Bachelor Happy Hour - How to Play Hard to Get | Golden Hour

Episode Date: August 20, 2026

Today on "Golden Hour," Kathy and Susan are back answering your questions. We kick things off getting into some Bachelor Nation news: what's the tea behind Kaity Biggar and Zack Shallcross not wearing their rings? Then, we get into our topic of the day: playing hard to get. What does that look like while you're dating, and more importantly, does it even work? We're answering! Then, we dive into your questions, and these are some tough cookies. Will a relationship ever last if you feel differently about having children? Is it a red flag that my boyfriend often talks about the girls before me? Tune in to hear this and so much more, and be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. I survived nine months in captivity, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files. Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable, abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced.

These are stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to the Survivor Files, with Elizabeth Smart on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. Pro Society is a weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for anyone who thinks pride and prejudice and love island to serve the same level of discourse. Each week, we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and pop culture with your favorite writers, book talk creators, and plenty of overthought opinions.

Yeah, I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. Listen to Pro Society on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinero, and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word Solita, trading the pity for possibility. Listen to Solita on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, this is Hayes-Davenport and Sean Clements. We host the podcast, Hollywood Handbook. Each week, we talk to someone in show business and try to help them with their careers and see what they have to offer us. Everyone has a good time, and no one gets mad at their publicists for letting them do our show. We've had a lot of great guests like Sarah Sherman, Adam Scott, Danny McBride, Ben Stillard and a lot of other big shots that wouldn't be where they are without us. Listen to Hollywood Handbook on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Nick Tutorough. You probably know me from NYPD Blue, the longest yard, or Spike Lease Black Klansman. And on my new podcast delivering happiness with Nick Totoro, I deliver pizza to a new guest. I've shared a slice with everyone from Seth Rollins. What are you doing? My belt. To Bill Burr. I don't think I've ever met somebody so exactly out of their mind as I am.

And now we even have more great guests coming up, including the great John Tuturo. It's called Happiness, delivering happiness. And many, many more. Open your free High Heart Radio app. Search Delivering Happiness with Nick Totoro. And listen now. Welcome back, everyone, to Golden Hour. Thank you so much for joining us.

I'm Susan. And I'm Kathy. And I don't know, we got, we got things to talk about today. First of all, you're going to be. getting rain and we're not. I just want to put that out there. Monsoons. We are burning up over here. It's 103 today. Right now. 1003. Yeah. That's Texas. I remember. I live there. I know. It's so hot. I'm ready for fall when it drops down to 85. I'm still enjoying summer and everybody's talking like it's, oh, it's almost over.

It's early, early August still for me. I like, I don't want it to end. I don't want it to You never want Summerdend. I'm telling you. But I've had a lot going on, Kathy. My emotions have been from way up high, good, to as low as you could get. Anything you want to share? Well, I think I shared with you before. My daughter is, they're starting a divorce, and my grandchildren are really suffering.

And anybody out there that's listening, you know what that's like. As a parent, you're only as happy as your unhappiest child. You know what I'm saying? Yep. It's not easy. It really isn't easy. It wears on you. Yeah. Well, here's hoping that, you know, they'll get it squared away. And because kids, I think, no one's asking my opinion, but I think kids are better. I don't think you ever stay married for the kids. I don't. No, you shouldn't stay. All right. Well, but let's get on better news. I was going to say, this is your news. Now we got to get into Bachelor Nation news. So the first one is my lovely neighbors who I adore. Katie Bigger and Zach Schallcross, who I now call her Katie Shalcross just to be difficult. But they reveal why they haven't worn wedding rings for quite some time. And of course, the story headline is always bigger than the actual story, which is they were having their rings resized.

And Katie has a marquee diamond. I saw it. So she got her ring on her first ring, you know, when she got engaged to Zach. the show. And then he decided to repurpose to her much like Kate. Yes, the rest of the young ones these days. Kelsey and Joey just did the same thing. So he gave, of course, acted an even bigger and more beautiful ring than she got on the show. And I guess he'd have the wrong size in it when he, when he ordered it for her. And so I think they were in Europe when he reproposed. But I've seen the ring. And it is glorious.

How romantic. Does he wear his? Yeah. I think they were both having them resized. And he was doing something different with his ring. I think he was adding something or whatever. They were just doing something a little bit different with their rings. But, you know, if anybody thinks that these two are not happily married, they moved into their new home.

I'm trying to get a date together where they can come over for dinner. Because, you know, we live in the same town. but they're talking about starting a family. I mean, they're going to have a lot of great news this year. Well, you know, we should have such a problem that our rings are being sized. You know, can I just say that? Yeah, well, I can tell you, I've had my ring sized twice, and it always goes bigger for my arthritic, nasty little fingers.

What else we got going on in the news? Well, wait. Now, you know, we had Juliana on our podcast just a little bit ago, and I know we were digging. Is there something going on with that relationship? with Mike, are you engaged? She would not tell, boom, headlines. Yeah, confirmed wedding plans admit ongoing engagement rumors. And it's so funny to hear her talk. She's saying like Mike is going to be the Bridezilla, not her. Yeah, because he does special, he's a special event planner. So he will be.

