Aspire with Emma Grede - The Aspire Playbook: How Allison Ellsworth Turned a Kitchen Experiment into a Billion-Dollar Brand

Episode Date: July 22, 2025

Ever wondered what it really takes to turn your small idea into a billion-dollar success? Today, Emma sits down with Allison Ellsworth, the founder behind Poppi, the revolutionary beverage brand that became the second fastest-growing drink company in history. Allison shares the real, raw journey—from brewing her first drink in her kitchen, to putting her life savings on the line, and ultimately landing a $2 billion deal with PepsiCo. This episode is your masterclass in courage, branding, and innovation. Allison reveals her exact playbook for knowing when to go all in, how to avoid costly mistakes, why being social-first changed everything for her company, and the unexpected reason she chose to step away from the business she built from scratch. If you're holding onto an idea, waiting for the right moment, or navigating the complexities of growing your brand, you can't afford to miss this conversation. Hit play for the ultimate inspiration to just get started and build the business of your dreams. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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so I can share it with you. Start with yourself. My debut book is available now. Visit emigre.com to purchase the book, also available on Amazon. on, your favorite audio platforms, and all good bookshops. Alison Ellsworth built Poppy, a modern soda empire from scratch. No roadmap, just hustle, TikTok and sheer grit. Then she sold it for $1.9 billion to Pepsi, a full exit from the company that she started at her kitchen table. Today, Allison shares the steps, the real numbers and what it actually takes to scale a business,

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Welcome to Aspire, Alison. I'm so happy to have you. Thank you for having me. I'm really excited to talk to you because I think the audience that listens to this podcast are the type of audience that are noodling about ideas in their head, thinking whether they should start a business. And that's exactly what you did. You took your own issues, created a solution, went out, created a business. You've grown that business, eventually sold that business, which is so impressive. But what would you say to somebody listening right now who's thinking about whether or not to take that leap, what would be your advice given all you've gone through? So I think the most basic thing in the world is you just have to do it.

I think that the rest of you, people always think there's this perfect moment or perfect time. There's no such thing when it comes to business. And I look back at those days and I'm so blessed that I didn't know anything. Naivety is a really good thing. It's like there's no fear. You can just jump off a cliff. There's no risk. You don't care.

you're putting your heart and soul into something. And so now it's funny. Like, everyone's like, what are you going to do next? You start another business? I'm like, yes, but I know too much now. It's almost harder. So you just have to do it and just like have no fear. That's your advice. Just do it. I know. And it's so annoying because it's not the best advice, but it's true. Like people think there's a magic sauce. And honestly, it's the person, I feel like it's the entrepreneur. It's the idea. It's the passion. It's the grit. You know, I think your advice is really truthful, though, because I often and say the same thing. I'm like, you just got to do it. It's a bit like having a baby. There's no like perfect time. The stars don't align. It's like you just got to one day decide that this is what I'm doing.

And then you forget all the bad and then you do it again and you forget all that. Hopefully. That's what that's about to happen to you now. You're going to forget it all and you're going to go full circle. So I want to understand a little bit about your upbringing and growing up. I think that you grew up around a lot of entrepreneurs. Did you know that you were going to start a business? Was that always in your path. No, I just know that I don't like being told what to do. And I think if you have that, you don't want to be in a cubicle or have a normal boss that's telling you what to do. And even throughout Poppy, that was like a really big struggle with me. I think people got to know it and I definitely grew throughout it. But my dad was an entrepreneur. My sister was an entrepreneur. They're

all hustlers doing multiple different things. My dad at one point was making $30 million a month, lost everything. No. Rebuilt a business. What was he doing? making $30 million a month? Maybe we should do that. I mean, I know. It was like he worked in oiling gas back in the 80s when it was like the big boom of oil and it was like the whole thing. Then the industry went down and he just rebuilt and he's now doing another business. And he loves the builds. And that's something with me. Like I love the build of business. I never do it for money. I think if you do it for money, it takes out the passion. Now money is amazing. It's amazing. But I'm guessing you didn't need money. If your dad was making $30 million a month at some point,

Did you need it? He never left us anything or set up a trust or no, absolutely not. I turned 18 and paid for my car, my rent, my school. I still, to this day, of paying student loans. Like, it's wild. I know. You can pay those off now, right? I know, but it's the interest, isn't it?

She's like, I've got a plan. I've got to plan. So for me, no. So my parents were divorced pretty young. I was raised by a single mom. So I had all this inspiration of entrepreneurial around me, but then I saw how hard my mom worked and how hard I had to work. And so it's just, I don't know, learn from the beginning. You've got to work hard.

So take me back to that moment because you actually started making what is now poppy, but you were making, well, actually, even let's go back before that, you're actually trying to solve a problem because you had some issues and you decided that you needed to, you'd figure out a way to do soft drinks better. Yeah, I know. I had a bunch of health issues. Anytime you travel, you don't have access to good food. This is before it was kind of the craze. And like, L.A. was like, oh, everything's gluten-free and all of that. But, I just couldn't find anything that made me feel good, started drinking apple cider vinegar. Now, it tasted disgusting. And I was like, okay, this is not sustainable. And I just went to my kitchen. Gosh, this was like eight years ago. So it was around 30 years old.

And it was one of those things where I wanted to start a family. I wasn't pregnant yet. And I was like, if I don't feel good, you don't want to bring a life into the world. And so I just did that. And then I ended up getting pregnant maybe like three months after that. I didn't want to go back on the road and kind of go work. You were working like a regular corporate job, is that right? I was working in oil and gas research.

So it's very entrepreneurial, though. I'd be in the middle of nowhere running huge multimillion dollar projects, and I wouldn't have a boss, and it was just me and the city council or the government are working through contracts. And I didn't want to go back on the road doing that pregnant. And so I took our product at the time. It was called Mother Beverage. And I just started selling it at the farmer's market as a hobby.

And it was just a fun hobby that I was just bored. I had no idea. I just wanted to share it with as many people as possible because I was so passionate about it. And yeah, it was just like, why not? How do you even start to make a drink? Because that's where people falter, right? They're like, I've got this amazing idea. I feel like I can go and sell this at the farmer's market. What did you actually do to get started? So a huge mistake people do is they take all of their money, whether it's in their savings to their credit card and they bring on some lab. or someone to produce a product for you. And you end up spending tens of thousands of dollars to get something that you're, you're not even sure how you made it yourself. So then is it really yours? So for me, I used Google.

Good old Google. Good old Google. And I just Googled how you would create a beverage and what kind of ingredients. And you can order anything online nowadays. So I got myself a scale. I got lab grade ingredients and flavors in Soda Stream. Hello. No, you did it.

I swear. literally. And then we would go to like the local hardware stores and we bought huge vats. We cleared the bed out of our guest room and just put like vinegar vats in our room downstairs. And this is you and who? My husband. No way. Yes. So you and your husband, you're Googling, you're buying all of the stuff and you're literally like mixing a drink and I'm assuming like tasting until you get to a place where you're like, this is delicious. Exactly. And I will never forget one Thanksgiving at home. And I'm like, hey, you guys, look at my amazing drink. And my mom is like, you want me to drink vinegar.

Like, you're insane. I was like, no, no, no, try it. And I remember my brother-in-law was the only one that sat down and taste tested with me. And he gave me like validation. He was like, you're not crazy. This is actually really good. And so we were like three weeks into the farmer's market. And then Whole Foods did come by our booth.

And they were like, nothing like this is in Whole Foods. And that was the first moment I knew it had a business versus a hobby. And the light kind of went off. And I was like, oh, okay. And I looked at my husband, I said, we're putting our life savings into this. We're going to open our own manufacturing facility and we're going to go all in. And he's like, you just bought a house? Three weeks in?

Yeah. And you're like how many months pregnant at this point? I was three months pregnant. Oh, my goodness. Okay. So you get yours and your husband's life savings and you at this point plow everything into this company. Yeah, we took about $90,000, which at the time was just so much money for us.

It's still so much money. Yes. And what I love about that is then we were able to kind of like upgrade how we made the product. We had a facility. We almost brewed it like beer. We had a brewery friend that was like, I'll help you guys figure this out. We got all the right certifications and did it legit because to actually go in a grocery store, you can't make it in your kitchen at home.

So what does that look like from going to from farmers market to Whole Foods? What do you do from a team perspective? You obviously put in all of your money. You upgrade your equipment. But what does it look like on the business side of the business? your team, your infrastructure, how did you like get to that Whole Foods point? It was still just me and my husband. No.

