Bachelor Happy Hour - James Weighs In on Romances and Bromances in ‘Paradise’

Episode Date: September 29, 2021

“Bachelor in Paradise’s” James shares the juicy details of his connection with Anna, the importance of actually being single when coming to “Paradise,” and how he was ready to pack his bags when going up against Tatty Daddy for Tia’s rose. He also gives an update on where his bromance with Aaron currently stands.  Then, Becca and Tia discuss all of the drama from this week’s episode, including Ivan’s exit, two new arrivals, and the most dramatic prom in “Bachelor” history. Plus, they share some behind-the-scenes tea!  “Bachelor Happy Hour” has exclusive interviews every week. Watch “Bachelor in Paradise” on ABC and listen to “Bachelor Happy Hour” the next morning.  Don’t forget to rate and subscribe so you never miss an episode.  See omny.fm/listener for privacy information.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Welcome back Bachelor Happy Hour listeners. And I am dying laughing right now because I know you can't see us, you can only hear us, but Tia and I were feeling very nostalgic this morning, and we figured why not bust out our prom dresses and all of the accessories that we had for what you saw go down like?

last night. So, yeah, can you please describe to me what you are wearing right now? So, imagine ladybug meets 80s, meets shoulder poop. I mean, if only you could feel how itchy this is. I have some red lace, Madonna gloves, good side pony. You are looking, you, I like, I know that we filmed Paradise and Cromsepper months ago, but you look like you just stepped off that dance floor. I'm telling you guys what. Oh, thank you. Let's describe your outfit.

I'm wearing like, um, it kind of looks like wallpaper up close, a little iridescent like 80s bride, like, or 18 year old loses her virginity at the prom. We've got, we've got the, uh, pink velvet scrunchy. You can't see them, but we got some nice big pink ball earrings on. Um, I do have to admit. though. A, I'm shocked that we were able to get these dresses back home after Paradise because we only had two suitcases and they were stuffed. Yours literally took up. I think you had to buy a third suitcase just to get through airport security with that. I'm surprised you didn't just

wear it on the plane. Like, that's what you should have done. Save some money with that third suitcase. But we are ready to do today's podcast in style. And, you know, I don't think I'm going to be able to get this dress off of me because it's very tight. So I might just be limited in it for a while. To get this off the last one. So I'm really concerned. You also ripped your, you also ripped your dress out because you were dancing so hard. You busted the whole shoulder sleeve off. Very much did. It still is busted. We just have to keep it up. There's so many layers of tool there that it just stays when you pop it up. You don't even need a safety pin. But enough about our incredible attire. I mean, check out Bachelor Happy Hour's Instagram because we

have a full Reels tutorial of us getting ready back in the 80s mindset. And I have to say, this was just for me personally, one of my most fun favorite episodes to watch just because like reliving that moment, reliving the dancing and of course some of the drama. But just like, do you remember the excitement that we had that day? When we walked in the whole day, the fuck you talked about. That's true. I remember my excitement when we, when I walked into the Rose Palapa and it was 80s-themed prom. It was like I was born for the moment. Okay, and we will get into more of the details of that night.

It made a lasting impression. It didn't. It was at the very end of the episode, but it made a lasting impression. And prom is always memorable, but this one was one for the books, I have to say. But let's start at the top of the episode because last week, it was a to be continued, and it was all of the drama surrounding Ivan and Aaron and Chelsea. and this somewhat love triangle going on. So obviously it picks up back into that.

Aaron and Ivan are going at it. There are so much that was said between those two and just between everyone regarding that situation on the beach. I think a standout moment of everything not only between just what you saw, but I think one of the main things was like people saw Riley get really heated. And like even I was heated. There were people on that beach. learning Rachel like people were mad for different reasons like there was just so much tension going

on obviously you see Aaron get mad because he was well he says he was into Chelsea we'll get into that he says he says but um I know people are probably going to say like that Ivan looks so terrible here's the thing when all of that was going on we only heard one side of the story all we heard was that Chelsea pulled Ivan, Aaron saw Ivan and Chelsea talking and making out, and then we just saw Aaron get furious. And from a bystander, I mean, you were there, too, Tia, which you can attest to, like, Aaron was extremely heated to the point where everyone was like, what the hell? Like, why is this guy so mad? He was terrible the whole time. But always just like after the fact and kind of like macho man sticking up for myself. And it felt like it wasn't ever really a

the girl. It was always just about his competition. Right. With the guys. It was kind of bizarre. It was more about losing. I think another point to that when we all found this out rubbed us all the wrong way because a lot of us like know Ivan as this kind, soft spoken, patient man. And we didn't expect him, I think, to, I would say lie or spin the story in his favor where he said that Chelsea pulled him. Did he actually say. that Chelsea pulled him or that Chelsea wanted to talk? Because in his defense, he did ask her to go talk and she agreed. So if he was saying, yeah, Chelsea wanted to talk to me, he was just kind of leaving out the

beginning part that he talked to her first. But did he actually say Chelsea pulled him to talk? I don't know. I said it. Okay, he said Chelsea pulled me. Okay, so that was a lie. My thing, though, is I know it's easy to get wrapped up in the nitty-gurdy and the little details and the he-said he-said type thing. It's like, at the end of the day, who really cares, who pulled who?

The fact of the matter is these two consented adults went to go talk. They both made out. And Aaron saw it. And then Chelsea also decided to go and live her best bachelor at life, which she should have, and talk to Aaron and kiss him. Like, that's what it is. Like, to me, it doesn't matter who pulled who. And, like, that type of thing is so just unnecessary. We did the same thing with Tammy and Thomas, though, too.

