Barbell Shrugged - Concurrent Training: Why Cardio Does Not Make You Weak w/ Anders Varner, Doug Larson, and Coach Travis Mash - Barbell Shrugged #554

Episode Date: March 8, 2021

Diesel Dad Class 3 registration is live. For busy dads that want to get strong, lean, and athletic without sacrificing family, fatherhood, or fitness.   Register Today.   Concurrent Training (CT) is defined as the combination of resistance and endurance training in a periodized program to maximize all aspects of physical performance. Unless an athlete is in a pure-power sport like Olympic Weightlifting, or a pure-endurance sport like long distance cycling; a combination of both power-related and endurance-related attributes are required to excel in mixed-type sports. Mixed type sports are sports that depend on several different energy systems and different strength and speed properties. MMA, boxing, basketball, soccer, hockey and many other team-based sports fall under this category.   In this Episode of Barbell Shrugged: What is concurrent training Does cardio make you weak Why concurrent training builds GPP Sport specific training while doing concurrent training How to implement and use concurrent training Anders Varner on Instagram   Doug Larson on Instagram   Coach Travis Mash on Instagram   ————————————————   Diesel Dad Training Programs: http://barbellshrugged.com/dieseldad   Training Programs to Build Muscle: https://bit.ly/34zcGVw   Nutrition Programs to Lose Fat and Build Muscle: https://bit.ly/3eiW8FF   Nutrition and Training Bundles to Save 67%: https://bit.ly/2yaxQxa   Please Support Our Sponsors   Organifi - Save 20% using code: “Shrugged” at organifi.com/shrugged   www.masszymes.com/shruggedfree  - for FREE bottle of BiOptimizers Masszymes   Garage Gym Equipment and Accessories: https://prxperformance.com/discount/BBS5OFF Save 5% using the coupon code “BBS5OFF”

Shrugged Family, this week on Barbell Shrugged, we are talking about concurrent training and why cardio does not make you weak. Inside this episode, we discuss what exactly concurrent training is, how to define it, why cardio does not make you weak, why concurrent training builds DPP, that's general physical preparedness, sports-specific training while doing concurrent training, and how to implement and use it in your day-to-day life. Before we get rolling, Diesel Dad, Class 3 is live right now for busy dads that want to get strong, lean, and athletic without sacrificing family, fatherhood, or fitness. Head over to barbellstrug.com forward slash Diesel Dad. Class 3 is live this week for registration starting today, Monday, and it ends Sunday. And we start training on Monday of next week.

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at leakygutguardian.com forward slash shrugged and use the code shrugged to save 10% off your order. That's leakygutguardian, L-E-A-K-Y-G-U-T, guardian, G-U-A-R-D-I-A-N.com forward slash shrugged, leakygutguardian.com and use the code shrug to save 10% off your order. Friends, let's get into the show. Welcome to Barbell Shrugged. I'm Anders Varner, Doug Larson, Coach Travis Mash. On today's episode of Barbell Shrugged, we are going to be digging into concurrent training

and why adding cardio is not killing your gains in the gym but before we do that travis mash have you had your pre-workout yeah you ready to rock yeah on february 6 2021 a man that is a gigantic human baptist back squatted 1311 pounds 1311 pounds setting the all-time world record but we don't really uh no talk about this back squat and what's going on in the world of uh equipped power lifting and the disaster that is counting that as the world record what in the world too far i think it's gone too far i think they should scrap the whole sport and like you and the disaster that is counting that as the world record. What in the world is going on? I think it's gone too far. I think they should scrap the whole sport. And, like, you know, I say that as someone who's participated in that,

you know, but, you know, when someone starts lifting weights, powerlifting, weightlifting, whatever, you know, you've got to say, like, you know, why am I doing this? Well, I did it because I wanted to be the strongest man in the world. I did not do it because I wanted to be the strongest man in the world. I did not do it because I wanted to like, you know, squat super high, wear tons of equipment, you know, and like manipulate things and then compare myself to the people of the past, even though I'm doing nothing close to what they're doing. What he did is there's no way you can call that a back squat. It was the most ridiculous thing. And then people are saying like, oh, well, it's the referee's fault.

No, at that point, no, it's your fault too because you knew good and well that wasn't even close. Now, if you're like kind of borderline and you got some lights, I mean, that happens all over the world. IPF, you might get away once in a while. What he did, he knew good and well. I don't even think it was a quarter squat. No, it was the most bullshit thing ever.

I don't think he got to a quarter. Yes. He's like hamstrings to knees. But the problem is he's got 40-inch quads. There is no chance. I mean, it's actually like really embarrassing to watch, and I feel bad for the guy only because i don't one i don't know what it's like to have 1300 pounds on your back and then two if you have 1300 pounds on your back

and you squat and someone gives you the white lights or in a power lifting meet they yell to you to stand and then everybody cheers like i I assume you just do what the judge says, but when you go back and see the video, you got to look at that and the fact that it is lack of character in the referees, the people watching the guy that took it. Let me tell you a story. So you're not just thinking I'm,

I'm the one talking shit. My first ever, uh, 700 pound bench press. Like I completed it, and then at the very tip top I felt something on the right side as if, like, I don't know, I got an extra boost. So when I stood up, I got three white lights, 700 pounds.

At the time it was a big bench. I looked to the spider, I'm like, did you touch that? And he, like, in disgust, he's like, by accident. And so I turned it down because I have character, because I didn't want anyone to be able to say what I'm saying about Nathan right now. Like, that is some bullshit, man. How do you live with yourself? You've got to look yourself in the mirror and say,

I am trying to compare this thing to, like, people in the past, like Ed Cohn, Kurt Kowalski. That is a disgrace to them. And you should immediately call and say, I turned that down, take it off the record books. Did you send it to any of your buddies? Oh, yeah. Just go, what in the world is this? Yes.

Eddie is way worse than me. He is very critical when it comes to depth. And he can because he squatted super deep, which is the very reason in the day when people were comparing me to Eddie Cohn, I went to the USPF to go head-to-head in the same federation because I did not want anyone to be able to say what I'm saying about Nathan right now because I have character, man, because I wanted to be strong no matter what. If we want to squat naked, I'll out-squat you.

