Aspire with Emma Grede - Aspire with Karlie Kloss: How To Turn Principles Into Power Plays

Episode Date: May 20, 2025

Model, entrepreneur and media mogul Karlie Kloss sits down with Emma for a rare, wide-ranging conversation about the bold pivots, personal principles, and hard-won lessons that have shaped her journey from the runway to the boardroom. With baby number three on the way, Karlie opens up about the balancing act of motherhood and mogulhood, the trade-offs she makes, and the guilt she’s learned to manage. Emma and Karlie dive deep into her transition from fashion icon to tech and media entrepreneur, her mission to empower women in STEM through Kode with Klossy, and her bold foray into publishing with the relaunch of i-D. Karlie also shares what drives her as an investor, her evolving relationship with money, and how she navigates being underestimated in male-dominated rooms. Whether you’re multi-passionate, mid-pivot, or just need the push to take a leap, Karlie’s story is proof that reinvention is always within reach. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Visit emma greed.com to purchase the book, also available on Amazon, your favorite audio platforms, and all good bookshops. Today on The Aspire podcast, I'm sitting down with my friend Carly Kloss. And let me just say, this conversation is going to be so good. Carly's having baby number three. She's running companies, investing in brands she believes in, and she is shaking up the publishing world. And yet somehow she's doing it all with the most grounded, no BS energy you can imagine. We talk money, mindset and what to do when you're feeling. We also get into mum life, mum guilt, career pivots, making bold moves and what it really takes to go from being the face of a brand to building your own empire.

Carly is thoughtful, honest and so much more than just a pretty face. So let's get into it. This episode is brought to you by Indeed. Stop waiting around for the perfect candidate. Instead, use Indeed sponsor jobs to find the right people with the right skills fast. It's a simple way to make sure your listing is the first candidate C. According to Indeed data, sponsored jobs have four times more applicants than non-sponsored jobs. So go build your dream team today with Indeed.

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Learn more at Schwab.com slash trading. Carly, welcome to Aspire. I'm so happy to have you here today. Thank you, Emma, for having me. I love you so much. I'm so in awe of all you've built, and I'm so honored to be having this conversation with you. Well, likewise, my darling, that the first thing is. first, you're having a little baby number three.

Oh my gosh. I like barely fit in this chair. I'm like, who busting. I'm so excited. I'm so, it's only just starting to hit me. I'm like halfway through and I'm like, oh, I'm going to have three children. You're going to have three, and three little children. Three under five.

Five, yeah. Oh my goodness. Are you kidding me? It's, I'm so excited and I'm so tired. But most of all, excited. You should be so excited. So I kind of want to start. there because, you know, you're about to have three children. I have four children. And you're doing

so much all the time. I'm really curious how you think about, you know, I really loathe the word balance when we start talking about motherhood, given everything that we do. But I wonder, like, do you have, like, just how are you feeling about the whole thing? How are you feeling about doing everything that you do while, you know, trying to be here with three kids? Well, I have lots to learn from you, mother of four and running your empires. I try just to do the best I can every single day. And I feel in a lot of ways actually having kids has sort of been a forcing function of prioritization. I've always been somebody who does a lot. I think that's just the way I'm wired. I started working at 15. I know you started really young as well. Pretty young. So it's in my blood to sort of just like be busy and do things and

and be a productive person, but also having a child. And, you know, I had my first son in the pandemic in 2021. And up until then, I really was a workaholic. I was on an airplane every two days, like genuinely. And even, you know, even through my relationship, like I was, work was always sort of my number one priority. And sorry, Josh, but we both, you know, we're both working all the time. but I think having a child and now being onto my third child, a lot of things have sort of just fallen into place, like what matters most to me and what I'm willing to compromise for, compromise sleep for, and what I'm not. Yeah.

What gives for you? What are the, because I always talk about this idea of they're just being inevitable tradeoffs. And I agree with you because I think you are forced to prioritize. Yeah. And for me, that makes actually your work, like you get really sharp, right? there's no time wasted, but I wonder for you, what are the trade-offs? Well, again, I feel really lucky I started working at 15. I feel like I've had three lifetimes by the time I had my first kid.

And I guess I'm still trying to figure it out. Yeah, that's the truth. I think there is no, there is no balance. There is no secret sort of formula. And at least if you've figured it out, let me know. But I am genuinely trying every single day to show up for the people that I love most in my life. and it's my children, that's my husband, that's my family. I'm very close with my sisters, my parents, and my friends.

And again, I think a lot of that candidly, until the pandemic, I, you know, I didn't prioritize, I think even my personal life, my friends. And your relationships. So the last few years have been a real, I think, evolution of me as a person to actually kind of take care of myself a bit more. Even if that comes at a cost of work, it's work. it. Yeah. I really love that you're so honest about that, though, because I feel for so many people, like you imagine that there's this, you know, magical formula and you're going to have some

perfect way of figuring this all out. But the idea that you say, I'm still working on it, I'm still figuring it out. I think that's really truthful and really will. And I find it so amazing that with baby number three on the way that you are so ambitious and that you do have so many incredible things still, you know, going on because you have been doing this for like a long time. You've been in the limelight for a long time. Well, I think we are both very lucky that we have very supportive partners who want that for us as well. You know, I think Josh really, my husband, we've been together since I was 19. Like we are, we have truly babies now having babies. And we, I feel like we've grown up together. And he has always been my biggest champion of,

I'm going to make me emotional here. But he's always been my biggest champion. And I think especially in this sort of like adjustment into motherhood. He has been somebody who's like, Carly, you cannot lose yourself. You will not be happy. And then our children will feel that. And I think that's something I so appreciate that he has always been sort of my mirror in that way.

How important is that choice? Because I talk about this with my friends all the time. Like, when you choose your person. I'm literally crying. No, I love that you're literally crying. And that's a great place to start. Because I do, I talk about it so much that the person, you decide to spend your life with and have children with, when you are also trying to balance

that we're having a career, it ends up being a really big decision. It's the biggest decision of my life, right? They can add so much to it, but they can also, I think with so many of my friends, the person that they feel gilded by the most is often their husband. And I have the opposite situation. I have someone who's like, go for it, like really believes in my ambition and has really kind of lifted me up in that way. Do you feel like that was a conscious choice for you? Like when you were like early in the, like, you know, dating, Josh, did you know that he was supportive of your ambition? Did you even think about it? Oh, yeah. I mean, we started dating so young. I was 19. He was 25, 26. He was just starting a healthcare company called Oscar. He had just, I think, launched

his first fund. He was some early days in his career. And I like to remind him, I was far more successful than he was for a very long time. And I, you know, but I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I had never met anyone like him before. He was such a kind, kind man. And I, you know, I felt like still a girl, but also had lived this very adult worldly life since I was 15. I had had my first apartment in New York. I had traveled by the week, you know, New York, London, Tokyo, Paris, everywhere while juggling my high school education. So, you know, I sort of just had moved to New York and was really, really lucky to meet. And I could have never imagined I would meet like the love of my life and the person I would end up like... At 19. And there's pros and cons to that for sure,

but I don't know. I definitely wasn't looking for it. But I think we also, because we met so young, we've been through so much together that we've both really grown together. And I think that's also part of why our partnership is so solid is because we've both, it's like there have been so many things in life that we've had to challenges we've faced personally, professionally, privately, publicly, that it's like, it's almost like a trial by fire. Like, it forges you in that bond forever. And I think that if you can get through those things together, you, like, that's, I feel very grateful for it because, like, I feel like we can get through anything.

