Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard - Geena Davis

Episode Date: July 20, 2026

Geena Davis (The Boroughs, Thelma & Louise, A League of Their Own) is an Academy Award-winning actor and activist. Geena joins Armchair Expert to discuss growing up shy and tall in a strict New England household, reinventing herself as an exchange student in Sweden, and going from posing as a department-store mannequin to landing her first role in Tootsie. Geena and Dax talk about winning an Oscar at 32, how Susan Sarandon taught her to stop apologizing for existing on set, and discovering her athleticism while filming A League of Their Own. Geena explains how roles can transform who you are, why the precision of Olympic archery offered relief from the subjectivity of Hollywood, and why lasting cultural change begins with making unconscious bias impossible to ignore.Check Allstate first for a quote that could save you hundreds: https://www.allstate.com/See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Welcome, welcome, welcome to armchair expert. I'm Dax Shepherd. I'm joined by Monica Padman. Hi. Hello. Today we have an icon. Gina Davis. She is an Academy Award winning actor.

Thelma and Louise, a league of their own. Beetlejuice, long kiss, good night, the fly. Legends. Sometimes we get legends in here. It's pretty cool. Oh, I loved her. Please enjoy Gina Davis. He's an armchair expert.

I was looking for the seatbelt. Oh, you were? Interesting. You were, because you think this is going to be a wild ride? I've been flying a lot lately. Okay. That was it? I don't know. It's just muscle memory.

That's really sweet. You really did just go for your seatbelt. Yeah. Who knows what's going to happen? How long have you been in Studio City? Only less than a year. I'm just renting. Just live in the Palisades.

Moved before all of that. unfortunately that house went and then I rented a place in Venice for two years then I gave up the lease on that because I had to go to New Mexico New Mexico to shoot a series and then just as I was going to come back I thought it would be so easy to find it the fires happened right when I was coming back and so everyone was renting up everything so everything was gone I ended up in a guest house in the backyard of some nice Armenian people in Glendale. Wait, hold on. You were in someone's guest house?

Guesthouse. And were they aware that Gina Davis was their tenant? Well, it was funny. My assistant booked it in her name. And then I came to meet them and she said, it's actually her. And I said, by the way, maybe don't talk about that I'm living here. Don't tell the neighbors. Yeah, yeah.

Just don't bring it up. And they said, why? What do you mean? They were like, bring what up? Bring what up? Are they first, are they new to the country? They had accents. So they might have moved here.

Okay. They weren't totally dialed into American pop culture. No, but here's the best part. So I asked not to talk about me. And they said, oh, oh, oh, you know who also lives in this neighborhood? The guy who's the fifth billing on Brooklyn 9-9 lives. And then that one lives over here. And I'm like, so I was just talking about, okay.

I'm doing exactly what you just did. I pray maybe you don't do. Yeah. Yeah. So that, that's what I don't want you to do. There's kind of a sweet naiveness to it, though. Like, perhaps in his mind he was like, good news. There's more of you on this block.

You could get together and have coffee and talk about whatever you guys talk about. People probably want to get together. Yeah. Talk about art and stuff. It's a very classy block. There's a lot of celebrities. Oh, it was. How long were you there?

About eight months. Eight months. Okay, so certainly I know you do Massachusetts, New York. Sweden. Where did you spend the bulk of your time? What cities? Were you in L.A. a lot? I moved here in 83 and I've been here ever since. Oh, you weren't in New York for any of that? No. Right after college, I went to New York because my whole class was going to New York. I studied acting. Yes. And they all wanted to do plays. I knew I wanted to do movies and TV, but nobody told me, well, you know, you should actually go to L.A. instead. So I went to New York and I was, how am I supposed to get in a movie?

movie. Yeah, yeah. They don't make a ton there. And then I did. Your town in Massachusetts that you grew up in is 300 and, I did the math yesterday. It's like 312 years old. Yes. That's impossible to be in America and a town that's 300 plus years old. Right. And I was in, they had a parade for the sesquicentennial, which was 250th anniversary, which the country is having back in the 80s. I was the parade marshal my parents that i dressed in costumes from the era my dad grew out mutton chops filgrimy stuff yeah yeah how close were you to plymouth rock 20 minutes 20 minutes wow that's so cool okay it's also wear wear wear ham it's also the gateway to cape cod right i just asked someone this the other day who grew up in a tourist town but when i think of certainly it would

swell in the summer, right? The amount of people that were in your town? Or did they just pass through? They passed through because it wasn't on the Cape. It's right before the Cape, but you must pass through it to get to the cave. Then this wouldn't apply. I'm like, every time I was somewhere for duration, like go to Northern Michigan in the summer, I would fall in love with the girl there and then I'd have to return home. And then I just imagine did that girl fall in love every year with someone that was out of town? Like that seems ripe for a lot of long-distance relations. Oh, sure. Well, I never had a boyfriend until I left down. You didn't have one all through high school?

No. That would shock people. But I've read enough about you that I know why it's not shocking. 348 years, that's what it was. 1678 that was settled in. Isn't that crazy? Wow. Yeah, 348. It's nuts. So your mother was a teacher's assistant?

Sometimes. Did she have a college education? No. She was born in 1990, I think. Yes, that's right. Wow. Incredible, really, now. My kids make fun of us.

They say, you guys are from the 1900s. And I'm like, oh, wow, that is true. And that sounds really funny. I'm sure to them in particular. Back in the 1900s. But what kind of mom was mom? Fabulous mom. She grew all of our produce.

She had an acre-sized yard. She grew so much that she would sometimes sell to the local little store, strawberries and stuff to them. Did she can? Canned. Oh, my God. Yeah. Both my parents grew up rather.

They're poor in Vermont. And so every piece of foil got saved. I'm not sure they bought a second roll, actually. Yeah. Just used what we had. They were very, very careful about everything. Well, it would have been little kids in the Great Depression, right? Yeah.

Yeah, that'll sear into your consciousness. Absolutely. And dad was a civil engineer? With the Corps of Engineers. Oh, like the Army Corps. Yes, yes. His unit was in charge of maintaining the canal, surveying it and maintaining it. And then he got assigned to go all up and down the coast, the East Coast, to survey waterways and things.

And you were what kind of kid? You were shy? I was very shy. And it seemed like every time I wasn't and burst out of my shell, somebody would say, oh, no, no, no, no, go back. That's to your shell. That's too much. Yeah, you had a little gap in your paper route, right? And then this little gap on your bike, whether or no one watching you would just let it rip and sing at the top of your lungs, but you'd get busted.

There was my house and a few other houses. It was a long hill where there weren't houses. And there was a creek that went there. And first of all, I was very superstitious at the time. So I had to find sticks on the ground in the shape of a Y, which meant, yes, you can keep going. Oh. And if I found one in a shape of a V, that meant very good to keep going. Oh, you made it very good.

Right, right. Well, what if you didn't find any sticks? You just stood there? Well, look around, you know. You find what you're looking for, don't you? That's true. manifest. The people up the hill, you know, most of them were older, and they wanted their paper.

And they'd come out and say, where is she? And they'd look down the hill. And then they'd call my mother and say, I think something's wrong with your daughter. She's added a gap. She's wandering around and not bringing the papers. She's staring at the ground. We might call that a little OCD tendency now. Yes.

And I'm so not superstitious now whatsoever. But I think I was worried about things. And that was a way to feel better. And you were very self-conscious about being tall. Mm-hmm. That was the tallest kid in class. Period. Throughout, yeah, from minute one.

Okay, so let's get into the compulsive behavior because I had a ton of it. I had a bunch of ticks. I had so many ticks. And then I did so many things to prevent bad luck, right? Like, I had to do every single thing twice. I had all these bizarre rituals. I had to take the toilet paper and leave the bathroom and touch the wall, then come back in, but I had to do that twice.

I was afraid someone would see. Wait, what about a toilet paper? Did you say? For whatever reason, at some point at eight years old while going to the bathroom, I was like, if I don't take the toilet paper and string it out all the way to the hallway and touch the wall, then come back in. But I have to do that twice or it's bad luck. Then go again, pray nobody in my house sees me because I know it's madness.

Yeah. And I just had a million things I was so busy with. Did you have any of that kind of stuff? Well, what I was very busy with was monsters in the house. And then I'll talk about the outside monsters. But there weren't just monsters in the closet or under the bed, which, of course, I had. Those are standards. To be expected.

Right. The worst one was, it could read your mind. And so when I was in bed, I had to think that I was somewhere else so that it would go there to look for me. Oh, wow. And get me. So I'd be thinking, here I am in the kitchen, here I'm in the kitchen. And I'm having crackers. It would get exhausting.

And I said, I hope it doesn't realize I'm actually in bed. I got to get up and spring out of bed and then I say yes I am in the bed I'm in the bed I'm in the bed of Oh my gosh. So you were trying to teleport your consciousness to deceive the monster. And what's great is the monster is so skilled that can read your mind but it can also be tricked very easily. Right. Yeah. That's the logic of a young person.

And it can't see clearly. Clearly. Or it would just observe you. Right. I didn't ever really think about that. Oh, none of these things make sense if you try to unravel. Like the whole evenness thing. Did you have that at all?

Evenness. Like you scuff your left heel walking to school. And then you just become neurotically obsessed with like, well, I have to make it a scuff on this side or it's in balance. I didn't have that kind of thing. You didn't have any of the balancing. Or I have to touch things. I didn't have that. No touching.

Yeah. Did you have a visual of the monster? Like, did you know what it looked like? That one was invisible. And the other ones were corporeal, but I didn't think too much about how they actually looked, but that they would have grabby hands. But there was one. They were very grabby. They're handsy.

They want to pinch you and grab your ankles. I had to vault into the bed from very far away. Of course. Yes. But there was one outside that was an enormous colossus giant. And if you could see the horizon, it was just below that. And if I did something wrong, it would take one step toward me. And so I would look at the horizon waiting to see the top of its head.

Is your current explanation of all this? Mine is easy. I had a stepdad that arrived in my life. He was an addict and he was violent. And then all these things took off, right? All these OCD type things. With someone is like, oh yeah, when your environment's very uncontrolled, you try to control things. Great. That makes sense. Right. Do you have an explanation? Is yours genetic or was there something nurture going on that you had a hunch? I think there was kind of something about that you have to be perfect. Dad was a deacon as well as a civil engineer? Yeah, I mean, they were very involved with the church. He and I also sang in the church choir. You played the organ for the young people's service. So there was this huge fear that you would be not good.

Yes. I hate that. Don't you fucking hate that? Yeah. Like, I got in a debate with my mother-in-law. I'm like, look, I get it. You want to introduce the kids to your religion. That is your right.

I wish you well. I do ask you to not introduce this concept of hell and sin. to these little brains. I don't think that's a healthy concept. No, exactly. But it was even more than religion. It was sort of a maybe a New England-y kind of thing where you had to help, help, help everybody ever could, but take nothing. It was to the extreme where if somebody was handing me something, but here, would you like to have some ice cream or a glass of water? No, thank you. No, thank you. You said you'd be at a girlfriend's house and you'd like smell the chicken and garlic cooking and he wanted it.

She invited you to eat and you said no. I said no. And then thankfully her mom knew about my mom. She called and said, Lucille, Gina's having dinner with us. No, she is. Yeah. She took charge. Oh, no, no, no. You can't say yes because it's too much trouble for them.

You don't want to be a burden. Yeah. Politeness. Where do you think that came from in them? I don't know. But they definitely both had this thing where you had to be the politest person. Not only polite, but just incredibly self-saccharacter. if I say perfect way to be with absolutely no needs, but I'm going to give you everything.

Self-sufficient and very generous. Yeah. That's tough. Yeah, how did that play out with like friendships? Did people think you were over the top with that? Or was it standard enough ethos in that area? You know, my only close friend was Lucian who lived across the street and who I saw and played with every day. But for some reason, the other kids, I was friendly with everyone.

everybody in school, but I didn't get invited to people's houses, which was weird. There was one time when I was already driving, I already had my license, and the cool boy from class called and said, hey, a few people are gathering in my house. Would you like to come? And I was, oh, hold on. It's finally happening. It's finally happening. I'm a junior in high school.

Hold on. And I went and followed my dad. I said, can I take the car? why? Well, I meant I invited to go over to Friends House, and he said, but it's nine o'clock. I said, that's okay. And he said, nobody goes out at nine o'clock. No, it's too late.

No. But what if I left at seven? I'd still stay there until 11. So what difference? It was like, no, no. And I had to go back and say, no. I'm sorry. I can't come.

