Bad Hasbara - The World's Most Moral Podcast - 160: The Greatest Shoahman, with Jamie Loftus

Episode Date: November 18, 2025

Matt and Daniel welcome comedian, author, and podcaster Jamie Loftus to speak on getting dropped by show business reps for speaking out on Gaza, the relative hardness of Nick Fuentes’ holocaust denial core, and Eylon Levy’s accusations of double-secret-reverse-bankshot racism.Please donate to the Sameer Project: http://bit.ly/sameerprojJoin the patreon at https://www.patreon.com/badhasbaraRaw Dog, by Jamie Loftus: https://us.macmillan.com/books/9781250847751/rawdog/Jamie on X: https://x.com/jamieloftusHELPJamie on IG: https://www.instagram.com/jamiechristsuperstarBetarhelp Hotline: [phone]New Bad Hasbara Merch: https://estoymerchandise.com/collections/bad-hasbara-podcastSubscribe to the Patreon https://www.patreon.com/badhasbaraWhat’s The Spin playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/50JoIqCvlxL3QSNj2BsdURSkad Skasbarska playlist: http://bit.ly/skadskasbarskaSubscribe/listen to Bad Hasbara wherever you get your podcasts.Spotify https://spoti.fi/3HgpxDmApple Podcasts https://apple.co/4kizajtSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/bad-hasbara/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Mashwam hot bitch, a ribbon polka dough. We invented the terry tomato and weighs USB drives and the iron dome. Israeli salad, oozy stents and javas orange rose. Micro chips is us. iPhone cameras us. Taco salads us. Pothomas us. All of garden us.

White foster us. Zabrahamas. Hasvara suss. McCoray, Ha-Col-Bes-Eder, and welcome to Bad Hasbara. Ken, Ha-Col-Bes-Eder-Gamor, the world's most moral podcast. That's right. My name is Matt Lieb, and I will be your most moral co-host for this podcast. Shmi Daniel Matte.

I'm your other most moral co-host. Welcome, everybody. So glad to be back. Little Americanized Hebrew for that ass. That's right. Right. I, listen, I refuse to ever learn to properly do an accent. Yeah. My accents are for doing racism only.

I will not do... Or self-hatred in this case. Self-hatred in this case, if you consider me Israeli. But, yes, I will not do it. So Ha'Kohl-Basader is what I'm going to say instead of the correct way of pronouncing it. You know what I found out recently? There's an Arabic word or expression, which... I would have sworn, I mean, it sounds just like Yiddish,

and it's for the same thing as a cul-besater. Everything's fine. Mishmushkala. Wow. Mishmushkala sounds like a grandmother's pet name for her poodle. Come here, Mishmushkala. But apparently it's Arabic. Everything's fine.

That's great. Wow, look at that. Look at that. Bringing us together through Yiddish, or through things that sound Yiddish, but are actually Arabic. I'm very excited to be back You guys had a great episode on Patreon you and producer Adam

Shout out to producer Adam He is once again backstage writing pithy messages to us And to all of you on screen But you guys are really great And if you want If you want to watch that episode Slash listen to it

Go to patreon.com slash badass barra You can get a bonus episode Every week pay up He says to you guys not to us. It'd be very funny if you said that time.

Pay up, Matt. This episode is being held hostage until Matt Venmo's Adam. Yeah. I got to... Sometimes I'm laid on the Venmo. What can I say? But yeah, it was a great episode.

You don't want to miss it. If you haven't listened to it, listen to it right now. Also, I'm telling you to subscribe on YouTube and all the podcast apps and give us, you know, stars and stuff like that.

So close to 50,000. on YouTube. I know. Honestly, at this point, it is ridiculous. We're just, we're right there. So just... We're like that mathematical theorem about how, you know, like half of a half of a half half of half. Half of half, we never reach the target. Yeah, I know. Sometimes I think about that right before bed and then I can't sleep. Does that ever happen to you? Uh, not that one, but there are... What mathematical theories make you stay up. that night. Avogadro's constant.

Oh, I can't stand it. That's a constant. These millennials with their Avagadro toast, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, that's paying $11 for Avagadro toast, paying $3.14159 for pie. These millennials are never going to own a home. Today's episode, oh, merch. There's new merch and the designs are awesome. I mean, it's the same merch from last week, but it's new.

you probably, go to badassbarra.com, you know, buy a shirt. Why not do it? But before you do any of that, consider giving money, and I would strongly urge you to give money to this week's sponsor. Today's episode is brought to you by the Samir Project. So this is extra important, not that any other time it wasn't, but right now it's the rainy season in Gaza. It just started, and it's going to be, you know, running through the spring. And this past weekend, storms left tens of thousands of Ghazans flooded out of their tents and all of their temporary structures. Often this happened in the middle of the night.

This is a straight up emergency. And in this emergency, the Samir Project is providing tents, clothes, shoes, and other essential items through their, quote, give warmth to Gaza campaign. So your donations are urgently needed, more urgently needed than any other time before. it is a truly a catastrophe. So please, if you see the link, which you should in the description, please click it and donate now. That's bit.l-l-Y-slash Samir-P-R-O-J. Daniel, what's a spin? Well, Matt, as you mentioned, you were absent on Friday. And it did go extremely well. Matt, you know, Adam and I have a great camera.

when you're not around, and we were able to, you know, tell some hard truths, and it's just a different vibe. Just like the two of you were great when I'm not there. You know, like if you take any two sides of a triangle, you take out one, it's all good. It's all good. And as much as I enjoyed it, as much as I was happy for you that you had the day off, although I don't think you did. I think you were doing other things. You were working all day. I can't say that it didn't bring up, you know, some attachment anxiety for me deep inside, you know? So that's the theme. of today's What's the Spin? I've got a song called Separation Anxiety by Faith No More

off their comeback album, Sol Invictus. Separation anxiety. Bob Dylan, blood on the tracks. You could say the entire theme of this album is, you know, anxiety and woe and regret and stuff after a breakup, and there's a song called You're Gonna Make Me Lonesome When You Go. Some stuff from the 80s, one way of coping with separation anxiety

is pretending you're not feeling it, which is the case in the song Missing You by John Waite. I ain't missing you at all. Since you've been gone. You don't know that song? It's a great one hit one. John Waite? John Waite, you would not know the name.

But the song is an 80s radio banger. Another one is Paul Young. Every time you go away, you take a piece of me with you, written by Daryl Hall and John Oates, actually. Holland Oates. I don't know this man either. He looks like Johnny Depp. Yeah, he does.

I want to. You don't know this. Every time you go away, you take a piece of me with you. There's a great version of Holland Oates doing it all coked out in concert ones. Speaking of them, they have the song, She's Gone on Abandoned Luncheonette. Yeah. I think the first album from the 70s. I feel like with this name specifically, you really can, you can really just randomize. Oh, yeah. A lot of people got separation and anxiety on the brain when they're writing songs. It's one of the most, it's a cottage industry, feeling separation anxiety.

It's a studio cottage industry. Finally, I'm sure you'll know this song, Patty LaBelle's wonderful duet with On My Own Michael McDonald. Oh, oh, okay, okay. It's a Michael McDonnell, Patty LaBelle. I don't know if I know this song in particular, but I love both of those artists separately. Yeah. Wow.

It's great. What is the other one? Oh, yeah, that's right. Michael McDonald and Christopher Cross did a song together. I know that one. Oh, they did a bunch of songs together. Yeah, I mean, they're all... Michael McDonald's just doing backups on Christopher Cross.

Yeah, ride like the wind. Gone a long way to golf. Such a long way to go. So, Jim Rican down to Mexico and more right. Yeah, that's a great. Rick Moranis did a fantastic SCTV skit about that. That's great. Well, that's what's spinning.

But, Daniel, I have one more thing that is spinning. It is something that, I'm going to be honest with you, I didn't know that I needed in my life. It is an Israeli pop girl group that I'm going to play a little bit of a music video from. I, to be honest, don't know their name. I know their name. I know their name. It's Hakufsa, which I believe means the box.

Okay, okay, okay. I'm not going to say anything there. Don't. I won't. What's in the box? What's in the fucking box? Open the box. Or, Miss Rachel, what's in the box?

You know, there's a lot you can do. I am the man in the box. A lot of box going on. Here's that Israeli girl group. And let's see what makes it Israeli. All right, it's pretty normal so far. Whoa. All right, well, there we go.

For a second, I thought we could just be in any country. Can listen. Listeners who aren't watching, you know, for the first 10 seconds of that clip, you got, you know, four. Four beautiful women, you know, dressing. Doing beautiful women things. Yeah, to just dress beautifully and singing about stuff. Flicking, their hair, they're blonde. Doing choreographed moves, yeah, they're mostly blonde, yeah.

