Bad Hasbara - The World's Most Moral Podcast - Bad Hasbara 45: Leaders of the New Shul, with Rolla Selbak

Episode Date: August 15, 2024

Matt and Daniel are join by Palestinian American filmmaker Rolla Selbak for a conversation about the state of Hollywood, a psychotic article about Gal Gadot in the Jewish Chronicle, and the Haaretz investigation into the IDF literally using Palestinians as human shields.Go to Rolla's website here and follow her on instagramClick this link find out more about the Safina Filmmaker ProjectSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/bad-hasbara/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Moshwam hot bitch, a ribbon polo. We invented the terry tomato. And weighs, USB drives, and the iron d'all. Israeli salad, oozy, stent, and jopas, orange rose. Micro chips is us. iPhone cameras us. Taco salads us. Pothalas us.

Olive garden us. White foster us. Zabrahamas. As far as us. Hello and welcome to Bad Hasbara. The podcast the most moral podcast. Yes, the world's most moral podcast. In all of the Olam, we are the world's most moral. I caught Olam. I thought Olam. And Imru, Amen.

Amen, aren't they great? That's what everyone's, that's what people say when they tune into our podcast, they sigh. And they go, amen. I love it when they talk at each other and through each other, but never to each other. Because that's how real men communicate over each other. That's how we do things. Over each other. But actually, I mean, this podcast is so damn feminist.

I mean, we're going to find out today how, I mean, two weeks in a row, Matt, two weeks in a row? Two weeks in a row, you, ladies and gentlemen, everyone else, we deserve a medal for being a male podcast that has remembered that we also need to have women on it. We are hyper-conscious men. Oh, yeah. And when I say deeply conscious, I mean conscious of optics and branding. And self, self-conscious. Self-conscious, yeah. Yes. And really, what more do you want in an ally than someone who is just constantly worried

about whether or not they're good? And also, you know, slightly resentful because of it. That's what real liberalism is all about. I mean, it's really the same thing women want in a male partner. Yes. Someone who's worried all the time. Someone who's deep, a deep-seated resentment well within their heart. all of the things when all they want to do is play video games but what they have to do is like be emotionally available yeah and most of the time that it's they they're able to uh walk that line and find that accurate balance of obedience yeah over pouting and acting out that's right the

pouting and acting out to a minimum right right i mean it has to come out sometimes and shouldn't we be rewarded for being good most of the time our mother is never did so it's up to you that's right uh five stars an review on all of the podcast apps uh and shout out to producer adam levin um also um this is some random news but uh if you are someone who is uh thinking about subscribing to the patreon at patreon.com slash bad hasbara apparently uh apple is doing this thing uh where um they are punishing all podcast apps that you get through there if you have an iPhone and you have like the Patreon app for example they're going to start taking 30% of whatever money you know is donated so

if you're like you know subscribing at $5 they'll take 30% of that it's it's insane so if you are someone who wants to subscribe to Bad Hasbarra's Patreon don't do it through the iOS the Apple app Just don't download the Patreon app. Just go on to your browser and do it there. What the fuck is it with the Jewish people and apples? I know. It's just... From the very beginning.

Fuck you, Tepua. Yes. You know, first you make us eat one and then we are kicked out of the garden. Well, but Matt, let's be real. It wasn't us. It was the women folk. That's right. We're back.

Men, men. Yeah. I truly, I do not know what's going on with the whole Patreon thing, but I got an email from Patreon just like, just so you can either eat the cost or pass it on down to your hogs. And I was like, my hogs will not be touched, okay? So how dare you? Farmer, Farmer Lieb draws the line.

Most moral farmer. Electric fence. Man, okay, let's say it with me. Down with the Patreonarchy. Down with the Patreonarchy. yeah no seriously you guys you know you're fucking up apple you're the worst um when i mentioned this on uh twitter like hey don't subscribe through the patreon app if you have an iPhone because apple is trying to um take money someone was like well the real reason to boycott apple was something about like

they will match employee donations to the idf or some insane thing and i was like yeah i'm sure there's other more sensible reasons to boycott apple but right now the most important thing is that my hogs aren't taken advantage of and i think are we the only are we the only like creatives in the world being like dudes go to spotify right now i know give them your business yes go on spotify don't you know go go use fucking google chrome open it up go patreon.com slash bad hasbara subscribe okay that's right uh can i introduce a totally uh superfluous extraneous and unnecessary segment for this show please i would love that all right so you you need to bring it in by saying what's spinning mate hey hey what's spinning well matt today these days i've been

spinning the leaders of the new school a future without a pass this is buster rhymes old group you see him there little busta before a baldheaded royale I didn't know that was him. That's him. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is before scenario, you know, with the tribe called twist. Then I've got Donald Fagan's very rare comicriot. This is the lead singer of Delaideon, but kind of sci-fi jazz band.

That's what's spinning. And then, and this is, I'm going to only get to do three at a time. This is the brand new Michelle Endadeo cello cello album, collaboration with the words of James Baldwin. Wow. Wow, I love that. No more water, the gospel of James Baldwin. It's very cool. I love it.

Yeah. Did Buster Rhymes go to the new school? Leaders of the New School. I always thought he went to Tisch. I thought he was a Barnard guy. He was the only man. No, it wasn't Barnard. it was uh what's the most jew what's the most jewish yeah oberland he went to

overland yeah or yeah yeah i love how i know the names of any of these schools i grew up on the west coast and i have only ever visited new york like for a week at a time maybe four times yeah it sounds like a great place though every time i go to new york i'm like wow the big apple and then wow wow wow new york city skyscrapers and everything name that tune oh uh alicia keys new york no no living for the city stevie wonder okay yeah yeah that's what i was going to that was the next thing i was going to say doesn't turn out well for that character uh and right before we introduce our guests i do need to play you one thing that i saw on the internet um because i know you are also a big kendrick lamar fan just like uh i am huge um

uh when the drake v kendrick uh beef uh beef was you know at its peak i remember thinking to myself like there's for sure going to be um some sort of has bar a backlash on that like this is going to be like considered anti-semitic somehow because drake is jewish and uh i said you know there's going to be think pieces or whatnot i know that those think pieces did happen at some point we need to read them together but i just want to play a video that someone sent us on twitter of someone explaining um how not like us is anti anti-Semitic and how its anti-Semitic trope is also true. I'll just play it for you.

This is, this is it. Patrick Lamar said to Drake, you're not like us. That's actually the biggest theme in anti-Semitism. The nations of the world tell the Jews, you're not like us. Spiritually speaking, this is actually true. I'm sorry, spiritually speaking, this is actually true. You just said it was anti-Semitic. But go on, please.

Jewish people are supposed to be a nation of priests serving God, and that makes us different. When anti-Semites say you're not like us, it's because we're not fulfilling our true purpose. I love this. When anti-Semites say you're not like us, it's because they're right. Zionists have lost their fucking minds. Also, no way this guy's part of the priestly class. This guy's a Levite. No way he's a Cohen.

Yes, he is not a Cohen. All right. But I got to play just a little bit more. It's time to stand up and follow the ways of the Torah. That's what this song's about. We go rise up, it's a brand new day when they're going gets tough. Yeah, we follow your, follow your ways. Every day.

Oh, boy. That song at the end, I like first listened to it this morning and I, like, the sleep was still, you know, like in my brain. And I just could not follow. I was like, is, does, is that song in any key in particular? It was, it's like a fever dream that song. Well, you know me. I'm already trying to write we not like you in my head, you know. I know.

I know. Hitler on the beat, ho. Oh, man. Anyways, love, love us. No, no, hold on. Hitler on the beat, dog. Something shake your ass up like an e-trug. Oh, wow.

Okay. Listen, well, this will come out. Yeah, it will. And we'll have to put it in an episode as soon as we write it. It'll happen, swear to God. But not today, folks, because today. Not today. Because today, segue, we've got a wonderful guest, a great guest who is a writer, director of both film and TV

and an alumna of Sundance, someone who I think is fantastic, who I recently did a panel with for SAG AFRA for Ceasefire. Ladies and gentlemen and everyone else, welcome to the podcast, Rolla Selba! Yay! Hey! Hey! What's up? I would love to just open by saying with your flowery feminist opening that I heard, I immediately regretted my decision to be on this podcast. However. You're welcome. You're welcome.

You're welcome, sister, and you're welcome, sister. Yes, exactly. However, I must say that why Kendrick lyrics are anti-Semitic reaffirmed my trust. Yes. That this is indeed where I belong. I belong here. So thank you both so much. You know what I like about your name?

Tell me. It works. If you invert some things, it works just as well. Sell a rollback. Okay. You know, you sell something back. You roll something back. Yes.

Yes. I have to. This is obviously the anglicized version, right? Yes. It's an Arabic name. It's an Arabic name. It's Rula Silva. Yeah.

But I do, I do love that point out. It's actually kind of fresh. Usually I get like, oh, you know, Rolex or, you know, rock and roll at, like, you know, so I do appreciate adding that to, to, to my notebook of the roster of fake names too. Yeah, of how folks can make fun of my name. It's awesome. Well, I feel like Rolex is a compliment of anything, you know. Right. Yes. That's not bad. It's a good watch. Yes. Good watch. Good quality. Always on time. Timeless, but always on time. So, Rolla, you are a filmmaker, you are a Palestinian filmmaker, and I can imagine that, you know, as a Palestinian filmmaker, as somebody who is in the entertainment industry, you probably have some thoughts about what the state of the industry has been like since October 7th.