Right. And so we're seeing a theme here with someone. And, like, you could only act half interested in someone so much. And then, like, you can't be surprised when they want to talk to someone else. That happens. That happens. We go into the roast ceremony, and this was probably the longest rose ceremony. ever had to stand through because that conversation between Ivan and Wals, it looks like it was

what, maybe five minutes. It probably took close to an hour. So we're all just standing there talking amongst ourselves. You can see everyone's eyes. We're so tired and like swaying and just it was a lot. I took a screenshot of your face where you're just like, what the fuck is going on? Oh my gosh. So tired, so late. It's just, it was hot. It was a lot. And so I think at that point, everyone was more pissed that Ivan just made this decision that we all had to stand through and deal with than like what actually happened the night before, which basically, to this day, we still don't quite know exactly how Ivan found Alex's room. But when we were all in lockdown during the storm in our separate rooms, Ivan apparently snuck out, found her number from a producer's phone, which was left

there. But in his defense, because I think we all, for the most, right, I don't want to speak for the group, but I will say a lot of us were excited, like we said last week, to have these comfortable big beds, have air conditioning, be able to shower, get ready, do our hair. Like, we were just all ready to go to bed so early because we never sleep on that beach. And so the fact that Ivan was in the mindset where I think he thought, okay, this is probably my last night. I don't have a strong connection. Let's just go. Kendall has just left. Kendall left. He's like, I think his mindset was, let's just go balls to the walls, all out, do whatever we can. If there's one person left here that I was excited to meet, and I now know her room number, why not? So I know he went around the system and broke the rules. I understand, though, where he was coming from and the mentality behind it. The issue and the part where he really fucked up, though, in that is that he, A, lied to everyone the next day. obviously especially to Chelsea and it was at her expense and I think the part where he went so

wrong where I felt for Chelsea in that moment was where after he confronted everyone after Wells pulled him aside and he was like Chelsea I'm sorry if you would have given me the rose I would have turned it down that should have been said well before the rose ceremony the audacity that was bullshit that is where I felt he did for Chelsea sentiment like how dare you think that I was going to give you a rose one and then say you're going to turn me down like Yeah. He could list that part out. And I think at that point, Ivan was like, I've burned all my bridges.

Like, they're truly, Chelsea was his maybe last string of hope, like the last little shred to potentially get a Rosen to stay. And with his confession of sneaking out and going to see Alexa, he obviously burned to that. And- Do you think Alexa is the one who told producers because she felt that and didn't want to go down to the beach? No, I think people heard that talking. Oh. And I will say to the record. I will say this.

Obviously, none of us had a clue. We had no idea. We were trying to get it out of Noah because Noah shared a room with him. But I want to touch on the fact that I know people probably think he snuck out and they hooked up. He even said, and I don't think they included this part when he was addressing us, but he even said this has nothing to do with Alexa. She has no part of this. She is innocent. This was me as a man sneaking out and making this decision, going to talk to her.

so she had no clue what was going on right exactly cutie ivan at her door she's like well damn she's like is this part of the show did the producers come here yeah exactly so um i want to make that very clear so i'm i'm sure there's going to be trolls out there on social media who will come at her and she is innocent in all this leave her out of this and she also made the decision not to go down to the beach because she felt so uncomfortable after i guess after she found out like it was not supposed to happen that way that yeah that was against the rules. Right. I really felt for her because she kind of missed out on her opportunity to. And she had been in quarantine for weeks. She had been waiting to come for weeks. And, oh, it's got to suck. But, I mean, you see, Ivan removed himself.

He leaves. And again, I think, sadly, it was at Chelsea's expense. And she was kind of put in this position. I mean, I don't know, I don't know had he not confronted everyone and told everyone what he chose to do. I don't know where her rose would have gone. Like, I don't think she was made up. She was, she kept talking to us. She was torn between the two guys. She was still moments before we all lined up at that row somewhere. I mean, still moments before she was torn of like trying to get the full details of the story of the arguing between him, between Aaron and Ivan. And so,

right. I mean, you see it all play out. She gives Aaron the Rose. So he sticks around. We see sadly Damar, Dr. Joe go home. Who else went home? Oh, Blake. Who's Blake? Um, Blake was so... Mattisage was pretty easy. Yeah. It, like, Blake was also so confused. I remember before he left, he was just like a deer in headlights of like, oh, I'm really going home to you give the rose to James. It's like, yeah, because you just gaslit the shit out of her the entire night in that conversation. Yeah, like, hello, knock knock. Were you present for any of it? Um, Uh, yeah. So those fellows go home and we see a couple new arrivals the next day, which I think it's interesting for all of us because it's down to the wire. There's only a couple days left. And so to

see Anna and McKenna walk in the next day, we were like, okay. We were having such a chill day too. Such a chill day and we're like, okay, got to got to work, work those moves fast to see what happens. Um, yeah. I know that it had to have been tough for you to see James go on the date with Anna. Obviously, you were struggling a little bit that whole day just because I don't think, I mean, and you can chime in here. I don't think you knew, like, James wasn't for you. I think you knew that. But also, you kind of were like, everyone's already coupled up. Like, he was the one connection that I could have potentially had here, you know, prom is about to happen. Like, that's, I think, where I don't think you were like all in of like, this is my guy.

but I think it was just like the situation in general. Yeah, of course. It's always a little punch in the gut to see the person that you just gave your rose to go out with someone else. But I truly was happy for him. But there was a moment where I actually said, I hope he's open to exploring options because he deserves that. When I gave him my rose,

I said you deserve to be here. You do. Because I knew that more girls were going to come in the next day. But yeah, of course, it always sucks to feel like. you wanted something to be there, and it just wasn't. And then you're just kind of left like, well, here we are. Here we are. I will say, though, and I just want all of our listeners to know this about you, because I've known you now for years.

You are one of the most helpless people that I've ever met. You, like, even though it was tough for you, you did say multiple times. And in many different words and forms and phrases that, like, You wanted James to be happy. You wanted him to find such a good girl because he was such a good man. Yeah. If he was an asshole, it would have made it a whole lot easier to be like, good ridges. You can have the next person, but he is such a nice, great guy.