Yes. And so I will never forget. No way. You did not have a product in Whole Foods and there's two of you in your company. Yes. And we literally, we would brew it during the week and bottle it. Me and my husband, we would sell on farmers markets on the weekend so that we could pay our mortgage. And then he was working a second job. On top of it, we were doing deliveries. I went into labor on the line, had the baby, was back on the. the line two weeks later with it strapped to me. I'm not even... Your first baby. The first baby. So then we finally maybe like 10 months in hired someone to help us like in the manufacturing full time. So it's

about three of us, about 10 months in. And then it got to the point where we were like, okay, we have something here. Obvious next step in the American dream is you go on Shark Tank. I just love it. Good old Shark Tank. Good Shark Tank. So at that kind of 10 month, because I think so many people think, when is the time to go out and raise money? When should I even think that? For you guys, what was it at that 10-month point? Sales looked like what, roughly? Like, where were you in the kind timeline of the business? Yeah, I think we had done maybe like 200,000 in revenue. We were like really starting to, really saturating in the Dallas market. So all of the local grocery stores, the local Whole Foods, we, I think had gotten a meeting with sprouts. And then we finally were like

And sheen towards the 500,000 in revenue. And we just, like, had no money. We're still just grinding. And you're almost like, we can't scale this. We can't go big if we don't get some real investment. We had someone that was going to give us some investment. And he was like, I have money, but I have no connections. And we've always heard, you know, even back then, don't take stupid money that can't work for you. And actually, really the connection. Not everybody knows that. The connections are way more important than the money. 100%. Money's kind of easy to come by. It's all of the rest of it. Like having a true investor who's got, you know, a track record and some understanding of your category and hopefully some

relationships, like that's the stuff that's really important. So you decide to go on Shark Tank. Yes. And you apply just like a regular person. So we didn't know you can just apply online or that they reach out. So I literally was the first time I got a babysitter. Spoilered. I got pregnant with my second like right away. So it was about three months pregnant. There's something about this. Yeah, a lot going on there. A lot going on with our second. I remember we went and stood in line at one of those just like open casting calls. Actually, Mark Cuban had. on his Instagram. We're coming to Dallas, come by. We did it. It was the first time I ever got a real babysitter. And we went and stood in line for like eight hours. And once we finally got

at the producers, they're like, this is incredible. You guys are going to sail through. Took about six months. Kept going, kept going. And then I finally was like, you guys, I'm nine months pregnant. I have to go on the show. Yes. But I went anyways. And I was literally on the show nine months pregnant. You were nine months pregnant. Had the baby 10 days later. No, you did it. Well, the excitement was like. Yes. Honestly, it kept me very calm. I was backstage.

Like, I cannot go in labor. And of course, the producers are probably like, this is going to make great TV if she goes into labor on our show. Bring a whole new meaning to there's a picture. Totally. It kept me very calm throughout the whole process. That's just absolutely wild.

So you go in with the mindset that you're going there to get a check and you're not walking out without one. We were determined. Like, it was either that or we probably would have gone out of business. Determined and desperate at that point? Probably, yeah. Yeah, 100%. A little bit, because you've stretched every part of your resources.

So you go in, you do the pitch, I've seen the pitch, it was like such a lovely one. I would have definitely invested in you. And you land your investor. What was the deal that you did on Shark Tank? So we did $400,000 for 25% of the company, which, looking back, I don't even know what we asked for. I don't even think we thought about it. We just yelled deal. Because we were just that excited.

And I've always just heard of, and like, we had no idea. Our shark was Rohan Jose. I had no idea who Rohan. was. You didn't? No, they don't, I mean, they don't tell you who your sharks are until the night before. No, I guess not, but you kind of lucked out, right? I mean, talk about the perfect guest at the perfect time for the perfect pitch. Exactly. I mean, the stars aligned for you, like, yeah, unbelievably, unbelievably well. So you didn't know who he was, but you did, you got $400,000 for 25% of the business, and you leave feeling like, that's it, we've made it. We've made it,

but also literally, he comes in, he goes, you have a fantastic story, you have a fantastic story, fantastic product, but your branding's crap. I'm like, you know what, you're right. And I knew it. So that's good. I was going to say you understood that. Yeah, I mean, you just hear like everything that we'd been doing. And I think this is a really big mistake. Entrepreneurs, or maybe just anyone starting a business does, is they focus on the product and not the brand. And so it was one of the first moments that you know that. You want to focus on the marketing. We got out of the kitchen. We stopped manufacturing. I always say,

like, should you be putting caps on bottles or should you be talking about your brand? Like all of those things were just like what we wanted, but we never had really opportunity to do it to that point. And I would argue that, you know, you can transition a brand. The product is what the product is. If customers don't have a love and an appetite for it, the jigs up. Do you know what I mean? Whereas you can take your brand and you can tweak and create new packaging and change names and evolve.

And that's typically what happens to even the best brands, right? When you start with a great brand, you've just got to have a great product. and you guys had an amazing category busting product from the outset. When you think about taking investment, I think it's such an interesting thing. And you mentioned earlier that you knew you had to find not done money. How did you think about the relationship with your investor? What does that look like today? I'm just interested to understand, like, you know you need money,

but did you know that you should be listening to everything that he was saying? Like, how did that relationship shape up in the beginning? Honestly, it started out really amazing. So I truly feel like Rohan invested in us as founders and the product, right? And at the end of the day, it is his money. So he had a lot of say. But I will say, we took about nine months off after our episode. And we did a full rebrand. Were you nervous doing that, considering you were on such a tear for the 10 months before? Yeah, and we were scared even going through the rebrand. So we were called Mother Beverage and going through that process, we're like, do we need to have like a nod to it? Or I think at one point we're going to call her. ourselves mom and pop, which I'm like, oh, so cheesy looking back on it. Like, no, it's cute, but like, not jinzy. And then finally we came up with Poppy, which is just a playoff of soda pop. And we just really established like our mission to revolutionize soda for the next generation.

We give people the freedom to love soda again. And it's just such an emotional, bigger message than like this drink apple cider vinegar drink. Right. And so we took nine months. We rebranded instead of going with white cans, which means healthy, we went with color, which means fun. And we did a lot of that work and it was me, Rohan, my husband, Stephen, and this other person we work really closely with Stevie. And it was just us four that did it. And then we launched it March of 2020 right as COVID hit. And it was still just me and my husband, two employees. No. Why? And what was the reception? So it was the first week of COVID, which was really stressful. But I will say that it was the first time everybody in the world was thinking about their health

and wellness. Yeah. True. And reading labels. True. And going. And going to the grocery store to look for products that were shelf stable and pantry loading and doing all of those things. But we had our update on Shark Tank Air the second month in April and it was explosive for us after that and just sales were insane. That's great. How insane. I want the details. Give me the team. This is like what's been so incredible about your journey. Our growth is insane. So first year business, we did like $2 million in revenue. Second year we did 20. We did $50. 200, 500. Like, we had triple-digit growth every year. That is insane. It's insane. We're,

we're the second fastest growing beverage in the history of beverage. And then I'm the only female founder and beverage of an exit of this size ever. So there's just a lot of firsts. And it's been pretty exciting. I mean, can I just tell you? Like, I think that you did your exit, like, the week that we launched this podcast. And I was like, get her on the podcast. Because I'm, you know, I just literally look at what you did. I mean, it's so unbelievable. impressive because this category, that drink, the fact that you were creating something that was like, you know, didn't really exist that has opened up like the world and all of our eyes to this category and what's possible. I mean, it's pretty unbelievable. People don't realize,

like when you're starting a business, we created a category that did not exist in a grocery store five years ago. There was no thing, what is now called the modern soda set. Even when we first went in, they were like, we're going to put you in the sparkling water, enhanced water. They didn't know where to put us. And we were like, we are soda. And it took us about four years to convince them. A Super Bowl ad helped where we said soda about 17 times in it. Just a little Super Bowl ad, casual. You know, it just kind of put our flag down as like, we are soda for the next generation. And all of that was so intentional. But I think I always say that is like, even if you're starting a candle, like, be the best freaking candle you can ever be. And who knows how you're going to

make you got to make it a little bit better, a little bit different, but at the end of the day, just lean into the brand and the marketing. And it's just been pretty special what we've built for sure. Not loving your AT&T or T Mobile Bill? Yeah, we've been hearing that a lot. Good news. Bring your AT&T or T Mobile Bill to Verizon and we'll give you a better deal. So get away from that unfortunate phone bill and get to Verizon. Run, ride, canoe. Whatever it takes, we'll be here. Bring your AT&T or T Mobile bill to a Verizon store today and we'll give you a better deal on the best network, a better deal. No surprises. That's Verizon. Best Network based on root metrics, best overall mobile network performance U.S. second half 2025, all rights reserved. It must provide

a recent consumer mobile bill in the name of the person who gave me the deal. Additional terms, conditions, and restrictions apply. The start with yourself tour kicks off on April 15th in New York City. Tickets are on sound now at emigre.com. I feel like you guys have really had such an amazing kind of run when it comes to marketing and owning your space around social media. Can you just talk a little bit about the brand and the marketing and how you've really capitalized on that side of things? Because I think not only do you have a best in class product and a category busting product, but you've also really innovated in the space from a marketing and social media point of view, right? So interesting. So I think it goes back to when we started. It was every playbook that any

traditional marketer could have done had gone out the window because during COVID, you couldn't see your consumer in real life. You couldn't do events. You couldn't do sampling. just even the way you're talking to everyone, I think TikTok just changed the consumer. You know, they're more authentic. They're real, they put their self out there. And I think that we were kind of bore out of that. So I got onto TikTok really early.

And I'll- Like TikTok for yourself or for the brand? For the brand. Okay. We were one of the first brands to get on TikTok. I remember, I was like, hey, you guys, there's TikTok. And they're like, no, no, no, brands aren't on there. Even at the board, even like Rohan and see everyone was like, no, Alison, that's silly. Don't do that.