And this is something we talked about at the panel that we did together. And I, yeah, I wanted to just ask you about that. So what, how's the industry? What's the state of the industry right now in Los Angeles? It's healthy. It's. The state of the industry is Israel. Right, right, right, right.

That's the state. Yeah, the industry state. But please, roll it. Please, that's my last interruption. No, no, no. What is this? I'm experiencing what you all have taught me. What I learned is, what's it called? Complement. Cooperative. Cooperative overlap. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I love it. Yeah, I mean, I think in general, it's, it's, you know, ever since the strikes anyway, it's been very, you know, we're all kind of questioning a lot about this industry. And we were already. And I think after October 7th, that kind of added, an overarching layer of just how messed up, actually, this industry is, to be honest, and also how artists within the system can't and are afraid to voice their opinions as well. So not only are the folks who are kind of the ruling class of Hollywood, let's say,

you know, staunchly, I don't know, pro-genocide, quote unquote, question mark, but also that the artists within it feel, and there already was. a and is a culture of fear within Hollywood, right? So we see the high, you know, Weinstein situations. We see so many situations where this culture of fear makes every creative feel like, oh my gosh, am I in, am I out the club, right? Am I in, am I out? Am I out? Am I get the job? Will I not? Right. And so you have this culture of fear anyway, and then you add now on top of it, the fact that you cannot even say what's happening is a genocide without getting blackballed is really scary, I think. It's a scary place to be. And then I don't have to say, but like we all

saw the brave Jonathan Glazer, like, you know, giving his Oscar speech, which was very, I thought, like just beautiful, human, like, you know, not really pushing any buttons. Yeah, thoughtful. Thoughtful. That's a perfect word. And yet you saw how his hand was shaking. It was how his hand was shaking. Yes. That's really indicative of what's going on in Hollywood. Yeah. Is the new version of the casting couch where a producer sits on the couch, invites you to come over and ask you, ask you what your favorite Israeli invention is. That's actually kind of milder, milder than I thought you would tell. What comes to mind when I say, make the desert bloom?

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. But certainly, and probably Matt, you know this, and Daniel, I'm not sure how Hollywood involved in Hollywood or Hollywood. what adjacent you are, but, but, but there, there absolutely is, um, this, um, the sentiment of are you or are you not, um, you know, I don't know. I think it's, it's more like, are you or are you not? I don't know if it's pro-Israel or if it's like, kind of, are you going to say anything? I don't really know what their deal is, you know what I mean? But you, you've seen those letters like from, you know, big agencies and, you know, I stand with Israel and all that stuff.

and you saw what they did with poor, like, Mahadakhil, who's like one of the biggest... Yeah, no, I don't know. Tell us about that. Oh, for real. Okay, I'd love to. Okay. I'm glad because I thought it was going to be repeating.

That's wonderful. So Mahad Dehiel is a huge agent, one of the biggest agents at CAA. And what ended up happening was shortly after October 7th. She made a post on Instagram, something about, da-da, genocide. So she said the word genocide. because that's what was happening.

And it was very sympathetic. It wasn't anything, you know, just basically like, wow, I can't believe this is happening. And so CA immediately was about to fire her. They demoted her from all the boards that she was on. And if it wasn't for Tom Cruise, who was her, who's her, yes, exactly, who's her, one of her, the biggest client. So Tom Cruise came, caped for her and said, please, please do not. So instead they made her take all these, like, you know, sensitivity like classes

just really, really degrading shit, to be honest. Can you imagine the sensitivity class for saying something that can be perceived as against Israel? It's got to just be Hebrew school. Leaders of the new

shul. Hey! Welcome. Welcome. Yes. Yes. Oh, now we have a title for the episode. That's great. But yeah, like, yeah, I remember hearing that story.

I didn't know that the agent's name. Yeah, and it's crazy because I think around the same time, you know, you had clients, big name clients leaving CAA because of this tweet or, you know, the reaction to it, you know, just completely kind of new McCarthyism sort of thing going on, at least within, you know, this very specific thing, Hollywood agencies, right? Yes. And I think it was Aaron Sorkin, who was like, he like left to go to like WME or some other agency and, you know, blamed it on anti-Semitism, just like total insanity.

And the insanity that we've seen, you know, since the seventh has been, I think, so pronounced that I, non, you know, L.A. people, non-industry people. have taken notice of it. But you as a Palestinian filmmaker, you've been Palestinian since before the seventh. So, I have. Yeah, how long's that been going on? Yeah. Tell us, tell us about that. What's up with that? What was the thought process in that? Yeah, exactly. When did you make the choice to have your existence be politicized? Do you remember we were bringing out the idea? Yeah, exactly. But, yeah, but seriously, do you, you know, your experience before, you know, what is it, what's it like to be a Palestinian filmmaker in Hollywood? Yeah, I would say, I have to say, I have to preface by saying, what's happening now isn't, you know, if you are Palestinian or not.

It's if you are outspoken or not about Palestine. I will say that. I really don't see much of a difference between those with Palestinian background or not. those who are outspoken, brave enough to speak on behalf of humanity and those who aren't. But I will say that I'll tell you my experience after October 7th and I'll tell my experience before. So remember CAA, right, like we just talked about, the biggest, one of the big three agencies in Hollywood. So I was part of CAA as well. And you notice I use the word was. And it's because I was dropped.

I was dropped by CAA a few months ago. Yeah, so I got dropped, you know, literally it's not like, like I had just come off of pitching with Sony at a TV show like to like Netflix and Hulu like all those places. Wow. So it's not like I wasn't, you know, active. Right, right. And so it was really, but it's so funny because I would tell like my friends and everyone, I'd be like, I wonder when this is going to happen. I haven't got the call yet. I know I'm going to get it because I'm very, very vocal and active on social media.

it finally happened so good riddance yeah yeah i mean it's it's crazy the amount of stories that i've you know been hearing from people i know because you know i come from a comedy background so it's people who uh you know it's all kinds there's people who are like industry industry you know comedians who have writing jobs or like you know or who are actors and stuff like that or pitch and stuff and then comedians who uh do podcasts and drive uber you know it's like all kinds of uh it's all kinds of people and all of those are great all of those those are wonderful avenues but you see like the amount of people who like just in the you know in their regular lives are you know the industry has not ever looked at their tweets and been like you know hey this is a problem you know they tweeted

black lives matter they tweeted about all sorts of different kind of like what I would consider like liberal movement politics stuff sure um and There hasn't been a second thought, but then the amount of people who, as soon as they acknowledged the very real reality of the genocide going on in Gaza, who are not just fired, but first yelled at. Did they, did they yell at you first or did they just drop you? Yeah, no berating. They just immediately just call quick, literally 30 second to one minute phone call. Never heard from them again. Wow.

It kind of calls into question what in reality constitutes. a really political tweet. Like, if you actually think about it, is it that political to tweet, I support BLM or science is real or whatever? Like, or is, like, like, I feel like, you'll know if it's political if there's an actual backlash.

Right. Yeah. I mean, I, I mean, I agree for the most part on that. Because it carries risk. Of course. And there's certainly like things in like, I would say the liberal zeit guys that are like no go zones, you know, obviously if you're tweeting a bunch of racist stuff, then that's a different thing. It's just like any kind of job. If your employer sees that you are someone who goes online and tweets a bunch of death threats

to women or, you know, in-cell shit or, you know, yeah, there's a lot of stuff for you that they're like, we don't want to have anything to do with you. The difference here is, you know, is kind of the inversion of reality that Zionism leads to in which you are called a racist for protesting against a, what is clearly a racist state doing racist actions. That's right. It is completely maddening. It is absolutely maddening.

It's enough to make you literally lose your mind, actually, and question reality and question everything. This gas lining is just so insidious, to be honest. They should be honest, to say, in this house we believe in race science trust the race science yeah it's been it is something that can make you lose your mind

I mean not even facetiously there is you know I think people out there I know who I've like had some serious mental health crises happen due to just straight up the gaslighting Just the gaslighting alone, just the, you know, idea of telling you, you know, all those, you know, mangled corpses you saw are not reeled or it's okay to do that. Yes. Daniel, I see you snickering.

What are you thinking? What's the pun? Tell me the pun. I don't have the formulation, but it involves the phrase gaslight chambers. Oh, yeah, yeah. There's something there. There's something there. Yeah, yeah.

Well, throw that out to the audience. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But watch out, okay? Not in the comments section. Do it at home. Do it at home on a piece of paper, okay? You don't have to workshop Daniel's pun in the comments. Please.

We have enough trouble getting demonetized already. But so that has been your post-October 7th experience. Now, did they say? say when they dropped you if there was specifically a post or a reason. No, they just kind of, they cited, you know, the generic like, literally it was a very, very quick phone call. And it was with all my agents, all three of them. Okay. Like it was like this like phone call, hey, I'm like, okay, I already know what's up.

Wow. And 30 seconds to a minute, like super quick, market reasons. Right. Bandwidth. Goodbye. Yeah. And that was it. You know, and this is like the thing about, you know, Hollywood in general is that when you, whether or not you get something or don't get something, you don't find out why.

