Bandsplain - One Album Wonder: Box Car Racer with Anna Zanes

Episode Date: November 16, 2023

Box Car Racer is a weird and wild look into the mind of Tom DeLonge. At the height of Blink 182’s success, Tom and Travis set out to make a harder record, a side project. Things are not always what they seem on this album. Songs that are seemingly breakup songs turn out to be about national tragedy. Tom DeLonge’s songwriting is deceptively simple, obfuscating a more complex playing style. The band’s existence and how it was communicated to the public seemingly put too much strain on Blink 182, and it went away before it truly got going. Alternative Press’s editor in chief Anna Zanes joins Yasi to connect the dots on the one Box Car Racer album we did get. Follow Anna on Instagram @annazanes Listen to songs we detail in the episode HERE Host: Yasi Salek Guest: Anna Zanes Producer: Jesse Miller-Gordon Audio Editor: Adrian Bridges Additional Production Supervision: Justin Sayles Theme Song: Bethany Cosentino Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What would you do if you got scammed? Would you suffer in silence, or would you do something about it? Well, I got scammed once, and this is the story of what I did. I'm Justin Sales, the host of the Wedding Scammer, a true crime podcast from The Ringer. And for seven episodes, we're hunting a comment. A guy with a lot of aliases, a guy who's ruined a lot of weddings. And with the help of some friends, I just might be able to catch him. Listen to The Wedding Scammer on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.

What's with this band anyway? I don't get it. Can you please explain? Wait, like, Bansplain? Hello and welcome to Bandsplaine. I am your host, Yossi Salick. This is a show where I invite an expert guest on to help me explain a cult band or iconic artist. Today's episode is about Box Car Racer. If you've never heard Box Car Racer before, I wish you were brave.

I wish you were stronger. I wish I was brave. I wish I was stronger. Wish I could feel no pain. You guys are a guest today is the editor-in-chief of Alternative Press Magazine, Anna Zanes. Welcome to the show, Anna. Thank you. Happy to be here. Why, when we talked about this, why did you want to do box car racer?

I am kind of regretting it. Why? No, it's so good. I'm so happy. But I was, as honestly, a huge compliment, I was absolutely thrown. for a loop. I was like, oh, she's going to say like any number of bands. And you were like, you know what I want to do is box car racer? I was like, let's fucking go. Yeah. I mean, I feel like a lot of us, some of us have always been in the blink first and a lot of us are diving back in

full force right now. I know what my job. We all are, whether we want to or not. And I actually, like I always have been sometimes a bigger fan of the side projects. I love plus 44. Transplants are incredible. So good. Boxcar racer has a special place in my heart. It's definitely the most emo

of all. Sure is. Maybe not in like the genre sense, but definitely in the whiny, sad boy way. And I love a whiny sad boy. Me too. I mean, we talked about this off mic, but But obviously, I was down as hell because Blink 1 & A2 being my first favorite band that was existing at the time really felt like my thing.

And even though, admittedly, I sort of stopped keeping close tabs on the band before self-titled. I definitely had this album. I had the Box Car Racer album. I fucking loved it. I was working at a record store at the time, I'm pretty sure. and I would listen to it all the time. And that was before I kind of fell off on my fandom. So I was really excited to do this.

And also, when we did the Blink 182 episode of Bandsplain, it was like in that middle ground before I became like absolutely fucking unhinged and like needed to like read and research every single thing. And I'm kind of sad about it because there's like so much stuff I is that's not in there that I almost want to go back and redo the Blink 182 episode. But short of doing that, this was like a good. opportunity for me to like sort of you know get back in the weeds of some of the like very arcane info about this band i mean i think tom delong too is such a complex person there's i could talk about

tom to long for i probably like a sick amount of time such a layered person i mean and we should mention you're like a smooth full decade plus younger than me so like if we're going to be honest if we're going to be technical. It's about 12 years. So you probably, I mean, how old were you when this album came out? You would have been... This is second grade. Yeah. My house was 20. Not me 20 years old at the fucking keg party being like put on boxcar racer and Jimmy a world bitch. Let's go. I always had been a very sad, weird kid though. Yeah, you were precocious. I get it. It definitely hit. I understand. I understand. You were eight years old and you were like, I feel so. Dot, dot, dot.

Thomas Matthew DeLong, born December 13th, 1975, a Sagittarius. I think to no one's surprise. If I gunned to my head and I had to guess what a sign was, I would have said Aquarius or Sagittarius because absolutely this man marches to the beat of his own drum. I think if he hadn't been right about aliens, he would have been an Aquarius. Oh, I see. You think Aquarius's are more insane. I think the conspiratorial, like, I mean, he,

He's got a lot of that, but he was right. He was right, babe. I mean, he was vindicated. Well, I mean, the long arc of history will show that Tom DeLong singing about aliens, like in between songs about masturbation and calling dudes gay or whatever, would be proven right about aliens. I did not have that on my bingo card. I don't think any of us did. I don't think any of us did. He was the son of a mortgage broker and an oil company executive.

I had a brother and a sister. His first musical instrument was the trumpet. So I'm just saying it could have gone real ska, but somehow that he's not the one in the band that had this checkered ska passed. But he did play this trumpet. And apparently his mom, they bought it for him for Christmas. He was like 11.

And they were like, listen, when you get really good, you can wake us up with a reveal. I don't know anything about music. It's insane that I have this job. And I guess that one day at 5 a.m. on a Saturday, he woke his parents up with this trumpet song. And they were like, okay. Gorgeous. Switch to guitar. Producer Jesse says it's a revela. I never purported that I could pronounce things. He first got into guitar from a friend at church camp. And around sixth grade, he got his first guitar. He got his first guitar. is a Christmas present, not from his parents. How cute is this?

From two of his friends. I love that. They pitched in and bought him a $30 acoustic guitar. He got into punk and Dinocer Jr. in the seventh grade. He was very obsessed of the descendants. Got kicked out of high school for going to a basketball game drunk. And this is important because he had to go to another high school for a semester,

which is where he met Ann Hoppice. Right. And also Scott Rayner, because they both played in the high school battle of the bands. and Mark was living in, I don't know, San Francisco or something up north with his dad because his parents were divorced. And he moved back to Sandy year after high school. And Anne was like, hey, you would like my brother.

He plays the bass guitar. The three of them formed Blink 182. Magic happened. We're not going to, again, I'm going to just do a quick TLDR on Blake 182. We don't really have time. But listen, they got together. Magic happened. They started writing songs.

One of the first songs they ever wrote was Carousel to date, probably my favorite Blink 282 song. They had you just another, I guess it's just another night alone. They had many names, duct tape and figure eight being two of them. Not good names. Tom then was like, we should be called Blink. They made a demo called Flyswatter in May of 93. Mark worked for a record store.

His boss gave them money. They made their first album Buddha. Then the cool local label cargo records was like, we'll sign you. and that guy O, may he rest in peace, who was the guitarist for the local band Fluff and also went on to be an iconic producer of punk albums. They made this real first album, Cheshire Cat, in my humble opinion, the best in Quentinage album. Yes. In my controversial opinion that no one agrees with, except for you, which is why we're friends. That came out February 1995.

M&M's got played on the local alt-rock radio station 91X. Here's a fun aside about me. My song, you know, like my song with my first boyfriend, my high school boyfriend, was Eminems. That was like our song. That's cute. It's pretty cute. We would write each other notes and would have like the lyrics in it. Also my high school senior quote is from Carousel.

You truly grew up a Southern California life. Literally my culture is not your costume. Like I couldn't be more of a real one. Like school life, it was a woken dream. That bitch is right in my senior page in my fucking high school yearbook. Okay, don't ever say I wasn't really fucking with the fucking program over here. So anyways, everything is going great. They're getting pick up.

Then an Irish techno band, which is also called Blink, sues them because they're like, no war blink. And they're like, okay, they changed their name to Blink 182. I used to have the Cheshire cat that just said blink on it. And it's lost to time and I'm really sad about it. I thought you were going to say that you used to have the Irish techno bands album. I used to have the Irish. That was a different song with a different boyfriend.

Different boy without actually it's really weird because I had these two different different boyfriends. I was really testing out the waters of different kinds of guys in high school. I would date an Irish techno dude. Are you kidding? That sounds so hot. I would too. In the 90s.

Yeah. Like he's absolutely wearing like, you know, Kappa, like a Kappa, like a Kappa track. suit. So hot. Okay, anyways, that's, we've wandered off the beaten path here. They're getting buzz, babe. By March of 1996, when I'm 14 years old, and by the way, I'm going to see them play in little clubs all around the South Bay and Orange County areas, because once again, a real one. And they get, and there's like a bidding war, big labels, they get signed by MCA, they put out Dude Ranch in 97, it goes gold, dammit is a big hit. Now, they go on this tour, right? This is where it's a little important.

I go on this tour with the aquabats. My favorite band. See, why didn't you say you wanted to do the aquabats? I mean, I'm kind of glad you didn't because that's a more extensive catalog. Their lineup changed every single year of that band, I think, which if you ever want me to come on for a part, we can do aquabats. But they're so smart because you would never be able to tell because they wore the what suits and the masks.

So it's like, who knows who is in that band? Nobody knows. but who was in that band was Travis Barker. So they're on this tour. Now let me get into Travis Barker real quick. Born November 14th, 1975. Once again, to nobody's fucking surprise on God's good earth, this man is a Scorpio. Is there a bigger Scorpio on the planet?

I do not think so. He's born in Fontana, California. When he was four, his mom gave him his first drum kit, played on that bad boy until he was 15. He also took trumpet lessons and was in the junior high choir. and was really into church. And I guess, very sad, his mom got diagnosed with something called Skorgon syndrome, which is like an autoimmune disease in the summer between, like, junior high and high school. And she died the day before he started high school.

And that was like a super formative thing to him. And he said in his book, which is called Can I Say, one of the last things mom said to me was no matter what, play the drums. Keep doing it. No matter what anyone else says, don't stop playing the drums, Travis. follow your dreams. Hmm. Isn't that so moving? I like kind of cried when I read that.

