Bad Hasbara - The World's Most Moral Podcast - 141: Livestream fundraiser with Noura Erakat

Episode Date: September 10, 2025

Here is the audio version of our livestream fundraiser with guest Noura Erakat. To donate to the Gaza City Flour Fund please click this link! http://bit.ly/gazaflourfundSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/bad-hasbara/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

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Ontario. Hello, everybody, and welcome to Bad Hasbara. The World's Most Moral Podcast, live for 2025, you suckers. Yeah, Prit, Prit, Prit, Prit, Prit, Prit, Prit, Prit, Prit, Prit. Yeah, thank you. Thank you so much to Lizzie, friend of the pod, Savetsky. Thank you guys so much. My name is Matt Lieb.

will be our most moral co-host for this live stream. I'm Daniel Matte, the other one. Hello, hello, hello, we're doing it. We're doing it live. That means nothing can get cut without people noticing. That's right. And I can take as many bathroom breaks as I want. That's right.

Does it mean that? It does, because the other option is I just sit here and piss yourself. Soil myself or piss myself. And, you know, we don't have enough Patreon members for me to provide that kind of content. That's true. That's true. That is on our super secret fansly page in which if you are a big piggy,

we will roll around in the shift for you for money. That makes us pigs. Anyways, so excited for you guys to be here for another wonderful episode. Another wonderful live stream. This live stream once again is a fundraiser for the Gaza City Flower Fund, a.k.a. Mosen in North Gaza, who is doing his level best to try to feed up to, I think it's at this point, 300 families in North Gaza and in Gaza City, trying to make sure that they can eat because, I don't know if you guys know this, but Israel is doing a genocide. So that's fucked up. And we're trying our best to get them enough money so that they, can you know purchase whatever they can to make sure people can eat the link will be i mean you see it above me but you should also see the link in the chat um it'll it'll be placed in the chat

a lot so please start donating you know immediately um you know just uh do it now uh do it early and do it often and in parallel with that help us get more people watching us live by liking the video by sharing the video everywhere you can by sending it to friends and family get people over here watching because this is where the cauldron of peer pressure to donate is and the more you know molecules we have in the in the beaker the more explosive the reaction will be yes in terms of generating interest and funding yes we're trying to make we're trying to make a nice and explosive for everybody, really trying to get everybody, you know, donating whatever they can. Right now, again, you know, we're not good at the whole live stream, you know, fundraiser thing.

So what we have is an amount that I see here, which is, what is it, 71,000 pounds, 609 pounds right now, currently on the Chuffed website that was put together by Harley. Shout out to Harley, who's been helping actually get the money to Mosen. So, yeah, we'll just be doing some math. And as that amount goes up, we'll let you know how much we made, you know? And Harley is in the chat. Is Harley in the chat? Yeah, Harley is in the chat.

Harley can answer your questions. Yes. I believe we do have a link in the description. If we don't, we can... Oh, the link isn't clickable in the description. So that link isn't clickable. So a link in the description would be easier. Okay, yes.

Is there not a link in the description? I guess not. Listen, we never said we were competent. All we said was we will do it. We are looking into it. Yes, we're looking into it right now. But yes, if you see, you know, the bar up there where you type in URLs, bit. dot ly slash gaza flower fund go ahead and do that uh if there's a way to put it in the the

description of course we will um but for now you know just spam it into the into the comment section do that um that way more people can you know at least copy and paste it um yeah so uh like i said today's episode is brought to you by gaza city flower fund this whole show is brought to you by that But Daniel, do you have a spin for this week? Are we spinning? I do have a spin. Daniel, what's the spin? All right, word.

Well, this is actually an extra, extra girthy spin because I found so many that fit this category. I was at a used, or not used, this was this new, but at a record store. And I found this compilation called Girls with Guitar is Know Why. Do they? I don't know which, like, what why they're referring to. Why not? But it's just, it's like girl groups from like the 60s, Goldie and the Gingerbreads, Debbie Williams and the Unwritten Law,

the wrong black bag of the chicks, the debutants. Anyway, I thought, well, which girls with guitars groups do I have in my collection? This is a really cool group called Fannie Hill from the 1970s. A couple of Filipino American sisters and a couple of white girls, women. Fannie Hill. They do a Beatles cover here, Hey Bulldog, and some other really cool stuff. Yeah, it's an excellent album. I like it.

It's called Fanny, I think. A group I had four crushes on as a kid, the Bengals. Oh, yes, yes. Featuring, you know, Walk Like an Egyptian and Manic Monday, written by, who wrote Manic Monday there, Matt? Garfield. Prince. Prince. But Garfield's a good guest.

Yeah, I mean. Good guest, yeah. It could have been Garfield. Yeah, yeah, he'd wrote, he'd write Manic Depressive Monday. The feminist punk group The Slits, or at least they're sort of feminist. In addition to the song, Typical Girls, there's an amazing cover of, I heard it through the grapevine on here. Oh, I love that. The Runaways, Lita Ford and Joan Jett and all them.

Hell yeah, hell yeah. They were teenagers when they recorded this. There's some like almost musical theatery kind of like storytelling tracks on there. The Breeders, Kim and Kelly Deals group. Oh. On this album, they were an all-woman group. On their more hit album, Last Splash, they had a male drummer, but this is Pod, their first. You know what?

I did not know that Kim Deal had another band. Oh, she sure did. I just learned that just now. Yeah, and she got to do more than just play bass and do cute backups for Black Francis. Um, she sings. Yeah, she's the lead singer. And she actually has a really lovely, uh, solo album that came out recently. I need to check that out.

Oh, by the way, just, uh, I'm going to point this out again, um, chuffed doesn't take Discover card. Uh, so, uh, you can put your money in the super chat, all super chats, all, you know, income from the stream is going straight to, you know, Gaza's city flower fund. So if you want to super chat your money, you can do that. Um, but chuffed is the preferred method, because otherwise I have to, like, you know, I have to do a bunch of, like, looking at the thing and it takes a while for Google to send the money.

It's very annoying. Yeah. Try to circumvent Google if possible, but, of course, super chats all go to Gaza City Flower Fund. So please send them. Very good. And finally, from the early 90s, Babes and Toyland, very dark metal group that there's a song on here called Bruce Violin. about Courtney Love. She was frenemised

with Courtney Love and features the lyric, You Fucking Bitch. Well, I hope your insides rot. It's a great, great song, great album. I remember them. I think I saw them open for Faith No More in 1992. Oh, I saw the spin today. That is what is spinning. Mosen is in the chat. Shout out to Mosen, thank you for being here. Apparently, I am blurry.

My internet has been sucking ass lately. I don't know why. I want to try something, but I'm scared that it'll fuck up the stream. So I don't know what to do exactly about my blurry face other than to say like

hey guys, sorry I'm blurry, maybe look at Daniel. Like Daniel's you know, he's, he looks good, you know? Azalea Jane, why are you asking Adam or Matt what on the ones or twos means? I'm clearly the hip-hop fan. On the ones and twos is the turntable.

one and turntable two it's a dj term that's right that's right and uh i respect the fact that you thought i would know that more than daniel and i appreciate that a lot it's very nice when the audience uh is like you know who else is smart matt yeah for matt is also smart man someone someone was like daniel's the o g or daniel's not the only musical genius on this team And someone else is like, what are you talking about? Matt's the OG musical genius on this. That's right. Have you ever listened to Pod Yourself a Gun?

To which I have to say, fair enough. Yeah, yeah. Listen, we both come from a background of music, some more respected than others. But I would say that a lot of people respect the fact that I did. Some of us got a graduate degree from NYU. Some of us were on the streets busking Bone Thugs in Harmony. Right.

Some of us know every lyric to every Bone Thugs song and know how to play on guitar. And some people actually are such renowned lyrics writers that the children of the Beatles will sometimes hang out with them. I mean, listen, all I'm saying, some people could be anybody. The point is that Daniel's more respected in his industry than I am, whereas I do have a group of people who do respect the fact that I wrote a parody song, for every episode of The Wire.

And, you know, that's great. I respect that madly. I do, too. So, thank you. And Adam's complaining that we're not talking about Scott. Motherfucker, I had Desmond Decker on my shelf a couple of weeks ago. If I knew ska, I would talk about it. I don't know Scott.

I know real big fish, and I know the guy who wrote the mozzarella stick joke. This is my contribution to ska. In fact, I think I am inadvertently responsible for a very, scaw-based meme that only scoff people know about ska band names annoy me without even hearing the music like the mighty mighty boss tones right yeah okay you're from boston the boss tones also like aquabats aquabats i don't like that are they ska i don't know adam are they scaw it doesn't matter people are just people are tuning in like what is this is there a band called scofface

Oh, see, that's a great name. So we have a lot of stuff to get to. I do not worry. Hi, thanks for having us on your live stream the other day. Yes, thank you so much. I'm glad that we have some Do Not Worry people here, a lot of crossover. Thank you for being here as well. And remember, donate, donate, donate, you know.

Nura would be here in a while, folks. She had a previous engagement. Yeah. She will be with us shortly. I won't say momentarily, but shortly. I really love the fact that there's probably a good amount of people in here who are just like, you think Nora's backstage just listening to this shit? If Nora doesn't come on in 30 minutes, I'm, I'm fucking out of here.