You really can. I mean, the two of you are so unbelievably successful. But I want to talk about you for a minute because I think it's so crazy to contextualize how long you've been, you know, in. Working. Yeah. How long you've been working? how long you've been doing it. I'm only 32, but people think I'm like 50.

We feel like you're 50. It's actually when I turned 30, people were like, how are you only still 30? It's really true. We were trying to work this out last night. I was like, when did I actually meet you? And I must have met you when you were 16, 17, 16, for sure. That's great. That's crazy to me.

So I feel like I've known you for a lifetime, but you were actually just a child. For sure. I was a child pretending to be a grown up for a long time. Well, I'm doing a really good job pretending. I learned the game very quickly. I grew up in Missouri wearing like The Gap. That was my idea of high fashion, maybe limited to. But I, so it was not my world that I grew up in by any means. And I was not reading Vogue. I was not, you know, so for me, I sort of dropped into this other parallel universe. So it weren't like you were a fan of the business. You were scouted because you were extraordinarily beautiful. I was an alien child. I was like unbelievably taught. I feel like all those back is as we're speaking.

Somehow I'm even taller today, but I was 5-11 at 15 years old, and I was so tall, and I just was in the right place at the right time. And did you have aspirations to model? Not at all. Not at all. I was walking in a mall in St. Louis in like Birkenstocks, and a really amazing local scout, Jeff and Mary Clark, they discovered Ashton Coucher at a bar in Iowa. Like, it was such a fluke, honestly.

And I feel very grateful that, you know, they sort of took me under their wing and really helped me launch in a very legitimate way. And if it would not have happened that way, there's no world I would have pursued this. It was not, it was not, like, honestly, what I was interested in. My dad's a doctor. I love science. I'm a total nerd. And that has continued to be sort of where, like, my heart and my mind kind of is most stimulated. But I had this key to the world overnight through sort of this. opportunity to build a modeling career. So from 15 to 18 years old, I took advantage of it. I ran with it. And I sort of took my studies with me. I was doing my homework backstage and on airplanes.

I had my grandma, my mom, my teacher, anyone sort of chaperoning me because I was under 18. And sort of living this jet set life and then coming back home to St. Louis and being a normal lame teenager. And then, yeah, and then. And then. And then, and then. And then, and then. And then, and then, We can't skirt over it because I think for the world, if we didn't already know you and I knew you because I was part of like, you know, just a fan of fashion. Yeah. But for the rest of everybody else, when you became, you know, Carly Closs, supermodel Carly Closs, it was that moment for Victoria's Secret. And you spent, what, a couple of years being a Victoria's Secret's Angel. I did. It's actually funny. I feel like I walked my first Victoria's Secret fashion show and I like pretty immediately they signed me on contract.

and I, as a girl in Missouri, like the exposure I had to fashion was on Project Runway. Heidi Clum on Project Runway and the Victoria's Secret Fashion Show. And like, I'm one of four daughters, so we would all pile around the TV. And, like, that's, that was the sort of, like, height of fashion in my eyes. And so it was very full circle to then sort of sign with them and be on the runway. And actually, it's funny, I had just graduated high school. And I think there was this feeling of, like, all those, all, like, I could not get a date in high school. school. I'm not exaggerating. You're like, I'll show them. I'm like, I'll show them. Like,

those boys that didn't want to like want to date with me. You're going to have to just back this up for me. Wait a minute. You couldn't get a date in high school. Like, what was happening? No, well, I think I was so tall and pale and like, I think they were like, where is this girl all the time? Did the phone just start ringing? Like, all of a sudden, you walk down the Victoria's Secret runway, you put your wings down and then it's like, ding ding! I mean, it was such a funny moment. It was actually, it was very, like, gratified. You're like gratified. Yeah.

See? You know, I don't want to shut up. Me and all my glory. Exactly. There's one thing doing high fashion. And there's another thing suddenly being in your underwear with so much scrutiny and so much coverage.

And, you know, you're suddenly like front and center as like one of the, you know, the names in fashion that we know, one of the girls that's just going to roll off the tongue. And you're in the windows of like, you know, pretty much every high street in America. So it's a different level. of, you know, it's just a different level of scrutiny at that point. There were a lot of things happening around that time. Social media was starting to develop. So I graduated high school in 2011.

I think I walked to my first VS show that year. I remember Instagram really was sort of one of the first places. And then I met Josh in 2012. And I remember, I think he was the one that was like, oh, there's this new thing, Instagram. Like, you should sign up for it. Like, it was also new. And social media was really one of the first platforms for someone like a me,

like a model that had been already very accomplished and successful on all the covers of Italian Vogue, American, like, American Vogue, Vogue's everywhere. Well, you've done like 40 Vogue covers, is that right? I mean, that's bananas. But I was on a household name. You know, it's like the names that Americans knew were the Victoria's Secret models. It was like, Giselle. Absolutely.

Heidi, Adriana. Absolutely. Aless. And, like, those were the girls. So in a funny way, it was almost sort of like just a box that I wanted to tick because. it was the highest sort of like platform a model could aspire to. But, you know, it's funny because I think, you know, and especially like, I was reflecting on this. Like, I think I was so dissociated from my body as a model. It was sort of my job. It was sort of this like almost, you know, I was like a racehorse. You know, it's like I was not, it was not me that felt like I was me on that runway wearing those wings. It was more like it was sort of. It was sort of. of a job. It was a... Wow. Almost like a caricature of yourself. It was a characterature.

It kind of created this like... A hundred percent. And that really, I think, is a way that I was able to sort of survive and thrive in my career as a model. And I started, you know, first I was a ballerina as a young teenage girl. And I think that sort of is something that trains you to almost, like your body is a performance vehicle. And so I always have sort of dissociated. I think my me, like me actually the person, Carly, from the way that I showed up in my job and in a photo shoot, which I think gave me, you know, it was both something I think now is like I've had to work through, which is, I think motherhood actually finally was the first time where I was like,

whoa, like, there's something, maybe Saturn return, I don't know what, but like I had to sort of actually ground myself in myself. But I think for those early years, I was so sort of dissociated. Yeah, I think that a lot of people will be able to feel that quite deeply because I think for so many people they put on a facade when they go to work. And for you, it was almost just like it's just a layer of protection. Like how do I protect myself? And I think so many women, especially at that time, right, would kill to be a Victoria's Secret

model. But you walked away from that. And so I wonder what the decision was to just decide. I'd like, that's the end of that part of my career. Yeah. I think I was maybe 23. It's all such a blur. But I was kind of over it.

