Badlands Media - The Choice S5E6: Reunions

Episode Date: September 11, 2026

Ashe in America and Ghost tackle Season 5, Episode 6 of The Chosen, "Reunions," and while they admit a few scenes feel like filler, there is still plenty to dig into. The hosts spend real time on the confrontation between Atticus and Kafni, unpacking a fascinating clash between Greek philosophy and rabbinic law, and a broader conversation about revenge as a driving force in both ancient and modern history. They also cover a quiet, powerful scene between Nicodemus and Yusef that both hosts call one of the best in the episode. On the political side, a mysterious Roman offer is made to Kafni that sounds a lot like a deal with the devil, and a familiar face from earlier in the season finally gets a name that longtime fans will recognize. The hosts close with some fun tangents, a touching listener testimony, and a look ahead at what is left before Season 5 wraps and Season 6 arrives in November. A meaty episode with a lot to chew on.

The badlands, one of the badlands, explain those badlands. That's a hell of their name. Oh, well, that's weird. Good morning, everyone, and welcome to the choice. Season 5, episode 6 of The Chosen is what we are talking about this morning. Sorry, it's evening when we're recording this, and I'm really trying to be in the appropriate time of day, but it's just convobulating.

And episode is called Reunions. I thought it was good. I thought it was entertaining. I think there's some stuff in there that's a little bit of filler. I felt like a little bit of filler. Like the plot between Atticus and Coffney seemed weird. Like what was that all about? Yeah, yeah, yeah, that is a little strange.

It's like Atticus, I don't know, it's like Atticus trying to manipulate. I mean, maybe there'll be a payoff on that in the next season. Yeah, I mean, it was a lot of drama, right? he was a of they burst in last episode they burst in and you know there was a scuffle and they got him and they arrested him and the entire point was to tell him to keep doing what he's doing yeah yeah that's well well it was kind of like to establish it felt like it was like to establish that koffney worked for him now like atticus was like yeah it was kind of like what the CIA probably it probably does where they're like all right you work you work for us now like if you if you ever

don't do what we want you to do, we will just destroy your life. And you will just, we'll throw you a deep dark pit where nobody can ever find you. So that's what it kind of felt. It felt like that's what was happening. And Coffney definitely was like spiraling. I think that was, I think kind of what I pulled from it is that it was less about Atticus. I mean, it was about Atticus, but it was less about Atticus and more about Coffney. because I feel like Kofny

kind of represented like unbridled like rage and like the desire for revenge and like I feel like that's a huge that's a huge like development and for Christianity like Christianity was a big turning point for that

because I feel like especially in modern Judaism revenge is almost like a foundation stone of like what Judaism is all about at least in the modern context, the way that the way that... In the application of it. And maybe in the rabbinic traditions and whatnot, I don't know. But God specifically said vengeance is mine. So it was never a biblical principle, but all of it's been perverted.

But the way that the rabbis talk about it in the context of like this story, like the way that they talk about revenge, the way that, I mean, the way that, obviously, Israel is deeply conflated with Jewish identity today. And then just the way that the Talmud talks about revenge, then the way that like Netanyahu talks about revenge, it just seems like revenge is absolutely like the drop, like probably like one of the most important and driving principles in modern Judaism, I would say.

I would say I think that's a fair assessment, at least as it relates to Israel and like Talmudic Judaism. it's like without revenge what would what would modern Judaism have you know it's like this idea like this identity that's around you know what happened in the Holocaust

what happened since the Holocaust what's happening now in Israel Israel having the right to quote unquote defend itself which is you know very much get revenge on anybody who's ever hurt them you listen to their politicians speak and they literally say if you flick us we will come back and kill, you know, destroy your entire village.

They talk like so I think that from that standpoint, Jesus coming out and talking about revenge being such a destructive force and being such a terrible thing and something that you shouldn't pursue and how you should turn the other cheek and how there should be grace and mercy, forgiveness. That really, in my opinion, is the foundation stone of Christianity. from a first principle standpoint. And when you see what it's done to Coffney here,

and the way that Atticus completely dismantles Coffney using Greek logic, using the principles of Greek philosophy, which as we've seen in this show, but also you can see it elsewhere in Jewish history, is completely repudiated by like the Sanhedron. They consider the Greeks to be complete perverts. They hate Greek philosophy.

And then you even hear, you even hear Caiaphas and how he's like, all these morons are falling for, you know, the Socratic method of Jesus, you know, asking these questions because they haven't studied Greek philosophy. They don't understand, you know, the seduction techniques that Jesus is using because it's a Greek technique. And so there's a lot like my takeaway from, and I know I'm getting a long window here, but my takeaway is like a few things,

the revenge thing, but then also this idea that Jewish philosophy, at least as is told through the eyes of the Sanhedron, is very emotion-based. It's very much like emotions. It's very much like rabbinic law, like the adherence to that, like the adherence to this thing,

that they've created, which is very much an earthly master, these 613 laws, versus Greek philosophy, which is very much like seeking that one truth, like seeking truth, seeking, you know, logic, reason, that thing. And the way that Atticus, and we'll watch the scene, but the way that Atticus completely picks Kofni apart, and he's just like, you have taken your daughter's death and you've made it completely about yourself. And then right after that happens, he goes to his wife. And his wife's like, I'm leaving. Like, I'm leaving you.

Because you've become such a loser now that this is completely consumed. And your entire identity now is getting Jesus. And as Atticus points out, he's like, if you actually wanted revenge, you would go after Quintus. But you're a worst. And you can't get your hands on him. So you're going to go after Jesus, who you know is completely defenseless and is not going to defend himself. against you. Yeah, I mean, I think the the one bit of that that I would push back on is I don't think that vengeance is a feature of just modern Judaism. I think it is a feature of humanity. And that desire,

that desire for, you know, the self-interested desire, particularly when people feel like they're the victim, right? Why does our society prioritize victimhood so much globally? and it and it and it and it does but reparations is seeking vengeance the i think you know a lot of these narratives that we have that go back you know a hundred or a thousand years to the crimes of the past the reason that you know jesus is is different than literally everything else is because of what you said like that sacrificial aspect of it the distinct of Jesus is the blood. It is the blood to atone for the sin of the world. And that's where the connection to Judaism is pronounced. But again, I think they're the example, right, of humanity.

And I think that that's what God did with the Jews throughout that's, you know, when he, when he talks about them being chosen, he didn't choose them because they were the greatest or the strong or the best looking or whatever, right? The craftiest or whatever. He chose them because it would be so obvious to reveal his glory through them because they weren't all those things, right? They weren't. Case study.

Right. And so when they're living, go back to, you know, Deuteronomy, when they're living in the protection and provision, prosperity of the Lord, when they're seeking the Lord, when they're trying to walk in relationship with their God, nothing can touch them effectively and they are, you know, elevated and whatnot. I'm speaking historically, like, and, you know, biblically historically. When they aren't, when they want to be more like the other cultures, when they run after

the other cultures, when they intermarry with them, intermingle with them, accept their customs, accept their gods, and, you know, ultimately sacrifice to their gods. That's kind of the logical end state. when they're in that posture, they're also the example. Because the example is to rely upon God, to seek God, seek first his kingdom and his glory, and all things will be added to you. It doesn't say, you know, build your kingdom using my name and I'll make sure that all of your wishes are granted. Right.

And that's kind of how it's been inverted. And, you know, Judas was looking for the same. thing in a sense as Coughney, his was just more, you know, kind of zoomed out big picture, but they want vengeance against Rome. Simon, when Jesus met him, was in the same posture, Simon Z as well, both of the Simons, right? Want, they, they want to enact what they think the punishment should be on the, you know, whoever's wronged them. And that's, that's inherent in all of us. And so I think it's, you know, it is, as we analyze the show and analyze current events in the context of the life and ministry of Jesus Christ, which is what we do. So, you know, on this show,

it always goes there, even if we try and stop it. We can't, we can't do that. It's important, I think, to remember that they are the example of human beings. and to the you know the the kind of central premise of the philosophy of judaism from a biblical standpoint or not even Judaism but from you know the the old testament philosophy of the jewish people um was obedience god's god's philosophy has always been obedience obedience i'm god obey me recognize me as who i am and we're incapable of it Adam and Eve were incapable of it and every single human that ever came since them was incapable of it. The end state, the goal, the objective of this prison planet is to figure that out and glorify God. Because that's the aim and how do you glorify God by obeying him? And that's really all he asks of us is to recognize him as who he is and do our best to obey and come to him when we don't.

don't. And so that's the thing is they've taken that that framework for obedience, the law, right? And have turned it in a way for themselves to be obeyed, not for God to be obeyed. They want themselves to be obeyed. And if they're, you know, if you disobey them, then you're not glorifying them. And it's a complete and total inversion. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. Okay. Before we get into the last supper scene, which we always start with here in season five. we are going to hear first from our friends at Tamarack. As we get older, our bodies don't always bounce back the way they used to. Years of processed foods, toxins, and stress can leave us feeling sluggish and achy. But we don't have to accept that fate. Our bodies were truly created to heal. We just need to give it the right conditions. At Tamarack Garden, our handcrafted remedies made from organic botanicals, weeds, and wildflowers are designed to gently support your body to do what it was created to do.

