Bachelor Happy Hour - Exclusive: Bachelor Matt James Is Here!

Episode Date: January 12, 2021

In his podcast exclusive, Bachelor Matt James opens up about the pressures of navigating this journey and talks about his nerves coming into the season. Plus, he discusses what it means to be the first Black Bachelor and shares why it was so important for him to protest this summer. Then, Matt breaks down his favorite limo entrances and talks about his dating life prior to coming on the show. “Bachelor Happy Hour” has exclusive interviews every week. Watch “The Bachelor” on ABC and listen to “Bachelor Happy Hour” the next morning. Don’t forget to rate and subscribe so you never miss an episode. See omny.fm/listener for privacy information.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Listen to the Good Stuff podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Dr. Scott Barry Kaufman, host of the Psychology Podcast. Here's a clip from an upcoming conversation about how to be a better you. When you think about emotion regulation, you're not going to choose an adaptive strategy, which is more effortful to use, unless you think there's a good outcome. Avoidance is easier. Ignoring is easier. Denials is easier. Complex problem solving. takes effort. Listen to the psychology podcast on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, my name is Enya Yumanzoor.

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Open your free IHeartRadio app. Search Emergency Intercom and listen now. Welcome back to another episode of Bachelor Happy Hour. And of course, we bring you a new week, new drama. And a lot went down. And while, of course, we love to recap Rachel, we have somebody very special joining us on the podcast today, which is the most eligible Bachelor himself.

Of course, we had to get Matt James on here. And if you can hear Minow in the background, she's got the squeaker toy ready. She's ready to welcome Matt. We all do. Yeah. But before we do, because I know all of you have just been anticipating us finally sitting down and chatting with him.

And thankfully, to anyone who submitted questions, we so appreciate that. I just wanted to take two seconds to acknowledge that, yes, it is Tuesday. We've already seen two episodes of The Bachelor air. but I don't want to undermine the fact that a lot has happened in our country in the past week. And so we want to acknowledge it here and to give our thoughts and prayers to everyone affected with the protests and the riots and the terrorist acts that happened at the Capitol last week. Rachel, I know I'm sure you'll go into depth on some of your other podcasts about it. But we don't want to, you know, breeze over the fact that there's a lot of heaviness happening in our country and it's so important to now more than ever. band together and really remember what our country stands for, which is something that we haven't

necessarily seen a lot of in this past, especially past year. So, you know, our thoughts and prayers again are to the families and people affected within that. But hopefully this can be a nice outlet for everybody. And we'll just get into the show and have a lighthearted, fun conversation with each other and with bringing Matt on. Absolutely. I very well said. Rebecca, the only thing I would add is, you guys, what we've seen transpire in 2021 up, which we were quickly reminded is just another date on the calendar. Everything didn't get left in 2020. You know, ask yourself, is this the America that we want?

What does America mean to you? It truly cannot mean what we saw transpire in a historic way last week at our nation's capital. So it's crazy because last week we said, you know what? Let's all just be better. Well, that message carries into this podcast. Let's just be better, guys. Let's just do better. Let's hold people accountable.

And let's bring this nation back to what it once was. The phrase united we stand doesn't seem right right now. So let's find our way back to it. Let's get back there. Yes. And speaking of getting back, let's get back to The Bachelor Talk. Because we originally were like, you know what? We're going to do a whole recap.

We're going to break down this episode, but why break down the episode when you have the man of the hour? So let's just get right to it. You guys have heard from Matt James probably on someone's in someone's magazine or someone's media outlet. But let me remind you, those are five to ten minute interviews, not even ten. I know, I do them. I have to do one for extra. We have Matt for an hour plus, which means we get to delve into all those questions that you may have. And Matt has the opportunity to answer those questions.

I didn't even see. Minnow is so exacted right now. Minnow is everybody right now. Minow is Bachelors Nation. Meno, I get it. I'm going to get right to it. That's Mito telling me we got to hurry up and go. She's the vibe right now.

You guys, Mito is the vibe. We've got the man himself. We've got him at great length where he can talk to us. And as I said, delve into everything we want to know about who he is, who these women are, how he got here. and kind of what to expect this season. So this is the moment you've been waiting for. We have our current first Black Bachelor matchings.

Well, Matt, we finally have you on, probably one of the most anticipated interviews we've had everyone sliding into our DMs for. So welcome to Happy Hour. We're so happy to have you here. Yeah. Hey, Rachel. Hey, Becca.

Thank you for having me. It's good to be here. Of course. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So I feel like it's been odd with you, right? Because you were announced in June. We never get this much notice of a lead coming. You're announced in June. We're quarantining. Then you had to watch two other seasons. I mean, we didn't know it was going to be two seasons, but it turned out to be two seasons with Claire and Tasia. Actually, you probably were already gone during Tashas. But still, two Bacheloretts come through. Now it's you. So now that it's your season's finally airing. We're meeting the women. that you get to potentially find a wife in. How does it feel? Surreal.

It's weird hearing myself on TV, you know, because I sound like a robot and I sound like a cartoon character. So it's been, it's like kind of cringy to watch back. But it's exciting to share that experience with like my friends and family, you know. So that's been the good part. I want to know because like Rachel said, usually when anyone has announced as the lead,

they literally get their phone taken away and they go, straight into filming for the season, filming for their promos, doing all the photo shoots, all that fun stuff. But you did have extra time. So that time when you were announced to when you actually left for Nemecolin and filming, what was that like? Like, did you try to kind of lay low and stay out of the DMs and off of social? Or were you taking it all in and like soaking it all in?

No, thank goodness. I was in Florida with Tyler quarantining. So like, and he, someone who's already been through. the process. He was on Hannah Brown season. So like I kind of already got the do's and don't. So it was nice being with him. And we just kept our schedule. You know, we wake up. We're going on our bike rise near the beach, work out, just like enjoy being with my, with and around my friends and like enjoying like a peaceful quarantine. So it was business as usual. Post social media videos. Create, create a whole page. Come on, Matt. We saw.

We saw it. And that was before. You said what I do after. That stuff was already going on. I guess that was kind of before. Yeah, we, I didn't let it. Again, we were just trying to find ways to entertain ourselves and not go crazy like everybody else. And that's a lot of what we were doing, just having fun at the house.