But this guy, can he squat 405? Who knows? This high squat it was um this is going too far you know you guys in equipped lifting that it's gone too far you should start i think the other thing about equipped lifting like i'm really happy that power lifting is getting away from that like me too if this had happened in say like aj roberts day when it was like still it was like just turning the corner getting back to raw um but i mean his squat was really shallow it was really and then once you do one shallow squat then it's like well where do we draw the line because you've complete now like he's not when you see him squat 13 11 he and they say this is the world record he's not – when you see him squat 1311,

and they say this is the world record, he's kind of not even comparing it to your generation. It's like – It's just that little generation. And the generation where they like really started to do short squats or shallow squats, and it just – it's funky looking. That's the part that bothers me the most is like you see it and you don't even have to be like a trained person to look at and go well that's not right yes like that guy has to unfortunately he trained his entire life to go do that did it

because of the internet the entire world saw it and no one even gave a shit because they just looked at it went well that was stupid it's like i didn even gave a shit because they just looked at it and went, well, that was stupid. I didn't see a single Instagram post. Barben covered it. It's like the only person doing it. He did it like – I wonder why Barben covered it. It was like were they doing it to see – to get people mad?

I mean they questioned the depth on it. At the end of the article, they're like, look, this is funky. But they're like the source for barbell weightlifting news i would not you should not even information this is you know some people yeah go ahead i was gonna say i've heard you say multiple times that you feel like equipped power lifting is kind of like on the downhill slide like in your mind how is it why is equipped power lifting not doing well but regular unequipped raw power lifting you don't seem to mention as much as far as it because of cross on the downhill slide yeah

because of crossfit people know what a squat is now and so like when they see that even the regular person you know knows that that is crap and like and the fact that you know they need this monolift and they need all these people around them and and then they squat super high like that. Everyone knows it's crap. But you go to RAW and you watch Ray Williams or you watch any of these amazing squatters, you're like, oh, they understand that. All of us have done it. Most of us have done a squat, whether it's for football in college.

And so we know what a decent squat is. So you can relate to RAW. You can say, okay okay that's amazing that guy squatted a thousand pounds super deep and raw but like they look at the equipment and it looks like a complete and utter joke and it is i have to give them to you know and then the people will say well uh the equipment uh makes it hard to go down well then bro then it's too tight you know it's like i got i want to send you both this this um video of brit meisel and he he was wearing a canvas suit and he squatted this was like um wait it's canvas yes yeah that's what that dude is yeah i've never put one on

the briefs that you got are they canvas too no no i mean i don't know anything about power this doesn't move you know it's like it's like you need 1100 pounds on your back just to sit in general it's like i'm gonna show you guys this video so you'll see that you can still squat deep in equipment so this was for my day this was brent mikesell at the time was like you know he surpassed he did 1070 first 11 something first like, you know, he surpassed, he did 1,071st, 11-something first. And, like, he was just, but he squatted super deep. And, like, that's a big difference. So, like, that was real.

Like, in my era, we were, like, breaking records right and left. But we were doing it right. It's like it wasn't because we were squatting high. It wasn't because, you know, we were these super-duper bench shirts that are, like, there's some crazy bench shirts nowadays we were just good you know we had ed crone steve goggins goggins me brit meisel uh and donnie thompson at the time but then somewhere along the line i and now i talked to aj about this and he even said he's like uh there was eras and like in his era they started saying you know at parallel was good you know where me it was below parallel then it is there it was at parallel was good. Where me, it was below parallel.

Then his era, it was at parallel. Then the era after him now is this whole new above. Yeah, where does the line start? Dude, squat deep. Squat your ass deep. Then I'll be like, congratulations. I don't care how much equipment. If you squat deep, awesome.

Do you think they should scrap the monoliths and just pull the bar out of the rack and walk it back and i think you do it like weightlifters i do you know i i that's why i love my favorite meet of all time is when i went to uh it was uh chester west virginia uh it was at the mountaineer gaming track it was like a horse track up there and it was me it was a cone is when i went head to head with them and it was walk out it was you know you can wear a when i went head to head with him and it was walk out it was you know you can wear single ply you know everybody's running super deep man yeah i do and like if you can't walk it out then like how functional is that is your ability to be able

to mess with this weight like yeah you know like i think at some point there has to be a thing right like all the guys that are doing power lifting in gear or in equipment where do they even train anymore like i if you go to a powerlifting gym now it's like just big strong people that are squatting normal and they look like they're training and they're not big giant fat people they're not like they look like they're just strong and in shape and really freaking strong. And they squat and deadlift and bench every day of their lives, and then they do accessories, and they're just big, strong people.

But I haven't walked into a gym – well, one, I haven't walked into a gym in a while, but NC Strength I used to go to here. And every time I would walk into the powerlifting side of the gym, just normal looking people that were just big and strong. Yeah. Nobody's in there wearing gear and training that exact like centimeter that they need to get their glutes to, or their hips to, to be able to stand up immediately and training like, you know, in, in short ranges of motion. It doesn't, I think though that they have to have

there has to be some example where someone just everyone just looks at and goes well this sport's dead yeah i think we got there they need to admit it and even louis like you know i know to him it's going backwards but like uh he is lost in time and like until you know the west side barbell starts to do you know get away from equipment like it'll just fade man it'll fade away because nobody cares anymore and there's nothing they can do about it you know like i would love to see dave hoff go raw because you know what he'd be really good like he's amazing dave hoff is an amazing powerlifter period but like for if he wants people to remember that historically then he's going to have to go raw like why not like i did i've done raw single you know multi you

gotta be i personally this is just my opinion like i wanted to be strong no matter what no matter where no matter what circumstances i wanted to be the strongest guy. And somehow people nowadays have lost that desire to truly be the strongest guy. Are you the strongest guy if you can only do it with a monolith of equipment? Shouldn't you be strong, like naked? If I were going to get in a fight with Doug, would I be like, hold on, let me put my gear on? Yeah, well, dude, I the the interesting thing about squatting is everybody knows now what it is there's no secrets right like when we when we first started

playing crossfit competitively and like going to each other's gyms and then going to these weekend competitions or even when you were at regionals like they hadn't figured out all the ways to cheat yet but you knew when people were cheating because you just looked at it and it just didn't pass the eyeball test of where you just let go well that's funky i don't know what you're doing but that's funky and you shouldn't do that because you're putting at risk the like pride at which we all are competing in like you're you're putting yourself winning over the character sport and the character and the pride that you should carry yourself with while you're competing like you spend your entire year doing this thing competing for this moment so we can walk out on this floor and then you pull some fucking weird stuff. Like what are you doing?