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Well, I need to get one of those then. Yeah, well, you got to come to Vegas. Yeah. It's got to get a flight. Yeah. All right. So let's start. with the last supper then.

All right. Let's see. So I don't have controls. Oh, I'm sorry. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's all right. I just, yeah, I can't do anything. Oh, I think she sent you an invite to your email.

So if you were, if you want, I can play the other two ads. If you want to go out and come back in with powers, you just have to go into your email and click the link and then you'll be set. Yeah, sure. Let's do that. That's be cool. All right. So we will be right back.

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What is that supposed to mean? Well, who is and who isn't? I have earnestly desired to eat this meal with you before I suffer. This is our last Passover together on this earth before we celebrate it again on all is fulfilled in the new kingdom. I would ask how long that will be, But I know the answer. You will understand. But first, Blessed are you, Lord, our God, King of the universe,

who brings forth bread from the earth. Amen. Normally, this bread is to remember and celebrate our redemption from Egypt into the promised land. From slavery

into freedom, we celebrate your redemption from sin because of me. This is my body which is given for you. Do this in remembrance of me. Blessed are you, Lord, our God. King of the universe who creates the fruit of the vine. Amen.

Normally the wine allows us to remember and celebrate the blood of the lamb spread on the doorposts of our ancestors. But tonight, this is my blood of the new covenant. shed for you and for many For the forgiveness of sins Drink it, all of you In remembrance of me I am the true vine

And my father is the vine dresser Every branch in me that does not bear fruit He takes away And every branch that does bear fruit He prunes That it may bear more fruit Abide in me I and you

as the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine. Neither can you, unless you abide in me. I am the vine. You are the branches. Whoever abides in me, and I in him, he it is, that there's much fruit. For apart from me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in me, he has thrown away like a branch and withers, and the branches are gathered, thrown into the fire, and burned.

If you abide in me, and my words in you, ask for whatever you wish, and it will be done. By this, my father is glorified, that you bear much for. And so prove to be my disciples. As the Father has loved me, so I have loved you. Abide in my love. These things I have spoken to you, that my joy may be in you.

And that your joy may be full. Rabbi, if he's smiling up? That's nothing. It's just that earlier, I may have washed some of your feet. some of your feet, but not all of you are clean. What are you saying? The scripture has now been fulfilled.

He who has eaten my bread has lifted his heel against me. What? Truly I say to you, one of you will betray me. Someone at this very table. Someone in this room? Who? One of you brothers? Who?

Tell us who? Tell us who, and we will bind him and gag him and throw him in a plate so he can't do it. Son of man goes as it is written of him. But woe to that man by whom the son of man has betrayed. It would have been better for him if he had never been born. Just say who it is? And we'll make sure that man wishes he'd never been born. What's it happen?

Andrew. Whoops. yours um okay so the the scene of the the last supper itself um we have we find in luke 20 luke chapter 22 uh starting at verse 14 and when he uh and when he the hour came he reclined at the table and the apostles with him and he said to them i've earnestly desired to eat this passover pass over with you before I suffer. For I tell you, I will not eat it until it is fulfilled in the kingdom of God. And he took the cup.

And when he had given thanks, he said, take this and divide it amongst yourselves. For I tell you that from now on, I will not drink the fruit of the vine until the kingdom of God comes. And he took bread. And when he had given thanks, he broke it and gave it to them saying, this is my body, which is given for you. Do this in remembrance of me. And likewise, the cup after they had eaten, saying this cup that is poured out, for you is the new covenant in my blood but behold the hand of him who betrays me is with me on the table for the son of man goes as it has been determined but woe to that man by whom he is betrayed and then he

goes into the i am the true vine speech which we find in john jon 13 and this was verbatim pretty much so i'm not going to read it but it was john 15 versus one through 11, although they cut out a couple of verses. So they cut out verse 3, which it says, you know, every branch that does bear fruit, he prunes that it may bear more fruit. That's verse 2. And then verse 3 says, already you are clean because of the word that I have spoken to you. They took that out in the chosen script, so not sure why. But then verse 10, if you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love just as I have kept my father's commandments and abide in his love. They took that verse out as well.

And I was reading the Bible artist's analysis of the episode, and he took real exception with them detaching the I am the vine from the next part that starts in verse 12, which is, this is my commandment that you love one another as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this that someone lay down his life for his friends. The way the chosen did this is they split it across two episodes, right? So that part we heard them talking about in episode five. But the purpose in the new, you know, we were talking about this at the top of the show of kind of the distinguishing characteristic of Christianity is that your life will look like the life and ministry of Jesus Christ. It will be that servant. He washed their feet, which we'll see next week. But he, you know, he showed them how they, how they were meant to be to glorify God.

and it was to be humbled on earth and to not elevate yourself. And that's the real inversion that we see throughout the story, specifically in the way it's being told by the chosen, is the, and I think it's just human nature, as we talk about all the time. But the inversion of, you know, seeking your own glory in your own kingdom instead of his glory in his kingdom. You're muted. Yes. Agreed. Well said. Um, the, the stuff about one of, you know, one of you is not clean that, that we find in John 13. Um, and, uh, I think, you know, for as far as the last supper scene. So I, um, I have a few of the confession to me in that I, uh, I couldn't stop and I watched the whole thing. So I know, I know what happens now. Uh, uh, through the end of the season. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's fine. That's fine. Um. Um.

No problem there. Yeah, so number one, we have to call up the disciples for being complete and total dinks. How they couldn't figure out in this moment who the traitor was is beyond me. I mean, they were sitting there arguing like hours before this or maybe it was a day before this. They were sitting there arguing about stuff. And when Judas was like, oh, well, maybe he's not the Messiah. Yeah, we'll keep looking for a new Messiah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like, we'll go look for a new Messiah. They were like, dude, you've been saying stuff. Like, one of them called him out for being like a black pillar for a while. Like, you've been black pilloring for a while now, bro. So it's like they were aware that Judas was being like a douchebag for a while. And they acknowledge that. And then he says, like, we can, like, you know, once we figure out what's what, we can just continue looking for the Messiah.

And then the look on Judas's face, like as this is all happening, like it's all over his face. The actor playing and does a great job with it. How do they not figure out that it's Judas? It's like, of course it's Judas. And like Jesus even like keeps looking at him, you know, as he, as he's like speaking. Yeah, I mean, just a bunch of donks. Y'all are dogs.

The fact that they set the table for, they set the place setting for John was awesome. I don't know if you picked up on that, but they did. There was like a play like when it was, you know, it was flashing back and forth between Jesus's perspective and their perspective. And even when it went to their perspective when like he wasn't there, the place that was still there. Yeah. And that's a reference to the Elijah to come. Oh, look for that. That verse. I thought I had that in here. But I like the way that they had John look so restored. You know, he wasn't all mingled and, you know, dirty and locusty, like everything. He was, he had showered.

Yeah, he had. And he had used beard oil. He used the, yeah, it was this, that was, that was the earliest soft disclosure beard oil application. But it said, he, he says, where is that moment where he says, these things I have spoken to you that my joy may be in you and that you. and that your joy may be full. That's John 15 verse 11.

And they cut immediately to John showing that he does it. His job is done. You know, he was the voice in the wilderness preparing the way for the Messiah to come. And the Messiah has come. And John took a, took a lot of heat, right? Literally lost his head. And I love in, this is foreshadowing, but in the, the, I think it's the, either the last episode or the second, I think it's the second to last episode.

So it'll be next week's, all right, six, seven, eight, yeah, next week's episode, um, where they do the flashbacks and you get the flashback of, uh, Andrew and John and, um, big James with John the Baptist. and, you know, kind of seeing how, I don't really know. I have to study that one more. I feel like it was a little bit more like what life would be like without Jesus. But part of it, too, was, you know, where they were when Jesus found them, the ones that we didn't see that story already. So anyway, we'll talk about that next week.

But or the week after, if Ghost and I don't get a chance to record next week's episode before Tuesday of next week. So just stand by everyone. There might not be an episode. We're going to try. But if we don't, then you have two episodes to look forward to after Gart before we do the season recap. But I just, I like the way that they did that. It was like a fullness. Like his joy, John the Baptist's joy is full.

He ran the race and finished the course and persevered until the end. And he is, you know, restored now. His joy is full. Yep. Yep. Um, yeah. And then they, of course, like, because this is all like going backwards, this scene starts off with, uh, Thomas saying like, who is and who isn't?

So like that's like a, it's like a cliffhanger at the beginning of the scene. Yeah. Um, okay. So. And just on the, on at the Passover, you set a place for Elijah. That's a part of the, the tradition. Oh, is it? And, and John.

is the, there's a, there's a verse, and I will find it while you're setting up the next scene, but there's a verse that talks about the Elijah that is to come, which is what, you know, in the Christian tradition, considered to be John the Baptist. Okay, so they, so the place, the place saying they set was for Elijah technically. Yes. But it was John, and that was like fulfilling, that was like the Christian, the Christian tradition. Okay, that makes sense. All right.