Yeah, and then about less than 30 seconds into it, a building explodes. Behind them. Right. Now, I don't, sometimes I feel like there's got to be one person in Israel who's just, I keep abreast with world sentiment. And I will come in and quality control the content. we're pushing out. I think the first thing I would say is do we really need to blow up a building within the first, I don't know, 15 seconds of this music video? Haven't we need to stop associating ourselves with the destruction of a civilian building? You know? It's, they just

can't leave a, they can't leave an edifice standing. That's right. And sleep at night. They really can't. Oh, well, you can listen to them. wherever the box is sold and now I would like to introduce our fantastic guest very excited to have her on she is a comedian she's a podcaster she's the host of the Bechtelcast she is also an author the author of a

wonderful critically acclaimed book called raw dog ladies and gentlemen and everyone else welcome first time on the pod Jamie Loftus hi oh my god that fucking girl group that was I mean you know reading the room I don't I don't know slay queens are we right they really are slaying over there aren't they yeah they really they read the room

from right to left and yeah it is beautiful music listen I understand any any country any group people can have a girl group I'm just saying maybe try not to blow up the building so fast into it. Yeah, that was, it was truly record time. It really was. Jamie, thank you so much for coming on. And this Israeli girl group is like, you know, the Ocean's 11 or whatever. Like, you know, they're like a crack squad of like, and they all have different specialties,

and there's always got to be a demolition expert. Yeah, right. Like there'd be demolition spice, you know. I think it's a girl group full of demolitions experts. Right. Well, there's also a bulldozer expert. That's true. That's true, yes.

And then there's the Checkpoint expert. Jamie, I am really glad to have you on. For those who don't know, Jamie, you are a hilarious comedian, an amazing author, a podcaster.

You do all of these things. I know you from stand-up and from the podcast world. And early on, after October 7th, you and I would see other at shows and kind of catch up and I wanted to just first thank you for being one of the few people shortly after October 7th who were willing to post links for Gaza and

fundraisers for Gaza despite the pushback so first like I mean likewise well first thanking you and I also wanted to have our audience get to know you ask you a little bit about yourself. One of the things I'm going to ask is about a story you told me not long after October 7th. You are one of a handful of people that I knew personally who was viciously yelled at and fired by your management for your advocacy of Palestinians. Can you tell us a little bit about that? Yeah. Yeah, it's wild.

I mean, how that was two years ago now. I mean, yeah. Yeah, so this was all, I mean, I guess where to start. Right. I always ask that question whenever I have to ask a question to anybody. Right. I don't know where to start the question. What happened?

And of course, it feels like you have to, you know, start. It feels necessary to start with, like, a bunch of asterisks of, like, ultimately, who cares? Which is, like, part of why I really have not talked about it very extensively anywhere, because it was, like, I don't, you know, there's, I would do the same thing again a million times. Yeah, and you're, but, you know, here on this podcast, the context is you're illuminating one experience that's part of a pattern that many people listening have been through, which is there's been all kinds of unfair and, you know, really out of proportion consequences for saying basically morally true things. Yeah, I mean, I guess I hope that talking about it a little, and I'm like very, I mean, I feel like you guys are the perfect people to talk about it with, will at least be validating for people who went through similar stuff?

Because I really haven't seen a lot of folks talk about, like across industries, sort of what the professional consequences have been for doing something that really felt like a no-brainer. And, I mean, I felt immediately, I mean, I already, I mean, I've known anti-Zionist for years before October 7th where, you know, like I was sort of educated, I want to say my early 20s, I guess, on the issue. So it was like I didn't have any qualms about where I stood. But I think where I felt very naive was I had never with my representation, And I guess when I say that, I mean like management, legal representation, you know, agents, all distinctly. I'd never had an issue with expressing my politics before, which I always have. And so to me, no, you're a big part of your career has been you expressing your politics.

I mean, on the Bechdel cast, you obviously are talking about movies from a, you know, feminist perspective. if I'm correct about describing it that way. Yeah. It's also a comedy podcast, of course. And, you know, you also have been known to be a guest on various political podcasts as well and be someone who talks about politics. You've been on my wife's podcast a few times as well. So this was not abnormal for you to have an opinion about a political matter. No, I mean, I definitely didn't think so. And it was very because you, because to some extent, you know, my representation was financially benefiting from me being very open about my politics over the years. And it had never been really an issue. And so I was really taken aback when, and to the point where it kind of took me a while to connect the dots in a way that feels very silly now. But,

that after October 7th, I was hearing from my representation less and less, which was, you know, I don't know, confusing. I didn't really pay attention to what my reps were posting. Like, it just wasn't something that I did, and I didn't really think about them keeping an eye on my stuff. And so it was surprising that I was like following up and following up and following up. And then, you know, after around a month, I was like, okay, something is like wrong here, you know, and from recalling. No, at this point, had you been, had you been, what kind of things

were you posting or talking about? Was this something? Yeah, what was the exact nature of your crime? Yeah. What was the exact nature of your thought crime? Had you yet committed a crime? Or was this like them anticipating a thought crime? I mean, yes, pre-crime. I, honestly, I mean, God, I don't even,

I couldn't tell you the particulars of what I was posting. I mean, it was, if I remember calling correctly, it was a lot of links. It was a lot of directing people to Palestinian writers. And I do remember specifically the story about, you know, that I think was, that was very contentious at the time, a hospital being blown up and Israel being implicated in that, that being something that was singled out as an issue with, like. Look, in fairness to your reps and anyone who would have been concerned, alarmed by that extreme behavior on your part, links are famously a gateway to the thing to which it is linked. You know, when you post links, one of the dangers is that people might actually click on it. Right.

And they might find out what's behind. And you can't control that. And I'm sure that wasn't your intention at all. But, you know, there's some bad things hidden behind that link. there, Jamie. And I should have been thinking about that. And I mean, and again, I mean, it was like clear, you know, immediately that it was like, as with anything, you have to like vet your sources and be careful and do your due diligence. But, you know, in my recollection, there wasn't really anything that I regretted sharing. It was just, I was surprised at the consequence. So I guess to

like... Just to clear, you know, for our audience, it was the, uh, on October 17, It was the Al-Ali Arab Hospital in Gaza City that was hit. And it was, yeah, it was a huge, Hasbara, you know, like field day because they were trying to say that it was a misfired Hamas rocket and whatnot. And there was, for a while there, they had, like, taken over that narrative completely. And it wasn't until as, you know, the weeks went on when more hospitals were being bombed, that people said, hey, remember that big deal that was made over

Israel would never bomb a hospital. It turns out they do it all the time and now they just excuse it. And have for, you know, since time and memorial. Well, that's the thing that blew my mind that as time went on, it was, the narrative shifted from

Israel would never bomb a hospital to Israel would never bomb this hospital. Right, yeah, exactly. Well, they would bomb a hospital. Israel would never bomb just a hospital. Right. Just this hospital for some reason. It would bomb hospitals.

It would bomb multiple hospitals. Right. So I remember that as an early thing. I guess, you know, each situation was somewhat different. The one that struck me the most, it was, you know, a longtime manager and I mutually parted ways because there just was like no way forward. We had to talk about it. And, yeah, there was no way forward. I think the thing that I found the most difficult was with the agency.

I was signed at. I, yeah, I received a phone call from two of my reps to two reps that had signed me originally years and years ago. And, you know, for what it was worth, like, 2020, I was having a good year. You know, I had, like, a best-selling book. Like, things were sort of on the up and up, which was very lucky because that was not true for many people in 2023. But, you know, it wasn't like I was, like, on thin ice with this agency.

I was making money for them. but I got I got a call from two of my reps there and it was it was bizarre because I was literally I got off the bus on my way to a fundraiser for Gaza this was like I was on my way to I forget where and maybe you were there bad but I just you know I got off because they were like it's it's urgent we need to talk to you it's on the phone I was like on speaker phone in a in a parking lot and it was just it was a very overwhelmingly like condescending call where that did really I mean these were people that I'd worked with

for years you know I I we'd never had a political disagreement before you know and like even times that I think they probably didn't align with how far left my politics are it never came up you know right but now it was you know

implied to me directly that I was putting their children in danger by saying the sorts of things I was saying that I didn't know what I was talking about, that the sources I had were bad. And it was just a lot of like, you know, whatever. I would say they had different approaches. But like one was like a soft condescension.

The other was like, you are hurting us and you really need to think about what you're doing here because you don't know what you're talking about. And it was, you know, I was like overwhelmed. and, you know, knew that, I don't know, it was so just, it was disoriented because I knew that, like, I was like this, I trust the source. But, you know, you get into this spiral and I went back and looked at everything I'd posted and I was like, yeah, no, I, I, I do believe this. Like, I'm not, you know. It's, it's totally like, it's something that I think a lot of people have experienced in the last couple of years on different levels.

But I think the universal experience is having someone that you know and have known for years who have maybe didn't share the exact same politics, but you knew on a personal level were fundamentally decent people or at the very least knowledgeable, telling you not just that like maybe your politics are wrong and kind of, I don't know, putting it to you the way they would talk about any other, you know, like political disagreement and instead calling you essentially a racist or a bigot or you know anti-semitic and beyond that saying that you are endangering them that feeling uh of am i doing that it's like it is most people i know had this exact experience where they looked back into everything and they were like what am i missing here because they took the criticism in good faith and i I think it was like a level of gaslighting that is now unfortunately so common that I think people are a little bit immune to it, which is maybe a good thing. And I think I sometimes lose sight of how common that is because I came into this with sort of a very well-formed opinion and a lot of background. And so when it happened, I was sort of right there.