And, again, trying to be safe and not go crazy. I step out, not get caught up. Listen, that's a feat. I don't know if I would have been able to do it. I'm just going to be honest with you. You want me to say on the straight and narrow for that long? It's honestly not as difficult when you've got a good support system. But like if I was by myself,

that's when things get tricky because you don't have someone telling you no and you can get persuaded to go places. Like you might take an impromptu trip to Miami, do something foolish. Like so it was nice having him there. Jupiter has a bunch of stuff to do. We were on the boat. Like we were doing safe, fun activities and just chilling.

Y'all invited me to come to the boat. We were trying to get you up there. I was invited. I was in Florida. I was in Florida. Becca, I lived like an hour away. I was in Florida. Can I ask you this too?

I want to talk about like quarantine though because one of the things that you were involved with with quarantine was the protest. And we talked about that. You know, I was in Florida. I was protesting. Well, we didn't as well. We didn't get the chance to do it together. But can you talk about why it was so important for you to protest this summer? A thousand percent. I think it was important for me because, and it's silly that I even have to

address this, that like, people think that because my mom's white, that I don't associate with being black. And my experience has been as a black man. Like, my skin's black. I don't wear a name tag or a resume carry around with me that my mom's white. Like, I'm a black man. And so, like, I thought that it was important to let people know that that's how I feel and that's how I represent myself and that's I'm going to stand with my people with what they're going through and it's important to me and not only was it important to me but it was important to my friends and they wanted to support me with that because they grew up in and around black people and this is their time to figure out how they can everyone's always asked what can I do

support support come march like come see what it's about and so Tyler came with me and a handful of my other friends and we went to a peaceful process and it was incredible for them to see that and hear people's stories, hear what people are upset about, hear people talk about things from an educated standpoint. And that's why we can speak on what happened yesterday at the Capitol. And we have that perspective of what it looks like to peacefully protest and what our experience has been like opposed to seeing that happen yesterday and see that they were treated differently than people who were treated

that were protesting peacefully with us in Florida and other states. across the country so um it was it was empowering rachel and it's it's something that i'm able to tell my kids about and something that i feel comfortable speaking about now because it's it's a part of who i am and i was a part of that process i want to follow up to that question too because obviously like it's no surprise this is probably one of the most historic seasons that we've had on this show because you are indeed the first black bachelor and you know we saw you during the premiere and throughout you know last night's episode as well kind of talking about this this responsibility of this role that you're taking on so what does it mean to you truly being the first black bachelor and

has that changed since you said yes to taking on that role versus now when you're done filming right um i think that it's two things for me it's what it means to me is i can only speak on my experience and what I've been through. And I am black, but I'm also mixed. You know, my mom's white and my dad's black. So my experience isn't going to be everyone else's experience. And I speak to that because I know that when people watch me, regardless of if I want to admit it or not, like, they're going to look at me as that is how, like, oh, that's, that's what, that's how black people act. Oh, that's what a black relationship looks like.

Or like, why did he do that? Do all black people do that? And, like, that was a big pressure that I put on myself when I first got there because I just felt this responsibility that I've got to make everybody proud. But at the end of the day, all I can do is represent how I was raised and who I am. And I think I did that. And that conversation comes up a handful of times throughout the season as it should because it's important. And regardless of what you look like, if you're black, if you're Asian, If you're white, like, my goal is to get married.

And marriage comes kids, and our kids are going to have some sort of pigmentation. So it's something that we need to cover because our kids are going to go through what I've been through. And it's something that we need to address going into the relationship so that when we get to that point, it's not this, like, big conversation. It should be something that we've talked about throughout the course of our relationship. And, yeah. Do you, yeah, do you? I was just going to say

without, you know, giving names and too many details away, do you feel like throughout that entire season you did have those conversations with the women that you formed really, really strong connections with and that you were with towards the end? Is that something that I'm hoping that we'll be able to see? Yeah,

we definitely had those conversations because it was important to me to have them because that's where we're at as a country and that's what we're going to deal with in a relationship And that's not a conversation I've had in a relationship because up into this point,

I wasn't ready for what I stepped into, which was to be engaged, to be married. And knowing what I was stepping into, I wanted to make sure that I was having all the conversations I would want to have with somebody who I wanted to spend the rest of my life with. And one of the major ones is going to be race, diversity, what our kids are going to look.

look like what you're going to go through being with me, what my experience has been like in the whole gamut of that conversation. I think it's interesting because because of what has come to being a black person, you've always been privy to it because being black, but because of what's coming out in 2020, a lot of people are recognizing things about themselves. Let me be more specific. White people are recognizing things about themselves that they have. hadn't before, like the word privilege, realizing that there's so many layers in depth to

that. So it'll be, it's interesting. I think it's even more difficult. It's already, it's already difficult for you to go through this season being a first period, no matter what you look like is difficult. Now you're the first black bachelor. That's a whole other level. There's certain stereotypes that are placed on a black man that aren't placed on a black woman that you're going to have to navigate as you go through your season that I didn't. Now we're doing this all in 2020 with an administration that is bringing other things to light, where racism is more overt than it ever has been before. And we're discovering past and certain behaviors about certain people that maybe they didn't even recognize about themselves. Okay, I'm going on a soapbox, but here's

the real thing I want to talk about. The conversation that you had with Chris Harrison. let's get into it because a lot of people were upset and once again I'm going to be specific when I say people I mean black folks were upset and I am very empathetic to you

Matt because I have been in your shoes and I know the pressure that you feel and I know the bias that people place on you and I know how you are going to get a lot of unfair criticism and it's not fair And with you, it's going to be even harder or even more criticism because I was the first and I already came through. People had no idea what I was going to do. I didn't choose somebody who was black.

Then Tasia comes. She doesn't choose someone who's black. So people are putting more pressure on you to choose someone who looks like you. To choose someone to not follow in the footsteps of the two other people of color that were leads and are assuming that you will do exactly what we do. So there's a lot even more placed on you that I recognize. So you and Chris Harrison have this conversation. I didn't like it either. I'll be honest.

And this isn't a knock to you. It was the presentation of the entire conversation. It was setting the stage, you're standing up there about to meet these women. And before you can meet a one of them, you would call Chris in to have this conversation. Now, we know. It was already fully candidly lit with two chairs properly placed in the room. So we know it is what it is. But then you proceed to tell Chris Harrison about the pressure that you feel and the focus of the conversation was the pressure you feel of who you have to choose and how you feel pressure to choose a specific person.