And then never got to ask. No. That was my one chance. That's awful. Yeah. So did you resent? them? Your parents. I probably didn't really grasp it as well as I do now. What was going on. I mean, I resented the hell out of not being able to live your life. Yeah. I know you went and studied in

Sweden for a year in high school. Is it because you knew everyone was so tall there? Do you think that was in the mix? No, but that was interesting. I didn't know that. I found it out. Yeah, you got there and you were completely normal, right? I was completely normal. My high school started this foreign exchange program when I was a junior. And the second I heard about it, I want to go. And I think it was that I somehow knew I could reinvent myself. They wouldn't know I was a geeky kid who didn't have a boyfriend. And that's how it turned out. They kept saying, you must have been so popular. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Had you taken any Swedish prior to? No, I don't know what the plan was or how this ever happened, but I got to Sweden without knowing how to speak one word of it. And I started

high school two days later. Oh, my God. Really? I show up at the school and they say, someone's going to help you to your classes today. And I'm in the first class and I'm like, hang on, it's in Swedish. Yeah. How is this supposed to work? Yeah. How are you going to learn anything? I went up to the teacher afterwards. And of course, they all do know how to speak English. I said, do you know what I'm supposed to do? She said, I don't know. I've been thinking about it because I can't teach the class in English. So I started, I'd ask somebody what was the homework?

And I'd take the book home and I'd look up every single word in the dictionary. So I would translate the entire homework. But I learned it fast. That's how the Scientologist learned. They call that like clearing words. Really? Yeah, you have to read everything with a dictionary next to you. And then they believe that the basis of all misunderstanding is that people misunderstand a word and then continue on and they build all this stuff on top of a misunderstanding.

So you're obligated. Wow. I've worked with a lot of scientists. And I've watched someone doing the clearing words thing. And I was like, what's going on here? Wow. Yeah. So you could have invented your own religion and you just missed the opportunity.

What was the family like that you were living with? They were conservative, I would say. They were pretty strict. There's a bummer. You left one constricting environment for another. You needed to go to the Scarsguard family. Oh, exactly. Right? Yes.

They're like naked walking around. Yeah, Alexandria said they were always naked and having wine. Oh, yeah, yeah. Well, the older girl, their daughter, had a boyfriend who slept over. Yeah, that was standard, right? Absolutely. And I was like, what? I'm sure they felt very responsible for me.

But, unless you did fall in love there. I did. What was the name, Mats? Mots. Yes. Mots. We went on a school trip to Amsterdam. Oh.

And I hadn't even really noticed him before. in my class, but we started hanging out. And he was gorgeous and blonde. How tall was he? taller than me. So that was like unbelievable. And his family adopted me. They were like, just come here. And they weren't strict. No. And they drank wine at dinner. And I was like, oh, my God. Wow. This is crazy. And then the dad had to go on a business trip one time. They said, would you like to come with us? Oh my God. Yes. And the people said yes. And they got a room for Mats and I. Oh. Wow.

What a blessing. And you were like 18? What world have I lived in? 17, right? Oh my God. You maintained a pen pal relationship? Yes, and my parents actually invited him to come visit us in the summer after I came home. And he came for like a week.

Had the magic fizzled out between? No, no, no. So summer was nice. Yeah, it was. Did you take him to Martha's Vineyard? No, but we took him camping in Vermont in our homemade camper. How did that end? They're hard.

Long distance back then was like a. dollar a minute, right? It's really hard. So when you first got out of high school, you wanted to go to University of Boston. That didn't work out for one reason or another? I wasn't home in order to audition. You had audition to get in the acting program. So I went to a college, New England College, which you didn't have to audition to become

an acting major for the first year. And as soon as I could, I auditioned to go to BU. And did you like it there? I did. You got an F in body movement? In movement class, which is sort of dance. But yes, because. Because there were these assignments like you and your partner create a scene with three hits and a fall or something like that.

Okay. And all the stuff that I came up with was so ridiculous that she would say very amusing, but again, not the assignment. Did you start gaining confidence in college? When does the transition from like, I'm an awkward duck to, I know by the time we get to New York, we're ready to try modeling. So something has happened between those two. Right. It was college. Yeah, it was because now, oh, I'm in charge of myself, be however I want to be.

I actually became sort of goth, a lot of eyeliner, and I pierced my own ears. You were rebelling. It was your time to rebel. Oh, that's my time to rebel. Yeah. Okay, so when you get to New York, you start modeling. And did that require like your first time doing it? That's a big leap of confidence.

You've kind of got to just, I think, fake it to you make it maybe. I mean, does anyone feel like a sexy runway model? I don't know. Maybe like five or six of them and those are our supermodels. But it's an awkward endeavor initially, no? It very much felt like I was faking everything. In fact, I guess because I was taller than most models, I would get a lot of bathing suit and underwear and panty clothes, those kind of jobs.

And I was actually in Victoria's Secret one time. So I'm shooting all these photos. in underwear, you know, very revealing. And then I go back to the dressing room to go home and put on my full, big grandma. Big grandma underpants. And I told myself, I just have figured out how to stand. That was all a trick, tricking them into thinking I'm attractive. I don't want to be too dramatic, but do you think you were able to disassociate? Yeah. Like, okay, we're going to walk out, we're going to act like we're a sex symbol. Right. Yeah. We know we're not. So we're just going to vacation Well, that's happening.

Exactly. I'm just going to pretend I'm all that. One story before we get to Tutsi. You were also working at Ann Taylor. Yeah. Go ahead, Mom. No, it's just a great story. So imagine she's there in the 70s.

I mean, I have to imagine this is Apex Window Display era of department stores, yeah? Right. So you were working there and what happened? I was a sales girl at Ann Taylor. We would dress like Ann Taylor style. I was always made up. up and dressed up. Except for the undergarments, which were enormous underneath.

Except for my giant paintings. And one time, the window display was a cafe table and two models were sitting at chairs. And there was like, mannequin models. Manichens. And there was fake food and all that. But there was one empty chair. And I kept looking at the window. Then I said to one of my coworkers, dare me go in the window?

And she was like, yeah, do it. I had no idea what I was going to do. But I went and got in the chair and people were walking by. that time and I were like, hmm, what she's doing? And I got in the chair and I just, Oh, yeah. And froze. Wow. And they're like, oh. And then they keep watching to find out what's going to happen. And then other people stopped and said, what are you looking at? But they had missed you arriving. And they said, just wait. Because they're like, she's got to move at some point. So I started moving, you know, like a robot occasionally. And they'd go, whoa. And then more

people come and say, what are you all looking at? Just what? Oh, my God. You created like a whole scene. I created a whole thing. At some point, the manager of the store came over and said, Gina, what are you doing? Get out of the window. And then she looked and saw this giant crowd outside and said, well, stay there.

Oh, wow. They started hiring me every Saturday. No. For like five hours or six. She had five hours shifts of sitting still. A little break every hour. I'd take like a five-year break. Wow.

It's like an art installation. But I think. Even sitting dead still for 15 minutes would be far more growing than people would expect. Is it not hard? I learned. I had no idea that I had this talent, but I learned that I had a tremendous skill at being motionless and that I could go a very long time without blinking. Because they're also waiting for me to blink. Oh, they're on it.

Yeah. You know, I could go like at least five minutes or more without blinking. Then I blink and they go, oh. Did you ever consider rubbing a thin, like. layer of vaseline over your eyes. Without a hell? So that they wouldn't need moisturizing.

Like maybe you could convince your eyes that they could stay open permanently. Well, that's why you're blinking to moisturize your eyes. I know, but no one wants to put Vaseline on. Of course not, but if you're committed to your craft. You can't be sure that would work. No, you'd have to try it. Then your eyes are covered.

You'd probably fall down getting in because it'd be blurry. I should have tried. But you know what? People would be looking, looking at me. And one time somebody said, ah, it's not a man. It has hair on its arms. And so I was like, okay. And I went home.

hear them perfectly through the glass. Isn't that fascinating? I would love to hear people talking about me. I don't think I can hear. It was so funny. So from then on, I shaved my arms and I got a wig that looked like the other mannequin's wig. Wow.

This is the reverse of the movie mannequin where a mannequin becomes a real-life beautiful girl. You are a real-life beautiful girl who became a mannequin. And then one time somebody said, that's not a robot or anything. She's not plugged in. So the next time, I had a very subtle little cord. disappearing. Wow. She's plugged in.

This feels impossible, but your first audition is Tootsie? Yeah. Oh, my. I mean, that really is nuts. How did you get it? Because the role required his dressing roommate to be in our underwear a couple of times. So he'd be like, well, they called model agencies and said, do you have any models who know how to act? And my agents knew that I did.

We do have one. She's currently acting like a mannequin on Fifth Street. And so they said, okay, so go. These are the lines, and you're going to go to an audition. And if they like your audition, they want to see you in a bathing suit. So just wear a bathing suit under your clothes. So I did, and I went to the audition, and I read. And it was just an assistant to the casting directors.

The first rung on the ladder. She did the video and then didn't ask to see my bathing suit. So it just went completely out of my mind. Of course, my first time. Nothing's going to happen. You flew to do a runway show, right? Yes, I went to Paris. I went to Paris, and I got booked for some of the runway shows,

and I was excited about that, and then got a message, call your agent, and they said, you got the part, and I'm like, what part? Tutsi. Huh? What? They said, but you could stay and do the shows, and I was like, I'm coming home. I got to come home.

Which I didn't need to, but I really wish. I regret that. But Sidney Bollick had seen your tape, right? He saw my tape when I said, I really like her. where's her underwear photo. And they said, oh, we forgot. We didn't do it. Well, get her back.

Oh, turns out we can't. She's in Paris. Well, do they have any photos of her in a bathing suit? Oh, my God. Lucky. And it turns out there's tons of us. I definitely did. Yes, with everybody else in this office.

Yeah, shodding. What was your intimidation level? Because your scenes were immediately with Dustin. Yeah. And Dustin's already being Harold. that is like the second coming of Brando, right? I mean, he is like God at that time. Right.

So, yeah, what was your kind of anxiety level? As someone who trends high with anxiety, I get there on the first day. The first scene I shoot is in my underwear with Dustin. But I was just like, this is what was supposed to happen. Yeah, you felt confident. As if it really happens anyway for people. But I felt kind of fine.

You think the modeling helped, like you kind of already crossed a really big bridge to do that. That's way more awkward than acting. Right. When I got to do a photo shoot for something, I'm like, oh, gosh, I can't stand this. It's crazy I act. No, that's true. And so we started shooting the scene. And Dustin and Sidney were so gracious and kind with me.

And then on one of the takes, Dustin accidentally ran into the door. And I went over and said, are you okay? You're all right? So I literally had living. Yeah. Sidney Pollock said, hey, come here for a second. Why are you not nervous? And I said, am I supposed to be?

I don't know. Oh, God. He was like, yeah, no, it's good. It's great. But it's almost creepy. But it's a little bit creepy. You said, I mean, you're acting a scene when Dustin has when you're in your underwear. And you seem just fine with it.

Is it fair to say, no, look, I've worked with really, really acclaimed actors that didn't have this ability. And then I've worked with really acclaimed actors where they have this ability, which is like, they're so good. They can just suck you into their bubble. Like, do you think Dustin's ability helped you? for that first role? Yeah, Dustin was incredible with me and immediately decided that I was going to have a career and just took me under his wing all day long tips and advice. And the second day, he said, come with me at lunch. I'm going to take you to Daileys. I didn't know what that was. And for the listener, Daelies are when they used to shoot on film, they go process all the film,

then you'd come back and watch it all in the theater on edited. Right. And it's typically just for department heads and whatever to see was the mic. in the camera or something. Yeah, is the hair reading weird in the sliding? Yeah. And Cindy was a little surprised when Dustin brought me in. He said, what's going on? He said, I'm going to teach her how to watch Daileys.

Yeah, because let's just add, actors are not invited to Daily's. No, no. If you're Dustin Hovman, you can go. Yes. And Sidney was like, okay. So every time I did scenes, I got to go to Dailies, and he would talk through it and stuff. And he wanted me to learn how to use Daileys as a tool. And so the idea was, let's say you think.

something you did, you had some intention and you hope it came across. Well, go see the daily's to see if it did. Yeah. And if it didn't, you probably have some other scene where you could work on that aspect of the character. So that was incredible. That's great. Also, you're like accumulating. I don't want to belittle it and say that you accumulate tricks, but you do accumulate the things

you're good at. And no one's great at everything. And some things are totally unexpected. Some you've been doing since you're eight. And of course it works. But also some of the things you were doing since you're eight on film. don't work. There's a lot to learn. There is. I was lucky the first movie I ever did, they invited us to Daly's. Really? It was a mixed bag. Oh, were you self-conscious?