Stop. Just respect the sport and go, go play. And if everything's going to hurt, I would love to talk to the briefly of just, you mentioned Hoff. Like he's, he's like the, one of the,

there's only like five people that have ever squatted 1300 or something. He's one of them, right? He's, he's arguably equipped wise. He's the best of all time. Cause I wonder when he looks at that, is he's one of them right he's he's arguably equipped wise he's the best of all time because i wonder when he looks at that is he like or 23 plus wait 3000 plus sorry yeah it's like 3012 or something like yeah that's a massive 12 pounds yeah like four years to go from

3001 to 3012 something like that right dave off is a great strength athlete no matter what. I just think if he would like – I know – here's the problem. It's because they haven't done a lot of raw. They could actually go to the raw and they might not win. But I believe if Davoff spent some quality time in no time at all, he would either be the number one or top three. And then he would you know he would either be the number one or you know top three and then he would have competition i would think a guy like hoff would want to go against the best of the best like i did i wanted to go against the best of the best no matter where they were like let's otherwise i think you can't call yourself the best yeah you think you have better success going

from equipped to non-equipped like if you go from squatting 1200 with gear and now you only have to squat only in quotes only squat 850 without gear it's like you're used to having that weight on your back you pick up 850 and you're like oh this doesn't feel bad at all as opposed to going the other way you go from 800 to 1200 you're like god this is smashing me it's smashing because the cns if during that time they were spending some time of raw you know if all they did which is a lot of them only do it equipped no i think it's gonna be super weird i think it's going to be like you know their hips are just not going to understand what's going on because you know the hips are used to when they were at their weakest point being super supportive with gear now they'll go

to being at their weakest point with zero support so i I think it'd be hard for them to go. I think either way would be hard. But I wouldn't take a guy like Ray Williams very long in equipment to figure it out because he's a massive behemoth. He's an incredible strength athlete. Those dudes, it would take some quality time. You know the funny thing they'll tell me, well, you know, I'd go raw, but I'm afraid I'll get hurt.

I'm like, say what? So you're telling me that putting 1,300 pounds on your back is more dangerous? Putting yourself on a body cast. Yeah, like it makes no sense what you're saying. Or the benchers nowadays, benching 1,000. So you're afraid to bench raw because you might tear a pec. However, you could put 1,000 pounds in your hands. Over your face.

You're lying to yourself. And you can't lie to me anymore, boys. I was there. You're lying. Yeah. Is it just the squat? There doesn't seem to be as much fuckery with the bench press and the deadlift. It's just the squat that has the depth issue.

But the other two don't seem to have too many issues like not touching what are you pulling deadlift like just above your knees and then you dropped it you just throw your arms up like world champ you should be shot right right between the eyes this is the same like four inches of range of motion it's like oh world champion no big deal you. Give me, pay me. Discarded. Spartan discarded. Yeah, you're gone. No more genetics.

You know who Nathan Bishop was before we say that? No, nor do I care to know who he is. Strongest. Yeah. 1,300-pound back squat. You had no idea who he was until we sent you the video. He's not the strongest in anything. Yeah. Strongest guy of the day, I hope he hears this.

Does he have an Instagram? Four-tenths, two-fifths squat at a – Who cares if he has a – 1,311 pounds. Man, it's just – you said the bench. There was a video just the other day of like obviously not locked out, and then they pull it onto the rack and everyone starts screaming and they counted it and so i'm like yeah normally the bench press is

not as bad but lately they've been getting away with like obviously not locked out like uh but they normally you know they'll touch they'll pause and you know they'll press but then it's just the lockouts they're giving a few of those. But it's not as bad. And deadlift is just deadlift, so you can't really cheat it. Equipment doesn't help you that much. It helps maybe a little bit. So deadlifts are pretty good. But if you look in those equipped federations,

there's zero great deadlifters. You go to the raw and they're deadlifting 1,000. 900 and 1,000 is commonplace now where you won't see any of that equipment so that should tell them something like the one lift that you can compare yourself to those dudes you're getting smashed boys smashed wait why do you think that difference is um i think because they've relied so much on equipment that they didn't take the time to actually get strong. So because equipment doesn't help the deadlift as much, you don't have anything for it. You can't find some toy to make you stronger,

so you're not strong, and then that shows. The people, if you're squatting 1,100 pounds, you go to deadlift, it's like 600. Come on. Come on, man. Some of those dudes in those federations will bench more than they deadlift. Come on, man. Or some of those dudes in those federations will bench more than they deadlift. Come on, boys. Yeah.

That's great. We're going to talk about concurrent training in one second, but, Matt, I've got to tell you this story. I told Doug yesterday. My training buddy here and friend, Matt, that lives down the street from me, came over to the gym last Friday. And we trained. He brought his stepdaughter. His stepdaughter brought one of her friends that lives directly across the street from me and worked out. Everything was great. And everybody goes home

after we're done training. I went and picked up Adelaide at daycare. I come back home and the girl that lives across the street from me, her parents are outside. And I'm like, I, I went from like the right side of the road and then pulled over to the left just to talk to them and say, Hey, what's up?

Like your daughter came over. So I rolled the window down and I'm like, Hey, just to let you know, like your daughter did awesome today. She's probably going to be super sore in the morning and you know, just give her some water, make sure she eats enough protein. It'll be two or three days that she's really sore and then she should be fine. And they looked at me with this blank stare and they go, my daughter was at your house. I went, wait. Yeah, she came over and lifted weights in the garage. Did you not know? And they go, wait, wait, my

daughter was at your house. And I was like, yeah, she told you. Right. And I was like, and I can see very clearly that their daughter never asked their parents, hey, can I go to that old dude across the street's house to lift weights? And I was presenting the information for the very first time to the parents. I have never felt so creepy in my entire life than trying to explain. It was like you realize immediately that when you go, yeah, your daughter's probably going to be pretty sore the next day. Like, just get her some water. She'll be good. And the parents, like stone cold that when you go, yeah, your daughter's probably going to be pretty sore the next day. Like just get her some water. She'll be good.