You know, they don't say, there's no reason that they tell you why you didn't book some gig or, you know, why it's just you don't find out about it or some generic market reason, you know. And so it just, it leads you to this place of going like, you can do this sort of McCarthyism without ever actually saying there's an issue with your politics. And that adds to the gas lining that you talked about. But it's when you see, I forget what PR agency was, it's a big PR agency where one of the head ones, right? That email like that you start, things get uncovered. And like all of a sudden this email is like, if you have. any clients that are like anti-Israel like you know immediately cut it off with them now and that was uncovered it's like oh okay we're not going crazy like this is happening yes yes it is happening

and then also if you know if you are someone who's you know in the industry and you know know people uh who are agents or managers and whatnot they tell you all about these kinds of meetings and they do happen and you know that's the uh the thing about all of this is uh if I know a lot of our listeners will be like, you know, it feels like something that would happen. It would make logical sense based on the way that these like Zionists who are not in the industry kind of justify all sorts of evil atrocities, that there would also be people who are Zionists in any industry being like, hey, we're going to do this to people. It's true.

This is things, these are things that have been happening everywhere. Yes. Man, trope springs eternal. Yeah. I mean, the world is a fucking trope. Like, what the fuck? Oh, but there's no cabal. There's no conspiracy.

Well, there is no conspiracy, but God damn it if they don't make it seem like there is. Just a slight tangent, but of course I'm speaking. So, of course, it's a tangent. Of course. A tangent. Who are some out and proud Palestinians in Hollywood? I know I can think of Hiam Abbas. Yeah, Heim Abbas.

Shireen Dabas, who's an amazing director. she won the Emmy for Only Murders in the Building, I believe. The silent episode, the non-hearing episode. So Shereen Deppes is a big one. Obviously, Moe Amir, who has the amazing show Moe on Netflix, who they wrapped up season two. So, yeah. Romney's not Palestinian, right?

He's Egyptian. I believe he's Egyptian. Yeah. I believe he's Egyptian, yeah. But still part of the fam. Dina Shihabi, who's an amazing actress and actually a really good friend of mine. she was one of the she was in jack ryan first and then one of the she was the lead in archive 81 another netflix show she was in a bunch so she's an amazing actor so yeah Palestinian as well so

did you ever have experiences um as a Palestinian filmmaker in Hollywood before the seventh in which um you consider your you know uh identity as a Palestinian filmmaker in Hollywood before the seventh in which um you consider your, you know, uh, identity as a Palestinian to be a hindrance or where you weren't sure whether or not the, your, uh, identity was being politicized just, you know, unconsciously or consciously. Yeah. I, I, I, to be honest with you, um, I, it was more of feeling tokenized, which actually, you know, maybe is a better feeling than, than being ostracized.

I don't know what's worse. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's one where we accept you, but we kind of want to control your image or we actually completely reject you and everything you stand for. I mean, they're both kind of insidious, but we understand, right? We understand that Hollywood's just, you know, basically the PR arm of, you know, the U.S. The American Imperial State, yeah, exactly. So it's no surprise.

Like, I knew what I was getting into. I'm not like a dumb, dumb and not, you know, it's like, oh, no, how has this happened? You know what I mean? I knew, I knew. However, yeah, I would say I felt more tokenized. For instance, examples might be, like when I would write Arab characters or even Muslim characters, you know, the notes I would get back because the people who are giving you notes are not Muslim and they're not Arab. And so what does that mean? That means that the notes are coming from maybe, on one hand, it's coming from, yes, we know what works on television.

and I have to give them that. Okay, that's their job, sure. But it's also coming from a very ignorant place. And what they're doing, and I'll tell you an example of one of the notes I got. I call it Tea Party and a Mosque. And I'll tell you what this note was. Please. So basically, my point is that, well, I'll tell you the note first.

So we were writing a show and da-da-da, and it's about, hey, three Arab friends, there are women and, you know, what's it like to be Arab, female, and young in, you know, in L.A. So that was the show and we're writing it, da-da-ta-ta-ta, and one of the feedback is can we put one of the girls in a hijab when she's talking to her parents? I'm like, she's not hijabi. Totally fine if you are, but that's not, she's not religious. Like, what do you?

No, for the visuals, for the visuals, for the visuals. I'm like, um, so are you ready? Are you already started getting like, oh, shit, okay, this is. So in my mind, I tried to be positive. I try to be like, okay, maybe this is more of an edgy. educational thing. I just have to let them know that this is not right. And if people watch this, especially of like Muslim era background, they're going to laugh at that. This isn't real. And then so they're like, okay, we want a scene where all the girls are together and they're having

like a conversation. Maybe like a tea party in a mosque. I'm like a tea party in a mosque. Okay. well i'll say i'll say this in paris i went to the grand mosque of paris yes and they have a wonderful tea lounge yes at the mosque but not in the mosque it's right it's it's of the mosque but not in the mosque adjacent if you will it is mosque adjacent no but my point is and so maybe that's what the thing right maybe maybe to your point daniel like maybe they had an experience once in Turkey or something. Right, right, right, right. They're like, I know.

It's like, da, da, da, da, da, no. It's like, well. They think that when Arabs meet inside of a room anywhere that it's technically a mosque. Yeah, exactly. It can't just be in the house or just at like fucking Earth Cafe or something. I'm like, what is it? It's crazy, though, because it would be like saying, you know, it's a tea party inside of a church. And it's like, in which, you mean in.

The church, church? Are you thinking of a cafe and or community center? A hundred percent. Can we have these two Jews share a Kiki and the, you know, just like the Bima, you know? Yes, yeah, yeah, while they're sitting Shiva somewhere. I'm like, what is happening? What is happening? So my point is like, it's one thing, by the way, and I never fault anyone for not knowing, okay?

I really don't. I'm not one of those who's like, you know. You should have known. You should have done your homework. I'm not that. However, the way to have I think asked it is like, is there a cultural thing where they can all be to, is what's relevant to you? Tell me.

Like, we'd love to have these girls, you know, talk, have a conversation in a more somber area. Like, what would that be to you? Like, is there a culture? So you could ask me. Don't tell me what you want them to do when it's completely irrelevant to the culture or the religion. Yeah. Don't give a weird suggestion, especially one based on ignorance. Yes, 100%.

And the thing is that, you know what the thing is, Matt, is I think the thing about it is it's the unabashed. It's the kind of unabashed feeling that they can just say anything and it's fine. They can just suggest anything and it's fine. You are not going to be offended. It doesn't actually matter what you think. I'm going to suggest, you know what I mean? And that they have great ideas. I mean, this is just a different.

This is a very specific Hollywood thing, is that anyone who is in the position where they give notes, they're in that position not because they have good ideas, but because they will not stop giving their ideas. And they think the fact that they have those, that position justifies how good their ideas are. So they're just like, I got all sorts of things. You can do tea inside of a mosque. I was thinking like, what's that big, that big square over Saudi Arabia? You guys are like a dance party at the square. You're dancing around the square. I got all sorts of ideas, man.

You're at Al-Ala-a-Wa-We will dance again in the square. Do they have fentons at Muslim holy places? Can we do a friends-type thing? Yeah. Blashing around. Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no. A hundred percent. And I'll give you one other example of actually tokenization, which is, so I got this,

this email wants for my agents and says, like, oh, looking for a Palestinian writer for a showtime show, like mini room right away. Like, basically they're looking for something. I'm like, wow, okay, palis. You know, this is exciting. They're finally, you know, even discerning between Arabs, like a difference between a Palestinian and Araqi and, you know, Egyptian. So I got excited. I'm like, cool. Do you guys know, like, showtime show? So immediately when they said showtime, I'm like, okay, I'm thinking home. I'm thinking, I'm like, okay, they have a certain reputation, but let's see what's up. So I met with them, and it turns out that it was an Israeli show where they literally actually

told me, literally, in actual literal words, told me that they wanted a Palestinian in the room to humanize two people. One of them was the wife of a terrorist, and then the other one was the sister of the terrace. Good. Good. We're not sure if it can be done, you know, but it would be nice to have them approximating

human. Yeah. Yes. We had the writer's room is mostly Israelis, and they were writing them, not really with dialogue, but more with like some sort of like oinking noises and braying and, you know,

grunts and such. And we said, what if they said human words. Well, because and we thought just why goes, like, let's go easy on the people doing the close captions. Like, how are you going to transcribe that stuff? Let's give them

some words so we can have it actually in the script. It'll be simpler. Who are we going to find? Yeah, it's funny because like in this sense for, in this quest for you know, a representation, which is like, you know, kind of a double-edged sword because it's hard to, you know,

representation is important in terms of equity in like riders' rooms or in any kind of, you know, work. But then you have, of course, it being used cynically by, you know, people who do it to tokenize in order so that they can have a more genuine terrorist dialogue or whatnot. And it's like, they're still repeating the tropes, but they're doing so, you know, while, you know, trying to humanize, which, you know, give, you can take it or leave it. There's obviously, you know, tokenization and that kind of, you know, stuff is, you know, obviously problematic and can be racist and disturbing.