Well, first of all, couldn't believe I was on a screen. Yeah. I was just like, oh my God, because they're showing the Dailies on a movie screen in New Zealand. Right. Yes, yes. And I'm like, this is happening. So maybe the first half of the times I went, I just couldn't believe I was in a movie. And then the last half I was like, we got to stop doing that, that, that, and that, you know? Right, right, right. Yeah, like, once the thrill of being in a movie wears off. Right. And you're like, oh, I could be doing a little better at this.

Yeah. Or I could be not doing that. Yeah. Maybe I don't need to do so much, period. Right. I think that's what you really learn a lot of times. Like, you don't need to be that busy. Yeah.

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roadside assistance plans provided by Allstate Motor Club, Inc. An Allstate Affiliate. So that movie comes out. It's enormous. I think it gets nominated for 10 Academy Awards, something outrageous like that. Big hit, yeah. And how are you computing having gone from being a living model? A mannequin.

A living mannequin to that moment. So I'm home visiting my folks at one point, and my best friend is, Mom comes over, she's talking to my mom, and she says, no one can believe somebody from Wareham is in a movie. Nobody can believe this. My mom says, well, she studied acting in college. Yeah, with 13 other thousand kids that year. But I remember just now, my brother and I took them to see the movie. It was a matinee.

Hardly anyone was there. The movie finishes we get in the car, dead silence. Mom says, so, what do we have? for dinner tonight. Oh, boy. I think it was because I had underwear. I know. I was going to ask how they were handling the underwear exposure.

Well, double whammy, there's the underwear. But then there's also just the like, we're a very pious, low poppy family and you're a model and now you're an actor. That just almost have been quite threatening with how worldly you were getting. Maybe. Although my mom really latched on to me being an actor. And she one time said, you're a mole. I would pay if you want to have it removed, if that would make any difference.

And she also said, I read that blonde actresses get more work. I would be happy to pay for you to get your hair dyed. Oh, she was trying to help. All terrible advice, but really sweet. That freckles like, that's Gina Davis. Yeah. The intention was kind. It was.

Yeah, it was. Okay, so at that time, I just immediately built a huge fantasy around this. Tell me if I'm right or wrong. Your husband at the time was a restaurateur. Yes. So when I think of New York, I'm thinking of Billy Joel's big shot. Like going out to Elaine's, the whole New York City, 1980 now, it wasn't so thrilling and glamorous. It wasn't glamorous.

It wasn't. No, no. Would he own pizza shops? He worked at various restaurants. But none of them were seen any ones? Nothing. You weren't seeing Billy Joel gacked up in a corner. No, nothing like that.

I'm sorry. I'm sorry I didn't do that. Were you going to Studio 54? No. Although my agency had a Christmas party at Studio 54, and they wanted to have models jump out of a giant present box. Sure. The walls would fall down and sing Jingle Bell rock.

Oh, wow. Yeah, classic. Classic a steam builder. Yeah. So because I could sing and do harmony, I was one of them. The other two were like pretty famous, but I got to do that. So we dressed in these skimpy,

little dresses which had jingle bells tying together the sides. Pictureing like almost the Hugh Hefner Bunny outfit in that world. Exactly. Okay, with some bells. Yeah, with little bells added. What was your identity doing that you thought you were a wallflower in high school? But now you're quite beautiful in your own movies and lots of men probably are giving you a lot of attention.

How are you integrating that into your identity? I think I still thought it was kind of a trick. Oh, I also thought because somebody happened to video. me while we were in college and showed me the video and I was like, I'm kind of photogenic. In that instance, I am attracted. Oh. If it's a photo or on screen. You made space for, there's a version where I'm beautiful, but it's only through a lens.

Only in this circumstance. I'll tell you my story. Okay. I have been embarrassingly vulnerable to female attention and approval. my whole life because I had this big window. I was like, no girls are ever going to like me. And I want a girl so bad. So did you have any of that where you just felt like that affection or approval held a weight that maybe otherwise it wouldn't have?

I think so. Yeah. I was also very impressed if somebody took interest in me. You were like surprise. I could like someone just because they liked me. Oh, me too. That's what I'm saying. Absolutely.

Yeah. If they said, I really like, I said, I like you too. Yes. Yes. Oh, yeah. That's a tricky. A tricky lane to fit. Then you're just like at the mercy of luck.

Well, I hope the right dude arrives in front me and says, I like you because I will like that person back. All you have to do is show interest in me. Yes. Yeah. It's not knowing yourself. It's not knowing what you really like. Or what you want. Or what you want to need.

Yeah. Yeah. Also, it just goes to show like what you think you're meaning when you're an adult. You just don't know people's childhoods. No, exactly. So, like, anyone that's meeting you and you're in movies and you're six feet tall and you're gorgeous, they're like, yeah, this girl's had every option or whole life. I'd be so lucky if she says hi to me back. Yeah.

And then you're sitting there like, oh my gosh, you just want someone to say they like me. I think this guy actually likes me. Something's wrong with them. Exactly. Okay. So then for the next few years after Tootsie, you start doing it. a bunch of television. You were in some of the greats. You were in Night Rider, freaking Remington Steel Family Ties. Now, you were on Buffalo Bill for a year. I don't even know

that show, but I was really excited to learn that you wrote an episode of it. I did. So Dabney Coleman was in Tutsi, and I met him there. And then he was getting ready to do this sitcom Buffalo Bill and recommended me to play his assistant. And I flew out to L.A. and immediately got the part. And then I had an idea for an episode that heavily featured my character. Assistant heavy. And I told one of the producers,

producer writer about it, and he said, well, okay, write that. And I was like, no, I don't know how to read it. Well, write it. That was cool of them? Yes. So I started writing it and I thought, maybe this is good.

And I wanted to show him, he said, I'm not, I'm not reading it until it's done. So that forced me to, finish it and then with everybody tinkering with it. But yeah, we did it. Wow. Was that so enormously rewarding to see an episode of television on air that you wrote? Yes.

Yeah, I'm shocked you didn't get more addicted to that. I know because forever I've wished that I could write a screenplay or something, but I don't know. Have you written? Oh, yeah. And I pride myself on it way more. Of course. Like when we're traveling, if we're meeting people who have no clue who either of us are and then say, what do you do? I'll always say writer.

That's what I have the most pride in. I totally understand. Okay, I just have to ask you this one because this is my all-time. It's a three-way tie, but it is number one. My all-time comedies are Raising Arizona, Florida Newark Disaster, and Fletch. Oh, boy. Yeah. I love your body, Larry.

You're one of the guys who would come up to me. Oh, well, I wouldn't have done that to you, but, yes, I would have been very thrilled you were around, that's for sure. Right. What was that movie like? I just watched the Chevy Doc. Oh. Did you watch that? I didn't even know there was.

I'd be so curious to hear from someone who did a movie with them. It's interesting. Most of the people that I have to have the conversation with, they didn't walk away with what I did. I can just tell you what I walked away with, which is like he is a genius. He's deeply uncomfortable. And he has this crazy wit and he acts out with it a lot. And he's mean to people a lot. But I also don't know that he knows he's mean to people in the way that he clearly is mean to people.

But at the end of the day, he is unhappy. He's uncomfortable and unhappy. So I have compassion for him. It's not like he was an asshole and he's having a blast. I think he's suffering the most. No, yeah. Was there any hints of that when you were doing Fletch? Well, you know, I had such a small part.

I originally auditioned for the lead female character. Mrs. Stanhope, Alan Stanhope's wife. I watched it a lot. Yeah, so many times I could do every line. I'm pretty sure they said you're not attractive enough to play that part. Oh. But we think you're so funny, we want you in the movie. And this was 85 where they would tell you.

Yeah, that's crazy. Yeah. That's so crazy. I was wearing my hair all curly and weird. Anyway, they said, oh, there's this part of the Moore chief whose name is Larry, but we'll change it to a female for you. And I said, but I still want to be Larry. Yeah.

It made it very memorable that you were Larry. But was he grouchy? Not at all. He was also at the peak. Everything was going his way at that moment. Yeah, and he might have really enjoyed that movie or something. because he seemed fun and funny and chill and great. Okay, so you did the movie, Transylvania, 6,000, and you met Jeff.

Yes. Had you seen him in things prior to that? Yes. Okay, because I think the fly is my introduction to Jeff Goldblum. He's immediately a unicorn, right? He's so peculiar in the most fascinating way. Fabulous way. And was he that way on Transylvania?

Yes. Yeah, I was immediately smitten. You sounded like him just like, yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Sorry, Jeff. But yeah, yeah, we hit it off.

It was pretty am I. Yeah, off to the races. Okay, yeah, then you do the fly. And the fly is a mega movie. What a movie. Really was, yeah. David Kronerberg, who wrote it also. You probably never saw the original fly, but it's goofy.

It didn't mean to be. That was in that spell of weird monster movies, right? The monster movies. The swamp thing. I wouldn't be surprised if Vincent Price was in it. And when the character turned into a fly, you had a human body and a giant fly head. And then they showed the fly toward the end had his human head on it, but tiny. And he was saying, help me.

But then it gets eaten by a spider. This has to be a very joyful phase of your life. Very. You meet someone, you fall in love. he's a unicorn. And then you guys do three movies together. Yeah. Back to back to back.

Yeah. Was there any stress or challenge to that or no? No, it was all fun. And in one, he's a fly. And another one, he's an alien. Earth girls are easy. Earth girls are easy. Yeah.

It was kind of crazy. So the fly is huge. I guess I would have expected after Tootsie you to have had more movie type offers. Right. But it takes the fly. That kind of gets the ball rolling. And then the kind of. big breakthrough for, well, that Beetlejuice is huge.

What's it like working with Tim Burton? Oh, so great. I went to meet him to talk about being in the movie. And he's an illustrator too, you know. He used to do animation. And all the walls were covered with his drawings of what Beetlejuice was going to look like. And it was fabulous. And I found out later that this happened that I said to him,

I want to be in this movie because I get it. I get this movie. And he told me later that he wanted to hire me because he wanted at least somebody on the set who knew what the movie was. He was like, because I sure don't. So that was great. Okay, accidental tourists then kind of,

now everything changes because you get nominated and then you win an Academy Award for that. You're pretty young still, yeah? I'm just like 32 or something. Yeah, 32. Feels very young to win an Oscar nowadays. Yeah. And what did you have to learn on that movie?

with William Hertz, just kind of darkness. Actually, so for that movie, I hired an acting coach. I had studied acting, but I had never worked with a coach, but I thought, oh, this is so important. I don't want to mess it up. And he actually had heard what Bill is like to work with. So he was like, we're going to proof you from being drawn off track by the way he is, because he did live at a dark place.

I think all of it was kind of painful for him. in some way. And so I was such a caretaker type. If he had been like that and I had no idea who was going to be like that, all I would be trying to do is make him happy, fix him up. You know, what can I do? So if he's unhappy, given your childhood, you would have likely interpreted those like, well, I've been bad. What is it about me that he doesn't like? Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I learned what to do if that happened. The coach said, if you say, oh, how are you? And he says, I'm terrible. You're going to say, I'm sorry to hear that.

Okay. Just not get sucked into that. And it was really unnatural. Yes. But I practiced it. It's like Al-Wanon. It's like very codependence teaching. Yeah.

Breaking. Right. Yeah. And submersion therapy all at once. True. Immersion. Well, yeah, this is the kind of the theme of your memoir is basically like a lot of these roles have forced you to take.

on qualities that otherwise would have maybe been unattainable. Right. And that certainly feels like a really good one. Not that you perfected it, but if I could have learned at 32, I'm currently learning it. I live with three women and it has occurred to me, I can't be affected by their emotions or this isn't going to work. Like this will be untenable. If I'm upset every time they're upset and trying to figure out what I got to do to fix it, I'm going to die. But it's like taking that life experience and forcing me to learn that.

So I would have loved to have learned that at 32. Yes. But it didn't apply to anybody else. You didn't wrap it on to anybody else. I learned her to do it with Bill Hurd. So you're good. If you're with him, you're fine. But anyone else, you're still vulnerable.

Okay. Immediately after, now we're on a fucking roll. Now we go into Tellman and Louise there pretty quick after that. And Ridley Scott, obviously, one of the great. kind of masters to ever do it. Just a genius. Heartbreaking end. What did he bring to that?