I, I, there were a lot of things that had happened. I wanted to go back to school. I mean, I had worked. I mean, first of all, you went back to school and you went and you studied. I went back to NYU. I was like, I, a couple of things. I think one, I finally kind of woke up to the reality that, like, yes, I can just and sort of show up on set and like wear my lingerie and a set of wings and like have fun because

I'm just sort of playing a character. But I think something kind of woke up for me because maybe also social media really all of a sudden I had a very direct sort of like access to an exposure to young women like quite quickly like hundreds of thousands and then millions of young women that were following me, Carly. And they were following me for, I don't know what reasons, but it sort of like clicked for me that like what I actually am doing in my job, what I'm putting out there, is whether I'm like choosing it or not, it is like I am projecting something. And I want to be more intentional about what it is that I'm projecting and making sure that that's authentically who I am. And I think that was sort of maybe the beginning of the reckoning of like not just me

a canvas for other people's ideas and values and messages, but like actually me being representative of like who I am. Yeah, how do I feel? I really think so. And the idea that you would, I mean, first of all, to leave the Victoria's Secret runway to then go and study what, feminist theory. Yeah. It's a, it's a real departure. It was a real departure, but I'm actually, I'm so glad I sort of followed that intuition. You know, I, I, there was like, So much that I had not learned, I think, in my high school, public school education, but there was, like, a lot of just in those classes, like, basic feminist theory around, like, the male gaze, the female gaze, the fashion image.

There was so much that I had just sort of, like, only just been introduced to these kind of ideas of, like, the influence of culture and the impact of these imagery on society, on particularly young women. Yes. And I think that that's something that, you know, can't control the world, but I can control how I show up in it. And I think that was really, you know, it was a leap of faith because, like, also, I was making, you know, a lot of money and providing for myself, my family.

And, like, to sort of choose myself and my values and, like, to walk away from things that I felt like didn't represent what I wanted to stand for in the world. Like that was, that was bold. Yeah. And I'm, it really feels it. I'm glad I did it. Was there a moment that you can trace it back to when you're like, this is the moment that you decide I need to do something else? I think it sort of developed like all of us in our teens and 20s.

I think I sort of just grew more and more into myself. I think I did small things that I, that helped me build confidence to feel like, you know what, actually, like I can, you know, first, the first entrepreneurial thing I remember doing through my modeling career, I think it. was, I can't remember what year, maybe you'll remember, Fashions Night Out. Do you remember Vogue did that? Yes, of course. Maybe it was like, it was after or around the sort of recession of 07-08 and Vogue had this sort of initiative to sort of, I think, like, stimulate the New York shopping economy and like, power to Anna for that. And they, I'd always, part of my like signature thing I always did on all the Vogue shoots, I would, and I was working, you know, again, long before Victoria's Secret, I was doing like, endless amounts of vogue shoots.

And so I would always show up on set with like fresh homemade cookies. That was my calling card because I was like, 17, wasn't going to a club the night before a shoot. I was baking cookies. You weren't taking shots at the end of the shoot. So you were like, okay, here comes the girl with the cookies. So Grace Coddington at one point was like, Carly, stop making cookies. Like, I'm going to connect you with Christina Tosi from Momofuku Milk Bar. You guys can make like a special cookie and do something for Fashions Night Out.

And that was, you know, that sort of. of was my first foray into social entrepreneurship. We ended up starting that night and going on for a number of years selling Carly's cookies. And we raised enough money through the sales of these cookies to donate millions of school lunches through Feeding America. And so, and feed, the feed program. And so that was sort of my first sort of foray into, oh, I can use my career as a way to make impact in ways that are meaningful to me. You have so much. You have so much power in everything that you were putting out into the world. And it seems like there's this moment that you all of a sudden say, okay, like, I get it. I understand my power and I'm going to

do something else and I'm going to leverage it in a different way. And I think fast forward into Code with Clossie, like that for me was the moment where I was like, oh, okay, one second, because I can understand that you were, you know, like to me, you know, the cookies felt like a little project and it felt like it was an add on. And when I saw Code with Clossie, I was like, oh, this is really purposeful. This goes on a mission to change. things and she's really using her power for good. So talk to me a little bit about Code with Clossie and how you even decided to get into tech because it feels like that was just like you were really early in that space. Well, it's funny because there weren't a lot of, there weren't a lot of

sort of celebrity consumer brands, I think being launched in the same way. Like it was still earlyish and actually before even Code with Clossy, your husband, Yenz and Eric, founders of Frame, of course, came to me. How did I forget this? In Paris, I know. I was like the whole, there was one other thing. One second. The frame, 40 inch in seam gene called Carly Forever.

I completely, first of all, I completely forgot about it. Maybe because when I got the product, it was completely irrelevant. It was like your whole body. I could have made two pairs of jeans out of the one pair. It was a very niche audience. But no, it was niche, but there was a need, right? Because all of a sudden, it was like, okay, we all know. We all know you for being incredibly tall.

And that was a real moment. Like, you were like the model doing that thing. It was like your own collection. You had clearly had a lot of input in this thing. And it was like, okay, I'm going to do my own product. Well, thanks to Eric and Jens. And they really came to me and they were like, just starting frame. I remember it was sort of just kicking off.

And I remember we got a coffee together in Paris. I don't, all the years run together. I want to say maybe it's 2013-ish. And yeah, that'll be about right. Yeah. And they were still running their creative agency. And I was working with them on different photoshoots and campaigns through that. And so it was sort of this almost just like side project that I was like, we're going to tag it on to the end of the day.

We're going to shoot one extra image. It was like so bootstrapped. Everything was so bootstrapped. And I think that was like such a fun experimental phase. I think in building anything. Like I love that sort of startup era. where you sort of just, there's nothing to lose. It was sort of like, they had a great brand,

they were making jeans, and they were like, Carly, would you want to do, like, a tall girl gene? And I was like, a hundred percent, even just for me to have selfishly, like, a couple pair of jeans. You're like, can you just make me ten pairs? Yes, please. And I was blown away by, even though it was niche, like hundreds of six-foot-two girls that I would run into everywhere,

that were like, Carly, this was the first time I ever was able to find jeans that fit me. And again, a niche thing. But it was sort of the first time that I was like, okay, this is a lived experience for me of like hard to find jeans that fit and use that to sort of build a small little business collab. That was really authentic and fun. And so again, that was another little boost of confidence. And I remember it because it was really differentiated from what was happening like back then. We take these things for granted now. wasn't run of the meal at that time. I'm imagining that your agent would have done the deal for you.

Did you have any part in that, like thinking, I usually get paid a big fat, you know, upfront fee, but this, that was different, right? Because they were selling, using your name image and like this. Do you remember what the deal looked like? Or did you say, you know, how, did you question? Your husband can pull up the contract, I'm sure. I remember it because I was the celebrity deal guru back then, and I was like, I'll do this deal for you guys. So I should have called you and said, Can you represent me? But I did. I remember I got like a license.

Yeah, you got like a royalty. I have royalty. Thank you. And so I remembered those checks. They were, they were meaningful. Or at least it was meaningful to me. It wasn't the biggest checks I'd ever received.

But I was like, wow. Like, it's ongoing. It's like, I'm not on set. But it also thought, like, the people who are actually buying this, like, are like me. Like, it actually didn't feel, because at that point, I'd already done endless amounts of campaigns where I got paid the top dollar to sort of just show up and sell somebody else's brand product, whatever. And it wasn't personal.