Is there a part of you that's like, oh, man, those were the days since the seventh? Oh, gosh. You know what I mean? Where it's like, now people are just openly racist. You're just like, oh, fuck. You know? Yeah, I know exactly what you mean. I do have to, just for the audience to know, I did not take that job and would never.

And I did, I declined and I told them why I declined. So I wasn't, it wasn't like a, no offense. It was a very specific. And they were like, thank you very much, C.C. every single important player in town. C.C., the mayor of Hollywood. Yeah, they're hard to work with. But no, I think to be honest with you, I've been thinking about this a lot, not just within Hollywood, but just in general. Like how cartoonishly villainous the U.S. characters, quote, unquote, are now.

I keep thinking like, you know, if the U.S. and if Israel was smart, they would actually go back to, you know, something that seemed like they were, they cared. And then they would, you know, keep genociding anyway. Like I thought, you know, maybe they'd do the good cop, bad cop, you know, if they were smart, they would immediately kick out Netanyahu, bring someone, quote, more center quote, even though there's no such thing as a center Zionist, and just have them be like, oh, we understand. we're trying to be they're not they're not even pretending they're not even pretending they're not even pretending they're so cartoonishly evil and for me it's been it's it's how don't on like obviously we don't want lives to perish and and this has been the most horrifying i don't know stain on humanity of our lifetime i think that we've seen in my generation let's say um oh in many many yeah but but it but in but in other words it's been so much

clearer to people who've been curious and have been like wait a minute what's going on this is going on oh i see it like they see it they see it there's no you have to read between the lines they see it and for me it's it's better to see it to be honest because yeah that's interesting yeah yeah no completely it is it is almost refreshing uh you know because you get to at the very least show people um who like what you have been seeing underneath all the smiling and euphemisms and be like, see, this is what I'm talking about, you know, these people who wanted to, you know, tokenize me for this role, you might, you know, write for these, a terrorist and the sister of a terrorist, you might see me and go like, oh, you know, hey, come on, they're doing their best, they're trying representation,

thought you wanted that. And now you get to see what's behind all of that. Now you get to see the actual, you know, the actual racism that they just have been holding on to deep in the hearts of every Zionist. Just, but I want to segue into something that is relevant to this in terms of the total inversion of, you know, reality with Zionists and specifically what's going on in Hollywood. There was an article by the Jewish Chronicle about, Gal Gadot and who as we all know

one of Hollywood's greatest stars one of Hollywood's best and brightest actresses out there Why not go all the way Matt Why not call her Gay Dodd? Yeah What? It's Godot.

I don't know. Is she? Oh, yeah. Is it Godot? It's Godot. It's Godot? It's good dot. You're right. You're right. It's gaddot. Yeah. I don't know what God means, but yeah.

Yeah. Well, listen. The plural, the plural of God. What if God was one of us? What if God was Galgadot? Yeah, what if God was Galgadot? So here is the article that I want to share with everyone. The boycotting of Galgadot isn't, quote, to war. It's anti-Semitic, anti-progressive, and anti-human. From righteous to ruinous, how the progressive mask is slipping away in the wake of October 7th. So here is this article.

Here's this opening. The author is notable too. This is an Iranian woman. Elika Le Bonn. Yes. Who's one of these Iranian people who, and it's not all Iranians, but there is a huge split in the Iranian community where for her, any enemy of the Islamic Republic of Iran who oppresses women and all this kind of stuff is is a friend worth is worth defending to the end yes you know yeah yeah she contacted she DM me once did she did she invite herself on bad Hasbara or was she trying to engage me in a conversation I hope she invited herself on this podcast I don't think so no I think she's on it right now yeah she's on it now welcome elika welcome Erica oh sorry

So here's the first sentence here. And if I didn't tell you what this article was about, imagine hearing this first sentence and thinking it's about this. One particular trend of our post-October 7th world is witnessing the tribe of people once lauded as humanitarian, progressives, and anti-racists becoming the exact opposite, regressives, racists, bigots, and xenophobes. How is that not exactly about every Zionist that I know?

That is the most insane sentence. That is literally verbatim what I have said about like 10 friends that I had where I'm like, listen, you used to be humanitarian, progressive anti-racist. Now look at you. Especially since she uses the word tribe. I know. She's using tribe. I swear to God, she's trolling us. She's actually a comrade.

The tribe called questionable politics. The next sentence is even wilder. It's even wilder. The waves of hate directed at Israelis and Jews in the past 10 months have revealed a widely accepted peculiar inversion of traditional racism, which once condemned the people for their alleged inferiority. now instead condemning a people for their alleged superiority. No, motherfucker. It's condemning a people for their own allegations of self-superiority, which is what we've always done any time a people ascribes or what's that word.

Self-imposes. Yeah, yeah, yeah, arrogates to themselves. Errogates arrogantly, but arrogates to themselves a status of superiority. Of course we condemn them. Who's condemning, yeah, all these, all these Palestine activists are like, we are so sick of this master race oppressing us. When will they stop lording their objective superiority over us? Yes. Just, it's not fair, all right?

It's truly amazing to write that sentence and just be like, you know, it used to be that racism was when you thought people were subhumor. It's subhuman. Now it's when you think they're Superman. Oh, my God. Whose song is Poor Superman? Oh, I don't know, poor Superman. Isn't that Lori Anderson or something like that? Could be.

Like an art rock thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that's what this is. It's poor Superman. Poor super humans. Yeah. Pity. The Uber mentions burden.

It's incredible to be like, yeah, now they're hated because of how awesome they are. That's right. We can't stop tweeting about how awesome Israel is. We're mad that they invented the cherry tomato. Not that they're constantly murdering people. Hamas crimes are excused and all Israelis are treated like war criminals. Well, but not all Jews. Not all Israelis.

Only Zionist Jews, they gleefully insist, as though conditional racism is something worth patting themselves on the back for once again Zionism not a race Zionist is not a race well she would say okay but Zionism is the condition

on the Jewish race but even then not not all Germans throughout history only the Nazi Germans throughout history yeah it's like yeah that's a very important distinction that's right insane and also not only Zionist Jews but Zionist everybody's yeah right Zionist everybody's yeah

we don't just we don't discriminate although I wanted to ask you guys this maybe this is a good moment for it please please I heard Norman Finkelstein on a podcast recently which by the way Matt I've I've written to the man and he's writing a book on Gaza right now but he asked us to circle back to him in September so okay the word is out Norm, you're on. But he says he doesn't use the word Zionist anymore as a descriptor or an epithet. He says that word doesn't mean anything anymore. It applies to Herzl and Jabotinsky and Moshe Dian and the founders, right?

They actually had an ideology that they believed in. These people today are Jewish supremacists and we should just call them what they are. And there's something I like about that. Sure. because it's a non it evinces a kind of non-technical contempt for what the thing actually boils down to sure there's no jargon in it there's no there's no there's you don't have to argue about the definition I'm not saying we should give up no no I thought it was an interesting point I have I I've mixed feelings on that because there was actually a point um with me in which uh back when I was still kind of like

grappling with my thoughts on Zionism and Israel, you know, when I was a little bit younger, where I was like, we should just stop using the word Zionist or anti-Zionist or, you know, Zionism because it means different things to everybody and, you know, anyone who's using that term at this point is suspect and we should just, you know, blah, blah, blah. And I just kind of got to the point where I was like, I personally think that what is more helpful rather than policing the word Zionist or Zionism is to firmly establish the definition of that word so that it is something you would not want to self-apply. And so I don't know, that's it's important to me because of the fact that people do self-apply that term.

Do you have any views on that? No one, given that, sorry, go ahead, Matt. Oh, I'm just saying no one, you know, would call themselves a Jewish supremacist, right? You know, except for in Israel, of course. In Israel, there are people who would call themselves a Jewish supremacist. But people call themselves Zionists, like, openly. And I think the thing to do is to clearly define that word so that people know exactly what Zionism is based on the consequences of Zionism. So that is inextricably linked to this genocide and to the persecution of Palestinians. And, yeah, that's my thought.

I love that. I love that actually. I didn't think about that. And actually, that's, that's, that's really, really, I actually love that train of thought. I think, I mean, I don't, I don't, I want to say I don't carry the way. It doesn't mean I don't care. It means that it actually, I think whatever's the most useful and whatever actually, most useful, less hurtful. That's, that's what it is. But I do like Jewish supremacy, why? Not necessarily to attribute to people like, for instance, Biden. To your point, I can't imagine him saying, like, I am a proud Jewish supremat, right? Like, that doesn't make any sense. But I do really feel like that term should be heard more as it relates to Israeli society. Because I don't think people really truly, not people, some people do not truly understand how when they're calling themselves the only democracy in the Middle East, yes, we see that obviously like they're genocidal, whatever, but I don't think they understand that it's also not a democracy. And also the rights of, you know, the Palestinian citizens within the occupied territories and outside and everywhere else are completely, you know, occupied by this Jewish supremacist system, legal system, society, all that type of stuff because they don't matter as much as they say the Israeli say the Jewish population does. Well, they matter strictly for optics. they matter. Oh, sure. It's very important that they maintain a 20%.