I can't stand anymore. God damn talk about ska. No, we have some content for you before Nora shows up. And I want to start with this. This was sent to me by a bunch of people, a few friends who, wanted me to watch this and then I just had to show everyone. By the way, folks, if you refresh your browser, the link should now be in the YouTube description. Yes, that's right. That's right. So a lot of

friends sent me this and I just want to show you. This is someone listening, someone posted this on TikTok of them listening to a commercial that came on the radio that shocked and appalled them. And I want you guys all to hear it as well we are witnessing the rise of anti-Semitism around the world like never before for many poor elderly Jews their dream of making aliyah one day and coming home to Israel is extremely difficult if not impossible but you can change all of that today for one precious Jew I pause hold on a second one precious Jew one it's my it's my favorite boys to men Slow Joan. But there are many poor... Just the picture of Golm holding a Jew.

My precious. What's Lodgers, precious? Juses are tricksy, precious. Jusies are false. Curse them. Curse them! Anyways. No, nobody likes Jews.

go away and never come back he's just telling jews to go to israel make alia and never come back oh my god one precious jew dude and the idea that there are i mean there are poor elderly jews okay there are some jews in in the category of poor people i mean i think yes all over the place all over the place yeah but you imagine them just sitting in their like rocking chairs wondering when they're going to finally get to live their dream of moving to Israel like they didn't do it earlier and that's all they want they don't want a hot meal they don't want to visit yeah they don't want to go for a walk in central park or whatever city they live in right they want to get on a plane and move to an entirely new place learn a new language it's like that commercial out of fucking better call

Saul, you know, when Jimmy makes this thing, you know, about I never got my money for a rancher or whatever the fuck it was going. Yeah. Yeah. It's so strange because it's like the way that they talk about Jews in commercials like these

and this is not, this is not like some, you know, a one-off thing. No, this is a genre. This is a genre of infomercial. But yeah, the way they talk about them is very clearly coming from a place of of no one knowing any Jews.

Like it is because if you know literally any Jews, all you're doing is thinking about like your grandparents or your friends' grandparents, you're like sitting in their house watching fucking reruns on TV. And then all of a sudden a group of Christians kicks down the door and airlifts you out of fucking, you know, Tampa and takes you to Israel. That's crazy.

The only thing poor elderly Jews are, wishing they had gotten to do was more cruises. Right. Yes. Exactly. Yes. As they're on their deathbed, the first thing they think is, I wish I had experienced more buffets. I wish I'd

eaten the shrimp. Yeah, I should have had the shrimp. Yeah, that's it. Yeah. Oh, I should have had the shrimp. That will be my dad's last words. I should have had the shrimp. I was arguing about a bill. as they die all right here's the rest of it is real i shouldn't have tipped that much yeah yeah

this covenant promise to bring his chosen people home is why we're asking you today to partner with us the cost to rescue one jew and purchase a seat on an upcoming fellowship aliah freedom flight is seven hundred and ten dollars with a donation to the international fellowship of christians and jews of thirty five dollars he'll help one poor elderly jew have a life of hopelessness and Anti-Semitism to start a brand new life in Israel. Cut to a park in Dallas, Texas, you know? Come over here. I want you to meet my new Jew. He's a rescue.

Yeah, he's a rescue. We're sending him. We're training him. We're house-breaking him so we can send him to Israel. Wow. He's a rescue and he's a pure breed. Wow. Dude, I love calling it a rescue mission. Like, just you can't, you can't take, here's what they're doing with these commercials. Is a lot of it kind of repeats sort of Soviet era propaganda where it was like, you know,

and it's not to say that there weren't Jews in danger in Soviet Russia. There's Jews and dangers in the United States also during this time. It was like the idea that like now there's elderly Jews at home watching Fox News hearing about how there's like encampments and they're like, we need to rescue this old Jew out of a life of hopelessness. Please give us $710, very specific amount of money so we can rescue them. I found like years ago, I think I was in college and I was like staying up late and I found And I was, as I was watching it, I saw a commercial that was essentially this and I finally

found it again. It was a program called the, uh, uh, on wings of eagles. And, uh, it was like an hour long, uh, program about how you can give money to, you know what it was like? It was like those commercials about like starving children. Yeah, with Sally Struthers. Yes, with Sally Struthers, but it was about like Jews. It's just, uh, so I, I, I, I, i need to play a little bit because i finally found that as well and it's uh it's wild the christian zionism is uh pretty fucking wild here it is never you can give will show that christians and jews can join together in saving lives and bringing biblical prophecy to life today the word of god says in jeremiah behold the days oh john hagi yeah yeah here's young john hagi yeah looking good

He's the crying guy, right? I mean, they're all the crying guy. But isn't he one of the famous I have sinned guys who... Probably. Yeah. But he certainly is either still around or has been around until very recently. Yeah. I also love...

I don't know if you guys caught this little wink, wink, nudge to the apocalypse here. We're together in saving lives and bringing biblical prophecy to life today. So, in case... you guys don't know and I don't know how much we've actually covered like a Christian Zionist prophecy and a lot of that has to do with the fact that is as important of an ally as Christian Zionists are I there's with me I want to be clear in you know like I don't like to blame everything on Christian Zionists I think that is it can be a little bit of a cop out you know people tend to be like you know the the real you know sinus problem is all the Christians and

It's like, yeah, but let's not let ourselves off the hook here. Our institutions and our institutional community is also ripe with fucking Zionism. So let's not pretend as if we are helpless, you know, just passengers on this fucking flight. No, but it is worth talking about. I recently met someone who has done some deep investigations and art projects around Christian Zionism. I'm hoping to get her on the podcast sometime soon. Oh, yeah, for sure. I mean, it is, it is fascinating because it is like once you see this piece of the puzzle, I mean, for those of you haven't, I'd be surprised because of this podcast subject matter. But the Christian Zionist piece is just so necessary for the amount of support that you see in the United States for Israel from actual people, not just from like, you know, paid off government officials and politicians. It's like actual people. believe in this end of days bullshit where the prophecy that's the explicit pitch you can press for

fast forward on the you know for horsemen of the apocalypse yes yes all you have to do is make sure that every jew is sent to israel which is just i always think it's so funny that that is like you know like a good friend a good friend does every is level best to kick you out of to deport you to deport you Christ. Yeah, I'm deporting you for Christ. And then, of course, once we're there, we all, you know, as soon as Jesus comes back, we either convert or die. So, you know, friends, here's more of it. Behold the days are coming, set the Lord, when they shall no longer say, blessed is the Lord God that brought us up out of Egypt, which is Exodus 1. But they shall say, blessed is the Lord that brought us from the north part, which is Russia. In other words, It is a biblical thing for us to help Jewish people come to the nation of Israel. It's a biblical thing.

For only $350, you can help airlift one desperate Jews. Returns. $350 returns one Russian Jew to Israel. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Returns. Very important. They were... Why do we have to pay for the shipping to send these Jews back?

Yeah. Can't we do it COD? Batteries not included. Just, I want you to just listen to the way he says, Desperate Jew and just leers for only three hundred fifty dollars you can help airlift one desperate Jew to safety and freedom in the holy land of Israel one desperate Jew you can mom it's very cartman right but mom I want to send one desperate Jew from my skin back to the Israeli game okay honey buddy but mom this is that the apocalypse will happen oh no

just say, Eric, you have to ask the Jew if he wants to go back to Israel, I'm kind. You can't just send him back to Israel, I'm kind. $1,400 will pay for a needy married couple and $1,400 for a family. I'm sorry. $700 will pay for a needy married couple. Why are they needy? I love they're a needy married couple. They're not just a married couple.

They're just like, you know, they're married Jews. They're nagging at each other. they're like oh i want this kind of lamp like it's also bullshit like it's 350 to return one russian jew and $700 to return a married couple there's no discount right that's just why not just 350 times two what's the point in them being married then and why do they have to be needy like i'm just like you're already not offering like a discount on two but you're still going to give them fucking i don't know man that's not nice description of them. They need some Jews running this sale. We'd have some wholesale discounts.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah, exactly. Welcome to Irving's clearance warehouse of needy Russian Jews. Yeah. Come down before Shabbas. Talk to me. We'll make a deal. Exactly. You can get 10 Jews all in one van. Listen, you're not going to get this deal in the air up set out of town. Yeah, exactly. Don't trust a Christian to move your Jewish family. $300 for a family of four. When you call with a gift of $350 or more, when the person or people you sponsor arrive, you'll receive a postcard from Israel with their names

and where they are from in the former Soviet Union so that you can continue to bless them with your prayers. Please call now while the door is still open for their flight to freedom. Oh, it is. You mean like before the gate closes? There's an iron curtain, right? So I guess there was a brief opening in the Iron Curtain.

