Bachelor Happy Hour - Rachel Lindsay Returns to ‘Happy Hour’ — Part 1 

Episode Date: March 3, 2026

Today on “Happy Hour,” Charity and Rachel welcome Rachel Lindsay back to the franchise for her first interview since 2021 — and nothing is off the table. She opens up about her unexpected appearance at the “Bachelorette” reunion, sharing what went through her mind when she got the call and why she ultimately decided to step back into the Bachelor Mansion. From there, the conversation turns candid and emotional as Rachel addresses the end of her marriage, including the shocking way she found out the divorce had officially been filed. It’s honest, vulnerable, and a must-listen. Tune in now — and don’t forget to subscribe so you’re ready for part two dropping tomorrow.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 2 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpright became the victim of a random crime. The perpetrator was sentenced to 99 years until a confession changed everything. I was a monster. Listen to Burden of Guilt Season 2 on the audience.

My Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Amanda Knox, and in the new podcast, Doubt, the case of Lucy Letby, we unpack the story of an unimaginable tragedy that gripped the UK in 2023. But what if we didn't get the whole story? Adidas has been made to fit. The moment you look at the whole picture, the case collapsed. What if the truth was disguised by a story we chose to believe? Oh my God, I think she might be innocent. Listen to Doubt the case of Lucy Lettby on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Clayton Eckerd in 2022. I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. But here's the thing. Bachelor fans hated him. If I could press a button and rewind it all I would. That's when his life took a disturbing turn. A one-night stand would end in a courtroom. The media is here.

This case has gone viral. the dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. Listen to Love Trapped on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Jay Chetty, host of the on-purpose podcast. I'm joined by Luke Combs, award-winning country music artist and one of the most authentic voices in music today.

The guy that says he's always going to be there and that will do anything to be there is the only guy that's not there. No matter what, I'm going to prioritize my wife and my children. I dread the conversation with my son. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Chetty on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. In 2018, the FBI took down a ring of spies working for China's Ministry of State Security, one of the most mysterious intelligence agencies in the world. The Sixth Bureau podcast is a story.

of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its fault of secrets. Listen to the Sixth Bureau on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello, everyone, and welcome back to Bachelor Happy Hour. I'm Rachel. And I'm Charity, and today we have a very, very special guest, back for the very first time since she hosted this podcast herself. please welcome the one and only Rachel Lindsay. Oh, hi, Rachel. It's so nice to be back. It actually really is.

I mean that. People are going to doubt that when I say that. It's been five years. And you said that you wanted to come back permanently off camera. I said being around you guys back here makes me almost makes me want to come back. And then I took it back as soon as I said it. Immediately. I miss the people.

We would love to have you. I miss you guys. I miss working with everyone. And like we were talking off mic how you guys have just like really come up. I'm so excited for the two of you. When you guys were announced, I was like, this is so much fun. The Bachelorettes are hosting again, new studio, new look. You saw how we were doing it.

We were thugging it out. Yeah. But I love what you guys are doing here. So I'm really excited for y'all. No, but obviously everyone is so excited anytime we get to have you back in any capacity. but this is actually crazy because you started this podcast. We did. And we've had over 700 episodes.

Really? Oh my gosh. Yeah, I guess 2019. That was my first time ever podcasting. Was it? Yeah. This is like I feel like our, well at least my first like official time podcasting. And it's so hard to get used to.

But we're excited. You're going to love it. Podcasting is the most freeing thing that you can do. I always thought just TV, that's it. Now I'm like podcasting. That's where it's at. I mean, you're a natural, like an absolute natural at what you do. So are you guys.

Thank you. We're getting there. It started here, though. It started here. It started here. And we're happy to continue your legacy. But we also got a little bit more of you recently. You did.

At the Bachelorette reunion. Shocker. Shocker. I think he started to cry when she saw you. She definitely did. Did she? I didn't. She shared.

Yes. Oh, Katie. We were all so happy, but so, like, surprised to see you back. Nobody knew. You just showed up that day. Except for Katie behind the scenes. Okay. Katie behind the scenes, do.

Producer Katie knew. I just, yeah, I didn't. I was, like, texting a couple of girls and was like, I don't know. I don't know. It was very last minute. But I am so glad that I came. And I think that even when it was announced, once like everyone's been posting that we did this, it's like, Rachel's there?

No, literally. What happened? They said big Rach is in the building. You know what, guys, it feels like a new day. Like if I was going to come back, like I almost came back for you, Charity. I almost came back. Listen, I would have loved that. I'm like, don't tease her.

But I messaged you. But I messaged Sherry and I was like, I'm not going to come back, but here's my number. You know, text me if you need anything. but I almost did for charity. And I wasn't ready. But this seemed like the perfect time. It just feels like we're turning over a new leave, just with who's the new lead and everything.

And so I just was like, come on, Rachel. Yeah. This is it. Yeah. I was going to ask, when was the last time you reached out to a lead before their season? Was it charity? Yeah.

It hasn't been you. Yeah. Wow. That's crazy. I feel like, my goodness. 20, 23. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. She's like, yeah, that sounds about right.

I feel like ultimately, like turning over a new leaf, I completely agree. This has been such a polarizing decision. And I know that you've talked about that kind of on-hire learning that this is kind of a move that the franchise needed to make. I think so. Do you still feel that way? Yeah. For business reasons, it makes all the sits in the world. Because some people, like, of course I put up a post about it. And I think people were like, is she kidding? Is she not? And I'm like, this. This makes sense. It makes all the sense in the world.