I was a, I found it very moving. And he did. He played the shit out of those drums. He became, you know, arguably one of the best drummers in the world. Anyways, he finishes high school. He's playing in the jazz ensemble, in the marching band. He graduates. He's working as a trash man in Laguna Beach.

He's playing in punk rock bands. They're called snot and feeble. Feble, he meets Chad Larson. Larson goes on to co-found the Aquabats in 94. The Aquabats were very popular. I, too, was an Aquabats fan. I used to go see them play, again, around the South Bay and Orange County area. Sometimes in Hollywood, babe, if there was an all-ages show.

They were cool. Scott was cool, you guys. I don't think people remember that. It was very cool. I was also a vooded glow skulls girl. Yeah. I mean, I think something else that was super formative about Travis was not only his mom's fasting, but his dad was very military from having been in the military.

And he has such, I mean, you could just tell the way he does everything. It's like so rigorous, so diligent. Totally. And he's talked about that too. I mean, that's why he left home wouldn't be a trash man. While he was in the aquabats off tour, he was still doing it. Well, I don't think he was making a whole ton of money on the aquabats at that time. But you're so right.

I mean, he's the classic example of like the 10,000 hours, right? Like, he would just drum all day. And apparently still does. I think he's just like the most devoted to his craft and like wants to be the best. And like you're so right. That is like such a product of having that sort of militaristic father. His book is great. It is.

There's a lot of things that really stuck in my mind. But it's really neither here nor there. So no doubt and sublime have blown up. People are checking for ska. Okay. So the Aquabats signed a golden voice. That's when they recruit Travis to play drums for their second. album. He's 19. The Alcobats are very Mormon. Do you remember this?

I don't, I don't know too much about that part of things, but it makes a lot of sense. Yeah, they were a Mormon band, except for Travis, obviously. And they wouldn't even, like, they didn't drink. They didn't do drugs. They didn't even drink caffeine. Like, they were like super practicing Mormons. Here's the other dude who founded the Alcabats, Christian Jacobs, who went under the name, the bat commander's, the one that gave Travis Barker's name, the Baron Vontito, which I did not realize was a variation. on the Red Baron. Oh, interesting. Yeah, the famous World War I German pilot, as Travis described in his book, that Snoopy used to fight in Peanuts, which is true, but also he was a real

person named Manfred von Richthoven. And anyways, Travis Barker has been afraid of flying and thinking that he's going to die in a plane crash since he was very young. And he was like, with my heavy visions of dying in a plane crash, I was tripping. Was this dude really naming me after an airline pilot? That name haunted me from day one. This is kind of insane, actually. Yeah, there's been a lot of that. There was one, I know Travis has talked about this one time that he, like, he blacked out and he told someone that he was afraid he was going to die in a plane crash. I think it's in the book, too. Anyways, I just also need to point out that Aquabats did tour with an early version of Maroon 5, which was then called Kara's Flowers. And I, too, saw that, or I saw that early version of Maroon 5, Kara's Flowers. They played at a, festival at UC Riverside called Waze Goose Fest. They were the second headliner, but the big

headliner was tone loke. Wow. What a time. It was a crazy time. And I remember it. It was on 420. And me and my friends were like, this is one like you first really get into weed when you're in college. And like your whole personality is smoking weed. You're like, oh, it's so cool. It's 420. We're going to get so high, you guys. So we're like super stone. And there was like a crowd around Adam Levine of girls. And like we're just like so stone. This is like probably 2002, maybe one. or two. And my friend Sarah Jeffries marches to the front of the crowd and goes, excuse me, who the fuck are you to Adam Levine? It was, and I thought it was the funniest thing I've ever heard of my life. I like stand by that. One year later, they're like the biggest band in the world.

Sorry, we've digressed the aquabats a little too much. But like, how could I not take that opportunity? They deserve a lot of time. They did great too also. I mean, the guy's dream was always to have like a children's TV show and he did that, yo Gabba Gabba. And they're doing very well. And, you know, Travis wore the wetsuits. Again, one of the harrowing details was about how bad those wetsuits smelled on tour. And there's a lot of that in the book where I was like, I can like, I don't like, I don't like, I don't want to think about how bad these guys' wetsuits smelled. Something about Travis, though, is he's like super humble. He's like, almost annoyingly so.

Yeah, to it. Like, he's like super grateful about it. And, you know, I mean, it was a great, like, it was a great band. It was a great band. And he's, but there's not that much. He's like, I didn't know they had costumes. I showed up. They gave me a costume.

I put it on. He was like, okay, sure. I'll put on that. I can't see Mark or Tom just putting on the wetsuit. A hundred percent, no. Also, there was one funny detail about like what I ate you when he finally joins where he's like, I was worried that I wouldn't live close enough to them for practice, but guess what? They never practiced.

So it wasn't an issue. They literally never practiced. And I was like, hell yeah. Okay. So anyways, now they're on this tour. Scott Rainer has to go home for undisclosed reasons. I think in the book they said it was because his girlfriend. friend was mad at him or something.

I think he also had some substance abuse issues allegedly. I don't know the details. But he leaves like the day of a show and they're like, we really need you to play. Can you play with us? And he learned 20 songs in like 35 minutes backstage. Yeah. I've heard that one. And he's, he like, it was just Tom playing guitar.

And he's learned them. What a fucking absolute legend. I mean, in fairness, this is early. Blinkney to and like all of Cheshirecat is probably like also 30 minutes long. You know, so but yeah. And I guess after he did that, then he was still wasn't in the band, but they were like bonding. They were really, you know, skateboarding punk. Here's what Tom said. The first time I met Travis, he was playing drums with the aquabats. He was wearing goggles and rash guards. I think he was dressed up like a fish. I might have said hi in passing. I didn't really

meet him until our drummer had a domestic issue and had to go back home. The worst thing was that it ended up being a non-issue. His girlfriend couldn't handle. that he was on tour. So she made up some big story that was a lie. Although that wasn't why we parted ways with that drummer. That's what started it. When we play with Travis for the first time, Mark and I were looking at each other out of the corners of our eyes.

The band sounds a lot better. We couldn't believe it. So shortly after he joins full time. I really love the Scott Raynor albums. I think it's totally a different sound. Travis is, he's like a freak of nature. No, Travis is by and far as superior drummer to Scott Rainer. I just love those albums.

I just don't understand how that man is still alive. Like the way he drums is not conducive to someone still having intact limbs. I know. Honestly, I really wish they would go re-record Cheshire Cat, like Travis's version, you know, like Taylor's version. Like that's like really my dream. Can you guys do that? I'll say it before. I've said it before and I'll say it again.

Please play some of these songs on the tour. You're being disrespectful to me. Yeah. me personally and also the fans that had Eminems as their song with their high school boyfriend and who paid good money $12 to $15 to see you guys play in the club in Huntington Beach. Do you know what I mean? Like stop disrespecting us. There's a lot of throwback stuff going on. It could happen.

Please. Please. Okay. So he joins the band full time. It's elevated. They put out Enma of the State in June of 1999. breakthrough. Massive. They're stars. What's my age again? All the small things. Adam's song. It's over. They're all over. I'm TV. Anyways, in 2001, they put out, take off your pants and jacket. That becomes their first number one album. Now, it's during the recording of this album that apparently Tom felt like he wanted to do something a little heavier. You know, he was a little frustrated. Travis had been teaching Tom about new kinds of music.

They would jam every day And he was like This is post-hardcore music Tom sit down I want to tell you about post-hardcore music So he played in Fugazi, Quicksand, Rocket from the Crypt According to Travis It inspired Tom to explore a whole new style of music

I loved how far he had come from a few years Before when he told me that metal sucked He was embracing this music so much He wanted to write songs inspired by it This plants the seeds of box car racer. I guess Tom comes back and he had some like sick riffs

based on his new found appreciation for post-hardcore. Travis was like, oh, should we use these for the next blink album? Tom was like, I'm thinking maybe it's not the blink album that we could do a side thing. Travis Barker was like,

I honestly thought that Tom had already had a conversation with Mark Hopis about this. They were so tight, inseparable. I couldn't imagine Mark didn't know. Spoiler alert, Mark did not know. There's a lot of different versions of that story out there, too. There's versions where they just, or Travis was just brought in because they needed a studio drummer and he wasn't part of the project too.

Yeah. I mean, that's, I think that's what Tom said most of the time. So it seems like, it does seem like that's probably kind of true, but then this part of the book disputes that. I don't know. Well, we do know for a fact is no one told Mark. And we'll get to when Mark finds out, but it's not. yet. So what happens is, well, 9-11 happens, actually. I know that sounds insane, but 9-11 happens and they have to cancel a European tour and then they reschedule those dates to early 2002,

but those also get canceled because Tom has really bad back problems. He was on a bunch of painkillers, I guess. And so they have free time, right? The time has opened up. And Tom's like, well, why don't we, why don't I work on this little project? Here are the, other names that there was supposed to be, the kill. And apparently the record was initially titled Et 2 Brute. Yeah. Which is kind of insane

given what a feud it caused between Mark and Tom. Like at like Brutte, you know, like Brutus is the the guy who stabs Caesar, right? Yeah, at two Brutei. That was Caesar. You two, you two would, you two would go against me. Anyways, maybe I'm reading

a little too much into like, but I don't know. This man is conspiracy there is. He's super smart. I don't think there's any, I know. There's no like things going over his head. That's what I'm saying. But anyways, thank God they didn't call et tu-brote or call the band the kill. They end up picking the name box car racer because Travis Barker had had a band in high school called Box Car Racer with Alex Barreto and James Lopez when he lived in Riverside, I guess. No, Billy Meyer and Alex Barreto, sorry, were the two guys that were in box car, the original boxcar racer. And apparently also, did you know that that guy Alex Bredo, Travis tried to find him to be in the band?