This was, I had gone to the factories in L.A. and, like, helped, you know, sort of designed every aspect of it. The stitching, we put a K on the side, the little K stitch. And there was so much. And also, like, I felt so invested in sort of making great imagery and then also social media launch. And then also like doing the sort of launch events and getting the right people there. Like it was the first time again that I was cutting my teeth and like building something using the power I had through my platform, through, you know, my sort of career and access as a model.

But it was like, again, these sort of building this muscle and having fun with it. And then seeing like that it actually touched people. Yeah. You know, real consumers. And making some money at the same time. And making some money. That's never hurts. I mean, it never hurts.

I want to talk to you a little bit about your relationship with money because you obviously started making quite meaningful money much earlier than most of us were. When I was 15, I was making paper out money. Was it not the same? Yes, no. The only job I had before walking in that Calvin Klein show was babysitting for $6 an hour, which was top dollar at the time. And the house that I actually babysat in was just down the street from the house I grew up in.

and I don't know, maybe five or six years ago, I actually bought that house. It was the biggest, most beautiful in the neighborhood. I bought that house for my parents. Wow, what a full circle moment. Very full circle. How baller did you feel then? It was pretty great. Yeah, I feel like when you get to the point where you can buy your mom a house, it's like, I'm good.

I'm done. But it's true. Money is, money is, to me, it's always been independence, freedom, safety. You know, I think, where I began. I mean, I was so aware. How'd you grow up? Did you grow up with money? No.

I grew up with very hardworking parents. I grew up in a small town in St. Louis, suburb where everybody had the same amount of nothing. It was like we all, and everybody was really happy. Yeah. Like, that was not. But you didn't want for anything. I lacked for nothing. And also my father is an emergency room doctor.

He was always sort of one of the most successful people in our town. You know, he was, we had four girls in our house, we had two cars. And it was like, we lived a big life. And I felt that. But also something I don't talk about a lot or I don't know if I've ever talked about. But I feel like this is, I so appreciate the importance of financial freedom and the power of money. Because in 2007, around the exact same time that I started my career, my family had a really hard time in the recession and had made some investments in real estate,

invested like our entire sort of family nest egg, and it all disappeared. Oh, wow. And so as a freshman in high school, you know, my family was like trying to keep the roof over ahead. And I, as a 15-year-old, you know, young model was able to sort of help support my family and provide stability for my family. and that was sort of, again, this motivating factor to, I didn't care about fashion, but it was a vehicle, a means to support my family and take care of my loved ones and create safety and stability. And I think that's where it's just like, I have been acutely aware of how important to me that that is to have for myself. I love that. And I can see that how important that would have been because it's like when you come from that type of family that have raised you in that way that you feel so secure, you want to be able to help them, right?

And to be in the position when you're 15, it's so extraordinary that you'd even be there. Just to fast forward in thinking about your own family life because I think about this all the time, I'm raising kids in a very different way and in very different circumstances to how I was raised myself. And I wonder how you think about your own children

and your relationship to money these days when you've made a lot of money, you're incredibly successful. You married a very successful. man and you know you're raising three children not not in a small town in Missouri and yeah well I I am very intentional in the environment I'm raising them in though I above all you know listen it's a new it's a new experience for me yeah the new experience I'm trying to do the best I can as I go but I am very intentional about the environment around them that I create around them like I am their mom I am extremely hands on I don't

like to have a lot of people, like, I want my kids to be able to, like, tie their own shoes and put on their own clothes. Same. Like, I... That's the goal. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's no, like... No one...

No one... No, no, no. Let's be serious. And also, you know, candidly, like, there is nothing more gratifying. Even though I would not wish what happened to our family or, you know, that responsibility on me, I would not wish that to... On anyone, but I am so grateful for the... The gratification and satisfaction I have been able to experience in building for myself.

Yes. I am so proud of the life, career, success I have built for myself. I am self-made. And that gives me such pride and confidence. And, you know, I make investments for myself. There is such power to that that I want my kids to feel that. Yeah. And I think your kids will feel that because you're modeling that for them.

Yeah. excuse upon, every single day, right? It's like, I met your two sisters last night. And it's like, I think that when you have that type of family, that type of closeness and those type of, you know, roots to where you come from, like that comes through every day. And that's, that's what your kids are experiencing, right? They get the other side, but they also see that of you. And it's like you are going out and creating this incredible path for yourself. Yeah. Every single day. And I think that's it. It's like there's things that we can't control that our kids are going you know, be exposed to our experience, but like, there's a lot that we can control.

And I think the intentionality, so any advice you have, please, I'm all yours. Like, we're kind of figuring this out in real time. Will I bring mine with me? You know, that's my thing. Well, my big secret is that I, you know, I like, I think it becomes really abstract for them, right? I try to bring them into the office. And I have that type of office where I can do that.

And so my kids actually get into see, like, this is what mommy does for work. Like, she's here. just contextualizing it for them somehow. They start to think about you in a very, very different way. You're not just their mom that does all of these things that they need. Like, they're a need, like other people need something from you. There's a requirement of you in other places. And I think they start to, like, you know, yours are really little,

but mine at 11 and 8 and not the babies who are three. But they've started to get an idea that I have other ambitions and there are other needs that have to be satisfied. and other people that need me outside of them. And I think it's actually been a really useful thing. I'm going to clock that for future. Take your kids to work. I take the kids to work. No, I think that's such sage advice. And I can relate to that. And I think, Josh certainly as well, like, he has so many stories if he was like, you know, working, cleaning up trash and working on construction sites and, like, joining his dad at meetings, you know,

early on. And I even went to, I mean, this was probably highly illegal. But there was a like a take your daughter to work day and like my dad worked in the emergency room. So there's like extreme trauma and like people and I'm like in a lab coat at like 13 years old. Totally should not have been there. And I, I loved it. And I loved seeing my dad in that light. Of course. And sort of like, you know, like when somebody, when you love what you do, like your kids see that. And they see it and they admire it. And they, that is something to aspire to. That feeling, no matter what it is that you do, the way that you feel when you do it, I see it for you. Totally.

It gives you energy. And by the way, I know it in myself when I am feeling that energy and when I'm not. And so I think what I've really tried to do is tap into like, what are the things that are not giving me that energy and that sort of state of flow? And eliminating those things from my life or as much as I can. I think that's so sensible because I do think you get to a point, especially when you start work at such a young age. and you have a little bit of success, you get swept up by it. And I think if we're honest at any one point, there becomes a point in your career and you're like, wow,

I'm doing a bunch of things that actually no longer serve me. And I try to make a point of every, I don't know, I feel like every year I'm like, okay, what is now taken hold of me that I don't need anymore. I'm just going, I don't need that. I need to just shed as opposed to just like, you know, because you get to the point where you're like, am I just doing a bunch of things that I no longer want to be doing?

And I think that's so important to always take stock. Yeah. And I, and I actually. Especially when you're a parent, right? Because you're sacrificing, you're giving your time somewhere else and it better bloody be worth it. Yes. And I think I'm sort of almost even evaluating again.