You know what? I just watched it with a friend two nights ago. I mean, I've seen it a million times, but I watched it again. And I was just so bold over by everything he brought to it. There's so many details that I kept saying, that was Ridley's idea. That was Ridley. He did that. You know, like a motorcycle suddenly screamed by or some vehicles shooting water out at the car

and we dodge it. and all kinds of just visual stuff of crop duster plane flies over the convertible and just keep brought such profound visual element to it besides being a genius director with all the acting and everything. Yeah, as an actor, you can miss all that stuff. You're like, focus on your scene. We have this three-page scene in this car. You don't even notice a fucking prop duster probably flew by in the back.

Or if you saw it, you would think it was coincidental. Right. Yeah. You're kind of unaware of how much of the sausage is being made around you. He made that movie so much bigger than. It could have been. And then Susan arrives in your life as kind of a real signpost of like some things you'd like to take on yet?

Oh, man. She changed my life more than anybody. And we're still ride or die. So the first day I met her was a good example. We were getting together with Ridley, just the three of us. We're going to go through the script and see if anybody had any comments or thoughts. And there was a few little things I wanted to bring up, but I had tried to figure out the girliest possible way to bring them up.

Well, this I can just mention on the set. Your pattern at that time was every sentence you said was mitigated with, this is probably a dumb idea or I'm sorry to even bring this up, right? You were constantly apologizing for having an opinion. Yes, apologizing for existing, let alone having thoughts about something. So we sit down, crack up with the script, and on page one, Susan says, Ridley, you know what? My first line here, I don't think we need it.

Or we could put it in the next scene. And he was like, yeah, sure. And I was literally like, what is she doing? What's this? How did she just do that? How come she didn't find out first how he'd react or something? And the whole day was like that, the whole experience. And then the entire movie was like that.

I had never been in the presence of a woman who doesn't apologize for existing ever. And advocates for herself without any fear of... And everybody loved her. It wasn't like, we like Gina better because she's so wimpy. Right. Everybody adored her. It wasn't like she was fighting, but she just knows what she wants and says what she wants. Were you trying to figure out how she had become that way?

That would have been my great fascination. It's like, how did she end up this way? I just took it up face. I never thought about how did she manage to be that way. She was the oldest of many siblings. She's a boss, yeah, yeah. She might have also just decided or understood that her value was more than just how she looked or being this very female presence that she offered something else. She offered thoughts and her brain and something.

Exactly. Which seems like it should be absolutely natural. Yeah. But it's not. But it sure wasn't for me. Not for a lot of women. It's hard. Now what's interesting is everyone now will recognize that movie as like this very semi-examination. feminist movie.

But I don't think I even realize this until I was researching you that that was not the takeaway at the time when it came out. Right. Like that was one of the weird things that were happening around that movie because it was wildly successful. Right. A lot of the reviewers had a problem with it. Like a week after it came out, Susan and I were on the cover of time.

But there were two editorials denouncing the movie about how bad this is. This is a horrible idea. And a lot of reviews were like, this is male bashing. Hmm. You mean rapist bashing? There's hopefully a difference between men and rapists. And there's seven important male characters. And oh my God, what a horrible message.

Now the women have guns. Oh, my God. So it was really frowned on. But it didn't impact its success. People really liked it and it did well. But culture was not there yet. Right. So you got nominated for that movie.

And Susan too. And Susan as well. So fun. We did talk about Susan a lot. So I don't want to be accused of now. I've got to talk about the one man in the movie. Oh, no, no, no. But I'm so in love with him.

I'm just so head over. I know. I know. Harvey Kitell is just gorgeous. I know. Oh, you mean. Oh, you mean. I don't know.

It's like the piano. He's nude in the piano, which I appreciate it. Harvey Kytel. Yeah, but obviously Brad Pitt, this is his breakout role. Yes. Did you think when you were watching like, yeah, this motherfucker's going to really. Be a thing? He's a star.

Or no. I didn't think this mother, right? This wonderful human being is just going to be all that. I was positive that the reaction he got was the reaction he was going to get. And you have a nice fun glimpse of him because you have a glimpse of him probably more awes-shucksie Missouri boy than this international movie star. Absolutely. Yeah, so what was he like back then? Oh, God, yeah.

He was so fun, so sweet, so excited. so happy to be doing it and playful also, which I think you could tell in the way he plays the character, but he was just having fun with everything and loose. And for his first really big role, he just killed it. Was everyone in love with them? Yeah. Yeah, sure. Well, duh. We still are. But I have to tell you a funny story. Did you hear about my George Clooney story? No. So I was getting on a plane in Europe one time, and all the flight attendants were waiting at the door. for me to show up and they said, guess who you're sitting next to?

George Clooney. Oh, my God. And from once in my life, I said the right thing at the right time. And I said, guess who he's sitting next to? That's right. That is right. And I was like, I can't believe I came up with that.

Oh, good for you. So I sat down. He's charming. He's gregarious. He's telling stories and we're talking. And then at one point he says, you know, I hate that Brad Pitt. I said, isn't he like your best friend or something? He said, no, I hate him because he got the part in some of the movies.

I said, oh, really? Did you want that part? And he said, couldn't you tell when I auditioned with you? Oh, wow. He had read with you? Yes. That's hilarious. Were you embarrassed?

I'm so wimpy. I didn't say, no, I didn't remember you at all. You know, I said, oh, right. No, I did. Oh, no. He would have laughed if I said. Hey, of course he would have. I might have done the same thing.

Yeah. Yeah. You want to make someone feel like they were unmemorable. Well, he made her feel like you don't remember. Then you could be like, I don't. That's a take. That's a Susan take. That's what Susan would have done.

Yeah, I think it's like, because I've been in this position a bunch of times. And it's like, the last thing you want is to tell someone like, oh, yeah, you're unmemorable. Not like, hey, I've met 11,000 people this year. But he is putting her in the position. It's one thing if he's just like, oh, yeah, I auditioned with you. Then you might be like, oh, I know, I remember. Like, then you want to make them feel good. But if it's like, you don't remember?

It's a trap. So then 92 League of Your Own comes along. This is a huge triumph as well. Open number one, 10th biggest movie of the year. You, Tom Hanks, Madonna. Had Madonna done much before then? Acting? Yeah.

I don't think so. Evita was after that? Yeah, for sure of either was. Yeah, and we didn't know what to expect. Exactly. She's going to have an entourage or what is it going to be? She was so normal, low-key, team player. Yeah.

For people listening today, you have to imagine Taylor Swift's in your book. Oh, yeah. I mean, and then some, right. Madonna was. Beyonce, maybe. Beyond. She was already an icon, but she was still very young. Were you guys bros?

Did you get on well? All of us got along great. I was mostly close with Lori Petty. This is again in your book. this is another one of the things like you had done no athletics and then you have to be the best baseball player alive. Anyone has ever seen. A female.

But you took to it really quickly. You surprised yourself? Yes. I surprised everybody, I think, but everybody else had been training in baseball for a while, but I had to catch up. And the coaches soon started saying, you know, you have a lot of untapped athletic ability. And I'm like, when did I ever think I was going to hear that? Yeah. That's crazy.

And I did. pulled it off, I think. Definitely. But I could really play. Up to this point, you've had a really wonderful incremental. Everything gets a little better than the last thing. Had you settled into, like, oh, that'll be the pattern? Or were you looking around and going like, no, everyone takes it on the chin. I will also take it on the chin. What were you thinking? Do you think it was just going to be a completely linear rise and all the movies would work? You're asking of course that not only nobody asked me, but I haven't even thought about. What did I think? Yeah, because we got to go back to 1992 for this question. Right. I think I felt like things are going to work out pretty good.

I didn't have a feeling like, well, I've been the lead or one of the leads in two movies in a row, you know, a year apart. And nominated for all the movies. Winning, winning Golden Globe. All the proof is there. Yeah, I don't know what I thought. I honestly don't remember what I thought or if I was surprised that didn't happen or anything. I didn't have nearly the run you had, but I did have a run where I had a few hits in a row. And they were all things that shouldn't have been hits. And I went, oh, well, duh, now when I go to this movie that's got a big budget with a great director, who fucking knows what's going to happen? And then, like, that movie didn't work.

I was like, oh, Jesus. Now what? I thought for sure, okay, we made it out of the 10-year fucking doldrums where finally it's happening. And then I climb up to this rung of the ladder. And then very rude awakening, like, no, if you have a couple in a row that don't work, it's. It's rough. That's right. So anyways, you had a couple in the row that didn't work as anticipated.

One of them is my favorite movie that you ever did, which is a long kiss good night. If you haven't seen Long Kiss Goodnight. In fact, I got to show my... You haven't seen it? No, I want to see it. I'll watch it tonight. Maria. Let me hear you with the premise.

She is a housewife kind of mom type lady. Uh-huh. Tad wife. She gets amnesia. Oh. She hasn't. I had. Had amnesia.

It doesn't realize she had amnesia. It's before born. It's kind of born. And then slowly starts realizing after an accident that she's got skills she can't explain. And she's actually an assassin. Oh, cool. Very boring. Yeah.

The script's great. You're fucking brilliant. The premise is perfect. And then Sam Jackson. Come on. What's that line he has? Like, you ask him if he's Mormon. He's like, yeah, that's why I just had two Jack and Cokes in a pack of Newport.

Or some shit like that. He has some great line. So great. He was just coming off of Pulp Fiction. Yeah. He was very hot. Were you so pumped to work with him? Oh, my God.

Yeah, yeah. And then he's the greatest guy ever. He's the coolest dude. The coolest dude ever. All we did was laugh and have fun. We had so much fun. But it didn't work? That one did fine.

We thought it was going to explode. The movie before Cutthroat Island was in the Guinness Book World Record is the biggest financial. That's been way blown away by now. Yeah. Even when I see the price of that movie, it's kind of cute. It was like 110 million. I know, I know.

biggest disaster ever. Oh, God. I know. Now people are writing off like 400 million movies and stuff. I know, I know. How did you process that heartbreak of that? You're also married to the director. I'm guessing when I've had movies that failed that I wrote and directed, I've got three

months or I'm just depressed. You know, I did that for two and a half years and now that happened. Oh, I see. And I'm naturally going to be depressed. Right. And now if my wife was also shouldering that same thing, I don't know who's available to nurture. Yeah, well, you kind of had to nurture each other through that. And we knew we had long kiss coming up. So that helped, but I was going to tell you about the pirate movie.

Oh, yeah, yeah, tell me. Cutthroat. Cutthroat. Yeah. So Cutthroat Island, it was going to star Michael Keaton. He asked Reni. I was already with Reni and maybe married already. He wanted some substantial actress to play the female part, which was much smaller than his and all that. So he was begging Reni to get me to do it. I think I really do want to do it. And Reni was begging me, please, please. Yeah, is that part stressful? Oh, very stressful.

Yeah, like you want to do your husband or wife of whatever favor they want, but also I don't want to gamble my career. Yeah. So anyway, I finally got my arm twisted enough that I said that I would do it. And then Michael eventually dropped out. He just suddenly, I'm not doing it. And Reni and I, I mean, he wasn't that crazy about the script either. And so we were like, we're getting out of it.

We don't have to do it. Oh, my God. We're like dancing around. And then Mario Casar was Caralco, was the producers. And I had the same agency as Michael. And I thought, well, easily I'll get out of this. And they were told, no, there's no way Gene is getting out of this. She is doing it.

We'll sue her. What does Michael Douglas get to get out of it? I don't get to get out of it. I'm normally as small potatoes compared to him. Was it Michael Douglas or Michael Keaton? Michael Douglas. Oh, Michael Douglas. Right, right.

Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's great, great, great, right. Yeah, Michael Douglas. So we're like, oh, God, no, we've got to do it. And we got Matthew Maudine, who was fabulous in it and a great guy and a lot of fun, but it was really against our will. Right. So it was one of those ones that didn't feel right from the jump and then turned out. So maybe we learned like a gut intuition lesson off of that one?

Well, yeah. I mean, don't get talked in to anything ever again. But we went into it with a good will, you know, and I trained to trade to do piratical stuff. Yeah, yeah. You learned a swashbuckle? I buckled my spice. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I had to learn horseback riding and all that stuff. Stay tuned for more armchair expert, if you dare. Okay, I just one fun thing that people certainly want to know is that. In 99, you tried out for the U.S. Olympic archery team.

What? What did I do in 99? Which you had started in 97. So you'd only been doing it for two years. Two and a half. And what you had seen it in something? Why did you even get interested? I had to play baseball.