And they couldn't find him. And they couldn't find him got MAA, but he also played in the chain of strength. Did you know that? The hardcore band. Amazing. The extended box car racer universe. This is very funny. Travis said, it's not like box car racer like a fast, speedy little car.

It was always meant to be three words. And it was just the name of something that means totally nothing. But Tom's political, so he'll tell you it was the bomb used on the Japanese people. This is from an MTV interview around the time. Tom said, I was writing these songs about the end of the world and all this crazy stuff. And then, you know, Revelations and the Bible speaks about the end of the world. And one day I was wondering, World War II was what Revelations spoke about. So I started looking it up, and the second bomb that was dropped on Japan was from a plane called Boxcar.

Actually, the plane was called Bock, like B-O-C-S-C-A-R, but it's commonly misspelled boxcar. Anyway, and it kind of really freaked me out. At that point, I didn't even want the name, but it was way too late. I blame Travis for that one. That, again, is the difference between Travis Barker and Tom DeLong. And also Tom DeLong and everyone. And everyone. Yeah, exactly, and everyone on God's Good Earth.

And that is also another example, I think, of him playing dumb and being very smart and very conspiratorial. Totally. He's like, I was just like, as we do one day, sitting around wondering if Revelations was about World War II, as we do. I mean, and I think that this album, like, kind of is the same theme, which is like, oh, it's just about a boy and a girl and, like, heartbreak, but it's actually not. It's about the government stuff like free masonry. This album is literally like 40% about 9-11. We'll get into it, but you're like, okay, I did not expect. Here's one little detail that I discovered that actually made me so sad over, like, what we could have had. Apparently, at first, Tom,

wanted this album to sound like violent femmes. I read that and it's that also made me feel, I mean, I'm trying to think about violent fems with Tom DeLong's voice. I mean, it kind of worked because honestly, the violent fems guy also has a similar kind of unique

slightly nasal voice. Yeah, I kind of love it. I don't know if Travis, like imagine a Travis Parker drum solo in a violent well it was supposed to be an acoustic record so I don't think Travis would have really been able to shine as much not that you can't

have drums on acoustic songs and there is an acoustic song on the box car racer record which does have great drums on it but like yeah it probably wouldn't have been like you know really Travis's cup of tea but I am still sobbing over what we could have had and Tom if you're listening if you

have any of those violent femmes-esque demos I would love to I'd love to hear them Okay, so they bring in David Kennedy, who was Tom's friend from San Diego, who had played in the straight-edge hardcore band over my dead body. Looped him in to play. And they here's, okay, we're going to talk about the album in a second, but they went on a tour before the album came out, right? They put out one single, I felt so. And this is how Mark finds out about Box Car Racer.

Yeah. was the tour. Travis said, I was talking with Mark one day and I mentioned that boxcar race were going on tour. And he was like, what? This is so terrible. Yeah. And also the rooms were just full of Blink fans expecting Blink to come out. And Tom and Travis came out and played music that nobody had heard yet. I mean, if you really think about it, it's such a cool thing to do in my opinion. Not to Mark. I think there was probably a version of this where you could have sat down with your best friend in your band. I've been like, hey, I want to do this other thing. So just, you know, I'm going to do. do it but doesn't mean anything about you know communication is key if you will but for whatever reason that did not happen but just you know wanting to like not just do the same thing over and over again and sort of indulge your other aspirations although like I'm so sorry and I I mean this with so much love and respect there's not that many songs on here that couldn't be able to play when a album. I'm sorry. Well, they, I've heard it called, like, Boxcacer is called blink in drop detuning.

In drop detuning. Yeah, exactly. And it's like, yes, but fuck yeah, bitch. Like, you, you heard fucking rights of spring and you lost your goddamn mind. You were like, Dag nasty, bitch, let's do this. Also, just formal invitation to Travis Barker. If you want to come on Bansplane to do Dagnasty, you're always welcome. I mean, I, like, as like a kind of, like, psycho blink fan do think that this, everything happens for a reason. And I think that this, and I think that this, needed to happen and this also opened doors for blink. I agree. Maybe they couldn't have done in that context because things were too stifled.

We would never have I miss you, babe. We would never have I miss you without this butterfly effect of box car racer. Yeah. So actually, I'm with you. This was God's plan. This is, I mean, and Tom also, for whatever reason, called this his art project, which kind of, I don't know. I mean, that takes a lot of liberties, but I think that it's.

It's also why it allowed them to, like, open new doors and experiment. Maybe he was, like, playing four-dimensional chess. Do you know what I mean? Like, all he really wanted in the end was to push blink sound in a different direction, but he couldn't do it explicitly. So it was like, here's the way I'm going to do it. I have a 10-step plan. I wouldn't put a pass-time.

I wouldn't put a past 10. I mean, his mind. I really wouldn't. His fucking mind. Okay. And it was a big tour, apparently. They toured with H-2-0 and they used. Remember they used?

That guy, I feel like I used to hang out with a bit. college, not being a used man. Bert McCracken. A friend of mine dated him. I love Bert McCracken. He's like a sweetheart. I don't remember anything about him except that my friend dated him and that I knew he was in a band called The Used that I didn't know anything about because by then I was sort of post post Blink 182 in my life. I had moved on to underground backpack hip hop. So as we do, as we're like, I'm sorry, I can't, I can't be checking for the new Blink 182 album because I'm listening to the living legends. So an atmosphere. So sorry to my kings. I did come back though. Okay. So they're doing this tour. Mark is a little bummed. I'm supposing. I don't know. This is fanfic. I think it's been

stated that he was. They've talked about it. explicitly. Well, it all plays into a lot, which we're going to get into in the end. But Tom does an interview where he, with MTV, where he says, Blink will never break up. Okay, again, spoiler alert. You guys blinked it break up twice. But that's okay. He said back and then it was not going to do. So now it's 2002, May 21st.

They even had Jerry Finn produce the album. I mean, it's like, it's like in every way a Blink won't eat you album. They didn't even get a different producer. It's also funny because when Tom is calling this his art project, which I think it is, he's also like, oh yeah, we're like we're going to self-produce. like we're going to put this out. We're not going to even be on a label. You know, it's going to be just super freeform and it's not going to mean anything. And then it comes out on MCA produced by Jerry Finn. And it's like, okay. That's like if you're all your friends were like, no, totally, Anna, we are doing

this thing. It's just, it's so different. It's just that it's all of us. And we were going to the same place that we always go to together. It's just that you're not going to be there. Is that okay? And that's pretty much, can you imagine how poor Mark felt? I mean, that ultimately, led to plus 44 later. Yeah. So again, God's plan. Which also was Jerry Finn. It's like, it's all just, you know, it's kind of incestuous. Not in a bad way.

I mean, it's why we got these great albums. Totally. Side note about Jerry Finn. May he rest in peace. He passed away. He was a protege of the great Rob Kovallo on this program. We Stand Rob Cavallo, who full circle moment discovered Kara's flowers, aka Maroon 5, and produced their albums. And also,

Jerry Finn had, at this point, produced Rancid's and out come the wolves. Penny Wise's third album about time. Some 41's All Killer, No Filler. And then, of course, the Blank Winni-2 albums. So he was already a certified legend. Yeah, he also kind of, he like cut his teeth or whatever on Dookie.

Yeah, because Rob Quavalo produced Dookie. Yes, he did the mixing. Yeah, he is a ledge. Let's talk quickly about the cover. I think can we agree with love in our hearts that this is not the world's best album cover. It's an interesting cover. It's definitely referencing that bomb. Yes. It's

sure. Dark in that way. But it's also the graffiti font is definitely giving famous stars and straps. Babe, it's giving 2002. It's the most 2002-ass thing I've ever seen in my entire life. It's funny because they talk about how like with the self-titled, the untitled album was the first time they let Travis

be the creative director. And he did it with famous stars and straps. He brought in its own brand. It got very graffiti. It's Not my favorite. Is that why it has the like face with the yeah, like the cause-esque? Yeah. Okay.

All right. Okay. So that I'm assuming Travis had something to do with the font. That's just me putting two and two together. That would make sense. Yeah, because the font is really, it's like if you saw this, you wouldn't, like to me, this looks like we have rage against the machine at home band. Do you know what I'm saying?

A little bit. Yeah. But okay. Look, it was just an art project. Also, just so you know there's a hidden message. I tried really hard to get a hold of a copy of this album, but I couldn't. Did you read about the hidden message inside? There are coordinates.

That's coordinates. The point to Manhattan, which is where we start with the 9-11 references. We just start right off the bat. They also think American Nightmare and Bain in the lighter notes, which is what this album sounds like in many ways. Spiritually. I think spiritually. Apparently Tom and Travis worked out 80% of it in Travis' warehouse in Corona before they

went to record it. Travis said Tom usually decides what key he's going to sing the song in. And then I decide what time signature it's going to be, how fast it will be. I mainly have a lot to do with song structure and tempos and stuff. They wrote the whole album in two weeks. And not much changed. No. I think they, they, they,

put it together and they went and recorded it. And I think, I think that's kind of how it seems like Blink works. They're not too, uh, fussy, you know. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I think so. Tom was going to pay for the album himself in his defense, but, you know, I think MCA caught wind of like a couple of songs and they were like, we'll pay for it. And Tom's manager was like, don't be dumb. Don't pay for like, someone else will pay for it. Don't pay for it. And he was like, okay. Here's what Tom said. about the vibes. The vibes were darker. That's the whole point, right? He wanted a place to explore his shadow, his dark side, his dark feelings. He said, it sounds stupid because you wouldn't think that I would really feel that way, knowing how I am with the other band. But I really was, and I'm not even

making it up to make me sound like a tortured artist. Oh, man. It's true. He is a multidimensional person, and I guess you probably get sick of just fart jokes. Do you know what I mean? Like, you want to explore some emotions. you're having. Well, I do think that they hit, so they had Adam's song on the last album, which started, which was a Mark song. But, and so it did happen to something different, but it didn't seem like Tom got the room to do that. And then the story goes with the last album would take off your pants and jacket. It was that like, towards the end of the album, they presented it to the label and they were like, you don't have enough hits. And so within a couple of hours,

they wrote First Date and they wrote a couple of the other songs on that one that are the hits. Great, the lighter songs. I think there was a little bit of resentment there that kind of led to this like, oh, what are, we're just like cranking out these hits and these songs that we're trying to put ourselves into arcinging. You know, so. Not a lot of room to grow there for Linquency to and to adult men with a range of emotions. Plus, you know, Tom had already started with his, all of his research. I think Tom started with his research long ago. He's been, he's got files, babe.