I was poised to like say something about it. and I found that the march of events as they went along were confirming my worldview. I mean, in some ways, that's not the best place to be because you don't question yourself, you know, and I think people like you who had to take a moment and be like, wait a minute, just a second, like that's a really healthy, good process and it shows you have some humility. But at the same time, when it comes to personal and professional relationships that matter to you, that's there's a lot of internal and external pressure there that yeah i can't really imagine what it would be like to navigate well i mean i don't know i mean i i i definitely did sort of enter that

spiral but it was you know this was something this was like a something i already knew where i stood i just never had it so aggressively pushed back on by someone i knew before yeah right um and so after that happened, there was about a month period, because this was, this conversation would have been, I think, in October, 2023. And then there was a month period where I, you know, one of these two reps called me the next day and apologized for the intensity of it. But it didn't make a difference, you know, because I kept following up in writing saying like, hi, I'm really uncomfortable with the way I was spoken to yesterday and the things that, you know, I was being accused of. And neither of these guys would acknowledge that this conversation had happened in writing. And so I followed up a number of times trying to, you know, just get the written confirmation that this conversation did indeed happen because I felt like such an idiot. Like, of course that was why it was on the phone. Of course. It was urgent. and I had to get off the bus and whatever it was.

Right. So that went on, I went to, you know, because this are two reps out of like six or seven I had at this agency. I went to other reps that I had saying, hey, this happened. I, like, don't know really what to do here because they've gone completely silent on me. You know, I had calls with other reps at that agency, and they were like, yeah, it's really, you know, people who, while they didn't say it, felt like we're a little closer to where I was at. but not enough to say anything, you know. And so after about a month, I was told that I was voluntarily leaving the – The whole agency? The whole agency, because I said, you know, I can't work with these two people anymore

if they won't even acknowledge in writing this conversation happened. That's, like, unbelievably dishonest, and I just can't work with them. And they were like, okay, well, then in that case, you're leaving the entire agency, unfortunately. And so I had to fight to get it in writing that I was being like, oh, not the other way around. Because that's not how that works. Like, it's just not. And you were able to have that

kind of, I don't know, like foresight, or at the very least, like, presence in mind. Yeah, to know that in writing, you know, obviously it's important to get it in writing because otherwise they can just deny the entire thing took place.

You were able to do that and not because your entertainment lawyer told you so because your entertainment lawyer also fired you. No, that was really, that was wild. Well, Jamie, I'm going to tell you something. And he says, it's very important. Get nothing in writing. That's how you learned it.

You don't want to write anything down. You don't want a paper trail of what they did to you. That's a very bad thing. I did reach out to my entertainment lawyer. Who I didn't, I wasn't even thinking that I had been referenced by the two guys who gave me this phone call. so um but i you know i was like hey this happened like i would love to talk with you about it and he's like i'll call you and then the first question i was asked is do you believe israel has the right to

exist i was like oh oh so this actually is like this is not this is not going to be a helpful phone call for me and so then we mutually parted ways uh shortly after that and and then it was like truly starting from i mean i i had two very nice accountants And that was all, like, that was it, every, everything, just like, you know, like, everyone was gone. And, uh, yeah, it was like, it was, it was bizarre. I mean, it couldn't have gone another way, you know, like, but, um, I mean, it's so strange. It's, it's so strange because your experience to me always stood out, uh, in terms of its, I don't want to say, like, brazenness, but in terms of, uh, the extremes to which they went. for the most part, the people that I know who were in similar situations, most of them were

quietly dropped or were, you know, sort of a few were ghosted until the point in which they demanded to actually speak to their, you know, representatives and then found out that way. Interesting. Okay. The amount of like, I don't know, being chided, being like, being like chastised, being like chast. chastised by people who, by the way, work for you. That's the thing about, like, agents and managers is technically they work for you. But, of course, as we all know, it is always a game of, like, you know, a power and whatnot. Who works for who, really?

Hard to say. Yeah. Yeah. When they really want you, they act like, you know, you're their employer. What I will say is I found it very helpful around that time, especially. I mean, there just was like a bunch of really supportive group chats I was in with people who are going through, you know, versions of the same thing. I think, like you're saying, like I got dealt the very bizarre hand where, you know, I think my reps were like not strategically shy about letting me know where they were at. which at least, I don't know, eliminated an element of mystery.

I knew very quickly what they thought of me and also what they thought of Palestinian people. Like that was really, because once I started, you know, having these kinds of phone calls or whatever, you know, or just I think after a period of protracted silence, I'm like, maybe I should check on their socials because I actually don't know. And then you see, you know, like, oh, we've got some big. Barry White shares. We've got some, I see, I see, I see. And, yeah, and like talking with other people who, you know, because it's like a small industry. And there's people I, you know, was friends with who were represented by the same people. And it's like, what the fuck's going on? Are you, you know, so. It's very telling, isn't it? I mean, you talk about, you know, left, right,

they knew your left politics. It's hard for me to think of a single left position that one could take along traditional right-left lines when it comes to economics. You could be a socialist, you could be a communist. That's not going to upset your handlers if you're still bringing in the income, you know? Right. Any social issue, any aspects of the culture war, you can fall as far left or as fall progressive as you want. There's plenty of famous people who do, but this issue, and issues in general of American power. But this is this. is a special case, you know, especially given the fact that people like your reps are making it personal and about them and their children and all that. Yeah, you just don't cross that line

unless you have the courage to do so, which you did. Yeah. And I think like crossing that line was not something that a lot of people that you and I both know, I think, wanted to do. And for reasons that I think I was pretty sympathetic to, mostly because I understand, you know, how easy it is to, you know, not work. You know, I understand that, like, coming off of the, I mean, this, the timing of the strikes having sort of just ended. Yes. Yeah. People didn't want to rock that boat. And, you know, I'm not obviously, I think they should have, but I am still sympathetic to it. Do you think that, you know, in the following years, you know, the last two years, do you think things have improved in any aspect? Have you noticed

any sort of consequences beyond that getting like yelled at and you know fired by management or uh yeah um no i mean i i think i think that i i've certainly i guess been encouraged by seeing you know seeing our you know community and just creatives in general become you know more comfortable and more motivated to speak out about Gaza. It's, it's tricky. I'm glad that people have become more involved who were not comfortable speaking out. Folks, just for the listeners, at the $1,000 a month level of our Patreon, you'll get a special bonus episode with Matt in a declamatory tone, just reading the names, calling everyone

out who didn't speak out and pointing at the camera and saying, I accuse you. Yeah, accuse! The 1,000 jacquesqueuse tier. Awesome. Yeah. But in general, I mean, I guess I'm curious what you both think about this as well, because I think that it is definitely felt, as time goes on, like a less controversial stance to take,

but at what cost is like the real question there. Yeah. I mean, yeah, just my final thoughts on this before we move on is, that I have felt like things have been, at least culturally, been moving forward in a way that I like. People who are, though it is now more safe and they should have spoken up earlier, I do feel the more the merrier. And I love how many people are speaking out now,

even if I, you know, have a secret list of resentments that I will reveal at the $1,000 a month here. It's inarguable that people, like, people like your former reps and agents and whatever, people in that industry, when they look out into the culture now, into the zeitgeist, they have to deal with a much more populated field of outspoken people with clout. Yeah. You know, who are saying, you know, they have to deal with the president. presence of a Miss Rachel. They have to deal with all the, you know, there's, there seems to be

more like British actors than American actors who are willing to go there. But there is, you know, Wallace Sean, who of course has been outspoken about this for decades. No, but I mean, Emma Stone signed the, the letter, you know. Hell yeah, I want to see Bologna here soon. Yeah. Benedict Cumberbatch, Javier Bardem, Hannah Eindbinder, you know, like, who's who's not just some old fuddy-duddy, but like an up-and-coming part of like a comedic vanguard and a very beloved one

and just won an Emmy for a hot show. So I think they have to be looking at a different landscape and they have to be feeling less emboldened about just trying to throw their weight around than they would have, you know, two autums ago. Yeah. And that does mean something. I mean, I think about, I did an event recently,

with a few other folks including Dr. Sarie McDisi who is like an incredible writer and you know he was talking about the changes of the last two years far more articulately than I ever could and he was talking about you know the big change here that is you know

net positive is that this is like the stance of the everyday person now and you know he was like And on all of the years I've been, you know, working, that has never been the case more so than now. And so it comes, it is at a tremendous cost. But the, but, you know, in the U.S., this has never been a more popular opinion than now to the point where you're more likely to find someone who wants a free Palestine than someone who doesn't. Yeah, yeah. And it's great. And, you know, the last thing I'll say is there's still, of course, old media holding on. to it. We have David Ellison, who you know, it was recently

revealed by Ha Aretz that Paramount Studios reportedly keeps internal blacklist of anti-Semitic industry figures. This follows Paramount's public rejection of a boycott against Israeli film institutions. A stance backed by

new CEO, David Ellison, the son of the tech magnate Larry, who has taken bold steps to reshape the company, including acquisitions and staff overhauls. he's taking bold steps to reshape his face is what he's done yeah i know you've seen larry is just he's nothing but thick lips and and just cut cheeks it's so like it's so nuts to i mean that that is just a headline too because it did feel like i mean i don't know like how how you guys

felt um and sort during the early days of people losing reps and on all this stuff like in our community specifically but it felt like over dramatic to be like well it's not like a blacklisting situation. Like, it's not like, because I do, I like remember, you know, the word McCarthyism being thrown around. And, you know, it's not exactly that for a number for instance, but you're also like, that feels overdramatic. And two years on, I'm like, well, not really. No, that's what it was. Yeah. Yeah. No, it didn't feel overdramatic to me, maybe because the person I had spoken to who had it happened to them really early on was Susan Sarandon. Yes. And, and, and here you have.

someone who should be untouchable yeah like who's like a maid like a maid star if ever there was one you know a list a list yeah and the bewilderment that you're expressing or remembering you had and they're like wait a minute did i say something racist was were there flags at that rally i went to that i didn't see right and then the dawning realization that yeah this supremacist ideology renders one disposable, no matter what you think your status is. That's a pretty stark example of, of, you know, a kind of McCarthy-ish wave coming through

where no one was safe. Yeah. And I think there's a bit of a rewriting of history now. I mean, now that you're seeing, you know, what's going on at Paramount, it is very clear that the sort of behind closed doors nature of this blacklisting is now, more out in the open because, you know, people like Larry and David Ellison are very much

planting a flag at these media companies that they've acquired, which is that we're here at the, not behest, but because of the Trump administration allowing us to be. And we're here very much to clean up CBS News and make it less biased towards Palestinians, which is a crazy thing. We're here to clean up paramount and make sure that we don't hire. As if, like, yeah, any of these institutions could ever be accused of having a Palestinian bias. I know. I know. It's insane. The world that they live in is wild. But, yeah, now you're seeing, you know, the state of that type of propaganda being just so ham-fisted that it's hilarious. A premier example of that is something I want to play for you all right now. When Alon Levy started, when we started talking about him on this podcast, he was at the top of his game.