Right. There you go. Yes. Yes. They love citing that 20%. Yeah. And the Drews. They love saying, oh, they love the Dries. Yeah, I love that. It's my favorite. What did you say about the visuals about the hijabi? Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's for the visuals. It, yeah. The Palestinian people in 48 Israel with which, who have rights with an asterisk, are a very, important facet of that of the bad has borough yeah we need the object but yeah i i i would love to talk more with uh norman uh finkelstein about that because i think it's interesting uh and i understand where he's coming from with that for sure um and when he does come on uh i look forward

to you interrupting him and then him yelling at you no it's it's he doesn't yell i've Mr. Mate, Mr. Monte, Mr. Monte, please. Mr. Mathewson. Exactly. Mr. Mate. Mr. Madison. Mr. Madison. You are so incontrovertibly dumb. I want him.

Oh, I love him so much. I did an online event with him. It's such a legend. It's more that I just wasn't. able to interrupt it. No, I know. I know. It's going to be great. Until we were just interrupting each.

Like, I think, yeah, we're going to have to adjust our, we're going to have to, but yeah. It'll be great. But, but, but, but anyway. Moving on, well, let's just continuing with the story real quick. Yeah, yeah. This is so good. Despite being historically oppressed, exterminated, drummed out of everywhere, they called

home. And one of the main victims of the same white supremacy, they are now charged. with quote I'm sorry drumed out is so funny her I'm just imagine like played off like on an award ceremony like every time the juice the drums get out like sorry juice got to go they struck up the oud and the and the fucking you know whatever the you know the arabic drums are called and just played them off until they left the fucking stage they drummed us out now we got to go and oh no they're bringing more drums we just got here oh jesus they're now charged with quote progressives and quote anti-racists have spun a new narrative that married every unconscionable

attribute stereotype and malignment malignment yeah into a into a cocktail of anti-semitic hatred accusing Jews of being oppressors and therefore unworthy of sympathy. Oh, Jesus. Yeah. Since 1,200 Israelis were killed on October 7th, we've watched as Jews and Israelis

have been targeted by the, quote, humanitarian and the, quote, bastions of justice, bastions of justice, and the, quote, anti-racists, all for the good of, quote, liberating the Ghazan people. Can you, I'm sorry, remove the quotes

And what you have is a sentence about how humanitarians, the ICJ and ICCN, UN, and anti-racists are trying to liberate the cause in people. At some point, you've got to be like, wait, this sentence, if the scarecrots are removed, it's about how we are being condemned by people who are interracist. Oh my God Of course any clear-eyed common-sense individual Can see there is no traceable thread Between targeting Jews and liberating Ghazins True I can see that That's absolutely true

There's also no traceable thread Between liberating Gossens and targeting Jews Yeah that's right Right like there's no traceable thread Between doing what we're doing Yes And anything or what any Clearide common sense

Palestinian or Palestinian advocate is doing Yes And whatever the fuck targeted Yeah, they are not, the idea that it's automatically targeting Jews is great, because then you get to invert it and say like, well, that's why you are targeting Jews so you can. I mean, I mean, okay, so yeah, I mean, I guess when Hamas puts an Israeli tank in their sites, right, pinpoint its location, literally targeting Jews. That's targeting some Jews. That's targeting those Jews. You come for our, you know, Merkavuz. You come for our, you know, Merkavuz, you come for all of us. If you're going to shoot, shoot not straight.

That's right. If you come for the king, you best miss. You best, you best miss. But that is the genius of this insidious bigotry, finding loophol to express its hate under guise of caring for humanity. Genius of this insidious bigotry. What is this, Lynn Manuel Miranda? Yeah.

In the latest chapter, Finally, we're getting to the woman of the hour, Gal Gadot. Actress Gal Gadot, who plays the evil queen in the upcoming rendition of Snow White, has been subject to this... Typecasting, typecasting, anti-Semitic casting. Yes. Has been subject to these same targeted attacks. As images of Gadot in the new role surfaced, the quote, humanitarian and quote, anti-racist emerge from their, quote, safe spaces for intersection. sectional liberation to launch a witch hunt against Gadot for her Israeli nationality.

She's literally playing a witch. Is it a witch hunt? If she's playing a wit, explaining how, yeah, explaining how fitting it was for Gadot to play a character that tries to kill a child and steal her kingdom. I'm sorry, but this person is, this is an op. I swear she is a comrade that is so funny and it'd be one thing if this were a meme spreading across the world

like everyone knew this funny joke about like how fitting it is for her to play a character who tries to kill a concealed kingdom I had not heard that that's hilarious I haven't seen this many quotes with like short like quotes around two words since reading manufacturing consent like Chomsky does this all the time

Yeah, he'll just pepper his thing by like citing the thing. But she's got no citations. Yeah, I was like, yeah, he has. They're just air quotes basically. Yes, this is someone who types and then does an air quote. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And she's typing. Oh, my God.

Yeah, at some point, if you write an article that is entirely filled with scare quotes, you are just, if you remove the scare quotes, you have, you have an actual sentence. all right cons and creators with huge platforms immediately demanded that their audience boycotts no white in protest of her participation with others parroted the old yeah with others parroting the old anti-semitic trope that she was only cast because quote jews run the world everybody together jews run the world yeah who run the world who run the world me oh god i wish i ran the world dog um who run the world yours truly yeah who run the world guilty i'm sorry but to say you know with others parroting this old who run the world present he present to say to say this without a single, you know, it's not a link, it's just like this, it is literally just writing something and being like, I'm inventing a straw man. I mean, listen, I'm sure there is someone out there on the entirety of the internet who said the only reason Gal Gadot got

this role is because Jews run the world. And I'm also certain that other Nazis wrote under that I guess but you're kind of missing the point here dude like she is already a huge star she got the role because she is Wonder Woman what the fuck are you talking about to be clear this was not a boycott against the war in Gaza against Netanyahu against Likud against settlements or against Ben-Givir no this was a Jewish boycott yes right no that's what this is sure This is not the first time we've seen the Jewish boycott. Earlier this year, Marvel erased the Israeli heritage of Sabra, a Jewish superhero, seemingly to appease the anti-racists who were offended by her race.

Not only that, but they introduced a non-canonical Palestinian character named Shatila. I cannot. Oh, my God. Sabra versus Shatila. I cannot. I cannot. I cannot. I cannot.

I'm on one today. You are odd. That is, that was really good. Well, welcome to the show roll. The Jewish boycott is often found in art-dominated spaces. It goes on and on to talk about all of that. But it ends with animus towards a people because of their race, ethnicity, or nationality is certainly nothing new. However, what we have come to understand more than ever in our post-October 7th world is that a shockingly effective loophole for expressing bigotry is to hide it behind, quote, caring for humanity.

Well, if it is, then Jews only have themselves to blame because we wrote the fucking law, right? We're the lawyers. So if there's a loophole, yeah, we got to fix that loophole. That's on us. Anti-Semitic tropes. Oh, God. I have to say that was very painful. Yeah, that wasn't it?

You know what, Matt? It's funny because I don't, I usually like, I'd never, you know, how'd you say, expose myself to that time of life? I'll read the headline and maybe whatever and then I'm like, no, I'm not doing it. This is the first time I've actually sat down and, like, been forced to read in the air. I'm like, this is so fucking bad. It's so cringy. Yes.

Like, who is this for actually? Who is this? It's for the people who are still desperately clinging on to the idea that Jews are being attacked by the Western world, not just the, like, Islam. It's for people in the West who are like, oh, man, I wish Hamas was here so that I could also claim to be scared. It's for people in the West to be like, oh, there's a secret Hamas hiding in every. single, you know, institution and every single liberal, you know, meeting and every single protests. Everyone is Hamas. It's a kind of a cosplay. Yes. We're living, it's like, I wish I'd live through a pogrom. Yes. Yes. So now I get to pretend that the world. It's so sick. It's so

sick. It's like, it's this addiction to victimhood is, is, is, I don't actually, it's so, it's so disgusting, actually. Yeah. I don't even know. But. But. Thank you. This is important for me to see what's out there. Yeah, you've got to know what the people are saying. What publication was that, Matt? That was the Jewish Chronicle, Jewish Chronicle, which is... Just call it the Hollywood Reporter, okay?

Yeah. We need to use it. Yeah, the nickname. Remember that this is a comedy podcast. Sure, we're glib, but you know, it comes from love. We're glib tards. It comes from humanity. We're hiding behind our human.

Yeah, we're hiding behind our humanity. Our loophole for humanity. Yeah. See, this is why I'm never sincere. This is, you know, I don't, I don't want to be one of those people hiding behind caring for humanity. I want to be hiding behind just a wall of irony so that I can live with, you know, people not knowing that deep inside I am filled with pain. It's fun. No joke before we go to commercial bake.