But here's, I have to tell you know, sometimes I'm a little bit of a sleuth. Juliana, By the way, Juliana, I think we've said this a million times, she grew up in my hometown, my sister knows her uncle. Giuliana, when you're listening to this, you've never gotten back to me about your uncle, but whatever. She posted a picture the other day in a dress, and she was twirling using a carousel. And I may or may not have stopped the video, and there's a ring on her left hand. Yes, yes, yes, yes. No, no, no. Do you remember she wouldn't say she was engaged?

She wouldn't tell us. Yeah, well, I think she is engaged. And, Juliana, I'm calling you out. If you don't want people to know, don't do videos of yourself with that ring showing on your hand. But I love that she said, I plan to bring you all along for the wedding ideas that may not be typical. And I love that because, you know, if you're an event planner, that's your job to make every event special. And how exciting. And he's in it.

It's his own wedding. You know everything is going to be special. I don't know where they're going to get married. but I can tell you she comes from a huge family and they'll all be their big Italian family. Yes, that's going to be a fun wedding, Kathy. So, yeah. The one I'm bringing you two at the end of this month is not Italian, so you can't even judge. Will there be cocktails?

There'll be plenty. It'll be fun. It'll be a blast. And who knows? Mr. Wright may be there waiting for me in his talks. We don't know. Okay. Okay.

Our last story, we have Debbie. Debbie. Okay, this, I have so much to say about this. Debbie, Debbie, Debbie, Debbie. shame, shame, shame. Debbie Seabirds reveals she almost got catfished in a dating scam and she's telling people to be aware. Wait, pause one second. Pause. Yeah. The word almost. Yeah. Almost. No, no, no. I'm struggling with the fact she even got, you know, he, the guy even got 10 seconds into it. Debbie, let me first say to you, I've told everyone on this podcast, I'm going to say it again. Never.

give a guy your phone number, anything that's traceable. Get yourself a Google phone number. And WhatsApp, you see, my friend, is attached to your phone number. So once you give that, he can trace you. If you use anything other than a Google phone number, you are traceable. So you realize, Kathy, you're one of very few that use a Google phone number. Well, guess what? I've never been catfished. I've never had a guy ask me for money. Given having your phone number doesn't mean that they're not going to do that. You're just lucky. You didn't stay online for years and years and years.

Listen, she said that he wanted to take it to telegram. I don't even know what that means. But here's what she wrote. I don't know what she meant. She said WhatsApp and Telegram. The only thing I get to give Telegram is to telegraph him some money. But she said there was only one picture of him. Come on, Debbie.

I love you. You're beautiful and you're smart. one picture in Italy and you and she goes and he was so good looking which I'm sorry Susan I'm hard-nosed about this. It gets you every time no it doesn't it never gets me and anyone if you are almost catfished by a guy

who has one picture who's asking you to go on to a different app and you're like oh he's so good looking I'm sure he's a nice guy I'm sorry wake up and smell the copy of this first red flag let's switch to this so we can chat yeah exactly and And so Debbie.

But maybe she wasn't used to being like she didn't know any better. I understand, but here's the thing for me. We are of an age where we are responsible for our own safety at this point. You know, we particularly we don't have men, you know, walking the sidewalk for us. We are responsible for our own safety. If something doesn't smell right on the Internet like, hey, can we take this on a different platform chat? Right there, Debbie. almost catfish it would have been sionara good bye see you and in fact i have a little story that i

wasn't planning on telling but i'm going to i had a guy reach out to me i think i told you this susan but this goes along with this i had a guy reach out to me a few weeks ago on facebook we had some mutual friends and all his pictures i verified him he was right but we were talking and he wanted to on, you know, on a different, like to my phone. I said, no, no, we're good here. Let's just chat for a little bit longer. And then I'll give you my phone number. Literally the next time we chatted, maybe the third time, he asked me what I was wearing. Oh. Wait, wait. I burst out laughing. I texted back just for giggles. Tell me why you're asking. I'd love to know. And he said, because I haven't heard your voice yet and I kind of want to put a vision of face and I look and I wrote back you have a face

all the pictures that are on Facebook and then you know what I did block and delete so that I wasn't almost catfished like when something doesn't seem right it's not we are responsible maybe just maybe you're smarter than the average bear I'm telling you okay well this is my PSA go online and try to date and they get caught up for a second in a nice picture. She's not thinking, boom, boom, boom. Start thinking. It just goes right down that rabbit hole. I hear you, but I'm saying, Susan, this is the PSA for today.

We as women, as single women, as adult women, were at a certain station in life. There's people out there. I get texts all the time from 30, 40-year-olds saying, oh, you're beautiful. I'd love to have a relation with you know what I do? I don't answer them. I block them. We are responsible. So if there's one picture of a guy and they're usually a little hazy

because they've taken that picture, they've hijacked that picture from, you know, a different site, it is up to us to not, quote, go down a rabbit hole and say, oh, but he was so good looking. Debbie, I love you. Call me. I'll give you some other safety tips. And think twice before. Just pause before you react. And you know what?

a lot of us have been on these and that's the way of the world. But isn't it a shame? Isn't it a shame that there's that many ugly people out there that do things like this? Susan, the list is very long. The list is very long of things that are a shame. The IRS wants their money every year. I've got to pay real estate taxes. I've got to get my car oil change. There's a lot of sad things out there. I just wrote that check today for the school taxes. It killed me. So moving right along. Yeah, let's move on. When I was 14 years old, I was kidnapped and held captive for nine months.