Alon Levy was the Israeli spokesperson for the Netanyahu, you know, for the office of the prime minister Netanyahu. He was the guy who you would call up to be like, hey, spit some facts about... Put on a snappy blue suit and get your ass over. over to Pierce Morgan. And make it sassy. And then unfortunately, he was fired because Sarah Netanyahu wanted him to be.

No. And since then, he has, of course, not stopped. Can't stop, won't stop, Ailon Levy. He has continued... He started a daycare for Hasbara kids? Yes, he did.

You know, he's got his little... His little has barrettes, beautiful women, and doing dances. And also he has his company, which is like the private citizen spokesperson of Israel, which is just a guy who bought himself a podium. And he made this video recently.

And, man, talk about losing the plot. This is Elon Levy talking about white supremacy. We need to talk about white coding. And how people who call themselves progressive use it to spread hatred against Jews. You've all heard the lie. Jews are white. Israel is a white settler state. It sounds academic and progressive. It's neither. It's racist and it's wrong. And this isn't actually about whether Jews are white. Spoiler alert, millions of us come from the Middle East and even the Jews from Europe were not considered white. They were hunted down as subhuman. White Jews are the ones who survived

or escaped a genocide. But here's the call. White coding is an anti-Zionist tactic that racializes Jews as hyper-white to cast us as everything. So what I'm loving about this so far is, first of all, I love me a royalty-free track. You know what I mean?

Just like something that's like, you like type in like upbeat, tech-focused, you know, and you just do it over a white background. I don't care what you're talking. about, I'm dancing. But I'm also loving the idea of the construct of race and white supremacy being taken as some sort of scientific fact. Like, what he's debating right now is the concept of whiteness outside of America, which is like, like he said, actually, very academic. You know, it's like the fact of Israeli, you know, being. citizenship for a multi-ethnic Jewish society and whatnot muddies the term whiteness, right? You can't apply it directly to every, you know,

Jewish person and Israeli. But he completely lives out the part in which, by his own definition then, it's like, okay, so do you want them to say Jewish supremacy? Like, I don't think he would feel as good if they all just called it a Jewish supremacist ethno state

instead he uses it to attack white progressives for being racist I was immediately like I thought that people especially people who are very knowingly intentionally making a real

would try to like you know whatever dummy proof it from having something clipped out and so the fact that he says Israel is a settler state even though he's saying as if he's about to say like

and that's not true I was like you shouldn't say that sentence because we could just be like look what Alon said to say yeah I'm gonna clip it well he doesn't want to deal with

the supremacy part right I got into a big infuriating debate on Twitter the details of which this is just a few days ago the details of which

are too arcane to get into here I think but it was with someone else So I think styles themselves as pro-Palestinian, but also Jewish and kind of tends to do a lot of like, what seemed to me like policing of like, don't fall into anti-Semitic tropes while you're supporting Palestine, which in and of itself, okay, there could be value to that. Absolutely. But was taking exception with the notion of Jewish supremacy itself and saying, well, Israel is a Jewish supremacist society. But Jewish supremacy does not apply here because we're not living in a Jewish supremacist society, right? And I was trying to say, well, look, people here are, they have attitudes that to them justify the existence of a Jewish supremacist society.

Right. They also, as Muhammad al-Kurd had pointed out, which was the whole reason this topic was up on the table for everybody that day, Jewish feelings and fears and emotions are held as more important and more supreme and more discussion worthy than Palestinian ones. And then this person was like, no, but the Christian supremacists, the Christian Zionists want to see Jews tossed into the pits of hell, and that's the only reason they support Israel. I'm like, great, so they support Jewish supremacy in the meantime, like as a means to an end. Anyway, supremacy is the point, whatever you want to call it.

And A-Loan is right that notions of whiteness can become a little bit abstracted from white. And either you're into abstract academic language and analyses or you're not. Right. And. Sorry, go ahead. No, that was an open-ended and for either of you to climb onto. I mean, I just think, you know, it's, the, the, how semantic it gets to me very quickly. all the time is telling

whereas like his resistance here is to a word that is inconvenient to the sentiment of what he's saying and yeah well the great thing is where he goes with it because you know he could have easily stopped the video

just to be like and I've seen this a lot stop calling it a white supremacy you know in in Israel you know Jews in Israel are not white European Jews were not considered white in the countries that they fled from

and of course there's a lot of Middle Eastern Jews and the majority of the country is Middle Eastern Jews Yes They represent the majority of A hundred percent I personally would be completely fine I don't speak about Israel as a white supremacist country

To me that language isn't useful In making the points that I'm trying to make Right exactly I'd be with him as far as it goes up until now mostly If he'd stop the video right there But just see where he goes with it Western culture now associates with guilt and sin. That's just one example of the inherent racism embedded in anti-Zionism.

So, so in case you missed it, hold on. Oh, so he's saying it's reverse racism. He's saying, he's saying, but he can't say that because now it's not bad if he said that. Because it's anti-white is what he's saying. Anti-Zionist tactic that racializes Jews as hyper-white to cast us as everything Western culture now associates with guilt and sin. That's just one example of the inherent racism embedded in anti-Zionism. So now you get who he's speaking to. It treats whiteness as a contamination and paints Jews as the most impure.

You see what he did with the lighting there or the filter? Yes, he made himself, he whitened his skin as an example, I suppose. And yes, he's calling this eugenics. Dressed up as social justice. And here's what's most twisted. White coating is usually pushed by white progressives who feel guilty about whiteness and take it out on the Jews. They use us as a scapegoat for their white sins.

Sorry, but, like, at this point, this is why it's just gotten so convoluted that I don't actually know the audience. At first, I understood the audience to be sort of a liberal Zionist audience, but also, I guess maybe we've come to the point where the liberal Zionist audience wants people or maybe they've gotten to the point where they are now scared of anti-white racism? I'm going to need a Glenn Beck-style chalkboard here. I need him to turn around and draw all the lines.

All the arrows, circle the things. I need the red yard here, because I want to know who made the editorial decision to use the light. Yeah. Oh, you know that was him. I can't imagine he has much staff anymore over at the citizen's spokesperson's office. Matt, I think this deserves a bumper we've neglected for a while.

Oh, it, you know what? Beautiful bumper. It just... What a jolt of adrenaline. Oh, boy. But, yeah, good for, you know, good for Alon. I'm glad things are going well. And, you know, hey, keep on going, dude.

Speaking of white-coated things, do I have a Hitler mustache today? You do not have a Hitler mustache? That's not a Hitler mustache. I shaved today, and I'm worried that I didn't shave quite evenly enough. You know, Jamie was just talking about getting clipped in bad faith. And now you have either clipped yourself in bad faith or someone will clip that in bad faith. Good. Yeah.

Bring it on. You set yourself up. You do not have Hitler mustache. And we, of course, do need to take a quick commercial break. Everyone, please listen to these ads. Oh, also, if it's an ICE ad, we are trying to get rid of ICE ads. That's what the skip ahead 30 seconds button is for. Yeah.

Skip, skip it. If it's ice, skip it. At this point, I've written. Don't join. You guys do not join. Don't join. Don't join. Doesn't matter how good the ad is.

Doesn't matter how out of work you are. Yes. Doesn't matter how out of work you are. You do not want to join the modern Gestapo. So please stick around. And I mean that literally do not join ice. And we will be right back. And we're back.

This badass barra, the world's most moral podcast here. Once again with Jamie Loftus. How you doing, Jamie? Hi. Doing great. Feeling great. Hell yeah. Hell yeah.

Same Zies. I'm feeling great. but not everyone is in fact a lot of people are feeling scared and uh is there trouble in the hen house there's trouble in the hen house um we've

got a post from hen mazig that I really wanted to read uh this is our this is our uh once monthly I think at this point Hen Mazig tweet reading series which I'll start with our bumper I had someone to say

and I kill Hey, see that Metallica album right behind me? Yeah. That's Garage Day's re-revisited. I just got it yesterday. And it features a cover of that fucking song. Oh, they did last caress. They did last caress.

It's where I first heard it. Oh, that's amazing. I love that. Hen, Mazig, who sounds like Glenn Denzig. It's a stretch. It's a stretch. He pointed out an experience that someone else had with a medical professional

who discriminated against a Jewish patient. And I want to read this for you to know what universe we are all living in. Here it is. It's a free Palestine nurse. First of all, great start. Great porn hub searched term. A free Palestine nurse is not a subsection of nurse. Surely there's a less clunky way to phrase that. Free Palestine nurse, sure.