Tom's got files. He also said that this album was directly influenced by Refused. Can you hear that? Yeah. There's like us, which song is it that really sounds like Refused? It's all systems go? No, that sounds like quicksand. That's the heaviest song, right?

On here, it's like the hardest riff, the heaviest riff. You can really hear that. I can definitely hear a little bit of it. I mean, it also sounds like blink. The one thing I think that is the gift and the curse of Tom's voice is that no matter what he sings, it's going to sound like blink. Because he sounds like, we talked about this, again, off mic, but like that is the most comforting voice to me. Like, to me, that is the voice of my youth. It just brings me back to a place where I feel like safe and cozy and she gets me Mexican food from, you know, whatever.

listens to UL and DHD, that's a Mark song, but just that place spiritually. And you could easily drop these songs and be like there are Blink 22 songs. And even if they're slightly tonally different, they're going to be, everyone be like, yeah, because Tom's singing. And Mark too. Mark also, Sombrero. Thank you. Mexican food from sombrero.

Thank you, Jesse. I went there once just because of that song. Yeah, I did too, babe. It's called a pilgrimage. Yeah. Many times. It's called going to pay our respects. to where our forefathers ate burritos.

Our forefathers in Blink, 22. There's a funny little interview moment. I just want to tell you before we get into the actual songs, which is they did this interview with, I think it was Guitar Center at the time. And they only Travis did it. Tom didn't do it. And they were like,

Travis, did you think that people were going to make the comparison between Boxcar and Blink? Did that affect how you guys approached your music and your lyrics? Travis said, no, not at all. When we wrote this album, we didn't know if it was going to be on a late. or if we're going to put it out ourselves. It was pretty up in the air. So we had no idea how many

people it was going to reach. I especially don't care what the critics say. Most of them are like 50 years old and they're not really educated in what kind of music we're playing to begin with. I just want to point out that Travis Barker is now 47 years old. Obsessed. And Mark and Tom are 50. The song was critically better received than any Blink album before had been, I think. Is that true? I couldn't find. Blink didn't get very many good. Like, I mean, it got very mixed reviews from well yeah you have to remember we're literally coming off of like the 90s critics who were like just one second ago jerking off about pavement albums where they're like and now we have to like literally listen to music about jerking off and like you know we don't know

what to do with this is not serious music little did they know they would be the lead zeppelin of our time the most enduring largest rock band of our times would be green day and blink one 82 okay let's start with I feel so it's a goddamn gorgeous beautiful song it's a banger it makes me happy when I hear it's all I gotta say it's Tom said it's just a song about feelings it's really just about being a kid not really being a kid but just about being angry at the world and kind of wishing you were a different way but you can't be a different way so you feel angry and you feel mad and you feel sad and that's what's in this song I can see why the eight-year-old and you really resonated with this music. Yeah. I mean, it's simple. It's really complicated, a lot of it, actually. And this is kind of

like the beauty of any Tom song. It's like, it seems simple and it's, it's pretty complex. Until you get to Angels and Airwaves, which is all kind of complex. Yeah, very complicated, which also is the same guitarist from Box Car Racer. Not, sorry, bassist from Box Car Racer. I feel so mad. I feel so angry. I feel so calloused. So lost, confused again. Let's start over. I don't know what this song is about per se, but I think he kind of nailed it where it's just about having complicated emotions. I mean, I think it's also kind of the explanation of why he created the band. Yes, this is the thesis, the statement of intent. It's a great fucking song.

All Systems Go is the next song. That's the first heavy riff he wrote, he said. He also said that it sounds like quicksand. So maybe it was one of those I heard quicksand and then I went and wrote this. this is like the classic Tom Baton switch song where you're like, this is a love song. And then you listen a little closer, but it's actually about aliens.

Like how Bono, you know, he's like the Bono of punk rock where like Bono is always like, oh, this is a love song. You're like, no, it's about God. But Tom, it's about aliens. You really get tricked.

You're like, this is a love song. And then you're like, oh, I left my fear behind me of those lights out by the station. The government is lying. The youth, they won't believe them. Yep. I mean, I feel like also this is,

kind of tom's Emma and like it's all it's all yeah it's part of the plan I'm like it's you're your tom don't know deep I think yeah but I I'm really starting to believe that like it's all it's kind of like this company he has which I'm I've been so fascinated by is like this they're basically creating a platform of communication from the government and from all of this like UFO research and he is the vehicle because he can speak to the people and the people at the government or the aliens oh the people you can speak to like the youth the when we were a young crowd is what you're talking about yeah so these songs they it's they are a bait and switch they are trying to trick you into thinking that it's a pop song and then you're you're listening to

these lyrics and it's about the government two things do you feel tom was let down by because i do feel that we've reached such a fever pitch of information being disseminated every day. Like, you know that like funny, stupid, terrifying statistic that like we take in as much information in one day as people in the 1800s took it in one year because they were like, yeah, there are aliens and nobody cared. Did you notice that nobody cared? I didn't see anybody talking about it. They were literally like, do you want to see this TikTok about whatever, this girl and how

she like, you know, meal preps? Like, I saw more of those being passed around than people talking about what the government literally confirming that aliens are real. And everyone was like, okay, I guess. I mean, I guess I'm biased because I live in this alternative press, alternative universe where that is Tom DeLong, but it's not the fuck. Tom DeLong is the mayor. It's not that important because it's aliens. It's important because it's Tom DeLong saying that it's aliens. So for us, it's big news.

I just like one of you was like, I've been screaming this shit from the. the fucking mountain tops trying to get you guys to pay attention and then the government finally confirms it and you all are like who cares yeah well they bought his t-shirts though that is important that is that is really important you're so right and then secondly i would love to talk to tom about this book that i am very into called raw the law of one it's out of print it is a book from i think the late 70s where physicists were very invested in communicating with aliens communicating with aliens was a big 70s topic and they hired a psychic medium, a channeler who channeled to try to talk to the aliens and they got in touch with one entity called Raw and asked it all these questions. And it's a very

profound and meaningful book for me because basically the entity talks about how everything is one thing. Well, I want to know more about that and I wonder if Tom has any thoughts in his files about it. I can't imagine he doesn't. Part of his theory too, I think is that all of this science fiction is not all fiction. So I'm sure you guys have a fascinating conversation about it. That's what Raw said. People always like, it wasn't Raw, the Egyptian thing. And they ask the entity and the entity is like, yeah, that was us.

Damn. We built the pyramids. Well, I look forward to that episode. That episode where me and Tom talk about. It's a special spinoff episode of Bansplain where me and Tom talk about a specific book from the 70s about channeling aliens. I'm so down, actually. Okay. The next song is Watch the World.

this song, you guessed it, also about 9-11. It's not funny per se, because obviously 9-11 is not funny, but the idea of writing a album full of songs inspired by 9-11 is just sort of, it takes you a back in a way that you just laugh because you're uncomfortable, I think. This song is really intense. A lot of it is about like burning down the CIA. Yeah, I saw Virginia get rid of Langley. Well, I wouldn't, let's not go that far.

I don't think that's what Tom was saying. They're going to come to his house and take him away. Although I guess he has a good, he has a good relationship now with the CIA. So they've, right, he's not a threat. That's another thing that makes this album kind of interesting. It's kind of anti-government, anti-CIA. And this one is, it's talking about the CIA, having these secrets. They're going to make them public.

And now he's working with them. But it's because he, I think he had secrets that they, they wanted. It's so insane. It's really crazy. Not enough people talk about how Tom Tom DeLong had had enough secrets about aliens that the government gave him like top level clearance. Yeah. Security clearance. And if anyone wants to talk about it, I'm here.

I will actually hold office hours at a local coffee shop like every single day if anyone wants to come by and talk to me about this because I have, I really need to talk more about it. Because it is, it's truly psychotic and amazing. And I'm so happy for him. It's all I've ever wanted was for him to succeed. I watched the smoke as it grew darker and blew up through the roof. I watched the Fed, saw them panic. It's a little play on words,

right? The Fed being the federal government, also the Fed, the people who were well fed as the fire grew, saw Virginia get rid of Langley and its secrets too. It starts with that, but then goes into the sort of dreamscape of all the, like,

the ways that he would want the world to be better. Like there's no hunger, we're curing cancer, that kind of stuff. It's a really beautiful song, actually. I'll say. I mean, that is kind of the flip side of this album, too. There's like a lot of silver linings, breadcrumbed throughout it, even though it's a pretty dark album.

Yeah. I mean, I think ultimately Tom is a hopeful person. I think part of his fixation and fascination with these other worlds has to do with hope. Absolutely. I mean, I think all the work he's done has, is like evidence to that fact. We really stand Tom on this program. I would also love to hear, like, in conversation, Travis and Tom on aliens. Yeah.

I would, too. I wonder if that would ever happen. Yeah. I mean, I don't know, like, Travis seems like a very earthbound person who's maybe more just, like, I'm happy for you or I'm sorry that happened, but, like, I'm not reading all that. Like, it doesn't have anything to do with me. I'm only supposing, this is fanfic, I have no idea. Perhaps he has very in-depth thoughts about aliens.

But also we should point out that we didn't even say it in the beginning. But this whole episode is really a long game on our part, a four-dimensional chess on our part, so for us to become lemmy influencers. Yeah, absolutely. I'm ready. We just want Courtney to notice us and perhaps put us in some sort of lemmy-influencing situation. I'll eat all the gummies. I'll eat all the gummies.