I survived, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files. I just remember this low, taunting voice next to my ear saying, shut up, don't say anything. Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable. I knew if he woke up, without a doubt, he was going to hurt me. I started feeling that there was someone at the end of my bed, and I just started screaming. They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. But these aren't stories about what's taken from them.

There's stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. This is Prose Society, the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought daughters, pop culture obsessives, and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse. I'm Eli Rallo, and every week we're connecting the dots. between books, the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having. I'm going to have to look up this story.

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I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinheiro, and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else. first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word solita, trading the pity for possibility. Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people and they were like, you smiled at us. Not a lot of people smile around here. It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your

mind, or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip. I hope you listen to Solita on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Hoda Kotbby, host of the podcast Joy 101 with Hoda Kotby. If you know me, you know, I'm always searching for inspiration and useful tools to maximize joy. So this podcast lets us uncover those things together through meaningful conversations with fascinating people. Like when my friend Henry Winkler offers you. advice to aspiring actors and really anybody hoping to stand out. You're not hired just to fill time and space.

You're hired to fill the space with you. You have something in your guts. You go with it. And Sean Johnson recalled the moment she realized her now husband, Andrew, was the one. He was just so unapologetically himself and knew nothing of Hollywood. He hadn't been on a plane before without his family. It was so pure.

Listen to Joy 101 with Hoda Kotby on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Our town is small taters by most standards, right? But to the people who grew up here, it's everything. What happens when a quiet Tennessee town becomes the front line in a battle over the future of America? Developers with right-wing ties have purchased hundreds of acres of land in the area. The first thing you see when it pops up is pioneers in Appalachia. But they weren't just planning houses. We need cities on a shining hill that exemplify and embody the Christian way of life.

Stop right there. Is that normal? A podcast about what happens when a small town becomes the site of a social experiment. God need men to rule. Great. And decides to fight back. Do not use my hard work to sell your bull. They're not just opposing what's being planned for here. Our hometown is not a test tube. feel like they're standing in opposition to an entire administration.

Guess you didn't move in on a bunch of dumb hillbillies now, did you? Listen to Our Town on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Good one for you. Has anybody ever, I wish I could, played hard to get. You know what they say in the rule of rules, you know. Don't be so available. Just pause. Make them chase you. I don't know how to do that. I never did. But, that's what we're going to talk about today playing hard to get well wait a second first let me ask you i know the answer have you ever played hard to get no she said definitively no ever i said not the last okay so i played hard to get when i was younger and you know it worked how young eighth grade like in high

school no in high school when you know i had a couple of boyfriends in high school and i played hard to get How did you play hard to get? What did you do? I just, you know, like they would call me. I wouldn't answer. That kind of stuff. Say, oh, you know, I was busy. I had more game then than I do now for God's six.

But let me stop you for a second. And you said that because you really weren't interested in them. Oh, no, I really was interested. I really was interested. But when we, when I was younger, people always said, you know, play hard to get. You'll get the guy if you do. Now we've got all these things like three day rule. Don't call them back for three days.

Don't answer the text for three days. Well, let me say to you, I got a lecture from my daughter the other day. A guy that I had seen a few times came down ill. And I said, we just were texting. He said he was ill. He was canceling something. And I said, oh, I'm so sorry to hear that. Can I bring you some soup or something?

I can just leave it. My daughter had apoplexy. She goes, Mom, he has not earned the right for you to take care of him yet. And I said to my daughter, Caitlin, I'm a nice person. I bring soup to friends. I think that's a nice gesture. Well, I took help for it. She said, now you're, and you know what?

She might be right. I haven't heard from him since then. So who knows? But I think that I hate playing games and some people say, oh, you know, it adds mystery. It makes you look more mysterious if you do that. You don't want to come across to available and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Just say, oh, no, I can. I'm busy, but I can maybe next week or something.

No. I never understood it because why would I put that off if I am interested? To me, that's a game. I don't know, but I was talking to our... I agree with you. I don't either, but it hasn't worked well for me recently. I was talking to C.K. About it, my good buddy C.K., and he was like, Kathy, you got to play the game.

You got to play the game. That's a man saying it. He did, but then he told me he doesn't play games. I was like, you're sending mixed messages here, CK. I don't know. All I know is that if the men that have been really interested in me, it didn't matter if I didn't answer the phone or texted right back, they were really interested. And, and the men, if you get a, if you get a text, do you pause, like make them wait a little?