And then I had to learn swashbuck, you know, horseback riding and gun shooting and then ice skating and gun shooting while ice skating for Lancas. Good night, all these skills. and I was kind of good at all of them. And I had not had any clue that I was coordinated. And so it was so much fun. And then I thought, I think I'd like to take up a sport in real life

and not the movie version of it, because no matter what, if I didn't catch the ball, I didn't do another take. Yeah. Put in the stunt double. So then I was just watching the Olympics on TV in Atlanta, and there was a lot of coverage of archery because the American men's team,

was winning all the medals. And I thought, you know, that's really beautiful. And it's very dramatic. And I didn't learn how to shoot pistols really well. And it's kind of a weapon. So I thought, I'm going to try archery and found a coach and became utterly obsessed with it. Like how frequently are you doing it? Practicing every day like four or five hours.

Four or five hours in your what backyard shooting on a hay bale? No, no. Don't be stupid, dad. No, I don't know. No, I was just said, hey, Bill, cannot stop an arrow. You really have to be somewhere safe to do that. So I'd go to a range and meet with my coach constantly. And then he told me I had to start competing.

And I was like, oh, no, I'm not anywhere near. He said, no, no, no, it's about getting better. You go to get better. So I've been competing and competing. And then I won the California Cup one year. Wow. And you said what you liked about it is it was objective versus how subjective your career was. Exactly. Are you hitting the target or not? Do you think it was a salve for dealing

with the kind of disappointment and uneasiness about what was next? Could be. Yeah, because again, it's a control thing. Back to the compulsive behavior, it's like repetitive. It's singular. Very repetitive. You've narrowed your world, which is scary right now and unpredictable, to a red dot. I mean, this all feels very regulating. Yes, very regulating and very specific. And I had the time. I didn't work that soon after long because I had good night. So I had two and a half years to focus only on that. Wow.

So you entered in 99 to go to the Olympic trials? I qualified as a semi-finalist for the Olympic trials. 300 people entered and you finished 24. Oh, my God. It was 300 people at the national tournament. And then they took the top 32 could be in the semifinals. You were in those. Yeah.

And then you somehow got a wild card and went to Athens. Sydney. In Sydney. So Sydney built all of their venues way before they hosted the Olympics. And a year before it, they tried out every single sport. And they had the top people come just to run it and make sure everything was great. And dress rehearsal. Yeah.

And so the real team went, they said, you could come to. So I got to wear the uniform and walk out. What? Music and everything. It was so fun. Oh, my gosh. That's fantastic. I didn't win that one, though.

That's okay. That's okay. You got to go. How old were you when you had your daughter? 46. Okay. So I wonder if you have, I have such great gratitude for waiting to 38, right? There were so many times when both little kids are screaming where I'm like, oh man, I don't know if I would have the patience for this in my 20s. Also, my career was sorted enough. I just all the mountains I was trying to climb tired of that.

And so this I could really, do you have that kind of gratitude for waiting later? Or did you have moments really like, God, I should have done this 20 years earlier? No, no. I always was grateful that it was later. And I felt like it was important that I had a stronger sense of self who I was. Yeah, because you're going to have to model what it is to be a woman in this society of ours. Yes. But you're watching children's programming with her when she's like, too.

And you start noticing a lot of little boys in these shows. I did. The very first thing I showed her, I had her on my lap. And I'm thinking, oh, this is great. It's a preschool show. I think it's because of Thelma and Louise, and it really heightened my awareness of how women are portrayed. Because women had so few opportunities to come out of a movie feeling empowered by the female characters.

So I immediately noticed that there seemed to be far more male characters. I even looked it up. And they had one female character in this large cast. And I was like, well, that's weird. And then rented a video. And it was like that, a movie that came out. And I'd go, wait a minute. Yeah.

And you were thinking what I would be thinking, which is like, oh, this has already been fixed. I had thought that. Yeah, yeah. We're like, we're 12 years past Thelman Louise. I assume this has been strained out. Oh, right. Absolutely. And then I immediately kind of went global with it because I'm like, wait, so we're training

kids from minute one to have unconscious gender bias. How can they not get it when every single situation has one? one female. Turned out to be three to one. The little rascals, you know, like when they had Darla and that was in. Yeah, we got it. We got Darla back to the boys. Right.

How could a young girl not into it? Well, there's one third as many role, one fourth as many opportunities for me. Like I should recognize that. That's the world I'm entering. Right. And also, how our boys aren't going to recognize that they're more important than girls? Yeah, right. How are they even going to care about the female character?

They're being told what's important. Right. But you had a novel approach to addressing this. Well, I went to the Olympics in it. Everything I do, I had to be careful about taking it up because whatever it is, I want to go to the Olympics. But I asked people constantly in the industry, whatever meeting I had, whoever it was, I'd say, have you ever noticed how few female characters there are in entertainment made for kids? And every single person said, oh, no, no, no, that's not true anymore.

No, that's been fixed. And they'd say, we fixed it at our studio, at our production company, whatever. And they would very often name a movie with one female character as proof that gender inequality was not a thing anymore. It's like saying, well, we have Obama as a president. Racism's over. Exactly. So it made me realize this is utterly unconscious. And they think it's not true.

So if I was able to, with data, show them that it is true, this big imbalance. maybe they won't want to change. So I sponsored this largest research study ever done on kids, TV and movies. Through the Annenberg School at USC, were your partners? That was. That's incredible. At that time, yes. And then started visiting anybody who makes children's entertainment.

The first studio that we went to, we finished the presentation, and their heads were in their hands. Their jaws were on the ground. They were like, how did we not know this? All we care about is doing right by kids. And we never thought of this. Because at that time, the conclusion of your study, right, was it was three boys to every girl. Right. And the lead characters, it was 11 to 1.

Oh, wow. For a lead female character. And crowd scenes and everything were wildly embellished. So we went everywhere. Everybody was horrified. And everybody started changing. Wow. That was 2004.

Where are we at now? I think 2020 was the data I read. So even four years ago, where was it? Yeah, now we're at parody and children's TV show. That's amazing. Oh, my God. Yeah. You should be so proud of yourself.

15, 16 years. Yeah. Oh, that's incredible. Yeah, the latest study we did, we looked specifically at new kids programs that just came out and it was 50-50. Oh, my goodness. That is so, what an accomplishment. Of all your accomplishments, I hope that's maybe one of your highest.

That's incredible. She also created the Benton Film Festival, Bentonville. Are you friends with one of the Waltons? Is that a Walton project? No, Walmart came up with the idea, actually, of having a film festival that focused on diversity and somehow thought of me. Probably not somehow. You're the most seminal feminist movie ever.

Yeah, I co-founded it. A cool thing about the Waltons is to get their inherent. all the children, they have to take on a large public works project and make their community better. So like Bentonville's is very weird town in the middle of Arkansas. You've been there? I have, yeah. But they have like one of the best museums in the world and they have the best bicycle parkway, right? They have all these like incredible installations because of how they get their inherent, which is so cool.

It's so incredible. And Alice Walton just built the best medical school ever built. And it's, I think it's either free or something. Oh, wow. If you agree to stay in the area and work for a certain number of years. It's this pocket of progressive explosion. It's incredible. With like some of the best art pieces in the world.

It's hilarious. You can imagine one day Bentonville being like this weird Eden that they have created through all these public works projects. Wow. Okay, the boroughs. Yes. I'm watching it and I love it. It's sweeping Netflix by Storm, right? I think I saw it's number one.

Oh, amazing. This is so wonderful and encouraging. Okay, so the boroughs, you explain how you want to explain it. I'm going to use a reference that only people my age will like, but I want to hear how you would set it up. It takes place in a fancy, fancy retirement community. I want to live there. It looks very appealing.

That's been my dream life. I want to live in a camp. Yes, for adults. Golf cart, shuffleboard. Right. They say, well, now we're going to go canoe. Oh, okay. Now we're going to take a field trip.

Okay. Now it's lunch. Yes, now it's lunch. And I don't have to decide anything. Yeah, yeah. You know, that's what I want. So retirement community and it focuses on a group of friends live all in the same cul-de-sac, and then something spooky and danger starts happening.

All a stranger things. It's Duffer Brothers. So there's like some, I don't know, there's a creature. Is he an alien? Is he a weird animal? Is he a monster from your childhood? Monster. Oh, right?

What I like about it, and I help you take this as a compliment because I fucking love this movie. and it speaks to how much it transcended that I would have watched this movie at 10 and loved it. But Coon is still one of my favorite movies ever. Do you remember Coon? Oh, yeah. There are these, do you ever see Coon, Monica? There are these alien pods.

These little cocooning aliens are in a swimming pool and it's giving them magic powers. And they all get very youthful. Now, what's incredible is, have you ever seen the Instagram post that says all of their ages from that movie? No, they weren't really that old. Brimley was like 52 years old.

Oh, my God. All the, I don't think anyone in the cast was over 60, maybe Alan Arkin or something, but nobody's even over 60. And we watch it movie like, oh, look these grandpals have super power. That's crazy. That's crazy. It is. Same with Golden Girls.

Yeah, Golden Girls. They were all young. Stal Geddes was like almost the same age as her daughter. Yeah. These were in their 40s on that show playing her retired grandma. Did they think people just couldn't stand to actually watch old people? It's such a different time. Oh, yeah.

I've had this moment several times where it's like I get offered a role in the character has an 18-year-old or a 24-year-old. And I'm like, yeah, that's correct chronologically. I just think this job has a very weird ability to remind you in a very cruel way of how old you are all the time. Yes. It's like, you're getting the thing. It's like, oh, I'm someone with a terminal disease. That's who I'm playing. That's where we're at.

So did you have any, like, shock of like, yeah, it makes sense that I would be in a show about this? Yes, I was like that. But like you, I mean, I turned down any number of roles because the character had adult children or grandma. And I was like, at no time on earth, am I going to play a grandmother? But no, I was very whatever age I was, but I don't even want teenage kids. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But this made sense. I've been on a couple shows where the older cast members are going to have to die, right?

Like I was on this great show, Parenthood, and Craig T. Nelson, who's just a blessing. Yeah. He's going to play someone's dying. I mean, vaguely of old age, you know, like just a hard thing, but still. And I just remember talking to him and being like, is this tricky, dude? Like, I think it would be tricky for me to go like, wait, this makes sense to everybody that I'd be playing someone that might drop dead right now. Like, is this a lot, I think, to contend with. Well, the good thing, I think something I really like about this show is we're all very able.

We can battle dangerous things and there's no beats about how we can't even get up there. Right. No, but there is a scene where you're all showing off your scars. That's true. And everyone's had a massive operation. Everyone's their whole front cut open. Someone's at their back coat. You've had your hip replace.

First, I just love the show. It's so good. Your character's so fun. You're kind of the vixen of this. scene. You're an ex-music manager, so you're like hip and cool and you drive a cool fairly convertible and you're awesome. You're a rock star. But I was like, we are still a little bit caught in the notion, like you wouldn't be in a retirement community. In reality, they need to be 15 years older. Everything's changed. When I was young, all seven-year-olds

were in retirement communities. That's not how it is now. It's not how it is now. And my character is the only one who didn't plan to go there. My mom bought that house and I had to take care of her and I also lost all my money and that I just ended up staying. But a few times I refer to the fact that I don't really belong here. Yeah. Yeah. Had you worked with Alfred Molina or Bill Pullman before? This is my third thing with Bill Pullman. My third project with Ed Begling Jr. I've done three with him as well. Really? What a sweetheart, huh? Is it a sweet. Oh, I love it. It scares me how sweet he is.

But also, Bill Pullman is like that. It's so sweet. I've never met him. Yeah. Oh, God. It's so weird to say this, but he's weirdly a revelation in this show. Right? He is.

Even though I've seen him a million times, I'm like, this is great. He's like a fucking beach stoner, retired dude. Right, right. Chill. Yeah. He's incredible. It makes you go, oh, no wonder they got him. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. This is great. This sounds like it's doing like anti-eachy. ageism work. Yeah. You have a very young lover. He's 40.

Yeah, he's 30 years. I hear the big guy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Fun. So.

But Renee's like, so what? Yeah. She's feeling very confident. And so is he. And everyone's winning. But I will say I was watching it with my wife and our 13 year old and 11 year old daughters last night. And I love these situations, right?

Like, I'm feeling a certain way and I'm like, I'm going to bring this up to everyone. And I said during that scene, we were watching the sexy scene with you guys. And I said, isn't it crazy, you guys, that we have seen at this point, a thousand movies where the age gap was this, but it was the guy and the woman. And you don't notice, but this is highly noticeable. Yes. And isn't that really something? Like, let's just talk about that for a minute. It really is. You wouldn't think about Michael Douglas is in something and he's got a 40-year-old. You know, you just...