I know who Agnostic Front is. I can explain it to you. While eating a gummy. While eating a gummy. Mouthful of fucking, you know, hair-loss gummies or whatever. Let's fucking go. I'm seriously so ready for this. I think they need us.

Okay, tiny voices I really want to talk to you about because the only note I have written here, while I really enjoy this song, I literally could not fucking figure out what this song is about. This one doesn't have many people out there talking about what it's about. I think he went a little too far in being cryptic. to the point that no one understands it. Because there's a lot of like 16 long years inhale the bullshit.

I don't know. 19 marks up walls each year one shortfall. I don't know what you're talking about. Tiny voices will make things harder. Everyone will be let down. I don't know. Yeah, I would love to talk to him about that one. I'm just curious.

But at the same time, I think every artist, especially someone like him, deserves to have one that nobody understands. For sure. And especially with Blank, there's, you know, there's innuendo. But they're pretty, they're pretty, it's just, you know what's going on. Yeah, there sure is an innuendo, but I wouldn't say it's a, it's a secret to be solved.

If you ask the genius annotators, which you never should, because I know what they're talking about, they said that it just says it's about voices in his head and then it has negative 18 down votes. Oh, no. Like it's nobody, nobody agreed with this person. Actually, one person wrote back, I really don't think so. So that's all I could get. Okay. Yes. Finally, let's fucking talk about cat-like thief.

I need to tell you that this song is my sexual orientation. This song is my sexual orientation. Many people of the internet would disagree, apparently. What? This, Tim Armstrong and Tom Long, in a call and response singing situation, that's literally my sexual identity. I need to, I'm not heterosexual. I am whatever this is.

That's who I am. I love this song, too. And I think their voices are so perfect together in this. And also, they credit Jordan Pundek from Nivon Glory in the back. I think he's just doing the backing vocals when they can barely hear it. You can barely hear them. Perhaps they mixed him. Jerry Finn was like, you know a little bit less of that guy.

It's definitely an interesting song. It's also heavy. But I think there's just a lot of people. I was on some 2002 chat room about it. As you do, yeah. A lot of people were like, we don't, people were not feeling Tim Armstrong coming in there, but I think psychotic. I think it's perfect.

There was one comment on this chat room, though, that I thought was really great, which said, this song literally just convinced me to keep pursuing a girl I really like so much. I think I may love her. I won't leave her. Zipped 666. I'm crying. I hope they're married now. But I don't think that's what this song is about.

What this song is about is two guys, or one guy technically, because you can't hear Jordan, but trying to convince their friend not to break up with his girlfriend, right? So it's Tom trying to convince Tim not to break up with his girlfriend. No, not to be like the do moi of early 2000s punk rock music, but Tim did break up with Brody Dolly the following year. And they did have a notably rough relationship near. the end. And I am just wondering, is this song like that true and sincere about that? Because I'm just saying, it does feel like it's in conversation with some of the songs that then come out on the next year's Rancid album, Indestructible, such as Fall Back Down, where Tim is like, I've been knocked out, beat down, black and blue, she's not the one coming back for you. And then talks about how if he falls back down, his friends are going to help him back up again. I'm just saying it sounds very much in conversation.

Yeah, it's not far off. Don't you think? Yeah, definitely. I mean, I also think that this song is special because it's so unlike a blink. I think this song is really unlike a Blink song. It's unlike any Blink love song for sure in the way it speaks. And also just the sound. And Tim and Tom.

Tim and Tom are so different. then Mark and Tom the way they sound together. And it's like, I'm obsessed with it. And it sounds so rough. It's like sandpaper. But like in a good way. It's in a perfect way. Like I can't, I can't over emphasize how much I love this song and how much I listen to it.

And just like Tim singing, I'm just because he, because he's, he has this unique pronunciation. And when he's just saying, don't live, don't live, don't leave. Don't leave her, don't leave her, don't leave her. I just love it so much. Yeah. I wish I could inject that into my veins. I think it would make me a better person. I think hardcore blink stands might feel abrasive to this song,

whereas you who liked Carousel and who liked Cheshire Cat, like you're looking, yeah, you're looking for the punk songs. That's true. And I love it so much. And honestly, I really wish what basically happened was Travis and Tim had already started working on transplant step together, which is sort of how Tim came around the studio to check out this. And that's how he like ends up popping on a song. But I really wish, this is my Marble Cinematic Universe. I know I've said that about a lot of

different things, but basically all things situations where varying band members cross over, those are my Marvel Cinematic Universes. And I just don't understand why we never got a Tom and Tim album. Yeah. Like some sort of. side project. That's just Tom and Tim. Or Tom hopping on a plus 44 song. That I would have been I don't need that. Plus 44 was a little bit too electronic for me.

Okay, quick question. Fuck Mary Kell. Blink 182, box car racer and plus 44. Like I feel so bad already for Mark in this case. I know. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I love Mark Hopkins. I love you. Oh my God. He's such a crucial part of the... But kill plus 44. We have to kill plus 44. We have to murder them right under a train.

I would fuck box car racing. and I would marry Blink. Literally same. Because I've had such a long and really tumultuous and growth relationship with Blink 1A2, like a real sense of intimacy, of closeness, of hard times and good times. Like that's my husband. Blink Winnie2 is my husband. But this song, Cat, Cat, like Thief, we're fucking, babe.

But if I were to say which one I most like, it would be Box Car Racer. It's a crazy statement. I mean, it's hard to say because you, like, you. Like, there's so many different eras of Blink 22. Actually, you know what? Blink 22 eras tour would be very sick. And then I would leave at the intermission. Yeah, I think a lot of people would and then maybe come back.

Get home really myself. I'm just kidding. We love you, Link 22. Yeah. I mean, and the new album is incredible. It is really good. We're going to talk about the new album a little bit later. Yeah, apparently Tim did this whole thing in 20 minutes.

Just freestyled. that was the second take i'm obsessed don't leave her don't leave her don't leave her don't leave her don't leave her don't leave her god it's so good everyone is wrong i need to i'm gonna find for i'm gonna rekindle the 2002 reddit thread and get in there and stir some shit up and just like start calling people names he should yeah and then right from that into and i crazy absolute fucking banger of a song maybe the best song on here i mean i think cat like beef is the best song on here but I'm a little biased, but like maybe objectively the best song on her. It's another one that I think is a love song that is showing a side of Tom and of a love love

songs that they hadn't before. Yeah. I mean, it's kind of nice because, like, again, like the songs that you think are love songs that they're ever talking about like breakup and whatever, it's obviously not a Tom love song at this point because he was with the same woman, I think, from high school to like 2019 or something, right? Yeah. But so that wasn't about this.

But this one clearly is, right? It's like a very sweet, like, sort of song about an enduring relationship. You'll always pull me through. Yeah, I mean, it seems the most, it's like, it's very authentic. And I think that that's kind of the, the vibe of this entire album and the reason he did it, which is like to be, like, himself. I've had a really nice time with this album because people do not talk about it enough. And I didn't even think about it again since college, really.

Like, I was like, really rocked. with it so heavy in college and then I hadn't really thought about it. And now I'm just like, this album is damn near perfect and no one talks about it. I know. I'm constantly trying to talk about it. Nobody wants to talk about me. I'm at fucking parties. My new personality is going to be at parties being like, do you have time to talk about box car racer? I'm going to like print out pamphlets. You know what I'm like a Jehovah's Witness on the street. Like, excuse me, sir, do you have time to talk about box car racer? People are going to be like, bro, get a fucking life. Letters to God is. So this is this is the acoustic song.

Yeah. It goes acoustic to electric. To electric, right. So it clearly started as the violent thumbs of it all. I also don't totally know what this song is about. The genius annotator thinks it's about a person's death.

Yeah. I mean... And like trying to get in... I don't know. Looking back and wishing you had lived your life differently, I guess. It's interesting because it's kind of like reminds me of that the Blank song, not now, except that in that song, they're like fully accepting death. Right. And in this one, because it's the angsty album, they're fighting it.

And it's, I really think that this song, I'm sure there's a really deep meaning to it that's heavy and has a lot to do with different dark parts of the internet. But I think that it also just like Tom was depressed. Yeah. I mean, probably felt a little stagnant. You know, he had other interests that he wasn't able to pursue. He's becoming, you know, no longer a boy, not yet a man. Although I guess like kind of firmly a man by 2002 there.

30. 30 years old. Yeah, he was going the fuck through it, babe. He's going to fuck through it. This song, I think also they would, Angels and Airway. covered a bunch. Oh, I didn't know that. I never got into angels and airwaves.

Perhaps I'm missing out. Did you find any information about if my first punk song was actually the first punk song that one of them wrote? I could see it being the first one Tom ever wrote because he was so obsessed with the descendants. And this is definitely giving early descendants vibes. I didn't even think about that. I was reading into this as making fun of blank. Oh. Well, I mean, because the lyrics are so fucking like Blink satire, but they're not even, it's not even enough to be sadder.

Like, these could be blink lyrics. Like, well, you kind of can't make fun of Blink because in that way, you can't parody Blink because Blink is already a parody. It's already such a parody. Like anything that you would say they've, like, they've literally said it, like, sodomy. Yeah. Masturbation, farts, Benoit balls. This is a confusing album, but this song confuses me the most as to why it's on this album. The inclusion did give me pause when going through the album again.

I was like, maybe they just wanted to, you know how that sometimes happens? You just want to lighten the mood for a second because it gets too heavy. And so you just throw in something to sort of like cut the tension. Like perhaps that was the point of this song. Yeah, for sure. And also they're playing to crowds of blink fans. Right. And they probably didn't want to play a blink.

song, which was something that plus 44 actually would do. Right. So they wanted, so they need some time to be like, you took this time to listen to me, so I'll say, hey, I fucked your brother. From your mother, it gave me syphilis. I got no dick. Yeah, that makes sense. They just needed maybe it needs, also you need a light in the mood at the show like you're saying, you know, like you can't just bring the used crowd down. Yeah. And to be fair, while this darker side is a side of Tom, it's a side. And blink is also an authentic part of him and he's a fucking pervert.