Remember when Mary held her first Seder dinner or her first, not her Seder, but her first Sabbath, Shabbat, she held her Shabbat. And she mistakenly, I think it was, mistakenly set a place for Elijah and Jesus shows up at her house, right? But it was that, that is a, that is a, hang on, it's Malachi. That's it. So it's Malachi verse four, chapter four, versus five through six. Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord. And he will turn the hearts of the fathers to children and the hearts of the children to their fathers, lest I come and strike the earth with a curse. And that is, I think that's the last book of the Old Testament, isn't it? Or it might be Micah.

I might be getting mixed up. Hang out. I'm going to fact check myself. Yes, Malachi is the final book of the Old Testament. Not that they were, you know, written in the way that they're presented. but nonetheless. That's the deeper meaning of that whole John the Baptist thing is that he was in that seat. Got you.

Okay. So. And look at all beautiful and restored. Yes. Okay. So the main, I would say that this episode mostly focuses on Nicodemus. I think Nicodemus is kind of like the central plot line, so to speak, of this episode, along with, you know, Judas just. like the turning of Judas, like they show you that moment of him scheming with Caiaphas.

I wrote my summary for this discussion that we haven't had yet already. I put, you know, like a blurb in my substack about all the shows of the week. And so I wrote and the way I described this was it was an episode of secret meetings. Because you have Nicodemus and Mary, you have Atticus and Coughney, and you have Judas and Caiapha. that are all, you know, kind of having these off. And again, I'm not sure all of them are super purposeful to the plot. Well, you also have Nicodemus and Yousef, and that's, in my opinion. I love that scene.

That one's like the one that's worth watching because I even clip that scene. I sent to the group. I've been trying to get Burning Bright to watch the show because I think if we watch the show, he'll read the Bible. Agreed. But that scene is like the application of that scene. to like what's happening right now. Like I wrote out the entire list of like,

here are all the things that are happening in the scene that are also happening right now in real life. And it's like, it's like a dozen things, including Nicodemus going through QDecodes, trying to figure out what's going to happen next by decoding, you know, scripture and looking at current events. And that's like, and then at the end, they're like,

well, should we do something or should we keep decoding? Oh, we're going to go back and keep decoding. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it's, but we will watch that scene. But let's do the, let's run through the Nicodemus potline first.

I think that one's like, Nick Demus and Mary. Well, just Nicodemus in general. Like, the whole Nicodemus thing is he, like he's been missing this entire time. Like you made the point of saying that, well, he's off the show now after season two. Yeah.

Didn't one, wasn't it? Wasn't it at the end of season one? Well, it was season one. Yeah, yeah. It was season one. I think he may have made like a brief appearance or something, but yeah, you're right, season one. But so now we learn what he's been doing this whole, this whole time. And what he's, what he's been doing is he went to, what's it called someplace.

Bethel? Yeah, Bethel. He goes to Bethel. And then he comes home. And so we get a flashback now eight months before. And you kind of see like his falling out with. the Sanhedron because it's pretty clear he's like having a falling out with them and he hasn't given up on the system to the point you made last week he hasn't given up on the system yet

but he certainly recognizes the evil that the the individuals that are in the Sanhedron have come to represent the fact they can't be trusted yeah so we ended last episode with Nicodemus showing his face to Mary of Magdalene, Mayor Magdalene and And he had her kidnapped, right? Like, Matthias is like, put this bag over your head. It's going to be. He told me you were going to be difficult. He told me you were going to be difficult.

Who told me? Who told me? Who told you I was going to be difficult? Don't worry about that now. Just putting this bag over your head. Yeah. So we see that. And then we see that it's Nicodemus that has kidnapped her. And it's Nicodemus that has been directing Matias, who we find out is the lurky character.

By the way, like absolutely abysmal decision making by Mary to go along with that. Ladies, if you're ever told by a guy to put a bag over your head and get in the trunk of a car, don't do it. Please don't do it. Unless the Holy Spirit tells you it's okay. Yeah, it would be difficult. That would be a difficult one. But we, so we see, we, we end last episode with them coming face to face.

And then we kind of start in the same place with them, you know, but we get this kind of very long flashback. So of Nicodemus returning from his trip to Bethel and it's nine months before where we are in the story. So nine months before right now in the story where he's meeting with Mary Magdalene, he comes back and he's completely unaware that John the Baptist is dead, that Jesus has made a name for himself to Jerusalem and that Caiapha, has made proclamations about him. And he has Zebediah, who is the rabbi that's presiding over the session before he goes and meets Nicodemus afterwards to explain to him, you know, he's just gotten back. So here's all the stuff that's happened. And Nicodemus is visibly notably shocked.

I don't think we should play that. It's too long. That scene is really long. And it's just to establish that Nicodemus has been paying attention to the ministry for almost a year. right and he's sent matthias out the well i think we should play the scene between mary and um matthias and nicodemus where he explains kind of you know you've been why she's like you've been watching us you've been informing on us there's a lot of stuff about spies specifically nicademus spies in this episode and then in the next episode we get into rome spies and it's like really interesting actually

the way that that episode unfolds it confirms a lot of the things that we've said with without knowing it. But it is like Nicodemus, my biggest takeaway, he's still riding the fence, right? Like he, he knows, and I think he knew in season one.

He knew in season one who Jesus was. But he's still looking at his own personal calculus, and we get a real taste of that in the team. Well, yes, but I think what it is, it's like the same kind of trap that Judas is falling into where, he thinks that the system is the thing.

Like he's like Jesus is the guy. Many such cases. I don't think there's any doubt that he thinks Jesus is the guy. Because we see that with the QD codes. Like he's going through the scripture. He's like the answer is somewhere here. Yeah. Yeah.

He's like the answer is somewhere here in the scripture. This is definitely the guy. But he thinks that the Sanhedron, he thinks that the system that he serves, he served his whole life is the thing that Jesus is coming to elevate, basically. And that's where he's missing it. And so he's trying to preserve this thing that is doomed because it is evil. I mean, let's just call it what it is. That's what Jesus says it is.

And he doesn't understand that it's evil because he's too close to it. And he also has a very skewed misunderstanding of, of the world, as is everybody else who sees the world through this lens that's been presented to them by the Sanhedron. Yeah, and so I think he's very much on board Team Jesus being the Messiah, but he's also still on board with the Sanhedron being the thing that's going to help save the Jews, I guess, or bring the Messiah into his kingdom. because again,

he doesn't quite understand Jesus' mission. Jesus has given him probably he, Nicodemus probably got the most insight the earliest of anybody else. When they met on the rooftop,

I feel like Jesus kind of laid it out for him, like what was going to happen. Not what was going to happen to him, but what his in-game was, was creating this kingdom. And Nicodemus is sitting there like, I don't get it. I still don't get it.

He's like, he's like the kingdom is not here the kingdom is in the next life that's what we're that's what we're building we're not building something here i don't care about this place and nicodemus can't wrap his head around that he's like what do you mean you don't care about this place like what like i don't understand what that means um but that's just because it's very small yeah like the the the focus right because i don't think jesus says the system is evil it's the perversion of the system that's evil. And the system, and this is a trap that a lot of Christians fall into, especially Christians that have never read the Old Testament, but only read the New Testament, is thinking that

the sacrificial system that Jesus came to fulfill was like a man-made invention. It was God's system designed and given to them in meticulous detail in the wilderness. And that system was fulfilled in Jesus. But the reason Jesus flipped the tables is because it had been so perverted, right? It had been, they had turned what was whole, but, but it wasn't. It wasn't intended to be this hyper monetized industrial commerce place. That was what they needed to elevate themselves and they were, they were, God was not in that. No, no, I get that that wasn't God's system.

That wasn't the system as it was handed to them. It's like saying this. It's like saying the Constitution, right, is a system. Is that the system that we have right now? No. The system we have right now is a system. It's not the system that our founding fathers created. Does that make sense?

Well, then why did Jesus need to fulfill it? The system that, well, he wasn't fulfilling the Sanhedron. He was fulfilling the prophecy that God laid out, which has nothing to do with what the Sanhedron was doing. Like the government that we have right now, is not the government that our founding fathers created. Just like the system that the Sanhedron have is not the system that God gave. It's still a system, but it's not the system that was given to them. That system is evil, just like our government is evil.

I think we need to understand that we can't excuse what is because of what we want it to be. We have to look at what is and we have to say it's a system. It may not be the system that we want or the system that was intended, but it is a system and it is evil. And because it's evil, it has to be wiped away. And this is, I think, a problem that a lot of people fall into whether you're talking about religion or you're talking about the church or you're talking about the government. People always want to say, well, wait a minute, there are good people in the government. Oh, well, then I guess that means that we should. No, no, no, no, no, I'm not picking on you right now.

I'm just saying that I feel like people want to say that because there's goodness in something, we shouldn't look at the evil in it and recognize the evil in it. And again, I'm not picking on you. I'm really thinking more of like conversations I've had with other people where people are always saying, yeah, but yeah, but I'm talking about people in my real people in real life, my family and stuff who were like, yeah, but you know, there are good people like in Congress. you want to do the right thing. No, they're not. No, they're not. Every single one of them got there because they cut a deal up a devil. They made a deal with a devil. All those Pharisees made a deal up a devil to get where they are. And all they care about is feathering their nest and making sure

that the system was for the glory of God. Yeah, exactly. So that system is easy. Well, so I'm still going to push back on this because that system was designed to glorify God. they took it, made it legalistic, and made it about themselves and their own power. That's what's evil. Not the system as it was designed by God, but it's perversion by the people that were perverting it for their own power in the name of God. That's what's evil. And that distinction is important because seeing it one way, right orient,

seeing it one way, right orients you to, okay, this is what the problem was. I'm not going to do that. like we're not going to we're not going to follow that path anymore right the the other way makes you think it leads you to it doesn't matter that system is does it doesn't matter we shouldn't even understand it and i think it's critical to understand it because jesus fulfilled it and so what was he fulfilling why was he fulfilling it why does it matter why is his blood being spilled out important. That's all the fulfillment of that system. So I do think it's important to draw a line that that system is not evil. It's perversion by men using the name of God to seek their own glory is evil.