I think it's a great decision. You know, I don't watch, I haven't watched the show in five years. Yeah. Who was the last season you watched? Who was before Katie? So Matt's season, Matt James season is the last,

which makes sense. Matt James season was the last one that I watched. But with Taylor coming in, it's like, it just makes all the sense in the world. Like, I'm excited. I watch Secret Wives of Mormon Lives. I still love reality TV.

And I, I kind of hope. I actually don't know. I take that back. I don't know if they should continue in this way. I'm so curious your thoughts. Like she's never been in the position as a contestant to be a lead. That's so hard when you don't know what they're going through.

Yeah. What are your thoughts on that? I think, Charity, I think I saw somewhere, because like, Bachelor stuff still is in my algorithm. And I think I saw you talking about maybe her struggling because she's never, been in the system before. And I was thinking like, yeah, I agree with that. I think I like the system of picking someone from before because the audience kind of knows their story and they fall in love with them.

But the audience, maybe this audience doesn't, but there is an audience that knows Taylor. So I think that people can sympathize with her and understand it. Now for Taylor, to your point that you made, I think she will struggle, which is why I think it's cool that we were able to talk to her. so hopefully give her some sort of guidance. But I think she's a little bit, she's going to be a little bit behind because this is a totally different world.

Like it's one thing to be yourself in your city with your friends, with your, I was going to say religion, but I don't think she's really tapped in like that. But just like that's like your world. This is a totally different world. It's a totally different beast. And you guys know, like even when you're a contestant, once you become the lead,

it's a completely different things. It's day and night. I think she'll struggle, but I'm kind of into the struggle. I want the dramatics of her trying to figure it out in a new way. And I think that'll be new for the audience too, because she won't know the system. So it's going to be tough for her. And I kind of want to see her work it out.

Not like I'm rooting against her, but I just think that that just adds a new element to the show. No, for sure. I think it's going to provide, like you said, an entertainment value that not to say any of the other former bachelorette's haven't provided. I mean, I kind of compare her a little bit to probably closest to Caitlin, like Caitlin Bristow. Like, yeah, a little bit of her mannerisms there. But honestly, I really do feel like Taylor is kind of in a league of her own, if that's, like, fair to say.

Yeah, no, that does. She is. It makes total sense. Now, do I think she's going to, like, am I watching the show because, I'm expecting her to like get engaged and get married. No. No. I think that she'll fall for someone.

I think it'll be entertaining. I like that she says what's on her mind. I think that she's a little rebellious. I'm into that. I, yeah. But I'm not expecting her to get married. I'm not watching for that. I wanted to ask like just going off of what we experience as a lead.

And I think even you especially, America puts you in a position where, you have to be like beyond perfect. Yeah. And what you were expected to live up to is almost impossible to reach. She's coming in and she already has all these, you know, I guess issues that society has a problem with. Yeah. But how do you feel like the way they treated us compared to the way now she's coming in and it feels like everyone's kind of fine with it? I mean, she's coming in as a hot mess.

I've said it. And I like that's, I think she would own that. I think she would own that, right? Like, it's messy. And it's, she gets it. I'm not trying to be messy in saying that, but there is a lot that she comes in with. You know, it's just, do I need to run it down?

I mean, we get it, right? Yeah. I think it's good. You know, I think to your point, what you're saying, the reason I wanted to even write a book is because I am not a perfect person. I don't have it all together. We're not normally walking around

and beaded jeweled dresses that weigh 15 plus pounds. We don't have our hair and makeup done every day. We aren't going on these, living these perfect lives, going on these perfect dates. And I think that the show has to step into 2026 and kind of get out of that antiquated view of what the most eligible woman is supposed to be

because that's kind of how in America is supposed to be. So I like that Taylor's coming in. I don't know if I find her relatable, but I think that, you know, just who she is and like some of her background is a little bit messier. And the word's not relatable. I'm struggling to find what the word is.

But I just like the change. I like the change. But I do think as a pushback, the audience that typically consumes The Bachelor, because I think you're going to get a lot of new people from, you know, social. media from Secret Lives Mormon Wines that are going to come in. And I think that's exciting for the show because I'm interested in to see what the dialogue

and the discourse is going to be. But I think old viewers will hold her to a certain standard. They will put the expectations on her of what a bachelorette's going to be. And I think that's going to be hard for her. So I still think she's going to go through what people held the standard that people held us to. And I think the new viewers, like that might be some of the conversation that's going on are going to say, no, but this is who Taylor is. and most women come in with a past of having hard relationships

and not being able to let go of that boyfriend. Like I think that's actually kind of cool. When I talked about that, there were guys that I couldn't shake, that I couldn't let go that I kept running back to. That is relatable. So the fact that we know that from her past and her story, I think will be interesting to watch as well.

Yeah, I think like going off what you were saying, I feel like in terms of the older audience or the long-term audience of the Bachelor franchise itself, they are going to be the audience that is, I guess, expecting this love story, right? And when you look at Taylor and all that she's bringing and coming in with, we're not certain if that's going to, like, play out 100%.