And that made it so, so hard. Like, the only times I was emotional was when I was bummed about not giving somebody a rose and thinking about someone getting hurt and then when I was just ready to go home. but yeah he's such a nice guy and he truly truly deserved to go on that date and to have his first date in the franchise right yeah his first one-on-one ever yeah and he was he was the last guy on the beach the last i would say person to get to get a one-on-one and so i mean list he's been here the i don't know how james keeps sneaking through week by week james and erin both we were well at one point we were like they should just give each other their roses because they only spent all of

their time together like the strongest relationship in paradise they really were there's so much like everyone was talking about at one point they're like james and aaron are just like even wells wells wells was like how the hell are you two still and they didn't like towards if they truly really didn't care to talk to any of the women at all they only were together eating 24-7 that's one of the things too people were like why wasn't it there what was going on i'm like you didn't see this, but they really didn't talk to the girls a whole lot. They were with each other. All the time. All the time. All the time. It was a running joke for the last couple weeks there because it's like, anytime someone's like, where's James? We're like, oh, he's

probably with Aaron and vice versa. So, yeah, but he did have a great day with Anna, a very random, interesting date with the human-made churros and the snakes. I would not have mine the snakes, but the sugar and the cinnamon would have pissed me off, having it all over my body. And then at one point, Anna's on her stomach, he's giving her a massage and her forehead is basically going in to the cinnamon and sugar. And I'm like, oh, fuck no. Uh-uh. If that gets in my eyeball or like up my nose, I would have been so pissed. The one thing, too, that I kept thinking about and I'm like, oh, why is this where my mind goes is I'm thinking, I hope that the show gave them the white swimsuits because if that was my own, I would have been pissed if I ruined my own

swimsuit on this date. That's all I was thinking of the entire time. We will ask James, we will have him clarify if it was his own or not. But okay, well, so Anna comes in. Yeah, so Anna and James go on her date. Then McKenna comes in. Now, McKenna, we saw earlier in the season. She went back and had to wait in quarantine for a couple more weeks until she came down onto that beach the last week. But she shows up, she pulls you a lot of men that day to talk to them. And honestly, I think most were, I mean, most of them were in a relationship and said, if you were to ask me, I would turn you down and just say no to anyone.

It didn't even have to be McKenna. I'm sure it would have been anyone. Right. Well, yeah, because Anna asked too. Anna straight up asked a few people if they would say yes. And they said, no, couldn't. Mm-hmm. So I think the interesting thing is watching her conversation between,

McKenna and Aaron, he seemed invested. He seemed excited, which I think got her hopes up, obviously very intrigued with him. She was kind of vague. She was all in to pull him on this date. And she asks Aaron and he goes, yeah, but let's go talk. Which makes it seem like, yes, let's go chat, yeah. Yeah. Which if I was McKenna, I'd be like, okay, he said yes, we're going on this date, but like, let's just go talk really quick. I'm sure he just wants to explain something. whatever it might be, we see them go chat and then he basically turns her down. But all of the reasons for turning her down had nothing to do with Chelsea. Nothing to do with Chelsea. And she noticed that immediately. Yeah. He addressed the whole group and didn't say anything about I want to

explore my relationship with Chelsea. So that's why I'm not. Which is like, why dude, were you so mad the night before? Literally about to fight someone over Chelsea because you needed a rose. And now you don't give a shit like it was very stressed out because he fought with someone it's because he was sad james was already gone on a date like let's be honest um but so ed to the rescue i know you don't see a ton of ed and you didn't on claire's season but ed is a sweetheart and that moment where i know it was hard because as a friend for natasha i felt for her but that was his decision that was his decision on his own to go check on her and it actually was very sweet who said chivalry was dead he and and what i like too though is he wasn't like forcing her in like a super super romantic way he's just like

listen either you're going to go home tonight or tomorrow just have some fun have one day with me if you hate it i'm sorry like at least we'll make it fun you don't need to like me but we'll have a good time like i liked that mentality of like no pressure which i think sometimes makes the best dates And turns out they had a great date. They rollerbladed all around to the hotel, but they had fun. And I think it's just what they both needed. And, I mean, we see them share a nice kiss. He asked her to prom the next day.

That's right. That's right. Yeah. So it was, like, you reminded us to me of, like, puppy love, you know, like crushing a little bit, not all invested, but it was just carefree. I'm glad that. panic that he's 37. I know, which, I mean, everyone's talking about the age difference. You don't really notice when you're there. It is what it is. Exactly. Exactly. So, yeah,

they had a good one. So we go into the next day. Obviously, we touch on prom a little bit. Such a fun time. It was so random. Did you, did you going into that night have any idea that Aaron would pull you and that it would lead to this steamy kiss? no clue I was just as shocked as everyone else I remember at one point I obviously couldn't find you and I will say this everyone was trying to do a great job of including you and like trying to have you dance with us like me and Thomas I felt like we had a our little like squad trio all night because we were just dancing like we would put you in the middle of us it was a slow song it wasn't a fun song when we walked in where everyone could dance it was immediately a slow song

and I was the I was like seventh willing and just watching everybody else dance and of course they included me in their slow dance and I was just losing my mind and was like this is that like there's no place to sit I can't even sit down but everyone did make me feel very very included which was nice I did end up having a good time but at one point I was where the hell is Tia she's been gone a while so I asked one of our producer friends I was like where's Tia and she told me you were with Aaron and she's like yeah they're hitting it off and I think no offense but I think I burst out laughing because I was like ha ha ha ha what like there's no way that's going to be anything and she's like no Tia's really happy and I looked at her like okay

okay it was come to me tomorrow moment and then I started to panic I was like this is not the place I want to be right now I'm not trying to have a target on my back yeah Tia one of the best parts though of watching it back when you guys were making out you like kind of kicked your leg over his leg, but your toes were like this, like all sprawled out. My feet were black. You had like, you had like these frog. I had to rewatch. I love you so much. I was like, oh my God. All right, Tio, as fun as prom was, there was some cloud hanging over the entire evening. And I think going into it, we kind of could see a storm coming between

Abigail and Noah, they just seemed really off that day. I was clueless. Were you? I feel like you and Noah had a good conversation so you maybe had some insight, but I really did not know that was coming. The last I heard was that he told her he was falling in love with her, and then I heard they broke up, but after seeing it back,