A little. I don't answer right back, but you know, maybe an hour. But you're conscious of it is my question. Yes. I bet you be an hour or two, but not, I don't wait two or three days. Here's my philosophy on playing hard to get. I think that if the guy is into you, the games don't matter. if he's not that into you,

then you can try playing games, but he's just not that into you. And the role's the same thing. I'm telling you, you and are singing the same song. I think that when you're younger and you're first learning out to date, you know, when we were in the 60s and we were kids and we were dating,

I think then it was learning how to date and I think then you wanted to be seen as really special. You wanted that guy. I think that's, if you will, the school of dating that we all went through. Well, do you think some of it's mysterious or they're playing? I'm about as mysterious as a lead pipe, so I have no idea. But I do think some women I've known, they say that.

They'll say, you know, I want to be a little mysterious. I want to be a little bit, you know, they're not sure what's coming. They have to, you know, keep them guessing, keep them on their toes. I read the books. They all say to do it. So how about if you go on a date and the man does not reach out for three days? Do you think that's too long after going out on a date? So this happened to me.

And I said to the guy. You will kick him right to the curve. You haven't heard from him. No, I didn't kick him to the curve. But when we had our second date, I said, I was surprised to hear from you. And he said, why? And I said, I didn't hear from you for like four days after our date. And he goes, oh, God, no, I was just so busy working.

a great time. And we had a great second date. Now, I haven't heard from him again. So, but weren't you feeling, weren't you feeling that insecure kind of moment like, oh, I thought we had a good time. I really thought he reached out. It wasn't insecurity. It was not insecurity, Susan. I felt like, WTF. It was like WTF. Okay. You know, you said, again, I'm, I'm going to have this tattooed on my forehead next week. Watch what a man does. Don't listen to what he says. And I, and so, you know, this guy can tell me all day long how pretty I am, how interesting I am,

how much funny he has, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But if you're not hearing from him, if he's not, you know, if taking out the trash is taking up his time more than sending me a text. Well, you answered and you went on a second date. That was three days you waited, so.

Right, but I'm saying. What's your limit? You know, honestly, I can tell you, I'm, but I know, I'm not hard. I know I come across as a hard, tough woman. I'm not, I'm a realist. It's why I have a Google phone number.

I don't mess around deal with problems. You are hard and tough. Yes, you are. No, I'm not. I'm not. I look that way. I'm a, I'm a, if I care about someone, a guy. No, I'm not saying that.

I'm not saying. I'm jelly in his hands. Of course. Well, so I'm not hard and tough. It was three days and you're usually you, as you said, you were WTF and then boom, he calls or attack. No, I'm, I WTF because his actions belied his words. His words were, oh my gosh, you're wonderful, you're beautiful, you're so smart. I haven't dated a woman is smarter. You're dating, they, date, oh, really? Because like I said, you must be having a great time

watching the grass grow or backwashing your swimming pool because you haven't been reaching out to me. And you said that to him? No, because I, here's what happens to me. I'm very different from you, Susan. And I don't know, like my standard for me, not for everyone, I am very intentional about what I say and do. So if he reaches- That's why I'm asking these questions. Yeah, so if he reaches back out to me, I'll wait the same couple hours. I happen to be going out of town.

And I'm going to say, oh, sorry, I'm going to be out of town for the week. I'm not going to say, but I'll be back next, whatever. In other words, I start building up the fence. I was open. Wait, let me finish. My heart was open. Now I'm not sure I can trust you. So now, if you're interested, you've got to earn it back. And he probably doesn't want to and that's fine. Now, for me, say I'm going to reverse the role, okay? Say somebody's doing that to me. And that's how he answered me if I was asking. And he didn't leave it open that, but I will be back. That would give me, okay, well, maybe we'll do it when you get back. But when you dead it out. like that and just I'm going to be out of town this week. That sounds to me, and I know we shouldn't assume, but that would be my first thought would be, well, he's not interested. Well, fair enough. I could say, yeah, okay, I could say, oh, sorry, I'm going to be out of town this week, but next week I have a few open days, something like that. I'd be, what I'm not going to say is I'll

be back at 6 o'clock on Sunday night and I'm available Monday at noon. You can pick me up. Yeah, no. don't be too easy. And I, I, you know, people say if you're too available and, you know, you're too eager, you hurt your chances to get the guy. If you believe it. Well, I got to say to you, if it's true, I'm not going to get the guy. And I'm okay with it because I'm not.

Susan, it's the same reason I don't lie about my age. Yeah. Or how my husband die. I don't lie. Because if you lie about that, what else you're going to lie about? And so... Do you think back in the day, like when people did it then, and we heard all those sayings, you know, if you're too available, they think you don't have a life or, you know, you don't have anything else going on. People would say, no, I had to wash my hair.

Right. Like, are you serious me? Oh, no, that used to be a thing. My sister. I know. I mean, I will tell you, I had two sisters that were very popular in high school and they literally, they just ran through those guys and they did that kind of stuff. You know, they just were like, Well, I think they have something to go on. I'm sorry at our age, Susan, if we're going to flip our hair, but you can't. I'm going to play hard to get it. 69 years old. There you go.

I'm going to miss it all together. I, you know, like I said, my daughter said, mom, you're being too interested. You should look less interested. And I said to her, Caitlin, I, first of all, as you well know, I am very picky about who I'll go out with. because I don't waste time, you know. I'm not dating guys on the internet who are dressed in United States, naval uniforms, pretending that he lives in Italy. 90-day fiancé for that one.

