Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard - Synced: My Best Friend's Boobs

Episode Date: September 20, 2023

In this episode of Synced, Monica and Liz chat about naked bodies, Liz teaches Monica about underwater hockey, and they debate how one never knows what is going on behind closed doors or social media captions. They discuss listener questions about whether there is such a thing as too much therapy, would they want to know if their parents cheated, and how much should parents contribute financially to a wedding? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello. Hello. Morning time. Good morning. How are you today? I'm good. I just had a lot of dreams. You know when you wake up and you're like, that was 18 movies.

Just starring all the people in my life. Or people used to be in my life. I'm sure I'm not allowed to bring this up. But then you have to. Well, it's not my thing to tell. Even better. A friend of ours had a dream about you. But okay, I think you might have misunderstood exactly what it was.

This person had a dream that there was a big group trip happening. And I was there and you were there and a lot of our friends were there. You were taking videos throughout the trip as you do. They were really good as they are and well produced. Oh my God, we have this on the record. Finally. You've stopped eye rolling. Even if I don't like them, I recognize that they're good and they're well produced. That doesn't mean I like being in them. Okay, got it, got it, got it. They are very good. You're very talented. And then in this dream, you got the footage from like the ring cam and like the security cameras in the house that we were staying in. And you were like

splicing in footage that we didn't know. Like we didn't know we were in and they were like us naked. And this person was masturbating. It was like Black Mirror. You were just like splicing in our real life within these nice produced cute videos. Isn't that crazy? I misread that completely. Yeah. I have a tendency to read things too quickly. So I skip words. When I got the text, I was on a run. How I read it was you were making videos that were becoming more and more sexual and you were masturbating. I didn't realize that I was exploiting people in this video. I read a very rose-colored glasses version. I was a little weirded out by this person saying that I was masturbating in their dream. I was like, that's a little much. But this feels worse,

though. Maybe you were, but I know this person also was, and I was also naked in it. So there was a lot. Everyone was naked. Yes. I thought this was so interesting. For one, I just thought it was funny because that's bizarre. So then I asked them, so you saw me naked in your mind, but you don't know what I look like naked. So I really am curious about the version that this person saw versus the reality. Oh, I like that. This is a close friend. So they know me in like a bathing suit and stuff.

They know essentially what my body looks like, but nobody knows what your body really looks like unless you're fully naked in front of them. I feel like I know what your body looks like naked. No, you don't. I think I do. Okay, but you don't. You don't think you do with me?

No. I think I know what a lot of your body looks like based on a bathing suit. Yeah. Maybe you'd be surprised by like one little element, but mostly you'd get it right. Although sometimes you get pop-outs. Like every now and then I'll see someone close to me's boobs or something. Yes. And I will be surprised. Yeah. Boobs really come in all different shapes and sizes.

I would love to know what other, well, not other people, but some people. What their boobs look like. What their boobs look like and what they think my boobs look like. That's my whole point. That's what I'm saying. Isn't it really just nipples? Exactly. I guess it's nipples. That's mainly it. Because obviously, you know, size and stuff based on definitely bathing suits and tight shirts or whatever. Well, this person did say, I said, oh, God, I wonder what you pictured. And they said the same thing you just said. Just like, I know what it looks like.

And I was like, no, you don't. And then they're like, I do think I got it a little wrong because Liz's boobs were bigger. And I was like, yeah, she has small boobs. Oh, my God. God, any flashbacks? Being 14. I kind of like that he imagines me with big boobs. I mean, I am attracted to women. I prefer bigger boobs.

But that's probably because you have smaller boobs. So everyone just wants what they don't have. I would love to have... Don't say it. I would. You have the most perfect... Don't. I would love to have very small boobs.

You can't say that publicly. You can't. I just said it. You can't. You have the ideal body. You can't. I'm just telling you, people are going to be mad. People are going to be mad at you because there's no such thing as the ideal body.

And I mean that not from a feminist standpoint. I really do mean that. Because there are so many shirts and shit that I cannot wear. Or I just do wear, but it doesn't look nearly as good as it would if I had a flatter chest. Right. And vice versa. I love my boobs now, but I really was insecure about it. Just as a teenager, too.

Like when I played underwater hockey with an all-male team. What's that mean, underwater hockey? You're below water? Yes, you're below. You don't know this? No. Okay, underwater hockey, there's a goal in the shallow end. There's a goal in the deep end. The stick is shorter, so it's about this big, like a ruler size, but it's like curvy. And then the puck is heavier, so it sinks to the bottom of the pool. And then you have defense and you have like the same. And then you switch because obviously it's way harder when your goal is in the deep end to defend. And so you switch every like, I don't remember, 15 minutes. And it's the hardest.

I did synchronized swimming. Yeah. And that was hard. This was so hard for me. That sounds impossible. How do you stay underwater that long? You have flippers. You have a mask so you can watch the game and breathe and then choose when to go down. Oh, we should go play. Yeah,

I'm definitely playing that. You won't even go on hikes with me. I won't even swim across the pool. That's the quickest way to get me to die. Ding, ding, ding. Last week's episode of how I die. You forced me to do underwater hockey. I don't think we have that here. Google it. I've never heard of it. It started in New Zealand. You should. Oh, my God.

It should be a flight of spurs. Go to David's pool. Oh, my God. David knows about it. Let's call David. David probably knows about it. Okay. I'm calling him.

David's not a sports guy. But also. No, he's a New Zealand guy. But also, of course, it started in New Zealand because it sounds so childish. Everything's babyish, like cookie time and baby. How quick was my pickup? Okay, David, you're on synced. Oh, hello.

We have a question for you. Are you aware of underwater hockey? Yeah, water polo. That's different than water polo. No, water polo is different than underwater hockey. Do you know about underwater hockey? No, I've never heard of underwater hockey. Exactly.