I could kind of see his perspective. Yeah. I was not shocked. I had a feeling going into prom that they weren't going to be leaving together. I had a feeling that that was their last night, only because, as you said, like, I did have a conversation with him that day. Their last conversation that we saw was interesting to me because obviously Abigail just kind of sat there in silence for a while and took it all in. And he didn't really give too much context or insight, he kind of just said, I know that I'm falling for you, but I don't think you're the one. And you're not my person. You're not my person, which, like, we've all been in

relationships where I think we've known, like, we can love somebody or have all these feelings and, like, trying to get somewhere in a relationship, but ultimately, we know they're not the one for us. We know that it's not going to work out in the long run. And I think that's what he was trying to get at. The conversation just went for way too long. Um, and I felt for her because that has got to be so hard to just the night before, less than 24 hours before, have somebody tell you that they're falling in love with them. And then, and she wanted to have to talk with him too. Yeah, and she wanted to tell him. And then it goes to them breaking up. So it's a complete 180 from, I think, where they were at the night before. And so it's, it's tough. And I can speak from his experience being

blindsided, which I think she was. And, you know, when she removed herself to go sit in the bathroom and cry, I was like, I've been that girl. I felt like it was like a digger to the heart. I felt so bad for her. And just as a friend in that moment, like, I think we all wished we could have been there for her and been in the bathroom to console her and talk to her and make sure she was okay. Obviously, we had no idea what was going on. We had no idea what conversation was taking place. So it's a tough one. We don't see how it formally ends because, again, it's another to be continued into next week but um and it was extra hard too because they had just been crowned not king and queen but what was it that they what was the award that they wanted to succeed or like together

in the real world or succeed in yeah after the show to work out in the real world and so it was um it was tough to watch but we'll have to wait and see how that's especially tough to be upset and heartbroken in an 80s outfit oh yeah As if it's not enough. But we have to bring our guests on because he obviously had a major moment, a major date this week. And we got to see a little bit more of him. So Tia, I know he kind of broke a heart a little bit this week. But we had to have our guy James on.

So without further ado, Bachelor Happy Hour listeners, let's welcome James to the podcast. James, welcome to Bachelor Happy Hour. It's good to see you again. How are you? Yeah, thanks for having me. It's great to see you guys. You guys look fantastic. I wish I still had my prom get up with me.

I know. Half white jacket. The little dangly earring. It was good James and evil James. I don't think there's evil James. I don't know where he is. Yeah, I've never seen the evil James. I don't think he exists.

No, he comes out not so often, but I think he's not. I will say this because at the end of the night, there was one point where things were kind of winding down. Everyone was laying, like half of us. were taking naps on the stage some people were on the on the dance floor laying down all the couples you know are kind of taking naps or kissing and i was sitting right next to you and anna and the two of you were talking the entire time and just hitting it off and i remember like kind of dozing off being like they're so cute like this is really precious right now yeah anna was kind of like a breath of fresh air you know my paradise experience had so many ups and downs and

cough cough to you you made it the whole way though you made it from beginning to eat we'll get into that but you know tia and i we we had a run obviously didn't work out for better for worse but um you know tia gave me another shot right and enabled me to stick around welcome yeah hey listen i'm very grateful that too i'm very grateful and oh you deserved it you deserved it thank you thank you but it seriously it gave me another opportunity to live to see another day and then fortunately anna came in you know that week and she was kind of the final arrival fortunately picked me on that one-on-one date and we hit it off right so shout out to tia for for allow me to survive that last rose same morning at least putting that opportunity it was an easy

choice so you so far have had quite the journey on paradise and i mean tia and i have joked like out of anyone were like how is james still around like i know that like tia gave you the roses but it wasn't until what we saw last night this week when Anna arrives where you like really had a solid solid connection. But we have to take it back to the very beginning

because you were there day one and right away I mean it seemed like you started off on a decent foot with Victoria P so take us back to the beginning who were you originally hoping to me when you stepped onto the sand

and from there did you ever think that you and Victoria P would have hit it off? Yeah, and great question as far as how I made it as long as I did. I wish I had the answer for you, but I kind of scraped by each week, but going because you're charming. It's because you're a good guy. Oh, stop it, stop it. It's, it really, I remember being in the hotel and I had only really seen, you know, Clarentation season and Matt season. So I didn't know too many names that could potentially be coming on the beach, but I wanted to an open mind. I wanted to use Paradise for what it was intended for, right? To explore relationships, not kind of have tunnel vision for one person and kind of just put all your

eggs in one basket. So walking onto the beach, I wanted to talk with anyone and everyone who's there, right? So came in, saw some familiar faces, had a few buddies there, obviously, for my season. But then when I saw Victoria, I remember the first time I saw her, she was standing at the bar and I was obviously immediately attracted to her and made an effort to kind of start developing some kind of relationship, some type of connection. And it just felt easy. It felt smooth. It wasn't forced. And we both kind of had this mutual understanding that yes, we are interested in getting to know each other more and more, but we're also not going to block ourselves off to meeting new people and exploring other relationships. So it was kind of a nice start. I felt confident coming into

the first week in paradise. Then obviously that suddenly changed to the night of the first restaurant. Mm-hmm. You dealt with a lot that first week. When she ultimately eliminated herself, what was going through your mind? How did you feel in that moment?

Yeah, I was shocked, you know, to have Tammy and Kelsey comes to me that information, which, you know, I appreciated, right? The honesty and the transparency. And I knew at that point I had to have a very direct conversation with Victoria. And, you know, to this day, I don't necessarily fully understand the dynamic of

what was going on. And I truly believe Victoria was single coming into Paradise, but I think there was a lot of baggage maybe and a lot of history from a past relationship that the door maybe necessarily wasn't fully closed. And I think she took a big risk and kind of a leap of faith in coming to Paradise and at least seeing what options were there. And I think maybe her heart was just pulling her in another direction when she got there and maybe she started missing that individual. And, you know, I can't knock her for that. And as upset as I was to have herself eliminate and to kind of have that relationship crash and burn, especially so early, I understood, right? You know, and I've been in situations like that before where you try to kind of move on from

your past and it keeps pulling you back, right? So I can't knock her for that. And it did put me in a tough situation because I was probably about an hour out from the first row ceremony. and I went against my own rule and I kind of put all my eggs in one basket with Victoria and I didn't have a connection with anyone there, anyone else. So I had some last minute discussions with Kelsey and Demi and eventually ended up kind of really giving a friendship rose to Demi. Yeah, and then I was obviously back to square one

with the girls having the roses and I knew I had to kind of start making a connection with girls elsewhere because obviously Victoria was gone. What made you give your rose to Demi over? Kelsey because as the viewer it seemed like it was going to be going to Kelsey like I know the interaction trying. Yeah and I know that you said the rose to Demi

was more of a friendship thing and you knew you guys would have fun but it seemed like you were leaning towards Kelsey. Yeah it was it was not an easy decision right and both girls are incredible both equally deserve their shot at love and

you know in hindsight I look back, and to be honest, I probably would have given my rose to Kelsey. I think maybe there was a greater potential there beyond just a friendship rose. But I saw Demi was, you know, bubbly and energetic. And, you know, she seemed to be there to have fun and meet people. So I eventually came to that choice. But in hindsight, yeah, Kelsey, I think maybe I should have given that a bit more time and attention and seen where that could have gone.