And I was like, look, you guys, I will. do this on my weekends and on nights. I won't take away from the business or take resources, but I think there's something here. And for three months, I posted on the Poppy account. I did dances. I did recipes. I did talk to cameras. I did anything you would think of. And then finally one night, I sat down and I just told my story. I had no makeup on. My hair was wet. And I hit post. And then I got calls the next morning. We did $100,000 where we were sleeping on Amazon. Grocerer store shelves were cleared out and everyone was like, oh my gosh, this is the wild, wild west. And we started moving all of our funds over there. And just for context, we almost have three

billion views on TikTok on our page. And one third of the platform has seen my face seven times. That's absolutely insight. One third of the platform has seen your face seven times. Yes, including that's nuts. Like my kids teacher. Is that annoying when you go? I'm like, wait a minute. Is that good finger about it? I mean, excellent for business. But it's so interesting. right because I think that when I first started, you know, in business, it was all about Facebook. And then the arbitrage of Facebook, you know, Facebook got really expensive and we all migrated over to Instagram if you were smart. And brands were definitely slow to go to TikTok because it was unplanned. Like at least with Instagram, we could create our beautiful content. We could schedule our

beautiful content. We could put it out in a brand appropriate way. Whereas TikTok, all the brands were like, hang about. They're like, those are just cute dancing kids. Yeah. And not even just cute dancing kids, but we were just like the speed at which you needed to be in the mix to create the relevant content felt unsafe for a brand, but seemingly you embraced that and your audience understood it. Did you know that what you were doing was something special? Or were you just like, I'm just moving the way someone in their 30s who has a brand moves? I think we were one of the first brands to take it serious. Right.

And by serious, we didn't take ourselves too serious. So I think we were really good at understanding what each platform was for. So Instagram is basically your new website. Facebook is maybe for a little bit older consumer, which we love our older baddies. For sure. But TikTok was just somewhere you could post three times a day. You could just be a little bit unhinged and go viral. Nowadays, I feel like everybody's on there.

And this sounds like really familiar. But those early days is where I feel like we built a community that is bride or die. And we were able to move at the speed of culture. We have community. We're really creative. And it just established us as just a brand of the, the community and of the people of Gen Z, which I think is really a big reason and why Pepsi was interested in us, like the next generation of soda drinkers, right? And I feel like you've

completely rewritten the playbook. Like when you think about the future and what's happening, like, are you as boisterous about TikTok and the future of like you guys on that platform as you were like maybe a couple of years ago or is it moving on? You know, I think as you have a business and I'll be real, as you get older comes lawsuits. and you have to be careful with music. Thank you for being true for. Yes. And so like I think the game has changed.

You're not the scrappy little babies anymore. As where we are, which actually pushes us to be a little bit more creative with our own content. But I always say to new businesses, it's going to be your best avenue and cheapest. And everyone doesn't want to be the face of their brand. But I do think that, hey, it's free.

It is free. Like if you, do you want to be successful? Like get on TikTok. You don't have to be it, but hire someone. Take it serious. Like, it's not going away. and everyone thinks it's going away. Like, I really know.

Even when we really thought it was going away, it didn't go away. I don't think it's going anywhere. Were you in mourning at that moment, or was that like something you were concerned about and seeing it, considering it's such a revenue driver for you guys? You know, I mean, I think it's a great part of our 360 mix. Now, if it were to go away, I think my, the saddest part would be like our community on there more than impacting the business.

For me, when it was doing that, it was like downloading videos. I had like a glass of red wine. I'm like sitting back and screaming. husband's like, go put the kids to it. I'm like, I can't. It's the last night of TikTok. And then the next day, I was like, oh, wait, that was dramatic. I think it's fine. And honestly, I think if it goes away, that community will find them somewhere else and someone else will come up with something else. For sure. I've read somewhere that you make somewhere between 50 and 100 pieces of content every month. Is it? Is it that about right?

Yes. That's a lot of content. How reliant as the brand become on TikTok to kind of remain relevant? Do you think that if you didn't have that in your business, that the brand would have less relevancy? No, because I think we've kind of moved past it, right? We've run a lot of linear TV. We've done a couple Super Bowl ads. We launched our clothing line with Target. Like, what kind of soda brands are, like, doing these type of things? We do these pop-ups where we get our community.

Like, we're doing a lot more than that. But I think nowadays you have to be a digital first brand. Not only that, but I also think you guys have the distribution at this point, right? I think people have an over-reliance on marketing and imagining what that can do. But it's like, you also have to have the distribution. Or traditional boring marketing like performance marketing that everything's tied to an ROI, which I would say for the first four years of business, our number one goal was brand awareness. Now we have a pretty high brand awareness. Over 50% of America knows what Poppy is.

And so now it's moving maybe a little bit more into, okay, now we need to convert. Does that make you get so proud when you say things like that? it's like, well, I'm a business woman, so I'm like, wait, I need more. You're like, wait a minute. I want to be like, I want to be like, fancy over here. I know. I never stop and smell the roses. I'm always like, there's still more work to be done.

So you still have a level of ambition for Poppy? I'm so hungry. Like, it's so hard to turn it off, right? When you start something, it just excites me. I'm very much a doer. Like, I can get in. I can solve any problem. Still to this day, probably people that shouldn't be.

calling me or like having me call me to like solve the, and I'm like, I'm here for it. I still love it. But I do think it's in this point, I've gotten to a point where I've so much trust in the team there because they've been a lot of them are like our first, second, third, fourth employee still there. So amazing. You've got to be very proud of that. I want, before we go into the acquisition from PepsiCo, I want to talk to you a little bit about the investment piece because it's such a key part of your journey and obviously change trajectory of what you were doing. What is the truth of taking investment? What has that been like for you? You know, our story is very different because we've had one investor. And I think

there's two things with that is we had a lot of opportunity to focus on the business and not raising money. It's so hard when you have momentum, if you pull back on momentum because you don't have money and having to raise to get that momentum again is it's probably one of the most difficult things in business. So we were able to have it poor gas, have the momentum poor gas, because we had a great partner and always funding us along the way. So not meaning that you didn't have to keep raising, you just kept raising with the same person. Correct. So you could keep your focus and your eyes on the prize. I mean, like there was like times where we thought about going outside and we did maybe try a couple rounds where we did that. I think the only outside of the investment that we took was

celebrity investment. Right. But there were obviously a couple of funds because that's how I got my little inching. Yeah, yeah. But there were usually like people that were like more so on like the celebrity talent side. We were all connected strategic people. Yes. I mean, I jumped at the opportunity to invest in you guys because, no, because I saw you and I was like, Pats the girl I believe in. Oh, thank you. I think the product is amazing. I think the category is amazing, but it was definitely about you from the outset. That's for sure. Aside from the obvious with equity, what did you give up bringing investment in? You know, you give up a lot of control. And we gave up control pretty early on. You know, obviously, Rohan got a bigger chunk of the

company early on if everyone's diluted. I mean, it's, it's like the way it went. I gave up a lot of control because at the end of the day, like, Poppy is me. I am the vision. I, every idea, every little thing, it's just like, it's, it just like oozes out of me. But I am not good at process, you know, and I probably shouldn't be the one running a people. P&L, even though I do know how to read one, right? I think that's important to know. But it's one of those things that they helped, like, professionalize the business. And, like, that was a huge growth for me personally. And I think as all of us, as entrepreneurs, like, egos can get in the way of growth. They can get in the way of, like, what's good. So that was the biggest lesson for me is, is that growth of

early on we brought in a CEO. I think it was like year two. And then a year later, we brought in a CMO. But the difference is because I was part of that conversation where I think a lot of people are resistant and then they get placed and kind of pushed out. I was part of those conversations, even though I cried, it was hard. There's ups and downs. There's so many things that go with it. But I just knew I've never built, I've never bought a super bad. I've never built a business this fastest and I had an opportunity to learn.

Oh, no, a lot of people have. Yeah. So I would say like it was one of the hardest and best decisions that I've ever made. And so I just always recommend just like, be. part of that conversation and don't resist it. It's a hard thing as an entrepreneur. I think that that's really, really good advice because, look, one of the most important things that I've learned is to know what you don't know. Like, nobody is excellent at everything. And the reason you've been able to build and then able to exit is because you've had focus,

like you've been able to do what you uniquely and nobody else could possibly do. And then you've surrounded yourself with people that knew the stuff that you didn't know. Like, it's really simple when you say it like that. And I get that it can be tougher the ego, but look what you've been able to do in the time you've been able to do it. And you bring in people that value what you're good at. So I'm really good. I ran the creative, all the creative at Poppy, you know, face of, you know, all the culture, like, cool, social, like all of those things. Like, I still got to do all of those things and have really big impact there where that was my main focus, which I think was the driver of the brand and the growth. So not easy, but best decision. Best decision. If you could

do it all over again, would you do anything differently? You know, I think I would have told myself earlier on that, like, I knew what I was doing. I think it's really easy as you're growing and you have a lot of people coming in and you can kind of get lost a little bit. And it took me, there was a few years in the middle that I kind of lost my voice. And I think it hurt the business. There were certain things that we were doing weird marketing things. I was like, I'm going to trust.