And the parents like stone cold blank face go, are you talking about my daughter? What are you? What did they say? What was the interest? I mean, I, I rolled the window up and I like left. I was like, oh, well, uh, yeah. Uh, she did great.

She's going to be sore. I'm just to go. I'm just leaving from daycare. It was so awkward and creepy. I don't know. I felt like the biggest pedophile in the entire – But she was there with you. There was another person. Yeah, there was four people here.

All right. Like literally, yeah, if she had just like come over, it would have been the worst possible scenario. Yeah. You're, you're like, yeah, I'm not worried about anything except now when I see her parents outside,

I'm like, what's up? Sorry. I'm the dude that's luring girls into my garage. Why didn't she tell them? I have no idea, but I wish she wish she had god i'd be so mad but man that was my that was my big moment of the week feeling as creepy as you can possibly feel trying to do the right thing and get kids weightlifting i would feel i've always been very

weary you know like especially in weightlifting like I try to like never ever you weren't alone so that's perfect I would never coach a girl by myself

ever like yeah it's just a bad it's bad business it's just like you know with all the stuff that happened

with Michigan State like nowadays you gotta you just gotta be super careful like yeah yeah dang it's crazy you're one comment got to be super careful like yeah yeah yeah you're one comment away of your whole life falling apart yeah yeah exactly that was kind of weird to me

like what and they tell everybody and then all of a sudden you're like the weird guy even if like you didn't do anything like you just it's not worth it you say i'm out of here i walked in the door and i just assumed i told told Ashton immediately what happened. And I just, I was like, I just pray that this doesn't wind up on like the next door app of like, watch out for that creepy guy with his back squats. He's over there teaching goblet squats, luring people into his garage.

I would be so mad at her. I would be so mad. Come on now. Lately in weightlifting, there's been some coaches, there's been a couple of highly recognized coaches who have gotten in trouble, like major trouble. Like for legitimately being happy? Yeah, for legitimately.

What baffles me is this, is that if you're a coach and you know you have tendencies, like you know that you're attracted coach and like, you know, like, you know, you have tendencies, like, you know, that you're attracted to younger girls, or if you know that you really don't care about people, or if you know that you like, you're trying to be super famous or whatever it is, like, why do you keep coaching? Like, you have to know that you're like the most disgusting human there is because like these kids that you're coaching, they you you know they need you to teach them and like yet you don't care about those needs like why do you why do you keep doing it like get yourself if you're you got problems with pedophilia get get out like go as far away from kids as you can like why would you stay there i guess yeah it is ah yeah concurrent training yeah the business the matter about something positive yeah i'm getting

pissed now i'm like i have i i i told doug that story yesterday and i was just like man it's like if i hold this and i just feel even creepier i have to tell everybody now so that it's like just it's level playing field i feel like I'm not holding a secret out. I was bringing bad energy my way. There's no better look than a parent's face when their 16-year-old daughter comes to your house to do goblet squats and they have no idea. And they're like, my daughter was

at your house? She was in your garage. What? Your garage? At what point do you realize, oh shit. Immediately. Because their face just drops it's like instead of being like oh that's awesome like excitement face like thanks for thanks for training her for a day yeah it's like confusion stone face and you're like oh no So we went the wrong way. Yeah. Dang. Yeah.

Current training. Yeah. I actually really love this because I've been doing some research on it. We talked about it a little bit with Galpin and Schoenfeld last week. Concurrent training at the highest level is just the idea that you can do all the cardio, do all the conditioning, and still build the muscle, which kind of goes to what everybody originally believed when it came to hypertrophy, form, and speed, and power. Low, steady cardio was going to kill all the gains. I feel like every single person has grown up in the early days of their training, believing that you didn't need to go running. You didn't

need to do any steady state cardio. And if you did that, you would just show up to the gym the next day, very weak. You would just be right. Instead of using like fat or carbohydrate for energy, all of a sudden your body would just be breaking down muscle tissue. Like that was the only way that you would get energy was to break down muscle tissue and concurrent training just pretty much goes against all of that. Um, when you hear those words, Doug, what, what, what do you think about, uh, just breaking down concurrent training? I mean, it's basically just what you said. Like it's, it's lifting weights and doing strength stuff. And then also at the same time, concurrently doing some cardio activity. I think it's looking at it in a binary way of like, if you do cardio, it's bad. And if you don't do cardio, it's good. If you're trying to gain muscle mass and gain strength is not the right way to go about it. It's, it's all about the continuum of volume, volume you could potentially do. If you're lifting weights, you know, five days a week and, and you want to go for a 20 minute jog on three of those days like you're not doing anything negative you're not but that volume is not going to smash you it's not going to burn so many calories it's not going to

have you under recover put so much joint stress that you can't still lift weights and gain muscle mass and get stronger but if you're if you're trying to be a bodybuilder and you're trying to be a triathlete at the same time well now you just have two conflicting goals and so you're not going to be really really good at either one but you're probably gonna be in really damn good shape if you're just a regular person if crossfit taught us anything it's that you can be strong and muscular and have a great cardiovascular capacity at the same time yeah smash that yeah matt fraser um look at those these are jack they can run for days for days so yeah i think that's like you know you got to ask yourself like instead of saying you can't do these things together you should say what do i want to do and what is the most optimal way

to do that so like you know alex vieta was a guy i don't know if you guys have ever heard of him but i feel like he's the one who brought concurrent training you know to the mainstream because that dude was doing ultra marathons and still squatting 700 pounds so like uh he is the he is the poster boy of concurrent training but he wrote a really good book it was called hybrid hybrid athlete i believe uh i have it somewhere but it and all he talked about was like you know it's all about matt uh matching the correct energy systems meaning like you know if i have a lot a lot of time to to build something i probably should be working on my aerobic system and i should you know low intensity steady state cardio and i should be getting strong because it takes longer to build those two. But, you know, things that don't go together would be like, you know, if I did a lot of