It sounds ridiculous, and I don't think it's real. I agree. Google. Liz is saying that it started in New Zealand, and so we were checking. I played it competitively, and I know my history. You don't know that it started in New Zealand, and you don't know it exists? It started in England, actually. Oh, fuck.

South Sea, England in 1954. But wait, it does say New Zealand, but in another... It says New Zealand, Great Britain, France, Turkey, Australia, South Africa, and Colombia are the leading underwater hockey nations. Okay. And David doesn't even know. Well, of course he doesn't know know Because I do think you dreamt it I think this is all made up

I have photos Of competition Oh my god For the record I think any sport That's a regular sport But then you just decide To put it underwater

Shouldn't count as a sport I agree I'm so hurt right now Wait is synchronized swimming Not a real sport? No that's a real That's half above water Some of it is all underwater

It can't is all underwater. It can't be all underwater. You can't even see the synchronization. To lift people up, you have to do lifts and you're underwater. Okay, but the whole sport isn't underwater. The sport we do have in New Zealand that I think is very New Zealand is we have competitive sheep shearing where we have competitions to see how quickly you can shear the wool off the sheep. Wait, I love that.

That's not a sport. That's just an activity. Yeah, okay, good point. I'll see myself out. Wait, for about 20 seconds, Rob, David, and I were on the same page. That's the longest it's ever been. Aligned against Liz.

I'm happy, yeah. Common enemy, that'll happen. Okay, bye, David. Bye, guys. Bye. Oh, man. All right, well, I'm sorry that. That'll happen. Okay. Bye, David. Bye, guys. Bye. Oh, man. All right. Well, I'm sorry that happened to you, but you did get schooled.

Schooled in what way? I'd done it for several years. I have photos of the competitions that we did. I can call up many of my friends who were on the team with me. There was only one team in Montreal, so I had to play with the middle-aged men and teenagers. It was like a mix of people. Because there was only one team. Which.

It's kind of. That goes to show how small the sport is. I'm not saying it's not a small sport. I was just saying it's from New Zealand. Right. But that's wrong. Ish. They play it there.

It's a leading. Okay. Anyway. What am I arguing for? I don't know. I played underwater hockey. You did. And I don't even know how we got here. We were talking about boobs. Anyway, did you have, were you insecure

about how developed you were as a kid? That's sort of the point is everyone is insecure about their body, regardless of what it looks like and regardless of what other people think their body should look like, because it's all so different. And yeah, I was definitely insecure, but that's why I can't really win. But you like your boobs. I like what they look like naked. They do get in my way a ton when I'm like buying clothes or shopping or I think everyone can relate to this. There's always something about somebody else that you wish you had. But nipples are so different across the board. And I do think what people imagine in their head is not always accurate. I don't know if I'm imagining people's nipples though. Are you? If I'm thinking about someone's boob, I'm not

imagining it without a nipple. Right. Rob, you've seen a lot of nipples. Do you feel surprised most of the time at what they look like? Or is it mostly what you expect it to look like? There's usually some surprise. There's some variance there. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. Even just as a straight woman seeing my friend's boobs, it's always like, oh, wow. I guess really what I imagine always is probably my nipples.

I'm just projecting that everyone's nipples probably look like mine because that's what I'm used to. And then they don't. The body is fascinating. Do you remember going to the swimming pool with your mom and then just seeing... No, I'm going to stop you there. No. Right. Sorry.

To play underwater hockey? No. Okay. Not swimming, but being in a changing room, basically. Oh, okay. And suddenly seeing so many vaginas and boobs and pubes. I'm imagining like the Ferris Bueller song, this intense experience of just being exposed to so many bodies and being like, oh my God, women's bodies. Because you had only seen your mom. Right.

If anything, I feel like that's a universal experience. It is. Or even like at school you would change and and you'd be so curious i mean but then you don't want to look well that's interesting because when i was younger the adult female body was way more like yes jarring and scarring than when you're in your own locker room at pe.E. Do you guys have P.E.? We do. Okay. What do you think?

Look, we just don't know about what everyone has, okay? And I just want to be respectful and ask. Speaking of, this is so funny. Did you watch my video? So our friend Ana, me and you were at Kara, shout out, per usual, and we were doing computer work. That's what I call working on your computer. Yeah. Computer work. We were there for hours. And as I was getting ready to leave, I got a text from her. Oh, if you haven't left it, can you get me a burrata? And

then, but like 14 versions of the word burrata. And then eventually she said, that was Siri trying to say burrata. And I was like, okay, whatever. You know, I just get this text. That's it. And then later her girlfriend had posted a video of her dictating that into the phone. And so I spliced it together and it really, really made me laugh. It's funny. Different cultures, you know, because of her accent. I mean, I assume that's why, but it's very interesting because Anna can try to like do an American version of her accent. And David does this too. I do it too, all the time.

We adjust to you because or else you don't know what we're talking about. How do you speak normal? Cirque du Soleil. That's not how we say it. It's Soleil, but if I say it the right way, you don't know what I'm talking about. I understand. Yeah, that makes sense. It's like the Frigidaire or whatever.

Which, by the way, I thought about this morning. An additional fun fact about Frigidaire is that we also shortened it to Frigo. We don't even say the name of the brand. We just like make it our own. Also interesting, just speaking about different languages, I can do Siri in English on my phone, but I cannot do it in French. Like, if I speak French and I'm writing to anyone in my life that I speak French with, it doesn't know my voice in French. Oh, interesting. And so I wonder if that's also what happened to Anna. I think your phone is getting to know how you talk. But it knows what you're saying in English.

It does. Right. But not in French because it hasn't, I don't know, learned it. But we have to be fair to Ana and David that they have accents. Okay. You speak French perfectly and then you speak French in the way that French is supposed to be spoken. Okay. When I speak English, I don't sound. You don't have an accent. I used to, but yeah. Really?