A nurse, palestin, I'm trying to do a practitioner. Yes, yeah, palestitioner. A free Palestine nurse refused to treat a Jewish woman in Amsterdam. Jonathan Weinberger, Jonathan, I don't know that name, recounts that she was denied medical care by a nurse who refused to remove a free Palestinian fist-shaped person. pin. Hold on. Wait a minute. Whoa. Hold. Hold on. First a sneeze, then a question.

Sure. Was she refused care? Or was she refused? Like, did the woman not take orders from her about what pins she should or shouldn't wear? Well, we'll find out in the next few sentences. Because I, too, was like, huh? Part of receiving care from a nurse is getting to bust them around about what pins and things they were. Well, if you're, you know, if your medical issue is that you are, you know, perpetually mad, then, yeah, that's part of it, okay? If you have a rash on your brain, they're only going to inflame it by refusing to do everything you say. Sure.

Quote, when I entered the room, the nurse waiting for me was wearing a large pin shaped like a fist in the colors of the Palestinian flag. I was shock. Instinctively, I whispered to the paramedic that I didn't feel safe being treated by someone displaying such a political statement. I'm sorry, instinctively, like, just on instinct, I immediately told someone. I don't know, I mean, I don't know what the medical issue being had. is. But I'm like, if you have the time, how, if you have the time to police what the nurse is wearing before you receive treatment, it's not feeling quite so urgent. We're about to be told it was urgent, actually. I read down a bit and we're about to be told that. The size of the pin, Adam. We're about to learn the size of this pin. Yes. Okay. Okay. Uh,

He cautiously asked the nurse if she could remove her, quote, pally pin. I don't know whose quote that is. The nurse replied that she did not wish to treat the woman and walked out of the room, even though Jonathan urgently needed medical attention. I can't possibly be that urgent. I just like, just me with an open gunshot wound in my gut just being like, um. Pally pin. Like, this is all so,

this just feels not real. I mean, beyond not real, it's like, if real, very strange to self-victimized in that exact moment. Like, ma'am, ma'am, we need to perform open heart surgery now. You will die.

Hold on a second. Hold on, hold on. Do you believe the state of Israel has the right to exist? Right. Like, I feel like every, especially on Twitter at this point, every tweet of this nature

needs to be treated as, uh, Ruth Konda forever until proven otherwise. Like you're just, 100%. Like that four like multi-paragraph Twitter anecdotes, that is the yardstick. Like you have to. I need more information. Yes. Uh, let's see. Was she going to, uh, Dr. Thomas Friedman at the hipster coffee? Yeah, yeah, exactly. This does feel like, uh, I was at a hipster coffee shop and everyone says Trump is doing a fantastic job. Um, it is just,

They all sound very fake. And also, if this is real, that is an insane way to act when medical care is urgently needed, but to each their own. It continues. Jonathan writes that, quote, you feel very unsafe in a moment like that. It wasn't even a small Palestinian flag, but an actual fist, a symbol of militant resistance. And that doesn't belong in a hospital. A hospital should be a neutral, safe space for everyone. Boy, do I agree with that.

Hospitals should be safe and neutral from politics and should not be bombed. I feel like more so the latter. Not being bombed feels probably like on the number one top of the list of things to not do to hospital. They should exist safely. Yes. This is just like And also just the image that accompanies it You're like

Is this the source? Does she stand still for you in a well-lit Nutri? No. That's AI generated. Yeah, that's the smoothness of like a little bit of ice melted to make. Yes, exactly.

That looks like it could be an ANC pin from actually, you know? Yeah, that's right. It actually does look like it could be. So for those who are, listening, there is an AI-generated picture of the pin attached to an AI-generated nurse wearing scrubs. An AI-generated free Palestine nurse. Yes, yes.

The AI-generated free-Palestine nurse. And the pin is the black power fist, but with the colors of the Palestinian flag. So, you know, if you get the black, the green, the white, and the red, it also, as Daniel said, does look like it could easily be an ANC fist. But the idea of this fist automatically being a symbol of militant resistance, like, you know, listen, if it were just a small Palestinian flag, you know, I wouldn't have said anything. I would have just taken a picture and posted it on Instagram later so that people could docks the person wearing it.

But because it was a giant one, I didn't have the time to do that. and instead I asked them to leave. And then, of course, they'd refuse to treat me. It is just, I mean, yeah, political displays don't belong in hospital, schools, planes or any public service and support for care. Plains feels kind of thrown in there. Looking forward to El Al removing all Israeli flags from. I think it does kind of speak to where things are at, though, that it's like, it's, like,

Like, inevitable that the majority of anyone where you are is going to disagree with Jonath. But just don't let her know. Just don't let her know that you. I'm like, what does that even accomplish to be like, no, I understand I would, you know, statistically be treated by a nurse, a free Palestine nurse. Yeah. I just don't want to know I'm being treated by a free Palestine nurse. You're like, well. I mean, I can't imagine there's any other, like, group in America.

in America specifically, now this is Amsterdam, so I don't know, but in America, the amount of people who are being treated by a nurse that believes that Black Lives Matter, I mean, you're going to be treated by someone who has different political views than you. And only on Fox News would you see the story of someone actually just being like, a Black Lives Matter nurse refused to treat me. The fact that this is being spread by Hen Mazig, the liberal Zionist whisperer to the stars. Really,

I mean, to me it says a lot about the state of our poor, poor hasbarists, you know? They're having to they're having to do fucking like Fox News schlock via, you know, 2016. It's like, that's pretty bad.

It's pretty bad, you guys. I don't think people are clicking on it anymore either. That, you know, The stories don't have the power they once did. They really don't. We need to call an Amisrael Heitner's to resuscitate this Haasbara, this failing Hasbara corpus. Don't worry. We're going to be annexing your scrubs and replacing that pin with an Israeli flag.

I don't want no scrubs. What's that? I don't want no scrubs. Scrubs is a fit that don't get no love for me. Very good. I thought you were going to go with a scrub as a zai who doesn't get them. See, we say zai. Zay is okay.

Anyways, so that's what's going on in the liberal Zionist sphere. But Daniel, you alerted me to a story that you're going to read from the, what is this from the Times of Israel? Something like that. Let's put it up and see. Yeah. Oh, this is right. Israel National News. Yes.

Yeah. Okay. And this is an op-ed piece by a guy named Steve Apful. An Apful a day keeps the free Palestine nurse away. Sure, sure, sure. Very good. And the title just drew me in immediately, and it did not disappoint. And this is, apropos of a conversation we've had, you know, recently on this show,

which is about this dangerous game that, you know, the Zionist establishment has played by cozying up to authentic anti-Semites. Which of course is not new. Herzl said the anti-Semitic countries will be our best friends. And he was right because they share a fundamental premise

that Jews don't belong anywhere except among each other. But here's the title. And folks, better strap in for this one because this might come of some news to you. Nick Fuentes is not an authentic Holocaust denier. it's such a be he's a poser like if he's a poser like if there's so he's a poser well the thing is

is that you actually have to be um grown in the holocaust denier region of france in order to be authentic holocaust denier you know yeah to have to have the label authentic you know legitimately stamped on you that's right yeah yeah um bombastic taboo breaker isn't worth the fallout between the Zionist Organization of America, Heritage Foundation, and Tucker Carlson at a time when anti-Semitic idols are on the ascendant. Opinion. Oh, boy. All right.

Here we go. All because of a foul-mouthed live streamer, the Zionist Organization of America issued a drastic and self-defeating ultimatum to the President of Heritage Foundation. It told Kevin Roberts that ties with it would be severed unless he made a post-apeutic. public apology for defending Tucker Carlson, as well as dump him for platforming Nick Fuentes. Supposedly, the affiliation and interview with red flags. Roberts duly caved. To believe the Zoha flirt with Carlson, and you can't begin to combat anti-Semitism.

Did Roberts cave? Did he come out fine? Because I thought he put out a defiant video, being like, we're not criticizing Tucker Carlson. He's our buddy. He caved very quickly after that. Or what he did was he apologized multiple times and clarified. He hasn't caved on Tucker. He has, as far as I know, Tucker is still, you know, affiliated with the Heritage Foundation.

But he did clarify that he finds, you know, Nick Fuentes beyond the pale or something like that. He had said something to that effect in his original statement, but it was couched in a stronger... Right. And I'm not going to cancel someone for interview. him. Right. To believe the Zionist, I'll say Zoa for a Zionist organization of America, flirt with Carlson and you can't begin to combat anti-Semitism. We shall see how much of a difference blackballing him makes. But to put it bluntly, the Zoa, you don't mess with the Zoa, was prepared to cut off its nose despite its face. Wow. Pretty big nose, am I right? Yeah, yeah. They're

doing tropes on the Israeli national news. Unbelievable. The demand was not. rooted in the symbiotic relationship between Zoha and heritage, a think tank to reckon with, the Zionist body was guided by an obdurate mindset, not by common sense. So what if Carlson let Fuentes go through his schtick of denying the Holocaust and poking fun at it? That famous denying the Holocaust, schick. Not stick. Listen, we all had to... We were just joshing around.

we were kibbitzing, we were denying the Holocaust, I was schvitzing. So there we were kibitzing about how the Holocaust did nothing. We're having a gnazhe. Hear him out. That's insane. Wow. Okay. Is it worth making a bun fight?