lactate training and strength training, like those are counterproductive, you know, because once there's lactate, you know, build up and all the other like waste products, you're not going to be able to do anything in that in that realm but yeah those two like strength and uh and then like aerobic you know oxidation phosphorylation like those two are fine because they don't compete for the same you know products you just got to think about you know what are the things i need to match i need to think about the energy systems i need to think about you know the enzymes that are going to be like you know the inhibiting enzymes you know, the enzymes that are going to be like, you know, the inhibiting enzymes, you know, the excitatory enzymes. So, but if you do this, if you just match strength, like pure strength

with, you know, like aerobic work, low intensity, steady state, you're good. And like the, but the closer you get in the middle of those two, the longer you start to strength train, you know, like if I do sets of 10 and I do start, you know, I'm starting to do sprints. Now you're competing for, you know, with each other. Taking a quick break in the show. I want to remind you this week from Monday through Sunday, Diesel Dad class three launch is going on. Registration is live right now over barbell shrug.com forward slash shrugged inside the Diesel Dad. You get three goal-specific programs. EMOM Strength is our 40-60 minute program for top-end strength, speed, and power. EMOM Aesthetics is the 20-40 minute hypertrophy-focused functional bodybuilding program.

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Class 3 registration is live right now. It's common in the CrossFit space for people to have off-season training, be lifting weights, and low-intensity, long, slow-distance work. And then as competition gets closer, they kind of – they move both those energy systems kind of more toward the middle, like you're talking about doing mostly Metcons and high-intensity interval training. Right.

And then those two, you can't really like – you know, you can't be maxing. Well, you can. There's no absolutes in this. You can do whatever you want. Yeah. Like if you're talking about optimally once you're in that realm once you're starting to do like metcons a lot of you know lactate threshold work uh high intensity sprinting once you're there you probably shouldn't be trying to max your squat too you know you can't you can but it's going to

start to suffer because you know those phosphocreatine stores are going to be getting you know hammered as well while you're doing your threshold training. So it's going to be wise. Philosophically, I feel like I align with this type of training more than anything. And I, I, I almost wish that it was just more widely accepted and people just realized how important it is to just develop a massive base of fitness. Like GPP really should be the goal for everybody that's not going to the Olympics. Agreed. And the reason you want to focus on GPP, whether it's going to run 10 miles or sprint hundreds and then lift weights at every intensity and time domain in between those two is the physical freedom that comes along with being able to go play for an hour to two hours

straight is awesome. The physical freedom to be able to wake up and go play a game of pickup basketball is awesome. And everything in between there, if you want to go lift and you want to do fives, eights, tens, twenties, awesome. You should be strong in all of those domains. And then if you want to go run the Spartan World Championship, instead of having to worry about getting in shape or being fit, then all you really have to do is set your sights on a slightly longer time domain that you're training in and now you can go play and you're in plenty of good shape your body just you just tailor the training as you lead up to game day i used to talk to people all the time about just being eight weeks out in which it was if you

say anders you're competing in olympic weightlifting meet in eight weeks. You've got eight weeks to train. Sweet. Let's go. I'll be ready. I'll be really close to my lifetime best. I've got to dust off some old wires and go get strong. If you want me to go run 22 miles down the trail here that we have from Raleigh to Durham did it last year. No training.

Just be able to go play. And there really isn't any way, like people look for this like perfect training plan so that they can go do everything. And there really isn't one except looking at training as a massive GPP program of building a really large base to go do as many things as possible and have fun

playing the game of being in shape. And philosophically, I feel like that is exactly how I've tried to live. Whether we're going to Jamaica and I get to go swim in the ocean for a mile, or we go race Johan Blake, or fucking John Cena shows up to your gym one day and you've got one day to be really strong and develop a relationship. Game on. You should be ready. I agree. And this training is just the day – it's the type of training I feel like gets very –

it's not as sexy because, no, you're not going to be standing on an Olympic lifting stage being the strongest person you could ever be. And you're also not going to go run marathons in world-class times. But as a lifestyle, you'll be very ready to go play and you'll be very ready to go have fun and you'll be physically fit and you'll have the physical capacity to go do anything that life really throws at you and it should be fun and i feel like mixing it up as much as you should be on a very consistent training plan that that you know repeats itself so you can have metrics and improve on them fun is also a really important part and and going running going and getting on an erg going long going short that

stuff's fun it's it's it's it's fun to have novel training days and this it it's not like you're gonna you you need to go into those training days and go well if i row this 10k today like i'm totally gonna use up all my muscle it's just not true. And I do want to know though, like when, when mash, if, if Morgan came to you and was like, Hey man, I want to run five miles today. Do you, what, what do we do? He is going to the Olympics. Yeah. So he has to have a very different approach. I would say absolutely not. Yeah. And here's why though. It's not, it's not because like i think

it would you know make him weaker or anything i just think it would be too much volume because i would say how about go row or um or maybe ride a bike it's just that running is impact upon an impact because we're already his knees and hips are already getting impacted by training twice a day every single day and i of which that volume will continue to go up. So like, you gotta be careful of the volume and like, like, like I might say,

Hey, go swimming instead, you know, that there'll be like zero impact. You'll still get cardio. So I wouldn't necessarily say don't go, you know, be healthy.

I would just say, choose your, you know, choose the, the weapon wisely. Like, so like choose your exercise. Yeah So, like, choose your exercise wisely. And, like, you know, one thing you said, like,

if you go out and you say you run, you were to run, like, a 10K, the next day or even that very day, you know, after you get some rest, you still would not be a bad idea to even max out. Here's why. Because your phosphocreatine systems didn't get touched at all. You spent your entire time in the oxidative, aerobic area. So like, you know, there's, you just got to be wise. There's so many cool things that you could do. You just got to understand your energy systems. That's what I would say. That is a really, just in the basic level of discussing energy systems, I think that just having a very,

even just small education in, in understanding time domains is really important from your 100 meter sprint being on the far left end of the spectrum or like a one rep max back squat, deadlift, something like maximum total out power output versus the long sustained, um, aerobic capacity pieces where you could be going for 30 minutes, an hour, two hours. Um, if you want to be able to go run a marathon without really training for it, you should

be able to spend some time doing hour long runs or whatever that is. Um, and there's plenty of ways to train that but that's what i love about understanding energy systems and and using that information it's like while you're developing that large base of gpp realizing that everything falls in between those efforts so if you are going to go run a marathon, well, you just move all of your training. You have this giant base of training, and then you just move everything a little bit further down the spectrum to a longer, slower distance. And then if you're going to go do a powerlifting meet, you move everything left, and everything becomes more aimed towards the one rep max and strength and power output. It's really easy to just get locked into a box when there's no need to get put in the box.