And a lot of people took that as because of how it was presented to them, oh, he wants to let everybody know that before I meet these women, I need to let you. I need to let you know that I may not choose somebody who you want me to choose. And a lot of people, because of all the bias that are already placed on you, which is so unfair, people assumed that that was a disclaimer that you were not going to pick a woman of color. Now, I am sure that conversation was a lot longer than what we saw. So I want to give you the opportunity to provide context to what it is that you were saying when you were sitting down with Chris. right so and and it's it's it's it's low-key frustrating to even have to address it because like

right like first off people should regardless of what they what they look like should want you to be happy with whoever you're with and like and and if you knew anything about me if you were close to me you would know that the last women that I dated were all black women and when you're dating somebody, if you're excluding a race, then that, like, I don't even, I don't even know where to begin on that. Like, how can, like my love story included, like you saw on night one, there was white women there, there was black women there, there's Asian women there, because those are the women that I've dated across the board. And what I'm looking for in women isn't race specific. And the conversation I have with Chris, I feel like, first of all, I respect Chris for

stepping into that because it was the start of the conversation. You can't get to a conclusion. You can't get to a resolution without starting that conversation and it just happened to be Chris and me having that conversation. And I don't think it's on me to explain why

that hasn't been the case in the past. I can only speak to my experience and what I'm looking for and what I'm looking for may upset somebody because what I'm looking for isn't a race you know what I mean it's like I don't only exclusively date black women

I don't only exclusively date white women I've dated all across the board and I've found redeeming qualities in everybody which is a blessing and that's why it's so difficult for me throughout the season because there's great qualities I love in Abigail there's great qualities in Kayla there's great qualities in Maggie and they all look different

and I'm trying to explain that for Chris as best I can and to everybody else tuning in because that might not be everyone everyone else's experience like being mixed like Mm-hmm

Talk about that So being mixed like I do holidays with my mom I do holidays of my dad I never saw color like for me in their relationship

it wasn't it wasn't like there was never like it's hard for me to fathom it would be like me quantifying infinity like I can't

I can't articulate what that means to only date or only look at and refer to someone in color because that's not been my experience. When you talk about those pressures and I think this is where I feel like the audience wasn't fair to you.

And this is why I just hated the whole setup of the conversation because the pressure isn't just about who you pick. What people don't realize is there are so many other pressures put on you and I'll like speak to one of them you as being biracial and that's why I was like speak on that because you're not just representing yourself as a black man you're also representing yourself as a biracial man and that's a whole other way to walk through life because you're just not one race and we constantly I'm not biracial but I dealt with this criticism and I know you do too of am I going to be too black in some circles or am I going to be not black enough in others is that so of the pressure that you were talking about as well. And I don't even honestly see it as a pressure anymore.

I just see it as a reality. And honestly, you see it. And you see it during the protest. It's like, like, oh, you're pro, like, oh, you're, like, who are you, like, who are you, like, what are you, like, what are you talking about? Like, I'm, I'm, I'm about the people. I'm about, I'm about, I'm about change. I'm about equality.

Like, like, like, you see me out here. And then it's like, like, like, like, what do I have to do to prove myself to you? Like, I'm not trying to prove myself, I'm just living out who I am. And it's on other people who that's not comfortable with because it's different to them. So, like, I'm hoping that through them seeing how I handle my business on the show and how I go about my normal life, it makes them comfortable with someone who looks like me being in their living room every Monday and someone who looks like me being more approachable to them in the grocery store or dating their daughter or their son or whatever. And that's kind of the pressure, if you want to call it, that I put on my,

myself being in that position because you and Tasia paid the way for someone like me to be in this position. So like I feel like it's, I owe it to everyone else who looks like me to represent black people in a way that is going to allow for more opportunities like this. Because if I go up there acting a fool, then I'm like, all right, like, this is why we haven't had them. But that's not the case. Like, I'm just like everybody else. And I'm hoping that comes out through the season. And it's not like, Like, for instance, we don't refer to, like, Serena Williams as a great black tennis player. She's a great tennis player.

But, like, I'm hoping that, like, 10 years from now, if I was a bachelor, that was a great bachelor, he just happens to be black. You know what I mean? And, like, normalized something like this. So. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Did you at any point throughout your season? And I'm sure it's different for you because you're the first person also to have never done this before.

You know, this was like your first time being miced up. standing and meeting all the women and going through the interviews all at the same time as as all the contestants. So you felt pressure from all sides in regards to the way you look in regards to that this is your first time doing this. So did you ever feel that pressure subside throughout the season where you got a little bit more comfortable with yourself, with Chris, with the women? Or did you still always feel that till the end and maybe feel it now as well? Hell yeah. I felt way comfortable halfway through like because it's draining to like try to be perfect because you can't be perfect and like those first few days with the

women I'm trying to say all the right things I'm trying to be articulate like I'm myself like I have a hard time reading sometimes you know what I mean I stutter like like I get nervous so like when I stopped worrying about how people were going to portray me and proceed me and think about what I said like it was liberating because I was able to be myself and that came through to these women and they were able to open up and be more comfortable around me because, like, oh, yeah, he's, he's just like, I am. Like, he's freaking shaking right now. He's nervous. And, like, so I guess, like, to answer your question, like, I just stopped caring about how I was going to be perceived by people because I am who I am.

Like, my thoughts aren't going to be like, I'm not going to come up with this, like, crazy thought out of left field. Like, I'm just going to tell you how I feel in the moment. And, like, that's who I am. You will kill yourself trying to be professional. please everyone. It's just impossible. Yeah. And I and I will say this is something that I mentioned to Rachel on last week's podcast when we were covering the premiere is

we both mentioned how endearing it was that you have never gone through this before because you sometimes when you know what to expect you go into it you know knowing the right things to say and how to act and if something happens okay you know the producers are going to be there to help you and and you know build you up and make you look good And it was, it was fun as a viewer who truly like, this is the first season where I really have no idea what's going on or like, you know, any spoilers whatsoever. And so it's been endearing and fun to watch you navigate it really in your own way and making it so unique to you.