I think we're saying the same thing. And by the way, it's fulfilled now. So it's effectively over in terms of its ability to glorify God. In any event that that system comes back, it will be. to you know it will forward god's purposes because everything does but it won't that that system won't be to the glory of god because i don't think because it's already been fulfilled i know you and i are on the same side when it comes to this i am going to continue to disagree with you because i think that jesus said this city needs to be destroyed every every stone will be torn down on the temple this is this is the synagogue of satan yeah but i think he but i this is the synagogue of satan yes he did he said this is the synagogue he said in the letter to um um revelation what is it revelation that's john

john wrote revelation yeah yeah but but he's quote but he's quoting a letter that jesus dictated to go look it up go go look it up that he jesus dictated a letter and in the letter he he is calling them a synagogue of satan that's what he says so i'm saying again then we can move on from this oh you're saying the inspiration for john to say that was jesus that's fine I can't get on board with that. It wasn't, it wasn't in red letters, right? Like synagogue of Satan is not Jesus

while he was walking the earth, something that he said. No, no, no. It was, yeah. He was dictating a letter that was being written, and it was his words in a letter. But I'm, but again,

like, I'm just going to keep pushing back on this because it was a, it wasn't God's system. It wasn't, it wasn't God's framework that he wrote. It was the framework that humans created, that humans perverted. That system was evil.

And I'm not going to let that go because it's the perversion of it was evil. The perversion of the system was evil. For the same reason, for the same reason that I'm not going to let the Republicans wrap themselves in the American flag and say, Do you think the Constitution is evil? No, not at all. Do you think the constitutional system is evil? No, I think the current government.

The perversion of the constitution is evil. I think the current government of America is extremely evil. Right. I agree with you, but that's a perversion of the constitution. It's not that the Constitution is evil. It's the perversion of it. But it is still the system of America right now. It's what you're arguing is an idea of what you want America to be, of what it should be, of what it should have been.

No, I think if you don't know your history, then you are doomed to repeat it. And if we don't understand why Jesus came in the way that he came into that system that you're calling evil as the ability, becoming the sacrifice that fulfilled it. I think we're at an impasse here. I think we're on an emphasis. I'm not. The evil system is what you're saying. I'm not calling God's framework evil. I'm saying the system as it exists under human beings is evil.

That's what I'm saying. I'm not saying the framework. I'm not saying the constitution is evil. I'm saying the system that humans made from that framework is evil. After centuries of using the framework and what they turned it into is evil and that system has to go away. I'm not saying the Constitution has to go away. I'm not saying that the framework that God gave has to go away. That was fulfilled.

I'm saying the system, though, has to go away. And I get pushed back on the sash from every single person in my life where they say, you're wrong, you're wrong, you're wrong. And I'm like, I'm sorry, but. About the Bible or the Constitution? The Sanhedron. The Sanhedron. The Sanhedron and the government.

of America in my mind are the exact same thing. Do you think that everyone that was in the Sanhedron was dedicated to the ends of Lucifer? Do you think some of whom are saying God? But you're doing it right now. You're doing it. That is the system. You're saying that there are a few good people.

And because there are a few good people, the system is redeemable. The system is not redeemable. I never said the system was redeemable. That system has been fulfilled. But why would God fulfill an evil system? I'm not saying God fulfilled an evil system. You are, though, because you're saying the system that Jesus walked into and became the ultimate sacrifice for was evil. I'm not saying that the framework is evil.

I'm saying that the synagogue that he walked into, the temple that he walked into, where he said this temple has to be destroyed because this temple is evil. And the people in it running it are evil. That system had to go. And that's why they got wiped away. That's what I'm saying. I don't care that there were good people in there. Yeah, there probably were.

Look, Yusuf, he's good. Nicodemus, he's good. That doesn't redeem the system. The reason I asked about all of the people in the system was not to say there's good people we need to save the system. It's to say that with God, and this is where we cannot conflate the Constitution with what we're talking about. With God, he looks at the heart. Right. And so there were there were Pharisees that were in that system.

trying to seek the glory of God. And they were redeemed by God. And that's fine. The individual can be redeemed. The individual Pharisee can be redeemed. The system that they are serving in the moment. Yeah. No, I cannot be redeemed.

And that's my point. And again, I'm not focusing here when I say this on the framework. Because I think the framework is the intent. The framework is what's given and saying, here, follow these rules. They didn't follow the rules. And so the thing that they built because they didn't follow the rules is the corrupt system. That's why it has to go. So that's where I have to land it.

But I can't budge from that. That's just like a first principles thing. I can't move away from the fact that the system is what the humans. The system is what the humans made. It's not a first principle, though. Don't call that first principles. Look, I'm a builder. If you hand me a blueprint and you say build this building and I go and I cut every corner to save

myself money to build it and I build you a shoddy building. Should that building be torn down because it's not safe for people to go inside of it? Does that mean the blueprint that you gave to build it? I'm not saying that I think we have to move on because we're going to if you're referring to the system that God established in the wilderness in meticulous detail as the thing that is is the blueprint. No, the blueprint is not evil. The blueprint is not evil. The structure that the contractor who was a scumbag and cut every corner to save himself a buck the building that got built that's a fairer metaphor i get not not not the blue the blueprint is fine there's nothing wrong with the blueprint it's the building that gets built because the contractor cut every corner to save

himself some money that that building should be torn down because that building is is no good that's what i'm saying that like you can sit there and say well the blueprint the blueprint the blueprint the blueprint i don't care about the blueprint the blueprint the blueprint the physical building that exists today which is the sanhedron in this story which is the government in our story has to go because it like it's just it's well yeah i mean that's what like jesus jesus came to fulfill it and specifically said you know destroy this temple and in three days i'll raise it up and he was he's he's he's that temple right like his his body church is that new temple But yeah, we can move on. We're an hour in and we haven't even played a scene yet.

All right. Let's play the Mary scene. Okay. Give Rebecca my regards. And you're the same to Zahara. We'll have to have dinner. Yes, yes, I'll have Matthias. Set it up. Shalom, Shalom, Shalom. Shalom. Shalom. Matthias? Yes, my boy. I want you to drop everything you're doing and listen to me carefully.

I have an assignment for you. Mary of Magdalar. Have you been looking for me? Yes. Teacher, it's you. Please. Keep your voice down. Not everyone in this house is awake.

Why is so secretive? Why didn't your men just tell me they were with you? I am so sorry, but we have no choice. I don't know what is in your head at the moment. How zealous you and the others are and what you will say and to whom. You've not been discreet lately, and I need to be. Crete, you're in the San Yatran. Where is this place?

This is my home, but you don't need to know where. This city is crawling with spies, agents, and informers. I don't know why you've been so difficult to reach. I've really needed your help. Where have you been? Marie. It is very dangerous what you are doing. You are wise not to ask for me by name, but it was clear to us what you were up to.

Who is us? You've had spies. Not spies, just keeping track. and your behavior could well have accelerated his demise. Accelerated, no, no, you're getting bad information. We've been on the run from the moment we arrived. Jesus has not passed up a single opportunity to make an enemy. I'm curious to know why you think that is.

I'm sorry? Why is he doing this? Why is he systematically turning allies into enemies? You know him? You've seen him challenge authority before? He won't shrink just because... Mary? This is something more.

I will read you his own words. How? My watchman was observing and taking notes. This from just two days ago, you know, when he upended the marketplace in the temple, woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites. For you are like whitewashed tombs, who outwardly appear beautiful, but within are full of dead people's bones and uncleanness. So you also outwardly appear righteous to others, but within are full of hypocrisy.

Lawlessness! Doesn't exactly sound like an invitation to join him, does it? How long have you been tracking him? Long enough. I don't understand. You've seen us. You've been watching all of us? Tell me why I shouldn't be very uncomfortable with all of this. He was only doing what I asked him to do.

I've not seen Jesus since Copernum, but when news, reached Jerusalem that he was claiming to be the Christ. I had to. You had to what, spy? Mary, I brought you here under duress, so I'm trying to be patient with your loose words. But you need to listen. I teach Torah and the foundations of our faith

to students all over Israel. Please try to understand the immense responsibility for our people that I feel on my shoulders from Adonai himself. Every year, from every year, from every year, every region. Someone comes along claiming to be the Messiah and trying to sway our people and mislead them. Now, most of them are crushed for their false prophecy, and we never even hear of them. But when someone like Jesus achieves this level of influence over these many people

performing these kinds of signs and wonders, all the while claiming to be the Christ and asserting his authority over the law and leaders of our people, I have a sense. secret duty to prove him wrong. What did you see? What did he report to you? You've met him yourself. I helped arrange it. I'm sure you saw who he is as well.