Oh my God, yes. I sounded like Celine Dion. Do it. I'll close my eyes. There's actually a voicemail at my parents' house. We could listen to it and that's how I used to talk. Oh, yes. I sounded like Celine Dion. Do it. I'll close my eyes. There's actually a voicemail at my parents' house. We could listen to it and that's how I used to talk. Oh, wow. If no one answers, you'll hear my voice and be like, oh, that's different.

Oh, they still have a landline. In their little cottage. Oh, cute. Let's see if it works. Because sometimes when I hit the voicemail, I'm like, oh man, that is me. But I've... It's before I was... How old were you?

Probably like 18. So many phone calls on this. Oh, no. They took it off? Why? I don't know. So sad. I'll just text them about the answering machine at the cottage.

But yeah, it's like, you have reached 544. Like, okay, you're closing the door. I remember it was like, bonjour. you have reached 544 like okay i remember it was like bonjour you have reached 566 i had to lisp a little bit more too okay 0524 please leave us a message it was like that but that sounds actually more american that was canadian yeah the french canadian accent is like uh so like do you understand the the way that we that's really like i never talked as much like that i didn't have an accent that was that thick but it's a little bit like uh you know we add a lot of us and uh do it like this and uh you know monica padman and her podcast it's really

good it would be like that you know yeah that is specific it's a very specific accent when i hear someone talk i'm like i know it's so fun because you get to be like, oh my God. Oh my God. Yeah. Are you good at accents in general because of that? No. No? I don't think so.

We won't put it to the test because it might end up racist. It will. You can't do accents anymore. I think it's... Well, Meryl Streep can. Well, Meryl Streep can do whatever she wants. I know. On Only Murders in the Building this season, there's a scene where she's, they're doing a play and they're at the table read and she starts doing these

different accents and it's unbelievable. You forget how good she is because she's so natural and then that comes into play and you're like, oh, this human, how? My dad, I don't think it works anymore since we changed our telephone service provider. How sad. He should have warned you so you could have saved him. I know, so sad. All right. Well, I guess back to boobs. Do you think that we've evolved when it comes to our acceptance of women's diversity of bodies and boobs? I think it's more just knowledge. I mean, and also to be fair, I guess men have known this for a long time because they have seen a lot of boobs.

But I think it's actually women that don't know. Like I just said, I just project my own body onto other people's bodies. And same with vaginas and vulvas. Like that Goop episode they did where they showed all of those different women's vulvas. Yeah. I was shocked.

Do you feel like yours is changing? Not really. Is yours? I think it might be. What way? But I don't know if it's just that I haven't, because I don't pay that much attention to it. Do you mean aesthetically or internally?

I don't know internally. I haven't been there. Oh. How would you know? With vagina bubbles, I'm saying, is there like something happening internally that you feel is different? Or are you talking about aesthetics? I mean, I think both. I think it's a very fragile ecosystem.

Microbiome. Microbiome. And that it's related to your gut and it's related to your stress and it's related to so many different things. And men, again, because it's on the outside, it's the same skin. You know that, right? Same skin as what? The penis and the vagina. It's the same skin. So when people say, you know, oh, vaginas have a smell like they don't, it's literally the same thing. It's just that ours is on the inside and guys have it on the outside.

Well, okay. I have to push back a little bit on the fact that we have to acknowledge that there's a different smell often from a penis and a vagina. I think that that is not a result of the internal physicality of the organ. I think that that's as a result of how it is. Wait, what do you mean how it is? That it's the same skin. Well, it's not the skin that's making the smells. Right. Well, that's as a result of how it is. Wait, what do you mean how it is? That it's the same skin. Well, it's not the skin that's making the smells. Right. Well, that's what I'm saying. Oh, I don't think anyone thinks that.

It's internal. Right. But I think some people, I mean, there's a lot of myths about vaginas. There's a billion-dollar industry that's around cleaning your vagina and douches and products that actually threaten your vaginal, you know, health more than actually help it. That comes from these myths that women need to clean the insides or again, put stuff up there when it's at self-cleaning. So self-cleaning of it. It is.

That's what they say. I agree with all that, but I think it is actually, it's because there's so much microbiome in a vagina that is not there in a penis. Yes. And that's why women are more likely to get HIV more than men. Same thing with a lot of STDs. Well, it's an open wound. I don't know if it's a wound. I mean, sometimes. Yes. Emotionally. Yeah, yeah. We are supported by Skims. I am so thrilled. We would do this for free. We should not say that, but we just said it. I wore a Skims outfit to my birthday party. That's how much I love it.

I think I saw like 10 separate occasions where someone complimented you on your outfit and you said it's Skims. And it's so comfy and stylish, which I feel like is a rare combo. And that's everything on Skims. Everything looks so cute and people will comment on how cute you look. And it's so comfy. Like you can wear what I wore to my birthday party on a plane. I recently just tried the Fits Everybody collection. I got the boy shorts, which I'm a big, big fan. And I got the t-shirt bra because I do have boobs. And it's really hard to find a good bra that goes under a t-shirt.

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Thanks, Skims. Have you heard about these? My friend Chelsea went to one of these. It's like a vagina retreat, basically. Like to make it feel happy? To make it feel happy. What do they do? A lot of different things. Like there's a whole thing about your body, a lot of different meditations. I think you give your vagina a name and then you are having conversations with her. What if your vagina is a boy? That would explain a lot. What if your vagina identifies as a boy? Like we can't control that. We can't control that. I would welcome it.

It would be discriminatory. It would be discriminatory. So we can't. Wow. Okay. I don't want to go to that. You don't. I feel like you're like four seconds away from saying let's go.