Yeah, I'm not doing that. And so if pretending, if I can't be myself, if I can't show someone I'm interested and have them not run away, well, then he's not meant for me. But you see, I'm secure in who I'm. I am, and I think you are as well. I don't, I don't go quite. That's why I don't play that game.

Yes. And I don't quite. If I'm interested, I'm all in. I'm interested. Right. So I don't know. I'm going to tell the truth. I'm busy.

I never played the game. Yeah. I guess, I guess for me, the weird thing has been the guys that have been really interested in me. And I thought this guy really was. The vibe was he was. It didn't matter if I answer the phone or didn't answer the phone. They were calling an hour later, hey, are you okay?

You didn't pick up. Like they were chasing me, whether I answered the phone or didn't answer the phone. They'd call me the next morning. They would text. It was like they were all in quickly. And it didn't matter. But it didn't matter. I call that being real.

And what I read and what I hear today in the world, you can't, you shouldn't be real. You should be a little mysterious. Make them wonder. Make them want you. Okay. So what's the most important, Susan, being. real, being confident, being mysterious. Confident and real. I mean, I agree with you. But, you know, here we sit. So let's try it a different way. So I think we should be mysterious, not answer the

phone for, you know, 10 days. Do you know, Kathy, I got to tell you a story. This is good. All right. I tried. I tried. I read all these books. I listened to all my friends. Don't be so available when I would have a phone number and I would really like we went out a couple times and then he wouldn't call for a little bit and I was so anxious I wanted to text I would delete their number I would give it to my cousin and say you hold it in case I ever need it but I didn't trust myself because when I think about somebody that I like I'm going to text them I'm just going to say hey I'm thinking about you or whatever so I would delete the number to try to play this mystery game. Okay, so wait, the guy that we're talking about with me,

where I've not heard from him, you would reach out again and text him and say, hey, whatever. If you really had a good time and you thought there could be something between you, he reached out the first two times, then yes, I would. No, no, no, after he said he was sick. Yes, I would have checked up on him the following day and said, how are you feeling? Are you better, you know?

No, no. To me, that seems like my daughter would have decapitated me if I done that. you're thoughtful. But to me that I would think, well, she don't even care. If you told somebody you were sick and you couldn't go, whatever, and they text you the next day, just check in and see how you feel like I do with you or you do with me. That is thought. That's nice. I don't disagree. It's thoughtful. I just don't think people, I don't think it necessarily means anything to him or to some men. And I will tell you back, I am assuming. But what I, what the last text was when I offered to bring him something. He said, no, I'm good. Thanks so much. I'll let you know if I need something. That told me,

leave it alone. Well, he didn't need anything, but you could just check in. And to me, checking in to see, hey, just check it in, see how you're feeling, hope you're feeling better. That is not more than a caring individual. Listen, I agree. But unless he was dead, God forbid, and he's recuperated, I haven't heard from him. and I'm a very logical person. So I think about his intentions. His intentions were either just to go out and have a couple of dates or he's got a stable of them, you know, of women,

and I'm in the next round. You know, my number hasn't come back up again yet. Or he's not interested because if he's well, if he's better. If he was interested, it would have reached out. He would have reached out. How long is it past the three days since that? Oh, yeah. Yeah.

And so I'm. Okay, I'm okay with that. I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm a little surprised based on what he said. But, you know, I read these things that say women, they, they play hard to get. They, they set these, you know, traps for men to try to coax them into calling them or, or getting another date with them. And I'm like, what that sounds like a lot of work for nothing. But, but here's what I really truly believe. I need to be more like you.

I'm sorry. Here's what I truly believe. Women will go, I don't understand. I don't understand what happened. We had such a great time. Ladies, don't overthink it. He's just not that into you. And I'm saying that to myself too.

Nothing happened. That's the point. Nothing is happening. It's hard to hear, hard to feel, you know what? It may be, but I think that it's going to serve me better believing that way and believe me if I hear from him, I'm not going to, there's not going to be any retribution.

Well, I'm not going out with you. Did you ever chase a guy? Oh, just, not really. I never had to chase a guy. Just one guy, the guy, my love of my life in high school, I, after we broke up, I was really, I kept breaking up with him and he kept taking me back. I was an idiot.

And then he didn't take me back. And then it was the chase was on to get him. That's when I learned my lesson. See, that was like I was going to make him, you know, that's what I mean about high school stuff, you know. All right, I can't handle this dating talk anymore. I want to move on. We are going to do our Golden Hotline, which if you loved Susan's in my opinion on playing hard to get, you're going to love our expert golden advice today. I want to know how many out there really do the hard to get game.

If you do, just send me some notes. Yes, you know what? I want to know. I want to know. We always say, you know, reach out on bachelornation.com slash golden hour. Yeah. That's what you want you to do. We want to hear.

But you make it personal right to us. Like, I want the tips. I want to know how to do it. You're going to have to spell it out for me, black and white for me to try. And if it fails, I'm going to hate you for it. And if Susan plays hard to get, I'm here to tell you, I'm going to make homemade French dinner for everyone in the world. Oh, my God.