Like, you do need to trust your team. But at some point, you got to keep them on. The straight and narrow. The straight narrow, for sure. looking back just having a little bit more confidence. And when I do this again, when you do do do it again, when hopefully I get to invest again. Yeah, I'll remember that. I'll remember that. I love it. No, but when you do do it again, will you do something differently, do you think? You know, I think that me and my husband, I will 100% do it with him again. Oh, so nice. He's so good at

everything that I'm not. He's good at all the business stuff. I'm great at the creative brand vision. We're a great partner. I think that I will bring in team earlier. I think that's another really big mistake that we probably didn't hire quick enough because maybe we just didn't know. Now I know. You didn't know, but also, yeah, you didn't have the experience

and maybe you didn't have like the free cash. Now you're rich rich rich. So you'll definitely do things to do it. Exactly. There's that part. There's that part for sure. Talk to me because again, you know I'm going to go back to the money,

but I'm interested to understand when you lose your voice, which I think happens a lot, when you bring investors in, when you have more senior management that comes into a company, you can get a bit lost. How did you claw it back? Because being a woman, I can imagine, you would have been surrounded by a lot of dudes telling you what was right based on all of their experience. So how did you get back into the driver's seat? It was really hard. It's almost like you have to let it go to allow them to realize it. And I know that's not like maybe the best advice,

but I kind of stepped back and I was like, fine, you guys figure it out. And then when things started getting wonky, certain people were fighting for me to get back involved. If I were to be like, I need to do this and I want to be involved, that only makes them want to push you aside. And even though it was really hard, I was like, and you know what? I always thought to myself, if I do step away and then it's successful, good. There's that too. You know what I mean? And I've had to learn that.

If you were to ask me that maybe two years ago, might not have said the same thing. But I stepped away. I was like, I can't be psycho, I can't be crazy. I got a coach, a business coach. You did? I did, yeah. I love that for you. I've done exactly the same things.

I tried therapy. It didn't work for me. And look, I'm here for it. But I needed someone being like, what do you want in life? I mean, it's like a therapist, right? Depending on who you have. I mean, I have a business coach and it's right in the midst of, you know, therapy and, you know, just traditional coaching.

And just learning to find my voice, learning to find, like, me again and all of those things. And honestly, it put me to a better place to be a better leader to, allow us to continue to grow. I wasn't showing up for my kids. I was tired all the time. I was grumpy. I wasn't being a good wife. And even my husband was just like, I don't even know who you are right now. And so I think once I went through that and came out of it, it was almost so good to go through that because I truly believe it made me a better leader. It made me a better mom, a wife, like all of those things. And so I wish more people would like talk about these things because it's like entrepreneurship and business is not easy.

Alison, what do you think we're here to do today? We're going to talk about this shit. We have to talk about, listen, I am never going to ask you about balance because I don't believe in it. I want to, every time somebody's like, how do you balance it all? I'm like, I want to wretch at the question. Yeah. But I do want to ask you how you've been able to build this incredible company, to have your free kids, to hopefully be like a good wife. You've now got other things that are happening in your life. And I'm assuming like loads and loads of opportunities that are coming your way. So what have you done to be able to get to where you are? And honestly, like, what gives? Early on me and my husband had a conversation.

It might sound sad. We were like, there's three things we can focus on, our marriage, business, and kids. I said, I'm going to give you the freedom within our marriage to, I'm not going to guilt you over Valentine's Day. I'm not going to guilt you on my birthday. We don't have to go on date nights. I'm just going to stop.

Like, I don't want, like, Valentine's Day. I don't want flowers. Like, let's just focus on our kids and our business. And then when we had those little moments, it was almost more special. So letting go that like expectation in life, because we set those expectations for ourselves, right? Another thing was I think it's really important to just stay grounded.

Yes, I have like a lot of money now, but at the end of the day, I still am at soccer on Tuesdays and baseball on Fridays and my kids are running around without shoes on and I'm like, where are your shoes? Like I think it's really important to like spend time with your kids and family and just stay grounded and just be like a normal human being. But I imagine there must have been times when you weren't able to do those things, right? There'd be times when the businesses are grind.

And did you ever have to make sacrifices? Oh, I mean, I would say I was on, I'm on the road more than my husband, traveling, doing these things. But I've always had a good support system with my mom and my husband, who stays home with them way more than I do. And yes, I look at it as sacrifices for like a greater thing that at the end of the day is for my kids and for my family. And everyone's like, but they're little. You're never going to get these years back. So a lot of times we would like take them with us to events. They've been to a ton of poppy things. Or like if I know I'm going to be in New York, we'll go a day earlier. We'll go spend a week in the Hamptons or something like that. And I just feel like don't guilt yourself. Like let the guilt go. Like let the guilt. Like let the guilt. I don't remember. Just literally we sold the company. I worked out seven times. And like the first. And it's just that expectation. And it wants you kind of let it go. It's kind of nice. I don't. I don't believe in balance. I don't remember just literally we sold the company. I worked out seven times. And like the first. And like the first. And the first. And the first. And the first. And the first. And like, first two weeks. I don't think I've worked out seven times in the last two years.

Like, I just, that's what gives. There you go. No self-care. I don't know what that means. No, it's hard. But I love that you made those decisions because I do think it's so much easier to accept the trade-offs if they're your trade-offs, right? And they're different for each one of us. But the idea that you decided as a couple to like let some of the, I'm not saying they're like the romance, but it's like some of those extra things that are maybe unnecessary. It don't matter. I know that you love me. Like, I'm good. This stuff doesn't matter. Let's like double down on our kids. You know, we're going on a work trip. We'll go a couple of days early and look at the sites in New York. Like, those are your choices. And then you can reconcile with them so much easier than if they're happening to you.

You know, I feel like when you are suddenly like, I have to go on this trip and you haven't thought about what you're going to sacrifice. It makes it so much harder. I'm very self-aware. Like, I'm a very self-aware person of like I see something happening and I'm pretty blunt. and I dress it head on. And I feel like I don't allow things to happen to me. I make things happen. And I do that within my business and within my life. And sometimes people are like,

I'm so blind. I'm like, let's just cut to the chase. Like, let's not dance around this. And so I don't know, I think that's helped. But no, I agree with you. There's no work like that. USAA knows dynamic duos can save the day like superheroes and sidekicks or auto and home insurance.

With USAA, you can bundle your auto and home and save up to 10%. Tap the banner to learn more and get a quote at usa. Do you think there's parts of your personality that have allowed you to be super successful? And if so, like, what are they? I know what I want. I'm direct. And I also feel like I have a lot of empathy and I am kind. And I think if you can just be a real human, I think if you can combine all those things,

like you get to know people, you get to know they work. But the end of the day, it's a business. Like, it's something that always kind of bothers me and this might be controversial is people are saying, well, my poppy is my poppy family. I'm like, we're not family. We work together. We can be friends. We can do stuff outside. We can celebrate. We can vacation together. But we are here to do a business. And so I feel like I've always been really good to like understand you can have relationships, but we're here to do something. Well, it's only controversial because you're a girl. That's probably true. Nobody thinks like that that would be controversial if a man said it.

I think it's because you are kind and because you're empathetic and because you're sitting there. dressed in pink and you look fabulous, that suddenly when you say something that seemingly so blunt, i.e. we're not a family. We're here to create a business. It feels really harsh to people. And I mean, I feel like I get that all the time, but I believe exactly the same, right? I look at myself and I'm like, I'm the coach, right? I am here not to go out and score the goals. I'm here to put the team together, to play the best players and to set everybody out for a win. That's my job. And sometimes I need to take someone off the field because you're not doing what you need to do. Like, I need to bring somebody else in. I found a new star. Like, you know, it's like all of those

things happen. But I think the minute as a woman that you start sounding a way that people find unpalatable, there's a lot of backlash. Have you experienced anything like that in reaction to things that you've said or an attitude that you've taken or coming back to you from your own staff, for instance? Yeah, I think like I like to get things done. So if I get a no, instead of just allowing it to happen, I'll, like, call 38 people. I will get that. Yes. I will go around you.

I will do this. I will make it get done. And a lot of people are like, well, you're just a bulldozer. You know those things that's like, and then I'll see, like, a couple other men do those same things. And it's like, oh, they got something done. So, like, yes, but I'm always been a really big person of, like, putting, like, I don't allow, like, everyone was like, oh, you're such a successful female founder. you have done so many things that so many women want, but I'm like, I also think it can be a mental space that you put yourself in. It's like I deserve to be here. I deserve to be successful.

And I actually feel like the time of the female founder is now, like there's so much happening and beauty and fashion and food and Bev that it's just like it's growing and the confidence is there. So I think we just have to like not put ourselves in that box. And I know easier said than done, but I think it's like a mental state that I've been able to really do a good job at personally. I mean, I couldn't agree with you more. I think you've done an amazing job at it. What do you think, like just in terms of women being able to get out of their own way and the things that you've done, like, what do you do uniquely that sets you up to behave differently or differently than what's expected of a typical female founder if we could even use that language? I know. I don't know. I'm a capricorn.

I'm a Capricorn. It's so funny. It's so cute. No, because people ask me so all the time. And it goes back to that, like, key thing. Like, they want this, like, success, I don't know, I don't know, magical thing that you can do. And I'm really big on no self-pity, like, no poor me's. I almost feel like I operate a little bit like a man would.