Yeah. It happens all the time in film. You don't even notice. But this is very noticeable. Right. Yeah. Because we're not used to it. That's why it's noticeable.

Yeah. The more we see it. It's a juicy thing for you to get to talk about with your kids. It's an opportunity to hear what these young girls think about that. Like, oh, wow. Why are we seeing this for the first time? Yeah. That's so cool you brought that out.

I really dig that. We're watching something from the 70s or 80s and something. gnarly happens, you know, it just doesn't happen that way anymore, like the way guys are talking to women or something. And we're just pausing and be like, well, what do you guys think of this? Oh, that's some cool. That was kind of standard biz. In the 80s, that was like standard guys would just say shit like that to women.

And, you know, what do we think about this? I was figuring to watch it with your kids, when my kids were, I watched everything with them because I felt like I could be their media interpreter. I would say, why do you think she's wearing that if she's going to go rescue somebody? Doesn't that seem like it's not appropriate? Did you notice, do you think girls could do what all those boys are doing? And why don't think there's more? So you got to the point where, and even if we're out of the movie, if I just went like this,

I go, I know, mom, there's not enough girls in that scene. I know, I know, I know. It's so great. That's the best part, though. Kids are supposed to fuck with their moms. My wife's constantly talking about what neurologist she just saw on Instagram and what new hack we have. As soon as my wife starts talking, either girls like, Is this one of your neurologists from Instagram or did you actually?

And they're like 11 and 13. They've already got a dialed, you know. That's hilarious. Okay. The last thing I want to talk about is you just kind of went viral. Second weekend of Coachella, you were a guest at the Sabrina Carpenter show. Yeah, not just a guest. I was on stage.

Oh, yes. I guess guest means you're in attendance. No, you were on stage in a convertible Cadillac or something like that. very much Thelman Louise ask. And Susan had done it the weekend before. Yes. Oh, fun. I had no idea when she did that.

I thought, oh, that's cool. I had no idea they were then going to ask me to do it. But that was wild. Who calls you? Does Sabrina Carpenter herself call you? No, I mean, they called my agent. Her people did, I guess. But she was the one that wanted me to do it.

That's awesome. What do you think of her? I love her. Oh, I love her so much. And she was so wonderful in person and so charming and gave me a, T-shirt, I guess the title of her show was Sabrina Wood. And so she gave me one that said Gina Wood. Oh, cute.

I loved it. It was so fun. But I didn't expect it to blow up like that. Somebody said, you're trying to get on like, what? Yeah. You never know what's coming. You never do. I have so much gratitude for her, for Taylor Swift.

I've taken our daughters to both of those performers. Oh, that's great. For them to be little girls watching these women who have created a true matriarchy. They have their own world, and they are the top of that world. They don't have to suffer any fools. They're in charge. There weren't a ton of examples like that.

And now there's a ton. It's true. It's true. It's incredible. Yeah, it is. Yeah. I'm delighted that that happened. Had you ever been to Coachella?

No. Yeah, me neither. No. I think that's the way I want to go the first time I want to be on stage. Right. Like the biggest, the most loved performance of the night. Exactly. Okay.

And then lastly, where are you at? Are you still susceptible to if a guy likes you or have we evolved in that? If a guy just simply likes you, is that enough anymore? No, no. That's not enough anymore. Good. You said that. And what did you learn when that shifted when you start thinking, wait, what do I like?

Is that what it was? Right. I had been attracted to extroverted, flashy, shiny men. And now not so much anymore. Not so much. So Brad Pitt doesn't have a chance now. Actually, well, let's make an exception. Let's not exclude him from the pool of bachelors.

Oh, well, Gina, I adore you for real. Sincerely, Long Kiss, Good Night. It was one of the first films I think I owned on Blu-ray that I watched over and over again. I just love it. I'm so in the mood to watch it again. I can't wait to show my daughters. It's an honor to meet you. Yeah, I'm really excited.

I got you. Oh, I just want to tell you one thing about Longtakes-G-Night. Sam and I, well, we changed the ending when we were shooting because we realized we'd love to do a sequel. And in the original script, Sam's character dies. So we reshot the last scene and made him live. And I know it's all these years later, but we still, Sam and I talk about we're dying to do a sequel. Oh, I would love you. You should.

Well, I know, but we've got to get somebody to do it. I nominate Netflix. Yeah. If you're there, you're crushing. They want to be in the Gina business now. Gina Wood. Let's get, yeah, Gina would. Would Gina do a sequel?

Yeah, Gina works. Gina is open to a secret. All right, well, lovely me and you. Thanks for the work you've done on the gender parody with kids shows. And hopefully that moves upstream all the way. And everyone watch the boroughs. Thanks so much, Gina. Thank you.

This is really fun. Oh, good. Yeah. Just a quick word. reminder that as part of our summer break, here's a rerun of one of our favorite fact checks. I got my hair cut today. Barb did my hair. Barb Thompson. Where do you find Barb? Barb Chopstick? What did you say? Don't ever say that again. What did you say? Barb Thompson. Thompson. Okay. She's awesome. She's done my hair before. She did it for a gala.

Okay. One of the only gals I've ever been to. And she's great. Always a bridesmaid, never a gala. I know. And she said you did a great job. Are you growing your hair out on your legs too? Don't look. I just haven't shaved. Oh, but I didn't know if you were making a decision like everyone's making.

That was a fair question. What happened? I'm sorry. I can't believe you did that. I was, I wanted to celebrate you if you were embracing. Fuck that. No. Okay.

I take care of my hair. Okay. I just haven't. And it's hot. Yeah, that's great. Can you understand there's a movement where women aren't shaving anymore? And I thought maybe you joined that movement. It was really actually self-conscious that it would get noticed.

And I was like, there's no way anyone will notice. And you noticed immediately. I'm very observant. You know this about me. I know. I don't miss a thing. It just takes a long time to shave. Yeah, I'm in the same boat.

I shave my arms now. I have all this money tied up in these tattoos and I want them to be visible. That makes sense. Well, you know, I also, I have to groom my arms. arms, my legs, my armpits, my vagina parts. Yeah, and I feel terrible for you. I've said that now that I'm, now that I'm grooming a lot. Yeah, it sucks.

Speaking of how's the cashmere, we haven't even seen it in a while. You know who's a real producer's Delta? Yeah. Yeah. Are you collecting? Yeah, yeah, it's growing. Although I may have a big, I might have a, I'm now thinking I might have a nice deposit in the drawer in my bathroom.

Oh, great. Maybe I haven't transferred some to the main storage. Okay, great. Okay, I had been wanting to tell you a story. Oh, yeah. Okay, so we all went to Monster Jam on Saturday. Yeah, who's, describe we all. Okay, so we all is Charlie and the boys, Ace and Wilder, the two handsomest men in Los Angeles.

And then my girls, Lincoln and Delta, and then Delta's friend. Fun. Yeah, and then Eric. Eric. Yeah, that's all. So we went. It was immediately fun. It's so fun. Monster Jam, so fun. We got to ride in the like 12 passenger monster truck. That's great. I was kind of not clocking any of this, but apparently Delta and her friend had brought their two most important stuffies in a red bag. I didn't know that. I probably would have been like maybe we don't bring them into the event. Can you describe the stuffies? Yes, it's imperative that people understand the stakes here. So anyone that knows Delta would know her son, Groot. Oh, my God.

I don't even count Groot as a stuffy. When you said that, I wasn't thinking of him. He's a real boy. He really is. I don't know that I've ever seen. And I had very deep relationships with my stuffies. I had three bears that I loved and I thought about them. And if I was gone too long, I felt guilty.

Like, I was very. touch and close with my stuff. What were their names? I don't, I didn't name them. One was a polar bear, one was a brown bear, and one was like a, and, um, koala bear. They were different breeds. So I didn't breeds. I see. So you just said koala, polar. I just never was like, you never called to them. I was just squeezing them and feeling guilty. But what if like it was downstairs? You had to tell your mom like, oh my God, polar is missing. That would never like. It would never happen. I would, I would Never. Lose track.

Never. Okay. And they didn't travel out of my room either because I was too afraid something would happen to them in the wild. Okay, but to put like this in perspective, Groot goes everywhere with us. Grut has truly a bigger wardrobe than Delta. Yeah. He has many different jammies.

He has swimwear. For Delta's birthday, she'll often ask for clothes for Groot. Mostly that's all she asked for is things for Groot. And he has books he reads and he's an artist. and she makes some dinner and he, like, it's so, it's such a huge part of her life, and then I didn't know this. I learned this recently about Groot. She was kind of explaining what was going on with him athletically.

And then I said, is Groot disabled? And she said, yeah, Groot is disabled. And I said, oh, what's his disability? And she said, well, he's half tree and half boy. So he needs to breathe carbon dioxide as a tree. but he needs to breathe oxygen as a boy. So his lungs are like half dedicated to breathing. And so that's kind of an impairment for his cardiovascular.

Additionally, this is all real. Like I didn't even know Groot was disabled. Well, I didn't, yeah. But I just had a hunch. There was some way she was talking about his athleticism and his outfit. Sure. I don't know. I asked.

And he is. And then she went on to tell me another challenge he has is, is he's got both veins. Uh-huh. And then he also has to have plumbing for the water. Yeah. So it's like his body's sharing a lot of. Wow.

Double duty. Double duty. Also, his bark hasn't come in and that's going to make him more stable. Oh, wow. Yes, it was a lot going on. Okay. Wow. And I'm going to be honest, I love Groot.

Like, he's also my grandson. And when we snuggle at night, I go, I want a little time. with Groot, so he has to be in my note. Does everyone have to leave? No, no, no, no. Just I will want Groot in my left nook and dealt in my right nook if we're all laying together. But she's got to give me some grandpa visit. Okay, never mind. Anyone. Oh. Never mind. I don't want to say. Okay. Good. It's because you like him in your neck and like, like a kid, like a kid. Yeah, like a little baby boy. So, okay, so great time. We're having the best time. Now we're up in the, this huge suite.

There's like 50 people in there. It's a blast. It's hectic. And Delta comes up like mid show. Again, I'm going to say, I've said it before. There's no better show on Earth than Monster Jam. It starts and it doesn't let up. Race, race, race, race, race, stunts, stunts.

So it's a party. We're eating food. And then Delta comes up to me and she is, she's past. Like she's, I don't want to say she's hyperventilating. she is so scared and panicked. And she said, we lost Groot. And I'm like, what do you mean? I didn't even know Groot was in here.

We lost the bag. So her friend was in charge of carrying the bag. She brought it in here. Someone maybe stole it or whatever. And I'm like, okay, no one stole it. Everyone that came is still here. No one left mid-time, you know. So now we start scouring all the bathrooms in there.

And then we go through systematically and we look under every single chair. This takes 35, 40 minutes. I'm missing the Monster Jam. Sure. You can hear it still. I can hear it. That is helpful. And I say at some point, okay, it's not in here, which means it didn't come up here.

Oh. Now, we arrived and we went right out onto the arena floor to take that ride. So it's like, we're seven stories up. That was pre-show. So now- Did they take him into the first- monster truck? Yes.

Well, here becomes the investigation. So then Carly and I'm like, oh, I made a video of them getting, I'm like, did they even bring the bag out of the car? Right. Let's hope not. I took pictures. Yeah.

I take some, oh, yeah, there's the red bag. Then I have footage of them getting on to the monster truck and she's carrying the bag. We don't have footage of them getting off. But I'm like, but this is, she would have never set it down in the elevator or on the walk. It definitely had to get left in the truck. So now.

Exactly. And we're now mid-show. This is hours later. And I- And is that truck like out on the thing? No. That truck has now been already put in a trailer to go to the next Monster Jam. So I like- This is like a movie. I asked my friend Sally, who I've been, you know, going to Monster Jam was Sally as our host for, I don't know, eight years now. Yeah. She's an incredible lady. She's an arm cherry. Oh, shout out. She's so sweet. And I'm like, I don't know what else to do.

But like, here's the situation. She's a mom. She put out a full court press. Oh, look. Okay, I'll try to get into that truck. Like, I'll try to find the truck in the parking lot and try to get into this semi to get into this mom's. Oh, my God. So, like, an hour goes by.

And Delta is really like, she lost her son. Oh, my gosh. And I'm very pessimistic. I'm like, who knows? is they set that bag down anyway. There was so many bags and so many things and so much equipment. And it's in an arena. So I was really, really pessimistic.