And I'm just going to tell you now. What would you do if I blindfolded you? I was like, okay, it's your birthday. I surprised you with like a really cool thing. And then it was four days

I had a vagina retreat. Where you talked to your vagina. We're in Costa Rica and you can't leave. Yeah, I'd be pissed. You'd go to another resort. Yeah, she would climb the Four Seasons. I would. Oh my God. That actually sounds great. Why does that feel not good? For me? Yeah. That feels like a massive waste of time and energy and I don't need that. Do you have a relationship with your vagina? Do you think it's a healthy one? Yeah, I do actually. Okay. I like my vagina. Okay. And my

vulva. Okay. And you wouldn't want to deepen that spiritual connection. It feels good. That's a little woo-woo for me. But the other day you said you would do breath work and I was so surprised. Breath work, because I do believe in meditation for sure. And I believe in your connection of breath and body. Actually, when I was in college, in theater school, theater major, actually when I was in college in theater school theater major in one of my acting classes my professor whoa ding ding ding that just reminded me I had a crazy dream last night where I was at my old college and only one of my professors came to see me and I was upset only one and you wanted more well it was like a thing like I was gonna be there and everyone was supposed to come and then only one came and he came late it was like oh no no one cares no one cares yeah which is weird but also was fun to revisit my college do you have a lot of dreams about college or high school or yeah I

think so I do a lot of school type dreams okay but sorry so my professor was in her own acting class at the time that was teaching them how to do certain patterns of breath that cause different emotions for acting. So you could do a certain breath pattern that would make you cry or make you feel sad so that you could apply that during acting. Anyway, all to say, I definitely believe in breath and body, but I'm sorry. I just don't believe that I need like a spiritual connection to my vagina vulva. I get confused about vagina versus vulva so I have to say vagina vulva okay slash the vv I was at the doctor the other day and there was a diagram of the female anatomy and I got up and I was like I need to know this and then really remember it and I don't it's it's so hard to

remember I did when I was working in media, tested my male co-workers. This was pre-Me Too, when you could do crazy shit with your co-workers. So I had all my male co-workers draw female anatomy off the cuff without knowing what they were coming to do. And it did really well. It was really funny because they all didn't know where anything was. And then my producers were like, would you be able to do it? And so we had women do it. Yeah, it's not like men don't know anything. It's like women either. I know a lot of us didn't. Well, yeah, that circles back to sort of what we were talking about at the beginning, which is I think in some ways we're not here to give men all the props, but not all, of course. But many of them have seen multiple versions of women's bodies. Yeah.

More than women have. And men have helped me accept my body even more or just as much as I think other women have. Feeling accepted, celebrated, and loved in a radical way by a man, I think is also like amazing. And I think men are more, I mean, there's all these studies, there's conflicting evidence, but that women think that men prefer a certain body type that men don't actually. So women think that men prefer a slimmer body type than they actually do. Yeah. And it's also personal. I think every time we try to do these mass studies, it's hard. It's not accurate. It's just like women. Women have varying degrees of what they like aesthetically in men and women. I think women have different ideas when they see

a woman, what they think is perfect and not. And then for men too. And for men, there's like a status thing where a lot of women on TikTok particularly have been sharing women who identify as fat proudly are like, you have no idea how many hot guys I get. And they just don't talk about, that they want to be with maybe a more slender woman for other men, actually. That is rewarded. Well, as a power status. Yeah. It gives you more status as a man to be with a woman that fits a certain ideal. Like a model type. Yes. Model type, exactly, is a better way to put it. Because that gives them status with other men. It's not actually about a preference for women.

Yes. Which I think is interesting. Yeah, I also think that can be reversed. I think women sometimes think they need this version of a male that's also a model type in order to also achieve status or feel like I got the alpha. Or a guy that like really loves me. Like, I feel like there's a lot of that on social media from, you know, what do you mean? I mean, just like, again, this is like a kind of a viral TikTok, but it was like a woman who has a boyfriend and like she keeps mentioning her boyfriend all the time, right? Or posting a lot about your boyfriend doing all these amazing

things for you. And I think for women, it's less being with a hot guy. I mean, being with a hot guy also has status, but I think it's like being with a guy that like really loves you and is so committed to you. Like it's more commitment porn. Wow, that's funny. I disagree. Okay. I mean, like the long caption. There's these TikToks laughing at that.

At the super long caption about her boyfriend's birthday. I think it was this male comedian. It was really funny. He was talking about this really long caption where clearly her boyfriend kind of sucks. But she's like, I love when you forget things, but like, that's just who you are. And like, that's just us. But that's not men.

That's a woman projecting that they're so in love. But I think that happens. Again, there's a lot of projecting on social media. Oh, yeah. It's the whole purpose of it. What gives you status within your own gender, though, I think is interesting. But I still think men are trying to impress other men

and women are trying to impress other women. Of course. And using the other gender to do that. It is all status. It's within your group. There's a hierarchy. So, okay, question for you personally. Pretend you didn't see that TikTok where you could see it sort of objectively. Are you Liz, someone who reads that and falls for it? Probably more than Monica does. Yeah. I think I fall for stuff. Gullible Liz. I mean, I've heard you so much just say that about certain couples and things that you come across like, oh, they're so in love or they're so perfect together or... Celebrity couples. I used to also... You helped me bring that down from a pedestal or just be more realistic about it because I would buy into... Yeah, I think I buy into stuff. Yeah, which is sweet. Like vagina

retreats. Like, sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I am. I think I'm more skeptical of everything. So if you see a caption like that, what do you think? I'm eye rolling immediately. And then I feel bad. This is the series of events. I eye roll and then I think, actually, it's sweet. This is nice for this person. And then I go again into, is it healthy? Because there's no way all that's real. And why do you feel the need to be so expressive about it? For others, that feels like you're having to prove to yourself that it's, about it. For others, that feels like you're having to prove to yourself that it's, you know, I go down a whole psychoanalyzation. I definitely do not find it aspirational. It's not something I want. Oh, wow. Okay. To like have a partner where I'm writing a paragraph, some paragraphs up. Also, that's just not my writing style. Although maybe my gift guy would say otherwise