And then I'm very self-aware when I'm pushing. people too hard in a room. I can read a room. I feel like women are very, like, aware of their surrounding. So like, you know where to push when to not. But I also think at the end of the day, if you know you're right, stand up for yourself. Yeah. Absolutely. So no imposter syndrome. Yeah. No, I know. It's bad. Ever? Never? No. No, there is sometimes. Like, there's certain things where I'm like, everyone always like, you're so successful. You've done all these things. And I'm like, me. I'm like a mom from Texas, like me? Yes, you. Yes, you. Yes, you. Yeah. So I think that does happened quite a bit, but it's, but I, I 100% believe I deserve this too. Because you do. Yeah.

I've worked really, really hard for this. No doubt. Like literally still working really hard for this. It's like been a little bit hard for me to let go of Poppy and I'm still pretty involved. So, so talk to us about post acquisition. Yeah. How does that even come about? Were you setting the company up for an acquisition? Had you said, like, I'm ready to tap out now or that was just like the trajectory that you went on? So in beverage, it's really, you have to. There's maybe three people that can buy you. Pepsi was one of them.

Because if you really want to become a global brand, it all comes down to distribution. Will you explain that a little bit for everybody that's listening? Because it's very similar to beauty in that way, right? It's like there's a couple of main big players. If you want shelf space, if you want to be in the right fridges, you've got to play the game. You've got to be in it to win it.

So currently, for example, we have 180 distributors. that distribute probably just in the U.S. There's more in Mexico, there's more in Canada. If we wanted to go to the UK, it would be a new distributor potentially too. You're not in the UK yet? Well, we're working on it. Please, the people in the UK. Come on. We're working on it.

I bet within the year we'll be there for sure. I love it. No doubt. I feel like Pepsi can make that happen. For sure. Well, that's the point, right? And so we are now going to go from 180 to one. So you have one workforce working towards you.

You're managing one customer. than distributing you and putting you on the shelf. Like, that alone is a game changer. Also, soda is traditionally has, like, pretty intense contracts. So we weren't able to get on college campuses. You cannot get on fountain soda. You can't go into a lot of hotels, fast, casual. Like, the Taco Bells of the world.

Because what you're saying is the big three players own all the shelf space, all the distribution, and you're essentially locked out unless you're part of one of those three, correct? And I feel like we did a really good job. Yes, we could have gone IPO, but that still doesn't solve the distribution problems. So when you are starting a beverage company, you want that to happen, right? And so that was always like from day one goals, not to sell out. A lot of people are like, you're selling out, but I'm like, no, hon, this is how we are going to get poppy into more than half of the households in America.

We're going to be able to really be, poppy will be the soda of my kids and grandkids drink and know as soda. And without that, we wouldn't have been able to do that. And so it's, yes, strategic. It's yes, you know, people might call it like selling up, but it's to me the American dream. It is totally, totally the American dream. For you to start something in your kitchen, go from farmer's market to whole foods to, you know, billion, $1.9 billion sale with PepsiCo. Like, that is, that is it. That is it. Who taught you about the trajectory and the way the business was going to go? Did you have advisors who was around you?

like who even set you up or set you on a path? Or did that all come from your investor? Yeah, no, Rohan was really great with that stuff from day one. He had been part of other incredible beverage brands. Yes, he's an investor, but he'd been working in the industry for years himself. I think that in beverage, it's a really small community. So we hired on great talent really early on. Our second employee is still with us today. He's our chief growth officer, senior VP of sales is still with us. Wow. Our influencer, manager is now VP of culture. Like, I think we brought in really good people that had been doing it at other brands before. Clearly hired really well if those people have been able to stay with you.

Yeah, and just had really good advice. What roles did you hire? Because you're what, 200 people now? Like 250. 250. So what roles did you hire too early? And what roles do you feel like you could have, you hired too late? I think one of the best roles, especially, and this is specific, probably more to CPG, is sales. Right. You have to get into the stores. And at the end of the day, it's all about relationships. If you have a good product, if you don't have a good product, you're probably not. not going to get in anyways. Totally. And then I think early on for us, it was on the marketing side.

So we hired on an influencer manager really, really early. I think a lot of people, I think our first two years, we didn't, we didn't spend a single dollar on like any paid media or anything. So I think a lot of people think you have to bring on a PR agency and do all this stuff really early on, which a good PR agency is going to be north of 20,000 a month, which people don't realize. So I think we maybe run on PR too early, but if you have nothing pressworthy, like you don't need a PR agency. Yeah. or anyone to even run PR. Now we desperately need a great PR agency, and I'm obsessed with,

we have a director of PR and all of that stuff, but I think a lot of people think they need to do that too early on. And you just astute that somehow. Yeah. Yeah, well done. That was like exactly the thing to do. I just wonder, and again, because I feel like people are loath to talk about the mistakes and the things that maybe didn't work out.

Have you had those moments in this business, and how have you been able to correct the? or change them or learn from them. Oh, gosh. It's so funny. I'm like with the mistakes. It's like childbirth. You forget about it. I would say for us, we, there was one thing that cost us millions and millions and millions of dollars was we were so focused on building the brand that we really wanted our cans to be gorgeous and jump off the shelf. And so we had them in sleeved cans for like two years. Well, a lot of people don't know when it comes to CPG. The packaging is the most expensive part. It's not the stuff inside. Right. Right. And there's, it's pretty fixed and there's

not a lot you can do about it until you get bigger and you scale. And then the price comes down, right? It's simple economics. And it's like one of those things that the sleeved can was the most expensive thing on our can. I think it was like 20 cents a can. And then we knew if we wanted to printed cans, we would be able to drop it, you know, in half right away. And then I'm sure it's gone down even since then. But we stayed in it for almost 12 months too long. And, which cost us north of like probably $15 million because we thought it was cute and that it looked better on the shelf. Like what? And now we're in printed cans and honestly, it's so much better. But you don't know what you don't know. Yeah. And so it's like those things where it's like you feel

like you get into your own world and you're so obsessed and you're not really like thinking about the business. And sometimes I'm always one to lean into the brand first. Like what is best for the brand? What looks best on shelf? And it can be very blinding. when you're such a brand forward brand to like, you know, it's okay to be in printed cans or to not have printed trays and like all those like little things that used to drive me up the wall because it wasn't cute. Yeah. Well, there you go. You wanted things to be cute. I understand why you make those mistakes, but you live and learn. Are there other things that looking back you got flat out wrong at Poppy? No. That's so nice. No. It's literally, I don't know. It's like it goes back to I think

the personal stuff, the growth, for me, it's so hard to look back at the mistakes. Because, yes, there's operational mistakes. There's personal mistakes. I think one time we brought in a CMO before our current one, that was probably one of the hardest moments of, like, are my career at Poppy, where we brought her in and she just was a wrong cultural fit. So I think a lot of people don't understand cultural hires and cultural fits and how you can bring in, like, one bad person. and how it literally sent some of like our employees into depression and like we had people quitting and all those things because of one thing. And so we realized that really quick. Like there's little things like that that I think a lot of people are like, well, we hired them.

We paid a recruiter fee. You keep them in place. Yeah. You're like, no. No, if they're a culture killer, like that is one of the most toxic things in the company that you can do. And it's hard to realize it. Yeah. And you can only really learn that the hard way. There's no easy way to learn that. You have to have that person. You have to inevitably keep them in the business too long to that you should have got them out a lot quicker. It's just, that's it.

Culture is key. To invest in culture, invest in your people. And by that, it's not meaning, like, having a gym in your office or the perks. It's the people. Yeah, it's really the people. Do you look at your life and think there are specific things that you do that allow you to be who you are? I'm, like, hyper obsessive focused on certain things.

So someone will give me a task. I can go down, like, a deep, dark hole. I will figure it out. I will call. I'll do all of these things. And it can be like even in my personal life if I'm planning like a birthday party for my kids. I think for me it's like that hyper fixation on greatness

in all aspects of my life will still allowing for chaos. So I love chaos. I love, I'm a creative. Why is that not important allowing chaos? Because perfect isn't fun. You know, I'm like okay with the clothes like thrown on the floor and I'm packing for three days after a trip. No, it drives my husband.

I know. It drives my husband up the wall. I would kill you. Literally, he wants to kill me. It's literally not a. I want to come to your house and unpack cases like right now. No, no, no. I need help for some. So it's like one of those things.

Like I like chaos. I like moving on to the next. And I love just like, what's the coolest? What's cultural? I also think what's really important is I don't love planning, but I love planning. So I love to plan like 80% and then to leave 20% for pure free. freedom, chaos, because, like, how are you going to live life? How are you going to have, like, social moments if you're so over-programmed? So I feel like that's something we've done

really well. Poppy that, like, kind of brought in from, like, me personally, that Poppy's allowed us to do. So we'll do, like, our AOP planning. We're planning, like, 80% of the calendar in these cultural events. But then I'm like, let's leave 20% up. And just, for example, the first year we bought Super Bowl. We bought it three days before the Super Bowl. Wow. Yeah. And it was just like a good piece of creative. It was something that I just so in love with this and I was like, you guys, we got to do Super Bowl. We were able to define one. And that was just like a last minute moment thing that I feel like would stress a lot of

companies out probably. Definitely. But that's like how my personal life, I feel like is really part of the culture of Bobby. You've just allowed yourself to be nimble. I also think that suits the way you guys market because you're so like in the moment and in the sight of what's happened. So you're actually like, this is what's like moving the culture right now. Great.