Now, listen, it is not untrue that there were programs both in America and in Israel to, you know, have Russian Jews emigrate to one or the other. I know a few Russian Jews personally who were part of that, who were Soviet Jews and moved. And they had a choice. You know, they were like, you know, going to go to Israel. They're going to go to the United States. and a lot of times they went to the United States, a lot of times they went to Israel. It's not to say that, like, in general,

I'm not talking shit about people who do fear for themselves or whatnot moving to safety. My problem is just the way the paternalism of a Christian Zionist is unmatched because it comes from a place of literally not knowing Jews. Yes. Like, not being friends with one, not being surrounded by any literally just being like the jew is this concept i have of uh of a scared guy yeah and it's like we need to help these scared guys please give our organization money a scared

guy that we can trade in as currency on jesus return yes exactly sort of uh human nfts you know these guys non non functional a non fungible Torah reader yeah there we go yeah yeah yeah the non non functional non fungible talmudic guy Talmudian yeah but it's it is just I love it the Christian Zionism in general is always been one of the funniest aspects of Zionism to me because it

it relies on it's like jews know that the whole prophecy thing is like obviously fairy tale shit so if you're being offered by an avowed christian anti-semi essentially to like you know we're going to move you to israel and in exchange you're going to go to hell when jesus comes back yeah most you know israelis are like sure buddy whatever you say like it doesn't matter it's not real so it's it really is just a deal that works out only for Israelis yeah oh it's great it's really wonderful stuff yeah yeah yeah we have a we have a we have a sinus troll in the chat who thinks it's an own to reveal mat to docks you that in fact you are you're half breed i'm a half breed that's right i am trafe i could only only half of me

could get on that plane airlifted they could only airlift half of me me to Israel and the other half. You could only get on L, not LL. Yeah, I can't get on LL, just L. The other half would be airlifted to Ireland. You know, it is funny, you know, for me, particularly, in particular, I'm like, it would be interesting if they did some sort of Irish birthright. I would really like that. Definitely. Yeah. If, if so, hey, country of Ireland, if you do birthright, like start one, start a birthright program. Let me go to, I don't know, dare, or wherever my limerick yeah sure is that a place it is a place and not just the type of poem no they only speak in that format of a poem that's oh damn they order you order a you know wherever you go it's

just like there once was a man from nantucket yeah yeah yeah there once was a man from right here who's hoping to order a beer yeah if you would please fetch it i damn it shouldn't have yeah listen this is why the irish are very good at what they too i'd feel i'd feel much less wretched yeah yeah and uh i think it drunk as a bear a deer yeah there we go uh yeah anyways uh let's see where we're at with the chuffed let's see we started at 71 000 we're damn we're at 73 73 642 pounds now thank you guys Thank you so, so much. I wish I had remembered the first number.

I'll scrub back when this is done and see how much we raised. But this is great so far. I mean, what is that? That's 2,000 pounds? What is that in American dollars? Probably a lot. Just shy of 3,000, I would think. Man, good job, everyone.

You guys are doing great, and that's not even including the, what do you call it? the other thing the the super chats that's right um yeah well let's maybe we could read some yeah i've got a text out to nora making sure she's got the link and all that six six eight yeah i need to go grab my uh can you start reading some super chat i got to go grab my uh yeah do it plug from the next room i'm gonna read some super chats uh adam doring i can show these um i'm gonna start from the beginning uh oh these are starred i see starred as long as they're all starred at them then I can read them, all the ones that come in. All right, so first there was Tyler Jones, 50,

who told us that Discover, they don't take Discover card. Thank you for that. Tyler Jones. And then we have Said M. Who gave a thousand Saur bucks. I dare anyone to push me to the second place. And then third, come on, I dare you. Yes.

Yes. Can you pay more than a thousand. Saar. I don't know exactly which one is Saar, but I like it. What else we got here? Jim D. Duichar's, 20 bucks. Hello from the Do Not Worry Nation. Thank you so much, buddy. Our list is 20 pounds. Ola from Manchester, UK. Thank you again for doing this. Oi from Manchester. Oh, thank you. I don't know. I wish I knew which accent was yours. I think it's that. Explosivo. Oh, explicevoification. 50 euros. When are you coming to Ireland? I don't know, but we are going, we are in contact with Tyg and all them. So we're trying to figure that out. Of course,

Tyke, as soon as we started talking about it, he had to go on a goddamn flotilla. And then, you know, so I have to wait for him to return in order to continue that conversation. Daniel, your video went out. How the hell did that happen? I don't know. Check your settings menu or whatever. There you go. You're back.

There you go. Explosivification. All right. And finally, this is, oh, no, not finally. God damn, there's a lot. Super guy, Bob, $20, hyphen, do not worry. Let's see, high, high, learious, high larius, okay, six pounds. It's me again banging on about the badass barra musical, free Palestine.

We do need to get that done. We should do a musical. I mean, what are we doing? What are we doing? Let's see. The death Zia, $10, or sorry, 10 euro, love from Spain, where we are literally stopping Israel, Israeli cyclists. I think I saw that. Was that the video of people waving Israeli flags at like some sort of tour to something?

Yeah, good job. You shall not pass. Sally Livingston, $20. Thank you so much. Emmy, of course, shout out. HBD shout out. Happy birthday shoutouts. Yeah, to my phenomenal dad and Star Trek, TOS, both yesterday.

much love, free Palestine. Thank you, Emmy. Are you telling me that yesterday was the birthday of Star Trek the original series? That's when it launched. I assumed there was terms of service. Sarah Treu, 50 pounds.

Fubar, 1999 pounds. Free Palestine. Abby Kelly, 50 bucks. Be like water. 30 Australian dollars, I assume. To help rescue an old repressed Jew from is not real.

Yeah, yeah, you know. Yeah, we should start getting a fun going for that. That's a great idea. Reverse airlift directly to Tampa. Oh, that'd be great. Can you imagine? Yeah, like, dude, people don't even know. But, like, you talk to any is racist?

in the United States who lives here now especially like, you know, came here around college age. The feeling is I'm so fucking glad to get out of there. That has been the feeling. I mean, obviously you know, this is

pre-October 7th for a lot of them that I'm talking about. But yeah, it fuck it sucks there. They would love it if there was a program that was like airlift one desperate Tel Aviv settler. What was the, what was the when they flew all those Ethiopans, Operation Magic Carpet?

Was it Magic Carpet? Yeah, I think this would be Operation a whole new world. Yeah. Oh, Operation Street Rat. This is just more Aladdin references, not a reference to anything else. Let's see. Lemon, Mint, Cat, $2 must ask for the consent to do the rapture. Yes, of course, you must ask consent.

Exceptual, excuse me, consent, apocalyptic consent is essential. 100%. And, you know, this is, you know, spoken and enthusiastic consent, you know? Definitely. Absolutely. Tom from Yakubia,

Free Palestine, thank you for your $20. Tam Bruggerman to Euro. Imagine being the voice actor reading for the ad. best job ever one desperate jew sorry can we take it from one desperate jew again it was great i just want a bit more of a sense of the the jews desperation have ever seen a desperate jew just try to channel that i can imagine one i can imagine one like kind of sad like sort of like crying have you ever been on a

cruise when the shrimp when the shrimp runs out at the buffet yeah uh yeah i think so yeah so just imagine a bunch of old Jews clamoring and upset and that's okay just to let crying a lot of you know snot there you go now we're talking okay let's take it again okay we're rolling for seven hundred dollars you can help one desperate gee get out great that was much shrimp as they want one desperate je uh michael uh kersner ten dollars uh uh uh What is that? Annie Wormouth. Anna Wormouth. Yeah, Anna Wormouth. Disabled Batty in undying solidarity with Palestine. Thank you for your $10. And here's a big one, $50 from Ashley Anthony.

Thank you, Ashley. Thank you so much. So grateful for the sanity sustaining pod and to be in some small way part of the work y'all are doing. you guys and BJG over oh briana joy joy gray over at bad faith pod keep me grounded would love for there to be a bad as bar as bad faith crossover one day hashtag baddies for Palestine well that's coming up coming up soon i think this month right or oh are we in the business of uh oh yeah we shouldn't doing spoilers now that yeah no that's right no no spoilers who knows what guests will have who knows not us not but we love briana we are big big fans her legendary status for me was cemented when she rolled her eyes that that is really one paid the price with her employment

paid the price paid the cost to be the boss for the job she lost um he's paid the cost to be her own boss yeah that's right uh catfish rusty 20 dollars rock on guys thank you rose uh billity five dollars I encourage donations directly to Chuck. If I recall correctly, YouTube takes a big part of the Super Chats. Yes. Also, I donate my relatives home in East Jerusalem. What? Also, I donate my relatives home in East Jerusalem.

Hell yeah. I love that. You should sell it out from under them. Sorry. One second. Sunflower Dragon, $20. Good afternoon, gentlemen. Love you both.

Thank you so much. Another Michael Kershner, he gave $5, free parking sign. Oh, no. And what, Royzen Malone. Roisin. Oh, sorry. Royin Malone. Rocheon, yeah.

20-year-of-Hirm Ireland. Chucky Allah to you and yours. And Valentina. Chucky Allah. Yeah. That's what psychopathic killer dolls and horror movies pray to. Yeah, exactly. They pray to Chucky Allah.

I know that's the, you know, the one that's Tiochfir, Turekferigarla. You know what I'm talking about? Yeah, that's what it looks like on paper, phonetically. Right. So apparently someone just says, just say Chucky Allah, and then you basically got it. Okay. Valentina gives us 20 euro. Thank you so much, you guys.

From Italy, Free Palestine. Thank you as well. And two more, Shaila, Kearney, 10 pounds, Canadian in England. Shaila? Why don't you say Sheila? Sheila, sorry. Are there no Americans named Sheila? There's a lot of Shalas in Canada. There's a lot of Shilas.