What did he see? He saw the eyes of the blind opened, the ears of the death unstopped, the lame man leaping like a deer, and the tongue of the mutants, saying for joy. The people that walked in darkness have seen a great light. Those that dwelt in the land of the shadow of death.

Upon them a light has shined. But you, O Bethlehem, too little to be among the clan of Judah. From you shall come forth for me. One who is to be ruler of Israel. One who's coming forth is from a vault. From ancient days. You now know he is the one who fulfills these prophecies. I prayed he wouldn't.

I needed him to be a fraud, but I've seen too much. I know the feeling. Do you saw Lazarus? So why haven't you told this to the others? Why have you been absent? I've been told you've not been seen in San Yeran at all lately. Apart from my present condition, there is the question of trying to get anything done in the Sanhedron,

let alone the intricacies of money and politics and fees. that guide most of them and govern their decisions. And when it comes to false prophecy, that is a wall I cannot lie. I've been looking for you because he needs your help. Why have you been wanting to talk to me if not to help? To warn you and for you to warn him that he's in danger. No message received.

But for whatever reason, he's clearly not running from that danger. So no, I'm asking you, that's asking you, To help eliminate it? Your wisdom and strength led you to pursue Jesus in Copernum when your colleagues wouldn't have ever considered it. I don't know what happened after that. That's between you and him, but I know you know the truth. And I'm asking you to do anything you can.

Just try to... Please! An academicist, there is something else I wanted to say to you. Thank you. For what? For trying. That day the... Romans brought you to my place in the Red Quarter.

It must have been very uncomfortable for you. It's scary for anyone. I'm so grateful you at least made the attempt. I should have told you that the day we spoke in the market. And I know coming to the Red Quarter didn't initially turn out the way you had hoped. But it led to. You're welcome. But I had nothing to do with who you are today.

Your change is just as convincing. as the prophecies of who he is. I don't know what else I can do, but I will search Torah. Perhaps the scriptures will reveal to us what is in store for him. Nicotemus? Zohara.

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to disturb you. Nico, you don't have to speak loudly for me to be stared by your spirit, like I have been for months. I've been studying in earnest. There are things about my position. Come in here. Zohara, you don't understand.

Come, have been with you for 60 years. Don't try to educate me on your position as though I'm the teenager I was when we married. You can prepare for your lectures and your sleep. You don't need this level of research. You haven't finished a meal in weeks without abandoning the table. And me. Pretty scrolls. You're losing weight.

You can barely hold herself up since Matthias burst in a week ago, whispering frantically. I am not deaf and blind, Nico. We have to talk. We will. I just can. Sorry. Yeah. So when he says, I have a sacred duty to prove him wrong.

What he's saying is, I have a sacred duty to prove God wrong. He doesn't realize in that moment he's saying that, but that's what he's saying. Is he saying, I have a sacred duty. and by sacred that, like, let's put that in quotations. Sacred duty to the system. I have a sacred

duty to the system to prove him wrong because if he's right, the implications are very damning to the system. And so he has been brainwashed.

Let's just call it what is. Do you want to keep arguing about this? Because you said you were going to end it, but now you're... He's been brainwashed. I mean, I'm sorry, but Nicodemus has been brainwashed. I see what he's saying more as scientific method, right? Like, if you have a hypothesis, if you make a bold assertion, you need to be able to prove it. And he's, his, you know, his assertion. But, you know, sure, I mean, it was, we are told from history books of the ancient world that there were Messiah claims all the time, that like in every generation,

there was someone claiming to be the Messiah. And so it became kind of, you know, their role in that was to defend the faith, defend the faith. Yeah, I mean, I don't really think they had faith, right? Yeah, but defend, defend the doctrine. Yeah. Yeah, like defend the framework that we were just discussing. Yeah, like there is a sense of if the Messiah comes, then our time is over. So we have to prove him wrong, which is kind of.

of what you're saying. I get that. Well, there's a cognitive dissonance because in the same discussion, he acknowledges that Jesus is the Messiah. He's like, he believes Jesus is the Messiah, but he's also saying, I have a sacred duty to prove him wrong. Because I think, like, he doesn't quite finish the thought, but he's also like, if he's right and if he is the Messiah, then the scripture says he's going to die.

It's like, that's like, he's like, he's like walking it to its logical conclusion. And it's kind of crazy that like he hasn't figured that out yet because Jesus has like laid that out to everyone. He's like, hey, go read the scripture. Says this is what's going to happen. Y'all know this is what's going to happen. I don't understand why why no one is, you know, getting it. But yeah. And and but again, like Nicodemus's mindset is like defend the system. He's got to stand between the system and whatever is threatening the system. And he doesn't understand why Jesus is threatening the system while he's saying the money, the greed, the politics is clouding the judgment of these guys. And I can't even go in there and talk to them rationally because they will eat me alive if I even go in there and try to have a reasonable discussion with them.

And it's like, dude, how do you not, how do you not see what's happening here? Jesus didn't come to take on the Roman Empire. He came on to take, he came to take on the Sanhedron because the Sanhedron is now standing between the people and God. Yeah, the one thing that I would say is that he's not just any old Pharisee, right? He is the teacher of teachers. His job was training new rabbis, training new religious leaders. Now, that is, it is biblical that if you are a teacher, there's a verse, I don't know,

see if it was Jesus or Paul that said it because I can't remember. Maybe it was James. Not many of you become teachers. The verse is James. It's James 3-1. Let not many of you become teachers, my brother, and for you know that we who teach shall be judged with greater strictness. So it's a somber, very serious.

very sacred responsibility to teach people about God, to be a teacher of God. Even more so, I would think, to teach the people who are going to teach people about God. That's a big, very, very safe. So you want somebody in that position to be taking it very seriously. Now, get your point about, I have to prove him wrong specifically. But contextually, in that time with that role, it's not. a it's not um it's not a lack of you know spiritualness or right orientation for him to take that responsibility very seriously that's actually a command yeah like all all the false prophets i get it like

like when a false prophet comes out of the woods he's got to be like all right here's why this guy's a false prophet while he's you know he's perverting he is perverting the word of the lord because he is you know falsely claiming to be the prophet however in this specific example, Jesus, it's different because he also is acknowledging that he's the Messiah. So it's like, yes, your job normally is to defend the faith against false prophets. But because you believe this guy is the Messiah, isn't your role to actually embrace him and be like, hey, you're the guy we've been waiting for this old time. You're the guy that like we built this entire thing for.

like welcome um and and and it's like in one hand he he's having cognitive dissonance because on one hand he is there but on the other hand he recognizes that's never going to happen in the temple because of everything that we've seen and everything he said and that's why when his wife is like we need to talk about this he's like we can't and he turns around and walks away because he's like he can't face it he can't face the fact that jesus went there and flipped to over tables because there is no reconciling what is and what should be. Yeah, like Nicodemus can come, right? Like Jesus is like, you can come.

You can't bring all that stuff with you, though. Yes, yes, exactly, exactly, yep. Okay, so we can, if we want to finish the Nicodemus arc. Yeah, we should do the part with him and Yusuf. Youssef. Yeah, that's a great scene. All right, let's do. This is the cue to code scene.

The spirit of the Lord is upon me. He's anointed me to proclaim good news to. He's got a whole wall. He's got, I mean, yes. It's always sunny wall. This is like, he's like, he's like elbow deep in Q. That's the red string and he's like elbow deep on Q research board. Just like like.

That's the ancient cue board on the wall. Yeah, it's like a thousand. tabs open and he's just sitting there flipping back and forth between tabs looking at news articles looking at cue at cue post checking the timestamps drawn the strings this is so blasphemous but it's so funny it's so true it can't blaspheme nicademus it's so true well i mean just because we're comparing coup posts of scripture but that is how to his pursuit of trying to find another way another route another path so i don't yeah yeah yeah but i mean that is 100% Q-posts are treated. It is treated like scripture. I love that he's got the wall with the

string. That is definitely the sick part of it. Yeah, the wall is hilarious. Oh, that is a faith. Yeah. Your hearing, I am the father of one. Ah, he was despised and rejected of men, a man, a man of sorrow acquainted with grief. Ha! Do not think I come to abolish the law or the prophets, I do not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them. Robyn McGilmess. Yousaf. I'm sorry to disturb you. His scripture has already disturbed me.

With all respect, I bring news that might make it worse. Youssef just pop into the chan. Yeah, yeah. The facts are not fully confirmed, but my confidants are not given to exaggeration or inference without solid evidence. Don't withhold, young man. Say yet. Caiaphas is making plans to arrest Jesus.

Oh, impossible. He doesn't have the authority. And according to my reconnaissance, no one is certain way to find Jesus. There is talk of a collaborator. A traitor? From within the ranks of his own followers. Who among them could be cannibal of such a thing?

I don't know what Matthias has told you. But not all of the followers are in agreement on how they view Jesus. I have witnessed dissent between them at the House of Lazarus. Even if one of them betrayed his whereabouts at this very moment, the Sanhedron would still have to convene for a trial. And it is illegal for a capital offense to be tried on the day of preparation for the High Holy Day. Passover is less than seven hours.