it's pretty lengthy. Yeah. You would write lengthy posts about gifts, products, but not about men. Yeah. Well, the other day, Kevin Bacon posted a picture of him and Keira Sedgwick. And it just says 35 years feels like a heartbeat. Hashtag anniversary. That is aspirational to me because that's not proving anything. That's just the truth. It's not trying. And they're not saying like we're perfect or where it's just like we've done this for 35 years, like knowing that it's not been perfect for that whole period of time. I prefer that. What about Ryan Reynolds captions about Blake lively? Let me read some like for her birthday. And he's done the posting bad photos of her. That feels more authentic.

The only thing irrevocably mine in this world is a love and appreciation and awe I feel for this person. Witnessing her life is something I couldn't take for granted if I tried. And believe me, I try. Happy birthday, Blake Lively. You hung the damn moon. Very sweet. Yeah, it's not trying. It's beautifully written.

I agree. I'm not against people showing appreciation of other people on social media. So how should they do it? What should be the rules? No, I don't want rules. Everyone can do whatever they want to do. I just see through a extremely verbose post that for me feels like I want the world to know how in love we are. Because in my head, I'm like, why do you need the world to know that? Because if you know it, that really is enough. The Ryan Reynolds post doesn't feel like he's trying to prove anything. He's just saying, I love this person, which is different.

There's different types. People can post whatever they want. I think it's monitoring how you perceive these things. Yes. I used to think jealousy was just, I think less of myself, but it's you think less of yourself and you think more highly of others than what they probably actually are. Yes. And so both are warped, not only your view of yourself, but the view of other people. That was something I, I mean, I guess I'm still working on, but I think it's less

intense than it used to be. And I didn't even realize that I was doing it. I just was assuming that like everyone else is great. Right. And I'm just broken. And it's like, no, literally everyone has their own little thing. That was something that my parents, especially my mom, had such a constant perspective and voice on. She would always say, you never know what's really happening over there. Because I was always doing so much comparison, especially when I was young, that was her party line. Just like, you have no idea what's really happening over there. Or even when it was like this mom and dad, blah, blah, blah. You don't live in their home. You don't know what's happening, which I was always felt mean. But now I'm like, that's

right. I have internalized that of you have no idea what is really happening with anyone, with any relationship, anything. And it helps me. And it's also real. It's just real. It's realistic. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Similarly, my parents were so on the outside what we were on the inside. And that was really hard for me. And I felt like I wished we could be like the other normal families that were just kind of normal on the outside. And again, probably chaotic. But they weren't. Exactly. Sometimes I wish that my parents would at least try. Yes, just be, quote, normal. But that's so fucked up because there is no such thing as that. And

actually, in hindsight, the people who were acting, quote, normal or very presentational, they are the ones doing a disservice because they're acting like there's a perfect way to be and there's not. Yeah. And that's also giving the message to the kids. It is. That you need to hide. Exactly. You need to fall into this box in order to be liked. Wow. Okay. Let's hop into some questions. This is perfect for us. This is from Kim. Is therapy making us selfish? What is too much therapy? So good. I've been on a journey in therapy since my dad died while I was in uni.

Once I found the right psychologist for me, it was a great experience. After being the avoidant, I'm just brutally honest friend, starving self-perfectionist my whole life. I started to learn to feel my emotions, work through trauma, and a lot of walls in my life dismantled. But flip side, my number of friends has dwindled significantly as I set up boundaries and set standards for how I want to be treated. I'm also finding myself just focused on myself, which I know is part of this, but how much is too much? How do you know if you're recovering from people-pleasing or becoming an asshole with no friends? Help. This is such a good question. I think about this all the time. We've talked about it. Are we over-therapized? And I don't feel that I am, but I worry that that could happen. And it is something to consider when you're overthinking so much about every

relationship, every interaction. Should I put up boundaries here? It kind of can become all consuming in a way that can feel unhealthy in its own way. Like trying to be so healthy that that also becomes unhealthy. Yes. Which applies to every other facet of our health. It's like caring about what you're eating. Great on face value, but if you're overthinking that and obsessing about it and it's taking over other parts of your life, I mean, it literally has a name, it's orthorexia, right?

Just like wanting to be healthy and wanting to eat healthy, you know, it can become a disorder. I don't know if we have like a disorder. Is it narcissism, I guess? if you're constantly thinking about yourself, I also think about this a lot and I haven't really fallen on one way or the other, but I sometimes feel like I wish I didn't know so much. It's such a fine line because you do need information in order to stop negative patterns, and you have to practice it. And it is not easy, and it does require a lot of thought for a long time before you can make new patterns. And this actually is something I want to talk about,

which is this period of time between when you know what you're doing wrong, where your actions are not reflecting the new attitude and the new neural pathways that you're creating about changes that you want to make. That's also a process. And I do feel like that's where people do give up on therapy. Or I also think we should expand that because that can feel so like a really elitist thing. Like a lot of people can't afford therapy,

but it's like free 12-step programs. It could be self-help books. It could be spiritual retreats, right? So my friends, like it's not even that they're doing that much therapy, but they're, I think, over-meditating and like spend so much time trying to get better and to fix themselves that then it becomes... Then they're isolating themselves from even the real world.

The point of, I think, all kinds of therapy is to have better connections with yourself, but also with other people. Yes, the point of, I think, all kinds of therapy is to have better connections with yourself, but also with other people. Yes, for sure. And so if that's cutting you off, and in this case, maybe it means if you're disconnecting from people who aren't healthy, are you spending time connecting with people who are?