I just, you know, I'm going through it, like letter by letter. It's blurry. Listen, the problem with my setup is my computer is very far away. Someone said, why is Matt using a potato as a camera? because also the internet is bad things are not easy it's not easy to set up a home studio all right god damn it me mother that's only been podcasting for six years that's so much longer um let's see shela kearney says canadian in england about to protest herzog this week trump's in the area to england's gone to the dogs free palestine and f f to the idf man are they

ever arresting people in England. Dude. They're arresting like wheelchair-bound people. Yeah. They're arresting old people. It's nuts. Even saying free Palestine. It's completely nuts. And not only that, but like

the whole like plasticine action shirt thing is so funny because I I mean, look, I grew up the United States, so obviously like my thoughts on this are painted by that where, you know, it's like if you wear like there isn't an illegal shirt you know what i mean it's like you could definitely get in trouble

for a lot of stuff you know but the idea that they could um you know like they see someone wearing a palestine action shirt and they immediately arrest them under terrorist laws i mean i feel like england's a little bit weirder like that to me is crazy that's crazy that is absolutely nuts Yeah, I mean, there are there, there, there are very few abysses into which America can't sink, but there is this free speech principle. Yeah. I mean, it's not to say it's perfect. Obviously, we know free speech is in free speech. We understand that, you know, while the government may not legally be able to, you know, curb it in quite the ways that other countries can, you know, the private sector consequences are like almost part of, I mean, that's the United States.

for you. Freedom of speech is words that they will bend, as Metallica said on their album and Justice for All, which came out 37 years ago a couple of days ago. Wow, look at that. Look at that. It's never, what's the spin never stops when Daniel's here. It's always spinning. At 78 RPM. Yes. Thank you guys for, you know, all of these super chats so far. We get any message from Nura? We have not. And I have no evidence that. She's even seen my messages. So I'm not sure what's going on. Well, you know, we could move on to our next piece of content.

Let's talk just for a second. Just think about Nura. Yeah. Just imagine she was there. Just be with Nura's energy. And I know that she said something. I'm sorry. I forgot to do the moment of silence thing.

I didn't say to be silent. Oh, good. Just feel into, you know. The contemplation. Her Nourousness. Oh, she's calling me. Give me a second. Look at that.

Look at that. Make sure you mute yourself. So all these goddamn piggys don't listen to your private conversation. All right. Now, guys, based on the face alone, we're going to see whether or not he's disappointed or excited. I see excitement. What do you guys think? Do you see excitement?

I see a little bit of like, oh, here's where the link is. Right? That's what I see. oh then i saw a look on his face at the end there just kind of said like uh-oh but what do you guys think i guess we'll find out we'll find out together yeah

what's up she said she was backstage and i said no you're not and she said do i have the right link i said maybe not so oh she probably has the old link before it was a uh before it was a before it was a what do you call it live stream so we should should have updated that that's on it uh did we send the new one yet i just did okay the one at the top of my the one in my browser window yes yeah uh yeah right that'll work yeah i think that'll work

listen you guys don't know i mean those who've watched any of our live streams now the amount of editing that goes into a single episode of bad has bar because so much of it is just is the guest going to be here was the thing that i said before about you know you know, Jews wanting a buffet, something that might piss people up. Can it be cut into some sort of out of context, you know, clip? There we go. She's here. I see Nura Erica.

Yes. And you're about to see her. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome to the Badhouse Barra live stream. The eminent, wonderful, and apparently surprisingly hilarious, Nurha Eracott. You didn't know. You didn't know about that part. We're about to find out. I have a future career.

Yeah, exactly. Welcome, Nora. And we apologize for the technical misapp. No, no. I apologize for not being here earlier. Hi, Matt. Hi, dad. Hi.

Hi. It's good to see you. Thank you so much for coming on. We're very excited to have you. Sorry, yeah, about the link snap food. This is, you know, a live stream. We don't often do live streams because, you know, it's, I feel like people who do live streams, they do it for hours and hours.

and I have like a bad back and stuff. So for us, we like to do a nice hour 45 and then lie on a hardwood floor for a while. Is this like a generational then live stream? It's like, yeah, yeah, it's like the older millennial live stream. I mean, for us it is. I feel like young people love the live stream, you know? Like your Hassans, you know, he's got a clearly he's got a really good back. Like he works it out and stuff.

whereas so he can sit for eight hours and talk about nothing i'm turning 50 this month so this better not be the older millennial live stream because oh yeah he's gen x he wants everyone to know that i'm gen x cusp okay yeah happy birthday early daniel and i didn't realize you know i actually really like hassan's uh musings yeah because it's like also a collection of everything that's happening in the world and online is that but okay this is exposing myself of how little live stream i watch is that what they all do i don't know because Because I also don't watch live streams because I, who has the time? Well, we appeared each of us separately on a live stream from a podcast called Do Not

Worry out of Lebanon with our friend Anthony Sargon. Yeah. The other day, this guy went from 3 p.m. his time to like three in the morning. And Matt and I were on for an hour each at separate times during that stretch. It's incredible the endurance these streamers are. Wow. Yeah, no, absolutely. Not us. We can't do it.

I mean, it's not just about that. I mean, I guess if we're thinking about this, just how much, you know, things are changing, I mean, the fact that, you know, that becomes something that there is an audience for, that despite the short attention span of most people, because, you know, we're constantly being stimulated to be able to sit that long, but also the way that we're consuming media becomes, you know, we generated on our own and then we monetize it. I mean, I say we in the general we monetize it through Patreon. on. So a lot of, this also represents, you know, the waves of change that we're experiencing

and who knows who will be on the other end of it. Yeah. And it creates a sense, at least, of community and a new kind of community that people are clearly missing, you know, so it's feeling, it's definitely filling a need. Nora, are you at home? I know you've been traveling. You were in Detroit. I was not in Detroit. You were not in Detroit. I'm so sorry. I had a major, major FOMO. I was following Detroit. Oh, okay. I apologize. But I was in Lebanon for most of the summer,

which was an interesting place to be at this time. You know, in Lebanon, as with the rest of the region, it's also going through a lot of dramatic change, what we've seen from if you can still call it the Arab world. I think, you know, the Arab world is a political

project, but it's been a political project that's been steadily unraveling. And in this moment, I mean, we've seen the collusion with genocide, the fact that none of these states in the region are members of the Hague group, for example, or have recalled their ambassadors. I didn't know that none of them are even in the Hague group. They attended the meetings, but they haven't necessarily committed. You see, you know, Cici's Egypt entering into a $35 billion gas deal.

With Israel, you see Jordan clamping down on any form of protest right now, any kind of protests now becomes a threat to the regime as they're trying to, you know, they're worried that any protest against, you know, genocide will then transfer onto the regime itself, the monarchy, you know, and you see that they've only used their, we know they have arms because they've used them to intercept missiles from Iran to protect Israel. So there's just like this general feeling in the region. And in Lebanon, the trend was one in the aftermath of the decapitation of, you know, Hezbollah. and some three weeks, also through tactics without any red lines, is one now where there is a push to disarm Hezbollah and then to put Lebanon on a steady track towards normalization with Israel, which is really has been unheard of. Right. But the region feels exhausted and very powerless

against U.S. intervention and its primary, you know, ally proxy is real and so you know it's it's even coming from you know from very politically astute folks this just this idea of maybe this will work maybe if we do this we'll have a chance to live a normal life and so that it was it was a really interesting place to be at the in this time you know Lebanon is historically the place of a tremendous amount of Palestinian organizing, I would say, like the heyday of, you know, Palestinian armed resistance and liberation organizing. You know, some have called it the state within the state when the PLO operated. There's, you know, about one and every four people in Lebanon

is Palestinian. Obviously, that changed after Israel's invasion in 1982 and the removal of the PLO to Tunisia, which then, you know, you know, removed for them. the potential of cross-border attacks and, you know, and mitigated. This is when we see kind of this mitigation and a direct confrontation. And together with other factors, leads us to this steady, you know, acquiescence to enter into what becomes Oslo from a very, from a place of weakness, even though it, you know, is ultimately catalyzed by the uprising, the Implifada. But today, Palestinians, you know, the numbers have been reduced to, 220,000 who are also living in, I say, indefensible conditions. Yeah.

Indefensible conditions that are of equal concern. You know, when we think about Palestinians, it's not just the challenge to the Zionist project, which is predicated on, you know, our elimination. But it's also the challenge to this idea of the nation, state, nationalism as an exclusive project. I mean, Palestinians are the quintessential refugees. The treatment of them also reflects the treatment of all other refugees in the Middle East happens to be the concentration of the highest number of refugees in the world. So this model is a really concerning model. Anyway, to what extent was the Lebanese populace feeling a sense of solidarity with

with Palestinians and support for Hasbalah's support for them. And to what extent, like, is there indifference now? What is the, what's the mood there? Yeah, no, it's a great question. Solidarity is not palpable, publicly. It's not like, you know, I remember doing, I've been traveling a lot for, but I remember being in Napoli. And, you know, for every Medadona, graffiti on the wall was a Palestinian flag.

Right. of the Palestina. It's not the case. Not the case. Not the case. It's not palpable. I mean, on the one hand, some might feel like it's redundant. Sure.

Because, you know, that's how people feel. So I want to just give folks, you know, nobody thinks. Well, some people obviously do. But, you know, in the United States or maybe in Italy that, you know, provides arms to, you know, the Genesadere, there's a need in order to protest and make your opposition known. Whereas the feeling, I think, in Lebanon is that everybody knows it's a genocide. But they also feel powerless, you know, in its face. Well, it's a well-earned sense of well-learned helplessness, right? And including not just watching helplessly from the sidelines, but helplessly being pummeled.