Gaelvis' hands are tied. I assure you they're not, or rather they are, to his father-in-law. Anos. He's been deposed before, we can depose him again. If he's the one behind all of this, which I suppose he is. We? It's a naked violation of the law and tradition. Most of the judges don't even like Anos.

You said we. Will you join me and Shimon and the centrist in denouncing Caiaphas's brazen infractions? Why would I even do that? Most of the administrative meeting spaces in the temple closed for Passover. Nicodemus, you know Caiaphas has no scruples. My informers say they will call an emergency meeting overnight, tonight, citing an obscure loophole authorization from the Sefer Hamakabin

during times of national crisis. But Jesus is not a national crisis. He is. A national security threat. Extraordinary executive authority. Like, Caiapus is he going to implement devolution? of Sanhedron. As far as they

rightly perceive them to be a threat to this continuity of Sanhedron. ...Israeli hierarchy, which is poised to dismantle. They're not all corrupt, but they are all scared. Of course they are. If I may be so bold, you are too harsh on your brethren, Raban.

They are mostly good men. Dedicated to their faith, devoted to preserving our traditions and Torah. They just weren't ready for Jesus. I don't think anyone was, but as in company included. Me or you? Both. Sunset to sunset has not passed, and somehow, I've twice been accused of misunderstanding Jesus of Nazareth.

So you do? Do I? Understand Jesus. I'm getting there. Let me show you this deco. What's next? How can... Yeah, yeah.

Did you see post 429? The die is cast. My status. Wait, wait. This is the best part. Nothing can stop what is coming. It's irrelevant. This requires a level of dexterity that neither of you have been forced to implement.

It's not something I can solve with stern words and back room somewhere. If you all I disclose our allegiance, now or ever, we will be shut out of all discussions altogether. Mary? His follower? I sent for her. She was searching for me, but recklessly. She could have quickened the disaster that is so rapidly unfolding. She was looking for help anywhere she can find it. I said recklessly. And you cared enough about that to bring her in.

Why? If you're so resigned to the fate of Jesus. To save her and the others. From what? From what could happen next? I can't stop the Sanhedron's attempts, but I can at least warn Jesus and his followers. Rabbi Nicodemus, please hear him. me. You are right. Neither I nor Mary have the wisdom or experience you have. But we are willing to do anything.

You say we will be shut out of all discussions if we reveal ourselves. I will follow your lead on that. But surely we can be part of the discussion tonight. I am studying the scriptures and Jesus is statements for clues as to what can happen next or what he has in store it's a mystery i have no idea what might happen tonight let's find out yeah um yeah man it's just so good they like nothing can stop what is coming a sternly worded letter is not going to do anything at this point the younger guy at begging the older guy to do something, please do something. Can't you just do something? And then the older guy being like, I could, but nothing can stop what is coming.

And I got to, I got to check out these decodes to see what happens. Still got too much to lose, too. And that's, that is the thing that is so disheartening, but also so human. You know, it's hard. It's hard to get super irritated at Nicodemus or even Yusuf, right? I mean, Yusuf, Yusuf went undercover in order to listen to Jesus speak, right? He was acting in the same way.

Went off with the Pharisees when Tamar asked him to come in with them on Palm Sunday. Like, they're weighing their personal calculus and what they have to lose. I think Yusuf less so, but Yusuf's family's on board, right? Yeah. His dad is on board and has already held. helped them out in some ways. And, you know, his father witnessed the raising of Lazarus, according to the show and everything.

And so it's, it's, it's, and there's a generational thing there, I think, too. And I don't know. I think it's showrunner, showrunner choice. But that's, that's particularly notable. Just begging the, you know, you're the one in the room with the most power, bro. Out of all of us that are dissenting, you have the most power. Well, I don't want to be shut out of the. the discussions.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Well, you make a good point because it's like he has the most to lose. Like he has, he has the nice big family. He has the grandchildren. He has like the really nice life. You know, he's dedicated. Yeah, respect.

He's dedicated his whole life to like helping build out this thing with Sanhedron. Youssef is young. He's new to this. I think he's pretty disillusioned with the whole thing at this point. Like I think he's just like he sees it for what it is. He doesn't have like this, this. I mean, he has a nice life. Like, he comes from like a good family and all that.

But he seems a lot, he seems more prepared to flip over the tables like Jesus did. And, and he's going to Nicodemus right now being like, let's go flip over the tables. And Nicodemus is like, uh, if we flip over the tables, they're never going to let us come back and speak to them again.

And Yusuf is kind of like, yeah, but if not now, then when? Like, if not now, then when? like this is the Messiah. The Messiah is here. Like we need to have the Messiah's back. Why are we not doing this? Nicodemus is like,

because, oh, like I, it's a lot. It's going to be a lot for us. Like, let's think this through. Let's take our time.

Another thing, um, just, and this is a callback to his discussion with, um, with Mary is when they're saying like she says he's, he, he hasn't missed an opportunity to make an enemy.

And Nicodemus is something about like the, the, you know, there's all these potential alliances that he could be making and he's not making any of them. Like, he's doing the opposite of what he should be doing. And Judas is kind of in that same posture, right? Wait a second. Why aren't we aligning with the Sanhedron against Rome? We can get them on our, we can get them on our side. Come on man. Like, let's just be a little bit nicer to them. And, you know, maybe don't call them, you know, vipers and stuff. Like just, you know, make them feel good. You know, they like to feel good about themselves. Make them feel good about themselves. And that is still fundamentally missing the point. Jesus didn't come to make alliances. anybody. There's no one that can make an alliance with God. There's nobody that has a set of circumstances to negotiate with God. You cannot negotiate with God, right? But they're all still missing it. Yeah, it's based. It's very based. It's like, hey, we need to make, we need to, we need to lie with the Uniparty, with, with the Republican establishment to take down the Uniparty,

which is also the Republican establishment. Yeah, it's, it's hilarious because that's exactly what Judas is arguing. All right. So let's do the Judas Caiapha scene real quick, and then we'll do the Atticus Kathleen scene and wrap up. All right.

So here is... Yeah, we're going to shortchange the show because we argued about the system for about 45 minutes. So sorry, guys, but you can all watch. It is what it is. Please sit down.

Can we serve you something? We are not the same. I don't know what Shemales told you. but you should know now. Note how like the director has like fit it up. The lighting. It's like he's wearing dark clothes. He's got like his eyes look like sunken in.

His skin looks very pale. He looks very villainous now. Like if you were making if you're like before he had like there was just something about him where he seemed more like a childlike wonder. Like he seems more like youthful and now he seems more like older. and there's just something about him where he seems like he's like possessed. Yeah.

Well, he sort of is. But you and I are not the same. That's certainly the case. He has you now. Who represents the nation. He has you now is what Jesus said to him at the table. Yep, he has you now. Yep.

Before God, the only human on earth allowed to enter the Holy of Holies. You on the other. Helping to save your people. I assure you, I've not been brought here under false pretenses. I can deliver him to you. But you must know something. I do believe that Jesus is most likely the Messiah.

Why? Most likely. Why what? Why do you believe that? I've seen too much. Then why are you doing this? I suppose I have not seen enough. Huh.

Hence, uh... Most likely. Khyphus is so great. The actor. Yeah. He effortlessly destroys his captors, leads us to victory over Rome and takes his rightful place on the throne of David.

Then I'll be celebrating with the rest of our people. You are utterly out of your death. I disagree. Marcus, Smowel. You give us the room. See that... This is where Kai Fis is 100% right right here because he is out of his depth. He's not even thinking through the logic he just laid out.

By the way, what he just laid out was so perverse. He's like, I'm going to test Jesus to see if he's the Messiah by putting him in a situation, in a life-threatening situation. And if he is the Messiah, he'll save himself. And in the act of saving himself, he'll save the rest of us because he'll rise up and destroy Rome? Like we the Jews are going to go arrest him. He's going to destroy his captors, which would be

the Jews, right, like the Sanhedron. And then he's going to destroy Rome? Like, that doesn't make any sense. It's like he's completely overlooking the fact that according to his own plan, the Sanhedron's going to get destroyed by this plan.

He's even like recognizing that without recognizing, without acknowledging it, that that's the logical outcome of what he's doing. is the Sanhedron being destroyed, which it is destroyed. It's not immediately later, but all of its power, like influence is basically destroyed by doing this. That is. I mean, maybe.

Look around. It's, you know, I'm right. I think the thing that we're up against right now is this thing right here, like the exact thing. And certainly the same spiritual force behind it. No question about that. The thing I like about this is I'm going to I'm going to spoil the next 30 seconds

of the scene but that's fine because you'll see it in 30 seconds everyone and everybody should I think probably watch this already anyway but Judas walks in there with power projection right right off the bat I'm not like you I'm not like you I'm not really betraying him I'm just testing him a little bit but most likely it's going to be fine.

And if not, then at least I'll, you know, have taken my bag. I'll have pumped my bag and literally pumped his bag. He's been stealing from the ministry since they put him in charge of money. But he has, he comes, he walks into that room. Now, one, very ballsy. This is the high priest. And yeah, he can't really like order him to, you know, face death unilaterally. But also, he probably could.

and get away with it, right? Because of who he is and how much power Caiaphas has. Judas comes in there thinking he has power projection. He's almost still, you know, kind of using the name of the Lord for his own purposes. Because he say, I believe he's most likely the Messiah. And, you know, he's going to usher in the messianic age and all of these things. And we're just going to test him. By the end of this conversation, Judas realizes very clearly that he has no power.