And maybe that's what needs to happen. What I also want to say is it's okay to have fewer relationships if those relationships are healthy and real and the other ones weren't. I do think there's a fallacy for a lot of people. I think for a lot of women that the more friends you have,

the better off you are, or it makes you feel good by having a ton of people around or have like the most people at your birthday party. And that's not true. Like it only serves you if it's a healthy, real connection and relationship and you can have one of those in your life and that can be perfect and enough. So I think it's, it's, did you lose people who you wish you hadn't? But it kind of doesn't sound like it. It sounds like you had boundaries and then that led to this and the realization of, oh,

wow, there's a lot of people in my life who I didn't have healthy relationships with. And that can, I guess, be jarring. But it's okay to let those people go. Also, I will say, and we've talked about this before, but I really, really believe it. Boundaries can look different. Boundaries doesn't always have to be, I'm not engaging in a relationship at all with this person or like cutting people off. It can be, I'm not going to have this kind of relationship with them. I'm not going to share all my secrets with this person

because I don't think this person can handle secrets or I'm not going to go to drinks with this person because I think this person can't handle drinks. You can adjust the type of relationship. You can still have one and it can just not have every single component to it or all the parts. That's true. It's not all or nothing. It's not all or nothing. And it's reminding you of what does this relationship serve? If it serves fun, then great. Amplify that and put boundaries around the other pieces and vice versa. But I do think there's a recovery period for sure when you start getting into therapy and you're really applying all of the things you're being told and it's a little

overwhelming and it can be all consuming. There's a, like you said, a time frame. Yeah. There seems to be an end, but that means that there's a beginning. And I think seeing this as the beginning of something might also be helpful, just reframing this moment. Again, if these were relationships that weren't serving you, not even serving, I feel like that's a weird thing that like relationships aren't there to serve you. I know what you mean because it sounds like you're just trying to get something out of somebody, but that's not what it means. A relationship is additive to your life. And so in that way, it is serving you. Everyone should be served on both sides of the relationship equally. So I think that's the distinction. I think it's okay to say that. Yeah. But I do think

that again, in this over-therapizing world, there's a lot of therapy speak and people diagnosing themselves and each other and using that as a way to, again, disconnect and to diminish people or to cancel people, right? Right. Like this person's lesser than. This person's toxic. And it's like, you know, okay, they did something that you don't like and you do things that people don't like, you know? So I guess seeing this as an opportunity to choose things that feel right for you in your life and people that you can be additive to in your life, I think is good. And I think the last bit is you are what you give your attention to. And if you're constantly focusing on your problems and that's what therapy can be, but make sure to talk about your wins in

therapy or positive things that you're doing in therapy. My approach is I have to talk about what's wrong in my life. And sometimes I'm like, I don't have anything wrong that happened this week. And then you almost look for it. You do. Yeah. So that is problematic. Yes. I think it's no one's fault. But talk about the positive things. Talk about positive relationships in your life. And that will grow, you know, instead of giving more attention to what's not working and the people who've left. Yeah, I think that's true. It's a balance. Everything's a balance. Yeah. Okay, great. Let's see. This one's tricky. Do I tell my now adultish children about their father's infidelity? This is anonymous. When my youngest child was only a few months old, my husband cheated on me with my

sister. My husband was very remorseful, only we worked hard on repairing the damage that was done. My sister and I no longer have a relationship. My children are now 21 and 23. They wonder why their aunt is not in our lives. I feel it might be the time to tell them. I would like for them to hear it from us rather than someone else in the family or outside of our family. I don't want them to hate their father. He's an amazing man, great father who made a horrible mistake. Do I keep this secret forever or is there a time to let them know what everyone else in our family knows. Oh, man. That's hard. What's your instinct?

My instinct is to want to ask her, like, why does she think it would be important for them to know? Well, I think she's saying she's worried that they're going to find out from somebody else. That's a good reason. If that is the reason, then that, I think, is a good reason.

Yeah. She says they wonder why their aunt is not in our lives. I guess there's an active questioning. But like, what would be the benefit of them knowing this? And if the benefit is that they would learn it from you instead of someone else, I guess that's good. But secrets are hard. You're only as free as your secrets, right? Or what's the expression?

Sort of. Something like that. I think that's right. Secrets weigh you down. And if this is weighing you down and it's taking a lot out of you or that you feel like it's affecting your relationship with them, I encourage people to tell the truth as much as possible. But yeah, it implicates a lot of other people. It does. And there is this school of thought of like, have no secrets, always be honest, always share absolutely everything.

I mean, we talked about this a little bit last week on a another question about would you tell someone if you knew they were being cheated on and secrets are i do think more nuanced a little bit than what we'd like which is just be honest wait can i say something why is it up to her to tell the daughters why isn't up to the dad if he cheated why is she the one who's, who would be revealing this? Well, she says, I would like for them to hear it from us. So my assumption is they together would tell. I feel like it's the dad, like, cause that feels different to me too. Cause I'm just imagining for me, like if my mom told me this, that would be just very difficult versus if my dad is telling me something and he's owning up to it, then I think that's different. But yeah, why is it her? What I'm guessing is they're approaching

this as a unit and it's like, are we going to tell them together? Not am I going to kind of like when two parents sit down their kids and tell them they're getting a divorce? My guess is it's sort of like that also because they're what seems to be in a healthy place now. They probably want to come as a solid front as like, we've worked hard and now we're here. We feel like we should tell you because you might find out from somebody else. But I will say, I don't want to know if my parents have cheated on each other. Like I really don't. Same. As a grown up person, it could have happened. And I don't care if it happened. And I will care if I know. So I'd just rather not. If I was in this scenario, if I was the kid and my grandma or something was like, oh, you know that your dad cheated on your mom with Karen, I'd be mad at my