So, like, in a traditional aspect, that is what these long-term viewers are wanting and watching this show for. but the new viewers are going to be, you know, like Rachel said, probably relatable to what she has going on in her life. And I think that's going to be like just a constant battle. And like you said, the dialogue of like her season itself. And it may either lose the viewers that are long term of the show or like you said,

holding Taylor accountable for that. I don't know how it's going to play out. I am very curious too. But I think there is some essence of that that I feel like could be a little complicated in terms of like, you know, what what the viewers are expecting that are long-term viewers of this show. And I want to clarify something. When I say, do I think that she's going to fall, like get married and get engaged?

I'm not saying that from Taylor's point of view. Right. I think the casting has a really, it really has a hard job of finding a guy who's ready to step into Taylor's world. I guess that's more what I mean. So I want to say this in defense of Taylor. I think Taylor loves being in love. She's one of those people.

Like she really wants to find somebody and to be loved. And do I think that the reality TV is the way to do it? No. Maybe I'm jaded. But I think that, you know, do I think that maybe she needs some time and some space? Sure. But I genuinely think Taylor wants to be in love. Now, finding a guy who's ready to step in and be a parent to,

Did she have three children? Yes. To be a parent to three children, to step into maybe another reality show, to move to Utah. Because she said that she doesn't want to do that. I don't think she is going to find that guy. That's more of what I mean of do I think it's going to come. It's not her. It's the guy.

I completely agree. And I know you've been a little bit critical of casting in the past as we all have been. Have you seen the cast for this season? It's popped up. and I've scrolled. I'm not into, I'm going to watch your season, but I'm just not into the,

let me look at the guys, let me see what they like, read their resume, their age, their career, career. I was going to say something along those lines too

because I think it's hard with casting. They already are going to find these men where this show is attractive to them because they want, you know, a social media career. With Taylor, I feel like it's basically a guarantee.

if you end up with her. Yeah. So what kind of men is that going to attract? That's going to be tough. And that's a risk that she's taking by coming on the show. So I just, it's just really, it's going to be really hard for her to be able to navigate that and try to find out. She won't know until she experiences them in the real world. Celebrate your pride with the station that's as bold, vibrant and diverse as you are.

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Let's go. With IHeart Pride Canada. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 2 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that does. destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpbright became the victim of a random crime. He pulls the gun. Tells me to lie down on the ground.

He identified Tremaine Hudson as the perpetrator. Termaine was sentenced to 99 years. I'm like, Lord, this can't be real. I thought it was a mistaken identity. The best lie is partial truth. For 22 years, only two people knew the truth until a confession changed everything. I was a monster.

Listen to Burden of Guilt Season 2 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. In 2023, a story gripped the UK, evoking horror and disbelief. A nurse who should have been in charge of caring for tiny babies. is now the most prolific child killer in modern British history.

Everyone thought they knew how it ended. A verdict? A villain. A nurse named Lucy Letby. Lucy Letby has been found guilty. But what if we didn't get the whole story? The moment you look at the whole picture, the case collapses. I'm Amanda Knox, and in the new podcast, doubt the case of Lucy Lettby,

we follow the evidence and hear from the people that lived it. To ask what really happened when the world. decided who Lucy Lettby was. No voicing of any skepticism or doubt. It'll cause so much harm at every single level of the British establishment of this is wrong. Listen to Doubt, the case of Lucy Lettby on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. China's Ministry of State Security is one of the most mysterious and powerful spy agencies in the world. But in 2017, the FBI got inside.

This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. This MSS officer has no idea the U.S. government is on to him. But the FBI has his chats, texts, emails, even his personal diary. Hear how they got it on the Sixth Bureau podcast. I now have several terabytes of an MSS officer, no doubt, no question, of his life. And that's the unicorn. No one had ever seen anything like that. It was unbelievable.

This is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its fault of secrets. Listen to the Sixth Bureau on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton Eckerd, and in 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. Unfortunately, it didn't go according to plan.

He became the first Bachelor to ever have his final rose rejected. The internet turned on him. If I could press a button and rewind it all I would. But what happened to Clayton after the show made even bigger headlines. It began as a one-night stand and ended in a courtroom with Clayton at the center of a very strange paternity scandal. The media is here. This case has gone viral. The dating contract.

Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. Please search warrant. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. This is Love Trapped. This season, an epic battle of He Said She Said, and the search for accountability in a sea of lies. Listen to Love Trapped on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So I guess like going along with that, it's obviously 2026.

Is it possible to come on a show and be open to finding love and getting engaged, but also still wanting to have a. social media career? Is it possible? Sure. If you're coming on the show for a social media career, if I'm the Bachelorette, you're not the guy that I want. Hello.

So is it possible? Like to find love, sure. And I think that you can be surprised. I was surprised when I was the Bachelorette. I came on thinking I wasn't going to find anyone. I came on thinking I wasn't going to fall in love. I didn't come on for social media. I came on because I wanted, you know, I've spoken about this.

I wanted young girls who watched the show who look like me to know that they could be desired in love too. That was my main purpose. And then I was surprised to find love. That was real for me. But if a guy's coming on for fame, because is that not what a social media following is, that's fame. If that's your intention, sure, you can find love. You can be beautifully surprised. But that's, I don't want that guy.

I think two things can exist. And like Rachel said, yeah, sure. You can come on the show, hoping to find love, but also wanting a career out of this. But I think the thing with, and especially within the Bachelor franchise, I feel like other shows are a lot more honest about that. I feel like here it's this like taboo rule of like, oh, if you are honest about I want a social media following or I want this, it's like, no, no, no, don't say that. You can't say that. You're not here for the right reason. And so there is kind of this like like conversation surrounding that.