Does he mean bum fight? I don't know what a bun fight is. That's bound to be counterproductive. Mm. Uh-huh. On the one hand, it will drive clicks for the manipulative bigot. attention seeker bar none. On the other hand, it will upend the Heritage National Task Force to combat anti-Semitism.

Such a breakup makes no tactical sense. After all is said and done, the play-acting Nazi inflicts minimal harm with Holocaust insults meant to provoke and make a spectacle that elevates him to a holy cow celebrity. I'm sorry, but like, okay, at this point, what does play acting even mean? Yeah, I just, we get to the point where I'm like, you have literally called Miss Rachel a Nazi. Yeah. She's not play acting, but. She's method acting.

Yeah, she's method acting. But Nick Fuentes is just doing a gag. Are you fucking, come on. I can presenting it as harmless, too. Like, it's just, like, he's just a kid. He can't, he can't be held accountable for his Holocaust denial. He's just a kid with 50 million viewers who are all in on the joke. Yes.

Yeah, believe the exact same fucking things. The fact is... Do you think this is Dennis the Menace? You think he's doing a problem child, fucking prank? Fucking A. The fact is, Fuentes is not an authentic Holocaust denier. He lads his Hitler's aura, compares the crematoria to cookie baking, fusses over the accuracy of 6 million, and generally goes...

Wait, wait, wait, wait, you stop there! All of the things. Fusses over the accuracy of 6 million. These are the Holocaust denial. It used to be the worst thing you could do. I mean, it used to be, you know. Like, I. Chomsky was, the mainstream tried to cancel Chomsky

because he advocated for someone who did just that right to say it and publish it. Right, right, yeah. That was beyond the pale. That was the definition of beyond the pale. Right. Yes, just to just to like say that, listen, people have a right to print something. Even that would get you fucking, but the fact is now it's just like, I don't know,

you know, he's just having a hissy fit over whether or not six million died. Oh, God, damn. God, they're like, the way that sort of like, I don't know who told, you know, like, normie liberal scientists about edge lords, but I really wish they hadn't heard it because now it's like at any, that's, that's the, that's the logic that's being used to justify it of like, well, it's like, it's a, it's a performance. And you're like, okay, to accomplish what? Yeah, I know. It's, yeah, it's just, it's just Grover Time Story Hour. Right. Because I mean, like, you know, what's the satire, man? What makes it inauthentic?

And generally goes for ridiculous but riveting theater on podcasts. Oh, a rave review. Oh, it's a performance. Okay. This works too well. The Tucker Carlson interview racked up 16 million views. As regards the Blackbuster star punting Nazi dogma or Holocaust denial, that's an altogether different kettle of fish.

For, contrary to popular belief, there is Holocaust denial, and then there is Holocaust denial. Okay. All right. So we're in the, well, it's not rape, rape portion of the Israeli has bar. That is, yeah. Let him cook. Let them cook. Go away.

For one thing, there's hardcore and softcore denial. And the latter is the one posing a high order threat. It's getting gross. This is getting nasty. You see, okay, so the soft core is like, it looks enticing, but you never see dicks going in. but the hardcore that's where you get the real strong stuff the mom dani stuff you know what i'm talking no no he's saying the opposite matt oh yeah this would be as if like an anti porn crusader was trying to ban yeah the hardcore porn it's a schick they're choking women they're doing

quadruple penetration there's there's there's scatological uh you know filth and all this but the softcore porn. That's what's really poisoning our eight-year-olds. We're talking about taxi cab confessions. We're talking about the Emmanuel visits Paris. All of this got to go. Do you guys not know the names of any soft-core

things off the top of your head? Nope. Neither do I. Every child knows that barely legal is just a joke. So Fuentes' denial is not hard or soft. It's clownish, and the less attention paid to him, the better.

All right, so I'm sorry, there's now three different versions of Holocaust denial. There's clownish. Okay. Yeah, there's juggalo anti-Zionism. I'm just like, I'm shocked that this article bothers to go on this long because it just gets like, like if I'm, if I'm, if I'm, yeah, if I'm a hateful editor, I'm still cutting this way down. Like, this is Israel national news we're talking about. Jesus. Can you make it a listicle at least?

No, this is translated from Hebrew? Very possibly. Okay, okay. Very possibly. All right. Exactly how does all of this work? After the snake in the Garden of Eden, man learned to do evil's bidding and tempting and self-serving ways. Man, we're starting way back.

Whoa. Forbidden fruit was never a match for silvery tongues. On the back of noble sentiments, depraved causes seduce receptive brains. Tinny mantras draw in, draw utopians in droves. Pural falsehoods evade detection. Okay. Whoa. Adele bin Ahmed is a Holocaust denier, but not that seductive softcore subtle type.

Preacher at a Jeddah mosque, he never bothered to mince words. Quote, the Jews disseminate everywhere the lie of the Holocaust and claim that Hitler killed six million Jews in gas chambers, although pure falsehood, they have made it part of their history. I'm sorry, but, okay, I, you know what I love? I love being like, no, no, no, no. You see, this self-proclaimed Holocaust denier is not a real Holocaust denier, despite his millions and millions of followers.

No, this real one is an Arab guy I found. Like, the fact that it immediately goes to a preacher at a Jeddah mosque is, I mean, you can't do better than that. Well, and it's also like what, what has this writer successfully shown that Nick Fuentes has said, like, that doesn't align with this exactly? Like, it's more just like the tone. It's the clownish tone with which he denies the holocaust. But if we read on, we're going to say. that he's saying that even this preacher at a Jeddah mosque

is not the most dangerous kind of anti-Semite. Oh, okay, good, good. Venom so crude. Are we going to get to the end, and it's just a picture of our podcast? Maybe, could be. Wait for it. Venom so crude, like, just when you think you've figured out

his point, I promise you, you haven't. Okay. Venom so crude or over the top has no hope of inflaming Jew haters of discernment, the educated in political classes and radicals on the left or right. connoisseurs of Jewish hatred. No, this is a rare Jew hate.

The Somaliade. Yeah, you know, it doesn't have the nose. It doesn't have the mouth feel. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We may call Ben Ahmad's type baseline hardcore Holocaust denial. Okay, all right. Iranian Mullahs also hardcore.

See, he's still working his way through the less dangerous kinds. Oh, okay, okay. At least work finesse into their schick about the Holocaust. Is this also, like, horny? Yeah, exactly. They don't...

They can't be in the news. They can do it backhanded. This made the late Ayatollah a bigger threat than the volcanic cleric of Jeddah. In this manner, he pitched target populations in seductive terms. Quote, observe that no one in Europe dares to speak about the Holocaust,

even though it's not clear what the reality is about it, whether it even has a reality or how it may have happened. I love Levy's calling the seductive. It's just like it's not the size of the anti-Semitism. It's really, I, it's, the motion of the ocean that we're going to drive the Jews into. It is shocking how, like, archive of their own, like, coded this language. Like, it's just, it's fan fiction language. Yes, yes.

Oh, man. But he's about to tell us what's the most dangerous kind. Woke ideology based on victimhood, however, because we Zionists would never, ever based on ideology based on victimhood. No, no, no, no. Is amenable to morality planted in Holocaust denial, Eve's serpent would stand a good chance with progressives. Got it. Consider, yeah, we resemble that remark, sir. Yes, consider in that remark, excuse me, consider in that regard, British politician David Ward.

His soft core Holocaust denial is delivered attractively packaged. Quote, you want to do your English accent there, Matt? I am sadden that the Jews who suffered unbelievable levels of persecution during the Holocaust could within a few years of liberation from the death camps be inflicting atrocities on Palestinians on a daily basis in the West Bank in Gaza, that suffering by the Jews is not transformed their own. reviews on how others should be traded. I'm sorry.

Terry Jones. Yeah. Yeah, I can only do it that way. And also, in doing that accent, I almost kind of like missed the content that was happening. And everything I just read was not Holocaust denial. Everything you just read was true. Yeah, and very specifically not Holocaust denial. That's right.

You're right, right, right. a list of. He didn't say, I am saddened to the Jews who may or may not have suffered unbelievable levels of persecution during the Holocaust. Reasonable people can disagree and many have. Yeah. Check out David Icky if you're interested. Yeah, if you want to learn more about lizard people, click this link.

No, he literally just says that Jews suffered during the Holocaust. His soft core Holocaust denial is delivered attractively packaged in Holocaust acknowledgement. And Holocaust lamentation. I know that this is, I mean, that you talk about this every single week, but it is like, it is so profoundly, like, sad that Zionists would more quickly align with a self-proclaimed Nazi than someone who is literally acknowledging the Holocaust and criticizing Israel. Like, it's just, it's really sad. It's, it is very sad. And it's like, it's, it's just insane. It's, it's comical.

I mean, you got one guy who's just like, I'm literally Hitler. And then they're like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course, you know, he's just having a little bit of fun. Like, in the sense that Tycho Waititi was Hitler. You know, like, it's just like, oh, it's a little performance. Yeah, exactly, exactly. Yeah. Oh, wow.

This is a strap, oh, and it keeps going. Oh, yeah. Oh, my God. We're halfway through. Oh, good. The words and tones. are distinct from hardcore denial. Andrew Wilkie, late of Nuffield College,

Oxford is David Ward's fellow artiste. Quote, I have a huge problem with the way that Israelis take the moral high ground from their appalling treatment in the Holocaust and then inflict gross human rights abuses on the Palestinian. What is... What's happening?