grandma. Same. I'd be like, no, he didn't. Or I'd be like, why did you tell me that? It's not your place to tell me that. Don't meddle in my life. I would be mad at that person. I mean, I'm a specific person. I don't know how everyone would react, but I think I would just feel then defensive of my dad, which is a weird defense mechanism to protect yourself and your own family. I don't know. There's a chance that they don't even want to know. That's how I, again, and this isn't even a show about telling people what to do at all to begin with, but I wouldn't want to know. That's why I'm like, why does it concern them? Does it affect their life? What are the consequences? Yes. And is she launching a show about fidelity with her dad? Like, okay, then there would be a reason to bring it up. But it feels like there's not really a reason other than maybe they would learn it from someone else, which again, could be

a concern that weighs her down and she doesn't want to live with that. But otherwise, I don't need to know everything about my parents. Yeah. You're my parents. That's actually kind of the whole thing. Like, I'm not supposed to know every up and down and your role is to be there for me. And that's a unique relationship. I think it's okay that parents have certain things that they don't tell their kids. And then it's like, they're going to go through their whole life and think about all the times. And it is a burden you are adding to them. And it might be worth it. I'm not saying it's not worth it. It might be. But that is the truth. You are adding a weight to them. Again, we can't really tell you what to do. But that's a really, really tricky position.

And I'm really sorry you're in it. I don't think that they would be angry at you that you didn't tell them. If they were to find out, sure. But they're not kids. Like, I don't think if I was 21 and I found out by someone else, like, would that make a dramatic difference

in how I feel about it? It's like, no, I'll know it. It won't make a difference to their lives. I feel about it. It's like, no, I'll know it. It won't make a difference to their lives. I mean, it might. There are people who would have a big reaction to this and might cut out their dad. Yeah. And sorry, my point was like, I wouldn't be mad at my mom if she had withholden this information from me or withheld this information from me. And if she had said, I'm not talking to your aunt anymore because we didn't get along. Don't create an intricate lie about it where it's like she moved away and like just say we didn't get along. That's not lying. You don't owe every single in the way that I don't

owe every single part of my life to my mom either. And then if they find out, they find out, you know, and you're like, I thought it would hurt you. And now that you know, we can talk about it. Exactly. And then you talk about it and you grow from it. I don't think they need to know. Would you want to know? Yeah. Would you want to know? No. So my mom got remarried and no one in my family knew that she had a previous marriage. And I found it in her closet when I was looking for a birth certificate. And then they uncovered it like three years later. And I was like, yeah, I knew. Didn't really change or matter.

Right. I mean, look, there is something about learning that there's been this secret this whole time that feels very unsettling, I think. But that's going to happen either way. They're going to find out either from you that there was a secret the whole time or from the other people. And maybe they'll never find out from the other people. So I would just let it be. I think it feels like kind of weird advice. But I think your point's right. They're not gonna be resentful of the mom for having not told this secret. Yeah, I would be like, that makes sense. If they can have empathy and compassion for the

whole situation, then they won't be mad. Or again, if she's like, I thought this was gonna hurt you. Like, yeah, it does. It's hurting. Unless again, it's like totally fine, but then you wouldn't be mad at all about anything. Exactly. Exactly. I know it's weird because I've thought about this on my own of if I found out that my dad cheated, I feel really bad saying this. I would not care. And then I feel guilty because then I feel like I should care on behalf of my mom. You have such an interesting relationship to cheating. You should like write a book about it.

He hasn't that I know of. This isn't a real experience. This is just imagined. So maybe I'm completely wrong. Maybe if I found out, I would hate him. I just want everyone to be getting what they want, basically. As long as one thing doesn't come at the cost of another. they want, basically. As long as one thing doesn't come at the cost of another, and that's so relationship dependent, especially in this society. Obviously, we really put monogamy on

a pedestal. And we think if you don't adhere to that rule, then you're bad and that you should be shamed. And I see all kinds of different relationships in my life. And my parents have a specific relationship that I see. And I'm like, if my dad was cheating, would my mom care? Yeah, it's more about their relationship than my parents are too. Yeah, it's looking at their relationship. And this is so bad to be making it them because it's all hypothetical. But let's say she didn't want to have sex with him anymore. And he wanted to have sex. Their relationship, and this is so bad to be making it them because it's all hypothetical,

but let's say she didn't want to have sex with him anymore and he wanted to have sex. She would be like, yeah, I don't want to have sex with him anymore, but I don't want to get divorced. I think it depends on how hurt your mom would be too. If she was like fawning over him and they were so in love. How much pain is this causing overall is something to sort of pay attention to. And it is very different for each person. And to just think, oh, it's just 100% awful and bad across the board, I do disagree with. Esther Perel has written a whole book about this, and she doesn't say one way is better than the other. But I do think that I'm in this Puritan sort of view of it's bad, and it's the most awful

form of betrayal. And I think that you have a more complex view of it, which I think is accurate of how things work in society. I think it's possible to say, this is my partnership and this is my priority. This is my family unit. This is my priority. This is always going to come first, but I'm not getting everything I need out of this relationship. And so I am going to get the other things I need. If those things need to fall by the wayside for the other unit, they will. But I'm not going through this life without getting things I want if I can. And that sounds so selfish. And it is. Esther Perel's view is sometimes an affair can help you stay in a relationship. An affair can actually kind of save your marriage, which again is controversial. But that's kind of what you're

saying. And I think that's not what we think when we see a headline of a, you know, a couple where the guy or a woman cheated on the other person. That's not what we think of. We just think like he or she ruined the relationship and betrayal. But in, I think, more cases than we are admitting, it does help save the relationship. Again, allows you to stay in that partnership. Esther always says like, you cannot get everything from one person. That is the reality. And I just so 100% believe it. I've seen it. I see it all over the place. If you really start looking at relationships like that, it's so obvious you're not going to get all of what you need from one person. And that, you know, sets you up to fail and cheat potentially. Yeah, if you go in thinking,

well, this person has to be my absolutely everything, give me 100% of everything I need, that's just not going to happen. Anyway, did we answer it? Yeah, we did. We did. Okay.