But also I think people aren't as honest about it. It's like you never hear anyone say, yeah, I want to find love. But I also like nobody has ever been honest about that. And I like not to say that it's a bad thing. But I think like if we were to be more, I don't know, if the conversation was more accepting about it like other shows, then it would be less of this thing that we were like always like kind of tiptoeing around. If that makes sense.

How would you guys feel if you, you were on the show and a guy comes up to you and says that to you. Like, yeah, like, I want to be a content creator. For me and things that I want in this life, no, like, that is just not what I'm looking for. But like, for someone like Taylor, I mean, that is her life. So perhaps she might be like, I need someone who's going to be able to make content with me all day, every day. You know? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Taylor, don't date a content creator. Like, I think you need somebody who doesn't, I mean, the first. fact that her ex is now leading dad talk. Hello. Let's talk about it's it's not even like a red flag it's like a wave it's like I don't even know it's like it's like don't date a content creator I think and also like isn't that kind of boring that's what do you date somebody who has a totally different career yeah you know that you could dive into their world and you know then they can appreciate what you do I just but you bring up such a good point that is tough I would not be able to separate, how do I know then you're not just using me for this opportunity?

How do I know that you just don't want to get to a certain point? So then you can be on Paradise or be the next lead. It's so hard with this system that is the Bachelor to be able to separate the two. Sure, it might be refreshing. I actually think the audience would probably accept it because it would be a first time thing. If someone said, well, I'm here because I'm trying to, I was a content creator before I'm trying to build my following, but I also want to fall in love, you know? But do we think we're getting that this season? I don't know. I didn't look at the careers.

Is one of them a content creator? So I'll say, yeah. I don't think any of them are, but they have been very active. One of them is for sure a content creator. How about this? They're following. I'll say this. I went through, we just did the cast bios and I was going through the Instagrams

and several have blue check marks already. Can't you pay for that, though? Exactly. You sure can. So what direction are you going? Ew. There's content being created a lot of content. Some good, but.

No, it's full on production. That's what I'm saying, have you not seen them, Rachel, because it's like I have never seen anything like this in, I mean, I've only been in this franchise. Like, I mean, their pages. I feel like we need to get the phone and scroll through a couple of them.

Right. So the cast got announced. And so as soon as they got announced, they are dropping videos. I mean, I think they all, like, did the same trend, but I'm telling you, like, full-on production value of, like, transitions, like, backdrop. I'm like, what is going on here? But, like, hey, this is, again, a new age, I guess. They definitely all own ringlights. Like, that's, we can guarantee.

And tripos, like a whole setup. I'm going to show my age because I'm going to take it back. So it's been almost, it's been 10 years since I was on The Bachelor. So, 2016, I was on The Bachelor. Because I'm going to say something about y'all's generation. of Bacheloretts, of Bachelorettes. So then 2017, you know, I'm the Bachelorette.

When I was a contestant, I didn't come with a makeup bag. The makeup I had, I had a friend helped me before get makeup. I didn't know how to do my makeup. I didn't have lash extensions. I didn't, truly, I had Vaseline, mascara, maybe some press powder.

There was no skincare routine. I learned that from, some of the girls. Fast forward to you guys coming on. The way you're talking about these guys, this is how we talked about y'all. We were like, look at them. They know how to do their makeup.

They know how to contour. They know how to, like, look at their pictures are perfect for social media. So it's kind of a sign of the times. So I'm actually going to defend the men here because is that not how they do social media in 2026? We were looking at y'all like, well, that's, I guess,

how everyone knows how to do. do their makeup. They know they know their lighting. They know their angles. We didn't know that. We looked stale. Go look at our cast pictures compared to you. That's what I'm saying it's not true because I get into it was. And Bachelor lighting, I will say, it's so like glowy and like candlelight. Like even in an interview, I think they put a filter. They have to on us because I'm like, I had no makeup on. I'm like, wait, I look good. There has to be something on that they put on us. Now they did for you for sure. Yes. Guys, go back and look at some. of this, go back and look at our social

medias, is more of what I'm saying. You guys looked picture perfect on your social media pages. So if these guys are doing the latest trend, that's kind of on point. That's kind of... That's true. That's true. So I can't get mad at it because these days, everyone lives in their phone. They live

for the content. If you're not recording it, if you're not taking a picture, did it happen? So I'm curious because how the conversations will be. Because I look, you know, 10 years later, everyone's living in their phone, they're talking like they talk on social media. Is that the conversation that I'm going to be getting from these men with Taylor? Is it going to be like, IDK? You know, I don't know, whatever the kids say. I don't know. I'm very curious as will there be like this in-depth, beautiful conversation

that we're having because we're just in a new. air where people talk like they're texting. Yeah. Truly. I'm curious. I feel like we talked a little bit about that, Rachel. Did we not when we were like kind of going over the cast bios? I was like.

We were kind of ripping them apart. Yeah, a little bit, but I am. When we went through the cast bios. So it's not good. Some are good. Some are fathers. It's an older cast. I would say everyone above the age of 28, which is like new for us.

They're above the age of 28? Youngest is 20. How many fathers? There's like four, like three or four. Okay, three. And some fathers with multiple children. Like kids. Yeah, they're giving her a very wide variety.