And so I just want to say that, you know, at the top of this, I mean, I know we've been talking for a little bit, but to let you know that I'm sure it was nerve-wracking and you did feel that pressure. but I think for a lot of people, they actually really enjoy the fact that this is your first time. This is your first go at this. Thank you. Yeah, no, I legitimately didn't know what to expect. Like that first rose ceremony, like, I literally couldn't speak. Like, I couldn't get words out because I was so nervous and I felt horrible sending great

women home that I didn't have a chance to speak to. You know what I mean? It's like, like I felt so bad. And that was real. And everything I felt throughout that whole. process was real because like I didn't know like I didn't know how how the dynamics of a group day work or how after party or a cocktail hour worked like like things were happening in a real time and I'm just dealing with them like some random dude off the street like yo go in there and do

this and like that's how I was like kind of handling every situation so I felt like I could relate to the women from a standpoint of like look we're going through this together like I I don't know what to expect like I'm but what I can do is is be my authentic self and be vulnerable with you so that that opens up and sets the stage in the floor for you to be open and vulnerable because if we're here, we might as well go for it. You know what I mean? Like, I'm not going to waste your time. I'm going to meet you where you're at. And that's what I tried to do. I appreciate that. You know, be unapologetically yourself. Like Becca and I said, and Becca just told you, it was endearing that you were nervous. You could tell, but it was like,

oh, he's not out here trying to be the next, a bachelor he saw before. you know and so i want to talk about your first night i want to step into that and what's this is what i mean about you can't please everybody oh people you do something we've never seen before which personally i loved you open up in prayer and you didn't just start praying you didn't order people to to clasp their hands together and close their eyes and bow their heads you explain what you do. I'm nervous. And this is what I do and I lean on. Because guess what? I'm the bachelor, y'all. I almost said I'm the MF bachelor. I cleaned it up. I'm the bachelor. I am looking for a wife. It is important that we're on the same page. We don't need to wait till the last minute

to find out things about each other. My faith is important to me. This is what I do. So I am going to open up in prayer. You know, it's like participate if you if you want to. Are you sure? shocked that people were offended by the fact that you opened up, your opening speech was a prayer. No, I'm not. People are sensitive. And I'll say this, like, that's the least of a gesture I could do for someone who sacrificed their life for me. So like if Pran for a Preach, Matt. You better preach. If a friend for a group of women is ever a bad thing,

then I don't want to be a part of what's good. Because that's where my peace comes from. That's where my values and what I believe in comes from. And I'll never, that being said, I'll never force it on anybody. Because guess what? My brother's an atheist. And I would die for him.

And you'll see that throughout the season. Like, I would never, I'm not going to push religion on anybody because guess what? You can't. You can't push anything on. on anybody. I'm going to do what they want to do at the end of the day. All I can do is show them where I get my strength from and show them that where I go

to in my tongue of like duress and sorrow so that you understand where I'm coming from and you see where my decision making comes from. Because if you see me doing something, I don't want you to ever be a question of where it's coming from because it's going to align with my views and beliefs. And like that being said, if that's not something you're comfortable with, then like, then we're just not meant to be with each other. but like I would never ostracize someone for not being and sharing my faith. But I'd hope that through the way I live my life and carrying myself,

they'd be curious as to why I am that way. You know what I mean? Come on, Matthew. As I love to point out, Rebecca, Rachel and Matthew, three biblical names. Did you, I want to know this too because I feel like it could be in that setting, very telling of who is into that and who is reciprocating, you know, on the level of faith. So did you, I mean, obviously there's probably a ton of emotions going through your body. And if it was me, I probably would have blacked out the second I entered the room when there

was like 30 plus men in front of me. I was like, oh my God, I don't know what I'm saying. I don't know where am I. What is my name? But did you, was it a way for you to kind of pick up on who appreciated that, who was like giving you like the compassion and the faith and the love back? To be honest, do not even. I wasn't even about that. Like I was literally, like you said, Becca, when I walked in there, I had, I had six months to think about what I was going to say to these women. So I'm like, yeah, I'm going to go in there. I'm going to kill it. I'm like barely making it in there. Like, I'm shaking. Like, and then I see all the women in there. I had nothing. It was nothing in my head. There was nothing to say. I'm like, man, I don't know what to say. Let me pray

real quick. And then I just like center me, got me back on track. And, and that's something that like, it should be like when someone says they're going to pray for you, like, that's an honor. like why should it only be someone's going to pray for you if like yo i heard your dad's in the hospital like i'm gonna pray for you like praying for someone's like that's a blessing to have someone praying for you that means they're thinking about you they care about you like i care about all the women that were there and i want them to have i want them to be at peace because if you're not comfortable in that setting then i'm not we're not going to get to know each other like if you're nervous if you're like thinking that i'm some like person that's unattainable or that i'm like this figurehead like i want you to see me

is like one of y'all and like i just like tried to humanize myself as much as i could whether it was off camera saying some goofy shit to them or whether it was like just being like my authentic self like i wanted them to see me as matt not the bachelor so that we could get past all the bull and get to the real stuff of like are we compatible like like what are you what are you looking for like can i be that person because like as much as as much as like they're on the bachelor like I'm convincing them that, like, I'm the, I could be the man. Yeah. So you probably out of anyone, other than I would say maybe Claire as the lead,

had the most time to prepare for this role. And I want to know, this is two-per question. First, what did you do mentally, mentally, physically, emotionally to help you prepare? And then what was it like once you were at the bachelor in front of all these women when they literally look at you? like this god where you know you can do no wrong and you're handsome and you're charming and you're the world's or the country's most eligible bachelor what was like that what was that like for you personally because for me i felt very uncomfortable by it so i i want to know if you

felt similar a little bit different if you soaked it in if you loved it um but first how did you prepare um that's a funny question because uh mike johnson had actually come up to stay with Tyler and I in New York, and this was in like January before I even knew I was going to be on The Bachelorette, but there was the opportunity. And he saw me getting out of the shower. And I just had a robe on. I just had a towel on. He's like, he's like, you got to put some weight on, homie. He's like, your neck is so skinny. And you got to, but he was just like, he was basically saying that. I can so see him saying that. He was just giving me the hardest time. You need to hit the gym.

You need to do this and that. And I was like, looking at myself like, damn, am I that weak? So, like, I just started working out a little bit more. And honestly, like, not to be repented, but, like, I was just in the words. Like, I was, like, reading my Bible and preparing myself for, like, to be around those women because I wanted to have a strong mind. And I wanted to make sure that, like, I was spiritually and physically mentally ready for, it's like asking someone like how do you prepare to fly a rocket ship it's like I don't know anyone

flown a rocket ship and when I get there I'm gonna figure it out so as I got there I'm like starting to understand because I came to Rachel I came to you I came to Sean Lowe asking questions about what to expect and it's all good advice but like nothing can prepare you for nothing in there and you see all those women or when you're having a extremely difficult conversation with somebody that you know is going to go home and it's like it's hard. Aren't you shocked? Weren't you shocked that?