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what you're doing for me feels even more relevant. So where are you? Because you've been doing this for a really long time. We're talking about 10 years. And that's such a commitment to the cause. But you've also probably had. had like some results I'm thinking by now. So I'd love you to share. I am so proud of our scholars. You should be so proud of it. It's pretty surreal. I mean, Emma, I would have never imagined

that it would grow into what it is today. And I didn't really think about it, I guess, all that much. How did you start it? Talk to me like from the beginning. Again, sort of that period of when I was wanted to kind of, again, evolve my life and let go of some things. And I went back to school and I walked away from Victoria's Secret and I was really kind of soul searching of like what actually does feel meaningful to me? What is intellectually stimulating? And also sort of a moment, and this is around 20, I guess at this point, 2014. And I had again felt this sort of responsibility and opportunity with so many young women following me on social media. And I felt like I needed to do more with that or I wanted to do more.

It was it was an opportunity to actually be impactful. So I didn't want to fully walk away from my fashion career because that was part of the power that gave me that sort of influence. Well, that was your enabler, right? Absolutely. So it was like, how do I stay one foot in this world, but use it in a more meaningful way, at least to me? And that's when I went back to school. I went back to this coding boot camp called the Flatiron School.

It was like a deep intensive in the sort of front end and back end of tech, both software, hardware. Just give me an idea. Like, what did you know at that point? Did you know, beyond like using a phone and a laptop like the rest of us, had you, did you have like an engineering background? Did you know someone who was a code? Not at all.

No. The only thing I knew. So I went to a great public school. There was no comp. You know, we had, thank goodness, a financial literacy class, which was ahead of its time. but we did not have computer science. It was still early. So I had had no exposure, but what I had had was by way of Josh, certainly,

and all the entrepreneurs I met through him. And I was meeting, you know, Kevin Sistram was one of the co-founders of Instagram. And he was, you know, a friend of mine. I forget that. I mean, by association with Josh, you are often around some of the best entrepreneurs of our time. So you were hearing conversations. No, no, I was deeply knowing these people. I love that.

I'm like, you know me, Emma. I'm in it. I'm in it. I'm going to that meeting. I'm calling to that dinner. Oh yeah. I know all the portfolio companies. Like, I know things.

So I'm like, I met, you know, Kevin was a good friend. And it sort of clicked for me. Okay, Instagram, which has transformed my job as a model. And certainly the fashion industry and many other industries, you know, he started with an idea. And he not only had this sort of business idea, but actually more than even a business idea, he just, he knew how to code. He had this secret skill set of this fancy language that only certain, at the time, it felt extremely sort of out of access to anyone outside of Silicon Valley. Totally. Intellectual thing that only certain, primarily men.

Yeah. If you knew, you knew. And if you didn't, you were left out and left behind. Exactly. And this was sort of still like earlyish days and in a lot of sort of tech platforms. And so I was really fascinated by that and I also loved sort of the challenge of that. I think maybe because I'm one of four daughters

and I have this like sort of competitive drive of like whatever the boys can do, we can do I can do as well. What is it about the four-daughter? On the four-daughter thing too, it really does something to you. It does. And so I think that like I felt like, all right, first of all, how amazing that like one person can build an idea that can transform the world.

Yes. actually. And then not only that, but like that one person is able to do that because they know this skill set. So what is this skill set? And why do more people not know it? And so I just started very simply with like taking a, you know, three month course at the Flatiron School. And I was one of the only sort of women in the school. And there were a few, but definitely not enough. And And I was really blown away by sort of just the basic anatomy of like how a computer works. It was almost like the anatomy of like the hard drive and the, you know, all of the sort of like machinery. It was like it was like a body.

It's like you have the heart. You have the brain. You have the veins that connect everything. So it sort of demystified the hardware. And then the software component too of like front end and back end of how to build a website. Like pretty basic. But it was like very just sort of eye opening. of like, once you can get past the sort of bulky, awkward,

or the abstract nature of, like, code and syntax. But it's like learning, I would imagine, Latin. Or another language, you know, I learned French. But, like, it's like learning a language. And that was sort of, again, another, I think, moment of confidence boost that I was like, you know what? If I can learn this, like, anyone can learn this. And was your idea at that point, like, I'm going to start a business?

I'm going to be like one of these founders. that I'm meeting? My idea at the point was, how do I get more girls to realize how powerful this is? Like, right at the beginning, that's how you felt. That's how I felt at the beginning. It was a very clear, like, oh shit, this is very powerful and it's not impossible to learn. This is the future, and there aren't many women that are part of it. This was 2015, and I put out on my social media at the time a very modest sort of scholarship program. I was underwriting for 21 girls to experience the same sort of coding boot camp that I went to. I love that about you, Carly, because I feel like even at that point, you were so young,

it's such an interesting thing that that's, you know, because again, I'm very opportunistic. I could have probably gone to that class and been like, I'm going to figure out how to build a website and I'm going to take all this information for myself. But even at that point, you're sitting there going, I've had this incredible experience. There's very few women involved and I'm going to take what I've earned and put 21 kids through the same course? I think it's because I'm from a big family. That's just what you do.

You share. You share the love. You share the love. And I've always been that way. Like I love to share things I'm discovering or experiencing. So it just was innate. I didn't overthink it. I definitely did not think.

Do you remember how much it cost you? Each, good question. I think the whole thing maybe was like, maybe it was a $50,000 donation. Yeah, but it's meaningful. It's a meaningful donation. For sure. Not nothing.

But I was so excited to sort of support the school. Wow. And I did not think in that moment I was starting an education nonprofit. I thought, I'm going to help a couple of girls out. I'm going to do a good deed. And Emma, when I tell you, the response we had to those 21 scholarship slots, thousands. Really? Thousands of young women around the world.

And actually people, women, men of all ages. And the scholarship specifically was 13 to 18 year old young women in our programs that we wanted to sort of teach these skills and that's the way the program was designed. But it sort of really was a moment where I was like, oh, wow, there's a disconnect here of the enormous opportunity in these spaces and the lack of access to them. And maybe I should have built a for-profit business at that time around it. But I was like, let me just help connect these dots. And how did you decide who would get into the program? Because I love that it was like, it's really for kids, right? It's 13 to 18. So how did you even piece that together?

Because I think so many people that listen to this show particularly love the idea of starting a business or having a pivot. And I feel like you've done so much of that throughout your career. And it really seems to have come from a really genuine place. But there's also a reality of that, right? You get thousands of submissions coming through Instagram. What did you do to organise yourself? It was so bootstrapped for a very long time. I, you know, we really sort of piece mailed it like, like at the time, you know, I had nobody helping me.

I didn't have an assistant. I had nothing. So the founder of the school and I sort of like went through a lot of applications. And, you know, the school really at the time was, was helpful in operating that first year. Right. And we, we, I mean, it was hard to choose. And it is hard to choose because, you know, and there's so much need out there. So much need. But so what, this is where it's like, I'm so proud to tell you this summer, for instance, we're going through applications right now. We will have 3,000 scholarships. No.

This summer alone, we will have 3,000 scholarships for young women around the world. How many women have been through the program? So this is the crazy thing. So from 2015 until now, we have more, had more than 11,000 young women in our programs around the world. So it started 21 scholarships. The next year was 75. the next year was 150, and then I think the next year was 1,000.

That's so impressive. What are those women going on to do? Do you keep in touch? Do you have any idea what type of careers and opportunities they're getting that's kind of, I guess because the interest starts here, right? If you're a 13-year-old taking this, it's like your interest is peaked, you have some skills, and you're like, okay, what's next? Oh, the stories, I could sit here and tell you forever.