Right, being involved in the violence directly. Yeah, I mean, Lebanon is an, you know, it's, this is a singular geography, right? My colleague and dear friend, Professor Maya McDashi, you know, no, it's like, it's the same sky. It's the same coastline, right? The intermingling, like the number of Palestinians, you know, or Lebanese who have some Palestinian heritage, right? This is a place where Beirut and Hefa have been historically connected through railway. And it's a site of Zionist aggression, relentless Zionist. aggression, right? Where people have survived and continue to survive an onslaught. I think, you know,

the places that I'm thinking about are less, you know, it's less, I wasn't in the South as much to be able, you know, to tell you, you know, what the, what the general vibe amongst Lebanese were. I will tell you that in the refugee camps, I was in several Palestinian refugee camps, obviously, you know, that's what everybody thinks about. But even the refugees who are quite destitute are fundraising to send it to Palestinians in Gaza. But as a. But as a. a general public feeling. You know, there's an acknowledgement that this is horrible, that this is bad, but there's not necessarily mobilization.

I think while I was there, there might have been maximum to protests against the Egyptian embassy. Yeah. But it's, yeah, it's not a site of, and then the feeling of, you know, it's this, it's this other feeling, like they have been on the front line, right? They have entered into the foray and they have been attacks. I mean, the pager attacks. sure

the number of strikes yeah the bombardment of Beirut itself I truly hate to say it I truly hate to say this but Israel has always had a policy of quote unquote deterrence which means the Arab world's fear of messing with them

and I fear that it is starting to succeed as it never has before as they continue carrying on all over the Middle East wherever they want assassinating people Today. Today, that's right. It's like breaking news in Qatar there.

They bombed the peace negotiations. And these were negotiations that were also in which the, you know, at least President Trump was saying like, oh, don't worry. I think we're going to get this done pretty soon. Whitkoff was saying this. And I not only did they say they did it, but also Israel said they take 100% full credit. It was us. Only us. No one knows. Yes. Yes. Right. Right. That says to me it was also the United States, right? significant U.S. military fleets in this nation and it was attacked without some sort of coordination.

No, no, no. No, no. I saw Trita Parsi say something really insightful today, which is that all these GCC countries have basically relied on the United States as their external security mechanism, that their own military capacity is dependent, you know, is externalized. And, you know, the idea was that they would be protected. And today should be a signal that you're not, that even that won't protect you. So what's in it for you? And that same logic, I think, is the one that we were talking about in Lebanon, where folks felt like we were ready to support, you know, the resistance because it provided a deterrent factor. But when your adversary can do anything that it wants without any red lines, without any consequence, you know, what is that,

you know, what does that mean in the long run and the horizon? And it forces you to rethink. I think it's, you know, I think it's really short-sighted to rethink that normalization is the answer because you see with the states that normalize, they have no, they exercise no meaningful sovereignty. Right. At all. Like that's not a viable future, right? You're just, you know, you're asking to be in a different kind of. But it's a viable future for a small elite in those countries who get to benefit from quizzling status and, right. And the, you know, and also, and direct Payment, too. I mean, you know, let's not forget that these are, you know, part of the normalization is money, you know, is and, you know, the money, it's not like it's going to the people. The money is, yeah, going to the select elite in those countries. I, I, you know, I want to ask whether or not you see a particular difference this time. Have you been to Lebanon before and was it palpable maybe in the past? you know versus this time around like can you compare it in that sense and how much of it is

sort of maybe more localized or internal politics regarding um you know the south support for hesbola and you know different factions within the government of Beirut who are a little bit less confrontational and and want to take more of a normalization path how much of it is the people themselves being like, I'm tired of this or how much of it is the government? Yeah. So let me start by saying in the first question. I have been there before many, many times. You know, it's a home for me as well. And the one thing I can say that's very obvious. And I think that's true that of almost anywhere that we visit today, even in the United States, the left was just stronger. It was more robust, right? In a way that it's not.

And it really, really, I mean, what we're seeing the world over is, you know, an acceleration of globalization. And we're seeing the privatization of public goods and the way that even national sovereignty has diminished as capital sovereignty grows in stature. Right. And so I think that the trends that are evident in Lebanon are not unique to Lebanon, although there are unique, you know, characteristics. but that these are long-lasting trends. I'm sorry, more general universal trends. In terms of government versus people and more equal parts, equal parts. You know, Hezbollah is part of the Lebanese government.

And they made this decision against their fierce opposition. And so that's, you know, that's their own internal crisis. But even people in general, there's just this feeling of we should try something new. If this didn't work, like, what else can we do where we can actually sustain an economy and have a life and raise our children without it being, you know, demolished through aggressive military campaigns with absolutely no accountability where we're forced to rebuild over and over and can never grow into a viable, you know, economy and political system? And I get that frustration. It's real. Doesn't that mirror in some ways the dilemma that 48 Palestinians face? You know, every time I actually interact with Palestinians on the land who are citizens and even some of the West Bank, there's also a sense of look like all of these river-to-see

goals and visions and dreams and like justice is on the side of all of those slogans. But we're trying to just, we're just trying to live and we are part of this economy and we are part of this system and you know like we we want some freedom we want some dignity we want some equality our goals are not the goals that are the sexiest to an international activist audience i mean look the thought i was going to finish on lebanon is i don't think that normalization is going to deliver that utopia they desire right of course not and that's that's the point like it's they will forever like it's not like maybe you'll be spared from genocide and regular assault but you will always be weak you will be you know you will be

you know you will always be weak you will always be beholden there will always you know and that part is you know that dream is going to be limited what's you know the dismemberment the steady dismemberment of iraq of syria right now i mean there's a trend here to make sure that no country can actually exercise robust sovereignty in the region. I mean, that's a bleak horizon. And then to basically say, I just want to survive anyway, whatever that bleak horizon is, I get that feeling. But what is it that we can do in order to ensure that kind of survival without, you know,

without believing a hype that won't exist for us? So for the Palestinians in the West Bank, for the Palestinians who are citizens, who are citizens of in the state, not necessarily of the state. I, we always have a choice, right? I think it was articulated by Bezalil Smotrich when he, you know, in 2017 issued, you know, this idea of the final solution and he gave Palestinians three options, right? He said you can leave or you can stay and forever understand that you're inferior and will be subject to our domination or you can die right we always have the choice yeah we always have the

choice the world over we could that's Palestinian agency yeah we always you know but you know all of us anywhere like you can survive as long as you agree to to be inferior and to be subordinate and and to live you know remember some country talking about give me liberty or give me death that those being really I wonder which one options yeah Sri Lanka I think it was three Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, I'm glad you mentioned Sri Lanka, actually, because I was at a convenience. No, really. That's so new.

That's such a newer, Erica, I'd interview a moment. Like, Matt makes just a random, pulls of a, random referee. Random pull off the globe, off the Atlas. No, no. But please tell me about Sri Lanka. So, you know, the Sri Lankans in the northwest part of the territory, the Tamils have fought for their self-determination. That's right. In the form of secession and in the form of self-determination.

and fought against the Sri Lankan army for decades, right, in an armed resistance. Ultimately, they, you know, it was horrendous, the genocide that they were subject to where they were basically, they had taken shelter, you know, they had taken shelter where they were then fumigated in the, I want to say, I can't remember the exact location, but they were killed en masse.

And so then the Tamils surrendered. when even after surrendering okay and this is this is relevant to our moment right now of thinking about you know this demand that if only Hamas surrendered everything would end right because that that that keeps shifting you know give the hostages step down from power now just you know surrender next it's going to be we want you to commit collective suicide right these are the demands right there's the fallacy in believing that surrender offers reprieve. When the Tamils surrendered, the UN was evacuating them in marked buses that the Sri Lankan army then massacred all of those who were on those buses, literally

massacring them, right? And it's a reminder that, you know, one, we should also be paying attention to the genocide of the Tamils, right? And the fact that Sri Lanka enters into now national security arrangements in the exchange of military carceral technology. with the United States and Israel in the aftermath, this is 2009, afterwards as a model. Like Sri Lanka did it, right, for counterterrorism. But, you know, it just puts you on this road.

Like, let's think of other moments of surrender that actually turned out much more poorly. Like, think about the, we were just talking about the PLO in Lebanon. When the PLO leaves Lebanon for Tunisia, the massacre, what the United Nations described as a genocide at Sabra and Shatila, happens after the PLO leaves. Surrender doesn't equal security.