Should parents contribute a bit of money to their son's weddings? This is from Hope. My fiance and I have been together for a long time and we are finally getting married. We are excited to finally do it, especially after lots of hounding from his parents. This is from Hope. months. I know that it's not an obligation, but they do have the means to help out a bit, even if it's a couple thousand. My fiance and I don't have a lot of money, and I'm sure you know how much weddings cost, and his mom has been asking us for years to hurry up and get married

and have babies. She seems to not realize how much these things cost. I want to ask her if she can contribute a bit to help us out, but that seems tacky. I have such strong opinions on this. Oh my gosh. Because you're Canadian. You've been to like one and a half weddings. But 400 funerals. Yes. So I don't know. I wonder if this is a different custom there.

But here, the antiquated system we have is the bride's family pays for the wedding. I did not even know this. Is this true? Yes. We didn't. Both sides contributed. That's nice. The tradition is... Yes. That the't. Both sides contributed. That's nice. The tradition is...

Yes. That the bride's family pays for the wedding, and then the groom's family pays for the rehearsal dinner. It's like a dowry. That's what it feels like, which is not good. It's child bride vibes. What the heck? What?

I know. It's kind of interesting hearing it from a different cultural perspective, because it is crazy. That's wild. So the idea behind it is... what? I don't know. Like if that is true, what else is true? And I'm afraid to ask. I will say I do think it's becoming more and more of a equal thing or people contribute. Also, people are getting married much later. As you get married older, you often pay for your own wedding and maybe like parents

contribute or family contributes. But the thought originally is these are basically kids getting married. Same reason why you give all these gifts because they're starting their life. They don't have any money. You don't have a toaster. Exactly. So it's like the community comes together to help so they don't have the money. So the parents are like obligated to pay. But I am all about in 2023, if people have the means and one family member. How would you ask? Maybe I'm just too Canadian, but like, why is she the one asking? Why isn't he the one asking his own family? Yeah, for sure. that is weird for her to go to his mother-in-law not to generalize but with my married friends sometimes i do see this happening where the son is not empowered to confront or challenge

you know his mom maybe in a certain way or sees that as a confrontation or challenge and so then the female partner is kind of put in this awkward position of needing to do that so i would just say like have a conversation with your young say yeah and then he should definitely be asking his parents and saying, this is how much they're contributing. How much are you contributing? Also in this weird day and age, assuming anyone's contributing, it's all complicated. My parents would laugh at my face. The idea that I would ask my parents, it would be ridiculous to them. That's so funny. No, if you have daughters in America, mostly, again, this is changing, but like, let's say when my age. Well, let us know in the comments. That's actually,

it may be an interesting thing. Yeah, how this has changed. Did you split? I am curious because my age, let's say, so my parents' generation, if you have daughters, like there's a wedding fund. Whoa. I mean, my parents, I don't. Do you have a wedding fund? No, because they're not of this culture. Also, I think my mom's parents paid for their wedding. I mean, sometimes there is also just a discrepancy in how much money people have. And sometimes it's the opposite. Sometimes the bride's family cannot contribute and the groom can. So they should.

But if parental support is happening, it should just be what people can contribute and who has the means to. Yes. Proportional to what you can. Proportional. It's all proportional. Yes. Which is hard. Even at really good weddings, I haven't been to a lot of weddings, but they're great. Like, I do see the way that the money thing can kind of play into, and even in happy families, money is complicated. It's so complicated. It is. But again, if they can, especially, which is what the letter writer is saying. Ask your fiance to ask his parents. Now,

what if the fiance says, I don't want to ask, then what? I don't know. Don't get married. Yeah. No, we're not saying that. We're not saying that. We can't tell people not to get married. But if he says, I don't want to ask. If he says, I don't want to ask. No, if he says, I don't want to ask. I love guests. Definitely people. If he says, I don't want to ask. No, if he says, I don't want to ask, she says,

why do you think that I should then? He might be like, I don't want us to ask them. That's not their responsibility and I don't want us to. Either of us. Oh, okay. So then you're having

a really small wedding, I guess. Well, then maybe you say, then I don't think my parents should contribute either because that doesn't seem fair. So let's elope or go to the city hall. Because you're going to carry resentment. Again, it's contribute either because that doesn't seem fair. So let's go to City Hall. Because you're going to carry resentment.

Again, it's not fair. It's not fair and caught resentment right in the bud. And if you can tell that there was going to be some, like it's going to grow. This is the beginning of your partnership. You want it to be on solid ground and don't let the wedding, again, this is why I don't like wedding.

I'm like, don't let the party ruin the marriage. Just the party. It's just the party. Best case scenario. The fiance approaches his own parents and says, Hope's parents are contributing $10,000 to the wedding. Is there any way you guys could match that so that it feels equal for us? What are you comfortable giving?

And then maybe downsize. Your parents can give that same amount and then do a wedding that size. Or yes, take the money and save it for kids or a house and then go to City Hall. It's cute. Kristen and Dax did City Hall. It's chic. I love it. That's what my parents did. That's what Canadians do. Do it the Canadian way. Canadian wedding. Yeah. No, I think a lot of people get big married in Canada, but not me. You said a lot of people don't get married.

That's Quebec. It's more French Canadian. Okay. So do it the Quebec way. Yeah. Yeah. Put a down payment for a little condo. Yeah. All right. Well, I think that's going to be it for today, but we'll see you next week. Yeah. Bye.