And then the show ends. And then we just sit there for another 45 minutes while the whole place clears out. We're kind of like waiting to see if they're going to find group. And then she says, well, you guys are free to, if you want to just wait in the car. So anyways, we go sit in the car now. And then I get a text from Sally. And it's a picture of her. And she's elated.

And she's holding the back. She found the bag in a random golf cart somewhere. No. Yeah. It was on its way to the trash. On its way to a sex trafficking. Don't save that. Oh my God.

Oh, my God. What a tale. Oh, my God. It was the amount of relief I felt. So obsessed, scary. When that bag returned. You know, I was starting to think about our next two weeks to a month. Like I was like, this is going to be.

Imagine when it's like to lose your son. You never get over it. Yeah. It's going to be devastating in a way that I'm not sure how we're all going to deal with. We lost group forever. That is so scary. And then I said to her, I was like, once we had group, I was like, you know, I started thinking like, what do I do? Would you have wanted me to find the same group?

And she's like, no. Yeah, because it's real and he's real. And there's no replacing him. Well, and so she answered our long. long lasting question about would you clone? Would you clone your dog or your kid? She won't. Yeah.

She's like, she's like me. Yeah. She is, I guess she has ethics. I don't know. We don't know what that means ethically. Oh, gosh.

That's why. But, okay, if he had gone in the monster truck and then got sent to the next monster truck show, that's a kid's book. That's a children's book. And like they love them and he becomes kind of a mascot for Monster Jam. Yes, but then he returns back home always.

Yeah, but he's like, now he chews tobacco and he's grown up a little bit. We have different versions of the stories. Well, he's on the Monster Jam tour. Yeah, he is. He's not going to like symposiums on physics. But he's very, it's very toy story. Yes, yes. He could have been on a real adventure.

I don't think all the dust from the monster truck would be good for his lungs. Well, not given what I've learned about his. Exactly. Now, what if, like, the driver of Gravedigger found him and started keeping him on the dash? Oh. And we could like, then we were watching and he was riding on the dash proudly. Oh, my God. That's terrifying.

Oh, it was really an event. So I missed a good half of Monster Jam both looking for and then panicking over. Oh, Sally. Really? Oh, my God. The hero of all heroes. Wow. Yeah.

I mean, if you were to ask me at some point what I would pay for his safe return, it would have been embarrassing. I know, but that's life. It's like you can't, you can't buy health. Well, actually, I mean, to an extent you can, which is a problem. But, you know, that's why health is the most important thing we have. And just being there, I guess. Being alive. Yeah, being there.

Being present. Well, I'm also grateful because I immediately got codependent for the girl. The friend. Can you imagine? No, I know. So that was all happening. She now feels so guilty and she's crying. Delta is crying inconsolably. Yep. Her friend's crying.

Yeah. This is the worst day. I'm like the dad watching. And so I kept going, oh, sweetie, it's totally okay. Delta should have been carrying her own bag. Oh, that's nice. Yeah. I was like trying to comfort her and trying to comfort Delta.

Her Groot is in there too. Oh, it is? She's got the double whammy. She's lost her stuffy and she lost Delta stuffy. Who was her stuffy? I didn't get a good gander at it once. They were all reunited. I didn't even know we were bringing stuffies to Monster Jam.

Not anymore. I hope not. And then, okay, now this is the thing that we go back to. We've been talking about this the last few episodes. I'm like, and I'm talking to Charlie and Eric, I'm like, you know, all I got to do is keep trying to find Groot and not say this is why we don't. What you want to say as a parent is this is why we don't bring toys to sporting events.

And I was like, she has learned that lesson. I don't need to tell her that. She is in major discomfort. Yeah. And so I let it go. But then I, on the way home, I was just saying how grateful I was that he was back. He was slipping it in a little bit? A little bit.

And then I said, he's just so valuable. We got to make sure that we're safe when we bring a place. She goes, but he can't just be a boy that lives at home and doesn't go and do things. I can't just be protecting him from. And I'm like, I know that's a great point. But there's a ton of things we can take him to so he's not stuck in the house. But that are also maybe not so distracting as Monster Camp. This is complex because this is how you feel about your kids.

This is how you parent them. You're like, you know, I'm going to let them go explore the world. and another person could say, look, they're a little too valuable for that. Don't let them just go down the street to Ralph's where there's crazies. Yeah. So it looks like she's inherited my parenting. Looks like it's nurture. Yeah, in this case.

Wow. Yeah. I'm grateful. I'm so grateful. I would have been really. Yeah, it would have been so sad if group, I mean, it would have been happy for him if he was on an adventure, but we know that really he would have gone in there. A trash.

Well, he's, he's so cute. Dax, missing persons after like 48 hours, they're dead. Okay, so you think he might someone murder him? Trash. Okay. I just can't imagine holding that little guy. He's so sweet-looking. Oh, I know.

I told him that that's why I didn't know he had a disability because he's so, oh, he's so smiley. I have no idea he's suffering from anything. He's in a perpetually great mood. Well, that's the thing. Is he in pain? It sounded like there's some pain accompanying these. Okay.

Yeah. The whole carbon dioxide thing is... Trick her into getting like pain meds for them. I might see if we can get some nerve blockers. Oh my God. Wow, that isn't quite an adventure. I'm... Yeah.

I'm really glad that had a happy ending. Oh, me too. Anything fun happened to you? Yeah. Okay, so you've been gone a couple days. Yeah. In the meantime, I've watched two full seasons of you, the show you. Oh.

Which reminds me I want to play the thing. That's a show about me. Exactly. It's about time that we revisit that because I'm watching it. Oh, it's such a great exchange. Okay. Laura Ingram? Yeah.

You want me to put on the TV? Oh, yeah, he can. This is my favorite clip of all time. And now it has extra meaning because I'm watching the show. Is it a great show? I love it. It has really Veronica Mars vibes. Oh, fun.

But it's like Dexter meets Veronica Mars. But I've never seen Dexter. Okay, let's watch this real quick. Yeah. You know, I was watching an episode of you where measles came up. Wait, wait, wait, when did I mention measles? I don't know. It was on you. I never had the measles.

It was on you. We never did a measles of a vaccine episode. Is this a joke? I know. It was on you. It was on you I've never had Raymond

I've never had me I'm talking about stupid it was an episode of a show Laura What's it called You

I just completely give up We got to go I give up Called you on Netflix It's a show called Lori. I'm moving on to Adele

I can't explain this dude What was he talking about So stupid So funny. It's a real life who's on first. It really is. Yeah.

Oh my God. Anyway, so yeah, I started you random. It like popped up as the next. This never works out. Right, right. Auto-recommend. Or whatever. And I was like, sure, why not?

Watch the whole thing. And then last night stayed up so late. I couldn't even look at the time I was too afraid to look. Oh, wow. And watched all of season two. How many episodes in each? 10. So you watch 20 episodes.

They're like 45-ish minutes. Whoa. Yes. Oh my God. Okay. So it is Penn Badgley from Gossip Girl, who I loved back then, Dan Humphrey. Okay. Great.

And he recently, he has a podcast, but also I saw, there's like an Instagram kind of viral video of him like dancing on one of these talk shows. And I was like, well or? Well. Okay. In my opinion. Yeah. And so I was like, oh, yeah, I love him.

Oh, yeah. And then he pops up. So dancing is attractive. I guess it. You know what? It is. Okay. I'm going to circle back.

I didn't say it wasn't. Right, right, right. You just didn't put it very high on the list. Yeah, but turns out it's really high. Yeah. So anyway, then it pops up and he is a, he's a stalker. Like, he's obsessed with this woman. Uh-oh.

There's like murder. Oh. He's a psychopath. have. But it's a love story and he's hot. And it's confusing. Yes. It's sexy.

It's scary. Yeah. It's very thin line for women there. Well, I know. And I hated myself, of course. Sure. I heard him say on an interview, something like that. Like, or someone asked like, what do you think of when people say he's hot?

Yeah. And he was like, he's a killer. Right. So I saw that clip before I watched a show and I was like, yeah, he's right. this is, people are crazy. Yeah. And then, of course, I'm like, he's hot. Yeah.

He's also tricky because he's like kind of a good boyfriend if he wasn't a murder and putting people in cages. Right. Yeah. Who just was everyone obsessed with that Salsa was a murderer? Wasn't there recently someone everyone thought was hot? Is it the United Health assassin? Oh, God. The person, like, really horny for him.

Luigi. Luigi. That one I, that's real life, so I find that much more complicated. I do not think he's hot. You don't think he's hot. No, I don't think there's anything good about killing. Would you think he was hot without the murder? There's no way for me to know.

Yeah, you can't go back in time. He's got very powerful eyebrows. I don't think murder is hot in real life. And I don't think vigilantes are hot. Okay. I'm going to say that. Good to know. I'm not.

There's a lot. of people that are like good for him. Oh yeah. And I disagree. Yeah. Yeah. I disagree. Holy.

Yeah. I think that industry is evil and I don't think you're allowed to kill people. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. Except and the show, sometimes he does kill some people I really don't like. Mm-hmm. And it is vigilante.

And like, it's for kids. He's protect. Sometimes he protects kids. He's weird. He's like kind of this like good friend. Hard to pin down. Mixed messages. Really, really mixed messages.

Anyway, I am loving it. Oh, wow. That's great. Five seasons. Oh, so you're fucked for the whole week. I know. So what time did you go to bed? Do you know?

I really don't know, but I was so tired when my alarm went off at nine. Okay. Yeah. And so when I had to go back to bed. Probably three. Wow, you're nasty. I can't help myself. I know.

You're indulgent. And because. I'm scared a little. Like, it's very cliffhangery. It's very good at keeping you on the hook. So I'm a little too scared in those scenarios to go to bed. Like, I need to know how it's completed. But they do a good job at the end of each season.

You never know. I did star episode three, but then I was like, Monica, no. Yeah, you got to stop. I got to stop. So I turned it off about halfway through that. When I woke up this morning after so much murder. Yeah. I was like, I think I need to take a break today.

Uh-huh. Because it really gets infiltrated. And then it made me think this is what's happening with boys and video games. Oh. They're just, it's like a constant, they're living in this world that's dark and bleak and they're shooting people and stuff. And then like reality starts to disappear. Hmm. You're feeling that happened to you?

Well, I just could see it. This is your OCD. Like, this is. You think you're a killer or you think you're a pervert. I don't. Okay. In this show, it's a lot of voiceover because you're hearing his thoughts. Yeah.

And so then today, I was kind of hearing my thoughts like that. Right. And I thought I need to take a break. Yeah, take a little break. No, but I also really want to know what happens. Keep going. Right. Let's see if there's anything else I want to talk about you.

You know, you're really tunnel vision. It is easy. I get why. I get how it happens. He's only so culpable. It was very confusing. But it was just. And he didn't do a good job.

Like he should have recognized what was going on much sooner and said it's a television show on Netflix and the title is you. And the title is you. Y oh you. Yes. And not Laura Ingraham. But he did end up saying it's a show on Netflix called you. And she still. But he did say I was watching.

watching you about seven times before it's a show on Netflix. It's so good. I almost feel like it's fake and I don't want to like look too. I don't think so. I don't either. He's such a genuine reaction from her. All right. Well, that's it.

Let's move into facts. Yeah, yeah, facts. Stay tuned for more armchair expert if you dare. So facts for Nick Kroll. When he said daddy's money when he brought that, I keep thinking how. funny that was when he said that. Do you remember that? Yes. I don't care because I have daddy's money.

Yeah. That was so funny. Also, I wrote down specifically when he said, Sick little cutie. I laughed so hard at Sick Little Cutie. I thought that was the funniest. It was just a sick little cutie. Yeah, he was a mess. He was coughing and snort and a little indigestion there for a minute. I fucking loved it. It was great. And then I was kind of like, oh, sick little cutie is kind of like my kink. That is your kink. Sick little cutie.

That could be your clothing line. Sick little kuties. Sick little kuties. Anyway, that was just, I really made me laugh. He's so funny. But it's more than that. He's got that thing some people have where he is just like infinitely comfortable in his own skin, which is so appealing.

Yeah. It's such a comforting personality type. It is. Yeah. The women came after me. Should I tell you that? What do you mean? The women, my, what I thought was an incredibly obvious joke about period, period underwear and Tampax.

Such a joke. Some women really came at me hard. I think they also might, I don't know if they really think that or if they're like playing along. They're playing your role maybe. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. We really did uncover, though, something with the X. Yeah, I know. Because MaxiPad. Yeah. TamaxiPad would have been the first. Probably. Yeah.

And then Nix. And then. Thanks. What is it? Thinks. That's another brand of. Spanx. And they go on your, they cover your.

