LA, you've got the Celebrity Center and you've got that big iconic blue building. Yes. Gold Base is the one which all the mystery surrounds it. And I just lifted a few facts off the Wikipedia page. It's a heavily guarded compound. the Wikipedia page. It's a heavily guarded compound, 50 buildings surrounded by high fences topped with blades and watched around the clock by patrols, cameras, and motion detectors. Scientology leader David Miscavige, senior church officials, and up to a thousand of the church's elite Sea Org live and work on the base. It's the location of a $10 million mansion built for

Al Ron Hubbard. And that's where they have that famous thing that they talk about the hole, which is that facility where they basically put members to retrain them. Yeah. And so I drove past and it's a public road that goes past, but you drive by and suddenly you just see these big, quite like, it's almost like you're driving past a theme park. There's this thing that looks a bit like a castle. There's razor wire all along the top. Wow. And I drove into one of the big main entrances

and I looked up and there was camera, camera, camera, camera. And the security guard absolutely looked at me because he'd get used to people pulling in all the time. Locked eyes made like a look that felt like I see you. Because I was originally thinking, well, I go up and like say hello and say like, what is this? Yes. And I was like, uh-uh. And so I just drove around and like turned back.

It was too creepy. It was full noise. And it's in Hemet. And Hemet is, as you heard, it's just this sleepy, small town, a lot of trailer parks, and the headquarters of Scientology. You know what actually makes me so angry? Of course it's there. If that is a low-income area, they are preying upon vulnerable people

and saying, I can get you out of this situation. Come to Scienti- That is what they do. That's why the Celebrity Center is right there. We are always recruiting people who are trying to figure it out. Exactly. It says SAG question mark. The most vulnerable people in this city who are dying to become actors are like,

yeah, I want to be SAG. Yeah, get drawn in. Yeah, if you want to go down a real rabbit hole, Google gold base and there's just the maddest things ever. It's like, yeah, it's so funny. I thought I'm in this town doing a story about school lunches, and there is gold base sitting right there. Are they trying to recruit at the high school?

No, no recruiting. I think it's more like where all their biggest, most important members go. You look at it on Google Maps, and it's this sprawling, beautiful country club in the middle of this really poor neighborhood. You know, it's not that far out of LA, and it's probably cheap to buy,

and it's just huge and massive and epic. Wow. Anyway, I just breezed over there in the dock, and it was just so strange that it was there. Well, this was really fun. I love high school and middle school. I love school. I have such nostalgia for it.

I think we all do. It's why whenever Netflix puts out some show at a high school, it does really well because we all love watching it. And everyone can relate. Yeah, completely. Yeah. Here's to the high school lunch. Yes. Muffins Cookies

Pizzas Cookie time Chicken nugs Cookie time I'll bring So when I go back to New Zealand I'll bring you back some cookie times Oh

Wait, is it cookie times? Cookie time I'm going to bring you back multiple cookie times A cookie time cookie is the one cookie Okay So I'm going to bring you back some cookie times. Okay. Got it.

Can't wait. Bye. Bye.