But I'll tell you some statistics to sort of grounds the community. So the community of 11,000 young women around the world, those who go on to college or in college now, 70% of them major or minor in computer science. Wow. So, 70% compare that to 4% of women in America graduating with computer science degrees. So 70% of our alumni are sort of go through our program and realize the enormous sort of opportunity, not just in tech, candidly. If you want to start a business like yours, if you want to go into beauty, you need an understanding, into social entrepreneurship, yes. into, you know, climate change, into mental health areas, into medical fields.

Like, technical literacy is invaluable, especially when you talk about things like AI, like the evolving world we're living in. I mean, by the way, the entire world will need to be reskilled as AI is transforming how we live. But that's what's so impressive, because you're single-handedly creating the pipeline of women that are going to have the skills for the next generation of opportunity that's coming up. And I think it's just so much the kind of cost. of entry is just so different when you're wrong. And the understanding and how we learn is so different. So I find it so impressive that you're doing this and you've been doing it for so long. You were really early. Thank you. Well, no, statistics show, I mean, women are slower to adopt

and adapt to AI and implementing that in their daily lives, even just today with CHOP GPT and the incredible tools that exist. And so, you know, I think what just again, to kind of go back to our community, 11,000, 80 percent identify as people. of color. 40% would qualify for free and reduced lunch programs. Also another 70% of our alumni are over 18. So yes, our programs kind of reach this young teenage high school student before they've decided what they want to be in the world or what doors they think might be open or close to them. And I think that is a huge part of why this is so impactful because we reach them at such a young age. But we're 10 years into this. So we have

scholars that are into their mid to late 20s and they are in the workplace and they are deeply still connected to us. And that is the sort of next evolution of the role that we play at Code with Klossi is how we continue to support them along the pipeline so that we keep them in these spaces because that is critical as well. And you know this. I mean, there's an enormous amount of sort of, I think, drop off and of women, you know, in that sort of broken rung era of sort of that first promotion to management. And so how to continue to support our scholars and our community in the spaces that they go on to as leaders.

And it's far just beyond, you know, the role that we play initially is sort of introducing them to computer science skills. We have AI machine learning. We have web dev, mobile app development, and data science. We take our curriculum very seriously. We build custom curricula. We train hundreds of teachers around the world. we have like a very robust program in how we run our operation.

And I'm so proud of that. But what we're doing now is really thinking about, you know, thousands of young women who are our alumni, who we're growing with as they're growing, and how to continue to sort of equip them with sort of 21st century leadership skills. Yeah. I don't even like to say like soft skills. No, but it's leadership skills.

It's like modern day leadership skills. But it's impressive to me because I feel like the idea. idea that you've been doing this for so long and you're actually thinking about the next evolution of it. And I imagine that through that journey and supporting so many women, because you also, obviously, you're an investor and you have a fund and you're investing in a lot of women, but it's kind of like these, there's like these kind of parallel tracks in what you do, right? It's like you start really young. You're actually putting your money where your mouth is when it comes to supporting females in business and, you know, closing that gap and making sure that there's,

this pipeline of incredible talent that can go and lead some of these female founded businesses is going to be really important. So what I'm just trying to understand, is there a link between Code with Clossie and what you're doing as you think about supporting female founders? Do you think about it as almost like one of the same things? Because your mission is like to me becoming so, so crystallized and so clear in terms of what you care about and where you're putting your energy. Thank you. I think it's just innately just the way. that I think and the kind of what things I care about. It's not some sort of master plan. It all sort of has evolved organically. And it's funny, I started angel investing long before it was like a

trendy thing to do. You know, again, this sort of, I think like you, you know, you and I, I think very much shared this sort of early entrepreneurial bug of like always thinking about how to problem solve in a sustainable way. And to me, that's what entrepreneurship is. is. It's like, how can I identify a problem and build a sustainable solution that that can be like a viable business and better for the planet? And I think that's the framework that I've always looked at the kind of companies I want to invest in. And companies is not even the people I want to invest in. The ideas I want to invest in. And that has always been the framework of what I put money behind. I mean, I think I was 20 years old when I put my first, you know, angel check into, and that was not even like a

term that I was aware of. I just, you know, one of the first, you know, two women that I wrote a check to was they started this company called Lola, a sort of direct-to-consumer. I remember it. It's the tampons and sanitary products, right? Exactly. And that was sort of one of the first moments where I really exercised my power of having money and being able to sort of support an idea that I felt like was better for the world and better for me as a consumer. There is this mentality that everyone should be a founder. And you instead, I mean, because arguably you have started a lot of things. But it's interesting that you decided I'm going to take my money and put it into other founders.

I'm going to empower other people to do that are being able to execute these businesses. What do you think that you've learned from investing in women particularly? What do you think you've learned about starting businesses and running businesses that's been useful? So much. One, I mean, women just get shit done. So I like, I love to invest in women. But also... Do you exclusively invest in women?

No, no, no, no, definitely not. I've invested in, you know, Kaliva Farms, almond milk. And, you know, so many other, like, consumer products, tech platforms, definitely some male-founded businesses, too. But there's a couple other businesses that come to mind that I love. I mean, two more since I've entered motherhood. One is called Bobby, another is coterie. Today we helped a...

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Carly, is that you're such a principled woman, right? It's like you really lead with your heart, but I feel like your background where you come from, your principles are so really, like, incredibly clear. And I think it's interesting because I think for myself, the way I do business, the way I go about my every day is really based on these things that guide me, right? It's like the things that made me, that yeah, and it really, and it really, and it really, and it really, really is. It's embedded into every decision I make. And so when you think about your principles and what guides you and guides what you want to do, they're like a set of things that you're thinking about because there's clearly no accident. When I look at your portfolio of brands, you know, it really is

all about, you know, female investors. It's about things that make sense for moms or the environment, but, you know, inherently good brands that are doing good for the world. That must have been purposeful for you. For sure. I have always thought any, and this was long before I had a lot of money, power, privilege, platform or a big voice, but all of those to me have been vehicles that I have wanted to use to drive impact or push the world toward the direction. I hope it goes. And I think that for me, I care so deeply about, you know, access to opportunity. My life has been transformed because of access to opportunity that I had. And that was because of something in a lot of ways I didn't have control over. I was a tall, skinny girl at the right place at the right time. That I couldn't

control. And a lot of things, my fate, you know, I hated that I couldn't control my success based on that. A young woman learning how to code who works, who pours herself into, learning anything, by the way, like that is a skill set that can create open any door you want. and create a life and a career for yourself. And to me, that's what I, like, I, I've lived in my experience, like, how transformative it can be when you have access to an opportunity and when you take that and run with it. So I have always wanted to use any power, platform, privilege, voice I have

to help create access to opportunity. Because even if it's just one person to, like, that would be meaningful to me. You have been incredibly vocal. about your views on reproductive freedom and what's happening. And of course, last night, you and I co-hosted a dinner. I know that this is a cause that's really close to your heart. I don't know that I've ever had the conversation in the way that we had it last night, not just because of the experience and the expertise that you brought around the table,

but just the level of honesty and the sheer feeling of the kind of relentless, like, attack that I think is happening right now. I'm just very interested at why you would weigh in on such a contentious issue. Now, I know that I feel all women should feel as passionate as we do. But I do think that when you're as high profile as you are, it's a choice to speak about it or not. And I just would love to ask you that question of why you've come into this issue so heavily in the way that you have. To me, it's healthcare. it shouldn't be a contentious conversation. It should be a basic human right of access to health care

if and when someone needs it and chooses it. If you don't believe in it, you don't want it, you don't need to choose it. Don't have one. But health issues don't discriminate. You know, I'm sitting here five months pregnant and there's a lot that I feel very vulnerable to that like, you know, God forbid something might happen that I can't control. And in And in that moment, I would hope that there is access to life-saving care, to vital care. And unfortunately, the reality is in many states across this country, there is not. And, you know, 25 million women of reproductive age in America are living in a state with some type of abortion ban. And to me, that is infuriating.