Okay. Yeah, women. X because X. Someone said that. Someone suggested that in the comments. And I think that's brilliant. and I don't think that's what it is, but that's a brilliant.

How could you possibly know? I'm just trying to imagine the tampax people going like, okay, let's call it, it's a tampon, but let's build on that and let's add X because of the chromosome. I just, I, what's your, what's your, you know, idea? That they wanted to imbue a sense of max,

like max comfort, max absorption, Max freshness. Max, what was the word? Huh? They had the word attached to Tampax in the ad we showed. Oh, Radiant. Max radiance. But it's not, it's Tampax.

Yeah. Not TAMX. Tampximum. I think it's X chromosome. That's good. It's good. We'd have to track down whoever named. MaxiPad.

That's the original. I bet you can do that and come back to us. Do you think they're alive? Oh, probably their kids or kids of kids. Okay. Well, while you read a fact, I'm going to ask AI if the inventor of Maxipads is still alive. Okay, great. Is the inventor of MaxiPads still alive?

If people listen to the CTE episode with Chris Nguinsky and then also it came up in another episode, The Peababy. Uh-huh. We had AI make a video of us originally talking about the Peababy. the original story of Peababy. Oh, really? Yeah. And I'm going to post it tomorrow. But so by the time you listen to this, it will be posted.

And I really, really recommend people going to watch this. It'll be on our Instagram. Because for one, the story is just, you need a good reminder of the Peababy. But the AI is hilarious. Oh, I can't wait to see it. And it's like a version of you and me. The AI made versions of us. It's so funny.

Well, I can't wait to see. Yeah. Were you holding this as a surprise for me? No. I just forgot. I'm doing stuff. I'm doing things to do. Anyway, so check that out.

Check out the P-Baby and the AI. It just reminded me, AI. Okay, great. Did it respond? Well, it had to have. Mary Beatrice Davidson Kenner, an African-American inventor is renowned for her development of the adjustable sanitary belt, a precursor to the modern maxi-pad. Okay, so they really went back.

that was 1912. Oh, wow. She passed away in 06, so that's off the table. Kenner's invention patented, and it featured a moisture-proof pocket design to hold menstrual pads securely in place, the innovation. Okay. We're in crissor face racial discrimination. That's a bummer, and of course was awarded five patents. In summary, Mary Beezis Davis and Kenner passed away, and I was like, okay, so I don't know if we're giving her credit for a maxi-pad or she did the belt.

Okay. Okay. All right, so we didn't learn anything. Nothing, absolutely nothing. Great. Now, what are the most watch shows on Netflix? This is on Wikipedia. And notoriously, Netflix doesn't really release this information.

Or they do it weird. They'll do like a minute. So I just saw this. And congrats to Dumas and Minka Kelly. Oh, Ransom Canyon. Ransom Canyon has 2.6 billion minutes viewed. And to put it in perspective, Mobland, which I love. and is seemingly hit, everyone I know is watching it, at like 580 million.

So a four and a half X of second place. But they do minutes, right? So that's an interesting way to quantify it. Interesting. As opposed to like households who watched it. Is it minutes or hours? Minutes. Interesting.

Okay, well, this is just Wikipedia. Oh, and it's most popular television series by hours watching their first 28 days. Number one is Squid Games season one. Yeah. Stranger Things is number two. Three is Wednesday. Okay. Four is Squid Game Season 2.

Mm-hmm. Five is Dahmer Monster, the Jeffrey Dahmer story. Wow. I wouldn't have picked that up just from walking around and people telling me to watch stuff. Yeah. That one's a surprise for me. Six is Money Heist. That was a big, big show.

Yes, I think maybe it was in Spanish, I think. Yeah, Anna turned us on to it. She loved it. Yeah. Oh, wait, no, sorry. So six is Money Heist Part 5. Okay. Interesting.

Seven, eight, and nine are Bridgerton, Season 1, 2, and 3. Uh-huh. And then 10, Money Heist, Part 4. Okay. 11 Stranger Things. I need to give Money Heist another shot. It was it was subtitled. Yeah, I think so.

I know I would watch that. I'm still in ER. Oh, I know when I started, which is so fucking good. The pit. Deli Boys. Oh, I want to watch Jelly Boys. You got to try it. Yeah, I want to.

It's such a unique tone that they are pulling off beautifully. Nice. It's fantastic. Cool. I love that. You know, I like discovering these hiccups in my thinking. Uh-huh. And so there's a joke in Delhi Boys.

They have to deal with this Italian mob boss quite often. And they're Pakistani. And the patriarch, not even the patriarch, one of the partners in the criminal organization, an older guy, he hates Indians. He's constantly talking about how he hates Indians. And so he's sitting across from this Italian mobster. And he says, Pakistani, but I'm telling the truth. Indians are terrible. and the Italian goes, oh, I thought you were Indian.

And he goes, no, I'm not. They are our mortal enemy. And then the Italian mobster goes, so you guys look identical to each other and you hate one another? And he goes, oh, Cookie just got canceled. He's like a, then they all laugh the notion of a mobster could get canceled. Oh, oh, that's funny. But then I was like, I think people do go, how do these two people. hate each other so much. They're clearly related.

And then I was like, yeah, I would never think that about the Irish and the English. Exactly. The French and the English. Yeah. And then I wondered if people in India are looking at those people going like, wait, you guys are the same people. Why are you fighting? Well, I wonder if it's like whatever in group you're in the out. It seems crazy on the outside.

It's always about land and religion often. Religion. But yeah, who owns what? Yeah. I mean, that's that's very timely because. India and Pakistan were. Well, this was obviously made before they've now launched missiles at each other. Exactly. But they're in a ceasefire.

Yeah. But anyway. Okay, Seth McFarlane and Nick that conversation, that's on the SAG after Foundation YouTube. Yeah. So you can watch that there if you're interested in animation. Pretty unique conversation. Okay. The seasons of Seth McFarland shows, how many?

Family Guy, 23 seasons. American Dad 19 seasons, Cleveland Show four seasons. 46. Wow. 46 television. 46 seasons of television. That's really it. That's all the facts.

Yeah. Well, Nick Kroll, we love you. Well, there was one. We pray for your speedy recovery. He's going to be sick for another 10 years or so. Yeah. Like six. Six more years he's got of being sick.

We're not sick anymore. Well, you kind of are. You're still kind of sick. Probably more sick than I was pre-kids in general. Yeah. But like they just stop putting their fingers in each other's mouths and butts. And like they just, they get a little more separated as they get older.

Speaking of kids. Yeah. I wasn't sure if I was going to bring this up, but why not? Yeah, why not? I said I was racist, you know. Well, no, this isn't negative towards kids. Well, right. And I'm just saying I revealed a lot that I had some vestigial racial thinking that I called myself.

Sure, yeah. Mother's Day, we just had Mother's Day, right? Yeah. It's getting increasingly harder for me. Okay. And I think from like so many reasons I feel overwhelming. Yeah. And I'm just tracking that.

Mm-hmm. that it's starting to feel really tough. I'm glad I go home. I go home. I've gone home the last couple of years. And it's nice to be with my mom. And I know it makes them very happy. So I like doing that.

But there is something about being there that's hard. When I'm there, especially for moments, events, yearly events, the passage, like time starts to feel very oppressive, the passage of time. Yeah. You know, we go to the same places and, you know, I'm going to this like mall that I went to when I was in high school and to see it be so much the same and also so different. It's just, it feels, it feels sad. It feels melancholic.

Right. And then seeing my parents' age. Yes. Is so hard. The lack of permanence to everything. Yes. Yeah. And I can kind of Buddhism.

I know. And when I'm not there, I can detach from it when I'm here. And you can keep it time locked in your mind and memory. Yes. And I think I can just compartmentalize in a way. Like they're there and that's happening. But I'm not seeing day to day like the little things that are changing. So it's kind of hard to be there.

I'm glad I make that decision. That's a little hard. And then I also know being here would be hard because all of my friends have kids. And that is painful in its own way. And like it just feels sort of like this day's hard. Is it painful because you feel like you're missing out on the mothering experience? Or is it painful because you feel excluded from your friends in a way? Which pain is it?

I think it's both. I think it's so tricky because it's not like on a day to day, I think, of the pain of not having children. But on that day, I am just very aware that I don't. Yeah. And that it's not, it wasn't really a choice. It's just the way my life went, right? Unfolded. Yeah.

It unfolded in this way. I made decisions that took me in certain places. I know, I'm not married to my high school sweetheart. I didn't have one, you know, and yeah, I'm just like aware like, oh, my life hasn't gone. Didn't go that way. Right. And yes, I can still make decisions that might lead to that. But it's different.

It's like really different now. Me having a kid now is a real choice. It is not like, oh, I fell in love with this person. And then maybe we'll have kids. That's the next step. It's, I have to make. Oops, I'm pregnant. What do we do?

Fuck it. Let's do it. It's real, real hard decision making. Yeah. It kind of, I don't, yeah. And that's, that's an annoying thing to have to think about. Yeah. So, yeah, I guess I'm just sharing it was a hard day.

Closer or further. I don't know. Like, it, it makes me feel, feel like, oh, I wish I had that. but does it make me feel like I'm going to take those steps to do it? If I were you, I would just want to be crystal clear if it is a desire to have the experience versus the A student in you. I know. That's hard to know which is driving it.

But I think one is worth chasing and one is worth overcoming. Yeah, I know. I don't know. Again, that's a question that I have to ask, that I'm kind of resentful that I have to ask, resentful towards my, towards life, I guess, because I know that if I was married and in a partnership, I would, I would have kids. Right. I would want that.

Yeah. So. What does a guy in your situation do? Like, what is this 37 year old guy who can't go get a donor? Well, they could. I mean, yeah, they could. then they got to get a surrogate. And it's definitely more complicated.

You're like, you're a stop at a sperm bank away from having a kid. Well, maybe. Well, maybe because of fertility. Exactly. But, you know, like a dude who's not loaded and can't pay for a surrogate and an egg and all that stuff. I wonder how they wrestle with it, you know? Yeah.

I mean, I assume it's the same feeling. and the same thing. Like, I guess I have to figure out if I'm going to, like, just be with a person I don't want to be with or take those steps. In some ways, I mean, it's all hard,

but I think for a man, if they have the means, I mean, a lot of women don't have the means to do any of this either. How much is a sperm donor? That's not terribly expensive. But to your egg, like, you know, do retrievals and it's expensive.

But let's just say you... You have to, remove the eggs in order to make the embryo to plant. Oh, they can't put a baster in you and do it? Oh, they can try it. Yeah, some people, that works for some people. It's pretty hard for it to take, but it works for some people. But then if that doesn't work, you spend money doing that and then you have to, you know,

it's a lot. Right. But for a man, they can make the embryo, you know, they'll take the egg, the sperm, they'll make the embryo and then they'll implant it into a surrogate. Yeah, I imagine that's a pricey endeavor. I'm sure. Fertility is so expensive. Another thing that's like that's a cost that it wouldn't be a cost.

I mean, having kids is an insane cost in general. To your mental health. Yeah, diapers. Diapers. Ding, ding, dang. That came up in Nick Krolls fat. Types. Your dipes and they went bankrupt. Yeah, my dipes went bankrupt.

Bad for business. Anyway, I just thought I would share it because I'm sure it's complicated for a lot of people. Surely, Mother's Day. For so many reasons. Carrie sent me this incredible post that a girl at our high school had put on Facebook. And she was a grade younger than us, I believe. I didn't like, of course, I didn't recognize her right away, but it was this really heartfelt, beautiful post about the complicated nature of Mother's Day and how she basically had to say goodbye to her mom at 16 because the mom moved Arizona and the mom was not healthy mom.

And so this girl was living, going to my school. Yeah. Living on her own. Oh my God. Paying for an apartment. She sent it to me because she goes, side note, that's fun. I was once in detention. And Dak Shepard said to me, what they put you in for?

Oh, that's funny. And then went on to say, don't worry about all this. Your life's really going to start in two minutes. And I know mine's not ending here in this. Oh, wow. Whether I said that or not, who knows, maybe in her mind, I said that. But I'm delighted that on that detention, should we had, you know, like a fun. Yeah, an interaction.

Yeah. But it was just a really sweet post and a reminder of like, man, some kids, like the experience can be so radical. Carrie sent it to me going, I'm such a fucking asshole for bitching about my two loving parents who, you know, whatever. Yeah. But like it's hard. But there's kids in your high school that are like, they're supporting themselves and living an apartment. Yeah. And they don't have any parents.

Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, well, that's it. All right. Love you.