Without question. What is the definition of denial? Well, denial is denying Jews the right to use the Holocaust however the fuck they want. Oh, God. You're denying them their Holocaust goodies. So that was, that was hardcore?

I guess. No, this is softcore. No, we're still soft core. This is the softcore kind. The kind that's harder to detect, the kind you have to take my word for is in there. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Mark the way Wilkie and Ward contrived to deny the Holocaust

without denying it in so many words. In any words, there's zero words. There's not a single denial in there. Not in so many words. Well, how many words? None. Zero words! History provides many instances of people being unbelievably persecuted or treated appallingly.

Many, however, live to tell the tale. This bears no comparison to a methodical extermination of six million Jews, not sparing the newborn. Okay. Wait. He's saying that if you use words like appalling treatment and unbelievable persecution, that's a euphemism, and that's a denial because you're inherently not including the salient fact that six million were methodically exterminated. Okay.

So it's not using it. But I'm, but, but, but, but, but, getting back to the unique features. The subject of this article, do we have any, like, when has Nick Fuent has done it? Like, it's just like, there's like 45 different yardsticks at play here. Right. And we're being told just so it's clear. to ignore the people saying the Holocaust didn't happen slash those numbers aren't real. We're being told that, don't worry about all that, bro.

Don't worry about that. That's a distraction from the people who are acknowledging the Holocaust in a wrong way. Yeah. Okay. Okay. But not citing the death count every single time they use the word Holocaust. Right, right, right, right. Mark also, how they contrive to kill two birds,

with one foul shot. They first upgrade... I think this must be written originally in English. It's a very English... Yeah, it's British. This guy sounds like he's from the UK. Okay. They first upgrade Israeli acts

to atrocities and gross abuses. Oh, really? That's the upgrade? They then downgrade the Holocaust to persecution and treatment. At the point... Appalling treatment... Yeah. Mind you.

At the point of meeting Israel... At the point of meeting, Israel can be accused with a straight face of... perpetrating a similar genocide in Gaza. Ah, very crafty. Very crafty indeed. Yes, okay.

All right, I see. So you've downgraded one and you've upgraded the other. All right, okay. You put them on a fictional level playing field, right? Uh-huh, uh-huh. Upgrading Israel's actions to atrocities and gross human rights abuses. Yeah. It's like, oh, I think we're long past atrocities and gross human rights abuses, dude.

Yeah. And it's not like Ward and Wilkins. like, independent of any expert opinion, testimony, research, and reporting, including in Israel from Bethlehem, just decided to do this upgrade. No, they're going off what the consensus is among people who know about this shit. Yes. Staying with Wilkie and Ward as softcore deniers, they lead people to think not so badly of Nazi Germany treating, quote, a non-lethal word.

Oh, my God. The Jews appallingly. Well, the is also a non-lethal word, and it's in that sentence. As if, like, third-class citizens, basic rights denied, imprisoned without trial, worked long hours for low pay, or troublemakers executed. Yeah, it's not like they were treated like Palestinians in the West Bank, you know? No, they were treated worse than that. Okay. Unbelievable persecution and appalling treatment give no hint of the elements which make the Holocaust a standalone genocide.

Oh, Jesus Christ. The use of... The showa stands alone. The show us stands alone. Hi-ho, the derrios are the show. I'm like, it's so shocking because you think you're on to something new. It's like crazy to do the pedantic, bad faith accusations of anti-Semitism in the same article in which you were defending Nick Fuentes, in which you were defending literal actual anti-Semitism. Who, I'm like, I know I'm being pedantic about this, but there's all such horseshit.

But like Nick Fuentes hasn't come up in paragraphs and paragraphs at this point. Well, this guy is clearly a jazz man. He's a jazz man who subscribes to Miles Davis's dictum that, yeah, man, it's not the, it's not the Holocaust denying anti-Semitic tropes that you play. It's the ones you don't play, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, that's what it sounds like. Yeah, exactly. That's the voice.

That's the voice. That's the voice. That's what he sounds like. I love doing your jazz man character. Oh, no, you're my cut out for that voice. Thank you, Adam. It's Miles. It's a very specific person. It's a very specific jazz band.

Honestly, it does sound like. That's what Miles Davis sounds like. If you don't know what he sounds like, he literally sounds like that. Go ahead. Exactly. I'm just doing my schick, okay? That's right. I'm just doing my Holocaust denial schick.

and also Miles Davis' voice affirming schick. So these are the things that make Holocaust a standalone genocide. Working people to death, that doesn't make it standalone. People have been worked, I mean, slavery. Yes. In the United States for many, many more years than the Holocaust ever happened. Exterminating millions by factory methods. Okay, yes, we've established that's a pretty unique feature in many ways.

But also, the idea of like every time you speak about the Holocaust, you say, you'll need to say the words exterminating millions by factory methods. I think they should just, what they need to do, the problem is that no one word can capture all of this. I think they need to like make a multi-hyphenate new name for that event. Right. It's like, it's semantically impossible to like reach whatever threshold this Raider is making up as he goes along.

No, unless we make the name of the event, the Holocaust, of six million Jews, which included working people to death, exterminating millions. And every time you say it, you have to include it. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Say it's name. We'll bring that up at the next meeting.

We'll bring it up at the next. But again, it's like, you know, all of the, like, all of the elements of the Holocaust that he's accurately describing here, when has Nick Fent has acknowledged any of these things? What? How does this relate to the topic at hand? It doesn't. It doesn't, and it's not going to. This article could exist in one of these lanes. It can't exist in both the lanes.

This is two pieces, yeah. He goes on to describe other things that are supposedly unique to the Holocaust, liquidating populations town by town. No, that happened during the Nakhba, actually. Yeah, ghetto by ghetto. Yes, I mean, what are we watching currently in Gaza? Butchering individuals. individuals and that's happening right now like butchering individuals randomly and mad fits of

furious every day in the west bank yes the play on words in soft core denial is no accident i know because i asked professor wilkie he couldn't explain the slight of hand the way he lumped together holocaust martyrs with abused Palestinian arabs abused in scare quotes right right right how clever of a politician and a law professor to deflate the holocaust to a massive crime while they flate casualties of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict to an equally massive crime. We're led to believe that what Jewish populations suffered in Nazi-occupied Europe gave Israelis the motive and impetus to make Palestinian Arabs go through similar hell. Well, ask the new Israelis who arrived there in the mid-40s.

I know. And were put, they were given a gun and a helmet and told, go kill the people who did this to you. That's right. And they believed it and they did it. There's testimony to that effect. Yeah. In the telling of anti-Jewish, Jew bigots, professors Norman Finkelstein and Marianne Hirsch,

children of Holocaust survivors, Gaza is another Warsaw ghetto. Well, according to Giora Island, who is no friend of the Palestinians, he's an Israeli military guy who suggested that they spread infectious diseases in the south of Gaza to thin the population, which reminds me of. of which criminal regime from the 1940s.

He called Gaza the largest concentration camp to ever exist. Yeah. Yeah. Or maybe that was Baruch-Kimerling, but Island said something very similar. British author Howard Jacobson, hey, we know him. Oh, yeah.

He's the walking anti-Semitic stereotype. Yeah, he was the one who was mad at the news for showing too many Ghazan children being murdered. And he thought it was anti-Semitic. If you call up a picture, of him, Jamie, you'll do a jump scare. Yeah, yeah. He's a weird-looking guy.

Not that we're not weird-looking, but I mean... So he explains this carefully laid trap. What do we think we are doing when we call the Israelis Nazis and likened Gaza to the Morsar ghetto? We want to wound Jews in their anguish history and to punish them with their own grief. It is as though

Jewish actions of today prove that Jews had it coming to them yesterday. No, it's not. For raiding Jews... I'm sorry, but if you think... think that that's that's a you problem that is a you problem yeah i mean no one is saying that fucking oh this is uh you know uh justifies the the holocaust it's saying well isn't this some dramatic irony and it's saying the fact that it happened to them yesterday doesn't mean we should condone it or ignore it today right right uh berating jews with their own history

disinheriting them of pity disinheriting them of pity that's it we're cutting you out of the will. I love it. Just like in probate arguing with your brothers and sisters over who gets the most pity for the inherited. That is, I love

disinheriting them of pity. Pity is not currency. Oh, but it is. Okay, all right. Because there's no business like showa business. Yeah, oh my God. Is the latest species of Holocaust denial more subtle than

the David Irving version with its clunking body counts and quibbles over gas chamber capability and chimney size. Those quibbles. Oh, my God. Ghoulish. Yeah, it is a ghoulish comparison. And it's so, the sickening part is how much this guy, you know,

Howard Jacobson is like, you know, if this were true, I absolutely would think we had it coming. Yeah, that's right. Like that, but of course, luckily it's not. true. And it's like, hey, there's a version of this in which it is true and also this does not excuse the Holocaust. You have to be really fucked up to immediately think that. And also, by the way, that means you also have to at the very least understand that it is a bad thing that is being done to the Palestinian people. And the fact that you are so deep in your denial that you're going

to willingly forgive a Holocaust denier. I mean, not that Howard Jacobson wrote this article. But I have feeling he has similar positions. If this was true, I would be the first to jump in the time machine, go back and whisper in baby Hitler's ear. Do it. Okay, do what you're going to do. Tribalization of the Holocaust is that it's worse when Israelis sling, quote,

Nazi at each other. Are its columnist Adirahas, he means Amerihas, effectively does that in her, quote, all suffering is equal statement. Quote, no one has the right to rank and rate suffering, whether the death camps or Gaza border clashes,

suffering is suffering. I truly love this. Oh, thank God, this is the last page. Yeah. Softcore, what do you think of that, Jamie? His stern pushback on the notion that suffering is suffering. No, suffering is suffering. I mean, look, it is so, I mean, it's just the propaganda machine is so broken there

because you're just like, just repeat, like, The three quotes he's pulling are so reasonable. Like, I don't understand why he's going with this softcore, like, just presenting objectively true statements that are all acknowledging that the Holocaust is real, unlike the subject in the headline, who has repeatedly done the opposite. Well, because his aim is to make you look away from that guy so as to not make mommy and daddy right-winger's fight anymore. And to look for it somewhere else,

he has to make you see it where it isn't. And he has to make you think, that's the sinister part. The fact that you can't see it means it must be there even more. I understand his goal. I'm just like, this is a clunker. This is not, I was like,

I don't know whose mind is getting changed by this one. Yes. I mean, it's all undercut by it being about, Don't worry about Nick Fuentes. It's like that, to me, like, I understand a, you know, BuzzFeed, circa 2016 article about microaggressions. But if the microaggressions article had been like, there's a lot of talk about David Duke, put that aside.