It makes us more insecure and vulnerable and destitute. So what models, like what models are they trying to move us towards? Right, especially when there's just such historical precedent for that kind of, you know, continued violence after a treaty. I mean, you know, in the United States, this is our constant, you know, history lesson is just a lesson of different treaties that we broke over and over again, treaties that were agreed to with, you know, the indigenous populations and constantly breaking over and over and over again until we, you know, did our manifest destiny. There is no, like, the idea of this, like, model of, like, you know, if you just surrender,

then everything will be fine when it's so clear. I mean, it's never been more clear, not just. in terms of the historical context, but right now, seeing the Israeli government and the United States government constantly lie about the safety of the people that they're negotiating with, the safety of the people that they're currently bombing, they lie. They constantly lie. And we know what the goal is. We don't need to pretend anymore. It's just, I do think there is a difference, So between me protesting my own government and my own government's involvement, and of course, the people of Lebanon, because they are on the front lines. They are, you know, directly dealing

with it. Yeah. Casualties, disfigured, disability, you know, institutions that can't even govern themselves. Right. This is real. The state, I mean, the state can't even be a state. I mean, that's going to get into internal Lebanese politics. So I won't even go there. But can we just, I really think it's so important that as those of us, because all of us are in the United States, and so it's just to center this idea that here we also are, you know, are settlers in a place where settler colonization continues. And that case specifically, Matt, that you're bringing up, I think it's the case of, it's a Supreme Court decision, the Cherokee Nation versus Georgia, right, where they were literally going to be for, this is, this leads up to the trail of tears,

right, under Andrew Jackson. They are literally protesting that they have a right and they have the sovereignty as a nation to stay on the lands that they're in. And so they sue the state of Georgia, which basically wants to extend its own sovereignty. The Supreme Court evades the question of sovereignty altogether by then, you know, basically answering the question of whether or not the Cherokee Nation has, or the Supreme Court has jurisdiction by asking the question only for, foreign states, you know, you have to be an independent state, you have to be a citizen of the state,

or you have to be an other state to be able to sue a state. So they're asking, are the Cherokee nation, a foreign state, are they citizens, or are they another state in the United States? And they answer all three in the negative, right? Except there is a treaty with the Cherokee. How did the United States into a treaty? A treaty is an international contract between two or more sovereigns. Right. How did you enter into a treaty with the Cherokee and then in the same breath say they're not they're not a sovereign. So, you know, just another reminder, like so much of this is happening in the language, the violence is happening in the language of law. There's a continuity here. And there's one, and for us living here, which is like, this is our genocide, that the primary

source of it happens through this, you know, perpetuation of American exceptionalism where you're right. these nations entered into treaties that did not protect them, even in the lease. That was the base, that failed Supreme Court decision ultimately resulted in the trail of tears. Right. Yeah. And, you know, it's the reason why when it comes to this stuff, you know, in terms of whether or not neighboring nations normalize and whatnot, I kind of reserve my judgment a lot of times. I have my opinions, but my judgment itself is based on, like, hey, listen, I don't live there. I don't know what it's like to be these neighboring countries. I don't know what it's like to be a 48 Palestinian.

I don't know what it's like to be living in Gaza or living in the West Bank. So people's opinions are their opinions. For me, I look at this as like we ourselves, people who live in, you know, the center of empire, people who live in the United States, especially people like, you know, Daniel and I, who are seeing our own, you know, Jewish institutions become fronts for Zionism is why it's like imperative on us to be constantly shouting at the top of our lungs at these institutions. But at least, Matt, there are institutions whose actual job is to chronicle historical acts. That's right. Criminal acts and to draw the appropriately general conclusions from them so that they never happen again to anyone. Am I right?

Of course there are. And one of them is a wonderful institution that we have here in Los Angeles. It's the L.A. Holocaust Museum. This is not the Museum of Tolerance. This is one that's over, it's near the grove. The Museum of Tolerance is where you just go and watch a guy get drunk. On, but he has to, but every day he has to drink more and more beers to have the same effect. Yeah, you have to up your tolerance.

I'm going to try it again, Daniel. I'm going to try it your way. Do it. Drink more and more. Did you try going to that museum? Oh. No. No.

It's a museum of tolerance in Los Angeles. They wanted to build the counterpart over the Mamila Cemetery in Jerusalem. Oh, yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I used to go on field trips to Museum of Tolerance as a kid. My dad famously sent back soup at the at the cafe. Like, listen, it's a, but this one is different.

This soup is intolerably cool. Exactly. I will not tolerate the soup. We have suffered enough. So, but the L.A. Holocaust Museum has a Twitter or sorry, a Instagram handle. Yes. They have an account, and first they came for the Borge. And they put out this message.

It was a slideshow that they had in which they were talking about things that I think most people would agree with. And so here are some of the slides they since have deleted this. Holocaust Museum, L.A. Never again can't only mean never again for Jews. So let's slide one. Jews were raised to say never again. That means never again for anyone. Next slide.

Jews must not let the trauma of our past silence our conscience. I didn't see that one. That's fantastic. Yeah, that's amazing. I'm glad they named the trauma. Yeah. And name the trauma and named the misuse of our trauma. That's right.

Yes, very specifically. I mean, let's be clear as to what this was. And then let's read their apology. standing with humanity does not betray our people it honors them so they put this out and it was by the time that this was out i had already heard the backlash like this this came out and immediately was attacked by all of the usual suspects all of like zionist instagram institutions like stop antisemitism.org posted about this um i'm just going to read some of the comments so you guys can see uh you can see how mad people were they were they were big big mad i thought a lot of they used the don't all lives matter us oh yes it was so insulting it was like co-opting the regret the regressive energy to stem you know black liberation in the united states yeah co-opting that in order to continue a genocide

Don't all genocides are bad us. Yeah, I know. It was, it's so insane too because it, like, trying to make a one for one comparison to like Black Lives Matter, which is a call specifically for the, you know, fact that black people in the United States were being, you know, gunned down by the police and the systems of white supremacy and then saying, well, you're all lives mattering genocide. And it's just you. But literally all lives matter in genocide.

Right. Literally all, if black folks had said black lives matter, while, you know, white kids were being gunned down by police for playing with a toy gun in the park, they might have had a point. Yes, exactly. They might have had a point. You can't reverse reality. All the lives do matter. And also the only reason they need to say black lives matter is that black lives have not mattered in the American political and legal system. Yes.

If anyone should be saying all genocides matter, it's, I mean, has the Holocaust not gotten some attention as genocides go? When it comes to genocidal awareness, genocide awareness. I hate that that's laughable. I hate, you know, because it's almost so sad. But, you know, this also reflects even the drafting history, right? Genocide wasn't even named until after the Holocaust. Yes, yeah.

It becomes the only one that is recognized. And in fact, when you learn about other ones, She's like, oh, really, that happened too? Like the Armenians and the Nama Herrero and the Native Americans, right? Really, that happened? Yes. The Rohingya, it's happening right now. My ancestors who died in the gas chambers of Auschwitz are saying enough already.

Talk about someone else, not the only ones. Leave us alone. I think about this all the time when I think about, you know, for Palestinians, what is, you know, what does it mean for us to imagine ourselves? in places of power, right? We have not been in that place, but we can imagine ourselves in that place. And the thing that I hope for more than anything is that when we are in power, we will not become the worst version of ourselves.

Oh, my God. That our victimhood and our suffering does not become a blank check to harm, right? Because that's how we hold on to our humanity. And so often, you know, the thing that I think just in terms of morality, like I don't, you know, and how Palestinians resist and what we do, the thing I constantly think of is we are actually superior morally. And I will not, I will not seed that grounds and I will protect that amongst ourselves. Like that's what I care about, that we remain superior morally. And that's incumbent on all of us. Yeah, it comes from your connection to your humanity. And that, see, the, there was recently this fucking, incident at the Omega Institute where I've taught before with Bessel van der Kolk, the eminent trauma therapist who wrote the body keeps the score. And he was giving a trauma workshop. And in it, he spoke, he had occasion, I don't know what the prompt was. I don't know if it was a question from the

audience or something. He was talking about the trauma in the world. And he talked about what's happening to Gaza, what Israel's doing in Gaza. And he's from the Netherlands. He was born in 1942, he, you know, and he compared Israel's actions to the genocidal actions of the Nazis. And there was a huge kerfuffle. And Jews and Israelis in the workshop were very offended. And he's now been banned by the Omega Institute from ever teaching there again. And they smeared him as an anti-Semite and all that. For being humane. For being humane. And for using his platform to talk about trauma inappropriately and what i want to say about that is there is an absolute refusal to heal that is at the center it's a it's a refusal to heal it's fuck you i won't ever let because if we're

if we heal then we become vulnerable again right if we are all scar tissue then we can't feel anything and we're safe and that's what israeli's security bita hon is all about it's about that feeling of invulnerability which means you can't be wounded which means you also can't feel which means you also can't feel compassion. So when you're talking about Palestinians staying moral, what I hear is staying human, staying connected to their emotions, to their vulnerability, to their love, including the love for land, which Zionists will never understand and will never stop being jealous of. Anyway, my rant is going on for long enough. It's not a rant at all. No, I think that that's absolutely, you know, germane. There was a, you know, I'm finishing a project. I finished a

project. I have a book project coming out with my comrade John Reynolds. He's a fellow Twaler, Third World Approaches to International Law, you know, Irish, compa. So we've written a book on confronting Zionism. And the project begins after the human rights reports come out where they want to basically say that there's a part that in Israel, but without race or racism. You know, that's what the reports ultimately,

Bitslem literally says, you know, in South Africa, there was race, there was color and racism in Israel. it's about nationality and religion. It's like, what? Like, racial regimes are not necessarily synonymous with color. Like, it was just completely wrong. Right, yeah. And Yesh Dien went further and, you know, made this statement to say that it didn't,

Israel didn't start like this, right? Right, right. Like, this is the preamble of every Israeli human rights organization is to just to first let their readership know that it was. It wasn't always like this. Once upon a time. There wasn't a different right. Right, right.