but obviously hindsight is 20-20 and Demi got my rose and I can only move forward from there. Do you look at TV, damn it? She does. She does. I mean, when T and I came down, we were so glad that Demi was still there because we love her. But does a part of you regret that? Like now looking back, do you wish you would have given it to Kelsey? I try not to live, you know, looking back and kind of thinking of I should have done this,

I should have done that, right? I made my decision and I kind of moved on from it. But yeah, I think about that often as far as what I should have done in that first row ceremony. I mean, first things first, I shouldn't have kind of put the blinders on for Victoria. I should have done what I intended to do and followed kind of my rules and explored different relationships, right? Because when that came crashing down, everyone else was kind of like a stranger to me. I didn't know anything about any of the girls. so that's that's number one but number two i think yeah i think i should have given

kelsey a bit more time and attention um she's she's obviously fantastic um but yeah i do i do certainly think about that uh i want to get into moving forward because like you seemed very open to i think really talk to anyone and have a connection and or at least try to form a connection with anyone. And obviously in the weeks to come, we saw drama between Chris and Atlanta go down with, you know, potentially having a relationship pre-Paradise. The same with Brendan and Piper. So for somebody who came in single, ready to mingle, do you have anything you want to say on the matter of, you know, the pre-Paradise potential relationships? That's obviously a really delicate subject. And it's very very,

strictly dissect because I learn very quickly in bachelor nation everyone it's a very close network right you know when when you go on the show you're kind of you bust onto the scene and with social media you have access and able to communicate with anyone and everyone kind of becomes friends right and where do you draw the line between you know friendship and something intimate and romantic right i know people go on trips together um piper and brennan you know they hung out a couple of times And so it's very hard to draw the line between a friendship and something romantic, right? And I think it's obviously case by case basis. In my opinion, I, you know, regarding the Alana and Chris situation, I think, you know, they had that San Diego trip.

I truly believe that they were kind of just on a friendship level, found out they were both going to paradise and, you know, we're excited to meet each other. I think they maybe had a predetermined plan to kind of attach to one another. And then the Brandon Piper situation, that's super messy, I know. And to me, I think that was an existing relationship there. You've seen apologies come out. So I try to avoid that. But in my opinion, it's tough, right? And it's a case-by-case basis.

But does any part of you, I want to figure out how to word this? Like, is there any part of you that is a little bit upset? or disappointed because, again, I think most people came down onto that beach open, ready to talk to everyone, you know, explore any sort of relationship. And so do you feel like in a way, if that was already in place or a relationship was already in place or a plan was already there, it took away from you potentially meeting two women that would be there that weren't already, I guess, would say, like, reserved or have this plan. Yeah, no, that makes total sense. And I do, right? And I think if you're already committed to an individual or one person, right, why even bother coming to paradise, right?

Work that out, you know, independently, like just in the real word, right? Don't come to the beach and try to finesse and finagle your way, rose after rose ceremony and just essentially exchange roses back and forth, right? And have a predetermined plan because not only for the guys, but the girls too, you're taking up valuable spots for people that are genuinely there looking to find a spark, find a connection. and have that flourish into a potential engagement and, you know, or whatever it may be, leave the beach together, right? So I think this is going to be an ongoing problem that Paradise is going to have, right, with contestants having preexisting relationships. I think there's really no way around it.

But yeah, it is unfortunate. Yeah, I agree. And I think I'm hoping that from people watching not only this season and those situations transpire on Paradise. But even the season previous, I know it was a couple years ago, but having some sort of relationship beforehand, hopefully people coming on now

will realize that's not the way to go. It never works out in anyone's favor. Hopefully people will be deterred from that after seeing this now. I think this season brought a lot to light that, you know, it will come to the surface. You will be caught. So yeah, hopefully we see a,

less and less people come in with that kind of predetermined plan and, you know, people are really there to explore relationships genuinely and, you know, find their match. Yeah. Well, we eventually see you and Tia exchanged some roses. Can you both speak on? How did that all come to be? Because I know there's obviously so much behind the scenes, James, you had surprised her in nowhere. Yeah. Well, every week, Tia, I was back to square one and you came in. I think you went on that first day with Kenny. but I you know just like I mentioned with Victoria how it felt easy it felt smooth it was the same with you right and we had conversations off camera too yeah you and I we had a connection and then it's I felt confident giving my rose to you and then obviously we had with Blake come on

and wasn't so sure moving forward but you it was great meeting you it just never felt forced it was always easy and you know like we had a mutual understanding that you know we are curious interested to getting to know each other more but we're not going to block ourselves off you know if we're going to go on a one-on-one date we're going to take it and yeah no either person would be completely fine with that right so blake beyond the stereo no tea is in the room but how did you truly feel or what was going through your mind when tia went on that date with tattie daddy daddy oh i was like i might as well start packing my bags now the timing was just i might as well just get on the next flight home but no listen like that's I can't knock Tia for it and you know she's out there

looking for love just like the rest of us right so what I will say and what I will thank you for Tia is when Blake did ask you on that date before you left you know you pulled me aside and said hey James I know this sucks the timing stinks but out of respect for you like I just want you know I'm going to accept the date and that kind of five minute interaction meant the world to me because, you know, I know eventually when Anna came and we seemed to be kind of fading a bit, but I kind of wanted to have that same conversation with you. So we kind of carried that mutual respect towards each other. And that meant a lot, right? And I genuinely did wish you the best, you know, with Blake and the date. So just wanted to thank you for that. Yeah, of course.

Okay, so Tia gets back from the date. Obviously, we'd go into the next row of ceremony that day. there was a lot back and forth between you and Tia, between Tia and Blake, and it seemed like you really stepped up and went above and beyond to surprise her and make her feel special because she deserves that. I think anyone in any relationship deserves to feel wanted and desired and cared about, which you definitely did for her. Going into that night, did you expect to get Tia's rose or was that? I guess should I say, were you confident in getting Tia's rose that night? Yeah, no, absolutely not. And I knew the connection that Herne Blake had. And the day we had kind of that cocktail party that started a bit earlier, I remember the night prior, T&I, I'd set something up from her and the conversation kind of revolved around, you know, what love languages we kind of fit with. And, you know, it was a great conversation. And, you know, it was something small I did. And but, you know, it's, I think, you know, the litter thing.

can kind of sometimes help it means so much it doesn't have to be anything crazy or expensive or fancy or anything like that just to show someone that you're caring about them is goes a long way it goes such a long way and i agree and i i got to kind of learn a bit more about tia and how kind of she she ticks and kind of what she's looking for in a romantic relationship and um that next day i kind of said hey i'm not really interested in pursuing a relationship with anyone other than Tia at this point. So, you know, I wanted to make sure she had time with Blake and, you know, take advantage of any window or opportunity that I saw to speak with her.