Yeah. What's more important. Micro-antysmitism. Yeah. The micro-antism. But what he's to, but what he's talking? talking about is like doesn't even meet the threshold of microaggressions. Right. No, exactly. Like it's it's it's people just saying objectively true things and while simultaneously holding

empathy and also confirmation of the atrocities of the Holocaust and saying well it wasn't confirmed it wasn't confirmed enough therefore Nick Fuentes is fine. Trying to fold the lessons of the Holocaust into a generous embracing view of humanity and what it means for humanity rather than what he thinks we should do, which is to just stop at. It happened to Jews. These are the things that happened. It'll never happen to anyone likes to say this again. Don't talk about it.

Here's the final slide. Softcore denial is a dangerous spreader precisely because Jews are not the object, I thought he was going to say, because you're less likely to use protection. Bad case of softcore over here. That's right. Precisely because Jews are not the object of hate. Zionists that treat Palestinian Arabs like dirt are.

Well, we could clip that. That's clippable right there. Jews are not the objects of hate Zionists that treat Palestinian Arabs like dirt are. Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Steve. Thanks, Steve. By this means, anti-Semitism

can be enticed through the back door. Now we're talking hardcore. What is with this language? Why is this so horny? It's so gross. When hate is couched in enlightened terms, disgust for Israel has a glow. Sort of a sex flush, if you will.

Yeah, you know, just kind of a buzzin, you know. Post nut and glow one night. You know what I'm talking about? A refractory and wet. Yuck. Those who deny the Holocaust without denying it have thought it all out. Wow. Oh, you're a clever one, you.

The way that you affirm. The way I said you said the thing you didn't say, and I quoted you on it. To make Israelis the new Nazis, deniers polish Hitler's record while they tarnish Israel's. There comes a point where the two meet, where like is like, and Jew equals Nazi. Well, you said it, I didn't. You said it. Oh, my Lord. What seemed all light nonsense before seems all dark purpose now.

And to be clear, also, conversely, what seems. seems all dark purpose is now just light nonsense. That's right. Yes. The whole being a Nazi out loud, being someone who as, you know, not just like been a Nazi in terms of saying like denying the Holocaust and talking about Jewish, organized Jewry and Jewish cabals, not in a sense of, you know, talking about government structures or whatnot, just like straight up just saying, no, groups of Jews.

Jews getting together automatically equals cabal. Not just that. Literally, Nick Fuentes is a famed in-cell who has advocated for, you know, getting rid of women's suffrage. He's someone who has talked about women in ways that are, honestly, very reminiscent of the way in which, you know, Zionists will dehumanize Palestinians, where this kind of as a lower form of life. He's talked about black people that way.

I mean, every single group, the guy is an open fucking Nazi. But that is just... And has been for like years and years and years. It is like, you know, depressingly interesting that he's having such a resurgence right now. Yes. Or it did feel like there was a cultural moment

where guys like that were nearly gone or they felt nearly gone, right? And now they're very much back. I mean, like, the Tucker Carlson interview, and also in our, like, dark corner in the world, the Red Scare interview, too. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's just like, I'm sorry, I, could we just go back to, and this is, this is just editorial, could we go back to the headline? Oh, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Could we go back to the headline and then just look at how long it was since, because Nick Fuentes didn't even come up again at the end. Yeah, that's right.

is Nick Fuentes is not an authentic Holocaust denier. I'm sorry, I'm sorry to be writing. Okay, so Nick Fuentes comes up in the first paragraph. Uh-huh, uh-huh. And he's the subject of the third. Okay, and then, okay, and then starting in the fourth paragraph. No, he's still here. Next, okay, so he's, okay, the last mention, Quentes' denial is not hard or soft.

It's cloudish, the secret third type of Holocaust denial. That's right. And the less attention paid to him, the better. And then he disappears. From this point on, disappears. There is no mention of a big, Bozo the clan member.

Fucking Fuentes. They don't even bring him back at, they don't even try to bring him back at the end. Because that is not, I mean, whatever. And you know who he doesn't deal with, who he doesn't deal with throughout the entire article is Tucker Carlson. Right. Because he can't.

Because that would be very inconvenient. Yeah. Because Tucker Carlson has been calling it a gentleman. And Tucker Carlson has been saying things that line up very much with the softcore deniers that he's excoriating. Yes. Can we just go to his byline at the end or his bio? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

It just has a funny ending. Yeah, I saw that he had one, but I haven't read it yet. That's always fun. Steve Batfeld is an economist, former director and founder of the School of Management Accounting, veteran authority on anti-Semitism, excuse me, on anti-Zionism, activists combating anti-semitism and prodigious author of non-fiction. I love that. Non-fiction.

Uh-huh. In case you were thinking that he was a prodigy. Some sort of prodigy of fiction. No, he has never written a single lie. He was a prodigy as a child. When he was five, he penned an article called Skeletor is not an authentic villain. I love people's bio. and it's why I always hate writing them

because it all just sounds like fake and embarrassing and made up. Yeah. No one should feel good about a bio. It is, it is just such a, it's just such a crazy moment, you know, with this particular right wing split that you're seeing, especially in American politics, but just like in general, you know, this is obviously, I think, a British, you know,

writer who is coming at it from his perspective. But that perspective, I think, of people, who are pro-Israel who are taking the side of people like Fuentes, who are taking the side of like

Tucker Carlson and the Nazis who are sort of becoming ascendance in the party. I feel like you don't, you haven't yet seen that, but I do think that's the future of this conversation. I really do.

You know, because right now what we're seeing is people, you know, the like Zionist organization of America and different different like right-wing Jewish institutions and groups trying to whip the Heritage Foundation into shape.

And I think more and more what you're going to see is just more capitulation to that wing of conservativeism. Because at the end of the day I don't think it really matters to them. whether or not people are anti-Semitic in America. You know what I mean?

Like, I don't think they care. If the whole party could go full Nazi, and they wouldn't mind as long as it doesn't cross Israel, which I don't know, man. We'll see. We'll see what happens. I'm excited. It's really, it's a fun time for the conservative movement in America,

where they really get to, they're going to have to choose, you know? They're going to have to choose. It's going to be, and I support their right to choose. You know, me personally. That's beautiful. That's beautiful. That's true. I am an ally. What can I say?

Oh, man. Should we leave it there? We should leave it there. Jamie Loftus, thank you so much for coming on Bad Hezbar and talking with us. Happy to do it. I had so much fun. Hell, yeah. Where can people find you and find your work?

you know where I guess I guess mostly Instagram these days I'm at Jamie Christ Superstar and yeah I have a bunch you could get my book Raw Dog which is a history of the hot dog if that's something you're into and it should be you should be into it it's it's very good I saw a Coney Island pendant on your wall oh yeah Nathan's must figure heavily in there yes Nathan's yes I actually got I still go I just I'm going to business expense hot dogs forever. I still go to the contest every year. So that was my little souvenir from this last year at the contest.

Oh, wow. One of my best friends in the world is a native of Vallejo, California, which is where, who's that guy? Oh, Joey Chestnut. Joey Chestnut is from as well. So it's like. Actually, I'm wearing, this is anti-Joege propaganda, but right now I'm wearing my free my free Kobe shirt or Team Kobe.

Because I am, I love, I'm, I love Joey Chestnut, but like, you know, Takera Kobayashi is the original. That's right. My team Kobe's shirt. Of course. But that's for another day. But yeah, the hot dog book, you can get it wherever there's a book, hopefully. Absolutely.

And it's a great book. Everyone please go out and get it. There will also be a link in the description. Jamie Loftus, again, thank you. Please come back soon. Yeah. And thank you to everyone out there listening. Patreon.com slash bad asbarra.

Badasbara at gmail.com for all your questions, comments, and concerns. All right, everyone. Once again, thank you. And until next time, from the river to the sea. If you're going to deny the Holocaust folks, do it inauthentically. It's jumping jacks was us. Push-ups was us. Gopma-gah us.

All karate us. Taking Molly us. Michael Jackson us. Us, Georgia makes not us, Andor was us, Keith Ledger Joker us, endless bread success, Happy Meals was us, McDonald's was us, being happy us, Bequam yoga us, eating food, us, breathing air, us, drinking water us. We invented all that shit. Thank you.