He has, his power projection was all false. It was, it was based on what he believed the, the calculus was. And I love the part where he's like, final walk. And Caiaphas is like, you know, we have, we have guards that can get this out of your head now that you've told us that you have it. And I'm willing to give you 30 pieces of silver right now. you could just get tortured for it. And Judas realizes that he is way out of his depth. He is so outside where his experience and skill has brought him.

And he's not in, you know, he doesn't have the power projection of Jesus because he's in the process of betraying Jesus. And that's what Kuyves calls him out directly. You believe he's most likely the Messiah. So why are you doing this? well, what if he's not? Okay, you're, who are you? Why are you here? Like, what, what can you offer me?

Oh, you know where his location is? Cool, I'll give you 30 pieces of silver. Oh, that's not enough. Okay, you get nothing and I'll torture you, right? Like, he has no, he has, he, Caiaphas has a similar demeanor and, you know, kind of, um,

like the way that the, the actor is playing it as, um, quintus. That kind of like, we'll have a, let's have a, you know, kind of good, like what sounds like good natured banter while there is also this underlying threat that don't you dare forget what the power dynamic is here. Oh, very much. Yeah, that's a great callback. Yeah, it's like the carrot mistake. It's like, here, I'll give you all the carrots you want. The minute you spit the carrot out, I'm just going to

be hit the stiff in. Yeah. And by the way, when Judas says, I haven't seen enough, I think that's a direct reference to he hasn't had the ego death. He hasn't seen enough. He hasn't had the ego death. Died his self, yeah. He's still the main character as far as he's concerned. And yeah, it's really well said, yeah. Yep.

I do not appreciate being spoken to in such a manner, young man. Well, if you change your mind about needing his whereabouts, just let me know. Sit down. We are not finished. You need information, and I'm the only one capable and willing to give it to you. All we have to agree on is a price. 20 pieces of silver. Don't insult me.

40. 25. 38. 30 pieces of silver. Final offer. Equivalent of four-month wages. That is the price of a slave. And I will not live like one while I'm looking for a new.

job. 35. 30 pieces of silver. It is my final offer and a slave is about what Jesus is worth to me now. You have no leverage, Judas. I'm your only buyer. And I'm your only seller. The Temple Guard have sophisticated methods of extracting information if you'd like. Or you can just take the money. I have one condition. I'm listening. I will provide an opportunity for you to arrest him only in the absence of a crowd. He is more powerful than you, and you know it. The people will riot.

If we do this stealthily, we can avoid an uprising, retribution from Rome, and the ruined Passover holiday. I thought you said if he's arrested, he'll use his divine powers to strike down his emphasis. would be the best Passover of all, wouldn't it? If he is who he says he is, if he's not, 30 pieces of silver will be of no use to me when pilot brutalizes us for disturbing the peace and inciting a revolt. A condition as well.

You have 24 hours to deliver him over to us. Time is of the essence. Deal. 24 hours. You're a number. You're your only son. I'm sorry? You're an only son of an only son and he's passed away.

I was given all your information, Judas. You're the last of the Ascarians. Yes? Unless you survive all this and have a son, this could be your best chance for your family name to be remembered. Don't look so down, Trotten. This is an opportunity. deliver on your promise.

You pause up for a second. So if the, but if when an ox gores a man or woman to death, the ox shall be stone and its flesh shall not be eaten, but the owner of the ox shall not be liable. But if the

ox has been accustomed to gore in the past and its owner has been warned but has not kept it in and it kills a man or woman, the ox shall be stone and its owner shall also be put to death. If a ransom is imposed on him, then he shall give for the redemption of his life, whatever is imposed on him. If it gores a man's son or daughter, he shall be dealt with according to the same rule.

If the ox gores a slave, male or female, the owner shall give to their master 30 shekels of silver and the ox shall be stoned. That is Exodus 2132 with the part of 30 shekels. That whole section starts in verse 28. Gotcha. Interesting. Yeah. So the part of the end about fame. It's like this is the last opportunity for your, you know, for your family to be famous,

for you to be famous for you to have a, have a, I mean, it's like that's the, that's the, the priority. That's the currency, right? Yeah. And that comes back around in a future episode. Well, I mean, it also comes back around like the name Judas is Scariot. like ringing through the ages of life. Yeah, yeah.

I just mean them hammering that home with his sister. I know it's been a while since you've watched this, but when June is reunited with his sister, it comes back around. Yeah, the flash back with this sister. Yes, you're right, you're right. Yep, yep, I forgot about that. That's a good call.

Yeah, it's really well done, very dark, right? You get the vibe, good use of sound. Again, Caiaphas, the actor playing Caiaphas, I think, just nails it. So good. Yeah, he is like you get, you get all the involuntary responses. He makes your skin crawl, but then you, it's like you like how much you dislike him. Like Quintas. Yeah.

Yeah. Quintus at least is like a little charming. I don't find, I don't find Caiaphas charming at all. Well, he's, he does, Quintas is lower in the pecking order, right? in the pecking order of the Jewish high pre the the the hierarchy of this system. Yeah. Caiaphas is the top. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. It's like, yeah. Yeah. Quintus was just governing a, you know, Copernum. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He was the savage with a very similar personality type. It's Caiaphas.

But Caius doesn't have to be charming. He doesn't have to be charming to anyone. Yeah. He's not even charming to pilot. which I know that's another scene that I feel like is sort of useless like Piaphas is what I almost said. Pilot and Caiaphas have an argument and is like, well, our alliance is going to be over if this goes one way or the other.

And it's kind of like, why was the scene even here? Yeah, but I do think the scene is useful because it does, it does present like from my upbringing in the church where Pilot is blamed. for Jesus' death. It does like throw... Oh, interesting. I was always taught he washed his hands of it. Well, yes.

Yes, he washes his hands of it. But it's like, it's always... The Sanhedrian is just not even taught. Like, in the Protestant... Kind of neutral. And it's kind of... Like, I didn't even know the Sanhedrine was when I was a kid. I was like, wait, what?

The Samhedo... You probably knew Pharisees, right? You probably heard the word... Yeah, I mean, I think I had heard the term Pharisees, but I did not understand the dynamic. between the Pharisees and the followers of Christ. Same. But also the,

the, I feel like what I, like my childhood feelings about the Pharisees is that they just didn't get it. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like they were the holy people, they just missed it. And, you know, I told you that book I read, that the one that treats Israel as God's wife.

Israel, my beloved, is the name of the book. It's written by K.R. It's a novel and it's it's really well done. It's, you know, goes through the history. I think you should read it. I think you would actually have a lot to say about it. But in it, when Jesus comes, because it tells the story of like the creation of Israel to the second coming of Christ, right to the end is the timeline of the story. So the part of like the time, the historical time when Jesus walked the earth is a part of the plot.

But the way that that book, which is a kind of Christian Zionist. framing treats it is that Israel doesn't even know Jesus is there. So like this is telling you the, Israel is a character in the book. Her name is Sarah. But she doesn't interact with Jesus at all. She doesn't, she she doesn't recognize him, not just recognize him for who he is. She's kind of mad that he's creating like the stories of him creating disruption and whatnot. But he's barely a blip in the story. And then what, you know, really raged me out about it having read it a second time with, you know, opened eyes is that in the end when Israel goes back to her husband and is reconciled to her husband he's almost like irrelevant in the way that it's written and it's just like that's that's that's

heretical yeah well and and uh yeah so like when pilot anyway sorry just to finish that point that's that's how i was brought up to think about it was that they were they just didn't get it right they weren't special enough to get it they'll get it later i wasn't even brought i wasn't even brought i wasn't even brought up to understand that they were characters. Like, I wasn't even brought up to understand that that was a thing. I was just brought up to understand that there was Jesus, his followers, the crowd, and then

the Romans. And then the Romans were just, oh, like, like, savages. Like, oh, absolute savages. They just had to have Jesus. They just had to kill him. And the reality is, is like, pilot comes storming in and he's like, what are you planning a do on Jesus? You better not harm

one hair on his head. Now, he's not doing that because he loves Jesus. He's doing that because he knows that he knows that that's going to incite a riot and when that happens it's going to be his head from from caesar so he's doing it from a point of self-interest but it's it very clearly i think lays out like the incentives here where pilot does not care about jesus whatsoever like if jesus wants to run around with a crown on his head and say i'm the king of the jews or whatever he doesn't care he's like whatever you're god you're king whatever none of that matters because you actually Yeah, because you don't have any power of rejection As long as you don't start a riot And you're telling people to pay their taxes, we're cool. But his wife, right?

And we're told in the scripture, the only time is like one verse, right? His wife said don't have anything to do with that man with that innocent man because of my dream, right? And then he washes his hands of the matter. So I think there was there was something, and I'm not saying in the way, the show the way the show is portraying it you're right he's more concerned about his wife than

anything having you know having to do with who jesus is but there is this concern and atticus shares this as well right that there's going to be a riot there's going to be something and then they're all rome is savage right and the um you know the you do get punished right quintus um you do get punished if you uh if you you you know are are the seen as having failed rome and so there There would be that tension and fear, I think. But it's not his calculus. He's not looking for a savior. He's not looking for a Messiah.