Because you kind of waltzed in and you're like, if I'm not really feeling them, I'll send them home and it's okay. But then like it breaks you. You got to send these people home. Aren't you surprised? I couldn't speak. I couldn't get words out.

I know. I couldn't do it. It's a testament to the women that were there. Like they're just, they were great women. Like I didn't think women like that were single. And as I'm getting to know on their story, what they overcome, why they're there.

I'm just like, how am I going to come out of this with one woman? Like, this is going to be so difficult. So, and to your point, Becca, like, I tried to just, like, continue to humanize myself. Like, I just, like, tell them funny stories or just, like, joke with them, like, off camera, just so they didn't look at me as, like, this, like, important person. I'm just normal. I just happen to have tuxedo on, you know what I mean? Like, so.

Let's get into the women. So we've met the women now. We've seen two episodes. You've experienced the whole season. But off the jump, who was your favorite limo entrance? That's a good question. To be honest with you, I was low-key disappointed with MJ's entrance only because I thought there was going to be pizza in that box.

the box was empty so I was kind of there was no pizza in there I was hungry too because it's like one of the morning yeah but you got a meatball from somebody I got a meatball that was nasty that was the biggest meatball I've ever seen in my life it was funny though because like I enjoyed everybody's because it showed me a little bit about themselves you know what I mean like if you came and you had some goat feet on like you're bold like if you can't oh she's my favorite she was great and then you sent her home matt hey it's like it's like do you how do you it's it's splitting hairs you tell the truth her feet were the most interesting thing about her that night and that's why you had to send her home

she took those shoes off she might put on hills and he was like oh man you got to go wait was there was there anyone who because we all have done this especially when you have so many people that you're meeting and kind of throwing themselves at you in such a short amount of time it's this i don't want this to sound bad but it's kind of easy to write some of them off so was there anyone that at first you're like maybe not my type or not into it but then they pleasantly surprised you later on yes can we get names of course of course i'll give you a name but i'm going to preface it with only because that said person was so shy that when i actually sat down and had a conversation with her, I was blown away.

Was it as a Lauren? But Matt, you dodged the question. Who was your favorite limo entrance? Favorite limo entrance was kid. Keep in touch? Just short, sweeten to the point? Because, because she pulled up in a Bentley. Oh, she did.

She pulled up in a Bentley and her dress was beautiful. She was so confident when she walked up to me, like, gave me like a look. Like she could have like, she like kind of like dismissed our entrance. She's just like, like, my name's Kit, like, keep it. I didn't even get the same thing. She was like up the stairs. Like, I'm like, oh, you like the hard to get. Kit said I live here.

Oh, would you like the kid? I live here. This is my show. They were playing the glamorous life in the background when she rolled up. She said, oh, oh, thank you. You know, nice to meet you. But let me go ahead and side. I got such bedded vibes from Kit, such bedded vibes with the belly.

And we all know how I love Bennett. So I love me. I already love Kit. I already said she was one of my favorites. I love kids. She is incredible. Like, she has so much depth to her. And the fact that she's one of the youngest people there is, says a lot.

There's a good track record with the baby Becca was what she was called. But she is, there's nothing baby about her. Becca Martinez was one of my favorites. On my season of The Bachelor, it was Corinne, who was a fan favorite. And every season we've tried, we've seen women try to be her. Victoria and fell miserably. Fell miserably. If you're going to be a villain, you've got to be funny.

Do you know what I'm saying? Victoria's hilarious. We haven't seen it yet. Oh my gosh. Rachel. We haven't seen it. She is one of the wittiest people I've ever met. We haven't seen it.

That's a good scoop inside spiroider was pretty witty. She's funny. Katie is funny too. But Victoria, like, she is unapologetically herself like she like i believe that like she's the quickest like you'll say something and she's got some and then she's out i'm like what like what you just say okay matt i want to go i want to ask another two-part question so for night one obviously we saw you give abigail the first impression rose and you had this sweet moment where you kissed her how many girls night one did you kiss

two and you saw both of them you saw a line with a spaghetti that was hella cold and then yeah I want to talk to you about that and then Abigail that was it so another thing black folks were talking about is that you ate the spaghetti and you know we don't eat other people's food unless we know what that kitchen looks like

people are upset Rachel, on everything, that was going through my head when I ate it. I'm like, yo, I just ate this noodle. I would have done it, too. Oh, my God. You had to. I didn't eat anything all the time. I couldn't be rude and like spit out after.

But, man, you also eat a meatball under somebody's handbag. He has to. You got to play the game. I had no choice. I couldn't deny the meatball. That's so fun. Like, we were dialed. I was like, you know, we got to see where,

we got to know what your kitchen looks like. We can't just eat your food from anywhere. It came from an end up one. You know, she did not make those noodles herself. No seasoning. They didn't look like it. They didn't have butter, olive oil, nothing. You couldn't tell.

Oh, I was going to say something about the first night, the first day. Oh, I know. I was going to just go and dive into episode two. Oh, God. I have this question. Now, be honest. All right. That orchid is part of the art set.

That orchid is part of the design of the room. I thought that I had dodged this question. It was in my notes. It was not. That flower was very hard to come across. It was Maryland's favorite flower, and I had to go to great lengths to obtain that. over the river and through the woods I had to go through great lengths

I said look at this shit Matt went and got a prop from the art department I was I was it was the funniest moment of the whole episode to me he said look what I've got you I said Matt hiding behind the couch I was dying laughing

dying laughing Okay it was it was sweet I feel bad for her I did have one question for your first one-on-one date you go ATV but then you have to chop your own wood for this hot tub

why was the axe either you're really big or that axe was so damn small it looks like a miniature little axe in this like a giant's hands all right well first of all disclaimer before I took my shirt off

and was chopping wood I hit like 150 push-ups because I knew that I was going to be chopped woods I felt like yeah so I I was feeling a little bigger than I was and then they gave you this baby axe the axe also was about as big as my handle was it like a hatchet it was so small this little hatchet but it did the job so funny and loki that took me about six hits to get through that wood it's not easy i had a lot of jack date of my season and sunny that was not the first swing that took about six drops now that i figured i was more disappointed that you took off your shirt and you're like

ripped and you know old johnny apple seed you know about to cut the wood and poor brie was just standing there muddy i said can we get her a towel could we wipe her down she's a beautiful girl and we're going to give math this glorifying moment and then they go they show it to brie and it's just standing there but thank goodness she looks pretty in the money i mean beauty is beautiful and if that interview would have been done after the hot tub and she would have been very clean but i had a long suit shirt on. Matt, you had some, like your cast is stunning. Yeah, they're beautiful. Stunning. That's what I was telling you earlier. I felt like the women who were there aren't typically the ones who were single. Like, I felt unworthy every time I went on a one-on-one,

every time I had a conversation, because they're just talking about, oh, yeah, I'm a lawyer, and I, oh, yeah, I do something. I'm like, yeah, just love it in, you know? Did you know? Did you know, Did you ever get a vibe? Because I definitely got this vibe from some guys on my season where I was like, they are not here for me. They are not into me.