Do you want to hear the derivation of the word sincere? Oh, yes. Yeah, please. This is fascinating. Wow. Well, so then the word genuine is related to genuflect, right? Right. To kneel, right?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sincere comes from, I think, the Latin, it's sin serre, two words. Seen is without, serre is wax. It comes from the days of marble making, where some marble makers, the cheaper ones, would smooth over the cracks. with wax right to make it look more quality than it was the the real ones would leave the cracks visible just like rugmakers you know persian rugmakers will leave a flaw or whatever without wax without any pretense of perfection wow love that that's awesome that's great hey I learned something new and I think our podcast is sincere in that way yeah I mean certainly in one way it's sincere yeah we're not earnest by any means no we're sincere we are sincere we're

sincere boys um okay we're going to continue this podcast uh but first before that we have to take a little commercial break because once again my car is dead so you're going to have to listen to ads and if you listen to enough of them uh then i get to afford a new car was be a used car but anyways stick around we'll be right back and we're back and we're back welcome to bad hasbar we're back talking with rola sellback filmmaker writer director sundance alumina and we're here talking about talking about Israel stuff Daniel you alerted me to something that Haaretz reported recently oh guys say goodbye to the fun part of this episode oh we're getting dark snikes what happened yeah um so this is basically a Haaret's report that the IDF uses Palestinian children

to as like mind sweepers essentially human shields Yeah, which... This has been reported in Arabic press for quite a while, but now... Now people are taking it seriously. Yeah, as Max Blumenthal said on Twitter, now that it's been reported in how... The New York Times has a Hebrew language report to ignore. Oh, yeah, exactly. Now, we'll ignore that one. Thank you.

All right, so I have it right here. Haaret's investigations, Israeli army uses Palestinian civilians to inspect potential booby-trapped tunnels in Gaza. Now, Daniel, do you want to read this? Yeah, sure. But not before I just throw it, the idea of a booby-trapped tunnel where you go into the tunnel and your grandmother is there. Your grandmother's there. Shiding you. Chiding you and cleaning your face and telling you, you know, learn to wipe your mouth or, you know.

Blow your nose. Don't just, don't just, you know, snore it. I'm thinking of mine. You don't eat anymore. Don't tell me it's a famine. All right. All right. At first, this is terrible. I mean, guys, at this point, the jokes are just going to be flailing attempts for us to keep ourselves sane. Right. This is incredibly dark and incredibly insane. And, you know, this is important. And so people know when they say they're the most moral army in the world, they're fucking lying. That's right. At first, it's hard to recognize them. They're usually wearing Israeli army uniforms.

Many of them are in their 20s. And they're always with Israeli soldiers of various ranks. But if you look more closely, you see that most of them are wearing sneakers, not army boots. And their hands are cuffed behind their backs and their faces are full of fear. The soldiers call each of them a shawish, an obscure Arabic word of Turkish origin, meaning sergeant. No jokes to make there. Random Palestinians have been used by Israeli army units in the Gaza Strip for one purpose to serve as human shields, louder for the Zionists in the back, to serve as human shields for soldiers during operations. quote our lives are more important than their lives soldiers were told the thinking is that it's better for the Israeli soldiers to remain alive and the shawishim to be the ones blown up by an explosive device fucking it's just so it's so insane and so explicit you know you know this uh if you wonder whether or not um the state of israel

Jewish supremacist, I mean, at this point, you're just lying to yourself, you know? I mean, you can imagine an army not based on an ethnocratic supremacy doing this kind of thing. Sure. But it would be called a rogue, cowardly, bitch-ass army, you know, just engaged in the dirtiest form of what, I mean, it would just be... They would be called Nazis openly by everyone. And we would all be like, yeah, that sounds like Nazi stuff. And ethnic supremacy makes it a lot. Even more Nazi.

And it makes it easier to do this. So the two aren't separable action. Yes. You know, the description is one of many obtained by Haarets. Some from, by the way, podcasters, everyone just pronounce Ha'Aretz correctly, all right? It's not Heretz. It's Ha'arets. It's Ha'arets. Let's just, you're more credible if you give it the right. mission. Some from combat soldiers, some others from commanders. The picture that emerges in recent

months, Israeli soldiers have used human shields in this way all over Gaza, even the chief of staff's office knows. So all this bullshit about, well, we're going to see these claims about, well, this is not policy and all that. Bullshit. Soldiers choose Gazans for the missions and bring them to the brigades and battalions operating in the strip. There is pride in it, said a source. who took part in some of the, quote, locating work? Jesus. Talk about head hunting. Yeah.

The senior ranks know about it, the source said. The army has played innocent, despite footage shown on Al Jazeera about two months ago. Like I said, Israeli soldiers can be seen dressing Palestinian detainees in uniforms and flak jackets, putting cameras on them, and sending them into badly damaged houses and tunnel entrances with their hands bound by plastic ties. Jesus fucking Christ Oh man The Americans are

Yeah go ahead No I just say It's like I've nothing to comment on I just The images alone of You know if you've seen these They're just like So

brutal to watch And just the The level of rank evil That I've been seeing on a regular basis Oh just really really fucks with my head bro that's what I'm saying he's fucked on rank evil and ranked evil at all these different levels of we're number one where that's is really here's an in here's an interesting sentence that's not really

backed up by anything the Americans are furious quote sorry not quote comma though Vedant Patel and he deserves a whole segment all to his own this for unfortunate fuck a state department spokesman has said that um the israel defense forces is investigating the incidents and that the evidence in the videos does not reflect the IDF's values and violates rules and regulation let's start with the Americans are furious yeah what's your evidence for that how do you know because they leaked something about how Biden called Netany a mean a mean a dog face pony soldier yeah yeah Yeah. The Americans are furious. I mean, at this point. And then this bullshit about, oh, the IDF is

investigating and it's not consistent with their values and it violates rules and regulations. Well, what is what is allowed? That's your regulations. What is your values is what gets done on the regular and the rest of the article makes clear that it's not even true that it violates these rules. And I'm sorry, but like, oh no, go ahead, please. Oh, no, I was going to say that. And it's really hilarious how. It's the fact that the Americans have said that, you know, this isn't IDF's values and, you know, the IDF hasn't said that, but the Americans. We know them. You don't know them like we know them.

Yeah, yeah. We know them better than they know themselves. It's like some country song, you know, like he's not that bad. Right. Yeah. And I'm just sorry, but like the idea that it's like this does not reflect the, you know, the values and the, you know, the morals. And it's like what your actions are consistently is your values and morals. You can say that it's against, you know, the rules or whatnot, like technically, but when it is just not only allowed to run rampant within, you know, the military and society, but when it is exposed and what they do is have, you know, a big public meeting where they debate whether or not it is, um, moral to do, you know, rape or to, to victimize Palestinians within this society, you just

go like, okay, so this feels very consistent with your values. You can pretend that you have rules against it, but at some point, like, we need to throw out the idea that any of these rules or any, you know, of their purported morals are, are anything but just window dressing. It's insane. And also, speaking of Human Shield, like. Patel like I mean what the fuck is going on also the difference between him and an actual human show that's being used is he's choosing yeah he could just fucking just he could get another job just leave yeah just quit like what do you what are all these people doing and do you notice it's a lot of them they're like people of color like that

they put as spokespeople as well the ones that like exactly raising their hands at the who used to be a vocal and vehement critic of APAC and all this shit what an absolute i mean i don't have words for that level of i mean i've seen these people's hands they are not zip tied yeah yeah that's the point yeah exactly there's no one with a gun behind them leading them down a fucking tunnel it's like it is their their hands are zippedied by their you know ambition and careerism and it's just so disgusting because it's not that the white got not that Matthew Miller and John Kirby or any better. No, yeah, I'm talking about all of them.

It's just when it's, you know, a person of color, it's always, you know, added with that a little bit of the liberal flair, you know, it's kind of the way that, like, we're being told that caring about Palestine when Kalmala Harris might be president is like, is racist or what something. And you're just like, God, you guys are so full of shit. I can't even, I can't even argue with it. 100%. And I will say, and I know you're going to continue to read the article, but not only have the human shields been used, you know, Palestinians use as human shields just obviously within

this genocide. I mean, there's like been decades. Like we say it, we, you know, document, da, you know, in the West Bank, they literally commandeer people's homes, force them to stay in the home and be like, this is now a military outpost. Okay, well, you're putting everyone in danger, the time. Palestinians are used for cover all the fucking time. We say it all the time. Okay, now Ha'adz says something like, let's say, you know, 10 months late, but I don't even, I don't understand, actually. I don't, I don't really know. Harats always says things a little late after smearing the people who said it earlier, but yeah, but to give them props, it's decent investigative journalism. It's good. It's as good as you're going to get in the Israeli press. And if there's one

advantage of having a free press there should be at least a newspaper that's doing this kind of work and this needs this is an important it's an important document but at least at least guys Israel has the dignity and decency um not to turn the human shields thing around and accuse the Palestinians are doing it and use that as a pretext for for decimating annihilating them at least they wouldn't at least they would never do that no they would never America it's against IDFs. Yeah, rules and regulations. That's what America says.

America quotes it. And Israel says it's against the State Department's morals and values to allow it. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. You know, if I'm such a murderer, then how come there's laws against it? If I'm such a murderer, then how do you explain this $20 billion arms ship? Right, exactly. Yeah.

If I'm so bad. Addition to the $14 billion earlier this year. It's crazy. Crazy. Yeah. Yeah. That's our country. All right.

Quote, when I saw the report from Al Jazeera, I said, ah, yes, it's true. A combat soldier and a conscript IDF brigade who took part in the use of Gazans as human shields told to Aretz. And then I saw the IDF's response, which totally doesn't reflect reality. Yes, but it reflects their values. Yes. And that's the more important thing to reflect.