There's men with like there's engineers. I mean, and there was a Paralympian. We have some like impressive. On pen creators. Cowboys. Actual like job description. But I'm curious your thoughts. I think when you're the lead and you leave with someone,

we've experienced this. It is so hard for the men to allow us to have that moment to be the Bachelorette, to have the success that comes after. I feel like it's almost guaranteed that Taylor's going to have so much more success after this. Yeah. What type of guy do you think she needs to end up with that would actually stand by her when that all happens? Because I know it didn't happen for me. He like couldn't handle it. Yeah.

So who did you have? It doesn't matter. We don't say his name. Okay. Okay. Sorry. I genuinely don't know. That's the way you like it.

I don't know this man. He can walk in right now. Sorry to this man. It's so funny. I had no idea. No, literally. I have no idea. But they struggle so hard watching us.

I have a different perspective because... I'm so curious because I need to hear. Well, I thought I was with a guy who did not care. It was kind of his brand. It was something that we bragged about. It was like, oh, he lets Rachel be Rachel and he loves it and he supports it, you know, and she's got this big personality and he's way more chill. And I wanted to pick a guy who kind of let me be big and take up a lot of space and was okay with that and was secure in himself. That's why I liked that, you know, my ex was older, that he had a career.

So I really was like, I found that guy. and that's what I would want for Taylor. Now, what I underestimated was that behind the scenes, he wanted that as well. For sure. He thought that my, what I was doing would trickle down to him, that he could latch on to that. And then that would, he in turn would be the same way. What will be interesting for Taylor is Taylor does content and she brings her life. into it. For me, when I came off the show, I didn't want to do anything that was couple related.

I didn't do, it was very rare that you saw a couple content. Reels wasn't a thing back then, but I just didn't do that. I didn't make content with my ex. And I think that's something that he was expecting and that that would, you know, in turn be beneficial to him. And it wasn't. And as our relationship progressed, I realized that that was not who he was. You know what? You know what they say you're meeting somebody's representative?

I was meeting his representative. For Taylor, I would encourage her to find the guy who wants her to be that separately, which is why I don't think of content creator is great. If she brings him into her life and into her content, great. But she needs a guy who is solid and who he is, has his own life, has his own career,

and hopefully he's truly okay with that and okay with her. Like he doesn't want to be famous. He really just wants to find a person, a partner who fits his life. He wants a partner. Yep. There is, I learned the hard way

there's a difference between a person and a partner in a relationship. I am rooting for Taylor to find a partner. So she, that's the type of guy she needs. Is it a long way of saying that? Is it possible to find out on The Bachelor? Yeah, I mean, don't you guys think that you came in for the, for genuine reasons? 1,000%.

Yeah, I mean, you went on somebody else's season at a time and you were genuine about really connecting and finding someone. So it's absolutely possible. I think women do it are more genuine than the men are usually. For sure. But because with men, they're competitive. So I think part of being in the house with other men, it's about the competition. So it's absolutely possible. I hate to be cheesy.

It's just about finding the right reasons. But Taylor's got to find the guy who is solid in what he's doing. Now, see, I should have known very quickly because what did I say? I picked a guy who had a career, who was older, who was solid in his life. My ex quit his job one week after the show was over. It was there. It was in front of me. Yeah.

And never did that again. never went back to that. He never went back to the career he originally came in with? He opened up a business in that field, but it took years for it to happen, and it wasn't the same as what he was doing before. So I think if Taylor finds a guy who's solid in what they're doing, and then they quit it immediately. If they're quitting it to move to Utah and, you know, establish whatever it is there, if they're a doctor or lawyer or whatever, I don't know. But that would be a red flag. Yeah.

Yeah. I'm like referencing when we did the Bachelorette reunion and like, you know, how we kind of broke off into groups and, you know, some words that I feel like were shared with Taylor at that moment was exactly what you said. I remember like me and Jojo, Joan, Trista and Des. We were all basically trying to find, I guess, similarities that all of our like guys kind of shared, which were like more reserved. They were very secure and solid in themselves. They didn't feel like, you know, whatever we were doing. was like a threat to, you know, who they were. And that was such a long and lengthy conversation that I really hope Taylor, like, took in and digested and really like, try to like, I guess, put into what makes sense in her life because it's exactly what you're saying. It's like when she meets these guys, granted, yes, the guys should be there for the right reasons. But ultimately, there is like a level of responsibility that's going to be on Taylor for her to be able to to like decipher and, you know, discern between whatever traits these guys are presenting or asking these right questions that aren't just surface level questions to these guys to really get

down of like, based off of how much they're showing you granted on air. And as we know, life really begins once the camera stop rolling truly. That's like the true test of it all. But I think there's like, you know, it really is 50-50. Like Taylor also has a role to play in this of how much is she going to be willing to kind of step out of her comfortability of what she's already used to versus like what she needs and i think that's like for a lot of bachelorette's it's very hard to do the newest tracks let's go new music and the next big thing always on the new music first your first place to hear it all because you're going to like it love her want to play it twice playing now high heart new music your digital station for brand new drops fresh fun

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until a confession changed everything. I was a monster. Listen to Burden of Guilt Season 2 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. In 2023, a story gripped the UK, evoking horror and disbelief. The nurse who should have been in charge of caring for tiny babies is now the most prolific child killer in modern British history. Everyone thought they knew how it ended.