They are only here to build their following and their fame. Did you get that vibe about some of these women? I try to get verified to benefits and doubt because at this point,

I still don't know who you are. Like, I'm trying to get to know you. And like, I cross night one off because it's like, everyone's got those jitters. So I'm assuming that that's like, like I'm like okay now everyone settled in like they moved into the house like I'm going to really get to see like what these women are about so like I still don't even know that but like if they are then I mean I

all I can be is myself I can't hold that against anybody like and that that that that will work itself out like it's not it's not a secret you know yeah and that comes out with the conversation like if we if we're not talking about anything then it's just like all right you know a main theme that we saw well i'm assuming it might last throughout the season but we obviously saw you talk about it and i won with chris is the fact that you have never been in love so i want because you know i'm i feel like i'm a first time viewer watching you and i'm sure everyone here is probably feeling the same way can you give us a little bit of your dating background and like did you ever have any really long lasting standing strong relationships where you thought you could get there or like give us the background of that so my dating history in new york is slim to none because i was broke like i didn't have any money so i couldn't take

anybody out on a date like new york's expensive so like just by default i wasn't doing a lot of dating you know what i mean i was focused on the charitable work i was doing or i'm at work or i'm trying to i'm trying to hustle like i moved to new york and grind and i knew that the relationship part would come but it had been a while since I've been in a serious relationship and when I said that I had never been in love I felt like it wasn't until that moment that I could say that

because I knew what love meant to me in that moment and that was the respect that you have for your partner the sacrifice that you would be willing to make for them the admiration you had like everything that goes into loving somebody I'd said that in the past but I wasn't willing to make those sacrifices and do the things that I was willing to do now.

So, like, whereas I would, I said it in the past when I was like a shit telling people that I love them, like now as an adult having that conversation, like, I can't say that I've been in love because I would have gone about porting that person and treating our relationship differently than I had. So that's why, like, so yeah, a long way to answer is like, I love for me changed and I hadn't been in love yet. Mm-hmm. um

did you have this is a as a general question any regrets from this season was there somebody you sent home and you're like you know what I probably shouldn't have done that or maybe I should have given them a little bit more time um

no no I don't have any regrets because of the way that I went about that process like I was a thousand percent honest. I was open. I was myself. I was real. I didn't hold anything back. Like, for better, for worse, they knew everything about me. The ones that that made it to like hometown, whatever. Like, they knew everything about me who I was, what my morals were

where I stood, what I wanted to do. And if it didn't work out, then it's because that person didn't see that with me. And I can't, I can't force that on somebody, you know? Like, if they, if I'm not that person for them, that I'm happy that they were able to figure that out with me and that I'm going forward. They'll be able to figure that out with that person. But, no, I don't have any regrets. When it came to hometowns, was there any apprehension on your part or were you nervous as a black man knowing that, because I'm sure you have a diverse final four?

Was there any, were you nervous about meeting these parents, especially if one of those women had never dated a black man before. Having dated women whose parents weren't accepting of me being black, I wasn't as much, I wasn't really nervous, Rachel, and here's why. They knew what they were getting into. Like, it wasn't a surprise when they got here that I was the bachelor. It wasn't a, it shouldn't be a surprise to them if they looked at my Instagram, if they looked at my Twitter,

if they looked at anything. But for the family, they didn't know that their daughter would make it that far. I never thought about it like that. I just assumed that... That's good. Then that's your answer.

That's great. No, I just assumed that everyone was cool with it because it's not like, hey, surprise dad, like Matt's here. Like, they knew that their daughter was going on The Bachelor and then I was the Bachelor. So like, I would be shocked if someone's parents weren't cool with it

because I'm like, yo. Well, and this is maybe this is what comes with you have never doing the show before. You never done it. Most parents do not think. They think this is a silly show. They can't believe that you're going on it. They don't think that it works. And so when you make it to the final four where they're like, oh my God, now I have to become a part of this, they don't get it. They don't understand it. It's very surreal to them. They ask a lot of questions. Like, even though, they're like, is this real? And so I guess my thing is, yes, they knew that they were coming on

your season. But nobody believes that their daughter one is going to make it that far and two, when their daughter is like, no, I love him or I'm falling for him and then it's like, wait, okay, wait, we have had to have a different talk. So that's why I'm asking

you, is that? When you ask that, it's a completely different answer. So from a race standpoint, like, thank God I didn't have any awkward or I didn't have to understand. But from a standpoint of like people's parents thinking this was silly and like,

there being some sort of like coded language like when we're all together there was a there was that and that threw me off because like again it may be my like me being naive to the process but like like like in that moment i'm so confused as to like like like when you it's like going into a water park in your shock that you get wet it's like you knew coming on here that like i would hope that you had enough trust in the redeeming qualities in your daughter that she would make it to this point. And now over here, like, you're confused that, like, she's here. It's like a, it's an oxymot. It's like, it's like, I was so confused because it was like they, it was news to them that were here. It was the first. Yeah. It's so foreign. Yeah. It's so foreign to people, you know,

to the point where like I almost didn't have words for some of the conversation because I'm like is that is that a trick question? Like what do you mean? Like what do you mean? I'm confused. So hometowns is going to be popping.

Hometown is going to be great. Hopefully it's a juicing one. So it's no secret that obviously you're friends with Tyler, you're friends with Hannah. You did talk to Rachel, myself, some of the past leads, who gave you, well, I guess I shouldn't say who, but what was some of the best and some of the worst advice that you got from anyone that was already

affiliated with the show some way somehow that you got before coming on? To be honest with you, I personally don't think I got any bad advice because everything that someone told me happened at some point. And one of the conversations that I had, Rachel, literally the last day before my home was taken was just be yourself don't have any regret don't try to please everybody because you can't

FETs it up I didn't say that me and Rachel had a great conversation and when I was in those moments of just like what am I doing or like super frustrated

I would fall back on those and be like okay I remember having this conversation and I'm not the only one who wanted to it. So, Matt, I have to say, because I face-timed with you for, what, maybe 30, 45 minutes before you left. And you seemed, I don't know if it's because you were a little nervous and you knew what you were getting yourself into very soon. And there was a lot of just that pressure that we talked about and stress. But you are so enjoyable to have on right now.