Exactly. It's done with the knowledge of the brigade commander at the least. And then some of the soldiers' comments in this article have also been told to the NGO breaking the silence. Chauvrim Stikar. We might want to have someone from there. I know, I know. We need to reach out. Yeah, another Israeli organization doing good work, as good work as you can do in that context.

Yeah. The idea, sorry, the soldier said that to the IDF, it's not a one-time something. Matt Lieb turned the page too soon, so he doesn't want you to know. They know that it's not a one-time incident of a young and stupid company commander who decides on his own to take somebody. Yeah. But think of the young and stupid people that, and we're going to see later in the article, how these kids are gaslit into overriding their natural objections to this.

I mean, they are, they are hostages of their own fucking army. not that they're not morally culpable but still there is also evidence that in some cases minors or the elderly are used there were times when really old people were made to go into houses one combat soldier said if the Palestinian knows Hebrew that's an advantage for the IDF when Gazans are used in buildings and tunnels they need to report to the forces outside as one soldier put it Palestinians are told do one mission of a a tunnel shaft that is and you're free yeah i mean it's just yeah it's just completely uh it's completely insane and it's uh it's the this is the people we keep giving money to this is the people that i'm

getting into fights with my friends about these are the people that they're carrying water for this is what pisses me off about all this shit is you just like how many how many fucking arguments into with people where I just listen to them just spouting off the same fucking talking points that I've heard my entire goddamn life and I'm just like I'm going to assume that you just don't know anything about this so I'm going to give you some time to like you know you're a thoughtful person you're going to start reading some shit and then eventually you might come around to it give me a call hey man you know I was reading about this you're right they're kind of crazy out there and instead you just have people continuing to carry water for these

total fucking psychopaths and I just can't fucking Matt Matt What's up? Bro. If you want Trump to win then say that

Otherwise. I'm speaking. I'm speaking. Sorry. Sorry. You're right? I don't want Trump to win. I'm going to let everyone else speak

especially the people speaking who have had the microphone for the last 11 months. Your sanity is problematic. By the way, That feeling that you have right now and that we all have, I think, on this podcast and people probably listening, I'm assuming. There's an Arabic word for it. It's called Aher or Qahir.

And what that means is it's, there's no direct equivalent, but it's like this kind of your heart hurts. It's burning. You feel upset. You feel angry. You feel like you don't know what to do. It's like this Aher. It's deep inside. So it's, there's an actual, there's a reason.

Yeah, there's a word for it. You know, you can't, there's an actual word for it. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's really, really, um, it's something I think we're all feeling for sure. And, and especially reading something like that. The emotional lexicon of Arabic is incredible. The, the, the, just the capacity to express, just from what I've, from what I've encountered. Like, there's so many words for feelings that, that that, that English is kind of insensate to, like where we have our kind of standard kind of therapeutic language. But there's, There's a poetry to being able to name these very specific things that the world actually evokes. I feel like being not just like a white American, but also like a white American Californian makes, I'm like emotionally disabled in terms of descriptions of my own feelings because I have like five words. It's like bummed, fucked up, that's sketch, that's chill. Stoked. stoked and that's what's up like like those are all I got that's your range that's my range like six things that I'm feeling at all time well to be fair I don't think there is an Arabic

equivalent to that's what's up so I mean yeah and I'm like feeling right now something in between like sketched out bummed and that's what's up and it's like it's it's like I don't know how to describe that deep in my heart man I need to learn Arabic to continue um still even though some Palestinians are required to remain with a unit quote only for 24 hours others wind up staying for two days or even a week when you're inside this thing you don't know how to say what's okay the soldier said what's certain is that it's a horrible feeling that's a that's quite a sentence when you're inside this thing you don't know how to say what's

okay yeah I mean, that's what I think. You don't know how to say what's okay. And that's inside all systems of of oppression and dehumanization. When you're inside of it, when you're incentivized not to speak out, it actually shuts down the brain's faculty

to even object. You're being gaslit every single moment. Once again, I am not trying to... Not excusing it at all. Not excusing it. But it's, you know, same as it ever was. The people care of making these policies are not the ones who have to carry it out against their own souls.

Right. And it's also like this is- The entire country of people who have been gaslit into doing this kind of shit or ignoring it or just the thing. Yeah. And it's also just like, you know, I don't want to hear another word from people claiming to give a shit about Jews, you know?

I don't want to hear another word from any of these, you know, fucking shills who are claiming to give a shit about Jews as Jews. You know, they're just like, you know, I care about it. anti-Semitism and to the safety of the Jewish people. And I'm like, you are actively contributing to the continued mind-fucking of a generation of Jews from a very specific country. And you're mad that, you know, I'm that I'm mad at them as a Jew and I'm mad at the government that's put them in this position. And yeah, it's just fucking, okay, there's a lot. There's a lot

a slide so if there's like a most important slide you let me know dog the one that i highlighted i mean here we have the idx spokesperson's unit commentary which we don't even need to read but upon receipt of the request the allegations were forwarded to the relevant authorities for review which is the janitorial staff exactly the head of southern command major general Yaron Finkelman, who I assume is about 19 going on 20. Yeah, yeah, right, 17-year-old guy. We know the perfect model of a modern Sabra Major General is barely drinking age in the States.

Knows, too, a source at Southern Command says, in every meeting where this issue was raised, there were commanders who were warned, or who warned about the ethical and legal implications if the matter was exposed publicly. Well, so the ethical implications don't apply if it's not exposed publicly. Right, exactly.

Ethics, ethics is basically optics. Morality is a different question, but that's never talked about. There were officers who asked that the meeting be halted so that they would be allowed to leave. And as I said on Twitter a few weeks ago about something else, boy, that deniability sure sounds plausible.

Yeah, very, exactly. A soldier in a conscript army brigade added, quote, about five months ago, two Palestinians were brought to us. One was 20 and the other was 16. We were told, use them. They're Gazans. Use them as human shields. According to this soldier, that day, soldiers in the unit began to ask questions about

this use of civilians as human shields. They also wanted to know who gave the order. According to the soldier, quote, they tried to say something about October 7th, not something concrete. One person said, don't beat them too much because we need them to open the locations where troops need to enter, such as buildings and tunnels. Oh, God. This order was just one that the soldiers received.

For example, they were also required to keep the Gossans handcuffed and to ensure that the Gossans didn't escape or enter. Can we ever call them Palestinians? I was just about to say that. I swear I was just about to say that. That the Gossens, Gossens didn't escape or enter the rooms and floors where the commanders were. The Gossens were given combat rations and water.

You got to keep that energy up if you're going to go get exploded. Many soldiers felt uncomfortable about this. Demanded answers and even shouted, said a person who was near one of the Ghazans. One of the Ghazan adjacent soldiers. Most of them realized there was a problematic incident here and it was hard for them to process. I love that. Poor them. It was hard for them to process.

Yeah, I love this like low-key therapies. speak here where they're just like well so this is problematic um this is a big yikes and also i'm getting the ick i'm getting the ick and i'm having trouble processing this right now so this is not a safe space i'm going to commit to take on mental health day that's right uh i'm going to go on leave with a mental health day and we'll come back and we'll explode these uh gazans not palestinians later yes if i'm going to commit your war crimes i need a safe space in which to do it yeah And this has crossed the threshold. 100%.

It's just like, you know, and of course this is like if, you know, again, credit where credit is due to Haaretz for like, you know, occasionally doing pieces like this in which they actually do have these investigations. Occasionally doing journalism. Occasionally doing journalism and, you know. But, you know, it's just like the ease at which you can humanize the IDF soldier and also the ease at which you can dehumanize Palestinian children as

the Gossins, you know, the human near the Gossens said and you're just like, you know, it's, listen, they're doing they're doing their best. Fucking a. It's like a zookeeper report, isn't it?

Yes, exactly, exactly. It's like near a giraffe. Is that a fucking just, oh man. Yeah. The Gossens were restless today. And it's just, like this whole article you know it's just you you you're seeing explicitly soldiers talking about

how they said use this person as human shield and uh and yet we're not only supposed to you know be mad at every single Palestinian who gets murdered because they are a human shield but we're supposed to believe that it is moral to do so to have them killed yeah you know them Magen David, the Mogandavid. You think it means Jewish star, right? Yeah, I thought so. But star is kohav in Hebrew. Magen means shield. So it's the, it's the shield of David. Whoa. That's crazy, though. I mean, that sounds deep. I don't know what it amounts to. I don't know either, but that's deep. That's interesting. That's probably deep. Yeah, probably deep. There's one slide where I highlighted some texts. The speaking of animals is worth

getting to I think it's coming up here we are this soldier said that the commander's comment was made with such aggressiveness that it was clear that there was little room for the troops to express doubts as opposed to other times in conscript armies where like let's take a straw poll guys how do we feel about this let's get the temperature in the room

okay we're doing morning comment section Bokotov everywhere on you just tell me any complaints you have and uh oh it's a good idea you'll see good idea Yeah, yeah. Let them live. Okay. One soldier said that when he and his colleagues asked why, they were told about the dogs of the Okets canine unit.

Dogs were getting killed or wounded when they were sent in to locate explosives or attack the enemy. Or after their experiences, the dogs had to be discharged because their operational senses had deteriorated. Oh, my fucking God. A more senior official confirmed this claim, though some soldiers said they thought this was just an excuse to soothe consciences. Oh, my. So just, just unpack that for a second. It's so disgusting on its face. Yes.