Literally, they say that apartheid can exist without racist ideology. I mean, so we begin our project there anyway. Long story short, we deal with material decolonization in the conclusion. And in dealing with material decolonization, I've been sitting, I've been grappling with this idea that is material decolonization. You know, I don't believe in necessarily rolling back the clock. I think that we go back to a future. Yes. Right.

So what then, so I like, I sit with that. grapple with that. And a dear friend of mine says to me, you know, regression is, is actually using the past in order to impede progress. It's not merely the looking back. It's using the past to prevent progress. And so thinking about this moment, the irony of how, you know, Jewish identity is being mobilized in order to impede the progress of, of, of, you know, you know, combating empire. Right. And think more, you know, something, I guess, another, another way to think about this.

I had seen someone else right about this, thinking about how womanhood is being used to impede the progress of, you know, transgender, justice, right? So you're using these categories of womanhood and, you know, Jewishness in order to impede progress on these other planes in such a cynical, sick way. Right. It boggles my mind why any Jewish person would want to participate. participate in that. Yeah, same zies. There's, especially since it's like there seems to be such a, I think genuine concern about anti-Semitism and what I mean by genuine concern, not that the

anti-Semitism they're perceiving is necessarily real, but that they are still, even living in this alternate reality, they are still scared. They still do care about anti-Semitism, even if they're being fed a bunch of bullshit. So it always blows my mind that it's like, you don't see how it's actually more anti-Semitic for Israel to be exporting, like, this claim that you and your, you know, and the government of Israel are one in the same that every Jew supports it. You don't see how that, like, how can you care about, but, you know, Israel's found an anti-Semitismismism. I'll be right back, guys.

Oh, yeah, yeah, go ahead. So just, I want to read a few more of these comments to you because they're just, they're, they're wild. They're awesome. Yeah. So these are what people said under that. post from the Holocaust Museum, L.A. Someone actually got paid to make this post.

Oh, my God. Fire the whole social media department and start working on that public apology. Wow. Stop anti-Semitism, wrote, donors seeing this, please DM us. We're happy to help redirect your giving our way, an org that focuses solely on the Jewish people and fighting bigotry, the bigotry we face. just the framing of stop anti-Semitism as like an org that stops anti-Semitism is one of the more disgusting aspects. The idea that they're trying to take money from a Holocaust museum so that they can continue their mission of doxing college kids.

That is, it's just insane to me. Someone wrote, again, of course, All Lives Matter. you know, never again comes from a poem written by a Jew in the Jewish community. You know, it's like I, it always blows my mind that people keep saying this is an all lives matter thing because like we said, not only does it, you know, invert the power dynamics of all of these struggles, but also all genocides do matter, you know? Logically, you can't even draw the comparison. You cannot draw the comparison.

Aside from the specificities of these cases, it's true that, yes, you can all lives matter a genocide. Yes, because I'm sorry, but the alternative that they're saying is like, don't say all lives matter. And it's like, are you saying some lives don't matter? Because that is. That's literally what they're saying. It's just like they're, it's the conservative like demon. This is what the conservatives would say people mean when they would say. black lives matter like they are liberals going into fascist like that liberal to fascist

pipeline is just so clear super super thin yeah did you read the one at the bottom there it says never again comes from a poem written by a Jew for the Jewish community yeah I'd like to speak to this person and confirm that in a 24-hour period they don't use any phrases that came say from if they're an American citizen that came from black culture right yeah that half the things white people say started. And, you know, also where, honestly, most Americans draw their moral their sense of moral superiority from the experience of black liberation struggles. That's literally why Americans have this like sense of themselves of who they are because of the sacrifices that, you know, black liberation struggle made and, you know, advance. Yes. Besides which,

that's never again, I'm sorry, it barely qualifies as a phrase. It's two words. Right. Yeah, exactly. It's not like, you know, the odds of putting those two words together are much greater than putting, give me liberty or give me debt. Like, most people who say never again are talking about a restaurant that they had a bad experience at. That's exactly right. The idea that the Holocaust owns never again, we got to. Or something to do it. I didn't realize.

Look at the one about Roots Metals wants to say they're really concerned with this phrase, why. Listen to why. At a time when Holocaust, distortion, and denial are on the rise. Who has distorted the Holocaust or denied it? I know. Largely due to the universalization of the Holocaust. To the contrary. That's what she thinks distortion is.

To put the holocaust to basically place the Holocaust on planet Earth is to distort its otherworldly cosmic realm nature. It is to cheapen its. Yeah, it's specialness. Yeah. That's what these people think the Holocaust is. The Holocaust is some kind of ontological category unto itself. Right. You know, this, let me just say something else.

Because so many of our conversations, and I'm aware of this, you know, especially as somebody who, you know, is engaged and dedicated to Palestine studies, right? We don't need anything to tell our own stories. We don't need a framework of apartheid to talk about racism because we have a Zionist, ideology that has historically been the framework that we use. And we don't need the Holocaust or the Genocide Convention to tell our story because we have the Nekba. We are not here in a moment, right, where we are trying to draw on these, you know, comparisons. What we're doing is we're tapping in to a Western civilizational canon. Yes. Right? That has literally for them,

Jews of Europe are the canonical victims of Western civilization. And it's the West right now that is fomenting and sustaining the genocide of Palestinians. To say these words is basically to appeal to their own sense of morality because our language, because I don't need any of this language. I don't need to tell you about apartheid or genocide because I can tell you about Zionism and Nekbeth, right? but will you even listen to me when you have beat you what has been made so clear what has made so clear is that Palestinian life right people people would like us to disappear samara ismir brilliant Palestinian scholar at UC Berkeley recently wrote this essay and I'm going to you know

I can't quote her directly I don't have it in front of me but you know she writes she writes this line like what else there would be relief in seeing us seeing Palestinians disappear like there's just you know there's almost you know people are tired of it there's why don't we just go away why don't we combat the systems that have made you know that have marked us for removal because there's no way that these systems can prevail that this level of cruelty dehumanization you know advanced weapons technology precision missiles AI right can be mobilized and used against Palestinians in somehow normalize and you all think you're safe. Yeah.

That frame of reference thing is deep and it's it's it's elusive inside of the normal way of thinking about things, which is just to say that I love discovering where I'm still brainwashed, right? And when you said that, I realized, oh yeah, what would it be like if you were like in a human relationship with somebody and all they ever said to you is, you know, that, wow, you really remind me of X or like comparing every. everything you say to the to someone else as a frame of reference you don't exist yeah of my ex you don't exist but you're an item in a thesaurus but there's no image yeah you have a thesaurus

entry but no dictionary entry you don't right you don't you don't yeah nice one okay okay yeah yeah daniel does that sometimes i also you know chapeau to the palestine studies folks historian shiting say ellie the first woman you know editor of journal of palestine studies Shapo to Rabbi Agbaria who writes the article towards Nekba as a legal concept and to the folks

who have given us ongoing Nekba as a way to think historically from you know, Fayy Sajir to Edward Saarind and Rashid Khalidi to Rosemary Saly who documents, you know, the stories of

refugees. We are our own canon and our own archive. right? And it sucks that I can't speak in that language and just be heard. And I think about that a lot when I think about, you know, this recent, you know, 180, this, you know, aha moment. Oh, you know what? It breaks my heart. David Grossman. It really breaks my heart, but this is genocide, right? Or to see the same thing from Omar Bartov, who wrote first time in the New York Times, you know, invoked his scholarship. I staunchly resisted my professional. obligations and the only intellectual conclusion that made sense for two years, but I simply can't

do it anymore. Because that's how moral of an Israeli eye. I simply have run out of Serraquil. He literally has two New York Times articles. One of them says, I'm a genocide scholar. This isn't genocide. And the other one says, I'm a genocide scholar. This is genocide. Yeah. Maybe. Bartah versus Bartah. We should have, maybe the expertise we should have depended on. We're Neckba scholars. Right. Because they knew it then and now. Yes. And literally no matter what the Israelis say, you know, no matter what the Israelis say, because they're telling us, the Avid Dichter said in November 2023, it's nekva, right? They're telling us now, you know, when they say we should, you know, the world should let us starve Palestinians. That was also Smotrich. The world should let us starve Palestinians. And then they're also telling us, Israel cats, we're just going to take it over. Like you need to leave, right? No matter what they tell us, the line keep. being you know if Palestinians just surrender and stop doing this to themselves when what will it take to be able to confront such a racist edifice and what is at stake what is this edifice protecting materially for the ruling elite that we can't chip away at it that really

To me, in the rap sheet, the litany of criminal omissions and falsifications and distortions that the New York Times and Western media have been guilty of, up there in terms of categories of it, is just their refusal to report what Israelis are actually saying and have said. Right. Have they ever quoted Giora Island calling it, you know, the world, the largest concentration camp to ever exist? Or maybe that wasn't it, maybe that was Burr- Kimmering. But on Giora, Ireland, he articulated

Parasitic disease in like 82. Okay. This plan of removing Palestinians was articulated decades before this moment. I would quote him anyway. Yeah. I'm going to say this, Israeli voices matter. Listen to what Israelis say and quote them and believe them. Believe Israelis.