Thank you. Yeah. Did he freeze again? No, I didn't know how to take that. I appreciate it. Yeah, no, I just like, like, it was, I just try to be, like, I don't want to give, like, a fake account of, like, who I am in my experience. Like, I just, there's no, there's nothing I get out of not being authentic.

And, like, that's, it was something that the show helped me with, to be honest with you. I felt like I was in two months of therapy. Like, I was just, I'm having to talk. about my feelings, things that I'm not comfortable doing. So, like, you just, it's draining to not, to dodge that. And it's not helpful to not talk about it. So, like, the more comfortable I got sharing things that I wasn't comfortable

and talking about my imperfections, like, well, I got just being real and, like, not really caring how I came off, as long as I'm not offending somebody, but, like, I'm not a Harvard-educated physicist, you know what I mean? I'm myself and like I hold myself to a high standard but like at the end of the day like I'm cute so I want to ask this too because that's such a good segue so I feel like for so many of well I would say both leads and contestants coming off of the show you find your voice a little bit more and you find what makes you you and what you know really fuels you and so at least for me personally when I got off the show I felt like I finally you know had my voice and I felt like I finally you know had my voice

and I felt empowered and strong and just so much more me in this very weird, chaotic way. Did you feel that? And like, was there, like, now that you've gone through filming and the fact that it's airing, like, how do you feel? And what is like one of the biggest takeaways that you've learned while you did the show? Well, two things. One, I had to stop myself from like being, like, like, for instance, when I got back, I, like, saw my best friends.

I'm like, how are y'all doing? Like, we're doing good. I'm, I know, really, how are you doing? Like, you said good. Like, why are you good? Like, I'm, like, still in the show mode. Like, I'm, like, trying to have these, like, deep conversations because that's what I'm doing. So, like, my biggest takeaway was just, like, being comfortable having uncomfortable

conversations and being comfortable having, like, coming into my voice and just, like, that was really the biggest takeaway for me. digging more for the answers of why people feel the way that they do other than just very surface level and that's more so from me like because like good like how are you doing I'm straight like that's not an answer like what is straight me like when someone asked me how I'm doing I'm like yo I'm upset because I had this lady cut me off at work today and it made me upset you know what I mean it's like put in context to like my feelings so that people understand where I'm coming from I was just feeling like good, bad, okay? Because that doesn't help anything.

And I'm trying to be a better communicator because it's something I've struggled with in past. You know what I mean? We need almond to be that way, right? Well, this is how I know that you grew from the show because before you left when I talked to you, I said, like, what are you looking for? And your response at that point was somebody I can kick it with.

And I was like, we're going to need more. We're going to need more than that. You can't just tell America, I want somebody I can kick it with. And so now look at you, man. Hey, listen, I'm a refined man. And being able to kick it with somebody is still one of the quality stuff. It's still important.

But I feel like to learn more. All that lets us know that you're a refined man is, one, you had some good fantasy sweets. And two, you found somebody. You found somebody. Because can nothing refine you in the proper way like a good woman can? So thank you for letting us know in a very indirect way that you are happy and you have found someone. We don't know in what capacity that was. We will take that and we will wait and see who it is that you chose.

But how were the Fantasy Suite? How many did you have one, two, three? Hannah got four. I'm still upset about that. Oh, you know what? Fantasy Suite? That's like what? That's like two months.

So in two months, we're going to dive into that. You said you talked to Sean Lowe before. Did you pull a Sean Lowe because he didn't have any? That's what I'm told. That's a great question. You can at least tell us, was there a Fantasy Suite week? Well, it is part of the process, right? If you had to have a theme song for each week, what would it have been for Week 9,

which is typically the Fantasy Suite Week? That's what I was going to say. That's easy. Always and Forever by Price and Tiller. Okay. For those of you who don't know, Bryson Tiller is an R&B. It's bedroom music, basically.

So there we go. There we go. There we go. Thank you. Thank you for that. I feel like week nine, Fancy Sweet Week and Home Town Week. When you're really hooking us in here, Matt.

Everyone don't listen to Anniversary, Bryce and Tiller. Then that'll set the tone for that week. All right, Matt. If you have listened to this podcast, you know that we ask every guest we have on what the rose and the thorn of the season was, but obviously since we've only now seen two episodes

up to this point, what was your rose and what was your thorn? The rose was easy. The rose was meeting all those women like one just because it exceeded any of my expectations. You know, like I was just pinching myself that I was fortunate enough

to have this group of women there. And like just the responsibility that comes with making sure that they feel comfortable they're getting the most out of this so that they can get the most out of me. And the thorn is when a special guest comes

to Nevercala. It better not be Heather. You better not be talking about Heather. We are pleased that we were able to have you on the podcast. It's been so much fun. We, Becca and I have been looking forward to having you on the podcast

to be able to talk with you not just about like your season and the women who are going to be on it, but about you to get to know who you are and why you were chosen and what it feels to be to be the first and to be chosen and how you're going to make your mark with all of this and let everybody know who Matthew, what's your middle name? Christian.

Of course it is. Matthew Christian James is. I'd like to close out in a prayer. I'm just kidding. I'm not even going to make a mockery of that because I'm a Christian. I'm a Christian too. I'm not making a mockery of that. I'm a Christian, too.

It just seemed fitting. It just seemed quite natural. You were hilarious. Okay, Matt, one thing Becca and I do before every season is that we go through the cast bios. It's one of our most fun things to do because we don't know anything about these women or men, depending on the season. So we went through all of your women. We know there are more to come. So I feel like we're at a very unfair advantage.

But from the 30 plus women that we went through, we came up with our top four. Now, in true Rachel and Becca fashion, we did not write them down. So we're going to go off pure memory and our happy hour listeners will hold us accountable. So I'll start with mine. I'm pretty sure I picked Kristen or I picked one of the black female attorneys. So it could have been Christian or Lauren. I think I picked Chelsea because I find her background intriguing and I met her before. Did not recognize her because she had hair, long hair when I met her.