And then I just can remember a moment. You were on a daybed with Blake and the conversation didn't look like it was going well. Not at all. And I said, you know what? Let me maybe try to go and see if Tia wants to step away from this and take a breath. I forgot about that. Yeah. And I came over.

He did. He tried to save me. And I was like, both of you just looked at me. And I felt, I was like, okay, this, I better walk away from this situation. I was like, is this a good time right now? And both we were like, not really. Yeah, I was like, I'm eating his lunch right now. If you could like, just wait a second, I'll be right there.

Yeah, and in my head, and I was, you know, I obviously wanted to continue to pursue things with Tia. But in my head, I thought Blake might be kind of self-destructing for me. And I kind of just let that play out. I didn't want to interrupt any more than I already had. But even after that kind of disagreement or fight, whatever you want to call it, that TN Blake had, I was nowhere near confident of getting the rose because I just knew the initial connection and spark that they had, right? And I didn't know what conversation, you know, what dialogue was going back and forth or what the disagreement was about. But it just didn't look like it was going

well from my point of view. I tried to make him jealous too. I was like, James set up something for me two nights ago. I will. He was like, so. I'm like, aren't you nervous he's like no that's your main competition right there blake right i know like that's what i wanted him to understand like i have a choice here someone's showing effort someone's not like james's the hero in this situation i need you to try step it up uh paradise essentially is a competition in itself right it's you know you can't just walk around you know not necessarily saying he was doing the bare minimum

but you have to make an impression somehow. Well, I'll say it. He was doing the bare minimum for somebody on the beach living there. He was doing the, like, if you could dig a hole and, like, go underground, like, negatively, he was doing that. Oh, no. Oh, no. I will say, I was team James. I remember talking to Tia that day and she was struggling.

I mean, and just in general, like the heat, the lack of sleep, everything gets to you. And so she was struggling because she knew, like, how incredible and kind of. you were. And so we were all team James. All of us girls were like, James. Like there's not even a question in our mind. I was telling Becca earlier, if you were an asshole, it would have made it a lot easier just to be like, no, this is an easy choice, but you're such a great dude. Do you guys ever feel like, I mean, T. I'll propose this question to you. I guess that Paradise almost made you a, I hate to be a victim of circumstance, so to speak, but if you had maybe more time in a different setting with Blake, that it would have been different. Because I often feel that

you know about in situations in relationships that I kind of pursued that's the thing that makes it tricky is that I mean that was a situation at hand we had never met beforehand um but like what better way than to have no interruptions no outside influences nothing else affecting you have plenty of time to get to know someone right and they still are like I'm not going to do this I'm not going to do this it's all for a TV show but you're choosing to be on the show and it just made me think, like, I was asking for very little. And he was saying, you know, I'm not going to do that here. I would do that outside of this, but not here.

And I'm like, well, if you can't do that here, then what makes me think that you're going to be able to do that in the real world? Because on our date, we did have a great connection. And I was like, I can see him being someone I would be into outside of this. And that small little conversation that we had that it was off camera, didn't show it, where he basically said, I'm not going to set anything up for you. I don't think that's realistic. I don't think that's real life.

I think it's fake. When guys do that, I think he said he thinks it's fake. That just made me think, well, if you can't do that here when it's so easy to be set up for you, what's going to make you do that outside of this?

So that it just was a major turning point where I was just completely turned off and it wasn't going to happen. I think you're right. Like the paradise is stressful as it is kind of presents limited interruptions, right? And there are a lot of variables when you go back into the real world, kind of life gets messy and problems come up. So I guess if you can't do it on that beach.

Okay, so I want to get into your first real, I would say solid, strong connection that gave all of us viewers hope. And that was when Anna came down. And T and I were recapping a little bit and we were talking about how random the state that you guys had, but it seemed so fun. And I think you too made the most of it. How did you feel, though, about becoming a human churro? I, to be honest, as strange as it was and unconventional,

I had a blast from start to finish. And I think not necessarily because of what the date consisted of, but because who I was with on that day, right? Anna just made it enjoyable from beginning to end. We shared the same sense of humor. We were kind of both lighthearted and saying, yeah, this is super weird, but let's just roll with it and have as much fun as we can.

You know, I never thought I'd be lathered up in butter and rolling around in a show. sugar pit and then having chocolate syrup drenched all over me turning into a human churro like would I expect to ever be doing that on a first date no way but it's all about who you're doing things with not what you're doing if that makes sense so I had a blast and you know I think she had fun too what did you like more the churro or the snake part the snake massage that was random too was it a massage like did it hit the pressure points so it's weird the the like weight and the weight of the snake and like it was ice cold i've never touched the snake before but when i felt it it was ice cold and

if i kind of turned off my mind and stopped thinking that there's a huge burmese python crawling around my chest and my face and just took my mind elsewhere it was it was comforting it was relaxing but then I felt a snake's tongue like slithering on my ear and I was like back to reality let's start freaking out again that snake was that actually wasn't the snake's tongue I was and I was right next to you I knew I just trying to get to second base with you had a feeling she straddled in though that was a hell of straddle and make out that was spicy yeah we were squeezing our each other's hands and I'm like why you're doing the snake massage I can tell you'd start to freak out because she would just start my hand harder and harder. And I was like, okay, this needs to end soon before one of us

freaks out. The hot tub was, it got steamy in there for sure. Yeah. Did you feel like a real genuine spark? Yeah, I did. And I think it goes back to it feeling just super easy from the jump, right? And I remember her walking into the paradise and kind of picking me for the date card. And I asked her, I said, hey, what made you choose me out of all the guys? She said, that she saw me and like my face kind of just lit up when I saw her and I had a big smile on my face and she was like, I want someone that's going to be excited and eager to hang out with me. So like you were an obvious choice. And then, you know, from the date, you know, we just had fun and it was, you know, we were laughing and enjoying each other's company. And, you know,

we had kind of some pretty serious conversations about her experience on the Bachelorette and, you know, how you carry a lot of insecurities when you're surrounded by 30 guys or girls. that are all successful, you know, super handsome. All the girls are gorgeous, right? And so we kind of began to peel back the layers of who we are as people. And then, you know, the connection was there. But then obviously, intimately, you know, she's gorgeous. I was attracted to her.