We're going to be there. We're going to be aligned with the trend in the moment. But then can I ask you a question? Because I feel like. skims is the same way, but on like a way larger scale. You guys must be so good at it too. I think it's a very, very similar thing that we are reacting to what's happening in the culture all the time. And we're really lucky because where I work in the company, you know, it's like I'm a cross product and I work so far out. But our marketeers have the freedom and the flexibility

to be able to go like, that's working, that's trending. We're loving this show right now. Let's double down on that. And I'm often the one that's kind of sitting there going, Wow, that was amazing because I forgot the product. You know, that happened to me 18 months ago. I'm like living in the future somehow. So I think that's, it's important. You want to be culturally irrelevant. You want to move at this feed of culture.

And it shows that like a smaller brain like Poppy can do that. A big brand like skims that, like anyone can do that. I feel like people feel like you have to stick to your plan. And I'm very much like, no, you don't. No, you can have a little bit of nimbleness. All right, I'm going back to this acquisition. So you know from your investor, like where you're kind of going, where the company's heading. How does it all come together? Talk me through that moment in time.

You know, it was interesting. We knew there's three buyers, right? And so you kind of do the dating, you kind of like talk. And the difference with Pepsi is they just really got us. Was everyone courting you? Was everybody coming after poppy? So we never did official process. Oh, okay. Like where you like hire banker and you like, hey, we're for sale. We never kind of did that because There was no official process. No, there was no official process. Ooh. Yeah, because we weren't quite ready.

We were having crazy growth. I mean, we went from like 200 to 500 in a year. Like, in year four. Like, it was just so much, we were like, how far can we take it? And you don't want to do it too soon, but you don't want to be, like, too big. Like, it's such a balance. And so it was one of those things that, like, just going into this year, we were looking just at our distribution and how we wanted to start going globally.

And we were just like, maybe this is quite, kind of the right year. So we kind of actually decided it last year instead of working through it. And then it just really sped up this year. And honestly, Pepsi reached out to us. And we just started talking to them. And it just clicked. Like their senior leadership got it. And their biggest motto, which was really important for me is they were just like, let's up poppy be poppy. I think they're, you know, obviously getting us for our brand and our people and our product. But that's always someone's biggest fear is they're going to come in and just change your company overnight. And I truly feel like they made that promise to us and we're seeing it happen. And so I think that was, you know,

made me feel like, oh, my kid can go off to college and now I can like, you know, go to Europe for a month. Totally. And there was nothing in you that felt obligated to go around and see what else you could get. You know, I think there's a part of it that if they really wanted it, they would come or you don't want to be desperate. But wouldn't you be curious? Like, didn't you hear a number and be like, okay, I'm going to shop this around. Like, I'm going to go and see if I could get X, Y, or Z? Well, I think M&A has been finicky the last few years. Yeah, MNA, mergers and acquisitions. And beverage historically hasn't done well.

So some of these bigger strategics have made purchases and it's not gone well. And they've overpaid by quite a bit. And there was like certain things and they've kind of learned their lesson. So I think the more, it's like it's timing market. And it was one of those things that like I said, we didn't want to go IPO. It was just like one of those moments that it just felt right. we could have said maybe it was too soon, but it still felt right. Maybe it was too late. Like, I don't know, but just kind of, it came together, like, really easy.

It did? Yeah, I would say it's, like, one of the fastest MNAs ever. Like, we started talking to them, basically, we talked about a little last year. We had, like, a little meet and greet. And then we got an offer, and February and closed, like, six weeks later. Yeah, it was really quick. And it was just, like, we just, I don't know, just, like, connected. It just works. I don't know. And that's how you just know it's right. Did you have a number in your head where you were, like, if I I get this, then I'm doing this deal. Yeah, I think like it was $2 billion. And you know what? If you would ask me four years ago, I would have said $500,000. You know, you asked me before I was said $200,000. Like you just, I always thought at least a billion.

And now it's like you don't know until the goal moves every year. Yeah, kind of goalpost. And I'm just really excited with it. And within it, they bought 100% the company, which is also rare. Wow. They bought 100%. So what does your role go forward? You totally out now? So I'm totally out. No. Yeah. Okay.

How does that feel? It feels, okay, so exciting, scary, amazing, terrified. They're keeping me on as an advisor. Okay. To still do all the fun, like, social stuff. And then I did run the creative and like all the vision and stuff. So it's really hard to be like, okay, bye. So I'm going to stay on an advise for a few years on that stuff, which is kind of

fun. It's like I get to do all the fun stuff, which is my willhouse what I'm good at. But there's no incentive there for you to, like, like remain in the company while it grows. Yeah. You've sold. You're out. I'm out.

I'm 100% out. But they put some incentive for me to stay. Like, like some goalposts to hit. There's a little, there's a little sweetener in there for you somehow. Which is great. You're not giving creative for nothing.

Exactly. Fair enough. Exactly. I'm a business woman. Yeah. As you should be. And do you have like restrictions? Are you going to go and start something else now?

I don't know. I like, it's my head. Like, I'm still so impoppy. So I've committed to like I'm still working 40, 50 hours a week right now. I'm still in it. I'm doing all these things. And then I'm going to take a family vacation, which I've never done. And I think it'll allow me to be with my family, be creative. And then after that, I think I'll have a lot of clarity. You'll no doubt have clarity. Where have you been left after this last five years of building this

incredible company, getting what you quite rightly deserved at the end? You're left with what type of feeling? Because your kids have watched their mom and dad build a two. billion-dollar brand. You've obviously made a lot of sacrifices in that time. So, like, what is, like, how do you feel about the next couple of years of your life? Do you, have you planned it? Are you doing the 80-20 rule like you do in the rest of your business? Like, what does this look like for you right now? Honestly, you might be able to relate to this. The most overwhelming feeling I have right now is freedom. I literally can do whatever I want at this point. Whatever you want. And it's such a freeing feeling of, I have no boss. I have no one to talk to, you, or you know,

my husband could say the same, but he still has me. But I do feel very free to like just if I want to be with my kids, I can. If I want to go to a girl strip, if I want to start another company, I can. And so it's really like, I'm like dreaming for the first time in like years and all of these things. It just feels really good. But I can just tell that you're going to go on this European vacation. I know, come back. You're going to cease it.

You're going to have like a, you know, your notes section of your phone's going to be. Oh, I already have... I already have two ideas. Do you really? Yeah. I love it. Can you see yourself going back into startup mode? Does that feel like part of the future?

So I think the number one thing people want for me right now is my time, more than my money, right? I think we are going to definitely invest. But my knowledge in what I've built is the most valuable asset that I can give. So in my head, I think I'll pick like a few companies to like advise and really give. But I don't know. For me, it's like, why would I do that when I can just do it? it myself. I see that. I mean, I've known you for 20 minutes. I don't know. And I feel like you're already going to start something. Yeah. I mean, listen, of course, needless to say, you have so much

to give and you have so much great experience and you've done things in a one-of-one way. But there's something about that founder energy that gets into your bones and gets under your skin. And it's very difficult when you've had that kind of like unbelievable acceleration for you to kind of go around and advise people. I just don't feel like you're a sideline lady. I mean, like, sure, I could be on your board, but, you know, I'll just help you spend your marketing budget. Do you, exactly, that I have no doubt you would. Is there anything, like, is there a company that you look at and you're like, I could be so useful to them? Like, I'd be so great. Yeah, there's a lot of probably food and Bev, I would say traditionally in the CPG.

But I think the key things I look for are they digital first, because, I think that's one of the hardest things to teach people nowadays is to be digital first because they get caught in their own ways and they just want to like run the business. I'm like, honey, this is the future. So anything I do or anyone I spend any time or invest in, you have to be digital social. And I mean like social first. Social first. Yeah. I really want to talk to you about that social first piece because I feel like you guys did it in such an interesting way. It's like these kind of tiny, repeatable actions that you just kind of owned, right? They were like things that were uniquely you and uniquely poppy that I guess I feel like

the rest of the industry kind of copied in a lot of ways or tried to emulate in a lot of ways, which is really wonderful, but they originated with you guys. Do you think that you could do the same thing again? Or do you think that everything's changed at this point? I think everything's changed and the people that, I think that's the problem. You have your marketing playbook. you think it works, then you try to, like, put it into something else versus what is uniquely going to work for this business and what is their story that they need to tell? And I feel like at the end of

the day, I'm just a really good storyteller. And that's what marketing is. And so what's going to work best and resonate for that particular business or whatever I do next, just redoing the same thing I did. Look, TikTok isn't the Wild Wild West anymore. It's a pay to play game. Right. It's a pay to play game. And so I think understanding that with anything is what is the next wild list? You think this one's coming? Oh, yeah. There's always something new. Is it AI?

I don't know. But there's something, I'm sure, and I'll be the first to learn it and be on it. Are you, like, obsessed with AI right now? I'm obsessed. I just, you know, wish that it was more attainable and easier for just, like, people to understand. Does that make sense? It's like the people that are just like obsessed with it and you're like, okay, but. I know.