But then the meta level, it's like they're kind of just whitewashing it. We don't really think it was about the dogs. Yeah. Like if it was about the dog. That's the most horrific thing I've ever heard for about 10 reasons. Yes. Yeah. It's just that's just so insane, we just fucking, even the dog, it just I can't even, listen guys, I'm having trouble processing this.

I hate to sound like an Israeli soldier, but this feels problematic and I'm having trouble. Do you need to be discharged from the podcast? Apparently the dogs, the dogs found it problematic too, right? I can imagine. Their operational senses had deteriorated. Yeah. Whatever the fuck that means. Yeah, whatever the fuck, their operational senses, it's just like, are you talking about a dog

that is literally traumatized? Yeah, that's a good thing about dogs. They don't ask questions. No. They don't ask meek, ineffective questions to which they'll get an unsatisfying answer and then they'll just obey. They just shut down. They can't do it.

Which, you know, because they're more sensitive. So here's another incredible paragraph. Either way, many soldiers still have harsh feelings. Yeah, they're mad. They're big mad. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They're not ready to make nice. Yes.

You keep quiet and try to convince yourself, you ready for this, Rola? Yala, okay, let's use them. There's the Israeli use of the word yala. I'm actually going to turn off my mic and video right now. I actually, I actually cannot fucking, I cannot. I actually cannot. I actually cannot. You literally cannot.

You know what's crazy is like, I've, we've been, oh my God. Okay. You haven't seen me this worked up through the whole article. Okay. Like Human Shields, I'm used to this, use of this. The fucking audacity just yellow okayed by an Israeli fucking soldier and a heart article. Now just a little fact check. So in Israel, Yala is used in a lot of different ways in Israeli Hebrew, most of all

impatience. Like, get on with that. Israeli Hebrew, what do you mean? That's not an Israeli Hebrew word. I know. It's a slant. But they've co-opted it. They co-opted Arabic.

It's not in Israeli. Exactly. Because it means, oh, God, right? It means, oh, God, but it's used to mean, come on, get on with it. I'm impatient with you. Is it ever used that way in Arabic? Yeah, that's what it's used for in Arabic. That's the number one.

That's the number one. It's like, let's go, come on, da, da, da, duh. You're trying to hurry someone up. Or it could be, let's go, come on. So it's actually used in the same exact context as, it's like if you're watching a fucking, you know, movie about the Nazi invasion of fucking Poland. And they're just like, oh, I'm schvitzing over here. You know, it's just so, it's just so offensive on its face where you're just like, you, at the very least would like hope that in your ethnic hatred and your, you know,

your patriotism that you would at least try to like freedom fries this and take the, take the Arabic out of the language, like decolonize Hebrew. Hitler in his bunker in the downfall scene waiting for his his his is trembling officers to give him the lowdown on what's happening on the various fronts and they're there's stone silent terrified and he goes, no. Oh yeah. Yiddish. Yiddish. Yes. Dude, it's just crazy.

It's like Yalah let's genocide. Amazing. Yelah let's genocide these gossens quote unquote. I actually cannot. Yeah. Yeah. yeah that's a that's that's a strong contender for the title of the episode too i loved leaders of the new shul yeah but yeah yeah let's genocide strong strong runner up i think at least

oh my god yala okay let's use them i mean it's just you just uh there's i think this is one of the reasons why in which people have described this you know moment in time in their life as like the moment where they felt the most crazy just because you just see shit like that where you've got the number one, I don't know, proliferators of the human shields, you know, as a reason for doing, you know, genocide. Like, well, we have to kill civilians. They're human shields. Doing the human shielding, like being the ones who are actually making Palestinian people to human shields is just like, yeah, of course you're going to feel crazy. Of course you're going to go insane

Because you just have to be told over and over again That you're wrong about this And you have to be told that in fact Speaking out against it Is something in which you will get dropped By your you know agents or managers I mean it's enough to make a person Not me but some random person

Some random person DM Hezbollah The Houthis The Islamic Republic And just with one word Yala Yeah Yeah just yala

Let's go Let's go I just DM Hassan Nasrallah Yala. Yala Nisrallah. Oh my God. Yeah, just, you know, just. Hala at Nisrallah about a dollar. About a yala.

Yeah, halla. Damn it. Hala at Nisrala about a yala. Yeah, I love it. I love it. So much, so much there. So much depravity. Too much for me to handle as we get closer to the end.

of this episode. My final thoughts are with a man, a myth, a legend, who's leaving us. Well, not us so much, but he's leaving the UN. I'm talking about Gilaude Erdian. Don't tell me.

Galad. Yeah. He is, he is officially, I think his UN term is expiring as the ambassador. He's hanging up his yellow star. he's hanging up his yellow star he's hanging up his baby shredder um you might remember him as the guy who brought a tiny shredder and go back and watch the emma vigeland episode if you want to see footage of that and he put in the uh un charter in there um that was insane where did he even get that

that's what i want to do it who makes it the tiniest rudder um and you stole it from a little like you know lester freeman on the wire makes those little little dollhouse miniature someone who makes one of like boring offices and all the appliances and shit yeah made a baby shredder

it was working too yeah it worked you know it took a couple of tries but he got the he also printed a mini UN chart watch the episode it was so cute

it was so cute so cute so cute so he is leaving the UN his term is expiring and he is also he's not going to be

staying around in New York. I think he was offered like some other ambassadorial gig with DC in fact, which I love that he gets to just continue being a diplomat despite being so disgusting. But here is him and his final words at the UN. Colleagues, as this may be the last time for me to address you as Israel as ambassador, though who knows perhaps another session will be called because of more terrorist propaganda, I would like to leave you with this. I have been immensely, immensely proud to represent my country here. The most moral country in the world.

The most moral country in the world. You listen? Palestinian representative. In this war place I hope one day That was a base reaction I'm like yeah I fucking heard you

Yeah what do you want from me Your last speech and you're still talking shit about me What the fuck? McNulty what the fuck did I do? Yeah, it's the fucking legend Like you can't go through his last UN fucking speech Without being like I'm the most moral.

Fuck you, Palestine. Unbelievable, dude. You know, I don't know, this is a very specific reference. It reminds me of Michael Jordan's Hall of Fame speech where he just talked about all of the other basketball players who he had problems with. That's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

He's just like, he's so bitter. It's like, dude, you're not in the hague right now. Be happy. It's got some real Sam Jackson and Pulp Fiction Energy to it too as well. And you will. know that I am the most moral hitman in the world when I lay my vengeance upon thee. And then he just puts something in a baby shredder. I did it.

You will also see the bias and perversion of morality here. And I pray that you will see the truth. The terrorist organization that this guy represents here, this guy regime should be condemned not protected and that Israel should be praised we are today the vanguard of civilization we are the vanguard of civilization but until then i'm israel hi thank you mr president p s screw you guys i'm going home i'm going home i'm going habay I'll teach you another word in Arabic. It's the best reaction to anything that you want to dismiss.

It's called toz, which means... Ah. Toz. Toz. Perfectly said. All right. Yeah. So you can use it any time.

Toz. I like it. That's how I felt about that. Do you see the Palestinians guy's face was like unbothered.com? He's like... Yeah. He's like, all right. It was just wonderful because he's just like, he's taken, I guess it's not really strays when it's Israel.

I was going to say Palestinian guys taking strays, but no, he's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, me again. Me again. I get it. For my customary Ghostbusters reference, it would be the same one we always do, which is, you know, I'm going to fix you, Vinkman. I'm going to miss him. Yeah, yeah. I'm going to send him a nice fruit basket. Well.

A nice basket of pomellos. and cherry tomatoes so from the most moral country on earth the vanguard of human civilization i love vanguard by the way it's just like just so you know everything to the uh you know everything of the east of me not civilized we got to kill all them right guys anyways um can't help but be racist even then that is been a pod i believe rola thank you so much for coming on Thank you guys. And talking to us, where can people find your work and where can people, you know, find you and follow you on social media?

Yeah, sure. I'm on Instagram, Roleselvaq, and, yeah, and Rolasaupa.com, if you want to take a look at it, my stuff. But, yeah, those are the two. And then I would love to just quickly plug something that I launched earlier this year. It's called the Sifina Filmmaker Project. It's specifically free initiative for Palestinian filmmakers or Palestinian projects. through free workshops and creative mentorship and stuff.

So if you want to find out more, if you're a Falustini or no Falisini filmmaker or working on a Falustini project, go to Safinafilmmakerproject.com and check out all the free workshops and services we provide. Absolutely. And the links will be in the show notes. So please check that out. Patreon.com slash bad has barra. bad hasbara at gmail.com all right everyone daniel take us out of here you set me up all right thank you guys so much for listening and until next time

from the river to the sea hooray for hollywood sarcastically well i like you jumping jacks was us push-ups was us god maga us all karate us take you Molly us, Michael Jackson us, Yamaha keyboards, us, Georgia makes not us, Andor was us, Keith Ledger Joker us, endless bread success, happy meals was us, McDonald's was us, being happy us, Bikkim yoga us, eating food, us, breeding air, us, drinking water us, we invented all that shit. Yeah!