It's the one case. I'm serious. No, I know. It is the one case in which like, that is true which is like please listen they are saying out loud we should do a genocide

we are doing a genocide just real quick we are at 75,6804 7. Right where we started at 72 something 71 so yeah so 70 we're 75,000 pounds now

please guys keep it going I want to just start donating we only have a few more minutes left of the stream if you haven't donated yet do it right now um i want to read the uh their apology because yes of course they oh the holocaust museum they're sorry oh we're back okay yeah they're sorry matt if you want i can stay on after you have to go and i can read some super chats oh yeah that would be great if adam's available to keep it going just so yeah if that's possible all right because you

you out you might need the studio right i do yeah but i don't know yeah i think unfortunately i will need the studio but um but yeah so guys you have a few more minutes a moment where like maybe this is an old millennial moment what's a super chat uh when people uh donate by pressing a special button in the there are comments going on yeah if you can see them and some people's are highlighted that means they donated money to have it and generally the protocol in live streams is to read those out loud to reward and honor the people who are donating yeah right yes uh it's a chat from planet krypton thank you producer out adam shout out to him uh here is their response to all of uh you know people yelling at their donors um holocaust museum la the survivor founded and oldest holocaust museum in the country

is committed to its core mission to educate commemorate and inspire and discriminate yeah but they should right but there. We recently posted an item on social media that was part of a pre-planned social media campaign intended to promote inclusivity and community that was easily open to misinterpretation by some to be a political

statement reflecting the ongoing situation in the Middle East. That was not the ongoing situation in the Middle East, also known as the Middle East. It has been removed to avoid any further confusion. A pre-planned social media You mean to tell me they pre-planned it like three years ago?

We didn't anticipate that there'd be a genocide going on. And people might think we were talking about that. Yeah. Oh, what? Oh, no. When we said like, you know, that just because we're traumatized doesn't mean we should perpetuate traumas on others. We're talking about some other shit.

So that is equally applies. Man, they should have just taken it back. That would have been less embarrassing than this. This is like this is as bad as when AOC wanted to defend, right? why she didn't vote for stopping funding. It's like stop gaslighting us. You should have just said nothing. It would have been better.

Did you see Zoran on getting grilled by Al Sharpton and kind of caving a little bit? No, I haven't. Yeah, whatever. We'll probably cover this in a separate way. Why is Al Sharpton tripping on grilling? Is it MSNBC? Because Al Sharpton is an MSNBC host who uses his black radical credentials to browbeat genuine progressives and be like, you know, I've learned some lessons over my years.

Right. to be careful with my language and it is a two-minute fucking monologue little like covert like under the table jabbing zoran and you know and then he's like yes i do discourage that kind of globalized the antifada language like that's no that's how they get you yeah that's how they get you that's how it starts yeah well we have to see the clip we haven't seen it yet we're talking it wasn't without seeing it yet um once we show the clip then we can fully uh critique it but all i know is uh you know, I have bad feelings all around and worries and concerns.

But if I lived in New York, I'd probably vote for them. Oh, for sure. Of course I'd vote. A hundred percent. You vote and you brace to be disappointed. Yes. It isn't removed to avoid any further confusion. We promise to do better.

We'll ensure that posts in the future are more thoughtfully designed and thoroughly vetted. We have taken actions internally to ensure our message always remains clear and reflective of our mission to inspire humanity through truth. I can't wait. I can't wait till we get the leak where somebody on the inside tells us exactly what happened. You know, one of the things that I've experienced a lot, I mean, less so right now, but probably in the first months, right, after the genocide began,

were the number of young producers who leaked the story of what was happening behind the scenes, that there was an internal battle. There is a generational battle happening between the establishment and those that are inevitably going to be the future. there must be something going on. I think what was it, a recent poll that said 18 to 24-year-old, 60% of them are sympathetic to Palestinians. That's the future.

Yeah. What are you going to do with these people? Yeah. And that's like, I mean, it truly is a question, you know, of what's going. Yeah, where does this go? Where does this energy go? Especially since it seems like any energy expended is just being, you know, deflected by every single political leader.

My concern is that those young people are the future, but they're not the future of those industries because the ones who are, that 60% are more on the victim end of the spectrum of late stage capitalism. The ones who are doing just fine are doing just fine because they're willing to do what it takes, including erase their awareness and their consciousness, consciences, in order to stay in those institutions, just like Chomsky said to that British interviewer. I'm not saying you don't believe what you're saying. you're saying. I'm saying if you believe something else, you wouldn't be in this position. Right. Yeah. And that has been consistently the case. That being said, you know, there's also, I mean, there's just, it's so many people that, you know, at least in a, I don't know, in a cultural sense, that's got to mean something. When the general population of the country is why.

watching a genocide happening on our dime and in our name for a lot of us. No, when people say Free Palestine, they're talking about entire systems that they want to be freed from. Yes. Like, they understand that, you know, again, that Palestine is literally ground zero of the desire to create a completely different kind of world order. That's right. those things that we know about national sovereignty, about democracy, about self-determination, about governance, you know, is being chipped away at. It's this idea of these anarcho capitalists who want us to understand that you're not a citizen of a state. You're a customer

of an entity, right? There's, you know, they're chipping away at this idea. And I think, you know, we're seeing it in its worst form, obviously, in the genocide and Palestine. But we're, you know, I think that battle is happening in the United States. States, right, where everybody is being primed to incredible cruelty and violence. They've been desensitized to incredible cruelty and violence so that the same things, right, the power that it takes in order to continue the genocide is also manifesting in, you know, dismantling whatever's left of a welfare state and where people are just, but I want to survive. What do I do in order to survive? How could I be okay with genocide? If I stay quiet,

quiet. Maybe I can keep my job and feed my kids, right? And this is, this is not the answer either. Well, we need to give people other options, other better options. Yeah. Well, we do have to end. And, you know, sorry to all the youth in the chat who say that an hour and 45 minutes is not long enough for them. Or for speaking for them. None of us are youth. He, I'm really sorry. You're saying. You're so much smarter than we are and can speak for yourself yes yes if you guys are all proud of you oh yes you are never going to stop talking down to you but i'm proud of you you're very special boys i'm not i'm not norah doesn't no no that's right oh yeah i am actually i'm turning 50 this month i'm exercising my old man get off my lawn privilege whenever i choose i've earned yes um but no

50 years when 50 years old you will reach tolerant of young people this much you will not be yes very good what did you that was Yoda that was that's Yoda you see that's a movie that you probably you saw in the theaters

yeah return of the Jedi of course in 1983 okay yo I'm such a fob I'm born and raised in the United States I swear to God

but I don't know any of these things because I'm first generation and so you gotta see Star Wars watching Egyptian theater film you know up until I started

to learn English in kindergarten oh that's fucking I'm just now learning about great Egyptian and Lebanese musicians through my vinyl collection. That's true. That's true. And I, you know, I'm the one who's been doing a cultural exchange here.

But, Yoda, the great Jedi. The great Jedi Master. Yeah, Jedi Master. When nine here, when 900 years old you reach, look as good, you will not. He speaks backwards because it's cute and it's a movie. But how do you do it? That's so impressive. He's just an impressive guy. I guess it's all the magical powers. I weigh NK. Ike Ekekeye-Eit-Eattingly. Oh.

Udge. Very good. All right. You got to give away of my age, too? Pig Latin, I feel like we must be the same age. That's what I'm thinking. But just real quick, an update. We have now reached, at least on the chuffed,

76,000 pounds, which means that we, in an hour and 45 minutes, have raised 5,000 pounds for the, for Gaza City mutual aid. that's not even counting the super chats and not counting the super chats and we'll get a total on that as well once uh everything is all finished but do not stop just because we're stopping you don't have to stop donating exactly that link is live so please keep donating get those donations in nora matt before i go i would be remiss if i didn't center gaza city i'm sorry we were talking about so much and so you know um Gaza city is 3,000 years old Like this is mentioned in the Hebrew Bible. Yes. This city is older than most, you know, continental European cities that's been inhabited.

It's like the center of civilization that's now being destroyed, building by building, a million people have been ordered to evacuate to nowhere, right? This is like a replay of the October 12th evacuation order from northern Gaza to below the Wadiqz de Rzdei. We're seeing it over again, except some 700. plus days later in a world that has all the tools available to stop this and hasn't stopped this. And I want to hear invoke my comrade Jihad Abu Salim, who's the director of the Institute of Palestine Studies, you know, who said to me, you know, if our world system allowed this to happen in Gaza, maybe that world system needs to go to.

Yeah. Yeah. More work for our younger siblings. Yes. Absolutely. And we'll be right there cheering you on from our rocking chairs. Yes, we will. Good job, children. Keep going. I've got to watch more streaming content. But thank you guys so much. Thank you, Nora, so much for coming on. Please come back soon. We'd love to, I could talk to you for, you know, three hours if my back holds up.

100%. Folks, look out for a special bonus episode drop coming soon of an interview we did with Greg Stoker, our man on the global swimmoot. Our man on the boat. He's our little man on the boat. From Tunis yesterday before the drone bombing attack or the cigarette-related explosion to the authorities.

So look for that coming out soon. That'll be free for everybody, not just on the Patreon feed. Yeah, so check that out. And thank you all. Patreon.com slash badassbarra. Badisbar at gmail.com. Get all those donations in.

And yeah, thanks for listening, everyone. and from the river to the sea. All praises due to Nura-E. Jumping jacks was us. Push-ups was us. Godmaga us. All karate us. Taking Molly us.

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