So I didn't recognize her, but I picked Chelsea, I think, I think I picked Maggie and I picked Rachel, obviously, even though we all know I have an issue with how she spells her name. It's not biblical. And if I'm being totally honest, I don't remember anyone who I said besides Maggie. That's the only one that sucked out to me. There was a girl. You might have said Sarah. I feel like we were big on Sarah, but I could be maybe I said Sarah. There was one girl and her name, all I remember is her name started with an A.

And I said she was going far because she liked champagne and I think chicken wings or something. And that's my picture. Matt's like we didn't even get there. I said her home. Yeah. it was probably somebody when I say I'm always wrong it was definitely probably somebody you said home night one can you tell us if we're closed

did I mean did we? Oh you were big on I think I said a brie too I think you're set of Brie yeah you're big on Bray yeah I might have said Brie I don't remember but are we close I've never done this before but I'm going to give y'all again I'm probably going to get in trouble with it but it's worth it you ready we are an edge of our seats

the the woman that I picked ends up with the rose at the end she gets a that bottom of road I literally almost used the bathroom on myself I thought I would get a rose I would give her rose I at least

thought you would tell us one of the women we were we named about six she gets a rose You guys may know walked out just to hear this. Rebecca's like naming names and she's like, I, I picked it. And then she's like looking to see how I'm reacting. She's like, just going through names. Wait, okay.

Let's go. Abigail. Elena. Alicia. Amber. Let me tell you how to. Let me tell you. Let me tell you reading between the lines, reading between the lines.

This is all at her. Oh, okay. So she gets a rose and not a ring. Bet, thanks for the hint. Take that. And with that, we'll let you go. Wait, I want to get you brought up. I heard that.

Wait, Matt, before you head off and take your nice little bubble bath here, in one sentence, give us a teaser of what's to come this season. What people can expect who are tuning in is authenticity and the level of realness of the hadn't seen before. All right. And who do you end up with? You guys. I appreciate that.

All right. Matt, it's been fantastic. Thank you so much for doing this. Oh, my gosh. Becca, we've both talked to Matt outside of all of this, but it's so much fun to talk to him on the other side of his journey. And to see, as you said, well, he said, we're fine. You've already been able to point out the differences in the conversation you had with him before versus after.

I'm so excited for his season. I mean, I already was just because of the historic. nature of it, but then in talking to him, and the fact that he will not give us the tea that we want, I know. I am really pumped for his season. I am too. He gave us just enough to leave us wanting more. And now, obviously, like, of course we're going to watch the entire season for these recaps and to talk to the contestants, but it's so enjoyable being able to get to know somebody outside of the show. And, you know, when we talked to him months ago before he even started, I think he felt the pressure, he was nervous, he didn't have any idea of what to expect.

And so I think at that point when we first talked to him, he was a little bit more buttoned up. And the fact that he can kind of just, you know, feel more free and feel more of himself. And like he found his voice and like what, you know, drives him. I think it's so special. Yeah, I cannot wait, though, to see what goes down the rest of the season because obviously we've seen teasers. We've now talked to him. we've had only Abigail on, so I can't wait to have more of the girls on and to continue this this crazy journey with him. Absolutely. I want to say this before we close out, too, is, you know,

a lot of people send messages and, you know, have their critiques about Matt, but I really hope that you guys got a lot of insight into the pressure that he feels, what he went through before going through the season. It was very unprecedented in the way that they announced him, kind of what they put on him in such a quick way. And then, for him to navigate this this whole world, this new world as the first black bachelor. So I hope that you give him, you know,

a little bit, I hope you're a little bit more empathetic to him and you understand him better after listening to this podcast. Stop asking us to call him out. I'm telling you right now we're not going to do that. Well, let me watch the rest of the season. Let's just put it that way.

We might at some point. But this is hard. It's a very hard process. And he's navigating, a new territory. These are new waters that he's stepping into and it's not easy. So I hope that you guys enjoyed the podcast. Yeah. Yeah. And as always like everyone in life is just trying to find what fills their heart, what fills their soul. And he's just trying to find, you know, maybe this missing piece of the puzzle to his life. And so just as we continue to watch week by

week, have grace for not only Matt, but for all the contestants as well. I know it's easy to get so wrapped up in the drama and they she said she said and to have the favorites and the villains but at the end of the day everyone on the show is still a human they still have feelings they still have thoughts opinions hearts emotions and so just give everyone some grace and with that we are so happy that you guys joined us again today so thank you for hanging out and we're also so happy that we finally were able to talk to matt so we can't wait to watch the rest of his season and as always we'll be the first to sit down and talk to his girls so if you have any questions don't get to DM us. You know where to find us. If not, it's at Bachelor Happy Hour on Instagram and at Badge Happy Hour on both Facebook and Twitter. I love that Minnow is getting it popping in the background. She's so excited.

You guys, I enjoyed the podcast, but I'm ready to go outside. So listen, guys. Yeah, she needs her attention time now. Exactly. And that was Matt. Before we wrap this up, listen, last but not least, don't forget to subscribe to our podcast on Apple Podcast, Spotify, the Wondery app, or wherever you're listening. to this right now. Trust us, you don't want to miss an episode. This is definitely going to be

an epic season. Take care. Bye, guys. It's important that we just reassure people that they're not alone and there is help out there. The Good Stuff podcast, Season 2, takes a deep look into One Tribe Foundation, a non-profit fighting suicide in the veteran community. September is National Suicide Prevention Month, so join host Jacob and Ashley Schick as they bring you to the front lines of one tribe's mission one tribe save my life twice welcome to season two of the good stuff listen to the good stuff podcast on the iheart radio app apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast i'm dr scott barry coughman host of the psychology podcast here's a clip from an upcoming conversation about how to be a better you when you think about emotion regulation you're not

going to choose an adaptive strategy which is more effortful to use unless you think there's a good outcome avoidance is easier ignoring is easier denials easier complex problem solving takes effort listen to the psychology podcast on the iHeart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts hi my name is enya umanzor and i'm drew phillips and we run a podcast called emergency intercom if you're a crime junkie and you love crimes we're not the podcast for you but if you have unmedicated ADHD Oh, my God, perfect. And want to hear people with mental illness, psychobabble. Yes, yes.

Then Emergency Intercom is the podcast for you. Open your free IHeart Radio app. Search Emergency Intercom and listen now. This is an IHeart podcast.