And I don't, all right, go on. Let's do the first question. All right. Let's get to our first one. When I was 14 years old, I was kidnapped and held captive for nine months. I survived, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files. I just remember this low, taunting voice next to my ear saying, shut up, don't say anything.

Every week, I'm with Survivor's. who lived through the unthinkable. I knew if he woke up, without a doubt, he was going to hurt me. I started feeling that there was someone at the end of my bed, and I just started screaming. They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. But these aren't stories about what's taken from them.

They're stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to the Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the IHeart Radio app. Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. This is Prose Society, the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought daughters, pop culture obsessives, and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island

deserve the same level of discourse. I'm Eli Rallo and every week we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having. I'm going to have to look up this story. I'm obsessed. From bestselling authors and your favorite book talk creators to the latest pop culture moments, nothing is off the table.

It's like if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters, then that is a Trojan horse. Whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations, or a community of readers who love to think a little too much, you're in the right place.

Listen to pro society on the Iheart radio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. See you between the pages. On the new podcast Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinero, and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word Solita.

the pity for possibility. Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people, and they were like, you smiled at us. Not a lot of people smile around here. It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is, and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind, or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip,

I hope you listen to Solita on the IHeart Radio. app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Hoda Kottebe, host of the podcast, Joy 101 with Hoda Kotbby. If you know me, you know, I'm always searching for inspiration and useful tools to maximize joy. So this podcast lets us uncover those things together through meaningful conversations with fascinating people. Like when my friend Henry Winkler offered advice to aspiring actors and really anybody hoping

to stand out. You're not hired just to fill time and space. You're hired to fill the space with you. You have something in your guts. You go with it. And Sean Johnson recalled the moment she realized her now husband, Andrew, was the one. He was just so unapologetically himself and knew nothing of Hollywood. He hadn't been on a plane before without his family.

It was so pure. Listen to Joy 101 with Hoda Kotby on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast. or wherever you get your podcasts. Our town is small taters by most standards, right? But to the people who grew up here, it's everything. What happens when a quiet Tennessee town becomes the front line in a battle over the future of America? Developers with right-wing ties have purchased hundreds of acres of land in the area.

The first thing you see when it pops up is pioneers in Appalachia. But they weren't just planning houses. We need cities on a shining hill that exemplify and embody the Christian way of life. Stop right there. Is that normal? A podcast about what happens when a small town

becomes the site of a social experiment. God need men to rule. Great. And decides to fight back. Do not use my hard work to sell your bull-h-h-h- They're not just opposing what's being planned for here.

Our hometown is not a test tube. They feel like they're standing in opposition to an entire administration. Guess you didn't move in on a bunch of dumb hillbillies now, did you? Listen to Our Town on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is from Katie from Portland. Hi, ladies.

I met the most amazing man last year, and I've honestly never felt this compatible with someone before. We have the same sense of humor, the same values, and we genuinely make each other happy. That's so nice. The only issue is that he absolutely wants to. children and I don't think I do. We keep hoping one of us will change our mind, but neither of us have. We love each other enough that neither one of us wants to walk away, but we're also scared. We're delaying the inevitable. Is love enough when your future goals don't line up? That's a big one. No, this is so easy. This is so easy. If

How so? Again, to me, this answer just came right to my brain. Katie, if your boyfriend wants children and he knows he wants children and you know you don't, you have two choices. You can have one and resent the fact that you had one when you didn't want one, and or you could get married hoping you'll change your mind or stick with him hoping you change your mind. Here's the problem. if you don't change your mind, your core values are never going to line up.

That is family values are not going to align with your boyfriend. So when you say we're scared, we're delaying the inevitable, you're already telling me that the inevitable means you are prepared to walk away, or he is, or you both are. So if you are that adamant, if you're that rigid, if you are so resolute in the fact that you do not want children, then let him go because that's not fair to a man who wants to have children. Let him go. If it is inevitable because you're not going to change your mind, let them go.

What do you think, for me, when I read it, she said she don't think that she doesn't sound 100%. That relationship sounds so perfect, but it's once again the C word, the communication word. You have to have the down to the ditty gritty bear. They have. What if we get married and we're loving our life and I decide there's no way. Will you resent me? Will you want to end that marriage? I don't think you can know that.

I don't think you can know that. I think someone, she said, I don't think I do. I don't think. We keep hoping, but here's what happens. We keep hoping one of us will change our mind. But we haven't. Sure, the possibility is there that one of you will change your mind. So keep dating and see if being a mother grows on you.

Yeah, it may. I don't know how old she is. She doesn't say. But a lot of women know for a fact that they don't want children, period. Yeah. And I respect that. I do. So do I.