So it was kind of just progressed pretty quickly on that first thing. Yeah. It seems like you guys really, really hit it off and just had some sort of spark there, which was fun to see because that's what we wanted for you the entire time. We wanted you to feel that. I wish she could have, you know, came week one or week two. But I had to be patient and, you know, it was well worth the wait. Exactly.

Okay, so let's get into it. Last night, we saw our fun 80-themed Paradise Prom. Did you, first of all, have fun that night? Because I know there was a mixture of emotions. Obviously, we saw some sadness between No and Abigail and their breakup go down. There was some other drama. Like, you being there with Anna, did you enjoy it? yeah i had a blast right who's not gonna have fun it from who's not gonna have fun just being stupid

and dressing up um it was kind of like a flashback in time going back into the 80s so i you know were you alive in the 80s when were you bored i was the um in a fucking minute yeah are you 50 and nobody no no but it's like it's it's it's fun kind of just being stupid and not and not taking himself too seriously. And I remember, you know, when Noah and Abigail ran into some problems, I was sad. But, you know, I was there for, for Anna, right? I wanted to just focus my attention, my efforts on her and my relationship and progressing that forward. So you're saying I was out of the picture at that point. You were making out with his best friend. You and that boy, Aaron, had buddyed up at that point. So I, as that ship had sailed to you, I'm sorry.

What was your reaction when you found out that Aaron was made? making the moves on Tia. So Tia and I, we were, there's no, no hard feelings there because I think Tia and I both were aware that we were kind of fizzling out at that point. And the rose that she gave me was more of, I won't call it a friendship rose, but just an acknowledgement of, yes, I know you're here for the right reasons. Even though I may not have found my person here, I still believe that you can. So I think it was an understanding of that, you know, we were kind of going our separate ways.

And Aaron actually came up to me that night of the problem and said, hey, look, you know, Tia and I, we kind of started as friends, we get along, but I'm starting to, like, develop something beyond that. Like, are you okay with that? And of course I would. Of course I was, right? You know, Aaron's, you know, like a brother to me and I want what's best for him. I want him to find love.

So he came to me and I was more than happy to kind of have him pursue that, right? And I think him and Tia would be a great match. do you think it's weird though that he came to you and not chelsea to talk about it yeah as a friend like that's kind of strange right so i think both conversations maybe were necessary um i'm not sure if he did have a conversation with prior with chelsea prior or after he didn't yeah i don't think he ever did so it made it really uncomfortable she was pissed she wasn't mad at you i even talked to her she wasn't mad at you tia oh yeah but it just like we're all living together and I'm just like, dude, I love you, Chelsea. I'm so sorry. Yeah, in hindsight, I think maybe Aaron, you know, he should have done that. I didn't ask me about that multiple times.

I was like, hey, if you talk to Chelsea about this, how does she feel about this? Where do you stand with her? Yeah, and what did he say? He's like, I talked to James. It's fine. Yeah, he's like James is my number one. Jokes on to everyone. Me and Aaron, I actually had a predetermined relationship and had everyone saying.

Oh, I knew. I'm surprised Joe didn't kick you off the beach. I know, I know. Well, you guys actually did because you live by each other. Oh, yeah, we live down the street. I mean, Aaron, he's, I swear, you know, I met him on Katie's season. And we talk about this all the time, how, you know, without each other on Paradise, we both probably would have crashed and burn because to have that person to just kind of go and vent out to and, you know, have that friendship at the end of the night where you can just unwind and de-stress. I probably would have lost my mind without him there.

So having him there was definitely kind of a nice safety net to have. I'm glad someone found love. Yes. Wait. Okay, James, I have a question for you because this is something that caught my ear yesterday when I was listening. But I think it had to do, oh, it definitely had to do when Aaron and Ivan were arguing and getting into it the day or the day before the row ceremony.

You made a comment to him, when you guys were chatting, basically along the lines of like, you know, I've always got your back. You're my best friend here. And you, I don't remember what exact words you used. So don't exactly quote me on this. But you said something like whether you're right or you're wrong, I'll always have your back. But I, which I was intrigued by because if you know one of your best friends is in the wrong, wouldn't you call them out regardless? It'd be like, hey, dude, I love you. You're my guy. But you're in the wrong here. And so I was. wondering about that that I wanted to ask you today.

Yeah, and I think my, I use poor wording now, of course, if I feel as if he's making mistake or doing something that's going to result in a kind of a negative way or him shooting something to put, I'm going to say, hey, man, you know, I'm going to support you no matter what, but I think maybe you should adjust your approach. And I think more in that moment, he needed that kind of just reassurance that he has me there regardless of you know he felt ganged up on too and you're kind of like that only one that was going to be honest yeah and i think i just wanted to make sure he know that he has a brother than me that is going to support him through anything and you know maybe a conversation i have

after the fact saying hey listen you know you're my guy but um just take a breath and you go have conversation maybe you should have handled yourself this way or that way but really in me saying that is just kind of reassuring him that no matter what decisions he makes, no matter what he does, no matter what the outcome, you know, I'm going to support him and see him. Yeah, he's not alone. All right, James, before we get into our game, I need to know what is the status with you and Aaron these days? Because we saw this beautiful connection, this bromance unfold on the beach.

So where do you stand with him? Listen, that's my guy. You know, he's a brother for life. And, you know, we met on Katie's season of The Bachelorette and, you know, we left the same night. We got eliminated the same rose ceremony in Katie's season. We continued to hang out back in San Diego. He's essentially my neighbor living down the street and just grown super, super close. And then to find out that we were both going to be on Paradise together, it's just a relationship that has grown stronger and stronger as each day passes.

And, you know, that's going to be a friend for life. I see him almost every other day. and, you know, Aaron, if you're listening, I appreciate our friendship. I love you, man. And it's, oh, my God. I'm going to throw up. I love it.