I'm feeling like I might send myself to like parvage. Like there's a couple of courses I looked at the other day. And I thought, maybe I actually just need to go to AI school for a month and like, teach it to myself and like just embed it in my head because I'm using it like a 42 year old lady right now. And I'm like that I really feel like there's more to this. I'm like when you only have like four apps on your phone, I'm like, hmm. this feels like I'm going to be left behind. I'm going to get on this.

That's something like I want to learn. I want to start like I. I joined like a I cohort. I'm trying to learn about it. But I think also I think it's what you said is as a leader, you have to learn it. You can't leave it up to your employees because I think that strategy has to come from the top down and understanding. I think that was a big piece of our success on TikTok.

Like I got it. I get it. Yeah. And that is that is the big thing because if the founder isn't there with that behavior, you can't expect everybody else to just pick up the slack for you. It's either ingrained in the culture and it's coming from the top or it's not. And it's never actually going to be a real part of the business. Or priority.

Yeah. Or a priority. Exactly. That is the absolute truth. I want you to talk to me a little bit more about like your kids and how you're, you know, because now you're an extremely wealthy, rich family. You've had this amazing business success. What are you teaching your kids right now about what

takes, you know, who your family are, how are you going to raise them with this, like, unbelievable wealth that you have now? It's, like, such an overwhelming feeling more so than having the money, but just like, how do you make your kids not be little turds? You know what I mean? Because they're already trying. I know what you mean. And I have three boys. They are boys, how old are your boys? Three, six, and eight. And you are in it. Yeah, bloody noses and stitches and just Like, they're so little right now. So I think the tone that we set so far is, wow, mom and dad created something and they work really hard.

Now, to your point, the money comes. So I think the next level is they have to learn to work hard. And that's something that's a really big focus that annoys me. Sometimes my husband's like, we have to teach them to do this. So they can't, you know, like fly first class because this, but that means I can't. I know. I always think about that. The idea of like your kids going in the back, I'm like, well, I'm not going back.

I did my time in the back of the bus. So what are we doing here? We're splitting up as a family. It's a nice idea, but it's not like. It's not reality because my, you know, everyone's kind of said like, yes, okay, you're not flying first class, but then you're going and you're staying at this villa in Tuscany. Like, they get it, right?

So like that can't be the band-aid. That can't be the solved. So I think it's foundational, hard work, continue to teach them to be good people. And at the end of the day, we're good people and we're good adults. So I'm hopefully it'll rub off at some point. And then I think that if you instill that, then hopefully the next generations, because yeah, we've created generational wealth for them. And it's always what do they say? Like the first generation builds the house. The second lives in it and the third burns it down. Yeah, there you go. Let's hope not. Let's hope not. So how are you planning to put this money to work? Are you thinking about investing right now? Yeah. So I think that's something that's really important to people just starting out as well.

understand we started planning for this three and a half four years ago between estate planning and trust planning and wills and just like how we're going to work through all of our gifting and family right there's so much that goes into that there's so much that goes into it and we invested really early so when it did finally happen we were really set up for success we have a great wealth management company we are going to invest and have fun in some things of these little things I've kind of told you about today where I'm like I don't know this is an interesting business and personally invest my time and money. I think we'll do some traditional safe. We'll do some risky stuff. And I also think something is really important as, you know,

it just happened to not go buck wilds. And so we're going to stay in our current house. And I just want normal. You mean you're not doing a massive splurge moving, building a McMansion somewhere? We will. But I do think it's like people, I don't want to be like where you get all this money and then you don't know what to do with. You make really dumb decisions. I'm just not that type of a person. But I mean, I do go shopping and we are going to go spend a month in Europe. Like, don't get me wrong. I will spend some money. But I also just don't even know what that reality is yet. And so, I don't know, just stay level grounded and then like, we'll slowly ease into it and then make those big life decisions. I'm interested as to how you are even learning about

this stuff. Because I think that I speak to so many female founders that, you know, make a ton of money and then perhaps, you know, that money, I will never forget my meeting with one. said founder and she had made an unbelievable exit and all the money was in her regular account. No wealth management, no investment strategy, just like sitting there in a regular interest account. But that happens to people. It happens to people more often than you think. So where did you and how have you started to educate yourself about money? And as a woman, what's the exposure that you've had to understanding how to manage and invest what you've got? It was advice from another founder early on and we ended up talking to a couple different people. And I think it was just we took that

advice early on. And we just believe. Like I found a friend or someone that just. A founder friend that was like, hey, you guys have something special here with Poppy. Like, you need to have these conversations now. And I think we're only doing like 20 million in revenue. And I was like, yeah. And they're like, no, no, no. Even if you sell the company for 20 million. Like, that's real money for you guys. Like it doesn't have to be a billion dollar exit for you to think about financial future. Yeah. And so we started. And tax planning. And all. And like the really kind of boring part of it. And the most expensive thing through that process is a lawyer because any good finance company is not going to charge you and they're going to help advise you

and invest in you. And if they don't, then you need to find someone else. And so for us, the biggest piece of that was the lawyer fees, which can be really expensive to get all that stuff set up. And that was the main investment. And you know what? We just didn't go on vacation that year early on, right? Like pick your battles. And so I think my husband is, I'm fortunate, he's very very buttoned up in that world. And I do join all the calls because I want to educate myself on it. And I'm not like bearing my head in the sand. I wouldn't say I'm the strongest in it. But at top level, every decision I've been a part of, I understand, you know, as much as I need to. I don't need to really understand how the stock market is like going in the detail of every little thing.

But I have that from my phone. I can look at everything right now. I can see how much money I had today. I think that's like the balance that works for me where some people I think they're like, oh, I left it up my financial advice. and like you don't, you don't want to be in that position either. Totally. When you meet other founders now, because I'm sure you're doing a bit of mentoring and you're teaching people everything that you've learned over the last few years, what advice are you giving and what questions are you asking them? Oh gosh. It's the brand first always. And then I think understanding process. So I used to just be so annoyed if someone was like, I have an agenda and like, we have to do something. You're probably like, no, I love agendas. But I'm the creative. I never think of myself as a process orientated person,

but I guess I am. Like, it's not even that I like an agenda. I just, I'm like, I get in a meeting and I'm looking for the out of the meetings. So I'm like, how can we be the most productive we can be with this time? Because I don't like sitting in meetings. You know, I feel like there's so many things that drain my day and emails and meetings just feel like the worst way for me to spend my time. never respond to the mouse. So I'm like, just don't send me an email. Didn't we just walk past each other in the corridor? Like, ask me. That's how I feel. We don't need 30 minutes. No, I think so like that that's like a really big piece of advice that I always give is like probably get the process in pretty early. You know, for example, I spoke at Target HQ last week and I had a founder come up to me

and she was just so desperate for advice. And she said that someone was telling her to change who she was. They were telling her to change her outfits. They were telling her she needed to be more business-like. And I said, why? Like, does that bring you happiness? She's like, why need to come across more professional? And I said, well, I wear pink and I'm professional. That has nothing to do with anything.

And so it's just having little moments like that where I can be like, don't lose yourself in your company. Because I think a lot of people feel like they have to change and lose themselves of who they are. You can grow and get better. Yes, you can. But you don't have to change who you are. you can get stronger, but don't change.

Because that's what you started this company. I told her that. I said, don't lose your confidence. You started a company. And you know what, that person didn't. Exactly. Do you feel like you've had to change along the way? I wouldn't call it change.

I would say growth. You evolved. I evolved. And I think people that don't want to evolve and don't want to change. That's someone no one wants to work with. I think if you just hold on and you can't change and you can't grow, I don't know. I actually embrace change. I wouldn't say, I mean, I've cried over change. It's not easy.

Change is not easy and it's not hard and I hate getting feedback and I hate saying sorry. Ugh, I think I've said sorry. Could you take feedback? It boils me, but then I usually have to like sit back with it. I'm like, okay, fine. I've learned something from that, whether it's good feedback or not. But it's helped me learn to give better feedback when I get feedback. It's like these things.

Yeah. But like I don't think you start a company to do like a mid-year review. Right? So like as an entrepreneur, you have to learn. all these things. Yes, but you do have to learn it. And then you owe it to the people that work with you. And so sometimes it's just not about you. Like, I feel like that was my biggest learning curve, you know, because for so long it was all about me. And then I moved to America, I was like, oh, it's not about me anymore, you know, and as things get bigger and you take on so much responsibility for so many people,

you have to change and adapt and do the things that are less comfortable. I always say that I kind of love companies when they're like 20 people. That's like my sweet spot. when I know everybody's name and when, like, that's my happy, happy place, you know. Yeah, because now you get big and everyone knows who you are, but you don't know who they are. Yeah. And that's a really hard place to be because it feels uncomfortable, but that's okay to you. Yeah, no, it's a really hard place to be. I wanted to ask you because I work with my husband and you've worked with yours for so long.

How has that been on your relationship? Obviously, you've had this major success together, but has it all been what it seems? No, real talk. The one piece that's always been really important is we value what the other person is good at. To the core of my soul, I value what he does and I know he values what I do. But the difference is because we're so opposite in what we do, sometimes I think mine's probably a little bit more important than him. Or vice versa. So when he's wrong, you mean. Yeah, yeah. So, like, for example, he was running our entire operations in our innovation team. So he had PhD scientists reporting into him. We had labs. He had a team of 50, like, huge. And I'm, like, running the brand and the creative and like all of this stuff. I'd be like, well, the event's going on. He's like, well, I have an offsite. I'm like, well, obviously the event's more important. Like, you have to stay home. Like, you know, and he's like, no. So, like, that was a big piece that was always like a part of contention of like, just because my work's not as fun doesn't mean it's just. is important. I'm like, yeah, maybe supply chain is important.