Nope, nope. For our listeners, like, you know, your first 10 seconds is that phosphocreatine. That's where, you know, that's stored in your muscles and it's awesome, it's very quick, but then it runs out quickly. So, you know know you got 10 seconds for that energy system and then anywhere in like you'll say you'll see that i cannot give you

exacts because it's still the science is not 100 on either way and it's very in but for about the net for about a minute you're in the glycolytic system and then um after that it becomes what people consider like the uh aerobic system but like the thing is that they all three do go together especially like glycolysis along with um you know the aerobic they still like they're not like you use this or this you use them together and the better here's the thing we're not talking about either and there's even if i'm a power lifter and i'm trying to get strong or a bodybuilder, trying to get huge, when I spend some time in the aerobic world and doing some low-intensity steady state, I'm also building more capillary density. Therefore, recovery becomes an easier thing. If I can get more blood and the blood is around those muscles longer because of the web, the capillaries of the sperm, it will be much more efficient at clearing those wastes.

So when you do those awful, like you guys call it pain cave, and you're getting all those metabolites and waste products are getting built up. Now you have this capillary network built that makes it much more efficient at getting rid of that so you can recover much faster from say like you know i go do a fran then i get a little bit of time i go do something else it'll it's you're much more uh efficient at clearing that stuff so yeah we're talking about capillary density and a fun point that i'll say about that is that there's a rationale for warming up that has to do with capillaries where you have sphincter muscles around some of your capillaries where you kind of like your main road and you have a bunch of side roads. And until you're warmed up, like a lot of the side roads are like blocked off. So you can't drive on those roads, so to speak.

So you only have one main road but once you warm up and those capillary sphincters relax and it kind of opens up the rest of the pathways then you can have a lot more blood flowing through your muscles which means that you can deliver energy and oxygen more quickly and you can remove waste and metabolites more quickly and in addition to that with with the aerobic training you get capillary density improvements but you also get mitochondrial density improvements so now the you know the powerhouse of the cell like everyone calls mitochondria that helps you process oxygen and it's like you know one of the primary um tools that you have for for your metabolism for converting food into physical energy uh you get more of that as well so you have a better delivery system and then you have a better processing system right yeah it's really interesting you say that Doug uh connecting dots back to competing when we were doing the open um we actually felt

like such savages because we would always build up or we would start all warm-ups for people in like a 10 to 15 minute just like long slow getting out a little bit into the aerobic side of things, running, rowing, whatever it is, just to get people moving and open up their lungs. And then we would always get people to build up to like more or less a max for day snatch, which turns on a whole lot of the capillaries on one side and then post activation because all the all the weights are significantly light when you've done the most athletic thing that you can do with a barbell and do it to a max for the day you kind of like trick your body into performing really really well by playing at both ends of the spectrum so whatever's thrown at you in the middle you're kind of just prepared the weight's a lot lighter your your lungs are open and it's a lot easier to perform because your

body's just tuned on both sides i think i think it's wise for people listening to this to think about their own weaknesses but what's like the weak link in your chain so to speak like are you are you uh very obvious are you back squatting, you know, 285 and you can, you can run a marathon. No problem. Well, you need to focus on strength and muscle mass. And then, uh, might not be that, that obvious, obviously, which, uh, which thing you need to pick.

Some people are going to be in the middle where they're kind of like, I don't know, my cardio is okay. And my strength's kind of okay. Like, which one do I do? Um, Ben Bergeron says a lot of times, like the, for CrossFit specifically, strength is the price of admission. So you need to get to a certain level of strength. And then once you're there, getting a whole lot stronger isn't necessarily the next thing that you really need to do. Bringing up your cardiovascular capacity after you've met a certain level of

strength seems to be the path to success with a lot of games athletes. Like we talked about Fraser the other day coming out of weightlifting and already being really, really strong and then the path to success with a lot of games athletes. We talked about Frazier the other day coming out of weightlifting and already being really, really strong and then selling his soul to an airdyne every single day. He can already have the strength piece more or less handled. He's still working on it just like everyone's working on everything all the time.

The cardiovascular capacity as far as CrossFit goes was the main thing that he needed to maximize in order to be a multiple time world champion. It takes a he needed to maximize in order to be, you know, a multiple time world champion. And it takes a long time to maximize that system. Yeah. So you got to spend a lot of quality time in like,

I feel like every, every CrossFit athlete should, the minute they're in their off season, like whether it's, you know, the, unless maybe it's the open is yours, is your thing, or now it's not really sanctionalsctionals, I guess, right? I don't even know what it is. Yeah. So whenever you can sit in your place. Nobody knows. You jump on an airdyne, and you should get strong.

You should do those two things. Step one, go to games.crossfit.com and figure out what the rules are because no one knows anymore. Yeah. I have a shirt on. Oh, there's something, too, that, you know, if you're like, let's say that you do squats one day, and then you want to do either some type of aerobic work that day or the next day, yeah, then running is probably not a good idea.