No, I honestly, like, I know that we joked about it. And everyone was like, oh, where's James with Aaron? And seriously, the strongest couple in paradise. But I think it's so important to have those friendships. I mean, you not only can potentially find love in a partner on the show, but it's, to get through a season, you always, need that one person. And thankfully, I had Tia, you had Aaron. So I think it's, it was a, it was a, you know, whether you found love or not, we don't know. We have to wait for the finale. But at least

you found love with Aaron. And I'm glad that you two have each other. But before we let you go, because I know you're a busy man, we have to play a game. So we've been playing this one with all of our recent guests. It's easy. It's a paradise superlative game. So we're just going to ask you a question. And you just have to name the person that it applies to. So, rapid fire, we'll just bang them out real quick. So I'll start. Who was the funniest in paradise? Aaron.

Best dressed. If you say Aaron for, if you say Aaron for all of these. Noah. Noah. Noah's got that one a couple times. He had some fresh outfits. Okay. Who is the biggest flirt in paradise? Tammy. Oh, I think we've gotten that a few times

too um biggest cry baby oh man um wow who who did i see crying a lot um i saw tammy crying a lot i'll go with tammy i was going to say if you say tia yeah no no i don't think i i don't think i saw it's he crying ever. Okay, who was the most outspoken? Joe. True. The paradox police. Laugh of the party.

Demi. Michelle. Best, best answer. Aaron. Aaron only had TikTok dances. That's all he would without. But he's perfected them. He has.

All three of them. um let's see what he says on this next one sexiest in paradise Anna I knew he wanted to say Aaron so bad I saw I saw the A him forming an A okay oh this is a good one most muscular Riley

I would say you I would say you too though James you give Riley a run for his money on his heels but I don't you know Riley he definitely came correct on the beach. James, I have never seen anyone eat as much as you in my entire life. Well, I was, it was, I loved it. You know, for breakfast, I just had endless oatmeal, fruit, eggs, you know, all the chambles. I honestly was shocked to see you talk so much in your interviews. You're kind of like the narrator of the season because I'm like, this dude never talked during the day

because he was eating. He was always eating. I was full of food all day. So you guys have to eat. James, I love you, but you make me want, to never have boys one day because you guys eat so much. It's so expensive. It's so expensive. I know. I'm like a bottomless pit. It's discussed. Just a human vacuum. I don't know where it goes. Okay. Wait, Tia, did you just go or did I go? I said it, but we talked about something else. Heartbreaker of Paradise. Wow. The biggest heartbreaker. paradise maybe thomas just because i i saw him kind of i know how upset tammy was and i can't

really think of any major breakup or kind of big switch um from one girl to another so maybe thomas that's a tough one that goes your boss i'm looking right at you no there's just something in the water like no comment i plead the fifth okay i i don't quite know what this last one means but he'll know what it means he'll know the best box Bachelorette or Paradise that seems highly sexual No he was in a box

Yeah no so you were in a box in paradise I was in a large pinata box Yeah on his intro Oh I was like I don't remember you being in a box Did you sleep in the box? The answer is an easy one because on Katie's season I was in a three piece wool suit in that box And it was about a hundred degrees in there

I was sweating bullets I was in there for hours in paradise i'm on a beautiful beach in mexico in a bathing suit in a pinata i'm going to go with the paradise box no doubt about it i was just going to give a really betch i was going to say box i i hear i was honestly like what are we hinting at here people yeah let's keep a pg guys that's the family friendly show uh james it has been such an absolute pleasure just to see you again to catch up and to get to know you a little bit more because Tia and I are huge fans. We have raved about you.

People love you. You are such a genuine, kind soul, such a gentleman that I'm glad that people can see, like, there are still great guys like you out there. So thank you for joining us. I can't wait to see what happens with you and Anna and Aaron next week on the finale. But take care to tell Ben. Thank you so much for having me, guys. And I miss you guys.

Let's link up soon. yeah i would love that yeah for sure i'll have to come to california yeah you do all right thanks james see you later bye bye oh tia what a guy what a good guy no no he's such a good dude he really is i'm glad that we were able to have him on because i mean we've been lucky enough to see bit by bit of him um but it was good to see him finally form a solid solid connection and i love that he had his first date. So I know it was a little bit late in the season, but he got it nonetheless. So a huge thing

I mean, how it was meant to be obviously since they had a really good connection. Well, and I loved how he said, like, even though he knew you and him didn't have that romantic relationship, you everything works out and you obviously gave him that rose to stick around

because you knew he was there for the right reasons to find someone. And it was perfect timing when Anna walked through those gates. So I'm glad that I'm really glad that you gave him that rose. I know, again, it was tough for you that week, but he deserves to be there. So it all works out. But a huge thank you to James.

And for you, Tia, for joining me again, it's always a blast. And to all of our Bachelor Happy Hour listeners, thanks for bearing with us. I know you can't see our great outfits, but if you can go check us out on Bachelor Happy Hour, Instagram, please do so because you don't want to miss this get up. And if you want to follow us on both Twitter and Facebook, we are at Badger's Nation. And as always, please don't forget to subscribe to our podcast. You can do that on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, the Wonderry app, or wherever you are listening to us right now. Have a good week.

My boyfriend's professor is way too friendly and now I'm seriously suspicious. Wait a minute, Sam. Maybe her boyfriend's just looking for extra credit. Well, Dakota, luckily, it's back to school week on the OK Storytime podcast. So we'll find out soon. This person writes, my boyfriend's been hanging out with his young professor a lot. He doesn't think it's a problem, but I don't trust her. Now he's insisting we get to know each other, but I just want her gone. Hold up. Isn't that against school policy? That seems inappropriate. Maybe find out how it ends by listening to the OK Storytime podcast and the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Dr. Scott Barry Kaufman, host of the Psychology Podcast. Here's a clip from an upcoming conversation about how to be a better you. When you think about emotion regulation, you're not going to choose an adaptive story. strategy, which is more effortful to use unless you think there's a good outcome. Avoidance is easier. Ignoring is easier. Denials easier. Complex problem solving takes effort. Listen to the psychology podcast on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Jamel Hill, host to the Sports and Politics Podcasts, and on the latest episode of Spolitics, House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries joins me for a candid conversation about

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