You're like, maybe. Maybe we need to get this product into the hands of people after I've killed it with the marketing. And then like you're together all the time so that you forget to have real conversations about life, marriage planning, kids. And we, like, that was something that we had to like physically be like, wait, wait, we haven't talked, actually talked in like a week. Actually talked. Yeah, because some people would be like, hey, did you talk to Stephen about X, Y, Z? And he's like, I'd be like, no, they're like, you're with him. You live with it. You live together. I have people in my office say that to us all the time. I also think it's difficult when you have a really brilliant, exciting business because you want to

talk about the business. So there's no like, okay, I'm so over this. Like, let's just forget about it. You're like, this is exciting. Like, we've got so many great things to talk about. So it does become all about the business. Were you able to like, I mean, obviously you have a marriage and you're still together. But how did you navigate? Like, how did you create a way for you to be happy, married, romantic partners and have this company together. I think giving mid-year reviews and feedback in our marriage, literally. Like, no, I mean, it's like one of those things where it got hard a little bit a few months ago when we were like really busy and I was traveling and doing all sorts of press and all of

these things. And he was kind of like, and then I would get home and I'd be exhausted. And then he'd be like, the kid just want to be around you and I'd be like, I'm tired. I can't. Like, whatever. I just need to go to bed instead of staying. He's like, I've been putting the kids down for like a week and all those things. So he finally sat down and he was just like, the kid just want to be around you.

Like, you have to go to these things. And I thought, I was like, you know what? No, I don't. And I started kind of clearing my schedule. And I was home more and it made me happier. But like I didn't think about it. I thought I was grinding, grinding, grinding. And he was like, do you not see like what's going on?

Like, you need to slow down. And sometimes I need to be checked. And like that's what I mean with like the feedback. And even though I hate to say he was right. But that was a, like, that's, that's kind of how we, like, have conversation sometimes. Like, we're really open with, like, our feedback and, like, being like, hey, it wasn't, like, dragged down, fight. Like, you know, we don't, we don't really fight. And people always think we're, like, crazy because we don't fight.

But, like, we're real. And we have conversations. And then I found just being home more made me happier. Me, you know, my kids made me happier. Maybe happier person. So, yeah, I think it's not easy, but I will 100% do it again. Any business I ever do again, I will do with my husband. You will?

I can't wait. Oh, I love that. Do you think he feels the same? Oh, yeah. He wouldn't do it without me either. He's like, no way. Honestly, there's certainly he wants to do. But I will say his biggest fear is if it's not my idea, I won't get behind it.

He's been really honest with me with that. He's like, what if the next business I come up with? And I'm like, I don't know how I feel about that. I'll let you know. Tell me your idea. I'll give you a mid-year review on that one. Yeah, exactly. That's crazy. I want to ask you, like, how do you feel? Like, do you walk around, like, feeling like, so proud? Do you feel a bit sad? Like, what's the feeling now?

Probably a little bit of both. You know, I think one of the biggest things was when it was finally said and done, you know, the day of me and my husband, all we want to do is, like, go to lunch or do something together to kind of celebrate, like, the actual day that it funded. And we ended up. kids screaming, horrible night, couldn't get into bed. It was like, go to bed. The next day I just cleared my schedule and we went to yoga and went to lunch. And I was just like, that was so much better. But it was just a good reality check that like life's really not that different other than that freedom piece. But it is sad. You know what I mean?

Like it's an end of an era of something I've been working for for seven plus years. The futures, there's a lot of unknown, which is exciting. and I've never in my entire life felt every emotion all at once. Within an hour, you're happy, you're sad, you're crying, but you're happy crying. And it's like, it's a lot on a person's like body. And so I've been very like conscious of taking care of myself. Like even though there's a lot of really great things going on is a lot of loss. And I think like anyone that says otherwise is crazy or not truthful, I really want Poppy to be successful.

honestly, if they would have offered me a Pepsi, like, badge and, like, kept me, and I probably would work another three years not stopped. You're like, I'm coming in. I'm going into the office. Literally, like, that's just, like, how much I love Poppy, but I just know that's not sustainable. It has to stand on its own. I really do think the brand is standing on its own at this point. What would be your nightmare to see? What's the one thing that you're like, if I see this, I'd just die? I would just die if I saw, like, a really cheese. commercial where people are sitting around a pool and they crack open a coffee and they're dancing and like cheersing and smiling at the camera. And like today, like we don't use like models in any of our stuff. We use real creators or real people or real community or me. It's like hiring on actors to like walk around like a cheesy old soda commercial. I literally think about that all the time. It's so funny. I literally sent it in a message the other day because someone, one of a

a brand made of that and I was like, this is my worst nightmare. Please never do this with my brand. What would make you so happy to see? What do you want in five years, ten years, twenty years time? To continue seeing Poppy everywhere I go. So if I check in my hotel, I see Poppy. If I go to Europe, I see Poppy. And just anywhere I go, it's within arm's reach.

I wanted to see it in every restaurant on fountain. And I really, when I say I want Poppy to be the soda, my kids and grandkids know a soda. Yeah. I think you have a good chance of that, haven't you, don't you? I just want them to be like, Mom, can I have a soda? And I just have a soda. And it's Poppy. Benchmark.

I'm so happy to meet you and so happy to have this conversation. And like, I don't want to say I'm patronizing, but just like so proud of you and so happy for you because it's so major. So few women that can say they've started something like this and they've seen it through to fruition. It's special. Stacks of cash just sitting there because of it. Period.

Congratulations, thanks. It's amazing. Now we only have the rapid fire to do. Okay. Here we go. What is the first thing you do when you wake up in the morning? Coffee and TikTok. Together.

Curling more drinking coffee. I love that. And what's the last thing you do before you go to bed at night? Don't say TikTok. Wine and TikTok, no. It's great combinations. These are things I could get with. No, probably watching reality TV or hanging in with my husband. Yeah. Rob. What's your reality TV?

I love Love Island. I love the Kardashians. The English one, Love Island? I haven't watched that. I love love Blind. No, Love Island. No, Love Island America is so good. Everyone in England is obsessed with Love Island. I'm obsessed with the only way is Essex. That is the show. I've seen every season. Basically, I grew up like right there. Yeah. I'm from East London and Essex is where you go. Literally. It's been around forever.

I know it has been around forever. They are having like such a run. It's crazy. Okay. What are you currently aspiring for in your business life? Normalcy. What are you currently aspiring for in your personal life? Normalcy. I'm so boring. It's not boring. That's amazing. You've done enough. You can take a seat. You're good. What is a book that's changed your life?

Okay, so I love this question, but I don't have time to read books. I love you. Can I send you a bunch of books just for the vacation? Yes, okay. I have things for you. I will just text me what it is because I'll download it and I'll listen to it. I feel like you're a download girl. I'm going to totally do that because I just feel like you're going to have this dreamy vacation and you are going to get. I love listening to books. Literally, it's the best. What is something that you valued when you were starting out that you don't value anymore? I used to really value recognition and the attaboys. And now I know I get it, but I don't need to hear it. Even though it's nice to hear. But it's like a lot of people feel like they need it to be successful.

You don't need it anymore. It's wonderful. And what's something that you value now that you didn't when you were starting out? Honestly, I didn't value other people's thoughts or opinions. I thought mine were the right. Like, I was always right. And now I really value other people's opinions and thoughts and collaboration. That's some real growth right there.

Amazing. Thank you so much. It's such a pleasure. So wonderful. Thank you, darling. If you're loving this podcast, be sure to click follow on your favorite listening platform. While you're there, give us a review and a five-star rating and share an episode you loved with a friend who'll be so grateful. A spy with Emmer Greed is presented by Odyssey.

I'm your host, Emma Greed. Our executive producers are Corrine Gilliott Fisher, Derek Brown and me. Our executive producers from Odyssey are Maddie Sprung Kaiser, Leah Reese Dennis, Asha Saluja and Jenna Weiss Berman. Justine Dom is our senior producer, our producer. Our producer is Kristen Torres. Sound design and engineering by Bill Shorts. Angela Paluso is our Booker, original music by Charles Black.

Video production by Evan Cox, Kurt Courtney, Andrew Steele, Carlos Delgado, and Arnie Agatha. Social media by Olivia Holman. Special thanks go to Britney Smith, Sydney Ford,

my teams at Jones Works and W&E, Moora Karen, Josephina Francis, Hillary Shuff, Eric Donnelly, Kate Hutchinson Rose, Tim Miko, Sean Cherry, and Lauren Vieira. If you have questions for me, you can DM me at Aspire with Emma Greed. Greed is spelled G-R-E-D-E, that's AspI-R-E with Emma Greed.

Or you can submit a question to me on my website, emigreed.me. Ambition comes in all shapes and sizes. At First Citizens Bank, we roll with your goals because we're built for what you're building. Fit for your ambition for citizens back.