You're so right. You're so right, babe. Sorrow, a good song. This one I don't also really know what it's about. I read one thing that this is kind of, this album could be, can, like, listen to like American Idiot kind of as some sort of narrative. And at least I do hear that with the love, the more love, quote unquote, love songs in this. Yeah.

And also if you think about it that way, maybe that song, that is like sort of like wishing to not die could be like still tied into 9-11 like a death of 9-11 like person wow I'm really we're just getting into the tom brain yeah now I'm like fully thinking like Tom I mean I think whether it's all about 9-11 or it's about the government or it's just all about his experience as someone who is suspicious and fearful and all of this you know and he was not wrong he was not wrong and time has Time has simply proven him right over and over and over again really a thousand times. I mean, yeah, like I've said this on this podcast, but like politically speaking, this was a really bleak fucking time. Like 2000 was the first election I voted in and that was like the one that set the tone for my political vibes, which was like, oh, Al Gore won. But then he was like, they were like just kidding. And then the voting machines and the hanging chads and then all of a sudden George Bush is president. you know like it was really like came from this like dark weird place and then 9-11 and then we

have war and like Afghanistan like it's just like one thing after another where like I think this was really the time where like people were like the fuck up with the government you know yeah and then also is it our responsibility to say something how do I talk about this right yeah the second single on this was there is which is also you know what I take it back there is maybe the best song on here. The other music video is pretty good too. So good. That there's someone out there who feels just like me. It's a very, it's a very complex album because a lot of it does come from this like inner child, you know, this like connecting with the inner child. Kind of like he said with like, like you could make fun of I feel so for being sort of oversimplistic in the way it talks about feelings. But that's how a child would talk. You know, like a child doesn't have nuanced and complicated words for how they're feeling. they just have like sad, mad, maybe not calloused, but you know what I mean.

Yeah. I mean, I also think this song has kind of one of the hooks is you could sum up Tom DeLong with it, which is, is there someone out there who feels just like me? Yeah. And is he talking about other people? Is he talking about aliens? Who knows? Yeah, exactly.

You don't know. But it's relatable regardless of whatever your beliefs about UFOs are. I don't know what it means, but it's provocative. No, but it is really relatable. And I'm sure, like, teenagers and even myself who was firmly 20 years old was like, you know, anyone who feels depressed, feels isolated and alone and feels like no one understands how they feel and that unfurling a hand out into the world to be like, is there anyone that gets it? Like, anyone that feels like me is very, it's very tender.

I think this song, too, really leads into, I miss you. And the untitled album, this song really sounds like the next era of Blank. Totally. Totally. Oh my God, so much. Where are you? I mean, like we said earlier, like that wouldn't have been possible without this album. Once again, we have a fake breakup song, The End With You. I don't think he's talking about a romantic breakup. No. It's about the end of the world.

It's about the end of the world. Yeah. You're like, is this a breakup song? No, it is about Revelation. He finally figured out what Revelation is about and he wrote a little song about it. I guess I haven't gotten to what the point of it is, but there are definitely a lot of references to letters in these songs. There's a bunch of songs about letters and there's a lot of talking about letters and at least four songs, I think. Yeah. Well, you know what, again, we've been a 9-11 thing. That's what I say. We've made light a little bit, but like, and you were, you were just too young, but like, I was in New York. It was my first day of second grade. I remember. You were like, actually,

okay, it was very real for me. Yeah. Like, we've genuinely, like, the pervasive feeling of like, is the world going to end?

Was very real. You know, like that was like such a huge thing. Yeah. You know you were right there. Like, yeah. I mean,

I think there's also a lot of people. I mean, yeah, I was there. I saw the second plane hit. I was like, I saw papers flying through the air. So these,

this letter. idea. I mean, and someone who's already suspicious of the government, who's feeling a lot of things, like, this is a heavy moment. And I think it also made a lot of people political who weren't, like any great trauma does. So, right. Like, I mean, yeah, if you think about it, that might have been like a super inciting incident for Tom Long, who already, I mean, he already probably had some like negative thoughts about the government. If you're into aliens, you always sort of think that the government knows about them and is hiding them. That's like the classic party line of people who are alien

epistemados but then like it being compounded by this like actual national tragedy where there's like at the very one end of the spectrum you're like

deeply mishandled at the other end of the spectrum were they involved you know and then it just maybe like radicalizes somebody in a way that you end up having a company that has top level government clearance.

Yeah it's it's all crazy and this album yeah I mean again like it's definitely not making light of it. This album talks on a lot of that. Do you think the kids go into the used tour to see box car racer were like, this is about 9-11? No, they thought they were going to see Blink 182. They thought they were going to see Blink 182. Yeah. And I'm like curious what that experience was like, too. Me too. I didn't go see them. So I don't know. They only did that one tour.

But I can imagine it's kind of a cathartic thing, you know, that lineup too. H2O is just angsty and I love H2O. I really love Toby. Shout out to Abby Morris. Yeah. And the use is just some not really emo music. That's also cathartic. And then to hear someone say things that are going on is, you know, it's always, like I said,

Tom's whole thing and everything he does is to be like a voice. A voice. Yeah. From the beyond. A voice for the feeling, for the dark feelings. So this is where things get extremely. confusing. This song, Elevator, does feature Markopis. So now it's every

member of Blink 1282 and one other guy. It's a really good song. This song is, once again, about 9-11, but also is it a little bit about Mark and Tom? That thought was going through me throughout this album, where I'm like, is one of these layers the, like, disillusion of the relationship of Mark and Tom? And Tom sort of also speaking to that. Well, that's interesting because I feel like a lot of the love songs on this album are obviously on the surface about love.

And then they're deeper. It's about 9-11. It's about the government. And then this one might be a flip. I don't know. But. Well, because it's like, yeah, for sure, like pretty explicitly about 9-11, like the building turned its back, ignored my call. The concrete looks too thin to break my fall.

But then let's forget this and all move on. I'm like, maybe are they talking about, like, let's forget this betrayal. Yeah. That Tom has done. Well, it's definitely having Mark on this was an olive branch. Yeah, totally. And I mean, it shows Mark being a big person for saying yes. Yeah.

I mean, I think that that is huge. My cunty ass, I've been like, go fuck yourself, bitch. Yeah, right. But that's just me. I'm not an evolved person. But it's definitely the most explicitly heavy. song, I think, on this album. Yeah.

It's super heavy. And I mean, I can't, again, Tom is too smart and too hip to what people would think to not, I think, realize the layer of Mark being on it, given the, like, sort of like, tension between them wouldn't be part of the song. Yeah, definitely. There was a Reddit AMA in 2017 where Mark said, the whole situation sucked. But I sang on the track because at the heart of it, Tom and Travis are my friends. I'm sure Tom felt the tension and asked me as an offering.

I was glad to have done it, and I was glad that he asked. That is sweet. And then it ends with an instrumental. Yeah. And there you go, a perfect album. This is a pretty perfect album. Pretty perfect album. Okay, so I only found three reviews.

I mean, the ones that I could, like, reads. There was ones mentioned on the Wikipedia with just, like, ratings and stuff. Yeah. Slant magazine gave it a really positive score of three and a half stars. It said they grabbed the finer elements. of Blink 12, pop sensibility, innovative percussion, DeLong's snotty wine, and added piano strings and acoustic guitar. Okay, that's true.

No, I'll tell you what, you know, I'll tell you who didn't like it. Punknews.org. Yeah. They did not like it. He wrote a sort of mean satirical ad campaign on behalf of MCA records that starts, Hey, kids, like Blink 182, so do we hear at MCA Records. Are your favorite singles by the band, those deep ones like Adam's song and stay together for the kids? You know the ones I'm talking about.

The emo ones. Those songs are really good, right? You know they are. Well, have we got the band for you? He's the hot one you like. Oh, man. That one I thought was unnecessarily mean. Like, do you have to kick Mark when he was down?

First of all, Mark was also really hot. You're both so hot. Yeah, it was like a boy band situation where like when you just picked one and that showed your personality, but that didn't mean they weren't all hot. Yeah. Scott was not that hot, but again, that was. that was before they were, you know, their visages were all around TV. By the time that was happening, we really had, we had Travis, who is obviously a gorgeous man and you're a lucky woman, Courtney Kardashian, please make us let me influencers.

Yeah. Well, the guy didn't like it. He called it utterly forgetable. Well, guess what, bitch? We didn't forget. I definitely did not forget. Yeah, we haven't forgotten. We love this album.

It's been nearly 20 years. It's been over 20 years, I think. It's been nearly 21 years. It's been nearly 22 years. Wow. I cannot do math. That's really dark. It's been over 20 years.

I'm so old. Yeah. And we still haven't forgotten. Yeah. And I think a lot of people are talking about it again because there is a box car racer song on the new blink album one more time. Yes. We're going to get to that.

And people haven't forgotten. There's another review that just fully says that the cat like thief's song, the other person is Mark Hoppice doing his best Tim Armstrong impression. Can you imagine being that wrong? Can you imagine having that under your name? Can you imagine thinking that Don't leave her, don't leave her, don't leave her was Mark Hoppice.