But I also respect the fact that the man does. I think it is more likely that you, Katie, may change your mind. Yeah. When a guy wants kids, he wants kids. And so I would encourage you, I don't know how old you are. But, you know, if you're in your 30s and he's in his 30s, he's going to want a family and he can't date you and have a family so you know that's one of those hard things i love you like we talked about in another podcast love is not enough katy if your

values don't align it's not likely going to be a good marriage and a lot of times kathy it's the men that decide they don't want children and women you know they do it the dirty way they get pregnant anyhow you know it's yeah it's something that's big it is big and you know what you're right katie to to ask that question yeah and i really think he should really talk a lot about it and do some self-searching yeah and you're adamant about it then you got to be straight with them you got to be straight and that means letting him go so he can find the woman that wants to have a family with him it's a hard thing but that's goals that's when you we talked in another podcast susan about is love enough and you said yes it isn't i said no it isn't and this is a perfect example when

love is not enough. I truly believe that Katie and her boyfriend love each other, but the resentment will grow. He will want a family. So let us know Katie, good one. One's not so bad. Don't be having multiples. No, Jesus. I can't believe you just told a woman who doesn't want children to have children. I'm moving on. Just have one. Make them happy. They sound so perfect together. And yeah, Katie, when you have it and you're not real happy having it, send it to Susan because she'd love, at 69, she'd love to raise them. another child. I mean, why not? It's only one. Katie, good luck, honey. All right. This next question, oh, this is from an anonymous, we love anonymous questions. Yep. Okay, I've been seen someone for about

six months. The only thing that makes me uncomfortable is how often he talks to the girl before me. He insists they're just friends now and that there's absolutely nothing romantic left between them. Would this bother you too? Bother me? Bother me? Bother me anonymous? Hell yeah. Bother me? It would be deleted. she'd be gone out of his, out of his contacts, or I would say, hey, listen, you know what, I think you might want to reconsider getting engaged, re-engaged to her. I wouldn't put up with that for five minutes. Ask me where I really stand. Seriously, you can't let go.

I mean, you have to talk to them every week. I wonder who broke up with who, who ended the engagement. And do you think I care? I would, I could care less. I mean, this comes under the category of when something, smells like a dog, looks like a dog. It's a dog. It's a dog. And she says it makes me uncomfortable. It would piss me off, okay? Forget uncomfortable. That would just piss me all. But you know what? Here's the thing that I think a lot of women in relationships, you know, she thinks he could be the one.

So she's trying to play the docile sweet. Don't try so hard now. This is called a boundary. And it's a healthy boundary to set. And so don't sit there saying, am I being insecure? Insecure would be if they ran into each other and he was nice to her and they chat it for a minute or that I get. That's insecurity that you can't stand one time. But this is going on weekly? Like they just hang out and text each other? No.

Okay, Susan. You get me or? I'm a hard nose bitch. I really, I'm hard. that would not make me insecure at all. I'd be sitting there going, I'm a queen. I'm a queen. I have a friend who says to me,

climb to the top of the mountain and stand there and wait for the guy to come to you. Don't be, don't be, you know, don't be repelling down the mountain, lowering your standards. This girl, honey, you do not need to be insecure about one little thing. What he's doing is bad behavior

and I wouldn't put up with it for two seconds, not even two seconds. So maybe I am hard, Susan. He thinks he could be the one. I wouldn't put up with it. I mean, does he think it? Oh, that's a great question. He's still talking to his ex.

I don't know about that. By the way, they've won't sell yourself short, anonymous. Just don't. Okay, let me say one other thing. You're absolutely right, Susan. We don't know if he thinks she's the one. The other thing is they've only been dating for six months. Six months.

And what do I tell you, Susan? The first six months of dating, this is Kathy's, the first six months of dating anybody's the honeymoon. Everything is wonderful. He doesn't burp. He puts his socks in the hamperer. The sex is great. He brings you flowers.

That's for the first six months. Usually never a fight. Between six and 18 months is when the real person starts to show who he or she is. Look at this guy at 18 months. At 18 months, and Susan, you can vouch for this, can't you? At 18 months, what you say. see is what you get. So if you don't like what you see in six months, I am living proof. I am living through it. Yes. And that will take up on yet another podcast. So that's so that, you know,

that's my advice to you. You're rushing things at six months. You can't possibly know if he's the one. No, you can't. I love this part where gals Google it. Kathy, I actually understand this week. I love it. All I can say is I love answering these questions. I know I seem hard sometimes. But I think you and I do give pretty darn good golden advice. So if you want some of our advice, please, please, opinions, questions, thoughts, send them all to bachelornation.com slash golden hour. We really want to hear from you. Remember I told you? I actually know some of the, I understand the gals, Google it now. Oh, you're kidding. Wait, the world's coming to an end. What's the first one? Okay. The first one is body tea. And that's that.

means a physically attractive fit or sexy body. It's used as a direct compliment to say someone's body looks amazing. So like her body tea, that's a short way of saying. Her body is tea. Using tea to mean hot or good looking. Now I'm just going to go out on a limb here and say, I have never heard anyone talk about my body tea. The only tea that they're talking about with me is English morning breakfast tea. That's it. English breakfast tea. I mean, seriously, a body tea. I mean.

They use that words, spill the tea. Give me the tea. Give me the tea. That sounds like some of the ones we've had over time. I've questioned you. Like, please explain it. The next one is snatched. Now that even sounds like, yeah, she's hot.

She's got it together. That outfit looks so good, right? Snatch being very stylish, attractive, or on point. similar to saying an outfit or makeup looks flawless. Okay. I've heard it used. I heard that word meaning something else when we were younger. What?