A verdict, a villain, a nurse named Lucy Lerner. Letby. Lucy Letby has been found guilty. But what if we didn't get the whole story? The moment you look at the whole picture, the case collapses. I'm Amanda Knox, and in the new podcast, Doubt the case of Lucy Lettby, we follow the evidence and hear from the people that lived it, to ask what really happened when the world decided who Lucy Lettby was.

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I'm Clayton Eckerd, and in 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. Unfortunately, it didn't go according to plan. He became the first Bachelor to ever have his final Rose rejected. The internet turned on him. If I could press a button and rewind it all I would. But what happened to Clayton after the show? made even bigger headlines. It began as a one-night stand

and ended in a courtroom with Clayton at the center of a very strange paternity scandal. The media is here. This case has gone viral. The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you.

Please search for it. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. This is love-trapped. This season, an epic battle of He Said She Said, and the search for accountability in a sea of lies.

Listen to Love Trapped on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Can I be honest, though? And I, yeah, see, it's possible. She just listed off all the people that are still unsuccessful, including yourself, successful, healthy relationships for the right reasons. I have to be honest, though.

I used to say to the relationship starts when the cameras go off. The relationship really starts when the bubble bursts, right? Because you're still in, you're still popular. You're still in the honeymoon phase. For me longer, because I was the first black bachelorette, I thought, okay, we're moving to the same city. There are no cameras. We didn't move to L.A.

like so many people at my time were doing, we're in Dallas, we're living a normal life, but we weren't. There were so many events. There were trips that we were going on. It wasn't a real life. So it really starts when you're waking up in the morning and you're going to your job or you're, you know, like you're living a more normal life. So I think that's something that we have, the conversation we have to have. Now with Taylor, it's different. She's a reality TV star. Her normal life is, is the camera's picking back up. So it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, even harder for her, but that is, it's really when the, you step out of the cloud, you know, like everything starts to be normal. There aren't people following your every move. They aren't

people like you're living. Like how many years are you, you're probably there now. You're probably. Yeah, we're like, yeah, we're two years out, about to be three in April. So it's like, it's very much declined. It's died down. Yeah. Like it really was just about you and not the show. because I realized our conversations were about The Bachelor and what was going on and I was podcasting and it was still so such a big piece. I feel like when I really stepped away and we didn't have The Bachelor,

it was kind of like, that was so much of our relationship. That was so much of it. So that's really when you get down to it. Yeah. Yeah. That is, well, just to share, like something that I really struggled with, like leaving. I only had two happy couples before we broke up,

but we could not have a conversation that wasn't revolving around The Bachelor, but I know that you famously in your fantasy suite were having really difficult conversations. You inspired me when I went into mine, okay, we need to talk about politics, we need to talk about finance. Do you think that's something that she's going to do?

No. Sorry. I actually am dying. I think there'll be conversations about parenthood, you know. I think there's going to be conversations about moving to Utah maybe, but. Yeah. Nothing further. No, and Rachel's not wrong.

I'm like, Rachel, I thought about you in my fantasy sweet. No, literally. I'm like, literally I did. I'm doing everything that I need to do. I was like, Rachel Lindsay said as this is this going into that week, I thought it. And you could only do so much, right? Like, I really did ask those questions. I hope Taylor does.

I think there will be serious conversations, but I don't think that it's like what's important to you, right? I don't think politics are as important. I don't think that's a deal breaker for her. For sure. So, you know, for her, maybe it's religion. Maybe it's definitely going to be parenthood. It's definitely going to be about moving to her city.

But I'm glad you did because you can only do so much, right? Like I definitely ask questions about politics, but maybe I didn't ask as in depth, you know? like I wasn't like didn't ask what you're registered. I didn't ask. And I just like it just, there was like some values and morals and I didn't ask how you vote. I didn't ask like different things like that.

But yeah, that was something that was important to me. Maybe I should have said like how well versed are you on politics. Yeah, that that's. I asked. Charity did you? I'm glad. I did.

Oh, I did. 100%. Yeah. Especially the time we came in and like, we need to know there's some important things we have to go over here. Yeah. I just think I said, are you a Republican? Yeah. Like, I think that was like

as I was going down my list, it was just for him like that. Also, like the times were different. It's 2017. I think it's, you have to have different conversations. It's really a true. Now, like, things have changed so much. But, yeah, I was like, credit scores and, you know, I think I would have asked,

this is so saying a lot. Like, I think is so petty right now. I'm working on a book, you guys. But I think I would have said, Things like, you know, how are you with money? How do you manage money? You know what? I didn't ask, do you want to be famous?

I didn't ask those type of questions. Do you, how do you see this relationship, you know, with the fame that will come with this? You know, do you think that, you know, like, do you want to capitalize on that? I didn't ask those type of questions. Is it important to you that we monetize our relationship? Like we were different when it came to that kind of stuff. Like I didn't think about that because that wasn't important to me. I just was kind of like, oh, the things you're not supposed to talk about.

But I wish I would have gone even more in depth. So, you know, to future bacheloretts, maybe those are questions that you should ask. Like, how do you want to move to a different thing? Like, what's important to you? Why, like, maybe do, are you a content creator? You know, maybe you couldn't say that. Is social media important to you? I just wish I would have thought of it in that way.