You might consider going for a swim. Or if I benched one day, then maybe I don't want to row. Maybe you should consider doing, that would be a good time to run or the bike. So just being strategic in the way you place, you know, your movements. So you're not just like, you know, absolutely crushing, you know, a muscle group. So those are, it's just, if you use your common sense, it's, I think I love,

I wrote the book called, you know, do what you want. It's all about this very thing, concurrent training. And, like, I think you can do whatever you want. Like, you know, some people, you know, like your, the one-time challenge, that's concurrent training because you're training powerlifting with weightlifting. Anytime you mix, you know, like disciplines, that's considered concurrent training. And I feel like we did a great job with, you know, the way we did one time challenge,

people were killing it. So the one time challenge, yeah, they're crushing it. The one time challenge is rad because you have to be able to lift to a one rep max for two straight hours. Yeah. Like nobody really thinks about how long two hours of maxing out is and how

you get to a one rep max. Like if you're not efficient in the way that you move and you don't have the lungs to go do that for half an hour we've still got four lifts to go it's gonna be a long day i see a lot of powerlifters too man like they could really powerlifters and weightlifters look if if you're a powerlifter and you get to deadlift and you're you're just exhausted you need to get your ass on a bike you know like you're just completely out of shape because daggone you're talking about like you know when you go into you've you've lifted for basically six minutes you know you've had three squats and three benches and you're exhausted you're gonna

have a heart attack man and then weightlifting too you know you they'll get to clean and jerks and you'll see people they just don't have any energy like you know there's nothing wrong with spending some quality time building that aerobic system you guys like it won't hurt your lifting you know as long as the majority of your time is spent doing the sport because there is something to you know like um specificity of fiber types so you know spend the majority of your time doing the sport that you want to maximize i actually specifically to you you guys have the the pel or what, Echelon at your house. Echelon, yeah. Do you notice when you're getting a good rhythm on that,

that everything else just feels easier? Like, is it a noticeable difference when you're spending 20 to 40 minutes a day on the bike just practicing breathing? Yes, it's 100%. And, you know, not only that, too, like, there's other benefits we're not even talking about. Like, when I'm on the bike, it's much easier for me to retain information than, you know, when I'm studying. Or, like, if I'm working on a project, I'm much more focused, which, you know, we had John Rady on the show.

And, like, you know, that's proven by now. Well, all of his research before was until he started kind of working. He mentioned on that show that he partnered with Reebok and started working with a bunch of CrossFitters. But all of his research before that partnership was in long, slow distance and just getting up and going for a run in the morning to get your brain solving movement problems, which turns on tons of hormones and makes you smarter and

more alert and there's you should go back and listen that show is a great show um all of his research was on long slow distance long slow distance lately in his newest book adhd 2.0 like now he's giving weightlifting more props he's like um it comes to the cerebellum like lifting weight doing something complicated so either martial arts i love your way lifting you know like something that makes you think is better for the cerebellum you know that's where that's what involves you know when you're riding a bike that stores that information forever yeah i think that that i mean you just i i feel feel like this also really just hits at the heart when you talked about problem solving. Like many people just look at lifting weights and saying, well, I'm just going to get jacked.

I got to go run to get good cardio. But they're not understanding kind of the deeper physiological side of things that your brain has to go solve some really complex problems of back squatting right that bar is trying to throw you through the ground yeah and your brain wants to survive or it's going to break in half and there's only one way to do that and your brain's got to be very very alert and aware of what's going on making sure your legs and your core and your spine and all these pieces are put together. Like that's why it movement is so important. And to think that just doing one specific type of training is optimizing all of the additional benefits that movement and fitness bring you is just a really shallow way of understanding what's happening inside your

body and the total adaptation that's going on. I think that's why training to me is still so fun over all these years. Like there's just so many different little games that you can play with yourself and continue to learn. And to think that getting better at one specific skill or one specific time domain is going to just destroy the last, like if I just went and decided I'm just going to run for the next three months to think that that's going to go and destroy 24 years of back squats. No way. No way, man. Alex Viet, I'm telling you, like, if you guys could,

if you could get a hybrid, you know, hybrid athlete or, you know, do what you want. But I love Alex just because he's super smart. He went to Duke, by the way. I think kinesiology major from Duke. And then squat 700 runs a hundred mile. How does one person, you know, I guess once you've, you know, perfected that whole beta oxidation, you know, fat is where you use fat.

Like you can go forever and, and, you know, to a degree, like it's just endless the amount of energy you can, as long as you don't get too far, as long as it can keep up, you know, once you, obviously if you start kicking things in, you could, you could quickly burn out on this big, but if you steady state it the whole time like if you get good at it you could do it 100 miles and then turn around and squat 700 that's that's the person i would love to be is like you know do both yeah i think it's also uh when you start to bring in kind of the nutrition piece where just going back to the foundations of like eating a well-rounded yeah um diet lots of carbohydrates um some really healthy fats and really high quality protein to ensure that muscle's not actually breaking down and

you can stay strong and continue to rebuild cells like um you know yes if you're a keto person you can still go run a marathon but i think when when we start to talk about like lifting weights sprinting the majority of 8 to 12 16 20 minute workouts like there's a massive carbohydrate burn in there that yeah you need to just be a well-rounded person or in order to be a well-rounded athlete you need a well-rounded diet so you can be i believe it's mike nelson's um certification that he runs metabolic flexibility in which uh the general idea of being able at any point to be able to alternate between fuel sources between fat and carbohydrate um you know if you're if you're completely depleted of carbohydrate

it's going to be really hard to do a crossfit workout and i can't be convinced you know it's hard for me to understand the whole um that the ketones can you know supply the body just as good as like uh glycogen it's hard like i'm i'm actually working on that right now because i gotta wrap my head around that, you know, especially the brain, which is, you know,

runs completely on glucose, but you know, you can, you know, lactate is, if you ask Andy, like lactate is also a good source for the brain, but like using ketones,

you know, I'm sure that I've, there's research I haven't read yet, but it's just hard for me to understand that one. I think, does Doug know about that? Yup. Well research I haven't read yet, but it's just hard for me to understand that one. I think Mike Nelson's done a really good job pretty much debunking any of that information that's come out. If you're going to be doing high intensity, high effort, short time domain, you need a lot of carbohydrates in your body to keep going.

I think so too. You know, like I do, I just, you know, like it just doesn't make any sense that, you know, the body is designed for, you know, glycogen and glucose and then fat for that's own reasons. And to like try to force it to just run on fats and the ketones, I just, you know, I don't feel like it was designed for that, but. Yeah. You know, like, and, and even when we interviewed, uh,

Galpin and Schoenfeld talking about hypertrophy and, and you asked, and we were talking about, you know, how many things that they still want to learn and they still don't know. And it's so exciting. And then when you pan that out and you realize that the things that they're learning and the things that they want to know are like this, that it's the tiniest little percent. Yeah.