Well, body part for women. Snatched? Yep. No, without past tense. Snatched. Of course. Well, that just shows you how pop culture is changing. isn't it?

Well, like sharp features, like a sharp lifted face or the makeup, you know, when the makeup artists do us and we feel like supermodels and they're posed for that picture. She's snatched. Have you ever, ever said to me, Kathy, you look snatched? Ever? I would vomit if you did. No, but I was, if I'm at New York Fashion Week or Milan and Paris Fashion Week, I'd say, damn. They're snatched.

that but we're old we don't use those words i'm sorry wait a minute i have a sharp i have a good jawline sharp cheekbones you and your daughter both you both same exact jaw so so i'm snatched i'm i'm gonna stay with that you know here's a thing i have pictures of me and i could say i was snatched for that moment there you go it was a good angle it was in the in the moment great photographer here's what i'm going to say to you it's it's so hard to learn these words to spend the time learning the music know why? Because tomorrow they're going to be different. I'm not only that. It's not even learning them. I won't probably use them. But if I hear them, at least I'll know what the hell they're talking about. I won't seem like.

I want to know who comes up with them. Seriously. I always come back to the movie, clueless. Isn't it clueless where, you know, that's not a word, whatever. Fetch, fetch. That's not a thing. That's when the dog got the ball. Right. Exactly. Go, fetch. the ball. It wasn't fat. But that, I love that line in the movie because I'm always like, who comes up with this. I'm going to stop you. It was, um, mean girls. Damn it. I knew it was mean girls. Uh, remember she says fetch? It's so fetch. And she goes, it's not fetch. That's not a thing.

I mean, I'm like, I say words that my grandchildren look at me. I go, do you even know what that means? And they go, no, Mimi. Like, what? What is that? Like, what do you mean? Something so normal for me. Like describing. something or I can't think of it off the top of my head. And I'll, you know, it's cool. They go, oh. Oh, yeah, awesome, cool. Those, I mean, those are archaic at this point, but I just think that people, I don't

know where these come up, where they come up with these titles, but here's what I'm telling you, I'm personally, I'm not going to bother spending too much time learning them. Because next week, it's going to be a whole new set next year. It's going to be a whole new, you know, vocabulary. It's the generational thing. We know things from our generation that like what Faith said earlier about how we were raised when she said something about the Playboy channel. But our mother's taught us, yes, you cook, you clean, you do the dishes and you take care of the children. And sometimes they have part-time jobs too.

And where today's is completely different. So of course, the lingo is going to be completely different. However, go-go boots came back. Oh, God. You know, I didn't like him the first time. I really don't like him the second time. I love them. I know you do.

I'm just sticking with my cowboy boots. That's what I, you know, then never go on a style. It's the same boot. Katz's the same length boot. Anyhow. I learned these for about two seconds and I'm like, yeah, except snatched. I did know what that one had. Yeah, that one I knew.

And Body Tea, I kind of got it. That's like a guy thing would say. Yeah, that's all I take it. A girl would say it, wouldn't they? No, a guy. I think a girl would tell another girl. She's sitting somebody's bit and sexy. I think.

think a girl would use it with another girl. I mean, what do I know? I don't have body tea, so I'm never using that word. And we're rapping. Thanks to everybody for joining us on Bachelor Golden Hour. We had such a fun time. And now I know that Susan Arbornezzed. Absolutely. I can't say body tea anymore. I take a good picture sometimes. With that being said, please make sure to rate, review, and subscribe wherever you listen to your podcast. And you can follow Golden Hour on social media at Bachelor Happy Hour and at Bachelor Nation. Absolutely. See you next time. I survived nine months in captivity and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart and these are the survivor files.

Every week I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable, abducted, stalked, controlled and nearly silenced. These are stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. Pro Society is a weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for anyone who thinks pride and prejudice and love island to serve the same level of discourse. Each week, we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and pop culture with your favorite writers, book talk creators, and plenty of overthought opinions. Yeah, I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed.

Listen to pro-society on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus, or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinero, and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word Solita,

trading the pity for possibility. Listen to Solita on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, this is Hayes Davenport. And Sean Clements. We host the podcast, Hollywood Handbook. Each week, we talk to someone in show business and try to help them with their careers

and see what they have to offer us. Everyone has a good time and no one gets mad at their publicists for letting them do our show. We've had a lot of great guests like Sarah Sherman, Adam Scott, Danny McBride, Ben Stillard, and a lot of other big shots that wouldn't be where they are without us. Listen to Hollywood Handbook on the IHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Nick Totoro. You probably know me from NYPD Blue, the longest yard, or Spike Lease Black Klansman. And on my new podcast, delivering happiness with Nick Tutorial, I deliver pizza to a new guest. share to slice with everyone from Seth Rollins. What are you doing my belt?

To Bill Burr. I don't think I've ever met somebody so exactly out of their mind as I am. And now we even have more great guests coming up, including the great John Tuturo. It's called Happiness, delivering happiness. And many, many more. Open your free High Heart Radio app. Search Delivering Happiness with Nick Tutro. And listen now.

This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.