I don't think he could do it even if he tried. You can't sound like that. Could not. I can barely do it. And I am a master of voices. Just wow. But they do compare it to Texas is the reason and Christy Front Drive,

which I thought were nice comparisons. That is a nice comparison. That's why, I mean, that's like that type of emo music is the emo music I love. So. Yeah, in this house we stand. Texas is the reason. You're right. It got pretty good reviews from other places. But this is also like the dark era of like blogosphere. And not a lot of like like for example, Rolling Stone did not review it. Spin not review it. I don't think I don't think there's a big marketing push. And I think there I read something that Tom said like once he saw how bummed Mark was about how real it was. They like fully cut all marketing efforts. They're like, don't push this anymore. Like don't put it out to press. Don't. Don't put it out to press. Don't. Don't.

we're not touring, we're not doing anything else with this. Yeah, I think there was definitely a lot of that, I mean. Which is, you know, that's smart. He saved Blink22. So here's a little tea, a little tea for you. So the album came out while Blinkent 82 was on a joint headlining tour with Green Day called The Pop Disaster Tour. This was April to June of 2002.

AP did a very good co-cover of that album. We'll post it. We'll post it in the Instagram story. is when this episode comes out. There is a in-depth corang piece about, it's about Green Day.

It's a profound Green Day. There's just this little part where they're like, the two camps are hardly kept apart on this tour. Or at least Mark Hoppice and Green Day aren't anyway. Travis Barker could be seen

around the backstage area, but seems very much to float in his own bubble. Tom DeLong, however, is nowhere to be seen. Trey Cool suggests that DeLong never leaves his bus and only speaks to his security guard

and his manager. Mark Hopp is often seen around, friendly, eager, and likable. He appears strangely, slightly lonely. Goss. That is some goss. There's trouble in paradise, babe. Maybe the wounds of boxcar racer

are pretty fresh on this tour and the vibes are off. Then in the summer of 2002, Travis, you know, makes that transplants record, that first transplants record, fucking phenomenal. Shout out, Skinhead, Rob. Really a phenomenal album.

It's honestly one of my favorite albums. It's so odd and, like, great. And there's so many strange, like, mixes of genres and sounds. And I love that album so much. Yeah. Travis has talked about how, like, being from Fontana, he had a bit more of an urban hip-hop. slant than perhaps Tom and Mark and Thomas said that hip-hop and urban stuff is not part of his DNA. So I'm happy that Travis was able to express that side of himself.

Yeah. And the transplants as someone from Torrance who does relate. And then we get the 2003 self-titled album, which like we've said, a bunch of times already, is clearly sonically influenced by Tom's box car racer direction, right? Yes. definitely. And they, I mean, they even fucking got Robert Smith to be on this album, which, you know, Mark Hopas's favorite band in high school is The Cure. But like, they're really like doubling down on like, we're going, oh, emo, babe, this man invented it.

We brought him on the album. Yeah. And it yielded I miss you, which I think is one of their, one of their biggest songs today. Is it their biggest song? No. It is. I think it is. And like, because I was, I listened to Travis on Toby Morris's podcast.

And he, he, like, has claimed that that song is bigger than the band. And I think, I think a lot of people who do know that band, that song and they don't necessarily know the band. Like, that song is. Yeah, it is a massive song. Yeah. Where are you? Yeah, that, even just that line. It's like a meme.

Where are you? I have this, this interview with Fox Car Racer from AP from 2002. Oh, my God. What did they say? And when they asked, does Mark have a side project of his own? own on tap. Travis said, you know what? Mark is super into golfing. His wife's about to have a child. He's preparing to be a daddy. Tom said, there's nothing weird at all. Mark's my best friend in the world. He's super supportive. It does sound like that might not have been the whole truth, much like the government.

Tom was lying. Yeah. Travis also said that they were trying to do a little dashboard confessional thing. With box car racer. Yeah, which I don't. I don't hear. Don't hear that either. But you know what? It's kind of like, again, with the, with the, the man, the myth, the legend, Jim Darmish said, it's not where you take it from, it's where you take it to. Yeah. So we might not hear refused or dashboard confessional, but that those were the inputs that filtered through Tom. The other notable quote on this is the interviewer who is Greg Heller asked, what do you

think God was trying to tell us on September 11th. Who did he ask Tom and Travis what God was trying to tell us? Tom says the Bible does say in revelations that are passed to Armageddon, first the Israelites will get their land back. That happened in 1947. Then it says that the new Babylon will fail. Babylon was the commercial trading center of the world in the Old Testament. The new commercial trading center was the world trade center. Maybe this is the beginning of Armageddon. Kind of sad, wouldn't it? That'd be. kind of sad, wouldn't it? Maybe this is the end of the world. Wouldn't that be kind of sad? Wow. A, what are you talking about? B, that's an insane question that a secular publication asked in the thing.

But also it does remind me that all three of them have religious backgrounds. Yeah, definitely. Which you don't, you don't ever talk about Blinkwainty to being ostensibly a Christian band in some ways. Honestly, most punk bands, I think, of that era are Christian kids who are either rebelling or they're making Christian punk music, which is also sick. Yeah. Not rancid. Not rancid.

But yeah, this is very interesting. I mean, even Travis said in his memoir that he would go to church all the time until his mom died and then he still believed in God, but he stopped going to church unless it was like a special occasion. They all strike me as spiritual people. 100%. Definitely Travis. I mean, he's kind of a. Travis for sure. He's like a vegan, you know, aerobone.

He's an heroin girl. They're a god-loving. They're a god-loving couple, and I'm so, so into it. Tom said this. One of the craziest things about boxcar racer is that it was the both greatest and worst thing from Link. It was obviously the reason why we made that last record, which I thought was a masterpiece.

He's talking about this all titled. But it also caused a great division in the band. It was really hard for Mark. He thought it was really lame, Travis and I went and did that. But it was a totally benign thing on my part because I only asked Travis to play drums because I didn't want to pay for a studio drummer. It wasn't meant to be a real band. But even before Blink was finished, Mark and Travis went out and started plus 44, and I didn't even know that until months later. I had to read it in the press. And that's what I didn't understand because the hypocrisy to me seemed ridiculous. But I guess at the end of the day, those guys had things they wanted to do with Blink. And I guess they couldn't do the things with me. Those was in 2005. He said that MTV News.

T. T. Anyways, it is in 2003 that Tom told Corang that there would never be another box car racer album. because of the emotions that it had stirred up between him and Mark. In 2005 February, so that MTV thing was after, the band announces an indefinite hiatus. Here's something really funny about this. So they put out a statement or whatever after Blink pulled out of music for relief, rebuilding South Asia, a concert in Anaheim

with Lincoln Park, Jay-Zia, no doubt, putting like a vague explanation, the blink on their website. fans started to speculate they had split up, but is actually Dave Navarro who spilled the tea, who actually like broke the news because he had played that concert with his group Camp Freddy. Oh my gosh. And he posted on his blog. This is what he wrote on his blog.

As I mentioned, Ozzy pulled out due to a family situation, but the big shot came when Blink 22 pulled out. Evidently, they broke up yesterday. I know how it can get when it's just not working anymore. Anyway, best of luck to those guys. Not Dave Navarro outing the blink when you break up before they're able to formally announce. He was really a living moss. When was that?

2005, 2005. 2005, yeah. You know, that's the 2005. Dave Navarro's blog. It was the Wild West. Anything could happen. Dave Navarro could fucking out you as being broken up before you even get a chance to put out a statement. I mean, I guess that's the way to go out if there's any.

So good. That alone, that detail alone was enough for me to be happy I did this episode. Yeah. Honestly, yes. I comment. Thinking about Dave Navarro running home to tap tap on his computer on this little blog. Like, I got to spill the tea bitch. Blake 1.82 is definitely broken up.

And I know because it's giving. Okay. Tom said that reality is at the end when we decided to take the break, our priorities were mad, mad, mad different. My priority was my family and my life had to be structured in a way where I had to be around for my daughter. She was two years old at the time. blah, blah, blah, blah.

His whole party line was that he was going to be for his family. But the statement was always, Travis is the best musician I've ever played with. Mark is a super sweetheart. He's my best friend. But when money and fame entered the equation, the way we're all growing up and having kids, I think we all just grew apart. They stopped speaking. Mark and Tom.

Travis spoke to both of them. Travis spoke to both of them. Travis is the literal child of divorce in this situation. He's always been so neutral. and he's been in these side projects that caused so much friction, but he's never really been part of the drama. No. He's always just kind of like, what?

You guys aren't talking? Right. I just won't play drums. So Tom and Mark don't speak for three full years. Apparently not until Travis has his plane crash, which is in 2008. And that sort of unites them to get together to meet up. And that also gets them talking about reuniting and they reunite the next year, 2009. Then they put out the album Neighborhoods in 2011.

And they tore a bunch. According to Travis, in just like one little line in his book, during this time, the vibes were not good, babe. The vibes were bad. They were off. Well, Neighborhoods was, I think, recorded remotely. Yeah, nobody won't. They didn't go in the same room together, which you know as a band is not a good, you know, it doesn't like end well when that's what's going on. It seems like they were like, we should do this, but like no one's really over.

Boxcar racer. Boxcar racer really had reverberations through the Blink 1AG universe, the wound, the chasm that was created. Right. And that's kind of, I guess, Tom, I guess, Tom said it was the best and worst thing for Blink. Yeah. He's not wrong. I think the untitled album is one of my favorites. Obviously, I love Cheshire, but it's... I mean, it's probably their biggest album, right? To date. It's a peak blink. again for me i'm i'm i'm i'm obviously love miss you and i love first date but i don't first say this from the last album it's not you know i'm i'm like a rural cheshire dude ranch girlie but that's just a personal preference you know i totally get i totally get people that love the self-titled the most anyway vibes are bad vibes are off tom in 2014 once again is like

i bid you adieu milady i'm i don't want to do this anymore and so he leaves the band they recruit Matt Skiba. Weird choice in my humble opinion. No shade to Matt Skiba. I just, I would, I just didn't understand. I went and saw them play on one of these tours during the time of the Matt Skiba era. And I just didn't understand Tom has such a singular voice that is so. He sounds like Mark. He sounds like Mark. Why would you have a man that sounds like Mark? I both great singers, but it's, sure. Matt's keep is a great singer. It's not blink. It doesn't do, it doesn't make the same noise. The respect I have from that schema, but I'm just saying, why my brilliant idea, if I was creative directing Blink 22, why didn't they ask Fat Mike? At the very least,

his voice is more in line with the uniqueness of Tom's. Are you laughing? I think it's a brilliant idea. I still think it's a really idea. Vocally, I think it's a great idea. So much of the rest of me is like just dead over that. This is, this is some four dimensional thing. This is like galaxy brain thinking. I think you have, you really have to understand the vision of fat mic singing the Tom songs. I understand it.