Yeah. I want to ask too, when you had left your season and started seeing these signs in Ryan, what was it that ultimately made you look over them? Ooh, I'm going to write about this. Anything you can share. Oh, no, no, no. It's a great question because I was 32. When I was, I turned 32 during my season of The Bachelorette.

had a birthday when we were filming. And I was at a place in my life where, like, I grew up in a pragmatic, religious family from the South. So I was in a culture where a lot of my friends were married. They were having kids. I had put my career first. I do not regret that by any means. But I was, like, ready to get married and settled down. And I wanted somebody who kind of mirrored that. And I felt, even though, so post the Bachelorette, Like it's like why everybody talks about, oh, the Brian, the Peter of it all. I didn't pick, despite popular belief, I didn't pick him because he wanted to. Like there were other reasons, but that was a factor.

I was always going to pick somebody who also wanted to, was ready for marriage. That is a factor. It wasn't the only reason. But I would, I felt a lot of societal pressure that I needed to be married. maybe I put some of it on myself. I felt that just with what society tells you as a woman. And I was ready to have kids. And so it was kind of like, okay, Rachel, what are you willing to accept?

Maybe he's not as ambitious as he had advertised himself to be. Maybe he's, you know, a little bit more into the fame of the Bachelor and the attention that comes with that than you are. But I felt like he was a good person. felt like he had good values. I liked the family that he was like into his family. And so that was important to me. And I thought I can get past, you know, if I'm going to be the breadwinner. Like, that wasn't important to me that I needed somebody to make more money than me. I just was kind of like, okay, he seems like a good person. I don't want to start over. I don't want to go back out there again. And I just kind of settled and accepted some things. They weren't the flags at that time. The time

we got married weren't as big for me to say, I don't need to marry this person. That kind of came after once we married and moved to L.A. It got worse. It got bigger. But yeah, if I didn't put that pressure on myself, I probably would not have gotten married. I just felt like I needed to make it happen. I didn't want to fail. That was the other thing.

I felt a lot of people were like, can she be loved? She puts her career above everything. Work is so important to her. And I didn't want people to say, here she is again. She can't be loved or it's not important to her. So that was another thing that I put on me. I listened to a lot of that. They did paint you even in your exit interview as that.

As someone who she just can't find it, she has everything. Then they present you with this opportunity. You chose the person who you thought would be the one at the end that would stand next to you. And then it falls through. So, yeah. I feel that because that's how I felt when mine failed. It's like they just created this entire show around me. Yeah.

And now I'm going to end it over something so small. I get, I get how you feel. Did you, because I know you're mentioning like a lot of like, oh, okay, you're, you know, your upbringing and a lot of your friends were getting married, a lot of those factors. But was there anything like that was super specific to the show itself of like, oh, I'm the first black bachelorette. I, you know, found my person on this show, like, I have to go through with this. Like, was that, like, a really immense pressure for you to be like, I need to make this work?

I think it wasn't being the first black bachelorette, but yeah, it was how public our relationship was that I felt the pressure to see it through. It was kind of like, I don't know if this is just within women. It's like, I don't want to quit. I've put so much into this. And I'm typically private in my relationships. And I put so much into this. and I've put so much into it in such a public way. And, well, no, maybe it was being the first black bachelorette

because I would get so many messages that were like, thank you for saying you ripped up your list and, you know, you just went for it. You know, thank you for, you know, stepping outside of your box. I look at you and I'm so happy that your relationship is so successful and you give me hope. I got a lot of that. and yeah, I felt like I was letting people down.

And I just was like, I'm a fixer, right? So I was like, I can fix it. It'll be better. I can encourage him in some of the ways that I think that, you know, that I, that I, that were advertised to me. Like, I was like, you know, like that, they'll be better. Like, we can work through this. We're a partnership.

We're a team. You know, I did that in the relationship before I was in. I was in a long-term relationship before I came on the show. And I kind of knew it was over, but I still was like, Not that I knew this was over before marriage, but I just was just like, we'll work on it. I'll fix it. I'll fix it because he's a good guy. I always fell back on he's a good guy.

He is not a good guy. I just want to be honest. I do not think that now. And that could have changed with the dynamic of our relationship, the show, the fame, the desire for certain things. I think that there were a lot of underlying feelings that maybe turned him in. And maybe, maybe, I don't know, my therapist says it was always there. But I keep saying it maybe turned him into something. It brought him something out.

But I, all that to say, I kept falling back on, he's a good person. He's a good person. Why do I need to go back out there if I found somebody who was good? The other stuff might be a little superficial. I was lying to myself a little bit. But yes, I felt pressure that I was letting people down. But I also did not want to fail. I think the bigger thing was people,

are going to say she can't be loved. And that's sad, though. Men don't necessarily do that. Have you ever heard any of the bachelors say that? No, ever. It's like kind of the, I don't want to say curse of a woman, but I'm reading this book about the patriarchy, so I say this a lot. Tell us. It's called erased. It's great.

I've been reading it for a while, but I think it's just a part of the patriarchy and what it tells us our roles are as women in society. and I still felt held by those standards. I was 34 when I got married, so 32 coming off the show, it's like there's certain things I wanted for myself and I felt like at that age I needed to have them. Could I have them with this person? At the time, I felt like, yes,

so I can look past some of the other things to get some of the other desires that I want in life. And, you know, that's sad. I don't live that way now, but I want to write about it because I feel like a lot of us do. We still do. We don't want to, but we still feel that pressure.