That is devastating because the implications of that are very real and are being played out in real time. And to me, that's not politics. This is light we're talking about. And, you know, I think the sort of inequitable access, you know, it's like for me, I can get on an airplane and leave whatever state I'm in to access the best medical care in New York or in California. But, like, a lot of women don't have that privilege or that time. And that, you know, I think there's so much statistics I can sit here and tell you about sort of the misinformation and misconceptions, I think, around this too. I mean, an overwhelming majority of abortions happen before 13 weeks. Overwhelming majority are already mothers who are seeking this care. This is not a light

decision. And to me, it doesn't matter how or why somebody's coming to that decision. It is a health service that people deserve to have if they need it. And to me, it's really infuriating. You know, I'm from Missouri, all my sisters, neighbors, friends, family, like many, which live back home and are, you know, Missouri is actually a state where we fought very hard over the last year to not only pass the ballot initiative, but just get it on the ballot. You don't even believe. And, but we passed it. It was the first state to ever go from a complete abortion ban to row standards to sort of, it was, it's, and, but it's still being contested. It's still been held up in the court cases. And now, you know, there's threats that they're going to try and repeal it.

So this is, I mean, imagine if you poured that energy into more productive places of actually helping people. And to me, all I, you know, hope to do is with any power, privilege, platform, or voice or vote that I have is do what I can to help others access care if they need it. And support the care providers who are risking their lives every single. single day to do this work. And, you know, I think maybe because my dad's a doctor, like, I understand. No one is, you know, the people who are doing this are doing this because they, they know that it is how critical it is. And I just want to do whatever I can to support that work. Well, I'm so unbelievably grateful to you for keeping the conversation going, but also for continuing to really educate people because I really believe so strongly that there is

so much misinformation out there and so much that we are kind of being fed that is just completely incorrect. And so it's really, really important that we don't just think about this as something that has happened to us. It's a fight and it's a reason for, I think, so many women to be energized around a cause that affects us all. So I'm actually just so incredibly grateful, not just to you raising the awareness, but also, as usual, Carly Klaus, putting your money where your mouth is. know, kudos to you. And one thing that I'm totally fascinated about,

and I really must ask you about it, because you've recently, you know, acquired, and I love this. We haven't even talked about that. Acquired, because it just makes me so, so happy for you. But you are one of very few women that is really, like, in the publishing space. You acquired ID magazine.

You acquired Life magazine. I think you're part of a consortium of people that acquired W as well. Is that right? And it just is so interesting to me because I'm like, why the rest of the world is like, magazines are dead, we're all moving on, all of the sudden, Carly class is like,

I'm going to start a publishing empire, which is also a very, very, very male-dominated space. Is there like a big grand plan? What are you thinking about? Like, why? Totally. Why and what are you doing? First of all, I'm like, there's no one who likes magazines more than me.

I will tell you right now, the minute people started shutting down magazines. I was like crying and mourning everyone. So I feel like this is such an interesting space for you to be getting into. Well, I definitely feel like the person that's running into the burning building that everybody else is running out of. I actually do think, like, call me crazy, but I also think that's where some interesting opportunities emerge.

And I think that is, it is a moment of evolution, absolutely, in the business model of media. And to me, what is very hard to do is build a brand from the ground up, which I have tremendous respect for all that you've built. You're right. And to me, what I saw with ID and certainly with Life and W is that they are... These are brands. These are storied brands. They have archival history.

They mean things to people. What they stand for, what the role they've played in sort of pop culture or culture. And to me, that is a very hard thing to manufacture or build from the ground up. And so I think when I saw this sort of distressed opportunity with ID, vice going through bankruptcy, you know, one, I mean, we both know and love Edward Enningful dearly. I mean, ID was one of the first editorials I did. And I mean, I grew up, like reading that magazine, buying that magazine, obsessing, like obsessing over the covers.

And the first 20 pages of that magazine would be like eating like a culture soup. You'd be like, what do I need to wear? What do I need to buy? Where do I need to go? It was so rich with information in a time when information wasn't so easy to come by, but, you know, such specificity. You were like, like, I am, I'm going to be called just like by virtue of reading this. So I think that you're absolutely right.

And exposing your mind and eyes to new ideas and new different ways of thinking and dressing and people. And to me, that's what, you know, ideas so uniquely sort of had this place in sort of youth culture, certainly in the UK scene and in the fact. But beyond, you know, I think that's like, you know, it's such a sort of storied platform also in music. So many musicians have sort of had the first. So, Collie, what are you going to do with it? This is what I need to know. I'm like, what are you doing? I'm so nosy. Yeah, no, no, no. To me, the opportunity is to sort of like re-imagined the business that can be

built around that. And we've, you know, it's been, I've learned so much. I mean, let me tell you, it's only been maybe a year and a half since I, or less, a year and changed since I acquired ID. And we've fully rebuilt the engine inside. You know, we rebuilt. We bought it out of bankruptcy. So effectively, like, had to build from the ground up the site, the sort of CMS, the back of house. Like the editorial team, too. Did you have to rebuild that?

Yes. There was a lot of sort of evolution across all aspects of the business. But to me, what the opportunity is and what we're really focused on doing is sort of preserving and protecting the DNA of what it always was. but reaching young people today where they are, which is, of course, across the digital mediums. Print is one spoke of what we do. I think print deserves to live on.

But there's a lot smarter ways you can manufacture and distribute your print, so you're not printing a lot of magazines, and then they're getting ultimately pulped, which is a sad truth about the publishing world. So were you really thinking about these brands in a much more 360 way? you're thinking through the event lens,

experiential. To me, it's like, you know, that is the opportunity to sort of build more than just a content business. You know, of course there's, and that's still a meaningful business. You know, I think, like, we consume more content and information than ever. But I think the way in which you can actually leverage that, to me, I think of three different sort of audiences that matter deeply. One is our audience, like consumer, like readers.

young people, people of all ages around the world who want to read our content, talent, and then our brand partners. And there's ways to sort of like create a better, better way to sort of serve all parties because they all play into each other. Like, it is not really serving a brand partner, like an advertiser, to buy a page in a print magazine anymore. Like that is, there's, there's a cashier to that. But it's like, yeah, it's like one way of hitting. But actually, what's more interesting is like an especially, I've seen this post-pandemic is like experiential in these sort of like moments that people are craving and brands find far more sort of meaningful. And so to me it's like how do we just,

how do we sort of think first principles about the business that can be built around these brands? Again, ideas very much sort of this youth culture, music, fashion, sort of street culture, like irreverence. And I think like there's so much that sort of we're building within that world. W is incredible. It has an incredible editor-in-chief. And then life. Like, and then life. That was like, to me, like, I got it. I was like, you know, fashion, W-I-D. And then I was like, whoops, skits got around the court. Life. That was like genius to me. That was really all Josh. Like, oh, really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like an American icon. Totally. And it's been asleep. It's been dormant for, I mean, out of print more than 20 years.