And like I want to hear it. I don't know if I want to see it. Hey, yeah. Okay, that makes sense. That checks out. I understand what you're saying. Okay. So then in 2017,

Tom does an interview with Billboard on the 15th. year anniversary of the box car racer album. They say, you tweeted recently that you and Travis had a serious conversation, was obviously led to many boxcar racer assumptions from your followers. You've since dropped more hints and even asked who fans would want to see guests on a second album. So how many beans can you spill? What's going on? Tom said, well, I'm not going to spill any beans, but Travis and I talk all the time.

There was always talk of boxcar racer. We've talked about it for a very long time. My good sir, you said just a. mere 10 years ago that you would never make another box car razor album. Anyways, we just came out with vinyl and we've gotten offers to bring it back. I don't think if it was like Coachella, but we've had things like that pop up from time to time. It's something that's never died in our imaginations and it's something that I think we're willing to do. Whether we come out with some big announcement or we're ready to say, hey, this is happening, I don't know any of those kinds of details,

but I think that our passion for what we did live strong. We do talk about it and we do want to do something, but we have no desire to talk about details because there's a lot going on in my life right now. Blink's doing really well and everyone's in a good spot. I have the best situation ever where that band can continue and they can do what they want. And I'm making major motion pictures and working with people in the government. So it's a big deal. True. He just put out his movie. True, babe. He was working on it. Now, keep in mind 2017, you know this, but for the listeners, Mark and Tom are not speaking. So I just picture Mark fucking firing up billboard.com being like, What, bitch?

You're going to make another box car racer album? They ask, you know, have you written anything for it? And he basically won't answer the question. But he says, I think the safe it's answer is that the music I'm doing now that I'm writing now lives more sided towards that box car racer sound than traditional angels and airwaves. So it sounds like he kind of was writing some box car racer stuff. Now this is. I think it's a sign that he was missing blink. I mean, that makes sense.

Yeah. He was starting to want that feeling again in boxcar racers are the closes he can get because he can't talk to Mark, but he can talk to Trump. Yeah, I think it was kind of a bridge out, but it might be, it was like, it's honestly kind of a bridge back in. Boxcar racer, man, really cuts both ways. They ask him if he was going to do another box car race album, who would you like to get involved with guests? Here's what he says. You know, it's funny. On Twitter, I was talking to Anthony Green from Circa Survive.

His voice just makes me, wouldn't that be great? This voice just makes me feel like I'm back in the 70s or some shit. But I don't know. He'd be good on that record. You know what? Try to get Ian Mackay to come scream or something. Do you put Enya on there? I could even see us doing an acoustic song with Ben Gibbard from Death Cab for Cutie.

You know? That'd be cool too. In another interview, he also sort of just says that he won't, he's talked to these people about doing it. And I did ask Ben Gibbard about it. I was like, I need the box car at Racer T. I read somewhere that you were going to be on the second album, and he was like, this is the first time hearing about that. So I have no idea what you're talking about.

I don't know her. But don't you think that would be amazing? I think... Anya, Anthony Green, Ben Geberd, and Ben Geberd, and Ian McKay. That honestly sounds amazing. I'm so invested. I'm so, like, who can I make some phone calls? Like, how do I get this popping?

Yeah. Interesting. I mean, I also like, I think that because Blink just didn't really have features on the new album. No. I mean, we again, as a society, we lost a Ben Gibbard acoustic box car racer collaboration song. I won't rest until this happens. Ben Giverd singing about, you know, the government. Ben Gibbard singing out of the government. Not now, babe. Same about like UFO whistleblowers. Like doing his little dance moves. I would fucking die. It would be so good. I would love it. His gorgeous voice, his beautiful voice. Anyways, that did

not happen. Then in 2019, Tom tweeted, recording angels and airwaves today, hashtag kind of sounds like box car racer. To which Travis Barker replied tweeted, never will sound like box car racer without me. So then everyone was like, what? Is there more box car racer? I like that banter. It's cute. I think it's cute too. Now, this is probably around the time they wrote Terrified, which is Ablyquen 882 song on the new album. If I, if I'm playing detective properly, I think it was around 2019, maybe 2020, okay? Mm-hmm. Because Mark was not involved because they're still not speaking.

However, in June of 2021, Mark Hopas was diagnosed with cancer. Extremely sad. Stage four. Stage four. The man beat box car racer and cancer. This spurred a reunion because of course, of course, right? Like you're not going to be like, oh, that sucks. Good luck to you.

I'm still going to talk to you. So they have a reunion, Tom and Mark, and I think that song one more time. I don't even think. This is not a hot take. This is very clearly what that song is about one more time. The title track is about this. It's about this whole situation. And they all wrote it together.

It's for strangers, from strangers into brothers, from brothers into strangers once again. From strangers into brothers. from brothers into strangers once again. Travis sings. It's a lot of firsts and it's honestly all those memes about fucking millennials crying listening to it. That was me. I wish they told us it shouldn't take a sickness or airplanes falling out the sky. Do I have to die to hear you miss me?

I'm crying. And then in 2022, Blink22 reunited with Tom. they played Coachella. They continued to refuse to play songs off Cheshire Cat, just to insult me. And then this year, they put out the album, which contains the boxcar racer song. That's the, that's the story of Box Car Racer. We've reached the end. I don't think they're ever going to make another Box Car Racer album.

Do you think they will? No, I don't. I don't think it would make sense. Literally financially, it wouldn't make sense. Like in any situation where they're like, if you guys are going to make a, If you and fucking Travis are making an album, bitch, it's a Blink. One-A-O and we're putting on some massive tour because you're Led Zeppelin. I don't think that the, like, the topic of it will go away because I feel like they're going to,

Tom, the way he just, like, talks and brings things up, will probably keep writing songs that are a box car racer songs. Right. Do you think there'll be more angels and airwaves? I'm not sure. Not for now. Yeah. Now they have to tour the entire world. I think it's, I think it's Blinks time right now.

It's really insane to watch the band that was like your favorite little band when you were 14 years old. And now you're 41 years old. And they're still like a big band that everyone's like, you know what I mean? Like it's a truly an insane feeling where like you're like, did. Am I like in the twilight zone? It's so insane. But yeah, arguably bigger than ever. Absolutely bigger than ever. Yeah, Green Day too, producer Jesse says. I mean, those were like, it's Green Day's not, doesn't feel the same for me because I honestly didn't know about Green Day until they were on MTV. Like, that's just true because I was too young and like I wasn't like the coolest 10 year old on the planet getting like whatever slapy stick sloppy hours. I can't remember the name of that album ever. 1001 producer Jesse knows it because he's a deep Green Day stand. I love Green Day. Green Day is one of my favorites. Well, Green Day also, but they've just been going. That's the thing about Green Day. They never had it.

They didn't have all this drama. They never left and came back. Like, you know, they've had the same lineup, which is the craziest part. I know. Maybe at one point they'll outdo you two. Right now, you two is the longest running original lineup band after the guy from Zizi Top died. I don't know if it still counts because now they're playing shows without Larry Mullen, but they're only doing that because Larry Mullen is injured.

He didn't leave the band. But maybe at some point when Bono retires, they will. be Green Day. Maybe. Well, this has been just a delight and a pleasure and I had a good time reliving my youth, talking about three of the most important men in my life. Yeah, truly. Me too. Begging to become a lemmy influencer. I'm ready for it, Courtney. Let me. Let me influence. You need a podcaster and the editor-in-chief of Alternative Press. magazine to give a little edge to your vitamins. She's an edgy woman now.

She dresses very cool. And she looks cool as hell. I bought those acne boots because of her. Yeah, I mean, she's definitely influenced me to be wearing things too. Yeah. Like, I'm like, that was a really expensive influence. Let's let the tables turn. Yeah.

Allow us the influence to become the influencers. Anyways, well, Anna, this has been a real treat and I'm really glad that you took the time to come on here and talk about boxcar racer with me. Absolutely. I never thought I would find someone who would let me talk about boxcar racer for so long. I could have truly gone on for like, again, I'm going to print the pamphlets and start standing on the corner of like, I'm going to go to like modern day. Like I'm going to go to like spiritual cramp and like military gun shows and just put

a little booth in the corner where I'm like, excuse me, do you have, do you have a moment to talk about box car racer? And I'm going to fundraise to get that fucking Ben Gibbard acoustic box car racer song made. Yeah, if there's anything that's This is my cause. Let me know. Yeah, thank you. If anyone wants to join in on my cause.

Okay, well, come back next week for a new episode of Bansplain. If you liked what you heard today, subscribe for more episodes of Bandsplain. Our guest today was Anna Zanes. You can follow her on Instagram at Anna Zanes. This episode was produced by Jesse Miller Gordon and edited by Adrian Bridges with help from Justin Sales. Executive producers for Bansplaine are Gina Dalbeck and me, Yossi Salick. Our gorgeous and catchy theme song was composed and performed by Bethany Gossentino and Jennifer Clavin and graciously recorded by Carlos Delagas in Los Angeles, California.

Special thanks to our producer emeritus, producer Dylan, aka Dylan Tupper Rupert, and also Casey Simonson, Michael Hardman, Robert Adler, Leah Edwards, David McDonough, Dana Mearsson, Jessica Hopper, and the 2024 when we were Youngfest lineup. Pretty Girls Big Graves come through. Come back every Thursday for a episode of Bansplain on Spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts. Did I freeze? Yes. What was the last thing you heard? Welcome to the show.

Okay. Welcome to the show. I didn't hear anything you said. Go ahead. You are welcomed.