I mean, you have done, I mean, so much before the franchise, you came in so successful and you have just completely launched, I feel like, into a different league. And we all love you and support you. But do you think there was a point that he started to, like, resent you a little bit for all that success? A hundred percent. Were there ever conversations he, like brought up to you? Like, was that something he just like kept to himself? Obviously, that's what resentment is.

But did you guys ever talk about that? No, but I think I had resentment too. I had my own resentment for different reasons. Not think I know. I had resentment too. And like you said, you keep it quiet. So I wasn't talking about what I was resenting him for. Just like I don't think he was not, I don't think.

I don't think. I know he wasn't talking to me about what he was resenting me for. But it definitely was there because all of that came out with the way our divorce went down. It didn't have to be that way by. any means when I was because I read about my divorce in page six I read about the details I had no idea what he had filed for or anything what he was requesting he talked me right before he texted me right before um like we had said we'd said two days before we both I was like I want a divorce he was like yeah me too he'd said it we'd said it so I was like cool we're on the same page it's gonna be amicable

and then he went to page six and then he he says no he says he didn't but he He texted me and said, hey, I just filed. And then... Because he wanted to beat you to it. For sure. And he said, hey, I just, I didn't even have an attorney. Like, I truly was like, oh, it's going to be hypocopal. It's going to be so great.

We're like, we both want this. Like, that's like the best thing, you know, that you could hope for it if you're getting a divorce. That it's a mutual thing. If it comes to that. But, yeah, I didn't, he didn't serve me with papers. He texts me about it. So I was like, oh my God, this is going to hit the media. And then boom, it hit.

And so I was learning about it like everybody else was. I didn't know what he had filed it under. I didn't know what he was requesting. I didn't know any of that. But my first response, though, and I don't want to give too much detail because I'm worried about it. My first one, I had to tell my family. Nobody knew. I hadn't said anything yet.

You didn't tell your family? I had said anything yet. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I didn't. Nobody knew. Nobody knew except for. for this is the only person who knew okay there are two people who knew after we had had the conversation because it's late at night it was New Year's Eve that's not a secret so New

Year's Day it's a holiday the only people who knew that we were getting a divorce was my wealth management guy and who's a friend and Justin Sylvester who we left that's the only people I had said at the moment because I was just kind of like it was like surreal but I was I was I kind of was on a high because it was like for the first time at a long time I know exactly what I'm doing in my relationship and we're on the same page So all that to say the the way that the divorce was handled lets me know that there was a lot of resentment And I was getting information from somebody where I learned that there was a lot of resentment about The way our relationship progressed but again it was both for different reasons but we both

both had it. Did you find out through the article about the spousal support? That's where you found out. You're kidding. Yeah, I found out because I wasn't served with papers. It was just a text message and he was still living with me. And, you know, we... Oh my God. So, yeah, that morning we had had a conversation and then he left for work and then I got a text message like 30 minutes later. So he couldn't even tell you in person. Like literally, like you were just with, literally just with him. Wow. And it was like kind of like a kind of like a text message like 30 minutes later. So he couldn't even tell you in person. Like literally. And it was like, kind of like a sad, it was like a quick conversation because I wasn't being emotional yet

about it because it was, I kind of just like went in overdrive. It was like, okay, so I gotta, I'm gonna have to do this, I'm gonna have to do this, I'm gonna have to do this. And I was just kind of like, it was like a to do list in my mind. And yeah. So it, I, we, it was kind of like

that morning, it was like, I think you think I don't care because I haven't shown any emotion. And we kind of, it was like really brief. But like he kind of said something. And I said something and then he left and sent a text message that said like, hey, I just filed. And I was like, wait, what? I go, what? Wow.

That was, and that was it. So, yeah. Wow. I didn't even stay home that night. I like went to Cary's. Oh, stop. Oh, my gosh. He was out of town because the wedding, the Bachelor, the Golden Bachelor wedding was going on at that time.

But yeah, no, he filed. My case filing is number one. For 2024, 0-0-0-0-0-1. Number one. So, number one. Okay, you guys, there is so much more to get into with Rachel, so make sure you listen tomorrow for Part 2. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 2 podcast.

This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpbright became the victim of a random crime. The perpetrator was sentenced to 99. years until a confession changed everything. I was a monster. Listen to Burden of Guilt Season 2 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Amanda Knox, and in the new podcast, Doubt, the case of Lucy Letby, we unpack the story of an unimaginable tragedy that gripped the UK in 2023. But what if we didn't get the whole story?

The moment you look at the whole picture. the case collapsed? What if the truth was disguised by a story we chose to believe? Oh my God, I think she might be innocent. Listen to Doubt, the case of Lucy Lettby, on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton Eckerd. In 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor.

But here's the thing. Bachelor fans hated him. If I could press a button and rewind it all I would. That's when his life took a disturbing turn. A one-night stand would ever. end in a courtroom. The media is here. This case has gone viral.

The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. Listen to Love Trapped on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Jay Shetty, host of the on-purpose podcast. I'm joined by Luke Combs, award-winning country music artist and one of the most authentic voices in music today. The guy that says he's always going to be there and that will do anything to be

there is the only guy that's not there. No matter what, I'm going to prioritize my wife and my children. I dread the conversation with my son. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Chetty on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. In 2018, the FBI took down a ring of spies working. for China's Ministry of State Security, one of the most mysterious intelligence agencies in the world. The Sixth Bureau podcast is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its fault of secrets. Listen to the Sixth Bureau on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

This is an IHeart podcast, guaranteed human.