And so that were deep in sort of the sort of underground phase of building the team around and relaunching. And you're working with your husband. And that is the first thing Josh and I have ever really worked together. I mean, you tell me, you work with your husband all day, every day. This is the first time that we are working together. I look at that as like possibly a partnership made in heaven. Because knowing the both of you, you both have very, very different skills and yet intrinsically

the same values. So to me, it's like, I'll bet on that partnership. Let me tell you. Well, stay tuned. I mean, I definitely am excited to, you know, have that sort of come to life, no pun intended, at the right time. But I think that, you know, it was always built on this sort of like deep sense of values. Stay tuned. I will keep you posted. I will be watching this space.

Thank you. You have no idea. And I wonder if there have been times. I mean, I don't know what fool would do this. But do you feel like you've ever been underestimated? Because you sit as you sit and talk right now, I mean, you are beyond impressive. Like what you're doing has so much gravitas, so much meaning, but there's so much heart in it. And I really admire someone that's able to fuse all of those things and be thinking about sort of, you know,

breathing life into these like new brands and creating completely new businesses that don't exist. And so I certainly wouldn't be one of the people. But have you been underestimated in the past? More times. I mean, all the time. It's still, of course, all the time today. You know, I think I have definitely. evolved. I think I think I growing up from being a young woman in the public eye, starting a career

in a very public way, I think I used to put so much more weight on the way that I was perceived, more weight on those judgments, those point of views of others to sort of assess how I felt about myself based on how everybody else felt. And I think that with time, age wisdom, and I think certainly motherhood, I generally don't give a fuck what anybody thinks about me. It's kind of really freeing. I didn't really freeing. I'm so glad you heard it. You have to give zero fucks because all of the things you're doing, like why would you?

It's really, really unbelievable. What kind of lessons do you, like I just feel like you're clearly kind of out here doing what you need to do on your own terms. and I think it's so difficult for so many people to reach that point where they feel like they get there and that that's a choice for them. So I just wonder what over the last 15 years of you being, you know, out here, walking the walk, talking the talk, getting to this point in your career, what have you learned? Oh my God, I've learned so much. I think I've learned to trust myself, to trust my instinct, to trust my, to trust my

sort of just my own voice. I think I, again, always, because I started so young, I had a lot of sort of like chaperones or agents or people sort of coddling me or telling me what I was supposed to be or do. And I think finally actually just trusting my own voice, my own gut response to things, that has, when I don't listen to that, then I go wrong. Yes. And I think that's where it's just, like, I'd rather make a mistake based on, like, my own choice as opposed to not trusting myself, listening to somebody else and ultimately making that same mistake. Like, I'd rather just own it myself. I love that.

It's a really solid piece of advice. I have a little rapid fire for you now, my darling. All right. Okay. What is the first thing you do when you wake up in the morning? Check my nan it for my kids or check on my kids run into the room. Or if I'm on the other side of the country like today, like check on my kids, call home. Yeah.

I love that. And then coffee shortly after. Yeah. I think that's a good one. The last thing you do before you go to bed? I make sure to set like three alarms because I'm a solid sleeper. What are you currently aspiring for in your business life? Hmm.

I think to continue to keep growing as a leader, I feel like I see this to Josh all the time. I'm like, I have no idea what I'm doing. And he's like, probably nobody does. And so that's helpful. But I think just to continue to sort of grow as a leader, as a boss, as a manager, as a person, and better sort of, I think work smarter, not just harder. Yeah. What are you aspiring for in your personal life? Working smarter, not just harder, to sort of free up more space and time.

And yeah, I think just like I have really tried to be as present in this moment because it does go, it is going so quick. My son, you see this, you have your, you're 8 and 11, right? That is like, they might as well be in college. They might as well be in college. That's how I feel. They literally might as well be in college. Oh my gosh. Time is moving so fast.

So just being as present in this moment as possible. No, I feel like that. That's just a great point of view for anyone with kids or kids. without kids. Be present. What is a book that's changed your life? Oh my gosh. Well, I always love reading The Alchemist. I most recently just read my friend Amy Griffin's book, The Tell, which was deeply moving. Deeply, deeply. That's one that everyone, everyone should read. I can highly recommend it. Fantastic, like gut-wrenching, but also a must read, I would say. What's something that you value now that you didn't back then?

I think, you know, I was always so professional back then, but I think I, I don't know, I guess I wasn't always, I was always on time. But I now really appreciate how that is a very important thing. But I was always very professional. But now I'm on time. Now you're on time. Yes. I know, time becomes very precious. Oh, my God.

Yes, it does. The older we get. the older we get. Thank you for being here today. Thank you for the chats and the honesty. And honestly, I'm like, I'm so happy for you. I'm so proud of you. I'm so like, I'm like team Carly all the way. I'm like, yes, you're amazing. Everything you're doing is so, so unbelievably impressive. Good for you, that means the world coming from you, Emma. I so, I love you. I appreciate you. I admire you. I aspire to be the woman that you are and that, you know, your four children. My God, I need all your lessons. but thank you for having me

and just the light you are in the world and you are such an inspiration for me and for so many. So thank you. You're darling. Love you. If you're loving this podcast, be sure to click follow

on your favorite listening platform. While you're there, give us a review and a five-star rating and share an episode you loved with a friend who'll be so grateful. Aspire with Emagreed is presented by Odyssey. I'm your host, Emma Greed. Our executive producers are Corrine Gilliard Fisher,

Derek Brown and me. Our executive producers from Odyssey on Maddie Sprung Kaiser, Leah Reese Dennis, Asha Saluja and Jenna Weiss Berman. Justine Dom is our senior producer. Our producer is Kristen Torres. Sound design and engineering by Bill Shultz. Angela Paluso is our Booker, original music by Charles Black. Video production by Evan Cox, Kurt Courtney, Andrew Steele, Carlos Delgado and Arnie Agassi. Social media by Olivia Holman. Special thanks go to Brittany Sessions.

Smith, Sydney Ford, my teams at Jones Works and W&E, Moora Curran, Josephina Francis, Hillary Shuff, Eric Donnelly, Kate Hutchinson Rose, Tim Mekyll, Sean Cherry and Lauren Vieira. If you have questions for me, you can DM me at Aspire with Emma Greed. Greed is spelled G-R-E-D-E, that's AspI-R-E-R-E with Emma Greed. Or you can submit a question to me on my website, emagreed.me. The ambition comes in all shapes and sizes. At First Citizens Bank, we roll with your goals because we're built for what you're building. Fit for your ambition, First Citizens Bank.