He doesn't understand the, you know, the whole shellfish scene. Remember that? Yeah. I just distinctly as a kid, remember figuring that out for myself, like figuring it out for myself that the Romans that, like, Pilate was washing his hands and walking away. Like, that wasn't explicitly explained to me. It was in the scripture.

It was in like the things that we were, like, we were reading. like we were like reciting as a group but that was never like explained to me like nobody went out of their way to be like oh yeah the romans like didn't actually like they weren't out to get jesus they were just the mechanism that were used to take care of him and it's really like actually quite infuriating that that like the protestant church completely omits the sanhedron and just erases the pharisees from the teachings to children because it as soon as i understood So what that was, like the story is completely clicked. And I was like, oh, now I get it.

It's like, it's a corrupt government. It's a corrupt like power structure on earth made by humans. And that's what Jesus was standing up to. It's like that as soon as you get that, it's like the story just makes perfect sense. But for reasons that are now very obvious politically, the Protestant church, their incentive structure, is to not have that at the forefront of education when it comes to children. all right so let's play this atticus scene with kathony and then we'll get out of here yeah i think just just on that last point it's also um it shows how you're like now we're dealing with and you

and i have talked about this before like the international holocaust remembrance alliance is in their stated information it's basically you know the the the sharing of the totality of the gospel story is anti-semitic anti-semitic yeah you can't but but you don't actually have to make such bold declarations. You just need to dilute it in how you're teaching it, talking about it, and forming belief around it. If you have enough time, right, which they certainly did. Yeah. You have no right to hold me here without explanation. What crimes have I committed? I have the right to speak to my legal representative. My friend, those rights are granted to citizens of the Roman Empire, of which you decidedly are not. Who are you?

the one asking the questions. You arrived from the North three days ago, bringing with you a small militia of malcontents. You have since grown in numbers, amassed weapons, sharpened resentments, and convened a veritable serpent's den of aggressors who will remind me of zealots but lack sophistication and training.

The zealots, you know, they're a pain. But they have a precision and a clarity of purpose that makes them in some ways predictable. They at least know what they're doing, and therefore so do we. But you are not precise. You are reckless and messy and disorganized. It was all too easy to find you out, to get in here and put you in that chair. So it's my understanding. The Jews have made pilgrimage to this city.

city to observe a solemn holiday of remembrance. Hmm? I might be getting that wrong. From what I can tell, there's only one person acting up around here this week, someone about whom so many people have such intense feelings and opinions, both good and bad. Still true. He's the only figure at the moment toward whom a man like you could stir up so much animosity.

Tell me something, Kofny. I, you. Everybody's got an opinion about Jesus. So what about yours led to all this? You're not a holy man. Acus be praised. You own land and wine country. He killed my daughter.

If Jesus the Nazarene had committed murder, believe me, I'd know about it. How? You're not God. God out of this. Honestly, I find the topic exhausting. That's a reference to the fact that he's like the secular omniscient

character in this in this story. More do you want to know? Instead of John Brennan. All right. Yeah. I'll bite. Fine. How do you kill your daughter? He seduced her. He really doesn't strike me as the romantic type. Not romantically.

Spiritually. For the God's sake, what did I just say about God? He performed. a magic trick at a wedding that made her so grateful and odd and entranced that she became more loyal to him than me. Hades and Sticks. That's the pettiest thing I've ever heard. She left a promising career as a wine vittner to join his pathetic roving band, wayfaring around the upper Galilee, with being crowds into frenzies over his teachings and sorceries, until a little Until one of those crowds

devolved into a stampede and she was run through with a sword by whom. The Roman preacher of Copernum. So see, he now realizes who she is. He knows what we're talking about, yeah. Yeah, he knows exactly who his daughter is now. Yeah, he knew Quintas.

Yeah. Uh-huh. And remember, he, like, I mean, like he knew who Ramah was because of Quintz doing that. So it's like, yeah, he understands this. So Roman Preter killed your daughter, not Jesus. You are dissembling, Kofny.

She would never have been near Kapornamur, anything resembling that situation, if not for him. And he has not been held accountable. She had free will, didn't she? No one was forcing her to travel around with his Jesus, were they? One of Jesus' other followers, a former employee of mine. He giled her with his youthful charm and lured her into the notion of marriage without my consent. I thought it didn't work that way with you people. There are loopholes.

The law is complicated. Did your daughter ever say anything to you about avenging her death if something were to happen to? It's what any father would do. Why haven't you attempted vengeance against the Roman Preter? He was fired and sent away. And for all I know. Why are you looking at me like that? Well, I don't know.

Seems like you're under the impression that you could have done something more to prevent this. To protect your daughter, to save her. And instead of facing your guilt like a man, or dealing with your grief, brief, you've decided to look for someone to blame. You don't know me. You don't know what's in my heart. You can't get directly to the preter who did the deed, so now you've moved on to, frankly, an easy target. He's not an easy target.

Let's find out. What? I don't have any children. But the way you've decided to make your daughter's untimely death all about yourself repulsus me. However, you're murderous. commitment to alleviating your guilty conscience may prove useful to my purposes. What purposes? I have a proposal for you, Kofny. Instead of arresting you for unlawful assembly, possession of illegal weapons, incitement to violence, conspiracy to

commit murder, and possibly insurrection, to name only a few, I will supply you with information regarding Jesus' whereabouts. What has he done to you? Pay attention, please. The only thing that's required to keep you out of jail or worse is that you continue to spread your venom to anyone who listen. Let me explain this to you in a way you might understand. Keep doing what you're doing.

Try to turn the tide of public opinion against Jesus. And quid pro quo. Right. change. I'll keep holes out of your hands and feet. Holes. We're finished here. So what now? Now we wait for what?

For the light of day. All right. We're at two hours now, so we won't watch anymore, but we will save the scene between Atticus and Z. Because that's a fantastic scene. and brilliant writing by the showrunners because they take the zealot whose name you never learned who were sent to kill Z

and then witnesses Jesus and then basically I don't know if he has a conversion of the heart but he sees enough to understand why Z left and basically like pities him and then says

okay Simon Simon, whatever, is Zebulus, is dead and leaves. And then we find out that that's Brabis, who's an extremely, extremely important character in all of this. That, like, I had completely forgotten that. Either I either completely forgot that, or I missed it the first time I saw it, that, like, where they showed him walking and you heard the, like, Brabass. Like you heard Z say it

And it's like, oh, that's Barabbas. So anyway, that's brilliant writing. Yeah, and certainly going to be a bigger, bigger featured character in the next season of the show that comes out in the middle of November. But we do seal him a little bit more in the next episode as well.

And so we can start off next week, or the next episode of the show, we can start off with the barrage. Rob us Simon Z. Atticus storyline and pick it up there. Yeah, I mean, fantastic. I think there's always stuff to quibble about. And, you know, I love debating this stuff with you and, you know, kind of drawing on how it relates to now.

A lot of people won't even go there. And, you know, you and I are perfectly prepared to be called all sorts of names for the conversations that we have. So, you know, it is what it is. It's the most important story ever written for a reason. And biblical allegory is the most common form of literary analysis for a reason. Because the lessons that you draw from it, just like the lessons that Jesus would teach lessons with parables and stories, it's the same thing. You draw lessons from it and then you apply those lessons to your real life to learn from it and improve yourself.

Yeah. Yeah. And you have a lot of fun doing it. Yes. So, you know, because we had that whole technical thing, we've already done all of our ads. So everybody, please just hit the like button for us. Share the show if you get a chance to and drop into the comments and or into the chat, the live chat on Rumble and say what's up. That's a unique, there's a unique chatters metric that helps us out quite a bit along with the likes. Those are great ways to support us.

If you do want to support the show, you can send a Badlands Boost. In fact, I'm going to look and see because I think there might have been one from last week. Badlands Boost is like an online message board that allows us to see your message. Your message stays up and we will read it before the, we'll read it during the next show. Season 4, recent one. that one. Did we read Thomas Times testimony yet? Thomas Times testimony.

I don't, I think we did. It's pretty long. Did we? I think we might have at the end of the last. Yes. Yes, yes, yes, yes, we did. We did read it. We read it was great.

Yeah, the phone call. The phone call, because we said that that was that alone made doing the whole series worth it. Yeah, and I stand by it. Yeah, for sure. we we certainly do appreciate you guys uh i think that's it there are there are no new boost so we have read them all but that's a great way to support us if you like the show and you wanted to keep going at badlandsmedia dot tv slash boost make sure you get your garc tickets if you don't have a virtual ticket yet we are doing our one and only big bang gart live stream exclusive with

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Everybody have an absolutely fantastic week. Ghost, we're going to miss you. I really still hope you show up. Yeah. I am literally holding my breath. I'm not literally holding my back. Yeah, but all right. And, you know, as I said, we may or may not have a show next week.

So check the schedule when it comes out. I think the schedule will come out in Monday's brief. And we should know by then whether or not we're going to be able to find the time to record. If not, then you'll have the final two episodes after Gart Week. Either way, we have plenty of time before the new season starts. So, with that, everybody, God bless. Have a great week. And we'll see you next time.

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