You pan it out. Like we have the answers for what Anders Varner needs. Some regular dude that wants to be strong, wants to be pretty lean, wants to be athletic, wants physical freedom. Once we have those, we've all got, that problem

has been solved. And if I am the representative of the average male that wants to live an awesome life without physical restrictions, eat enough carbohydrate, eat plenty of really healthy fats, and eat a lot of lean meat, you're good. Nature's's gonna take care of the rest like it it many times i feel like that debate and and you know can get into this does cardio make you lose muscle it's like come on like what what do you think this human body adapted to be a meathead like we're we're putting challenges in front on our body and forcing it to adapt that we have to basically make problems up. But the basic science is the exact same, like eat carbohydrates. They give you fuel to do really high-intensity efforts and eat really healthy fats and get enough protein to build muscle and repair cells.

I agree. and get enough protein to build muscle and repair cells. If you're lifting weights and you're doing a lot of cardio and you're not getting stronger or gaining muscle mass like you hoped you would, yeah, maybe the cardio is influencing your lack of gains in some way, but I think it's much wiser to look at all the other components of your training. What is your training program actually like? What is your recovery actually like? Are you getting enough calories to put on muscle mass? All these other things are much more a factor than simply doing a little bit of extra cardio and then and then kind of

scapegoating it and saying oh that's what that that was the problem without focusing on all the other big items that could possibly contribute yeah like when people come to me and they're like um i'm i mean i'm struggling i'm getting worse like know, it's always the same thing. It's like, I already know the answer. So then I go, well, how's your sleep? You know, how's your appetite? How's the stress at work? Somewhere in those three or stress at home, somewhere in those four questions, you find your answer. It's not a program. It's not, you know, it's no like, oh, you're doing it too much frequency. It's none of that. It's always like oh you're doing it too much frequency it's none of that it's always like they're just not they're not fueling themselves properly they're not sleeping

properly or there's extra stress and like and then if that's the case then you have to back out somewhere you know you can't just add stress on top of stress eventually there's that you know there's the end point so then they've reached it. But it's never the workout. It's always their life. Living their life poorly. Philosophically, go do everything. Yeah. If you want to be the most jacked human in the world, you should probably lift a lot more weights.

If you want to go run ultra marathons, you should probably go buy a nice pair of running shoes and get after it. Hit the road, man. By the way, all the arguments against concurrent training are usually based on we're trying to maximize this one specific thing it's usually strength or muscle mass right but but again if if that's not your sole siloed life goal to be stronger and have more muscle mass and you're trying to be healthy in many different capacities then yeah you should

definitely do all this stuff it's not gonna it's, it's not going to hurt you at all. Maybe you don't get quite as strong, but if you're not like, feel like 2% less strong and your cardio is like 300 X of what it would have been if you didn't do any cardio at all, then overall, like, like as far as your life goes, you're going to be much healthier, much happier, have more energy, feel better, et so it's it's a it's always a goal-dependent question and for most people they're just training to feel good have fun and and be healthy yeah live a little live a little bit longer you know i think it's super fun uh and i i do more of this stuff now when i'm just having fun in the gym it's like go run two miles and then

see what your one rep max back squat is like train yeah and test at the same time with the two uh the two ends of the spectrum like there's just it just makes things more fun yeah you want to go do more stuff mix it all together in a way that's fun and interesting um and don't worry about so many of the tiny little details. Just realize that having as large of a base of fitness as possible is always going to be a good thing. It's going to be a good thing. I think every powerlifting weightlifter listening should consider doing at least some low-intensity steady-state cardio.

I think your recovery, and then, you know, as a powerlifter, I've had so many, I'm only, you know, I'm 47. I've had multiple friends already dead. So you powerlifting people out there, like, you know, I know when you're 20, you're like, I don't care. I just want to be the world champion. I don't care if I die at 30. You do care. I promise you when you're 40, you care. So take care of yourself. And you're probably going to be better for it anyway. If you don't go overboard, you'll have, you'll recover faster. That's why all your 300-pound friends, when they were squatting 1,000 pounds,

now weigh like 225. Or they're dead. I have a bunch of my 300-pound friends that are dead, several. Because they care. Yeah. Coach Travis Mash. Where can the people find you? Mashley.com or you can go back.

Keep crushing on LinkedIn. So, you know, Travis Masterly. You took a little break? Yeah, like, yeah. So I've been having fun with it again. I love it when somebody, and this is all social media, but when I go on LinkedIn right now, when Aaron Horschig put up the picture, I think it was of Brock. Brock, yeah, yeah. I think it was a rock rock.

Yeah. Yeah. I'm like, I go on my LinkedIn now and it's just Anders Varner. You have a billion updates on LinkedIn. I'm like, from what? Yeah.

Aaron Horschig. Some of you posted like a month ago. I know. He's cycling. Like if you're, if you're an Instagram, that thing is gone. You know,

you got one day and you'll never see it again. LinkedIn a month later, you're still getting some, you know is gone. You got one day and you'll never see it again. LinkedIn, a month later, you're still getting some feedback. Coach Doug Larson. Doug Larson! He's a coach too. I coach people on occasion. It's just not what I normally call you.

That's right. Find me on Instagram, Douglas C. Larson. I'm Anders Varner. Coach Anders Varner at Anders Varner. We are Barbell Shrugged at barbell underscore shrug. Get over to barbellshrugged.com forward slash diesel dad. Strong, lean, and athletic without sacrifice in family, fatherhood, or fitness. And if you are in San Diego, L.A., Palm Springs, or Vegas, get over to Walmart.

We are on the shelves. Three programs in the pharmacy. Friends, we'll see you next week. That's a wrap, friends. Thanks for hanging out. I want to remind you, barbellshrug.com forward slash diesel dad class three registration is live right now

through Sunday. Also, head over to Organifi.com forward slash shrug. Pick up the green, red, and gold juices as well as our friends at Bioptimizers at leakygutguardian.com forward slash shrug to save 10%. Leakygutguardian.com forward slash drug to save 10%. leakygutguardian.com forward slash drug to save 10%.

See you on Wednesday.